Is Comedian Robby Hoffman the Last American Dream?

We’re closing out 2025 with the person who made us laugh the most this year: comedian Robby Hoffman. [You can watch this conversation https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GEN-gQ8sJx8&t=1s on YouTube.] At the top, we unpack the joys of her new Netflix special Wake Up https://www.netflix.com/title/81978270 (4:00), her views on Sunday football (9:00), and the state of masculinity (15:00). Then, Robby walks us through her Orthodox upbringing (19:00), leaving America for Canada (21:00), and how she started to find herself in high school (32:00). On the back-half, we talk her first night doing stand-up (39:00), some candid thoughts on her community (47:00), how she landed her break writing for The Chris Gethard Show (51:40), the conditions she fought to improve during the WGA strikes (53:00), a tribute to the late Rob Reiner (1:07:30), and the systemic change she wants to see in 2026 (1:10:00). Thoughts or future guest ideas? Email us at [email protected]. See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:15Sam Fragoso?

  This is Talk Easy. I'm Sam Forgo, so welcome to the show.

• 0:32Sam Fragoso?

  Today, comedian Robby Hoffman. She's been called the people's comedian, the future of comedy, the scene-stealing star of shows like Hacks and Dying for Sex, the Michael Jordan of the gay community, although I believe Robby came up with that one herself. And my personal favorite, a brilliant lunatic who makes me laugh until I'm delirious. That was from fellow comic John Mulaney, who also directed Robby in her brand-new Netflix stand-up special, Wake Up. Let's take a listen.

• 1:03Speaker 01

  My friend Carmen, he called me. He's like, "Hey, Rob, why didn't you come to my birthday party?" I was like, "Huh?"

• 1:11Speaker 01

  He's like, "Yeah, I sent you the particle."

• 1:17Speaker 01

  I said, "Carm, how old are you turning?" And he said, "39." I said, "39? No, I don't go to a 39-year-old grown man's birthday party. What, are you fucking gay?

• 1:35Speaker 01

  Birthday parties are for women and children. What are we doing?

• 1:41Speaker 01

  What am I getting there? We're playing duck, duck, goose? What the fuck is going on?"

• 1:47Sam Fragoso?

  That was from the new special Wake Up, now available to stream exclusively on Netflix. If you want to check her out live and person, I believe she's doing a tour across America, or at least to some cities across America. You can find those at robbyhoffman.com. In a press release for the special, Malaney went on to say, quote, "No one has owned a stage like Robby since James Brown." And while on the surface Robby Hoffman and musician James Brown may not have a ton in common, I think he's on to something there because Robby's command of the stage, the note-perfect pacing of her bits, the unabashed confidence, the bravado with just enough vulnerability to remind you you're actually watching a real human being do this live

• 2:32Sam Fragoso?

  in front of you, it's pretty electric. And I actually do remember the first time I saw her perform and I remember just being completely spellbound by her. She was abrasive, she was provocative, and for all the comedic influences that came to mind that first night, Fran Lebowitz, Larry David, Andrew Dice Clay, she was ultimately herself, which is why I wanted to have Robby on the show to close out 2025 and usher in the year to come. If you'd like to watch this episode of Talk Easy, you can click the link in the description. You can also just as easily search Talk Easy with Sam Fragoso on YouTube.

• 3:15Sam Fragoso?

  I think our video team, they always do a great job, but the look and feel of this one, I thought, turned out really beautifully. So shout out to Red Gaskell, Alex Leo Garcia, and Corey Attad for all their great work. If you haven't checked out an episode of our show on video, I think this is the one to do it. You can do that again on YouTube. It's also in the description of the episode. And to all of you listening, watching, whatever you're doing, thank you for being here and showing up in 2025. To close us out, here is Robby Hoffman. I'll see you next Sunday.

• 4:06Sam Fragoso?

  How are you doing?

• 4:08Speaker 01

  Good. I'm very excited to be here. I have been, we've been begging. I knew even when I saw you, not to be name dropping, but why shouldn't I? You don't think I've been, we were both invited to SNL after-parties? We've been, when I saw you at the SNL party and you saw me and we had a knowing look, I said, first, we're gonna do nothing this first week. The first half of that second week, we're still gonna do nothing. But there'll be something percolating. There'll be a brew. There'll be a brew. And here we are in the second half of the second week, getting it done.

• 4:41Sam Fragoso?

  What a great setup.

• 4:42Speaker 01

  Thank you.

• 4:43Sam Fragoso?

  Do you wanna wear headphones?

• 4:44Speaker 01

  Oh, should I?

• 4:45Sam Fragoso?

  Yeah. Are we good on?

• 4:48Speaker 01

  Was that not recording?

• 4:49Sam Fragoso?

  Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 4:50Speaker 01

  Bro, I come in hot.

• 4:52Sam Fragoso?

  We're coming hot, that's good.

• 4:53Speaker 01

  I come in hot. I grew up without a father.

• 4:55Sam Fragoso?

  I could...

• 4:57Speaker 01

  I come in hot.

• 4:58Sam Fragoso?

  That may be the best introduction we've had on the show.

• 5:01Speaker 01

  I'm not surprised by that.

• 5:02Sam Fragoso?

  It's a good preamble.

• 5:03Speaker 01

  I knew that we would deliver for each other. Like, you're such a delight, I'm already enjoying you, I know nothing. But just, your voice. You know, some people, and they say this to me, I get a lot of positive and thank you for everybody. But sometimes they'll say, you know, a face for radio.

• 5:22Speaker 01

  Okay, they don't get it. I am a cutie in certain circles. Hurt control from laughing at that. I'm a cutie for a certain, for certain circles.

• 5:31Sam Fragoso?

  I think the circles are expanding.

• 5:33Speaker 01

  Thank you, thank you. But you do really have a voice for radio. I'm just, you have a one, I don't think it's a negative.

• 5:41Sam Fragoso?

  You do know there are three cameras in here.

• 5:43Speaker 01

  No, I know. And you're also, we have not only a voice for radio, but a face for cameras. I'll say that, but your voice is excellent.

• 5:52Sam Fragoso?

  Robby Hoffman, welcome to the show.

• 5:54Speaker 01

  Thank you so much for having me, Sam.

• 5:56Sam Fragoso?

  You've had quite a year.

• 5:57Speaker 01

  Yeah. I mean, I've had many big years. Every year has been a big year. Just not everybody's been a part of it.

• 6:05Sam Fragoso?

  Just the other week, The Hollywood Reporter ran an article with the headline, "Well, at least Robby Hoffman is having a good year."

• 6:12Speaker 01

  Thank God.

• 6:14Sam Fragoso?

  And I gotta say, you're one of the only people I know who's done really well in 2025.

• 6:20Speaker 01

  I know.

• 6:21Sam Fragoso?

  And everyone seems to be happy about it. There's not a lot of envy. I haven't seen it.

• 6:27Speaker 01

  No.

• 6:28Sam Fragoso?

  People are happy for you.

• 6:29Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 6:30Sam Fragoso?

  It's not make-a-wish-like, but...

• 6:31Speaker 01

  I'm one of the last American dreams. No, literally, I'm one of the last living American dreams. I just feel the swell of the people, almost to the point that, and I've thought about this a lot and talked about it, but when you grow up rich versus poor, I get to live like a rapper. I get to live like a ballplayer, like anybody I ever wanted to be. When you come from nothing and you make something...

• 7:00Sam Fragoso?

  You didn't marry a cheerleader of a former NFL team.

• 7:03Speaker 01

  Thank you. Thank you. Okay? So in a way, I'm a quarterback. Me and Tom Brady, we're not so different. I've said this, we're not so different. We're not so different. So I think people root for that. I think that if somebody saw me driving down the block in a Ferrari and a lime green Lamborghini, they'd be thrilled about that. Versus my friends who grew up in Westwood and rich and all this have to drive a Prius.

• 7:28Sam Fragoso?

  I don't like to root for them.

• 7:30Speaker 01

  No, because and they have to, you know, they got, and the Prius, I actually feel bad for them. When we get it, it's like, let's live, let's go.

• 7:39Sam Fragoso?

  You know, I'm glad you mentioned Tom Brady because, as you know, this podcast comes out every Sunday morning.

• 7:45Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 7:45Sam Fragoso?

  In your new special, you talk about how men also tend to come out on Sunday.

• 7:51Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 7:52Sam Fragoso?

  What do you think about the Sunday football routine for straight men?

• 7:56Speaker 01

  I love it. Here's the whole thing, guys. We're joking. Football, I actually like that the men have an outlet to be a little gay.

• 8:04Sam Fragoso?

  Mm-hmm.

• 8:05Speaker 01

  I think if we thought war was bad now, we thought everything was bad now. Thank God they have the small outlets they do.

• 8:11Sam Fragoso?

  Do they need more outlets?

• 8:12Speaker 01

  Well, yeah, they're pretty pent up. And everything exposed is a little gay. So just come on.

• 8:21Sam Fragoso?

  I think we've set up the clip just about perfectly.

• 8:23Speaker 01

  There's a clip. That's fantastic.

• 8:24Sam Fragoso?

  We give listeners and viewers a look?

• 8:28Speaker 01

  Let's throw to the clip. I've never said that. And here from Robby Hoffman, "Wake Up."

• 8:32Sam Fragoso?

  Robby Hoffman's Netflix special.

• 8:35Speaker 01

  Fellas, you have a gay thought, you keep that shit to yourself. You keep that shit to yourself.

• 8:44Speaker 01

  They're not allowed to be a little gay, but still, they gotta get the little gay out somehow. Still there, it's gonna seep the fuck out. But they can only get the gay out in the ways that are appropriate. The ways that are socially acceptable. Right? That's why they play football.

• 9:03Speaker 01

  Even gayer, they watch it. There's no other way to explain. A dude will wear a shirt with another man's name on it. I'm not making this up. A dude will...

• 9:17Speaker 01

  Excuse me, he'll go to the store, he'll purchase a shirt, he'll pay extra to have another man's name embroidered onto the shirt. I'm making this up. If another planet landed here, they'd be like, doesn't that sound too obviously gay?

• 9:35Speaker 01

  But no, that's what the fellas here are doing.

• 9:40Speaker 01

  And they're not doing this in secret. They're not doing this in the dead of the night, in back alleys.

• 9:50Speaker 01

  They're doing this broad daylight, Sunday at noon.

• 9:56Speaker 01

  The fellas in this country wake up Sunday at noon with a pep in their step.

• 10:06Speaker 01

  Throw on a shirt with another man's name on it. Run down the stairs hard as a rock, ready to watch this shit.

• 10:17Sam Fragoso?

  I watched that and I thought, oh man, should I tell Robby that I have a fantasy basketball team?

• 10:22Speaker 01

  Absolutely. I say get the gay out.

• 10:25Sam Fragoso?

  Mm-hmm.

• 10:25Speaker 01

  I'm all about it.

