Ep. 749: The MeatEater Running Club

Steven Rinella https://www.instagram.com/stevenrinella/?hl=en talks with Jimmy Rinella https://www.instagram.com/jimmyrinella/, Katie Finch, Janis Putelis https://www.instagram.com/janis_putelis/, Brody Henderson https://www.instagram.com/brodyjhenderson/, and Seth Morris https://www.instagram.com/sethmorris_45/?hl=en. Topics Discussed: Jimmy's public face reveal; Steve's big butt hole; Jani's race and chap ass; unevenly-hanging testes; how another American recently died being charged by a cape buffalo in Africa; the hats that Steve can and can't pull off; and more. Connect with Steve https://www.themeateater.com/authors/steven-rinella and The MeatEater Podcast Network https://www.youtube.com/@MeatEaterPodcastNetwork Steve on Instagram https://www.instagram.com/stevenrinella and Twitter https://twitter.com/stevenrinella?lang=en MeatEater on Instagram https://www.instagram.com/meateater, Facebook https://www.facebook.com/StevenRinellaMeatEater/, Twitter https://twitter.com/MeatEaterTV?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor, and Youtube https://www.youtube.com/@MeatEaterPodcastNetwork See omnystudio.com/listener https://omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

  This is an iHeart Podcast. Guaranteed Human.

• 0:04Steven Rinella?

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• 1:17Speaker 02

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• 1:31Steven Rinella?

  When you're miles deep in the mountains and carrying everything you need on your back, your boots aren't gear you think about, they're what you depend on. That's why Western hunters trust Zamborland. And man, I'm telling you, I've been running around in some Zamborlands. They are so comfortable and just well-built and feel great in the hills. Family-owned and handcrafted in Italy through three generations, Zamborland boots combine nearly a century of bootmaking expertise with premium materials and new innovations for any pursuit, game, and terrain. They're comfortable, supportive, resolable, and built for the long haul. From rocky desert to steep shale slopes, Zamborland's perfected their craft to ensure your success.

• 2:13Steven Rinella?

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• 2:33Steven Rinella?

  This is the Meat Eater Podcast coming at you shirtless, severely bug bitten, and in my case underwearless. We hunt the Meat Eater Podcast.

• 2:42Steven Rinella?

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• 3:07Steven Rinella?

  Welcome, everybody. Thanks for joining. You'll notice something new. My son Jimmy has been on the show before, but he's never, he's always had that camera. You were on the show here and the camera was behind your head.

• 3:18Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 3:19Steven Rinella?

  Because we had a prohibition on you seeing your cute little face on screen. But then you hit 15 years of age, arbitrary number, you have a learner's permit. What else happened? You have a learner's permit?

• 3:34Speaker 04

  Well, something changed in the mind of his parents. Yep. Yep.

• 3:38Steven Rinella?

  Well, he got to that age.

• 3:40Speaker 00

  Well, that's not totally what happened.

• 3:43Steven Rinella?

  Oh, you tell me what happened.

• 3:44Speaker 00

  Well, Jimmy was, he went on a hunt with you and you were going to share a picture of his hunt. And then all of a sudden, and I was cool with that, but then all of a sudden he had like a public Instagram account.

• 4:01Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, because I decided at his age. Remember does that, remember was that joke, the punchline to the joke? I said, I'll tell you the punchline when you get a learner's permit.

• 4:09Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 4:12Steven Rinella?

  Just because I felt like once you have a learner's permit. So he got his, he's just got his learner's permit. He's 15 and now he can, now when he's on the show, he could, people could see what the kid looks like.

• 4:22Speaker 00

  Yeah. I mean, I don't think it's-

• 4:23Steven Rinella?

  Oh, the only thing that happens, he got taller.

• 4:24Speaker 00

  But it wasn't like a decision. We didn't like discuss like now is the time and this is okay. It's sort of, it caught me unawares a bit too, when that happened. Just before being honest.

• 4:38Steven Rinella?

  The kid can't hide under a rock his whole life?

• 4:40Speaker 00

  No, he can't. But the other two kids, so you're, do you, do you think the other two kids, when they turn 15 will, like that's the age, that's when they can have Instagram accounts?

• 4:50Speaker 04

  Not Rosie.

• 4:52Steven Rinella?

  Not the girl, no.

• 4:53Speaker 04

  No.

• 4:55Speaker 05

  That's not happening.

• 4:55Steven Rinella?

  The other boy.

• 4:56Steven Rinella?

  That'll go over well.

• 4:57Steven Rinella?

  Not the girl. The other boy, sure. Uh, so Jimmy's here. This, this, he's been on the show. How many times have you been on the show, buddy?

• 5:05Speaker 05

  I did kids trivia once, and then I did one podcast in Wisconsin.

• 5:11Steven Rinella?

  Hmm.

• 5:12Speaker 05

  Um, and then I did one in Alaska, and then this isn't, so.

• 5:16Steven Rinella?

  Oh, he's been on the show all the time?

• 5:17Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 5:18Steven Rinella?

  It's number three. Regular. Jimmy just caught, Jimmy just caught a nice fish. The, uh, this spring, Jimmy and I were out fishing, and, and I hit a spot, and, and remember I said the water talked to me?

• 5:32Speaker 05

  The?

• 5:33Steven Rinella?

  What's that?

• 5:34Speaker 05

  The butthole?

• 5:34Steven Rinella?

  Steve's big butthole?

• 5:35Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 5:36Steven Rinella?

  The water talked to me, and we pulled in, and I said, this is where the water talked to me. You dropped your jig down, and what happened?

• 5:45Speaker 05

  Caught a 65-pound halibut.

• 5:47Steven Rinella?

  Hmm. What did the water, what did the water say when it talked to you? It said, come fish here.

• 5:53Steven Rinella?

  Steve, I'm down here.

• 5:55Steven Rinella?

  Fish me, Steve. Fish me, Steve.

• 5:58Speaker 06

  That doesn't sound like the voice of Steve's big butthole. Well, it's gotta travel through a lot of water.

• 6:04Steven Rinella?

  After it comes up, it's distorted.

• 6:06Speaker 06

  Hmm.

• 6:07Steven Rinella?

  Um, in our news, Seth is here. It is, as annoying as it is to have Seth as a neighbor. Oh, it's annoying, huh? It just paid off. I'll take my bolts back. It just paid off because just for people to see. I had bought that. You'd think that would pass through two little pieces of aluminum in a bolt hole, but it don't. It's too short. So I went to my neighbor and said, I need stainless steel. I produced that. Whole pile of them.

• 6:42Speaker 06

  You know, I got a segue from-

• 6:42Steven Rinella?

  Pays to have good neighbors.

• 6:44Speaker 06

  I'd buy those bolts for going through the chain. I was unsure about length, so I got two different lengths, because I knew you'd.

• 6:52Steven Rinella?

  Hmm. Well, you could've just got one with more thread on it.

• 6:55Speaker 06

  Well, I got two different lengths.

• 6:57Steven Rinella?

  Well, we'll always put them to use.

• 6:59Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 6:59Steven Rinella?

  Um, Yanis is here. Yanis ran.

• 7:04Steven Rinella?

  We haven't talked to Yanis since this happened. Yanis ran, recently ran one of those 100 mile races. This morning, he got circumspect about it. Is that what, is that what it's called when you kind of get like you start thinking back?

• 7:17Speaker 04

  Yeah, when you're able to look at it from a distance.

• 7:19Steven Rinella?

  He was sitting right over in that chair and he got circumspect and he said, you know a thing about it?

• 7:25Steven Rinella?

  And I thought it was gonna be something like the mental gaming. He was like, "The chap ass."

• 7:33Steven Rinella?

  Like, you just can't picture the chap ass.

• 7:36Speaker 04

  I don't know. I think that would stick with you.

• 7:40Steven Rinella?

  He said crippling chap ass. And there's no way you're gonna run 100 miles without chap.

• 7:45Speaker 04

  Was there something you put on it? Oh, yeah. Lots of it. I use a product called Squirrels Nut Butter. Oh, yeah. I've heard of that. I think people use a product called Body Glide, whatever. And some Vaseline would probably work. Yeah.

• 7:59Speaker 00

  How often are you applying then?

• 8:02Speaker 04

  It seems like all the time.

• 8:07Speaker 04

  But if I had to guess, every one to two hours.

• 8:11Speaker 00

  Oh, wow.

• 8:13Speaker 04

  Are you carrying it with you or are you getting? Yeah, I have like a, I had like a little baby one and I had started with it full and I used it up to the point where at a later aid station, I had to refill from the bigger tub.

• 8:25Steven Rinella?

  So I got a question. Where was the bigger tub?

• 8:27Speaker 04

  Traveling with my crew.

• 8:29Steven Rinella?

  First off, you should probably tell people a little bit what we're saying. You ran 100 miles.

• 8:33Speaker 04

  Yeah, at a race called the Crazy Mountain 100, which happened in the crazy mountains of Montana, which is, I don't know, northeast of Bozeman, maybe 90 minutes or so, depending on what trailhead you go to.

• 8:46Speaker 04

  Yeah, 100 miler had 23,000 feet of elevation gain total through the, into the entire course. It's like Mount Everest. Yeah, what is, what's Everest? 29. Yeah. Somewhere in there.

• 9:00Steven Rinella?

  It's only 29. This is 28 something.

• 9:03Speaker 04

  Yeah, close to 29. It's a long ways up there. Anyways, it's up there. And yeah, my first one at that distance, I've done a couple 50s, working up to that distance and yeah, started on July 25th, finished on July 26th, 33 hours after I started.

• 9:23Steven Rinella?

  33 hours of running.

• 9:24Speaker 00

  So impressive.

• 9:25Speaker 04

  Running and hiking.

• 9:26Steven Rinella?

  And what hour did the chap ass kick in?

• 9:32Speaker 04

  Not that far into it, mile thirty, so I don't know, late in the afternoon, midday of the first day.

• 9:40Speaker 05

  You know what chap ass is, young Jimmy?

• 9:42Steven Rinella?

  I can take a wild guess.

• 9:46Speaker 05

  Picture your butt cheeks.

• 9:51Steven Rinella?

  Going like that.

• 9:52Speaker 00

  Does that happen all the time while hunting?

• 9:54Steven Rinella?

  No, what chap ass comes from is being hot and sweaty. Some people just suffer. Some people have debilitating chap ass.

• 10:01Speaker 00

  Okay, do you?

• 10:02Steven Rinella?

  No, I have had chap ass. I wouldn't say I have debilitating chap ass, and I only get chap ass in hot climates.

• 10:09Speaker 00

  Got it.

• 10:10Speaker 04

  Yannis, is it a common enough thing that you would like see someone on the side of the trail applying? Oh, you don't stop to apply.

• 10:18Speaker 00

  Oh, my God. What do you mean?

• 10:22Speaker 04

  What, you just, you know, you slide your hand down there? Oh, yeah.

• 10:25Steven Rinella?

  So you run along, you get out your chap ass, man.

• 10:28Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 10:29Steven Rinella?

  You go down through or reach around?

• 10:31Speaker 04

  You're going both, both, depending on what's chafing, you know? Yeah, yeah.

• 10:36Steven Rinella?

  You might do it down through.

• 10:38Speaker 04

  Yeah, like, one of my testies like hangs a little bit lower, like I think it does with a lot of men, you know?

• 10:44Steven Rinella?

  I understand.

• 10:45Speaker 04

  And that one tends to just get a little bit more friction also.

• 10:49Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, I got that idea. Appreciate you.

• 10:51Speaker 04

  So, yeah, I would hit that from the front, but mine, it's definitely start, I got a couple of theories, because this is something I had not suffered from at all for most of my life, even though I had been a runner and had done some longer distances.

• 11:03Speaker 00

  And it never happened to you while hunting?

• 11:05Speaker 04

  Never, not even kind of, no.

• 11:07Speaker 00

  Okay.

• 11:07Speaker 04

  And, um.

• 11:09Steven Rinella?

  Hold on, I got hung up on, um,

• 11:13Steven Rinella?

  so one of them hangs down a little bit.

• 11:15Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 11:16Steven Rinella?

  And that causes chafing?

• 11:20Speaker 04

  Well, I think it's chafing on the fabric.

• 11:22Steven Rinella?

  But one isn't, his body's not.

• 11:24Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah.

• 11:27Steven Rinella?

  Jimmy, when a man gets on.

• 11:33Steven Rinella?

  So.

• 11:34Speaker 00

  Wait, no, no, no, I wanna, I wanna hear this.

• 11:37Steven Rinella?

  I just wanna make sure I'm clear. Okay, here's your nuts. One is like this.

• 11:42Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 11:42Steven Rinella?

  Rubbing your undies in his body.

• 11:45Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 11:46Steven Rinella?

  Is not.

• 11:46Speaker 04

  It's sitting high enough that something, something's different. I, I, you know.

• 11:51Speaker 00

  Wouldn't like, like sport underwear change that?

• 11:55Speaker 04

  Yeah, and honestly, sometimes I try to like jack everything up a little bit more to have more support.

• 12:01Steven Rinella?

  Yeah.

• 12:02Speaker 04

  You know, things are just.

• 12:03Steven Rinella?

  You'd have to go to a tailor.

• 12:05Speaker 04

  Micro little rubs turn into a big thing, you know.

• 12:08Steven Rinella?

  I need to have.

• 12:09Speaker 06

  A special set.

• 12:10Steven Rinella?

  One side of my underwear, uh, talking.

• 12:14Speaker 00

  So, so when did you first figure out that that was happening?

