Why Waiting for the “Perfect” Property is Costing You Wealth

Your idea of a “dream home” or “dream investment property” is stopping you from building wealth and taking steps toward financial freedom. Don’t believe us? Today’s guest proves it. Mitra Kalita lives in her dream home today, but it’s only because she bought a house FAR from what was her dream back in 2002. With her family moving often, she was accustomed to packing up and making somewhere new her home throughout her childhood. So, when it was time to buy her first property, then later move, settle in, move again, and repeat, it was nothing new. This has now led to her dream home, but it only started because she made a move on that first property. Mitra went through the 2008 housing crash as a journalist, seeing what actual loss looked like for everyday Americans. However, even with memories of the last crash, she still owns real estate and hopes the new generation of first-time homebuyers can do the same. Today, we’re talking with Mitra about the impact 2008 had on the housing market and society at large, why your “dream home” often comes after your first home, and why working while investing is a superpower that most Americans are missing. In This Episode We Cover Why you should ditch the “dream” home/property idea and buy now instead How the 2008 housing crash changed America forever and still affects today’s buyers Is buying a house still worth it, and if so, will most millennials ever get their chance to buy? Why combining real estate investing and a strong career can be a wealth-building superpower And So Much More! Check out more resources from this show on ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠BiggerPockets.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ and ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.biggerpockets.com/blog/real-estate-1130 Interested in learning more about today’s sponsors or becoming a BiggerPockets partner yourself? Email ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠[email protected]⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Dave Meyer?

  Your first house doesn't need to be perfect. It just needs to be the right property for you right now. And this is true whether you're buying a house to live in yourself or a pure investment property. And it's an important mindset shift that you can make today if you're struggling to buy. And it'll empower you to take one step towards achieving your goal. And that's really all that you need to do. Just take one step at a time.

• 0:31Dave Meyer?

  Hey, everyone. I'm Dave Meyer, head of real estate investing at BiggerPockets. I've been buying rental properties and pursuing financial freedom for 15 years. And on this show, we teach you how to achieve financial freedom through real estate. Our guest on the show today is Mitra Kalita. She's a journalist and the CEO of URL Media. Mitra bought her first home back in 2002 and has been thinking deeply about real estate ever since. She's covered the 2008 crash as a reporter at The Wall Street Journal and more recently, launched a newsletter called Escape Home. In my conversation with Mitra, we're going to talk about how making the right real estate investing decisions can be a secret key to unlocking success

• 1:14Dave Meyer?

  in pretty much any career you want to pursue, whether that's in real estate or something else. Whether Mitra sees any echoes of 2008 in today's real estate market and the advice she gives people all the time about how the first house you buy, or even the third house, or the fourth house, is probably not going to be the last one. And so you don't need to plan everything out perfectly. You can't plan everything in life, so you just need to make the best decisions that you can today. This is all super powerful advice for people at any stage of their investing career. So I'm very excited to share it with you. Here's my conversation with Mitra Kalita. Mitra, welcome to the BiggerPockets podcast. Thanks so much for being here.

• 1:52Speaker 01

  Thanks, Dave. It's great to be with you.

• 1:54Dave Meyer?

  Yeah, I'm excited. This is going to be a lot of fun. Could you maybe just start by telling our audience a little bit about yourself and your career to date?

• 2:03Speaker 01

  So my career is, you know, like my family moved around a lot. My father worked for Citibank his entire career. This will not surprise anyone who's familiar with corporate America, but like the more he moved, the more he would get promoted. And so having an opportunistic Indian immigrant father. He agreed to move us around a lot. And so I was raised in Brooklyn, Long Island, Puerto Rico, and then we settled in New Jersey for my high school years. And because I moved around so much, I've joined the school newspaper as a way of making friends. And I was really lucky that like even my elementary school and then my private school in Puerto Rico all had school newspapers. And then when we moved to New Jersey, I joined

• 2:48Speaker 01

  the Panther Press at the age of 12 and interviewed the principal and kind of that's how the journalism thing took hold. And then I spent most of my career as a business reporter. I was at the Associated Press, the Newsday as a, as a business reporter. I covered post nine 11 and the New York City economy. And then I was at the Washington Post and then I moved to India and I sort of like repeated what my father had done to us. So we've moved around a lot as well.

