Why Are Some iPhones Turning Pink?

It was a headlines in a hat week because there was just so much to talk about! First, we get into the new Galaxy XR headset from Samsung and Google before talking about why some iPhones 17 Pro are turning pink. We also talked about the new Liquid Glass beta, the ChatGPT Atlas browser, and the AWS outage before getting into trivia. Enjoy! Links: MKBHD - Android XR video: https://youtu.be/az5QL_NLBvg?si=k9779Ar8zAIfC-E7 MKBHD - M5 Apple Vision Pro video: https://youtu.be/rU9aqBv0YdY?si=g5fMXWYPpUZfJl_A Waveform - ICANN and the 7 keys to the internet: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=26WvISI14g0 Reddit - Pink iPhone thread: https://www.reddit.com/r/iPhone17Pro/comments/1o9ynrs/my_cosmic_orange_iphone_17_pro_is_turning_pink/?share_id=jIF7nlwCqxYBOL82Fpd8h 9to5Mac - Pink iPhone: https://9to5mac.com/2025/10/21/viral-rose-gold-iphone-17-pro-discoloration/ OpenAI ChatGPT Atlas: https://openai.com/index/introducing-chatgpt-atlas/ Apple TV x F1: https://openai.com/index/introducing-chatgpt-atlas/ Verge - Color e-ink photo frame: https://www.theverge.com/tech/803173/aura-e-ink-digital-photo-frame Verge - Liquid Glass Beta: https://www.theverge.com/news/802963/apple-liquid-glass-ios-26-1-beta-tint-option Verge - SpaceX launches 10,000th satellite: https://www.theverge.com/news/802509/starlink-launches-10000th-internet-satellite Waveform - New Space Race: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vcbkn6LQlbE Music provided by Epidemic Sound Shop the merch: https://shop.mkbhd.com Social: Waveform Threads: https://www.threads.net/@waveformpodcast Waveform Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/waveformpodcast/?hl=en Hosts: Marques: https://www.threads.net/@mkbhd Andrew: https://www.threads.net/@andrew_manganelli David: https://www.threads.net/@davidimel Adam: https://www.threads.net/@parmesanpapi17 Ellis: https://twitter.com/EllisRovin TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@waveformpodcast Join the Discord: https://discord.gg/mkbhd Music by 20syl: https://bit.ly/2S53xlC Waveform is part of the Vox Media Podcast Network. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Andrew Manganelli?

  This episode is brought to you by On Investing, an original podcast from Charles Schwab. Each week, host Lizanne Saunders, Schwab's Chief Investment Strategist, and Colin Martin, Head of Fixed Income Research and Strategy for the Schwab Center for Financial Research, bring your fresh insights on what's happening in the markets and why, and what the implications might be for your portfolio. Join Colin and Lizanne as they explore questions like, how do you evaluate corporate bonds that look interesting? And what sectors are on the move right now? Download the latest episodes and subscribe at schwab.com/oninvesting or wherever you get your podcasts.

• 0:33Speaker 01

  Support for the show comes from Jira by Atlassian. AI is only as useful as the context it has to work from, but when that context is scattered across tools, threads, and DMs, that means your team and your AI agents end up flying blind. That's the problem that Jira solves. What's the goal tied to your project? What got decided last week in Slack? Atlassian's teamwork graph pulls all these pieces together, from Jira, Confluence, Slack, GitHub, and more, so nothing falls through the cracks. With Jira, you can actually share that context with the AI agents you already use, like Claude, Cursor, and GitHub Copilot, assign them work directly, or connect your agents through MCP. Spend less time digging through endless links and DMs, less time chasing down what got decided and by who, and more time actually shipping. Learn more at jira.com.

• 1:18Speaker 01

  That's J-I-R-A dot com.

• 1:21David Imel?

  And I was like, well, you know what? This isn't such a big deal, because I'll spend the money that I have on a new one to give to him, but if I find it, I get a new toy. And Did you ever find it? I did. It was hanging, it was hanging on like the side handle of the car. Oh, that's such a good toy story. That's some Toy Story.

• 1:40Andrew Manganelli?

  I don't remember. You actually left it at a pizza joint, and it was just trying to get back into the car.

• 1:46David Imel?

  Optimus was like, I'm finally getting that.

• 1:52Speaker 01

  Yo, what's up people of the internet? Welcome back to another episode of the Waveform Podcast. We're your hosts, I'm Marquez.

• 1:57Andrew Manganelli?

  I'm Andrew.

• 1:57David Imel?

  And I'm David.

• 1:58Speaker 01

  This week, we've got so many headlines to finish up Techtober that we're gonna do headlines in a hat. Everyone's favorite game. There is no winner or loser, it's just a game that we play.

• 2:09Andrew Manganelli?

  Everyone's a winner.

• 2:09Speaker 01

  Everyone's a winner.

• 2:10Andrew Manganelli?

  The audience is a winner after they subscribe.

• 2:12Speaker 01

  Well, we've put all the headlines that we think are interesting or worth talking about at all this week, and we put them in a hat, and then we're gonna pick them out and react slash talk about them. So we've got stuff like Android XR, the browser wars coming back, a bunch of things that went down during AWS's outage, including probably the site you're watching this on, pink iPhone updates, and more. So, without any further ado, I pick first?

• 2:35David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 2:36Speaker 01

  I'll pick first.

• 2:36David Imel?

  So much stuff happened this week, it was a struggle. I was like building the script yesterday, and I was like, how is it possible that we talk about all of these topics?

• 2:45Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah, luckily, none of them are gigantic. Well, we can yap enough to make something gigantic.

• 2:51David Imel?

  Well, yeah. Oh, the most boring one goes first.

• 2:53Speaker 01

  The first draw. Uh, maybe. This is Galaxy XR launch. So I'll give you what's boring about it, and I'll give you what's interesting about it.

• 3:01David Imel?

  Alright, hit me.

• 3:02Speaker 01

  So Galaxy XR, we did a video months and months ago, actually, taking a first look at Samsung's competitor to the Vision Pro. And on one hand, why would you be trying to make a competitor to the Vision Pro if the Vision Pro isn't even doing what the Vision Pro thought it could do? But Samsung's come along, and they've made a headset that is premiumly priced, premiumly built, and has almost every equivalent feature you could possibly imagine. It has the same external battery, it has the same look, it has the same glass on the front. Uh, but it's made by Samsung, and it's running Android XR, so it has a bunch of things that I think make it better than the Vision Pro. It might not be as high fidelity, it might not plug into the Apple ecosystem, but it has a YouTube app.

• 3:46David Imel?

  That is important. That is very important.

• 3:48Speaker 01

  It has a YouTube app, right? It has working AI features everywhere built into the OS. I actually think this is its best feature.

• 3:56David Imel?

  Gemini.

• 3:57Speaker 01

  Gemini everywhere, and I saw some demos of it, and they continue to evolve on this where you can talk to Gemini really naturally, I'm probably triggering somebody's right now, but they can say things like, "Oh, I think all my windows are kinda messy. If you could fix that Gemini, that'd be great." And it hears that sentence and knows that you're triggering Gemini, and will reorganize your windows. So you don't have to say the klutzy Okay, G, do this for me. Like, you can kind of just talk and trigger Gemini on occasion, which is nice. Um, now, that being said, I don't know if there are, you know, things about it that are gonna one-up Vision Pro other than the software features being way better. Uh, but it is $17.99.

• 4:37David Imel?

  Half the price.

• 4:38Speaker 01

  It is half the price of Vision Pro. It is significantly lighter and more comfortable to wear than Vision Pro. And, uh, it will plug into your Google ecosystem. So, I'm a fan. I'm gonna check it out.

• 4:51Andrew Manganelli?

  Can I ask potentially a stupid question?

• 4:53Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 4:53Andrew Manganelli?

  Sure. What is this called? Cause I just realized it's written as Galaxy XR, but this says, "Infinite Possibilities of XR with Galaxy X AI."

• 5:03Speaker 01

  So, it's running Android XR software.

• 5:06Andrew Manganelli?

  Yes.

• 5:07Speaker 01

  And the headset is called the Samsung Galaxy XR.

• 5:10Andrew Manganelli?

  Okay.

• 5:11Speaker 01

  That's the headset.

• 5:11Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah.

• 5:12Speaker 03

  It's not Project Muhan anymore?

• 5:14Speaker 01

  That was the, that's the video. We made the video about Project Muhan, but yeah, now we know it's the Galaxy XR. It's $17.99. It is, uh, out, basically now. They actually have a bunch of software that comes with it, like subscriptions. So, if you, you buy it early, there's an explorer pack, which comes with 12 months of Google AI Pro, 12 months of YouTube Premium, three months of YouTube TV for a dollar, a season of NBA League Pass, 12 months of Google Play Pass, and a whole bunch of other NFL, Pro, Era, Asteroid, Adobe Project, Pulsar, a whole bunch of others.

• 5:47Andrew Manganelli?

  That sounds like the list of side effects after like a medicine commercial.

• 5:50Speaker 01

  It's a bunch of-

• 5:51Andrew Manganelli?

  Like, what are we doing? But they're not all the same time. One of them costs a dollar. That's-

• 5:56Speaker 01

  Well, it's more about the content. Like, when you get in this headset, you're like, "Well, I wanna watch, uh, what's it like to watch a NBA broadcast?" And you kind of just wanna jump in and see what it's like without committing to a whole season. Bam! You jump in. You got a free year of it.

• 6:07Speaker 03

  They're definitely just like leaning into the content consumption of these things. They're not even trying to be like, "Look at all these other cool things you could do."

• 6:14Speaker 01

  I mean, with Vision Pro, that was-

• 6:15Speaker 03

  Yeah, like the dinosaur demo, remember?

• 6:18Speaker 01

  Yeah, I mean, what ended up being the things that broke through on Vision Pro were the content consumption.

• 6:23Speaker 03

  Exactly.

• 6:24Speaker 01

  And that's why they keep pushing all of their special spatial movies and everything. And I keep getting these press releases being like, "Do you wanna come to a special unveiling of this four-minute experience?" And I'm like, "No."

• 6:36David Imel?

  I don't.

• 6:36Speaker 01

  That's gonna be a no for me.

• 6:38David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 6:39Speaker 01

  I'll just repeat. It has a YouTube app.

• 6:41David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 6:43David Imel?

  R.I.P. to Juno, by the way.

• 6:44Speaker 03

  Is there still a YouTube VR thing? Remember with like Google Cardboard if you were watching YouTube?

• 6:48David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 6:49Speaker 03

  There's that little cardboard logo? Is that still there?

• 6:51David Imel?

  I think that's still a thing.

• 6:51Speaker 01

  Well, this is the thing. So both these headsets now will natively play back tons of online 360 videos. So if you open the YouTube app and you play a 360 video, which I've uploaded, I think, one ever, you are just placed in the environment. You can look around and watch the video in the environment as it plays out in front of you, which is kind of cool.

• 7:11David Imel?

  That's cool. Is there a persona type thing that they do or no? Any sort of video calling capabilities?

• 7:18Speaker 01

  Yes. Now, Apple's personas with, and we can talk about the Vision Pro in a second, have gotten way more, uh, high fidelity and lifelike and have made genuine improvements to look less uncanny valley and more real.

• 7:31David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 7:32Speaker 01

  Samsung's are not trying to do that.

• 7:35David Imel?

  They're just doing the opposite.

• 7:36Speaker 01

  They are cartoons.

• 7:37David Imel?

  Hmm.

• 7:37Speaker 03

  Correct.

• 7:38Speaker 01

  They are cartoon characters.

• 7:39Speaker 03

  That's what it should be.

• 7:40David Imel?

  No.

• 7:41Speaker 03

  Like Fortnite.

• 7:42Speaker 01

  That is what you should do.

• 7:43David Imel?

  Fortnite's the most popular game and those are cartoonish as hell.

• 7:45Speaker 01

  Well, that's Fortnite though. If I'm on a call with my like-

• 7:49David Imel?

  Take a video call on Fortnite.

• 7:50Speaker 01

  Mom or something, or my cousin, I just want to see like, oh, show me your spot. Or like, oh, like, let's chat about whatever. I don't want to see a cartoon.

• 7:59David Imel?

  No, I'd rather see your face.

• 8:01Andrew Manganelli?

  I think also when you, you have to assume that a video call is not all going to be right in XR. So that means half of them will be Windows with a real life face and half of them will be cartoon heads.

• 8:11David Imel?

  Here's going to be the camps.

• 8:13Speaker 01

  Sorry.

• 8:13Andrew Manganelli?

  Same thing for Vision Pro though. It's either, even though it's more realistic, it's still a weird, this is an actual video and this is a persona.

• 8:22Speaker 04

  This is true for Vision Pro and Samsung, but I could just picture like a big group call where someone's like, hey, can you actually like, can you get off the headset? Like this is serious.

• 8:29David Imel?

  Well, yeah, and here are going to be the two camps, right? It's the people that use Memoji as their profile photos will love, will love the Galaxy XR.

• 8:40Speaker 01

  Yeah, Cartoon City.

• 8:41David Imel?

  Uh, the people who do that.

• 8:44Speaker 01

  I have no respect for you. I'm sorry. I, I don't.

• 8:48David Imel?

  Dude, you have to.

• 8:49Andrew Manganelli?

  That's like all of my family.

• 8:51Speaker 01

  I have no respect for all of my family.

• 8:54Andrew Manganelli?

  They need to change.

• 8:55Speaker 01

  Go to therapy. Go to therapy.

• 8:58David Imel?

  But yeah, there's the, the, the golf in like realism. I kind of feel like they do this because they aren't as good at that. Like, I feel like if you could make a really realistic avatar, you would offer that. But because they cannot, they are sticking with a highly customizable cartoon.

• 9:13Andrew Manganelli?

  It's the safe bet.

• 9:14David Imel?

  It's the safe bet.

• 9:15Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah.

• 9:15David Imel?

  Yeah. Apple has put, this is like, Apple's on their third iteration of this. Remember the original personas were horrible?

• 9:23Speaker 01

  Yeah, they're tough.

• 9:24David Imel?

  And they've gotten better and better and better. And they have a whole persona team. Samsung's just, I bet you Google and Samsung don't really think this is gonna work out in the next couple of years, right? Like, we had the Windows XR headsets that came out during the whole, like, Windows 11 3D thing, or Windows 10 3D. I don't think that Samsung or Google are that sure on that this is going to be the future of computing. And so I don't think they want to commit like a whole team to actually like making photorealistic avatar software.

• 9:53Speaker 01

  It's funny because that's kind of where I landed with the Vision Pro review. Is that, is that one of the headlines in the hat?

• 9:58Andrew Manganelli?

  There is a Vision Pro.

• 9:59Speaker 01

  We got M5.

• 10:00Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah, we talked about M5 and the new strap and stuff.

• 10:02Speaker 01

  Then I'll get to it when we talk about that.

• 10:04David Imel?

  Okay.

• 10:04Speaker 01

  But yeah, that's Galaxy XR. Nothing really else to talk about it with it, right?

• 10:07David Imel?

  That's, that's pretty much it.

• 10:08Speaker 01

  No, no.

• 10:09David Imel?

  It's the same, it's the same cost as the foldable, so there's that.

• 10:11Speaker 04

  With the Vision Pro, you gotta go, you gotta get the fit.