• 10:26Sam Fragoso?

  Yeah.

• 10:26Speaker 01

  I don't care. Get it out in the ways that are appropriate, but just call it what it is.

• 10:30Sam Fragoso?

  Mm-hmm.

• 10:31Speaker 01

  Don't yell at girls for loving Twilight and soap operas when you have your own soap operas.

• 10:36Sam Fragoso?

  Mm-hmm.

• 10:36Speaker 01

  Sports is the male equivalent of the soap opera.

• 10:39Sam Fragoso?

  Hmm.

• 10:40Speaker 01

  Right? They're not necessarily, it's not about the ball getting from one end to the other. It's about this guy, he comes from nothing and his father, and then he moved states, then, and then he broke his leg and then he came back from the recovery. It's the narrative. It's the exact same drama. It's just that when we have it from the feminine, it's always demeaned. Feminine in society is always demeaned, and that's across the board. Even in a gay man relationship, the effeminate is looked down upon, or it's secondary. As a masked, somewhat masked dyke myself.

• 11:16Sam Fragoso?

  Why do you say somewhat?

• 11:17Speaker 01

  Just some people put me, I know there's way butchier than me. If you've noticed some of the broads I know on the motorcycles, Sam, believe me, okay? They could flip me with a, okay, so I say somewhat. But as somebody who has some masculinity, I do feel luckiness since that I get a little more randomly compared to some of my feminine counterparts, you know, very, you know, my more feminine presenting, um, straight girl comedians. I notice that they sometimes can have a harder time than me. I'm kind of, I benefit a slight amount from masculinity. And masculinity is always the preference, and that's across the board. So that's why football is so glorified, but then women loving astrology or loving what they,

• 12:02Speaker 01

  it's like, ooh, that's stupid. Your shit is dumb as hell.

• 12:05Sam Fragoso?

  Hmm.

• 12:06Speaker 01

  It's dumb as hell. They're all dumb. But they're all the way to get the narrative and the feelings and, and, and just vents out. I'm pro football. I'm pro Sunday morning. I just want to call it what the fuck it is. Fucking gay. You're having an orgy. It's a mental orgy. But I consider cheating a mental, you know, as soon as you're texting the other woman, you cheat. I started there.

• 12:31Sam Fragoso?

  Now, you're married.

• 12:32Speaker 01

  I'm happily married.

• 12:33Sam Fragoso?

  Are those the rules in your relationship?

• 12:36Speaker 01

  What?

• 12:36Sam Fragoso?

  No texting another?

• 12:38Speaker 01

  We don't even have said rules. That's just the way we both operate.

• 12:41Sam Fragoso?

  Mentally cheating.

• 12:42Speaker 01

  I would consider mentally cheating cheating, but I would want, let's say, I would want her to do that. Like, I don't want, it's not like I don't cheat because I can't. It's that some people, if they need the rule to tell them not to do, okay. It's that I am naturally monogamous. I don't feel the need or want or anything like that. I so happen to be that way. So it's not a stated rule, and that's not the reason I don't cheat. Even if you told me I could, I probably wouldn't cheat. I would just be with Gabby. Let's say you told me, okay, we're doing like, we don't have that rule, like how you put it, and everybody's open. I'd probably just wait for Gab. I'd be, I'd be, I'd wait for her to go.

• 13:26Speaker 01

  I just wouldn't do that. So it works naturally for me. I mean, as a dyke, you know, I always joke, lesbians are penguins, monogamous to the day you die. And then gay men, poly is not for the faint of heart. Gay men have been perfecting it. Year after year, they have the temperament. And straight people get to cheat. These are the rules. I didn't make them.

• 13:47Sam Fragoso?

  You said on your podcast that we must remember gay men are men, and they are on the decline.

• 13:53Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 13:53Sam Fragoso?

  What did you mean by that?

• 13:55Speaker 01

  Gay men used to be in charge of like, deculture to some extent. Or they were really pivotal in arts and pushing those spaces. And they were really, you know, led with intellect and a lot of this stuff. It's not to say that they haven't. But, and I'm not, I'm not putting it on Queer Eye, and I've met some of those guys, and I like them. And I'm not saying, but I'm just saying, the West Hollywood gay, the Queer Eye, the... The kind of Ken doll gay has kind of stripped them of that, that they've become very like standardized. They've lost it. They don't have that it factor anymore. I think dykes have been slow and steady. Even look at fashion, suits and girls' rings.

• 14:40Speaker 01

  Since we've really had, we brought back men's fashion in a way that I think is surprising. Men kind of abandoned it for their Hawaiian shirts and showing off their pecs and this. And and Dykes said, well, whoa, whoa, I want to, I'll wear that. And then now we're back. So I just think that-

• 14:55Sam Fragoso?

  You think they've, you think they've lost a step?

• 14:56Speaker 01

  We've never, we've always been on the fringe lesbians. And I think that that's actually sometimes cooler. They like went way too much and they lost themselves. And now people are like, what's that dyke up to?

• 15:10Sam Fragoso?

  You know, 2025 has been, I would say, the year of of the manosphere.

• 15:15Speaker 01

  Right.

• 15:15Sam Fragoso?

  It seems like anytime I'm online, I have to hear something or read something about the men that are taking over.

• 15:21Speaker 01

  Right.

• 15:22Sam Fragoso?

  Politically, socially, culturally. Do you think this country has an obsession with the infantilized man child?

• 15:29Speaker 01

  Absolutely.

• 15:32Speaker 01

  Men are infantilized, period. Yeah, I think, again, that goes back to the masculine being preferred. Right? The reason, to make it political, if you need a political example, for those who can't think outside of that sport, Pete Buttigieg can run for president because he's a top. Yes, that's a gay man, but he's not an effeminate gay man. Chasten's not running for anything. Hillary Clinton suffers from femininity because people know she gets fucked. We don't want somebody who gets fucked in this country. We want to, we want somebody who fucks. Pete fucks. Hillary doesn't. Bill fucks. Kamala gets fucked.

• 16:15Speaker 01

  But I'm just saying, we really, we really demean that, that position. And I think it's

• 16:22Sam Fragoso?

  Why do we do that?

• 16:22Speaker 01

  I just think it's ingrained. It's from, it's, it's this, you know, it's just embedded in the culture. Women, the feminine cannot, that is like, they're too insecure about it. And that I do think that they've ushered in AI robots from the beginning. Wouldn't it be cool if we did robots? Most girls were like, not really. I'd love like an Easy-Bake, let's get some cookies going. Like, you know what I mean? Like, why would I want, you know what I mean? It's like, but that is, I think that they've ushered, they know that women are coming. And just to have somewhat of control, they made robots, robots. Or, I don't know. I don't know. I think that women are, that, that, that men are most feared by being dominated by

• 17:07Speaker 01

  women over anything else. Now, AI could also be a bubble. Remember NFTs?

• 17:12Sam Fragoso?

  No.

• 17:13Speaker 01

  They were telling us, NFTs, art is gone. NFT, art could not cost more. And NFT is where? NFT who?

• 17:20Sam Fragoso?

  I mean this genuinely. I'm not just saying it because we're on a podcast.

• 17:24Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 17:24Sam Fragoso?

  I still don't really know what it is.

• 17:28Speaker 01

  Thank you.

• 17:29Sam Fragoso?

  I looked it up once.

• 17:30Speaker 01

  Yeah, and they're saying it was gonna take over. It was like the Segway, remember the Segway? We're not even gonna walk anymore in a mall. Which, by the way, they're right, we're not really walking in a mall. But I'll tell you, we're not Segwaying in it either.

• 17:41Sam Fragoso?

  Speaking of Segways, you know, in the second grade.

• 17:44Speaker 01

  Is that a pro? Is that a pro?

• 17:47Sam Fragoso?

  This is when you were growing up in a pretty Hasidic community in Crown Heights. Is that right?

• 17:53Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 17:54Sam Fragoso?

  You were the seventh of 10 children.

• 17:57Speaker 01

  Yes. I love that you had me cast aside already in your hand motions. You were seventh?

• 18:03Sam Fragoso?

  Yeah, you were seventh. What does it mean to be the seventh of 10 children?

• 18:07Speaker 01

  I'm still learning this, Sam. And maybe to any listeners, you know, I, I've talked, you know, birth order is something that people take very, very seriously. And there's qualities and attributes attributed to the firstborn and the middle. But what about sevens?

• 18:20Sam Fragoso?

  Do people care too much about birth order?

• 18:22Speaker 01

  I mean, I think so. I think people care about shirking responsibility. Oh, it's not that, you know, it's not that I, I, I, I can't figure out to get up and, and go do something. It's that I'm a middle child.

• 18:35Sam Fragoso?

  Growing up, tell me about the kind of household you lived in. It was fairly orderly despite having 10 kids, right? Your mom was on it.

• 18:43Speaker 01

  It was not orderly at all.

• 18:44Sam Fragoso?

  It wasn't orderly?

• 18:45Speaker 01

  No, no, I grew up feral, Sam. I'm lucky to be alive.

• 18:48Sam Fragoso?

  Okay.

• 18:49Speaker 01

  Our bathroom was like a latrine. We had one bathroom and my brothers would piss in it in the morning around it as if it was a urinal on the toilet while some of the girls are brushing their teeth in the one sink. I mean, this is just, I don't know. Where you researched that it was orderly? It was anything but. My mother could never get ahead of the pest infestation. Pest control was impossible. Okay, one kid would get lice. All of us would get lice. By the time she got rid of the lice, some other kid came home with lice again. Opening the light to go to the bathroom in the middle of the night and the roaches would disperse across the floor. No, the point is I'm orderly now because we had no order.

• 19:34Speaker 01

  It's a response to it.

• 19:35Sam Fragoso?

  That's right.

• 19:36Speaker 01

  My mother, not to any, you know, well, I wouldn't say not to any fault. She had 10 kids and she gave it almost no thought.

• 19:43Sam Fragoso?

  Having the 10 kids?

• 19:44Speaker 01

  Yeah, I asked my mother, how did she have 10 kids? And she goes, I don't know. It seems like every day, every night I went to bed, I woke up pregnant. And I was like, that's the grossest thing I've ever, can you close the legs?

• 19:56Sam Fragoso?

  It takes a lot of work.

• 19:57Speaker 01

  It takes a lot of work.

• 19:58Sam Fragoso?

  10?

• 19:58Speaker 01

  10.

• 19:59Sam Fragoso?

  That's a lot.

• 20:00Speaker 01

  It's a lot. It's too much. When we moved out of the house, everybody was able to either go to school or get a job by 18, but you had to move out. So we all pretty much moved out at like 17 ish. But our first stop was my sister Chaya's house. Thinking she's the oldest, she had an apartment, she had a boyfriend. She lived in the ghetto, whatever, but she had her own apartment. She had a boyfriend and somehow would let us live with her.

• 20:23Sam Fragoso?