• 3:16Dave Meyer?

  It's a really, a pretty amazing story. So I'm sure you've, you've sort of seen it all from a real estate perspective, but I'm curious, because you know, I got into real estate right after the Great Recession in 2010. But you know, what was it like sort of covering real estate during what is probably the defining moment of, of the real estate industry in the last maybe century?

• 3:37Speaker 01

  I mean, it really was tragic, right? So despite my interest in like what made you want this home and kind of that framework, the humanity is what I remember and trying to bring that to the work because people really lost everything. And you have to kind of remember that being over leveraged predatory lending, like access to credit, the factors that marched us straight into the 2008 recession were propelled by a desire to make homeownership more accessible to more people. And I think we also lose sight of that. There was something about 2008 for me as a journalist that was really Eye opening in terms of the fragility of the whole country.

• 4:18Speaker 01

  Also, this era that I don't think we've abandoned since 2008 of an era of uncertainty. Right. Because you have a lot of factors of, you know, the financial crisis, but also information technology and that boom. And today, I feel like, um, you know, there's a direct line from that into, again, uncertainty, also a lot of opportunity as a result. But, you know, define a tech company for me today. Right. Define a bank for me today. Like, it's a very different economy today.

• 4:47Dave Meyer?

  You've said something that I've interviewed a lot of people on this show, and I've never really thought about that. In 2008, we talk about it so negatively, but sort of fail to see how that came about. We talk a lot about the logistics, you know, the availability of credit, the lack of regulation. But a lot of times, these negative economic outcomes come from good or modest intentions. Right. Like, no one was trying to do this at first. Sure, some banks probably got a little greedy and got ahead of themselves. But you did see sort of the pendulum swing back in the other direction after 2008, where homes got less affordable, you know? And, and so there is that sort of negative element of it. I think like, living through that sort of has been one of the defining like,

• 5:32Dave Meyer?

  elements of my life. Not in that I was invested at that point, but it sort of created this like, I, I've joked about it being like, housing market trauma for a lot of recent generations. And I'm curious how you see that playing out, like, oh, in your personal life or the people you cover, like, do you think people are still like, hung up on what happened back then?

• 5:52Speaker 01

  The majority of millennials I know who are buying homes and sort of fit the description of, you know, this fallout from 2008 are getting money from parents in order to make that down payment. And like, that's something we don't talk about, right? There's an inheritance generation that has been created and in the Massive wealth gap that we are seeing right now, which also is contributing to household formation rates and it's kind of the ability to like move, you know, and mobility and all, I mean, it's so connected to our psychology around the economy. And just some other examples of like how that plays out right now. Again, my generation is notorious for the we did it this way.

• 6:37Speaker 01

  Like the belief in meritocracy or kind of like, it's gonna be okay, like you'll work your way out of this. That's what we were told. And I think for millennials, there's a disbelief, rightfully. I think some of that, again, roots back to that 2008 housing crisis, the financial crisis. And I also think rightfully, you know, they're looking at their wages and housing costs and looking at, for example, my wages and housing costs when I bought my first apartment. It's a very different financial picture right now. And so that's the, probably the biggest difference between 2008 and now is just that the gap in wages, you know, and the increase in housing costs, you know, that I don't think I've been able to reconcile.

• 7:20Dave Meyer?

