#1213 Polina Marinova Pompliano On The Hidden Genius Behind Millionaires and World Champions

Polina Marinova Pompliano is the founder of The Profile, the author of a brand new book Hidden Genius, and also my wife & best friend. In this conversation, we talk about her book Hidden Genius, and all of the lessons and insights that she packed into the book. There has been years and years of her reading thousands of profiles on the world's most successful people and companies, in order for her to distill it all down into the book. Order Book: https://www.amazon.com/Hidden-Genius-secret-thinking-successful/dp/1804090034 ======================= Pomp writes a daily letter to over 235,000+ investors about business, technology, and finance. He breaks down complex topics into easy-to-understand language while sharing opinions on various aspects of each industry. You can subscribe at https://pomp.substack.com/

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:02Anthony Pompliano?

  What's up everyone. This is Anthony Pompliano. Many of you know me as Pomp. You're listening to the Pomp Podcast, which is my effort to find the most interesting people in the world and sit with them for hours while I ask questions in an effort to learn. So it would mean the world to me if you would subscribe to the show on your favorite audio platform, watch episodes on YouTube, and tell your friends and family about the podcast. My goal is to help millions learn from the world's most interesting people. So let's get into today's episode. Paulina Marinova-Pompliano is the founder of The Profile, the author of a brand new book, Hidden Genius, and also happens to be my wife and my best friend. In this conversation, we talk about her book, Hidden Genius, and all of the lessons and insights that she packed

• 0:45Anthony Pompliano?

  into this one book. There's been years and years of her reading thousands of profiles on the world's most successful people and companies in order for her to steal it all down into this one book. I've read the book multiple times. She's read it to me more times than I want to admit. And in this conversation, we talk about all of those lessons and insights, but also have a little bit of fun at the end to make sure you stay for that. Here is my conversation with Paulina Maranova-Pompliano.

• 1:14Speaker 01

  The action's on the court, and as the official beer sponsor of the NBA, Michelob Ultra is getting fans closer to the game with a chance to win courtside seats, merch, and more. Visit michelobultra.com/courtside to enter. Michelob Ultra Courtside, 26 to 27. No purchase necessary. Open to U.S. residents 21+. Begins on October 1st, 2026 and ends on June 30th, 2027. Multiple entry periods. See official rules at michelobultra.com/courtside for free entry, entry deadlines, prizes, and details.

• 1:42Anthony Pompliano?

  Anthony Pompliano runs Pomp Investments. All views of him and the guests on his podcast are solely their opinions and do not reflect the opinions of Pomp Investments. You should not treat any opinion expressed by Pomp or his guests as a specific inducement to make a particular investment or follow a particular strategy, but only as an expression of his personal opinion. This podcast is for informational purposes only. Guys, bang, bang. I've got plenty here. My wife, my best friend, and also the author of Hidden Genius, The Secret Ways of Thinking That Power the World's Most Successful People. Before we talk about the book, we went to Barnes and Noble over the weekend. And when we went to Barnes and Noble,

• 2:22Anthony Pompliano?

  you went right, I went left. We were looking for the book because someone had messaged you and said that they saw a book that was in their Barnes and Noble, which it wasn't supposed to be. The book technically comes out today, but Barnes and Noble cheated. They jumped the gun. They pump faked everyone to put some of the books out. So we went, of course, because we gotta go see, is it in our local Barnes and Noble? And when you went right, you ended up empty handed. That is a lesson for life eventually. I went left, and I found the book. And I caught on video you walking over and seeing it for the first time. What were you feeling?

• 2:56Speaker 02

  It was crazy, mainly because I was, not only was I not expecting to see it, because I was like, oh, like one local Barnes and Noble made the decision to put out some books because they got a shipment early. I was like, surely it's not going to be here. And I was in the nonfiction section. So like, I was looking at the books. I didn't see it. So I just started perusing and I wasn't looking at my phone. And then you came over and you're like, I just texted you. And I saw the text.

• 3:22Anthony Pompliano?

  That's like a normal thing in our relationship.

• 3:24Speaker 02

  And I went over and I was like, I thought, I thought you were messing with me. That's why I was like, wait, what?

• 3:30Anthony Pompliano?

  Why would I ever do that? For the record, the reason why when you went right, you were wrong, and I went left and I was right, is you went to the old nonfiction, which of course the book wouldn't be there. I went to the new nonfiction, the new releases.

• 3:41Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 3:41Anthony Pompliano?

  And found it. All right, let's get into the book. I just want to throw out a bunch of people that are in the book and a bunch of topics. I've heard over the years, you talk about some of these things, but this is the first time you've put it all together into one single resource. Alter ego. I always tell people this, and I never give you credit because I want to feel smart. Explain what's going on with alter ego and why so many successful people have an alter ego.

• 4:04Speaker 02

  Yeah. So I discovered this when I personally started doing a lot more like public speaking and interviewing people on stage. And I had never done that before, and I was really nervous. But then, I started doing this kind of thing where like, I was like, okay, well, I'm really, you know, shy and introverted and kind of nervous, like in my real life, but when I'm on stage, I have to like, put on a show for the audience. Audience doesn't want to see somebody who's like nervous and not confident. So I kind of had in my head this idea of like confident Paulina on stage. And it's funny because like, when I went on stage and I started interviewing the person, it felt almost as if like, this other thing took over and suddenly I had the confidence

• 4:48Speaker 02

  and it was easy and whatever. Um, so I was like, I wonder if this is actually a thing. And when I started researching a lot of these people, I found that, for example, Beyonce, who you think is like this powerhouse, we went to her concert, you saw.

