ROLLUP: Solana ETF? | $Blast L2 Launch | Solana's Blink & ZK Compression | ETH ETF Next Week?

We’re on the edge of our seats with the potential Ethereum ETF launch just days away. Are ETH ETF products finally going to be tradeable next week? Solana is also in the spotlight, hinting at its own ETF while rolling out impressive innovations like ZK Compression and Blinks. The Blast token has also finally dropped! Are you eligible? We unpack everything you need to know. Plus, Ethereum’s new execution client might unlock a hidden beast. And we cover everything happening price with prices. Are we in a crypto bull or bear? Tune in to find out. ------ ✨ Mint the episode on Zora ✨ https://zora.co/collect/zora:0x0c294913a7596b427add7dcbd6d7bbfc7338d53f/23 ------ 📣PERMISSIONLESS | GET YOUR TICKETS NOW https://bankless.cc/PermissionlessDiscount ------ BANKLESS SPONSOR TOOLS: 🐙KRAKEN | MOST-TRUSTED CRYPTO EXCHANGE https://k.xyz/bankless-pod-q2 ⁠ 🛞MANTLE | MODULAR LAYER 2 NETWORK https://bankless.cc/Mantle ⚡️ CARTESI | LINUX-POWERED ROLLUPS https://bankless.cc/CartesiGovernance ⚖️ARBITRUM | SCALING ETHEREUM ⁠https://bankless.cc/Arbitrum 🌐 TRANSPORTER | CROSS CHAINS WITH CONFIDENCE https://transporter.io/ 🔗CELO | CEL2 COMING SOON https://bankless.cc/Celo ------ TIMESTAMPS & RESOURCES 0:00 Intro 3:19 Markets 3:53 Mt. Gox is ready to distribute the bitcoin https://x.com/WatcherGuru/status/1805168222645244311 https://x.com/Ian_Unsworth/status/1805251746354131379 9:07 Germany is about to start selling the seized bitcoin https://x.com/ArkhamIntel/status/1805542881454633282 9:30 Meanwhile, the U. S. government sent $240M of BTC to Coinbase https://x.com/DegenerateNews/status/1806012142094614695 https://x.com/RyanSAdams/status/1806347784129290364 11:09 ETH Tailwinds https://x.com/Matt_Hougan/status/1804137327964438729 https://x.com/econoar/status/1805123906602144125 15:31 L2 Update https://l2beat.com/scaling/summary https://rollup.wtf/ 17:33 Bitcoin flows https://www.theblock.co/data/crypto-markets/bitcoin-etf/spot-bitcoin-etf-onchain-flows https://www.theblock.co/data/crypto-markets/bitcoin-etf/spot-bitcoin-etf-on-chain-total-net-flows 18:21 All spot ETH ETF S-1 amendments are now in! https://x.com/NateGeraci/status/1804264951315403233 https://x.com/matthew_sigel/status/1805624888821989576 https://x.com/Matt_Hougan/status/1805941968838533534 21:20 Cooked Airdrops https://x.com/k1z4_/status/1804498112154620370 https://imgur.com/a/q7riQXD 27:41 Is Solana getting an ETF? https://x.com/matthew_sigel/status/1806313241431138434 https://x.com/JSeyff/status/1806322096924217412 https://x.com/JSeyff/status/1806324109045031034 https://x.com/EricBalchunas/status/1806319656694628659 https://x.com/JSeyff/status/1806330548887093414 https://x.com/jchervinsky/status/1806331553594675563 https://www.coingecko.com/en/coins/solana 32:10 Solana’s Blinks + ZK Compression https://x.com/solana/status/1805587979723063440 https://x.com/phantom/status/1805588661213220968 https://x.com/dabit3/status/1805955810800947472 https://x.com/0xCygaar/status/1804536674338357368 https://x.com/ufukaltinok/status/1804362153903681823 39:20 Blast launched their airdrop https://x.com/Blast_L2/status/1805630569830924310 https://www.coingecko.com/en/coins/blast https://x.com/blur_io/status/1805631184028024909 https://x.com/OlimpioCrypto/status/1805634498358366697 45:44 Ethereum execution client Reth was launched! https://x.com/gakonst/status/1805920383390154845 48:52 MiCA is about to enforce strict rules for stablecoins https://www.theblock.co/post/301989/eu-crypto-mica-stablecoin-disruption https://x.com/SethHertlein/status/1799102535459877201 52:15 Gary Continues Taking Ls https://x.com/MinarikLaw/status/1805715857030439306 https://x.com/EleanorTerrett/status/1806334142432293142 https://x.com/milesjennings/status/1806354239092080665 https://x.com/WatcherGuru/status/1806303516694122663 https://www.coindesk.com/policy/2024/06/27/coinbase-accuses-us-sec-fdic-of-improperly-blocking-document-requests/ 56:39 Winklevoss twins donated $2M in BTC to Trump’s campaign https://x.com/tyler/status/1803872859938549920 59:10 Raises and BVC Investments https://x.com/hotpot_dao/status/1806357081231909168 https://x.com/KAndrewHuang/status/1805632313759514783 1:01:47 Voting on Bankless Nation podcast suggestions starts today! https://www.jokerace.io/contest/base/0x0bac0ec9b6aeafa6c2212f67a67950940eda63a7 1:03:34 July schedule… https://lu.ma/k0amrrnz https://x.com/TrustlessState/status/1805381346510225776 1:04:58 Meme of the Week https://x.com/BitwiseInvest/status/1806326930477654147 1:05:43 Closing & Disclosures ------ Not financial or tax advice. See our investment disclosures here: https://www.bankless.com/disclosures

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Ryan Sean Adams?

  Solana, is Solana getting an ETF? What's going on here?

• 0:08Ryan Sean Adams?

  Bankless Nation, it is your last weekly rollup of June. Man, this month flew by fast. We got a lot to talk about, including it is the week before the Ethereum ETF, the products, at least according to your prediction, David.

• 0:21David Hoffman?

  My prediction and others, not just mine.

