Bonus Episode: 2025 Rock 'n' Roll Hall of Fame Nominees and Helter Skelter

Oasis, Bad Company, Black Crowes, OutKast, White Stripes, Joe Cocker, Joy Division / New Order, Chubby Checker, Cyndi Lauper, Mana, Phish, Soundgarden, Billy Idol, and Mariah Carey. Which 7 artists would you choose to induct into the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame? Will Billy Idol, the consummate rock 'n' roll animal, make the cut? Next week, we're bringing you a story on Mama Cass Elliot and her connection to Charles Manson and the Tate LaBianca murders. We want to know: Do you believe that the accepted narrative on Helter Skelter is true? Did Manson kill for the reasons they said he did? Tell Jake at 617-906-6638, [email protected] mailto:[email protected], or on socials @disgracelandpod. For more great Disgraceland episodes, dive into our extensive archive, including such episodes as: Episodes 77 https://www.disgracelandpod.com/077/oasis-pt-1 and 78 https://www.disgracelandpod.com/078/oasis-pt-2 - Oasis Episode 137 - New Order https://www.disgracelandpod.com/137/new-order Episode 202 - The Cramps https://www.disgracelandpod.com/202/cramps Episode 156 - Mariah Carey https://www.disgracelandpod.com/156/mariah-carey To hear an extended version of the After Party and unlock access to a monthly exclusive episode and ad free listening, become a Disgraceland All Access member at disgracelandpod.com/membership. https://disgracelandpod.com/membership. This month's episode (coming soon) will be on the Allman Brothers Band. Visit www.disgracelandpod.com/merch https://www.disgracelandpod.com/merch to see the latest Disgraceland merch! Sign up for our newsletter and get the inside dirt on events, merch and other awesomeness - GET THE NEWSLETTER https://mailchi.mp/doubleelvis/disgraceland-email-newsletter Follow Jake and DISGRACELAND: Instagram https://www.instagram.com/disgracelandpod/ YouTube https://www.youtube.com/@disgracelandpod X https://twitter.com/disgracelandpod (formerly Twitter) To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices See omnystudio.com/listener https://omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:01Speaker 00

  This is exactly right.

• 0:13Speaker 01

  OnDeck is built to back small businesses like yours. Whether you're buying equipment, expanding your team, or bridging cash flow gaps, OnDeck's loans up to $400,000 make it happen fast. Rated A+ by the Better Business Bureau and earning thousands of five-star TrustPilot reviews, OnDeck delivers funding you can count on. Apply in minutes at ondeck.com. Depending on certain loan attributes, your business loan may be issued by OnDeck or Celtic Bank. OnDeck does not lend in North Dakota. All loans and amounts subject to lender approval.

• 0:41Speaker 02

  She's been thinking about this sleepover all week, but I think about her food allergies all the time. Fortunately, her doctor prescribed Zolair, omalizumab. It's proven to significantly reduce allergic reactions if a food allergy accident happens.

• 0:54Speaker 03

  Zolair 150mg is a prescription medication used to treat food allergy in people one year of age and older to reduce allergic reactions due to accidental exposure to one or more foods. While taking Zolair, you should continue to avoid all foods to which you are allergic. Don't use if you are allergic to Zolair. Zolair may cause a severe, life-threatening allergic reaction called anaphylaxis. Tell your doctor if you ever had anaphylaxis. Get help right away if you have trouble breathing or if you have swelling of your throat or tongue. Zolair should not be used for the emergency treatment of allergic reactions, including anaphylaxis. Zolair is for maintenance use to reduce allergic reactions, including anaphylaxis, while avoiding food allergens. Serious side effects such as cancer, fever, muscle aches, and rash, parasitic infection, or heart and circulation problems have been reported. Please see zolair.com for full prescribing information. Ask an allergist about Zolair.

• 1:37Speaker 03

  This is an advertisement for Zolair paid for by Genentech and Novartis.

• 1:43Jake Brennan?

  Hey, Discos. Need a little more DisgraceLand in your life? Just a touch to get you through? Yeah, me too. This is the podcast that comes after the podcast. Welcome to DisgraceLand: The After Party.

• 2:09Jake Brennan?

  Welcome to the Disgrace Land bonus episode, a little thing we like to call the after-party. This is the show after the show, the party after the party, the bridge to get you from one full episode of Disgrace Land to the other, the backyard to dig into the dirt. On this bonus episode, we are talking about this week's full episode subject, Billy Idol. We're previewing the coming Charles Manson, Mama Cass, Sharon Tate Madness that'll be in your Disgrace Land and Hollywood Land feed shortly. We're talking Rock and Roll Hall of Fame Blues, and we get into your voicemails, texts, DMs, emails, and as always, a whole lot of Rosie Allright discos. Let's get into it.

• 2:58Jake Brennan?

  Billy Idol, this week's full episode subject of Disgrace Land was, as you've by now learned if you listened, a true rock and roll animal, as we like to say. Few musicians lived as dangerously and as wild as Billy Idol did, and fewer still lived to tell about it. Billy is on the shortlist of rock and roll animalism, that shortlist with like Keith Moon, Keith Richards, small handful of others. Billy Idol is also on another list. He's on the list of musicians nominated this year to the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame. Along with Billy Idol, Oasis, Bad Company, Black Crows, Outkast, White Stripes, Joe Cocker, Joy Division, and New Order as one band. How does that make sense?

• 3:42Jake Brennan?

  I'm not sure. Chubby Checker, Cyndi Lauper, Mana, Phish, Soundgarden, and Mariah Carey are all nominated. That's with Billy Idol, 14 nominees. Now, only seven are going to get in. Only seven are going to get into the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame. Does Billy Idol deserve to be one of these seven? That's what I want to figure out. Again, here's the list. Oasis, Bad Company, Black Crows, Outkast, White Stripes, Joe Cocker, Joy Division, and New Order, Chubby Checker, Cyndi Lauper, Mana Phish, Soundgarden, and Mariah Carey. So which seven are you choosing from that list? If it's me, I'd nominate Bad Brains, Graham Parsons, New York Dolls, Motorhead,

• 4:25Jake Brennan?

  and The Smiths before I nominate most of this list, but that is another story. Let's stick to the cards we've been dealt here in 2025. You have seven artists you can choose from this list of 14 artists. Oasis, Bad Company, Black Crows, Outkast, White Stripes, Joe Cocker, Joy Division, New Order, Chubby Checker, Cyndi Lauper, Mana Phish, Soundgarden, and Mariah Carey. Who are you choosing for your seven? Now, Rock and Roll Hall of Fame inductees are chosen by a mix of industry insiders and a fan vote. Right now, the fan vote has the following seven artists in the lead with what I would assume is the best chance of getting in when the polls close on April 21st.

• 5:10Jake Brennan?

  They are, in reverse order, number seven with the most votes, number seven, Chubby Checker. Number six, Joe Cocker. Number five, our friends who we've been talking a lot about here in Disgraceland lately, Soundgarden. Number four, Cyndi Lauper. Number three, our guy Billy Idol. Number two, Bad Company. And number one, Fish. Fish! Fish! Number one in the voting by a wide margin as well. Now, I don't know about you guys, but Fish would be way down on my list, but I'm guessing

• 5:49Jake Brennan?

  their top ranking here in votes has more to do with Fish's fanbase being super active online. I think that's what's going on. I don't think people by and large think that Fish is more deserving, the most deserving of all 14 of these nominees, to be in the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame. Now, notably, Black Crows, Mariah Carey, Joy Division/New Order, White Stripes, Outkast, Oasis, and Mana. I don't know who Mana is, but anyways, Mana are currently not receiving enough votes to qualify. How is it that there's an artist on the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame inductee list that I've never heard of? Okay? That makes no sense.

• 6:34Jake Brennan?

  And I know you're gonna say, they're from South America, or Mexico, or Spain, or some other country that I'm not paying attention to. You're right, I'm not paying attention to them. But that's not my problem. That's their problem. They're supposed to be so undeniably great and Hall of Fame worthy that they are pulling my attention toward them. That's another story. I don't want to get into that. Just know that Mana, along with Oasis, OutKast, White Stripes, Joy Division slash New Order, Mariah Carey, Black Crows, right now, as of the voting, are not getting into the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame. And that a list topped by Phish, well, you know. Okay, so this list doesn't upset me as much as

• 7:17Jake Brennan?

  the grunge list from a couple of weeks ago that we were talking about. But it's, you know, I mean, guys, again, the seven in the lead, Phish, Bad Company, our guy Billy Idol, Cyndi Lauper, Soundgarden, Joe Cocker, and I got, I got a problem with Oasis and Black Crows being below Chubby Checker, Joe Cocker, Bad Company, Cyndi Lauper, and Phish, even Soundgarden. I think I'd put Oasis and Black Crows above Soundgarden. I would. I think so. Yeah. I'm not sure what the criteria is here, but rock and roll animalism, it should be an input. It should be a thought, at least. It should be a trait, no matter how heavy or how lightly we weight it. It should be a trait that we consider when we

• 8:02Jake Brennan?

  consider the worthiness of an artist for the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame. I know, I know it's, you know, this is our purview, our side of the street, our point of view is rock and roll animalism. I get that. I get that most people aren't thinking about that. But still, how do you just ignore it? You know? How do you ignore it? Phish. Again, Phish. So I want to know from you guys, who should be inducted into the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame this year? We can only choose seven artists. Okay, I already listed five that I think have been historically snubbed. Bad Brains, Motorhead, Graham Parsons, New York Dolls, and The Smiths. That leaves only two remaining slots from our current list

• 8:45Jake Brennan?

  of 14 nominees. Again, Oasis, Bad Company, Black Crows, OutKast, White Stripes, Joe Cocker, Joy Division slash New Order, Chubby Checker, Cyndi Lauper, Mana, Phish, Soundgarden, and Mariah Carey. From that list, if I can only choose two to go along with my list of five snubs, if I can only choose two from that list of 14, who am I choosing? Well,

• 9:12Jake Brennan?

  Definitely Oasis, definitely. And I guess I'm bringing it all back to Bangkok, holler, holler, city of squalor. I gotta go with Billy Idol. I do. Oasis and Billy Idol, along with Bad Brains, Motorhead, Graham Parsons, New York Dolls, and The Smiths would be my list of seven Rock and Roll Hall of Fame inductees for the class of 2025 if your guy right here, me, yours truly, was responsible for the Hall. But I'm not. Maybe some of you are. I don't know. I think that's a great fucking list.

• 9:53Jake Brennan?

  Bad Brains, Motorhead, Graham Parsons, New York Dolls, Smiths, Oasis, and Billy Idol. But I want to know, who are you inducting into the Hall of Fame? Okay? You can only choose seven. All right? Seven. And I think some of the list of the current 14 nominees are worthy. I think Billy Idol is worthy, this week's subject. I really do. I truly do. And not just for his rock and roll animalism. Dude wrote stone cold hits. Okay? Huge, massive, culture-defining, genre-defining, era-defining hits. He was such the avatar for punk rock that he made it something else where he tricked

• 10:37Jake Brennan?

  our brains into ignoring the fact that he was punk rock, if that makes sense. He was that big. His songs were that impactful. And I know he's Billy Idol, and for those of us who were watching MTV at the time, he's a top 40 artist, and he was kind of a cheese ball, and I get all that, and I've never really bought a Billy Idol record in my life, but he just defined that generation. And Generation X, the band he was in before that, was just, I mean, come on, ready, steady, go. Just, just great, great, great punk band. And I truly believe that if he weren't, if he didn't end up being as big as he was... The Generation X would have been looked upon more fondly and as an equal of The Clash,

• 11:18Jake Brennan?

  as an equal of any of those great UK bands from that generation of mid to late 70s punk rock. Anyhow, I want your list of seven nominees for the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame, 617-906-6638. You can call me, leave me a voicemail, you can send me a text, and perhaps we can talk about it next week. Okay, coming up next in your feed is our episode on Charles Manson, the musician. This is our rewind episode, our archive episode. Charles Manson, the musician. Yes, he's the same dude as the cult leader, Charles Manson. A lot of people don't know this, but Charlie was a real, sort of real, I guess, musician before he orchestrated the murders at Seattle Drive and the La Bianca residence. Charlie's music was in part what contributed to his murderous rage,

• 12:02Jake Brennan?

  or at least that's what we're told to believe in helter-skelter. And Charlie's music lived on long after he was sent to prison, and it inspired a whole group of punk rock and hardcore kids and alternative musicians who came up in the 80s and in the 90s. Trent Reznor, Henry Rollins, and a bunch of others. We get into all this in the archive episode on Charles Manson coming Friday. But the main thing we do in this episode is we set the stage to totally disrupt the helter-skelter theory that we've all been led to believe over the last 50 years or so, okay? If you watched the recent Chaos documentary on Netflix, or you read the Chaos book by Tom O'Neill about the Manson murders, you'll know what

• 12:43Jake Brennan?

  I'm talking about. So our Manson episode this Friday is going to feed directly into our Mama Cass Elliot episodes, parts one and two, coming up on Monday and Tuesday. And not only do these Mama Cass Elliot episodes coming next week challenge and disrupt the accepted narrative on helter-skelter, they lay out what I think really happened. And the truth is way stranger and much more violent than the story about Charles Manson that we've all accepted. The truth involves international drug trafficking, gang rape, like the worst possible thing that could happen to a dude short of watching his child die, and a plot so thick you're gonna need a shovel to dig yourself out of. Afterward, okay. Which brings us to next week's question of the week.

• 13:28Jake Brennan?

  When you're listening to the two-part Mama Cass episodes, it's a simple question. Do you believe that the accepted narrative on Helter Skelter is real? And, and again, you know, I'll point out that I rep this, this narrative that I no longer believe in in my Beach Boys episodes, because I had not yet read Chaos when I made the Beach Boys episodes. This is sort of my me riding the ship attempt with the Mama Cass episodes. When you're listening to them, my question is, did Manson kill for the reasons that they said he did? Or was there another reason as I lay out? That's going to be next week's question of the week. Do you believe the Helter Skelter narrative? To further stoke your Helter Skelter flame, our Hollywoodland episodes next week on Monday,

• 14:11Jake Brennan?

  tied directly with our Disgrace Land episodes. Like I said at the beginning of next week in the Disgrace Land feed, you're getting our Mama Cass Elliot episodes about the Manson murders. But did you know that Mama Cass Elliot was best friends with Sharon Tate? Sharon Tate, who was murdered by the Manson family? Did you know that her best friend was Mama Cass Elliot from The Mamas and the Papasins? And that there is evidence that Charles Manson, through Mama Cass, actually met Sharon Tate before killing her? It's super creepy. Not only do we get into that in the Cass episodes, but we also get into it in the Sharon Tate episodes that we are releasing next week in Hollywoodland. Okay, the Tate Hollywoodland episodes speak directly to the Mama Cass Disgrace Land episodes. We wrote them in a Rashomon way.

• 14:55Jake Brennan?

  Each story is set in the same place, but told from different points of view. The Disgrace Land episodes are set in Helter Skelter and told from the point of view of Mama Cass. And the Hollywoodland episodes are set in the same exact place, but told from the point of view of her friend Sharon Tate. Okay, so holy 1969 Batman. Here is the upcoming schedule. Tomorrow in your Disgrace Land feed, a rewind episode on Charles Manson, the music man. Monday and Tuesday, the story continues in Disgrace Land with parts one and two of the Mama Cass Elliot story and her relationship to the Manson murders. And also on Monday, over in the Hollywoodland feed, our two-part story on Sharon Tate. I'd listen to Manson, Cass 1, Cass 2, Sharon Tate 1,

• 15:38Jake Brennan?

  and Sharon Tate 2 in that order, and then call me and let me know if you still believe the helter-skelter narrative as told by Vincent Bullosi in the biggest selling true crime book of all time, Helter Skelter. All right, I'm gonna take a break. I'll be hanging on the telephone on the other side with your voicemails, texts, and DMs.

• 16:06Speaker 01

  Cash Flow Crunch? OnDeck's small business line of credit gives your business immediate access to funds, up to $200,000, right when you need it. Cover seasonal dips, manage payroll, restock inventory, or tackle unexpected expenses without missing a beat. With flexible draws, transparent pricing, and control over repayment, get funded quickly and confidently. Apply today at ondeck.com. Funds could be available as soon as tomorrow. Depending on certain loan attributes, your business loan may be issued by OnDeck or Celtic Bank. OnDeck does not lend in North Dakota. All loans and amounts subject to lender approval.

• 16:36Speaker 05

  Hi, I'm Jenna Oshkowitz. You might know me from Glee. This is At the Table, the food allergy podcast, a show about food, connection, and what it really looks like to live with food allergies. Each episode, we hear stories from real people like Daniel.

• 16:51Speaker 06

  People would always think I was lactose intolerant, so I just kind of shortened my explanation to I'm deathly allergic, in a big way that defined a lot of my childhood.

• 17:02Speaker 05

  And while there are challenges, there are moments that remind you, you're not alone.

• 17:07Speaker 07

  One of the best guys that I dated, he made a point to memorize all my food allergies.

• 17:13Speaker 05

  So join us and hear their stories and more, because living with food allergies isn't just about what you can't eat. It's about still having your seat at the table. Brought to you by Genentech and Novartis. Listen to At the Table, the food allergy podcast, on America's number one podcast network, iHeart. Follow At the Table and start listening on the free iHeart Radio app today.

• 17:41Jake Brennan?

  All right, guys, I'm back. Apple Podcast listeners, real quick, if you're listening on Apple Podcasts, make sure you have auto downloads turned on for DisgraceLand and Hollywoodland. That way you do not miss any episodes. 617-906-6638. You know where I'm at. I'm in the phone booth. It's the one across the hall. I'm hanging on the telephone. You want to send me a voicemail or a text, 617-906-6638 to hang on the telephone with yours truly. Let's check out this voicemail from-

• 18:09Speaker 07

  Hey, this is Ben from the 803. Jake, Jake, Jake. God damn it, you got me again, much like I did listening to John Denver. I sat there slack-jawed thinking, my God, all my crazy conspiracy theories on JFK were totally off-base because I never heard Dylan involved in any of this stuff. And what can I say, other than you got me again. Great episode, thanks. Keep up the good work as always. Rock-a-roller.

• 18:41Jake Brennan?

  Ben, all right, man. I'm happy you got into that episode. I'm happy you get a, you get, you know, a sense of humor about the whole thing. Appreciate you. I'm especially happy to know that you fell for John Denver and then you fell for Bob Dylan as well. All right, let's check out the 412.

• 18:57Speaker 07

  Jake, it's the Big Gaber from the 412, Pittsburgh, PA. I just want to tell you, you fucking got me, man. So good with this Dylan episode. My mind was freaking blown. And I thought I was gonna pass out with rage or whatever, when you revealed that it was an April Fool's joke.

• 19:18Jake Brennan?

  412, out in Pittsburgh. Rage, man. I'm not trying to, I'm not trying to drive anyone to rage. Just trying to entertain some folks. Sounds like you took it well. I appreciate that. Thanks for reaching, reaching out. Are you a Pirates fan? Let me know. I've got a late-breaking opinion about the Pirates.

• 19:37Jake Brennan?

  I think the Pittsburgh Pirates might have the best uniform in baseball. I think they have the best hat, the one with the piping, you know, circular, goes around the whole thing. What do they call that? What's that hat called? Hit me back 412. All right, this one comes from the 415415 writes in, "Hey, totally got me. Bob was very influential in my life." He's talking about Bob Dylan. "Saw him in 1965 at a Berkeley Community Center." Wow. Goes on to say, "I love that you actually worked with Carl." He's talking about Carl Bernstein. "You got me with the John Denver one too, but that did seem way out of line. This was more feasible. Curious about Tom Paine Award. And if Dylan really was so flippant about the war, he certainly was affected by his death by the murder most foul song recently."

• 20:20Jake Brennan?

  Well, yes, the Tom Paine depiction in the episode, the Tom Paine Awards depiction, that is all, everything I put in Dylan's mouth in that episode is verbatim. I quoted him directly. And all true, and it was a big, big, big controversy at the time. No one really talks about it anymore. It's not part of his myth. It's not part of his lore. And that goes to show just how history records some things and how history does not record others. The bit about him being flippant about the war also completely true. That's from Sing Out Magazine. That quote is a direct quote from Dylan. "I don't believe Dylan was for the war. However, I think he was fucking with that journalist. I think what Dylan was for was not being pigeonholed

• 21:02Jake Brennan?

  into any sort of image of the 60s generation of the anti-war movement, anything like that." So 415, appreciate you. Thanks for the text. 907 writes in, "Jake, I must tip my hat to you, the maestro of the April Fools gag. No later than five hours after I had bragged to my students," I'm a high school chemistry teacher, "that no one had fooled me on April 1st. I then finished listening to Bob Dylan Part 2. I bought every bit of your episode, right up until you spelled it out. Well played, sir. Well played. Keep on doing what you do." Lisa from the 907. Lisa, thank you so much. Do a couple more here. 201 writes in, "Hey, seriously addicted. Just pissed that I'll be caught up in the better part of a year of commuting." Thank you. You got it. 201.

• 21:47Jake Brennan?

  617-906-6638. You guys want to send me a voicemail? Send me a text. I was talking about the Pittsburgh Pirates earlier. Baseball is on my mind. All right.

• 21:58Jake Brennan?

  I've been watching a ton of baseball and I got no one to really talk about it with, you know, I talked to my stepdad about it, talked to my kids about it because they're fucking obsessed, which is great. And I've got the MLB app on the screens here most 24/7, most days, basically because of them, they have it on actually. But there's this new, if you guys, you know, I know there's a lot of Red Sox fans that listen to me and for Yankees fans out there, just bear with me for about 10 seconds here. There's a new Netflix series called The Clubhouse, A Year with the Red Sox. And I gotta say, I am loving it. I'm learning a ton about this new generation of Red Sox players and I'm even, I'm even liking Tristan Cassis a lot more than I thought I liked him. Just fantastic. All right. Check

• 22:40Jake Brennan?

  it out, Red Sox fans, you'll dig it. That's my 30 secondish sports bit. I can't, I can't help it. I talk music and movies all week with you guys, but I consume a ton of sports and it's hard not to talk about them, especially when it's something like this, it's got its hooks in me and I'm thinking about it all day long. Anyways, I'm thinking about, uh, thinking about movies too, and I'll be back in a flash with your emails, reviews, and the Hollywood land in a minute.

• 23:10Speaker 01

  OnDeck is built to back small businesses like yours. Whether you're buying equipment, expanding your team, or bridging cash flow gaps, OnDeck's loans up to $400,000 make it happen fast. Rated A+ by the Better Business Bureau and earning thousands of five-star TrustPilot reviews, OnDeck delivers funding you can count on. Apply in minutes at ondeck.com. Depending on certain loan attributes, your business loan may be issued by OnDeck or Celtic Bank. OnDeck does not lend in North Dakota. All loans and amounts subject to lender approval.

• 23:38Speaker 05

  Hi, I'm Jenna Oshkowitz. You might know me from Glee. This is At the Table, the food allergy podcast, a show about food, connection, and what it really looks like to live with food allergies. Each episode, we hear stories from real people like Daniel.

