JR Smith opens up on 16 years NBA career, winning with LeBron, the Finals mistake that changed everything, Knicks, playing depressed, time in jail, heartache, Mental Health, golf and finding purpose beyond basketball

“16 years in the NBA and 70% of my career, I played depressed. “-JR Smith In this episode of The Pivot Podcast, former NBA champion and basketball icon JR Smith sits down for one of his most candid conversations yet. From his rise as a high school phenom to a 16-year NBA career, JR reflects on the highs, lows, and lessons that shaped his journey. He opens up about playing on the biggest stage alongside LeBron James, competing in multiple NBA Finals, and what it meant to win an NBA Championship. Beyond the highlights and headlines, JR shares the personal battles he faced with mental health, the pressure of fame, and navigating life under constant public scrutiny. JR also revisits one of the most questionable and talked about moments of his career—the infamous NBA Finals play that became a defining headline of his legacy—sharing what was going through his mind, how he handled the backlash, and the lessons he learned from a mistake that nearly altered basketball history. JR also discusses some of the darkest moments of his life, including time spent in jail, the devastating loss of a close friend, and how those experiences changed his perspective forever. He speaks honestly about fatherhood, the challenges and rewards of parenting, and the responsibility of being a role model for his family. Now in a new chapter of life, JR reflects on personal growth, finding purpose beyond basketball, and the mindset that continues to drive him forward. This is a raw, honest, and inspiring conversation about resilience, redemption, and discovering who you are when the game is no longer the center of your world. Don't miss this powerful episode of The Pivot with JR Smith. Pivot Family...comment, like, hit the subscribe button, we enjoy hearing and learning from you- the good and the bad, we want to know! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:01Speaker 00

  This episode is brought to you by Michelob Ultra. Good times mean competitions between you and your friends. Like seeing who can throw some pigskin the farthest, or rush the field the fastest. Winner gets an Ultra. Because it's not just a superior-like beer, it's also giving fans superior access to their favorite sporting events. Superior is worth playing for. Visit michelobultra.com/superioraccess to enter. Enjoy responsibly. Copyright 2026 Anheuser-Busch InBev Michelob Ultra Beer, St. Louis, Missouri.

• 0:28Ryan Clark?

  JR Smith's story has never fit neatly into a box. From being a teenage phenom drafted straight out of high school by the Hornets, to becoming one of the NBA's most electrifying players. JR lived a career filled with unforgettable highs, painful lows, and lessons that came at a cost. Today, we sit down with a man who was often misunderstood. A champion, teammate, brother, father. A man who has openly discussed living with ADHD and dyslexia while navigating a league that celebrated his talent, but often overlooked his struggles. We talk about the New York Knicks playoff run and what that city still means to him. We revisit the 2018 NBA Finals and the Game 1 moment that's followed him for years.

• 1:10Ryan Clark?

  Obviously, we discuss his relationship with LeBron James, winning an NBA championship in Cleveland, and the pressure that comes with playing on the biggest stage in sports. JR opens up about losing a close friend and carrying the weight of the responsibility that followed. He shares why he felt the NBA didn't always care about the depression he battled behind the scenes, and how those experiences shaped the man today. And in true JR fashion, we talk about life after basketball. From becoming a college golfer and competing in his first tournament against Hornets—not necessarily his opponents—to finding purpose, peace, and a new challenge beyond the game. This is a conversation about accountability, it's about growth, mental health, redemption,

• 1:52Ryan Clark?

  and learning how to move forward when the world thinks it already knows your story. Listen, I'm RC, and now JR Smith sits down with Chan, Fred, and me. And this is One of the Biggest Pivots.

• 2:24Ryan Clark?

  Welcome to the Pivot. JR Smith, man. Two-time NBA champion. Once called a hobbyist, actually. That's what Kevin Love called you. A great hobbyist. This is Fred Taylor, Channing Crowder. I'm Ryan Clark, Pivot fam. Thank y'all for pivoting with us. I want to ask you about that, though. There are people in the world, Odell Beckham Jr., but like, he can do everything. He could hoop, he could play soccer, he could play baseball. You're the same, man. You played football, baseball, ping pong. You could golf, all of these different things. Was it hard to sort of settle down into doing one thing? Because you were so good at so many?

• 3:04Speaker 02

  Yeah, like, for me, it was, I was, I don't know. I say, it's crazy because I still say it, but like, I was a football player. I considered myself a football player. Football was like the, one of the sports, was actually, at one point, the only sport I had a scholarship in. And once I, my dad and my high school coach kind of tricked me into transferring into a prep school because I didn't have the grades. And I didn't really understand where I was at and not being able to go to college, even though I had all these offers. When they tricked me and sent me to this prep school, they didn't have a football team. So it was pretty much, it was all basketball. And they kind of like threw all my eggs in one basket. And then, once I reclassified to get, to really to get the grades,

• 3:48Speaker 02

  I went from, I was in bronze class and I would think I was like 74th or something like that in the country. And once I reclassified and did my junior year over again, I went, literally in 48 hours, I went from 76th to number one player in the country.

• 4:04Ryan Clark?

  Oh, wow.

• 4:04Speaker 02

  So RV school, like, literally overnight, just started offering me for basketball. So, and that's kind of, kind of how that went.

• 4:14Channing Crowder?

  Pat Riley says it all the time. Make the main thing the main thing. But you didn't have a main thing. But then you went and played 16 at the highest level. Do you think if you, if somebody, if you did basketball, it would have been, you could have been better because you balled out, but, because you would have been better if you would have locked in?

• 4:34Speaker 02

  If I would have locked into basketball earlier?

• 4:35Channing Crowder?

  Yeah, from nine, from eight.

• 4:37Speaker 02

  No, I mean, basketball was my, I mean, I've been playing basketball since I was three. But it just so happened, like, I was just, I wasn't.

• 4:47Speaker 02

  I didn't grow until, what, sophomore year? Like, on my freshman year to sophomore year, I grew six and a half inches. Like, in the summer. It was like, three months. I went from, literally, being able to barely dunk, to putting that shit between my legs and behind my back in the air. In three months like that. So, it was like, I got good very fast at all of these things because I was already, like, I was already into it. I was already playing sports. I played everything growing up, but I was always, I wasn't as big as everybody else, I would say. And my cousin was, my cousin played at the University of Miami, played football. And I was, like, watching him and I was like, man.

• 5:30Speaker 02

  I watched, literally, all these top college coaches come in, sit in the living room, and, literally, had these conversations with him. I'm like, man, I want to do that. And, like, football was just like, it came natural to me. And, um, basketball, I would say it did too, but I wasn't, I was, I was just, and mentally, I was just a football player to me. Basketball, they were soft, they, they didn't really like contact. And for me, that's all I wanted to do. Like, for real, like, that's, that was all I want. I wanted to smoke all the time on the football field and, and on the basketball court. But it was just like, football was just, it was, it was just ingrained in my head that, like, this is what I want to do by watching somebody.

• 6:12Speaker 02

  Like, I had somebody to aspire up to every single day by watching it.

• 6:16Fred Taylor?