• 0:23Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah, and others, okay. Next week, we get to see if you're right. And like, we'll talk about that. I mean, we should talk about flows as well. Not only that, though, David, I feel like Solana is maybe trying to upstage the Ethereum ETF a little bit. This could be Solana week on Bankless.

• 0:39David Hoffman?

  Right, right where the ETF is about to get the spotlight. A surprise Solana ETF filing is filed by VanEck. Definitely not what people expected. And we'll talk about how likely or not likely that is going to get approved. But nonetheless, an S1 is getting filed.

• 0:56Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah, I don't know whether that's a trust or an ETF or what that actually means.

• 1:01David Hoffman?

  I'll tell you all about that.

• 1:03Ryan Sean Adams?

  They were also shipping some pretty big things over in the Solana land. ZK Compression, we'll talk about that. And these things called blinks, which are like links on Twitter. Also, Blast just dropped a token. We got to talk about that, including the price. I don't know about the price of the Blast token. That's been a topic of conversation.

• 1:19David Hoffman?

  And then over in the Ethereum land, we get our first Rust execution client. We'll talk about what RETH is and what it means for the Ethereum landscape. And lastly, what the hell is up with prices? They're down, but then they're up, but they're still down. We're going to talk about that. We're going to unpack that. And all the people who are selling Bitcoins, just like people finding Bitcoin, governments just finding Bitcoins just to dump them and a few other things as well. But I would like to see all of you listeners in Salt Lake City, the best city on Earth, October 9th through 11th, 2024.

• 1:51Ryan Sean Adams?

  Is it the best city on Earth?

• 1:52David Hoffman?

  Well, it's up for debate.

• 1:53Ryan Sean Adams?

  To say that. Well, for a few days, it would be the best city on Earth.

• 1:57David Hoffman?

  It'll be the best city on Earth because Chris Dixon, Sri Ram, Kioni from ONAD, Nick White from Celestia, Ellie from Starkware, Vance and Mike from Framework, Tom Emmer are going to be there. And of course, me and Ryan are going to be there as well as Mike and Polito. And Jason Yanowitz from Blockworks because we are throwing the Permissionless Conference. Best conference in America, 10% off if you want a ticket with Bankless 10, 30% off. If you are a Bankless citizen, you can get that link in the Discord. Or if your short notes is on your, on your cool little website. And yeah, this is gonna, this is gonna be really, really sick. We have a pretty chad lineup. Like Mike Novogratz is gonna be there. It's, it's very, very cool. October 9th through 11th. The Bloomberg, yeah, Bloomberg Boys. Yep, exactly. Basically, everyone, everyone is gonna be there. And like, why is everyone gonna be there?

• 2:41David Hoffman?

  Because between Bankless and Blockworks, the two media organizations who know how to coordinate and orchestrate content, know everyone in crypto and they're like, hey, you came onto my podcast, now go to my conference.

• 2:51Ryan Sean Adams?

  It's the three Bs. Bankless, Blockworks, bull market. That's what you need to know. Come to Salt Lake City. Price goes up every two weeks as well.

• 3:01David Hoffman?

  This, this happened last time and I'm sure a lot of you were like, I keep hearing how David and Ryan are telling me that the prices go up. And then you came because you bought a last minute ticket. You could just get ahead of that now.

• 3:11Ryan Sean Adams?

  Kind of like the price of crypto. All right. You don't want to wait too long. You gotta, you gotta buy when things are low because they have a tendency to go up and get way ahead of things. Speaking of that, let's talk about markets on the week. And thanks to our friends and sponsors over at Kraken for these beautiful charts.

• 3:27David Hoffman?

  Nah, they're ugly. Well, they're beautiful, but they're down.

• 3:30Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah, well, they're, they're, I guess we, we, we can only compliment them when they're up, David. Is that, you're just a fair weather friend to these charts. Well, I guess we're down then. You spoiled it. You spoiled the news here. How, how bad are we down?

• 3:43David Hoffman?

  Bitcoin down 5% at the week, currently at 61,800. It's coming up a little bit. We're doing a dead cat bounce thing, which could, could turn into a real bounce. Doing something similar. Mt. Gox, we talked about this in an episode, midweek episode, but if you didn't listen to that, Mt. Gox is finally ready to distribute the Bitcoin. We are finally going to remove this Mt. Gox cell pressure overhang FUD that has plagued the industry as long as I have been in crypto. So if you don't know.

• 4:11Ryan Sean Adams?

  Did you know Mt. Gox is not a real mountain?

• 4:14David Hoffman?

  I just learned this on, on your Twitter feed earlier this week. How dare they? It's not, not, if it was a real. Mountain, I would have loved to climb it, but no, it's not. Instead, it's just fun.

• 4:23Ryan Sean Adams?

  Why is it called Mount Gox?

• 4:24David Hoffman?

  Magic the Gathering Online Exchange. It used to be an online exchange for Magic the Gathering cards. And then Mark Carpelli's, who had that URL, who had that like infrastructure was like, well, now I like Bitcoins. So now I'm gonna let it trade Bitcoins.

• 4:36Ryan Sean Adams?

  So there was never really a mount to it, like the mount is just stands for magic.

• 4:41David Hoffman?

  Yeah, exactly.

• 4:41Ryan Sean Adams?

  Like MT Gox, MT Gox, really?

• 4:43David Hoffman?

  It was actually MTG:OX. Cause online exchange.

• 4:49Ryan Sean Adams?

  Not only not a mountain, it's just like not even named a mountain.

• 4:52David Hoffman?

  Right.

• 4:53Ryan Sean Adams?

  It's Magic the Gathering. Anyway.

• 4:55David Hoffman?

  This is exactly the information that people crave for us. Okay, it was founded in 2010. It suffered a security breach in 2014. People, like longtime Bitcoiners who were here before the Mount Gox hack, experienced the Mount Gox hack. It was like, oh, well, there goes the, and that's the end of Bitcoin. That was the end of that experiment. Bummer. Like Andreas Empenopoulos, like the OGs of OG Bitcoiners, like, well, like, that was fun, but oh, well. So loss of 850,000 Bitcoins, of which only 140,000 Bitcoins were recovered. 140,000 Bitcoins in 2014 is actually not like, it's not a low amount of money. Now it's a huge amount of money because Bitcoin has come up.