  This is in Montreal?

• 20:24Speaker 01

  Yeah, this is in Montreal. And she prioritized a life of dignity. Small things that could make you feel rich. For instance, she kept neat. She kept a trash can empty. She had small things and something that she imparted. Like when we did get our own apartments, like I moved into her neighborhood. I got my own apartment. As a housewarming, she got me a set of sheets. You know, they were better sheets than I would have bought on my own. Things like that, just the small things that she. Insisted upon. I mean, you know, being poor is one thing, but living with a little dignity

• 21:05Speaker 01

  can help. So even when I had my tiny apartment, I said, well, if I keep it neat, I'll feel rich. You know, when you watch a rapper video, you watch all of these Usher songs or whatever they were. They were always like in the white bathroom with the white towels, you know, splashing water. I was just keep neat. So it was kind of a reaction to how we grew up where everything was everywhere and it could not be neat.

• 21:26Sam Fragoso?

  So everything was everywhere.

• 21:27Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 21:28Sam Fragoso?

  In Montreal.

• 21:29Speaker 01

  Are we low on water, by the way? Oh, look at that.

• 21:32Sam Fragoso?

  Uncle Eddie, I think is living down below. Is that right?

• 21:35Speaker 01

  Yeah, well, it's Uncle Eddie's house.

• 21:37Sam Fragoso?

  It's Uncle Eddie's house.

• 21:38Speaker 01

  Yeah, he took in 11 people on a moment's notice. You see, they don't build people like this anymore.

• 21:42Sam Fragoso?

  They don't. No, no. Your mother flees Crown Heights.

• 21:45Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 21:46Sam Fragoso?

  Takes all 10 of you.

• 21:48Speaker 01

  You know, I've never told this story.

• 21:50Sam Fragoso?

  Can you please tell it? The night of it?

• 21:54Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 21:57Speaker 01

  It's crazy because I'm like an old man where I've been. I've never told a story because I thought I would save it, but okay, I'm taking a deep breath and then I'm going to say the whole story. It's a hard story, though.

• 22:10Speaker 01

  Okay, so we were kids and my father was not doing well. My father was suffering. My mother was really suffering. My parents were in an abusive relationship. Like, and I I share parts of this, but I've never shared the story of how we left the community. Just because it's never been funny and it's so I was saving it for some, I don't know, some non funny whatever. Um, so we'll do my Nanette here with you. My mother was was being badly abused by my father. And it was getting really bad. I mean, it was bad, but it was starting, I was starting to stay home from school a lot to help with the kids. And the girls in my family, coming from a traditional orthodox background, the girls are more about the

• 22:53Speaker 01

  the kids and the food and whatever. And the boys were, were, you know, my brothers were more responsible to study Torah and and do whatever their responsibilities were. I don't know much about. They didn't have as much as us say that. And we moved to Florida because my grandfather, and this is where my grandfather, I have to even go back further in the story. And I know you have so much to talk about. So do you mind that I'm actually taking the time to tell this story?

• 23:17Sam Fragoso?

  You're gonna talk about Zadie.

• 23:21Speaker 01

  He's good. Okay, so Zadie, my mom's parents are from Montreal. My mother's from Montreal. And my grandfather, Zadie, always kept a close relationship to my mother. My mother grew up a daddy's girl, whatever. They were very close. They grew up secular Jews, maybe conservative, but just Jews like you know them. You know, pretty good, regular, working Jews. My grandfather was a butcher. And but he, my mother, he kind of describes that he lost my mother to this, you know, religious sect. My mother felt a calling. She said it was the seventies. Everybody was getting into something, which I'm like, Mom, it's like drugs, like not God, you know what I mean? She was like, you know, so she gets into that. She has 10 kids by 30.

• 24:05Speaker 01

  And my grandparents felt like, you know, they were very close to their daughter and and she was gone, you know, and she was also having a kid a year and it's very difficult on a body. She was in her twenties. And my grandfather, on the few visits that he was able to have with us when we were kids, he would, he told me that he would try and plead with my father, like, hey, like, how are we going to afford all these kids? Like, and he would look at the sky and he said, my, my father seemed gone. He would say, Hashem's well.

• 24:32Sam Fragoso?

  What does that mean?

• 24:33Speaker 01

  God's well. You know, like he had no control over it. So, which, thank God, I'm seventh born. I don't know when my grandfather had that conversation. I wasn't there, but I'm pretty far down the list. So, thank you. You know, I wouldn't have chosen to be here, but now that I'm here, I'm thrilled to be here. So years go by and my father stops working. He had different sales jobs or tried to bring in some money, but he mostly was like studying and I don't know how it is with other religious sects of other religions, but I know sometimes with Islam, it's similar to when somebody radicalizes into a deeper Jewish faith, is that they go hardcore. Like they've become the best Jews or the best Muslims or, you know, they just,

• 25:14Speaker 01

  they're intentionally doing it more because they're grownups learning about it and they've chosen this. So my parents went all the way, so to speak. But my father was. Drinking a lot and not handling, you know, there's no real resources. You know, they tell you have as many kids as you can and it'll just come. Well, it wasn't coming and he's still having kids. So, you know, I can't imagine the stress he was facing. That said, my mother certainly got the brunt of it. And he was really down and out and my father, my grandfather, Freudian slip. My grandfather had an apartment in Florida.

• 25:55Speaker 01

  So I don't know how, I wasn't privy to this grown up conversation at the time either. But from what I've heard is my grandfather like could get my dad a job or something was going to help him out financially. If they came to Florida, like there was a position in, I don't even know. My father takes them up on that. So we all moved to Florida, but really my grandfather was just going to try and give him money and get my mom close to him. Because they had not, they'd had a very touch and go relationship during my parents' relationship. Because my grandfather was considered outside of the community and not a great influence. And they were both fighting for control over my mother. You know, my father was very controlling to my mother and he knows that my mother was also very

• 26:41Speaker 01

  in love with her father in a sense, you know, where she, she really respected him. So we go to Florida and it's getting really bad. My mother, this is where my mother thinks it took a turn, even though it took, you know, many turns. It was already. And in Florida, at this point, my father is like not even coming out of the bedroom. Like he's going on these for bringing like, it's like a drinking, studying party. Like the, the more you drink, the more you think, the more you read and you're, or he wasn't even going to synagogue. He was just sleeping all day and doing nothing and being crazy. And I witnessed a lot of violence and I was staying home more and more. So to help my mother, she was really starting to fall apart.

• 27:22Speaker 01

  And my grandfather finally came over one day. And my father was passed out of the room. I was home from school. And they were sitting in the kitchen and they had a small conversation. My mother maybe had a black eye or her face was really badly beaten when he came by. But I think she was like, she was wearing a tichol, which is like a shawl on your head to cover your head. Like she was pulling it down and it was just bad. And I was kind of playing with the baby or doing whatever. And he said, and I wasn't privy to this either, but the way that he, you know, he said that he walked in and she looked so tired. And he said, you look tired. And she said, you know, I am dead.

• 28:07Speaker 01

  And he said, okay, come home. And he just got her on one of the days and she said, okay. And he got the ball moving. And I remember my grandfather showing up. My dad was still passed out, maybe a week or two later, I don't know. And I was holding maybe my little sister. And my grandfather, who I loved, came and he said, you ready to go? And he came with his best friend, Jermaine, who was a French Canadian former cop, who was living in Florida, snowbird culture in Canada that they come down to Florida. And Jermaine was a former cop and amazing man. And they came with two cabs to pick up my mom and all the kids who were at home, which was only the four youngest and I'm the fourth youngest.

• 28:53Speaker 01

  And all my other siblings were at school. And we got into the cab. He said, you have everything? And I said, yep. And I really just had my, I was holding one of my siblings. And we just got in the car and we went to my grandfather's apartment. It was really chaotic. Then all my older siblings, my grandfather called their school and said, please drop them off at my apartment, not at the, not with their father. And I think my father, when he woke up from his slumber or whatever binge he was on, it was already, from what I hear, there was already police there and there was some sort of restraining order for him not to come. And we were able, we were granted access into Canada. We moved in the middle of the year. My grandfather took 10 of us, my mother.

• 29:34Speaker 01

  Actually, a couple of my siblings stayed back, I think for a second, maybe in two trips we went. And then we moved in. My grandfather called my great uncle Letty, may he rest in peace, who's his brother. And he said, I'm bringing, I'm bringing Connie and the kids. Go to Zeller's, which is their Walmart, whatever, get beds, get whatever, and we'll be temporary. Figure it out. And we moved there, I think, in February, and it was snow up to here. And my great uncle Letty picked us up at the airport and we were supposed to be temporary. And my mother was still in that house. So it's just, we moved in on a moment's notice. I've never shared this story. So that's really, it's not from a good, it's not funny.

• 30:18Sam Fragoso?

  It doesn't have to be funny.

• 30:19Speaker 01

  You gotta be funny.

• 30:20Sam Fragoso?

  We can be funny for the rest of the podcast.

• 30:22Speaker 01

  Perfect.

• 30:23Sam Fragoso?

  Are you all right?

• 30:24Speaker 01

  Yeah, no, no, I'm good, I'm good. I'm just shy that I shared that story.

• 30:27Sam Fragoso?

  You know, they don't all have to have punchlines.

• 30:30Speaker 01

  No, no, no, no, I totally agree. I'm not saying, I, I, I, by the way, I'm somebody who knows that also.

• 30:35Sam Fragoso?

  Yeah.

• 30:35Speaker 01

  Okay, I'm heart, heart and humor. Okay, I'm aware of it. But that said, it's not just my story to tell. It is my mother's story.

• 30:43Sam Fragoso?

  Mm hmm.

• 30:44Speaker 01

  I mean, it is all our story, you're right.

• 30:46Sam Fragoso?

  Yeah.

• 30:47Speaker 01

  And by the way, I tell my mother all this, all the time. Of course, I'm talking about it, didn't you? Look at you, I'm talking. Like, this is the only saving grace is that I have these stories. I wish I didn't.

• 30:59Sam Fragoso?

  You wish you didn't.

• 30:59Speaker 01

  I wish I didn't.

• 31:01Sam Fragoso?

  Hmm.

• 31:02Speaker 01

  What a life to enjoy.

• 31:04Sam Fragoso?

  Hmm.

• 31:04Speaker 01

  I can't imagine.

• 31:05Sam Fragoso?

  Not a kind. As you know, I, I, I do a ton of research and I know you haven't shared that story. So thank you for sharing it. That means a lot, that means a lot.

• 31:16Speaker 01

  Thank you so much.

• 31:17Sam Fragoso?

  Um, when we come back, why don't we talk about the beginnings of your comedy career?

• 31:23Speaker 01

  Also a nightmare.

• 31:24Sam Fragoso?

  Well, hopefully this one has a punchline. That's more after the break with Robby Hoffman.

• 31:52Sam Fragoso?