• 5:03Anthony Pompliano?

  Fire.

• 5:03Speaker 02

  Fire. Uh, she.

• 5:05Anthony Pompliano?

  Jay-Z was there, two boys, don't worry.

• 5:07Speaker 02

  Yeah, but Beyonce was the main, um, show. Uh, she, uh, the, the way she presents on stage, I mean, she's super confident. You would never, ever think that she's actually incredibly introverted and shy in real life. And she's like, to create that persona and dress like that and dance like that, I would never do that in my normal life. So I had to create this version, um, this aspirational, almost like ideal version of herself called Sasha Fierce.

• 5:34Anthony Pompliano?

  Sasha Fierce is who goes on stage.

• 5:36Speaker 02

  Yeah. So Sasha Fierce on stage, Beyonce off stage. Uh, Kobe Bryant, during the lowest moments in his career, when he was like being booed on the court, he was like, you know what, I'm, when people were saying boo Kobe, he's like, I'm not going out there as Kobe. I'm going out there as the Black Mamba, this like snake.

• 5:53Anthony Pompliano?

  Killer.

• 5:53Speaker 02

  Yeah, exactly. So he, it didn't affect him in the same way as if he identified as Kobe. David Goggins, same thing. He doesn't identify as David Goggins because he says David was a weak kid. He was bullied, he was insecure, whatever. I'm Goggins. And he said, he likes to say that he was, uh, built, not born. And that just attests to the fact that like, you can create your identity and the person you are today does not have to be the person you are tomorrow. And yesterday, you actually introduced me to a new person who had an alter ego.

• 6:25Anthony Pompliano?

  Brian Dawkins.

• 6:27Speaker 02

  That's right.

• 6:27Anthony Pompliano?

  Last night, Polina was talking about alter ego. I said, sit down right here, young child. Let me pull up YouTube. Let me show you from the archives of the internet. And I pulled up some Brian Dawkins highlights where he has two lockers. One is the Brian Dawkins locker.

• 6:41Speaker 02

  He physically has two lockers, like.

• 6:44Anthony Pompliano?

  And the other locker is Weapon X. And he talks about how when he goes on the field, he isn't Brian Dawkins. That's Weapon X.

• 6:50Speaker 02

  Yeah, but I will say something really interesting. Um, over time, it's possible for yourself to get closer to the, to your aspirational self to where they are one. So for example, Beyonce was being interviewed by Oprah and she told her, by the way, like I killed Sasha Fierce. Sasha Fierce doesn't exist anymore because this is who I am now. Like I am confident. I don't need this extra psychological crutch to carry me on stage.

• 7:16Anthony Pompliano?

  I'd like to report a homicide.

• 7:20Anthony Pompliano?

  All right, uh, let's talk about Nims Persia. Uh, in the book, you talk quite a bit about, uh, the ability to handle risk and especially in times of uncertainty. Uh, Nims is probably one of the best examples of this in the world where, uh, he continues to climb these mountains. He's probably one of the best mountaineers, climbers, whatever you want to call them, uh, in the world. And in the book, he basically says like, nothing that you plan goes as planned on the mountain. So what can we take away from him specifically?

• 7:48Speaker 02

  Yeah, I want to talk about him and then I want to talk about like another mountaineer. That's the flip side of that exact idea. So Nims, um, summited 14 death zone peaks. It had never been done before in the, um, in the amount of time, I think the last time it took like 14 years or something insane. But it took Nims six months and six days to summit all 14 peaks, which is absolutely insane. If you haven't seen the Netflix film, it's great.

• 8:14Anthony Pompliano?

  Well, he also did crazy stuff during it, like he was climbing the mountains and he was doing it for time. But I think at least once, maybe twice, they would call him and be like, hey, Nims, I know you're like in the middle of this, uh, race essentially against yourself. But like, there's somebody stuck on the mountain. Will you go back and get them? And he would go back and actually get them and carry them down.

• 8:31Speaker 02

  Yeah, he, uh, he like gave some of his oxygen to someone who was, who needed oxygen on the mountain. And that's really, really dangerous because if you miscalculate something, it's, he, he calls it a suicide mission. Um, but. Yeah, he's done all of that. But Nim's, like, his whole idea is that you have to be incredibly competent and prepared before undertaking something like this, because nothing ever goes as planned. So if your body's not right, if your mind's not right, and one tiny thing goes wrong, again, a suicide mission. So, so his whole thing is like competence is the key to doing these insane challenges.

• 9:12Anthony Pompliano?

  And is it competence is the mitigator to risk?

• 9:15Speaker 02

  Yes, in, in his mind, and, and I agree. But there's also a flip side to that. Morgan Housel talks about how risk has three sides. He says that there's the odds you will get hit, the average consequences of getting hit, and the tail end consequences of getting hit. So you can mitigate the first two. The last one is kind of like, if you're an investor, if you're, if you're just a human living life, there will be unforeseen risk. And that risk could be a black swan event, it could be a global pandemic. But he talks about how that tail end risk has the least likelihood to happen, but the most impact, and it's the one you cannot really prepare for.

• 10:01Speaker 02

  So another mountaineer is Conrad Anker, who I talk about in, in the book. He incredibly competent, he's a legendary mountaineer. Him and two buddies were climbing Mount Shishapangma, and they were, I believe, close to the top, when all of a sudden, an unforeseen event happened, an avalanche just came down. And it was so close, and they had so little time to prepare, that he went to the left and his buddies went to the right.

• 10:28Anthony Pompliano?

  So there's three people standing there, and they saw the avalanche coming, and they basically were like, run?