• 10:14Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 10:15Speaker 04

  Same with the Samsung?

• 10:16Speaker 01

  Nope.

• 10:17Speaker 04

  No?

• 10:17Speaker 01

  No.

• 10:18Speaker 04

  How?

• 10:19Speaker 01

  It's very customizable, the whole like band thing. And it doesn't like fully light seal around your eyes. So with Apple, you're like fitting a light seal thing. This one doesn't have a light seal.

• 10:28Speaker 04

  Okay, but it's like in, in focus and it doesn't?

• 10:31Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 10:32Andrew Manganelli?

  Wait, for, Apple, you just need to do like a face scan with your phone, right?

• 10:36Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 10:36Speaker 04

  I think that's all.

• 10:37Speaker 01

  You do a face scan with your phone and then you get a size designated for you, which is to give you a somewhat snug fitting light leak uh cover thing.

• 10:46Speaker 04

  And the Samsung is one size fits all.

• 10:48Speaker 01

  The Samsung has no cover, so you can kind of just look around and see down and around the room around you, but in front of you is the uh the headsets and the speed and the lenses still move to align with your eyes and like everything looks sharp and the sizing of the whole headset is fairly customizable, but it's one size fits all.

• 11:04Speaker 04

  I have one more question. As someone who uh has spent an inordinate amount of their life in Vision Pro.

• 11:11Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 11:11Speaker 04

  Um, this one is eighteen hundred dollars?

• 11:13Speaker 01

  Yeah, yep.

• 11:14Speaker 04

  So how does it compare build quality? Why? Have you gotten to wear it yet? You you did.

• 11:18Speaker 01

  Yeah, I wore it.

• 11:19Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 11:19Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 11:19Speaker 04

  So how does it compare fit and finish?

• 11:22Speaker 01

  I mean, the funny thing about comparing it to Vision Pro is it's kind of not a good comparison. It does everything else the same as Vision Pro, but it's made of plastic like a Quest. Like it's built way more like a Quest. So it's way lighter. I think the the thing that kind of just holds onto your forehead is like pretty nice and snug and comfortable and soft enough and then it wraps around your head and the weight distribution with some of the battery on the back of your head is just way, way better to wear for a long time.

• 11:47David Imel?

  The actual goggles are aluminum though, right?

• 11:49Speaker 01

  Uh, I gotta pick them up again, but I don't think they are. I think it's glass on the front and then the rest is is plastic, which is it's good for weight. It doesn't mean it's gonna hold up when dropping as well, I guess, as aluminum, but.

• 12:02David Imel?

  Good question.

• 12:02Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah, there's one, there is a light seal for the XR. There's an available light seal.

• 12:07Speaker 01

  An available light seal, but by default, okay, that's actually true. You can pop one on, but by default, you don't seem to need one.

• 12:12David Imel?

  It looks like metal to me, but who knows?

• 12:16Speaker 03

  Okay, I have another question before we hop off this topic.

• 12:18Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 12:19Speaker 03

  Uh, as the person who sits next to Ellis while he is in this VR world using the Vision Pro in like multiple monitors, can this have multiple monitors like a computer?

• 12:30Speaker 01

  That's a good question. I had not gotten to try that. I would be willing to bet that you could get displays to show up on it from a computer, but it wouldn't be as easy as like tapping a button next to your Mac. I'm betting you'd need specific software to make that work, but I haven't tried it yet.

• 12:49David Imel?

  I'm excited to get a review device.

• 12:50Andrew Manganelli?

  So we can actually mess with it.

• 12:52Speaker 04

  As of the last time I used the Vision Pro, you still could not do multiple monitors on it. You could have one monitor.

• 12:57Speaker 01

  They have the widescreen now.

• 12:58David Imel?

  So true.

• 12:59Speaker 01

  Ultra widescreen.

• 13:00Speaker 04

  My last question, because the thing that kept me out of the Vision Pro.

• 13:05Speaker 01

  Besides the weight.

• 13:06Speaker 04

  I never really had a problem with the weight. I guess I'm just like built like an F1 driver. You know what I mean? Just like.

• 13:13Speaker 01

  Flex.

• 13:13Speaker 04

  Trading out the. But.

• 13:15Speaker 01

  I can see it.

• 13:16Speaker 04

  It was the heat. It was like.

• 13:17Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah.

• 13:18Speaker 04

  Which I guess makes me not built like an F1 driver.

• 13:20Speaker 01

  It kind of blows hot air into your eyes.

• 13:22Speaker 04

  I just got so schwitzy in the Vision Pro. Do you, did you have similar experiences in the Samsung XR?

• 13:30Speaker 01

  So we'll get to the new Vision Pro. The Samsung XR, no.

• 13:33David Imel?

  It's been so long.

• 13:34Andrew Manganelli?

  When you don't have the light seal, it's more breathable.

• 13:36Speaker 01

  It's way more open.

• 13:37Andrew Manganelli?

  Your eyes can breathe.

• 13:38David Imel?

  Your eyes can breathe.

• 13:39Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 13:40David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 13:40Speaker 01

  Which is nice. And I didn't, you know, I didn't stress test it for game or do mirrored displays for hours at a time. So maybe it would get hotter if I did that sort of thing, but I imagine because it's more open, it wouldn't be a problem.

• 13:50Andrew Manganelli?

  Did your face feel hot on Meta Quest Pro? Cause that's more similar to the openness.

• 13:56Speaker 04

  Quest Pro or three?

• 13:57Andrew Manganelli?

  Not saying.

• 13:58Speaker 01

  Closer to Quest Pro.

• 13:59Andrew Manganelli?

  Weight, but like in terms of.

• 14:01Speaker 04

  I don't.

• 14:01Andrew Manganelli?

  And the lack of seal.

• 14:03Speaker 04

  To be honest, I, I couldn't have as long sessions in Quest Pro, not Quest 3, but Quest Pro. Because the, the, it was just so much less, it focused so less well. That like I would get headaches from eye strain, which I don't remember ever feeling eye strain on the Vision Pro. I'm trying to remember. I think Quest 3 was like a little better, but, and I do remember heat being a problem on Quest 3 because I was using it for those long sessions. But Quest 3 is a bunch of other issues that just make it frustrating for long.

• 14:34Andrew Manganelli?

  Well, yeah, and it's, it's sealed around your, that's why I was asking. It's more, Quest Pro is more similar to like Galaxy XR because if you're not using the light seal, it's open.

• 14:44Speaker 04

  Right. Yeah. For Quest 3, I taped a bunch of microfiber cloths around my face. Cause I don't, I don't like the, the.

• 14:51Speaker 01

  Seeing the room light?

• 14:52Speaker 04

  No, like, like I, I don't want, I don't want MR. I want, I want VR.

• 14:58Speaker 01

  Interesting.

• 14:59David Imel?

  Right.

• 15:00Andrew Manganelli?

  Cool.

• 15:00Speaker 01

  All right.

• 15:00Andrew Manganelli?

  You want to pick one, David?

• 15:02David Imel?

  Yeah. Glad we got the most boring topic out of the way first.

• 15:04Andrew Manganelli?

  I don't know. I think there's one other one on here that might be more top.

• 15:07Speaker 01

  Pink iPhone update.

• 15:09Andrew Manganelli?

  Now we're talking.

• 15:11David Imel?

  It's that one.

• 15:11Andrew Manganelli?

  Game time, baby.

• 15:12David Imel?

  Talking. Okay, this is really, it was a conspiracy theory at first, right? And then it kind of just surfaced a little bit more from one or two people doing this.

• 15:19Andrew Manganelli?

  I've got the timeline downline, if you want me to, uh, if you want me to, okay.

• 15:22David Imel?

  What is the?

• 15:23Andrew Manganelli?

  Run it back. So there was an update last week, but we didn't bring it up because it was, for those who missed two weeks ago, there was a Reddit post about a guy whose orange iPhone 17 Pro Max looked like it was turning pink. Um, and

• 15:37David Imel?

  Rose gold, as he was.

• 15:38Andrew Manganelli?

  Rose gold. I don't know.

• 15:39David Imel?

  Unfortunately, they did say rose gold.

• 15:41Andrew Manganelli?

  It looks. That person then made another post with a couple more pictures, mostly just replying that he was mad that no one believed him without providing much more context. So it was like, okay, this didn't feel like much of an update. Since then, we've gotten a new TikTok video where somebody has the same issue and another Reddit post where someone has the same issue where they're explaining a little better and, and also have video of it. Um, and through all of that, just, you know, now we have three examples. Nine to five Mac decided to make an, uh, article about why it might be happening. There's still no, this is definitely why it happened, but we have the idea of why it might be happening. And some of these, I mean, it's pink. Your boy's real pink. It is.

• 16:26David Imel?

  It's like hot pink.

• 16:27Andrew Manganelli?

  I think it's the, the drasticness of it is why I was like, I don't know if I fully believe this.

• 16:33David Imel?

  I kind of want that.

• 16:34Andrew Manganelli?

  It's pretty cool.

• 16:35David Imel?

  What happens to the blue one?

• 16:36Andrew Manganelli?

  That's what I also was wondering.

• 16:37David Imel?

  Turn green?

• 16:38Andrew Manganelli?

  Well, here's the thing. Here's what nine to five thinks is happening.

• 16:41David Imel?

  Uh.

• 16:42Andrew Manganelli?

  And if you wanted to test it, you could try.

• 16:44David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 16:44Andrew Manganelli?

  But basically potentially using cleaner that involves bleach or hydrogen peroxide is one of the things that Apple tells you not to do.

• 16:52David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 16:52Andrew Manganelli?

  Uncleaning material like this.

• 16:54David Imel?

  Because of the anodization layer.

• 16:55Andrew Manganelli?

  Yes.

• 16:56David Imel?

  Which is exactly what we predicted.

• 16:58Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah, pretty much. Um, you know, it's not that much of an update, but this is potentially why it's happening. If we wanted to test it out, I guess we could try and.

• 17:07David Imel?

  Why did this person went their phone with hydrogen peroxide?

• 17:09Andrew Manganelli?

  We don't know. They have not said that they did that. And I think it's hydrogen peroxide inside of the cleaner. It doesn't have to be straight hydrogen peroxide.

• 17:16David Imel?

  I have a lot of that in my.

• 17:17Speaker 04

  Let's, uh, let's, we should take more. Marquez's orange iPhone and divide it in into four quadrants and clean one of them with bleach, one of them with hydrogen peroxide.

• 17:26Speaker 01

  Did I show you?

• 17:26Andrew Manganelli?

  Marquez's iPhone is already nuts. He like put us, do you want to describe your current?

• 17:31Speaker 01

  I I put a, I put an area 51 D brand skin on it and then I decided I didn't apply it very neatly. And I was like, I'll start over. I'll try again. And I tore it off and halfway after halfway through tearing it off. More than halfway. Seventy percent. Seventy eight percent into tearing it off. I thought it looked kind of cool like that. So.

• 17:51Andrew Manganelli?

  You just looked over from your desk and you were like, I think I like this. And I'm like, what? The orange phone? You're like, no, this like D brand look. And I'm like, yeah, but you're not done taking it off. And you're like, yeah. It looks like for audio listeners, like when Venom starts taking over and like half of his face has like the black web stuff. Yeah, it's pretty.

• 18:10Speaker 01

  I think that's cool. I've taken, I've had this thought before. I've been taking skins off the, off of things before and thought it looks sick. And then I always just finished taking it off this time. I'm like, this is a look now. I have, this is a one of one skin.

• 18:21Andrew Manganelli?

  You better not take my skin off.

• 18:22Speaker 01

  This, that would be a one of one skin as well. So yeah, I'm, I'm sticking with that.

• 18:28Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah. Part of me wants to half dip a, uh, an iPhone in like hydrogen peroxide and see if you can get like.

• 18:34Speaker 01

  I have a ton at home if we want to do it.

• 18:36Andrew Manganelli?

  Yes, I could do that.

• 18:37Speaker 01

  I have a ton of hydrogen.

• 18:38Andrew Manganelli?

  Somebody needs to, yeah, try this. But yeah, that's kind of the update. It's not too much. But there's multiple videos now, which I do think helps solidify that maybe this isn't a prank.

• 18:47Speaker 01

  Sure. But also whenever I think about gates with iPhones or any phone, I just think about how realistic is this for the average person? Like when the iPhone six plus started folding under a not that much pressure, it was like, theoretically, someone could sit on it with their, in their back pocket, somebody could accidentally bend their phone. And that would actually be kind of a big deal. Or the iPhone, was it the four S or five antenna gate? Which, which phone was that?

• 19:12Andrew Manganelli?

  That was the four S.

• 19:13Speaker 01

  Four S, I think. Where if you hold the phone in a certain way, which some people really held that way, you're covering the antennas and the, and you'd actually have worse signal.

• 19:21Andrew Manganelli?

  Those people are wrong.

• 19:22Speaker 01

  Those are realish gates because that could affect you with regular use. Right. How many people are regularly cleaning their phone with like an alcohol based solvent all the time? To the point where their phone starts changing colors. Yeah. A hydrogen peroxide, like ultra industrial strength cleaner. Like I bet you could.

• 19:44Speaker 01

  I bet you could dip your orange iPhone in there and it would change colors, but is that a gate?

• 19:48David Imel?

  Well, also, my question, because we don't know what this guy did to get it to turn this way. But my question is, if that is truly the reason.

• 19:55Speaker 01

  We should see other.

• 19:56David Imel?

  Why was he wiping his phone with hydrogen peroxide or a similar chemical?

• 20:00Speaker 01

  So.

• 20:01Speaker 03

  I know.

• 20:01Speaker 01

  Depends on the.

• 20:02Speaker 03

  He could have been like not wiping his phone, but doing other things and his hands had like residue of hydrogen peroxide and then go back or like whatever he was using bleach.

• 20:11Andrew Manganelli?

  Can I throw one more wrench in all this for all the still conspiracy believers?

• 20:15David Imel?

  Okay.

• 20:15Andrew Manganelli?

  Okay, the second Reddit post has 650 upvotes, 379 comments. The person who posted responded a bunch, but for some reason, when you click his profile, it says there doesn't seem to be anything here despite having 9,000 post karma, 2,000 comment karma, but no, it won't show any of his posts or comments or anything.

• 20:38Speaker 03

  Is that because?

• 20:39Andrew Manganelli?

  11 year.

• 20:39Speaker 03

  Club or something?

• 20:40David Imel?

  He has it set to private.

• 20:41Andrew Manganelli?

  I thought it would say private.

• 20:43David Imel?

  I think I'll just bring in, I'll bring in all my film development chemicals. Yeah, we'll dip a bunch of phones.

• 20:51Speaker 01

  We'll have a gate.

• 20:52David Imel?

  And we'll create our own gate.

• 20:53Speaker 01

  We'll get all the clicks.

• 20:55Andrew Manganelli?

  You said it this time. Create.

• 20:57David Imel?

  I like to put it next to the mic so you can hear the. It's the headlines in the hat.

• 21:02Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 21:02David Imel?

  For the audience.

• 21:03Andrew Manganelli?

  Headlines, they are in a hat.

• 21:05David Imel?

  Apple.

• 21:05Andrew Manganelli?

  Perfect. Apple TV.

• 21:07David Imel?