  Jay, what, what are your thoughts on reclassification? For you, it was a benefit, it worked. But for a lot of people, they do it hoping it works. So, when I was coming out, you wanted to be double-promoted. You know, get to college, excel in academics, all this other stuff. Now, with the sports landscape, in a lot of communities, people see sports as a way out. Right? So, they hold their kids back so they can get ahead. What do you think the pros and cons are of reclassification?

• 6:47Speaker 02

  I mean, I think it's dependent on, on the kid. Like, well, for one, it should never have to do with, with the parents trying to get ahead and using their kid as leverage to, to me, to... To do better for them. Like, you should only want to do better for your kids. You put yourself in that situation where, where you live the way you live, and you ha- he was, you raised your kids the way you did, and it just so happened that they became successful. I don't think you should put that on your kid, where it's like, I'm using my kid to like, essentially pay me back, in a sense. That's the way I look at it. For me, it was perfect for me because where I was mentally and intellectually,

• 7:29Speaker 02

  I didn't understand, like, to live out my dreams and, and hopes and all this, I would have had to, because I didn't have the grades. If it wasn't for the McDonald's game, and I didn't play the way I did, I really wouldn't have went to Carolina, because I didn't take the SATs again. Right. I was supposed to take the SATs, and the McDonald's game happened, and they was talking about, "Bro, you can be, you can go first round." I was like, "Shit, I'm out." Makes sense, yeah. Like, I ain't about to go to Carolina and be over here, or, or go to do some Prop 48 shit that y'all talking about, go to some Juco and, and do all of this, just so I can do, get to where I want to be anyway, I'm going. Right. Just get me in the door, I'll figure it out.

• 8:09Ryan Clark?

  You know, you keep mentioning the grades part, which is obviously huge when you talk about having the opportunity to not only play in college, receive a scholarship, and be eligible. You know, you've talked about it now since going back to school, though, with the dyslexia and also the ADHD. When was it, did it finally click to you that you do learn differently than other people?

• 8:35Speaker 02

  Thirty-five, when I went to scho- I went back to school.

• 8:37Ryan Clark?

  Really? How, how was it that you learned it then and finally figured it out?

• 8:41Speaker 02

  My tutors.

• 8:42Ryan Clark?

  Really?

• 8:43Speaker 02

  Yeah. I had tutors, and they literally constructed a, a game plan on how to study. And-

• 8:55Speaker 02

  We went through it every single day. Like it was like a workout. Like you was preparing for a game or a season. And when I did that, for me, it was like, I didn't, I never thought of it like that. Like, it was literally broke down in increments of thirty minutes, fifteen minutes. Just because the way I think, I can't sit there and do the same shit over and over and over again. And if you look at me when I play, I'm not gonna shoot the same shot. I could be in the same spot, you can pass the ball the same way, I'm not gonna shoot the same shot. It may look like it, but for me, in order to be locked in and engaged, I can't do the same thing over and over again.

• 9:35Ryan Clark?

  Can you look back at your life, whether it be academically or athletically, and see where those things did affect you?

• 9:45Speaker 02

  Hundred percent, hundred percent. It's funny because when I was playing football, I didn't know how to read the playbook. So, everything I was doing was pretty much off pure skill. And when I got, when I switched over to basketball and went to St. Benedict's, my coach would try to tell me, you know, try to show me the plays and get me locked in and engaged on the plays and how to like run the offense and all that, and I didn't. I had to do it opposed to look at paper. Like, you gotta put me in the spots, show me what you want me to do, and then I can replicate it. Like, I can't, if I see it and my body does it, I can do that, I can lock in and do it as many times as you want.

• 10:29Speaker 02

  But if you just tell me like, oh, do that, that, that, that, that, I don't know what you're talking about. My brain don't operate like that.

• 10:37Ryan Clark?

  Wow.

• 10:37Channing Crowder?

  And, bro, even to that point, like dyslexia, like, do you see, like, your R's are backwards? Like, or the lines move? Like, I don't, like, you know, the people that have it.

• 10:51Speaker 02

  Kind of, yes and no. Like, a lot of the times, like, numbers, I'll see numbers backwards.

• 10:56Channing Crowder?

  Thirty-six is sixty-three.

• 10:58Speaker 02

  Yeah, a lot of the time.

• 11:00Channing Crowder?

  And you didn't know that till you were thirty-six years old?

• 11:02Speaker 02

  No, no, no, I knew that. I mean, I knew that, but I didn't know what it was. I didn't know why I was like that. I didn't, I couldn't put.

• 11:11Speaker 02

  I had insecurities about how I think and the way I envision things. But I know other, I've been around other people enough to where I know everybody is in dissent. I'm not like that.

• 11:22Channing Crowder?

  Yeah, and the, the, the school system, they failed you. Somebody should have seen that, bruh, before you were 36, bro.

• 11:30Speaker 02

  I'm from Jersey, so I went to a school that was like predominantly, uh, white kids growing up. Like from, literally from birth to 8th grade, or maybe 9th grade. It was literally like 5 black kids in the school, the whole school, and one of them was my siblings. And they put me in like special ed and all of it, like all these classes. And it was like, for me, I couldn't embrace it because I was already an outcast. I was getting picked on a lot because of being black and wanting to be, trying to be an athlete and being quote unquote, "good at sports" or whatever. And then being in special ed, it's like, "Oh, you are dumb. Like, you dummy. You stupid."

• 12:12Speaker 02

  Like, literally. And then, but at the same time, these are the same kids I play every sport with. They on the football teams, they on the, the Pop Warner teams, they on the little biddy league basketball teams. They on the little, uh, Little League baseball teams. And I'm still, you know, juggling that. But then my little brother, he got all the friends. He the man. He the man. He ain't in special ed, ain't nothing wrong. Like, he got, he play all the sports and all that. So for me, I kinda like, I disassociated myself from a lot of people and, uh, at an early age. And I really just threw myself into sports and my imagination.

• 12:51Channing Crowder?

  When you look back, how did that form your personality? Because people be like, "Man, this dude wild. This dude crazy. This dude..." Like, did you, did it make you not care? Because I always say, there was one article, I remember, we talked about it. There was an article at Florida, when I got locked up and they, they told me, "Put him in a cage, let him out on Saturday morning to play linebacker, and then put him back in the cage." And it made me not care anymore. Like, it turned my mind off to, to the outside world. Do you think any of that changed your personality?

• 13:24Speaker 02

  Yeah, I like, I kinda, I kinda formed that. At like, probably like nine years old, ten years old. Cause my, at the same time, like, they, like, when they first put me in that, on special ed and all this, I had lost my grandmother. My grandmother was like, uh...

• 14:04Speaker 02

  I hate crying, dawg. I do this shit all the time, I can't help it.

• 14:13Speaker 02

  She was like the matriarch of our family. And at a very early age, I understood that. And she died from lung cancer, ironically, cause I smoke all the time. Uh, she was a smoker.

• 14:28Speaker 02

  And, uh, at the same time that happened, they put me in these classes. And my childhood started changing.

• 14:43Speaker 02

  I kinda distanced myself from friends and I threw myself more into my family.

• 14:49Speaker 02

  My siblings, my cousins, I had a lot of cousins too, growing up. It was like, well, we didn't, we wasn't like, I didn't live near they, where they lived at, but we was all from Jersey, so I got like, literally like, twenty-some cousins, we all around the same age.

