The Switch 2 and "Vampire Survivors+RPG"

Nintendo finally announced the Switch 2. So why do folks seem a bit disappointed by the reveal? We discuss what we know so far… and what’s to come. Plus, one of our most anticipated games of the year got stealth dropped and it’s a delight!

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Griffin McElroy?

  I downloaded a Neo Pets cheat engine. And when that's running, which it is around the clock, because I'm always grinding it out.

• 0:08Russ Frushtick?

  Yeah.

• 0:09Griffin McElroy?

  Um, it tends to slow down some of the other processes.

• 0:13Russ Frushtick?

  And what, what, what are you turning on in there? What, what cheats you got going?

• 0:17Griffin McElroy?

  Infinite breeding.

• 0:20Russ Frushtick?

  Yeah.

• 0:21Griffin McElroy?

  Yeah, a lot of the Neo Pets, they only let you breed them one today.

• 0:24Chris Plante?

  I turned on that cheat in college.

• 0:29Griffin McElroy?

  I don't want to. High five that.

• 0:31Speaker 03

  High five me. I turned on that cheat in college. High five me.

• 0:34Griffin McElroy?

  I recently turned that cheat off for myself. I removed that cheat from my own personal bio cheat engine.

• 0:41Russ Frushtick?

  Which is a cheat in and of itself.

• 0:43Chris Plante?

  Griffin went to the, Griffin went to the vasectomy doctor and turned on yes clipping.

• 0:47Griffin McElroy?

  Yes.

• 0:51Russ Frushtick?

  That's a good line.

• 0:52Griffin McElroy?

  Oh, man, that's good. I, and this contractually, this checks off this podcast for talking about my vasectomy on, I think. Um, I gotta get it on Death Bar this year and then that's the, that's the whole.

• 1:02Chris Plante?

  And, and Radiolab, you said you were gonna do somehow.

• 1:05Griffin McElroy?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:07Russ Frushtick?

  Kerry Gross has a lot of questions.

• 1:27Speaker 03

  My name is Justin McRae and I know the best game of the week.

• 1:29Griffin McElroy?

  My name is Griffin McRae and I know the best video game console of 2025.

• 1:33Chris Plante?

  My name is Christopher Thomas Plant and I know the best game of the week.

• 1:37Russ Frushtick?

  My name is Russ Fraschigai and I know the best game of the week.

• 1:40Speaker 03

  Welcome to the besties where we talk about the latest and greatest in home interactive entertainment. It is a video game club. And just by listening, you've become a member. This week, we're gonna be talking about the Switch 2? Didn't they just make one of these things? Chris Plant, is that right?

• 1:57Chris Plante?

  They did it again. Nobody saw it coming this time, but they said, "Switch again." And here we are.

• 2:05Speaker 03

  Switch again. Uh, we're gonna talk about that, what that means, why it means, and so much more, right after this. In the B segment, we're gonna be talking about heroes of Hammerwatch 2.

• 2:18Speaker 03

  Like it or not.

• 2:21Speaker 03

  So they did it. They did it. The Switch, the Switch 2. They just made a sequel to one. They finally did it. Like, this is not unlike the Wii U, which is a colossal failure.

• 2:32Russ Frushtick?

  Yeah, God, I hope.

• 2:33Griffin McElroy?

  That's interesting, Juice.

• 2:34Speaker 03

  Well, no, I'm saying like, we.

• 2:35Griffin McElroy?

  Speak on that.

• 2:36Russ Frushtick?

  Yeah, please.

• 2:37Speaker 03

  Okay, I will. Wii mega-popular thing. Wii U, which is basically Wii 2, right? I mean, that's what it's supposed to sound like. Wii U, Wii 2.

• 2:46Griffin McElroy?

  Yeah.

• 2:47Speaker 03

  Wii 2.

• 2:48Griffin McElroy?

  I would say, yeah.

• 2:49Speaker 03

  It's bad. No one likes it. So this is like.

• 2:50Griffin McElroy?

  That's so cool. Yeah. I would say the only difference is that the Wii U was a dramatic departure from the Wii in form and function, and the Switch 2 looks like a big switch.

• 3:02Speaker 03

  But it's that they learned their lesson, right?

• 3:03Russ Frushtick?

  Well, did they, though? Because the Switch is really just a Wii U without wires.

• 3:07Chris Plante?

  I was gonna say, everybody's like, hey, they're just redoing the same thing again. And they kind of did that with the Switch. They should go back and change the Wii U to like, the Switch Alpha.

• 3:19Griffin McElroy?

  Oh, that's cool.

• 3:20Chris Plante?

  You see? And now there's a natural progression. That makes sense.

• 3:23Speaker 03

  Yeah. I mean, I will, you want, who, who understands the, the specs the best?

• 3:29Russ Frushtick?

  I know, I know all the specs.

• 3:30Speaker 03

  Tell me what we know before we get into like the.

• 3:31Russ Frushtick?

  That's a good call. Good call. Okay, here are all the specs. So the Switch 1 came out. It was 3.7 inch screen with a 2,400 hertz processor. And the Switch 2 is a 6.4 inch screen with a 7,700 hertz processor.

• 3:50Speaker 03

  That's a large, that's a much bigger screen.

• 3:52Griffin McElroy?

  Hold on. Are these official specs or are these what's been, okay, let's make that very clear.

• 3:57Russ Frushtick?

  That was me totally making numbers up.

• 3:59Griffin McElroy?

  I was gonna say, that's insane, man. That's crazy. We don't know anything.

• 4:04Speaker 03

  What's wrong with you?

• 4:05Chris Plante?

  I like the bit. Such was his confidence that we were kind of.

• 4:09Griffin McElroy?

  Okay. It's when he said the Switch had a 3 inch screen that I was like, is that right? Uh, we don't know the specs. They have not announced any, anything going on under the hood.

• 4:20Chris Plante?

  We can share what the widely assumed rumor of the technology is.

• 4:25Russ Frushtick?

  Yeah, go for it.

• 4:26Chris Plante?

  Which is, the Switch, even when it was released, followed the Nintendo trend of being pretty not powerful and then pulling off amazing feats with a manage like a middle of the road like smartphone after a few years. The Switch 2 sounds like it will be a basically like a Xbox Series S. And will it literally be that powerful? No, but with the all the like changes in modern technology, specifically things like DLSS, which is where you can use AI learning to make the resolution much, much better and process it at a lower rate.

• 5:06Chris Plante?

  It will be like equivalent to that. Why that matters? You can put third-party games on the Switch 2 in theory in a way you couldn't on the Switch 1. And that would be like a big differentiator for it.

• 5:18Russ Frushtick?

  You can run, I think my, what my head cannon is, is like PS4 Pro. It's like in that ballpark. It's like the PS4, PS4 Pro. And, and yeah, that's a big improvement. I will say, and obviously the other big change, apart from the actual like raw power of it, it's about one inch bigger on the diagonal. I don't have the exact number, but it's about that size based on this, the CG trailer that they put out. Also, it looks like it has a mouse, but that's not officially confirmed.

• 5:46Griffin McElroy?

  Yeah, so there's an, uh, it seems to be some sort of optical sensor on the side of the thing, which now snaps in VTOL style to the side of the screen part of the Switch instead of sort of sliding into a groove. We, and Nintendo hasn't confirmed that either, I don't think.

• 6:06Speaker 03

  I mean, you look at that, could only be magnets, that beautiful snap.

• 6:09Russ Frushtick?

  That is the problem is after two years of leaks, they've just gotten closer and closer and closer to the truth that the second we saw Joy-Cons like sliding around on a table, we're like, boop, mouse confirmed.

• 6:21Griffin McElroy?

  This reveal felt like the most perfunctory, like, all right, we gotta, we're bleeding over it, we gotta get something out there. It felt, it felt extremely light on detail, but I, I was, my spirits were buoyed by the fact that it will be backwards compatible. Aside from select games, which I have to imagine is like fucking Ring Fit Adventure and other sort of like peripheral games that require the old Joy-Cons. Right, exactly.

• 6:54Speaker 03

  Let me just kick this off. I'm, I would love to know what you guys think because I am having trouble ginning up anything too strong about this because it seems so kinda. Uh, evident and um, I, I, for me, this just feels a little bit disappointing. I feel like of all the different aspects of the Switch experience, for me, at this point, the Switch is really just, uh, it's permanently attached, like the, the JoyCons main, I mean, I don't even need to separate them at this point.