  MUBI is a global film company bringing great cinema to the world and to you. Everything at MUBI is handpicked with an emphasis on visionary filmmakers and movies worth discovering. One new movie is called Teenage Sex and Death at Camp Miasma, from writer-director Jane Seanbrun, who made the film I Saw the TV Glow. The film stars Hannah Einbinder and Gillian Anderson. It follows a young director tasked with resurrecting Camp Miasma, a once-beloved slasher franchise that after years of sequels has fallen out of favor. Looking for inspiration, she visits the reclusive actress who starred in the original film. But what begins at an attempt to revive the franchise soon pulls the two women into a blood-soaked world of desire, fear, and delirium.

• 32:36Sam Fragoso?

  It's a world-expanding, genre-bending movie from one of the most distinctive filmmakers working today. Teenage Sex and Death at Camp Miasma is now streaming exclusively on MUBI. You can try MUBI free for 30 days at MUBI.com/talkeasy. That's MUBI, M-U-B-I dot com slash talkeasy for a whole month of great cinema for free.

• 33:00Sam Fragoso?

  I think a lot of us are gonna spend the next few weeks looking for gifts online. And while I like finding something thoughtful for the people in my life, the process can get a little ridiculous. You've got a dozen tabs open, you're comparing prices, and you're trying to remember which store had that one thing you saw that has a deal, and you flagged it, and you saved it, and now you can't find it. Anyway, that's what I like about Shop. Shop brings all kinds of stores together in one place, so you can search for what you're looking for across different brands while discovering new ones along the way, plus tracking all your orders without jumping in-between websites. And just in time for the holidays, they're celebrating the all-new shop.com with a pretty extraordinary giveaway.

• 33:41Sam Fragoso?

  1,000 shoppers will win $1,000 in Shop Cash. That's $1 million in total, which you can put towards gifts for other people, or maybe something you've had an eye on for yourself. And you don't have to buy anything to enter the giveaway. Enter to win the $1 million Shop Cash giveaway from now until November 1st. Just go to shop.com. There are so many ways to win, and that's shop.com, shopping designed around you. No purchase necessary. Restrictions apply. Official rules available at shop.com.

• 34:24Sam Fragoso?

  Okay, coming back. In a recent interview, you talked about how all the things that you were embarrassed about as a kid, you've now turned into bits as an adult. So when you're in Montreal growing up,

• 34:40Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 34:40Sam Fragoso?

  Your mother is at home, taking care of kids, cooking often.

• 34:44Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 34:44Sam Fragoso?

  Except for the one night a week when she did night school.

• 34:47Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 34:48Sam Fragoso?

  Which took her 12 years to complete.

• 34:50Speaker 01

  Yes, by the grace of God.

• 34:52Sam Fragoso?

  And then she finished and got her degree.

• 34:54Speaker 01

  Yes, she did.

• 34:55Sam Fragoso?

  People have asked you, who were your comedic influences growing up? And you said, everyone in my family.

• 35:02Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 35:02Sam Fragoso?

  What was the kind of sense of humor that was around the Hoffman household?

• 35:07Speaker 01

  Well, you know, it was, my mother was so funny in the way that many people's parents are funny, where it's like, they don't even realize they're being funny, but laughing at her, you know, the kind of kids could rally and laugh at her. And she took it like a good sport. And she was also laughing, confused often about what we were laughing at. But she did, we had funny heartbreak all of the time. Okay, so everything, I mean, a few things that I can think of were, you know, every morning, we woke up the same way. There's Cheerios and Rice Krispies on the kitchen table. There's Cheerios and Rice Krispies. Like, she would be like, up, up, up. Like, I remember she just turned on the lights in the girls' room, went down to the boys. Up, up, up, there's Cheerios and Rice Krispies. And everybody would just kind of get to the kitchen,

• 35:52Speaker 01

  grab a bowl, grab either Cheerios or Rice Krispies. I was a Cheerios kid.

• 35:56Sam Fragoso?

  Was she proud of you for attending what sounds to me like this pretty nice private school in Montreal? Where you're on scholarship, but from my understanding, it's sort of unofficially segregated.

• 36:10Sam Fragoso?

  There's tough, there's tough teachers, pop quizzes.

• 36:13Speaker 01

  Yeah, no, I went to this rich school. You know what, when we were moving to Canada, my grandfather was now helping, you know, was, was de facto parent. He was trying to get us into these schools and we got an interview for this fancy school. And my brothers got into a fight during it and they said, okay, we're gonna take the girl, we'll pay for the girl to go, but the boys are out. My grandfather begged them, it's a package deal. In any event, I went, I got to go to the school. And I was good at the school, I was fine with school. But the problem is, you know, I was one of two poor kids at this school and they reminded you, or they had ways of subtly reminding you, not so subtly, that you're poor and you're lucky to be here. And my mother agreed with them.

• 36:52Sam Fragoso?

  How did they do that?

• 36:53Speaker 01

  If I had a field trip, for instance, and my mother didn't give the thirty dollars, they would say, oh, you know, we're going to the Fine Arts Museum or something like that. Uh, it's thirty dollars. And my mother said, I don't think so. No extras, no extras. This school, they gotta just teach you there. They gotta teach you there. And so they would put me in the library, the whole grade would go to the, would go to the field trip, whatever it was. And I went on some of the field trips and there were some that were free, but if there was a major cost to it, or and my mother said like, so I, one thing they did, instead of just throwing me on the bus and cover, they're already covering the year, what's the difference of this thirty dollars? Is they put me in the library to research the museum.

• 37:37Speaker 01

  So it's like, I'm on the library computer now. Like writing a composition. They would say you can write a composition of the exhibition or something like that.

• 37:47Sam Fragoso?

  When you're seventeen years old, you gave this interview, I think to Forbes, later on in life, and you said about this period, quote, "I had the chance to marry rich, I was getting good guys, and I felt like that could be a good ticket for me." When did you know you had to throw away that ticket?

• 38:05Speaker 01

  Oh, well, gay happened to me. It was one of the worst things. I know that people want to be gay. I didn't want anything else.

• 38:10Sam Fragoso?

  How, how, how did it happen to you?

• 38:13Speaker 01

  I met a girl. I didn't grow up thinking I'm gay and this and that. I was, I literally didn't think of it. And then I met somebody in Segep, which is like a pre-university, a col- like what we would call college in Montreal. I think Quebec is the only place that has this. And I, yeah, it felt different than a friendship, I guess, because I had friends who were girls my whole life, but nothing like that. And this was different. And I thought, she brought up the idea of gay, like, what if I kissed you? I remember her telling me this. I said, kissed me? What are you fucking gay? Like, I thought this girl was like nuts. Like, to even suggest something so sick. And I just ignored her, stopped talking to her, and then she would,

• 38:59Speaker 01

  you know, weasel her way back in. A little bit, like, we would talk, or sometimes she needed help with an essay. Like, I would, for money, sometimes write somebody's paper. For like $200, I'll write your paper. I remember I did this once for her. She gave me like $200 and I wrote her paper, and I got her a better grade than me. So I stopped really doing that. I realized I didn't have it in me to compete against myself. I'm like, I don't want to get 85, she's got 90. Like, it's just, it bothered me. So, but yeah, so we did small things like that. I, I would say we kept it professional, school professional. So then I was, I remember thinking so many nights, like, another thing? Like, I gotta be gay now? Like, I was, I had a whole plan that I was gonna graduate with a university degree. I was gonna marry rich, because at this point,

• 39:45Speaker 01

  I was poor and pretty judged for it in the community that I was surrounded by. But the fellas didn't care that as much, sometimes as the girls. Because I was low-key cute. I was a bit of a cutie. And I can be, by the way, I'm low-key pretty. I'll say that. It's never, if I could, trust me, I could do it up if I want to. Trust me.

• 40:06Sam Fragoso?

  I, I, I think.

• 40:07Speaker 01

  You seem doubtful.

• 40:08Sam Fragoso?

  I think it's here today. No.

• 40:09Speaker 01

  Thank you. Thank you.

• 40:11Sam Fragoso?

  There, there's, there is no doubt in my mind.

• 40:13Speaker 01

  Thank you. I appreciate that.

• 40:14Sam Fragoso?

  I, I, I've been looking at you for 45 minutes now.

• 40:16Speaker 01

  Thank you. Thank you. And I have, yeah, I have nice eyes and good skin. Okay, thank you.

• 40:20Sam Fragoso?

  Skin's fantastic.

• 40:21Speaker 01

  Thank you. So, I always had like a safe guy friend, like a, like a guy friend who would confess his love for me ultimately. But I'm like, what's he doing? But in this, but, but while he's in love with me, I'm also very safe around them. Maybe their family, I got close to their families where they lived rich and things I loved. Like, you know, like a richer lifestyle. They had a dog or they had a pool or, you know what I mean? They had snacks galore, their snacks, the pantry, you could walk into it. All of this I was exposed to and I thought that that could be a great ticket for me. And in fact, I had a friend who told me often that this, he could do that for me. He knew that I wanted that. He said, you would never have to work.

• 41:03Speaker 01

  So then when the threat of being gay happened, I go, I gotta make money now. I gotta make money. I realized immediately I'd have to make some serious money. This would be a big shift versus just marrying rich, which was my first plan.

• 41:20Sam Fragoso?

  Hmm. So for people who don't know, you get a business degree in accounting and communications.

• 41:25Speaker 01

  Thank you.

• 41:26Sam Fragoso?

  You get a job right out of school.

• 41:28Speaker 01

  Thank you.

• 41:29Sam Fragoso?

  At an accounting firm.

• 41:30Speaker 01

  Thank you.

• 41:30Sam Fragoso?

  Where, where you work during the day.

• 41:32Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 41:32Sam Fragoso?

  And perform stand up at night.

• 41:34Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 41:35Sam Fragoso?

  At your first open mic.

• 41:36Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 41:37Sam Fragoso?

  How'd it do?

• 41:38Speaker 01

  It was brutal. Bro, I gotta be honest with you.

• 41:41Sam Fragoso?

  You call me bro.

• 41:41Speaker 01

  Yeah, because it was like, I gotta get real now.

• 41:44Sam Fragoso?

  We're at the bro stage.

• 41:45Speaker 01

  Yeah, we're at the bro stage with you. Yeah, I, I fucked with you since the first podcast I've heard, seeing you, everything. It's as expect, he's as delightful as you would imagine. Cause you know, you meet people sometimes or you see someone, it's like, oh, it's not like it was. Or this was, no, I'm like, and there it is.

• 42:01Sam Fragoso?

  I do know. I, I host this podcast.

• 42:03Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. How am I doing on that scale?

• 42:06Sam Fragoso?

  You're doing great.

• 42:06Speaker 01

  Really?

• 42:07Sam Fragoso?

  Mm hmm. So the, the first stand up, have you, have you, have you, have you ever bombed before?

• 42:12Speaker 01

  It's very rare.