• 15:04Speaker 02

  I kinda threw myself into them and like, really didn't trust anybody else other than them.

• 15:11Speaker 02

  And it kinda, it was to my, I feel like it was to my detriment, because I don't really give people the benefit of the doubt, because I don't trust them. I'm off the rip and I don't give them an opportunity to really show me who they are. Cause I lead with this preconception of, this is dangerous, this person can like, affect me in a lot of ways. It sucks.

• 15:38Ryan Clark?

  When you grow up like that and you don't have a ton of people, how does that affect you in trying to process a loss like your homeboy Andre, right, that you're a part of, you're punished for, but you're also punishing yourself for losing somebody that's close to you when you don't really have people that are close to you like that?

• 16:06Speaker 02

  You know, it's crazy, man, like, I played with a lot of great players and there's a few players that you really wouldn't expect, like, that was there for me when I was going through that time. It's crazy because I had all these quote-unquote "great" coaches and all these people and there was like three people who came to see me when I was in jail for that. And then there was like probably two people, I feel like, who genuinely cared when I got out on how I was going really push through. And my parents was the ones who, after I got out,

• 16:47Speaker 02

  I really felt like those was the ones who was obviously going to help me mentally engage and get back to myself because I was literally like, I felt like I was dead inside. And people don't really understand, like, it's one thing if you lose somebody, but it's a whole nother thing if you lose somebody and it's your fault.

• 17:12Speaker 02

  And I gotta live with his mom not ever seeing her son again. I gotta live with that being in my hands and for me, a lot of that was probably the hardest, next to my daughter, the hardest shit I ever had to do.

• 17:34Speaker 02

  And nobody, like...

• 17:41Speaker 02

  Nobody cared.

• 17:43Speaker 02

  When I got back to season, nobody cared.

• 17:46Speaker 02

  Like, how many threes you made this season? How many, what's your shooting percentage? Like, I had coaches who really didn't, an organization who did not care about it. Made it seem like it was just like, you know, everybody goes through something.

• 18:04Speaker 02

  And then, when my play isn't to that level of expertise, you don't check in, nothing. It's just like,

• 18:13Speaker 02

  he's a problem. He's out all the time. He's drinking, he's smoking, he's doing this, he's doing that. He's like, bro, you don't see,

• 18:24Speaker 02

  you don't want to intervene and try to help?

• 18:26Fred Taylor?

  Yeah.

• 18:27Speaker 02

  You write terrible articles, you put out bad

• 18:33Speaker 02

  reps to other, to damn near the league. Like, at no point do you want to say like, yo, man, just, you want to talk? Anything going on? Like, can I help you? Can I get you help? Like, none of that.

• 18:51Speaker 02

  None of that. Just kill your character completely.

• 18:58Speaker 00

  This episode is brought to you by Michelob Ultra. Good times mean competitions between you and your friends, like seeing who can throw some pigskin the farthest or rush the field the fastest. Winner gets an Ultra. Because it's not just a Superior Light Beer, it's also giving fans superior access to their favorite sporting events. Superior is worth playing for. Visit michelobultra.com/superioraccess to enter. Enjoy responsibly. Copyright 2026 Anheuser-Busch InBev Michelob Ultra Beer, St. Louis, Missouri.

• 19:27Fred Taylor?

  The game is crazy. Hey, did any of your people laugh at you when you went back to school?

• 19:33Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah.

• 19:34Fred Taylor?

  They laugh at you?

• 19:35Speaker 02

  Hundred percent.

• 19:35Fred Taylor?

  Because I got one in the room laughed at me. He said I was the oldest motherfucker in my graduating class when I went back to get my degree. You remember that?

• 19:44Channing Crowder?

  Forty-seven years old, sitting in the dorm. I hope your, your judge ain't sitting no dorm.

• 19:51Speaker 02

  I ain't sitting no dorm, dawg.

• 19:52Fred Taylor?

  Nah, I didn't.

• 19:53Speaker 02

  I ain't sitting no dorm.

• 19:54Fred Taylor?

  I took it online and then, but it was a cool thing to be able to go back and, and knock it out. So basically, I say all that to say congratulations, man. Like, to go through those, the, the, the learning disabilities early and actually at thirty-six to figure out that it actually was a learning disability. I think it's good, it's a great story that we can give back to a lot of athletes that might face those challenges, having those difficulties. Uh, but throughout all that, JR, man, um, I think that was a, a great thing that you were able to do. Uh, but, bro, you, you were so talented. We all make our mistakes, right? If we consider them those. Through that, though, the media painted a certain narrative. In it, what, what's, what's to now?

• 20:39Fred Taylor?

  What's the biggest misconception about JR Smith?

• 20:44Speaker 02

  That I don't care.

• 20:47Fred Taylor?

  Mm-hmm.

• 20:48Speaker 02

  To me, like, I just don't care about what everybody else care about. I don't care about being JR Smith, the

• 20:57Speaker 02

  athlete or the entity and all that shit. Like, I don't care about being seen and taking pictures and all that. Like, I do it because I feel like

• 21:09Speaker 02

  I got shit done very early on by a dude who played in the league when I was coming up. And it was just like, I don't want to be like him. I know for sure I don't want to be like him. I never treat a kid like that. So I take all these pictures and do all that shit because I feel like I owe it to the people. I walk around here by myself. I, I'm not walking around and, I'm not. I used to have the jewelry and all that shit. I don't really care about that shit no more. Like, I'm, I found out, like, it's okay to be me and be, and like what I like and not have the repercussions of worrying about, like, is it the right thing or is it the wrong thing? Like, I'm not hurting nobody.

• 21:50Speaker 02

  I can walk up and down these streets, I smoke weed, I, I, I hang out with my kids, I be by myself, I go to the golf course, I come home. I'm not messing with nobody.

• 21:58Fred Taylor?

  Right.

• 21:59Speaker 02

  I ain't out there hurting nobody. So like, for me, it's just like, not at this point in my life, especially being forty, about to be forty-one, I got five kids. I'm just trying to enjoy what I got left. I'm just trying to stay out the way, inspire the young kids who are like me and who understand that something is, something's not right, and I may be insecure about coming forth with it. But in time, hopefully, they see stuff like this and see me, they can talk to me and get that,

• 22:33Speaker 02

  I would say, confidence. But other than that, man, I'm out the way.

• 22:38Channing Crowder?

  We play ball too. You know, the teams, like you brought up a second ago. You feel as if they should have helped you in some way? Because really, to be honest, they worried about how many tackles I make, how many yards he gets. You know what I'm saying? But there's that, you know, saying now the mental health and all of that stuff. Like, do you, do you feel as if they, that the league lets you down in some way?

• 23:01Speaker 02

  A hundred percent. I feel like they let a lot of players down. It's like, and y'all, I feel like y'all know it more than anybody because y'all play with the most brutal sport there is. You want me to go out here and lay my life on the line? Every, every play? Every game?

• 23:22Speaker 02

  Now I see some of your hits, dawg. Bro. There's no way there shouldn't be, somebody there, y'all should have fucking full health insurance.

• 23:31Channing Crowder?