  Oh.

• 21:07Andrew Manganelli?

  Formula One.

• 21:08David Imel?

  Oh.

• 21:09Andrew Manganelli?

  Very quick.

• 21:10David Imel?

  Yeah, what happened?

• 21:10Andrew Manganelli?

  Okay, so Apple TV officially announced they are the exclusive partner of Formula One in the US for the next five years, starting in 2026. Yep, this is like this thing where I think is usually like, most people hate stuff like this, and I totally agree. I hate exclusivity on like a platform that you might not give a damn about paying for to watch sports.

• 21:36David Imel?

  To clarify, are you talking about Apple TV?

• 21:38Speaker 03

  The hardware, Apple TV, the app, or Apple TV, the subscription service.

• 21:42Andrew Manganelli?

  Just the Apple TV. Can only watch it on the physical Apple TV. Yeah, sorry. The subscription service is now going to be the only way you can watch Formula One in the US.

• 21:50Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 21:50Andrew Manganelli?

  I'm starting next year.

• 21:51Speaker 03

  Making fun of their branding.

• 21:54Speaker 04

  Technically, the hardware is called the Apple TV 4K. The new one. Technically, I don't think, I think it's the only one they make right now.

• 22:01Speaker 03

  Thanks, Joss.

• 22:01Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah.

• 22:02Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 22:02Andrew Manganelli?

  Thanks. Thanks.

• 22:03Speaker 03

  Wait, so they just bought the whole sport.

• 22:05Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah, they bought the whole sport in the US.

• 22:07Speaker 03

  In, in the US.

• 22:08Andrew Manganelli?

  Total sense. Formula One movie they made was great. It did really, really well. You know.

• 22:14Speaker 03

  Marquez said it was predictable.

• 22:16Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah, well, it was fine. It probably made a ton of money, which is all they give a damn about. So this makes a lot of sense. I still think exclusivity sucks. They are providing some coverage for free for everyone, limited to select races and possible practice sessions, which is hilarious because if you watch F1, FP1, FP2, FP3 are like three sessions that happen that.

• 22:40Speaker 03

  They mean nothing.

• 22:40Andrew Manganelli?

  Do pretty much nothing. I'm sure people enjoy watching it, but it's usually like testing out balance and tires and stuff like that on the car.

• 22:47Speaker 03

  Watch it on YouTube.

• 22:48Andrew Manganelli?

  It, it means nothing to the actual standings.

• 22:52Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 22:52Andrew Manganelli?

  So saying that some of that happened is like, cool, you could get a bunch. And I'm just waiting for the like, select race they do to be like, Japan, that happens at 2 AM in the US and nobody can watch it anyways. For anyone wondering, there used to be a subscription service called F1 TV, which was a way you can get a ton of different angles and broadcasts and stuff like that. That will just be baked into the Apple TV subscription for next year, which is good news.

• 23:18Speaker 03

  Did they buy it?

• 23:20Andrew Manganelli?

  I don't know if it's just now the subscription service that was showing stuff like Sky Sports will be inside of.

• 23:27Speaker 03

  Cause wasn't a big part of the F1 app itself, like that you can have your own configuration on what angles you wanted to watch.

• 23:33Andrew Manganelli?

  It's just different street, like feeds.

• 23:34Speaker 03

  Yeah, different feeds, but you can like customize how you wanted it to look.

• 23:37Andrew Manganelli?

  I don't know exactly that, but weirdly, this works out great for me because right now I'm paying for cable for hockey and Formula One. That's all I care about and cable sucks and is expensive.

• 23:49Speaker 03

  Are you gonna cut the cable?

• 23:50Andrew Manganelli?

  I'm gonna cut cable next year and I also have not watched a single Apple TV show or movie. Because I don't have it.

• 23:57David Imel?

  So you're looking at that as like a new library.

• 23:59Andrew Manganelli?

  Looking at it as now I can cut cable, get an app for hockey and have Formula One on Apple TV and finally get to watch all of the things. This is the most niche like benefit.

• 24:09David Imel?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 24:10Andrew Manganelli?

  This is legit math, yeah. So it works great for me.

• 24:14David Imel?

  I have a story.

• 24:15Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah.

• 24:16David Imel?

  Okay, this is related to you thing. When I was like 12, I borrowed this transformer toy from my friend and then I lost it.

• 24:24Andrew Manganelli?

  Not good.

• 24:25David Imel?

  And I decided to do boy math. And I was like, well, you know what? This isn't such a big deal because I'll spend the money that I have on a new one to give to him, but if I find it, I get a new toy. And um.

• 24:37Speaker 01

  Did you ever find it?

• 24:38David Imel?

  I did. It was hanging, it was hanging on like the side handle of the car.

• 24:42Andrew Manganelli?

  Oh, that's such a good story. That's some toy story.

• 24:46David Imel?

  I don't remember.

• 24:47Andrew Manganelli?

  You actually left it at a pizza joint and it was just trying to get back into the car.

• 24:51Speaker 01

  Optimus was like, I'm finally getting out.

• 24:54David Imel?

  But it's the same thing. It's like, you wouldn't have Apple TV, but you're like, actually, I'm glad because now I get to watch Apple TV shows.

• 24:59Speaker 04

  It's just like how, you know, I spend, you know, like $17 a month on League Pass and another $10 a month on YouTube, or I guess more like $2 a month on YouTube Premium.

• 25:09Andrew Manganelli?

  For now.

• 25:10Speaker 04

  So if I just spend $1,800 on the Samsung XR.

• 25:16David Imel?

  I get one year of free YouTube Premium.

• 25:19Speaker 01

  Does that math out? Does it math?

• 25:20David Imel?

  No, not even close.

• 25:22Speaker 01

  Well, the one year of League Pass, one year of, let's say you cancel all these subscriptions because you're getting them for free now. You get a year of League Pass, you get a year of, what was it? YouTube Premium.

• 25:33David Imel?

  And Gemini.

• 25:35Speaker 01

  And Gemini Pro.

• 25:36Andrew Manganelli?

  And three months of something for a dollar.

• 25:39David Imel?

  Yes, it could be nice.

• 25:41Andrew Manganelli?

  And sleep apnea.

• 25:44Andrew Manganelli?

  Remember that really cool like F1 concept Vision Pro app that has like the track and everything? People are hoping that like that might be a really cool way of doing all of this inside there and that maybe with exclusivity for five years, we could see something like that. Sounds awesome. Can't imagine wearing Vision Pro for an entire race. That sounds miserable.

• 26:04Speaker 01

  That's for the driver.

• 26:04Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah, races are, could be pretty.

• 26:06Speaker 01

  They're pretty long, but that would be so sick. That would be the best vantage point. The one extremely niche thing that I can say is now that I've been to an F1 race, there's, it's really hard to pick one vantage point. Like the broadcast is the best vantage point to watch a race. And if you're, if you're at the race, you can watch one corner, basically. So if you can find a corner, but then you can also turn around and see a TV with the broadcast, then you can watch the race and watch the cars at the same time.

• 26:30Speaker 03

  There are some points in a race that have that in the grandstands, there'll be like a TV, but like you really can go on some corners where you're just in like a field.

• 26:37Speaker 01

  But I think the ultimate vantage point is the Vision Pro concept, which is you can watch the broadcast and look down at a little mini map of where all the cars are on the track at the same time. That's sick.

• 26:47Speaker 03

  I can't wait for the race where there's just like a group of 20 people in Vision Pro and like lawn chairs at one random corner off to the side of, yeah.

• 26:55Andrew Manganelli?

  Apple has been eating up all of these like niche sports broadcasts.

• 27:00Speaker 03

  I can't believe you just called Formula, okay, thank you.

• 27:02Speaker 04

  What, you mean baseball? Are you talking about baseball?

• 27:05Speaker 03

  Formula One, the niche sport. Exclusive rights to MLB?

• 27:09Speaker 01

  Yeah, they don't.

• 27:10Speaker 03

  Not exclusive, not exclusive. That's what I'm saying. Oh, no, yeah, I mean exclusive, like MLS, you can only watch it on Apple TV.

• 27:16Speaker 01

  What's MLS?

• 27:17Speaker 03

  Major League Soccer.

• 27:18Andrew Manganelli?

  He only watches Premier League.

• 27:20Speaker 03

  Well, Premier League is everywhere. There's no way they're gonna.

• 27:21Andrew Manganelli?

  That's what David watches.

• 27:22Speaker 03

  But MLS is Apple. Now F1 is Apple. I think they're gonna eventually add NHL. That's the next biggest sport from the bottom up.

• 27:33Andrew Manganelli?

  It's not worth it. I love hockey, but it's not making enough money for Apple. They'll have to make an Apple TV NHL show.

• 27:39Speaker 03

  It's not for money. They're just trying to get the content so people will subscribe.

• 27:43Speaker 01

  All right, that's actually true. They should get ultimate for it. I just wanna say back in the, back in the Vive days with HTC, you know, HTC Vive, okay. HTC partnered with Valve and Valve is big on, you know, Steam stuff and they made a VR Dota thing where you could watch live pro Dota games in VR. And you could like spin the map around and zoom in on things that were happening and it was super sick and it existed for like three months. I want that, cause you guys have your niche sports. I need my niche sport.

• 28:14Speaker 03

  Just call esports niche?

• 28:16Speaker 01

  Dota. Dota's not that niche. Dota just copied the legend, so. No.

• 28:23Speaker 01

  I'm gonna riot.

• 28:23Andrew Manganelli?

  That's at least 20 comments. That's 20 free engagement points.

• 28:26Speaker 01

  I'm gonna riot games. Okay. Oh, God, they're all stuck together.

• 28:29Andrew Manganelli?

  Should this be? That was three so far? Four? We have 10 total.

• 28:33Speaker 01

  All right. I've got another topic. Headline and hat. Ooh.

• 28:37Speaker 01

  Oh, shoot. OpenAI, Atlas, the Browser Wars are so back. And by that, I mean another Chrome wrapper. Yeah, baby. No, it's actually, it's kind of interesting. OpenAI drops Atlas, their browser, this past week. Yes. I notably have been, how do I say, in the market for a new browser lately? Unfortunately, Arc is still the best browser. It is the best browser. Every time I say it, it sounds worse because it's even more and more out of date, but Arc is still the best browser. It is. But I'm giving all these new browsers a shot. And the reason I have all these browsers to give a shot is because all these browsers are adding AI sidebars and agentic AI features, et cetera, to them. Yeah.

• 29:18Speaker 01

  One by one. Chrome does it. Perplexity's new browser, they have this stuff. Dia, they have this stuff along the side. And now, another one. ChatGPT themselves. OpenAI. They have their own browser. It's literally called ChatGPT Atlas. Yeah. So what did I do? I downloaded it. That's right. I installed it. That's right. It's macOS only. I set it up. So far. I know, unfortunately. They said other platforms coming soon. So far.

• 29:43Andrew Manganelli?

  This company is worth trillion dollars.

• 29:44Speaker 01

  They want a trillion dollars and they can't. I know. Give them a second, guys. They're just work, they're working on the sloppy AI scrolling app. Give them a second. But I try it. It's, it's, I mean, I'd use Dia the most lately out of these browsers, and it's the same thing. Yeah. I haven't used the agentic features nearly as much. And to those who are that much in the weeds, this is probably a differentiator. I don't know, man. But just because ChatGPT is like the biggest player in this market, next to what Chrome and Gemini, obviously, people are willing to hear it out. And so I'm giving it a shot, and it's fine. Yeah. It's fine. It doesn't have sidebar features, doesn't sync with any mobile app, is only macOS. There are plenty of things missing from it.

• 30:27Speaker 01

  I don't think extensions even work yet, but it's built on Chromium, so theoretically that's coming soon. Browser Wars are back. Yeah. It's, um, it's just Dia.

• 30:37Speaker 01

  It's just Dia.

• 30:38David Imel?

  Which is just Chrome.

• 30:39Andrew Manganelli?

  Which is like the argument that Dia is just a browser with ChatGPT inside. It's like both of them are just the other ones. It's the Spider-Man meme of just like pointing at each other.

• 30:47David Imel?

  Because Dia literally is just a ChatGPT Chrome.

• 30:51Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 30:51David Imel?

  And ChatGPT Atlas is also.

• 30:56Speaker 01

  Do you want to hear the psycho behavior I've been using apps or browsers lately? When I'm like researching a video, I have, uh, what's this called again? Arc. I have Arc on my, Arc's my main browser.

• 31:07David Imel?

  Yeah, on the left.

• 31:08Speaker 01

  On the left, and I'm doing most work in Arc with the writing.

• 31:11David Imel?

  Uh huh.

• 31:12Speaker 01

  But then on the right, I have an instance of Dia open.

• 31:15David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 31:15Speaker 01

  Which is where I'm like messing with the tools and researching and finding links and, and, and messing around there. And I always have a tab open with ChatGPT. If I ever want to reference anything that I had done in ChatGPT before, I can always have that ChatGPT tab open. Cause I can ask new queries of it, but I want to find the history of it.

• 31:33David Imel?

  Oh.

• 31:34Speaker 01

  Atlas is basically just that tab again.

• 31:40David Imel?

  That's your browser.

• 31:41Speaker 01

  So you can, when you pull up the sidebar in Atlas, it's just your ChatGPT history.

• 31:47David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 31:47Speaker 01

  And so it's just that tab, but expanded and now it's the whole browser.

• 31:51David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 31:51Speaker 01

  So now I'll have Atlas open on the right and Arc open on the left.

• 31:56David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 31:56Speaker 01

  And I was trying to main Arc or main Atlas. God, these are so hard to keep track of.

• 32:01David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 32:01Speaker 01

  And I mained it for like a day and a half and now I'm back on Arc, but.

• 32:04David Imel?

  It came out yesterday afternoon.

• 32:06Andrew Manganelli?

  Isn't it?

• 32:06Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 32:07Andrew Manganelli?

  Okay. Doesn't Arc have a side by side thing? Couldn't you just?

• 32:10Speaker 01

  It does.

• 32:10Andrew Manganelli?

  Do that in Arc?

• 32:11Speaker 01

  I can side by side, but I want to write full screen.

• 32:15Andrew Manganelli?

  Okay, sorry.

• 32:15Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 32:15David Imel?

  Yeah, it's just a process.

• 32:16Speaker 01

  No, I get, I get what you're saying. Cause like my, my ideal research setup as well is, is a Google Doc window on the left with an Arc. And then Dia on the right. Because when I'm doing the research on the right window.

• 32:27David Imel?

  All the messy tabs.

• 32:28Speaker 01

  I sometimes like to ask questions about the page.

• 32:31David Imel?

  Yep.

• 32:31Speaker 01

  And then double check it, which takes too much time, but it, you know. Anyway, um, so now there's this, I s- I see what they're doing. Okay. Like the reason they launched a browser is because.

• 32:43David Imel?

  These models get better the more context they have about you and Google automatically has all of the context possible about you with Chrome.

• 32:51Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 32:52David Imel?

  They have all your Google accounts, they have everything you've ever searched, all this stuff.

• 32:55Speaker 01

  Every website you've ever gone to.

• 32:56David Imel?

  Right.

• 32:57Speaker 01

  All of the frequencies and the tendencies you have online.

• 33:00David Imel?