• 10:33Speaker 02

  Run, and like, pick a side.

• 10:34Anthony Pompliano?

  Yeah, like, I'm out, like, that's a nightmare scenario.

• 10:37Speaker 02

  Exactly, so, so it's like, so Conrad had like a broken collarbone, he suffered head lacerations, but his buddies weren't found, their bodies weren't found for a number of years. So it's like, that one stupid dumb luck decision that you made, and that really, really consequential.

• 10:54Speaker 02

  Event saved his life. So it's like, yes, you can prepare all you want. You can be as competent as you want and you can make all the right decisions, but that doesn't mean that you will get the outcome then.

• 11:06Anthony Pompliano?

  I'm playing 3D chess with you. You know how?

• 11:07Speaker 02

  Oh God, because I went left in the store and you went to the right.

• 11:10Anthony Pompliano?

  No, I went left, you went right.

• 11:13Anthony Pompliano?

  Survival, death. I'm just saying, hey, I'm just making the connections. All right, let's talk about Amelia Boone. And Courtney Doll Walter. Both of them, they love pain.

• 11:22Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 11:23Anthony Pompliano?

  This is like, this is crazy. Both of them are these like ultra marathon runners. I think that Amelia Boone, if I remember correctly, she talks about like becoming friends with pain and Courtney Doll Walter calls it like the pain cave. What's going on with these women?

• 11:35Speaker 02

  Yeah, I think Amelia Boone's nickname is the queen of pain. So they both kind of are masterful at separating pain and suffering, but Amelia, and they both personify pain, which I think is really important. Amelia, when she talks about like during a mud, a tough mud race, she'll have something go wrong, her ankle, her, you know, whatever. And she's like, instead of listening to myself, I start talking to myself. And the distinction here is when you listen to yourself, you're like, oh my God, my foot hurts. Oh my God, how am I going to get through the next 10 miles, whatever. But when you talk to yourself,

• 12:15Speaker 02

  you're giving yourself the thoughts that you want to think and put into your head. So you're like, hey, my foot hurts, but, but like, your good foot, like you literally personify the foot is a, is a separate entity from you. So it doesn't feel as personal. Courtney is fascinating. I mean, she takes, I watched this interview with her with Joe Rogan, where Joe kept trying to get her to like, talk in depth about like, oh, but tell me philosophically how, and she's like, nope, I just do it. She's very matter of fact, and she sees pain as a place. So she's like, when I'm running these 100

• 12:56Speaker 02

  mile races, she's had severe nausea, she's had a bleeding head injury, she's had a broken foot, she's had it all, but she's pushed through it. And they're like, how? How is that even possible? And she says that in her head, she visualizes like, the pain cave is there. I know I'm approaching it. As she approaches it, she's like, okay, it's, I'm in it. Things hurt really bad, but by thinking of it as a place, you're in control of when you enter it and you're equally as in control when you leave. So she's like, I, I know that eventually I'm gonna be on the other side. So she doesn't, and, and can I just add something here? The personification of pain is really, really important, uh, because it builds mental

• 13:41Speaker 02

  toughness. And I've noticed that Courtney Don Walter does this with the pain cave. Um, David Goggins does this with, again, a place, a dark room. He's like, I go in the dark room as David Goggins. I look at myself in the mirror and I face myself and I say, you're fat, you're lazy, you're a liar. What are you gonna do about it? He, there's a transformation that happens in there and then he leaves and becomes Goggins. Uh, Anthony Ray Hinton, he was somebody who wasn't seeking out pain voluntarily. He was shoved in there against his will when he spent 30 years on death row. Um, and he was-

• 14:19Anthony Pompliano?

  For something he didn't do.

• 14:20Speaker 02

  For something he didn't do. He was wrongfully, yeah, uh, imprisoned, but he watched 54 men walk past his cell to get executed by electrocution and he managed to keep his mind sane. And he was in oftentimes in solitary confinement in a tiny, tiny cell by himself. Again, a place of suffering and pain. Um, and he says that in that place, he used his mind for good. So he would visualize traveling to England, having tea with the queen, uh, winning Wimbledon, marrying Halle Berry, things like that, that allowed him to escape his current reality. And the, the importance of this is that by visualizing pain as a place, it's almost

• 15:01Speaker 02

  like you're, you're one type of person. You go into this place of metamorphosis and you transform into somebody else. And David Goggins says, basically in that dark room, if you don't break, you'll transform. And that's the case of all these people.

• 15:17Anthony Pompliano?

  So let's talk about Bob Bowman and Michael Phelps. This is the craziest thing, I think.

• 15:21Speaker 02

  Is it the craziest?

• 15:23Anthony Pompliano?

  I mean, Michael Phelps jumps in the water, I think at the Olympics, and while he's in the water, he gets water in his goggles. Now, I'm not a goggles guy, but if I was wearing goggles and I got water in my eyes, I'm done. I'm gonna stand up, put my feet on the ground, I'm gonna take the goggles off, I'm gonna, you know, dangle them out there, get the water to drip out.

• 15:41Speaker 02

  Ladies and gentlemen, is why Anthony isn't at the Olympics.

• 15:43Anthony Pompliano?

  Yes, exactly. And then I put the goggles back on. I would kind of do each nose, make sure I get my, the water out of my ears and I'd keep swimming.

• 15:48Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 15:49Anthony Pompliano?

  And I would lose. But he kept swimming with the water in his goggles. Explain how he did that and why he was so prepared for it.