• 7:29Russ Frushtick?

  Yeah.

• 7:30Speaker 03

  It seems, uh, it's a little bit disappointing that of all the things to sort of like carry over, that that is something that was sort of like prioritized when I, for me, that is super not how I use.

• 7:44Russ Frushtick?

  For sure.

• 7:44Speaker 03

  The.

• 7:44Russ Frushtick?

  Are you, are you saying you use it exclusively in handheld mode or?

• 7:48Speaker 03

  Yeah, or even if like, and even if not, even if it's docked, like.

• 7:52Russ Frushtick?

  Pro controller.

• 7:52Speaker 03

  I'm pro controller, like I'm certainly not sliding those things off and like, uh, I just don't, of, of the things to like bring over, it's just like so sort of, I don't know, I find it very uninspiring.

• 8:04Russ Frushtick?

  I think there is an argument to be made, and this might be Nintendo's argument, that because of the larger size and because they did improve the like kickstand on the back of it, it's like a better kickstand or something, it does become a little more viable in a split screen couch co-op scenario.

• 8:24Griffin McElroy?

  I, I, I would love that. I would love that to be, to be true, because I, I, the number of times that, you know, Henry's been playing a game on TV and then Gus wants to take over the TV and so we switched to playing, you know, Kirby co-op with the thing on the couch constantly fucking falling over because the kickstand even on the OLED is not very good. Uh, to the idea of playing that with the JoyCons, with individual JoyCons, instead of two pro controllers though, is just unthinkable because it doesn't feel great to use a Joy-Con sideways as like a regular controller when there is a, a normal controller. But if that is, if that is available, that would save me a lot of headache, you know, whenever that situation arises, as edgy as it is.

• 9:03Chris Plante?

  I, two, two, two takes different directions. One, we don't know what the JoyCons do yet.

• 9:11Chris Plante?

  Like, they might be mice, for one example, which if that's true, could be cool. And I hope that there are like weird things that the Joy-Cons still do. Maybe they are better versions of the Wii-motes and they're actually going to have more physical play back in the system. I don't know, I feel like there's like still a surprise that could come.

• 9:34Russ Frushtick?

  Yeah.

• 9:34Chris Plante?

  The other direction of this is, what, I guess like, what do you think the audience is asking for? Because I feel like half the audience is like, this is a disappointment. I wanted it to be so much weirder. Nintendo, like, they come out, never since the GameCube, they make things weird. And then the other half of the audience is like, I want it to just be the Switch, but better, and like ultra-powerful. And I think they're, I feel like it's kind of, they're caught between those two camps.

• 10:03Speaker 03

  That, to me, is what's hard, is, for a company, this is like easily distracted, as Nintendo, with, with stuff like this. I feel like, if you're not coming out saying that this mouse functionality is like a big part of the idea with the thing, I can't see them, I mean, they even mentioned HD Rumble when they pitched the Switch. Like, I, I can't imagine it being a big aspect of it, you know what I mean?

• 10:26Chris Plante?

  Yeah.

• 10:26Speaker 03

  I think if you're waiting for another shoe to drop, like, where it's like a, a big bit of functionality, or a bit, I don't think it's gonna come out, I think this is it, like, I think.

• 10:35Chris Plante?

  I, I will say, there's still more shoes to drop. I, I, I feel pretty.

• 10:41Speaker 03

  I'm not saying that they won't do it, I'm saying that like, they won't support it in any meaningful way. I'm saying, I'm saying they might come out with something, but like.

• 10:48Chris Plante?

  That's interesting.

• 10:49Russ Frushtick?

  They kind of forget.

• 10:51Speaker 03

  Yeah, it's like, right, like HD Rumble, again, like, okay, well.

• 10:56Russ Frushtick?

  I mean, to, to be fair, the, all of the first-party games on the Switch basically have HD Rumble, it's just none of the third-party games do. So they did, didn't forget about it, but you're right, it wasn't the like, oh, you can feel these balls in one-two switch rolling around in your Joy-Con.

• 11:11Chris Plante?

  What I could get excited.

• 11:12Griffin McElroy?

  I still, I stand by that BTS, that was cool.

• 11:14Speaker 03

  What I could get excited about is like, if they were gonna use this to bring in, if they were gonna use mouse functionality, not for like gaming, because that's. No, like no, no, we're not gonna do that.

• 11:26Russ Frushtick?

  For a first, if you want to play Doom on your thing, that's not a valid.

• 11:30Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 11:31Russ Frushtick?

  I'm serious.

• 11:31Griffin McElroy?

  Only if one Joy-Con turns into a mouse and the other one turns into a tiny keyboard.

• 11:35Speaker 03

  Yeah, it's just like realistically, it's never gonna be a thing. But like for creativity apps, like if they wanted to get back into the Mario Pay space.

• 11:43Griffin McElroy?

  That's, I said that earlier, not entirely joking.

• 11:46Speaker 03

  That would be cool. Like if you want to get into that kind of, or Mario Maker.

• 11:50Russ Frushtick?

  Mario Maker.

• 11:51Griffin McElroy?

  Fucking Flip Note Studio, like there's, they have a history of like, having wild sort of apps like that.

• 11:58Speaker 03

  Wouldn't you make that part of the trade? I mean, wouldn't you make that part of the reveal? That's what's hard for me.

• 12:02Russ Frushtick?

  There's gonna be so much more coming though.

• 12:04Griffin McElroy?

  This is, this is what I'm, this is the conversation I feel like that, that we can have, right? Because there's so many unknowns.

• 12:09Russ Frushtick?

  Yeah.

• 12:10Griffin McElroy?

  The question is like, why was this the opening shot? Why was this the first salvo, right? Why not wait, for me, there is no company, and obviously there's not a lot of companies making gaming hardware, but like, there's no company where the hardware and the software are more intrinsically linked than Nintendo, right? Because I pretty much, at, at, at this point, only play Nintendo first-party games and multiplayer games with my kid on the Switch, right? Everything else is going through the Steam Deck. And so like, the fact that there wasn't anything other than a new Mario Kart, which is fine, but like, not at all demonstrative of what the Switch 2 could do.

• 12:53Griffin McElroy?

  Like, I did, I honestly did not clock that it was a new Mario Kart game the first time I watched it.

• 12:59Russ Frushtick?

  You gotta look at Donkey Kong, he looks fucking weird in that trailer.

• 13:02Griffin McElroy?

  Okay, yeah, I guess I wasn't zaprootering it hard enough to like, but like, why not? We all know this shit, we know this stuff because like, the images from accessory makers, like, this thing was fully out there, fully, fully, fully, fully out there. Not the specs, maybe the specs are all rumored, but like, what the thing is and what it looks like is out there. And then they had a trailer that 90% of it was dedicated to like, and here's what the Joy-Cons look like, and here's what the screen looks like. And it's like, yeah, we kinda know that, so why not have a, a reveal trailer that's like, yeah, it's, here's all the stuff you already know? But also.

• 13:38Speaker 03

  That's what I'm saying, if you could.

• 13:41Chris Plante?

  Gin up some X. If you had another thing where you're like, sorry, press sneak fucks. You don't have this.

• 13:48Griffin McElroy?

  And if it's coming out this year, they have that, right? Like, they, they know what games are gonna be on it at launch. Now, like, you don't have to, you know, completely go ham and show everything, but like, now we're waiting three months? Until we find out anything else about it. Like, all you did was kind of say like, yep, all that stuff? That is out there. That's true. Bye.

• 14:12Russ Frushtick?

  Well, what that lets them do is now third parties can say, we're making this game for Switch 2. Which they couldn't before that trailer happened.

• 14:21Griffin McElroy?

  Sure.

• 14:22Chris Plante?

  Yeah.

• 14:22Russ Frushtick?

  Well, that does open the gates.

• 14:23Chris Plante?

  I also just feel like this is like, this is wins all around for Nintendo. Because now, everybody, you're like, like, everybody gets emotional, everybody wants it, people talk about it. People, oh, it's three months, three months. Three months comes, and then they're like, here's everything. Here are all the games you wanted. Here's Mother 3, here's Mother 4, and Mother 5. Here's Pokemon 32. They, we've, we've got it all for you. And then people are immediately like, okay, I'm relieved. I'm going to play the new Mario Kart, and the new MMO, and the new Mario, and the new Animal Crossing.