• 23:53Speaker 06

  People would always think I was lactose intolerant, so I just kind of shortened my explanation to I'm deathly allergic, in a big way that defined a lot of my childhood.

• 24:04Speaker 05

  And while there are challenges, there are moments that remind you, you're not alone. One of the best guys that I dated, he made a Point to memorize all my food allergies. So join us and hear their stories and more because living with food allergies isn't just about what you can't eat. It's about still having your seat at the table. Brought to you by Genentech and Novartis. Listen to At The Table, the food allergy podcast on America's number one podcast network, iHeart. Follow At The Table and start listening on the free iHeart radio app today.

• 24:42Jake Brennan?

  All right, we are back and you know what time it is. It's time for the Hollywood Land Minute, brought to you by the Hollywood Land Podcast. Don't know what the Hollywood Land Podcast is? Well, the Hollywood Land Podcast is hosted by yours truly, where every week I tell you a story from the annex of Hollywood and true crime. And right now, there are over 40 episodes waiting for you to binge. Episodes on James Dean, Charlie Sheen, Danny Trejo, Meryl Monroe, Sean Penn, Steve McQueen, Drew Barrymore, Jane Fonda, and most recently, master filmmaker David Lynch. Let's check out this clip.

• 25:10Jake Brennan?

  Angelo Badalamenti sat at an old Fender Rhodes piano. David Lynch sat next to him. A cassette recorder sat quietly on top of the keyboard. It was 1988 and Lynch was assembling the project that would become television's Twin Peaks. It was a huge risk for the director. The art house auteur behind such underground classics as Blue Velvet and Eraserhead. This was long before The Sopranos and long before what's called prestige television. Back then, talent like David Lynch did not work in television. Television was considered by some to be trash, but David Lynch was a visionary and he was

• 25:54Jake Brennan?

  currently trying to envision television as art. His starting point was the story his co-creator Mark Frost had told him about. Local history from the town in upstate New York where Frost grew up. It happened 80 years earlier. A beautiful blonde girl was found murdered floating in a pond in the woods. Lynch was using that story as inspiration as Angelo Badalamenti worked on an evocative composition by his side. "Okay, David," Angelo said, "what do you see now?"

• 26:25Jake Brennan?

  David Lynch closed his eyes. He was there, in the woods, in the dark. A soft wind blew through the pines. On the keyboard, Angelo slowly alternated between an A-flat and C minor. The bass was slow, like the lapping of the pond water against the shore. The breath-like movement of a body floating on the surface. "That's good," David Lynch said. "Now, from behind a tree, there's a very lonely girl." And the music rose. It came out of the dark and drifted to the shore. And then it built to something bright, but sad. A ghost glowing in the dark woods.

• 27:08Jake Brennan?

  It was so beautiful, the vision, the music, that it broke David Lynch's heart. And David Lynch jumped up and hugged his composer. "That's it," he said. "That's Twin Peaks."

• 27:22Jake Brennan?

  All right, guys, make sure you are subscribed to the Hollywoodland Podcast on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Castbox, iHeart, Odyssey, wherever you get your podcasts. Get into that Hollywoodland feed and hit follow, hit subscribe, whatever they term it as. Make sure you're getting every episode as we release them every single Monday. Next week, as I said earlier, we have a two-part episode coming your way on Sharon Tate. And again, you're not going to want to miss these episodes because they speak directly to the Mamacas episodes that are being released in the Disgrace Land feed. And I don't mean like we're just talking about the same thing. I mean, we produced these in tandem. They're like a puzzle piece that when you put them together, all the pieces fit, okay? You familiar with the Rashomon Effect?

• 28:06Jake Brennan?

  The Rashomon Effect describes how parties describe an event in a different and contradictory manner, which reflects their subjective interpretation and self-interested advocacy rather than an objective truth. Remember it. That's what happens in these episodes, except without that fancy AI definition that I just read you. Okay. But basically, the Rashomon effect in the Sharon Tate episodes coming on Monday in Hollywood land. Make sure you're subscribed to Hollywood land and then call me 617 906 6638 and let me know what you thought of Hollywood land, or you can send me an email and let me know what you think. [email protected]. Susan Pranato? Pranato? Is that how you say it? I think so. Pranato? Pranito? That's probably it, right? Saying, hey, our

• 28:50Jake Brennan?

  generation. Who spoke for our generation? This, of course, is in response to last week's question of the week. We're talking about Dylan. We're talking about the voice of the generation. Susan here thinks that in the 1980s, it was John Cougar Mellencamp. I know, she says, it was oversaturated, but this was the voice of folks in a small town in the late 1980s. And I can't argue with you, Susan. I'm from a small town, but not from one in the Midwest and on the East Coast. And the Coog was ubiquitous. For me personally, I would not call John Cougar Mellencamp the voice of my generation, but I like to represent as much of this great country as I can in these responses. And I appreciate Susan's point of view here, the Midwest point of view. Thank you, Susan. [email protected].