• 5:38Ryan Sean Adams?

  Wait, wait, wait, hold on, hold on. So a loss of 850K Bitcoin?

• 5:42David Hoffman?

  Yeah, to the Mount Gox attacker. Yep.

• 5:44Ryan Sean Adams?

  And then all of that went to the Mount Gox attacker. It was not recoverable. That's not what's in like bankruptcy. The 140,000 Bitcoins.

• 5:53David Hoffman?

  Yeah.

• 5:53Ryan Sean Adams?

  What happened to the 850K? I don't even remember my Bitcoin lore.

• 5:57David Hoffman?

  If you, if you know, you should tell me. If anyone knows where that Bitcoin went.

• 6:04Ryan Sean Adams?

  Michael Saylor's got some of it, maybe.

• 6:08David Hoffman?

  Okay, so 140,000 Bitcoins are going to be distributed. Not all of it all at once. And so there are 127,000 creditors of Mount Gox, which is pretty big. That's $9.4 billion in both Bitcoin and Bitcoin Cash, mostly Bitcoin. There are some like nuances, some like details about how it's getting released. It's not getting all released. All in one lump sum, like some fundsters would like to have you believe. But it is going to use the majority, bulk of it, a big chunk of it is getting distributed in early July, which is coming up next week and week after. People fear that that will be sell pressure because these people have been locked up since 2014. Like, surprise, surprise, Bitcoin's got up very big lead since 2014.

• 6:51David Hoffman?

  And so people think that like they're going to want to cash out on their gains. I think the answer is a lot more nuanced. You can listen to our episode about that. Claims on Mt. Gox have been a thing that you could have sold. And so it's not like sellers have been meaningfully locked up for a very long time. They could have sold their claims to Mt. Gox if they really wanted liquidity. And so claims have been like churned around. A lot of hedge funds have bought claims, like VC funds have bought claims because it's basically buying discounted Bitcoin. If you're a long-term holder, you might as well do it. I kind of think the sell pressure from this is overblown. It's kind of going to be cool to get like this Bitcoin kind of reintroduced into the supply. It's not necessarily bullish. Actually, it's just not bullish. It is bearish in the sense that like there can only be sell pressure from this.

• 7:33David Hoffman?

  I just think the market might have already like priced in too much sell pressure versus what's actually coming.

• 7:39Ryan Sean Adams?

  On Monday, we had, see this candle on the chart, we had 8% down on Monday, right? And that was the market reacting to this, this news and but we're down 5%.

• 7:46David Hoffman?

  Or people front-running the news is also a conspiracy.

• 7:48Ryan Sean Adams?

  We're down 5% on the week. I guess that feels about right to me, though.

• 7:51David Hoffman?

  Sure.

• 7:52Ryan Sean Adams?

  Like 5% is not crazy. I mean, that does, and like just to give you some benchmarks here.

• 7:58Ryan Sean Adams?

  We're talking about 142,000 Bitcoin. Just some context here, since the beginning of the opening of the Bitcoin ETF, BlackRock has acquired two Mt. Gox worth of Bitcoins, about 300,000 Bitcoin. So that's what we're talking about here. There is some sell pressure, right? Even if you take the full amount, I know you're talking about creditors and that sort of thing, but like even if you took the full amount, I mean, the Bitcoin ETF more than pays for it, right? This is kind of like a few months of Michael Saylor dollar cost averaging in. I mean, like, can get us close to that. So it's not all that much, I guess, in the scheme of things.

• 8:39David Hoffman?

  I will also say, it is more bearish Bitcoin and bullish the rest of the market, because these Bitcoins were lost in 2014. You know what didn't exist in 2014? Ethereum, Solana, like most relevant altcoins.

• 8:53Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah.

• 8:53David Hoffman?

  And so like if any of these Bitcoin holders have like become not like Bitcoiners, they could be selling their Bitcoins for like other tokens.

• 9:02Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah. So, market doesn't like selling.

• 9:04David Hoffman?

  Or dollars, or USDC, is also another token.

• 9:07Ryan Sean Adams?

  Gox is not the only thing dumping on us too. The German government is dumping on us too. So every, every week, like we see from a government address that like Germany owns, they're, they're selling Bitcoin. And they acquired about $3 billion worth of Bitcoin in like seizures from various like kind of nefarious legal exchanges and that sort of things. They're just selling it. They're not, they're not holding it. And this is actually another fun fact. It's not just the government of Germany, but yesterday came out that the US government is selling some of its Bitcoin. It just sold, here's a tweet.

• 9:39David Hoffman?

  Also from criminals.

• 9:40Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah. 240 million worth of Bitcoin to Coinbase Prime. So they are dollar cost averaging out with the seized Bitcoin they're selling it. But here's a fun fact for you. This comes out on Friday. So David, this is a Friday fun fact. You ready for this?

• 9:54David Hoffman?

  Uh huh.

• 9:54Ryan Sean Adams?

  Okay. So the fun fact is, the US government owns the most Bitcoin of any other nation-state. So owns about 214 Bitcoins. That's like 1.5x amount Gox worth of Bitcoins right now. And that's the largest by far. So that's the first fun fact. The second is, that's still less than Michael Saylor owes.

• 10:15David Hoffman?

  Not by a lot, actually. Michael Saylor owns 226,000 Bitcoins and the US government has 214,000 Bitcoins. I know it's like too complicated to do the inter-agency stuff like this for the government.

• 10:26Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah.

• 10:27David Hoffman?

  But they should just transfer it to the Federal Reserve.

• 10:30Ryan Sean Adams?

  Back the dollar?

• 10:30David Hoffman?

  Just why do they have to sell it? Just put it in the bank?

• 10:33Ryan Sean Adams?

