Beauty Standards, Twitter & AI Girlfriends - Mark Normand

Mark Normand is a podcaster, an actor and a comedian. The mere discussion of some topics can cause huge controversy. Both sides of every issue are adamant that their opposition is fundamentally evil, malicious, bigoted or a secret race of lizard people. What is driving this huge demand for outrage? And can we do anything about it? Expect to learn Mark’s takes on the Bud Light & Miller Lite controversies, why brands have completely lost their sense of humour, whether you have engaged in Digital Blackface and why it makes you racist, the ethical dilemma of incest, why AI girlfriends will destroy society, whether Tom Hanks is part of the Illuminati, if there’s a joke that is so offensive it should never be told and much more... Sponsors: Get 16 free meals plus free shipping from HelloFresh at https://hellofresh.com/modernwisdom16 (use code: MODERNWISDOM) Get a Free Sample Pack of all LMNT Flavours with your first box at https://www.drinklmnt.com/modernwisdom (automatically applied at checkout) Get 20% discount & free shipping on your Lawnmower 4.0 at https://manscaped.com/modernwisdom (use code MODERNWISDOM) Extra Stuff: Follow Mark on Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/marknormand Check out Mark's website - http://marknormandcomedy.com/ Get my free Reading List of 100 books to read before you die → https://chriswillx.com/books/ To support me on Patreon (thank you): https://www.patreon.com/modernwisdom #racism #marknormand #comedy - 00:00 Intro 01:10 What People Don’t Know About Life on Tour 03:25 We Need to Stop Using Digital Blackface 07:53 Dove’s Quest for Realistic Beauty Standards in Gaming 18:29 How Mark Stays Positive in Today’s Society 28:11 Sexy, Playful AI Girlfriends 36:55 People’s Desire to Disconnect 39:45 Women Wearing ‘Safety Layers’ on Trains 47:34 Prince Harry’s Failed Appeal to Have Private Police 55:58 Mark’s Upcoming Netflix Special 1:02:42 Rules for Being an American Sports Fan 1:10:26 Why Beer Companies Need to Be Charming Again 1:25:19 Ethics in Porn & Incest 1:29:02 Target’s Satanist Pride Collection 1:34:24 Where to Find Mark - Get access to every episode 10 hours before YouTube by subscribing for free on Spotify - https://spoti.fi/2LSimPn or Apple Podcasts - https://apple.co/2MNqIgw Get my free Reading List of 100 life-changing books here - https://chriswillx.com/books/ - Get in touch in the comments below or head to... Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/chriswillx Twitter: https://www.twitter.com/chriswillx Email: https://chriswillx.com/contact/

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Mark Normand?

  If I kiss you, that doesn't make me gay. I just did a gay thing for a second. And if I make a racist joke or say a bad word, I don't mean that thing. I just did it for a second. You see what I'm saying?

• 0:11Chris Williamson?

  But how many gay things do you have to do before you become gay?

• 0:14Mark Normand?

  I think it's all up here. It's like being a woman. I identify, you identify.

• 0:17Chris Williamson?

  You can suck a [BLEEP] and be straight?

• 0:18Mark Normand?

  Yeah.

• 0:19Chris Williamson?

  Yeah?

• 0:19Mark Normand?

  Because sucking a [BLEEP] is just a physical act.

• 0:22Chris Williamson?

  Right.

• 0:22Mark Normand?

  But actually wanting to suck a [BLEEP], that's when you're gay.

• 0:25Chris Williamson?

  Interesting.

• 0:26Mark Normand?

  Blow, you can blow me right now, and I won't call you gay. I promise.

• 0:32Mark Normand?

  Wait, are we on?

• 0:33Chris Williamson?

  Yeah, sure.

• 0:34Mark Normand?

  Oh geez, I didn't know that. Alright.

• 0:36Chris Williamson?

  Let's say that we're on. Mark Norman, welcome to the show.

• 0:38Mark Normand?

  Hey, comedy. I didn't know if I was gonna trash those other comics you just mentioned, so I had to make sure. Um, good to be here.

• 0:45Chris Williamson?

  Thanks, man.

• 0:46Mark Normand?

  New studio.

• 0:47Chris Williamson?

  Uh, yeah, different. We're in a new place. I like this place. It's very, very cool. Yeah, it is. It's kind of like what I imagine the inside of a dildo looks like.

• 0:54Mark Normand?

  Hey, this is the fleshlight right here.

• 0:57Chris Williamson?

  Yeah, ribbed for your pleasure.

• 0:59Mark Normand?

  Smells weird, too, and it's a little sticky. But yeah.

• 1:02Chris Williamson?

  Um, so you're seeing Tom Segura at some point, I think while you're in town.

• 1:06Mark Normand?

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:07Chris Williamson?

  He's just finished a 300-date tour.

• 1:09Mark Normand?

  Woo!

• 1:10Chris Williamson?

  What do people who have never been on tour that look at comedians that are traveling the world and think, "Oh, that's cool."

• 1:16Mark Normand?

  Yeah.

• 1:16Chris Williamson?

  "That'd be good to do." What do they not know about what tour life's actually like?

• 1:20Mark Normand?

  Well, there's a couple different kinds. There's the, and the two extremes would be Segura and Burt, which, and they're friends, they're yin and yang, and, uh, Burt is a drunk, fat guy who's partying, whereas Segura has a trainer every morning at 8:00 a.m. He doesn't really drink, he eats well, he's playing the piano, he's writing, so that's really the tour life, you know? Just, which one are you on that spectrum? And I'm more towards Burt, and I'm worried because I'm gonna die, but that's really, that's really what it is. Touring is grueling, and it looks fun. We show you Instagram of us on a jet or at the big arena with the chandelier and the curtains, but

• 2:03Mark Normand?

  it's a lot of get up, what are we doing today? Oh, we gotta go to the airport. Oh, the airport's in a different language. We gotta figure this out. It's a lot of logistics, and that part sucks. But it's fun.

• 2:15Chris Williamson?

  Yeah, I don't know. I guess the reality from the outside is tons of travel, loads of packing and unpacking.

• 2:21Mark Normand?

  Yes.

• 2:21Chris Williamson?

  Being in and out of hotels.

• 2:23Mark Normand?

  Nightmare. It's all a blur. It's like that montage in Fight Club where he's just going from place to place. And you're like, who am I? Where am I? What's going on? Uh, I gotta write a new joke. Is that joke? So you're on the flight and any moment you have, you're like, all right, I gotta rest and think about my act.

• 2:38Chris Williamson?

  Yeah, I, I, I guess, um, Ryan Long was talking about this as well, that the reality of tour life is so different to what people sort of idealize.

• 2:46Mark Normand?

  Oh, yeah.

• 2:46Chris Williamson?

  And what I think most guys are doing at the moment is these little weekends, right? You just jump out, spend a weekend, two nights, three nights if you can, and then you come back. And it's like, I kind of have a life, but then I don't have a life and then I

• 2:57Mark Normand?

  Yes.

• 2:57Chris Williamson?

  Have a life and I don't. But you're going to Australia.

• 2:59Mark Normand?

  I'm going to Australia for a month, but those weekends are, that's ideal because you get to escape. You hate your girlfriend, you hate your husband, you hate your wife, you hate your apartment, you hate your city. I live in New York and it says hobos and, and shit on the street and subways. So then you get to go to Denver and you're like, ooh, I'll smoke weed, I'll go get a hike, I'll do shows and then I'll come back. So it's perfect. It's like a built in marriage saver.

• 3:23Chris Williamson?

  Have you heard of digital blackface?

• 3:25Mark Normand?

  Ooh, wait a minute. Is that where you act black online?

• 3:30Chris Williamson?

  Kind of, yeah. So this is from CNN. If you're white and you've posted a gif or a meme of a black person to express a strong emotion, you may be guilty of wearing digital blackface, writes John Blake. Maybe you shared that viral video of Kimberly Sweetbrown Wilkins telling a reporter after narrowly escaping an apartment fire, ain't nobody got time for that.

• 3:50Chris Williamson?

  You posted that meme of supermodel Tyra Banks exploding in anger on America's Next Top Model. If you're black and you've shared such online images, you get a pass. But if you're white, you may have inadvertently perpetuated one of the most insidious forms of contemporary racism. You may be wearing digital blackface. Simply put, digital blackface is 21st century min- minstrelcy.

• 4:11Mark Normand?

  Minstrel.

• 4:12Chris Williamson?

  Minstrelcy.

• 4:14Mark Normand?

  Yeah. Wow. I mean, I thought I was being inclusive by adding some black people in my memes and my gifs. Isn't that diverse? I'm diversifying my gifs.

• 4:22Chris Williamson?

  Appropriating.

• 4:23Mark Normand?

  I guess so. Jeez.

• 4:24Chris Williamson?

  I asked Jordan Peterson what color emoji he uses and he said black.

• 4:29Mark Normand?

  Oh, really? That's funny. You can't get in trouble. I mean, we're all using the eggplant. That's black.

• 4:35Chris Williamson?

  Is it? Oh, do you speak based on size?

• 4:37Mark Normand?

  Size and, you know, it's a dark shade of purple. But you know, mulignan is what Italians call black people, and that means eggplant. That's the, uh, that's the N-word for Italians.

• 4:47Chris Williamson?

  You're kidding me?

• 4:48Mark Normand?

  Yeah, so.

• 4:48Chris Williamson?

  And it's what mu- mu-

• 4:49Mark Normand?

  Mulignan. Like, these mulignans over here stole our truck.

• 4:53Chris Williamson?

  And it means eggplant in Italian?

• 4:56Mark Normand?

  In Italian, but that's their N-word.

• 4:58Chris Williamson?

  Wow.

• 4:58Mark Normand?

  Oh, yeah.

• 4:59Chris Williamson?

  Italians don't give a fuck.

• 5:01Mark Normand?

  They don't give a fuck, and it sounds cool. Mulignan. It just sounds pretty.

• 5:04Chris Williamson?

  It's way less offensive than hard R-ing your way through some, like, racial tirade.

• 5:09Mark Normand?

  Exactly. They also call retarded people retarded. No, I'm just kidding. But, um, that would be, I'm sure they got a cool word for that, too.

• 5:18Chris Williamson?

  But, yeah, digital blackface, man, you gotta be careful out there.

• 5:21Mark Normand?

  Well, they know number one threat to America is white supremacy, according to our president, so, uh...

• 5:26Chris Williamson?

  That's an interesting one.

• 5:27Mark Normand?

  I see. I like this stuff because it just shows that we're not that racist. If we have to look this far to find racism, that's a good sign that maybe we're not as racist as we think we are.

• 5:38Chris Williamson?

  So, I learned about this idea called concept creep, which you'll probably be familiar with, but the way that it's sort of come across, or been used, I guess, in, um, the modern world, is, is super, super interesting because, let's say that there's a, a bar of racism that needs to be, oh, there is a, a demand for racism.

• 5:55Mark Normand?

  A bar of raci- that's called a biker bar. Alright, sorry.

• 5:58Chris Williamson?

  Ah, there's a demand for racism that needs to be met, and if racism isn't getting bigger, what you need to do is expand the definition of it in order to maintain the supply.

• 6:08Mark Normand?

  Perfect.

• 6:09Chris Williamson?

  Yeah, so concept creep is when the demand for racism outstrips the supply of racism.

• 6:13Mark Normand?

  Yes.

• 6:14Chris Williamson?

  You need to continually make more and more things racist to keep that level high.

• 6:17Mark Normand?

  Wow. See, I love when these, these smart people come up with terms, because it just solidifies it all right there. It succinctly explains it.

• 6:25Chris Williamson?

  Well, if you think about, there are a number of people who's basically in tight careers, you know, this CNN reporter, they need to write an article.

• 6:32Mark Normand?

  Right.

• 6:32Chris Williamson?

  John Blake needs to write an article for CNN for today. God, what am I going to write about? Well, you're the racism guy.

• 6:38Mark Normand?

  Yeah.

• 6:39Chris Williamson?

  Specialize in racism. You've got to go get out there, find yourself some digital blackface. And that's now the thing. But yeah, I think looking at

• 6:46Mark Normand?

  Fascinating.

• 6:47Chris Williamson?

  Looking at the increased dilution of what different types of bigotisms and obias and whatevers. The reason for that is that there is a lack of supply.

• 7:00Mark Normand?

  Yes.

• 7:01Chris Williamson?

  Still an amount of demand.

• 7:02Mark Normand?

  It's kind of like crackheads. Well, like you start out with a good, good, solid crack rock. And then eventually like, maybe I mix baking soda and a frog's ass and like peroxide, I'll get high. And it's not actually drugs anymore, but you just, you need to open it up a little more to get high. Cause you can't get the crack.

• 7:20Chris Williamson?

  So you're saying modern day racism is like poor quality drugs?

• 7:23Mark Normand?

  Yeah, it's stepped on.

• 7:25Chris Williamson?

  Right.

• 7:25Mark Normand?

  You know, it's got baby laxative.

• 7:27Chris Williamson?

  This pure racism.

• 7:28Mark Normand?

  Yeah.

• 7:29Chris Williamson?

  Where's the pure racism that we, you know, that good old fashioned Colombian, direct from the source.

• 7:34Mark Normand?

  Jim Crow, that was pure cut cocaine, you know, Jim Crow, KKK, the, the, what do you call it? The hoses with the dogs, civil rights stuff. That was, that was pure cut. And now we're stepping on it with fucking baby powder.

• 7:47Chris Williamson?

  Blackface.

• 7:48Mark Normand?

  Yeah, exactly.

• 7:49Chris Williamson?

  Digital blackface is baby powder for that. Right. I sent you earlier on a video about Dove.

• 7:56Mark Normand?

  Yeah, that was great.

• 7:58Chris Williamson?

  So for the people that haven't seen it, Dove is on a mission to challenge and change female representation in video games and help make gaming a positive space for women and girls. So they've created this video of a like superhero, girl superhero, and they, she slays this, this evil baddie. And then she gets back into the changing room and takes her armor off and gains 80 pounds.

• 8:19Mark Normand?

  Yeah, that was odd.

• 8:20Chris Williamson?

  Immediately. And then like sits down, puts her hands behind her back and realizes I don't need to wear the armor that is holding me in. And then she goes out and like keeps on fighting, but now she's 80 pounds bigger.

• 8:30Mark Normand?

  Yeah.

• 8:32Chris Williamson?

  Female characters in games do not accurately represent the diverse gamers of the world and are often heavily sexualized and created within narrow, unrealistic beauty standards. 74% of girls feel unrepresented in video games.

• 8:45Chris Williamson?

  I'm looking forward to the Call of Duty Lizzo skin dropping. I want to unlock, I want to unlock Lizzo.

• 8:52Mark Normand?

  It's too big of a target. The terrorists, it's too easy. But here's my thing with a couple of things. I love the idea of the animator being like, the director's like, we need her fatter. So he's like, oh shit. All right. So he has to make her bigger, but also. I get it. Look, it's all, I'm all about helping women and having them being represented. But aren't we going, it's, it's getting hacky now, like Miller Lite, Bud Light, all the Starbucks had a big commercial with the trans and you're like, well, now it's just hack. The whole thing with the marketing and, and stuff like this, like this kind of art, you gotta go a new way. Isn't that the whole point of, uh, being original? Like when they zig, you zag and they're all zagging.

• 9:33Chris Williamson?

  Everybody's going in the same direction.

• 9:34Mark Normand?

  Yeah. So I'm like, to me, it's not even about the, the woke shit or whatever you want to call it. It's like, you're just being unoriginal now.

• 9:41Chris Williamson?

  It's boring.

• 9:41Mark Normand?

  It's boring.

• 9:42Chris Williamson?

  Well, I think the main concern that people have.

• 9:44Mark Normand?

  And predictable.

• 9:44Chris Williamson?