• 12:20Speaker 04

  I, you know, it's some other race and, uh, I think it was the 50 mile that I did earlier this summer. And luckily I had this little tub with me at that time because had I not had it, I don't know if I would have made it to the next aid station. Definitely not running. I would have like limped in.

• 12:35Steven Rinella?

  And at the aid station, they have it because it's so calm.

• 12:38Speaker 04

  Oh, yeah, for sure.

• 12:38Speaker 06

  What, um.

• 12:39Speaker 04

  For sure.

• 12:40Speaker 06

  What takes people, like people that are in good enough shape to complete it, what takes them out? Blisters, chapped ass?

• 12:46Speaker 04

  Uh, definitely those two things could.

• 12:49Steven Rinella?

  Chapped ass can take you out.

• 12:50Speaker 04

  Oh, a hundred percent.

• 12:51Steven Rinella?

  You know who, you know who gets terrible, uh, you, you know what is, um.

• 12:56Speaker 00

  You're gonna talk about who gets terrible chapped ass?

• 12:59Steven Rinella?

  No, no, a thing that where, uh, guys going through the buds program.

• 13:03Speaker 06

  I know.

• 13:03Speaker 04

  Oh, yeah.

• 13:04Steven Rinella?

  The sand.

• 13:05Speaker 04

  Sand, yeah.

• 13:05Steven Rinella?

  The sand in your shorts or the sand in your pants will.

• 13:10Speaker 04

  Oh, I can picture that, yeah.

• 13:12Steven Rinella?

  Tap out.

• 13:12Speaker 04

  Because of it.

• 13:13Steven Rinella?

  Because of just, because picture all those hours and days, wet sand packed up in there.

• 13:18Speaker 04

  Yeah, and they're like, they go running for hours on end without changing those clothes.

• 13:23Steven Rinella?

  Yeah.

• 13:23Speaker 04

  So, yeah, it's bad.

• 13:24Steven Rinella?

  Thinking of that, it always seems miserable. I never pictured what you're.

• 13:27Speaker 00

  I have a lot of friends that just like summertime and their thighs.

• 13:31Speaker 04

  Women.

• 13:32Speaker 00

  Yeah, women deal with this. It's not chapped ass. It's like chapped thigh.

• 13:36Steven Rinella?

  Chapped thigh.

• 13:38Speaker 00

  Yeah, and there's lots of different products for it and.

• 13:40Steven Rinella?

  For when your thighs are rubbing on the inside.

• 13:42Speaker 00

  Yeah, like just walking down the street.

• 13:45Steven Rinella?

  Inches apart.

• 13:46Speaker 06

  Yeah, I don't got, I don't have any.

• 13:49Steven Rinella?

  Inches apart.

• 13:51Speaker 00

  Cause um, well, you don't have like twig legs, but you're not, you don't have a lot of.

• 13:57Steven Rinella?

  Well, I just can't picture my thighs.

• 13:59Speaker 07

  You don't have like linebacker thighs. You're just like.

• 14:01Speaker 04

  No, you don't have that high ass like Pete Alonso.

• 14:04Speaker 07

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 14:05Steven Rinella?

  Uh, okay. So I, I gotta, I just, I'm so hung up on the chapped ass thing because this is just a miserable feeling.

• 14:12Speaker 04

  Oh, it's terrible.

• 14:12Steven Rinella?

  So blisters take you out, chapped ass takes you out.

• 14:15Speaker 04

  And I would say probably the next most common thing, just because I've heard about it a lot and it definitely almost took me out is uh, nausea. And I would say that that is connected to what people call GI distress. And I think GI distress comes in many different forms. You could be, have diarrhea, you could be puking, you could just feel nauseated, but people start to not eat because of these symptoms. And then you basically don't have the energy to continue and you just go slowly downhill until you tap.

• 14:48Steven Rinella?

  So people are getting the shits from the running.

• 14:52Speaker 04

  Yeah, from exertion and from, you know, if you haven't trained on what you're eating. And again, cause I don't know the other 200 people that started it with me, right? Like, I don't know what they did going into it to, to train themselves. But I spent time literally eating dinner at home, dressed up in my running clothes, have dinner with my family. And as soon as I was done eating, be like, okay, great. I'm out of here. I would run out the door and go out for two or three hours just to, train like running on a full belly.

• 15:22Steven Rinella?

  Hmm.

• 15:23Speaker 04

  And like, you know, like I, I knew I was, my goal was to try to eat somewhere around 80 to a hundred grams of carbohydrates every hour. Which most of it I, I took through gels or uh, liquid carbs, like a mixed drink kind of thing.

• 15:37Steven Rinella?

  Hmm.

• 15:38Speaker 04

  And so I would also train on that. But the problem was with this distance is that it's very hard to train on what you've, it's hard to train how you feel at mile 60, 70, 80, 90, because you just don't have the time. And just getting to that point takes a lot out of a human body, right? And so.

• 16:02Speaker 04

  You just don't know what it's gonna be like until you're there.

• 16:04Steven Rinella?

  Was there a mile that you thought, I don't think I'm gonna finish? And then was there a mile at which you thought,

• 16:13Steven Rinella?

  I will be do, I'll, I'll do this. I'll get this done.

• 16:15Speaker 04

  Yes, 100%. I, uh, the miles like 75 to 90 were by far the hardest.

• 16:24Speaker 04

  It was a bummer too, because those came like, kind of like the second morning. And a lot of people say that that second morning, like your brain kind of has like the, oh, it's a new day, even though we didn't sleep last night. It's still a new day and we're gonna reset and we're gonna get going. And I did not experience that, even though I was like in my head, I'm like, ah, at any minute.

• 16:42Steven Rinella?

  Like some kind of circadian rhythm like.

• 16:45Speaker 04

  Yeah, 100%.

• 16:45Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, cuz you know, like, I don't do it anymore, but in the old days when you used to drive, you know, you like go drive like a 22 hour drive or whatever and just do it.

• 16:54Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 16:54Steven Rinella?

  You would feel like morning would come.

• 16:55Speaker 04

  Yeah, when the sun comes.

• 16:56Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, it come and all of a sudden you're like, you feel like something clicks in your head and you're sort of back in it, you know?

• 17:01Speaker 04

  Yeah, you can make it another eight hours.

• 17:02Steven Rinella?

  So you were just, you never got no, no little kick?

• 17:05Speaker 04

  I mean, I might have, but it was, it was short.

• 17:10Speaker 04

  But, uh, yeah, I, I think had I not had my buddy Steven Brucker with me, who was pacing me during those miles, pushing me along, continuing to be very positive, a lot of just like, hey, we're doing good. Like, we're moving, you're running, it's great. Like, you're looking good. Just like constant, just all of that. And just like, hey, have you drank? Have you eaten lately? You should drink some more. You should eat some more. And just like, making me eat, you know, and just, and just keeping me moving along. Like, I never stopped. I would, I did stop to actually take a nap purposely, but I never stopped out of pure, just like exhaustion, being like, I can't move any far, I can't go any farther.

• 17:52Speaker 00

  How long was your nap?

• 17:53Speaker 04

  Eight minutes.

• 17:55Speaker 00

  And you fell asleep immediately?

• 17:56Speaker 04

  Oh, hard. I remember like laying down and being like, he's not gonna let you sleep longer than eight, so you better fall asleep quickly. And I was almost starting to stress about not being able to fall asleep. And then all of a sudden, he's like, hey, get up, you know, and so.

• 18:08Steven Rinella?

  Who said that?

• 18:09Speaker 04

  My buddy Steven that was with me.

• 18:12Steven Rinella?

  So he just watched you sleep?

• 18:14Speaker 04

  Oh, yeah, with a big smile on his face. What was funny is that the, at like a trail at an aid station.

• 18:19Steven Rinella?

  So you're meeting up with buddies and they're gonna do blank mile to blank mile with you.

• 18:23Speaker 04

  Yeah, so mostly in the United States, you can't pick up a pacer until roughly halfway. So you gotta do 50 miles on your own and then you can start picking up Pacers. In Europe, it, there's like no Pacers. It's like not a part of it. Like the rule says.

• 18:39Steven Rinella?

  That's the only thing they do harder in Europe than America.

• 18:43Steven Rinella?

  Jimmy, cause they basically like have given up.

• 18:47Steven Rinella?

  And we still got like, we still just, just. Western Europe as a continent is kind of in its retirement.

• 18:54Speaker 00

  Okay, I, no.

• 18:56Steven Rinella?

  They're kinda kicking it. You don't think so?

• 18:58Speaker 00

  No.

• 18:59Steven Rinella?

  Four day work. We, I mean, they're kinda wrapped it up. They kinda wrapped it up. My friend just got back from Spain. He told me all about it.

• 19:06Steven Rinella?

  He say mostly people kick it. He goes, as far as my experience in Spain was like people chill. They chill, they eat stuff. Not a lot goes on.

• 19:14Speaker 00

  That is.

• 19:15Steven Rinella?

  Harrison told me.

• 19:16Speaker 00

  That is a, I mean, no offense to Harrison, but uh, uh, the observations of a 18 year old.

• 19:25Steven Rinella?

  Gospel. Gospel.

• 19:28Speaker 00

  And you're gonna, you're gonna talk about Western Europe as a whole. What was the farthest you ran prior to this?

• 19:35Speaker 04

  55 miles.

• 19:37Speaker 00

  So this was like, you were gonna be like double.

• 19:40Speaker 04

  Pretty much.

• 19:43Speaker 00

  That's crazy.

• 19:44Speaker 04

  Yeah. The interesting thing was is that the body felt fine. It really did. I felt durable. I felt good, but at some point at those miles, I was just talking about like the, the fuel tank.

• 19:56Steven Rinella?

  Yeah.

• 19:56Speaker 04

  Which just seemed to go empty. And even though I was like trying to eat, trying to drink and felt like I was getting stuff in, I just couldn't refill it. The nausea was just like kinda constant.

• 20:08Steven Rinella?

  Did you throw up?

• 20:09Speaker 04

  Never threw up, throw up, threw up. Um, there was a one time where I stepped off to the side of the trail thinking like, oh, it might be coming. And then I was fine and it didn't come.

• 20:19Steven Rinella?

  Did it stay fun or did you get lost in this idea that it would never end?

• 20:24Speaker 04

  No, I got, you start to get worried of like, oh, am I gonna finish? Cause this race has a pretty strict cutoff of 36 hours, which is pretty short for 100 milers. Like a lot of races have more like a 38 or even a 40 hour cutoff. And at one point, Steven says to me, he's like, hey, we're like not in a hurry yet, but like, we don't want to make it interesting. Meaning like, let's not F around because let's like, let's get.

• 20:49Speaker 06

  It'd be such a, just a bummer if you were at 90 miles and they're like.

• 20:54Steven Rinella?

  Oh, just wasted your whole day.

• 20:56Speaker 04

  Like a couple.

• 20:56Steven Rinella?

  Wasted two days.

• 20:57Speaker 04

  Yeah. Well, you can't look at it that way. It's not, it's not a waste. I mean, you've still accomplished something by moving that far. You just don't get the belt buckle. But some guy a couple of years ago literally finished like 36 hours and like 15 seconds. And they, they didn't give him the finisher's buckle.

• 21:15Speaker 00

  Oh my gosh.

• 21:17Speaker 04

  I know. It's a thing. It's been discussed.

• 21:19Steven Rinella?

  I listen, man, I like it, but I'm saying, no, when I, all I'm saying is if I was that guy. Would, and people go like, hey, I heard you ran that 100 mile race.

• 21:28Speaker 04

  Yeah, sure. I did.

• 21:29Steven Rinella?

  Did you finish? I'd be like, yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 21:33Speaker 06

  It's kinda like shooting 199 inch mule deer.

• 21:36Steven Rinella?

  200, 200 inch mule deer.

• 21:37Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 21:41Speaker 00

  I just can't believe that you, I can't believe that you did that. I can't believe that people do that. That is a crazy distance to run.

• 21:49Speaker 04

  It is, it is. No, you, uh, we trailed, ah, every time I say this, I have a hard time spitting those two words out of my mouth. But we cleared trail a couple of weeks earlier with a fella that had done it twice already and did it a third time. The same, when I did it two, three weeks ago. And he's a, uh, middle to back of the pack finisher, but he's finished it every year. But comes in like, he was showing me pictures of like his ankles and his feet the first two years. I'm like, oh my God, I hope I don't have to experience that. I mean, just like swollen and like sausage toes.

• 22:24Steven Rinella?

  Really?

• 22:24Speaker 04

  Yeah, like pretty beat up.

• 22:26Speaker 00

  How do you know you're not like? Totally damaging your body.

• 22:30Speaker 04

  Ah, you don't. I don't. I think the most people, their brain won't let them get to that point. There's few people. Like, we were talking about this with learning how to hold your breath, right? Weren't we? And Jake was telling us about how the only people that will actually take themselves to passing out in the pool are the Navy SEALs. Those kind of people that have that mindset that they're like, oh, you're gonna tell me I can't pass out? Watch me. And they'll go down there and hold their breath until literally they they pass out, right? And I think that there's a small subset of people that will be like, oh, I'm just gonna keep running until someone else tells me to stop. But most people's brain is you're gonna tap out.

• 23:13Speaker 00

  But I think that's the most confusing thing for me about a race like that is if all running, I mean, running for me is like misery. So it's all mental effort to say like, I can do this, mind over matter, whatever. Like, where's the line between mind over matter? And like, you need to listen to your body because it's telling you, like, you're on the edge.