• 14:58Griffin McElroy?

  Metroid.

• 14:59Chris Plante?

  And I'm, nobody's going to think about this announcement ever again, except for like, sickos like us.

• 15:06Russ Frushtick?

  It is a little disappointing, though. I think the disappointing aspect is like, because when the Switch 1 was announced, and that trailer was like, what the fuck are they doing? Are they playing video games on the rooftop of their fancy condo? That was mind blowing.

• 15:20Griffin McElroy?

  And that shit came out of nowhere, right? Like, it's, it is, there is no comparison. I don't, I don't want the Switch 2 to be bonkers. I want it to be a stronger Switch with a really good first-party lineup. For me, the thing I'm looking forward to isn't the Switch 2 hardware. It's that the, the dissolution of this fucking logjam of first-party Nintendo titles that we have, just have not been getting. Speaking of, we're gonna talk about Donkey Kong Country Returns HD later in the honorable mention segment. But like, that to me is like, when that is finally moving, when that is finally flowing, then I'm gonna start getting investment.

• 15:57Chris Plante?

  Can I ask, though, like, is Nintendo making a good case for them to continue to be in the hardware business? If this is the hardware, like?

• 16:06Speaker 03

  You said that you don't want the Switch 2 to be anything crazy, right?

• 16:09Chris Plante?

  Yeah.

• 16:09Speaker 03

  Well, I'm not necessarily disagreeing with you. I can't say that I'm like, I was wanting it to be like, it's a camera that goes in your fingers, but like, the, but um, I mean, at this point, why be a company that makes hardware, right? Like, if you, if this is the best you've got, if this is your big idea is like, another Switch, and it's basically like, it's basically a Steam Deck. I mean, like, I, like, if Nintendo is not, things are so much more boring than they were 10, 15 years ago, 10 years ago, whatever. And I don't, I think it's worth, like, kind of, I do think it's worth, like,

• 16:49Speaker 03

  we, we, we like to joke on Nintendo for being such an oddball all the time, but like, I don't, I do think it's a little sad that it's just like such a clear, sort of like, continuing to follow the money that's been working pretty well.

• 17:03Chris Plante?

  I, I think that all completely checks out. I think what Nintendo does at its best is it gets ahead of where the market is going. And that is as early as like, home consoles with the NES then going into the Super Nintendo, that is, the Game Boy going into the Game Boy Advance. They're always like ahead of where the market is. The Wii, there was a moment, it's hard to remember now, where it felt like motion controls were the future of gaming. And the, the funny thing, I guess, about the Switch is they were so far ahead of a schedule. Like, way more than probably ever before. We're, we're gonna create a handheld console experience. So now, the rest of the market is finally catching up to them.

• 17:47Chris Plante?

  And they basically get a freebie of, we don't have to completely reinvent the thing, because we are just dead center in what the market is. The reason that they actually make the hardware then is because they can make money off of hardware where nobody else can. People will design their games down to be on their hardware. I might say down, I mean, the like, visual presentation, not the quality of the game. And people will buy their games wherever they are. So, I think if it were any other company where they're losing money on hardware, you know, Xbox is, I think, hitting this problem, totally agree with you. And I think there's real questions of like, should Xbox even make a handheld? Or should, do they just make an OS that is somehow better than SteamOS?

• 18:28Griffin McElroy?

  But the Switch, I think it's just free money.

• 18:31Russ Frushtick?

  Yeah, it's free money. They sold 146 million switches.

• 18:36Griffin McElroy?

  It's a lot.

• 18:36Russ Frushtick?

  That was as of September of last year, so even more now. It's probably going to be the best selling game console of all time. It's going to beat out, I think the PS2 was ahead of it.

• 18:48Griffin McElroy?

  Or the DS? Wasn't the DS up there?

• 18:53Griffin McElroy?

  DS was up there. I used to do the joystick Japanese gaming hardware sales report every week.

• 18:59Russ Frushtick?

  And to keep in mind, like that, so strictly capitalist reasons, that's the reason to be in the in the console market. And the other thing is, as Plant was alluding to, like, a lot of people will design for this hardware and Nintendo is getting, what is it, 30% of every third-party sale that happens on their marketplace. So.

• 19:18Speaker 03

  Russ, Russ, I love you, my friend. I love you, but please, save this for CNBC. This is an enthusiast.

• 19:27Griffin McElroy?

  You're shooting your, your, your, your wad, man.

• 19:30Russ Frushtick?

  You don't want to bring money, money logic into this?

• 19:32Speaker 03

  What are we doing? Like, what do we give a shit? Like, I'm seri-

• 19:36Russ Frushtick?

  I'm telling you why they're doing it. I'm not saying it's why I'm-

• 19:39Speaker 03

  I'm saying that, like, I think it's, I think it's sad. I think it's very sad, and I think that we should say that it's sad to watch the reveal video for a new Nintendo console and the reaction is, hmm, because that's how I felt, and I can't imagine anybody feeling any different. That's a bummer, man.

• 19:57Russ Frushtick?

  I admit it. I thought the first, the Switch 1 trailer was like a ground-changing moment, and this was definitely not that.

• 20:04Speaker 03

  Wii, Wii U, Switch, Virtual Boy, Nintendo 64, GameCube. I mean-

• 20:12Griffin McElroy?

  Now, hold on, you can't slide Virtual Boy in there like it was-

• 20:16Speaker 03

  When you saw the reveal of the Virtual Boy, you were like, what in the fuck are you guys doing? That's so crazy. You're gonna sell that?

• 20:24Griffin McElroy?

  I bought a Virtual Boy, and it was all the money I had in the world, and it sucked shit.

• 20:27Russ Frushtick?

  But it's still-

• 20:28Speaker 03

  But we, but we like rely, I just think it's like- If the argument is like, we should be celebrating Nintendo because they get to rest on their laurels this generation.

• 20:37Chris Plante?

  No.

• 20:37Russ Frushtick?

  I'm not saying we, we should celebrate them.

• 20:39Chris Plante?

  Yeah.

• 20:40Russ Frushtick?

  I'm just saying they're gonna make a really successful fucking handheld. I, I would also say it leaves them room to do two things.

• 20:46Speaker 03

  You would leave this to Microsoft. Let Microsoft do this.

• 20:49Chris Plante?

  All right.

• 20:49Speaker 03

  All right. A true gamer would want the cameras in the fingers.

• 20:53Chris Plante?

  Right.

• 20:54Speaker 03

  Where Miyamoto-san sees the future.

• 20:56Russ Frushtick?

  Let me just say, I think, apart from the shock value, all their innovation comes in software. Like, you get that initial shock value of what is this console? And then, once the console's out, the next seven or eight years is just like, basically, software innovation. Or, hey, we're gonna let you build a cardboard robot that connects to your Switch for some fucking reason. Like, they will bring innovation in other ways. I agree with you. This handheld, this console does not seem like it is bringing that fire. But they're gonna have the new answer to like, what Zelda's fucking is this year.

• 21:26Chris Plante?

  You know what? You know what? I want hoops. I want the original.

• 21:30Speaker 03

  You're proving my point. Don't make hardware then. But then they get to make fun.

• 21:35Russ Frushtick?

  They make money, and then the money funds the software, like.

• 21:38Speaker 03

  They make money off of us buying it. Do you understand what I'm saying? Just make video games. Don't, you're not proving the worth of your existence. Why exist?

• 21:46Chris Plante?

  We, we're missing it. It is so obvious. They have to keep the Joy-Cons because they're gonna finally deliver on the original Switch's promise. You will be able to get fishing Joy-Cons. You will be able to get basketball hoops from Joy-Cons. Where you're flipping little baskets. You're gonna, it is gonna be the Sega Dreamcast accessories of Joy-Cons.

• 22:09Speaker 03

  Switch 2 will be the one where you can insert it into the, the original Joy-Cons will be.

• 22:14Chris Plante?

  A keyboard is going to strap onto your Joy-Con. It's gonna be fucking awesome. And then, we're all gonna look back at this episode and be like, we were, what were we thinking? We should've known that they were gonna put Seaman, the, the, the Dreamcast game in my Joy-.