  Yeah, so OpenAI thinks, oh, if we want to make this like true digital personal assistant that knows everything about you, it should know everything you've ever searched and blah, blah, blah. A roadblock that I ran into yesterday is that my brain is not wired to talk to the browser naturally. It's wired in SEO. So I like searched the name of a restaurant near me. It was like D on D Greenpoint or whatever. But the problem, the thing about Atlas is that the search bar, the default search bar page is just ChatGPT. So if you search it in in SEO language, that's not natural language, it doesn't know what to do with that. And now we're facing the opposite problem that we used to have when we didn't, when the boomers didn't know how to Google things.

• 33:42Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 33:44David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 33:44Speaker 01

  Yeah, I've done that a lot. And ChatGPT has a search function built in, but it's not quite just like Googling something.

• 33:51David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 33:51Speaker 01

  So often I'll just command T and just type three words because I'm just trying to Google something real quick and find a link.

• 33:56David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 33:56Speaker 01

  And when you do that in these browsers, it tries to do a search in the LLM for it. It just doesn't.

• 34:02David Imel?

  And it takes longer.

• 34:03Speaker 01

  It's not good.

• 34:04David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 34:04Speaker 01

  Yeah, so I'm rewiring a little bit too.

• 34:07David Imel?

  The one really useful feature that I see from this is that you can ask it to pull up a tab that you don't remember what the website was just based on what it was. So you can say, can you pull up that page that I was looking at last week that had this on it? And it will try to find through your search history and use the contextual information from your search history to bring that back up.

• 34:25Speaker 01

  Useful.

• 34:26David Imel?

  That is probably the most useful thing that it has.

• 34:29Speaker 01

  Built that into Arc.

• 34:30David Imel?

  Dude.

• 34:31Andrew Manganelli?

  Okay, wait, I have three, three really quick things. Okay, one, God, I love Firefox. I'm so glad I don't have to do what you morons are doing. Next two.

• 34:42David Imel?

  Coming for you.

• 34:43Andrew Manganelli?

  Is it not funny that both of you somehow have turned into a arc on the left, Dia on the right? And that the company makes both of them probably should have just thought about making them one singular thing?

• 34:54David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 34:54Andrew Manganelli?

  Three, the biggest winner of all of this is that same company who's just making what this OpenAI thing was.

• 35:01David Imel?

  They're.

• 35:01Andrew Manganelli?

  Selling to a company who.

• 35:04David Imel?

  That is pretty funny.

• 35:05Andrew Manganelli?

  Bought it for what? Seven hundred million dollars?

• 35:07David Imel?

  It was six hundred and ten million.

• 35:10Andrew Manganelli?

  The browser company.

• 35:12David Imel?

  Was acquired.

• 35:13Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah.

• 35:13David Imel?

  Right before all these.

• 35:15Andrew Manganelli?

  No, actually.

• 35:16David Imel?

  It gets better. The acquisition. Went through yesterday, which is the same day that ChatGPT Atlas came.

• 35:23Andrew Manganelli?

  Released the thing that they just bought.

• 35:26David Imel?

  And perplexity comet just went public like like massed like it was invite only or whatever. And that also dropped yesterday. And also Claude released a desktop app.

• 35:37Andrew Manganelli?

  Web desktop app, which they have a cool feature that if you double tap the caps lock button, it turns on the voice input mode.

• 35:44David Imel?

  Ooh.

• 35:45Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah, that's interesting. I want that for everything.

• 35:48David Imel?

  I like that idea. So it kind of just feel, yeah, Atlas, ChatGPT Atlas, but by the way, horrible name, but really good branding idea. Really good branding. Because normies know ChatGPT, they would not just know Atlas, they would not know Atlas GPT. Really good branding, even though it's it's horrible branding, it's also good branding. Good logo too. Ah, it looks like the Telegram icon.

• 36:08Andrew Manganelli?

  I thought ChatGPT was terrible branding, but here we are. Everyone knows it. Everyone loves it.

• 36:12David Imel?

  It is terrible branding, but it's. Somehow broke through. Popular.

• 36:15Andrew Manganelli?

  It's somehow. That is just the signal and.

• 36:18David Imel?

  It looks like the Telegram.

• 36:18Andrew Manganelli?

  Co-pilot.

• 36:19David Imel?

  It does look like a pilot. Look, it feels to me like this was a bit rushed, you know? I think they've been working on this for a very long time. The reports of them building a browser have been going on for like 11 months or so. Is when these reports first dropped. But it still feels like they rushed this out because it's it doesn't have that many feet like it's just Dia with like a couple extra little things. And then it tries to focus a lot on the agentic mode, which you still can't really convince me that anyone finds super useful. There's like a tiny, extremely vocal minority that loves the agentic part.

• 36:56Speaker 01

  But they are like at the bleeding edge.

• 36:58David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 36:59Speaker 01

  It's most, most people don't.

• 37:00David Imel?

  Yeah, it's a cool idea, but I don't know. I think that they were just worried that if Anthropic came out with like a Claude browser quicker, or if, it's really probably Chrome that they're all scared of. Yeah, so it's gonna be interesting. I'm, I'm wondering how much market share this gains. Like, they have such insane brand awareness, and if they were to put this in ChatGPT and say, download the ChatGPT browser, I think this would pop off pretty quick.

• 37:26Speaker 04

  I've been learning, trying to learn a lot of new things in the past few weeks. I'm trying to teach myself Blender. I'm trying to finally get my Python scripting together, trying to like incorporate all these new skills in my life lately. And so I've been spending a lot of time on the internet, like, learning these things, right?

• 37:40Speaker 01

  That's crazy.

• 37:41Speaker 04

  And I, and I, I know I sound like a broken record. I know I say this once a week, and I'm sorry for everyone that's tired of hearing me saying it, but I just cannot overstate how much Google ruined their own product with AI overview, because I'm Googling things so much to like, learn these things.

• 38:00David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 38:01Speaker 04

  100% of the time, the AI overview is wrong at this point. Like, I never, ever, ever get anything useful, and lately, it's been so far away from being right. Like, I don't know if mine is just poisoned by my search history or something, but like, like, it's getting to the point where like, if I need to Google, like, as like a practicing, I've been building this like weather app that pulls weather data from an API.

• 38:23Speaker 01

  I'm talking my language.

• 38:24Speaker 04

  It's like constantly getting Fahrenheit and Celsius mixed up. Like, I'll be like, what's wrong with this code? And it'll be like, huh? It'll be like, well, clearly, it's 100, it's 100 degrees Celsius today. And it's just like, what are you, what are you talking about? Like, anyway, this is all to say, I, someone who doesn't normally reach for AI tools, have literally just stopped Googling stuff, like, and just go straight to Claude. Because I just, it's so, I waste so much time forgetting that the first thing I see is the AI overview, and I think we need to give Google credit for creating the need for AI browsers by literally ruining their

• 39:01Speaker 04

  own product so hard. And again, I know I say this every week, but I just think I've never seen a company release something so bad in my entire life.

• 39:13David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 39:13Speaker 04

  As AI overview.

• 39:14Speaker 01

  Have you heard of Humane?

• 39:16Speaker 04

  This is so much worse than the humane pin. It's so much worse.

• 39:20Speaker 01

  HP Humane pin?

• 39:23David Imel?

  Yeah. You know what's funny about that is that Google used to be good, right?

• 39:28Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 39:29David Imel?

  Back in the day. Okay.

• 39:30Speaker 04

  It was good like last year.

• 39:31David Imel?

  Yeah. It was better. Yes. It was better. Over time, as they realized that they needed to make more and more ad dollars because of ad shitification, it just got more and more and more bloated with like worse results, sponsored posts, all these ads, all this stuff. Right now, in the, you know, LLM era, we are in this nice little, perfect little box where you can talk to it and there's no ads and it just gives you the clean information. It's probably wrong, but it gives you the clean information. We will get to the point where it is just Google, but in natural language, but it will, it would also be just as bad because it's going to have sponsored results.

• 40:12David Imel?

  It's going to have ads everywhere. It's going to get worse. Just remember that when you go to sleep.

• 40:18Speaker 04

  I would even, I would even take ads if it meant that it was right 10% more time of the time. You know, like, like 100% of the time I take like a coding answer from AI overview, it's wrong. 100% of the time it has anything to do with actual information.

• 40:34David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 40:35Speaker 04

  It is wrong.

• 40:35David Imel?

  Can you not turn that off?

• 40:37Speaker 04

  No, you can't turn off AI overview.

• 40:39Andrew Manganelli?

  You can press a button every single time you go to Google.

• 40:42Speaker 04

  Yeah, or, or you can download a Chrome extension that like blocks it from showing it. Like, there's a bunch of ways. I don't use Chrome, so maybe that's why. Maybe if I used Chrome AI overview.

• 40:50David Imel?

  Use Chromium?

• 40:51Speaker 04

  I use Safari.

• 40:52David Imel?

  Oh, webkit.

• 40:54Speaker 04

  The best browser.

• 40:55David Imel?

  Um, speaking really quickly, this is a slightly off topic. I just wanted to say really quickly. I was on Amazon yesterday, bought a product. It said, "People also bought", and it listed three products. Two of the three products, it said, "Sponsored". So I was like, so people didn't buy.

• 41:13Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah, they bought, they, they bought that spot to put their products in.

• 41:17David Imel?

  It's like, you can't say "People also bought" and then say,

• 41:21Andrew Manganelli?

  Amazon could do whatever the hell it wants.

• 41:22David Imel?

  We're just shoving these. I was like, what?

• 41:24Andrew Manganelli?

  Yes. There are no rules on Amazon.

• 41:25David Imel?

  Yeah, that's fair. Shovelware. All right, well.

• 41:28Andrew Manganelli?

  Let's do one more.

• 41:29David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 41:30Andrew Manganelli?

  Cause we can go five, three, two.

• 41:32David Imel?

  I've also never said thank you to Sam Altman before.

• 41:34Andrew Manganelli?

  I'd never will.

• 41:35David Imel?

  Because I don't normally have a reason to, but thank you for dropping that on a Tuesday.

• 41:40Andrew Manganelli?

  Oh, sure.

• 41:40David Imel?

  So that we could actually talk about it.

• 41:42Andrew Manganelli?

  True.

• 41:43David Imel?

  Okay. Liquid ass tint, iOS 26.

• 41:49Speaker 01

  This is a beta feature.

• 41:51David Imel?

  Yes, so this is very funny, and I destroyed my phone for this, so you guys better be grateful. But in iOS Beta 26.1, Developer Beta 4, they have added an option to tint the liquid glass.

• 42:08Speaker 01

  And it's not even varied in accessibility settings. This is a mainline setting.

• 42:12David Imel?

  A mainline.

• 42:13Speaker 01

  Display setting.

• 42:14David Imel?

  Display.

• 42:15Speaker 01

  Liquid glass tint.

• 42:16David Imel?

  Liquid glass tint. So there's clear, which is what we've always had. The deep, well, it's not what we always had because what we had before was even more clear. This is slightly more opaque. Now we have a tinted mode, which is almost completely back to iOS.

• 42:30Andrew Manganelli?

  It's just flat frosted.

• 42:32David Imel?

  18 or whatever. Yeah, it's, it's, there is a, there's like a 5% opacity.

• 42:37Andrew Manganelli?

  It's right at 90% opacity, like 90% total opacity.

• 42:40David Imel?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 42:41Andrew Manganelli?

  You can barely see a little bit from behind.

• 42:43David Imel?

  A little bit. So I'm sticking with clear for now because I sort of like the effects. My question is, is this for accessibility and the people who are complaining about not being able to read? Or is it for the battery life? Because I know that they were having trouble with like the occlusion and the rendering.

• 43:01Speaker 01

  Good question, actually.

• 43:02David Imel?

  But I, and I'm also wondering, when you set up a new iPhone, once they actually ship this, will it ask you if you want clear or tinted when you set up the phone?

• 43:11Andrew Manganelli?

  That I think, that's really interesting.

• 43:13David Imel?

  That's gonna be.

• 43:14Andrew Manganelli?

  That should be, that should be a question you get asked in the setup process.

• 43:18Speaker 01

  I agree, but I don't think they will do that.

• 43:22Andrew Manganelli?

  I also agree with that.

• 43:24David Imel?

  It's just funny because if, if they're giving you the option to use tinted, I mean, I'm glad to have more options. Don't get me wrong, right?

• 43:29Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 43:30David Imel?

  But they're just basic, their whole shazam at that show was like, wow, this is our new thing. You know, and now they're just like.

• 43:39Speaker 01

  I kind of wonder if that's a battery thing. I, I would, I hadn't considered that until you said that, but you know, the, the glass and all the rendering and all the effects and everything having a pretty serious effect on battery life, maybe on especially older phones with smaller batteries. If this is going to, someone should do the, the test.

• 43:54Andrew Manganelli?

  I think it was pretty much confirmed that that was like, really causing the, well, no, not changing this, but previously in the first liquid glass beta, you guys were getting batteries tanked.

• 44:04David Imel?

  Which I believe, but it was just harder to attribute to specifically just this effect because the beta had so many new things. Now it's just one, now that it's one toggle and I can go full on liquid glass everywhere, or I'm trying to say.

• 44:18Speaker 01

  Now that it's just one toggle, someone should have two phones. One has a toggle clear, one has a toggle tinted. And see what sort of a difference. That's a free short idea for someone to make. How much of a difference does this make to battery? My conspiracy theory? No, here's why I don't do that. I'll actually tell you why I do not. I don't do most benchmark battery tests. Because I don't believe that, I mean, they're decently useful, but I don't believe any of them will inherently be able to tell me what my battery experience will be like. Yeah. I can look at, like, obviously, I have a pretty good sense now from using phones for a long time. For a couple of days, like, this is going really well. This is going really poorly. How good is the battery? But certain chips and certain softwares and certain OSs, they all handle things so differently. If you just do video playback,

• 45:04Speaker 01

  your winner will be the one that optimized the best for video playback. If you just do benchmarking until the phone dies, yours will be the one that draws the least power at max load. If you just do, like, using a phone, like, regularly, I've noticed a lot of OnePlus phones that even though they don't have the best battery, they're very aggressive with killing background tasks. So they don't have the biggest batteries, but they last forever because they're constantly killing background tasks. I don't see any single battery benchmark that can account for all of my usage of a phone. So I don't do battery benchmarks. Yeah. But someone should.

• 45:37Speaker 01

  For this one feature. But it's not gonna be me. Yeah. You can do that now if you want. That was sort of a big deal. Liquid glass. You can also do it on Mac, which is interesting. That's what I'm excited for. Oh, is that also on the beta? Yeah. I kind of like the clearness on the Mac, though. Yeah, me too. Although, I don't like the top bar being clear now. I love it. You don't like that? Not as much. Change your wallpaper, change your life. Well, I do, but look at the, look at this top bit of my wallpaper, how it, like, cuts through the text. Before, it was obscured. Anyway.

• 46:07Andrew Manganelli?

  I'm realizing I need to upgrade my operating system. Looking at both of you guys.

• 46:11Speaker 01

  Get on Tahoe. No, you don't need to get on Tahoe. It's not actually that different, but. Okay. Anyway, we should take a quick break. We've got a bunch more headlines in this hat that we should get to. But before we get to that, trivia time.