  I don't know, but does this gift? Like, that feels like a nasty precedent. All right, so US government goes and seizes this criminal assets? And then you just put it on their balance sheet? I don't know, there's something kinda...

• 10:45David Hoffman?

  Well, they're selling, they're pocketing cash either way. It's not like where are the dollars going? It's not like they're donating it to charity.

• 10:51Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah, that's true. Where are the dollars going? When they seize, when they seize property like this is quite, quite the gain. It was quite the incentive to go seize Bitcoins.

• 10:59David Hoffman?

  13 billion dollars.

• 11:00Ryan Sean Adams?

  Huh, yeah, gotta find something wrong with the bankless podcast guys and go like seize some assets, huh?

• 11:07David Hoffman?

  No, it's not giving me any ideas. All right, moving on to Ether. Ether starting the week at $3,500, down 2% on the week to where it is now $3,460 at the time of recording. So, down just a little bit. Uh, but ETH tailwinds in the second half of the year from Matt Hogan. I would like to tell you about them. Uh, this is a list of all the reasons why you can be bullish ETH. And of course, we put it in the roll up. Uh, significant new demand pending the ETH ETF approval, which we know is coming. We think it's coming next week. Uh, constrained supply, that's the ultrasound money meme. Uh, improved regulatory clarity. I think that's bullish for the entire market, but especially for Ether after the SEC dropped its consensus lawsuit. But I would also say that's like equally bullish, any other token that was at risk of becoming a security like Solana,

• 11:51David Hoffman?

  like anything else that's like a centrally issued smart contract platform. Uh, so that's like bullish for the entire market. Um, and then significant improved UX, thank you, base institutional adoption, BlackRock. Uh, and then also cycle timing, macro conditions and the election. So, Matt just kinda like listing out all the reasons to be bullish, which I appreciate that in these trying times.

• 12:10Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah, I mean, I feel like I need that hopium on the week. Cause like we were making the comment that sentiment has switched very bearish, right? Right? Not, not on bankless, okay? We're still bullish. So, uh, inject this hopium right in your veins.

• 12:22David Hoffman?

  I've never been bearish once.

• 12:24Ryan Sean Adams?

  You've never, yeah, you have. You've been bearish.

• 12:26David Hoffman?

  No, I haven't.

• 12:27Ryan Sean Adams?

  Not this year, in previous years. Okay. Uh, how about the global crypto market cap? We're at 2.14. How are you feeling about this?

• 12:36David Hoffman?

  2.41, nice try, that's why I do it.

• 12:37Ryan Sean Adams?

  Come on.

• 12:40Ryan Sean Adams?

  A decimal place. I'm gonna find another decimal place and correct you. Okay, so here's kind of a comment. Just like zoom out a little bit. This is Eric dot Eve saying, "You could have walked away 16 weeks ago and ETH and Bitcoin would be the same price. You're only missing a boring plus 15% and negative 15% range. Quit overreacting. What is this market? This is a sideways cool off. Just hold and chill." People panicking. Like a lot of market sentiment.

• 13:11David Hoffman?

  And interweek emotions are just never worthwhile to listen to.

• 13:14Ryan Sean Adams?

  We are in a plus 15, minus 15% band. It's like not the end of the world. Like, I mean, look at this chart.

• 13:20David Hoffman?

  It's like the third ending stretch of the bull market.

• 13:23Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah, like, okay, so like, I mean, like, let's look at this bull cycle from, I guess, a, you know, total crypto market cap perspective. This is what you asked for, David. This is like the stair step up and then kind of a pause and then another hopefully stair step up and then maybe a pause. Like, it's nice and gradual. Remember, we did this whole roll up where you're playing like slow and steady type of, you know, like wishing your desires in the market. You're getting your wish.

• 13:50David Hoffman?

  That's exactly right. Yeah. Honestly, like, I'm starting to get ready to call the four-year cycle is dead. We need to like crab for longer and maybe we won't do that if the ETF is as like good as I want it to be.

• 14:01Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah.

• 14:01David Hoffman?

  But like, I think it would be great if the four-year cycles just went away. They have to go away because that's just a complete anomaly. Like, that's appropriate for when things are young and market caps are low. But if we want like, if we want like all the tokenized stocks on Ethereum and all like all these, you want crypto to take over the world, you can't have four-year cycles. It has to, it has to like smooth out over time. And so if this is what we're getting is smoothing out and eliminating of the four-year cycles, that's great. That's fantastic.

• 14:28Ryan Sean Adams?

  I'm still a subscriber to the four-year cycle belief, but I will say, I think we will stair step to the four-year cycle. I think that's a possibility all the way to stair step to 10 trillion. That sounds good to me.

• 14:39David Hoffman?

  Okay, well, where's the next stair, Mr. Stairstep?

• 14:42Ryan Sean Adams?

  After the summer, September, late August, September.

• 14:45David Hoffman?

  How trillion? How many trillions?

• 14:47Ryan Sean Adams?

  How many trillions? You want me to like actually predict every single stair step?

• 14:50David Hoffman?

  Yeah.

• 14:51Ryan Sean Adams?

  Actually, I think what'll happen is, to be honest, I don't think it'll stair step.

• 14:57Ryan Sean Adams?

  Now that you called me out.

• 14:58David Hoffman?

  From 2.5 to 10?

• 15:00Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah, it's been stair stepping right now.

• 15:01David Hoffman?

  We're taking like four steps.

• 15:02Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah, like it's stair stepping because it's just crypto natives, right? And I still think that we'll get to some euphoria. It won't be as extreme as previous euphoria. What just what I like about this setup and why I think Eric's right is because in despite like the sentiment on crypto Twitter, right? Builders are continuing to build like there's so much going on and it's just like nice to just let that set in. So, uh, and then like get real retail interested when we have like the, the stuff fully built. Uh, speaking of that, this is a quick L2 update brought to you by our friends over at Mantle. It was actually rollup.wtf. This is a cool chart of like TPS in real time, right? Like updates every like, I don't know, microseconds, some kind of a microsecond.