• 15:55Speaker 02

  He basically did it blind, right? Like, the reason he was able to do it blind is because his coach, Bob Bowman, for many, many years, basically his main coach throughout his career, wanted Michael to undergo uncertainty and create these rehearsals for what could go wrong and how could he, how he could react. So during practice, he would break his goggles. And Michael Phelps would be like, what the hell? And he's like, I want you to know how to pace yourself with breath and counting strokes instead of using visuals to get you to the other side. So in, in, again, like at the Olympics, the unexpected happens. He gets water in his goggles.

• 16:39Speaker 02

  Now he knows, oh yeah, I did that when he broke my goggles, so now I can like count strokes and know exactly where the wall is and where I need to turn. It's, it's really hard to do, but that's why he's the best.

• 16:48Anthony Pompliano?

  He won the gold medal. So he did this, blindfolded essentially, and won the gold medal.

• 16:53Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 16:54Anthony Pompliano?

  Which tells you that he's just, one, dominant, but two, also is prepared.

• 16:57Speaker 02

  Mm-hmm. It's competence builds confidence.

• 17:00Anthony Pompliano?

  Competence builds confidence. I like that. All right, Jim Coke.

• 17:03Speaker 02

  Coke.

• 17:04Anthony Pompliano?

  Cook? Coke? Coke?

• 17:05Speaker 02

  Cook.

• 17:06Anthony Pompliano?

  Cook? Whatever, whatever his name is. Boston Beer Company. Uh, he... Basically took this like big leap of faith to start a business, but he was rich before.

• 17:15Speaker 02

  Mm hmm.

• 17:15Anthony Pompliano?

  And he was making what like the equivalent of a million bucks in today's dollars. He just quit his job and was like, I'm gonna go like be a beer brewer.

• 17:21Speaker 02

  Mm hmm.

• 17:22Anthony Pompliano?

  So they call them beer brewers. All right, what's his story?

• 17:25Speaker 02

  Um, his story is basically Jim Cook was in his late 30s, making $250,000 a year at Boston Consulting Group.

• 17:33Anthony Pompliano?

  Which is a million dollars today.

• 17:35Speaker 02

  Equivalent, thanks inflation. Um, but he, he was, um, so, so at the time, he was the only one in his lineage of people. Cause the cooks came from Germany in the 1840s to the US and each eldest son, um, became a beer brewer. And they were big beer people in Germany. And at the time in the 90s, there was a joke that, uh, water is stronger than American beer.

• 18:03Anthony Pompliano?

  Tell the real joke, come on, let's go. They, you're, you're giving us the watered down version, no pun intended. Tell us the real joke.

• 18:08Speaker 02

  But like, some people don't get, okay, I'll, I'll say.

• 18:10Anthony Pompliano?

  Trust me, my audience will understand the joke.

• 18:12Speaker 02

  Audience is the right audience.

• 18:13Anthony Pompliano?

  They like sex jokes.

• 18:15Speaker 02

  Um, so they said, uh,

• 18:18Anthony Pompliano?

  She's so uncomfortable.

• 18:21Speaker 02

  The joke is, the joke is, um, okay. So the joke is that American beer is like making love in a canoe, too fucking close to water.

• 18:32Speaker 02

  So American beer, basically it was very close to water. So it didn't have flavor. It wasn't like German beer and, and it was, um, known that European beer was so much more dominant. Uh, so Jim was like, well, what if we change that? What if we make American beer that's flavorful and, and, and good? And like, people really like it. So he was rummaging through the family attic when he found his great, great grandfather's original beer recipe from Germany. And he was like, whoa, what if I take this and create an American beer? Um, he told his dad his idea and his dad was like, Jim, you're making 250K at Boston Consulting Group? This is the dumbest effing idea I've ever heard.

• 19:13Speaker 02

  So, um, so he was like, okay, but he was really bored at BCG. So then, but he had a hard time. He had a kid, he had a wife, he had a mortgage. He was like,

• 19:25Speaker 02

  Am I really going to quit this amazing salary and go start something that I don't even know if it's gonna work? So he started asking himself the question, is what I'm doing scary or is it dangerous? And the difference between scary and dangerous, and I use this framework all the time in my life, is that if you do the scary thing, the scary thing is only scary for like a few days. You're scared to tell your boss, you're scared your college professor will be disappointed in your decision, you're scared what your friends will say. But dangerous is you looking back when you're 80 being like, damn, I wish I started that beer brewing company. So he ended up deciding that he didn't want to stay in the dangerous situation, he wanted to take the scary risk.

• 20:08Anthony Pompliano?

  Let's talk storytelling. There's this famous profile, I guess, or article that was written, Gay Talese, I think is how you pronounce the guy's name who wrote it. He went out and he was gonna go meet Frank Sinatra, legend Frank.

• 20:21Speaker 02

  To profile.

• 20:22Anthony Pompliano?

  To profile him. But he had a cold. And he writes this line, I wrote it down to make sure that I don't forget it, because it's perfect. He says, Sinatra with a cold is Picasso without paint, Ferrari without fuel. Fire. Like, Gay Talese, if he had Twitter, be viral every single day. Explain like the importance of storytelling. He could have just been like, yo, Frank Sinatra had a cold, so I didn't get to talk to him. But instead he hits us with fire lines. Sinatra with a cold is Picasso without paint, Ferrari without fuel. How important is the storytelling in today's day and age where everyone seems to have very low attention spans?

• 20:56Speaker 01

  The action's on the court, and as the official beer sponsor of the NBA, Michelob Ultra is getting fans closer to the game with a chance to win courtside seats, merch, and more. Visit michelobultra.com/courtside to enter. Michelob Ultra Courtside, 26 to 27. No purchase necessary. Open to U.S. residents 21+. Begins on October 1st, 2026, and ends on June 30th, 2027. Multiple entry periods. See official rules at michelobultra.com/courtside for free entry, entry deadlines, prizes, and details.