  We have more with Mitra coming up, but first we have to take a quick break. Buying real estate has a funny way of making the future feel very real. You start thinking about mortgages, cash flow, tenants, and suddenly you realize, if something happened to me, would the people I love be okay? That's why life insurance is one of those things that's easy to put off, but is super important to actually deal with. Ethos makes getting life insurance fast and easy, 100% online. You can get a quote in seconds, apply in minutes, and potentially get same-day coverage. There's no medical exam, you just answer a few simple health questions online. You can get up to $3 million in coverage and some policies are as low as $30 a month.

• 8:03Dave Meyer?

  Ethos helps provide financial security and helps protect the people who depend on you. Take 10 minutes to get covered today with life insurance through Ethos. Get your free quote at ethos.com/realestate. That's E-T-H-O-S dot com slash real estate. Application times may vary, rates may vary. There's a point where basically every investor realizes traditional financing stops scaling with you. At first, it works. You qualify with your income, your job, your tax returns. But as you grow, that model starts to break. Now, it's not really about your personal income. It's about the income from your properties. That's where DSCR lending comes in. And it's why a lot of investors end up working with lenders like Host Financial.

• 8:48Dave Meyer?

  Host Financial qualifies deals based on property income, not personal income. So you're not dealing with W2s, or tax returns, or DTI constraints. And with 80% to 85% LTV, you can stay more flexible as you scale. It's just a different framework, one that tends to align better with how investing actually works. If you're buying rentals, refinancing, or growing your portfolio, go to hostfinancial.com, that's H-O-S-T financial dot com, and see what you qualify for. Do you ever notice how every passive investment somehow turns into a very active lifestyle? Active spreadsheets, active phone calls, active stress? Here's a better question. What if you could buy brand-new construction homes 10% below market value in the best

• 9:33Dave Meyer?

  markets across the country without making real estate your second job? That's exactly what Rent to Retirement does. They're a full-service, turnkey investment company handling everything for you. In some cases, investors get 50% to 75% of their down payment back at closing, plus interest rates as low as 3.75%. They've partnered with BiggerPockets for over a decade, helping thousands invest smarter. If you want to do the same, visit biggerpockets.com/retirement to learn more. A lot of insurance companies compete on one thing: speed. But if you're protecting an investment property worth hundreds of thousands of dollars, should speed really be the priority? Enreg believes strong coverage starts with understanding the property, the

• 10:16Dave Meyer?

  risks, and the realities of ownership. That's why they don't rush the process. Their policies are designed for real-world claims, not just quick quotes. If you want insurance built to protect your investment when it matters most, visit nreg.com/bpllc and learn more today.

• 10:38Dave Meyer?

  Welcome back to the BiggerPockets Podcast. Let's jump back into my conversation with Mitra Kalita. 2009, 2010, whatever, five years after the crash, everyone was afraid of real estate. And I remember people always say, oh, it's amazing you got in in 2010, how lucky. People thought it was crazy, you know, like people, it was still, the market was still going down. But that fear sort of had people miss out on the opportunity to affordably buy real estate. And now you fast forward another 10 years beyond that. And there's a lot of fear that you'll never be able to buy real estate, you know, like people feel like they've missed out. I wonder how that plays out because it's so unaffordable at this point. I wonder if we're going to start to see declining homeownership rates or people sort of embracing more of a rental model.

• 11:22Dave Meyer?

  I'm curious if you've thought at all about that.

• 11:25Speaker 01

  Oh, gosh, all the time. So, you know, I run a series of newsletters and two of them are at opposite ends of the economic spectrum. One is epicenter, it was formed out of the pandemic and we really kind of target immigrant queens, you know, young, exploring New York City artists, small businesses. But the housing piece for me is always with the lens towards you too can be a part of this. And I think that's such an important message that gets lost. And some of it, Dave, I think is who you're hanging out with. So if you're living in your parents' basement and all your friends are living in their parents' basements, like you're not necessarily dealing with people where one person has experienced the possibility, as I did,

• 12:06Speaker 01

  of buying your first apartment at the age of 24 for $82,000.

• 12:11Dave Meyer?

  Amazing. In New York?

• 12:13Speaker 01

  In New York City.