  I agree with that.

• 23:33Speaker 02

  Like, there's no way you shouldn't get, be able to get any kind of help mentally, physically, for anything. There's no way. If you need to go talk to somebody and all that, that shit should be paid for by the whole league, and you ain't gotta worry about nothing. Every single player who played.

• 23:52Speaker 02

  Like, they don't care about players. They don't care. It's literally, how many tackles did you make? How much, how much did that?

• 24:01Speaker 02

  How many jerseys did he sell? Like, that's all they care about. They talk about more about Shador's getting the money he made off his jerseys than they're more than his play.

• 24:11Ryan Clark?

  He was a commodity.

• 24:12Speaker 02

  Yeah, but they'll ask him how he doing with dealing with the situation that he was in and with the coaches and continuously being asked questions and all that. Like, that takes a toll on your mental ability. Now, granted, he got a great father and I'm sure he can talk to whoever he would need to talk to when he do. But I'm saying like, as a team, as a business, whoever you working for, whoever the Browns, you should be able to go talk to whoever you need to talk to, bro, to get all of that shit out. And I think that's a huge part of, and that's why I love K Love, because he talk about it all the time. Like, the mental aspect of it, the emotional, the depression, all that shit, bro.

• 24:56Speaker 02

  Like, getting hurt and not being able to play, getting hooked on pills. Bro, I went through all of that shit. I played for the Knicks, I tore my meniscus, I had to sit out, came, they rushed me back, I'm hurting the whole time. I get addicted to pain pills.

• 25:16Speaker 02

  They know it, pain, going out, doing all, but no, you don't come to, yo, man, you good? Like, what can we do to help you, bro? Nah, he's terrible, he's this, he's that, ship him to Cleveland, he's a throw-in for the trade. Like, I'm dealing with a lot of shit. Y'all don't care. You literally don't care at all. You just throw more dirt on my name and then just move me.

• 25:38Speaker 02

  It's like, huh, do you deal with them? We don't.

• 25:42Speaker 02

  I just won Sixth Man of the Year for you.

• 25:45Speaker 02

  Like.

• 25:46Ryan Clark?

  Yeah.

• 25:47Speaker 02

  Shit is crazy. It's weird.

• 25:49Ryan Clark?

  You talked about K Love. You've actually been honest about depression as well. I remember an interview when the Lakers picked you up and you talk about that break you on. And you say you were depressed, you was like, couldn't even play video games. And now you're talking about being addicted to painkillers during that time, throwing dirt on your name. Mentally and emotionally, how much of a toll did your career and some of those misunderstandings, misconceptions, not being taken care of, play into the deterioration of your mental health?

• 26:26Speaker 02

  I mean, major, bro, like that, all of that. The car accident, losing my best friend, or continuously being benched for stupid shit. Missing a bus, or being, like, I went through things with my mental health consistently, and long enough to where it's like, I feel like, I played 16 years, I probably played 70% of my career depressed.

• 26:53Speaker 02

  Like, that's crazy to think about.

• 26:57Speaker 02

  That's nuts. And to still be able to have a, I would say, a good career, wasn't great, it was a good career, but, I literally think about this shit all the time, bro, my potential was so high in that aspect of it. I do live, I still live with regret in that. I, I, I can't, it keeps me up at night, I can't lie, 100%. I look at my son and I sit here, it's like, I never want you to feel this feeling. You have all of the, if you have all of the ability that I have,

• 27:29Speaker 02

  one thing I, I, you can talk to me, your mother, your grandmothers, whoever you gotta talk to, I never want you to live in depression and still be able to have to go to work. That's the worst feeling in the world. And, and your job is your passion, like, is your, your dream job.

• 27:49Speaker 02

  Not many people get a chance to do that. Yeah. A lot of people wake up every day like, shh.

• 27:58Speaker 02

  I wake up and go play a kid's game. For a king's ransom? And get treated like royalty. I walk up and down these streets and, and like, my mom puts this fear, and I get it, because she's my mom, and like, something gonna happen, you gotta get, you stop walking around by yourself, and it's just like, bro, they treat me like royalty. Everywhere I go. I don't run into problems, I don't run into issues, I'm not looking for issues, I'm not looking for problems, but like, to, to do what I love to do. And I still walk around, I'm still walking around at times with depression, and I, like, it's still the same. It's like, it's like playing. And playing golf depressed is no, it's impossible. It's impossible. You gonna go shoot 90.

• 28:43Speaker 02

  And if you're a good golfer playing in good tournaments, you're not gonna play, you're not gonna make the cut, you're not gonna make the money, you're not gonna play well, you're not gonna perform, whatever you wanna call it is not happening. It ain't happening.

• 28:54Fred Taylor?

  It's the smoking. The excessive smoking, a lot might consider it, but to you it might just be normal. Is that your coping mechanism for the depression and anxiety? Has that been what's carried you through over all these years?

• 29:07Speaker 02

  A thousand percent. A thousand percent. I mean, I feel like I'm an accountable person and I hold myself accountable. So I'mma call it an addiction. I'm addicted to smoking because of a lot of the depression and pain that I feel and I don't know how to get out and express it. I've been to therapy, I don't trust therapists because I don't, a lot of them tell you what you wanna hear.

• 29:33Speaker 02

  And I've learned to where...

• 29:39Speaker 02

  I don't, me personally, I've been around enough people to kiss my ass, I don't really need that.

• 29:46Speaker 02

  I just think it's a hundred percent...

• 29:50Speaker 02

  Like, I could stop drinking, I'm not a drinker, I've never really been, and I'm really trying to understand the smoking because it's definitely, it's addiction. It's, I smoke miles, I smoke weed. Shit, when I was playing in China and I couldn't get weed, I was smoking cigarettes in the locker room.

• 30:09Speaker 02

  Like, I'm a smoker.

• 30:11Fred Taylor?

  Your grandmother's passing, didn't scare you enough to stop? Or attempt to stop?

• 30:16Speaker 02

  Shit, it couldn't have.

• 30:18Fred Taylor?

  That's heavy.

• 30:19Channing Crowder?

  We ain't gonna kiss your ass and I'm not a therapist. What are you depressed by now? You're rich, you have five beautiful children. You know what I'm saying? You set for life, you play golf, you went back to school. Like, we joke about it, but like, why are you depressed now? See, from the outside looking in, it seems like your life's amazing.

• 30:37Speaker 02

  It seems like it, but I don't get to spend the time I want with my kids.

• 30:43Speaker 02

  I don't get to live the life that I wanna live or I feel like I shouldn't live, be living where I'm at in this stage in my life. I don't have the perfect relationship at home. Like, I don't have a lot of things that people assume that I got. My parents are struggling, going through some issues, my dad is getting older, health issues. I got real live family issues right now, just like...

• 31:08Speaker 02

  Not.

• 31:09Channing Crowder?

  Nothing that money gets sold.

• 31:11Speaker 02

  Yeah, like it's. And that's nonstop. Somebody calling me about something, something happened to somebody, like I gotta be the the person to get somebody out of something or fix something or like.

• 31:25Speaker 02

  Continuously, bro, I've been the.