• 22:31Speaker 03

  That's not how it's pronounced. That is not the emphasis we like to put on Seaman. Here is what I'm telling you guys. Here is what I'm telling you guys. We went from a world where there were multiple Nintendo consoles doing different things in. Different directions, different form factors, like as many as three platforms at once going. And I just think it's like a little sad to go from that Nintendo to Nintendo that follows up like the longest running console it has ever had with just like a number two of that console.

• 23:02Griffin McElroy?

  It's like The name is bad. The name is disappointing. The name, I think, more than anything is disappointing.

• 23:07Speaker 03

  The name is accurate. I feel the name I have the least problem with because it very much is like, mm, Switch.

• 23:12Griffin McElroy?

  You know, my, my grown up Christmas wish for the Switch two is that they have a, they get a little bit more fun with the OS. I miss me, Street Pass. I miss like that, that stuff I feel like was, uh, I don't know. It really characterized what Nintendo's priorities were, uh, when the 3DS was kind of like, you know, the, the, the big heavy hitter for them. Uh, and I feel like the Switch is, it has a very functional OS, but it's not as sort of like silly and exciting. I want to be able to open presents when I buy a game. I want it to be in a little present box and I click that present box and I have presents.

• 23:53Speaker 03

  Here's what I, what I would love if, if Nintendo is going to go down this route, right? What I think you're missing by increasing the size is I think you're losing more of like that portability market. I think there's a market of people and I do think that a lot of the like the retro consoles, part of what they show is that I think people want a device in that form factor, right? You don't necessarily want your Jinkos to, to carry around your thing. I would love for them to play with like something that's in like a VMU, like the idea of a Joy-Con that you can bring with you. You know what I mean? Or can like respond to other people's Joy-Cons. You know what I mean? Like it make it, make there a reason for that.

• 24:32Griffin McElroy?

  A Joy-Con Street Pass functionality? That would be very cool.

• 24:35Speaker 03

  Cause I don't want to carry even less. I already don't carry the Switch around, but like even less am I going to carry that Switch two in my pocket?

• 24:42Griffin McElroy?

  Yeah. I mean, but there's also the Switch Lite, which also isn't pocketable. Uh, I love the Switch Lite. It is my preferred form factor of the Switch, even though the Screen is not anything to write home about, but it is not, it ain't, it ain't pocket sized, right?

• 24:58Russ Frushtick?

  Yeah.

• 24:59Griffin McElroy?

  And so there is something lost.

• 25:01Russ Frushtick?

  Yeah, I would agree that of the, all the things, the limited things they announced, it being bigger was not necessarily a selling point for me because I play it almost exclusively in handheld and I just want to like have it be light and easy to hold.

• 25:14Griffin McElroy?

  Yeah.

• 25:15Russ Frushtick?

  I was also a little bummed that the Joy-Cons do not look remotely, they've like seemingly made no effort to make them ergonomic, which was one of my big critiques of the first Joy-Cons.

• 25:25Griffin McElroy?

  They still look terrible.

• 25:26Russ Frushtick?

  They're still just like flat backs, which I think is because they want people to use it detached and like sideways. But again, I don't think a lot of people are necessarily doing that. So maybe just make them comfortable to hold in most circumstances.

• 25:40Griffin McElroy?

  Yeah.

• 25:40Speaker 03

  If they made it comfortable to hold without the doodads, I think, I think people could meet, it is just that combo of like, even after you put the stupid things on, they're still not very good. It's not worth it.

• 25:50Chris Plante?

  Have you all seen the IONEO 3?

• 25:52Russ Frushtick?

  Yeah.

• 25:53Chris Plante?

  Like that, how you can like replace the, effectively the control faceplates, they're like clip in. I guess, I know I'm repeating myself now, but I really wish Nintendo, I really hope they do something like that. I think having Joy-Cons that are more for ergonomics, I know that, like saying this out loud, I know that they're going to rely on third party to just handle it. But having their design level handling this issue would be so much better and so much more enjoyable.

• 26:22Russ Frushtick?

  You know, I'm starting to feel like the third parties are really doing kind of an amazing job filling in the blanks on the ergonomic side. Like you talk, you look at companies like, I've been using like a GameSir controller, which is a company that I hadn't heard of until like the last year. And it kind of crushes the original Xbox controller, like D-Brand and all these sorts of companies, I think are doing a very good job of, of filling in the blanks where these.

• 26:48Griffin McElroy?

  I got a Power A Nano Controller for the Switch for Henry to use because it's a little bit smaller. And now it's also what I exclusively use because it feels good to use a tiny little.

• 26:57Russ Frushtick?

  I think it just allows for more flexibility, rather than being like locked into whatever the thing is. I just, just fix the fucking Joy-Cons guys, like make sure I don't have to replace them every year because that was.

• 27:10Griffin McElroy?

  They hate that.

• 27:11Russ Frushtick?

  Yeah, they really do.

• 27:13Griffin McElroy?

  I am impressed with our ability.

• 27:15Speaker 03

  One of my least favorite things about the joy cause is how fucking many of them you buy.

• 27:19Griffin McElroy?

  I appreciate the fact that we have gotten 28 minutes of blood out of this stone. I don't know that there's a lot more to talk about.

• 27:25Russ Frushtick?

  There is one more thing. I want to, I want to, because you guys didn't see him initially, uh, because he was in the background. Can we comment on Donkey Kong? The new design for Donkey Kong specifically in Mario Kart 9. Cause that was like the biggest difference that was in the entire trailer. I've dropped an image of the new Donkey Kong into the chat.

• 27:42Griffin McElroy?

  Yeah.

• 27:42Russ Frushtick?

  What are your first reactions?

• 27:44Griffin McElroy?

  I mean, we'll start with his gains are impressive. This is a thick, this is a thick man who has been putting in the hours and the discipline.

• 27:56Russ Frushtick?

  Is this AGH that he's using?

• 27:59Griffin McElroy?

  It's, yeah, it's, it's a ape hormone stuff. I don't know what that acronym stands for. It does look like the movie, it looks like the movie DK, um, to me.

• 28:10Chris Plante?

  Yes. Oh, and like the very classic drawn on the side of the arcade cabinet.

• 28:16Russ Frushtick?

  Oh yeah, it's kind of throwback in that way.

• 28:19Chris Plante?

  Yes, I think that's what they're going for here.

• 28:21Russ Frushtick?

  That was a, that was a meaner Donkey Kong and angrier Donkey Kong.

• 28:25Griffin McElroy?

  The Donkey Kong that is on the left here is just Andross from, um, Star Fox 64 with like different, with wearing some sort of grim ape mask, uh, on.

• 28:39Griffin McElroy?

  Can we go to the break and talk about a really good game called Heroes of Hammerwatch 2? Let's do that.

• 28:46Russ Frushtick?

  Okay, so let's all look back in time to when I introduced Heroes of Hammerwatch to this crew.

• 28:54Griffin McElroy?

  This would be a celebration of you.

• 28:55Russ Frushtick?

  Many years ago, I introduced this game and you guys rolled your eyes. You're like, oh, this is, look at these little baby guys with their old graphics. Who cares? And it grabbed the podcast by storm. I don't think Plant played it, but everyone else played it a lot and really liked it.

• 29:10Griffin McElroy?

  It was my most played Switch game of that year.

• 29:13Russ Frushtick?

  That's crazy.

• 29:14Griffin McElroy?

  I didn't play it a bunch.

• 29:16Russ Frushtick?

  You didn't play it that much?

• 29:16Griffin McElroy?

  It was just me and you, really, Russ.

• 29:18Russ Frushtick?

  Oh, okay. We got, we got hard into it.

• 29:20Speaker 03

  Play this.

• 29:20Russ Frushtick?

  Uh, Hammer Watch 2 came out. We didn't really like that too much. And now, Heroes of Hammer Watch 2 has come out. And the naming convention is very confusing, but this is the good one, y'all.

• 29:31Griffin McElroy?

  Yeah, this is the good one. This was on my-

• 29:33Speaker 03

  Forza Horizon, right?

• 29:35Griffin McElroy?

  Right. This was on my most anticipated Games of 2025 list. I didn't realize that it would be out three days after, like, we released that episode. They totally stealth dropped it.

• 29:47Speaker 03

  Yeah, so it's like, if you can imagine, they grafted, uh, RPG mechanics onto, um, Vampire Survivors. So like, uh, or, and Gauntlet, and you put a little bit of Gauntlet in there, and I think you're pretty, pretty close.

• 30:03Chris Plante?

  Wow.