• 15:44David Hoffman?

  Really fast, really fast.

• 15:45Ryan Sean Adams?

  For Ethereum. And we're at like, right now, we're at about 307, 305, 286. Yeah, it adjusts as I'm speaking. TPS, transactions per second. It's a measure of mega gas as well. It's just a measure of total transactions per second across the Ethereum ecosystem. And it like updates all of this across all rollups in real time. And I just love it. Like I sat here when I.

• 16:08David Hoffman?

  It's so cool.

• 16:08Ryan Sean Adams?

  I, I stared at this for like a good 90 seconds, probably an embarrassing like, like long time.

• 16:14David Hoffman?

  Just like transfixed.

• 16:16Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah, just transfixed.

• 16:17David Hoffman?

  It's pretty cool just to see all the rollup activity happening in one place. You can see, you can see Ethereum like flex up and down. It's going to be really cool when we have some like gas intensive day where like prices are super volatile. Either we're going up a lot, we're going down a lot. People are getting liquidated or whatever. I want to see like the activity on that day because like this, this is like watching the pulse of Ethereum. Like I'm watching a circulation system happening right now. And I'm watching like, cause like TPS can flex up, MGAS, milligas can, can flex up. And so I remember watching like being like in my young neophyte days of Ethereum and be like, oh, like gas is up today, gas is down today. That's so cool that you can watch gas go up and down. But yeah, now we have TPS, milligas, kilobytes a second. We can watch all of these different metrics. Like you can watch the internet of value like flex and change.

• 17:02Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah, like it's like a living organism almost, right? That's why it's so fascinating. And, and imagine this chart, David, or imagine this, the screen when you have like thousands of different rollups, right? And you have like. Thousands of TPS and then tens of thousands of TPS and the spikes are that high. Like it feels like the birth of something new. That's anyway, I don't know if bankless listeners will spend 90 seconds thinking about it, but

• 17:24David Hoffman?

  They should do more.

• 17:25Ryan Sean Adams?

  They should. They should. David, give us an ETF update. Let's start with Bitcoin and then we'll get to Ethereum.

• 17:31David Hoffman?

  Spot Bitcoin ETF flows are not changing. They're still flat. There's no update. We had a spiky update in the beginning of June. Towards the end of June, it's kind of just been very slowly leaking outflows. We had a kind of a negative day where we lost 4.5,000 Bitcoins in the ETFs. Yesterday was a positive day, but we are just not, not doing anything really. It's not going up, it's not going down.

• 17:56Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yesterday was the first positive day in a week, right? Because we had like a week of negative days.

• 18:00David Hoffman?

  Yeah, it's the first positive day in, since the 13th. But like all the negative days haven't been like big.

• 18:06Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah.

• 18:06David Hoffman?

  Except for, except for the 25th. The 25th was, was pretty big. That was the negative 4.5,000 day. Today, so far, we are up 700 Bitcoins.

• 18:15Ryan Sean Adams?

  Well, let's talk about the new kid on the block that's about to enter. Maybe next week. I'm sure we'll have some podcasts about this if it happens next week. So give us a status on the Ethereum ETF filings.

• 18:29David Hoffman?

  Right now, we are entering the fee war era of the ETF S1 amendments. And so all of these different S1 filers are jostling for fees. So far, the fees of the ETH ETFs that we know of, Franklin Templeton coming in at point 1.9%. I believe that's 19 bips. VanEck's got 20%. I believe that's 20 bips. But I think VanEck is going to come in feeless for a really long time. They, this is what Matthew Siegel says, VanEck to waive fee initially on spot Ethereum ETFs. He doesn't give a time. I would imagine maybe up to six months for zero fees. And then a take from Nate Drossi, who says, for the record, I expect a grayscale to meaningfully undercut

• 19:12David Hoffman?

  everyone on fees with the ETH Mini Trust, which is what they're doing with it, with the Bitcoin Mini Trust, trying to reserve, trying to hold on to the ETH in their, in the grayscale trust.

• 19:21Ryan Sean Adams?

  Cause they'll be bleeding from the

• 19:22David Hoffman?

  Because they'll be bleeding. Unless, yeah, they'll be, well, they want to bleed from their trust that has like 2.5% fees. And they want to bleed it into their mini trust, which will have something very low.

• 19:34Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah. And this is the other take on, on timing. All spot ETH ETF S1 amendments are in, they're in. And it seemed like over the last couple of weeks, there's like some mild corrections, but like not that much. So it feels like the setup may be before the product release.

• 19:49David Hoffman?

  Right. And even Garen Gensler this week made a comment saying like the ETH ETF process is going smoothly. Which was like the weirdest thing to hear out of Gary Gensler. I'm just like, was that, do I align with that statement?

• 20:02Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah. Yeah. And by the way, the issues are Bitwise, Fidelity, 21 shares, which is like ARK Invest plus 21 shares. Grayscale, of course, Franklin Templeton, VanEck, iShares. iShares is, is BlackRock, yes?

• 20:16David Hoffman?

  Yes, that's correct.

• 20:17Ryan Sean Adams?

  And Invesco. So some biggies there. All right. Let's talk about flows. So Matt Hogan from Bitwise, Put Together and Analysis. I, I think we'll do an entire episode on this because there are some people that are doubting the Ethereum ETF inflows. And some people who are very bearish, like I, I saw some estimates of just like a billion dollars.

• 20:36David Hoffman?

  Half a billion dollars of demand for the ETH ETF.

• 20:38Ryan Sean Adams?

  Not very much. What does Matt Hogan say? What's his estimate?

• 20:42David Hoffman?

  Matt Hogan's estimate, and this has been corroborated by other people that I know are in the know. He says, "The Ethereum exchange traded products will attract $15 billion in net flows in their first 18 months." So a little bit less than 1 billion a month. And then he gives out a big thread as to how he got to that estimate. And that, this whole thread, which I don't have enough time to go through, is linked in the show notes. But the TLDR is about a billion dollars a month coming up to 18 months, which is pretty strong.