• 23:36Speaker 04

  It's tricky. Because, you know, as tough as it was for me, the recovery was extremely easy. And so I feel like, oh, I maybe could have hit it a little harder. Because some people do talk about recovering for months. And not thinking about doing something like that again for six months. Where right now, I feel like I could, I'd want to talk to maybe some professionals, but I feel like I could go tomorrow and knock out another one.

• 24:04Speaker 00

  Do you think you could ever do that?

• 24:05Steven Rinella?

  No.

• 24:06Speaker 04

  Yeah, everybody could.

• 24:08Steven Rinella?

  Well, okay. I'm sure, yes, I think that if I dedicated myself to it and did all the training, I think that, based on that I can walk long distances, good. I'm sure that I could get there, like, and I would have the, you know, like, when I set my mind to something, I'm gonna do it.

• 24:32Speaker 04

  Yeah, you would 100% have the mental fortitude.

• 24:34Steven Rinella?

  But I would never commit myself, like, I would never deprioritize the stuff I'm already trying to do in order to make room to properly dedicate myself to doing something like that.

• 24:51Steven Rinella?

  And I would never do it half assed.

• 24:56Steven Rinella?

  You know what I mean? It'd be like, it'd be like, if I was gonna do it, I'd have to just do it. And if I was gonna, but I'm not gonna quit doing all the stuff I think about in order to accommodate that. Cause for a while, that's all he, that's all he had room to think about.

• 25:08Speaker 00

  Is that true?

• 25:09Steven Rinella?

  Like free time?

• 25:11Speaker 04

  I mean, you definitely spend a lot of time running and preparing.

• 25:14Steven Rinella?

  But you said, you'd eat dinner and then go run for two, three hours.

• 25:16Speaker 00

  Yeah, but did that, was that like?

• 25:18Steven Rinella?

  I eat dinner and I go fiddle around in my garage for a minute.

• 25:20Speaker 00

  Yeah, but was that like a good thing? Were you like stoked to be doing that?

• 25:23Speaker 04

  Oh, yeah. I enjoy the process.

• 25:26Speaker 07

  Yeah, for sure. Did you keep track of your training miles? Like how many miles you ran?

• 25:29Speaker 04

  You know, I have an app that the, the coach and I, you know, work through together and it, you know, mostly I run with a watch on. And so, yeah, but I can't tell you off the top of my head how many miles I ran in preparation.

• 25:41Steven Rinella?

  Gotcha. Tell me about the minute you knew you were gonna make it.

• 25:44Speaker 04

  Well, so I went through miles 75, 90 in, in, and I haven't, unfortunately, prior to this recording, I haven't had a chance to have a, a good sit down with Steven to be like, okay, tell me what you saw from the outside. Like, he, in short, he's been like, I think you did really good. I think you pushed it. You didn't, you weren't like being a little baby out there and whatever. But, um, it, it was tough. And like I said, I went through a place of just being like, man, like I'm like losing time and people start passing you and you're just like, why can't I run? Why can't I run? But we finally roll into roughly mile 90, 92, I think, where Mark Canyon was gonna start pacing me.

• 26:25Steven Rinella?

  Why did he get the closer?

• 26:27Speaker 04

  Huh?

• 26:28Steven Rinella?

  He got the closer?

• 26:29Speaker 04

  Well, there was two short sections.

• 26:30Steven Rinella?

  I would've come in at 99. I'm like, come on, Yanni! We're in it together!

• 26:35Speaker 04

  You could have. They basically, there's kind of a bunch of rules. Like you can't have more than one pacer prior to that. But that last section, they kind of-

• 26:42Steven Rinella?

  What do they feel, what do they feel, what's the difference?

• 26:45Steven Rinella?

  Is it just trying to police the area and like?

• 26:47Speaker 04

  Yeah, there's a little bit of that. Like it's all under Forest Service permits, right? So they have to watch how many people are kind of using the Forest Service during the race and all that. But um, yeah, I don't know exactly why, but um, yeah, it's probably a lot of it is just to keep the numbers of people down. But anyways, we roll in there and it's whatever. I've got eight miles to go and it's probably one, 1:30 in the afternoon.

• 27:13Steven Rinella?

  You're saying you roll in where?

• 27:15Speaker 04

  Into the, into the last aid station.

• 27:17Steven Rinella?

  Okay.

• 27:17Speaker 04

  It's called hunting camp, but and it is a legit hunting camp that an outfitter uses. Um, but it's set up as an aid station. So you basically come out of the mountains finally, and the last eight miles is on a dirt road that's ever so slightly going downhill. You hit pavement and there's this little micro climb that I'm sure for some people seem like a lot, but it's like a hundred yards and it just barely climbs. And then you pull off the pavement onto another ranch and you've got, I don't know, 300 yards to the finish line.

• 27:47Steven Rinella?

  If you spend a lot of time outdoors, you got dogs, you got kids, you know how hard it is to keep the floor of your rig clean. A thing we do in our, in our little fleet of vehicles that I have at my household, if you go look, open the door on any one of them, they all got WeatherTech. We get a car, we throw the mats out and put in WeatherTech. Cause that way, when there's a mess, it's like your kid's fault, your dog's fault, it's the weather's fault, doesn't matter. You take them suckers out and hose them off and you're back to being good as new. I'm telling you, if you got a vehicle, put WeatherTech in there. You're gonna be happy you did it. And check this out, American made floor liners and cargo liners. Okay? They laugh in the face of all weather. Go take a look for yourself today at weathertech.com. In military families, service is more than a job, it's a legacy.

• 28:31Steven Rinella?

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• 28:55Steven Rinella?

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• 29:23Speaker 02

  One Pay is a financial technology company, not a bank. Banking services provided by Coastal Community Bank or Lead Bank. Members FDIC. Builder card results may vary and aren't guaranteed. Learn more about banking through One Pay at onepay.com/podcast.

• 29:39Steven Rinella?

  Oh, sorry, we had a little mishap. The generator ran out of gas. So if there's a rough edit, that's what happened. Trying to remember where we were.

• 29:47Speaker 04

  Yanni was.

• 29:48Steven Rinella?

  You read the last.

• 29:49Speaker 04

  Oh, Mark Canyon.

• 29:50Steven Rinella?

  Station.

• 29:50Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah.

• 29:51Steven Rinella?

  You tell Mark Canyon, don't be asking me no questions.

• 29:55Speaker 06

  You gotta explain that, like.

• 29:58Speaker 04

  Why he got to finish.

• 29:59Speaker 06

  Like whitetail hunting questions or like how you feeling questions?

• 30:02Speaker 04

  Any. Cause I didn't want to talk.

• 30:04Steven Rinella?

  It's your biggest regret.

• 30:05Speaker 04

  You're out of like, at that point, the human runner is out of energy to waste any energy.

• 30:11Speaker 06

  So you wanted him to talk at you, but you didn't want to.

• 30:13Speaker 04

  Just like entertain my brain. And he was actually really surprised how much I retained. Cause later he was like quizzing me about what I, what we had talked about. I'm like, oh, yeah.

• 30:24Steven Rinella?

  What was he telling you about?

• 30:25Speaker 04

  Well, you know, Mark, he says you're a bookworm. So he gave me like three book reports. And then he told me about the book that he's, you know, pretty much finished writing is at the editor now, the first, first version.

• 30:40Speaker 04

  But I can't remember what else. We definitely talked about some deer.

• 30:43Steven Rinella?

  So he was just filling space with good useful information.

• 30:46Speaker 07

  At that point in time, are you able to like, if he said something funny, are you able to laugh?

• 30:51Speaker 04

  Oh, yeah. Yeah, for sure. Well, what was funny is that.

• 30:55Steven Rinella?

  Whatever worked to put a piece of Saran Wrap between your butt cheeks?

• 30:58Speaker 04

  I think that. No. No, but a slick thing, because this is something that people don't think about is that if you're not ready, when you're applying it.

• 31:10Speaker 04

  You know, it's just your fingers.

• 31:12Steven Rinella?

  Sure.

• 31:12Speaker 04

  And then you're not out there exactly with like a hand washing station.

• 31:16Speaker 06

  Well, that's what I wanted to get back to, like the whole like sanitization.

• 31:20Speaker 04

  Oh, yeah. No, so I would come into the aid station and high five everybody and then like, uh, now that we've done that, you guys all want to sanitize your hands.

• 31:30Steven Rinella?

  Cause I've had my finger in my buttocks.

• 31:31Speaker 04

  Yeah. Yeah.

• 31:33Steven Rinella?

  You know, one of the funniest things that just, I'll get back to the race, but uh, we're, you know, that, that dental floss called Glide?

• 31:41Speaker 04

  Mm hmm.

• 31:42Steven Rinella?

  I remember we were talking about that and my brother Danny was giving it a bad review.

• 31:46Speaker 04

  Yeah, cause it doesn't glide.

• 31:47Steven Rinella?

  He said it was, he said it's like wiping your ass with Saran Wrap, which I always thought was a great visual. That Glide stuff, like it doesn't

• 31:58Steven Rinella?

  get the gunk out.

• 31:58Speaker 04

  No.

• 32:00Speaker 00

  I think it depends on how close your teeth are together.

• 32:02Speaker 04

  That's true.

• 32:03Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, I might be just tight toothed people.

• 32:05Speaker 06

  It's a little too thick.

• 32:06Steven Rinella?

  So Mark's talking all about these books.

• 32:09Speaker 04

  Yeah, he's telling me about books. What's funny is that right there leaving, you gotta climb up this little hill. I forgot. It's a little bit of a bigger hill and I was just gonna walk up it. But Jennifer's like, they're there at the aid station, but they're like, but we made another aid station at the trucks. At the top of the hill and I, when I, when she says that to me, I'm like, why did you make a, an aid station like on top of another hill? You're gonna ask me to at this point, walk up like a bonus hill? Cause to me it sounded like, oh, we're gonna take you off of the trail, up some hill to where the cars are, where we have this nice aid station. And then you can come back. I'm like, I'm not going up some hill. And she's like, looking at me like, what are you talking about? Like right there where you, everybody else has to go. We're like right off the side of the road.

• 32:53Speaker 04

  And then I understood. Anyways, we get up there and two things happened. One, you're out of the mountains. So you're off of the, the crazy mountains. The trails are extremely rough. Like there's a lot of trails that they, there are signs that say, like do not take equestrian animals on these trails because they're just so loose and so many just little rocks. And when you're 20 miles in, or even, you know, 30, 40, you're just like, just kinda hopping and skipping through them and it's no big deal. But when it gets to a mile 80, and your brain is like looking at just this like, trail full of rocks, and it's just like, your brain's like, we don't wanna contend with that anymore.

• 33:36Speaker 06

  One like, one bad step ends the race, right?

• 33:39Speaker 04

  Well, that could be too, but you're just having to work for every step, you know? And like, it got to the point where you could see like, people were actually running in the grass, cuz just like, running even through those like, bunchy grass, which no man ever wants to hike in bunch grass when you could be on a trail. But people were like purposely, you could see where they were running in the grass, over the rocks. And this is something I had heard, is that people say, yeah, once you get down to that road, your body, your legs, your brain is like, oh, you can run, cuz you don't have to think about it, you can just go. And, so there's that, and then Steven also gave me a couple Tylenol. And I'm like, Tylenol? I'm like, I'm not really hurting. He's like, it'll be good, trust me.

• 34:22Speaker 04

  And I almost didn't take it, because I'm thinking like, oh, I'm gonna take these two Tylenol, and then the nausea, and then these two things in my stomach that I'm not really prepared for, and it's not gonna be good. And he's like, no, I think you should take it. So we start walking, and I give Mark my speech, I'm like, we're gonna just, like, we'll run a little bit, like, we might run to that next tree, and then we'll walk, and then we'll run, and we'll just kinda feel it out and see how it goes. Well, we start running, and I'm like, oh, this feels pretty good. And then my buddy Cooper comes by, and he's jamming some Wu-Tang in the truck, like, super loud. And I kinda get that, and a little head bob going, and I'm like, oh, okay. And we start clipping, and we had been passed by two groups, and, but they're like, maybe 300, 400 yards out ahead of me.

• 35:06Speaker 04

  And all of a sudden, I'm like, Mark, we're gonna take them down. And when we go by them, we're not stopping, and we're just gonna keep going. And the next thing I know, we knocked out those eight miles in like, I don't know, it felt like 90 minutes or less. Like, we zoomed. And, um, like, I felt great. Like, by the time everybody caught up to me, that was racing, basically passing us to get to the finish line to be there, like, they're like, looking at us like, whoa! Yeah, let's go. Cause we were like actually running. We almost caught another group. Um, we bumped them. It's a funny thing that Steven says, just like how you bump animals sometimes and then they start to.

• 35:41Steven Rinella?

  They see you coming.

• 35:42Speaker 04

  Oh, yeah. Well, we bumped these, this pack, three pack of girls and I was closing in good. Like I made it to like a hundred and fifty yards probably. And then I'll, cause they were doing the same thing that I, I had. They were like, we're gonna run and then walk, run and then walk. And we're to take that all the way to the finish. But once I bumped them, they went running all the way in.

• 36:02Speaker 00

  And so that was like a combo of the Wu-Tang, the Tylenol.

• 36:06Speaker 04

  And the road.

• 36:07Steven Rinella?

  Book reports.

• 36:08Speaker 06

  Did you feel the Tylenol hit your system or you just felt, you just felt?

• 36:13Speaker 04

  You know, I, I sure wish I would have taken the Tylenol like mile eighty.