• 30:05Speaker 03

  What?

• 30:05Chris Plante?

  Why have I not played this?

• 30:06Griffin McElroy?

  Yeah, Chris, you should play this fucking game, man.

• 30:08Speaker 03

  Pretty good.

• 30:09Chris Plante?

  Wow.

• 30:10Speaker 03

  Yeah, so basically, you're making, you're taking a, you're, say you pick a wizard, there's four different classes. It's the classics.

• 30:16Russ Frushtick?

  There's actually seven, but some of them are-

• 30:17Griffin McElroy?

  Yeah, you unlock other ones as you play.

• 30:22Russ Frushtick?

  Come on, Juice, do your homework.

• 30:23Speaker 03

  Does your wife seem happy? Like, does she seem like a happy person?

• 30:25Russ Frushtick?

  No, she does not.

• 30:26Speaker 03

  I didn't think, I wouldn't have imagined. So there's four classes. There's a warrior, and there's a wizard, and there's a, you know, a rogue, and there's a paladin. Each one feels pretty different, you know, it's like, the difference between slinging spells around and then having like, uh, more close combat abilities. But it is still that, like, feels that auto-shooter thing, where you're trying to like, fire as fast as you can and, and fire off your abilities as fast as you can. More, more, uh, I would say more agency than a lot of those like, auto-shooter things give you, but, uh, it is that, it feels like that-

• 30:57Russ Frushtick?

  It's like a Diablo D make in a lot of-

• 30:58Griffin McElroy?

  Yeah, it feels like an ARPG more than a, more than an auto-shooter.

• 31:01Speaker 03

  It's hard because like Vampire Survivors is, is already like a, you know, like, we're taking like, mechanics there and like, boiling them down to their, there's some of that, there's some of that in there. There's Gauntlet in there, there's Vampire Survivors in there, there's, um, a persistent sort of, and actually- If you didn't play Halls of Torment, it's kind of similar to that, where you have different characters that have different gear that you unlock. So like, as you're leveling up each of these individual classes, you guys would have played a lot more than me, so you could probably explain better how leveling up each class is helping your meta.

• 31:36Griffin McElroy?

  So each class has like a mastery bonus that applies to every character. So for the rogue, if you make a rogue, every level that you get with your rogue adds like a 1.5% gold bonus, which really starts to stack up as you level up that class. Sorcerer, if you level them up, it increases your mana regeneration. The basic like loop of the kind of like rogue-like elements of Heroes of Hammerwatch 2 are what make it so strong. Because every time you play, you are leveling up your character and earning those bonuses for every other character you might make. You're finding resources to upgrade your

• 32:16Griffin McElroy?

  town, which unlocks all kinds of different upgrade opportunities for you. You are finding pieces of equipment, which is new for Heroes of Hammerwatch 2. So like, you're not just like leveling up, you're also putting builds together based on like what kind of equipment you're finding, which like has all kinds of new systems associated with it. There's an enchanter that you can use to like get the right, you know, sort of bonuses on it. It's so, it is so much stuff. And it makes it feel like every time you are playing, you are getting stronger in like 10 different ways, which is very, very, very compelling to me.

• 32:53Russ Frushtick?

  It also has the like, the juice that you get when you're playing a Vampire Survivors or Halls of Torment, where you are fighting seemingly like a thousand, I mean, it's not this many, but like 100 guys at once, and the screen is filled with numbers going up, and you get that satisfaction of, I'm gonna drop this nuke and like clear the entire screen. Like, that feels fucking amazing.

• 33:12Speaker 03

  I will say that in, as long as like the Vampire Survivors comparisons are coming, I did experience kind of a slow period in, in most of the time, early in runs, where like, as it's not really much of a challenge, and you're just trying to get it going. I don't know if like, I know Vampire Survivors fixes that with like a hyper mode or like a, you know, of, of, of, you know, that kind of deal. I don't know.

• 33:35Russ Frushtick?

  Yeah, there, there's a, there's a fast travel mode that's a little bit hidden in the game, but you

• 33:39Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 33:40Russ Frushtick?

  basically get the ability to skip the first five levels, worlds. If you feel like you're strong enough. It's actually a really smart system. Once you get, uh, deep enough into the game, you unlock this era, this tower, this room. And you basically say like, okay, I'm going to challenge myself with, basically you can light these different candles. And if you light four candles, a shitload of enemies are going to come in. And if you survive all those enemies, it'll give you enough gear to basically survive seven levels deep. So it kind of like, uh, it's like a skill test.

• 34:11Griffin McElroy?

  It throws one incredibly difficult challenge at you.

• 34:15Russ Frushtick?

  Right.

• 34:15Griffin McElroy?

  In lieu of playing through like three or four levels.

• 34:18Russ Frushtick?

  Right.

• 34:19Griffin McElroy?

  Which is, which is great because then you skip ahead. You skip ahead to the harder stuff where you're getting more experience and more money and better loot. And like, it lets you skip some of the more, uh, you know, repetitive stuff that you've already done. Uh, here's a hammer watch two is actually pretty good at, at, uh, at doing that. More so, more so than, um, here's a hammer watch one.

• 34:37Russ Frushtick?

  Yeah.

• 34:38Griffin McElroy?

  I think it looks great. I think it, it, I'm playing as a Paladin and it also has class specialization. So once you get a class to level 10, there's like three different branches that it goes off in. Uh, so the Paladin I'm playing is all about like fire magic that goes out in this huge radius, which then sets off this combo system. So now you're moving twice as fast and shooting like bolts of light out of you. It's so like fast and crazy.

• 35:02Speaker 03

  I'm often hard on games with a retro aesthetic, but I will say they're doing some really cool stuff with like transparencies and things like that. That have like a, it almost makes it feel a little bit uncanny valley because it's like graphically, it's sort of, it looks like something you'd remember, but there are, there's effects, there's things going on under the hood that, that feel very modern. I don't know. It's a cool.

• 35:21Russ Frushtick?

  Yeah, the lighting is very modern.

• 35:22Speaker 03

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Um, and the designs, like the designs, the individual like characters and the spells and stuff are, are, are modern. Did you guys like playing all of the classes equally or did you find yourselves gravitating towards some?

• 35:34Russ Frushtick?

  I went wizard. I started with a wizard and that's kind of like glass cannon is usually what I start games with and that felt really good and I ended up leveling that up all the way and eventually beating the game with it.

• 35:46Griffin McElroy?

  What's the bonus for that?

• 35:47Russ Frushtick?

  What's cool is when you beat the game, you get gear for the other classes. So I was able to start a fresh Paladin with like a level 20 sword right from the jump. So what was previously like a very slow restarting of a character from scratch actually went a lot faster because I was like, what's the term? Twinking? Is that right?

• 36:08Griffin McElroy?

  Yeah.

• 36:08Russ Frushtick?

  That doesn't sound right, but when you drop gear for a little-

• 36:10Griffin McElroy?

  That's right. I mean, that is what it is called. Yeah.

• 36:12Speaker 03

  I have not heard that term used for quite some time for reasons that I bet you could figure out.

• 36:19Russ Frushtick?

  So yeah, I was able to like basically get past the slow parts of leveling up a guy from scratch. For Chris Plant, I will say this. The reason that I think, I think you would enjoy the core gameplay, but this game definitely requires you to do that thing where when you're level three, there is no possibility you will ever beat the game. Numerically speaking, you will not have the strength to get to the end of the run. It's not spelunky. You don't start from scratch. You need to like grind the resources to get enough stuff to level up the skills to get you there. Once you're there, it feels really good and satisfying because you feel like you've earned it, whatever. But that is just a heads up because I know you are not a big fan of doing that stuff.

• 37:01Speaker 03

  I, my, I did not have a lot of problems with the game. The only thing that was like tripping me up, and this could just be, yeah, your mileage may be everything, but some of the abilities, like the wizard has an ability where it's like bringing up a reticle and then you're firing. So it's like bringing up a targeting reticle while you're moving around. And there's this targeting reticle and then you have to push a different button to fire off the attack. So it's like you start the ability and then you aim with the the reticle while you're moving and then you fire it off. And I found-

• 37:33Griffin McElroy?

  It feels like more of a mouse and keyboard kind of contrived.

• 37:36Speaker 03

  It's not hard or impossible. It just, especially on the Steam Deck, like felt bad. It just like, I was getting like a weird claw grip to make it happen.