• 21:11Ryan Sean Adams?

  That'd be nice. That'd be, that's a lot. David, one other thing in the market section before we move on to other things is airdrops. So over the weekend, you sent me this tweet. I was like not paying attention to.

• 21:24David Hoffman?

  This tweet kind of like made my blood boil.

• 21:25Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah. And you were like, oh man, this, I forget what you said, like, look at this asshole or something.

• 21:30David Hoffman?

  I, I think I said like, fuck this guy.

• 21:33Ryan Sean Adams?

  Okay, who is this? What are we looking at?

• 21:35David Hoffman?

  I don't know. It's some loser.

• 21:37Ryan Sean Adams?

  And on account.

• 21:38David Hoffman?

  Hey, ZKSync, and on account. Hey, it's Hags ZKSync. Just want to let you know that I finally finished transferring the tokens from my 350 wallets, averaging 18,800 ZK tokens per wallet. Shame, I didn't have enough money to buy a Lambo and a decent villa in Beverly Hills. I expected a lot more. You failed. This is a guy just flexing that he farmed the ZKSync airdrop with 350 wallets.

• 21:58Ryan Sean Adams?

  A screenshot too, right?

• 21:59David Hoffman?

  And screenshot, yeah. Yeah, I guess there's no actual proof here. But like, we know that there are accounts like this. And like, the audacity just to go on Twitter and like brag about it. I mean, there's no cost to doing so, other than people like me thinking you're an asshole.

• 22:14Ryan Sean Adams?

  Well, yeah, actually, I think there's more too, to substantiate this. Like, he goes through the detailed process of like how he... Yeah, like, I saw some of the details. He was talking about like, the complicated way he sort of made his footprint on-chain look like a real human, and like the extent, like the lengths he took to do this. It was so fairly sophisticated, and made like 1.1 million.

• 22:36David Hoffman?

  1.1 million dollars. Yeah, so if that was like your full-time job for the like 18 months of time that ZKSync Era has been up and running, like 1.1 million dollars over 18 months? Like, that's a payday.

• 22:46Ryan Sean Adams?

  It's just like, hey, look, I ruined this for everyone. Cool. I mean, this is a take that we had, I don't know, 6 weeks ago. This cycle is cooked. There's a podcast episode about this. We were mainly talking about airdrops. And like, if it was cooked then, right now, it is like charred. It is like, you left the meat on the grill, like overnight.

• 23:06David Hoffman?

  Overnight, yeah.

• 23:07Ryan Sean Adams?

  And it's like burnt, is just black, it is charred. To me, this is kind of like the end of the last airdrop meta. Do you agree with this?

• 23:16David Hoffman?

  Yeah. Yeah, I mean, there are still gonna be some airdrops, because people made the choice to do that like many, many months ago. And so they're just gonna have, that momentum is gonna carry them forward. But new companies who are starting to think about this now are not thinking about airdrops. They're thinking about a different distribution mechanism.

• 23:31Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah, they have to think about it in a different way. It has to be more civil-resistant, maybe slower easing into the drop, like maybe some sort of making, like, putting in steps to quest for the community to earn it. Something like that has to like take over here. Because it seems like, right now, the surest way to get even crypto Twitter to hate you is to drop a token.

• 23:48David Hoffman?

  Yeah. Even this guy was like, he's clearly who got paid by ZK Inc. the most.

• 23:56Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah.

• 23:56David Hoffman?

  Is still calling ZK Inc. chumps.

• 23:58Ryan Sean Adams?

  He's like, hey, morons. I scam from you.

• 24:01David Hoffman?

  Yeah, exactly.

• 24:02Ryan Sean Adams?

  Speaking of airdrops, David, you gotta give me an update on the BLAST token, which just dropped last week. And like, seriously, we gotta talk about price because that's been interesting as well. Also, Solana, is Solana getting an ETF? We didn't mention it when we were talking about Bitcoin and Ethereum, but like, what's going on here?

• 24:20David Hoffman?

  It's getting a filing.

• 24:21Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah, so we'll talk about all that and more, but before we do, we want to thank the sponsors that made this possible, including our recommended crypto exchange, Kraken. Go create an account.

• 24:31David Hoffman?

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• 25:16David Hoffman?

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• 26:00David Hoffman?

  With testnet arriving as early as summer 2024. With a Cello Layer 2, gas fees will stay low and users can even pay for gas using ERC20 tokens, including native USDC and USDT, sending crypto to phone numbers across wallets using social connect. But Cello is a community governed protocol. Make your vorus heard in the Cello forum to shape the future of Ethereum. Follow @Cello on Twitter and explore the ecosystem built for the real world on cello.org/Quest. Are you worried about the security of your cross-chain transactions? Cross-chains with confidence using Transporter, the revolutionary token bridging app designed to give you peace of mind. Powered by Chainlink CCIP, Transporter is your trusted gateway for securely moving assets like ETH, native USDC, and Lync and so many more across some of your favorite blockchains.

• 26:42David Hoffman?

  Over $2.8 billion has been hacked from token bridges to date. Transporter puts a stop to this by ensuring your transfers are protected by the most robust security features available. Chainlink CCIP provides Level 5 security backed by multiple decentralized oracle networks and an independent risk management network. Transporter also provides real-time tracking throughout your transaction with its newly engineered user experience, so you'll never have to second guess the safety or location of your assets ever again. And the best part, Transporter makes it simple. Whether you're a blockchain beginner or a seasoned trader, Transporter's intuitive interface lets you execute cross-chain transactions with just a few clicks. No additional fees, just a low cost for using CCIP which can be paid in Lync or your blockchain's native gas token.

• 27:25David Hoffman?

  But don't just take my word for it, see for yourself why Transporter offers a stress-free bridging experience. Experience the future of token bridging at transporter.io and just send it. Breaking tweet this morning, Thursday morning, from Matthew Siegel, who's the head of digital assets at VanX, saying, "I'm excited to announce that VanX has just filed for the first Solana Exchange-Traded Fund ETF in the United States," and then goes through some of his thought process to why they wanted to file this thing. This kind of like come, came as a shock because we have been told many, many times that the process for getting an ETF, a crypto ETF, is first you get a futures ETF in order to get price discovery, like price discovery happening on the futures ETF, and then have spot to futures correlation be proved.