• 42:13Sam Fragoso?

  It's very rare.

• 42:14Speaker 01

  It's very rare.

• 42:15Sam Fragoso?

  So when you hear about it, does it sound foreign? Does it sound strange?

• 42:17Speaker 01

  It does. It sounds weird that comics, it, it's kind of like, I watched, and I love him. I mean, I don't know him, but I love him, but I watched Judd Apatow's amazing documentary on Gary Shandling.

• 42:27Sam Fragoso?

  Mm hmm.

• 42:28Speaker 01

  And Gary Shandling. It's so funny that the first part of the documentary is talking about how much he's bombing. He's getting banned from this club. He's walking the audience. He's doing so bad. He had a deal that went bad. It's like, how many chances is this fucker getting? Like, it just had me, it had me respecting so many people who came up more. And shout out to him, he's worked it out and whatever. But it's like, wow, he got a lot of chances. You never hear Roseanne saying she was bombing for four years, or Ellen, or me. It's like, you kind of have to do well, still.

• 43:01Sam Fragoso?

  How much time did you give yourself when you first started out?

• 43:03Speaker 01

  Six months.

• 43:04Sam Fragoso?

  Six months?

• 43:05Speaker 01

  Six months, because I had that great job at KPMG. They gave me a laptop for keeps. And I thought, this is a great job, being paid every two weeks. If stand-up doesn't work, okay, I'm at this amazing job. But then stand-up was going good, and I was more and more conflicted.

• 43:19Sam Fragoso?

  But it was a job that you would often show up late to.

• 43:22Speaker 01

  Yes, it was, no, it's, I wouldn't wish going to a job.

• 43:25Sam Fragoso?

  Your soul wasn't in it.

• 43:26Speaker 01

  No, no, no, I showed up late. I remember my boss, Paul, would say, you know, it's 10 o'clock, we started at 8:30. It's okay. And he would say, you know, it's, so it's 10 o'clock and you're late. I said, listen, either you're gonna fire me or you're not. But if you're not gonna fire me, I got a lot of emails to catch up on. It's already 10 o'clock. So there was no managing me. That's why working for myself ended up working out. But just to circle back on the first stand-up night, it was at this place called, it was a loft on Prince Arthur called Too Much. It was run by George Braithwaite, who was a brilliant, brilliant comedian and friend at the time. And it was all filled with like homeless people, like coming in, you know, to shelter from the cold. And people were smoking inside.

• 44:10Speaker 01

  And I was kind of sheltered in a different way, obviously. And I was very dizzy. And I was very, when I got up, I was almost near faint. There was so much smoke. I did okay, even dizzy. Like, the few minutes I did do up there before I had to sit down? I'm like, even dizzy, even nauseous, I did okay.

• 44:30Sam Fragoso?

  Wow.

• 44:31Speaker 01

  So it's not to say it's never happened, but I'm just saying that when I hear comics going, "I'm bombing and you got a bomb." And I'm like, "Not really." If you're bombing that much, maybe, maybe you ought to rethink.

• 44:43Sam Fragoso?

  It takes a decade to find your voice.

• 44:45Speaker 01

  It's only that too. It took a decade. I had older guys telling me it takes a decade. You know, I'm like 25, "It takes a decade to, to, to find your voice." And that's the first thing I heard. It was the opposite. Everybody was saying, "Your voice? Like where did you come from?" So I realized I couldn't listen to any of the things. Like it was all opposite. It was gonna be on my way. I'm gonna go slow and steady. I'm just gonna do good. I didn't have any gimmicks, nothing. And so I think that's also why people are feeling the swell underneath me. Why I'm carrying, why I wanna take everybody with me is because it's one of the last times where just doing good is good enough. But you have to really, if you're only selling good, then you gotta be consistently good.

• 45:30Speaker 01

  Because it's the only thing I'm coming with.

• 45:32Sam Fragoso?

  But also effort. You would go to Ottawa, to Waterloo for 10-minute sets.

• 45:37Speaker 01

  Of course.

• 45:38Sam Fragoso?

  You'd travel by Greyhound bus to get there.

• 45:40Speaker 01

  Shout out to the Greyhound.

• 45:41Sam Fragoso?

  So do you think you found your voice before you found the material?

• 45:44Speaker 01

  I didn't even find it. I had it.

• 45:46Sam Fragoso?

  You had it.

• 45:47Speaker 01

  I'm not finding anything.

• 45:48Sam Fragoso?

  You didn't find anything.

• 45:49Speaker 01

  Nothing I have found.

• 45:50Sam Fragoso?

  We're, we're trying to find something.

• 45:51Speaker 01

  It's like when people go, "Oh, I'm finding material." I'm like, "I'm just looking."

• 45:54Sam Fragoso?

  Okay, you're looking.

• 45:55Speaker 01

  I'm just, no, I'm just like, my eyes and ears are open. It's like, I'm not trying. I'd rather not know all of this. I'd rather not think these things.

• 46:02Sam Fragoso?

  What do you mean you'd rather not think these things?

• 46:03Speaker 01

  Like, why do I have to think about these things? Why do I have to like? I'm just saying the fact that I'm on a plane, I was on a plane once with a lady next to me. Okay, and you know, like, and she was ordering Pinot Grigio, white wine. I don't know if it's Pinot Grigio, but white wine. I think it sounded something fancy like that. And she was enjoying it. And she would put her hat on, mall cop too. With Kevin James, who I think is very funny.

• 46:28Sam Fragoso?

  Mm hmm.

• 46:29Speaker 01

  Okay, so she has Mall Cop two on. It's not even Mall Cop one. Now, I can't hear, but she is already laughing. Like, I could feel the rumble, like, just at the setup.

• 46:38Sam Fragoso?

  Mm hmm.

• 46:39Speaker 01

  By the time they got to their pratfall punchline, or whatever the fuck they're doing in that movie, she is plucked. She's done on the floor. And I was honestly jealous because I was still looking for something to watch.

• 46:51Sam Fragoso?

  Hmm.

• 46:51Speaker 01

  It takes me so much to, to really enjoy. And here's a lady who can throw on anything and enjoy life. That type of a life does entice me. And I wonder if even one day of just that.

• 47:07Sam Fragoso?

  Hmm.

• 47:08Speaker 01

  What that would do for me. Because right now, I go and I go, ah. Like, for me, and I've taught, for me to complain is to enjoy.

• 47:16Sam Fragoso?

  Well, that's what I was gonna ask you. Isn't that enjoyable?

• 47:19Speaker 01

  Well, that's how I enjoy. Glove to enjoy is to enjoy. But for me, to complain is to enjoy. It means I'm present and I'm, I'm, I'm living. What's the word? Not, um.

• 47:30Sam Fragoso?

  Oh, mindfully.

• 47:31Speaker 01

  It's me living mindfully.

• 47:33Sam Fragoso?

  Right.

• 47:34Speaker 01

  Is to go, huh, there's a draft, or.

• 47:38Speaker 01

  You know, it's like, I'm enjoying, actually.

• 47:40Sam Fragoso?

  Right.

• 47:41Speaker 01

  Because I like, like, I'm like, oh, the window's open, but should I close it a little bit?

• 47:44Sam Fragoso?

  Hmm.

• 47:45Speaker 01

  There is a draft. But it means I'm feeling everything. I'm in the space. I'm, I'm whatever it is.

• 47:50Sam Fragoso?

  So on your first special, I'm nervous.

• 47:53Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 47:53Sam Fragoso?

  What was some of the material that, that you liked, that you thought, okay, I think I got something here?

• 47:59Speaker 01

  I liked all of it.

• 48:00Sam Fragoso?

  You liked all of it?

• 48:01Speaker 01

  Yeah, I think my material is really good.

• 48:03Sam Fragoso?

  Mm hmm.

• 48:03Speaker 01

  I mean, that's the thing with stand-up. It's like, people ask me, like, what do I like to? I think if I think if something's funny, it's probably funny.

• 48:09Sam Fragoso?

  So the woman on the plane who liked the Paul Blart Mall Cop movie.

• 48:14Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 48:14Sam Fragoso?

  Would she qualify for someone that has zero personality disorder?

• 48:18Speaker 01

  Yes, she would have zero personality disorder.

• 48:20Sam Fragoso?

  Explain that to people.

• 48:21Speaker 01

  I mean, people suffer from this, and it's, it's really, we, it's very new, and, and, and people, people aren't really aware of it. And I'm here, you know, I like to, to spread awareness, but many people I know suffer from zero personality disorder. I was, I, I discovered this, I had a friend who would have stories, for instance, that had no story. For instance, we would get to class, and she would say, should we get to class? She'd be like, you know, I went to park and there was already a quarter in the meter. Okay.

• 48:48Sam Fragoso?

  That's it.

• 48:48Speaker 01

  That's but she would like pitch it as this big. And well, again, sometimes everybody's seen a little more time in the meter like.

• 48:57Sam Fragoso?

  Would these people have big, eventful weekends?

• 48:59Speaker 01

  So this is the same person she ended up like working in HR and, you know, society handled her perfectly. And then became like a weekend worrier, you know, you have to the Friday, the Saturday, you gotta go out, you gotta do activities. They're painting pottery, they're they're rock climbing, they're doing nonsense because you just. They equate having many activities for a personality. But unfortunately, that's not how it works. When people ask me what I do on the weekend, it's nothing because I have a personality. So I don't have guilt, you know, binging the 50 Cent Sean Combs docu-series in a day.

• 49:36Sam Fragoso?

  Do you celebrate Pride?

• 49:38Speaker 01

  No, what am I doing at Pride? You gotta have, you gotta be proud to be a Pride.

• 49:43Sam Fragoso?

  You're not proud?

• 49:44Speaker 01

  No, gain a shame to the day I die, just leave us out of it. Dykes, we had nothing to do with the Pride festivities. I never would have come up with a parade.

• 49:51Sam Fragoso?

  Wait, wait, wait, they're not involved?

• 49:54Speaker 01

  We are not involved.

• 49:55Sam Fragoso?

  Why aren't lesbians involved?

• 49:56Speaker 01

  March naked down the street. That is a game. We would have stayed home with the cat. I I'm not, I'm not marching in the sun.

• 50:04Sam Fragoso?

  You weren't part of the committee?

• 50:05Speaker 01

  No, and I wish they wish they would ask me more, you know, dykes get mad at me, people get mad at me. It's so funny, queer people think I never do nothing for the queer community. I get a lot of flack that they didn't see me at Pride or I didn't post enough about Brittany Griner's triumphant return to the US. That I don't do enough for the community. Do you see what I got done? Sam, do you see what I got done? My wife had 25 boyfriends. She was the bachelor, she had 25 boyfriends three years ago. Did I get it done? Did I? I'm an inspiration to this community, am I not?

• 50:36Sam Fragoso?

  You really are, you really are.