• 37:44Russ Frushtick?

  It's not remapping a lot of controls just to make it feel better.

• 37:47Speaker 03

  And when you're moving, trying to like target something in that view while you're moving, it just feels like too much. I don't know. I like the characters that were, that didn't rely on, on that as much.

• 37:59Russ Frushtick?

  Yeah.

• 38:00Griffin McElroy?

  I will also say there was a patch yesterday that improved this somewhat, but there is this insane issue where after you play a certain number of levels, the load times become exponentially longer and it doesn't get fixed until you quit the game and restart. Which is, which is like, they do save it every time you start like a new level of your run. So it's not like catastrophic, but it is pretty annoying. And, and hopefully the kind of things that, that, that they can fix.

• 38:28Russ Frushtick?

  It seems like they've been very proactive. There's been, I think the game launched last week and there's been three patches, significant patches since then that have really addressed a lot of the community concerns. I think they are very worried after the reaction of Hammer Watch 2. I think they're like extremely worried of like falling in that muck again, but obviously the response for this one has been much more positive.

• 38:49Griffin McElroy?

  Really great. I'm, it's so strange to me how they released this. Like, I know it's not the biggest franchise in the world, but this game kicks ass. It's really exceptionally fun and good and I can't stop playing it. And the people play, the like community is like super, super into it. I don't understand why they didn't put like a little bit of heat.

• 39:11Russ Frushtick?

  Here's my thinking.

• 39:12Speaker 03

  Well, I, I will say, guys, I think you got some roast in the glasses on. I'm enjoying it, but like, I think you're seeing a lot of the potential, potential because of the experience you've had. That, my experience technically was really bad. I mean, like really bad, like freezes. Beyond the caching, like it would just stop, hard stop, or like it wouldn't be able to move the character like there's a lot of stuff going like that. And some of the things we're talking about with like. Equipment and the way that those systems all interact, a lot of it's like not very clean or well explained. And maybe you understand it better like from, from previous experience, but I think there's probably more rough edges than you're, than you're seeing.

• 39:50Russ Frushtick?

  I think that's right. And, and keep, keep this in mind. When I got super into Heroes of Hammerwatch, it was at the Switch launch. And this game is only on PC right now. And I'm pretty sure when Heroes of Hammerwatch one launched, it launched on PC first. And then, I don't know, it could have been a year later that it launched on Switch. And so it wouldn't surprise me if to answer both of your questions, one, they're going to address a lot of those issues as they work through these patches. And two, they'll do more of a marketing push when the game hits console. I could see both of those happening. I am really loving it. I'm very much into it. And if you're a fan of the first one, I think you should definitely check it out. If you're a little wary, you can wait because

• 40:34Russ Frushtick?

  it'll, you know, they're clearly patching it a lot and, and.

• 40:37Speaker 03

  It's hard. It definitely feels like one of those that like, if you play it in a year, it will almost certainly be a better experience. Like it's almost certainly gonna be.

• 40:45Russ Frushtick?

  I don't, I don't think it's in a bad state right now, but I think a lot of that, you're right, has to do with me and the amount of time that I've spent on the original.

• 40:54Speaker 03

  On the original.

• 40:54Russ Frushtick?

  But I am more, the fact that I'm already seeing performance gains and like not seeing as those like dramatic slowdowns that I was three days ago.

• 41:01Speaker 03

  Oh, yeah.

• 41:02Russ Frushtick?

  Really says that they're pretty tuned in to what's going on.

• 41:04Griffin McElroy?

  The first game also got a few really good DLC releases that I'm hoping they will, they will continue supporting. I don't know. I, I loved that first game and Hammerwatch two, I thought was so, so disappointing and frustrating. And I was worried that they would not be able to sort of like return to form. But I, I, I think that those fears have been assuaged for me.

• 41:29Russ Frushtick?

  One last thing, it is really, really fun in multiplayer. We mentioned it in passing, but it's like kind of perfectly designed for multiplayer. It supports up to four players normally. Apparently people have been using debug codes to get like 16 people in a game, which is very funny to watch.

• 41:44Griffin McElroy?

  I joined the server with 64 players. It was so funny. I had to leave after like 10 seconds because my switch, my Steam Deck was gonna melt in my hands.

• 41:51Russ Frushtick?

  But it's great. You can revive people. There's like this tension of like, oh shit, this guy died while going through a bunch of traps. Do I bother to revive him or not?

• 42:00Russ Frushtick?

  It just feels very much like a great, it would be like a great couch co-op experience or online for that matter. It's, it's very stable. It doesn't feel laggy at all.

• 42:08Griffin McElroy?

  Yeah.

• 42:10Griffin McElroy?

  What are we gonna do now, guys? Are we gonna do honorable mentions and talk about Donkey Kong Country Returns HD?

• 42:15Chris Plante?

  Let's do that. Let's do that.

• 42:17Russ Frushtick?

  Sure.

• 42:20Griffin McElroy?

  I didn't play the original Donkey Kong Country Returns.

• 42:24Russ Frushtick?

  I played it on 3DS. This is actually the third time it got, I guess the second time it got re-released, uh, cause it came out on Wii originally. And then it got released like a year later on 3DS and now this is coming out on Switch, which is a very bizarre sequence of events.

• 42:41Griffin McElroy?

  Yeah, but it was the predecessor to Tropical Freeze, which was a Wii U game that came to Switch. And now there's an HD version of Donkey Kong Country Returns.

• 42:54Russ Frushtick?

  Yeah.

• 42:55Griffin McElroy?

  Called Donkey Kong Country Returns HD.

• 42:57Russ Frushtick?

  And it was, this was the basically retro saying, we're gonna reboot the Donkey Kong Country franchise, uh, after doing so well with Metroid Prime. And so they made basically, you know, they, these games play like Donkey Kong Country, but obviously with 3D graphics, uh, but still side scrolling. And I think with this one in particular, they were, it feels very much like they're like, let's get our feet wet. And more or less make like a relatively basic platforming game in the style of Donkey Kong Country. But from a design perspective, we're not gonna like swing for the fences necessarily. We're gonna like focus on other stuff. I don't know. Just to like,

• 43:38Russ Frushtick?

  get it set. And so when you compare this game to Tropical Freeze, it's like kinda night and day. Tropical Freeze feels like a much more developed, thoughtful game.

• 43:47Griffin McElroy?

  Yeah. I played it with Henry, pretty much exclusively in two-player mode. And we were having a pretty good time with it. It does get really hard, really, really fast, because it's a Donkey Kong Country game. And when I say really hard, I mostly mean, you know, for, for an eight-year-old. I'm fucking li- I can beat any game, like, try me, put me in front of you, I'll fuck it up. But it, it started to get very frustrating. There is one mechanic that I think is the worst thing, just the worst thing ever, to ever feature in any kind of multiplayer platform or game. And it is that if one of your players dies when you're playing co-op,

• 44:33Griffin McElroy?

  that player can respawn into the world as a DK barrel on a balloon that floats down. And it goes across the screen, back and forth, in an insane sine wave that is unpredictable and demonic. And if you don't hit it as the other player to free that monkey, then that barrel's gone, as is that life. So like, there was a level we were trying to get through for a long time. That was like an ocean level, where you're jumping across all these little platforms and trying not to fall into the water and instantly die. And if one of us would die, we'd spawn back in, and the barrel would just zoop, zoop, zoop, zoop, zoop, back and forth. And we'd miss it, and would go through all of our lives, and then lose and have to restart the entire level.

• 45:17Griffin McElroy?

  Like, there's some stuff in here that is so frustrating, and not in a enjoyable way.

• 45:24Chris Plante?

  Ruin the faith of your child in you, right? Like, your child is like, "You, Dad, Mom, you're a pro gamer. Surely you can do this." And here you are, jumping off a cliff, trying to save the life of your child.

• 45:39Griffin McElroy?

  Of your child, yes.

• 45:41Chris Plante?

  And they're like, "Wow, you can't even, you can't even do this? You can't even do this for me? If you're gonna fail me here, how are you gonna fail me in the future?" I do not, I'm not a fan of this.

• 45:51Russ Frushtick?

  It's also weird, because Tropical Freeze did add more, I guess, help to kid gamers. They added the Funky Kong mode, which had, he had more health, he had a double jump, he had like fucking hovering, like, he had all sorts of like- Things that he was making the game easier with, and it doesn't seem like they've added a lot of that stuff here.