• 21:26Speaker 02

  Yeah, so Frank Sinatra has a cold is like the gold standard of profile writing. Gay, at least actually pioneered a new form of journalism called narrative nonfiction.

• 21:38Anthony Pompliano?

  What is that?

• 21:39Speaker 02

  Huh?

• 21:39Anthony Pompliano?

  What is that?

• 21:39Speaker 02

  Yeah, before this, before that profile, the way that profiles and just news articles were written where it was very formulaic and it was very dry. He introduced fiction elements to tell a nonfiction story. So that's why it reads like that. It's very full of detail and context and nuance. And it's so ironic that the best profile, the gold standard of profiles, he never talked to the subject, but it shows like how it can be done. He talked to like a hundred people in Frank Sinatra's orbit. So he was able to get even a better portrait of the man than if he just talked to him.

• 22:17Speaker 02

  And then, in terms of storytelling, I think a lot of us think that this day and age, there's like, I was talking to Anthony Scaramucci yesterday and he was like, you know, today.

• 22:29Anthony Pompliano?

  The mooch.

• 22:30Speaker 02

  The mooch. He said, today we can barely agree on what the facts are, let alone like anything else. And I was like, but that's not because we're not agreeing on what the facts are. That's because we have conflicting stories of what we believe the facts say in our interpretation of the facts, not the facts themselves. And so in the book, I talk about these like incredible storytellers, one of them being Aaron Sorkin. He's very well known for the social network, the film, and which is Mark Zuckerberg and the inception of Facebook. And the way he talks about it, he was interviewed about it and he was like, I wasn't particularly interested in tech or startups or venture capital, anything like that.

• 23:13Speaker 02

  What drew me to this story in particular were that there were.

• 23:18Speaker 02

  Three different or two different lawsuits that had three different versions of the truth. So Eduardo was suing him, the Winklevoss twins were suing him, and then Mark had to defend himself. All three parties had different stories. And um, the way he and he was like, and by the way, with the film, I didn't want to be like, here's the ultimate source of truth. He was like, I wanted to show all these competing versions of the truth, which I think he does very well in the film. Um, and he says to get a great story, basically story equals conflict plus intent. So he says the best stories have conflict that is laced with intent.

• 23:58Speaker 02

  When you tell a good story and you only talk about the problem, but not what the protagonist's intent is, it makes no sense. So he's like, Mark Zuckerberg, his goal wasn't, you know, money or wealth. It was fricking social status and he was willing to plow through anything to get that. And um, any obstacle, the obstacle of the Winklevoss twins, his friend Eduardo, his girlfriend at the time, or the institution that is Harvard. He was willing to get through anything to get to his final destination and make Facebook this thing, because he didn't get an invite to a fancy social socials club.

• 24:39Anthony Pompliano?

  For those that don't know about Aaron Sorkin's uh, early life, they should go and uh, and learn about the guy was just.

• 24:45Speaker 02

  He was an addict.

• 24:46Anthony Pompliano?

  He never slept. He was doing cocaine like every night and basically he would go to like a different uh, like world essentially and he would sit there and he all night would just write.

• 24:57Speaker 02

  And he said that he was scared that it without his addiction, he wouldn't be good. But the thing that actually stopped him, if I remember correctly, is that he got caught at the airport. A TSA with his child there and that's kind of what.

• 25:12Anthony Pompliano?

  Yeah, it reminds me a lot of like Hunter S. Thompson's life. That guy's a legend.

• 25:17Speaker 02

  There's a lot of writers who are addicts.

• 25:19Anthony Pompliano?

  Yeah, well, Hunter S. Thompson addict would be one description, but if you ever look at Hunter S. Thompson's daily schedule, it's insane like how the guy live. All right, let's move to somebody who's an addict, but not for drugs. Tom Brady, he has a quote in the book, you gotta limit inflation in the body, whether it's through your diet.

• 25:36Speaker 02

  Inflammation.

• 25:37Anthony Pompliano?

  Inflammation, what did I say?

• 25:38Speaker 02

  Inflation.

• 25:39Anthony Pompliano?

  You gotta limit inflation too. That is an important thing. You see how my brain works? You gotta limit inflammation in the body, whether it's through diet, nutrition, or your thoughts.

• 25:48Speaker 02

  Right.

• 25:49Anthony Pompliano?

  Diet and nutrition, cool, got it. But thoughts is an interesting thing. You gotta limit inflammation in your body through your thoughts. What's that mean?

• 25:57Speaker 02

  It's, um, I have this idea of like a content diet that actually you helped me develop. Uh, but the idea that like, for example.

• 26:06Anthony Pompliano?

  Helped is, is kind for you. Go ahead.

• 26:09Speaker 02

  For example, when we met, I was watching a lot of like reality television, which included like The Bachelor, The Bachelorette, like all these, all these shows that basically when you put that garbage in your brain, um, it like you see the world through a different lens. So you're constantly like, is he mad at me? Is she mad at me? Uh, did I say something wrong? Did I? It's like through the lens of relationships in a very negative way. And then you realize that like you're not putting difficult, um, material in your brain. So you're just kind of like consuming junk food content. And what.

• 26:45Anthony Pompliano?

  The example, just so people are clear, because I got you on my show now, so I can, I can hold you hostage and roast you.

• 26:51Speaker 02

  This is really.

• 26:52Anthony Pompliano?