  It's kind of the same as the, like, supply, demand problem for racism, which is, it doesn't seem genuine.

• 9:51Mark Normand?

  Yes, it's forced.

• 9:52Chris Williamson?

  Yeah.

• 9:53Mark Normand?

  Completely forced, completely, what do you call that? Uh, it starts with a C.

• 9:58Chris Williamson?

  Contrived.

• 9:58Mark Normand?

  Thank you. You nailed it.

• 10:00Chris Williamson?

  Fuck yeah.

• 10:01Mark Normand?

  Wow.

• 10:01Chris Williamson?

  What's happened?

• 10:02Mark Normand?

  Get in here. Where our periods are synced.

• 10:04Chris Williamson?

  That's menstrual cycle, exactly.

• 10:06Mark Normand?

  Menstrual.

• 10:08Chris Williamson?

  Cycle. Menstrually cycle. Um, so yeah, I think it's just that people don't believe that this is, is this actually coming from a place of genuine sympathy? Or is this coming from, what's it called? Woke washing?

• 10:22Mark Normand?

  Yes, yes. Madison Avenue.

• 10:24Chris Williamson?

  Yeah, I learned, uh, what was the fucking thing? Woke washing is allowing brands to monetize virtue signaling. It conceals the less altruistic business practices. So Miller Lite and Bud Light, you know, is two good examples that you brought up there.

• 10:39Chris Williamson?

  They'll, where are they getting their tin from? Is anybody looking at the aluminium that goes into the cans?

• 10:44Mark Normand?

  Of course not.

• 10:44Chris Williamson?

  Is anybody like looking at the production processes? Are they meeting sanitation standards? Are they doing all the rest of it? And it's like, no, but they gave Dylan Mulvaney six, a six pack with her face on it. That's like enough to look over there, look over there. You don't need to look over here.

• 10:57Mark Normand?

  Yes, yes.

• 10:58Chris Williamson?

  And I think with the Dove, Dove maybe actually does feel a little bit like, um, A company that for a long time has been fighting for different beauty standards.

• 11:07Mark Normand?

  Yeah.

• 11:07Chris Williamson?

  They've done stuff with skin.

• 11:08Mark Normand?

  That's true.

• 11:09Chris Williamson?

  Like trying to get representation for different girls. But if you're gonna fight the good fight, it doesn't feel like video games are the place that girls are looking.

• 11:17Mark Normand?

  Yes.

• 11:18Chris Williamson?

  To find their representation.

• 11:20Mark Normand?

  Exactly. And there was no soap in that commercial. There was not one bar of soap, not a lather, not a lotion, nothing. Yeah, exactly. It was just video gaming. And I'm like, I don't know. It's also weird that we have to shoehorn women. Sure, there are women gamers, I'm sure, but like, it doesn't feel like that's their, their big demo is these fat ladies. Like, like advertise on Vanderpump Rules. Like, every lady I know, my wife included, has like six girls over. They're all watching it. I walk in, they're like, shh, you know, Vanderpump.

• 11:51Chris Williamson?

  Selling Sunset or some other bullshit like that.

• 11:53Mark Normand?

  Yes, yes.

• 11:54Chris Williamson?

  Yeah, where's the bigger girl on Selling Sunset?

• 11:55Mark Normand?

  Exactly, exactly. But she's not there, which is also probably why it's doing well. You know, it goes back to the Barbie. It's like Barbie's unrealistic. And I'm like, yeah, yeah, but who wants a realistic toy? You know, but women think they're gonna think they have to look like that. I'm like, maybe they wanna look like that. Or maybe, you know, that's, that's okay. If you wanna, like, I, every superhero I had, it was jacked. I don't want a fat superhero. I'm not jacked.

• 12:20Chris Williamson?

  Someone, so I put this out on Twitter earlier on, and someone replied and said,

• 12:25Chris Williamson?

  they can't wait for a version of Kratos, you know, from God of War? Are you familiar with that guy?

• 12:30Mark Normand?

  No, no.

• 12:31Chris Williamson?

  Just like a Jack God, God figure type guy. Can't wait for skinny fat Kratos or Solid Snake.

• 12:38Mark Normand?

  Right.

• 12:39Chris Williamson?

  To be creeping around, but he's lost a foot due to diabetes. I don't know, just, there seems to me, if you need, if you're so narcissistic that you need direct representation.

• 12:49Mark Normand?

  Yes.

• 12:49Chris Williamson?

  In your avatar in a computer game, there are bigger problems than simply having a fuller figured avatar are going to be able to fix.

• 12:56Mark Normand?

  Yes, completely. And it's just human nature. We like to look at attractive things. I mean, every president who won has been taller. Every, I think maybe except for one, but it's always a taller guy who wins. Full head of hair helps. Yeah, yeah. I mean, it's, it's in men too. Like, we, we want our men looking the right way as well.

• 13:15Chris Williamson?

  What was that? Was it Nixon? Did he do some famous debate?

• 13:20Mark Normand?

  Yes.

• 13:20Chris Williamson?

  He was, one of them was sweaty and the other one wasn't sweaty.

• 13:23Mark Normand?

  He did one on radio and one against Kennedy.

• 13:26Chris Williamson?

  Right.

• 13:26Mark Normand?

  You couldn't see how good looking Kennedy was. And then when they TV aired it, Kennedy won.

• 13:31Chris Williamson?

  That pretty privilege, man. Yeah, I don't know. I think it's just, it's such a shame that you have conversations that get captured by, like, there are much longer levers than trying to fix.

• 13:43Mark Normand?

  Yes.

• 13:44Chris Williamson?

  Whether or not girls are being misrepresented in video games.

• 13:47Mark Normand?

  Exactly. And let's talk to the ladies, see what they think. Also, it just, first of all, I feel so forced, but oh, I forgot my point. You said something. Say, say what you said again, maybe it'll jog it.

• 13:59Chris Williamson?

  That it.

• 14:00Mark Normand?

  Oh, I got it back. Thank you. That's all I needed was your sweet, sweet English voice. So, oh, I lost it again. Say it again. Start talking.

• 14:12Mark Normand?

  Oh, I got it. I got it. I got it.

• 14:15Mark Normand?

  That was real. But you mentioned the tin can. Where's that coming from? And then, like, here's a perfect example. Kaepernick. Everybody's blowing Kaepernick. He's kneeling. He hates police. I get it. Nike, the biggest example of all sweatshops, you know, we need the Asian fingers to make the shoes and all that. And you could overlook that because you're looking at the guy with the Afro who's got the fist up. And you go, hey, I'm a good person. But when you say to people, well, what about the sweatshop people? They go, ah. And you're like, no, no, no. You're not allowed to go at me with the sweatshop and like Kaepernick. You have to, if you're such a morally good person and superior.

• 14:53Chris Williamson?

  Correct.

• 14:53Mark Normand?

  You have to agree to both. But they just, they just shut one out. And that's where I get pissed.

• 14:57Chris Williamson?

  Well, hypocrisy is just like the perfect tool that people want to point out on the internet.

• 15:04Mark Normand?

  Yes.

• 15:04Chris Williamson?

  Because for the first time ever, we have this locked in stone history of every single thing that we've said precisely as we said it at the times that we said it. And it allows you to say, well, hang on, you're making this point now, but I can see that that's not exactly aligned with what you used to say previously.

• 15:21Mark Normand?

  Right.

• 15:21Chris Williamson?

  So, one of my smart friends, the one that taught me about concept creep. He also taught me that in the modern world, our opinions and our deeds have never been further apart. In the past, any opinion and any deed would have ended up being stress tested at some point. If you say that you're a good person and 20,000 years ago around the campfire, and yet every time you go out hunting, you don't bring back meat for everybody else. You just bring it for your family. Eventually, someone's going to go, well, come on, you keep saying that you're a good person.

• 15:49Mark Normand?

  Right.

• 15:50Chris Williamson?

  Whereas on Twitter, no one ever actually ends up scrutinizing the way that you show up in the real world. You can be the most empathetic, pro female person in the world, and you go home and beat your wife.

• 16:01Mark Normand?

  Yes.

• 16:02Chris Williamson?

  And nobody knows. Well, for the most part, nobody knows. And then when people get rumbled for it, that's why it feels so satisfying to us.

• 16:08Mark Normand?

  Yes.

• 16:09Chris Williamson?

  I think that it's because we have this sense that a lot of the people who push virtual, real virtual beauty, or push digital blackface is something that should genuinely be cared about, are just doing performative empathy. I don't think that we believe that it's true.

• 16:24Mark Normand?

  Completely right, but the problem with the empathy is like, when you're on the other side of it, we're like, let's say you're Ellen, who, you know, big [BLEEP]. And her thing is like what you said, because she was the happy, dancy, nice lady. And then we found out she was a coos. Everybody flipped on her because she was performing. But the problem is Ellen could be like, well, I donate a million dollars to charity. I do all this. I help the homeless. I help old people. But we just know about the [BLEEP] thing.

• 16:51Chris Williamson?

  Yes.

• 16:51Mark Normand?

  So you don't get that redeeming part. And we love, Sam Harris had a great point. He said, if the first time you hear about somebody is when they've done something wrong, maybe don't jump to hate them. That's the first thing you've heard about them? What about all the other good shit they did? But we don't care about that. We just go, oh, Michael J. Fox said fag in 88. I've never heard of this guy. Like, if you're some young person, I've never heard of Michael J. Fox. I hate him now. And you're like, you hate him now because you heard one thing about him in a headline? But you just, you totally disregard his whole other life? It's crazy.

• 17:28Chris Williamson?

  It's a shame that we...

• 17:31Chris Williamson?

  Sort of jump to conclusions so quickly and this difference between opinions and deeds, the fact that you're able to behave in one way and say a different thing and people will care about what you say more than what you do.

• 17:42Mark Normand?

  Yes.

• 17:43Chris Williamson?

  Because what you do is never seen.

• 17:44Mark Normand?

  Exactly.

• 17:45Chris Williamson?

  But it also means that when you do try and actually put some empathy across, that gets scrutinized too. Oh, well, maybe you're just doing this because, no, I genuinely care. I care about this movement or I care about this group of people. This is me being earnest or vulnerable or open and not for some perverse reason. I'm doing this because I actually care about a thing.

• 18:02Mark Normand?

  Yeah.

• 18:02Chris Williamson?

  And immediately people use the same idea, the methodology, the skepticism they have about all the other shit from all of the other people that have been doing the concept creep, supply, demand bullshit. And then they apply it to you and you go, okay, like, and I think that disincentivizes people from doing genuine.

• 18:20Mark Normand?

  Completely.

• 18:21Chris Williamson?

  Like altruism as well.

• 18:22Mark Normand?

  I agree. Yeah, it's a tough time. Makes people just not want to do anything and just hang back so they don't get yelled at.

• 18:29Chris Williamson?

  You seem to be quite a positive person generally.

• 18:32Mark Normand?

  Yeah, yeah, I think so.

• 18:33Chris Williamson?

  How do you avoid getting drawn into cynicism? And there is this sort of culture of negativity and cynicism on the internet. What's your prophylactic against that? What are you, what condom are you wearing?

• 18:45Mark Normand?

  Well, I hear the old post and ghost. I'm a big on that. And my friend, he works with Louis CK a lot, so he gets a lot of hate, you know? So he just started blocking everybody and he's like, I don't even hear them anymore. Like anybody who says one thing, I just start blocking them on Twitter or whatever. And so it just eventually he kind of like cleaned it out. And I'm like, that's pretty good, but you still have to go in and read it to block it.

• 19:10Chris Williamson?

  Yep.

• 19:11Mark Normand?

  So I don't want to do that. So I just kind of, I let it go and I'm sure this fire is going on all over and I just try to put it out of my mind.

• 19:18Chris Williamson?

  And that protects your mental space relatively well, it seems?

• 19:22Mark Normand?

  Relatively well. I mean, I've definitely had my, my weeks of like sleepless nights. I'm like, this guy said this, it taps into some fucked up thought you had about yourself and it validates all the evil thoughts you have. And then it just, it just mushroom clouds in your brain and you're in the shower going, ah, maybe I am attracted to kids. You know, or whatever the fuck. And I'm not, but you know, people can just get in your head. And you know, when I was 15, I was like, am I gay? Maybe I'm gay. Am I gay? And I had this friend who was super hot and ripped. And I blew up. No, but I had this friend. He was super hot. I kept being like, am I attracted to him? I don't know. I don't know. And it's the same. You can do that with anything like, am I racist? What the hell? And I'm like hanging out with a bunch of black guys last night at the mothership.

• 20:07Mark Normand?

  And you're just like, what am I? I'm not racist, but you just, your brain can go in these fucked up places, especially mine. Mike could really turn on me.

• 20:15Chris Williamson?

  It's so funny that you can question your own sense of self.

• 20:20Mark Normand?

  Completely.

• 20:20Chris Williamson?

  Because of what somebody's just prodded or poked you in the direction of at the right time.

• 20:24Mark Normand?

  And that's really what Twitter is. It's this weird little prodding. And Colin Quinn describes it as you're giving yourself schizophrenia because it's literally eight million opinions and you're just absorbing all of them. And that's what schizophrenia is, just 800 voices going off all the time.

• 20:39Chris Williamson?

  You're crowdsourcing personal insults from the internet.

• 20:42Mark Normand?

  Yes, exactly.

• 20:43Chris Williamson?

  That Sam Harris said that being on Twitter is like the most malignant form of telepathy ever that only allows you into the worst of everybody else's thoughts.

• 20:52Mark Normand?

  Wow.

• 20:54Chris Williamson?

  A classic, classic wordsmith in from.

• 20:55Mark Normand?

  He's the king.

• 20:56Chris Williamson?

  Mr. Harris.

• 20:57Mark Normand?

  He is the best. I mean, there's not a lot of positivity. It's not a lot of like, I had a great day today. Just had a hell of a turkey sandwich and I got a great, my ass got eaten. You don't really see that on Twitter, you know? It's just, you know, ah, this guy's racist. He's a piece of shit, whatever.

• 21:11Chris Williamson?

  Yeah, that's an idea for a future tweet. You could throw that out, talking about whatever it is that you've eaten and then what, when you've been eaten. Yeah. Avoiding the cynicism things. It's a tough one, man. And I really, I'm really trying to sort of slowly nudge myself away from it. I'm really trying to rail against it.

• 21:25Mark Normand?

  Yeah.

• 21:26Chris Williamson?

  Just seeing what happens if you do try and give people a little bit more hope. You know, Michael Malice, you familiar with Michael?

• 21:32Mark Normand?

  Oh, yeah. Smart guy.

• 21:34Chris Williamson?

  Yeah, so he, he wrote this book about the period from sort of 1920, 1910 up to 1990 in Russia. And it's all about the absolute terrors of communism and famine and all sorts of crazy fuckery. His point was.

• 21:54Chris Williamson?

  We thought that this was the worst that the world could ever get. This is how low things sank. These are the terrible stories of famine and prisoner mistreatment and children and all this sort of stuff. And the good guys won. So his argument, he was called the white pill, the book. And the reason for that was that he said, if you think that the evil people always win, here is the most stark example of the evil people losing.

• 22:17Mark Normand?

  Oh, thank God. But the problem is it took 90 years or whatever you said. That's the problem is you want it to happen next week, but it, it takes so long. And then, you know, like black people were marginalized and oppressed and all this. And now I feel like they're doing, doing well. But now it's kind of like, fuck whitey. So we're going to be in that for a while and that'll go away. But it just, it just sucks when your, your life and your adulthood is like right in the middle of the shit part.

• 22:43Chris Williamson?

  That's a really good point. I often, you know, there was this really interesting study I remember seeing ages ago that looked at the difference if you were born in, I want to say 1920 or 1930. And if you were born in 1920, you grew up during the formative years when you needed nutrition, being the Great Depression. Then by the time that the war came around, you were conscripted to go and fight.

