I Overheard My Mom Bad-Mouthing My Wife

On today’s episode, we hear about: - A man who overheard his mom gossiping about his wife - A young man wondering if he should start dating his ex . . . again - A woman unsure when to disclose her checkered past to her boyfriend Next Steps: 📞 Ask John a question! Call 844-693-3291 or send us a message. 📚 Building a Non-Anxious Life 📝 Anxiety Test 📚 Own Your Past, Change Your Future ❓ Questions for Humans Conversation Cards 💭 John's Free Guided Meditation 🤘🏼 The Dr. John Delony Show Merch Connect With Our Sponsors: Need to talk to someone? BetterHelp is virtual therapy when it’s convenient for you. Get 10% off your first month of BetterHelp. These are the BEST sheets and towels in the world. Get up to 40% off with code DELONY at Cozy Earth. Getting lots of spam calls? DeleteMe can clean up your online presence for you. Get 20% off when you join DeleteMe. Find peace every day. Hallow is the simplest way to slow down and get your head right for the day. Go to Hallow for a 90-day free trial. I have Helix Midnight mattresses in EVERY bedroom in my house. Get 20% off when you visit Helix Sleep and take the sleep quiz to see what you need! I took Thorne supplements way before I worked at Ramsey. Stoked that we can work together now! Get 25% off for LIFE at Thorne. Head over to Poncho Outdoors to try the best outdoor performance shirt for yourself! Explore More From Ramsey Network: 🎙️ The Ramsey Show 💸 The Ramsey Show Highlights 🍸 Smart Money Happy Hour 💡 The Rachel Cruze Show 💰 George Kamel 🪑 Front Row Seat with Ken Coleman 📈 EntreLeadership Ramsey Solutions Privacy Policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:05Speaker 00

  I was doing some side work for my aunt. She'd been calling me all day and one of the times that she called, it ended up being a butt dial. I heard my wife's name, so it was an eight-minute conversation that I listened to.

• 0:17Dr. John Delony?

  Damn, Gina, they, dude, they went after your wife.

• 0:29Dr. John Delony?

  Woo, what's up? This is John with the Dr. John Deloney Show, taking your calls from all over planet Earth. Real people going through real tough stuff. And my promise is I'll sit here with you. I've been sitting with hurting people for more than two decades, trying to figure out what's the next right move. You want to be on the show, go to John Deloney, D E L O N Y, JohnDeloney.com/ask, A S K. Let's go out to Raleigh, North Carolina, and talk to Chris. What's up, Chris?

• 0:58Speaker 00

  Hey, Dr. John, how are you?

• 0:59Dr. John Delony?

  I'm good, brother. What's up with you?

• 1:02Speaker 00

  Oh, man, I'm trying not to sweat my butt off out here. It's hot.

• 1:05Dr. John Delony?

  It is, it's hot. You want to keep your butt, that's an important part of human anatomy, butt. Yeah, it is hot up there, dude. It's hot, hot, hot. What's up, man?

• 1:14Speaker 00

  Well, I'll just kind of get right into my question. I was doing some, some side work, some, some extra work on the weekends, and I was working for my aunt, and she'd been calling me all day just to kind of check in and see how the work was going, and one of the times that she called, it ended up being a butt dial, and picked it up, said hello, and I heard my name, and then I heard my wife's name in the background, and realized it was a butt dial, and so I thought, okay, maybe I should hang up, but then hearing my name and my wife's name-

• 1:46Dr. John Delony?

  No, we gotta keep listening to this one, yeah.

• 1:49Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:51Speaker 00

  So it was an eight-minute conversation that I listened to. And it was basically my aunt and my mother talking about what my wife and I should do differently, about how my wife should work more, about how she should just get over the mental illness that she deals with, and how she, you know, there, there are just better ways that she could parent our kids, and-

• 2:14Dr. John Delony?

  Damn, Gina, they, dude, they went after your wife.

• 2:21Speaker 00

  They did, yeah.

• 2:24Dr. John Delony?

  What an unfortunate butt.

• 2:25Speaker 00

  I'm not real happy about it.

• 2:28Dr. John Delony?

  No, did you say anything?

• 2:30Speaker 00

  So I didn't. So eventually what ended up happening is I heard somebody pick up the phone and say, "Oh crap." And then they said, "Chris, are you there?" And I totally ignored it, acting like, like I wasn't there. And then they hung up. And like five minutes later, they called back like, "Hey, I'm just checking in to see how things are going." And I acted like it was totally fine.

• 2:53Dr. John Delony?

  Oh, no, you didn't. Okay.

• 2:55Speaker 00

  I did. Just because I, I've been through some things in life and I know that my gut reaction is not the one that I should listen to.

• 3:01Dr. John Delony?

  Me too, me too. Good for you. Good for you. Good for you.

• 3:06Speaker 00

  Um, so I decided to write into the show and, and get your advice on it.

• 3:11Dr. John Delony?

  Um, yeah, there's a lot here, man.

• 3:16Dr. John Delony?

  Um, I guess first out of the bag, I personally, and I'm sure there's different opinions on this, I, I don't think you're a bad guy for listening when you heard your name. I don't know. I, I would have. I don't know if there's a right or wrong, or maybe it's wrong, but, um, I have a rule that whenever I pick up the phone and I hear somebody's butt dialed, I immediately hang up. Because I, I just, if you don't want to talk to me, I don't want to hear it. Um, but if I pick up the phone and someone had butt dialed and I heard them say my name, I would definitely listen. So I guess maybe past right or wrong, you're human for having listened, okay?

• 3:54Speaker 00

  Um, okay.

• 3:55Dr. John Delony?

  The bigger deal is, it doesn't matter. You have that information now.

• 4:00Speaker 00

  Right.

• 4:01Dr. John Delony?

  And so I guess you have to deal with the fact that your aunt, your mom talking crap about you and talking crap about your wife, talking crap about your marriage. And I guess you get to decide what you do next. The only thing I would ask you is to continue to be a person of integrity and dignity and respect in your response.

• 4:22Speaker 00

  Okay.

• 4:23Dr. John Delony?

  And what that means is, don't pretend it didn't happen. Um, if you choose to not in associate with your aunt anymore, or with your mom anymore, at least be of the courage and the integrity to tell them why.

• 4:38Speaker 00

  Okay.

• 4:39Dr. John Delony?

  Um, or if you want to confront them and sit down and say, hey, I heard y'all talking about my wife, like, let's just be open about this. And, I mean, well, I, knowing your aunt, your mom, how would that go?