• 36:20Speaker 04

  I guarantee you I will have some with me next time I get to eighty miles.

• 36:25Speaker 00

  That is the anti-inflammatory one, right? Acetaminophen is anti-inflammatory. So I'm sure it just like maybe calmed your body down a little bit.

• 36:34Speaker 04

  Could be a lot of different, a lot of different things. Again, when your body's at that point, you don't know how that stuff's affecting.

• 36:40Speaker 00

  Right.

• 36:41Steven Rinella?

  So this is, this is something you're gonna start doing?

• 36:44Speaker 04

  Uh, maybe. You know, the, if there was no kids at home, if it was just Jennifer and I, yeah, I'd probably do a whole bunch, but it takes.

• 36:52Steven Rinella?

  A whole bunch?

• 36:53Speaker 04

  It takes time. Yeah. Because the thing that even like within the, maybe the first day after, probably on Sunday, I didn't do too much time. Rethinking about the race. Cause you're just kind of in this euphoric state where you're like, yeah, I'm a little beat up and I'm definitely fatigued and tired. And. I had what I described as a very lounge lizard day where I would sort of like go from bed into the kitchen, like eat as much as I could possibly could until I kind of lost energy. And then I would sort of like slump down and I would either make it to just the carpet or maybe I would make it to the couch or back to the bed. And I just did that rotation all day long. You know, obviously there was like a bathroom break in there too. But like, you're not going anywhere. I forced myself to walk to the barn and back one time, just like move my legs. But by the next day.

• 37:39Speaker 04

  You're like, oh, how could I have done it better? Where did I mess up? What were my mistakes? Was it, could I have taken Tylenol at mile seventy? Could I have done more coke? Could I have just pushed a little bit harder? Was I being a little baby there?

• 37:54Speaker 00

  Could I have done, did you just say, could I have done more coke?

• 37:57Speaker 04

  I drank more Coca-Cola.

• 38:01Steven Rinella?

  I'm glad you cleared that up, Kenny. You know, it's a lot like coming off a five, six hour halibut jig. Yeah. You know, you're out there, it's like. I've been there. You're out there, I mean, you're just trying to get through. Yeah. Six hours of jigging. It's tough sometimes.

• 38:17Speaker 04

  Well, it's amazing how like.

• 38:18Steven Rinella?

  Come in at night, you're like, how could we have done better? Yeah.

• 38:21Speaker 04

  How at like eighty, eighty-five, I'm like, if Steven wasn't here, I would just DNF right now, you know? Like, I had thoughts like that come through me.

• 38:29Steven Rinella?

  What's that mean?

• 38:30Speaker 04

  I did not finish, when you just pull yourself out, but like.

• 38:33Steven Rinella?

  I don't think you would have quit.

• 38:35Speaker 04

  Well, that, again, that's, that's something that I wanted.

• 38:38Steven Rinella?

  Too much into it.

• 38:39Speaker 04

  That's something that I would like to explore. I don't know if it'll be the next one I do, but I will, no, I will definitely, I will definitely do one solo.

• 38:46Steven Rinella?

  Oh.

• 38:47Speaker 04

  Cause I think it's a whole different mindset.

• 38:49Speaker 00

  What was the, um, like, what was the inspiration to do it in the first place? Like, when did you first say, like, has this been like a long-held, like, desire and goal?

• 39:00Speaker 04

  No.

• 39:00Speaker 00

  Like, I'm gonna run a hundred miles one day.

• 39:02Speaker 04

  No, honestly, when I moved to Bozeman, I had done a couple of Vale Trail half marathons at that point, maybe three. There was like, we had like a race series and where Brody and I lived in Vale, and I would do a couple of trail runs. And then all that stuff started really just to be in shape for September, so I could feel like I could go uphill and, you know, get to the ridge before the elk did. And then when I got to Bozeman, I heard about this Bridger Ridge Run. It's like nineteen, twenty miles. I'm like, oh, that looks like a sweet place to do a run. So I did that, and then Rick Smith used to always talk about the rut.

• 39:33Speaker 00

  Hmm.

• 39:34Speaker 04

  And he, and I would like look at it online and be like, that's insane. And then someone's like, oh, no, you could do it. I'm like, oh, maybe I could. So I got a coach, and they're like, oh, yeah, we can, we can get you ready for that. Thirty-one miles in the mountains, no problem. So I did that, and this is like sort of every distance I've done, I'm like, oh, I wonder if I could go a little bit farther. Going from 20 to 30, no big deal. 30 to 50 was really, I wouldn't say that big of a deal. Very doable, but 50 to 100 was, it was a leap.

• 40:05Speaker 00

  Wow.

• 40:06Speaker 07

  So now, when you look at the rut, are you like, ah, that's, that's easy?

• 40:10Speaker 06

  Cupcakes.

• 40:10Speaker 07

  Yeah.

• 40:11Speaker 04

  No, because you're gonna, no matter what the distance it, what the distance is, or the amount of elevation gain the race has, your brain, your body is gonna go at a certain effort level to do that race. Like I did a, I think it was a 25K in Helena in the spring, and it took me, I don't know, three hours, something?

• 40:32Speaker 07

  Yeah.

• 40:33Speaker 04

  And like, I ran way faster, but I still exerted a bunch of energy, and by the time you get done with it, you're like, ah, you know, and you're, you're done, right? You need a day off. And so I think you just, you know, you sort of just pace yourself to whatever distance it is.

• 40:49Speaker 07

  Gotcha.

• 40:49Speaker 04

  So yeah, can I finish it easily? Sure. Yeah, I could go do the rut 50K without any kind of problems.

• 40:56Speaker 07

  Yeah.

• 40:58Speaker 04

  But again, do I want to like, beat my last time that I did it? Probably, you know?

• 41:03Speaker 07

  Yeah.

• 41:03Speaker 00

  Rosie and I are doing the 11K rut.

• 41:06Speaker 04

  That's right.

• 41:06Speaker 00

  And that is more K's than I have ever run, ever, in my life.

• 41:11Speaker 04

  Lot of K's.

• 41:11Speaker 00

  I'm really nervous about it.

• 41:12Speaker 07

  It's gonna be a K-hole.

• 41:14Speaker 04

  Yeah, so you're, that's at like, probably six and a half, seven miles?

• 41:17Speaker 00

  Something like that, yeah.

• 41:18Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 41:18Speaker 00

  Yeah, I've never run that much in one fell swoop, ever.

• 41:22Speaker 04

  It's gonna be great.

• 41:24Speaker 00

  Is it?

• 41:24Speaker 04

  I think so.

• 41:25Speaker 00

  I mean, certainly having people in my life that can run 100 miles and can talk about it and how cool it is, is very inspiring for something like that, but...

• 41:34Speaker 06

  Oh yeah, it like, it's inspiring, but also like, when I'm outrunning, it kind of makes me angry that Yanis is out there running 100 miles.

• 41:42Speaker 00

  But you're running a lot.

• 41:42Speaker 07

  Oh, like, it does the opposite.

• 41:44Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 41:44Speaker 07

  It does the opposite of pump you up.

• 41:47Speaker 06

  Yanis, like, I'm outrunning five miles and I'm like...

• 41:50Speaker 00

  Five miles is not a short run, though.

• 41:52Speaker 06

  No, I know, I know.

• 41:54Speaker 00

  And you're doing that multiple times a week? Like, that's awesome.

• 41:58Speaker 06

  But it's like, because I'm old, and I want to keep hunting when I'm old.

• 42:01Speaker 04

  That's right.

• 42:02Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 42:03Speaker 06

  That's right. It's not because I want to...

• 42:04Speaker 00

  Well, you're not old, but I understand what you're saying. You're trying to keep in shape and...

• 42:09Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 42:09Speaker 04

  But this, this guy that we cleared trail with.

• 42:12Steven Rinella?

  Jimmy's got a question.

• 42:13Speaker 04

  Jake.

• 42:14Steven Rinella?

  No, I was just saying you guys started running.

• 42:15Speaker 04

  He, he, he, he said it right. And, and like it stuck with me in a time, but at mile 75 or 80, it really rang true where he's like, yeah, the first 50. He's like, it's kind of fun. He's like, the second 50, you find out what you're made out of. And it's like, you can't really say it any better than that because that second 50 is like, the first 50 is just kind of like the price of admission. To get to see what's going to happen in the second 50, you know what I mean? Cause you can't, you're not going to know one without the other.

• 42:47Steven Rinella?

  Yeah. You're like, I'm just here to see what happens later.

• 42:49Speaker 04

  Yeah, but you are. You're like, scenery is great. Like we're in the mountains.

• 42:54Steven Rinella?

  Like I know I got this one. I got the first 50.

• 42:57Speaker 04

  It's a beautiful, long day in the mountains. I had this crazy guy run up to me like, I hadn't been done. I had crossed the finish line, hugged everybody that was there. Helping me and the other friends that had, had ran it. And this other guy, Stephen Graham, who I kind of know, um, I've run into him a few times on the trails around Bozeman. He runs up to me and he's like, what'd you think about that crazy ridge around Honey Trail? When I'm up there, I just feel like I'm following a wounded bull elk. And I'm just like, what dude? What are you talking about? And then he's like, yeah, you know, you're just on that like kind of sloopy rolling hill and there's really no trail and it kind of just keeps going and going and going. And I'm like, oh, yeah, I kind of see what you're saying.

• 43:40Speaker 04

  Like, like he just like, that's what is in his mind. Cause it's not a great trail. There's just these flags like on this like bunch grass hillside. And it's just like this kind of like, you're like, why is the trail here? So it's like a, like a, like a trail a wounded bull elk would take where you're just like, there's no rhyme or reason. He's just sort of like traveling here. And, uh, but that guy had way too much energy. But I'll leave it with this. It's amazing how at like 90, you're like, I'm going to die up here.

• 44:08Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 44:08Speaker 04

  You know, I might lay down and the crows will just pick my eyes out. And then you get done and you give a few hugs around and everybody's like, sit down. What can we get for you? And all of a sudden you're like, oh, now I feel pretty good. Now that that's behind me. Like I'm cool to hang out and like, let's watch everybody else finish and clap and, and like all of a sudden your brain is just like, oh, that's behind us. So you can like enjoy yourself again.

• 44:34Speaker 00

  Yeah, man. That's so cool that you did that.

• 44:39Speaker 00

  I just, I can't even, it's like very hard to imagine running that much.

• 44:43Steven Rinella?

  Did this giant candy sack come when the generator went down?

• 44:46Speaker 04

  Yes.

• 44:46Speaker 07

  Yeah, this just appeared.

• 44:47Steven Rinella?

  Yeah.

• 44:49Speaker 00

  Do you?

• 44:49Steven Rinella?

  That's nice.

• 44:50Speaker 00

  Would you like it to go away?

• 44:51Steven Rinella?

  No, it's just like a little bit of continuity would be appreciated. I mean, Phil, no amount of magical editing from Phil. If Phil cleaned up.

• 45:00Speaker 00

  Sorry, Phil.

• 45:01Steven Rinella?

  If Phil cleaned, it feels like, no problem. I got the whole thing cleaned up. It'd be like all of a sudden, and it'd also be like,

• 45:08Speaker 04

  Yeah, I mean, I was trying to address it when we, when we started recording again, and I was saying that we're, we're kind of like some long distance runners. That basically at some point you just turn to eating a lot of sugar.

• 45:19Steven Rinella?

  So hopefully Phil knows, well, he'll, he'll know.

• 45:22Speaker 07

  He knows now.

• 45:23Steven Rinella?

  There's no point in trying to clean up the edit.

• 45:25Speaker 04

  No, don't do it, Phil.

• 45:26Steven Rinella?

  Can we combine these bags or do you want to just keep them separate? Yeah. A little candy management here? Yeah. It's like Halloween. Uh, You should bring us home and give it out. Well, congratulations, man.

• 45:36Speaker 04

  Thanks.

• 45:36Steven Rinella?

  Yeah. Yeah, I was proud of you.

• 45:37Speaker 07

  Congrats, Johnny.

• 45:38Steven Rinella?

  I thought that was cool.

• 45:40Speaker 04

  Speaking of doing crazy shit.

• 45:42Steven Rinella?

  It's a cool, it's a good feat. It's like a, you know, it was a real accomplishment, man.

• 45:46Speaker 04

  It is. No, no, I, I a hundred percent feel that way. I'm very, my goal was, number, first goal was to finish. And I always say finish with a smile on my face, which I did. Second goal was to go 30 hours. And I did it in 33. It was a lofty goal. I said, I think I could go back now with experience, probably pull that off. But, uh, yeah, I'm very happy. It's, it's like, uh, there was at times I'm like, eh, did I do it? Did I do it well enough? And multiple people have reached out and been like, look, dude, that's like one of the hardest ones in the country.

• 46:20Steven Rinella?

  Mm-hmm.

• 46:21Speaker 04

  It's a lot of elevation, like those trails I was talking about earlier, where the footing just stinks for mile after mile after mile after mile. And so they're like, look, as your first attempt,

• 46:32Steven Rinella?

  Yeah.

• 46:32Speaker 04

  your debut 100, uh, great job, you know? So, uh, I'm pumped.

• 46:38Speaker 04

  I got my belt buckle.

• 46:40Speaker 00

  Do belt buckles?

• 46:41Speaker 06

  Oh yeah, I saw the belt buckle.

• 46:42Steven Rinella?

  You got it on right now?

• 46:44Speaker 00

  Do you get a belt buckle for like everyone?

• 46:47Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 46:47Speaker 00

  Or is that?