• 12:14Dave Meyer?

  That's amazing. Throw a couple of zeros on that now. Yeah.

• 12:17Speaker 01

  That changed my life, right? And like, I don't, I worry that we're not making this accessible. So what happens is you kind of, again, from a media perspective, we share like the down payment programs. We share the housing lotteries. You know, the statistics on this, the good luck, it's like a handful of people, right? And then there's the people whose parents can help them, which nobody talks about. In between, I think there has to be kind of, to your point about the societal and cultural access, right? Like this is about. Access like there has to be a this is how I did it. And sometimes that involves a level of risk that I think for millennials who've kind of grown up also on the internet where information is just coming at you.

• 12:59Speaker 01

  So every decision I've seen people make is very well thought out. It's researched. Your house that you finally buy is going to be the place where you picture your kids playing in the yard. And guess what? Like, that was not my first purchase. My first purchase was a one bedroom co op. They didn't even allow dogs. Like, look, I get it. It's not perfect, but it got me in there. And I think we need to undo some of the desire for perfection. I worry about that because your first place probably shouldn't be where you're going to end up. Right? And like, I see so many people putting this pressure on themselves. It's not quite right. And I'm like, oh, gosh, like, is that, is that what real estate is? Like, it's supposed to be perfect, you know?

• 13:42Dave Meyer?

  Yeah, totally. I think this is such an important conversation. So I just dig in here for a minute because it's something we talk about a lot on this show too. I think it's the same mentality where people, if they're trying to buy their first real estate deal, they want it to be a home run. They want it to be a grand slam. A lot of times people look back and think, oh, my God, if I had just bought in 2020, it would have been amazing. It probably would have. But the reality of real estate is that it's sort of a slow thing. And it's kind of like this long protracted benefit that is not a get rich quick scheme. This is an old adage in our industry, but it's more about time in the market than timing the market. And it really doesn't need to be perfect.

• 14:23Dave Meyer?

  And of course, that feels super intimidating because this is probably going to be the largest check you've ever written. No matter if you're putting 3.5% down or 20% down, that's scary. I admit all the time on the show, I've been doing this for 15 years. I'm scared every time I buy a house. Absolutely. But like you said, like making that clear that it is scary, but it doesn't have to be perfect. I know for everyone who went through 2008, you think of it as this huge risk asset. Like it's the stock market or it's cryptocurrency. But in reality, real estate is actually quite forgiving. Like if you look at the history, the last hundred years of real estate prices, it's actually one of the least volatile assets that you can buy.

• 15:05Dave Meyer?

  And just finding something that works for you at that point in your life is probably more important than finding something that's perfect.

• 15:12Speaker 01

  The other thing is like, people also kind of are like, well, we're going to have children after we do this. I'm like, there's just so much sequencing of life that people are putting dependent on real estate versus like, what do you need right now? And I'm like, you don't even know if you can have kids. Take it from someone who's like, you know, like struggled a little bit with that. Like, it doesn't always work the way that you think it's going to work. What are we doing here?

• 15:36Dave Meyer?

  Given your history and covering this for so long, is this advice that you're giving out frequently? Are people coming to you for this kind of thing?

• 15:43Speaker 01

  So I have a group of like six really close friends in Queens. I've found homes, I think for four of them. And like, some of it is selfish because they help watch my children. They're really good cooks. But also some of it was like, no, listen, I'm telling you, you really just need to get in there. Like, or I already talked to the Realtor. I negotiated this deal. Like, if you don't take this, like, I can't help you more than this. You're never going to get in there, right? And so there is, I think when I say like, people need to talk about this more, like, I think we have faith in our friends. I think thankfully, this group of people had faith in me. Even the ones where I didn't negotiate the deals, they would say like, could you come over and take a look? And I'll never forget the Realtor looking at me, looking at my friend's apartment in Forest Hills.