• 46:24Speaker 04

  Trivia do. Guys, coming up, we have a story about this week's, last week's, this week's. I don't remember when it was.

• 46:32Speaker 01

  One of the.

• 46:32Speaker 04

  The AWS outage.

• 46:34Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah, that was last week.

• 46:35Speaker 04

  So today's.

• 46:35Speaker 01

  Last week.

• 46:36Speaker 04

  First this week.

• 46:37Speaker 01

  Oh, Sunday night. So is this week.

• 46:39Andrew Manganelli?

  That was this week.

• 46:40Speaker 01

  Yeah, this week.

• 46:41Speaker 04

  Fun fact, sometimes when I am walking through lower Manhattan and I walk by a pickleball court that has people between the ages of 28 and 38 playing pickleball on it.

• 46:50Speaker 01

  That exists.

• 46:51Speaker 04

  I will look at my.

• 46:52Speaker 01

  You're sure it's not 28 to 88?

• 46:54Speaker 04

  No, no, no. And they look techie. I will look at my phone and just say really loudly, "Oh, my God, AWS is down." And they will always stop playing pickleball and freak out.

• 47:05Speaker 04

  Every time.

• 47:07Speaker 01

  So good.

• 47:08Speaker 04

  But guys, in related, today's question, I lied. It's actually not about AWS.

• 47:13Speaker 01

  Or pickleball.

• 47:14Speaker 04

  My story, it is about Spider-Man. What is the name of the alien species referenced by Andrew when he compared Marquez's D-branded Patina to Venom from Spider-Man 3?

• 47:27Speaker 01

  Oh, there's an actual name?

• 47:30Speaker 04

  What is the name of the alien species that Venom is a part of? And I will accept the common name or the deep nerd name? And if you can get both, I guess that's two points.

• 47:42Andrew Manganelli?

  Do you even know what it is? I don't watch kids' movies.

• 47:46Speaker 01

  He said it, not me.

• 47:47Andrew Manganelli?

  At Andrew Manganelli.

• 47:49Speaker 01

  Quality rage bait. We're gonna get plenty of comments. Well played. Well, I definitely don't know the answer, but well, we'll see if maybe David knows it at the, at the end. Well, I guess you didn't see The Wild Robot, then.

• 48:02Speaker 04

  David, no!

• 48:05Speaker 04

  We'll be right back.

• 48:15Speaker 01

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• 49:20Speaker 05

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• 50:05Speaker 05

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• 50:42David Imel?

  All right, welcome back. We have more headlines and we still have the hat, so Andrew?

• 50:47Speaker 01

  Not bad. I expected disaster.

• 50:50Andrew Manganelli?

  All right, what do we got here?

• 50:52Speaker 03

  Marquez was wearing the hat and took it off without dropping any of the papers.

• 50:55Andrew Manganelli?

  I was very impressed by it. What I wasn't impressed by was the AWS outage that took out much of the internet this week.

• 51:01Speaker 04

  Called it, let's go.

• 51:03Speaker 01

  That was fun. How long did that last?

• 51:05David Imel?

  It was like, almost a full day.

• 51:07Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 51:07David Imel?

  It was the evening of Sunday until like, Monday afternoon.

• 51:11Speaker 01

  I remember the next morning, listening to like, the NPR morning news or whatever, where they just kind of talk about the biggest stories and they were like, "Oh, a bunch of sites were down yesterday with AWS and it made us really think about how many sites depend on AWS." I was like, "Don't we have this conversation every six months when AWS goes down for three hours?" We all go, "Wow."

• 51:29David Imel?

  Well, the irony was that YouTube had gone down like, two days prior.

• 51:32Speaker 01

  That's what I was remembering. I was trying, I was like, "I don't remember..." Here's the funny thing. I noticed the YouTube outage way more than AWS outage, because I was trying to watch, I was actively about to watch YouTube stuff and it didn't work. The AWS stuff took down, here's what I did notice. When I woke up, my Eight Sleep showed that I had slept for three hours. And I was like, "That's kind of weird. It's missing the first half of my sleep." And then I log on and it says, "AWS outage has kept people's smart beds from being able to recline or decline."

• 52:03Andrew Manganelli?

  That's the best part about it.

• 52:04Speaker 01

  Because there is a version of this bed that has like, a motor thing that like, inclines and declines, and obviously it can heat or cool. And if it's not working, if AWS is out, the app doesn't work. And so people had, they're stuck in whatever temperature or incline setting that they had last had it on, and I'm glad that didn't happen.

• 52:25David Imel?

  So I have a funny story related to that. So you guys were all talking in Slack about how your Eight Sleeps like, didn't track that night. And I was like, "Huh, well, I wonder if my Eight Sleep's still down?" So if you hit the si, if you like, slap the side of the bed four times, um, someone appears in the mirror, just kidding.

• 52:41Andrew Manganelli?

  Well, AWS was down, so he couldn't.

• 52:43Speaker 01

  Jeff Bezos appears in the mirror.

• 52:46David Imel?

  Your bed inclines or reclines into like bed into reading mode because I use the reading mode fairly frequently.

• 52:53Speaker 01

  Gotcha.

• 52:54David Imel?

  To read, which is crazy. So I slapped it, you know, and then nothing happened. I was like, oh, it must be down. So I like went online and it was like, everyone's like, oh, it's back up. And I was like, what's wrong? And then I realized it was unplugged. So you guys had server outages. I just didn't plug my.

• 53:14Andrew Manganelli?

  Local outage.

• 53:15David Imel?

  Local outage.

• 53:15Speaker 01

  Skill issue.

• 53:16David Imel?

  Skill issue. Yeah. So I wanted to use this outage as a little game to talk about how, how did you guys first notice that the internet was down?

• 53:26Andrew Manganelli?

  Was it Slack?

• 53:29Andrew Manganelli?

  I think someone mentioned on Slack and then I have a Discord server with a bunch of my friends and they're all software engineers and that chat just popped off because none of them had anything to do with it. And I was like, alright, you guys are.

• 53:41David Imel?

  There was a funny thing where it said that people that were in Slack huddles could not leave the huddle.

• 53:45Andrew Manganelli?

  That's, that's my worst nightmare. That's just.

• 53:50Speaker 01

  Andrew, your mic's on. Andrew, your mic's on. Andrew, you're still on?

• 53:55Andrew Manganelli?

  That's it for me. Okay. See you guys next week. Wait, wait. You guys can just watch me work for the rest of the day?

• 54:00Speaker 01

  Apparently a bunch of, what was it? AI stuff was on, or no, I was, I don't know. I just kind of listened to the NPR story and I was like, wow, that is a lot of new stuff that is all on AWS.

• 54:10David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 54:10Andrew Manganelli?

  AWS is like the backbone of a lot of these. We lost frame.

• 54:14David Imel?

  Oh, right. Mariah was trying to put something on frame and frame.io was just, just, just crapping out.

• 54:20Speaker 01

  Having, it's clutching its pearls. I had no idea what to do.

• 54:23David Imel?

  I remember I woke up at four in the morning because I've been having insomnia and just so you know, a little bit about my backstory.

• 54:30Andrew Manganelli?

  Comment what David should do to help him sleep.

• 54:32Speaker 01

  Plug it in, sleep.

• 54:36David Imel?

  Yeah. So I tried to go on Reddit because that's what I do and I can't sleep. Yeah, it's worse for me. It's not good for me.

• 54:43Andrew Manganelli?

  I'm just gonna let that one go.

• 54:44David Imel?

  I know. Anyway, it said, it kept saying.

• 54:49Speaker 04

  Oh, no, no, no.

• 54:49David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 54:50Andrew Manganelli?

  On the app? Sorry, I'll let you go.

• 54:52David Imel?

  So I don't even have the app.

• 54:53Andrew Manganelli?

  Okay.

• 54:53David Imel?

  And I was on the browser and it kept saying, uh, rate limit reached.

• 54:58Andrew Manganelli?

  Yes, yeah, yeah. I was trying to respond to things and it was like, yeah, saying something.

• 55:02David Imel?

  Rate limit reached. And I was like, I thought that this was only a thing that happened if you had a third-party Reddit app, but I'm using the browser. So what's going on? And then I found out, oh, like Reddit's like down.

• 55:12Andrew Manganelli?

  I found out because in the app, the way their refresh loading symbol is, it's a, it's an orange circle with the Reddit snoo, like running and his feet are going really fast, except since it wouldn't load, it just went down. It was just like,

• 55:26Andrew Manganelli?

  and would just do it for like a minute straight of just like running and running and running.

• 55:29David Imel?

  Oh, wow.

• 55:30Andrew Manganelli?

  Like, wow, what the hell? But I just assumed it's because Reddit sucks.

• 55:32David Imel?

  Yeah. Other things that went down are the McDonald's app, Fortnite, Canva, Snapchat.

• 55:39Andrew Manganelli?

  That killed Ellis's whole weekend. McDonald's and Fortnite.

• 55:43Speaker 04

  Eat Fish Filet is a new Canva. I don't know. Like, did you see the funniest one that went down?

• 55:48David Imel?

  What?

• 55:48Speaker 04

  That, I really hope I have the backend details of this, right? I was like trying to research it and there wasn't a lot of great reporting, but I'm pretty sure the Bored Ate Yacht Club images are posted on AWS. So everyone who owned those NFTs could not view their little monkeys.

• 56:04Andrew Manganelli?

  Oh, no, that's sad. Wow. Anyway.

• 56:06David Imel?

  Yeah, Amazon said that the issue was related to the domain name system. They did not specify how or why. But if you want to learn more about the domain name system, we have a full two-part mini-series. Called ICANN and the Seven Keys in the Internet and the Secret History of the Internet.

• 56:22Speaker 04

  We drove for seven hours to make that and all slept in one hotel room.

• 56:26David Imel?

  That's true.

• 56:27Speaker 01

  I just want to say, I feel like when, when, when, obviously when AWS goes down, like a whole section of the internet, like all these people can all gather together and be like, wow, look at how frustrating this is. When YouTube goes down, I feel like it happens once every two or three years. And they used to have actually, when it like really went down, it would just be like the monkeys are trying to fix things page or whatever, and that would go viral. But when YouTube goes down, I feel like all of society collectively goes, huh?

• 57:00Speaker 01

  I do now, like, at least for me. I don't, I don't use Netflix. I use a whole bunch of other stuff. So what I'm trying to watch a YouTube video and the specific way that it went down.

• 57:08Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah.

• 57:08Speaker 01

  Was the homepage would load, thumbnails would load.

• 57:12Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah.

• 57:12Speaker 01

  I would click the video, the page, the player and all the related thumbnails would load, but the browser, the video would just never load.

• 57:19Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah.

• 57:20Speaker 01

  And so I was like, I was in the zone of, I want to watch this video.

• 57:24Andrew Manganelli?

  And you're just waiting.

• 57:24Speaker 01

  Couldn't watch this.

• 57:25Andrew Manganelli?

  Bad plane wifi.

• 57:27Speaker 01

  It was like, yeah.

• 57:28Andrew Manganelli?

  It was like titles loading.

• 57:29Speaker 01

  Terrible wifi. It was like being on United flight. Anyway.

• 57:32Andrew Manganelli?

  It was very, it's very funny because, uh, like a week and a half ago, so my friend Mark was gonna go on that subway takes thing.

• 57:38Speaker 01

  Um.

• 57:39Andrew Manganelli?

  So I said, what's your take? And he said, I don't know if I could say this, but we have to take out the data centers to just restart society. And I was like, yeah, that's a, that's a good one. And then the next week. I was like, did Mark do something?

• 57:52Speaker 01

  Did he set this up?

• 57:53Andrew Manganelli?

  Now that the internet's back up, because you're watching this, I guess we have other things to worry about. Yeah. Hopefully, that's two days from now.

• 58:00Speaker 01

  Was it me?

• 58:01Andrew Manganelli?

  I thought it was Marquez, because I went last.

• 58:03Speaker 01

  You just pulled AWS, right?

• 58:04Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah, but we were not going, we're going in a Marquez, David, Andrew order. We're clockwise.

• 58:08Speaker 01

  Oh, we're clockwise. Not snaking. Got it.

• 58:12Andrew Manganelli?

  It was more of just me offering it to both of you before me and then now that's.

• 58:16Speaker 01

  Uh, I don't know anything about this.

• 58:17Andrew Manganelli?

  Yes. This is my, I think this is the coolest thing we're gonna talk about today.

• 58:20Speaker 01

  I love this. I got a story about this.

• 58:22Andrew Manganelli?

  Do you wanna take it or?

• 58:23Speaker 01

  You'll have to explain.

• 58:24Andrew Manganelli?

  It's up to you.

• 58:24Speaker 01

  Let me just read what it says.

• 58:25Andrew Manganelli?

  Okay.

• 58:26Speaker 01

  Color.

• 58:27Andrew Manganelli?

  Yes.

• 58:28Speaker 01

  E Ink.

• 58:29Andrew Manganelli?

  Yes.

• 58:30Speaker 01

  Flames.

• 58:30Andrew Manganelli?

  Frame.

• 58:31Speaker 01

  Frames. You wrote flames.

• 58:34Andrew Manganelli?

  I did not. That's an R.

• 58:35Speaker 01

  That's an R? You sure about that?

• 58:36Andrew Manganelli?

  Vaguely. What do you think that is?

• 58:38Speaker 01

  Color E Ink Flame.

• 58:39Andrew Manganelli?

  Color E. It would be pretty cool.

• 58:41Speaker 01

  Color E Ink Frames. Can someone explain this to me?

• 58:44Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah. Yes. I, I'll go.

• 58:46Speaker 01

  You go.

• 58:47Andrew Manganelli?

  I'll go and you join in.

• 58:48Speaker 01

  I'll join in later.

• 58:49Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah, but in, okay, so Aura, which disclaimer, has sponsored the podcast before, so take everything we say with a grain of, grain of salt. But.

• 58:55Speaker 01

  Chill.

• 58:57Andrew Manganelli?

  They just released their new Color E Ink Wireless Photo Frame. Previously, they've done the photo frames where you get an app, it plugs in and it can rotate images.

• 59:07Speaker 01

  Color E Ink Wireless Photo.

• 59:09Andrew Manganelli?

  Photo Frame. So it has a built in battery? Yes. So it can die?

• 59:12Speaker 01

  No, but it's.

• 59:13Andrew Manganelli?

  Yes, hold on, all, so it is.

• 59:15Speaker 01

  But it's color.

• 59:16Andrew Manganelli?

  It's color.

• 59:17Speaker 01

  So?

• 59:17Andrew Manganelli?

  The colors, dude. The colors. It's all static state. Okay, I'll do the specs first. 13.3 inch panel. It is 11.5 by 14. So this is like a pretty good size.

• 59:27Speaker 01

  It's pretty big.

• 59:28Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah. The battery life should be approximately three months on a full charge. Also, the charging port is on the outside of the frame with a 10 foot cable. So you can charge it while, without even taking it off the wall. I think that's cool.

• 59:41Speaker 01

  That's cool.

• 59:41Andrew Manganelli?

  Because it is using the new Spectra 6 display technology. And because of all of that, because of the less power draw, this is the first time they could go wireless because an LCD obviously takes so much more power.

• 59:57Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 59:57Andrew Manganelli?