• 46:48Speaker 04

  Every hundred. It's like a, whatever. I don't know where it came from. I should look that up, but it's like a thing.

• 46:53Steven Rinella?

  Like they stole like rodeo's groove.

• 46:55Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 46:56Steven Rinella?

  That's not very nice. Why don't they come up with their own thing like a headband?

• 46:58Steven Rinella?

  So you gotta, you gotta start dressing like a little western just so you can show off.

• 47:02Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, why not? Just give you like a, like a headband.

• 47:05Speaker 06

  You, you should be giving out like halibut belt buckles up here.

• 47:08Steven Rinella?

  That'd be a sweet belt buckle.

• 47:10Steven Rinella?

  That would be pretty cool actually. I don't wear any kind of belt. I, I wear a belt. My belt has no metal on it.

• 47:16Speaker 06

  I've never owned a belt buckle.

• 47:17Steven Rinella?

  I wear all, it's all fabric Velcro belt.

• 47:21Steven Rinella?

  I used to rock a belt buckle back in the day.

• 47:24Speaker 00

  You don't anymore?

• 47:25Speaker 04

  You've had that fancy bell doesn't keep your fly closed.

• 47:28Steven Rinella?

  No, I never zip that up. You know why? Well, when I'm wearing my bibs, when I'm wearing my bibs and I've been wearing my bibs all day, I leave that down. Cause I got coverage elsewhere.

• 47:36Speaker 04

  Totally. Yeah. I was actually running that program today too.

• 47:40Steven Rinella?

  Yeah.

• 47:42Steven Rinella?

  If you spend a lot of time outdoors, you got dogs, you got kids, you know how hard it is to keep the floor of your rig clean. A thing we do in our, in our little fleet of vehicles that I have at my household, if you go look, open the door on any one of them, they all got WeatherTech. We get a car, we throw the mats out and put in WeatherTech. Cause that way, when there's a mess, it's like your kid's fault, your dog's fault, it's the weather's fault, doesn't matter. You take them suckers out and hose them off and you're back to being good as new. I'm telling you, if you got a vehicle, put WeatherTech in there. You're gonna be happy you did it. And check this out. American made floor liners and cargo liners. Okay. They laugh in the face of all weather. Go take a look for yourself today at weather tech.com. In military families, service is more than a job. It's a legacy.

• 48:26Steven Rinella?

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• 48:52Steven Rinella?

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• 49:18Speaker 02

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• 49:34Speaker 04

  But speaking of doing kind of hard, crazy stuff, we really haven't gotten to sit down and chat about Africa at all.

• 49:40Steven Rinella?

  No, you and I have not. I've been chatting about it a lot.

• 49:42Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 49:42Steven Rinella?

  But I wouldn't call it like, it's not, it's not, it's, yeah, I wouldn't say hard and crazy.

• 49:50Speaker 04

  But we were just talking when we weren't recording about how another American has been killed.

• 49:56Steven Rinella?

  Two guys this year.

• 49:57Speaker 04

  Two guys have been killed this year hunting.

• 49:59Steven Rinella?

  Black Death. I didn't know that till, that's the nickname for the Cape Buffalo, Black Death.

• 50:04Speaker 04

  Oh, yeah, I knew that.

• 50:05Steven Rinella?

  Yeah. Two, yeah, two Americans killed, a guy that's got killed now.

• 50:08Speaker 04

  Right.

• 50:08Steven Rinella?

  We were just debating like, how bad do you feel? Like, it's too bad. But part of the allure is that you're hunting a thing that gets you.

• 50:18Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 50:18Steven Rinella?

  That's what's so, that's what like, it's so enticing about it. So, you know.

• 50:22Speaker 04

  Because otherwise, it's kind of like you're hunting a cow.

• 50:24Steven Rinella?

  Yeah. And I had friends that pushed it too long in mountaineering. And they knew where that was going.

• 50:31Speaker 04

  Right. But it's part of that animal's part of the big five and all, like, the reason they're called the big five is because they're all dangerous, right?

• 50:40Steven Rinella?

  You know what I didn't, you know, I didn't know? You know when people say plains game?

• 50:44Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 50:45Steven Rinella?

  I was like, well, what's not plains game? The only thing not plains game is dangerous game.

• 50:52Speaker 04

  Oh, God.

• 50:52Steven Rinella?

  I thought there was like, I don't know, like another category.

• 50:54Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 50:55Steven Rinella?

  Dangerous game, plains game.

• 50:57Speaker 05

  What about like, um, waterfowl? Is that just called?

• 51:00Steven Rinella?

  Oh, no, no, in Africa hunting.

• 51:02Speaker 05

  Well, don't they have?

• 51:03Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, that would be just a whole different category. But people say like plains game and you're like, okay, what is not that? And what's not that is dangerous game. Um, yeah, it's like.

• 51:18Steven Rinella?

  It's like being around, uh, like in the end, we had like, nothing happened.

• 51:22Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 51:23Steven Rinella?

  We killed a bull and watched it, killed a bull and watched it die.

• 51:25Speaker 04

  Yeah, but so that's what I want to know about is exactly that particular hunt. Like when it finally went down.

• 51:34Speaker 04

  Were you scared?

• 51:35Steven Rinella?

  No, not at all.

• 51:36Speaker 04

  Never.

• 51:36Steven Rinella?

  I was, I wasn't.

• 51:40Steven Rinella?

  There was points where you're like, oh, I see how this goes. You know, like you're in eight foot high grass.

• 51:47Speaker 04

  Mm hmm.

• 51:48Steven Rinella?

  And they're right in front of you. You can see the grass moving. You can hear and see the birds, the oxpeckers that are on them all the time. You can hear the oxpeckers and you see them flittering around and they're just 20 yards. You know, you're like, there's a 2,000 pound thing, 20 yards that has a reputation, right? But all they do is they just want to, they don't like, you know, they smell you gone. But you're, so you're aware. And then we're at a spot where they're like, oh yeah, this is where Roger got, you know, we went to the spot and they're like, oh yeah, right here. This is where Roger got, this is where Roger got plastered and he got plastered.

• 52:22Speaker 04

  Grizzly bear that 99 out of 100 times it smells you and runs. And then, but 1% of the time it just is like, oh, I'm pissed and I'm coming after you.

• 52:29Speaker 07

  Is there a lot of time it's when they're wounded?

• 52:31Steven Rinella?

  It's, it really is like, that's what was unusual. The, there's a guy from Texas just got killed and it, and the article and the reporting for the article was pointed out was unwounded. So these guys. Morgan knows got like the trackers.

• 52:50Steven Rinella?

  It's.

• 52:53Steven Rinella?

  It's just, they're worried about the wounded ones, but what was pointed out to me, it's interesting. It doesn't mean it was wounded by you.

• 53:00Steven Rinella?

  This guy Roger got plastered by one that had been wounded by a lion.

• 53:05Steven Rinella?

  Right? So it's, or they get wounded by someone else or wounded from some other reason. And so there's just, there's a chance that out there are wounded ones. It's so, there's also that you hit one and then you got to trail your wounded one.

• 53:18Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 53:18Steven Rinella?

  And when you hit them, they go into the thickest shit they could find. Right? And then you gotta go in there, he's either on a rot or you're going to go in there and find them. And that's nerve wracking. Or there's always a chance that you're on one. And he's something else wounded him, but the trackers are paying a lot of attention to how it behaves. This is just through conversation. They're, when they're tracking, they're watching like, is something wrong with it? If they, if they're on one that's dragging its foot funny, not doing the right things in the right places, suggesting that he's got a problem, then they'll be like, heads up, we're following one that something's wrong with.

• 54:00Speaker 04

  So how did yours go down? Have you already explained this in a different podcast?

• 54:03Steven Rinella?

  No.

• 54:04Speaker 04

  How did yours?

• 54:05Steven Rinella?

  We talked about a little bit.

• 54:07Steven Rinella?

  We, we got on a group and tracked a group

• 54:13Steven Rinella?

  for a few hours, lost him, got back, got in a truck, went down the road a little ways and saw a bull.

• 54:23Steven Rinella?

  Just caught a glimpse of a bull moving along. Got out and went down the road paralleling them. And kept, well, first we went off, tried to find him, parallel a while, looked for him, looked for him, looked for him, couldn't find him.

• 54:39Steven Rinella?

  Then we stopped and we're doing that little thing like, like, ah, we lost him. You know, standing there. Uh, it was very late in the day. They, they cut where we, we ducked in at one point and cut a track and saw that he'd already come through. We're like, we're like, we're like, we know he's going along in a line. So we're kind of parallel along 75 yards off. And at one point cut over to intersect his line to see like, had he been through or not yet? And realized, oh, he'd already passed through. So now we kind of went and cut thinking we were going to maybe be in front of him. But they hit the track and like, no, he's already been through here. So we backed out, paralleled more.

• 55:23Steven Rinella?

  And then just nothing. It was like, see nothing, hear nothing. And then we're doing that little stand around thing you do? Like when you kind of regroupen? And all of a sudden, heard like a twig.

• 55:37Steven Rinella?

  And everybody all of a sudden like, like, well, the twig went snap. And everybody did that like, like I just heard something. And all of a sudden, like, everybody stared in the same spot. And all of a sudden, there is just like, there's like, he's out and all of a sudden, there's his head peering.

• 55:55Speaker 06

  How far?

• 55:55Steven Rinella?

  Down through seventy-five yards.

• 55:59Steven Rinella?

  His head peering down and um, and you could see him playing his day. And at that point, he kind of turned a little bit. Morgan's like, see the, see his chin. Go eight inches down and four or five inches over from his chin.

• 56:17Steven Rinella?

  And hit him right there.

• 56:19Speaker 06

  Cause you could, like, you can't pick out.

• 56:20Steven Rinella?

  You shot him quartering two. Well, I didn't do what he said. I was a little off, but it was like, all's well that ends well, because it was high, but just went right into his chest cavity. So it kind of almost went in like, he's looking at you with his head down. Imagine that he's down like this. Imagine it entered kind of in your, where your cheek meets your neck. But just, you know, then I shot it, then I, then I tried to hit him two more times when he ran, but missed him for the trackers and the, or the skinners, they never found anything. I shot at him two more times as he ran, but I don't think I connected on him, but the one was fatal.

• 56:57Speaker 06

  The, and the whole time you're following and tracking them, the most important thing is wind?

• 57:03Steven Rinella?

  Or? Yeah, but you, like, we, we did two long, we did two, like, long, like, real active tracks. Following.

• 57:12Speaker 06

  Yep.

• 57:12Steven Rinella?

  Um. One, like, you get on them. And you're hoping to.

• 57:21Steven Rinella?

  You're, you're tracking, and the trackers know the behavior so well, but it'd be kind of very similar. Like, picture you following elk in the snow.

• 57:30Steven Rinella?

  You get up at daybreak and he's out, like you know where he's not gonna be. Meaning if you're up on some big high plateau, right? Uh, blown off where he's feeding in the snow. It's like now it's nine in the morning.

• 57:43Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 57:44Steven Rinella?

  I know where he's not gonna be.

• 57:45Speaker 06

  Yep.

• 57:46Steven Rinella?

  He's not gonna be here. He's gonna be up in that timber hole, right? So you kind of got that, right? And they know that it's different because it's more subtle, but they know where he wants to be. So when you're going along, sometimes you're like, he doesn't want to be here. And then you get to places where they become intensely interested. So you'll come into some little thing like a, like a thick timber patch and like a little depression. And what they'll know, like, what's the sun gonna do? And how much? Cause they want to be in the dark.

• 58:18Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 58:18Steven Rinella?

  Dank. They want to lay down in the dark. They want to lay down where they can see out of their hole and they're gonna be in like tucked in. So all of a sudden they'll get where they just stopped and they stare and stare and stare. And then they move five feet and stare and stare and stare and then move over and stare and stare and stare. Cause they're like, I think he's.

• 58:37Speaker 06

  In there somewhere.

• 58:38Steven Rinella?

  He's in that hole.

• 58:40Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 58:41Steven Rinella?

  And then you look at it from every angle. And you look at it from every angle and you just can't find them. And eventually someone slips around and like, he left. He's not in that patch, but he's still not running. He never ran.

• 58:54Speaker 06

  Is it over if you bump them?

• 58:57Steven Rinella?

  Not necessarily. We bumped them and went, we bumped one twice. So when you go, he's not there and he didn't run.

• 59:07Steven Rinella?

  Then you keep on them. So one, we get to the end, one, the way it ended is all of a sudden, I'm from. I don't know, man. Not, not me to that sink. But we're like in one of those patches. And they're just, they're like, he's here. They just know, they're like, he's here.

• 59:28Speaker 06

  And was that at all creepy?

• 59:30Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, there's two of them. And they're, he's just here.

• 59:33Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 59:34Steven Rinella?

  And we're in there and all of a sudden that's like, and all of a sudden one gets, I gather, gets up out of its bed. And I can just see half its face and one of its horns. And that thing is, that thing is not me to that sink, but it's, it's just like right, all of a sudden. That was the first one I got a good look at. I got half his face and a horn and he's just there.

• 59:55Steven Rinella?

  It's like, it didn't, he had zero interest. All he wanted to do was slip out, but you're like, yeah, I see now.

• 1:00:04Steven Rinella?

  Do you know what I mean? Like, they let you just get on them. And sure, at some point, now and then, boom, you know, but he was nothing like that. There was no, all the, all the tension, any tension that I felt was all because the, all the stories. Do you follow me?

• 1:00:23Speaker 06

  Yep.

• 1:00:24Steven Rinella?