• 31:28Speaker 02

  I've been the top person in my life since I was seven, eighteen. The breadwinner, the money getter, the go, who everything relies on.

• 31:41Speaker 02

  And then there's a lot of people.

• 31:44Speaker 02

  Like I focus on my, my kids as my immediate, obviously they get whatever they, you know what I mean? But I got a lot of people outside of that that I'm responsible for.

• 31:54Channing Crowder?

  And me, me, I say me personally. We talked about it recently. Being the patriarch and not feeling the appreciation for it, is that something about it?

• 32:05Speaker 02

  That's, that's another thing that, that, that you, that I go through. Like going, like people make it seem like it's easy to walk around every day and be J.R. Smith because like it just seems like a ball. Like you're just having fun all the time, do what the fuck you want. You're like, no, bro, like I make moves based on other people all the time. Every day. Literally every day. Like. My career going to certain teams was based off other people. Is this person gonna be happy if I go here? Is this person gonna be happy if I go here? Is this person gonna be happy if I don't start? Is this person gonna be happy if I do start? If I'm not making X, Y, and Z, is this person gonna be happy? Like all the time.

• 32:51Speaker 02

  I literally live my life on a daily basis of making other people happy.

• 32:57Speaker 02

  And it's crazy because I can understand how it may look like.

• 33:02Speaker 02

  I'm having a ball because it's like, oh, he's playing golf. He's doing what he want to do. And it's like, y'all know more than anything, if you don't practice, you don't get better. And if this is your thing, you gonna have to, you gotta practice. So just, I'm on a golf course, but that don't mean I'm not dealing with shit. That don't mean, when you was playing football, you wasn't dealing shit when you was playing. Granted, good at it, 100%, you're amazing. But that don't change that you're a person too.

• 33:33Ryan Clark?

  Was it like the most fitting thing? You got attacked by bees then in your first golf, in your first golf tournament in college?

• 33:42Channing Crowder?

  That was so funny.

• 33:43Speaker 02

  Bruh, they tore my ass up. They tore my ass up, dawg. I walked on the damn hornet's nest that was in the ground. Bruh, first of all, I didn't know that, like, in golf, especially college golf, like, it's not the most manly thing if you don't carry your bag during the rounds. And I was pushing a damn cart. I had to blow a push cart, whatever. And normally, the females on the women's teams use the push carts. The males don't use the push carts normally. So of course, I'm pushing this damn cart. I can't find my ball, whatever. And sure enough, I go right over top of the damn hornet's nest. And my coach is standing right there, and he got the nerve to say, I seen it. I thought you was gonna, like, bro.

• 34:28Speaker 02

  Like, bruh, alright, man, I said, they tore my ass up, bro. They had to stop playing and everything. That shit was so embarrassing. I'm already 35 years old, out here getting waxed by some 18, 19-year-olds. Some shit like that happen, bruh, that shit was so embarrassing, bro. So embarrassing.

• 34:47Ryan Clark?

  Hey, when that happened, I was like, that's honestly like the most JR Smith way to introduce himself to college golf.

• 34:53Speaker 02

  First round. First round. I'm like, bruh. I'm glad, I'm just glad it didn't really affect my play that much after. I got, it really wasn't as bad as I thought it was, and I was able to finish the round. I thought it was, I thought it was gonna be over. I was like, man, I'm done.

• 35:13Speaker 00

  This episode is brought to you by Michelob Ultra. Good times mean competitions between you and your friends. Like seeing who can throw some pigskin the farthest, or rush the field the fastest. Winner gets an ultra. Because it's not just a superior light beer, it's also giving fans superior access to their favorite sporting events. Superior is worth playing for. Visit michelobultra.com/superioraccess to enter. Enjoy responsibly. Copyright 2026 Anheuser Busch InBev Michelob Ultra Beer, St. Louis, Missouri.

• 35:42Ryan Clark?

  You mentioned being 18 and being the patriarch of the family. I'm from New Orleans, right? Placing a 19-year-old in New Orleans with not much guidance is a very difficult place to be. Especially under a coach like Byron Scott as well, who's gonna be paying attention to all of those things. What was that adjustment like for you? Being from Jersey, really making a late decision to go to the league, you know, and now you're in New Orleans and they're asking you to be the first-round pick that makes a difference, but you're still trying to adjust to everything?

• 36:19Speaker 02

  I mean, for me, it was the worst decision in the world. Like, it was the worst place in the world to be in at the time because all of those things, literally, you just said. It's just like, I didn't have the mental capabilities to deal with a lot of the things that they put me through as an 18-year-old in that type of city with that type of team. To where I was more, like, a lot of the dudes who came out were a little more mature in the aspect of understanding what they were walking into. I was way more, I think, in denial of thinking like, you know, the league was a place where, you know, it was a grind. Like, you worked out all the time, or you practiced all the time,

• 37:02Speaker 02

  and it was like more of camaraderie. I went to a team, an older team, with an old-school coach who really didn't look at it like that. We would practice for like two hours, three hours, and you had the rest of the day to do what you wanted to do.

• 37:23Speaker 02

  Like, bro, I'm 18. You gave me a pocketful of money in New Orleans. Yeah. I got cars. All of a sudden, I'm cute.

• 37:32Speaker 02

  Like, bruh. I ain't never had no, this many girls go on me like that. And I was the man in high school. Like, I was the man in Jersey in high school. But, bruh, man, I'm over there at Xavier. I'm a dealer. I'm still young enough, I'm going to high school games. I'm watching DJ Augustine go crazy. I'm like, man, what? I got grown women, like, 40 years old. Grown ass women. And I'm messing with damn near their daughters. 18, 19 year olds. Like, bruh, you couldn't. I had, at the time, I was living with my pops and I really didn't, like, I was, when I was growing up, I was very, what you call it? My pops was like, real strict. The, uh, I, I ain't had that much leash. Right.

• 38:14Speaker 02

  So, give me, give me, giving me a little leeway, learning about the road. I got dudes from 35 years old. I'm, like, I'm literally learning from grown ass men. I'm like, bruh. My next year, my pops was out of there. He needed some freedom? Yeah, buddy, we gotta, we gotta, we gotta reevaluate some things. We go, had to look here, dog. And I was staying in the guest room. Right. Like, bruh, I bought this big ass house, I'm sleeping in the guest room? You got, you got the big jump? Like, come on, man.

• 38:45Speaker 02

  Hey, when the 40 year old come over, we gotta, we gotta go to, we gotta go to the small room, boo. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I was like, wait a minute, I'm, I'm learning, like, as, like, like, who I am. But I'm like, but I was also, like, figuring it out, but still being defiant with my pops. And me and my pops got a great relationship, I love my dad. But it was just, it was one of those things where, like, it was like, old school caveman shit. Two men can't live in the same cave. Not two grown ones. Not two grown ones, and not one trying to figure out how to be grown anyway. Like, and figure, like, I'm not, at this point, I can buy three caves. Like, I ain't gotta stay in your cave. You come to stay in my cave now, like. You can't come in my cave telling me where I can't go and where I gotta sleep. Like, hold up, bro. Yeah.

• 39:32Speaker 02

  Let's get some room over here. I went from high school, Dan Hurley was my coach. I wake up at 6:00 AM. You work out for an hour and a half. Take a shower, get ready for school, school, eight hours. You got practice, study hall.