• 23:08Mark Normand?

  Yes.

• 23:08Chris Williamson?

  And then let's say that you've survived both of those traumas. You finally came out and like died in the seventies or some shit like that, let's say. Whereas if you were born in 1930, you got to, you weren't conscripted. You came out the other side. You got to live most of your glory years through swinging sixties, seventies, psychedelic revolution.

• 23:26Mark Normand?

  Right.

• 23:26Chris Williamson?

  You know, increased equality, all this sort of stuff. And yeah, I do wonder sometimes in retrospect, what am I going to think about the generation that I was a part of?

• 23:35Mark Normand?

  Totally. Throw in a pandemic, throw in nine 11, throw in the George Floyd stuff. Like it's a wild time, but you know, the sixties were wild. They MLK got shot. They went to the moon, Vietnam. So there's always, there's always bad shit, but the problem is this is new bad shit with the internet. This is all unprecedented.

• 23:56Chris Williamson?

  Yeah. Novel, novel problems.

• 23:57Mark Normand?

  Yes, yes. So we're, not only we figure out how to deal with it, we don't know what the hell it is. And it's, it's all new and kids are killing themselves and girls are depressed and. You know, we're addicted.

• 24:08Chris Williamson?

  Sixty percent of teenage girls say that they have persistent or regular feelings of hopelessness.

• 24:13Mark Normand?

  Unbelievable. It's so sad. And, you know, like the sixties, you mentioned growing up then, or in the twenties, and then the thirties, and the depression and all that, World War I, too. I bet they were happier.

• 24:24Chris Williamson?

  You think?

• 24:25Mark Normand?

  I bet they were happier because you had a goal. It's like, depression, gotta get bread, gotta get food, gotta get some water. Now I'm in World War I, gotta stay alive, gotta stay alive. Now it's World War II, gotta stay alive, you know, the air raids, you know, I think that was at least somewhat, we have a common enemy, we got a common goal to survive. Now it's just like, this looming cloud of sadness and like, did I get enough clicks? And is this person gonna drag me online? And, you know, it's this, it's this weird, kind of ungrabable sadness. Whereas before, it was very like, the Russians are gonna shoot us, or Hitler's bad, or whatever.

• 25:03Chris Williamson?

  Ambient anxiety.

• 25:04Mark Normand?

  Day! That's good.

• 25:06Chris Williamson?

  Yeah.

• 25:06Mark Normand?

  We're in a A.

• 25:07Chris Williamson?

  And but it's the, I totally get that, the directionlessness, the fact that you don't have a single, call it an enemy or a life goal, or a direction that you're moving toward, means that you kind of just get distracted by everything. And I think a lot of people have this sense that a lot of their mental time and their sanity is taken up worrying about things that probably don't matter.

• 25:26Mark Normand?

  Yes.

• 25:27Chris Williamson?

  That just the number of cycles that your brain goes through per day, having thoughts that tomorrow, you're not going to be glad that you had. Can't remember who it was that says, the bizarre thing about life is that it has to be lived forward, but only makes sense in reverse.

• 25:40Mark Normand?

  Oh, that's good.

• 25:42Chris Williamson?

  When you think about the fact that, you know, you look back over the last five years of your life, I thought maybe from 10 years ago until five years ago, you can kind of, oh, yeah, well, I understand. I was, I was here, and that's why I was here. And then this thing happened, and then that changed me, and then whatever. And then you look at now, and you go, what the fuck am I doing?

• 25:57Mark Normand?

  Yeah.

• 25:57Chris Williamson?

  Like, why, what, why, what, what are all of these different contributing elements? And am I doing it right? Am I doing it right? I might be doing it wrong. And should I be doing it? Should I even change it?

• 26:06Mark Normand?

  Exactly. I know. It's, it's tough, because, you know, you know, when you get into a relationship, and you're like, man, I want to get out, I hate this girl, she hates me, all we do is fight. And then you break up, and you're like, I miss her, I love her so much, the relationship was perfect. And I think we're gonna look back on it like that. Like, right now, it's like this looming, what did you say?

• 26:25Chris Williamson?

  Ambient anxiety.

• 26:26Mark Normand?

  Ambient anxiety, which sucks, and it's always in my brain, and I hate it, and I can't shake it. But I think when I'm 80, I'm gonna look back and go, man, the internet, those are wild times. Porn, OnlyFans, Stormy Daniels, Rachel Dolezal. We're gonna look back and go, wow, that was fucking nuts, cuz we're not gonna remember all the ambient anxiety.

• 26:44Chris Williamson?

  You're still gonna be thinking about Stormy Daniels when you're 80?

• 26:46Mark Normand?

  Oh, I like to jerk off to her cuz I know her. It's fun to jerk off to someone who's on the news.

• 26:51Chris Williamson?

  Ah!

• 26:52Mark Normand?

  You know? You get to see the CNN story and then go right to her like...

• 26:57Chris Williamson?

  You can text her, you can text her straight away.

• 26:58Mark Normand?

  Yeah, yeah. So, it's a kooky time, but I think you gotta just press on. And my thing is, I use the internet, like, you wanna fuck with my head? Well, I'm gonna use you and get everything I can get out of you. Meaning like, post clips, do podcasts, share everything, reach a bigger audience. So there are perks. It's like fire, it can burn your house down, but it can cook your food.

• 27:21Chris Williamson?

  Yeah, yeah, that's interesting. I think looking at how to use the internet more healthily is a challenge for everybody that's trying to make anything, right?

• 27:32Mark Normand?

  Yeah.

• 27:32Chris Williamson?

  Because as soon as you post something, there's inevitable criticism.

• 27:34Mark Normand?

  I know.

• 27:35Chris Williamson?

  And posting ghosts, not a bad solution for that. Or just do a salmon, completely torpedo your entire account and just exit the internet at large. That's another solution, I guess.

• 27:45Mark Normand?

  My friend did that, and he lost 30 pounds. He's like happier, he sees his kids more. Cuz when you really look at your phone and think about it, like, you get that screen time thing? Oh, what a kick in the balls that is. That hurts. My wife's always like, I have no time. And I'm like, I watched you look at TikTok for two hours. Two hours, you could've watched a movie, you could've read a book, you could've flown to Florida.

• 28:09Chris Williamson?

  Or not.

• 28:10Mark Normand?

  Yeah.

• 28:11Chris Williamson?

  AI companions are being created to fill the role of sexy and playful girlfriend.

• 28:16Mark Normand?

  Uh oh.

• 28:17Chris Williamson?

  Amaranth is an OnlyFans content creator who is one of the most followed women on Twitch. And now she's releasing an AI companion of herself called AI Amaranth. So her fans can interact with a version of her. They can chat with her, ask questions and even receive voice, voice responses.

• 28:31Mark Normand?

  Oh no, I mean, guys are fucked. Young dudes are fucked. It's not good because used to young, uglier. You know, what if there's a top percent, 10% of guys who all get laid? And then the rest are just incels, school shooters and, uh, you know, basement dwellers. Yeah, exactly. So those guys are all gonna turn to this. The, the path of least resistance always wins.

• 28:56Chris Williamson?

  So one of the pushbacks that I spoke to one of my friends, William Costello, about this evolutionary psychology guy. The problem you have with AI girlfriends is that there is no prestige associated in having one. Because there's no process of selection.

• 29:11Mark Normand?

  Ah.

• 29:12Chris Williamson?

  It's the same way as saying, um, I subscribe to Amaranth's OnlyFans account. Aren't I so special? And you go, well, anybody who has the price of a spare cheeseburger per month can subscribe to the OnlyFans. So it doesn't make you special.

• 29:27Mark Normand?

  Yeah, that's good.

• 29:28Chris Williamson?

  His, his thought, like a slight white pill that's in there is it should be able to salve people that are very lonely. But it's not going to take the place of genuine females because it's not sufficiently satisfying. There's no prestige because you're not being selected and the selection thing's very important.

• 29:43Mark Normand?

  I completely agree. And that's good that we, if we start praising these guys, like my AI girlfriend's hotter than your AI girlfriend. Then we're fucked. But the fact that it's not impressive is a good sign because that means it won't be, it won't be praised.

• 29:57Chris Williamson?

  With AI Amaranth, fans will receive instant voice responses to any burning question they may have. Whether it's a fleeting curiosity or a profound desire, Amaranth's AI counterpart will be there to provide assistance. I got a Chris bot made, not that people can access, but that I can use for asking it questions on Q and As. And, uh, I used it and. The ease that these guys can do, so they could just take every podcast episode that you've ever been on.

• 30:22Mark Normand?

  Yeah.

• 30:23Chris Williamson?

  Run that through a language learning model and there you go. There's a moderately accurate mark, digi digi mark.

• 30:29Mark Normand?

  Oh my god.

• 30:30Chris Williamson?

  Mark bot.

• 30:30Mark Normand?

  That's a bummer.

• 30:31Chris Williamson?

  Yeah.

• 30:32Mark Normand?

  Sorry folks. You don't want two of this. That's not good.

• 30:35Chris Williamson?

  Could you imagine how ridiculous a AI version of you would be?

• 30:40Mark Normand?

  Oh god, I know. I'd be late, first of all, but.

• 30:43Chris Williamson?

  Even the AI one would be late, yeah.

• 30:45Mark Normand?

  But I heard a comic go on stage, because all these comics are worried about AI, and he did, I'm gonna read a joke I wrote and a joke that AI wrote in my voice, and you see if you can tell. And he did both, and his joke was so much better, and it made me feel a lot of relief.

• 31:01Chris Williamson?

  Ah, you're still like years ahead of what the AI bot can write?

• 31:04Mark Normand?

  Yeah, because joke, comedy's all context, you know, and computers can't feel context. And I think that's, that's a big part of it. A computer can have a twist and a setup and a punch, but it doesn't, doesn't have that little, you know, when a joke bombs, is a comedian go, well, that bombed, and that gets a laugh. But I, I don't think AI could do that.

• 31:25Chris Williamson?

  Someone said on a podcast I was listening to, will know that AIs are fully conscious when it exits the interaction and regrets not saying the funny thing that it should have done as it's on its way down the stairs.

• 31:37Mark Normand?

  Wow, that's brilliant.

• 31:39Chris Williamson?

  Yeah.

• 31:39Mark Normand?

  That's killer. But like, here's a great, here's a great old joke. You know, this is Junior Stoppka's joke, brilliant comedian, he goes, the Holocaust actually had a lot of mentally challenged people in it, but you never see pictures of them because they're all smiling.

• 31:55Mark Normand?

  And it's a great joke, but AI could never be that twisted to think of that. And that's why I love comedy.

• 32:02Chris Williamson?

  There was a, it's called Dark, is it called Dark Bot?

• 32:07Mark Normand?

  Uh oh.

• 32:07Chris Williamson?

  Which they tried to do a version of ChatGPT, but the whole thing was trained on the DarkNet as opposed to on the Surface Web.

• 32:16Mark Normand?

  Yeah.

• 32:16Chris Williamson?

  So this is all of the fucked up, only access, custom access forums and like Dark versions of 4chan and shit like that. And they trained this thing on that. And I don't know, maybe that'll be able to do the fucked up jokes. I'm not sure, but.

• 32:29Mark Normand?

  Maybe, I hope not.

• 32:30Chris Williamson?

  I think.

• 32:32Chris Williamson?

  I would be worried if I was a YouTube thumbnail creator, if I was a middling legal sort of litigation person.

• 32:43Mark Normand?

  Yes, that's the worry.

• 32:45Chris Williamson?

  Yeah, or if I was like maybe a radiologist that's looking at scans that are kind of relatively easy to break down. So those kind of, you know, they're still quite complex jobs, but those jobs that are a little bit more automated.

• 32:58Mark Normand?

  Yeah.

• 32:59Chris Williamson?

  I think comedy is probably going to be one of the ones that's safe for a little bit longer at least.

• 33:03Mark Normand?

  Totally. And you like a guy or a gal, you know, you go, I like Ali Wong, you know, even if I don't love that last joke she said, or whatever, you just like her or you relate to her or you connect with her. And I think with a radiologist, there's no, none of that.

• 33:16Chris Williamson?

  Yes. So it's not just the context of the joke, it's the context of the person that tells the joke.

• 33:20Mark Normand?

  Completely. You know, people go, Joe Rogan, that's my guy. That's my guy. He's, he's, he's, he fits for me.

• 33:25Chris Williamson?

  Would happily laugh at something, even if it was totally shit.

• 33:28Mark Normand?

  Exactly.

• 33:29Chris Williamson?

  They've got this warm feeling. Yeah. I mean, I saw Joe do a set. It was maybe the first one that I saw of him. And, uh, at least, I would say 20% of it was storytelling. You know, there was, it was humorous or whatever, but it was like, he did this bit about, is it, what's this animal that's got, the females have got like a clit dick? Is that a coyote?

• 33:50Mark Normand?

  Oh, is that a laugh, hyena?

• 33:53Chris Williamson?

  Hyena, maybe. Yeah. And you're like, you were hearing him talk and it's kind of entertaining, but we're like 90 minutes into learning about the, you know, like the unique physiology of female hyenas or something. This is just a miniature version of, of the podcast. So it's not necessarily even to do with the joke.

• 34:11Mark Normand?

  Right.

• 34:11Chris Williamson?

  So a lot of the time people go because they just feel comfortable listening to this person speak. Oh, this is familiar.

• 34:16Mark Normand?

  Also, you know, Joe actually gives a shit about that.

• 34:20Chris Williamson?

  Yes.

• 34:20Mark Normand?

  And that makes you give a shit a little more. Like he's not, this, this is kind of funny. Like he's actually interested in that hyena clit.

• 34:27Chris Williamson?

  Yes.

• 34:27Mark Normand?

  So that helps. But like Tom Hanks, Tom Hanks, I don't know anything about Tom Hanks, but we love him. We love Tom. If he's in a movie, you just, it bumps up the box office tenfold because we all love Tom Hanks. We know zero about him.

• 34:41Chris Williamson?

  Yeah.

• 34:42Mark Normand?

  Except that he's been a retard of a military guy, a baseball player, you know, an astronaut, but. I don't know anything about it. Does he like chocolate? Is he a pedophile or whatever? You know, but you like him.

• 34:55Chris Williamson?

  Have you ever been down the Tom Hanks is part of the Illuminati rabbit hole?

• 34:59Mark Normand?

  I don't wanna go. That's terrifying.

• 35:01Chris Williamson?

  We're going, so.

• 35:02Mark Normand?

  I don't even know what the Illuminati is. It's a guy in a room with masks on.

• 35:05Chris Williamson?

  This one, if anybody wants to look at it, Google Tom Hanks glove Instagram photo. So there's a sequence of people that take photos, famous people that take photos. And I think Tom was taking photos of lost gloves. That was his thing. So you'd see one on the street and you'd take a photo and you'd put it on his Instagram. And in a bunch of the different photos, people had found chalk text that had been written on the floor below it. And it's downtown fucking Denver or some shit. So, you know, it could just be anything. But people then started putting these codes in on the internet. And, bro, it's such a rabbit hole.

• 35:40Mark Normand?

  Oh, yeah.

• 35:41Chris Williamson?

  It's terrifying. It's so interesting.

• 35:43Mark Normand?

  Terrifying. Yeah, I wouldn't. I don't wanna go.

• 35:45Chris Williamson?

  You seen Tom Hanks's son, Chet?

• 35:47Mark Normand?

  I love that guy.

• 35:48Chris Williamson?

  Wild.

• 35:48Mark Normand?

  Hilarious.

• 35:49Chris Williamson?

  Absolutely wild dude.

• 35:50Mark Normand?

  I love that guy. Good for him. He, when he, when he stopped that lady, he's like, yeah, yeah, I don't give a fuck. And she's like, you just think it's this, this? He's like, yeah, that's what I think it is. And I was like, yeah, fuck this lady.