• 46:12Griffin McElroy?

  There's an inventory where you can like bring power ups and stuff like into levels. Uh, most of them don't work when you're playing in co-op mode. So like, what are we, what are we doing, man? Um, we, we pivoted off discussing this as like our main game of the week. I think pretty quickly after each of us played it and we're like, it's, there's not a ton to.

• 46:32Russ Frushtick?

  It does, it does make me wonder, I just worry a little bit because Nintendo will obviously continue doing this. They're gonna re-release their old games and in a lot of cases, I'm thrilled that that's happening because there are games like Link Between Worlds that I would love to play again in full graphics and on a big screen, something like that. But I do worry that like, if the barrier to like a remake is this, rather than like a much more full-featured thing, that, that makes me a little worried. Like, I think Super Mario World was a great example. What was it? Super Mario?

• 47:07Griffin McElroy?

  3D World.

• 47:08Russ Frushtick?

  3D World was paired with Bowser's, whatever the fuck story.

• 47:12Griffin McElroy?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 47:13Russ Frushtick?

  Whatever that game was.

• 47:13Griffin McElroy?

  That was great.

• 47:14Russ Frushtick?

  That was fucking amazing because you got two great games in one package. Totally worth it, but this for $60 is just like, it's a Wii game for $60.

• 47:23Speaker 03

  I want to just say also, I want to resent my earlier trepidation about the Switch 2. If Nintendo can continue to deliver like this on the software end, I think we're in for a very bright future indeed.

• 47:35Griffin McElroy?

  I think this is more indicative of the logjam. The fa- the past like, I don't know, man, year of Nintendo first-party exclusives has been so lackluster. Uh, and so disappointing. And it just feels like there's this big, beautiful tomorrow waiting just around the bend.

• 47:56Chris Plante?

  The weird one for me is why not Wind Waker? Like, that thing has been done forever and like, why are we getting this?

• 48:07Russ Frushtick?

  My thinking, my guess is that they just are spacing out, spacing out Zelda titles and they just had a Zelda title come out four or five months ago.

• 48:16Chris Plante?

  They need one next year.

• 48:17Russ Frushtick?

  And they need one next year. So that, that would be my guess. But I'm sure it'll happen. I mean, I've been saying that for four years, but I'm sure it'll happen.

• 48:25Griffin McElroy?

  Can we talk about other honorable mentions?

• 48:27Russ Frushtick?

  Yes.

• 48:27Speaker 03

  Yes. Um, I want to briefly mention one, the movie Night Bitch on, uh, you can watch it on Hulu. It's adapted from a novel and it's a, I would say like it's sort of a heightened reality.

• 48:44Speaker 03

  Movie.

• 48:45Chris Plante?

  I hope so.

• 48:45Speaker 03

  Yeah, I would say, uh, it is a movie about, uh, a, a woman struggling with, uh, balancing like motherhood and her career and her aspirations and the pressures that society puts on her and, and everything. And it is, in the premise, there is this idea that she is turning into a dog at night. And that is a metaphorical device, maybe. I don't know. You gotta watch the movie, find out.

• 49:18Chris Plante?

  There was a wink there.

• 49:19Speaker 03

  Yeah, there was a wink. You didn't hear it. But it's a movie about how women are expected to function in our society and, and parents in general, and how hard that is and how unrealistic and monstrous in many ways it is. It, there is a lot of stuff watching this movie that like, I could feel like my wife sort of like reverberating with and things in this movie that like helped me understand what her experience is like and has been like. There is a lot of this movie that I'm already realized from like talking to my wife over the years and, and, and living through things with her. But if you are someone who is a young parent, uh, on no matter what, where you are in the sort of like gender spectrum,

• 50:01Speaker 03

  I think that's like a really powerful movie and a very like, I wish I had seen it as a younger dad because I think I would have been a better parent and I, if I had seen it and understood a little bit better, sort of like my wife and, and, and where her head had been at. But it stars Amy Adams. It's called Night Bitch. It's very funny. It's very well done. It's very entertaining. It's not like preachy or anything, but it is, I found it very moving. So. The other thing I briefly wanted to mention is that since we had our like retro discussion, I've been like, uh, Messing around a lot with the retro, retro games and trying to get a bunch of stuff up and running on the Retroid 5.

• 50:45Speaker 03

  And I had this idea of like trying to get a bunch of FMV stuff that I had never checked out, right? The like digging that out. So here's the problem is the Philip CDI had this thing called the digital video cartridge, which

• 50:59Russ Frushtick?

  And Justin can confirm, this shouldn't be a three hour YouTube essay, right?

• 51:03Speaker 03

  It'll be really quick.

• 51:05Griffin McElroy?

  Jenny Nicholson this if you wanted to.

• 51:06Speaker 03

  It will be really quick. So, you know, like a memory pack expansion for the Nintendo 64, right?

• 51:13Griffin McElroy?

  Right.

• 51:13Speaker 03

  This is a digital video cartridge that you had to install in the Philip CDI because it could play video, but in order for it to like process video off the discs, you needed the digital video cartridge, which was not inbuilt into the Philip CDI. The digital video cartridge has not been well emulated in any real sense that is that can be reproduced. So there are a lot of titles on, on the, the CDI that I have never, and as far as I could tell, will never experience because the emulation is not there and there's no passion for it. There's things like, guys, what's Christmas country and Christmas crisis?

• 51:58Speaker 03

  I don't know, right? Do you remember the sixties? I don't know. I don't get a chance to, you know, because I don't

• 52:05Russ Frushtick?

  Is that actually a game?

• 52:06Speaker 03

  Yeah. Monty Python's Invasion from Planet Skiron? And I don't get to, that's, it's not fair, right? There's a seventh guest, you know? Guys, there's a Hulk Hogan, Thunder in Paradise FMV game that I don't get to. I listen, okay, listen, that's a bad one. But here's what I, here's what I'm doing. Here's the deal. I am taking this opportunity to announce Justin McElroy Prize for Success in Innovation. And here is the prize. If you can get the Philip CDI digital video cartridge emulated in a way where I can play it on my Retroid Pocket 5, I will give the recipient of that award $1,000 in Olive Garden gift certificate.

• 52:51Griffin McElroy?

  Wow.

• 52:54Griffin McElroy?

  That's a lot of pasta.

• 52:56Speaker 03

  I will not be adjudicating this. I will not be researching it. If you are the person who says, hey hoops, here's how I can get these digital video cartridges going for you. I did the emulation. I made it up. That person's gonna get this incredible prize. Let their hunt, let the race begin. Let man's progress be unfettered. And let's get. Okay, I mean like.

• 53:22Griffin McElroy?

  And our lawyer's not here. Our lawyer's not on the call, so I'll go ahead and say.

• 53:26Speaker 03

  Is not on the call.

• 53:28Griffin McElroy?

  I'll go ahead and say this might not work for you at home. If you think I have the skills to do this, you might do it and still not win the prize. There is gonna be an element of chaos.

• 53:38Russ Frushtick?

  The first person to email you, right?

• 53:39Speaker 03

  The first person to email me with their work. Don't just email me a link to something you read that might work. No, I want you to make it. Make it easy for me. I'm using the same, I'm using the same CDI core. It's within the main framework. That seems to be the accepted way people are playing CDI games. By the way, this isn't like piracy. No one gives a shit about the Philp's CDI on in any reality. If I called Phillips, they wouldn't, I don't even know if I could call Phillips. I don't think I could.

• 54:09Griffin McElroy?

  I don't think you could call Phillips at all.

• 54:11Chris Plante?

  I, I, I just wanna make sure I have this right because I am writing the rules down into the newsletter. If the, the Justin McRoy Prize for Success in Innovation. If you can get the Phillips CDI emulation fully playable on Justin's Retro pocket 5.

• 54:27Speaker 03

  Well, I'll let me say the, the Phillips CDI digital video cartridge emulated. Cause that's what I need.

• 54:35Russ Frushtick?

  It's easier to pick a title. Maybe you should just tell people if you can play Christmas.

• 54:39Speaker 03

  Because I don't want them to like, but I, this is a prize in innovation. This isn't selfish. I'm trying to move mankind forward.

• 54:47Russ Frushtick?

  I see, I see.

• 54:48Speaker 03

  Do you understand?

• 54:48Russ Frushtick?