  They can't do it where now we're at e-ink. It's taking way less to be able to show these photos. In fact, it's so, it's so dim, they actually needed to add a little tiny front light inside of the mat of the frame. But Alison Johnson from The Verge did an article on this, which everyone should go read if they're interested. But she said she like, didn't even notice it at first. And also that light will turn off once ambient light is off at night. I just got signed out of my Google Doc for some reason. Is AWS down?

• 1:00:26Speaker 01

  I have some questions about this. I have some thoughts as well. So I'm not, I'll just preface this by saying I'm not a big photo frame person yet. Maybe I will be soon, right? But as someone who doesn't use photo frames, is there any advantage to it not just being plugged in all the time? Like, why would you ever unplug it? Because then you have a big wire.

• 1:00:48Andrew Manganelli?

  You have a wire. If you want to hang it on the wall or something.

• 1:00:50Speaker 01

  If you hang up a regular photo, you, you don't have to plug it in. It's art. I guess I pictured a photo frame being on a desk. You're like hanging it on the wall. Yeah. Okay.

• 1:00:59Andrew Manganelli?

  So right now my Aura Frame, which I love, I have one of them. I have bought them as gifts before. If you are somebody with children and want to give a gift to the grandparents of those children, it is like the easiest gift in the world.

• 1:01:12Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:01:12Andrew Manganelli?

  But like mine's on my desk now because of the wire. The one I have like at home is on a table because of the wire. I can hide the wire.

• 1:01:20Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:01:20Andrew Manganelli?

  You just don't want a wire hanging up your wall.

• 1:01:22Speaker 01

  Yeah. Okay. And because I've seen a bunch of smart, like the Google Home can be a photo frame in the same way. Like you set a Google Photos album to always be displayed on it. And it's always next to the wall because it's plugged in. So that's kind of how I picture photo frames. But okay, you can hang it. The other thing is how good does this look? How good does colored e-ink look versus like a, a normal?

• 1:01:40Andrew Manganelli?

  Even an OLED, maybe if it's like a super premium.

• 1:01:42David Imel?

  So that is, that is the question. I have been lusting over e-ink picture frames for many, many, many years. Every year I would go to CES and it would be like, we put Alexa in your fridge. And I'd be like, no. And then I'd go over to the e-ink section and I'd be like, yeah. And they used to show these prototypes of both things like this, which they had, they actually had big prints like that. So the cool thing about this is because it's ink, right? It is actual ink, so it looks just like it's on actual paper and actual canvas. The big seller of the Samsung Frame TV is that they have a special like matte layer on it. They have the borders around it. They have the light box, the matte box. It makes it look fairly realistic.

• 1:02:24David Imel?

  And I think the Frame TV Pro has like a matte option that can make it even more realistic looking. But if you want like real, real looking art, that actually has depth and dimension and like texture. You gotta use ink.

• 1:02:38Andrew Manganelli?

  Interesting.

• 1:02:38David Imel?

  Right? So I've been lusting after a big thing where I can just like rotate my, my film work around forever. And so now this coming out is great, but didn't Allison say that the resolution didn't look amazing?

• 1:02:52Andrew Manganelli?

  Allison, so she said, there's a couple of different things. You know, some colors might look a little off. She said like blues looked really nice and, and pictures with good contrast looked better on it. And I think she said like some paler faces might have like a little bit of a green tint to them. Um, but she said, resolution wise, if you are right up there pixel peaking, you can definitely see all the different, um, dots that it is creating.

• 1:03:17David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:03:17Andrew Manganelli?

  But from far away, or just like on the wall as you're walking by it, she said, looks totally fine. The interesting thing about this, and one way it saves battery is normal aura frames, like when you have it, you're, a lot of them are rotating every five or 10 minutes, depending what you set on. What this does is it by default only does one picture per day and actually changes the picture at night. Because of the way it needs to, uh, like

• 1:03:41David Imel?

  Like flash.

• 1:03:42Andrew Manganelli?

  Change all of the different specific dots.

• 1:03:45David Imel?

  Modules.

• 1:03:45Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah. She said it takes about 30 seconds before it'll stop flickering a little bit because it's still changing.

• 1:03:51David Imel?

  The lowest power draw version of a

• 1:03:53Andrew Manganelli?

  Exactly. So like it'll just do it every day. So then every day you wake up and you just have a new photo on your wall, which I think is awesome.

• 1:04:01David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:04:02Andrew Manganelli?

  That's

• 1:04:02David Imel?

  This is the Buchs Palma 2. When you turn it on, it does this flash thing and then you can like, you know, reset the screen. It has to flash in and out. So when these are setting, it, it does the same thing where it flashes and then it slowly sort of like magnetically moves the modules like in front and in that area. I can see the color not being amazing because they probably only have

• 1:04:26Andrew Manganelli?

  Six colors.

• 1:04:27David Imel?

  Cause they use individual little like, like ink bead things. And yeah, if you only have six colors, obviously you're not going to be able to recreate like rec 2020 or something like that. With billions of color options.

• 1:04:40Speaker 04

  Can't you recreate all the colors with three colors?

• 1:04:43David Imel?

  Well, that's

• 1:04:43Speaker 04

  Or four colors?

• 1:04:44David Imel?

  That's dependent on luminance.

• 1:04:47Speaker 04

  I'm not talking about CMYK, son.

• 1:04:50David Imel?

  Yeah, but you still need like different levels of like luminance and saturation and that kind of stuff where these are just finite colors. They can't change, they can't change luminance. They can't change saturation.

• 1:05:02Speaker 04

  It's not like, it's not like actual ink where you, you can make more or less ink. It's either there's cyan on cyan off magenta on.

• 1:05:09David Imel?

  Exactly. And the different mixes when you're standing far enough away look like other vaguely like other colors. But you need different luminances and saturation values to actually do that. Well, which is probably why people's skin tones have a little more green in them because we, our skin tones actually do have green in them. You just, we don't really see that as much because there's other colors mixed in.

• 1:05:29Speaker 03

  Can I be the grumpy boomer here?

• 1:05:31Andrew Manganelli?

  If you want. Want to get roasted by the Ian community?

• 1:05:34David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:05:35Speaker 03

  Why would I want this in my frame on the wall? Like I get it.

• 1:05:39Andrew Manganelli?

  Why not?

• 1:05:39Speaker 03

  I get it in because it's something else that I have to charge. That's so annoying.

• 1:05:43David Imel?

  Yeah, but okay.

• 1:05:44Andrew Manganelli?

  Sorry. No, I was just gonna say, I have an, I was gonna say my doorbell, I thought the doorbell was gonna be so annoying. Why would you ever want to charge it? It's so easy.

• 1:05:53Speaker 03

  I'm not saying it's hard. I'm just saying it's another thing that takes up mental space that I have to think about. Like my Garmin watch lasts a month, but when I have to charge it, it's still like, ugh.

• 1:06:01Andrew Manganelli?

  If it sends me a notification that like frame is low, charge it in the next like three days, chances are, especially if you don't even need to unplug it, if there's an outlet within 10 feet, just when you go to bed, plug the outlet in and toss it in and then take it out in the morning.

• 1:06:14David Imel?

  Can you not just like set one photo and if you don't rotate it every day, it has unlimited battery life?

• 1:06:20Speaker 03

  It's not gonna last forever. It'll eventually die.

• 1:06:22Andrew Manganelli?

  Probably not. It still has the light though. That needs to.

• 1:06:25Speaker 01

  Has a light.

• 1:06:26Andrew Manganelli?

  Light.

• 1:06:26Speaker 01

  Draw, so it's probably internet connected to just stay available.

• 1:06:29Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah, okay. Like, to me, the draw of this thing is something like the one that you have on your desk. Because that is perfect. You plug it in, you forget about it, and you ignore it forever. Even though it's every three months. Unless AWS goes down. Unless. I wouldn't be surprised if mine went off after the. Or didn't rotate, sorry. Still needing to think about this is too annoying. That's my take. This is like.

• 1:06:50Speaker 01

  Yeah, I would just.

• 1:06:51Andrew Manganelli?

  This is an awesome step.

• 1:06:52David Imel?

  My blinds I have to charge like every three months. It's really not that bad.

• 1:06:54Speaker 01

  I would just leave it plugged in the whole time.

• 1:06:56Andrew Manganelli?

  That's what I'm saying.

• 1:06:56Speaker 01

  I would never unplug.

• 1:06:57Andrew Manganelli?

  I would just never unplug this. Now you just get the option to be, if you're someone who's not a grumpy old boomer like Adam, then you get to hang it on your wall without a wire.

• 1:07:04Speaker 01

  I would leave it plugged in forever, and then when I have company over, I would unplug it.

• 1:07:07Andrew Manganelli?

  That's, that's fair. That's totally fair.

• 1:07:09Speaker 01

  And then as soon as they left, I'd plug it back in.

• 1:07:11David Imel?

  I do think we unfortunately have to move on from smart picture frames.

• 1:07:14Andrew Manganelli?

  I love this.

• 1:07:14Speaker 01

  I didn't realize how long we talked about this.

• 1:07:16David Imel?

  I love this topic, but we are more boomer than probably our audiences, so.

• 1:07:19Andrew Manganelli?

  I love, this is my favorite thing of the week.

• 1:07:21David Imel?

  I, it's great.

• 1:07:22Speaker 04

  Tech is all about.

• 1:07:23David Imel?

  That's right. This is a gadget that I don't feel bad in buying and.

• 1:07:26Andrew Manganelli?

  Can't wait till the next one has an L L.

• 1:07:29Speaker 04

  Yeah, the next one is like new, new TikTok integrated gun.

• 1:07:36David Imel?

  That's the thumbnail.

• 1:07:37Speaker 01

  Three thousand.

• 1:07:38Andrew Manganelli?

  Ooh, I think it's.

• 1:07:39Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:07:39David Imel?

  That, that is real. Okay.

• 1:07:41Andrew Manganelli?

  What, we'll do this one and then another ad break?

• 1:07:43David Imel?

  Not too different from that. Vision Pro Strat Plus M5.

• 1:07:47Speaker 01

  Hey, okay, I can do this one. Huge update this week in Apple land. You can watch my Twitter video or the first 30 seconds of the video I made about this to understand where M5 dropped. Cause it didn't drop everywhere. You might expect everything with M4 got M5. No. Only iPad Pro, which had M4, now has M5. And M4 MacBook Pro has M5. And Vision Pro, which had M2, is now M5. The other two devices kinda just got that spec bump and that was it. The Vision Pro got a little bit more than just the new chip. It's been a little longer, almost two years actually, since the original Vision Pro dropped. It had M2.

• 1:08:31Speaker 01

  And so what you get is the spec bump, which enables, you know, a slightly larger area of foveated rendering, 10% more rendered pixels, a slightly longer battery life, three hours of video playback instead of two.

• 1:08:42David Imel?

  Isn't 2.5 instead of two?

• 1:08:43Speaker 01

  I think it's three instead of 2.5.

• 1:08:45David Imel?

  Oh.

• 1:08:45Speaker 01

  Correct. It might be somewhere in there. It's not a dramatic difference.

• 1:08:48David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:08:49Speaker 01

  And I think things like ray tracing and general fidelity being slightly higher. Great. M5 enables that. But the actually more important thing was just the new strap, the $99 dual-band strap, which you can also buy for your original Vision Pro. But it is counterweighted. It has tungsten weights in the back. And so you put it on and it actually has a little bit more weight on the back of your head and on the top. So it takes the weight off of the bridge of your nose and it just holds it in a more comfortable way.

• 1:09:18David Imel?

  Significantly better.

• 1:09:19Speaker 01

  It's more comfortable than any of the other bands they've had and it's better looking than the other dual-strap band they had. So that's the Vision Pro update. That's kind of it. I mean, most of the updates with Vision Pro that are significant are the software. Vision OS 26 has like the new personas, which are higher resolution and better looking and more realistic and all the pinnable widgets all over the place and all the other stuff.

• 1:09:39David Imel?

  Precisely.

• 1:09:40Speaker 01

  And Apple Intelligence finally starting to show up with writing tools.

• 1:09:43David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:09:43Speaker 01

  I think there's one, if you were doing what Ellis is doing and using the Mac mirroring, there's one new big ultra-wide monitor. So there's like standard wide and ultra-wide.

• 1:09:54David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:09:54Speaker 01

  The ultra-wide looks crazy.

• 1:09:55David Imel?

  Why can't they just give us two?

• 1:09:58Speaker 01

  I don't know. I think that might be a power limitation. I mean, it's still a lot of pixels.

• 1:10:03David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:10:03Speaker 01

  But yeah, it looks really good. I just was messing with it. Honestly, that's probably the same exact thing. Just cut it in half.

• 1:10:10David Imel?

  Yeah, the fact that they did not drop M5, I don't even, you know, I get that why they didn't drop M5 Pro and M5 Max yet, but a friend of mine hit me up, just, he just got a new job. And he was like, oh, my job is giving me a quota to buy a new laptop. What should I get? I was thinking of getting an M5, but I kind of wanted a MacBook Air. And I was like, yeah, why didn't they put this in the MacBook Air?

• 1:10:34Speaker 01

  Yeah, there's still a bunch of places that have M4 like MacBook Air, Mac Mini and iMac. An iPad Air that have base chips that they didn't do M5 in.

• 1:10:43David Imel?

  Yet.

• 1:10:43Speaker 01

  Yet. They presumably will. I just don't know why they were unable to do the whole refresh across the board.

• 1:10:50David Imel?

  And not only was it only the base MacBook Pro, but it was the only 14 inch.

• 1:10:55Speaker 01

  Well, because the 14 inch is the only one that you could get the base chip in. The 16 inches only ship with Pro or Max chips.

• 1:11:02David Imel?

  Okay.

• 1:11:02Speaker 01

  So if you want a base chip MacBook Pro, you have to get a 14 inch and now you can get an M5 instead of M4.

• 1:11:07David Imel?

  It's just weird that they didn't put it in the air. Unless they're planning like a big hardware update for the Air, which I doubt they're doing because they just did that.

• 1:11:13Speaker 01

  Hard to say.

• 1:11:14David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:11:15Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:11:15David Imel?

  Interesting.

• 1:11:16Speaker 01

  Yeah, there's a world where like people were not yet going to buy an iMac because they're waiting for the M5 iMac. And now the M5 chip is out and there's still no M5 iMac. Now what? Do you just get the M4 now?

• 1:11:27David Imel?

  And aren't we still on like M2 Ultra for the Ultra chip?

• 1:11:30Speaker 01

  Oh, the Ultra chips, M3 Ultra is the biggest one.

• 1:11:32David Imel?

  M3 Ultra.

• 1:11:32Speaker 01

  And that's in the Mac Studio. My Mac Pro is on M2 Ultra.

• 1:11:36David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:11:37Speaker 01

  So now that we have M5 out, I'm like, alright.

• 1:11:40David Imel?

  Yeah. I did want to know, everyone was memeing the fact that this is heavier online because of the counterweights. Yeah, I'm just trying to find the exact extra weight, but it's like 150 grams more, which is, it seems like a lot and it is a lot. But the fact that it is in the back headband on the new strap actually makes it better weighted on your face. And when you're wearing it for longer, it doesn't put nearly as much pressure on the bridge of your nose. So yes, I agree. It is very funny that it was way too heavy and now it's even heavier, but in a good way.