• 50:38Speaker 01

  I'm the Michael Jordan of this motherfucking community. They could have a float for me at Pride, maybe then I'll show up. How's that?

• 50:43Sam Fragoso?

  Why haven't they already done that?

• 50:45Speaker 01

  It's insane.

• 50:46Sam Fragoso?

  Maybe if you win the Emmy for hacks.

• 50:47Speaker 01

  Thank you.

• 50:48Sam Fragoso?

  They'll do a float.

• 50:49Speaker 01

  Thank you, six lines on Eminem, is that insane?

• 50:53Sam Fragoso?

  You know, speaking of the community.

• 50:54Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 50:55Sam Fragoso?

  They, them, you know, there's been a lot of conversation about it.

• 50:58Speaker 01

  They botched the rollout, they, them.

• 51:00Sam Fragoso?

  You think the rollout was bad?

• 51:01Speaker 01

  The rollout was bad because they said it's seamless, it's easy. It wasn't seamless, it wasn't easy. It's not something you can say.

• 51:06Sam Fragoso?

  Take it back to the beginning. What, what was the problem with the rollout?

• 51:09Speaker 01

  First of all, they didn't consult any of the members of this community, okay? As somebody reluctantly, whether I want to be a member or not, I look like the face of it. So they're not even going to ask people who are standing there, this Brooklyn bitch with a boyfriend is making a decision for me when I have to look like this.

• 51:26Sam Fragoso?

  Wesleyan.

• 51:27Speaker 01

  Like you, by the way, you should have been consulted as much as me. We have a similar look. Okay? I would say that they should have come to the people who are the face of such a thing.

• 51:38Sam Fragoso?

  You think I could have been one of the faces?

• 51:39Speaker 01

  Well, just the, the, the, the middle part and the, I, I think I, I, I have an affinity for you. I think you can understand me more than some of these sometimes because they would know, hey, Rob, how can we make your life easier? You know what it's not? It's not suddenly I gotta be plural and explain to everybody. I'm not even in the mood. I wasn't in the mood for a new project. I wasn't in the mood for a campaign. I have to go campaigning now? I'm not running for anything. I'm not running for, like, here's the whole thing. It's like, they botched the rollout. I do agree. I just, I do agree that, yes, they, they bring their logic, but it takes this much time to explain it. This is how already unseamless it is. They, them can be used as a singular.

• 52:24Speaker 01

  When you're standing in line at the 7-Eleven, at the bodega, and somebody's in front of you, you'd be like, they were here first. If you get into a car accident, class for shalom, God forbid, you hit someone, you don't know who you hit, you'd be like, I hit them. You, you don't know who it is, okay? You don't know if it's girl, but it's used more rarely. than it is for the plural. And it's not seamless. They're still having problems with it. I don't care to be understood. Some people really want to be understood. So that's fair. I think it's all valid. I don't care if anybody understands me. I understand me. That's like really good enough for me.

• 53:00Sam Fragoso?

  I've been trying to understand you.

• 53:01Speaker 01

  Yeah, like, but I don't care if somebody. Like people, like people love to be seen.

• 53:07Sam Fragoso?

  Yeah.

• 53:07Speaker 01

  And seen in kind of like a philosophical sense.

• 53:10Sam Fragoso?

  And heard.

• 53:11Speaker 01

  I don't care as much about that. Like some people, maybe they grew up with their parents always watching everything and taking pictures. We left with nothing. I don't even really have pictures because we left everything behind when my mother took us to Canada. So I guess I'm like so comfortable not being. I just got comfortable with myself. Like I get me, what, what, for me to know. And you find out like I, it's just, I don't need that to be seen by everyone. The less they know, sometimes the better. Especially my private where it's like, what is your, I'm like, something's off. Just leave it be. You see Robby, she's in her brother's pants. Just leave it be. Just leave it be. What, you're gonna right away go up to her? What's your pronouns? Something is off.

• 53:54Sam Fragoso?

  Are people asking you?

• 53:55Speaker 01

  Yeah, people go, you know, what are you, I'm like, something's off.

• 53:58Sam Fragoso?

  So you always had yourself. There was all the, the self possession. I mean, going back to one of your first jobs, working at the Chris Gethard Show.

• 54:07Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 54:07Sam Fragoso?

  There were somewhere between 800 and a thousand packets that were sent.

• 54:12Speaker 01

  I love that the number always changes. Like 800 is like two, yeah.

• 54:15Sam Fragoso?

  Who the hell knows?

• 54:16Speaker 01

  It was a lot of packets. There's these jobs are few and far.

• 54:18Sam Fragoso?

  The point is, he didn't know who you were.

• 54:20Speaker 01

  No.

• 54:21Sam Fragoso?

  You sent in a blind packet?

• 54:22Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 54:23Sam Fragoso?

  He said yes.

• 54:24Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 54:25Sam Fragoso?

  Why do you think you did?

• 54:26Speaker 01

  This was the best packet. Again, I just do good work. Well, you send in blind packets for those listening, they don't know how, how, how this works. For some of these late night shows and to call the Chris Gethard Show a late night show is really an, an overstatement, but um. What happens is you submit.

• 54:43Sam Fragoso?

  It's really catching a stray there.

• 54:44Speaker 01

  And he's used to that, believe me. And, and you submit, for instance, if you want to work on Kimmel, or you want to work on Fallon, and they have a job open, they'll go out to writers to say, submit 10 segments we can do, a million jokes and different ideas for the show, whatever. So I, when his packet came up, it's a writing job, so I'll do anything. I watched one episode of a show, I said, what is it even? Who cares? Like, it's not even, this is the easiest thing, I can't even believe they would pass. So I sent in a packet where I just vomited ideas onto the page. And I got on to the show.

• 55:21Sam Fragoso?

  I want to get to this new special because this year, which I think Vogue called the year of Robby Hoffman. She's in Dying for Sex, she's in Hacks, she's got a special.

• 55:32Speaker 01

  What can she do?

• 55:32Sam Fragoso?

  You, you got married this year?

• 55:34Speaker 01

  Did I get it done?

• 55:35Sam Fragoso?

  My god.

• 55:36Speaker 01

  I'm an inspiration, Sam.

• 55:38Sam Fragoso?

  You said, what, you say Jordan for the gay community?

• 55:40Speaker 01

  Yes, I think I am.

• 55:42Sam Fragoso?

  You said earlier that you've never bombed on stage.

• 55:44Speaker 01

  No, no, no, I'm not saying I never, but it's, it's, it's, so it should be a rare thing.

• 55:48Sam Fragoso?

  A rarity.

• 55:49Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 55:49Sam Fragoso?

  Have, have you ever bombed on a Zoom?

• 55:51Speaker 01

  It's also very rare. I happen to be good at what I do.

• 55:55Sam Fragoso?

  Okay, how about, how about?

• 55:56Speaker 01

  So sue me.

• 55:57Sam Fragoso?

  How about, how about in a labor dispute?

• 55:59Speaker 01

  You're getting to the WGA, this is what you're bringing up with me now?

• 56:02Sam Fragoso?

  That's what I'm bringing up with you.

• 56:03Speaker 01

  Now, listen, I'm a member, whether I want to be or not, the WGA.

• 56:07Sam Fragoso?

  Doesn't sound like you want to be.

• 56:07Speaker 01

  Well, A, I have no healthcare with them because they make it impossible to figure out how to figure that out.

• 56:12Sam Fragoso?

  That's not right.

• 56:13Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 56:13Sam Fragoso?

  Why no healthcare?

• 56:14Speaker 01

  You're stuck in bureaucratic hell.

• 56:18Sam Fragoso?

  Let's cut this part, we don't want that part on there.

• 56:20Speaker 01

  We don't?

• 56:20Sam Fragoso?

  You don't want the part where you're not having healthcare, unless you want to do it.

• 56:24Speaker 01

  Why?

• 56:25Sam Fragoso?

  I don't know, the union will get a, I.

• 56:27Speaker 01

  Oh, they do? Well, they, no, they have to make it easier, you know what? I think you should keep the whole thing in here, especially with how, I don't care. Why are we afraid of our own union? I'm in the union.

• 56:35Sam Fragoso?

  I'm, I'm in the union.

• 56:35Speaker 01

  When you say the union, you're talking about me.

• 56:37Sam Fragoso?

  Yeah, I am.

• 56:38Speaker 01

  Because I'm a member of the ISACOP.

• 56:40Sam Fragoso?

  Writers Guild of America, East and West or something.

• 56:43Speaker 01

  We need healthcare to be more accessible, if it's, by the way, I qualify for it.

• 56:48Sam Fragoso?

  Okay.

• 56:49Speaker 01

  So then just give it to me.

• 56:50Sam Fragoso?

  I don't understand.

• 56:51Speaker 01

  What are these hoops and forms and this? It's very difficult. I want to just send in my ID and you just do the rest of it.

• 56:58Sam Fragoso?

  Summer of 2023, they decide to go on strike.

• 57:01Speaker 01

  I just started making a little bit of money, Sam. I just, by the grace of God, I just sold my show. Thank you, which is a feat.

• 57:09Sam Fragoso?

  Beautiful.

• 57:09Speaker 01

  I'm just starting to make a little bit of money. I'm making, I'm making my rent, doing what I love. It's a miracle. You never hear of it. It's the last American dream.

• 57:18Sam Fragoso?

  You're touring a little bit?

• 57:20Speaker 01

  A little bit. We're starting to sell out. People are going, oh, I'll go to the Robby show. People are coming. Hey, Rob, can we get more tickets? I'm posting, hey, guys, it's sold out. Is there any more tickets?

• 57:29Sam Fragoso?

  It's what we call a chapter turn.

• 57:31Speaker 01

  Thank you. I didn't know that. It's a chapter turn. Okay, yeah, we're in a new chapter. And by the way, speaking of, I think by the time this airs, we are adding more shows. Not many, not many, not many. Okay, I'm in no mood.

• 57:46Sam Fragoso?

  I will plug it in the intro.

• 57:47Speaker 01

  Yes, okay, so, so just check out robbyhoffman.com.

• 57:51Sam Fragoso?

  I'll plug that in the intro.

• 57:52Speaker 01

  I didn't realize that the Netflix would resonate so much and it came out on such a weird, difficult weekend. But then the, the whole thing, we're adding a few more shows. So I don't have the temperament for any more than whatever's on there. There's people say, oh, you're, you're touring the country. You're doing eight cities. I go, yeah. By the way, I know because I give a real good show. I don't like to be burnt out.

• 58:13Sam Fragoso?

  I understand.

• 58:14Speaker 01

  Some people like to be burnt out. It's not for me to burn out.

• 58:16Sam Fragoso?

  You're well rested.

• 58:17Speaker 01

  Thank you.

• 58:18Sam Fragoso?

  I see no bags under the eyes.

• 58:20Speaker 01

  Thank you. Beautiful. Thank you.

• 58:22Sam Fragoso?