  All the stories. So it's like, you're carrying all those tails.

• 1:00:30Steven Rinella?

  Right? Cause otherwise you'd be like, what are you like, what is the deal? It's some like giant bovid looking thing.

• 1:00:38Speaker 06

  And the trackers aren't throwing off any cues. Like you should be pretty scared right now. Like you're looking at the trackers and they're just cool as ice.

• 1:00:46Steven Rinella?

  You know what they do? When one, one comes, they're down flat on the ground.

• 1:00:51Speaker 06

  They disappear.

• 1:00:52Steven Rinella?

  They dive out of the way, but they're down and they want to be down where they can't get hooked back up. And, and Morgan, the, the professional hunter kept saying to the trackers, he's like, um, don't worry about them. Like they're, that's my job.

• 1:01:09Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 1:01:10Steven Rinella?

  And they're going to be very quickly, they're going to very quickly go from being in front of me to be in, to be in mine. Cause like he's the dude with the gun. Like at the end of the day, he's the guy. That's putting everybody in the situation. And so it's his job to draw the attention.

• 1:01:25Speaker 06

  Yep.

• 1:01:26Steven Rinella?

  So like your role as a professional hunter, your role is to all of a sudden be the menacing one. And he wants all eyes on him. Like he don't, he don't get to dive down. Do you know what I mean?

• 1:01:39Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 1:01:39Steven Rinella?

  He's got to stay in the ground.

• 1:01:42Speaker 06

  Yep.

• 1:01:43Steven Rinella?

  Like that, that's what you signed up for. Cause you're the like, there's, it's just not part of the ethos. Do you know what I mean? Like if it comes, you're there and, and that's your thing. You don't get to flinch.

• 1:01:57Speaker 06

  Yep.

• 1:01:58Steven Rinella?

  You gotta go forward into it. And everybody else is expected to like,

• 1:02:03Speaker 06

  Save themselves.

• 1:02:04Steven Rinella?

  He's like, don't do anything. He wouldn't even tell you. Don't do anything that takes the attention from me.

• 1:02:12Steven Rinella?

  Like I'm the problem. I'm the one up in his face, not you, you know?

• 1:02:18Steven Rinella?

  Uh, so no, like nothing like that. Like other stuff, you know, we had a black, we had a run in, we talked about this a bunch on the podcast, but previously we had a, we had a, not even a run in, we had an experience with a black mamba and you're like, holy cow. Like I could so easily see how that goes. You're like, I see how that happens. With that, with my experience with Cape buffalo, I wouldn't have come away, hadn't I had the background of reading and the stories, I wouldn't have come away and been like, I can see how that goes bad.

• 1:02:51Speaker 00

  I have, I have a question and it's, this is not a, um, this is not a passive aggressive, nor aggressive aggressive question. And it's for all of you guys that hunt, which is everyone here. Um, given how we started talking about this because of the two unfortunate guys who died hunting Cape buffalo. And you were saying, well, you know, it's kind of, it's a part of hunting Cape buffalo. That's a risk. So you can't really say, oh, it's, you know, you can say that it's a bad thing that it happened and it's sad that it happened, but you can't really say it was totally unexpected.

• 1:03:29Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, it's, it's like, it's kind of complicated. I don't want to sound.

• 1:03:34Speaker 00

  That's not my question though.

• 1:03:35Steven Rinella?

  Okay. Oh, sorry.

• 1:03:36Speaker 00

  That's okay. My question is knowing that, like if you on this hunt were to have expired because you got killed by a Cape buffalo. Um, like, do you ever think some of the things that you're hunting? Like, is it ever irresponsible to go on a hunt, given your family, given uh, other responsibilities you have in the world? Like, do you ever think about that before you pursue a certain animal or a certain hunt?

• 1:04:09Steven Rinella?

  No, because none, none of it's like, none of it's, none of it's like that.

• 1:04:13Speaker 06

  Also, I don't know that, and I don't want to speak for those guys, but I don't know that what, in the long run, that what Steve did hunting buffalo is any more dangerous than going fishing or.

• 1:04:26Speaker 06

  Like you name it, hunting grizzlies or like anything can get you, right?

• 1:04:31Steven Rinella?

  Hunting big wa- fishing big water in small boats.

• 1:04:34Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 1:04:34Steven Rinella?

  But none of it rises up. When I, when I, dudes that have families and die on K2, that, that I'm like, man, that's kind of a weird call. It's an odd call as a dad.

• 1:04:50Speaker 06

  But they'd probably say it was stupid for you to-

• 1:04:52Steven Rinella?

  They'd probably say the same thing for you. No, no, because there's a death for every four summits.

• 1:04:56Speaker 06

  True. Yeah.

• 1:04:58Steven Rinella?

  Or whatever, right? I think it's a death for every four summits. Like I'm saying, there is a point, there, there is a point at which where there's a point where the risk is so high and I don't condemn them, but there's a point where the risk is so high when a guy dies on K2 and you don't need to go on K2. Like when a guy dies on K2 and I see that he has a family, um, you know, I will think to myself, huh, that's a, like a strange call. That's a weird call you made.

• 1:05:25Speaker 06

  Going base jumping or something like-

• 1:05:28Steven Rinella?

  I don't know enough about the statistics on it.

• 1:05:30Speaker 06

  Yeah, but I mean, I would look at that as like, yeah, that'd be your response.

• 1:05:34Steven Rinella?

  Like an odd call when you have kids.

• 1:05:36Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 1:05:37Steven Rinella?

  You know, one of the first, one of the first times I ever really stopped to think about that thing, like, like this kind of thing we're talking about is Yanni and I had the good fortune to spend some time with Rourke Denver, who, uh, was a Navy SEAL, was deployed overseas, served in combat zones, combat veteran. And he would always use this, he had this like, like a euphemism for death. Um, you remember what he would say?

• 1:06:04Steven Rinella?

  If I fall,

• 1:06:07Steven Rinella?

  if I fall. And I remember him saying that he went to his mom to say, if I fall, and that was the term, that's the term he used. Uh, if I fall, I don't like, don't, I don't want you to be sad. Like, don't be sad if I fall. And, um, and I don't think that way, but I, I, it was funny to hear someone where, uh, someone in a certain occupation. Who had been to such high risk environments that got to the point where that's how you think about it.

• 1:06:38Speaker 00

  Mm hmm.

• 1:06:39Steven Rinella?

  Like that it's so high risk that you're telling your mom how you would like her to, how you would like her to feel.

• 1:06:47Speaker 00

  But I.

• 1:06:47Steven Rinella?

  Like that's high risk.

• 1:06:49Speaker 00

  Military service, I feel like is a totally different.

• 1:06:52Steven Rinella?

  Saying like that, like that is like legitimately high risk climbing K two. Like I think like to be like, uh, to be like.

• 1:06:59Speaker 00

  Also not just, not just high risk, but like in the service of your country.

• 1:07:02Steven Rinella?

  Oh, yeah, I'm not, what I was getting at, I wasn't, there's, there's, there's zero parallel. What I was getting at was, I was, what I was trying to capture there was I was trying to capture like, what is the mindset of someone who does things that are actually high risk?

• 1:07:19Speaker 00

  Mm hmm.

• 1:07:19Steven Rinella?

  Right? Like not, there's, you can't even, there's, there's no, you can't equate it at all. What I like me dicking around hunting with doing something like that. You can't equate it, but the point was like, the way Rourke had such a, and maybe it's over now because he's out and has kids and all that, but he had such a comfortable, he just arrived at a very comfortable place about it because it's actually high risk, right? Like remember there was a single helicopter crash that killed

• 1:07:50Steven Rinella?

  18 guys, including like in the like 13, I don't know, it was 13 or 14 seals all like bam.

• 1:07:56Speaker 06

  I mean, they, they couldn't do their job if they.

• 1:07:58Steven Rinella?

  No.

• 1:07:59Speaker 06

  You know what I mean? If they worried about it.

• 1:08:01Steven Rinella?

  Yeah. Super comfortable. A friend of mine, like a, kind of a friend, a guy acquaintance I had, a guy I knew, um, died on K two.

• 1:08:12Steven Rinella?

  He'd lost most of his friend group already. Very comfortable, like very comfortable with it because it's like, there's such a likelihood, like he went once and got injured, went up in the hospital, got better, went back and died. And it's like, I don't, there's no thing.

• 1:08:31Speaker 00

  Is there any?

• 1:08:32Steven Rinella?

  There's no thing in hunting. There's no thing in hunting. Uh, there's no thing in hunting that, that is at that.

• 1:08:41Steven Rinella?

  Risk level.

• 1:08:42Speaker 05

  Do you know what the like, is there a statistic for injuries like K Buffalo? Is that even like a?

• 1:08:50Steven Rinella?

  I don't know.

• 1:08:52Speaker 05

  I feel like it's gotta be relatively low.

• 1:08:54Steven Rinella?

  Couple a year.

• 1:08:55Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 1:08:56Steven Rinella?

  But I mean, there's not that many people doing it, but a couple of year.

• 1:08:59Speaker 00

  Is Brody and Yanis and Seth, is there any hunt you wouldn't do because of the risk?

• 1:09:05Speaker 07

  I mean, if, if there was like all of a sudden, you know,

• 1:09:11Speaker 07

  like say, you know, the coups deer hunt in Mexico, say all of a sudden it's like extremely dangerous and like to go there. And a lot of people are getting like killed by the cartel, whatever.

• 1:09:21Steven Rinella?

  Oh, like mafia stuff.

• 1:09:23Speaker 07

  Yeah, I'd be like, okay, I'm good. I don't, I don't need to go.

• 1:09:27Speaker 00

  But not the actual, so like the circumstances and the area.

• 1:09:31Steven Rinella?

  No, I can't answer Seth, but.

• 1:09:34Speaker 07

  Yeah, not, not,

• 1:09:37Speaker 07

  not an animal. It would, it would be the environment, like the, you know, it'd be more human element, I would say.

• 1:09:46Speaker 00

  Right.

• 1:09:48Steven Rinella?

  If you spend a lot of time outdoors, you got dogs, you got kids, you know how hard it is to keep the floor of your rig clean. A thing we do in our, in our little fleet of vehicles that have at my household, if you go look, open the door on any one of them, they all got weather tech. We get a car, we throw the mats out and put in weather tech. Cause that way when there's a mess, it's like your kid's fault, your dog's fault, it's the weather's fault, doesn't matter. You take them suckers out and hose them off and you're back to being good as new. I'm telling you, if you got a vehicle, put weather tech in there, you're gonna be happy you did it. And check this out, American made floor liners and cargo liners. Okay. They laugh in the face of all weather. Go take a look for yourself today at weather tech.com. In military families, service is more than a job, it's a legacy.

• 1:10:32Steven Rinella?

  At American Military University, that legacy can help open new doors through education. If someone in your family served in the military, you could be eligible for reduced tuition. Take the next step with flexible online programs built for real life.

• 1:10:51Steven Rinella?

  More at amu.apus.edu/military. Listen, we're all trying to save up for something. I got buddies saving up to buy their new house. I got people eyeing a new boat. I know buddies that are trying to switch out trucks and get an upgrade in their truck. Whatever. People are always saving up for stuff. In reality, though, we see that it can be hard to actually save money. But that's what's great about the One Pay app. It makes saving money easy. First, you earn 3% cash back on up to $150 in monthly spending. You choose categories, okay, like Walmart, gas, or dining, and then get rewarded when you spend in those categories.

• 1:11:32Steven Rinella?

  So you're rewarded for what you're already buying. And with high-yield savings, your money keeps growing. Download the One Pay app or visit onepay.com for banking that gives you more for what matters.

• 1:11:46Speaker 02

  One Pay is a financial technology company, not a bank. Banking services provided by Coastal Community Bank or Lead Bank, members FDIC. Cash back is earned as points. Go to onepay.com/rewards/terms for redemption options and additional details.

• 1:12:03Speaker 05

  There's some places that I wouldn't, like, I'm not experienced by any means, but there's certain places where I wouldn't, like, free die that.

• 1:12:12Speaker 00

  That's, that's an interesting.

• 1:12:14Speaker 05

  Like, there's, there's areas that I wouldn't.

• 1:12:15Speaker 00

  Diving into it is interesting.

• 1:12:16Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 1:12:17Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, I thought I had that, but then I went there and it was not fun.

• 1:12:22Speaker 04

  You took me there, didn't you?

• 1:12:24Steven Rinella?

  Well, then I went with Greg another time, uh, like NorCal stuff.

• 1:12:28Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:12:29Steven Rinella?

  You know, and I shouldn't say it was not fun. It was like so much going on, like, it's so much going on. And then there's that. You got that stupid shark-proof thing hanging off your ankle, shark deterrent. That, that, yeah, but you just get used to it. He just does it now. And he's like, you don't think about it. There's nothing you can do. You're not gonna know. If what? If you get hit by a white shark. He's like. That's relaxing. You're, there's nothing you're gonna do. Other sharks, there's stuff you can do. He's like, with that shark, you're not gonna know. And there's nothing you can do. And so I just don't think about it. That's Greg's take on it. Greg dives that. Greg, that's cut it. That's his whole. That's his zone.

• 1:13:10Speaker 00

  I wish Greg was over here. We're talking about like, how does he assess? The risk? I mean, I understand that all of these things that we were talking, like extreme running or hunting in, you know, really wild environments, like these are the things that make you feel alive. So you can't be so afraid of death and all the things that you're doing. But like, where is the, where is the line?