• 1:12:15Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:12:15David Imel?

  So just to clear that up for people.

• 1:12:17Speaker 01

  So you know how earlier in this episode, you were saying like, I don't know if Samsung really wants to commit that much of a team to like fighting the Vision Pro? Because it seems like they've realized it's not doing that well.

• 1:12:28David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:12:29Speaker 01

  That's how I feel about this Vision Pro.

• 1:12:32David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:12:32Speaker 01

  We had so many thoughts and initial impressions when the Vision Pro came out. It was a new form factor. It was all this interesting stuff and this crazy expensive bleeding edge device. And so the second generation theoretically should tell us the most about what they learned, the direction they're going, and like what this thing is really about to become.

• 1:12:50David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:12:51Speaker 01

  And we get this refresh and your eyes were getting hot in the first one, still gets hot. All of the vents are in the same places. The chip still gets hot, still has the R1, still has the M chip. It's still heavy. They didn't shave a single gram of aluminum out of there. It still has the glass. It still has the same eyesight on the front. They didn't make any like directional change with Vision Pro. They just showed up and went, okay, the strap's done. Anything else we want to do with the Vision Pro itself?

• 1:13:17David Imel?

  Nah.

• 1:13:18Speaker 01

  New chip? Toss that in there.

• 1:13:20David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:13:20Speaker 01

  All right, yeah, should render a few more pixels. Ship it. Like, I didn't see any commitment to a direction, if that makes sense. So I got the same feeling that Apple was like, oh, this isn't really doing anything. And plus, all those articles we've seen about, you know, maybe them doing a vision air and then realizing that's not the direction they want to go either and shifting to glasses.

• 1:13:38David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:13:39Speaker 01

  I totally believe that. I have no way to prove that, but I've seen the reporting and it just feels like this Vision Pro is like the last update we'll see for a while.

• 1:13:46David Imel?

  Yeah, part of it to me feels like they just needed to make more M5 chips to get the per unit cost down.

• 1:13:51Speaker 01

  Toss it in the Mac Mini. Or the MacBook Air, the most popular laptop.

• 1:13:55David Imel?

  Yeah, I don't know. It's strange. It is very strange.

• 1:13:58Speaker 01

  The video's out, if you want to watch it.

• 1:14:00David Imel?

  It is, uh, it is a whole bunch of my musings about smart watch, smart displays, smart headset, smart.

• 1:14:06Speaker 01

  You're doing great.

• 1:14:07David Imel?

  Smart face.

• 1:14:07Speaker 01

  Smart.

• 1:14:08David Imel?

  Face.

• 1:14:09Speaker 01

  Computers.

• 1:14:10David Imel?

  Glasses.

• 1:14:11Speaker 01

  Sick.

• 1:14:11David Imel?

  Glass.

• 1:14:12Speaker 01

  Let's, let's.

• 1:14:13David Imel?

  Et cetera. Um, speaking of trivia.

• 1:14:17David Imel?

  We were.

• 1:14:18Speaker 04

  Do you guys know that, uh, there's a Star Trek villain named M5?

• 1:14:24David Imel?

  Really?

• 1:14:24Speaker 04

  Yeah. And it's a computer.

• 1:14:27Speaker 03

  Hmm.

• 1:14:28Speaker 04

  Pretty good episode, season two, episode 24.

• 1:14:30Speaker 03

  Nice.

• 1:14:31Speaker 04

  Should watch it.

• 1:14:32Speaker 01

  Of, uh, Next Generation?

• 1:14:33Speaker 04

  I had to Google the episode. I did not know the episode.

• 1:14:35Speaker 01

  Star Trek is one of the few shows I have watched.

• 1:14:38Speaker 04

  Shut up.

• 1:14:39Speaker 01

  How much of it?

• 1:14:39Speaker 04

  Which one?

• 1:14:40Speaker 03

  All of it?

• 1:14:40Speaker 04

  Which one?

• 1:14:41Speaker 01

  Next Generation?

• 1:14:42Speaker 04

  What do you mean you don't know?

• 1:14:43Speaker 01

  Well, I didn't watch it in any order. I just sat down.

• 1:14:46Speaker 04

  There's like 10 different Star Trek shows.

• 1:14:47Speaker 01

  Oh, there's like. Whatever was actually playing reruns on TV a decade ago, that's what I've watched.

• 1:14:54Speaker 03

  Probably Next Generation.

• 1:14:55Speaker 01

  Marquez has only watched.

• 1:14:55Speaker 04

  Was the guy bald or was he could he have hair?

• 1:14:58Speaker 03

  There was a spark in there.

• 1:14:59Speaker 04

  So it sounds like you watched original Trek.

• 1:15:00Speaker 03

  That's Star Wars.

• 1:15:01Speaker 04

  Classic.

• 1:15:02Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 1:15:03Speaker 04

  That's my favorite.

• 1:15:03Speaker 03

  That's Digimon.

• 1:15:04Speaker 04

  That's Dig.

• 1:15:05Speaker 03

  Bulbasaur?

• 1:15:07Speaker 01

  After the break, we will be talking about space. Specifically Starlink.

• 1:15:11Speaker 03

  Frontier.

• 1:15:12Speaker 01

  The final frontier, specifically Starlink. So here's the question. In which layer of the atmosphere do Starlink satellites satellite? I know this.

• 1:15:21Speaker 03

  I would guess.

• 1:15:23Speaker 01

  I will accept two answers. Oh. The actual.

• 1:15:27Speaker 03

  Layer and the general phrase.

• 1:15:30Speaker 01

  The upper.

• 1:15:32Speaker 03

  Not that simple.

• 1:15:32Speaker 01

  I have, I, I only know so many layer names.

• 1:15:34Speaker 03

  The fifth floor.

• 1:15:35Speaker 01

  So I have to go with one of the ones that I remember.

• 1:15:37Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 1:15:38Speaker 01

  Okay, yeah. Well, we will think about that. Answers will be at the end like usual. We'll be right back.

• 1:15:52Speaker 01

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• 1:17:25Speaker 06

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• 1:18:04David Imel?

  All right, welcome back. We have two headlines left in this hat.

• 1:18:08Andrew Manganelli?

  Do you remember whose turn it was?

• 1:18:09David Imel?

  I think David went last with Vision Pro, right? I went last with Vision Pro.

• 1:18:14Andrew Manganelli?

  Okay, yes, so then it's my turn.

• 1:18:15David Imel?

  So you go. Yeah, take the second to last headline. What happened this week?

• 1:18:20Andrew Manganelli?

  Oh, this is fif- this is a very long thing. So I wrote, 15 pixel super fans get to beta test new phones.

• 1:18:27David Imel?

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:18:28Andrew Manganelli?

  15% of my diet.

• 1:18:30David Imel?

  15% of my beta fans get to test pixel ones? Yeah, do you know about this?

• 1:18:33Andrew Manganelli?

  I do not.

• 1:18:34David Imel?

  Okay. Saw this headline. All right, so Google is letting 15 pixel super fans beta test new pixel devices while still in development. At first, this was a rumor that popped up, but then there was confirmation that it was actually happening. So effectively, what this is, is that a bunch of people got to apply if you were a super fan, which is basically Google's way of saying... You're loyal. You will not stray from your loyalty. You're 100% loyal to Apple.

• 1:19:04Andrew Manganelli?

  Kiss the ring.

• 1:19:05David Imel?

  Kiss the ring. Um, yeah. If you're in their super fans program, you could apply to be one of these people that get to test phones.

• 1:19:12Andrew Manganelli?

  But you also have to apply to that program.

• 1:19:15David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:19:15Andrew Manganelli?

  Which I tried to do when this article came out and one of the checkboxes is, are you a member of the press AKA blogs or podcasts? And I was like, damn it.

• 1:19:24David Imel?

  Got me. Oh, they don't let you do that if you're part of the press?

• 1:19:27Andrew Manganelli?

  I mean, I don't know if that's a pro or a con, but the fact that I need to say that I'm a part of.

• 1:19:31David Imel?

  That's definitely one of those Google docs where as soon as you check that box, they just go, all right.

• 1:19:35Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah.

• 1:19:36David Imel?

  Never mind. Yeah. Basically, you could apply for this. And then if you were selected, you would have to sign an NDA not to talk about the device. You have to agree to put the phones in these protective cases to hide their designs. And submissions are going to be based on depth of knowledge and passion for Google devices and soft software.

• 1:19:56Andrew Manganelli?

  Okay. Can I ask something?

• 1:19:58David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:19:59Speaker 01

  What is the point of this?

• 1:20:00Andrew Manganelli?

  Wait, I, can I counter it?

• 1:20:02David Imel?

  Loyalty.

• 1:20:03Andrew Manganelli?

  I see the point of it.

• 1:20:04Speaker 01

  What's the point?

• 1:20:05Andrew Manganelli?

  Assuming the NDA is you also can't really talk about it afterwards, then this is just making sure it is people who really do like pixels and probably go through the settings. Getting to test software and potentially find bugs before it comes out. They're not reporting on it. So we don't have to worry about. They're not allowed to talk about it. We don't have to worry about biasness in a report from them. But they just, this is the kind of.

• 1:20:29David Imel?

  Outsourcing their QA testing.

• 1:20:30Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah, no, no.

• 1:20:31David Imel?

  Point is they're getting.

• 1:20:32Andrew Manganelli?

  15 is not enough, I would say.

• 1:20:33David Imel?

  Free QA testing.

• 1:20:34Speaker 01

  15 enthusiasts to help bug test.

• 1:20:38Andrew Manganelli?

  Essentially. I mean, how many times do things come out where like this thing works perfectly? And then we peel the screen protector off the first fold. And it's like, maybe if you threw that to one normal person, not.

• 1:20:48David Imel?

  Fair?

• 1:20:49Andrew Manganelli?

  Like, they would have seen that.

• 1:20:50David Imel?

  Cause I guess I hear that, uh, there's an NDA and they can't talk about it. So I'm like, okay, this isn't press. And then what was the other thing?

• 1:20:58Speaker 01

  They have to be in a protective case that includes the design.

• 1:21:01David Imel?

  So they can't promote it. And even if they did, there already is pixel super fans that they're going to anyway. So that wouldn't have been unique. And also is the pixel super fan really going to critique anything? So really it's just bug testing.

• 1:21:12Andrew Manganelli?

  That's the, the question, I guess. Yeah, are you gonna be like, this is perfect. I don't want to say anything bad or because you're in a private thing, you're probably gonna want to

• 1:21:22David Imel?

  Be productive.

• 1:21:23Andrew Manganelli?

  You you're gonna want to prove that you are worth being part of this thing. I'm assuming if you applied to be a super fan, you probably will go pretty deep into it. So yeah, this is like intern labor.

• 1:21:34David Imel?

  Yeah. Yeah. It will be funny when one of these leaks.

• 1:21:39Andrew Manganelli?

  Oh, yeah, 100%.

• 1:21:41David Imel?

  I can't wait. Um, I know that, you know,

• 1:21:43Speaker 04

  Pixels never.

• 1:21:45David Imel?

  Don't be silly. It's only 15 people, so the chances are lower, but I am also basically guaranteeing that one of these people will really want the 15 minutes of fame.

• 1:21:56Andrew Manganelli?

  I want to know if they can talk about it after the

• 1:21:59David Imel?

  They probably can.

• 1:22:00Andrew Manganelli?

  Levels.

• 1:22:01David Imel?

  They probably can, because then they would be able to say, I got to have a say in the design and the development of this pixel.

• 1:22:08Speaker 01

  Being a super fan.

• 1:22:08David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:22:09Andrew Manganelli?

  But then can you not apply next time because now you're part of the press?

• 1:22:13David Imel?

  Uh, hmm. Yeah, you're an intern.

• 1:22:14Andrew Manganelli?

  Checkmate, super fan.

• 1:22:16David Imel?

  Super fans.

• 1:22:17Speaker 04

  And I agree with you. I think this is good.

• 1:22:19Andrew Manganelli?

  I think it's

• 1:22:20David Imel?

  I mean, on one hand, I understand Google wants to know what their core audience likes and doesn't like about the software, about the hardware.

• 1:22:27Speaker 01

  So you hired Dieter.

• 1:22:28David Imel?

  Makes sense. They already did that.

• 1:22:31Speaker 01

  Right, right.

• 1:22:32David Imel?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:22:32Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:22:33Andrew Manganelli?

  I feel like they would probably use this as an opportunity to test completely different devices, not just software.

• 1:22:41David Imel?

  Yeah, well, they said, so it's gonna be the new phones, the new hardware.

• 1:22:45Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah, but I mean, like different crazy, different designs and see like which one speaks to the core pixel user more like

• 1:22:51David Imel?

  I see.

• 1:22:52Andrew Manganelli?

  This one with the square camera bump, or this one sticking with the visor, or what if we put the camera over here, you know?

• 1:22:56David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:22:57Speaker 01

  But if they have to use it in a protective disguising case, they can't really evaluate that.

• 1:23:01David Imel?

  Well, at least when they're out in public.

• 1:23:03Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah.

• 1:23:04David Imel?

  Yeah. Interesting. Yeah, Google's design chief Ivy Ross has said that the company is looking to mix up the design of the Pixel every two to three years. So considering the Pixel 9 and Pixel 10 are the same phone, we will probably be seeing something relatively new next year, possibly, maybe.

• 1:23:21David Imel?

  As one of these comes out.

• 1:23:22Speaker 04

  Do you guys?

• 1:23:23David Imel?

  As soon as it leaks, it's gonna leak.

• 1:23:24Speaker 04

  I think this is really good. Do you guys know the, the, the, the computer guy joke? A QA engineer walks into a bar. Have you heard this?

• 1:23:32David Imel?

  Uh, I don't know about that.

• 1:23:34Speaker 04

  Yeah, uh, uh, uh, like this, a computer science engineer, computer guy walks into a bar and orders a beer. And then they order six beers and then they order negative one beers and then they order 10 million beers and then they order null beers. And then a normal person walks into a bar and asks where the bathroom is and the bar explodes.

• 1:23:54David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:23:55Speaker 04

  And that's exactly why I think it's good that they're giving it to random people who are just super fans.

• 1:24:00David Imel?

  Yeah, I know. I didn't get that joke at all.

• 1:24:02Speaker 04

  It's because you can, you can test all the different things of something, but you can never predict what random thing an actual user is gonna do. That will just break your product, like ordering null beers is fine.

• 1:24:14David Imel?

  Well, that's, I think 15 is like, cool, that makes sense, but.

• 1:24:18Speaker 04

  I was kind of bummed that didn't get a, a huge laugh.

• 1:24:20David Imel?

  Maybe the audience is laughing.

• 1:24:21Speaker 01

  I think I might've heard it before, but that is, that very much applies.

• 1:24:24Andrew Manganelli?

  Type ha, ha, ha, ha in the comments.

• 1:24:25Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:24:27Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:24:27David Imel?

  With the timestamp, Elsa's joke really got me.

• 1:24:29Speaker 04

  Anybody wants a funny email podcast at F P P H D dot com? Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha.

• 1:24:34David Imel?

  C C Adam.

• 1:24:36Speaker 01

  Okay, well, we got one more headline. Uno mas.

• 1:24:39David Imel?

  Uno mas.