• 39:52Speaker 02

  Bro, my day gone.

• 39:53Ryan Clark?

  Yeah.

• 39:55Speaker 02

  I go from all that structure and all of that to,

• 39:59Speaker 02

  we practice for three hours, I always see y'all next day at 11.

• 40:05Speaker 02

  We got action.

• 40:09Speaker 02

  We got action. I say, "Look here, man, I'm out of here." "What?" "I'm gone."

• 40:13Ryan Clark?

  Didn't you call Bron though, when you first got to the league?

• 40:17Speaker 02

  Yeah, when I first got to the league, I went to Akron and went to work out with Bron, but Bron was like cold at the time, like mentally, he wasn't like, he wasn't dropping the jewels and like, he was going to work out, but he wasn't telling me he was going. Like, we would go work out once, and then I didn't, I come find out the next day, he went and worked out like three other times. I'm like, "Yo, bro, you wasn't gonna tell me?" Like, dang. But that's, he been like that though, man. That's, I was like, that was my first introduction to like, really like,

• 40:46Speaker 02

  somebody who worked and like, looked at basketball like, this is a lifestyle, this is not like...

• 40:54Ryan Clark?

  It wasn't a hobby for him?

• 40:55Speaker 02

  Yeah, no. No, no, no, no, no. Very early on, he understood, "This is not a hobby. This is like, this is my job." I still didn't, I didn't get that shit until I got to Cleveland, really.

• 41:07Ryan Clark?

  How did it feel though, to know that he vouched for you in Cleveland though? That he was somebody, and multiple times LeBron James has said, "Nah, I want JR Smith on my team."

• 41:17Speaker 02

  I mean, it means the world because, I mean, arguably the best player ever to, and for him to say that about me is, I think it speaks volumes to the level of player that like, I am, and not only that, knowing, him knowing me as a person. It's one thing to, for somebody to, you know, give you credit of your athletic ability, because a lot of us are athletes. We are athletic and can run, jump, whatever. But when he talks about you as a person, and talk about like, "Yo, nah, he cool, like, that's my man, he should be straight." That's like, that right there means way more to me than somebody vouches for me as an athlete.

• 42:00Speaker 02

  Like, I know I'm good. I know, I got, I got plenty of confidence. I don't need nobody to tell me my worth into this, in this game, and the work that I've put in. But if you vouch for me as a person and you know I'm a good person, that means the world to me because everybody thinks I'm such a fucked up individual because of a coach or something that they try to throw on my name. And I'm not that person.

• 42:26Channing Crowder?

  Talking about Bron though. I remember y'all sitting on the bench, two seats away from each other at 18 with Golden State. When your ass ain't know which basket you was running to.

• 42:37Channing Crowder?

  Did you?

• 42:40Speaker 02

  You should have told me, you was gonna, "Ass, I'm gonna spit this damn water on myself, man."

• 42:45Channing Crowder?

  That big motherfucker got that rebound kick out of you, took off the other way?

• 42:50Speaker 02

  I got the rebound.

• 42:51Channing Crowder?

  You got the rebound?

• 42:52Speaker 02

  He dribbled it out. He dribbled it out.

• 42:54Channing Crowder?

  Were you dribbling it out or was dribbling the other way?

• 42:56Speaker 02

  I was dribbling it out. So first, I got the rebound. I'm thinking we gonna call a timeout because at that point, the game is possessional. Yeah. 107, 107. 100%. So I'm thinking, okay, bet. We not about to rush. We gonna get the best shot possible. Any other time, you look at it, and even now, teams do it. You get the rebound, you call timeout and get it to your best player and then they make the play. That's how it go. So I didn't hear no whistle, so I'm like, "All right, shit, let me take this bitch to the corner." Like, "Let me get some space. KD's seven foot. I ain't about to shoot over this dude when he right here. Offensive rebound, you tripping. Let me get to the corner." Nobody still to say nothing. So I'm like, "All right, bet."

• 43:38Speaker 02

  Yo, Bruh, yo, it looked like they was trying to deny Bron, so I'm dribbling it out to get the ball to Bron. Like, "Bro, if I shoot this shit, they gonna be mad as fuck. You shoot this shit, they gonna be like, well, we gonna live and die with that."

• 43:52Speaker 02

  So for me, I'm just like, at the whole time, I'm like, "Listen, let me get this shit out of here. Get the big fella, he gonna do what he gotta do." Worse can worse, we gotta timeout. Yeah. I'm not gonna call timeout because then if I call timeout, y'all gonna be, "Man, you wasted our timeout." Like, "Bro, come on, man. Don't do that. Don't do me like that, Bruh." "I wanted to call it, did it." "All right, man. All right." But Bruh, Bron's face though, dawg, when he was looking at- Yeah, he was hot. He was legitimately hurt though. He was hot. He was confused because he didn't understand what is happening right now. And I looked at, I'm literally looking at him like-

• 44:34Channing Crowder?

  I'm trying to get you the ball.

• 44:35Speaker 02

  Like, bruh, this is your job. It's your job. That's why you don't get the big bucks. They don't pay me enough for this shit.

• 44:43Fred Taylor?

  Yeah, he did the same exact thing.

• 44:45Channing Crowder?

  Yeah, but we talked about this recently with, was it? No, Jalen and A.J. Brown. Did y'all have a conversation about that? Because you see the video on TV, the video that I saw on TV.

• 44:56Speaker 02

  No, we never talked about it.

• 44:56Channing Crowder?

  Y'all never talked about that?

• 44:57Speaker 02

  He's still mad. He's still mad.

• 45:00Fred Taylor?

  Can't be too mad.

• 45:01Speaker 02

  Oh, he's so mad. He's still mad.

• 45:03Fred Taylor?

  He can't be too mad. I mean, y'all won the championship together in Cleveland. And then y'all ran it back and won it in L.A.

• 45:10Speaker 02

  Yeah, he's still mad.

• 45:11Fred Taylor?

  But that brings me to this question. Because I heard Danny Green saying the bubble was the hardest championship he won. When people look at LeBron, they always try to find a way to kind of move the goalpost and taint its legacy a little bit. So they would say that championship is watered down. What for you, having come back from down 3-1 against Golden State teammate LeBron? And being able to go and win it in L.A. and in the bubble? Of those two championships, for you personally, which was the hardest championship?

• 45:42Speaker 02

  I mean, I think the 3-1 was harder because the team we was facing. I think the Warriors was just, I mean, they was best record in the league at the time.

• 45:50Fred Taylor?

  Right.

• 45:51Speaker 02

  Ever. I think that team was just probably one of the best teams that ever was assembled.

• 45:56Fred Taylor?

  Right.

• 45:56Speaker 02

  But I think the bubble one was definitely hard because the consistent grind staying there and like the fans and all of that, all of getting tested every day. All that shit was weird. And seeing your opponent literally in the hotel, you, I'm getting on an elevator, I'm playing against this dude an hour and I see him on the elevator, like, bruh, I don't want all that.

• 46:14Fred Taylor?

  Who's that, that Paul George?

• 46:17Channing Crowder?

  Somebody told us the same thing. You want all that closeness?

• 46:19Speaker 02

  Nah, man, I don't want to see you, dawg. Make them stay on the other side. Put us on different rooms, different sides of the hotel, something. And then it's like, you go to the lunchroom, you see dudes eating with other dudes on the teams and all that, and it's just like... I'm getting too old, like, I gotta go. Like, this is, this is weird. Like, it was cool, but at the same time, it was just like, it was too friendly. I'm used to a sport and grew up around a sport to where it's like, when I see you and I went my, it's like, we like gangs at this point. When I see you and it's a court right there, we can go check up right now, like,

• 46:54Fred Taylor?

  Right.

• 46:54Speaker 02

  Get your five, we gonna get our five and we ready. That's how it was in the bubble, which I liked a little bit, but like, it wasn't as organized and structured, because it was just a bunch of the guys going to hoop. But I think the hardest one had to be coming back from 3-1.

• 47:10Fred Taylor?

  3-1.

• 47:11Speaker 02

  For sure.

• 47:11Fred Taylor?

  What type of pressure y'all felt then? Because do you just say, fuck it, I'm just gonna let my nuts hang at 3-1? Or do you have to, like, tap into a whole different level of what's inside you?

• 47:24Speaker 02

  I mean, I think for that team, it was, I ain't had to do much. I gotta, I had to guard, I know, well, guard Klay was definitely. Yeah, yeah, I will say that. But I didn't have to carry the burden of shit trying to go get 40.

• 47:39Fred Taylor?

  Right.

• 47:39Speaker 02

  Like, one guy did triple double and the other one had 40 something. Like, I ain't had to carry that burden. I just had to make sure my job was being done. And for me, like, that's what, I tried to lock in more than any, like, more than ever to, and he still got off a little bit, like, to Klay. Because I knew for sure, like, him, I mean, it's hard to say who was the one who made it go, because obviously Steph is Steph. But I knew for sure, if I can keep him contained a little bit, I give us an amazing opportunity to win. And also, the thing that really changed it for me, coming out the third, I had James Jones.

• 48:21Speaker 02

  I think I may have shot one shot, I don't really think I shot one, but I may have shot one in the first half. And he came to me at the T-Lu's halftime speech, and he was like, yo, bro, what you gonna do? You gonna take him home with you? Like, you know you a shooter, shoot the ball.

• 48:36Fred Taylor?

  Yeah.

• 48:37Speaker 02

  So I was like, damn, like, alright, because I was so locked in to trying to stop him. I'm like, y'all got the offense. I'm not even worried about it. When it come, when it come my way, alright, cool. But I was more in a defensive mindset. And coming out that third, I was like, alright, shit. Every time I catch that Joe in the first couple of passes, I'm shooting it.

• 48:55Fred Taylor?

  Right.

• 48:56Speaker 02

  And literally, every time it touched my hands, I shot it and it was falling. And luckily, it was falling because it gave us a boost to where...

• 49:02Fred Taylor?

  Y'all needed that, yeah.

• 49:03Speaker 02

  Yeah, we needed that. We needed that spark and we needed... That's where, that's the games where like, game seven in that situation, that's where like, you really need every single person who's in your, like, core rotation. You need everybody to come up big.

• 49:18Fred Taylor?

  Right.

• 49:19Speaker 02

  And even though Kev wasn't the points Kev, like, he's normally a 20-20, 30-20 dude. He had 20 rebounds. Like, that's major. I think Kev maybe scored eight bucket in game seven, maybe two points. This is Kevin Love, he going in the Hall of Fame.

• 49:34Fred Taylor?

  Right.

• 49:34Speaker 02

  Like, that sacrifice and not worrying about it, like, listen, I'm just gonna do my job. Whatever comes, however the ball falls, that's what it is. Because at the end of the day, we all win shit, we all win. We all win. And I didn't really, until I got to Cleveland, I didn't, I didn't understand that sacrifice of a team. Like, I've never been able to literally

• 50:00Speaker 02

  sacrifice as much because I felt like, for one issue with it, didn't like the coach. Denver had a dumbass coach.

• 50:10Speaker 02

  New York, I just felt like I was, I should have... Everywhere I've been until I got to Cleveland, I just felt like I should have been the starter. I should have been like, the starter on that team at that position. Because you keep bringing in people who are not better than me to play in front of me. And that doesn't make sense when it comes to sports. Like, it never made sense to me. Unless you like the coach's son, like, growing up, like, that's the only time he's going to play in front of the better guy.

• 50:36Fred Taylor?

  Right.

• 50:36Speaker 02

  Like, that's it. In professional sports, you literally putting dudes in front of me that's not better than me. I don't understand this concept of your sixth man and all that other shit. So when I got to Cleveland, I was like, oh shit, they really don't need me to score. My job is to play defense. Yeah, you shoot, but like, you guarding a primary scorer night in and night out. For me, that was a job of somebody who couldn't score. I was a scorer.

• 51:06Ryan Clark?

  Right.

• 51:07Speaker 02

  But I look at it, I'm looking around like shit. He's probably the best offensive player I've ever seen. He's probably the best scorer I've ever seen. He just came from averaging thirty and twenty every night.

• 51:21Ryan Clark?

  Play some defense.

• 51:27Speaker 02

  Hey, switch, switch. Hey, I got him, don't worry about it, I got him. Y'all, yeah, shit is easy.

• 51:35Ryan Clark?

  Hey, you talk about what you need in the finals. You know, it's been this big thing, man, once a Nick, always a Nick.

• 51:41Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 51:42Ryan Clark?

  And it's been so cool to see like the generation of Knicks players who supported throughout this run to the finals. The electricity in the arena. When you're there and you're getting to be a part of this run, even with the way your Knicks tenure went, do you truly feel like a part of what's going on?

• 52:03Speaker 02

  A hundred percent. And I credit Wes and Leon in that, they really built a culture to make the players be a part of the family, even after you move on, even to a different team, or to retire, whatever. And I feel like that's the way it should be. Like, you should be, you should, especially if you played in that city or played well in that city, and like you were a household name in that city, like you should take care of your players.

• 52:31Ryan Clark?

  Right.

• 52:31Speaker 02

  Like, that should be your thing. It shouldn't be a thing to where it's like, you look at some of these dudes who, and this is not my generation, this is generations older than me, like, who just go through hard times because they don't have it, and you literally are a legend walking around the city.

• 52:48Ryan Clark?

  Yeah.

• 52:49Speaker 02

  Like, you gotta sell your championship rings and all that, like, you going, like, I get, you know, some people just not good financially with money and all that other stuff and whatever, whatever, but I'm like, you, they don't do nothing for you, right? Like, you got a jersey in the rafters. They named this after, like... To me, I just think that's crazy. I don't understand why that's not more of a thing. And the Knicks do the best job by far of making. I want to hold chip in Cleveland. They haven't invited me back once. And it's been 10 years. It's our 10 year anniversary.

• 53:26Speaker 02

  They haven't invited me back once. And they like Cleveland got a lot of players to invite back. I mean, they've won one championship in the last, how many years? That's what I'm saying. Just saying, like.

• 53:38Channing Crowder?