• 1:13:32Speaker 04

  But again, the odds, like if you're gonna start worrying about stuff, the odds are that you're gonna get smashed by another driver driving around your town and get killed that way before you get killed by a grizz or a Cape buffalo or a great white shark.

• 1:13:47Steven Rinella?

  That's like, that's what the psychology is, is, is, um, there's these fantastical things that suck up tons of headspace. So when I took Jimmy diving the oil rigs in Louisiana, like it's just, there just are sharks. It's not like, what will happen if we see a shark? I mean, there's just are. Every rig, there's just, they're there. Like bigger than you, every rig, they're just around. Um, and so I then, I'm not worried about me, but I'm like worried about something like there's a sort of mental irritation that that'll happen to him. But I'm like, why am I not having a bunch of mental irritation?

• 1:14:30Steven Rinella?

  That he'll make a really dumb judgment and get himself in the prop? It's probably like far more likely that you're gonna screw up and someone's gonna throw it in reverse when they're not supposed to, when you're gonna miss here, that it's clear or whatever. Why am I not all day thinking about the prop? But instead, all day, I'm thinking about sharks. But then you talk to the guys you're with, and they're like, oh, this, that's from the boat prop. This, that's from the boat prop.

• 1:15:01Speaker 05

  I feel like there's a level of what you're like.

• 1:15:03Steven Rinella?

  But you don't think about boat props because they're not exciting to think about.

• 1:15:07Speaker 05

  I think it's also what you're necessarily used to because like, I'm just gonna say we're around a lot more boat props than we are sharks. Like, that's a common thing.

• 1:15:19Speaker 06

  Yeah, I mean, the things you can't control are scarier, right?

• 1:15:21Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 1:15:21Speaker 06

  Especially when they got teeth or horns or whatever, you know?

• 1:15:26Speaker 00

  Or you're just like me and you worry about everything all the time, no matter what, boat props and everything.

• 1:15:31Steven Rinella?

  You often aren't worried about the right thing.

• 1:15:36Speaker 00

  Tell me more about that.

• 1:15:41Speaker 00

  Really?

• 1:15:42Steven Rinella?

  Well, no, you probably are. Like, hanging around here, you know what you ought to be worried about?

• 1:15:46Speaker 00

  No, I mean, just, let's add it to the list.

• 1:15:49Steven Rinella?

  Getting in the, being, uh, yeah, you're worried about the right thing.

• 1:15:53Speaker 00

  Being in little skips in the big water?

• 1:15:55Steven Rinella?

  That all of a sudden you're in the water and the boat ain't?

• 1:15:58Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:15:59Steven Rinella?

  That's bad.

• 1:16:02Speaker 00

  I think about that every single time I get in the boat. I think about that every single time.

• 1:16:08Steven Rinella?

  It's just like insurmountable, like you can't swim it.

• 1:16:10Speaker 00

  I watched one of my kids get in the boat. I think about what would happen. Like, do you think about that?

• 1:16:16Steven Rinella?

  Yeah. Today, Mabel, she, someone said something about the boat sinking, and I said, she said, well, we're dead. And I said, no, we're gonna swim that way. She goes, I can't swim that far. I'll get hypothermia. I'm like, yeah, that's true.

• 1:16:31Steven Rinella?

  I didn't tell her.

• 1:16:34Steven Rinella?

  I was like, well, we're gonna stick with the boat. And I don't know, like, that's a thing to pay attention to.

• 1:16:39Speaker 00

  No, it's, it's on the radar, for sure.

• 1:16:42Steven Rinella?

  When I'm diving around here, you know what I'm thinking about? I'm like.

• 1:16:45Speaker 00

  Boat props.

• 1:16:46Steven Rinella?

  I know they don't, but why don't killer whales bite people? Why don't they bite people? That's what I'm thinking about. I'm like, I know they don't, but what if they did? And I'm not thinking about what if um I come up and the boat's gone?

• 1:16:59Speaker 00

  Right.

• 1:16:59Speaker 05

  That happened once.

• 1:17:00Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, that happened to me, Jimmy.

• 1:17:01Speaker 05

  Um.

• 1:17:01Speaker 00

  I didn't, I was not aware of that.

• 1:17:02Steven Rinella?

  Well, no, we were by the shore. We, it would just been a sucky situation.

• 1:17:06Speaker 05

  Well, if we were out in the middle of the ocean, we've been a

• 1:17:09Steven Rinella?

  far bigger problem.

• 1:17:10Speaker 00

  I mean, you've almost killed me in these waters before.

• 1:17:13Speaker 05

  They, um.

• 1:17:15Speaker 00

  Have you, did you hear about that? Story? Yeah.

• 1:17:17Speaker 05

  Over at Greg's place, um, he has GoPro footage.

• 1:17:20Steven Rinella?

  I wasn't married to yet, though, so.

• 1:17:22Speaker 00

  No, that's true. Wouldn't have been your wife.

• 1:17:23Steven Rinella?

  It would've just been, I killed my girl. People would be like, ah, he killed his girlfriend. Not the mother of his children.

• 1:17:29Speaker 05

  There's GoPro footage of him like diving around like on the bottom, around that chum bag, and sea lions like coming in at Franks, coming in behind him, and heads going like here and just going straight past him and circling him.

• 1:17:44Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, I don't like those sons of bitches.

• 1:17:46Speaker 07

  Yeah, those things seem mean.

• 1:17:47Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, that's the only thing I'm thinking about.

• 1:17:50Speaker 05

  Well, I mean, like, those do attack people.

• 1:17:52Speaker 07

  Just the way they swim through the water.

• 1:17:54Steven Rinella?

  Yeah.

• 1:17:54Speaker 07

  With their heads, yeah.

• 1:17:55Speaker 05

  Well, and underwater, they spiral like this and like get all close to you and act all aggressive.

• 1:18:00Speaker 04

  You've seen that in the water?

• 1:18:02Speaker 05

  No, but I've seen, I've, I mean, he just had, him and Greg had a, I'm trying to stay away from those. They scare me. I've seen seals. I've gotten pretty close to seals. Seals don't do anything, though.

• 1:18:13Steven Rinella?

  No.

• 1:18:14Speaker 04

  I'm not gonna get in the water if there's sea lions.

• 1:18:16Steven Rinella?

  Oh, we had one last talking point. Oh, sorry, go ahead.

• 1:18:17Speaker 00

  No, I was just gonna say, I think that's, when you can picture what people would say when you, if you were to die.

• 1:18:24Steven Rinella?

  Oh, yeah. What an idiot.

• 1:18:25Speaker 00

  And people would be like.

• 1:18:26Steven Rinella?

  I wrote about that. I wrote about that.

• 1:18:29Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:18:30Steven Rinella?

  Um.

• 1:18:30Speaker 00

  For the, the Free Press thing.

• 1:18:32Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, I wrote about that. When you're doing things, you can't live that way, but you're doing things you just picture like. You know, oh, that he would bring his children, he would put his children at risk.

• 1:18:48Speaker 00

  But there's truth to it. I mean, there is truth to that. I'm not saying that that truth should like supersede the other positive benefits that are, you know, gleaned by giving your kids the opportunities to do these really wild adventurous things. And I think as parents, we are in agreement that that outweighs the risk. But it's sad to think like if you were to, if you two went diving tomorrow and you were to be killed.

• 1:19:20Steven Rinella?

  By what?

• 1:19:21Speaker 00

  Be like, what an asshole. Took his kid out.

• 1:19:23Steven Rinella?

  By what?

• 1:19:24Speaker 00

  By anything.

• 1:19:25Steven Rinella?

  Lost our boat.

• 1:19:26Speaker 06

  Lightning.

• 1:19:26Speaker 04

  Yeah, but I guess if he's this is

• 1:19:30Steven Rinella?

  The one's gonna be doggone

• 1:19:31Speaker 04

  Too close to home, really, but like if you're, if he took his kid driving.

• 1:19:37Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:19:38Steven Rinella?

  That's a whole nother story.

• 1:19:39Speaker 04

  In a, you know, in sketchy winter conditions.

• 1:19:42Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:19:43Speaker 04

  And then there's an accident.

• 1:19:44Speaker 00

  Yeah. I mean, there's, I know, there's always.

• 1:19:48Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, the, like, the judgment part, that, that I don't, I'm aware of it, but the judgment part, I got enough problems if something bad happens, like the judgment part, I wouldn't worry about. And, and

• 1:20:04Steven Rinella?

  when, what's kind of funny is, we'll close this up in a second, but when the submersible, the Titan, the Ocean Gate submersible, when it imploded,

• 1:20:22Steven Rinella?

  I was asked about, like, immediately, all these people, without even knowing any of the story, all this condemnation, oh, so stupid, what idiots, the hubris, they deserved it, right? And it was like, before anyone knew the details, there was a ton of condemnation. I'm going to be careful with my words here because before the details emerged, there was an immediate condemnation. And it was kind of like, how dare you be risky?

• 1:20:57Speaker 04

  How dare you go where you're not supposed to be?

• 1:20:59Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, how dare you be risky? We're going to ridicule you for being risky.

• 1:21:06Steven Rinella?

  And I almost wrote about that. I was asked to write about it. I was asked to write about risk and like in this sort of thing where does people feeling like they had to be so safe all the time. In hindsight, I'm glad I didn't because when the story emerged about Stockton Rush, the CEO, right, of the company and his attitude toward his own team, his attitude toward safety records, his attitude toward just basically the science of what he was trying to do was negligent to the point that he kind of killed those people.

• 1:21:46Steven Rinella?

  Like he, he not quite that he put a gun against him, but like he was toying with the hammer, right? He was playing with a pistol with those guys downrange, like to put it in gun terms. So then I was like, man, I'm glad I didn't do it. I did because it was something bad. And so there's that. There's like, people that get into a thing where there's like an inevitability of what's going to come. To bring it back to Kate Buffalo, and I respect him, you know, we talk about Morgan Potter.

• 1:22:28Speaker 00

  He was wonderful.

• 1:22:30Steven Rinella?

  Yep. Great guy. Family man. But there, you're like, oh, so you're going to track a bunch of those and you're going to track three or four wounded ones every year and you're going to do this for 30 or 40 years. Oh, I see. That's an interesting choice. It's like, that's an interesting choice.

• 1:22:53Speaker 00

  But what's also interesting is he was doing that, he was doing that prior to having a family.

• 1:22:56Steven Rinella?

  Yeah.

• 1:22:57Speaker 00

  That's like, you know, in many ways, a lot of the stuff that you do.

• 1:23:04Speaker 00

  Even if I don't like it, or if I think it's too risky, you did it before

• 1:23:07Steven Rinella?

  Yeah.

• 1:23:08Speaker 00

  We were married and had a family. So how could I ask you not to do it now?

• 1:23:11Steven Rinella?

  Yeah.

• 1:23:12Speaker 00

  Like, it wouldn't be fair. It's not who you are.

• 1:23:15Steven Rinella?

  Hmm.

• 1:23:17Speaker 04

  Now, I don't feel like I do risky shit anymore. I just don't.

• 1:23:21Steven Rinella?

  No, I don't feel like I do risky stuff. Well.

• 1:23:23Speaker 00

  Yeah, a hundred mile, a hundred mile run.

• 1:23:26Steven Rinella?

  Yeah.

• 1:23:27Speaker 04

  What is it?

• 1:23:27Speaker 00

  Some people could say.

• 1:23:28Speaker 04

  Could have a heart, give me a heart attack?

• 1:23:30Speaker 00

  Maybe? I don't know.

• 1:23:31Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, but we just had a, we just had a colleague that was out for a run and had a tragic

• 1:23:37Steven Rinella?

  accident. Not an accident, but a health, you know, issue.

• 1:23:42Speaker 04

  Did I know about this?

• 1:23:43Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, you know about it.

• 1:23:51Steven Rinella?

  You're the one that told me about it.

• 1:23:55Speaker 04

  No.

• 1:23:56Steven Rinella?

  One of our camera guys passed away.

• 1:23:59Speaker 04

  Oh, I didn't know the details, though. So I didn't tell you about it.

• 1:24:04Steven Rinella?

  Oh.

• 1:24:05Speaker 04

  Sorry.

• 1:24:06Steven Rinella?

  You said that to me.

• 1:24:08Speaker 04

  Well, yeah, but I, but at that point, we didn't know.

• 1:24:10Steven Rinella?

  At this point, like, there's a GoFundMe for him. We had a cameraman.

• 1:24:13Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:24:14Steven Rinella?

  Um.

• 1:24:14Speaker 04

  Yeah, I'm aware.

• 1:24:15Steven Rinella?

  Well, his, his, we had a cameraman. He has children. His name is Mike Lindemuth. He's, he, he filmed, if, if you watched the Meat Eater TV show and you saw an episode where Yanni and I went hunting a meal deer, for instance, in Wyoming, with Crooked Sky Outfitters, like, the cameraman that shot that show.

• 1:24:30Speaker 04

  He filmed, he filmed here.

• 1:24:32Steven Rinella?

  He, he, he sat.

• 1:24:33Speaker 04

  He sat around this table.

• 1:24:34Steven Rinella?

  He sat at this table.

• 1:24:35Speaker 04

  Yeah. And hunted this up here. Missouri with Parker Hall.

• 1:24:37Steven Rinella?

  Yep, yep. Okay. Yeah, he sat in this, sat here. Uh.

• 1:24:44Steven Rinella?

  Um, he was like, out on a run and collapsed.

• 1:24:48Speaker 04

  Hmm.

• 1:24:49Steven Rinella?

  So, uh, I don't know tons of details about it. But when he was imagining, I hate to do this, I mean, I hate to even talk about this, someone that recently passed, when he was imagining the risk in his life, I don't think he was imagining.

• 1:25:04Speaker 04

  No.

• 1:25:04Steven Rinella?

  That. Right. He wasn't looking in that, he wasn't looking in that direction. And this is not, I mean, I don't even want to kind of be like, being, I don't even want to kind of get like philosophical about what his family's going through, like, or, or like draw lessons from what happened to him. I mean, it's totally unexpected, totally tragic. However, there's just, there's like, the things you are obsessing over, and then there's the things that are gonna get you.

• 1:25:30Steven Rinella?

  And they're not the same. Sometimes for the, for the lucky few, they're the same. Stockton Rush, the Titan submersible guy, the thing he obsessed over, the thing he worried about got him.

• 1:25:44Steven Rinella?

  You know, and most people, the thing you obsessed over.

• 1:25:46Speaker 06

  And some people would say, you know, well, that's okay.

• 1:25:50Steven Rinella?

  He probably would have. I think he would have. Uh, last thought before we close.

• 1:25:54Speaker 06

  Mm hmm.

• 1:25:54Steven Rinella?

  You guys are wondering why, uh, how it came to be that I used to tease you guys. I don't think I teased you about Stormy.

• 1:25:59Speaker 06

  Oh, no, you did. No. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. I think it qualifies as teasing.

• 1:26:03Steven Rinella?

  Here's what happened. Why do, why does, uh, why do I now have one?

• 1:26:08Speaker 06

  What is it with these guys and those Stormy Cromers? Yeah. Like maybe, uh, the term goofy hat would have, would have been used.

• 1:26:15Steven Rinella?

  I didn't know. I was teasing something I didn't understand. You want to know what happened? Here's what happened. There's a rancher that lets me hunt his place. And as I do, when I get, uh, when someone lets me hunt their place, I always like to follow up with a gift. And there's nothing a rancher likes more than a Stormy Cromer.

• 1:26:34Speaker 06

  Yep.

• 1:26:34Steven Rinella?

  So him and his kid.

• 1:26:35Speaker 06

  Cowboy hat maybe, but I, I see where you're going.

• 1:26:38Steven Rinella?

  So him and his kid, so first light had a Stormy Cromer, uh, a couple of Stormy Cromer collabs. So I wanted to get one for the dad, one for the son. I got one of them a warm one.

• 1:26:53Steven Rinella?

  Uh, and I got one on the wax cotton, but I want them to come to my house so that I could then package them with a couple of little gifts and send it as a annual thank you. And I got it and I don't want them to listen to this and think I put it on, but I got it and I was like, oh, I see. Because you order it to your size.

• 1:27:16Steven Rinella?

  And in a boat, there's no way your hat's going to blow off.

• 1:27:21Speaker 06

  Or hunting.

• 1:27:22Steven Rinella?

  Whatever. It's just the sucker's on there and the bill is the right length and sits just where you want.

• 1:27:27Speaker 06

  It's not too long. It's not too short. Just right.

• 1:27:30Steven Rinella?

  And it's a little bit warm. It's not a hot weather hat, but boating around, yeah, I'm sure.

• 1:27:35Speaker 06

  Wool ones have their place, man. They're nice.

• 1:27:37Steven Rinella?

  But boating around, uh, your hat is staying where it belongs.

• 1:27:40Speaker 00

  I think it's pretty interesting that as a thank you gift, you ordered something for two people that you thought was goofy looking.

• 1:27:48Speaker 04

  That's a good point.

• 1:27:49Steven Rinella?

  I thought it was a little bit stolen valor for, uh, like, I thought it was like, uh, it'd be like if these guys had big old belt buckles.

• 1:27:56Speaker 00

  Yeah, he does now.

• 1:27:57Steven Rinella?

  Well, he does now. Not, it was just like, it was like, it's like, I view it like, it's like a, it's like a rancher hat, right? Yeah, he's trying to be thoughtful. People in the ag industry.

• 1:28:07Speaker 00

  I think you were jealous of the hat.

• 1:28:08Steven Rinella?

  A guy that's not in the ag and a guy that wasn't in the ag industry, I was a little bit like, yeah, I don't know, should I be doing that? I just want to know how long that thing sat there and Steve's like looking at it like.

• 1:28:18Speaker 00

  Oh, like two minutes.

• 1:28:19Steven Rinella?

  No, I knew immediately. I knew immediately. I knew immediately. I understood why.

• 1:28:24Speaker 04

  It just happened to be your size that you had ordered.

• 1:28:26Speaker 05

  Well, you know, it's funny, Brody's son last year at the mule deer hunt.

• 1:28:31Steven Rinella?

  He was running one.

• 1:28:32Speaker 05

  Yeah. And you said it was the greatest hat ever made. And you told me about the history in Michigan and we looked at on the back and everything.

• 1:28:37Speaker 07

  Yeah. See, when I was growing up.

• 1:28:38Speaker 05

  And then you still trash talk.

• 1:28:40Speaker 07

  When I was growing up, it was like.

• 1:28:41Steven Rinella?

  I was conflicted. I was conflicted. Here I am. I got the damn hat on.

• 1:28:45Speaker 07

  When I was growing up, it was, I never even thought of a rancher or someone in the ag industry wearing, it was always like the Northwoods hunters. Like folks in Maine, folks in northern Minnesota was got like.

• 1:28:55Steven Rinella?

  No, no, no, northern, maybe Maine, northern Minnesota. I'd have been like, really? Well, it's Michigan, isn't it?

• 1:29:02Speaker 07

  Yeah.

• 1:29:02Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:29:02Steven Rinella?

  It's a Michigan product.

• 1:29:03Steven Rinella?

  It's Michigan company.

• 1:29:04Speaker 07

  Yeah, U P.

• 1:29:05Steven Rinella?

  Again, you'd like ag adjacent.

• 1:29:10Speaker 00

  I think that was in.

• 1:29:10Steven Rinella?

  Ag adjacent. Like if you were down, I mean, does, I don't, we don't spend all day, you know, some guy.

• 1:29:16Steven Rinella?

  No, I'm happy as a clam to see you with a hat. Some guy getting a cranberry scone in Minneapolis, you know? Yeah, I get, yes.

• 1:29:26Steven Rinella?

  Like, I'd be like, really?

• 1:29:28Speaker 04

  Listen, I, I find it interesting how many people.

• 1:29:31Steven Rinella?

  I love cranberries gone.

• 1:29:32Speaker 07

  It's cranberry country.

• 1:29:34Speaker 04

  The Stormy Cromer to me is a very like technical, functional piece of equipment. Especially when you compare it to a classic half plastic, half, uh, cotton baseball hat that most hunters are walking around in the woods in. That really, I mean, it gives you some shade, but other than that, it's like the, the fabric that it's made out of is not very technical. It's if they get wet, they, it stinks. Um.

• 1:30:03Steven Rinella?

  They don't keep you warm. They don't keep you dry. I mean, what, what greater, what greater, uh, capitulation?

• 1:30:14Steven Rinella?

  Could there be? Then here I am.

• 1:30:17Speaker 00

  I just think.

• 1:30:17Speaker 04

  Like I said, I'm happy.

• 1:30:18Speaker 00

  People don't hear you often say that you were wrong or they change your mind. So I feel like everyone wants to hear you grovel a little bit.

• 1:30:25Steven Rinella?

  I was just, I, I, I wasn't wrong. I felt that there was like a, just the same with cowboy hats. There's, there's guys, and I don't know, I know it when I see it. There's guys that should have them and there's guys that shouldn't have them.

• 1:30:40Speaker 04

  So I'm like the Stormy Cromer. You're not gonna wake up one day and be like cowboy hat. Like give it away.

• 1:30:46Steven Rinella?

  No, listen, listen, listen, me? No business in a cowboy, if you ever catch me in a cowboy hat. If you ever catch me in a cowboy hat, I would expect you to punch me.

• 1:30:59Speaker 04

  Okay.

• 1:30:59Steven Rinella?

  I will never, I have no business in a cowboy hat. No business in a cowboy hat.

• 1:31:04Speaker 04

  I'm just glad you came around on the Stormy Cromer.

• 1:31:07Steven Rinella?

  I have no, yeah, I, I have business in a Stormy Cromer.

• 1:31:11Speaker 04

  Oh yeah, you fit the part, man. Look at you.

• 1:31:14Steven Rinella?

  Business in my fur hat. I do not have business in a cowboy hat.

• 1:31:17Speaker 00

  Cranberry scones for you while you're wearing it is what you're saying.

• 1:31:21Speaker 04

  He's not gonna, he doesn't want.

• 1:31:22Steven Rinella?

  It depends on what I'm on my way to do.

• 1:31:24Speaker 04

  He's talking about some like hipster with a curated look.

• 1:31:28Speaker 00

  I know what he's talking about.

• 1:31:29Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, like, and then I, you know. Uh, listen, these guys I bought a couple for. It was a gift. I was trying to think of what, what could I get for them that they would like the most?

• 1:31:40Speaker 04

  I think it's a great gift.

• 1:31:42Steven Rinella?

  Very nice.

• 1:31:43Speaker 04

  Just never got to it.

• 1:31:44Speaker 00

  All of us really like the hat. We've always liked that. You're the one who had that hat problem.

• 1:31:48Steven Rinella?

  Sitting there wearing some bitch right now. Now what I'm not gonna do. Yanni puts an elk ivory up front.

• 1:31:53Speaker 04

  It's not true.

• 1:31:54Steven Rinella?

  I don't even have enough personality.

• 1:31:57Speaker 04

  I don't have any with an elk ivory up there.

• 1:31:59Steven Rinella?

  You do.

• 1:32:00Speaker 04

  No, I don't.

• 1:32:01Steven Rinella?

  What do you have up front on yours?

• 1:32:03Speaker 04

  Nothing. I just, but I will say, I just have mine tied in the little bow and I like.

• 1:32:07Steven Rinella?

  I don't have enough personality for the bow.

• 1:32:09Speaker 04

  I, well, no, but I like what you did because that bow has a hard time staying tied.

• 1:32:14Steven Rinella?

  Yeah.

• 1:32:15Speaker 00

  What did you do?

• 1:32:16Steven Rinella?

  Squaring out, tucked in.

• 1:32:17Speaker 04

  You've committed to never turning the ear flaps down.

• 1:32:20Steven Rinella?

  Cut it and burned it. No, I think I did.

• 1:32:23Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:32:23Steven Rinella?

  Well, put the ear flaps down, you just pull them down. Pull them down on the stormy.

• 1:32:27Speaker 04

  Do they go down without untieing that thing?

• 1:32:29Steven Rinella?

  Oh yeah. Oh yeah. You just pull it down.

• 1:32:31Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:32:35Speaker 06

  They do that on the wool ones?

• 1:32:36Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:32:37Speaker 06

  Why did I never know that?

• 1:32:41Steven Rinella?

  Like, I could pull off a stormy chrome or no problem. Case in point. Now with a bow up front? No.

• 1:32:50Speaker 00

  I think you could, Steve, right? You're, you're, uh, selling yourself short. I think you could pull off a bow.

• 1:32:55Steven Rinella?

  A bow.

• 1:32:56Speaker 04

  You got it.

• 1:32:57Steven Rinella?

  A bow on my hat. Little bow peep.

• 1:32:59Speaker 04

  We did see a guy at the state theater in Collinsville, Michigan, that I think had a pair of, uh, wild pig tusks tied into his.

• 1:33:10Steven Rinella?

  That's a lot of personality.

• 1:33:12Speaker 04

  It is.

• 1:33:13Steven Rinella?

  I don't have that kind of personality.

• 1:33:15Speaker 04

  But I liked it when I saw it. I was like, that's cool.

• 1:33:17Speaker 00

  Why did Steve think you had, what do you think you had?

• 1:33:19Speaker 04

  An elk ivory.

• 1:33:21Steven Rinella?

  You don't have elk ivories tied up on top of yours? I like that idea.

• 1:33:25Speaker 00

  I love it that in your mind he does.

• 1:33:26Speaker 04

  I don't want to lose my elk ivories. They, they fall off.

• 1:33:29Speaker 06

  My wool orange one is more on the legal.

• 1:33:32Speaker 05

  Never wear a hat that has more personality than you do.

• 1:33:35Steven Rinella?

  Never wear a hat that says hello before you do. That's right. Like father, like son.

• 1:33:40Speaker 06

  I need an orange one. Mine's faded.

• 1:33:42Speaker 04

  Okay, we've gone long enough?

• 1:33:43Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, people are bored by this.

• 1:33:45Speaker 04

  What do we have to do now? We just have to eat dinner and get ready to go fish again, huh?

• 1:33:48Speaker 06

  Hopefully clean some salmon.

• 1:33:50Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, the, the water's laid down. Things look good. We got some bad weather coming in. We got some good weather coming up.

• 1:33:56Speaker 04

  Yeah, and our crazy little kids have gone out to the float and are swimming.

• 1:34:01Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, they always do now.

• 1:34:02Speaker 04

  Fifty-five degree water. It's not even sunny out there.

• 1:34:05Speaker 00

  Yeah, we should, that's something I worry about.

• 1:34:08Speaker 06

  High risk.

• 1:34:08Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, eighty of them out in one canoe. I can't believe you let your kids do that.

• 1:34:14Steven Rinella?

  Uh, all right. Thank you, everybody.

• 1:34:15Speaker 04

  Thanks for listening.

• 1:34:43Steven Rinella?

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• 1:35:23Steven Rinella?

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• 1:36:50Speaker 04

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