• 16:27Speaker 01

  And he was like, are you a structural engineer? And I was like, I'm just a really nosy friend, you know?

• 16:34Dave Meyer?

  I completely agree. I just think people tend to overthink it a little bit. And I understand that not everyone can afford it. That that's a different thing. But I think for people who can afford it, it is just such a good financial decision. Is buying the dream house that's perfectly manicured and someone else just flipped and making money off you? The best financial decision? Probably not. But finding something that you can add value to, that you're going to live in for a while is just such a powerful thing. Given your history and career, you're in a situation I think a lot of our audience will resonate with, which is, You've built an amazing career outside of real estate investing and outside of real estate, but you're sort of in the real estate world. How do you find the time to like,

• 17:19Dave Meyer?

  take on a renovation? Like, how do you get the, I don't know, the courage to sort of take these things on when you have other things going on?

• 17:27Speaker 01

  I mean, what's interesting, like, saving money will do that to you. Like, saving money helps you find time, right? And so my husband and I, like, you know, there's some tile shops in Flushing that we are really at one with the owners and managers of. And you know this, Dave, like, you look at the price there versus like getting an architect to do the thing. And you're just like, well, I could just do that. And plus, I'm going to end up with something that I know I love. And first of all, I think it has to be something you sincerely enjoy. I have met some people who find the idea of what I just described to be like, an afternoon of misery, going to tile shops in Flushing, Queens, right? And if that's you, then like, you should not do this. If you have the disposable income where somebody could manage this for you, great. But then I'm like, but then when I

• 18:12Speaker 01

  do, like-

• 18:13Dave Meyer?

  Then you're not getting the financial benefit. Yeah.

• 18:15Speaker 01

  But I think if you're like, the type where, like, for us, like, we obviously see possibility. We also love our neighborhood. We like pulling our children into this. They actually, I, it'll be really interesting to see if this, this goes to a third generation. So my parents were this way. We're like, we would hang wallpaper together. We would go shopping together. We would do all of this stuff together. I feel like we pull our children into it. They seem really miserable about it.

• 18:38Dave Meyer?

  For now.

• 18:39Speaker 01

  I don't know if it'll sink in. But I think, um, looking at where you spend your time and also, is that enjoyable? Right? Which like, again, people don't, people often look at real estate as, um, you know, it's obviously transactional. It is very transactional. It's intentionally a side hustle that hopefully you'll like maximize your returns. But if there isn't something about it that's appealing, like, really, you don't, you don't have to do this. And then I think like, the third piece is honestly, for sometimes just breaking even and learning is like a gift in and of itself. And so I think the idea that things can be undone, it's okay.

• 19:14Dave Meyer?

  Learning is a type of return in this industry. If you're an investor, learning is especially early in your career, as valuable a thing as you can get. Later in your career, you probably want to be making money and not, not just learning all the time. But a hundred percent, I mean, I've shared this story a lot on the show, but like my first deal, I partnered with three people. I had no equity, so I had a double loan on it. I wasn't really making money off of it in the first couple of years. It turned out to be fine, but like you just get into it and start to figure it out. And that's just more important. And I agree, like if you make a mistake, that happens too. Cut your losses and move on. Like, you know, just trying to dwell on it. And there's just some things that are bad luck. Like, sometimes you make a good decision,

• 19:56Dave Meyer?

  and it doesn't work out for you. And that's okay. Just learn what you can and move on to the next deal, the next opportunity. There's no point. Like you said, you can't change it. It already happened. So figure out how to proceed going forward, and to figure out something that is going to work the next time around.

• 20:13Speaker 01

  I really like what you said about learning too, because there's something about reading about real estate versus doing it that's so different. So when people are like, I don't know how you know these things, because partly I was, of course, covering it as a journalist, but then you see how they come together and you're like, oh, or even some tools that are out there. I'm just thinking of like FHA loans, or bridge loans, or things, products that exist. Again, when you read about these, you're like, when would I ever really need this? And then you're like, oh, I could see how that would be useful. And so I think there's also something which I've, which I've tried to tell young people is by getting in the game, you're also going to be much smarter, because you'll understand how the next and the next and the next might work.