• 4:53Speaker 00

  Um, justification would, would be the immediate response.

• 4:58Dr. John Delony?

  Tell me, what does that mean?

• 4:59Speaker 00

  This is, so, they would be like, oh, well, we, we didn't mean it that way. That's not what we said. That's, you know, we, we don't mean any harm or ill will to, towards you or, or your wife. You know, we were, we were just talking because we want what's best for you, and we know how hard you work, and we just feel like she could work harder. And these are things that I've, that I've heard before.

• 5:18Dr. John Delony?

  Sure.

• 5:19Speaker 00

  From them.

• 5:19Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 5:20Speaker 00

  Um, this is not the first time, it just, this is the first time that I've happened to hear them talk about it when nobody else was around.

• 5:25Dr. John Delony?

  Yeah. So, let's leave them out of this for a second. And let's not them, let them dictate, what's the next right move for you?

• 5:36Dr. John Delony?

  So, I'll ask you, what's the next right move for, for you and your wife?

• 5:43Speaker 00

  Um, the next right move would probably be to put up, well, my next right move would probably be to tell my wife that this happened.

• 5:52Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 5:52Speaker 00

  So, she doesn't even know that this happened.

• 5:54Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 5:56Speaker 00

  And that's kind of my way of protecting her, because she does have a lot of, um, mental health challenges going on. Um, a lot of them surrounding self-worth. And for me to go and tell her these things would probably not be the best idea.

• 6:09Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 6:11Speaker 00

  Um, after that.

• 6:12Dr. John Delony?

  Let me, let me catch, let me pause you right there. Tell me about, um...

• 6:19Dr. John Delony?

  Because here's the thing, I'm not gonna let two other people

• 6:24Dr. John Delony?

  drop a bomb in my marriage, and for you, that marriage, that bomb is a secret. And somebody struggling with self-worth, it can be incredibly attuned to their partner hiding something from them.

• 6:36Dr. John Delony?

  And they will backfill that, what they perceive that gap to be, that, that secret, that hole in the relationship, with all kind of wild stories. And so in a way, keeping secrets can be cruel. At the same time, um, let's, let's use a totally different example. Let's say, um,

• 6:55Dr. John Delony?

  I'm gonna take it away from your wife, just to make it so I can be obnoxious. Let's say you had a buddy, like a dude buddy named Dan, okay? And let's say Dan was 400 pounds overweight. And another couple of your buddies butt dialed you and heard you, and they were just making fun of you. "He's so fat, oh my gosh, he's the fattest guy, sick, he's gross," whatever. And then you were in with Dan, and Dan said, "Hey, I wanna call the guys and bring them over."

• 7:23Dr. John Delony?

  There would be a way you could say that to him,

• 7:27Dr. John Delony?

  that he would get the picture, that you wouldn't have to bury him.

• 7:32Dr. John Delony?

  And you could hurt him with the precise truth, or you could very much tell him the truth without burying him. Do you get what I'm saying?

• 7:39Speaker 00

  Yes.

• 7:40Dr. John Delony?

  And so I would recommend, if you're, especially if your wife's in a fragile emotional state, or she's working, like, right in the middle of working on her mental health challenges. She ain't got anxiety, depression, what's she struggling with?

• 7:52Speaker 00

  Yeah, anxiety and depression.

• 7:53Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 7:54Speaker 00

  And, and she's, she's getting ready to get tested for bipolar.

• 7:57Dr. John Delony?

  Okay, is she seeing somebody?

• 7:59Speaker 00

  Uh, she is. It's, it's a once a month thing right now. We're, we're looking to work our finances up so that she can go more often.

• 8:05Dr. John Delony?

  Okay, make that a high priority. And I think there's a way to sit down and, and say, "Hey, listen, here's the deal. Um, my aunt and my mom butt dialed me, and I'm not gonna go into specifics, but they said some ugly things about how I'm choosing to live my life and people I love and care about. So I'm putting up some boundaries." "Oh my gosh, what did they say? Did they say something about me?" Like, I'm not getting any of the details. I don't wanna go back and rehash all that, but I'm putting up some details, because I heard some things that I didn't care for what they said.

• 8:35Dr. John Delony?

  There's that, or there is, they told, they said that you need to get off your butt and work more. You see what I'm saying? And one of those will tailspin her, and one of those may be painful for her, because she'll know by inference, but she will be spared the barbed wire of those details.

• 8:52Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 8:55Dr. John Delony?

  But there's a way to make yourself feel better and almost empower yourself and unite with her against your aunt, your mother by being very specific. But man, if she's in a delicate situation, she's getting bipolar, that tells me that she's really struggling right now, right?

• 9:10Speaker 00

  Yes, very much so.

• 9:12Dr. John Delony?

  Yeah. And does she know in the past that aunt and mom have said things about her, or don't like how y'all are doing your, deciding to live your lives?

• 9:20Speaker 00

  Um, no, it's been more, we set up boundaries when we first started having kids that, um, you know, each of us would take the lead at our respective family's houses. And so, um, you know, when we're over at her family's house, she would be the one that kind of would lay the boundaries down with the, with the in-laws, and I would do the same thing with my family. And so like, if there was anything that happened that went wrong, I would be the one to take care of it at my house, or at my parents' house, and she would be the one to take care of it at her parents' house. And then we'd come together afterwards and talk about what happened and what needs to change and what would be different.

• 9:54Dr. John Delony?

  Okay. Tell me how your wife, so if my wife came home and said, "I overheard somebody saying something about you and us, and it disgusts me, we're not hanging out with them anymore." I would go stone insane until she finally told me what they said.

• 10:09Dr. John Delony?

  If I came home and told my wife, "Hey, this person said some gross stuff about me and you, we're not hanging out with them anymore, I don't want to talk about it," my wife would never ask another question.

• 10:20Dr. John Delony?

  She would say like, "I trust you to, if I don't need to hear it, I don't want to hear it." How is your wife?

• 10:25Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 10:26Dr. John Delony?

  She like me, or she like my wife?

• 10:28Speaker 00

  She would be like, "That's fine, I don't need to hear it."

• 10:30Dr. John Delony?

  Oh, that's awesome. Good for you, man. That maybe that's, that maybe she's wise like my wife and not immature like me. But like, uh, that's where I would leave it, man. I wouldn't go too deep on it. So what, what does boundaries mean for y'all two?

• 10:45Speaker 00

  So as far as family goes?

• 10:47Dr. John Delony?

  Yep.