• 36:01Chris Williamson?

  Have you, uh, have you ever had people kind of try and, I don't know, flummox you? And I don't know how much newsy, interview-y, real press shit you do.

• 36:11Mark Normand?

  Not a ton, but I've definitely had people like, so you think this? And they keep trying to gotcha you. And you're like, what are we doing here? I thought we were just gonna hang out and talk or be funny. And they're like, but you, you, so you're saying, a lot of us say you're saying. I'm like, no, I'm not saying that at all. Stop telling me what I'm thinking. You know, but that's what we do because they want that clip or they want that, that win. And it's a real bummer, you know? So you, uh, you think ivermectin is whatever? And I'm like, well, I'm just saying it's a Pulitzer Prize winning drug. It's taken by millions. Oh, so you don't think it's horsepower? I'm like. You haven't heard of ivermectin until two days ago and now you're like wildly angry about it, you know, like, I'm not the weirdo here, you're the weirdo, I, I'm, I'm agnostic, I don't give a shit, I'm neutral.

• 36:52Chris Williamson?

  Speaking of, uh.

• 36:53Mark Normand?

  I try to stay neutral.

• 36:54Chris Williamson?

  Forrest Gump and Tom Hanks, one of my friends is running across America at the moment.

• 36:58Mark Normand?

  Hmm.

• 36:59Chris Williamson?

  So he's doing, uh, 64, 65 days, 50 miles a day. So I think a few thousand people have been to the top of Everest.

• 37:07Mark Normand?

  Hmm.

• 37:07Chris Williamson?

  300 people have run across America.

• 37:09Mark Normand?

  Wow.

• 37:10Chris Williamson?

  So he's gonna be the fastest sprint guy called Will Gooch.

• 37:12Mark Normand?

  Uh, Gooch.

• 37:14Chris Williamson?

  Hey, uh, if people wanna go and check him out, they can Google Will Gooch and, uh, support the run and shit like that. But he's in, where is he now? He's in the Appalachian Mountains.

• 37:22Mark Normand?

  Wow.

• 37:22Chris Williamson?

  Pennsylvania. He's going from, uh, LA to New York.

• 37:26Mark Normand?

  Good for him. Have you heard this new thing taking over where people do a 12-hour walk?

• 37:30Chris Williamson?

  Yes, one of my friends did this on Sunday.

• 37:32Mark Normand?

  Really?

• 37:32Chris Williamson?

  Yep.

• 37:33Mark Normand?

  And they say after about six, seven hours, first of all, your feet are bleeding, you know, but your brain goes to these places, cause we're so used to just being constantly entertained, phone, screen, computer, TV, Netflix, but it just go, oh, third grade teacher, oh, summer camp, and you just go to these crazy memory banks and it's pretty wild.

• 37:53Chris Williamson?

  All of the times that you were molested is gonna come back up.

• 37:55Mark Normand?

  Yeah, yeah, I don't need a walk for that. Um, but I think, uh, this is the new craze, is this like shutting down Amish, uh, full-on disconnect.

• 38:07Chris Williamson?

  Well, what's that, what's that Jewish thing that people, Shabbat, is it? What's the thing where they?

• 38:11Mark Normand?

  That is something, Shabbat shalom.

• 38:13Chris Williamson?

  Where they do, uh, they don't use any-

• 38:15Mark Normand?

  The Sabbath.

• 38:16Chris Williamson?

  Kind of, I think. I'm pretty sure it's called Shabbat. Anyway, it's from Friday evening until, I think, Saturday, and they don't turn on any lights, they don't do any work, they don't blah, blah, blah. But I'm pretty sure that in really, really hardcore, uh, Jewish households, for some of the things that they need to do, they have, it's almost like a Shabbat servant.

• 38:36Mark Normand?

  Hmm.

• 38:36Chris Williamson?

  To do things like turning on and off the oven.

• 38:39Mark Normand?

  It's a weird loophole.

• 38:40Chris Williamson?

  Right?

• 38:40Mark Normand?

  No, no, they'll-

• 38:41Chris Williamson?

  Right.

• 38:41Mark Normand?

  People in Brooklyn, these Orthodox guys, like, can you come in here and turn the light on?

• 38:45Chris Williamson?

  You're kidding.

• 38:45Mark Normand?

  I swear to God.

• 38:46Chris Williamson?

  You're kidding me.

• 38:47Mark Normand?

  Cause they can't do it. So some, some kid in the neighborhood's like, alright, and just flips it on.

• 38:52Chris Williamson?

  That's so funny.

• 38:53Mark Normand?

  It's so silly. Religion is so many dumb loopholes and stuff like that.

• 38:57Chris Williamson?

  Where are you living now in New York?

• 38:59Mark Normand?

  I'm in the West Village, Manhattan.

• 39:01Chris Williamson?

  Okay, so is that on the island?

• 39:03Mark Normand?

  On the island, baby. You know, Greenwich Village. That's Bob Dylan, Bleecker Street, Washington Square Park, the Comedy Cellar, the whole thing, NYU.

• 39:11Chris Williamson?

  Did you purposefully pick the distance from there to the Cellar so that you didn't have to go too far to work?

• 39:16Mark Normand?

  Well, I've always wanted to live in the Village, just being a kid, growing up in the South, just thinking about Greenwich Village. Wow, you know, Bill Cosby, Woody Allen, all the other rapists. But, you know, they would all play these coffee houses and all that stuff. So Beatnik and folk music and all that. So I always loved it. So I moved to New York, lived in Brooklyn, way out, got mugged, got beat up, all that shit, bedbugs, and then slowly moved my way to Greenwich Village.

• 39:43Chris Williamson?

  I saw this story from some girl in New York. Women are wearing a safety layer over their outfits in public to deter creepy men, with many labeling it sad but necessary. This girl captioned a clip, "The real fit is underneath." Apparently it's because of weird men on the underground. Others who hadn't heard of this trend expressed how sad but necessary it is. This is sad. Someone else called it, what's it called? A fashion safety layer or the men blocker.

• 40:12Mark Normand?

  Whoa.

• 40:14Chris Williamson?

  But there's all of these stories about just how bad New York subway is at the moment.

• 40:18Mark Normand?

  Totally, yeah.

• 40:19Chris Williamson?

  Have you been on it recently?

• 40:20Mark Normand?

  Yeah, I go every day. It's pretty dicey.

• 40:23Chris Williamson?

  Really? Like, what's it like? It's people that live in, I don't know, London, where the underground is absolutely fine, or Tokyo, where it's also absolutely fine. What's the experience of getting on the subway like at the moment?

• 40:32Mark Normand?

  Well, the thing with the subway is there's a, the hobo count went up way, way high after the pandemic. And so the subway is a place where you have a trapped person. Like, you know, you bump into a guy on the sidewalk on Broadway and he's like, "Give me your money or I'll kill you," whatever. You're like, "All right, just keep walking." But the subway, you're waiting for the train or you're on the train. So I think hobos have been like, "I can get people there. The doors are closed." You know, you'd have to run up the stairs or wait for the subway to stop. So I think it started out as like, now they're on the subway, I can get money out of them. But now it's kind of like, "I'll also fight you."

• 41:06Chris Williamson?

  Why did the population increase?

• 41:08Mark Normand?

  I think all the people moved out or stayed indoors during the pandemic. So the homeless kind of got a little more brazen and like, we have the city to ourselves.

• 41:19Chris Williamson?

  Awards ceremony where there was tons of homeless people, was it the Golden Globes or the Oscars or something?

• 41:24Mark Normand?

  Probably.

• 41:24Chris Williamson?

  They had to shift a ton of

• 41:26Mark Normand?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 41:27Chris Williamson?

  People out that were living in there, there was like a bunch of homeless people.

• 41:30Mark Normand?

  Lot of tent, tent homes and stuff and they had to shove them all to the side.

• 41:34Chris Williamson?

  DiCaprio's coming.

• 41:35Mark Normand?

  Yeah, exactly.

• 41:36Chris Williamson?

  24 year old girlfriend and then once he's gone through, they're fine.

• 41:38Mark Normand?

  Exactly.

• 41:39Chris Williamson?

  Yeah, well, there was that story about that guy who restrained a dude that was under warrant and arrest and all this stuff and now he's, it's not looking too good for him.

• 41:49Mark Normand?

  Guy went from hero to murderer in like one second.

• 41:52Chris Williamson?

  Yeah, fuck.

• 41:54Mark Normand?

  Brutal.

• 41:54Chris Williamson?

  That's not uncommon to see, well, I mean, I'm sure that someone killing somebody on the, or restraining somebody to death is uncommon, but like aggression and

• 42:04Mark Normand?

  No, not uncommon at all. People getting pushed on the tracks, just getting, I have friends who just got randomly punched in the head, you know, it's just, it's just crazy people out and about mingling with millions of New Yorkers. So it's, there's gonna be some tension.

• 42:20Chris Williamson?

  It's wild, especially if you think, coming from the UK where we have the underground tons, you know, it's not as big as New York, but it's not far off, loads of tracks, everything's complex, different layers, it's the same, it's the same system.

• 42:32Mark Normand?

  Yeah, the tube.

• 42:33Chris Williamson?

  And it's lovely.

• 42:35Mark Normand?

  Yeah, it's great.

• 42:36Chris Williamson?

  Almost pleasant experience.

• 42:37Mark Normand?

  Yeah.

• 42:37Chris Williamson?

  Borderline pleasant.

• 42:39Mark Normand?

  No, this is, uh, this is like head on a swivel all the time.

• 42:42Chris Williamson?

  I had a conversation with a friend a couple of nights ago and he was in, he lives in Tokyo and as he gets on a train, he was having to text me on WhatsApp in response to my conversation through his AirPods because nobody speaks, you're not, you don't speak.

• 42:58Mark Normand?

  Whoa, is that right?

• 43:00Chris Williamson?

  No one speaks.

• 43:00Mark Normand?

  Wow.

• 43:01Chris Williamson?

  And he was so concerned, like there was some things where he was finding it, we were talking, he was laughing, so I could hear him stifling a laugh, doing like a whisper laugh whilst on the subway because he didn't want to make any noise.

• 43:11Mark Normand?

  That, that's a little much.

• 43:13Chris Williamson?

  Yes.

• 43:13Mark Normand?

  You know, I'd rather somewhere in the middle of the choking out and the texting, but that leads to a lot of repression too.

• 43:20Chris Williamson?

  My point, my point being that you can be very civilized, like with the right culture, you're able to control behavior pretty well. So for people to say, It's inevitable if you've got a ton of people living in a city and they're all gonna be underground, you know, they like they it's just it's part for the cause. What do you expect them to do? You go, well, like behave in any way that the rest of the world does?

• 43:40Mark Normand?

  Yeah, I know. It'd be nice, but that's just not part of the culture. And as much as we shit on America and America's racist and full of hate and bigoted and gun toted fat people, which there are, we're pretty considerate and pretty uh lenient with uh nut jobs. Where in China or Japan, I feel like if some guys wearing tattered clothes and smells like shit and going, ah, I'm gonna kill all of you, they'll just fucking knock that guy out, put him in a sack, tase him and throw him over the bridge.

• 44:11Chris Williamson?

  He's gonna make your shoes.

• 44:12Mark Normand?

  Yeah, yeah, or that.

• 44:13Chris Williamson?

  To a desk and make your shoes. There's this company called Nine Line Apparel and they just did, the owner just found out about, they did a test on the fabric of a particular garment supplier and they were able to trace all of the garments back to Uyghur workers.

• 44:31Mark Normand?

  Whoa.

• 44:33Chris Williamson?

  Supposed to be sustainably sourced, but it's not. And wow, yeah, it's fucking crazy, dude. It's like millions of people maybe strapped to literally tied to desks, just sewing cheap.

• 44:46Mark Normand?

  Unreal.

• 44:46Chris Williamson?

  Fast fashion stuff. Right now, 2023, right now.

• 44:50Mark Normand?

  Unreal. And no one cares. No one's doing a thing about it. Not one tweet. Meanwhile, in America, nobody wants to work because they're like, I need healthcare, I need dental, I need free coffee, I need snacks, I need vacation time. Like my wife used to work at LinkedIn. I would go there. It was beautiful. I would hang out there. It was like pillows everywhere and espresso machines and candy and a and like a, what do you call it? Ice cream booth, you know, and you could just go. I'm like, this is the chefs were making lunch every day. It was incredible.

• 45:20Chris Williamson?

  Meanwhile.

• 45:21Mark Normand?

  Meanwhile, the Uyghurs are tied to the desk.

• 45:23Chris Williamson?

  To a desk.

• 45:24Mark Normand?

  Yeah, they got the fucking suicide net outside the Apple company, Apple factory.

• 45:28Chris Williamson?

  Have you seen the South Park episode where Cartman gets a job?

• 45:33Mark Normand?

  No.

• 45:33Chris Williamson?

  Oh, it's phenomenal. It's from this newest season, so. Butters gets a job at an ice cream parlor and Cartman's jealous because he wants a job as well. Butters is his referral and says, that's okay, like you can come and work, but everyone's like, dude, he's not gonna last.

• 45:47Mark Normand?

  Yeah.

• 45:47Chris Williamson?

  Someone makes a bet that he won't last for two hours and five minutes into the shift, the boss comes over and Cartman's sat on his phone and he says, what are you doing? He says, I'm taking a mental health break. And then another five minutes later, he says, oh, it's, it's like Take It Easy Tuesday. And then I'm looking forwards to walk out early Wednesday. Just by the, by the end of it, he's ringing Butters from home whilst he's taking a mental health leave day, saying, you do know that we're earning all of this money for the ruthless guy that owns it and we're the ones that are doing the work. We really should own that place.

• 46:17Mark Normand?

  Yeah.

• 46:18Chris Williamson?

  And they're on the money, man, like.

• 46:20Mark Normand?

  It's those guys, they're, they're such geniuses because they nail everything and are funny and they never do interviews or anything. So you don't really know how they think, but they just, they got it. They get it right every time.

• 46:30Chris Williamson?

  Shit on everybody.

• 46:31Mark Normand?

  Yeah, it's, it's beautiful and no one fucks with them because they're a cartoon.

• 46:34Chris Williamson?

  Yeah. Well, unless they put a image of Mohammed up, which they did.

• 46:39Mark Normand?

  That's true.

• 46:40Chris Williamson?

  Remember that?

• 46:40Mark Normand?

  Yeah, that got ugly.

• 46:41Chris Williamson?

  Eight years ago or something?

• 46:42Mark Normand?

  Yeah, yeah. Well, that's a whole nother. He's like the ultimate Karen Mohammed, you know? He's like, hey, how dare you? We're gonna shut this thing down.

• 46:50Chris Williamson?

  But it's not him.

• 46:51Mark Normand?

  Oh yeah, that's true, but the, his, his, you know, lackeys.

• 46:54Chris Williamson?

  Yeah, yeah. That is a, it was, they did Andrew Tate as well appear in the, in the last episode of South Park this season. So they started with Prince Harry.

• 47:03Mark Normand?

  Oh.

• 47:04Chris Williamson?

  And did Andrew Tate.

• 47:05Mark Normand?

  Beautiful. I mean, there's a wealth of comedy out there now. It's so good. Meghan Markle and, you know, Dolezal, as I mentioned, Trump, it just.

• 47:12Chris Williamson?

  What's happening with Dolezal?

• 47:13Mark Normand?

  She's on OnlyFans.

• 47:15Chris Williamson?

  You're kidding me.

• 47:15Mark Normand?

  Oh, I'm a subscriber. Yeah.

• 47:18Chris Williamson?

  What, do you know what she's doing?

• 47:20Mark Normand?

  Uh, you know, fingering tits, the whole thing.

• 47:23Chris Williamson?

  Fingering tits.

• 47:24Mark Normand?