  Is, uh, no, if you sit and you watch a bunch of people arguing on television all day long, then naturally, whether you realize it implicitly or not, or explicitly or not, is that then you go argue a lot with the people in your life because you're basically mirroring what you just watched on television. So if you just put in your head all day long, idiots, you know, 25 women chasing one dude, and then you go into your real life, you start arguing with people. It's like, wait, hold on a second. Like, take the garbage out of your brain, right? Put good information in.

• 27:20Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 27:20Anthony Pompliano?

  Which I had to learn too, right? Like I would read stupid stuff or watch stupid stuff, whatever. And then you quickly learn like, oh, if there's like high quality stuff that goes in, then actually your actions, the output ends up being high quality as well.

• 27:32Speaker 02

  Yeah. And it's not just, um, it, it like, that's not to say that all you read and all you listen to and whatever is just really difficult material that makes you think it's okay to have a sliver of that, but just don't make it like your entire food content pyramid.

• 27:47Anthony Pompliano?

  It's like dessert. You can do like once a week and you're good.

• 27:49Speaker 02

  Yeah. And, um, I, I, I want to touch on this thing that so, yes, like a content diet is determined by what you read, what you listen to, what you, what you watch. But one thing that I actually learned from you is that, is that, um, a part of your content diet is also who you hang out with because those conversations then lead to thoughts, which then lead to beliefs. So if you surround yourself with people who maybe like are your high school buddies that, you know, don't, you don't have that much in common with anymore. You end up staying on surface level conversations. But when you have friends who you can actually talk about really interesting subjects with, you get new ideas. It's, it's a much healthier, uh, content and way to live, but, um,

• 28:34Anthony Pompliano?

  And can I add something real quick since you said that I taught you that?

• 28:37Speaker 02

  Okay, okay, okay. It's gonna help to me.

• 28:39Anthony Pompliano?

  Is, well, I think that there, I think that there's a somewhat acceptance of this thing like, don't surround yourself with people who talk about people, surround yourself with people who talk about ideas, where it's been talked about often. Um, but it's also surround yourself with people who have different life experiences. And so one of the things throughout my entire life is I kind of feel like, uh, I made bus stops. Right? Like I was on the bus and I went and okay, cool. I was in high school. I met a bunch of amazing people still to this day. I think very highly of them, right? And they all had a similar experience to me in high school. But then I got on the bus and they all went to a lot of the same schools. I went to a completely different school, went to a different bus stop, right? Met a bunch of people there. Then I went into the army and then I went to, uh, Silicon Valley.

• 29:21Anthony Pompliano?

  And then I went, you know, and, and I kind of went to all these different bus stops and I kind of collected friends. So I'm still in touch with many people at those different bus stops, but I never was like all in on one bus stop. I never thought of, okay, this is the only thing that I'm going to do. I want the variety of experience and I want the different knowledge to take with me. And in some way, like the bus got smarter.

• 29:41Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 29:42Anthony Pompliano?

  As we kept going down the road, right?

• 29:43Speaker 02

  Yeah. And then there's another, um,

• 29:46Anthony Pompliano?

  Put that in your book.

• 29:47Speaker 02

  Well, I did, but no, there's another thread in that that I don't know if it's in your little, you know, questions to ask, but I have a chapter on clarifying your thinking. And I, you know how I'm like fascinated with cults and like the people who join cults? I definitely think that.

• 30:02Anthony Pompliano?

  If you want to admit that publicly.

• 30:04Speaker 02

  Well, it's in the book, so. So I think like, I think that a lot of people who, uh, right now, we live in a very tribal society. And, and James Clear one time was like, you know why it's so hard for people to change their beliefs? Even if they think that like their beliefs are absurd. It's because, uh, when you're asking somebody to change their beliefs, you're essentially asking them to change their tribe. And very few people are like, oh, I'm gonna, these are my friends. I'm gonna go like make friends with another group. That's not how it works. And I think what you just said about the bus stops is like the reason that you and I don't have really strong beliefs about one thing.

• 30:47Speaker 02

  Um, is because, for example, for me, like, I was born in Bulgaria. I grew up in Atlanta, Georgia. I moved to New York as an adult. I kind of always feel like an outsider, but also not just that. I've had a multitude of experiences and I've seen how different people think. So I can understand why they make the decisions they can make. Therefore, I, like Aaron Sorkin, I don't see something as like the ultimate source of truth. I see it more of like a grayscale based on your past experiences. And I think what you just said, like, if you hadn't had those experiences where you went to one school, you went to war, you came back. Like, those are all things that shape your mind.

• 31:26Speaker 02

  And you're like, oh, I, this one tribal group isn't the only source of truth. There's so many other ways to think.

• 31:34Anthony Pompliano?

  I went to six schools in 12 years.

• 31:37Speaker 02

  Oy.

• 31:38Anthony Pompliano?

  It's crazy. I never even thought of it that way. Alright, I want to talk about one more thing. Bruno Cuccinelli, which you found real early in our relationship, lifetime, whatever.

• 31:49Speaker 02

  The king of Kashmir.

• 31:50Anthony Pompliano?

  The king of Kashmir, not to be confused with our boy The Wolf in Kashmir.

• 31:56Speaker 02

  God, who is that?

• 31:57Anthony Pompliano?

  Uh, LVMH guy.

• 31:59Speaker 02

  Oh, but I don't think he's called The Wolf. Is he called The Wolf in Kashmir?

• 32:03Anthony Pompliano?

  I think so. I just look, I got a big brain, some stuff stays in there. I think that's one of them. Alright, so Bruno Cuccinelli says that he rereads, what is his name?