• 10:49Speaker 00

  So we've, we've already set up some pretty, some pretty good boundaries with, with my family, just because this has happened before, again, just with them talking poorly about others. Um, you know, so like if there are family get togethers, we kind of take it on a moment by moment basis. And if it comes day of, and we just kind of get this feeling that today is not a good day, we're just, we're gonna say, hey, today's not a good day for us. We're not coming over. Um, you know, we don't even do Christmas with the family. We don't do, um, we'll do Thanksgiving every other year. We kind of swap off with, with the in-laws. So there's already some pretty, um, some pretty good firm boundaries in place. Um, and they are tested. They, they, I won't, I won't say that they're, that they're perfect, but they are tested. Um, but, but we do our best to hold as, as firm as we can with

• 11:34Speaker 00

  them.

• 11:35Dr. John Delony?

  Very cool.

• 11:39Dr. John Delony?

  If this was me, I would probably sit down and talk to my mom about it unless my mom was, um, someone who couldn't hear it or someone who's unstable.

• 11:49Speaker 00

  Okay.

• 11:50Dr. John Delony?

  Um, that's just me. And the reason I would do that is not to one up my mom or try to gain a power position. I would want to be honest about why the dynamic of our relationship will, is going to continue to further change.

• 12:05Dr. John Delony?

  And I cannot control her. I cannot control aunt. You can't control what they're talking about. You can't control what they think about your wife and whatever. I can control my calmness. I can control my honesty and my integrity, and I want to try to uphold that the best I can.

• 12:21Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 12:24Dr. John Delony?

  But I hate this for you, dude. Sorry, man.

• 12:27Speaker 00

  I, I appreciate it. Thank you. Yeah, it's a sucky situation.

• 12:31Dr. John Delony?

  Yeah. But I mean, uh, yeah. And unfortunately with technology, I mean, you accidentally get CC'd on an email. You accidentally text the wrong person. I've done all three of these things, by the way. Um, and that's where I've, I've tried to develop a lot of grace. If I start reading an email that it's not for me, I just instantly delete it because I'm hoping that somebody does that for me someday. Um, if I, again, if somebody, if I pick up the phone- And I clearly somebody's butt dialed, I just, I stop it immediately because I know I have been talking about stuff and I've accidentally butt dialed people before and I just hope they'll treat me with grace too. So, but here we are, man. You heard your name called and you listened to it and I think you've got to act on it. But, um, taking care of your wife and being honest

• 13:14Dr. John Delony?

  at the same time is a, is a delicate balance. But, um, there's a way to be honest with your wife and not weaponize the truth with all those jagged edges of what was said exactly. And if your mom can hear it, maybe we sit down and say, hey, mom, I heard this and it breaks my heart. We're working really hard and I love my wife and I'm gonna ask you not to talk about us, but she can do whatever she wants. And if you do, stop going over there more, stop being around the family more, etc. I think it's worth being honest about it. And then it doesn't have to be a long, drawn out conversation. You already know exactly what they're gonna say. So it's more about you just standing up for yourself and standing up for your wife and remaining a person of dignity and respect. But, thanks for the call, my brother. Appreciate you reaching

• 13:56Dr. John Delony?

  out. That's a, geez, that's a bum deal, man. We come back, a man asks how to handle his ex fiancee wanting to date again.

• 14:07Dr. John Delony?

  Alright, it's time to talk about Helix. Summer's here, the sun's up earlier, school's out, but we're already planning for the new school year. I cannot even believe that. And kids are bouncing off the wall. And if you're like me, everything in your life is just kinda chaos. It's chaos! And when that happens, what's the first thing that tanks? Our sleep. We stay up too late, we get up too early. I'm gonna be honest with you, when I'm not sleeping well, I got a short fuse with my wife, I can be grumpy with my kids, and everything just feels harder than it should. Listen, sleep isn't just about rest, it's about showing up the next day as the kinda person you wanna be, and it's the kinda person your friends and your colleagues and your family need you to

• 14:51Dr. John Delony?

  be. And that is why I sleep on a Helix mattress. I've tried all kinds of mattresses, mattresses that were too soft, too stiff, they had weird memory foam stuff. Listen, I've tried them all, Helix matched me with the perfect mattress based on how I sleep and how my wife sleeps. They've even got options for couples who need different feels on the same bed. It's incredible. I want you to take the Helix Sleep Quiz. I took it and it's great and it takes like two minutes and they're going to match you with the right mattress just for you. And right now, my audience gets early access to their Labor Day sale for 20% off site wide. Go to helixsleep.com/deloney and get 20% off your entire order.

• 15:35Dr. John Delony?

  That's helixsleep.com/deloney. With Helix, better sleep starts right now.

• 15:43Dr. John Delony?

  All right, Jacksonville, Florida. Let's talk to Nate Dogg. What's up, Nathan?

• 15:48Speaker 02

  Dr. John, how you doing, sir?

• 15:50Dr. John Delony?

  Good, brother. What's up with you, man?

• 15:52Speaker 02

  Man, I'm, I'm good. Nothing much.

• 15:55Dr. John Delony?

  That's awesome. What's up?

• 15:57Speaker 02

  Yeah, so I, um, yeah, first of all, I mean, thank you so much for taking my call today. It's, it's really an honor and a blessing to talk to you. Um, but I'm, I'm dealing with a little bit of grief here, um, with, with the current situation that I'm in. And so I'm wondering, you know, how do I go about building a new relationship, um, with my partner and kind of come to terms with the wrongs that I've done in, in our past relationship?

• 16:24Dr. John Delony?

  What happened?

• 16:26Speaker 02

  Um, so it's, it's definitely a unique situation. Um, we were together for about four years, um, and, uh, we were engaged and, and in March, uh, she came to me and, and told me that she was not happy and she didn't want to get married to me anymore. And, um, a week later, she, uh, had, had a moving truck ready to move out of the apartment and move into her new apartment and told me that- She didn't want any contact, no communication. And so I was trying to navigate as a, as a single guy. And three weeks later, she, she reached back out and, um, you know, said she had a change of heart and wanted to,

• 17:10Speaker 02

  to date again. And, um, you know, of course I, I reached out and, uh, I, I wanted to, to make it work. And so we have been, uh, having some conversations and, uh, really deep talks about what happened and how we go from here. And I think we are reconnecting, um, and we're in a better place emotionally. And I think, um, that kinda.

• 17:36Dr. John Delony?

  You still haven't told me what happened though. What'd you do?