• 28:10David Hoffman?

  Once it's approved, then you can legitimately go to the SEC and get your ETF. That has been the hurdle that the Gensler administration has said exists. And that's why we, the industry has been like, well, there's no new ETFs coming for a long time, because you first need years of just price on a futures ETF first. Nonetheless, they have filed this S1, which is an application for a Solana ETF, which is the first part of the process. James Safer here says, "Early thoughts are that this only has a shot to launch sometime in 2025. If we have a new administration in the White House and the SEC, even then, it's not guaranteed."

• 28:52David Hoffman?

  And so I think James is saying, "Maybe in 2025, if Trump gets elected and also replaces the SEC with pro crypto people, then we can be kind of optimistic about this ETF." He also continues and says, "There's no deadline yet for this ETF, because this filing is just an S1 at the moment. I don't see a 19B4 filing yet, which would give us an idea of timing, deadline timing. If they were to file a 19B4 today, the deadline would be sometime around mid-March 2025." Eric Balatruna says, "The knee-jerk reaction here to this is, oh, this will never be approved, because there aren't Solana futures." I agree, but if changed at the President of the United States, I think anything is possible. Just imagine Heser Purce or someone like that running the SEC.

• 29:36David Hoffman?

  So Heser Purce won't be running the SEC. She just wants to move on, this is known. So it would have to be someone else running the SEC. But nonetheless, it's a shot on goal. It's an attempt to get a Solana ETF. Overall, Solana is up 7% on the news today.

• 29:53Ryan Sean Adams?

  I mean, I think those takes are right. I mean, there is some conceivable way this could happen if you had like a Trump presidency, let's say, and he followed through on this promise to like dismantle the anti-crypto army, and he gets Gensler out in some way and like brings in someone who is a super crypto favorable, and they just start stamping things, like doing favors basically for the crypto industry. So you could see it happen in that way. And it is possible to bypass the... Like commodities, CME traded ETF first, right?

• 30:24David Hoffman?

  If that's a matter of policy by the SEC. The current SEC policy is that, no, you can't do that. But that's a matter of policy that could be changed.

• 30:32Ryan Sean Adams?

  One question I had for you, though, when I first saw this, I was like, oh, this is a, this isn't an ETF filing. This is a trust, like Grayscale has a Solana trust in the same way they have Ethereum trust. And they had a Bitcoin trust, they have Ethereum classic, they have trusts for like a lot of different assets, even DeFi assets, right? And I thought it was that, is it that? Is this a trust?

• 30:52David Hoffman?

  It's not that, it's not that. I asked about like, what, what the hell is this trust word doing in here then? And apparently it's just like a technical detail. You're safe to ignore the fact that that trust is here. It is the same exact structure as the ETH and Bitcoins ETFs.

• 31:05Ryan Sean Adams?

  Last take on this for me is just, I think this is partially a symptom of all the competitors. You know, we read all the competitors out, like Franklin Templeton, Fidelity, BlackRock, Fanac, all of them. They're now in this race to get ahead of one another in terms of marketing. So like, this is Fanac saying, oh, me first, I'm doing this first, right? So it's kind of like healthy competition. It's healthy competition and I think it'll, it'll push ETFs forward as well.

• 31:29David Hoffman?

  I think really this is kind of like opening up the war of like the many versus few ETFs. Like, will BlackRock ever issue a Dogecoin ETF? Like, no, they probably, they probably will not do that.

• 31:42Ryan Sean Adams?

  You think so?

• 31:42David Hoffman?

  They probably won't do that.

• 31:43Ryan Sean Adams?

  I can't even say that now at this point.

• 31:44David Hoffman?

  But like, Fanac will probably do a Dogecoin ETF. And so there's gonna be some issue where it's like, yeah, we're just gonna ETF everything. And then there's gonna be some issues where like, I'm, I'm not gonna play in that game. Yeah. And so I think this is Fanac saying like, yeah, we're, we're gonna, we're gonna ETF this shit. Like, you guys like tokenization? No, we're, we're gonna ETF these things.

• 32:00Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah.

• 32:00David Hoffman?

  Securitize is that word.

• 32:04Ryan Sean Adams?

  All right, I said it was Solana week in the intro, David. It is, we got some more stuff on Solana. So, uh, blinks and ZK compression. These are two things hitting the Solana ecosystem. Can you first start with blinks? Explain this, what are blinks, David?

• 32:18David Hoffman?

  Blinks, blockchain links. Put that together, you get a blink. This is something that was introduced into the Solana world. This is kind of like, if your frame of mind starts with a Farcaster frame, that's the, the place to start. Start it is an embedded. It's a link. It's a that's an embedded link that you can, you know, paste over the internet that will allow action aware clients, which is like your browser extension, like a phantom, for example, or anything who is like integrated with this to display additional capabilities for your user. So on a website, a blink might immediately trigger a transaction preview in a wallet so that you like, don't have to go to your app that would be on Solana. So you don't have to open up Jupiter, but a Jupiter blink

• 33:00David Hoffman?

  inside of a tweet would make a little frame that shows Jupiter and maybe some token that you might want to buy or something, or some like Solana NFT. And so the idea is it just pushes the ability to interact with Solana to like web to like websites, just via a URL. And so just want to emphasize, you need to have an extension that opens up this portal to Solana. And so phantom is one of these things. They are integrating this. And so if you have phantom on your browser, in your browser, and then you have a blink and a tweet, then this frame will show up inside of Twitter, which will let you do something. It's pretty cool.

• 33:38Ryan Sean Adams?