• 32:11Speaker 02

  Brunello.

• 32:12Anthony Pompliano?

  Brunello, sorry, Cuccinelli. He rereads every year Marcus Aurelius's Meditations, famous book, been around for thousands of years. This dude's got the same problems that we got today, trying to figure out himself and obviously he's writing his meditations down on probably parchment at the time, now we have it digital.

• 32:33Anthony Pompliano?

  But he says that the reason why he reads it every single year is because each year he's a different person and he gets different things out of it. So in his twenties, he learns some things and in his thirties, other things were more important in his forties and fifties, whatever. Explain like how people can use that in their everyday life to actually improve and compound over time.

• 32:50Speaker 02

  Yeah, well, again, like if you read a certain book, a lot of us, when we're excited about a book, we tend to speed read through it. And you're like, oh my God, this was the best book ever. But how often do you go back and reread it? And I found myself the same thing that Brunello talks about is like, when you reread a book at a different stage in your life, you're able to pull out different things that you never saw the time before. For example, let's say you read it the first time in your twenties and then when you read it in your thirties, now you have kids and you're like looking at it through the lens of a parent and you're taking away different things that you might have, you might have when you were twenty.

• 33:29Anthony Pompliano?

  Alright, now that we're good with the book, let me close my little notes here.

• 33:36Speaker 01

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• 34:03Anthony Pompliano?

  So hidden genius, the secret ways of thinking that power the world's most successful people. This is Plena's first book. Says Plena Maranova Papliano on the cover. Very long name now. Welcome. And there's James Clear says a goldmine of actionable ideas and useful advice from top performers in all fields. James Clear, for those of you don't know, author of the number one bestseller Atomic Habits. We then go on the back here. We've got Morgan Housel, Brandon Stanton, Danny Meyer, Patty Sellers, Kat Cole and James, known as Jim O'Shaughnessy. I like that he used James though. And so the book as of today is on bookshelves. Before I let you go, I want a prediction or a guess. How many books do we think get sold in the first week and in the first year?

• 34:48Anthony Pompliano?

  I will also guess and then we will see who's closer. This is, I know this is like your worst nightmare, but we're, we're gonna do it.

• 34:56Speaker 02

  Why would I ever do that?

• 34:59Anthony Pompliano?

  What do you think?

• 35:00Speaker 02

  It's like, I don't do price predict. You don't do price prediction. I don't do book prediction. Book sale prediction.

• 35:07Anthony Pompliano?

  Can we hit number one on Amazon?

• 35:08Speaker 02

  I would love to hit number one on Amazon.

• 35:11Anthony Pompliano?

  What's the highest in pre-sales did you get?

• 35:14Speaker 02

  In pre-sales?

• 35:14Anthony Pompliano?

  Yeah. During the pre-sale period, what was the highest you got on the list?

• 35:18Speaker 02

  Oh, I got to number 500.

• 35:20Anthony Pompliano?

  Oh, all right. That's easy. Now the book's live. Let's go people.

• 35:24Speaker 02

  Let's go people. Yeah, I would love to.

• 35:26Anthony Pompliano?

  All right. So all people have to do is they go either on Amazon and they buy it or the local bookstore, go to the local bookstore, support local. I got it.

• 35:33Speaker 02

  Support independent.

• 35:35Anthony Pompliano?

  That's right. And if they do it and they take a photo and they tweet it at you, do they get anything?

• 35:40Speaker 02

  Well, you could offer something. For the people.

• 35:44Anthony Pompliano?

  I'm busy. I already, let's take it from the end back to the beginning.

• 35:49Speaker 02

  Take it.

• 35:50Anthony Pompliano?

  Nice little storytelling here. Um, when we went to Barnes and Noble, you went right, death. I went left, life. And, uh, we found those books. You were taken over with emotion. I, on the other hand, being the amazing, being the amazing husband and father that I am, was chasing our daughter around the store as she tried to grab every book off the shelf. I would dive and knock it back in so that there was no damage to the store. Cause I didn't want to buy all these stupid books that I didn't want. Uh, I wouldn't let you leave the store until you signed them.

• 36:22Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 36:23Anthony Pompliano?

  And you.

• 36:24Speaker 02

  Because I thought you didn't ask for permission.

• 36:26Anthony Pompliano?

  Hold on, hold on, I just want people to understand the pain, the pain cave I live in every day. Sinatra with a cold, pomp at the bookstore. Don't worry. Listen to this.

• 36:40Speaker 02

  This is not comedy.

• 36:40Anthony Pompliano?

  I went and I got a pen from the people. And to get a pen, I said, hey, my wife wrote a book. The book's over there. She's gonna sign them. Can I have a pen, please? They said, oh, no problem. Here's the pen. I took the pen. I brought it to you. And then you, cause you're a nerd. You are a nerd.

• 36:54Speaker 02

  I was like, I have to ask for permission.

• 36:56Anthony Pompliano?

  Hold on. You sat there and you're like, I can't sign the book unless I go and I ask for permission. I said, it's your book. Sign the book. Put it back on the shelf.

• 37:02Speaker 02

  Nobody knows that.

• 37:03Anthony Pompliano?

  But I need to ask for permission. What if they get mad at me? Tell them it's my book. Like, no, but I have to ask for permission. And we stood there for five minutes of my life. I was in the pain cave, negotiating with basically a book terrorist who wouldn't sign the books until she got permission. Yes, for the record, I triumphantly convinced her to sign the books. You signed them. I tweeted it and was like, hey, go get it. And next thing you know, people were like, hey, I went and I picked it up.