• 20:57Dave Meyer?

  This is true of almost everything, but in real estate, it's such a tangible thing. You know, it's not learning something online, or some skill where you're just reading. And reading is important, it is a good part of it. But you gotta do it. You gotta go talk to the tenant. You gotta go Meet with a contractor. You gotta go through a loan process because everything else about it is just, it can't just be this academic exercise where you just learn, learn, learn, and then all of a sudden you're an expert in doing it. Because you can learn for 10 years and when you buy your first property, something's still gonna go wrong. So you might as well just do it, right? Like, I think there is a sweet spot. You don't want to just jump into it blindly. But if you've learned for a couple of months, you're

• 21:40Dave Meyer?

  probably ready. You know, you probably know enough to not make a really bad mistake. And the rest of it just has to be hands-on. I totally agree with you. We have to take a quick break, but stick with us. We have more with Mitra right after this quick break. For my wife's birthday, I wanted to make her a new website for her landscape design business. So I researched a lot of different options. I tried out a couple, but honestly, it was really overwhelming. It was pretty time-consuming, and still, the site wasn't coming out the way I wanted it to. Then, I tried Hostinger, and everything was super simple. I asked Hostinger's AI to build a clean site for her business, and it had a working version up in minutes. No coding or designer needed. Plus, its AI agent helps

• 22:25Dave Meyer?

  with SEO, website copy, and email marketing after launch. You get domain, website, email, all in one account. And right now, you can get Black Friday and Cyber Monday pricing through December 14th. So snag Hostinger's services at their lowest prices before the sale ends. Create your website today for just $1.99. Go to hostinger.com/realestate and use code REALESTATE for an additional 10% off Black Friday and Cyber Monday pricing. I just booked a ski trip to Park City, and I've already got the whole thing planned out. Five days, first tracks every morning before the crowds show up, my knees reminding me I'm not 25 anymore by the second run, and an embarrassing number of overpriced

• 23:10Dave Meyer?

  burritos at the lodge. I don't even care. This is the trip I look forward to all year. But here's the part I actually appreciate. The practical side of my brain kicking in is that my place doesn't have to just sit there Empty the whole time I'm away. I can list my space on Airbnb and bring in a little extra income while I'm out getting humbled on a mountain. And with the co-host network, I'm not the one handling all of it. You can partner with a vetted local co-host who can create your listing, manage reservations, message guests, and even handle the styling. So I get to fully focus on my trip and my place is still working for me the whole time. Find a co-host at Airbnb.com/host.

• 23:53Dave Meyer?

  Investing in real estate has always been smart, but it hasn't always been simple. Now it's both, thanks to the Fundrise Flagship Fund. The Fundrise Flagship Fund launched more than five years ago with a mission of delivering low-fee access to blue-chip private market real estate. Today, the Fundrise Flagship Fund has grown to manage more than $1 billion of real estate on behalf of hundreds of thousands of investors, making it one of the largest funds of its kind. For those who believe real estate has an important role to play in their portfolio strategy, the Fundrise Flagship Fund has positioned itself as both a simple and a smart option. Whether you're starting with $10 or $10,000, the Fundrise Flagship Fund makes adding

• 24:38Dave Meyer?

  real estate's unique potential for both passive income and consistent growth. Just visit fundrise.com/pockets to make your first investment today. Carefully consider the investment objectives, risks, charges, and expenses of the Fundrise Flagship Fund before investing. This and other information can be found in the fund's prospectus at fundrise.com/flagship. This is a paid advertisement.

• 25:01Henry Washington?