  Yeah, well, she's, she's going all in. She's, you know, it's a fetish and, and I use her as gifts because it's not black, but it counts, you know, it's, it's close enough.

• 47:33Chris Williamson?

  So I saw this story about Prince Harry has lost a legal challenge over his bid to be allowed to make private payments for the police. His lawyers wanted jurisdictional review of the rejection of his offer to pay for protection in the UK. A judge ruled not to give the go ahead. Home Office lawyers have opposed the idea of allowing wealthy people to buy security from the police. So I wasn't really too sure about how I felt about this.

• 47:55Mark Normand?

  I don't, what is it? Can you, uh, translate that?

• 47:57Chris Williamson?

  So Prince Harry no longer has his normal protection from being a royal because he lost his royal status. He, it seems, has security concerns when he travels to the UK. So his plan was to just pay for police to come with him so that there would be a degree of protection, but also so that it didn't chew into the police's budget for whichever area of the country.

• 48:22Mark Normand?

  Got it.

• 48:23Chris Williamson?

  So you'll have seen at, um, the mothership, there is a, like a low key couple of cops that are on site.

• 48:30Mark Normand?

  Sure.

• 48:31Chris Williamson?

  And they're paid for privately, but they're, you know, official cop, I'm going to presume that they're not, they're probably off duty, still sanctioned.

• 48:39Mark Normand?

  Yeah.

• 48:39Chris Williamson?

  I think, I don't really know how it works. Up until I'd seen that, I'd never really heard about anybody being able to pay for private police protection. But it actually makes a good bit of sense because if you don't, if you don't allow somebody that's going to be heavily scrutinized and, and caused loads of, you know, guffaw amongst the public to actually have some protection, they're going to have to go in any case to do crowd control. So just let them pay, I guess.

• 49:06Mark Normand?

  Yeah, but they said no.

• 49:08Chris Williamson?

  No, they said no. I think there's a big, a big problem, especially in the UK of allowing, like wealth in the UK is really, really looked down on, especially ostentation as well.

• 49:17Mark Normand?

  Really?

• 49:17Chris Williamson?

  Yeah. So if you were to say, I'm going to use the money that I've accrued to buy the usage of what is typically seen as a, a public service. It's one of the reasons why. People in the UK forget that you can get private healthcare because the NHS is there. So they would happily wait six months for their cancer to metastasize. So they can get their scan for free.

• 49:40Mark Normand?

  Right.

• 49:40Chris Williamson?

  Then think about paying for insurance. They'll pay for their dog's insurance. An English Bulldog, that'll be a hundred bucks a month or a couple of hundred bucks a month.

• 49:48Mark Normand?

  Yeah.

• 49:48Chris Williamson?

  But they won't think about doing it for themselves.

• 49:50Mark Normand?

  Interesting.

• 49:51Chris Williamson?

  And I think that the UK has a bit of a problem with people using wealth, especially to sort of chew up services.

• 49:57Mark Normand?

  Wow. Well, hey, I mean, you know, this kind of feels like the, the defund the police people who immediately call the police right when anything goes down.

• 50:04Chris Williamson?

  Uh, what's his name? You know, Coleman Hughes?

• 50:06Mark Normand?

  Yeah, I like that guy.

• 50:07Chris Williamson?

  Yeah, he's great. He was on CNN a couple of nights ago and they were talking about why have we got these increases in crime and homicides and da, da, da, da, da. And it got toward the end of the segment and Coleman was like, I have an idea. What is it? And he said, refund the police and they cut the segment shortly after that. They're, we're gonna have to, we'll leave it there, Coleman. Thank you.

• 50:26Mark Normand?

  See, that's what bugs me, not to spin off into another thing, but that's what bugs me about the times we're living in is. I don't, you know, I get that we can have certain opinions, but we should at least be able to discuss everything. Like, I know that's a different, differentiating opinion than CNN. You know, they have to go with the narrative or they have to go with the checkboxes, but let's hear them out. You know, like, like you bring up drag queens and I don't give a shit about drag queens. I don't have kids. It doesn't affect me. But just bring it up. My friend was like, oh dude, dude, let's not even go there. And I'm like, why not? That's the weird part to me.

• 51:00Chris Williamson?

  Dinner or something?

• 51:00Mark Normand?

  No, no, on a podcast. But that's why it weirds me out. I'm like, so we can't talk about it? The not be able to talk about it to me is weirder than the actual activity. And that's what no one is understanding. You know, they're like, oh, you got a problem with drag queens or you like drag queens? I'm like, no, no, I'm neutral, but I'd like to discuss it and see if we can get somewhere.

• 51:17Chris Williamson?

  Situation.

• 51:18Mark Normand?

  It's an interesting situation, but then they're like, shut it down, shut it down or cut that out. I'm like, now that's the scary part, to cut that out. What are you so scared of? What is that feeling like, oh, this is, this is bad. We're in the red. Shut it down, abort. I'm like, that's what worries me.

• 51:34Chris Williamson?

  Well, it's because nobody is not allowed to have an opinion on everything anymore. Like, everybody has to have an opinion.

• 51:39Mark Normand?

  Right.

• 51:40Chris Williamson?

  On absolutely everything. And, uh,

• 51:43Mark Normand?

  And I just wanna learn. I'm an idiot, so I wanna learn more, but they just, ah, like, trans is a big one. I said, what's up with trans? If this is that, then what's up with that? And you go, ah, buh, buh, buh, buh. And you're like, well, now, now I'm really interested. It's kinda like when I was a kid, I was, I was, was an atheist. And, you know, you go, so wait, if heaven is real, and heaven is blissful eternity, then are you old in heaven? Cause that wouldn't be blissful. I'd rather be young. Also, is my grandma in there? And is she old or she young? And you start asking, and they go, ah, shut the fuck up. Yeah. How dare you, uh, you know, talking the, the name of God and all this shit, you know, the Lord's name in vain. And you're like, oh, you have no answer. And I feel like that's the same with all this stuff. And I just wanna learn. I'm not

• 52:25Mark Normand?

  trashing heaven. I'd love to go to heaven. But I wanna get to the bottom of it. And they get, they start getting angry. And that's what worries me.

• 52:32Chris Williamson?

  My friend's got this, uh, theory of bespoke bullshit. Many people don't have an opinion until they're asked for it, at which point they cobble together a viewpoint from women half-remembered hearsay, before deciding that this two-minute-old makeshift opinion will be their new hill to die on.

• 52:46Mark Normand?

  Ah, that's fucking perfect. Who is this guy?

• 52:49Chris Williamson?

  Yeah, it's the same dude.

• 52:50Mark Normand?

  This guy's on fire.

• 52:51Chris Williamson?

  Gwenda Bogle. Yeah, he wrote this phenomenal article on Tik- he's like, I forced this guy onto the show, probably every three or four months or so. And he's basically a digital ghost, apart from tweeting aphorisms like that and writing awesome substacks. And, uh, I just, like, drag him, kicking and screaming.

• 53:07Mark Normand?

  Yeah.

• 53:08Chris Williamson?

  Place him on a podcast, and then he scurries away and learns more good shit, and then I drag him back and bring him back on again.

• 53:13Mark Normand?

  Here's the question. Why does he have to be a digital ghost? Because he's, doesn't want all the backlash and the bullshit, but like, we're just trying to learn.

• 53:19Chris Williamson?

  It does seem that way. The, um, the, the fact that everybody feels like they need to have an opinion on everything, means that, you remember the, uh, silence is violence?

• 53:28Mark Normand?

  Oh, that was a good one.

• 53:29Chris Williamson?

  Silence is compliance.

• 53:30Mark Normand?

  Yeah.

• 53:31Chris Williamson?

  Thing. Is like, well. If you're pushing people to take a particular position and you can only allow them to either be for or against a thing, you're going to lose all of the interesting stuff and people are just gonna check out of having conversations.

• 53:45Mark Normand?

  Completely.

• 53:46Chris Williamson?

  They're not gonna bother.

• 53:47Mark Normand?

  And it's only silence is violence if you're not saying my thing, you know, like it's like when people go, we need more diversity and you're like, what do you mean? Like you need more people look like me. Like, oh, you want to be on the show. You know, you're not thinking about the Pacific Islander, you know, or the wheelchair guy. You're thinking about you. So I get that. We're all selfish at the end of the day, but you get to be selfish and mask it with this guise of moral superiority. It's pretty genius.

• 54:12Chris Williamson?

  The performative empathy thing is one of the reasons why I think everyone, I do think it contributes to cynicism because it's so hard to work out whether someone's being genuine or not.

• 54:23Mark Normand?

  Yes, yes.

• 54:24Chris Williamson?

  Is this person actually doing the thing that they say that they do because they care?

• 54:29Mark Normand?

  Yes.

• 54:30Chris Williamson?

  Or are they doing it because they know that it's an effective current social trend to ride off the back of?

• 54:37Mark Normand?

  Exactly, exactly. And you can see which way the wind's blowing and most people I think just go, I'll go that way because I don't want to deal with getting yelled at and backlash and be labeled.

• 54:46Chris Williamson?

  Remember, what is it? Only 10% of Americans have a Twitter account. So 90% of Americans don't have a Twitter account.

• 54:54Mark Normand?

  Wow.

• 54:55Chris Williamson?

  Which means that, you know, and I think on Twitter, it's around about 95% of tweets are created by less than 20 or 10% of the users. So even there is a small cohort of people from the world who are on Twitter and within the people that are on Twitter, there is a small cohort of them who produce almost all of the content.

• 55:16Mark Normand?

  Right.

• 55:17Chris Williamson?

  So the overwhelming majority opinion that you see is actually unbelievably unrepresentative. They incredibly small and biased.

• 55:25Mark Normand?

  Yeah.

• 55:25Chris Williamson?

  Because all of the people that tweet a lot, you know, there will be something in common that everybody has. It's like you see someone post something negative or there's a flood of negative comments and you go, I wonder what all of those people have got in common. Because they will. There will be some things, some elements of personality that will contribute to have that be the case. It's not a representative sample.

• 55:43Mark Normand?

  No, no, but they swarm. They'll swarm on you and it feels like a million people. Jonathan Haidt called it death by little needles. You know, just like, you know, one needle prick, you're like, that was weird. But a million of them coming at you, that hurts.

• 55:59Chris Williamson?

  John Heidstein, some interesting stuff. Have you seen that he's writing his entire book publicly at the moment?

• 56:04Mark Normand?

  What does that mean?

• 56:05Chris Williamson?

  So he, he's got, I think it's maybe a Substack or some other sort of mailing list. And he's got this book that's gonna be out at some point in the future. And each, maybe few pages or each chapter, as he writes them, he's just publishing.

• 56:18Mark Normand?

  Ah.

• 56:19Chris Williamson?

  As he goes.

• 56:19Mark Normand?

  That's pretty cool.

• 56:20Chris Williamson?

  And then he's getting feedback in the comments and then presumably we'll be making adjustments before the final book.

• 56:25Mark Normand?

  It's like comedy. It's like stand-up.

• 56:27Chris Williamson?

  Yes.

• 56:27Mark Normand?

  Wow. He's doing a live act and then editing.

• 56:31Chris Williamson?

  Yes.

• 56:31Mark Normand?

  Based on reaction.

• 56:32Chris Williamson?

  You did a special.

• 56:33Mark Normand?

  I did one, yeah. It comes out July 25th on Netflix and they let me say everything. They, I mean, I really go hard. I was shocked at no notes. So I think maybe things are changing or maybe Netflix wants, cause any press is good press.

• 56:48Chris Williamson?

  So when you mean notes, it was, you were able to submit it and they didn't say, we can't have that joke?

• 56:53Mark Normand?

  Take the R word out, all that. No, Holocaust, trans, it's all in there. And everything's a joke, everything gets a laugh, but it's, uh, it's all the, all the hot button topics.

• 57:05Chris Williamson?

  I asked Schultz this question. Do you think that there's any joke that is so extreme that it shouldn't be told?

• 57:14Mark Normand?

  I don't, but I'm a comedian who likes fucked up jokes.

• 57:19Chris Williamson?

  He said, uh, is it funny?

• 57:21Mark Normand?

  That's, I completely agree.

• 57:22Chris Williamson?

  And I was like, uh, yeah.

• 57:25Mark Normand?

  Yeah. And I, oh, sorry. I would.

• 57:27Chris Williamson?

  Apparently it matters.

• 57:28Mark Normand?

  Funny is everything. It's a stand-up comedy show. At the end of the day, even if someone has a non-offensive joke that isn't funny, I say, get rid of it. It doesn't matter if it's offensive or edgy or whatever, or, or not edgy. Get rid of it either way if it's not getting a laugh. Funny is a, is a, you know, what's that Oscar Wilde? If you're gonna tell the truth, you better be funny or they'll kill you. And I think that's so true. And I would say the same for these people who, who their whole act is like, I was molested. I was the victim of racism. And you're like, that's easy. Anybody get molested or be a victim of racism? That's easy. What, what, the hard part is to get in the laugh. Anybody get molested? That's not an accomplishment.

• 58:08Mark Normand?

  You know, it's, it sucks, but we gotta get the, the ha-has in there. That's what stand-up comedy is. That's why it's an art form and that's why it's fun. It's the whole point.

• 58:20Chris Williamson?

  Yeah, I uh, I was using this example. Did you see True Geordie? Do you know who that is?

• 58:25Mark Normand?

  I've heard of him, but I don't know.

• 58:27Chris Williamson?

  YouTube guy from the UK and he does podcasts.

• 58:29Mark Normand?

  Big guy, tough guy.

• 58:30Chris Williamson?

  Tattoos, forehead. And um, he's from the city where I used to live.

• 58:34Mark Normand?

  And uh, Hates Jake Paul.

• 58:36Chris Williamson?

  Hates Jake Paul, I think. Not a massive fan of Jake Paul. He told a joke, him and Andrew Tate had had a run in for quite a long time. And someone asked on a live stream forever ago, uh, what do you think about Andrew Tate's recent conversion to Islam?

• 58:52Mark Normand?

  Hmm.

• 58:53Chris Williamson?

  And Brian Trujodi said, uh, he should prove it to us all by blowing himself up.

• 59:01Mark Normand?

  That's a good line.

• 59:02Chris Williamson?

  That's a good joke.

• 59:03Mark Normand?

  Yeah.

• 59:03Chris Williamson?

  It's a legitimate joke. And Andrew said the same. He was like, it was obvious misdirect. He was playing off tropes. Like it's just, it's classic joke.

• 59:11Mark Normand?

  Classic.

• 59:11Chris Williamson?

  Yeah.

• 59:12Mark Normand?

  Love it.

• 59:12Chris Williamson?

  And he got, within 24 hours, uh, Myprotein dropped him, Jim Shark dropped him, Pokerstars dropped him, and he was banned on Twitch.

• 59:19Mark Normand?

  Wow.

• 59:21Chris Williamson?

  In 24 hours.

• 59:21Mark Normand?

  See, that's, that's horrible. And what annoys me about when people are like, he's got money, he'll be fine, shut up, he's fine. You're like, he lost all that. That sucks. That's over a joke. So when they say like, oh, shut up, when you're complaining, you can't, oh, comics can't say anything. Look, I still say everything I want, but this guy said one quick zing about a guy who's pretty well hated, and he still got in trouble.

• 59:45Chris Williamson?

  Yeah.

• 59:46Mark Normand?

  That sucks. I hate the whole he'll be fine. Cause you're like, okay, so let's say you call Michael Jordan the N-word at a game. He's a millionaire, blah, blah. He went to work the next day. He's fine. So that, that doesn't matter? It still should matter. I don't get why calling someone a bigot and then calling someone the N-word is, is uh, not the same.

• 1:00:10Chris Williamson?

  Well, the, the problem that you have, especially if you look at, I don't know. Someone's quality of life, based on how much money they're able to earn, or how much money they've got in the bank account, completely disregards the fact that status is so important to the way that we feel about ourselves.