  I think this is really cool. And a big fan of the frames functionality in Farcaster. And I wonder if this functionality is just basically borrowed that idea and just like brought it to other places. This is basically how it looks. So if you're writing a tweet, and you format the tweet in kind of a certain way that conforms to kind of the blink standard, then it can be expanded into like, just kind of a mini embedded app inside Twitter for those that have the wallet extension that is required and also the functionality turned on. So here's how it looks in like phantom. You go into phantom, and you enable Solana actions on X.com. So it's not all websites, but right now it's on X.com. Of course, like, these things can be risky in the same way they are.

• 34:21David Hoffman?

  I'm going to be asking for some transaction simulation to come alongside with this. I would like to know exactly what I'm signing first.

• 34:28Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah, and that's very important. This is important on Farcaster as well. But this is just a great place to get like crypto native money verbs out there, basically like, you know, pay, mint, claim, all of these different money verbs that we've created embedded inside of web two experiences. So it's a it's a cool move. I do think that Ethereum layer twos will be moving on this too. And they should be moving. Now, now it's Ethereum layer two's, you know, a chance to go copy something from Solana.

• 34:59Ryan Sean Adams?

  I'm sure Base is looking at this right now, like OPStack, Arbitrum, they're all looking at this and then be like, hey, this is pretty cool. And like, well, well done to Solana for pushing the envelope on user experience.

• 35:10David Hoffman?

  Here's a take out of Nader Dabbat, who says, "Having built many far caster frames, I've also checked out Solana Blinks and see a lot of similarities, but Blinks meets users where they already are, which is potentially much more powerful and viral. This is an example of an ecosystem coming up with a great idea that will also benefit everyone outside of that ecosystem. I'm sure, I'm excited to see more chains support this in the future." Yeah, so it's really like a primitive, that like many, like, the reason why I like this is that it's the opposite of like whatever Chaney is. Like, you're not exposed to Chaney-ness, you're exposed to Twitter, and then like Solana is like happening in the background.

• 35:45Ryan Sean Adams?

  Oh, you mean the blockchain is abstracted, basically.

• 35:48David Hoffman?

  Exactly, yeah, abstraction, yeah, I like, I like, I'm trying to make my Chaney word happen.

• 35:52Ryan Sean Adams?

  I get it.

• 35:52David Hoffman?

  We're making, we're making things less Chaney.

• 35:54Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah.

• 35:54David Hoffman?

  And like having like financial actions inside of, like via some client that's aware, inside of your Twitter, inside of your tweets, that's very not Chaney.

• 36:03Ryan Sean Adams?

  It's not Chaney, it's more powerful, it's potentially more viral, right? It's how we start onboarding more people. Not the only release coming out of Solana that was notable this week, also this, ZK Compression. Can you explain this one to me?

• 36:15David Hoffman?

  ZK Compression, this is a collaboration between two different Solana ecosystem companies, Light Protocol and Helios Labs. Helios is a RPC provider. ZK Compression allows Solana state to scale. We all know what ZK Compression does, like start with a ZK rollup as your mental model. But the idea is you compress a lot of Solana activity, a lot of bundles, and you only post the proof in Solana active state. And so this is kind of similar to how ZK rollups on Ethereum would post proofs to call data before Ethereum had blobs. Solana has active state and it also has inactive state. And Solana charges rent on the amount of data posted to active state, I believe.

• 36:56David Hoffman?

  And so if you make, if you do a lot of transactions, you bundle them up and then post the data, which is the big expensive part, into inactive state. And then you just post the proof to active state, you can get a cost efficient. That's improved by up to 162,500 times, which is a lot. And so it's somewhere, it's not exactly, it's not a layer two, because there's not an off, there's not an off-layer-one blockchain that holds state on its own. All of the data is held in the Solana Layer One. It's not exactly not a layer two, because it is like off-chain compute using ZK compression. It's somewhere between a mix of a layer two and like a stateless client.

• 37:34Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah, almost. I also think about a coprocessor is maybe

• 37:37David Hoffman?

  Coprocessor is like adjacent to it.

• 37:39Ryan Sean Adams?

  Is also adjacent to this. And the net of it is, it's basically Solana using ZK technology to support more throughput and at lower fees, which is very cool and pretty impressive. Now, I still have some questions on this. I want to do a deep dive, but here's a conclusion tweet from from Saagar. Number one, account data is mostly stored off-chain. Something I'm not sure about and find out more about that.

• 38:03David Hoffman?

  My rule of thumb for a layer two is if there is data that you need to reconstruct the state, to have like full trustlessness, full banklessness, and the data isn't on the layer one and it's held somewhere else. That's a layer two.

• 38:16Ryan Sean Adams?

  It's a layer two. You're coming down on this argument, huh?

• 38:19David Hoffman?

  Yeah, I mean, if there's data that's stored that you need to process this in order to make this work and that store isn't stored on Solana, then it's stored somewhere else. And whatever that somewhere else is, is a layer two.

• 38:30Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah, all right.

• 38:31David Hoffman?

  It's a veridium.

• 38:32Ryan Sean Adams?

  This is a semantics debate. Is this kind of a taxonomy nomenclature type debate? This is this is a debate that was being held on crypto. Like, is this a rollup? Maybe. It depends on what your definition of what a rollup is.

• 38:43David Hoffman?

  Rollup, but if there's something off-chain, it's a layer two.

• 38:47Ryan Sean Adams?

  All right. Well, David, you might like this meme. We've renamed rollups to ZK compression so that our marketing team doesn't have to delete old tweets. Making fun of, I think, Solana's reluctance to say layer two or rollup.

• 38:59David Hoffman?

  And totally will never, will never say layer twos.

• 39:01Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah, I don't know. I don't know. What's a layer two anyway is kind of a question. I do want to dive further into what the limitations of the system might be as well because you know, like that's unclear to me. So more to discover here, but still a really cool ship by Solana.

• 39:15David Hoffman?

  All right, last up for the big news of the week. Blast finally launched their airdrop. The Blast token is out and about in the wild. 17% was dropped to two different categories of people, split 50/50 down the middle. Points holders and gold holders. Gold was one of the like growth campaigns out of Blast. