Alien Mummies Or Ancient Humans Butchered And Sold By Grave-Robbing Conmen?

Anyone with an interest in any and all evidence related to alien species, non-human intelligence, or UFO/UAP is likely familiar with claims of mummified alien remains. Proponents say the remains have been buried in South America for hundreds of years and have been conclusively examined and studied by scientists and medical experts - and are legit. But many of the claims made are muddled at best, and persons involved in bringing the mummies forward have been caught fabricating evidence. For the last few years, WEAPONIZED co-hosts Jeremy Corbell and George Knapp have followed the controversy, as reported in various news reports, but decided to leave the topic to those who have the expertise needed to formally investigate the claims and the mummies themselves. If the three-fingered mummies turned out to be non-human or even extraterrestrial in origin, it would be a massively important finding that would boost the credibility of those who argue that non-human intelligence has been present on Earth for hundreds of years - maybe thousands. So, bottom line: Are these mummies the real deal, or have the proponents engaged in ghoulish grave robbing and the surgical manipulation of long-dead, but very human, corpses? An explorer and YouTube creator turned UFO investigator traveled to Brazil to take a deep dive into the claims and was, for a time, a believer, not a debunker. His YouTube site, “Incredible History,” included a previous video entitled “Show Me the Mummies,” and his explosive new video, released just days ago, appears to blow the lid off of the mummy claims and the people who have promoted what some believe is a money-making scam - one linked to South American drug cartels. Two esteemed academics have joined the conversation, and both make strong arguments that the two best-known mummies show clear evidence of tampering. In this episode of WEAPONIZED, we speak with Will Brown who created the “Incredible History” YouTube channel, along with Dr. Dan Proctor, a biological anthropologist, and Michele Adams, a highly experienced radiologist who says she is an experiencer herself. Both of these professionals are openly interested in ETs and non-human intelligence, but their precise criticisms of the mummy evidence made public so far have subjected the two PhDs to personal attacks and allegations that they are designated debunkers working on behalf of the deep state to muddy the waters. Is there an assembly line somewhere in Peru where long-dead humans are being carved up and then re-arranged to look like three-fingered aliens? And is there a flourishing black market where private collectors pay huge sums in order to obtain their very own “alien” mummy? This WEAPONIZED episode includes a spirited discussion about where the mummy debate stands now and what it would take to confirm that the two most prominent mummy specimens are the real deal. FOLLOW WILL'S EXCELLENT WORK AT https://www.youtube.com/@incredhistory GOT A TIP? Reach out to us at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠[email protected]⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ••• Check out Will Brown’s awesome YouTube channel INCREDIBLE HISTORY here https://www.youtube.com/@incredhistory ••• Watch Corbell's six-part UFO docuseries titled UFO REVOLUTION on TUBI here : ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://tubitv.com/series/300002259/tmz-presents-ufo-revolution/season-2⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Watch Knapp’s six-part UFO docuseries titled INVESTIGATION ALIEN on NETFLIX here : ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://netflix.com/title/81674441⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ••• You can now watch all of Corbell's movies for free on YouTube here : BOB LAZAR : AREA 51 & FLYING SAUCERS https://youtu.be/sZaE5rIavVA HUNT FOR THE SKINWALKER https://youtu.be/TczkJ6UAQ8A PATIENT SEVENTEEN https://youtu.be/gDVX0kRqXxE ••• For breaking news, follow Corbell & Knapp on all social media. Extras and bonuses from the episode can be found at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠WeaponizedPodcast.com Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

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• 0:31Speaker 01

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• 0:59Speaker 02

  So a Mexican journalist displayed bodies of two supposed non-human beings in Mexico, in front of the Congress in Mexico.

• 1:07George Knapp?

  The mummies, I thought, well, you know, maybe one of these days we have to dive in. And I suppose that day has now arrived. All of a sudden, we started hearing about mummies in Mexico and mummies in Peru, and I was having a hard time keeping up with it.

• 1:20Speaker 04

  My research area focuses on the feet and hands, so, and that's where a lot of the central claims are, is in the feet and hands. So as soon as I look, I can tell immediately it's not real. These are butchered beings, and I will go further and say that I believe they were butchered in modern times.

• 1:37Speaker 05

  Once I understood that I was looking at a human being, and once I understood that somebody was desecrating these remains to achieve a narrative, I, that's why I decided to do this, is because this is really gross, and it's...

• 1:56George Knapp?

  Ghoulish.

• 1:57Speaker 05

  It's, yeah, it's an evil behavior, and it's something that we shouldn't prop up.

• 2:03Jeremy Corbell?

  This is weaponized.

• 2:13George Knapp?

  This is Weaponized. I'm George Knapp here in Las Vegas, joined by my friend and colleague Jeremy Corbell. Jeremy, how you doing?

• 2:19Jeremy Corbell?

  I'm good, man. Good to see you.

• 2:21George Knapp?

  So I was gonna be goofing off this week. My slave master Jeremy, who cracking the whip, had told me that we're gonna take a couple of days off, but that didn't last. That lasted about 24 hours, and here we are. Gonna dive into a topic that we've considered for a long time, but sort of had a variety of reasons to avoid. You know, Jeremy, I don't know about you, but I have a bucket list, mental list of places I'd like to visit before I kick that useful utensil. And Peru is right up there. Top five, maybe top three places I'd like to go. But I'm so burnt out on travel, I've managed to avoid actually getting there. And then when the story about these mummies, these alien mummies popped up, I thought,

• 3:04George Knapp?

  hmm, maybe I finally have a good reason to go ahead and plop down some dough, buy a ticket and trek on down there. But the reality is, this topic is sort of way out of our comfort zone. And I always figured, somebody else could figure this out. I have no knowledge of this. I couldn't even pretend to understand some of the terms, medical terms, being kicked around, so figured we'd leave it to somebody else. We have a mutual friend, I'm not even gonna name him now, but he's deeply involved in the subject and has told us he thinks it was real, and he's chronicled all the evidence back and forth about the legitimacy of the mummies. And well, you know, maybe one of these days we have to dive in, and I suppose that day has now arrived.

• 3:45Jeremy Corbell?

  Yeah, this is a topic that I didn't want to wade into. You know, we didn't over all these years. I figured that there are people that were more enthusiastic and better suited to jump into this. And I also, I had a bias about this with the alleged alien mummies. In 2016, I was approached by a company who wanted me to throw down and be the face of this stuff and help bring it to the world, and it just seemed too bizarre. And honestly, it felt like a hoax, and I was like, no way. So just for our audience, the story that I'm aware of, and I could be completely wrong, because we, you know, this is not something we've covered, but... It is my understanding that there are like many confirmed fabrications of these like

• 4:29Jeremy Corbell?

  alien dolls that are a mixture of human and animal bones. But the big ones, the ones they call like Maria and Montserrat, that those do not show signs of being faked or manipulated. So the idea is, okay, there might be a bunch of noise and a bunch of like crazy things, but we really need to look at these like bigger mummies. Look, they, these were shown in, in Congress in Mexico. These were all over the news and the whole time it just something didn't sit right with me, but this is not my expertise. But then my friend Jesse Michaels from American Alchemy, he did this excellent deep dive into the case.

• 5:08Jeremy Corbell?

  And it really, it puzzled me when, when he laid it all out and it inspired me to wanna hear more about, you know, this issue. It was an amazing documentary that Jesse Michaels made. So his investigation made me kind of less dismissive, which was a heavy lift at the time. And what he did kinda is elevate the conversation, asking for more professional analysis. And that's kind of the last I heard about it was that we might find out that these mummies are eligible for a proper ancient DNA analysis. And that is really exciting. No stone unturned, dive deep into it and uncover what's going on. Let's get to brass tacks here.

• 5:50Jeremy Corbell?

  But yesterday, I saw a message in my inbox and then I watched this YouTube video and I was totally captured by the rational and specific analysis that this guy who I'd never met, but I had one message from him a long time ago. Will from a YouTube channel called Incredible History. So how I understand it is this guy Will is a good faith actor. He wanted to know if these mummies represented a new or a non-human species. I, I saw a video of him. He was in Peru at that, that infamous press conference, George, you know, where the government officials stormed in and tried to confiscate the mummies. So Will was entrenched. I recognize his face as being entrenched in this mummy thing for quite some time.

• 6:36Jeremy Corbell?