• 29:34Jake Brennan?

  If you guys want to send me an email, 617 906 6638. You want to send me a voicemail, leave me a text, @disgracelandpod on the socials. I'm just now realizing I forgot to do DMs. That's okay. We're going to keep motoring through here, trying to keep these episodes tight. Matt Bowden is still pissed off at me for making him mix an hour plus Bob Dylan episode. I think you guys appreciate the tightness as well. That's the real reason. We want, we want a tight product. Speaking of product, you can review our product, Disgraceland, on Apple Podcasts or Spotify. And if you choose to leave a review, we will forever be in your debt. Well, that is until we choose one of you, read the review here in the podcast. And then if you get in touch with us, we'll send you some merch as a nice little reward. The reviews, as you know, they power the podcast, they power discovery, they help

• 30:19Jake Brennan?

  people discover on Apple, Spotify, wherever. So go ahead, leave a review, just like Ocean1185, five stars. Ocean1185 writes, and I spent Spent an entire summer about 15 years ago, reading memoirs and biographies about dead rock stars, even ones whose music I didn't even listen to. I just like hearing stories about creatives and the good, the bad, and the ugly aspects of their lives. And this show captures my interest with some great storytelling about all the creatives of our generation and the generations before us. Also, I also love the way Jake says Mellotron. You got it, Ocean1185. Thanks for leaving a review over on Apple Podcasts. Get in touch, we'll get you some merch. Rob over on Spotify. Rob, Rob, I love you, Rob. I love you for this one, man. Rob says, "Nice one." This is in response to the Bob Dylan

• 31:04Jake Brennan?

  Part Two episode. "Nice one. James Earl Roy would be proud." Well, Rob, you just made my day. Thank you very much. Rob, get in touch, we'll get you some merch as well. Guys, leave a review, Spotify, Apple Podcasts. We appreciate it. This episode, it's coming to an end. And as you know, the after-party continues for our All Access members. And All Access is going to get you an extended portion of this here after-party. It's going to get you ad-free listening of all of our episodes. And it's going to get you one extra full episode per month. Okay? This one is very true crime-y, the one coming this month. It's on the Allman Brothers. I learned so much with this episode, and I think you will too. I hope you sign up. Go to disgracempod.com/membership. Five bucks a month. That's it.

• 31:48Jake Brennan?

  $5 a month. And we're giving you a lot of bang for the buck. I like to think anyways. All right. Appreciate you guys. disgracempod.com/membership to become an All Access member.

• 32:10Speaker 01

  OnDeck is built to back small businesses like yours. Whether you're buying equipment, expanding your team, or bridging cash flow gaps, OnDeck's loans up to $400,000 make it happen fast. Rated A+ by the Better Business Bureau and earning thousands of five-star TrustPilot reviews, OnDeck delivers funding you can count on. Apply in minutes at ondeck.com. Depending on certain loan attributes, your business loan may be issued by OnDeck or Celtic Bank. OnDeck does not lend in North Dakota. All loans and amounts subject to lender approval.

• 32:38Speaker 05

  Hi, I'm Jenna Oshkowitz. You might know me from Glee. This is At the Table, the food allergy podcast, a show about food, connection, and what it really looks like to live with food allergies. Each episode, we hear stories from real people like Daniel.

• 32:52Speaker 06

  People would always think I was lactose intolerant, so I just kind of shortened my explanation to I'm deathly allergic in a big way that defined a lot of my childhood.

• 33:03Speaker 05

  And while there are challenges, there are moments that remind you you are not alone.

• 33:08Speaker 00

  One of the best guys that I dated, he made a point to memorize all my food allergies.

• 33:14Speaker 05

  So join us and hear their stories and more, because living with food allergies isn't just about what you can't eat. It's about still having your seat at the table. Brought to you by Genentech and Novartis. Listen to At the Table, the food allergy podcast, on America's number one podcast network, iHeart. Follow At the Table and start listening on the free iHeart Radio app today.

• 33:42Jake Brennan?

  All right, we are back. Thanks for hanging out with us in the after-party. Appreciate you guys. Let's recap, shall we? We've got this massive archive, got a vault of episodes, you guys know this. And each week, I highlight a couple that we mention usually, typically, in just talking here in the after-party. I highlight them here. Matt grabs the show info and links, and he throws those in the show notes, so you guys can find these archive episodes very easily if you are interested. We talked today, we mentioned Oasis, we have a two-parter on Oasis that I just love. I love that band so much. And if you love them, or even if you don't, if you're sort of Oasis curious, check out these episodes that we did a couple of years back.