• 1:00:26Mark Normand?

  Yes, yes.

• 1:00:27Chris Williamson?

  If you have this massive downfall.

• 1:00:29Mark Normand?

  Yes.

• 1:00:30Chris Williamson?

  Everybody hates you and there's all of this bad stuff. And you know, if someone's righteously indignant about the joke that you made against their religion or their race or their disability or their advertising campaign or whatever, they're going to be unhappy. But like that person is going to suffer a lot. You have to be really, really fucking hard-nosed to go through a massive downfall.

• 1:00:50Mark Normand?

  Totally.

• 1:00:50Chris Williamson?

  What was it that Rogan said, like the way that he dealt with his little, his thing a couple of years ago was like a moderate dose of mushrooms pretty much every single day.

• 1:00:58Mark Normand?

  Yeah.

• 1:00:59Chris Williamson?

  That was one of the frameworks, like training a lot and I did an ice bath and my diet was clean and I took a lot of mushrooms.

• 1:01:05Mark Normand?

  Yeah.

• 1:01:05Chris Williamson?

  And you think, well, I don't know, man, like.

• 1:01:09Mark Normand?

  That's a lot of stuff just to do the day.

• 1:01:11Chris Williamson?

  Precisely. From somebody that's got an awfully long way to fall.

• 1:01:14Mark Normand?

  Yes.

• 1:01:14Chris Williamson?

  Accrued a good bit of status and goodwill below them. And still, there's all of these things that you need to do. Oh, he'll be fine. Well.

• 1:01:23Mark Normand?

  Yeah.

• 1:01:24Chris Williamson?

  Like the daily psychedelics and the ice bath and the training suggests that it's not just the sort of thing that you can easily get through.

• 1:01:31Mark Normand?

  I, I think it's horrible. I think calling someone a tranny is mean. That hurts their feelings. I get it. It's funny, but I get it when they're like, hey, we gotta stop saying that word. And I think the same goes for people who just call everybody racist or a bigot or a transphobe or whatever, when they're not. You know, like if I, if I kiss you, that doesn't make me gay. I just did a gay thing for a second. And if I make a racist joke or say a, a bad word, I don't mean that thing. I just did it for a second. You see what I'm saying? And that's what bugs me.

• 1:02:03Chris Williamson?

  At what point do you become gay?

• 1:02:05Mark Normand?

  I think when you're attracted to men.

• 1:02:06Chris Williamson?

  But how many gay things do you have to do before you become gay?

• 1:02:09Mark Normand?

  I think it's all up here. It's like being a woman. I identify, you identify.

• 1:02:12Chris Williamson?

  Suck a dick and be straight?

• 1:02:13Mark Normand?

  Yeah.

• 1:02:14Chris Williamson?

  Yeah.

• 1:02:14Mark Normand?

  Cause it's sucking a dick is a, it's just a physical act, act. But actually wanting to suck a dick, that's when you're gay.

• 1:02:21Chris Williamson?

  Interesting.

• 1:02:22Mark Normand?

  Yeah. So blow, you can blow me right now and I won't call you gay. I promise. That mustache, I wanna jizz all over it.

• 1:02:31Chris Williamson?

  Yeah, I've been trying to sort of really uh channel my 1970s Miami cop.

• 1:02:37Mark Normand?

  It looks good.

• 1:02:38Chris Williamson?

  Good, yeah, fuck yeah.

• 1:02:39Mark Normand?

  I'd sit on that.

• 1:02:40Chris Williamson?

  Hey, I'm a, I'm a Rangers fan, I'm a Texas Rangers fan now.

• 1:02:43Mark Normand?

  Oh, nice.

• 1:02:45Chris Williamson?

  What do I need to know, like about American sport? What are the, the skills that I need to be able to watch American sport well?

• 1:02:51Mark Normand?

  What do you mean, the skills? You gotta be fat, you gotta be drunk.

• 1:02:54Chris Williamson?

  Yeah, these things.

• 1:02:55Mark Normand?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:02:55Chris Williamson?

  What is that? What should, because I haven't been to a baseball game since I've moved here. What should I expect?

• 1:02:59Mark Normand?

  Get a cold beer, uh, you gotta learn the, hey, bada bada bada, and then there's also the whole culture of like trashing the guy from the stands, like, you call that a throw? Well, I've seen better throws on a pillow, or whatever, on a rug, you know, and that's all fun and games, and then maybe you can catch a fly ball, that's big. Then you gotta give it to the retarded cancer kid with the bald head, so there's all kinds of tropes, um, it's fun, it's fun, you get out in the sun, take your shirt off, live it up, man, it's the American pastime.

• 1:03:28Chris Williamson?

  Fuck yeah.

• 1:03:28Mark Normand?

  Bring sunflower seeds.

• 1:03:30Chris Williamson?

  I needed, I decided that I needed a, uh, I needed something, I needed a sport and a team that I could follow, and Texas Rangers, owned by, what were the reasons? We wanted, um, a place that had a nice stadium, a place that wasn't more than three hours away, a place that was owned by racists, and it turns out that George, George Bush, the Bush family's just heavily invested in the brand new stadium for the Rangers.

• 1:03:49Mark Normand?

  I love it.

• 1:03:49Chris Williamson?

  So we got all three.

• 1:03:50Mark Normand?

  Oh, you're gonna have a blast. I went to, when I went to Australia one time, I went to, I don't even know the name of the sport, cricket, quidget?

• 1:03:58Chris Williamson?

  Cricket, that was the thing.

• 1:03:59Mark Normand?

  Was it cricket?

• 1:04:00Chris Williamson?

  Be, be careful here, this is the sport of my childhood.

• 1:04:02Mark Normand?

  No, no, it wasn't cricket, because I know cricket, that's got the paddle.

• 1:04:05Chris Williamson?

  Yep.

• 1:04:05Mark Normand?

  This was more of a sockery rugby kind of thing.

• 1:04:08Chris Williamson?

  Oh, Aussie Rules Football.

• 1:04:09Mark Normand?

  Maybe that was it.

• 1:04:10Chris Williamson?

  Yeah.

• 1:04:10Mark Normand?

  And it was amazing.

• 1:04:11Chris Williamson?

  Yeah.

• 1:04:12Mark Normand?

  Went to the big stadium, the whole play, oi, oi, oi, and it was incredible.

• 1:04:15Chris Williamson?

  Have you seen, uh, hurling? Have you seen that, the Irish sport?

• 1:04:18Mark Normand?

  No.

• 1:04:18Chris Williamson?

  So, you've seen lacrosse?

• 1:04:21Mark Normand?

  Yes.

• 1:04:21Chris Williamson?

  With the nets, the nets and the thing and they like run like that.

• 1:04:24Mark Normand?

  Yeah.

• 1:04:24Chris Williamson?

  So imagine that, but instead of it being a net and a little ball, it's a wooden, like a big hockey stick. And they run sort of balancing the ball on the hockey stick.

• 1:04:33Mark Normand?

  What?

• 1:04:34Chris Williamson?

  But it means that they can swing this thing unbelievably hard. None of the players have got any teeth. It's like.

• 1:04:40Mark Normand?

  Whoa.

• 1:04:41Chris Williamson?

  It's kind of the same as ice hockey without the ice or the skating.

• 1:04:45Mark Normand?

  Wow.

• 1:04:47Chris Williamson?

  Absolutely ruthless.

• 1:04:48Mark Normand?

  You have to balance it while running?

• 1:04:49Chris Williamson?

  Running, yeah. So they do this. It's fucking crazy, man. Hurling. Look at that.

• 1:04:52Mark Normand?

  And they could hit you with the stick?

• 1:04:53Chris Williamson?

  They swing through a lot of the time.

• 1:04:55Mark Normand?

  Oh, my lord. No helmet?

• 1:04:57Chris Williamson?

  Uh, I can't remember. I feel like the goalies got a helmet, but not them so much. And then there's Gaelic football, if you've seen that, which is literally like halfway between rugby and football. So they have the rugby stands with the, the thing.

• 1:05:11Mark Normand?

  Yeah.

• 1:05:12Chris Williamson?

  And the bottom bit has got a net and got a goalie in it.

• 1:05:14Mark Normand?

  Whoa.

• 1:05:15Chris Williamson?

  So you got to try and score in that. You can get it over the top and there's other bits and pieces. They play here, they play here in Austin.

• 1:05:19Mark Normand?

  I love it. Well, what about UFC? That's, to me, that's my favorite.

• 1:05:23Chris Williamson?

  Is that what you're spending a lot of time watching at the moment?

• 1:05:25Mark Normand?

  That's my number one. I like a one-on-one. Like I like tennis too. I like one-on-one. I like the mental part of it. I like the different, like this fighter is better than this fighter, but he can still beat him because of the style differences, you know? I love that kind of stuff and I loved learning, you know, Nate Diaz is a character. Conor McGregor's a character, uh, Style Bender. You get to know them, whereas football is just a bunch of nameless, faceless helmets. And I like that where you, you can kind of get them. It's more like stand-up.

• 1:05:54Chris Williamson?

  I went to Columbia at the start of the year to get stem cells. So I spent a full week in Medellin. And my in clinic, like patient partner was Al Jermain Sterling.

• 1:06:04Mark Normand?

  Whoa.

• 1:06:05Chris Williamson?

  So I got to spend a full week with him.

• 1:06:06Mark Normand?

  What's he like?

• 1:06:07Chris Williamson?

  Fucking cool dude.

• 1:06:08Mark Normand?

  Yeah.

• 1:06:09Chris Williamson?

  Very just like a chill, not like.

• 1:06:12Chris Williamson?

  It's a compliment, but unbelievably normal.

• 1:06:15Mark Normand?

  Yeah.

• 1:06:15Chris Williamson?

  But incredibly normal. And I get the sense that if I'd spent the week with Sugar Sean, it would have been less normal with Conor McGregor, it would have been less normal. But there are, you know, this is, you know, getting toward being super, super dominant within, what's he, three time defending champ now?

• 1:06:31Mark Normand?

  Yeah, something like that.

• 1:06:32Chris Williamson?

  Of the 135 belt.

• 1:06:34Mark Normand?

  Yeah.

• 1:06:34Chris Williamson?

  And, uh, next fight's going to be against Sugar Sean. So, yeah, he, he was really, really normal, super nice guy, texted his team on the night that he had the fight and wished him good luck and stuff. And that's fucking cool, man, what they're doing. I haven't, hasn't the UFC partnered with WWE?

• 1:06:51Mark Normand?

  Oh, is that right? I hope not.

• 1:06:53Chris Williamson?

  Pretty, I'm absolutely certain. WWE UFC, I promise you that I'm going to bring this up.

• 1:06:58Mark Normand?

  I hope it doesn't get too wrestling.

• 1:06:59Chris Williamson?

  Yeah, where are we? Uh, the, yeah, the WWE UFC merger.

• 1:07:04Mark Normand?

  Whoa.

• 1:07:05Chris Williamson?

  Yeah, this is a month old now. World Wrestling Entertainment, WrestleMania is the biggest event, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh. Uh, on April 2nd, the second day of WrestleMania, CNBC broke the news that the WWE is to be sold to Hollywood talent agency Endeavor Group Holdings. Endeavor, which also owns the UFC, is to merge the two iconic complementary global sports and entertainment brands to form a new $21 billion plus live sports and entertainment company.

• 1:07:34Mark Normand?

  Oh no, they took the money. Dana White, you cuck? God damn it. I hope there's not, I don't want to see Justin Gage, you get hit with a folding chair. How far are we going to take this? I hope they don't mesh too much.

• 1:07:48Chris Williamson?

  Bring the Dudley Boys back?

• 1:07:49Mark Normand?

  Yeah.

• 1:07:51Chris Williamson?

  What is it? A Royal Rumble, but in the octagon?

• 1:07:53Mark Normand?

  Right. Now Rogan's gonna have to be the new Slim Jim guy. Oh, yeah. Oh, boy.

• 1:07:59Chris Williamson?

  Yeah, funny, man. I don't know. I feel like everything kind of descends towards WWE. Well, it's interesting because WWE, basically what they did was. They realized if we got rid of the sport element of the sport and we tried to create all of the drama as effectively as possible, what would we end up zeroing in on? So they've split tested the same way that you have with jokes for forever.

• 1:08:23Mark Normand?

  Yeah.

• 1:08:23Chris Williamson?

  They've split tested what makes a compelling character and a narrative and rivalry.

• 1:08:29Mark Normand?

  Yes.

• 1:08:30Chris Williamson?

  Story.

• 1:08:30Mark Normand?

  Yes.

• 1:08:31Chris Williamson?

  So when people say, uh, this is becoming like WWE, what they mean is this is descending more into showmanship. It, what, what's happened is WWE has captured the most effective way to create rivalry and intrigue and storyline in sport.

• 1:08:49Mark Normand?

  Yes.

• 1:08:50Chris Williamson?

  You know what I mean?

• 1:08:50Mark Normand?

  Completely. A hundred percent. I mean, it's as old as time. Good guy, bad guy, the fittive, battle of the strongest wins.

• 1:08:57Chris Williamson?

  Yep.

• 1:08:57Mark Normand?

  And then you get the, we hate you more. You're the heel.

• 1:09:00Chris Williamson?

  Yep.

• 1:09:00Mark Normand?

  And you play it up. It's, it's, it's, it's nothing new, but it works.

• 1:09:05Chris Williamson?

  Well, that's Jake Paul, right? Jake Paul's, you know, professionalized the heel.

• 1:09:08Mark Normand?

  Yeah.

• 1:09:09Chris Williamson?

  Someone fucking said about that when there was talk about, before Andrew Tate was under house arrest, uh, there was talk about Jake Paul versus an Andrew Tate fight. And you think, who's the bad guy?

• 1:09:20Mark Normand?

  Right.

• 1:09:21Chris Williamson?

  Who's supposed to be the bad guy in this fight?

• 1:09:23Mark Normand?

  Well, I'll take it one step further. There's Jake Paul, Andrew Tate, but there's also AOC and Marjorie Taylor Greene. That's also WWE.

• 1:09:29Chris Williamson?

  Did you see the image, the AI only fans enhanced image of AOC?

• 1:09:35Mark Normand?

  No, please lay it on me. I'm gonna get hard. I'm wearing a bathing suit here.

• 1:09:40Chris Williamson?

  Dude, it's so fucking good. I text.

• 1:09:44Mark Normand?

  She's very attractive.

• 1:09:45Chris Williamson?

  I texted this to Rogan a couple of weeks ago.

• 1:09:50Mark Normand?

  Oh, come on. Yeah, that's, that's nothing to sneeze at.

• 1:09:54Chris Williamson?

  And it says, uh, the caption above it says, will you give me your guns now? And the tweet is, you give me your guns, I'll give you these cannons.

• 1:10:04Chris Williamson?

  The top, the top rated comment was, uh, what was it?

• 1:10:10Chris Williamson?

  This is an attack. Quick, objectifying the people who are helping to make our country and the place it needs to be, the right, and right the wrongs of the past and give way for the future. I was like, you nearly killed my erection there. Good try.

• 1:10:23Mark Normand?

  Oh, man. But that's the other thing is, I talked to Schultz about this, I think, when the Miller Lite ad came out. He's like, "Look, I get it, women started brewing first, but can't we just have fun? Can't we just enjoy beer?" That's the real problem with the ads. It's not like, I don't think a lot of people are like, "Fuck women, put them in bikinis." Ah, it's just like, "I'm just getting lectured here about a fucking poison that I want to drink to forget about my job," you know?

• 1:10:51Chris Williamson?

  Well, I think one of the main problems people have is they just seem like such humorless pricks.

• 1:10:55Mark Normand?

  Yes, yes, exactly.

• 1:10:57Chris Williamson?