• 17:38Speaker 02

  I had gone to, to strip clubs, um, and didn't tell her that they were strip clubs.

• 17:43Dr. John Delony?

  Okay. Did you tell her they weren't strip clubs?

• 17:45Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 17:46Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 17:46Speaker 02

  I did. Um, so I lied about that. I was, um, addicted to, to pornography.

• 17:53Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 17:54Speaker 02

  And I, I lied about that and didn't tell her that I was struggling. Um, and so, um.

• 17:59Dr. John Delony?

  Hold on, I want you to exhale for a second. I want you to sit in this for a second.

• 18:02Speaker 02

  Yeah. Yeah.

• 18:04Dr. John Delony?

  Exhale for a second.

• 18:09Dr. John Delony?

  Tell me it doesn't feel better to be free of that.

• 18:15Speaker 02

  Yeah, it does.

• 18:16Dr. John Delony?

  Okay. You don't have, I mean, there's a, there's millions of people who will hear this, right? But like, you don't have to hide from me. Okay?

• 18:24Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 18:24Dr. John Delony?

  There's something about just saying it, dude. Okay? You were not who you used, you wanted to be years ago. I wasn't either. None of us were. And there's something about just exhaling and saying it. So we can get on to how do we heal and build something new. Did you ever cheat on her?

• 18:40Speaker 02

  No, no, sir.

• 18:41Dr. John Delony?

  Okay. And so did she find out about this while y'all were engaged?

• 18:46Speaker 02

  Uh, no, sir. I, I came clean and, uh, and just owned up to it all.

• 18:51Dr. John Delony?

  Okay. And how'd she take that?

• 18:55Speaker 02

  Um, it was, it was tough at first. Um, I think she was kind of confused on how she felt and she took a couple of days, um, to think about it. And, uh, this was, I, I came clean in December of, of 2024, um, kind of let it all on the table. And, uh, you know, she took some time to think about it and told me that she didn't want to leave and she wanted to, to continue and press on with me.

• 19:21Dr. John Delony?

  Okay. So what happened that finally she just said, I can't go through with this?

• 19:27Speaker 02

  I, I think the, the lies were, um, were bad for my character. I definitely think that

• 19:35Dr. John Delony?

  I know, but like, but if she stayed for 18 more months,

• 19:40Dr. John Delony?

  that tells me that you continue to lie about little stuff all the time. Anyway, is that true?

• 19:47Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 19:47Dr. John Delony?

  Okay. Because if she, if she heard you and said, all right, you did this thing a couple of years ago. I don't like it. You lied to me, but I'm all in. I'm staying. I trust you. And you're going to always tell me the truth. You're like, yep, I'm all in. Cool. 18 months later,

• 20:06Dr. John Delony?

  unless she's getting breadcrumbs of this dude is still the same guy. He just circles the truth, doesn't come clean, just always has kind of got a, a roundabout way of trying to gloss things over. Her just saying, hey, I can't trust this guy to, to anchor into and build a life with, right?

• 20:23Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 20:24Dr. John Delony?

  Yeah.

• 20:26Dr. John Delony?

  So I don't know that you're like making amends for past mistakes. If, if 18 months ago, you dumped it all on the table and said, dude, all those times I told you, I was just like going to Chili's. I was actually at strip clubs and all those times I was doing X, Y, Z, I was out smoking weed with my buddies. And like, if you were honest and poured it all out there, then we're here. And if you live in a state of deficit, like I owe you now, you'll never catch up because you're scorekeeping.

• 20:54Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 20:54Dr. John Delony?

  Right? She'll, she'll feel more like a mother than, than a girlfriend, fiance, wife.

• 21:00Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 21:00Dr. John Delony?

  But how do you rebuild your relationship? First and foremost, dude, you have to get over whatever it is about Nathan you don't like.

• 21:09Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 21:10Dr. John Delony?

  Like, you don't like you, dude. Why?

• 21:15Speaker 02

  Just, I, I think I'm falling into the patterns of my, uh, of my biological father.

• 21:22Dr. John Delony?

  Okay, let's, let's leave him out of this. Did he bail on you?

• 21:25Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 21:26Dr. John Delony?

  All right, let's don't bring him back to the table and start pointing fingers at him. Let's just deal with the dude in the mirror. Why don't you like you?

• 21:34Speaker 02

  Not who I want to be.

• 21:35Dr. John Delony?

  Okay, who do you want to be?

• 21:38Speaker 02

  I want to be, I want to be a good husband one day. I want to be honorable. I want to be honest. I want to be loyal and trustworthy.

• 21:49Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 21:53Dr. John Delony?

  What does, what does being deceptive about things get you? Now, if you

• 22:00Dr. John Delony?

  have five beers and end up in the backseat of a car and everybody takes you to a strip club and you just like go along with it? And you lie the next day, that gets you out of trouble. I get that. But what is lying about work stuff and little stuff and where's the phone charger? Like, what does that get you on a day-to-day basis?

• 22:21Speaker 02

  I mean,

• 22:24Speaker 02

  it doesn't get me anywhere. Um, but I think the reason why I struggle with it is it's, it's easier than having a, a longer conversation.

• 22:41Dr. John Delony?

  Well, there's two sides to that. One, you're gonna have a long conversation. It's either gonna be when she's moving out?

• 22:50Dr. John Delony?

  Or it's gonna be done in tiny little chunks, like, dude, why'd you take the phone charger again? That's one side. You're gonna have that length of a conversation.

• 23:00Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 23:01Dr. John Delony?

  The second one is a deeper one, which is, what are the things that you're continuing to do that are so bad that you think, I need to risk blowing up relationships at work, with friends, with my fiance? I've gotta keep this part of me hidden.

• 23:22Speaker 02

  Yeah, um, I've just been, I've been very, very selfish, um, especially this year.

• 23:30Dr. John Delony?

  What does that mean? That honestly, bro, that sounds like a move. Tell me what that means.

• 23:38Speaker 02

  Well, I mean, just, I, I, I'm not very, I mean, I, I think a, a larger problem of this, you know, that, you know, the lying has kinda led up to is, you know, I just, I'm not very emotionally available for her, you know, I'm not, I'm not thinking of her needs and, you know, it, it doesn't really matter her, or at least it did, you know, until this all happened. It didn't really matter where she was at, you know, she was my fiance and, and she was there and she wasn't gonna leave and I got in this state of just comfort and, and

• 24:23Speaker 02

  just normalcy that, you know, it didn't really matter what I did or, or if I needed to go above and beyond for her, you know, it was just, it was, it was a constant. And, you know, I think that's what really hurt her the most is just that she could just tell that I, I didn't care.