  Moisturizer?

• 58:23Speaker 01

  Yeah, I use whatever's available.

• 58:25Sam Fragoso?

  So I get it. You were having, you were having, you were starting to have this moment.

• 58:27Speaker 01

  I'm starting to have this.

• 58:28Sam Fragoso?

  In the summer of 2023.

• 58:30Speaker 01

  They call a strike, but they say it's not just that we have a strike, that we're going on strike. We are going to have a general assembly meeting. Every member of the union has to go to this meeting. If they don't go to the meeting, they could be like docked demerit points. They could be like losing their healthcare. Like the, the, the, the union would punish the members in some way.

• 58:47Sam Fragoso?

  Which you didn't have anyway.

• 58:48Speaker 01

  Which I didn't have anyway, but I was on thin ice. So I, so we all went there. So it's like 3,000 writers or something fill this massive auditorium, like, like a UCLA football field type of audit, like just a huge auditorium. All these writers, showrunners, people have to go to it. And we had to sign in. They made you put your member number so, so that you, you know, so everybody was like very into getting there and making sure they signed in, whether they stayed or not. And then we had a big Q and A. And I got up on the Q and A and as you know, Salmon, you mentioned I have a background in accounting. Thank you very much.

• 59:23Sam Fragoso?

  By the grace of God.

• 59:24Speaker 01

  By the grace of God. And I thought I would be remiss if I, as a former accountant, didn't take a look at the union's numbers.

• 59:31Sam Fragoso?

  You checked the books.

• 59:32Speaker 01

  They want us to be involved. I'm getting involved. I do a simple look see. I go to the union. We're non-for-profit. I find their financial statements and I give a look at the balance sheet. So sue me if I take a look at an income statement. I want to see what are they making in, in membership dues, which we pay one and a half percent on everything that we make to them. And where are the, where's that money going?

• 59:54Sam Fragoso?

  So what did you find in the books?

• 59:55Speaker 01

  We have a lot of real estate.

• 59:57Sam Fragoso?

  Hmm.

• 59:57Speaker 01

  It's giving, we work. I don't, we work was, was pitching that it was, you know, Scientology is picking, pitching it's this, it's this new religion. But actually it's, you know, it's a shell for real estate.

• 1:00:10Sam Fragoso?

  So you say what in the meeting?

• 1:00:12Speaker 01

  So I didn't realize, first of all, the vibes of the Q and A was really that everybody's cues, which stands for questions, was not questions. It was like hoo-ha energy of the strike. Like terrific, we're not working. And as, as somebody who just started working, I'm like, who's cheering this? Right?

• 1:00:29Sam Fragoso?

  It was a pep rally.

• 1:00:30Speaker 01

  It was more of a pep rally. And I'm going, why are we striking? They said, you know, we're gonna go on strike, we're gonna fight back. I said, we should have been fighting back with litigation. Striking should be the absolute last resort of any union. It should not be the first. And it felt like this union, from the small research I did, was, was forcing its members to strike as, as a first defense, rather than a la, absolute last resort. We should be litigating. The studios versus the right, the studios are telling us they're sharks. They're telling us that they, you know, that they're trying to fuck us. And we believe them. We should take that seriously. We should also stack up with the world's greatest fucking lawyers from Harvard and Stanford, and we should be litigating at

• 1:01:14Speaker 01

  every turn, just like the studios do. The studios litigate everything. We should have a revolving door. We have enough money, one and a half percent on every writer, which is millions and millions of dollars, to hire the best lawyers. Instead, we're not fighting it in court. We're fighting it with ourselves, going on strike. I just felt like it was bringing a gun, you know, it was bringing a knife to a gunfight. I wanted more information about why we own this real estate. If we have to strike and people are going to be out with money, then let's offload our real estate, sell it and split the profits among the members.

• 1:01:45Sam Fragoso?

  And how did this go over?

• 1:01:47Speaker 01

  At first it was going really well. The writers like, huh, but then I asked the head of the union, why he makes over $2 million in membership dues? For a volunteer, non-for-profit position and they, and that's what they said.

• 1:02:02Sam Fragoso?

  That's a good question.

• 1:02:03Speaker 01

  They said, you got to, you have to sit down. He scolded me. I said, this is public information. Why are you making such a salary? I should have said to this man in a language that this room understood, woke language, I should have said to this rich, straight, white man making 2.1 million, I should have said, oh, so when he said, you need to sit down, as if I'm a child, as if I'm not a member of this union with outstanding dues that I still have not paid, as if. I should have said, so you're telling a straight, rich, white man telling a young queer woman to sit down when she has a question? She doesn't know the answer to, just so we're clear. But I didn't have the, I was already crying when he told me to sit down. I was like a little girl. He was talking to me and I was like,

• 1:02:47Speaker 01

  but then as months went on and the, and the strike waned, a lot of people were in my DMs. Like, hey, why are we? We weren't getting updates necessarily about the plan, how litigation was going. We had kind of a couple has-been writers who are now acting as lawyers and I'm like, can we get a resume from Harvard? Can we get somebody on this legal team? It's insane. You don't think Sony has the world's best lawyers?

• 1:03:15Sam Fragoso?

  But you were crying because you felt like?

• 1:03:17Speaker 01

  I care about all of us. I'm bringing our statements. I'm saying, why are we the first line of defense? Why isn't our union telling us or at least showing their works and we've been litigating something? Rather than telling us, okay, we're upset, we're going to strike again. This can't be our only move to throw us under the bus every single time. So it started a conversation. Listen, I could be wrong. I am wrong oftentimes. I'm just starting the, tell me where I'm wrong. Let's have the conversation. Let's bring everything to light.

• 1:03:47Sam Fragoso?

  Did you think you weren't going to work again?

• 1:03:48Speaker 01

  I thought I was never going to work again. My friend Carmen goes, shout out to Carmen Christopher, goes, we gotta get out of here. I said, that's it. It's a room again, Sam. Every writer in the city, powerful writers, some powerful TV creatives, powerful showrunners, people who are in positions, everybody booing me. But then a few months later, some people who booed me came back and they said, you know what? She has a point. And that's the thing with me. I'm a grower, not a shower.

• 1:04:15Sam Fragoso?

  Say more about that.

• 1:04:15Speaker 01

  Slow and steady wins the race. I've never been the overnight success. It takes a second. Okay, but she has a point. You come around. You come around. And that example was no different.

• 1:04:26Sam Fragoso?

  And Mulaney came around when?

• 1:04:28Speaker 01

  Apparently, he was one of the few real ones who said, this is the craziest thing I've seen, and that's the funniest person.

• 1:04:35Sam Fragoso?

  So for context, in GQ, John Mulaney, who directed this new special of yours, called the unofficial performance, quote, "one of the greatest show business debuts in history."

• 1:04:47Speaker 01

  Thank God. Look at God. Look at how that frown turned upside down. That's what I'm talking about when you ask me that some of my worst moments have become my best moments. In the moment, I thought, well, that's it. I'm going back to accounting. All these writers, oh, you know, how dare you question our supreme leaders? And then as their savings started to dwindle, they said, what was Robby talking about? Why don't we sell off the $40 million building we have on Sunset that sits empty? And divvy it up. Each get a little check, Trump-style COVID. Send us $1,400. Why not?

• 1:05:24Sam Fragoso?

  So now that you've made this special with Mulaney directing.

• 1:05:27Speaker 01

  By the grace of God.

• 1:05:28Sam Fragoso?

  How are you feeling?

• 1:05:30Speaker 01

  Awesome.

• 1:05:30Sam Fragoso?

  You were on the precipice just two years ago, thinking, I'm gonna have to go back to accounting.

• 1:05:35Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:05:35Sam Fragoso?

  I should go get that CPA, master's, whatever the hell it is.

• 1:05:38Speaker 01

  No, it's really a miracle I'm here. I understand why people, as they get successful, they become more religious, because they're always like, give it to God. And I don't give it to God, like specifically. I don't really even know what that is.

• 1:05:49Sam Fragoso?

  Who are you giving it to?

• 1:05:50Speaker 01

  Just to. Just by the grace of God, it doesn't necessarily mean God, it doesn't not be God. And I hope it is God, but it's just despite all of this, despite all of this.

• 1:06:03Sam Fragoso?

  And by this you mean?

• 1:06:05Speaker 01

  Incidents like this.

• 1:06:07Sam Fragoso?

  How you grew up.

• 1:06:08Speaker 01

  One of the worst.

• 1:06:09Sam Fragoso?

  Moving the way your family did.

• 1:06:11Speaker 01

  Horrible. How do you even get born Jewish and poor anymore? I was trying to think of this. I said, this has to be one of the worst bag fumbles I've ever seen. Because you have to imagine, you're a baby, you're born. Okay, you're born in New York. Okay, that's kind of cool. Jewish? Okay, shit is looking up. Welfare? What went wrong?

• 1:06:30Sam Fragoso?

  Mathematically.

• 1:06:31Speaker 01

  What went wrong? Right? So it's just, I've always been so close.

• 1:06:37Sam Fragoso?

  You said on your show, the billionaires have made us into money. It's over. I've stopped recycling. I'm trying to sell out as humanly possible.

• 1:06:46Speaker 01

  That's it. It's like you put me in this video game.

• 1:06:48Sam Fragoso?

  Tell me where you're at.

• 1:06:50Speaker 01

  That's what I'm doing. I'm not doing kids. I wouldn't wish this on my worst enemy. I'm not doing this again.

• 1:06:55Sam Fragoso?

  You're not doing one again?

• 1:06:56Speaker 01

  I know that I'm like this. Imagine I have a kid and he's like, you knew that I could have, I could be worried like you and you still, and I'm not doing this again.

• 1:07:03Sam Fragoso?

  So no, no children for you and Gary?

• 1:07:05Speaker 01

  Right. So let's just get as many tokens as we can, spread them out, share them, bring people to the party. And they forced us in here.

• 1:07:13Sam Fragoso?

  Why is this level so hard?

• 1:07:14Speaker 01

  It's just, what a mess. What is this? This is insane. Who thought of this?

• 1:07:19Sam Fragoso?

  By this, you mean what?

• 1:07:21Speaker 01

  The world. It's a, it's a very hard, so they're like, and you need these tokens to survive and to get this. And the tokens can be traded for healthcare, for this. Okay, so I'm trying to get the tokens now because it's worse without the tokens. It's definitely worse without the tokens. And I'm here to tell you that, that, that, that is a ruse, right? It is over, not because I ended it, because the power did.

• 1:07:42Sam Fragoso?

  There's no chance of, of riding the ship?

• 1:07:44Speaker 01

  I don't think there is much a chance. I do think we're too far gone.

• 1:07:47Sam Fragoso?

  This is hard because you, you did call yourself earlier, the, the people's comedian.

• 1:07:51Speaker 01

  I am the people's comedian, but the people know this.

• 1:07:54Sam Fragoso?