  And with him, he brought on a guy named Dr. Dan Proctor, who I'd never heard of, but I understand he's a PhD in biological anthropology. And he, his specialty is, is the functional evolution specifically of hands and feet. And they're looking at, at the details of this. They also brought a woman named Shelley, who I understand is an expert radiographer. And I, she might have decades of experience, but it was just somebody that, none of these people seemed like they were out to debunk anything. They just ran across some inconvenient facts about the, the two, specifically, I think, two beings or bodies that everybody's like, well, we need to look into these. And they did. So, kind of to conclude this is, um,

• 7:20Jeremy Corbell?

  what I took away from that YouTube video is that Will and his team, that their conclusion is that these quote unquote alien mummies are a complete and total hoax. That we've, we've all had our curiosity kind of hijacked. We've been intentionally deceived by the mummy creators, that these mummies are like a modern day Frankenstein scam. And, and I don't know, but I am interested to hear, and I hope collectively in this show today, that we're going to learn something new. So, uh, with no further ado, George and I are eager to, to hear the experiences and analysis of Will and, and the people that he's brought together about these alleged alien, uh, mummy beings.

• 8:02Jeremy Corbell?

  And, um, we want to find out, is there, you know, substance to this? Or is this just like a hoax that's been perpetrated on like eager optimists willing to, you know, search for the truth? So, welcome to Weaponized, um, Will, Dr. Dan, and Shelley.

• 8:19Speaker 07

  Thank you. Thank you. Thank you, Jeremy. Thank you, George. Good to be here. Good to be here.

• 8:22George Knapp?

  Will, you started off, you went down there. Were you thinking you were planning on debunking the whole thing? Or you're just interested? You would, you would be covering it for your incredible history channel. Regardless of how the dominoes fall, right?

• 8:37Speaker 07

  Correct. Uh, no, sir, I was not going down there to debunk them. Um, so I've had a, I'm a former history teacher. I just, uh, stopped teaching last year, actually, uh, to do this YouTube thing full time. Uh, but I was teaching online for the last three years of my career, history and economics, and I put a VPN on and go travel around and, uh, I'm a person that likes strange oddities. George, I read your book or listened to your book, um, on audiobook, Hunt for the Skinwalker, as I was driving through Utah. Um, I've interviewed Ronnie Johnson from Delphus, Kansas, from the 1971, uh, Delphus, Kansas incident, correct his circle. Um, and so, uh, you know,

• 9:18Speaker 07

  I've, I had a history of just being curious about stuff like this and open-minded. And so I wanted to go down, I was in Colombia and Peru was next. And actually, two years ago, maybe not to the day, but getting close, I landed in Peru and like, as I was landing, I can't remember the exact timeline, but basically when I got there is when those airport dolls came out. And keep in mind, let me just rewind a little bit. September 2023 was when the Mexican Congress, uh, presentation happened. And I was open-minded. Um, I'm a believer in this stuff. Uh, well, you know, that something is, uh, that we're not aware of something much larger going on here. I don't know how much of it I

• 10:03Speaker 07

  believe, but I know I listened to your podcast quite a bit. And so I immediately saw that the media was calling these, uh, dismissing everything as animal bones, which was true about the dolls in the airport. But I've known about Maria. It, you know, there'd be little blips on the internet since 2016. Maria is the, uh, the one with providence, the one that has like a nine-year head start on all these other ones we're seeing now, right? Which I believe is an important point that I'll make later. And um, and so I knew right away, I go, well, that's not animal bones. I, I know like if that's a fake, it's a, it's a human being, right?

• 10:42Speaker 07

  Um, so I was curious, um, you know, no one was kind of looking into that specifically. It just waved the magic wand. This is not real. And so I got, uh, hooked up with some proponents down there and, uh, went down to ICA. Um, started talking to people, would interview people that were involved in the early days of like the Incari Institute. Um, and went on like a little petroglyph hunt where I found these three fingered beans. You know, and I'm, I'm documenting all this. All of a sudden I, you know, interviewed Jaime, um, Mauson. And, um, Joe S. Montilla, journalist down there in Peru that was covering these.

• 11:21Speaker 07

  Uh, pretty soon I got to talk to some of the, um, ICA University medical staff that was basically, um, taking, uh, Maria in at the time and some of these other ones that had done some work with these. And they quickly started telling me some interesting things about like how there was osteo-integration in some of the small ones. Um, and, uh, I'll send you some pictures, uh, so you can see that on the screen, some, some of those examples. And so for people that don't know what osteo-integration is, it's a term that's used in dentistry quite a bit. Where you see cellular fusion between, you know, a metallic implant and, uh, the, the tissue.

• 12:03Speaker 07

  And so this is a doctor telling me that, or I guess I should say a dentist telling me that, that also had his medical license and, and some type of practice. Um, and it blew my mind. Um, I was pretty sure the little ones weren't real, but like that blew my mind.

• 12:17George Knapp?

  Can I interrupt or just, can I interrupt a second? Just to, to help our listeners who are not familiar with all the intricacies, the airport mummies. Um, they were, uh, discredited as being, uh, made from animal bones?

• 12:31Speaker 07

  Correct.

• 12:32George Knapp?

  Who brought those forward? Are they related to the same people who found these other ones?

• 12:37Speaker 07

  So the other thing that I was willing to dismiss the airport dolls was the person that admitted to making those was not the original Waquero, or we'll call them like a grave robber that found Maria. That was another reason I was like, okay, well, that's another person. And I'm glad you asked that, George, because we're going to get to that in a moment when I talk about why I got skeptical. But basically, the osteo-integration thing, kind of, if that was true, that would say, well, this bean had to be alive when this was implanted. You know, you can't osteo-integrate when you're dead. So, you know, but that's never been peer-reviewed, by the way. And I just want to make that clear. But, you know, this is blowing my mind. So also,

• 13:22Speaker 07

  they had these 3D scans, and I'm just a former history teacher. My knowledge on anatomy is right there with any other person that's not an expert in that, right? But, you know, they'd say, try to find signs of manipulation. And sure enough, I couldn't find any. And Michelle will tell you a little bit about 3D rendering with some of these scans here in a little bit. So how do I start getting skeptical? Is that what you'd like to kind of?

• 13:49George Knapp?

  Yeah, sort of, you know, all of a sudden, we started hearing about mummies in Mexico, and mummies in Peru, and I was having a hard time keeping up with it. And I'm just wondering if this, they all came, supposedly came from the same place, and how the airport mummies are were exposed as fake.

• 14:06Speaker 07

  Exactly. So I make this low-budget documentary with my iPhone down there with all the interviews I did, all the little adventures I went on. And then I was also at the Nazca Mummies Press Conference that got raided by, you know, they were looking for the bodies. And at that press conference, the other thing that kind of blew my mind was they announced that Montserrat was, had a fetus inside of there. And so that was mind-blowing as well.

• 14:32Speaker 07

  But shortly after I published the documentary called Show Me The Mummies, I thought I was being funny with that. Turns out that's not a great way to get views. There was like no SEO. But I, I, I published that. And shortly after that, I, I found out about the Roswell slides incident. And I don't know, George and Jeremy, if you remember that. But basically, if you don't know what the Roswell slides is, I'd like to, you'd encourage you all to go look that up. And what it was, was a, there was a group down in Mexico. And the same group, including some of the doctors that are involved with promoting these mummies, were involved in kind of pushing this new disclosure of a photo of an alien body.

• 15:16Speaker 07

  That actually ended up being a desiccated remains of the Native American child. And that was proven, uh, there was a whole debacle with it. And I think people just kind of moved on from it a little bit, but kind of a dark day in the UFO world, right?

• 15:31Jeremy Corbell?

  Yeah, I, I remember that. It was like this alleged image of like a Roswell body. And people just used AI sharpening techniques and they found that there was a little placard underneath it. And it was like a known, so yeah, that was a really dark day in the UFO thing when it comes to bodies and beings. And, and like you said, that comes from like the same group of people. And that already puts you on a little bit of guard about this, but you, you seem like a really open individual. You went down there, none of you, which we'll learn in a second, are trying to just debunk all of the UFO thing. You just came across some inconvenient facts. So you've got that in your mind. Continue your story.

• 16:08Speaker 07

  Yes. And so, uh, I find that out maybe shortly, maybe the day I published that. And you can go still see this, the pinned comment in my Show Me The Mummies documentary, which by the way, is just me kind of telling the timeline of events. I don't give an opinion either way. I'm telling you what's weird, telling you some of the stories of skepticism. But I put a pinned comment, hey, you all should know about the, uh, um, the Roswell slides and the characters involved here, including one of the main doctors that they are pushing with this. And people make mistakes, you know, uh, you know, I'm willing to still hear the person out. So, um, proponents also start, here's kind of how I got cast out of my spell or broke the spell.

• 16:51Speaker 07

  I start hearing them really pushing points like carbon dating. Well, the carbon dating shows that these are thousands of years old. How do you explain all that? I'm like, Well, I don't think anyone's question, that might be the one thing that's correct here. I, if these are fake, I think they're ancient people that are being dug up and butchered. Um, and then I would hear stuff from like the proponents or even I, I believe even doctors saying, well, there was no evidence of scarring. I'm pretty sure you gotta be alive to have scarring. Uh, I, that's a healing process. So I'm hearing stuff like this and I'm like, okay, maybe I should start being more skeptical. Also at the time, I kind of took a break from all of it because

• 17:36Speaker 07

  quickly found out the, you know, there's a lot of passion in this topic and it was getting overwhelming. And then fast forward a year, I think and a half, a year, uh, last April, 2025, I went and saw Maria. And I got to see Maria in Peru and had my mind blown. It's a pretty, we've all seen Maria. Talked to the doctors, but I think on that same trip is when I found a video of Dr. Dan Proctor, who is here with us now. I think that video at the time, Dan had probably, uh, 300 views on YouTube.

• 18:13Speaker 04

  Yeah, not a huge audience.

• 18:15Speaker 07

  Yeah. And I, I, he immediately explained in a way that he could see on this, just the scans that they had out there. Manipulation on Maria's hand, in particular, something called the trapezium was still there, which is an articulate, uh, uh, articulate surface that your metacarpal one, bottom of your thumb bone should attach to. And he just simply asked, why should that still be there? And I actually, and actually I'll share my screen here if I wanna, I kinda wanna show you this real quick. Um, let me see if I can find this real quick.

• 18:55Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 18:55Speaker 07

  And so that made sense to my mind. I immediately was wondering what that was about. And he explained it in a way where he kind of asked the question, why would you evolve a trapezium if you didn't have anything there? Oh, by the way, the metacarpal one, the MC1, it's not necessarily missing. It's right in the central digit in the second phalange.

• 19:22Speaker 07

  And so then I go, well, how does he know that? Like, I don't like, don't the flanges all look the same? And it turns out, and Dan will talk more, Dr. Proctor will talk more about this. The first metacarpal has a V taper that the rest of the uh, metacarpals don't have, and that's for, I'll, I'll let Dr. Proctor talk about that. So now my spell is like really starting to break. And I, um, so I start going down the rabbit hole. I'm sure you all are familiar with Steve Marra. And Steve Marra has a YouTube channel and at that time he had just posted a video of maybe a few months before that. Shout out to Steve Marra. Um, I did include some of your shots in the documentary. I hope that's okay.

• 20:04Speaker 07

  I tried to get ahold of you, but I couldn't. And I, I hope this message amplifies your video. But Steve Marra has a 42 minute video where he just gives a spill all on his entire experience down there, which included what he claims is Wakerow whistleblowers saying that two taxidermists were used for the big ones and that they were still making them. And that Maria was listed on the black market for a million dollars. Steve received death threats. There was a lot of rumors of other crimes happening revolving around these mummies. And then he also just shows you some really good visuals on why a lot of this is fake as well and just what he discovered. So I want everybody to go check that out.

• 20:47Speaker 07

  So now, fast forward to August of, um, actually I think it was the summer of 2025. I receive a photo from an anonymous source, or I, I come across a photo of the Wakerow responsible supposedly of finding Maria with this giant head that is fake as the day is long. And they even have a scan and I was told at the time, you know, please like, you know, you can't reveal that they're gonna reveal it. I promise they're gonna reveal it, then you can talk about it. So I did, I I held my promise there. And as soon as it came

• 21:27Speaker 07

  out recently, I made a video in December, December 15th about this problem. There is a scan of it. It's clearly fake. The proponents admit it's fake. I also was aware at this time of the little mummy Mawita, which is a little mummy that I believe was butchered by these people, a little toddler. And they also admit that that one has been manipulated. Everyone admits that. And the whole thing people say is, well, that's all noise. You know, of course, they're gonna manipulate more to make money if there's actually some real ones. And I just disagree with that. To me, it was signal. And I'm

• 22:10Speaker 07

  kind of rambling on a little bit. I want to give time to Proctor and Michelle. But basically, just recently, within the last couple of weeks, I had put that video on, and it kicked the hornets' nest. I put a small video on about the giant heads. One of which, another one of which, is just so fake. There's another one. And I got the person who released that image to admit to me, yep, this was also made by that same Wacaro, the one that was responsible for-

• 22:38George Knapp?

  This is the one that looks like an alien face made out of plaster of Paris or something?

• 22:42Speaker 07

  Correct. You want me to, I can show it to you right now. And, and, so, let's see here. So-

• 22:50Jeremy Corbell?

  Yeah, and let's just back back up one, one second. So basically, you went in there with good intention, trying to understand what's going on. Like, all of you, none of you are, you know, skeptic in the way of just trying to debunk stuff. You all have interest in this subject. You're genuinely, as a good actor, going out there trying to figure it out. I think where the world is kind of gonna understand this is- You know, there has been a lot of controversy. Obviously, there's a lot of fakes, right? But what the argument is, is despite all the fakes, these two kind of bigger mummies, that we should investigate them with DNA and also just looking at how they're made.

• 23:32Jeremy Corbell?

  If, if they're not fabricated, they, even though all the fakes, like the winged demon little, you know, bodies they found.

• 23:40Speaker 07

  Which is listed for $20,000, by the way.

• 23:43Jeremy Corbell?

  Yeah, so it just drove me crazy. You know, it, it's super messy. Even my, my friend Jesse said that. He goes, looking into this was super messy. There's so many fakes. What we're looking at today is, have you guys found that on these ones that they say are authentic? Are there specific signs of manipulation that should make us distrust? The, you know, the argument that these are natural beings. And, and so now you're showing an image, like a crazy image of like, yeah.

• 24:10Speaker 07

  It's, sorry to interrupt you, Jeremy, but yeah, when you said the one with the wings, I just had to tell you the price of that one. And I'll tell you how I know that later, but. Um, so, um, yes. And so I make this video about that giant head and then the, the other one that'll probably be on screen with your editor. And, uh, it kicks the hornet's nest. And all of a sudden, uh, Dr. Proctor, who I've been trying to get on to talk with me on camera since what? April two, or maybe May, uh, 2025, Dr. Proctor? Didn't want to do it. You know, that's great.

• 24:43George Knapp?

  Cause you know what it means. You know what's coming. Yeah.

• 24:46Speaker 07

  Yeah. Well, he'd, he'd already received the backlash just from his video with 300 views. And so, um, all of a sudden I see they ask a radiographer on Twitter, Michelle here, if she would take a look. And Michelle, like you said earlier, is an experiencer and, um, believes in this very, it's very dear to subject to her. And she goes, yeah, enthusiastically was ready to see him. And I think it was like within 30 minutes, you had posted a video like, this is where the amputation happened. This is where, you know, this, the metacarpal is not connected to the articular service here. And basically somehow, I can't even remember now, but somehow we got together, Dr. Proctor, myself, Michelle, and Dr. Joseph Wilson,

• 25:30Speaker 07

  who did a great job of explaining what some of this 30% unknown DNA might mean. Um, which is just, you know, there's, there's a, we can get into that as well. Dr. Proctor might be able to help me with that. Um, but basically contamination. And we made this video. And I feel like I've been talking a lot and I, I think we need to, we need to bring it to the, the two MVPs here. Uh, because what they showed in the video to me was a slam dunk and it, it gave me the courage to finally say, what I think is going on, and that is that these are, uh, butchered beings, and I will go further and say that I believe they were butchered in modern times. Uh, so.

• 26:11George Knapp?

  So Dr. Proctor, jump in. When you looked at whatever data was available and posted online, what jumped out at you? How did you know that this thing was a fake?

• 26:22Speaker 04

  Where to begin? So my, the thing is my, in anthropology, the mummy trade is, is nothing new. You know, we're aware of that. Uh, claims of aliens from Peru are not new that, you know, people have looked at the cranial modification from ancient cultures for a long time and make claims. So I was already, you know, coming into it with virtually zero expectation that this would be real. But my research area focuses on the feet and hands. So, and that's where a lot of the central claims are, is in the feet and hands. So as soon as I look, I can tell immediately it's, it's not real. Um, that it's been fabricated and I'll, and I'll share some of my observations with you here too.