• 24:43Dr. John Delony?

  Is that true that you didn't care?

• 24:46Speaker 02

  No, no, no, of course not. Of course I cared about her.

• 24:48Dr. John Delony?

  I don't think it easier. Where do you work? Don't, don't tell me the office, but what kind of industry do you work in?

• 24:53Speaker 02

  I work in marketing.

• 24:54Dr. John Delony?

  How much money do you make?

• 24:56Speaker 02

  Uh, sixty grand.

• 24:58Dr. John Delony?

  Is that a real number? Is that a made up number?

• 25:01Speaker 02

  No, it's a real number.

• 25:02Dr. John Delony?

  Okay. Are you proud of that? Are you embarrassed by it?

• 25:06Speaker 02

  I'm proud of it.

• 25:07Dr. John Delony?

  Okay. Do you drive a car you can't afford?

• 25:12Speaker 02

  Uh, no, sir.

• 25:14Dr. John Delony?

  Okay. Do you live in an apartment you can't afford?

• 25:18Speaker 02

  Right now I do.

• 25:19Dr. John Delony?

  Okay. So here's what I want you to do. I want you to look at the places in your life where you're avoiding reality. Cause that's another way of lying to yourself.

• 25:29Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 25:31Dr. John Delony?

  If you make sixty grand and you drive a sixty thousand dollar car, you're lying to the world about this is how much money I have, right?

• 25:38Speaker 02

  Right.

• 25:38Dr. John Delony?

  If you live in a three thousand dollar a month apartment and you make sixty grand a year, you're lying to your friends and family about what, how you're doing.

• 25:46Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 25:49Dr. John Delony?

  I want you to take ownership of the skills you have. You're clearly talented at your job, they wouldn't pay you 60 grand.

• 25:55Dr. John Delony?

  And this woman clearly loves you, she keeps coming back and keeps coming back. My guess is she sees something in you that you can't see in yourself.

• 26:04Dr. John Delony?

  Is that fair?

• 26:05Speaker 02

  Definitely.

• 26:06Dr. John Delony?

  Has she said that exact thing to you?

• 26:09Speaker 02

  Something very similar.

• 26:10Dr. John Delony?

  Exactly.

• 26:12Dr. John Delony?

  And then, literally, this sounds silly, but you're gonna practice not lying anymore. And that means you're gonna have to have all of your little bitty shortcomings exposed in rapid succession, it's gonna feel like an exposed nerve, but then you're gonna realize she's not leaving and you're not gonna die. And that's how you're gonna practice standing up on your own two feet. I appreciate the call, man, we're not gonna go make amends, you've done that, you've told the truth. We're not gonna live in deficit.

• 26:42Dr. John Delony?

  But the only way to rebuild your relationship is to become somebody who is so concretely integrous

• 26:51Dr. John Delony?

  that you never hide from yourself or anybody again through dishonesty and lies. Thanks for the call, brother. We come back, a woman wants to know how to disclose her past with new dates.

• 27:04Dr. John Delony?

  Everywhere we turn these days, everyone's talking about AI, or our data privacy, or hacking, or whatever, listen, right now scammers are using phishing attacks, that's phishing with a P-H, they try to trick you into giving them something important or precious, like your data, by pretending to know you. You might get an email, a text, or a phone call, and the person or the AI bot on the other end sounds like someone who's trying to help you out and look out for you. They're not. With the new technological advancements, none of us can keep up, which means none of us is really safe. So what are we supposed to do? First, we're gonna start controlling what we can, we're gonna learn how to be careful with our digital privacy, online and offline, and we're gonna sign up with Delete Me.

• 27:49Dr. John Delony?

  I use and recommend Delete Me because they work in the background of my life to reduce my online presence, and that way I don't have to worry About creepy data brokers having my information without me knowing it and selling it to God knows who. Delete Me has reviewed over tens of thousands of sites for me and they've removed my data from hundreds of them, which has saved me countless hours and a ton of stress. Stop the phishing attacks and the harassment and the other online threats before they even start and take control of your digital privacy with Delete Me. Go to joindelete.me/deloney today for 20% off their annual plan. That comes out to less than nine bucks a month. That's joindelete.me/deloney. Go check them out.

• 28:35Dr. John Delony?

  Dayton, Ohio. Let's talk to Samantha. What's up Samantha?

• 28:39Speaker 03

  Hey, Dr. John Deloney. How are you?

• 28:42Dr. John Delony?

  What's up? I'm doing great. How about you?

• 28:45Speaker 03

  Better than I deserve. You know, partying.

• 28:47Dr. John Delony?

  There you go. What's up?

• 28:49Speaker 03

  So I want to first say that you're not just a YouTuber, Dr. John. You are really doing God's work. You know, I for one have learned so much from you and the compassion you have for others. And sometimes when I hear your call or struggles, it's really humbled me and made me even more grateful to be in the position that I'm in and show up better for the people in my life. So thank you so much for you and your staff.

• 29:11Dr. John Delony?

  Thank you. I'm grateful that you're taking what you hear on this show and putting it into the world, man. It's awesome.

• 29:19Speaker 03

  I feel like I have a third degree, a psychology degree, after binge watching all of your YouTube podcast videos.

• 29:24Dr. John Delony?

  Yeah, I'm not smart enough to be a psychologist, but I appreciate it. What's up?

• 29:27Speaker 03

  Yeah, totally. So I don't know if I have a simple question, but I find myself in a position many times where it's hard to navigate and I really need some guidance so that I can put my best foot forward and be able to have a life with things that I can still dream about and have.

• 29:45Dr. John Delony?

  Okay, let it rip.

• 29:48Speaker 03

  So from two thousand and sixteen to two thousand and seventeen, I got three DUIs.

• 29:53Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 29:54Speaker 03

  Where I live, um, I had to serve time for my third conviction, so I'm, I am a convicted felon.

• 30:00Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 30:02Speaker 03

  So it has really impacted me like in a multitude of ways. So my years of schooling, having proper and well-paying study employment, and now the way I even show up to be in relationships.

• 30:17Speaker 03

  So when I share the sensitive information, I've often been rejected. It feels like I am constantly aiming for a job that I'll never get. Kind of like when you're like up to bat and then your coach just benches you. And I have really, really come a long way in these eight years. How can I have my past no longer, I can't say no longer dictate my future, because it will forever dictate my future. But I, I, I just feel like I'm constantly rejected through, by so many people, future potential, potential employers. Now even relationships.