  Buy smart, drive for less, and trade for more. That's Toyota affordability, and it all starts with a great deal from your local Toyota dealer. Make a smart buy on an all-wheel-drive Camry, Corolla Cross, or get a Corolla sedan packed with the latest features, advanced tech, and head-turning style. Take a test drive in two of Toyota's most popular SUVs, the spacious, family-friendly Grand Highlander and adventure-ready RAV4. And with so many hybrid and plug-in hybrid models available across the lineup, Plus efficient all electrics like the BZ, BZ Woodland and all wheel drive CHR, you can drive your way and skip the pump. And long after you leave the lot, your Toyota keeps delivering with legendary resale value built on a reputation for quality and reliability.

• 25:46Henry Washington?

  So when it's time for your next Toyota, you could trade in for more from a great deal today to a great value tomorrow. A Toyota is right for you. Shop toyota.com for deals and details or stop by your local Toyota dealer today. Toyota, let's go places. BiggerPockets Real Estate is brought to you by MOD. MOD prescribes a once or twice daily modophonal drink that can keep you energized, focused and alert throughout the day. Here's the mechanism. Energy drinks with caffeine temporarily block eudenecein, the chemical that makes you tired. It builds up and when the caffeine wears off, it all crashes down on you at once. Modafinil works differently. It engages multiple pathways in your brain, dopamine, norepinephrine, histamine and orexin to achieve steady energy and alertness

• 26:31Henry Washington?

  for 10 to 12 hours. Modafinil was invented in the 1970s and since it's been used in the highest performers on the planet, soldiers, pilots and astronauts aboard the space station use modophinil in high stakes situations where full concentration and alertness are paramount. It's now available at mod.com to qualifying patients. Visit mod.com, that's M O D dot com for free consultation and get 10% off your first order plus free shipping with promo code B P R E. That's promo code B P R E at mod.com. See their website for important safety information and we thank MOD for sponsoring the pod.

• 27:13Dave Meyer?

  Welcome back to the show. I'm here with Mitra. Let's jump back into our conversation. You said something earlier, you know, it's funny. There's so many people on this show and a lot of BiggerPockets is about financial freedom. We, you know, a lot of people want to quit their jobs. They want to go full time into real estate. It sounds like you've benefited a lot from real estate, but at the same time you have this other career. Like, have you ever thought about going into real estate full time?

• 27:39Speaker 01

  I would rather take the lessons I've learned and impart them to more people. I mean, I think it's like, it's a very New York thing for me to liken this, but like, you know, you go to a restaurant and you love it, right? You have two options. You can either not tell anyone and that's like your go to spot or you write about it. In one of your newsletters and then the New York Times writes about it six months later and you're like, oh no. But like for me, I think life and just money and kind of some of this real estate accidental investing has been the latter. That is because I come from a background where like my parents didn't always have a lot, but like speaking of homes and how important they are, like there was always enough room for other people,

• 28:24Speaker 01

  right? Like someone would show up at the door and my mom would somehow like make it work. Whatever we were eating for dinner, there'd be enough. Or my cousin came to live with us for a while. And of course he like lived in the basement, which is kind of uncomfortable. But like, there's something to coming, I think, from an immigrant background where this idea of sharing information is actually revolutionary. I think we're at that point about housing, just because so much of the calls that we get, you know, Epicenter was formed in the pandemic. It was to help these communities I described. The calls we're getting now are not over access to health as much as they are. I cannot find affordable housing. It's all connected to me. Like if I can help you find affordable housing now,

• 29:04Speaker 01

  that's a rental, but there's a pathway to eventually owning. I feel like that, just from like the purposeful part of what we do versus the individualistic aspects of wealth creation, that to me just feels like a more meaningful way to live my life.

• 29:19Dave Meyer?

  So this has been a lot of fun. Thank you. I'm curious, what's next for you, real estate or career wise? Like, are you leaning more into real estate? Or you, I know you're an entrepreneur, a business owner, are you, are you going to be focusing more there?