• 1:24:39Andrew Manganelli?

  Whose was it?

• 1:24:40Speaker 01

  You just went. Oh, wait, no, it's my turn. Cause it was, it was vision. You got vision pro, then you went, so now it's my turn. All right.

• 1:24:47David Imel?

  Take your headline. Oh.

• 1:24:50Speaker 01

  Oh, I got one. What's my fortune say? Really long.

• 1:24:53Speaker 04

  It's a big one.

• 1:24:54Speaker 01

  It says that SpaceX launched 10,000 Starlink satellite.

• 1:24:57David Imel?

  Yeah. Okay, cool. Yeah. Well, I just wanted to take a moment of reflection. So you just said the headline. They have launched a 10,000 Starlink into

• 1:25:10David Imel?

  a certain part of the atmosphere.

• 1:25:14David Imel?

  No, I wrote it into the script. Oh. I deleted it now. No. So only now I know about it.

• 1:25:19Speaker 01

  I may have seen it.

• 1:25:22David Imel?

  Um, anyway.

• 1:25:23Speaker 04

  I have backup trivia questions if we need.

• 1:25:26David Imel?

  Of all of those 10,000, uh, only about 8,608 are operational, according to Jonathan McDowell, who was the guy that we interviewed for our new Space Race episode. The goats. Plug number two of this podcast.

• 1:25:39Speaker 01

  What happened to the other 1,300 of them?

• 1:25:41David Imel?

  Uh, I think that they stopped working and burned up.

• 1:25:44Speaker 04

  They only, they fall out of the atmosphere after five years.

• 1:25:46David Imel?

  They burned down.

• 1:25:47Speaker 04

  They only have a five year lifespan.

• 1:25:48Speaker 01

  So they've launched, they've launched 10,000, but only 8,600 are still in orbit.

• 1:25:54Speaker 04

  I believe currently two fall out of the sky every day, and by the time they reach their 12,000, we'll be losing in between five and seven per day.

• 1:26:05David Imel?

  As a fun little statistic, if you guys remember, when we did that new Space Race episode four years ago, there were a total of 12,020 satellites that had ever been launched into space, only 7,550 were still in space, and only 4,600 were still functioning. And now, uh, there are 8,608 operational Just Starlinks.

• 1:26:26Speaker 01

  Just Starlinks.

• 1:26:27David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:26:27Speaker 01

  Just.

• 1:26:28David Imel?

  And this is why we talked about Kessler Syndrome, which is Which is what? One of the ends of the world, where, not the end of the world, but it's where basically things in orbit are falling at 17,000 miles an hour. When they hit each other, they explode. Then you've got shrapnel falling at 17,000 miles an hour. And so when the shrapnel that you can't track very well hits other things, it also explodes. Cause everything going at 17,000 miles an hour just explodes. So. I don't think that's true, but okay. I don't know, man. When it hits other stuff?

• 1:26:58Speaker 01

  When it hits stuff?

• 1:26:59David Imel?

  That's a big qualifier. I mean, I explode going 17,000 miles an hour.

• 1:27:05Speaker 01

  So I've been flying a lot of United flights over the past couple of years. You're talking about the Starlink? And not one of them has had Starlink wideband. Dude, I know. I saw, I saw someone post that they were getting like a gig, like a gigabit down on a United flight. And I was like, I've not seen any of them that have actually deployed this. I've only seen it on Twitter. It's like Elon and United's Twitter, like sharing speed tests and like, "Look at these live streams from United website." And I'm like, "Oh, wow. Seems like we should get it any second now." I've flown it so many times. None of them have had it, but hopefully soon.

• 1:27:38Andrew Manganelli?

  If flights get gigabit, you're just gonna need to like upload a video last minute and just book a flight.

• 1:27:43Speaker 01

  Book a flight.

• 1:27:43Andrew Manganelli?

  Just go hop on.

• 1:27:45Speaker 01

  We've got a really big car to upload. Time to book a flight. The title writes itself. Anyway, I'm, I'm hoping that happens soon, but yeah, Starlink. There's a lot of those things.

• 1:27:54Andrew Manganelli?

  I'm hoping lots of things. Don't fly at 17,000 miles an hour and explode in space.

• 1:27:59Speaker 01

  I don't know enough about like when they fall out of the sky, they surely burn up before hitting the ground, obviously, but maybe they hit, they hit other satellites on the way. I don't know. Well, there's low earth orbit and then there's geostationary orbit. So they're like different levels. So when they fall out of the sky, they are no longer in geostationary orbit? They're in low earth orbit. The Starlinks are all in low earth orbit. So when they fall out of the sky? Yeah. They burn up before hitting the ground? They're supposed to, yes. And they're supposed to not hit other Starlinks that are also in low earth orbit? Yeah, I mean, 3D space is big.

• 1:28:35Andrew Manganelli?

  It's pretty big.

• 1:28:35Speaker 01

  So the odds of actually hitting one are... It's pretty low.

• 1:28:38Andrew Manganelli?

  Well, that's low, but it's not zero. It's the chain reaction of the one hitting another, which hits another, which hits another.

• 1:28:43Speaker 01

  Yeah, this is one of the movies I watched. Gra- and interest- Gravity? Gravity.

• 1:28:47Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:28:48Speaker 01

  Yeah. That movie was just like uncut gems. I was so anxious the whole time.

• 1:28:53Speaker 04

  There's another thing that's going on with these Starlink re-entries, which is that the like aluminum, as it re-enters the atmosphere and burns up, gets incinerated and turns into aluminum oxide, which is really, really bad for the ozone layer.

• 1:29:06Speaker 01

  It is, yeah. I guess I don't, there's so many different scales of polluters that I'm like, all the cars that will be driven today versus the two satellites that fall out of the air.

• 1:29:15Andrew Manganelli?

  It's your fault for not throwing that Coca-Cola can in the recycling?

• 1:29:19Speaker 01

  Yeah, that's also a factor. But I guess, yeah.

• 1:29:23David Imel?

  Okay, but scale that up to all these companies launching their own satellites and then having this like ungoverned space.

• 1:29:30Andrew Manganelli?

  I feel like that was the whole point of when we first brought it up. It's not just like this one certain thing is doing it. It's just that like.

• 1:29:36David Imel?

  There's no law.

• 1:29:37Andrew Manganelli?

  Where, yeah, where does it stop? Where do we make a regulation on it? And when every trillion dollar company or multi-billion dollar company could just launch.

• 1:29:45David Imel?

  Yeah, Amazon's doing it with its creeper. How are you?

• 1:29:50David Imel?

  I was more worried about the Starry Night, I think. Yeah.

• 1:29:54Speaker 01

  Getting ruined.

• 1:29:55David Imel?

  Yeah, that's also a problem.

• 1:29:56Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:29:57David Imel?

  By Van Gogh.

• 1:29:59Speaker 01

  They stole it, right?

• 1:30:00Andrew Manganelli?

  They stole it from the Louvre.

• 1:30:01David Imel?

  No, they didn't. It's not in the Louvre. It's in the, it's in the MoMA.

• 1:30:06Speaker 01

  That was a bad joke.

• 1:30:07David Imel?

  See it many times.

• 1:30:08Speaker 04

  All right, trivia?

• 1:30:09David Imel?

  They stole my dignity from the Louvre in seven minutes. It was there.

• 1:30:13Speaker 01

  All they needed was a ladder truck.

• 1:30:15David Imel?

  Still your dignity.

• 1:30:16Speaker 01

  That's all you need. Let's do trivia. Let's do trivia.

• 1:30:19David Imel?

  Seven minutes. That's all I need.

• 1:30:23Speaker 01

  This first one, I don't know. I just don't know. I'm gonna write it now.

• 1:30:27Speaker 04

  All right, Spider-Man.

• 1:30:28Speaker 01

  I don't.

• 1:30:29Speaker 04

  Marquez's phone.

• 1:30:30Speaker 01

  What was the question?

• 1:30:30Speaker 04

  Venom.

• 1:30:31Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:30:32Speaker 04

  What is he?

• 1:30:33Speaker 01

  I don't know.

• 1:30:36Speaker 04

  I'm sorry. I thought this question.

• 1:30:39Speaker 01

  You know I don't watch movies.

• 1:30:40Speaker 04

  I just, I thought this question would be more fun than it turned out to be. I mean. Thanks. See?

• 1:30:46Speaker 01

  I hope you guys get one. Like, for all the movies, for all the movies you guys watch, I hope you get a point.

• 1:30:52Speaker 04

  Yeah, there's two possible answers here.

• 1:30:54Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:30:56David Imel?

  I can, I put two answers.

• 1:30:59Speaker 04

  All right.

• 1:31:01Speaker 01

  I wrote, I don't know, which is correct.

• 1:31:06Speaker 04

  True.

• 1:31:06Andrew Manganelli?

  I wrote the Venomites.

• 1:31:09David Imel?

  All right. I, I wrote Korg, because it just sounds like an alien monster race. And I also wrote Meteor Juice. Because didn't it come from a meteor?

• 1:31:20Speaker 04

  Kind of love that.

• 1:31:22David Imel?

  The alien?

• 1:31:22Speaker 04

  Can give you a point. The, uh, the colloquial name is symbiote or symbiotes plural.

• 1:31:28David Imel?

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:31:29Speaker 04

  And according to Wikipedia, I did not know this. It is also known as the Klintar, the Klintar.

• 1:31:35Speaker 01

  That's kind of close to Klingon.

• 1:31:38Speaker 04

  Everything is Star Trek.

• 1:31:39Speaker 01

  Star Trek again.

• 1:31:40Speaker 04

  Star Trek. It's actually Dune.

• 1:31:42David Imel?

  Every time someone leaves me, I cling on.

• 1:31:46Speaker 01

  Perfect. Like an alien. Anyway.

• 1:31:49Speaker 04

  All right, Adam.

• 1:31:49Speaker 01

  None of us got that one. Next one. All right. We have a chance with this one.

• 1:31:52Speaker 03

  Quick update on the score after that. Marquez with seven, Andrew with nine, David with five.

• 1:32:01Speaker 01

  Honestly, not that bad.

• 1:32:02Speaker 03

  Not bad. All right.

• 1:32:03Speaker 01

  Two hundred.

• 1:32:03Speaker 03

  Question number two. In which layer of the atmosphere do Starlink satellites reside?

• 1:32:09Andrew Manganelli?

  Did we not say this out loud?

• 1:32:11Speaker 03

  We did, so now I will not. I will no longer accept one of the two answers. There's two answers. Now I'm gonna need the specific name.

• 1:32:18Speaker 01

  No.

• 1:32:20Speaker 04

  We are no longer accepting low Earth orbit.

• 1:32:22Speaker 01

  No.

• 1:32:23Speaker 04

  Thank you. Get [bleeped].

• 1:32:30Speaker 03

  You made it harder for yourself.

• 1:32:32Andrew Manganelli?

  There's a line which I know is in it, but I can't think of anything other than Mason Dixon line.

• 1:32:39Speaker 01

  You should write that. Just give it a shot. I wrote the de minimis line.

• 1:32:45Speaker 03

  Why?

• 1:32:46Speaker 01

  I don't know. Just.

• 1:32:46Speaker 03

  Are you thinking about tariffs?

• 1:32:48Speaker 01

  Oh, yes, I was. I was.

• 1:32:51Speaker 03

  What is that handwriting?

• 1:32:52Speaker 01

  It's cursive, bro.

• 1:32:53Andrew Manganelli?

  That's him hearing me say.

• 1:32:55Speaker 01

  You wrote de minimis.

• 1:32:57Andrew Manganelli?

  Because I ran out of time.

• 1:32:59Speaker 03

  Andrew, what did you say? Blank?

• 1:33:02Andrew Manganelli?

  It's blank.

• 1:33:02Speaker 03

  Okay. Marquez?

• 1:33:04Speaker 01

  I took a stab. I said the ionosphere.

• 1:33:07Speaker 03

  No, but good try. It's the thermosphere.

• 1:33:09Speaker 01

  The thermosphere. The Celsiusphere.

• 1:33:14Speaker 01

  I, um, yeah, well.

• 1:33:16Speaker 03

  Marquez is right.

• 1:33:18Speaker 04

  The thermosphere is part of the ionosphere.

• 1:33:21Speaker 01

  Bang. But is that where they reside?

• 1:33:23Speaker 03

  Ionosphere is like most of it.

• 1:33:25Speaker 01

  Could I have written the sky?

• 1:33:30Speaker 01

  I think I'm right. The MISO sphere.

• 1:33:33Speaker 03

  All right, all right. We'll give it to you.

• 1:33:34Speaker 01

  I'm not wrong.

• 1:33:35Speaker 03

  You're not wrong. That's true. You're not wrong.

• 1:33:38Speaker 01

  I'm taking that point.

• 1:33:39Speaker 04

  Marques Brownlee, congratulations on your eighth point.

• 1:33:44Speaker 01

  All right.

• 1:33:45David Imel?

  Congratulations.

• 1:33:46Speaker 01

  But also comment section, feel free to tell me why I'm right. Or wrong, but I'm taking the point, though. Either way, that's been Headlines and a Hat for your final episode of Techtober.

• 1:33:55David Imel?

  Technically, no.

• 1:33:56Andrew Manganelli?

  It's not Halloween.

• 1:33:57Speaker 01

  Oh, my God, you're right. Next week is still Techtober. Okay, for your second to last week of Techtober.

• 1:34:02David Imel?

  It don't end, baby.

• 1:34:03Speaker 01

  Headlines will continue. Hats may or may not continue, but we have much more to talk about.

• 1:34:07David Imel?

  Probably on Andrew's head.

• 1:34:08Speaker 01

  Get subscribed if you haven't already. Go Devils. Who else is in the playoffs right now?

• 1:34:12Andrew Manganelli?

  What? It's the sixth game of the season.

• 1:34:14Speaker 01

  Who else is playing baseball right now? Go Dodgers.

• 1:34:16David Imel?

  LGD.

• 1:34:17Andrew Manganelli?

  Dodgers and Jays.

• 1:34:18Speaker 01

  Go Blue Jays.

• 1:34:21Andrew Manganelli?

  Go Blue.

• 1:34:21David Imel?

  Go Sixers.

• 1:34:22Speaker 01

  And go Sixers.

• 1:34:23David Imel?

  Lakers.

• 1:34:24Speaker 01

  And go Birds and go Knicks.

• 1:34:26Andrew Manganelli?

  Next opening night.

• 1:34:27Speaker 01

  And go Nets. And go, and that's all we have to say. Thanks for watching.

• 1:34:32Andrew Manganelli?

  Wait, David used to pick a sports team. What's your favorite Dota team?

• 1:34:36David Imel?

  Team Liquid.

• 1:34:37Andrew Manganelli?

  Team Liquid.

• 1:34:38Speaker 01

  All right, you heard it here first. Go Team Liquid. See you guys next week. Peace.

• 1:34:42Andrew Manganelli?

  Wait, former spruce by Adam Alina and Ellis Ruffin, a partner of Vox Media Podcast Network. And our outro music was created by Vansil.

• 1:34:47Speaker 01

  Bingo.

• 1:34:47Andrew Manganelli?

  I don't know why I felt like a robot reading that one today.

• 1:34:58Speaker 06

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• 1:35:38Speaker 06

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