• 30:59Speaker 03

  Sometimes I even find myself like, I don't know, like I, I feel like I've, I've been craving companionship for so long that maybe I should hold out for another month or two before I just even lay it on thick with my past. Uh, and before you ask me any questions about why I don't like myself, or why can't I forgive myself, I really, really have. I have grace and I really have a lot of love for myself.

• 31:26Dr. John Delony?

  I wasn't even gonna ask you that one, but I'm glad that you've forgiven yourself. That's awesome. Are you sober now?

• 31:32Speaker 03

  I, I'm coming up on eight years sober in August.

• 31:35Dr. John Delony?

  Amazing. How often do you tell that story?

• 31:39Speaker 03

  Um, when I'm in AA, um, when I feel that like that, when I feel like that good comfort and vulnerability with someone else, that I can be vulnerable, I'll share it with them. Only very few close family members and friends know. It's not something that I like to talk about, but sometimes when I meet someone and I know they're struggling through something, I'll share about my past.

• 32:04Dr. John Delony?

  But you walk around not with the eight years of sobriety, with the eight years of victories, with the eight Super Bowl championships you've won. You walk around with the three you didn't win.

• 32:20Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 32:21Dr. John Delony?

  Why is that?

• 32:25Speaker 03

  I mean, I was a teacher, John. I have a bachelor's degree. I can't, I can't use that anymore.

• 32:30Dr. John Delony?

  That's not true. That's not true. In certain contexts, that is factual. That's not totally true.

• 32:39Speaker 03

  Mm-hmm.

• 32:41Dr. John Delony?

  And if you lead with, I do recognize you have to check a box that says, are you a convicted felon?

• 32:48Speaker 03

  Mm-hmm.

• 32:49Dr. John Delony?

  But if you lead a conversation with, I've been sober for almost a decade and I had, I was very ill, made some bad choices a decade ago. I'm gonna tell you right now, if people are holding me accountable for stuff I did a decade ago, I don't want to work for you.

• 33:08Speaker 03

  Hmm.

• 33:09Dr. John Delony?

  Right? And I would tell you, if people don't want, I can't think of somebody that's in a better position to compassionately and empathetically sit with young people than you.

• 33:22Speaker 03

  I say that to myself all the time. Like, the bad kids love me.

• 33:25Dr. John Delony?

  I know, I know, but you say that to yourself, but you don't walk through the world that way.

• 33:31Dr. John Delony?

  Because as much as you say you've forgiven yourself, you haven't.

• 33:35Speaker 03

  I feel like um my community and where I'm from, they've um really held it as a taboo. I I grew up in a conservative Muslim home.

• 33:46Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 33:46Speaker 03

  So it's something like I had to lie about where I was going for that time. I lied and I said I went to Africa to teach for.

• 33:54Dr. John Delony?

  Let me back out of that. Let's let's back out of that. We're going to be done with the offloading of responsibility.

• 34:01Speaker 03

  All right. I like that offloading responsibility.

• 34:03Dr. John Delony?

  I chose to lie to my family and community until I went to Africa.

• 34:08Speaker 03

  All right.

• 34:09Dr. John Delony?

  Because I chose to be imprisoned by a story for the next decade, then deal with their ostracization back in 2017.

• 34:21Dr. John Delony?

  Let's be honest.

• 34:25Speaker 03

  All right.

• 34:26Dr. John Delony?

  Is that fair?

• 34:27Speaker 03

  That's.

• 34:30Speaker 03

  Yeah, it's so fair.

• 34:31Dr. John Delony?

  You chose prison.

• 34:34Dr. John Delony?

  Over possible excommunication, fair, right? Fair.

• 34:38Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 34:41Dr. John Delony?

  But this prison is locked on the inside out.

• 34:44Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 34:45Dr. John Delony?

  I mean, they're locked on the inside. If they do not want to be in your life because of choices you made when you were struggling. And let's be honest, I always want to reiterate on this show. If you get three DUIs in a row, A, you must be taken off the road, correct? You know that, right?

• 35:03Speaker 03

  Absolutely, absolutely.

• 35:04Dr. John Delony?

  If you get three DUIs in a row, then you've got demons that you are desperately trying to drown out, which tells me with great compassion, that's a hurting person there.

• 35:19Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 35:21Dr. John Delony?

  And so if your community a decade later

• 35:26Dr. John Delony?

  won't welcome you back in with open arms, then I am going to, as the great Jay-Z once said, brush my shoulders off. And it's my job now to unlock my prison from the inside out and go find a community that will celebrate the decade of sobriety and going to war with myself that I've endured.

• 35:47Dr. John Delony?

  And that, my sister, is forgiveness.

• 35:51Speaker 03

  Now, when do I, like, share, like, see, I've reconnected with someone in my past. And he brought up a very triggering question. Is there anything about your past that's gonna, like, impact my future, our future? Like, how do I begin? Because I almost want to say, "Bro, it's Google. Look up my first and last name, and if you have any questions, come back to me."

• 36:18Dr. John Delony?

  What kind of dating question? I don't know. I don't date anymore, so maybe that's a popular question.

• 36:22Speaker 03

  I haven't had a relationship since 2016, so...

• 36:28Dr. John Delony?

  Why? Why have you not?

• 36:33Speaker 03

  Because I was at a place where I didn't even want to date myself.

• 36:36Dr. John Delony?

  Okay. That's a, that's a, that's a, I don't know.

• 36:41Speaker 03

  I didn't have my stuff together.

• 36:43Dr. John Delony?

  Fair.

• 36:44Speaker 03

  Coming out is hard.

• 36:45Dr. John Delony?

  Yeah.

• 36:46Speaker 03

  And, you know, not just reintegration to society. It's like, what do you do for a living? You're a teacher. I'm like, no, not a teacher anymore. So you work at, you know, a local restaurant? Yeah, I look at it. It's just, there's a lot of questions that I just felt like, you're not Barbara Walters. Why am I, why am I feeling like this is an interview on 60 Minutes or whatever? It's annoying.

• 37:10Dr. John Delony?

  Let's flip that whole thing around.

• 37:13Dr. John Delony?

  Why does, why have you given the proverbial Barbara Walters questions?

• 37:20Dr. John Delony?

  You are, you are taking the questions people ask?

• 37:26Dr. John Delony?

  And the answers you would give if you were honest? And you are judging yourself and taking your judgments and putting them in their heads?

• 37:34Speaker 03

  Hmm, alright.