  You're not charming.

• 1:10:58Mark Normand?

  No.

• 1:10:59Chris Williamson?

  You're not charming. And for the people that haven't seen, especially the British people, haven't seen this Miller Lite ad, it was basically snuck in under the radar at the same time as the Dylan Mulvaney thing. And I think the lady that's presenting it is maybe a LGBT person, too.

• 1:11:14Mark Normand?

  Yeah.

• 1:11:14Chris Williamson?

  And she's walking through a museum and saying, "Women brewed beer, and how did we reward them? We rewarded them by putting them in bikinis." And it cuts to a 1990s ad of two girls mud wrestling in the middle of the street. And it's like, you buy a Miller Lite and you're into girls mud wrestling or whatever, which is true. People that drink Miller Lite probably are into that sort of stuff. And then the lady's castigating anybody that thinks that's cool. And it's like, "We're committed to changing..." And you just think, I think a lot of things. First off, I think, how fucking tone deaf do you need to be about your own audience?

• 1:11:47Mark Normand?

  Yeah.

• 1:11:48Chris Williamson?

  How fucking confident do you need to be in your share price and your sales figures?

• 1:11:52Mark Normand?

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:11:53Chris Williamson?

  And how little fun are you?

• 1:11:56Mark Normand?

  Exactly.

• 1:11:57Chris Williamson?

  It's so humorless.

• 1:11:59Mark Normand?

  I know. Like, why can't progressiveness and inclusiveness be fun, too? Like, what, also, not to be this guy, but what's so bad about bikinis? Like, aren't all these women on OnlyFans very empowering? You know, I thought that was empowering. Like, hey, we're taking our sexuality back, we make money on it, we do what we want. That's empowering.

• 1:12:18Chris Williamson?

  I'm allowed to objectify myself, but you're not allowed to objectify me.

• 1:12:21Mark Normand?

  I guess, but it's not like we tased a woman and knocked her out and put her in a burlap sack and then said, "You're in this bikini commercial or we'll kill you," you know? She, I'm sure, thousands of women auditioned and were like, "I got it, I got the Miller Lite ad with the twins."

• 1:12:33Chris Williamson?

  Well, do you remember Diet Coke, that

• 1:12:37Mark Normand?

  Yes, the buff guy.

• 1:12:38Chris Williamson?

  ...ad of all of the women looking out over that?

• 1:12:40Mark Normand?

  No guy, not one guy complained about that.

• 1:12:43Chris Williamson?

  I'm looking forward to becoming skinny fat in middle age and being able to point at that and say, "That was what caused me to lose my gains. I was objectified. I didn't want to be seen as a sex object."

• 1:12:54Mark Normand?

  Yeah.

• 1:12:54Chris Williamson?

  Not just a piece of meat.

• 1:12:55Mark Normand?

  It's so funny how bad I want to be objectified. I would love a woman to objectify me. But I guess it's a supply and demand. They get it so much that they're like, "I'm annoyed."

• 1:13:06Chris Williamson?

  I've got no objectification left to give, Mark, I'm afraid. There's no more. Yeah, it's a, it's so fucking weird, man. I just, I really hope that we're around the corner from something that's gonna be different in terms of like cultural memes, because I'm kind of exhausted of it as well.

• 1:13:22Mark Normand?

  Well, I think, well, I think a lot of people are. And I think it's almost like a fever breaking, like these Bud Light and Miller Lite and the Starbucks and the...

• 1:13:29Chris Williamson?

  What was the Starbucks thing?

• 1:13:30Mark Normand?

  The Starbucks is, it's pretty great. It's a old Indian guy and he gets a call from his son. So the son pops up on the screen and he's like, "Ah, damn." And then in comes his new daughter, so the son transitioned. So the daughter comes in and he's like, "Motherfucker." You know, he's all angry and the mom's like, "Come on, be nice." And he's like, "You know what? You're right. Let's get a coffee." And that's the ad. So he's accepted his trans daughter.

• 1:13:57Chris Williamson?

  They bond over going to Starbucks.

• 1:13:58Mark Normand?

  Yes, exactly. But it's just so forced and I think it's great that he's accepting his trans daughter. That's great. And it's, I'm all for the love and everything. I want everybody to get along.

• 1:14:07Chris Williamson?

  This fake Indian man is accepting his fake Indian, Indian trans daughter.

• 1:14:11Mark Normand?

  Exactly.

• 1:14:12Chris Williamson?

  To then go and shamelessly shill a multi-billion dollar.

• 1:14:16Mark Normand?

  Yes.

• 1:14:16Chris Williamson?

  Enterprise.

• 1:14:17Mark Normand?

  Exactly. And my, my joke was, I think he's really mad because his brother did the operation. You know, the, the Indian doctor. But yeah, I, I just think it, it just feels forced. And again, why can't it be a funny ad? Like, it's cool with trans person, person transitioning, but like, make it fun. Why does it have to be so somber and, and educational?

• 1:14:39Chris Williamson?

  Dude, the Miller Lite, the Bud Light thing, they're releasing, I saw this earlier on. Bud Light is set to launch a line of camouflage aluminium bottles that promote the Folds of Honour program, which provides educational scholarships for families of fallen and disabled American military service members and first responders, the New York Post reported. So basically, there is just this permanent flip flop between the two. Now, the Bud Light thing... The relatively very unpopular opinion for me to say, I feel bad for Bud Light because that was evidently a small influencer campaign that some portion, that some advertising exec

• 1:15:24Chris Williamson?

  somewhere that's not in no position, but isn't the fucking owner, right? And isn't the shareholders and isn't all of the people that do most of the things, some small portion that didn't have sufficient oversight, decided that they were just going to chuck this set of cans to Dylan Mulvaney, not realizing how badly it was going to go down. And now two huge big dick marketing execs have been fired. This has been halted and now they're trying to do all of this backtracking stuff. So even within that, and I don't think that Dylan Mulvaney is going to tap into the core demographic of Bud Light drinkers. Even within that, what you see is the desire for people on both sides of the fence to become

• 1:16:04Chris Williamson?

  offended. Like immediately, you want to have this knee jerk reaction to be able to go, see, see this fucking woke washing, these cooked fucking leftist organizer, they took our beer. Like they took everything. And I don't deny that it's a fucking shitty idea. It's a shitty advertising campaign that doesn't target the right people. And I don't think that Dylan Mulvaney should have been used. But I do also think that going, does this represent, how long's Bud Light been around? Probably fucking forever. Right? Is this really, oh, finally here's the mask off that shows that they were the America hating leftist cuck CCP sympathizing bastards that we thought of all along? Well, you say

• 1:16:49Chris Williamson?

  that if somebody says one accidentally slightly untoward racist thing, that that doesn't color their entire history, but you're not necessarily prepared to give the same

• 1:16:58Mark Normand?

  That's good. That's good. Great.

• 1:17:00Chris Williamson?

  ...of freedom to the other side.

• 1:17:01Mark Normand?

  Great call. Great call. So you're saying to the, to the people angry about the, the new trans guy or trans lady being the sponsor, you can't just judge it all on one commercial?

• 1:17:12Chris Williamson?

  Yeah.

• 1:17:13Mark Normand?

  Yeah, I completely agree. And if you like Bud Light, just keep drinking it.

• 1:17:16Chris Williamson?

  Bud Light's a good beer.

• 1:17:17Mark Normand?

  It's a good beer and it's very popular.

• 1:17:20Chris Williamson?

  What was it? They had, uh, Bud Light has reportedly told wholesalers that it will buy back unsold cases of beer that are past their expiration date. Twenty-three percent down year on year sales last week.

• 1:17:35Mark Normand?

  Wow.

• 1:17:36Chris Williamson?

  And they're doing camouflage print in an effort to boost sales. They're doing all sorts of stuff. So they're, I mean, fuck dude, can you imagine being, I don't know who the CEO or the chief MD or whatever of Bud Light? I'm waking up one morning and going, uh, like looking at your phone and being like, sir, we're trending. Oh, brilliant.

• 1:17:56Chris Williamson?

  What for?

• 1:17:56Mark Normand?

  Yeah.

• 1:17:57Chris Williamson?

  It's not brilliant, sir.

• 1:17:58Mark Normand?

  Right, right. But what about the whole any press is good press? Is that just, is that a myth? Cause this is the most press you can get. It's all we're talking about. It's all any, I mean, any comedy club, if someone's drinking a Bud Light, it's boom. Right to you. Joke, joke, joke.

• 1:18:14Chris Williamson?

  Yep.

• 1:18:15Mark Normand?

  How can this not be good? Does Bud Light know something we don't know? And then every other beer company and Starbucks and all these other dove are doing it. So is there something we're missing or, or is this just a huge fuck up?

• 1:18:27Chris Williamson?

  I think it's a fuck up.

• 1:18:28Mark Normand?

  Okay.

• 1:18:28Chris Williamson?

  So I have a friend who has spent a lot of time doing e-commerce and they've split tested bigger girls and they've split tested girls that are fit. And he told me, we have all of the data. Bigger girls don't sell clothes.

• 1:18:42Mark Normand?

  Yeah.

• 1:18:42Chris Williamson?

  So when you look at Victoria's Secret, someone that's trying to undo their cis heteronormative patriarchal misogynistic presuppositions of what a woman's body shape is supposed to be like, they are paying a price with their top line and their bottom line. And eventually some shareholder somewhere that owns fucking 15% of the company is going to look at a report and say, what's going on here? And you go, ah, no, sir, it's this, you see, it's this really cool social movement that we're a part of at the moment. It's like, it's real, it's super progressive.

• 1:19:15Mark Normand?

  Yeah.

• 1:19:15Chris Williamson?

  It's very good, you know, for the, the Gen Z, uh, 15 to 18 sort of lefty. And he's going to say, get fucked. Where's, put the girls that sell clothes back on the website.

• 1:19:26Mark Normand?

  Money.

• 1:19:27Chris Williamson?

  So there is some criticism, like Get What Go Broke. I have a friend that's done a shit ton of analysis on this. And the Gillette ad from a few years ago didn't, didn't impact long-term, didn't impact their positioning and a couple of others. I'd love him to run the stats back on these and see what happens longer term. I think really huge brands like a Bud Light or a Nike. Nike with Colin Kaepernick. Tons of people took offense to that campaign.

• 1:19:53Mark Normand?

  We're all wearing them.

• 1:19:54Chris Williamson?

  Yeah, I'm wearing them. I wear them every single day.

• 1:19:56Mark Normand?

  Yeah.

• 1:19:57Chris Williamson?

  First off, when it's a product, if the product's good, you kind of don't care.

• 1:20:01Mark Normand?

  I don't care.

• 1:20:02Chris Williamson?

  And secondly, if it's a big enough brand over a long enough period of time, people forget.

• 1:20:07Mark Normand?

  True.

• 1:20:07Chris Williamson?

  You know, Bud Light, it may take them, it may take them five years, probably won't, but it may take them five years to get themselves back. And we realized that we made some mistakes with this thing and da, da, da, da, da. And they'll, they'll be back selling Bish soon enough.

• 1:20:19Mark Normand?

  Of course, of course. It's a, it's a fun blip in the whole thing and we get to trash it and make fun of it. But I do appreciate the swing. They took a swing. They seemed like they were the first one to try it. And it was a big swing and it fucked up, but sometimes you gotta try a crazy idea. And sometimes it fucks up, like, like Got Milk. Got Milk was huge.

• 1:20:40Chris Williamson?

  What's Got Milk?

• 1:20:40Mark Normand?

  Got Milk was this ad, milk was just going down in America. Everybody hated milk. It's just people turned on it. Got Milk was this one ad where a guy's eating a peanut butter sandwich and it's all close up and he's watching a movie and he's like, mm, mm. And the phone rings and he's like, oh, hello? And it's like, you've won the million dollar prize. Just gotta answer this one question. And that whatever the question was, was about dinosaurs and they show his wall and it's full of dinosaur posters. He knows everything about dinosaurs, got dioramas and all this shit. And he's like, dinosaur, hello? And they're like, we can't understand you. You lost. And then it goes Got Milk. Like a milk, glass of milk would have gotten the food down.

• 1:21:16Chris Williamson?

  Right.

• 1:21:17Mark Normand?

  Huge ad campaign. People had T-shirts, Got Milk, just billboards say Got Milk. Milk skyrocketed. It went through the roof and it changed everything.

• 1:21:26Chris Williamson?

  Milk stocks had never been higher.

• 1:21:27Mark Normand?

  Huge milk stocks. So I think Bud Light was like, it's so crazy, it might just work.

• 1:21:33Chris Williamson?

  Hmm.

• 1:21:33Mark Normand?

  So I think you take a shot every now and then.

• 1:21:36Chris Williamson?

  That's kind of fun. Yeah, I.

• 1:21:39Chris Williamson?

  I don't know, man. Again, with the delivery, let's say that they'd, and this would be an interesting question to ask, you know, the most ardent, like Matt Walsh, I'd love to ask Matt Walsh, hey, Matt, had it have been funny or entertaining?

• 1:21:50Mark Normand?

  Yeah.

• 1:21:51Chris Williamson?

  What would you have thought?

• 1:21:52Mark Normand?

  Hmm.

• 1:21:52Chris Williamson?

  Like, would it have been, because we said, is there a joke that's so offensive that it should never be told? If it's funny, no.

• 1:21:58Mark Normand?

  I agree.

• 1:21:58Chris Williamson?

  Right? So if an advert is entertaining and good, should it have not been put out? You go, well, there's probably some limits because it kind of creates a role model, you know, talking about kids and positioning and shit like that. But it's what, 21 plus in this country, pretty much every state in order to be able to drink. So I don't know. Had it have been, had it been entertaining? But it was just, yeah, I wondered, I wanted to find this out. Can you imagine how much you could sell a Dylan Mulvaney can of Bud Light for? Because there was only six pack of them that was ever created. If she started-

• 1:22:32Mark Normand?

  Oh, huge money.

• 1:22:33Chris Williamson?

  Yeah.

• 1:22:33Mark Normand?

  Crazy. That's like that monkey NFT, you know, that's gonna be billions.

• 1:22:37Chris Williamson?

  The new Bored Ape.

• 1:22:38Mark Normand?

  Yeah, Bored Ape.

• 1:22:39Chris Williamson?

  Bored Dylan.

• 1:22:39Mark Normand?

  Yeah, but I do think there is, they were tapping into something the right way. I think there's, controversy can lead to huge numbers and huge sales.

• 1:22:48Chris Williamson?

  Not trans controversy when you're a beer brand.

• 1:22:51Mark Normand?

  I guess not. But like Lil Nas X, you know, that guy?

• 1:22:53Chris Williamson?

  The Blood?

• 1:22:54Mark Normand?

  Yeah, he's not gay, I heard. So I-

• 1:22:57Chris Williamson?

  He's not gay?

• 1:22:57Mark Normand?

  He's not gay. It's just all adding on to his, his brand.

• 1:23:02Chris Williamson?

  I'm gonna Google this. Is Lil Nas X-

• 1:23:05Mark Normand?

  And a lot of people hate him because he's gay. He's a devil guy. He's against conservative values, Christian values.

• 1:23:11Chris Williamson?

  Lil Nas X came out as gay, being the only artist to do so whilst having a number one record, but you're saying-

• 1:23:16Mark Normand?

  I'm saying that was a branding move.

• 1:23:18Chris Williamson?

  Very smart.

• 1:23:19Mark Normand?

  Marketing.

• 1:23:20Chris Williamson?

  Very smart. Lil Nas X came out as gay on the last day of Pride Month whilst he was number one. That seems-

• 1:23:26Mark Normand?

  Feels very calculated.

• 1:23:28Chris Williamson?

  Lil Nas X says music industry wants LGBTQ plus artists to be gay without being gay.

• 1:23:35Mark Normand?