• 29:31Speaker 01

  I mean, so the escape home is really going through a bit of a metamorphosis. We were born out of the 2020 boom in second home ownership. We are now contending with, you know, Airbnb being banned in many places, including New York City, where I'm at right now. You know, I think this past month saw like the lowest number of second home mortgages, like historically.

• 29:54Dave Meyer?

  Yeah, well, there's, I think, demand is, it's, it's the story about this, like half of what it was pre pandemic and a third of what it was in 2021.

• 30:02Speaker 01

  And then you have remote work, which is like no longer a thing, right? And so you kind of have like the best conditions allowed us to create this newsletter. And now we are contending with Subscribers of this newsletter and people like us that are like, well, what now? Right. And so I feel like what's next is answering that question of what now? I'm super interested in some other trends we're seeing of like home exchanges, for example. And it's like what goes around, comes around, which is, you know, couch surfing and kind of the peer to peer thing that led to Airbnb's rise. Also, you know, the corporatization of Airbnb, policy changes and so forth have like led to its, I don't want to say unraveling, that feels really strong, but definitely a shift

• 30:45Speaker 01

  in people's fondness for the brand. And then the other piece, you know, 2008, one of my lessons was like the whole country was hurting. Right now, things feel a little bit uneven to me. So New York, I think is going to weather this housing crisis. You know, I'm looking at other cities, like I just wonder about like, let's say a place like Austin or, um, you know, some of the other kind of sun belts. Again, like this is all coming full circle, you know? And so we're looking at some of those markets to see what happens and whether we need to be more cognizant of, it's not one housing market right now. It's many, many housing markets. It's also many, many labor markets. And also, again, like within the labor market, we're seeing such shifts in government layoffs

• 31:29Speaker 01

  have been one piece of it, but what AI is doing to both of our industries is also seismic. And so I just feel like, given my desire to make this an easier life for people to live, right? Which is like the fundamentals of the products that we run. Um, how do you make AI feel less scary and more, you know, going hand in hand and being more educational in the type of journalism that we're committing? Like, how do you optimize this in your life and your career?

• 31:58Dave Meyer?

  Yeah, when you figure that out, please let me know, because I'm very eager to have the answer to that.

• 32:04Speaker 01

  When you're small, it's actually easier. Like it's, so if I were, if I were still at CNN, I think implementing a lot of the AI in our workflows would have been much harder, but at places like Epicenter or the Escape Home, like, you know, we're, we're using it pretty much every day because it's just such a small team that they're eager to experiment and kind of to take a lesson that we've been talking about here. It can be undone, right? This is not permanent. We can fix it tomorrow and the, and the system's learned from you.

• 32:31Dave Meyer?

  Well, I'm fascinated to hear what comes next. We'll have to have you back sometime. Mitra, thank you so much for joining us. We really appreciate it.

• 32:39Speaker 01

  Take care.

• 32:40Dave Meyer?

  Thank you again to Mitra for joining us today and thank you all so much for listening to this episode of the BiggerPockets Podcast. We'll see you in a few days.

• 32:49Speaker 03

  Afternoon glare totally ruined my watch party for the big game. That's when my buddy recommended Blinds.com.

• 32:55Speaker 04

  With custom window treatments made to fit your style, space, and budget, customers who shop at Blinds.com experienced overwhelming satisfaction. Side effects may include a fuller, deeper night's sleep and the sudden urge to host the watch party again. Blinds.com isn't a medication, but it can improve how you feel about your home.

• 33:12Speaker 03

  Shop Black Friday all month long at Blinds.com. Don't miss huge deals dropping every week.

• 33:18Speaker 05

  Now at Kroger, your points add up to more ways to save every trip. Use them your way to take dollars off groceries at checkout or save at the pump. You can even save up to $35 on your next fill-up. Same points, more choices. And with low prices on fresh, quality food, plus digital and personalized offers tailored to how you shop, your dollar goes further. Redeem your points online or in the app. Kroger. Fresh for everyone. Restrictions apply. See site or store for details.