• 37:36Dr. John Delony?

  And maybe they are gonna say judgmental things, and then, great, they're opting out. "Oh, back in 2018, they were right."

• 37:44Dr. John Delony?

  "Oh, my gosh, you did all this stuff, and you can't even go in a classroom anymore? They should take you out of a classroom." And they were right. They should take you out of that classroom. And after a decade

• 37:55Dr. John Delony?

  of kicking butt...

• 37:58Dr. John Delony?

  For you to go meet with an HR director of a small school district and it's not going to be possibly in Dayton, in the big city, but hey, I'm just coming clean. 10 years ago, I was a mess. Here's my 10-year, my 7-year, my 8-year coin. Boom. I'm sober. I worked a plan. I'm in an amazing place. I have a graduate degree. I want to be a teacher again. What's my path back?

• 38:21Speaker 03

  Well, I went back into teaching for 2 years, 2 school years.

• 38:26Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 38:27Speaker 03

  And it was in my best interest to not go back again. It was a very small school, as you said. You know, I had that courageous conversation with, you know, the director and whatnot, but I just felt like I was getting at a place where it was going to compromise my sobriety.

• 38:46Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 38:46Speaker 03

  So I left teaching again. I never wanted to be a teacher, you know?

• 38:50Dr. John Delony?

  Okay. I'm sorry. I misunderstood.

• 38:52Speaker 03

  No, you're fine. I never wanted to be a teacher. Thank you. Yeah.

• 38:58Dr. John Delony?

  Like you, you saw yourself going down a path again and you walked back. It's awesome. So I guess I'm confused.

• 39:06Speaker 03

  I didn't want to be a teacher when I was 18 years old. It was something that was appropriate for a young girl. You either went into nursing or healthcare or education.

• 39:22Dr. John Delony?

  Okay. So what do you want to do now? How old are you?

• 39:23Speaker 03

  I am 38 and a half-ish.

• 39:27Dr. John Delony?

  All right. Good. My mother

• 39:29Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 39:31Dr. John Delony?

  went back to college at the age of 42. So

• 39:33Speaker 03

  Yeah, I love that story.

• 39:34Dr. John Delony?

  Okay. You haven't even started. You're 4 years ahead of her. What do you want to do?

• 39:38Speaker 03

  I've always wanted to go into business and marketing.

• 39:41Dr. John Delony?

  What do you want to sell?

• 39:42Speaker 03

  I love startup companies. I like being a part of something brand new.

• 39:50Dr. John Delony?

  None of that is a thing. What do you want to sell?

• 39:55Dr. John Delony?

  Do you like it when you go get your hair done? Do you like it when you get a good cup of coffee? Do you like it when you open a new box of shoes? Like, what do you want to sell to somebody to bring joy, or light, or help, or support to their day?

• 40:07Speaker 03

  I guess I never thought about products and items. I thought about just working for a company.

• 40:13Dr. John Delony?

  I know, but here's the problem with that.

• 40:14Speaker 03

  I've constantly been told what to do my entire life.

• 40:18Dr. John Delony?

  I know.

• 40:18Speaker 03

  I've never really just had like a free

• 40:22Dr. John Delony?

  That's it.

• 40:22Speaker 03

  Like be allowed in and do whatever I want.

• 40:24Dr. John Delony?

  That's why I'm trying to free you from it. The problem with the modern American workforce is that everybody wants to show up to a job, and that job give me something. Instead of, "I want to be a part of a group, a company, a small business, a solopreneurship." "I want to be about helping a customer with X." Get therapy, get a roof, get their plumbing fixed, get new shoes, get a million dollar car. I don't care what the thing is. But if you go to a company to solve you, it will fail every time. If you go to a company to say, "I'm giving all of myself as a part of this team so that we can help X, Y, or Z." Now you're talking about purpose.

• 41:09Dr. John Delony?

  And so what you're looking to do, you're running around, your community has abandoned you, your romantic relationships, you have created this world where you don't think you can be successful there. And you have created all these stories about yourself, and now you're putting all of your potential future on some company. You don't even care what they do, what they sell, anything that's gonna turn all your light switches on. And that doesn't exist.

• 41:34Dr. John Delony?

  Do you get what I'm saying?

• 41:36Speaker 03

  No, yeah.

• 41:37Dr. John Delony?

  So I want you to ask, "Well, who do I want to go help? Do I want to help pet owners? Do I want to help, like, people who's got flat tires? I don't care what it is."

• 41:48Dr. John Delony?

  And then you show up to a place and you begin putting all of you into it. Not the you that thinks you're broken down and unworthy because 10 years ago you were sick and you made some bad choices 10 years ago. But the eight Super Bowl champion years later you.

• 42:06Speaker 03

  I wouldn't say eight. I would say like a great three-year Tom Brady.

• 42:13Dr. John Delony?

  Whatever you want to say.

• 42:15Speaker 03

  Five years after was pretty, was pretty rough.

• 42:18Dr. John Delony?

  It was rough. You got eight years of sobriety, I'm counting it. But you, you, you sell it however you want to sell it.

• 42:23Speaker 03

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 42:25Dr. John Delony?

  And if you haven't been sober for eight years, then don't go around with that story either. If it's only been three, great. Say three.

• 42:31Speaker 03

  No, no, no, I'm just saying the, I'm thinking about just the entire time that I've been out.

• 42:38Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 42:39Speaker 03

  And what I've been doing.

• 42:40Dr. John Delony?

  You have to decide, I'm not going to judge me as harshly as my community has judged me.

• 42:46Speaker 03

  All right.

• 42:47Dr. John Delony?

  And you have to decide, I'm not going to judge me as harshly as knuckle-headed people. I did not have three DUIs. I've never got a DUI. I have things from my past eight years ago, 10 years ago, 15 years ago, 30 years ago that I'm not proud of.

• 43:01Speaker 03

  Mm-hmm.

• 43:02Dr. John Delony?

  And that's what forgiveness is about. That's what making amends is about. And that's what going to do the next right thing is about.

• 43:09Speaker 03

  So when do I share it? And is it just how I share it? Like, yo, listen, I just, I messed up. It is what it is. I can't say it is what it is, but.

• 43:22Dr. John Delony?

  There's not, there's not a date or time. If your body tells you this person's not safe, then don't go on a second date. And also, don't be that weirdo who's like, hi, my name is Samantha. One time I, don't be that person either.