• 34:25Jake Brennan?

  I mentioned Joy Division and New Order. We have an episode on New Order. Check that out, all right? Cyndi Lauper, don't have an episode on Cyndi Lauper, but she comes up heavily in the Cramps episode. Keith Moon and Keith Richards, there are, of course, multiple Rolling Stones episodes. There's a Who episode, and what else?

• 34:44Jake Brennan?

  Oh, Mariah Carey, mentioned her, got a Mariah Carey episode. Soundgarden, got a Chris Cornell episode coming up, coming up. Anyways, Matt will have those links for you, that show info in the show notes if you want to dive into our archive, okay? Let's recap, shall we? Number one, my other podcast Hollywood Land is alive and kicking over in the Hollywood Land feed, so make sure you're subscribed and following Hollywood Land on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts and get ready for our Hollywood Land Sharon Tate episodes coming your way on Monday, right now in your disgraceland feed. Our episode on Billy Idol coming tomorrow. Number three, coming tomorrow, our rewind episode on Charles Manson. Number four, merch winners, get in touch, you know who you are. Number five, remember, no one cares about preserving the true spirit of rock and roll more than you do, and well, that's a disgrace.

• 35:27Jake Brennan?

  All right, in honor of this week's subject, Billy Idol, this is me reading you, the billboard charts from the day Billy Idol bailed on his motorcycle and barely escaped death, February 6th, 1990. Number one, how am I supposed to live without you, Michael Bolton? Last week, one, weeks on chart, 15. Number two, opposites attract, Paula Abdul, duet with the Wild Pair. Last week, eight, peak position, two, weeks on chart, eight. Number three, downtown train, Rod Stewart. Last week, three, peak position, three, weeks on chart, 11. Number four, two to make it right, seduction.

• 36:11Jake Brennan?

  Last week, five, peak position, four, weeks on chart, 13. Number five, Janie's got a gun, Aerosmith. Last week, 11, peak position, five, weeks on chart, 11. Number six, I remember.

• 36:34Speaker 06

  Quit talking and start mixing. Cut it.

• 36:39Speaker 02

  She's been thinking about this sleepover all week, but I think about her food allergies all the time. Fortunately, her doctor prescribed Zolair, omalizumab. It's proven to significantly reduce allergic reactions if a food allergy accident happens.

• 36:52Speaker 03

  Zolair 150mg is a prescription medication used to treat food allergy in people one year of age and older to reduce allergic reactions due to accidental exposure to one or more foods. While taking Zolair, you should continue to avoid all foods to which you are allergic. Don't use if you are allergic to Zolair. Zolair may cause a severe, life-threatening allergic reaction called anaphylaxis. Tell your doctor if you ever had anaphylaxis. Get help right away if you have trouble breathing or if you have swelling of your throat or tongue. Zolair should not be used for the emergency treatment of allergic reactions, including anaphylaxis. Zolair is for maintenance use to reduce allergic reactions, including anaphylaxis, while avoiding food allergens. Serious side effects such as cancer, fever, muscle aches and rash, parasitic infection, or heart and circulation problems have been reported. Please see zolair.com for full prescribing information. Ask an allergist about Zolair. This is an advertisement for Zolair

• 37:37Speaker 03

  paid for by Genentech and Novartis.

• 37:39Speaker 02

  Cash flow crunch? OnDeck's small business line of credit gives your business immediate access to funds up to $200,000 right when you need it. Cover seasonal dips, manage payroll, restock inventory, or tackle unexpected expenses without missing a beat with flexible draws, transparent pricing, and control over repayment. Get funded quickly and confidently. Apply today at ondeck.com. Funds could be available as soon as tomorrow. Depending on certain loan attributes, your business loan may be issued by OnDeck or Celtic Bank. OnDeck does not lend in North Dakota. All loans and amounts subject to lender approval.

• 38:10Jake Brennan?

  Hey guys, time to dust off your detective skills while unwinding in the Caribbean on Virgin Voyages' second true crime voyage. Back by popular demand, this five-night, adults-only escape sets sail March 20, 2027, to Grand Turk in the Beach Club at Bimini. The difference between this year and last will be that I will be on the cruise this year, along with Zeph, and he and I will be taping a live version of Disgrace Land along with podcast hosts from Exactly Right's Buried Bones, Podcast of the Year Award winners Wyscrack, and other fan favorites. Get on this cruise with us, guys, and enjoy live podcast recordings, behind-the-scenes storytelling, exclusive meet-and-greets, and immersive true crime programming throughout this one-of-a-kind voyage.

• 38:54Jake Brennan?

  Head over to www.virginvoyages.com/truecrime to secure your spot.