  Right.

• 1:07:54Speaker 01

  We have been knowing this.

• 1:07:55Sam Fragoso?

  And, and now you're telling us that, that, that the people are fucked.

• 1:07:58Speaker 01

  I think it's like a rich thing to really believe in the system. I think like that is like an ideology of like, okay, well, these Democrats or these Republicans, these establishment people are gonna help us. And I think the poor have seen their lives through both types of, you know, administrations and been like, nobody's coming for us. They don't know we're here. Hello? They've let us know that it's all a ruse and they have gone too far and they didn't heed any warnings. And God willing, more of us, I think the only antidote would be if more of us got through, but they've made that even harder. It took all of us to get me here. But like literally, it took all of you, anybody who's like, oh, like that's what it took for

• 1:08:43Speaker 01

  one person versus the rich, it takes, they do, the father calls one person and it's done. You know, going up poor and they, and they tell you things like money doesn't make happiness. Let me see for myself. Let me see for myself, because I'll tell you now that I have a little bit of kessa, I'm enjoying, I'm enjoying a lot more than when I didn't. So don't fucking lie to me when I'm down there. Because then you make me question, well, is this worth it? It's very worth it. It's very worth it. But they don't want you to think it is because they're afraid you're coming for theirs. And by the way, I am.

• 1:09:17Sam Fragoso?

  You are.

• 1:09:17Speaker 01

  By the way, I am. I'm right up behind you, bitch.

• 1:09:20Sam Fragoso?

  You have some people in mind?

• 1:09:21Speaker 01

  Anyone.

• 1:09:22Sam Fragoso?

  Anyone.

• 1:09:22Speaker 01

  And I'm telling, I'm that kid, I'm going, I'm going to the rich, I'm going to all your shit, and I'm running back to the people I'm saying, I'm telling. Do you know what the fuck I saw? I'm telling on you. I'm running back and I'm telling. That's what I'm doing.

• 1:09:37Sam Fragoso?

  You're like Paul Revere.

• 1:09:39Speaker 01

  Who is that?

• 1:09:40Sam Fragoso?

  He's the one I think that said the British are coming.

• 1:09:42Speaker 01

  Thank you.

• 1:09:42Sam Fragoso?

  You could take that.

• 1:09:43Speaker 01

  Well, you have it and we'll just, just keep it both recorded and put it out.

• 1:09:47Sam Fragoso?

  My last thing for you, I'd be remiss to not bring up the fact that we're talking just a few days after the murder of Rob Reiner.

• 1:09:56Speaker 01

  Oh, my God.

• 1:09:58Sam Fragoso?

  A comedic legend, someone who came on this show seven years ago.

• 1:10:03Speaker 01

  Oh, wow.

• 1:10:04Sam Fragoso?

  I looked at old photos, like I've.

• 1:10:06Speaker 01

  I didn't know that. Wow.

• 1:10:07Sam Fragoso?

  Obviously, like one of, one of the giants of, of comedy of the 21st century. What have you made of, of the last week here, or the last few days?

• 1:10:17Speaker 01

  I had my watch party. My Netflix special debuted just hours before all the horrors of Sydney and Rob Reiner unfolded. And then by 12 hours later, this, all this stuff happens. A lot of people didn't, the, the Rob Reiner news came right after we played my special at my house. I had a few close friends and some family and to watch it. I didn't want anything big. And my real takeaway, my brother, Shmuley is staying with me and, uh, Tim Dillon was over and a couple of people were over and, and my brother was a big fan, as am I, of Tim Dillon.

• 1:10:56Speaker 01

  And Tim was just on his phone, we were watching my special, great evening, and he finds out that Rob Reiner died. And, and tell, my brother, Shmuley is like, whoa. And then the only thing my brother, Shmuley, has been saying since he found out was, "Do you know that Tim Dillon told me? I found out about Rob Reiner dying because Tim Dillon personally told me." That has been, for some reason, and I hope Rob would appreciate that, that my brother was so excited that a comedian he loves told him about another comedian he loves dying. And so my takeaway is, it's all bittersweet. It's horrible, you know?

• 1:11:40Speaker 01

  Um, I don't even, I'm still processing, but I think the fact that my brother is both horrified and delighted to have heard the news from one of his idols is where I'll leave it.

• 1:11:53Sam Fragoso?

  A, a lot of people found out through Donald Trump.

• 1:11:55Speaker 01

  Oh, that tweet was horrible.

• 1:11:57Sam Fragoso?

  I don't know if you saw it. Um, can you take a look at this?

• 1:11:59Speaker 01

  Yes, I'm not going to read this. It was, you want me to read it? I think both sides, this is again, where we start to realize it's not you versus me. He's a baby. He's like, he's bad with words. He's like, bad at language. He can't even write. Like, we have a president who can't even write. It started with Kofifi, remember Konfifi or whatever?

• 1:12:19Sam Fragoso?

  Of course, of course.

• 1:12:20Speaker 01

  Like, he can't even write. Like, we don't have a president who reads and writes, never mind. Which, by the way, I haven't read a book since so far, but I read things. I don't know. This is just, I mean, I think everyone has condemned this. Have they? I haven't been on the online.

• 1:12:36Sam Fragoso?

  But I guess I bring this up because you talk about like, it's not about Democrats, not about Republicans.

• 1:12:40Speaker 01

  No, exactly.

• 1:12:42Sam Fragoso?

  And people are listening to this at the end of the year, after what has been, let's just say reasonably not a good year for this country.

• 1:12:49Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:12:50Sam Fragoso?

  You keep going and want to do comedy? How and why?

• 1:12:54Speaker 01

  I mean, I just, just what I do. This is how I toil. I don't, I wouldn't, I never chose comedy. I wouldn't choose a calling on my worst enemy. It came to me and I felt.

• 1:13:04Sam Fragoso?

  But what do you mean? You wouldn't, you wouldn't.

• 1:13:06Speaker 01

  Like, some people want to do comedy.

• 1:13:08Sam Fragoso?

  Right.

• 1:13:08Speaker 01

  I never wanted to do anything. I wanted to marry rich. And then, and then I heard about comedy and I thought, oh, that seems like something I could be good at. But I was hoping not. I don't want to have to pursue something and every night and go out.

• 1:13:22Sam Fragoso?

  This, this sounds like when you discovered you were gay.

• 1:13:24Speaker 01

  No, exactly. I just wanted to keep steady, keep the course, marry rich. You get to go to this rich school, you're meeting rich boys. This is a gift from God. So then it's like gay and then it's like, what, I gotta be an artist? It's horrible. Now, some people want to do comedy, whatever. I wouldn't wish a calling on my worst enemy. You, you mentioned, I'm on Greyhounds, I'm going to Waterloo. Who's even heard of it? Who wants to go? So, so no, it has been the rich versus the poor, continues to be the rich versus the poor, and I hope more moments like this expose that. We hit a fever pitch of divide and conquer, and that is, that is by design by the powerful.

• 1:14:06Sam Fragoso?

  I will say that is the kind of depressing and fittingly depressing advice, I think.

• 1:14:13Speaker 01

  And by the way, that's optimistic. I feel this is, this is as positive as I get.

• 1:14:17Sam Fragoso?

  Yeah, I think you've done a good job.

• 1:14:19Speaker 01

  Thank you so much.

• 1:14:20Sam Fragoso?

  Being as positive as you could be.

• 1:14:21Speaker 01

  Thank, I'm actually a positive person. This is just the circumstance that I have to report on.

• 1:14:24Sam Fragoso?

  You're the opposite of Ellen, is that right?

• 1:14:25Speaker 01

  I am opposite Ellen. Thank you, Sam, for noticing. People, you know how Ellen purports to be kind and nice? She was up there dancing. She's actually a terror to work with. Well, I come out aggressive. I'm a little, okay, fine, it's a little pessimistic. I'm a little rough around the edges, but I'm actually a fucking delight to work with, am I not?

• 1:14:44Sam Fragoso?

  You, you've been a delight.

• 1:14:45Speaker 01

  Thank you.

• 1:14:45Sam Fragoso?

  You've been a delight.

• 1:14:46Speaker 01

  Thank you. It'll come out one damn kind. You wait and see. Until then, you can check out my Netflix special. Wake Up. Out now.

• 1:14:55Sam Fragoso?

  Can I say one last thing?

• 1:14:57Speaker 01

  Yes, it's your show. Go ahead.

• 1:14:59Sam Fragoso?

  As it continues to get better for you.

• 1:15:00Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:15:01Sam Fragoso?

  And it will.

• 1:15:02Speaker 01

  Thank you.

• 1:15:03Sam Fragoso?

  May you continue telling.

• 1:15:05Speaker 01

  Thank you for supporting me. We did this. And Sam, we did this today. And I really appreciate you having me on. Big fan, truly. Can I keep the mug? By the way, you have a white mug. Do you have that color? Or I have to keep this one? I like this one, too. But yours, I've been looking at the whole time. Because I can even use yours. I'll wash it. It's not, it's a mug. You know what I mean? Let's say you, somebody was staying with me. They might drink out of it or wash it.

• 1:15:27Sam Fragoso?

  Can I tell you, given everything we've talked about, I'll get you a new one.

• 1:15:31Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 1:15:32Sam Fragoso?

  Robby Hoffman, thank you for the time.

• 1:15:34Speaker 01

  Thank you, Sam. Thank you, Talk Easy. I really appreciate it.

• 1:16:10Sam Fragoso?

  And that's our show. If you enjoyed today's episode with Robby Hoffman, be sure to share the program on social media, tag us at Talk Easy Pod. I want to give a special thanks this week to Covert Creative and of course, our guest Robby Hoffman. Her new stand-up special, Wake Up, is now streaming exclusively on Netflix. For more episodes with very funny people, I'd recommend Seth Meyers, Rami Youssef, and Julia Louis-Dreyfus. You can now watch this episode with Robby in full on video. Go over to YouTube, type in Talk Easy with Sam Fragoso, or click the link in the description. Be sure to subscribe to the channel. Follow

• 1:16:50Sam Fragoso?

  us over on Instagram and Twitter at Talk Easy Pod. Talk Easy is produced by Caroline Reebok. Our executive producer is Janix Bravo. Today's talk was edited by Corey Attad and Kaitlin Dryden. It was mixed by Andrew Vast. Dola, engineered by Tim Moore out of York Recording in Los Angeles, California. Video by Red Gaskell and Alex Leo Garcia. Our music is by Dylan Peck. Our illustrations are by Kresha Shanoi. Photographs today come from Simi Malik. Graphic design by Ian Jones. Research assistance from Callie Saringas. This episode was made in partnership with Higher Ground Media, and I'm Sam Fragoso. Thank you for listening to Talk Easy. I'll see you back here next Sunday with Gwyneth Paltrow. Until then, Happy New Year.

• 1:17:35Sam Fragoso?

  Stay safe, and see you.