  Yes, yes, yes.

• 54:49Chris Plante?

  Sorry, say this, the digital video cartridge?

• 54:52Speaker 03

  Yeah, that's, yeah. Hey, play, I'll say this. If they have this much trouble with what it's called, they're probably not gonna win the prize. Okay?

• 55:00Russ Frushtick?

  Can they get cash value for the cards?

• 55:02Speaker 03

  Yeah, they can, they can, as long as they don't mind selling someone their Olive Garden gift certificates. Because that's the only way it's gonna work. Maybe somebody will give them pennies on the dollar.

• 55:11Griffin McElroy?

  Potter down at the bank is buying Olive Garden certificates for 50 cents on the dollar. I'll be closing my account.

• 55:20Speaker 03

  Now, hold on just one second. I'm trying to open Cabara's Grill.

• 55:27Griffin McElroy?

  Your money's in her Olive Garden gift certificates.

• 55:31Speaker 03

  All the Darden family of brands is represented.

• 55:36Griffin McElroy?

  I want to, I want to promote a documentary series on Peacock called SNL 50 Beyond Saturday Night. It's a four part docu-series about Saturday Night Live on its 50th anniversary. First episodes about, it's called Five Minutes and it's all about auditioning for Saturday Night Live. What that is like from all the cast members. Uh, the second episode's about what it's like to be a writer going through the week, you know, Monday to Saturday. And the third part is about the more cowbell sketch. The whole thing is about the whole, uh, and then the fourth part is about season 11, which was the insane season where Lorne Michaels returned to the show after like a five year hiatus

• 56:19Griffin McElroy?

  and cast fucking Randy Quaid and Robert Downey Jr. And like all of these people who were only on for a single season, almost getting the show canceled forever. It's so fascinating. The audition and writing episodes have given me so much anxiety as a like comedic performer. Uh, and so, uh, there is a strong emotional response, but I think it's just fantastic. And it really, really, really takes you behind the, behind the curtain.

• 56:47Russ Frushtick?

  I cannot fathom the amount of anxiety that that show must produce in people. It is

• 56:53Griffin McElroy?

  Yeah.

• 56:53Russ Frushtick?

  truly the worst scenario.

• 56:56Speaker 03

  It really though, I, I just want to echo what Griffin said. That first episode is, is the only one I've watched so far, but like you think about what Broadway video, which like Lorne Michaels company like has access to the, I mean, like think about all of these auditions are. Perfectly captured in HD. So there's so much footage you've never seen before of like people, people watching their auditions for the first time. Like that's like seeing Heidi Gardner watch her audition.

• 57:21Griffin McElroy?

  Of comedy.

• 57:21Speaker 03

  Yeah, 100%. That's yeah.

• 57:23Griffin McElroy?

  Oh, man. Heidi Gardner's audition is so like her response to it is so moving. You get to see Tracy Morgan's audition, which is like the funniest shit. Will Ferrell's audition is like iconic. Like, I don't know. It's I I have fallen off SNL. It's not a show I watch every week anymore, but the I I I feel like I care a lot about that show still and and got to see some stuff about it that I didn't know. I also have been messing around with Retro pocket 5 and I've been playing mostly Final Fantasy IX because we talked about it last week. That game still looks fucking great and it's fun to play and Shenmue because finally Dreamcast emulation is pretty good. And Shenmue is a absolutely wild thing.

• 58:06Speaker 03

  I maybe need to come up with a new prize to make Seaman work. That one's tough to emulate too. I was trying to get that going.

• 58:13Russ Frushtick?

  Do you have a mic on the Retro pocket 5?

• 58:15Speaker 03

  I don't know.

• 58:16Russ Frushtick?

  How are you gonna talk to Letter Nimoy if you don't have a mic?

• 58:18Speaker 03

  I don't know.

• 58:20Griffin McElroy?

  I'm gonna Google that.

• 58:23Russ Frushtick?

  Uh, Plant, you have anything?

• 58:25Chris Plante?

  Um, people who are in New York, go to the MoMA if you can between like now and I think like mid February. Cause there is a movie playing that I think the last time it played was 2010 called The Clock. And it is a 24 hour movie.

• 58:43Russ Frushtick?

  Oh, my God.

• 58:44Chris Plante?

  Where each minute is related to moments in other movies where they're talking about that minute. So like if it's 2:22 PM, they it's a clip from Taking a Pelham 123 where John Travolta is like, "It's show 22! You better be ready by 2:34!" And then at 2:34, we like get the follow up to that scene for 24 hours. It sounds.

• 59:10Russ Frushtick?

  Can I just watch it on Netflix or something?

• 59:11Chris Plante?

  I wish, man. I really wish because the first.

• 59:16Chris Plante?

  I don't know, 10 minutes, I was like, oh, this is real painful and slow. The next five minutes, I was like, I think I'm asleep. And then in the next two and a half hours, I'm like, this is the most engaging thing ever.

• 59:28Russ Frushtick?

  I mean, it's like TikTok.

• 59:30Chris Plante?

  It is. You can't stop. Like, it's...

• 59:34Russ Frushtick?

  It's like constant cliffhangers.

• 59:35Chris Plante?

  And the artist who made it has like a great sense of humor. So you start to realize that it is kind of building its own story and that there are callbacks and goofs between all of it. And it is not like all art films. Like, a lot of it is...

• 59:52Russ Frushtick?

  I mean, it couldn't be.

• 59:53Griffin McElroy?

  Yeah, right?

• 59:54Chris Plante?

  Yeah. Um, it's great. And I, yeah, if you can go see it, you should. Also, if you can't go see it, hey, I'm just gonna say you should be using your Crunchyroll subscription right now because it's the new season of anime and there's a lot of good stuff. Uh, Honey Lemon Soda, I watched. It was just good vibes. If you want a little sweet romance, you can get that right now.

• 1:00:21Russ Frushtick?

  Cool.

• 1:00:21Griffin McElroy?

  Russ, what about you?

• 1:00:22Russ Frushtick?

  Uh, I played Donkey Kong Country. I'm in, uh, you know, potty training hell, so it has been a lot going on. I'm continuing to play Pokemon Snap, new Pokemon Snap, which is, I think we're like, probably 50 hours into that game. There is so much fucking shit in that game. It's insane.

• 1:00:41Griffin McElroy?

  That's incredible.

• 1:00:42Russ Frushtick?

  I think, I think I massively underestimated it when I first played it. And if you are a Pokemon fan or you want to turn a child into a Pokemon fan, holy shit, this is the one to do it with. Uh, very, very, very fun.

• 1:00:58Russ Frushtick?

  I think we did it. Do you want to recap?

• 1:01:01Chris Plante?

  Yeah, we talked about the Nintendo Switch 2 announcement. We dug into Heroes of Hammerwatch 2, Donkey Kong Country Returns HD. We also mentioned Final Fantasy IX, Shinmu, new Pokemon Snap, Night Fitch, SNL 50, Beyond Saturday Night, The Clock at MoMA, and Honey Lemon Soda. And we revealed, or announced, the Justin McRoy Prize for Success in Innovation. You can find the details at besties.fan.

• 1:01:32Russ Frushtick?

  I wanted to thank everyone over at the Patreon for supporting us. Patreon.com/thebesties. You can get new episodes and all sorts of cool stuff there. We have Rest These episodes. We have this month's bracket episode. We have a new bracket episode coming out first week of February. Always new stuff there. So, thank you so much to all y'all for supporting us. I also wanted to mention that the readers, specifically Bastode, wanted to applaud us over the fact that Russ from Metro Gamecorps last week mentioned that he was a Master Chief in the Navy and none of us made a joke.

• 1:02:09Griffin McElroy?

  Oh, guys. Oh, man. We were all on our best behavior, I think.

• 1:02:13Russ Frushtick?

  We really were.

• 1:02:14Speaker 03

  Yeah. I think we all did the like simultaneous eyebrow raise.

• 1:02:20Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 1:02:21Russ Frushtick?

  I was vibrating.

• 1:02:23Griffin McElroy?

  What are we doing next week?

• 1:02:25Speaker 03

  Next week, we're going to be talking about Citizen Sleeper 2, a bit of a cult hit. Getting a follow-up here. We beloved the first one. Will we beloved this one? Hard to say. Only time will tell. Find out next time on The Besties. Because shouldn't the world's best friends pick the world's best games?