  I got one more. Because the lore of you, the super salt with David Jones. You threw soup at a man?

• 53:48Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 53:49Channing Crowder?

  Why you throw soup? Like, I gotta know the story, man. I read the story. I'm like, no, that ain't enough information for me. Why this man throw soup at a man?

• 53:57Speaker 02

  People can't really understand that I'm not a person who like, if I tell you stop playing with me, stop playing with me. Like, I don't play. I'm not playing. I'm going through the times where I'm not, I'm not playing well. My relationship at the time, my marriage was sketchy. I'm in a situation to her. My daughter was a year out of being premature. So she's still got a really like,

• 54:26Speaker 02

  I'm still dealing with that and helping and figuring that aspect out. Still got people who need and rely on me. So I'm having a day completely in, before I go get to my job, where I have to go perform. I get in the lunchroom. We in there chilling or I'm in the line, processing, just trying to get my soup or whatever. And he comes in here playing, trying to like knock, knock the soup out of my hand.

• 54:53Speaker 02

  So I'm like, yo, bro, like, stop playing. Of course, he, ha, ha, ha, ha. Like, tried to knock it out my hand again. So I was just like,

• 55:04Speaker 02

  throw it. This motherfucker screamed so loud, dog.

• 55:11Speaker 02

  That shit was hot. Chef just put it out. I was the first person to get a cup. Bruh. He screamed, ah.

• 55:23Speaker 02

  It just so happened that the Gia now was in the room, in the cafeteria. And he went in there and told the, the big dog, and was just like, "Bruh." And that's how I got, and that's how they ended up suspending me. Yeah, yeah. I didn't understand even why they suspended me because they, we, we know him. We know how he is. So...

• 55:45Speaker 02

  Because if it was somebody else, you're not gonna suspend them. You know, you wouldn't have sus-, you wouldn't have suspended them. There's been plenty of other things that went on in the building that has happened where players or somebody should have been suspended and it didn't get suspended. So, you've gotta like, that's where it was just for me, it was just like the right was on the roll. It was time to go. Yeah.

• 56:03Fred Taylor?

  Yeah, what, what kind of suit was it?

• 56:05Speaker 02

  Chicken tortilla. It was one of my favorites too, bro.

• 56:10Speaker 02

  Did you get you another bowl? Hell yeah.

• 56:13Fred Taylor?

  Cause you got creamy suit? Like, I like broccoli cheddar, but that don't get as hot as the liquid chicken tortilla or chicken noodle.

• 56:20Speaker 02

  Oh man, that shit was gonna fly.

• 56:20Fred Taylor?

  That liquid get hot.

• 56:23Speaker 02

  It was a tall ass, bro. When I tell you the pen he be bringing up, that's how good it is. He gotta make literally like... Big ol' pot of it. Big ol' pot, cause everybody get it. Everybody get, I'm the first person. This is fresh off the joan.

• 56:39Speaker 02

  Alright? Stop playing. I don't, I ain't got time for stupid, like foolishness, bro. Especially if I'm in the, already in the mode, like, bro. I can't, I, I can't lash out the way I really want to. So if I really did it, like, y'all would have probably kicked me off the team. Y'all would probably sit me home for real. Right.

• 56:57Fred Taylor?

  Hey, Jay, we always ask our guests, what's their biggest pivot in life? That's the moment you can look, moment or moments, you can look back on and say, because this happened to me or for me, I am who I am today.

• 57:08Speaker 02

  It's funny, man, like, I feel like I'm constantly pivoting. I feel like I'm constantly changing roles and doing things that's like outside the box that people wouldn't really expect for a person like me to do. Uh, cause they don't really know me. But I, I feel like for me, it's just like, my pivot is my personality consistent. It's like, I feel like once I learned, I guess going to school would be my biggest pivot then. Because I learned how to think and I, once I learned how to really compartmentalize my thoughts and put it into perspective, I learned that I can... Really do anything. Mm hmm. It's just like, you know, it's everybody always says it's like, oh, like when you growing up, like, oh, you can do it.

• 57:53Speaker 02

  You can be anything when you grow up. You can be anything you want to be. You can be anything you want to be. And it's like, almost it became like this fictitious slogan that people live by. And I think like, fortunately enough, in our time, we've seen a lot of things change to where

• 58:12Speaker 02

  I really started believing it. I'm in a state of mind right now where I really believe like I can do anything. And that came with me going to school, learning how to think. And that's probably why I'm going to continuously, I think, stay in school for a while because there's so much stuff that I want to learn. Mm hmm. I have the opportunity to learn. Before that, I didn't exercise that right because I felt like I was just content on who I was or scared to be what I really wanted to do or what I really wanted to be. So I would say my biggest pivot that would be going to school and that shit, I say it happened for me opposed to it happening to me. Right.

• 58:53Speaker 02

  Because it's like I had the opportunity to be around another super athlete who taught me

• 59:00Speaker 02

  something about myself that I didn't really know. And that's like continuously trying to get better at everything, not just being an athlete. Like, we all go, we all been in the gym, working out, working towards something to where I want to help my team. I want to like help myself and my family get out of a situation. It's just like, but you can also do all of those things with working out in your mind. Working your mind out, going, educating yourself, continuously putting yourself in different situations, in different surroundings. Like, I didn't know I would want to go to real estate school.

• 59:38Speaker 02

  Ten years ago, you could ask me that, I was like, what am I doing that for? Now I'm doing it just because I want to do it. And I feel like I should know something about properties, property taxes, what's going on in the market, like, all of that. Like, I want to learn that. And it's not for nobody else. It's for me and for myself. Because I could get those jewels to my son and put him in a better situation. Because I didn't learn that until I'm 40.

• 1:00:06Ryan Clark?

  If you could go back and change anything about your life, what would be different? Because a lot of times, people who end up being as successful as you are, when they talk about their life, they always say, "I'm glad that happened," or "I'm glad this happened," and "this made me who I was," and "I wouldn't change a thing." You don't seem like you feel that way. You feel like there are some things that you would have liked to be different.

• 1:00:30Speaker 02

  100%.

• 1:00:32Ryan Clark?

  What is something that you would have liked to be different about your past? If you could change it, you would?

• 1:00:39Speaker 02

  Man, for me, when I was nine years old, I wish I'd have learned how to... I wish I'd have had the tools of opening up and being able to express what I was going through, what I felt. If I was capable of expressing myself at an earlier age, I feel like a lot of my own thoughts wouldn't be to my detriment. And I didn't realize this until as I got older and even still. Just having those hard conversations, having the courage and boldness to have those tough conversations with people,

• 1:01:22Speaker 02

  you really find out that it's not that bad. It's not as bad as you think. And I didn't learn that for a long time. And I feel like, for me, if earlier on, I wish I'd have had that.

• 1:01:35Ryan Clark?

  I love that. Nixon 6?

• 1:01:37Speaker 02

  Yeah, I had Nixon 6. I was hoping for the broom to come out, but don't even worry about it. Big orange-faced motherfucker want to show up and fuck everything up.

• 1:01:47Ryan Clark?

  And that's the pivot with JR Smith.

• 1:01:54Speaker 05

  Every game day you show up for your team. Now it's your time.

• 1:02:29Speaker 06

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