• 27:06Speaker 04

  But it's also important for me to mention that I'm not like you've mentioned, I'm not in the habit of debunking things. I, you know, I follow both of you. I've, I've watched like a lot of other people, the hearings. You know, the, the exceptional testimony from people like David Gruish, who, who I find compelling. You know, and so I believe there are biologics out there most likely, but these are definitely not those biologics. So, um, you know, I guess where we can start is, you know, do you want me to go through some of the specimens I've talked about on Will's channel? And I also have Paloma here too. Sure.

• 27:44Jeremy Corbell?

  Yeah, I, I think just tell us why, like you think that, you know, these objects are fabricated and, and, you know, obviously they're biological beings. That, that's what took people really to the side. No one's arguing, these are probably ancient people that were just like dug up in grave rob. But you're trying to say that they're manipulated and you have evidence and I'd love to see that evidence of, of the manipulation.

• 28:06Speaker 04

  All right. Well, if you'll, can you see this?

• 28:09Jeremy Corbell?

  Yes, sir.

• 28:10Speaker 04

  Okay. Can you see my cursor?

• 28:13Jeremy Corbell?

  Yep, yes.

• 28:13Speaker 04

  Okay. All right. So just bear with me. There's just a couple of things so that you kind of know what I'm talking about. I just have an image here of a foot and a hand and these, these basic three regions of the foot and the hand, the, the phalanges and in the foot, metatarsals and tarsals. In the hand, there are the phalanges, metacarpals and carpals. Now, one of the things I'm just going to give you, kind of front load you a little bit so you, so you understand what I'm saying. One of the things I want you to notice is in the hand where I'm indicating right now, these, these first phalanges that come off of the metacarpals. You notice that they're very different from the ones on the, that come off of the metatarsals, right? The, the hand ones are longer.

• 28:59Speaker 04

  The foot ones are not only shorter, but the shafts are thinner. So that's going to be important here in a minute. The other thing is where I'm pointing right now on the hand, that's, that's what's called the first metacarpal for your thumb. And that has a very distinct shape and you can see how the shape of that is very different than, than these phalanges on the hand. And are you following along so far? Yes, yeah. Okay.

• 29:25Speaker 04

  All right, so, so this area here is the palm. Now where the, that trapezium is Will mentioned a few minutes ago, that's really important. Because that's the joint surface that lets your thumb function, basically. And when I saw that, it immediately was a red flag because normally if, normally you don't have joint surfaces that don't have a matching bone to articulate with, right? And the skeleton changes through life. So let's say you were born without a thumb or something, but you still had this hand. That, that wouldn't be a normal looking joint. It, it, you know, the joint is going to kind of atrophy if it's not being used. And you can see that there's a kind of a pocket there that would articulate with the thumb.

• 30:07Speaker 04

  So that was one of the, the major clues is that there used to be a thumb here, but it's just not present anymore. This little illustration is just showing there's a wide range of motion at this joint. It's a very distinct, distinct structure. And just stop me if you have any questions. Can you tell if it's been cut from this image or not really? It's not, I can't really tell. It's not a very good resolution of an image. To, to, yeah, to see cut marks, at least I haven't.

• 30:35Jeremy Corbell?

  But you're saying, you know, as a evolutionary biologist or whatever, you know, that there is a joint there that would have had a thumb because it, it, it atrophies over time if you don't use it, or it just, it wouldn't be there if they weren't born with it?

• 30:53Speaker 04

  Yeah, it wouldn't, it both is, both I think, it would, it just wouldn't be there. You know, if you didn't use it, it wouldn't be there. It wouldn't, it wouldn't look like that.

• 31:02Speaker 04

  So, you know, so that would have had to have been removed after it had already been a functional joint. Is, is I guess the main point there.

• 31:09Jeremy Corbell?

  Right.

• 31:10Speaker 04

  So, and then, okay, so that's kind of one of the main issues with on that side of the hand. Another, another thing that I, that I think is, is a dead giveaway is that this yellow arrow is pointing to, what we would call the second phalange of the central digit. And I could tell immediately that shape is is unique. It's not, it doesn't match like other phalanges or even other metacarpals in the hand. That's actually the the metacarpal, the the main bone that goes with the thumb. And I isolated it over here to kind of show you next to a human one. And they're both, of course, human. And and one of the diagnostic shapes here is that there's a V shape at the bottom.

• 31:53Speaker 04

  And that goes along with this trapezium that I pointed out. It fits right in there and it allows this range of motion. So that's one of, and then also it's kind of a, you know, chubby, fat little bone that looks different from other phalanges. So it's very distinct shape. So, and now, the other important thing is this joint surface is is meant to be, to having a wide range of motion. Normally, in this position, you would see a hinge joint that's only really allowing a flex, flexion and extension kind of motion. So it doesn't even make sense for it to be there. The shapes don't even match, the the, each side of the joint doesn't match.

• 32:33Jeremy Corbell?

  Right, so there's a little bit of like V shaped space in the top and bottom of that image. Because you're saying normally that joint would be rotating. And in the other fingers, you see that it's just for flexing and pulling. And and you, right, so you're seeing a different bone put in there. So what, they took the thumb bone and they put it in the middle of the hand?

• 32:52Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah. And it's it's either her thumb bone or some other thumb bone, but or, you know, from another body. But but yeah, that's a human thumb bone sitting right there, so.

• 33:01George Knapp?

  It's very efficient. It's efficient by whoever did this, I guess. They didn't just throw it away when they cut, cut it off. They may do some.

• 33:07Speaker 04

  Well, you're gonna see some more of that, actually, some, some, uh, no, nothing left to waste.

• 33:14Speaker 04

  Yeah, just briefly, one, one other point that I want to make, and I think Michelle will probably will touch on this maybe. But it's not just that the wrong bones are are rearranged. It's also that the joints are often left disarticulated. This is an X-ray on the left of Maria's foot from the bottom side. And I just have arrows pointing at these gaps. This gap here on the right would correspond over here to the big toe. And you can see that the gap between this this bone for the big toe and this tarsal bone is very small. Um, but over here it's very large and this isn't a joint that would would make contact. You wouldn't be able to even operate this this foot.

• 33:55Speaker 04

  There'd be nothing for it to work on. Um, and it's not even, and you can see from the picture, it's not even the right bone anyway. You could probably tell this bone here is much skinnier.

• 34:05Jeremy Corbell?

  Yeah, I read online against that. I read online, somebody posted that the, the, the, the white and black, you know, what we're seeing here, that it's not properly exposed. That if you exposed it more to see the white, like you see on, on the right side, that it would be closer to that joint. Is, is that incorrect?

• 34:25Speaker 04

  Well, it's definitely a poor, a poor image. Um, but, but where I'm showing the, uh, the cursor right there, that's about, that is about the edge of that bone. So that, that is a real gap. This, this, this bone, it doesn't, I've just familiar with the shape of metatarsals. Like if, like, for example, if I look over here where you see my cursor, this area here is, is the equivalent right here. So it doesn't, it wouldn't flare out any further than that.

• 34:54George Knapp?

  You would expect the next time we see a photo of that, that foot from the people who are selling this merchandise. It'll be an improved version of it that looks more like what you're describing as real.

• 35:07Speaker 04

  Yeah. And I think, you know, Michelle can talk more about this, but she actually found a, a large gap too, from a, from a different kind of image that supports what I'm saying here.

• 35:15Speaker 07

  Real quick, Dr. Proctor, will you tell everyone where you got the image?

• 35:20Speaker 04

  Let's see, I think, so they had a bunch of images available in a download. And this one was actually one that was just like up on a wall and I had to kind of like zoom in and, and get an image pulled from it because they don't, they don't really do a good job of sharing high quality images. And in fact, you have to make special requests and in some cases sign NDAs to even get a hold of them.

• 35:44Jeremy Corbell?

  Are you serious? They seem like they were so open and they're posting everything. I mean, that's what they're portraying is that they're posting all the scans. It's all open source. You have to sign an NDA to look at certain scans of theirs.

• 35:58Speaker 04

  In some cases, for some people, yeah, that's my understanding.

• 36:02Jeremy Corbell?

  Weird.

• 36:02Speaker 07

  Now, they have, they have released a lot more recently.

• 36:07Jeremy Corbell?

  Yeah.

• 36:07Speaker 07

  But there was a time where it was like, yeah, you had to sign up basically to go look at these things.

• 36:15Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 36:17Speaker 04

  Okay. So if you can bear with me, if you want to hear a couple more, I've got a couple more for you.

• 36:21Jeremy Corbell?

  Yeah.

• 36:22Speaker 04

  So this is Montserrat, the left foot. And I, this is, this is a little different kind of image, but this here, I just want to highlight a couple of things. One, again, there's large gaps between the bones. This is really poorly articulated. This, this would not be a functional bone or a functional foot. It wouldn't, it wouldn't be able to move properly.

• 36:44Speaker 04

  And the other thing is the joints don't even line up. They're just kind of placed, they're kind of spread out to, to give the foot a natural width, I think, but, but they don't really match up right to the joint surfaces. Normally there'd be five metatarsals here and there's only three, but all of the joints for the original five are still present. And that's, that's what are labeled with these letters.

• 37:05Jeremy Corbell?

  Yeah, that's really obvious. And that's from one of the bigger alien, alleged alien mummies?

• 37:11Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah. Montserrat are another ones that are modified from a human.

• 37:15George Knapp?

  Dan, as you-

• 37:17Speaker 07

  Montserrat's the one that has the fetus.

• 37:20George Knapp?

  Dan, you, you mentioned, I think in, in other conversations that not only are there some pretty obvious and glaring problems with the individuals, but they don't match up. That if they're from the same species, they're really quite different.

• 37:34Speaker 04

  Yeah, that's right. And I'll show you that next. That's a good, that's a good, a good segue here. So here's Montserrat's right hand in comparison to Maria's. Now, this, I already pointed out how Maria has a first metacarpal for the thumb sitting here. The equivalent bone over here for Montserrat looks totally different. You can probably kind of see that. It's longer and thinner, right?

• 37:59Jeremy Corbell?

  Yeah.

• 37:59Speaker 04

  And, and the other thing that's pretty glaring about this is that Montserrat has three phalanges for each digit and Maria has four. Now, so, you know, they didn't, they didn't even use the same number of bones to put the hands together. Not the same number, not the same type. And then the last one I'll show you, which there's a lot going on on this slide, so I'll kind of walk you through. But this one I haven't shown before publicly. This is Paloma. And this is showing Paloma's left foot and right foot. And again, Paloma was released, I think in 2024. And it's another of the larger mummies.

• 38:39Speaker 04

  And so there's a reference here for the human in the hand, right?

• 38:44Speaker 04

  Now, if we look at the left foot and the right foot. Now, and I don't know if these are scaled correctly. So the size difference may be just an artifact of the, of the images here. But this, this yellow arrow that I'm indicating, that's pointing at another thumb bone that I've already, that I've already showed you before on Maria. So this is that same type of bone on the, and this is the outer, the outer digit, I guess you would call it. And notice that it doesn't look the same shape as the equivalent ones next to it. And I think maybe you can, maybe you can tell that it looks fatter, the, the head of it, we call that the head, it's fatter. And then if we, if we kind of zoom in a little bit and flip it over, so right next to it, I've got it isolated.

• 39:29Speaker 04

  And you're looking at it from the underside instead of the top. Where these white arrows are pointing, those darkened areas are where there would be, there would be two small oval shaped bones that are involved in helping flexion of the thumb. So that's another giveaway that, that this is a metacarpal for the thumb and not, not a, you know, a proper phalange.

• 39:50Jeremy Corbell?

  Cause like tendons would go on those nubs of the bone to help, right?

• 39:54Speaker 04

  Yeah, right. And so, so the red arrows, these are, these are phalanges. And the phalanges here, if you may be able to notice, they're kind of similar in shape to the ones over here on our reference hand. And that's because they come from a hand. So, so the metacarpal came from the hand. These two phalanges are the same phalanges that go over here on a hand. But they're a lot longer than the phalanges on the toes. And they're very obviously a different size and shape. I think you can tell from the photos. Um, now, so that's the left foot. Now, the right foot is totally different.

• 40:31Speaker 04

  Um, the ones that, so these, this yellow arrow, the bones that those are pointing at, those are in the equivalent position as, as these, uh, phalanges and metacarpal over here. Um, but these are hand bones that are metacarpals. They're just straight up metacarpals that they've butted up against the metatarsals. Um, and I don't know if you can tell, but, um, right here at the base, it's a lot thinner. And then as you move over to the head, it's wider. And that's a very distinct shape that you would see over here on the hand for the metacarpals. Um, so we have a lot of things going on with paloma. They, they didn't, they didn't try to match, um, the types between even the same foot on the same, or the feet on the same specimen.

• 41:11Jeremy Corbell?

  Where they put a thumb bone in, in one of the feet. And then they have finger bones in the other part of the feet or?

• 41:18Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 41:18Jeremy Corbell?

  Or?

• 41:19Speaker 04

  Yeah. Yeah, well, yeah, they're all, they're all hand bones, but, but yeah, the finger bones on the other part of the same foot. And then, and then the central hand bones in the foot, on the right foot. Yeah.

• 41:34George Knapp?

  And what traditionally happens in, in these kind of anthropological frauds, I guess mummies are a big business. I didn't know that.

• 41:42Speaker 04

  Um, yeah.

• 41:43George Knapp?

  Is that they'll listen to people, people like you who point out the obvious errors and impossibilities. And then they'll get better at it. They'll put out better fakes after they hear from critics like you.

• 41:55Speaker 04

  Yeah, and they could get better at arranging the bones, but I think, you know, as Michelle will tell you, there's other, there's other clues that can let you know that they've been manipulated, that it's not only the skeleton, there's also soft tissue to talk about.

• 42:08Jeremy Corbell?

  Yeah, so Michelle, I would love to hear your perspective. I know you're an experiencer. You came into this UFO world just, you know, really wanting to kind of understand and connect with people on this because of your own experiences, but all of a sudden you get these inconvenient truths. So what is your background and history with radiography? And, and what did you see jumping into this?

• 42:31Speaker 05

  So I had applied probably six or 10 months ago to get access to the images. And when I saw the post on X that, hey, I'm putting out more images, would you like to look? I jumped at the opportunity because they'd been on my radar for a while. So I was really excited to see below the 3D rendering because that seems to be most of what they present. So in CT, when we scan you, it basically cuts the body up like a loaf of bread and we can control how thick and thin we make those slices. The thicker the slices, we don't really get great detail. The thinner the slices, though, as thin as you can go,

• 43:12Speaker 05

  looking at the scanner they use for these like 0.4 millimeters is how small we can go. That's where you build your best 3D renderings from. You want those nice thin slices. So they're great to look at. They're fun to the eye. But I started to get suspicious after a few months of just seeing videos of these 3D renderings. I'm like, why aren't they showing us like those actual slices that we see when we roll through? And then we can also, because we scan in a volume, we're able to post-process that volume into multi-planar reformations. So basically what that allows us to do is zoom through the body from left to right, front to back, top down, and kind of get a look at it and spin that volume

• 43:57Speaker 05

  of data so that we can look at it from other directions. Once I loaded it on a viewer,

• 44:05Speaker 05

  You know, I've done probably millions, looked at millions of images over my career. Treated all kinds of trauma, all kinds of chronic disease, cancer, all kinds of surgeries. So your eye gets used to seeing like human beings, like you're, we're trained to look for these things. A lot of times CT techs, especially in the facility where I work, it's very small. We're the intermediary where we're the first ones laying eyes on these scans. So it's up to us if we catch something life threatening to reach out to the radiologist and go, hey, this person's got a PE or this person has an abscess or a hot appendix. Like we need to elevate this and get a stat read so we could get them in front of somebody.

• 44:47Speaker 05

  So it was very in your face.

• 44:53Speaker 05

  The feet, our feet have muscles and fascia on the bottom that allow that, you know, contracture of the foot and allow you to curl your toes and all of that stuff. And as I'm scrolling through the feet, it basically, you can see that sharp cut across the tissues. That tells me that something's been cut away. And it was apparent on more than one image for me. Will, could you show them the normal foot? Just what that looks like? He has an image of an MRI. That's a sagittal plane. So that would be looking at the body from like left to right or side to side. So you're looking into the foot from the side of the foot. And then Will has an image of the normal soft tissues. They usually taper, so you'll have a definitive insertion on each end.

• 45:39Speaker 05

  Otherwise it's just a cut rubber band. It, your foot won't function, so.

• 45:44Speaker 07

  Just ignore the, uh, ignore the text because there's a different point that can also be made on this image. But you can, does that help, Michelle?

• 45:52Speaker 05

  Yes, so that image on the right, um, that's an MRI sagittal view.

• 45:59Speaker 05

  And you can see, yep, if you'll point, Will, those bands across the bottom of the foot, that's how your fascia should look.

• 46:07Jeremy Corbell?

  Right.

• 46:08Speaker 05

  You should have that nice taper from one end to the other. You shouldn't see any clean lines straight across. That jumped out to me immediately. And then, once I started looking at the bones, it was, I basically saw the same thing that Dr. Proctor was seeing. They didn't make any sense. There were bones in the wrong place. There were some bones I wasn't sure if they were from the hands or the feet. The cortical thickness, which is kind of that white rim around the edge of the bone, usually is pretty consistent in your, in every individual. So you won't, when you're scrolling through a foot, you won't have this drastic change from a very

• 46:49Speaker 05

  thin cortical thickness to the bone right next door having a very thick cortical thickness. So that jumped out. That was a huge red flag. I went, those don't even look like they belong to the same human being. And then, the articular surfaces. So same issues that you see in the hand, you see in the feet. It looks like on, from Maria de Montserrat, Maria was altered a little, a little floppier. And then with Montserrat, they tried to be a little more conservative. And what's really interesting is like, this has gone really fast. So in the interim, I've researched what the techniques were in that area. And the Chinchoro, I just

• 47:32Speaker 05

  want to read something to you guys, because this matters, is recognized for having developed the earliest known artificial mummification techniques involving complete bodily disassembly and reassembly, anatomical reconstruction, and detailed external treatments using clay pigments and other minerals. So when you start diving into the history of that, mummies from that part of the world, and you start putting all of these things next to each other, I mean, it becomes very apparent very quickly that there's things going on that are, are greater than this. And, and like George had said earlier, you know, people have mapped a lot of this science already and studied a lot of these. So.

• 48:15Speaker 05

  It was a slap in the face, but I also felt bound by

• 48:22Speaker 05

  the ethics. You know, when you work in medicine and you take care of people, we all make a pledge to do what's best. So, once I understood that I was looking at a human being, and once I understood that somebody was desecrating these remains to achieve a narrative, I, that's why I decided to do this, is because this is really gross and it's

• 48:50George Knapp?

  Ghoulish.

• 48:51Speaker 05

  It's, yeah, it's an evil behavior and it's something that we shouldn't prop up. And Jeremy, I know you are a proponent of UFO transparency. And where my mind is right now, I'm, the believing part's over for me. So I'm, it's not a question of whether I believe or I want to debunk anything. I would like answers. And I think that if you have things like this making noise and adding mud to the water, it makes it so much harder to develop metrics, or develop technology, or, you know, direct attention to things that actually might put some definable metrics up on

• 49:31Speaker 05

  this phenomenon. So to me, it was kind of an assault on all fronts, to my ethics, to my training, to my experience as someone that's had to deal with this personally. Like it was an affront to me on all fronts.

• 49:47Jeremy Corbell?

  Right. Like, so your interest is in the topic itself, but you see absolute cut lines and things like that in scans. You've seen, you said millions of them. So you have to kind of call it out because it causes a lot of turbulence when you take people's sincere desire to learn and understand about this and it's being faked.

• 50:08Speaker 05

  Right, right. And it's just, we have such limited resources on the topic, period. You know, it's a mud from the water kind of moment right now. Just, just doing this project and working with Will and Dr. Wilson and Dr. Proctor, you know, sciences are intersecting right now. So the, having stuff like this, like the room's on fire, we don't need people screaming. We need people looking for buckets. That's kind of where I'm at on it.

• 50:39George Knapp?

  So Will, is this going on right now? Are they manufacturing, they, whoever they are, manufacturing more of these in order to sell? Do you know that any of them have sold on the black market? And the people who have come out in support of the legitimacy of these mummies? People with doctor in front of their names, the university that's studying? Where are they on all this right now?

• 51:00Speaker 07

  Uh, yes, they are still being manufactured and sold. And yes, they have been sold. And I believe, I believe they even got some of them, uh, you know, taken back to Peru from whoever bought them, you know? Um, and I, I believe the person who found Maria, if memory serves me right, got like a $5,000 fine in 2022 for grave robbing. Uh, you know, that's a tax write-off compared to what they're, uh, you know, selling these things for. And so, yeah, as for the people involved that are saying they're real? You know? At one point, George, I was wondering if these were real.

• 51:43Speaker 07

  Uh, so I, I'm really trying not to make this a personal attack on anyone that believes they're real. Um, you know, I watched the Jesse Michaels documentary. I thought it was good. Jesse Michaels, you know, makes really cool content on like some really strange things that, you know, deserve, deserve an honest look. And there are a lot of strange things with this. This is, there's a bunch of strange stuff and you got a bunch of doctors down there telling you there's no signs of manipulation. And, you know, he just simply, I guess, came to a different conclusion on, on the big ones than I guess what everyone here did. So, um, I really like Jesse and I really like his show. I'm gonna keep watching the show.

• 52:27Speaker 07

  Um, but yes, they're still selling them. And my friend Raoul from Pillars of the Past helped me understand this. And he under, he helped me understand what's going on with the grave looting. Amazing YouTube channel, mark my words. He's about to make some splashes. He's gonna go, um, he's about to go mainstream. And Youtube channel basically documents, he's probably put thousands of miles on the ground with his feet. These amazing sites improved that had never been, you know, documented before, but much of it has been just ransacked, completely pillaged. Bodies that, you know, this is out in the desert, so they're kind of relatively preserved despite being five, 600 years ago, some of them older.

• 53:11Speaker 07

  And he got a chance to actually interview the Wacaro. And yeah, according to Raul on my video, said that it was just for $20,000, a little, the little freak winged one, right? With the tell. And that's the thing, now that the hype is at the peak here, just like basic economics, that's when you flood the market. That's when you go, whatever, with inflation, we'll lower the price a little bit, because they used to be more, the small ones, like 40,000. And I think, I don't, I don't think they're really, I think some of these small ones coming out now, you know, they're flooding the market. I don't know how long they're taking with it. But I would really encourage everybody to go check out Raul from Pillars of the Past, Pillars of the Past on YouTube.

• 53:55Speaker 07

  And go check out his stuff on Grave Looting in particular. Hey, this is a scary topic. I didn't, one of the reasons I didn't want to cover this is because there is organized crime here. That's the big secret. These aren't just, you know, some guys, they're like, oh, you know, some of it is, some of the Wacaros are really, this is the way they feed their family, but.

• 54:16George Knapp?

  Somewhere there's a warehouse, Dan, somewhere there's a warehouse where people are putting these together. Are they merely taxidermists? Or do they, is there people with more expertise than something like that involved?

• 54:29Speaker 04

  I think Will has heard a little bit about that. I mean, I don't know how much expertise they have. They don't, they don't know their hands and foot bones, though, I know that much.

• 54:39Speaker 07

  I would, I would like to hear more from Steve Mara on that, on what he knows about that. In his video, he said that he was told by a whistleblower that two taxidermists were involved. And I think Steve, it'd be interesting to see some follow up on that. So shout out to Steve Mara. So that's, that's the source I got on the taxidermy. And I mean, that kind of just makes sense, right? Like, we've, we're seeing the images here, if these are fake, which I believe they are, I mean, and this isn't just some random doing that. You know what I mean, George?

• 55:14George Knapp?

  Yeah. So the government of Peru seized some of these things. I don't know how many they seized and they're classified and they won't let them out. Would one of you address that? I don't know how it worked. Did they get a bunch of them? Why are they stashing them away? And are they coming out and giving their opinion?

• 55:33Speaker 07

  So the government of Peru has actually, from my knowledge, only had possession temporarily of Maria at one point when the Ministry of Culture made a deal with the University of Ica, which is holding a lot of these that they, you know, in good faith, let us just scan the body with, you know, I don't know if, I don't know what type of scanner they had, and then we'll return it. Other than that, I don't believe the government actually does have possession of any of these. I could be wrong on that, but I believe that the possession is currently with the University of Ica and then the Wakeros. Some of them have been donated to the University of Ica. And then also buyers, private collectors.

• 56:18Jeremy Corbell?

  Yeah, look, even Jesse, when he was telling me he's going to Peru and he's going to do all this, he said it's really messy, you know, and in good faith, Jesse is also trying to get DNA analysis on this, like, you know, actual ancient DNA analysis from a company that could actually do it. So I love the idea of moving this forward. But what you guys have found is that, you know, essentially these are ancient mummies. They're full on burial grounds where people are just digging up these bones. And you are showing, or at least claiming that you see very specific evidence of alteration and just Frankenstein stuff that makes no sense. Like, just use your logical mind.

• 57:01Jeremy Corbell?

  You have two beings that are supposed to be the same species. They got completely different bone structures. You can tell certain bones were replaced from other parts of the body. At one point, you gotta say, look, it looks really impressive. When you do this cool 3D scan of the body, it is a real being. Nobody is saying it's not a real being, but it's absolutely manipulated. That's what you guys, I believe, are saying is that we can stop right there and say, these are not naturally grown beings. That they have been manipulated. And, and one thing that, that I want to bring up with you guys, because I know your DNA expert is not here, but the junk DNA. Well, it took me like five minutes to do a deep dive through AI and try to figure out what the, what the,

• 57:46Jeremy Corbell?

  you know, junk DNA is in these mummies. It turns out we have precedent for this, that it is an expected thing to have a high significant percentage of junk DNA. There, there have been other ancient human samples that have been recovered. And it's thirty to sixty percent of unknown DNA, that that is natural, that that is known. When you take these, um, kind of ancient samples and, uh, put them through analysis. So all these things that seem so mysterious, and maybe you can tell me more about the DNA. But all these things that are propagated as so mysterious, oh, junk DNA. They're really explainable and, and it makes me mad. It makes me mad that people are being taken advantage of.

• 58:30Jeremy Corbell?

  Can you tell me a little bit about the junk DNA thing?

• 58:34Speaker 04

  If you don't mind, I have, I have a remark on this. Um, you know, the, the thing is, I don't think a lot of, and I'm not a genetics expert, okay? But this is just my understanding. Um, yeah, these genetic tests, they're, they're designed to look at human DNA. And sometimes, uh, you know, match it with animal DNA and they're working with known structures. So the idea that you could take alien DNA and just submit it to an ordinary test that we have available, even an advanced test, even an ancient DNA test, that that kind of a test would tell you that there's an alien structure or there is, is ridiculous. It doesn't work that way. You would need some kind of special, specially calibrated test for that. And, and probably need to know a little bit about what you're looking for in the first place.

• 59:20George Knapp?

  Well, let me ask you this. I think I read some comment in regard to your video, Will, about the DNA that it's been identified as 70% human and 30% unknown. And one of your colleagues has said, well, the unknown means it's contamination. If it's contaminated, though, and I've heard this in regard to Bigfoot discussions, where they've done DNA tests and 40 or 50% in some of these samples are unknown. And they've run them in these gen banks that should have every species known to exist on Earth. If it's unknown, wouldn't one of those pop up? You could call it contaminated, but wouldn't some other species or animal pop up? And you'd know what the other unknown part is?

• 1:00:05George Knapp?

  Any of you?

• 1:00:05Speaker 05

  I can take that one.

• 1:00:07George Knapp?

  Go ahead.

• 1:00:07Speaker 05

  I can take that one. So the way they do it, that when they do that next generation sequencing, is it has to be in like a sterile lab in order to get a sample that's not super contaminated. And the problem with a lot of these mummies is they weren't encased and they were handled outside of a sterile lab by multiple people, breeding on them, touching them, passing them around. So it would be very hard to just take a core sample and send it away and guarantee that there wasn't any contamination from all of the people that have interacted with them.

• 1:00:47Speaker 05

  So at this point, I would actually like to see, like, I want them to do the next generation sequencing. I want them to do it to each individual bone in the hand. Every single bone, test it. See if they're even from the same person. And see if they're human beings. And that's kind of where you get your answer. So if you take a hand apart, if you dissect it, and then you find that all of the phalanges in the hand come from three or four different individuals, you get your answer. That's your answer right there. So, I mean, to me, they need to take it all the way to the end.

• 1:01:24Jeremy Corbell?

  Yeah, and George, yeah, I just, I just read something the other night. I want to make sure it's, it's correct. But George, I was reading about these specific ancient human samples that were taken, and they all showed 30 to 60% unidentified reads. And I, I think that that is, they say in all these articles I was reading about it, like peer reviewed articles, that that's normal. So that's why I think Jesse was trying to get colossal biosciences, because they specialize in ancient DNA analysis and then removing all the things that are known that are contamination. And I think that's the hope for everybody. But kind of all that's dead for me if you guys have found absolute manipulation of bone structure in the, in these beings.

• 1:02:07Speaker 04

  Well, I think it's worth, oh, go ahead, Will. Sorry.

• 1:02:10Speaker 07

  No, I'm sorry, because I'd rather have you talk, Dr. Proctor. You know a lot about this. But I just want to make one point here on a double standard with the, the mummy proponents. Steve Merritt helps facilitate a DNA test on Maria's fingers. And the DNA test found that there was multiple different types of specimens, maybe in that hand, but it was dismissed because of contamination. But when something pops up that says, you know, there's 70% is showing Homo sapien, and then 30%, you know, kind of unknown, all of a sudden, that unknown is really highlighted. You know, there's, there's ways to twist the narrative. So with the contamination with Steve

• 1:02:55Speaker 07

  Merritt's DNA test pushed to the wayside, with this other one, you know, 30% unknown. What does that mean? So I just wanted to add that.

• 1:03:03George Knapp?

  I just don't understand why the unknown, if it's humans handling it and breathing on it, why that unknown doesn't come out as human?

• 1:03:11Speaker 05

  Because it's all from different people. So like, a lot of those DNA sequencers are trying to put those fragments into an order that makes sense. And when the machine is unable to put those into an order that makes sense, it's usually because there's contamination from multiple different people. So all of the fragments that you have, it's like having puzzle pieces from 10 different puzzles, and you're trying to make the pieces fit, and they're never going to fit. So they, it gets classified as unknown, because they're fragments that nothing can get. Piece back together.

• 1:03:44George Knapp?

  It's a big mishmash.

• 1:03:45Speaker 05

  So they twist that language, they take the ignorance of that, you know, knowledge, because genetics is pretty deep and most people don't study it, and use that to kind of be like, see?

• 1:03:57George Knapp?

  Right. Dan, you've been trying to jump in.

• 1:03:59Jeremy Corbell?

  Just look at ancient human samples. It's 30 to 60% unidentified reads across the board. I was looking it up last night. It's not something anomalous.

• 1:04:09George Knapp?

  Dan, you've been trying to jump in for a while.

• 1:04:11Speaker 04

  Oh, well, I just wanted to say, just kind of a bigger picture. It's easy to get lost in a lot of these details about the genetics and the anatomy. But just, just take a step back and look at the way the science is being done publicly. And the way that you see them going about, you know, they're like Michelle mentioned, you've got people, you know, some are wearing scrubs, some are not wearing scrubs. They're handling these remains. They're, they're passing them around at hearings. You know, is this, is this the way a scientific project would go if it really had the kind of importance they claim? You know, and, and this is another thing, you know, you can't really find a central research team that's in charge of this. You just have

• 1:04:55Speaker 04

  kind of a loose collection of people who, who are making various claims. And some of them are scientists, some of them are not. Most of them aren't even in, if they are a scientist, not from a relevant field. It's, it just, it doesn't, it calls itself science, but you don't see any actual science happening.

• 1:05:13Speaker 04

  I guess that's my point. You know, you don't, they're not treating the remains with the importance that they would be treated if, if they really were what they claim.

• 1:05:21George Knapp?

  Are there any bones that we have on our body that may have been relevant eons ago, but which, a tailbone, for example, we don't have tails anymore. That, I've seen that used as an argument and comments on your video, Will. Yeah, well, there's a lot of things that are in different animals that they don't, they've evolved beyond it. Is there, is there something to that?

• 1:05:43Speaker 07

  Going to defer to Dr. Proctor here, please.

• 1:05:46Speaker 04

  You mean?

• 1:05:49Speaker 04

  I mean, there's nothing in human evolution that would make sense to what we're seeing. You don't. And the other thing is, you know, you don't, there isn't really any biological explanation for why you would get randomly hand bones in the feet or foot bones in the hand. You know, it doesn't work that way. And there's, you know, you can tell stories all day. People say, well, they're, they're strange alien hybrids. Well, that's not a testable hypothesis. You know, what do you do with that? You can say, you can say anything.

• 1:06:16Jeremy Corbell?

  What do you think of, I've heard people say, well, wait a second, you guys are wrong because, you know, the fingerprints, they're very, you know, linear and they're not normal swirls. And then they also say there's no belly buttons on these mummies. I didn't even know about that. I saw that last night. Do you have a comment about those two things? I want to know, is there anything mysterious about these to you anymore?

• 1:06:37Speaker 04

  No, not to me. I mean, the belly buttons, how would you know they're covered in all that crust? I mean, but, and the fingerprints are interesting because you're dealing with skin that is dried out and shrunk and it's changed shape. So I don't know how you can look at the fingerprints on that dried out skin and say that that's the way it looked when it was alive. I mean, it may not, I think, and it's, and you know, there's a whole body of literature that talks about what happens to fingerprints on cadavers. So I mean, I would start there. I'm not, I'm not a fingerprint expert.

• 1:07:06Jeremy Corbell?

  Well, I guess what does it really matter if they're saying, you know, these are legitimate, all the others, like the winged demons and all the little, you know, beings that could never even articulate or walk and they've been proven to be made with chicken bones and with human anatomy. None of that really matters at this point if you're saying that the two that are being focused on are clearly modified and Frankenstein. I think that's, that's what's so important. If you have clear evidence of this, then that creates a problem for the entire investigation, DNA or not, right?

• 1:07:41Speaker 04

  Yeah. Yeah.

• 1:07:44Speaker 07

  Can I show you one more photo that?

• 1:07:46Jeremy Corbell?

  Yes, please.

• 1:07:48Speaker 07

  I visited Maria in April 2025, and this was not apparent. This is a new thing that's happening with Maria. And so I'm going to share my screen right now. And this is actually on tridactyls.org. Can you see my?

• 1:08:05Jeremy Corbell?

  Yeah.

• 1:08:06Speaker 07

  My cursor? Something is being revealed here. There are people on Reddit that suggested that looks like fiberglass tape.

• 1:08:14Jeremy Corbell?

  Oh.

• 1:08:15Speaker 07

  And I have, you know, I guess other people say, oh, it's reptilian skin. But, but, uh, you know, here's the thing. I think that if you look at a picture of Maria in 2016 versus now, you'll often hear them say, she's degrading. She's no longer in the cave with diatomaceous earth. You know, I think it's just, you know, it's been 10 years after she got dug up and covered in diatomaceous earth. And she's starting to reveal herself. I don't know what's going on there. I actually do have a picture of Maria with the, with next to fiberglass tape to kind of show a comparison. I'll send that to you all. But you know, that, that one also would just signal.

• 1:08:59Jeremy Corbell?

  Well, then just test that. If it's fiberglass tape, just like scrape it and test it for fiberglass. That's what drives me crazy about this is like, we all, you know, we all want to believe, right? There's, we know there's UFOs, so there's got to be bodies somewhere. Just the problem is these ain't them. And I know a lot of people say, well, we gotta continue. No stone unturned, you know, check the DNA. And I actually do agree with that, but I do see people's curiosity absolutely hijacked about this thing. And they fight for it. They fight against it, like just the fact you're coming on and saying, you know, we have evidence that we don't believe that these are authentic, that there's clear signs of manipulation. Oh, man, people are going to come after you.

• 1:09:38George Knapp?

  Yeah.

• 1:09:39Jeremy Corbell?

  You know?

• 1:09:39George Knapp?

  Whatever, and now whatever accusations you've had so far, you're, prepare yourselves, batten the hatches, take a two week vacation because after this airs, you're really going to get it. Thing is. Yeah.

• 1:09:51Speaker 07

  That's what I did, George.

• 1:09:52George Knapp?

  Yeah, I understand that people are passionate about their individual cases. They're passionate about the legitimacy of these mummies. It's no loss to scratch it off the list. If the evidence says these mummies are not real, the examples that have been made public are not real. Doesn't mean there aren't some out there. David Gresh's testimony that we do have biologics suggests these things have been around a long time. There might be other ones out there, but these are not it. That's not a loss to go ahead and admit that that the evidence shows they've been manipulated. It means you got to go somewhere else to look for it. It's Jeremy and I are not, we don't, we're not married to any UFO videos that we release. If it turns out there's an explanation for them, great. Cross it off the list and move on, you know? Yeah.

• 1:10:36Jeremy Corbell?

  Have you guys? Have you guys debunked to your, to your satisfaction and to everybody you're talking to right now? Have you debunked these Peruvian or Nazca mummies? Have you debunked them or is there still, are there still questions that you have? Would you like to see DNA analysis, you know, by colossal biosciences? Or are you done? Are you like, this is an absolute fabrication? Please tell me your strongest standpoint right now.

• 1:11:03Speaker 04

  Well, for me, absolutely they're fake. And, and I don't think DNA can answer the question anyway. Not, not your standard test from a lab, just any random lab. I don't think it would, I don't think it's going to shed any light on the issue. And I, and, and it certainly isn't going to correct the, the issues we find with the anatomy. That's still there. So yeah, for me, they're, the case is closed.

• 1:11:26Speaker 07

  All I needed to see was the analysis by Dr. Proctor with Maria. Montserrat is also very interesting, but Maria, it has the provenance. I believe in eight or nine year head start before we started seeing these other big ones. So if you go, if maybe some, there's some proponents out there that can go, okay, Maria. Yeah, Maria is definitely fake, but look at Montserrat. Montserrat still got tendons on the foot or whatever. You are now making the argument that the original one that they drug out eight years ago is fake, but these new ones are, are real. Um, so that's why provenance is, is important here. And I believe Michelle in the video, um, said Maria's feet looks like arts and crafts.

• 1:12:09Speaker 07

  Where like Montserrat, you know, they put a little bit more effort into it. Um, so yeah, I think they're, I think they're fake.

• 1:12:16Jeremy Corbell?

  Sure, yeah, you. Sorry, Michelle.

• 1:12:19Speaker 05

  So, they're definitely human beings. If you do some research on how they used to mummify people in that part of the world, and they call it annular artificial cranial deformation, where they would like wrap fabric or bands around their head to get that conical shape. I did a video on that today to kind of help show people. A lot of what you see in these overlaps with customs that were traditional to that area at that timeframe. So, they also, there are also some cultures that used to disassemble their dead as a way to pay homage or grieve. So, there was a whole bunch of things that, once I started looking at this,

• 1:13:02Speaker 05

  and you add them all together, you just go, God, this is like, it's hard to wrap your head around, but for me, these are fake. These are human beings that have been manipulated.

• 1:13:12Jeremy Corbell?

  But isn't the claim that the head thing is that there's no sutures, like there would normally be on skulls, is that true or not true?

• 1:13:19Speaker 05

  That's true. So, when you do that annular ACD, when you're modifying a skull like that, it's a normal thing to see semi-adhesion of those sutures, or for those sutures to get really tight. And that's because you have all this pressure on the head. So, a lot of the things that they claim are alien, the science has already been mapped for. They've studied hundreds of skulls from the Andes and looked at all of this stuff in Bolivia and Peru and all across that region. And the volumes are within range, at least the few measurements or few metrics that we've been given. And the maxillofacial deformations that people like to talk about

• 1:14:03Speaker 05

  are our classic symptomology of doing those types of head binding. So, like, the more I look at it, the more I'm like, all this science has been mapped already. Like, this is all, you can go and look for yourself. I put a whole bunch of stuff up on X just because I want people to at least, if you're going to believe, at least be educated about the area and what the practices were. Because all of that matters in this, too. You know, I think there's a level of ignorance or unknowing that gets weaponized against people.

• 1:14:34Speaker 05

  So.

• 1:14:34George Knapp?

  Flap nice. I like that. That was a good sentence. Okay, um, are we about there? Anything else you want to add, Dan? Anything that the public should know? I think I'm good. I think I've said my piece. You know, there could be real specimens out there, but as far as you know, they haven't been found. These are not it. These are not it.

• 1:14:54Speaker 05

  These are not it, no.

• 1:14:56George Knapp?

  Well, we all enjoyed their video. That was pretty cool. I can't wait to see what you come up with next, and I wish you all well over the coming weeks. Life is about to get turbulent. Jeremy?

• 1:15:07Jeremy Corbell?

  Yeah, you know, thanks so much. It was really neat to kind of see your point of view. And again, like I, I am always the kind of person that's like, well, we should uncover everything, you know, no stone unturned, but it is very disheartening to see the way that people attack when you're just saying, I have found evidence. It does not concur with what everybody's saying about these being, you know, alien beings. Like, I wish they were too. How cool would that be, man? Find biologics? You know, go back to history, but I think the ultimate thing is that you're, you're saying through your journey, through everything you've done, that you've come to the conclusion, these are not alien beings. They look very impressive because they are human beings, probably ancient, that have been manipulated or Frankenstein. And, and that's sad to begin with.

• 1:15:51Jeremy Corbell?

  But, um, look, more evidence might come forward, but at this point, I'm, I'm really grateful for what you guys have, have, uh, have done and come forward and don't beat these guys up. Don't beat all these people up. Just, just, you know, listen to what they have to say. And if you got a better answer, refute it.

• 1:16:05Speaker 05

  Absolutely. I agree with that 100%.

• 1:16:07George Knapp?

  Yes, thank you all.