• 37:27Speaker 02

  Yeah, that was really cool. Thank you so much. I, people did go and they did buy the signed books. Um, it was really cool.

• 37:36Anthony Pompliano?

  Now, that's what we call in the showbiz, a setup. Cause I just want everyone who's watching on video to know that the book that I have right here. Is also signed.

• 37:45Speaker 02

  Excited.

• 37:46Anthony Pompliano?

  Excited to take you on a learning adventure.

• 37:48Speaker 02

  Paulina.

• 37:49Anthony Pompliano?

  Ha, ha, ha. Any last words for the people?

• 37:52Speaker 02

  What did you think of the book?

• 37:54Anthony Pompliano?

  I thought the book was fantastic. I'm only offended for two things throughout this entire process. One, I was not asked for a quote for the front or back cover. My quotes were relegated to in private. I think it's excellent. I would have had some fire to put, but you know, it's all right. I'm not as big as James Clear and all these other fine people. Uh, and then the second thing is, uh, I've actually read the book about 17 times. But I never actually picked up the book and opened it until now when it was about to be. And I have listened 17 times. Do you read it to me? Every single individual chapter.

• 38:27Speaker 02

  If you want to improve your writing, read it out loud because your ears catch mistakes that your eyes miss.

• 38:33Anthony Pompliano?

  Correct. So I got read the book 17 times, but then I went to another pain cave. And for the last four months, every day, Paulina has asked me, are you going to read the physical book yet? Are you going to read the physical book yet? And now I have, the reason I have is because I was waiting for now it's showtime.

• 38:51Speaker 02

  And now it's showtime.

• 38:52Anthony Pompliano?

  You were doing the pre-sale stuff. Now it is time to sell books.

• 38:56Speaker 02

  Oh, man.

• 38:56Anthony Pompliano?

  We're going to get this book in every single person's hands. And I think that the measure of success is if people put it on their little bookshelves. And when they're on Zoom, you see, you see it there and it's like a status symbol. Like, yeah, I read the book.

• 39:11Speaker 02

  Yeah, but see like to me, it's more like, I don't know. I, when you read the book, I would love to hear your feedback, but like if it, if something resonated with you and it genuinely changed something that you do or a habit or something for the better, let me know. Like those are the, that, that means so much more to me.

• 39:27Anthony Pompliano?

  It is the difference between you and I. It's like, I see a number and I'm like, oh, there's a game to play. How many books can you sell? And you're like, I don't care about the book sales. I just want people to like, learn from the book.

• 39:38Speaker 02

  I really do.

• 39:39Anthony Pompliano?

  All right. Where can we send people to find the book?

• 39:41Speaker 02

  HiddenGeniusBook.com.

• 39:44Anthony Pompliano?

  Or Amazon.

• 39:45Speaker 02

  Or Amazon, but like you have to search there, you just click.

• 39:48Anthony Pompliano?

  And it goes right there, buys? All right. Uh, my book says, uh, no price on it. How much is it?

• 39:53Speaker 02

  Um, well, uh, it depends where you live.

• 39:56Anthony Pompliano?

  Okay.

• 39:56Speaker 02

  $27.

• 39:57Anthony Pompliano?

  Damn, y'all again trying to get smart?

• 39:59Speaker 02

  Euros, dollars.

• 40:00Anthony Pompliano?

  Oh, got it. Okay. All right. And where can we find you on the internet?

• 40:04Speaker 02

  You can find me on Twitter at, at. What do you call that?

• 40:09Anthony Pompliano?

  It's an at symbol.

• 40:10Speaker 02

  Oh, okay.

• 40:13Speaker 02

  Paulina underscore Marinova. Because friggin' Twitter, I have a long thing with Twitter.

• 40:17Anthony Pompliano?

  That's how I found Paulina in my DMs. All right, guys. Great episode. I really appreciate.

• 40:23Anthony Pompliano?

  I appreciate you coming and doing this. It was a very far walk for you. It's just a pleasure to get to meet you and learn from you. So I hope everyone goes and buys the book.

• 40:32Speaker 02

  It was a pleasure getting to answer your questions. We could work on your presence a little bit on your podcasting presence.

• 40:41Anthony Pompliano?

  I have white pants on right now.

• 40:42Speaker 02

  You need an alter ego. You do, that is your alter ego.

• 40:44Anthony Pompliano?

  I do, I didn't want to bring it up earlier, but just real quick, maybe we'll end on this. You probably don't realize this, but every morning when I wake up, yeah, I got white pants on. Yeah, look at that.

• 40:53Anthony Pompliano?

  I'm not sad, but I am sad I got white pants on.

• 40:57Speaker 02

  Is it the chair or is it the pant?

• 40:59Anthony Pompliano?

  So you don't realize this, but every morning when I get up out of bed, I know it's dark and everything, right? But you don't see me, I pick up my left leg and then I pick up my right leg. You've never seen me do this?

• 41:09Speaker 02

  And put your pants, white pants on?

• 41:12Anthony Pompliano?

  No.

• 41:12Speaker 02

  One leg at a time?

• 41:13Anthony Pompliano?

  Anthony woke up, I had to get in my pump suit, let's go hit the day.

• 41:19Anthony Pompliano?

  She's so embarrassed. She's so embarrassed.

• 41:21Speaker 02

  This is like.

• 41:22Anthony Pompliano?

  I love you. Congratulations.

• 41:23Speaker 02

  Thank you.

• 41:24Anthony Pompliano?

  The book's amazing, everyone go get it, hidden genius. See you guys next time.

• 41:27Speaker 02

  Thank you.