  This is pretty good. Now, this is just what I heard. I'm not saying he's not gay.

• 1:23:38Chris Williamson?

  Wants to be more gay. Prove it, Lil Nas.

• 1:23:40Mark Normand?

  Yeah, blow me!

• 1:23:41Chris Williamson?

  Get yourself in here.

• 1:23:42Mark Normand?

  Yeah.

• 1:23:43Chris Williamson?

  I saw him, uh, I saw him perform at Austin City Limits.

• 1:23:46Mark Normand?

  Oh, wow.

• 1:23:47Chris Williamson?

  Last year. Like, that's one of those things. You know, when you see, you've been to see a ton of bands and they're, the shows are between 1,000 and 2,000 and it's like a, it's like a normal band, right? And then you go and see a performance, like a Lil Nas X thing, and the guy's sprinting offstage to do fucking costume changes and shit in between songs and it's all choreographed and there's dance numbers and then he comes out and he's on a harness and he's flying through the air and there's a helicopter and like all sorts of stuff. And you go, oh, okay, this is different.

• 1:24:16Mark Normand?

  Yeah.

• 1:24:17Chris Williamson?

  This is something else. This is no longer a musical rendition. This is a fucking, like, this is performance art.

• 1:24:22Mark Normand?

  Right, right. And I think, I think what's genius about him is Bud Light, you have to go Bud, buy Bud Light and people see you drink it at a bar and everybody makes fun of you. This you can put in your iPod and your, your earphones and you still sell the song, but you don't have to be seen with it.

• 1:24:38Chris Williamson?

  No public branding.

• 1:24:38Mark Normand?

  Yeah.

• 1:24:39Chris Williamson?

  Did you see when Harry Potter first came out and it was super popular and people hadn't read it, but adults didn't want to be seen in public reading a children's book?

• 1:24:51Mark Normand?

  Oh.

• 1:24:51Chris Williamson?

  They released adult covers of Harry Potter so that it looked less childreny.

• 1:24:56Mark Normand?

  Genius.

• 1:24:57Chris Williamson?

  Uh, so I wonder whether people are going to get koozies that they can slot over their Bud Light?

• 1:25:03Mark Normand?

  Yeah. This is Corona.

• 1:25:05Chris Williamson?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:25:06Mark Normand?

  Well, they should do this for kiddie porn. Just put a, a, an adult woman on the cover and then there you go. All right, that's my last kiddie porn pedophile joke because it's getting a little weird.

• 1:25:16Chris Williamson?

  I asked, uh, an ethicist, a porn ethicist, whether or not, uh, illustrated like anime or manga child porn is unethical.

• 1:25:27Mark Normand?

  Manga?

• 1:25:28Chris Williamson?

  You know, like anime.

• 1:25:29Mark Normand?

  Okay.

• 1:25:30Chris Williamson?

  Manga and anime, like hentai, right?

• 1:25:33Mark Normand?

  Ah, gotcha, gotcha.

• 1:25:34Chris Williamson?

  I guess it would be called, whether that's unethical. Because let's say that you're able to reduce real world harm by having illustrations. Nobody's been hurt with the illustrations, apart from perhaps the illustrator.

• 1:25:46Mark Normand?

  Interesting, and you're getting it out a little bit. Now you don't have to touch a kid because you're getting it out at home.

• 1:25:50Chris Williamson?

  Real world's concerns have been, or real world damage has been reduced.

• 1:25:55Mark Normand?

  It's pedophile methadone.

• 1:25:58Chris Williamson?

  Well, here's another one, is a, is a child sex robot unethical?

• 1:26:02Mark Normand?

  Yeah, yeah, that is tough. Well, I think this, you could say this for Woody Allen. Like, aside from the touching his daughter's accusations, he married his adopted kid, right? Soon ye, and obviously that's weird, but they're still married. They love each other. Is it wrong?

• 1:26:23Chris Williamson?

  Fucking crazy, man. So I learned about why we have incest aversion. Ryan Long was gonna try and do, he texted me about like, he'd listened to the episode where I spoke about it. He was like, we're gonna try and work this into a, into a set. I was like, dude, if you manage to get this concept into a set, I'll be very fucking impressed.

• 1:26:38Mark Normand?

  Yeah.

• 1:26:38Chris Williamson?

  So the reason that, do you have brothers or sisters?

• 1:26:42Mark Normand?

  Older brother.

• 1:26:43Chris Williamson?

  Okay, cool. So the reason that you don't want to fuck your brother is something called the Westermark effect. So between the ages of about two, and I think it's 12, there is a window of time. And if you are around another young child who you see interacting with your parents in particular kinds of ways, there is a bucket in your mind that that individual goes into that means that you're going to be sexually repulsed by them.

• 1:27:11Mark Normand?

  Hmm.

• 1:27:12Chris Williamson?

  Now, the reason that this is interesting is you can imagine a scenario in which twins maybe, or brother and sister are separated at birth, or separated perhaps in early childhood, and then come together later on, and they can find that they've got loads in common. Well, of course you do. You share maybe 50% or 25% of your genetics together.

• 1:27:32Chris Williamson?

  So they go apart and then they come back and you go, you know, how disgusting is it? How terrible is it for brother and sister to have sex? It's pretty bad. They're gonna procreate, it's pretty bad. But the reason that you have an aversion to it has got nothing to do with your genetics. It's everything to do with this Westermark window. And the same thing happens.

• 1:27:50Mark Normand?

  Interesting.

• 1:27:50Chris Williamson?

  With fathers. So if you have an absentee father, you know, a lot of single mother households and stuff where kids grow up in. Father leaves, comes back into the daughter's life, perhaps at 16, for whatever reason. And maybe some daddy issues might contribute to it. But generally, you, there is a, a lack of incest aversion that goes on there. From sleeping with it. So you've got this father that comes back in.

• 1:28:14Mark Normand?

  Whoa.

• 1:28:15Chris Williamson?

  The abandonment, finally being accepted by a man, a man that I have a lot in common with. Of course you do, you know, he's literally 50% of your genes.

• 1:28:22Mark Normand?

  Whoa.

• 1:28:23Chris Williamson?

  Yeah, pretty fucking crazy. So this Westermark window is, is a, a key period. And you can also have another way. Adopted siblings who are not genetically related can find massive incest aversion to each other. Even though, yeah, because they just went through that window together.

• 1:28:39Mark Normand?

  Yeah, wow.

• 1:28:40Chris Williamson?

  How cool.

• 1:28:41Mark Normand?

  That's super cool. And I'm lucky because my family is not attractive. So that helps. But wow, that is, thank God for, that, that, that's a good advertisement for, for the nuclear family.

• 1:28:53Chris Williamson?

  Keeping the family together to make sure that you keep your brothers and sisters apart.

• 1:28:56Mark Normand?

  Yeah.

• 1:28:58Mark Normand?

  Yes, clip it.

• 1:28:59Chris Williamson?

  Fuck yeah.

• 1:28:59Mark Normand?

  That's a great commercial.

• 1:29:01Chris Williamson?

  Target partners with a Satanist brand for pride collection. Live, Laugh Lesbian. A new pride collection introduced by Target includes clothing made by a UK-based brand. His designer has expressed Satanist views. A London-based company created T-shirts and tote bags that include messages like, Live, Laugh Lesbian, Cure Transphobia, Not Trans People, Too Queer For Me, and We Belong Everywhere. They made kids.

• 1:29:29Mark Normand?

  What does that do with devil, liking the devil?

• 1:29:31Chris Williamson?

  They also made some like Satanist stuff in the past, apparently. Also sells apparel that includes satanic imagery, including pentagrams, horn skulls and references to the devil. So here's, here's the thing, did you see, was it Sam Smith? He performed as like a.

• 1:29:44Mark Normand?

  Big black blob kind of thing?

• 1:29:46Chris Williamson?

  Yeah, white guy, but like big black blob.

• 1:29:48Mark Normand?

  Oh yeah, he was wearing a black, inflatable kind of suit.

• 1:29:52Chris Williamson?

  He came out and he was like, there was devil horns and whatever, whatever. And a bunch of people, especially sort of Christian commentators were like, oh, you see, it's this Satanist thing. And I get it, but it does seem like the more conspiratorial elements of of America. I don't think that it's great to have a devil up on stage, but I don't know. To me, there's no more existential difference between that and it being Mickey Mouse or it being, you know, like for anything else.

• 1:30:18Mark Normand?

  It's just a point. It's all fake.

• 1:30:19Chris Williamson?

  Yeah.

• 1:30:20Mark Normand?

  Yeah, I don't believe in the devil either.

• 1:30:22Chris Williamson?

  No.

• 1:30:22Mark Normand?

  But.

• 1:30:23Chris Williamson?

  Like if you had Santa Claus up on stage, it's what he represents. It's like, well.

• 1:30:27Mark Normand?

  But the difference is the devil is equated with evil.

• 1:30:29Chris Williamson?

  Yeah.

• 1:30:29Mark Normand?

  Okay.

• 1:30:30Chris Williamson?

  So Santa Claus, like, yeah, no. Like if you had Thanos, if someone went up and they would.

• 1:30:35Mark Normand?

  Right, right. Or Darth Vader.

• 1:30:36Chris Williamson?

  Yeah.

• 1:30:36Mark Normand?

  Yeah.

• 1:30:37Chris Williamson?

  I don't know. It's just, it's the

• 1:30:41Chris Williamson?

  moral panic to some regard over like satanic imagery. I don't know my position on it yet. I might come back, come around to it in a couple of years' time and say, actually, yeah, no, fuck do you, we can't have this. It's turning all of the kids into Satanists.

• 1:30:52Mark Normand?

  Right. Well, it's funny what imagery you're allowed to have. Like, uh, somebody, I can't remember who, some comedian had a great bit about how as a kid, you could dress up as a pirate and pirates are rapists and thieves and pieces of shit like drunkards. And they would steal your boat and take your money and your women.

• 1:31:06Chris Williamson?

  Diliging.

• 1:31:07Mark Normand?

  Yeah, but like if you dress up as a Nazi, you're a piece of shit, but like they're both evil.

• 1:31:12Chris Williamson?

  Pirates are one of the few fancy dress categories that as of yet the cancellation hasn't.

• 1:31:19Mark Normand?

  Yeah, that's true. I think because there's nothing to take from them except, I don't know, an eye patch. Or, I don't know, it's all these like, uh, like Captain Phillips. Did you ever see that movie?

• 1:31:28Chris Williamson?

  Yes.

• 1:31:28Mark Normand?

  Yeah, those are pirate. Those are the modern day pirates.

• 1:31:31Chris Williamson?

  Yeah, if you dressed your son up as a Somali.

• 1:31:33Mark Normand?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. But it's just weird how like, like Tony Soprano is like this praised guy. He's a cool guy, but he's a fucking sociopathic murderer.

• 1:31:44Chris Williamson?

  Yes.

• 1:31:44Mark Normand?

  You know, but we, we pick and choose like, well, he had a family and he was funny and likeable, but he was a murderer.

• 1:31:50Chris Williamson?

  But that's the thing. If you're able to be charming and funny and entertaining with it, people will allow so much.

• 1:31:56Mark Normand?

  Oh, yeah. Like Barack Obama. I, I don't know anything about politics, but all I hear is he killed millions of people and all these innocent families and he bombed them.

• 1:32:05Mark Normand?

  But he's cool as shit and good looking. Good speaker, fun.

• 1:32:09Chris Williamson?

  Recently narrated a series on Netflix about nature, I think.

• 1:32:12Mark Normand?

  Yeah.

• 1:32:12Chris Williamson?

  Nature shit.

• 1:32:13Mark Normand?

  I don't give a fuck that he did all those things. I mean, it's horrible, I guess, but I, you know, out of sight, out of mind.

• 1:32:19Chris Williamson?

  Well, wasn't that the same Bill Clinton's widely regarded as one of the most charming people that's ever walked this earth, right?

• 1:32:25Mark Normand?

  Totally.

• 1:32:25Chris Williamson?

  Anybody that's ever met him in person felt like they were the only one in the room.

• 1:32:28Mark Normand?

  Yes, yes.

• 1:32:29Chris Williamson?

  There's all of these stories, millions of stories, right, that I've heard about this. And you go, I can see, can see why he managed to get through all of the different scandals and all the rest of it. So, yeah, there's, um...

• 1:32:40Mark Normand?

  Charm, I guess, goes a long way. It's like Samuel L. Jackson said, "It's the one charming motherfucking pig." Pulp Fiction. But, yeah, like, he's like, "I don't dig on swine," because it's the same reason we don't eat dogs. They're charming. But we eat pigs, because they're gross and ugly.

• 1:32:54Chris Williamson?

  Didn't you once say that charm is makeup for men?

• 1:32:57Mark Normand?

  Yes. Wow, good memory. Well done.

• 1:33:00Chris Williamson?

  What do you mean?

• 1:33:01Mark Normand?

  Well, I mean, like, like, you know, when you have, like, a one-night-stand, most guys typically want the lady to get out of there, because we don't want to be charming again. It's a lot of work. Being charming is exhausting. So, like, you just want to be done with it. And I think women feel the same way, where you're like, "Hey, you want to come over?" And they're like, "Ah, I'm not wearing makeup. I don't want to put it on and put on an outfit. I'm in my pajamas here." So, that's our, our makeup. Charming. Confidence. I'm not confident, but I got to fake it on a date.

• 1:33:30Chris Williamson?

  You've got to put the effort in.

• 1:33:31Mark Normand?

  Yes.

• 1:33:31Chris Williamson?

  You've got to ramp it up beforehand.

• 1:33:32Mark Normand?

  Exactly. So, when guys are like, "I need this girl out of my apartment," uh, it's just because we're, "I need a minute. I need a break."

• 1:33:38Chris Williamson?

  To be myself.

• 1:33:39Mark Normand?

  Yes.

• 1:33:39Chris Williamson?

  To fart and pick my feet and...

• 1:33:41Mark Normand?

  Yeah, my wife, love her to death, but when we started dating, I would go on the road and I would come back and, you know, be a six-hour flight. And she's like, "Come over." And I'm like, I would lie and say my flight was later, just to buy me a couple hours at the house where I could just fart and...

• 1:33:55Chris Williamson?

  Be a shithead.

• 1:33:56Mark Normand?

  Be a shithead and take a dump and watch, you know, a couple of minutes of YouTube and all that.

• 1:34:00Chris Williamson?

  Wow.

• 1:34:01Mark Normand?

  Yeah. And she's like, "You don't like me?" She took it personal. I'm like, "No, it's not even about you. It's just me. I got to be a piece of shit."

• 1:34:06Chris Williamson?

  Such a decrepit, awful, hate, hateful creature.

• 1:34:11Mark Normand?

  Yes.

• 1:34:11Chris Williamson?

  You need, you don't want to see me when I'm like this.

• 1:34:14Mark Normand?

  Right.

• 1:34:15Chris Williamson?

  Girls, like, uh...

• 1:34:16Mark Normand?

  They got the kiwis on their eyes or whatever.

• 1:34:18Chris Williamson?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. Don't look at me. Don't look at me. I haven't got my makeup on yet.

• 1:34:20Mark Normand?

  Exactly. That's our version.

• 1:34:21Chris Williamson?

  Yes. Very fucking good. Mark Normand, ladies and gentlemen.

• 1:34:25Mark Normand?

  What have you got coming up next? People in Australia, can they buy tickets? Buy tickets? We're adding shows like crazy. I go, I don't know when this comes out. It'll be out in a week. Okay, great. So I'll be there now. Tickets are still on sale. Going to New Zealand, Perth, Brisbane, Adelaide, Sydney, you name it. And then, you don't say. New tour announcement coming out in August. The tickets are on sale now. They're on my website and a new special in July. Fuck, yeah. It's all happening. Things are cooking. It's all downhill from here. Appreciate you, man. Thank you. This was fun.