• 43:34Speaker 03

  No, the, the recovery talks is what I had the first few months right after I came out. I'm in recovery, I'm in recovery. And everyone would be like, ugh, what's that?

• 43:45Dr. John Delony?

  And if that's the case, that's not your person.

• 43:51Dr. John Delony?

  But you can also say that 10 years ago, man, I had a rough go. 20 years ago, I had a really rough go.

• 43:58Dr. John Delony?

  Oh, yeah? Tell me about that. Dude, I went to jail one time. What?

• 44:01Speaker 03

  Oh, God. I don't want to talk about that. It's horrible.

• 44:05Dr. John Delony?

  I know, but it's a part of your life. And here's the thing, I think people are going to distance themselves from you. They're going to flinch from you.

• 44:14Dr. John Delony?

  Because you haven't fully metabolized what happened.

• 44:19Dr. John Delony?

  And if you put it on the table with confidence as a, this is in my past and this is not a part of my future.

• 44:27Dr. John Delony?

  People will lean into that. Occasionally, they won't, and so be it. Forget them. I'm going to hook you up with my buddy, King Coleman's book. He has a book called Find the Work You're Wired to Do. It's got a career assessment in it. I want you to take that career assessment. And then I want you to tenaciously start knocking on doors, having coffee with people, applying for jobs. And just, just like you did with that small school district, be honest and say, here I am.

• 44:53Dr. John Delony?

  And yes, I got to pass, but dude, I've been eight years sober and I, I will be the best employee you have. And I'm going to start, you're going to go after it. I'm going to stop asking my job to solve all my world's problems. And instead, I'm going to bring myself fully to the service of finding that helping somebody with a thing, a customer at the end, a person at the end with support and help and love. And then it's going to be game on. Thank you so much for the call, Samantha. We'll be right back.

• 45:22Dr. John Delony?

  I love Poncho shirts and they are back as a supporter of this show and I'm super jazzed about it. If you've seen me on stages across the country, maybe in the airport on this show, or recently even when I was out fishing with my son in the Gulf, right? Or maybe you've even seen me mowing my yard out here in Nashville. I'm almost always wearing Poncho shirts. Poncho makes the absolute best outdoor performance shirts for men, period. Whether they are sponsoring this show or not, I'm always wearing Poncho because they're the best. Of course, I love their denim shirts and their insanely soft flannels. But now that it's super hot, I'm wearing Poncho's ultra light shirts. Shirts too. They're really lightweight, they're breathable, yet they're tough enough to handle whatever chaos my day brings. And I'm talking everything from traveling,

• 46:07Dr. John Delony?

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• 46:50Dr. John Delony?

  and the Valentine's Day Marriage Retreat with me and my friend Rachel Cruz. It's a two and a half day weekend here in Nashville, Tennessee. It's half a Thursday, all a Friday, all a Saturday, or into the evening afternoon on Saturday, and then you are free to go enjoy Nashville, and just hang out in this great city. It is, so don't forget to go, we'll check, you can check the show notes here, go check it out. I would love to have you here. These events sell out every year, and I'd love to have you guys come, if y'all can get in. But we have an anonymous question box at Money and Marriage, and this year we got a whole, whole bunch of questions, so I'm answering them now. Here's one of the questions. "How do I help my husband forgive how I treated him the first 10 years? Year 25 was this

• 47:35Dr. John Delony?

  year. I was a different person then." Yeah, we all were. "I get held to who I was after trauma and family pain." So, I guess the crux of the deal here is you can't make your husband do anything. And you can't choose to force your husband to forgive you. He doesn't have to. And that's a heartbreaking thing to say, but he doesn't. He can continue to hold this over you. What you get to do, is to decide, "I'm not going to be held to that anymore. It's been 15 years."

• 48:13Dr. John Delony?

  You might sit down with him and say, "You keep holding me to stuff that happened 10 years ago." That's not helpful because now you're in a loop. You'll have done that dance a million times because he'll say, "Well, I have to because you..." We're not doing that. But you can say, "This happened last week. This specific thing happened last month, and this specific thing has been happening for the last year. And I," we're going to use "I" messages, "I feel uncomfortable. I am choosing to be frustrated, or angry, or anxious in these moments. I am asking for the following." And that's the path you

• 48:54Dr. John Delony?

  have to move forward. I would love it if we could both agree to exhale on the first 10 years. I've acknowledged it. I've owned it. I have proven over the last 15 years. And so I'd need some more context on what he's doing, right? Is he like hoarding the money, or still going through your text messages? Like, I don't know what's happening here, but you get to, I mean, any number of things. But the major overarching theme here is you can't make him. You can't help him forgive you, other than become worthy of forgiveness. Meaning, I'm not that person anymore. I don't do any of those things. I don't ever lie.

• 49:38Dr. John Delony?

  I don't cheat. I don't steal money, whatever was going on back, you know, 15 years ago. So that's the best I can help you. But sitting down and saying, "I can't make you forgive me, and I am going to choose to not live in a house where things that happened 15 years ago are still held over me in the following ways." You can draw a line. But thinking you can do things to make him change, that's a futile, futile way to live your life. We just can't make other people do things, as much as we try. Hey, that's it. Kelly, what else you got? Anything else?

• 50:19Speaker 04

  No.

• 50:20Dr. John Delony?

  No? You're just looking like pleasant today.

• 50:25Speaker 04

  You seem baffled by it.

• 50:29Dr. John Delony?

  It's a baffling thing?

• 50:30Speaker 04

  Well...

• 50:31Dr. John Delony?

  I'm happy. Is it because of all those showers after the skunk incident? I've been telling you for months that if you shower regularly, you just are happier.

• 50:43Speaker 04

  People listening, I shower regularly. Very regularly, as a matter of fact. Daily. Ben, I see you in the reflection.

• 50:52Dr. John Delony?

  Yeah, what you don't see is the other engineer who smelled too long and passed out under the desk. But alas.

• 51:01Dr. John Delony?

  I don't know, I like joyful-

• 51:02Speaker 04

  But I like how you gave me a compliment and then, right there, you killed it. So, I appreciate that. Makes me more comfortable. I know what to do more with that than I do the compliment.

• 51:17Dr. John Delony?

  What, bathe? Shower?

• 51:19Speaker 04

  No, you being mean versus a compliment.

• 51:23Dr. John Delony?

  I'm never mean.

• 51:25Speaker 04

  We should end the show now.

• 51:26Dr. John Delony?

  Love you guys. Stay in school, don't do drugs, except don't stay in school because it's summertime. But keep making good choices. Bye.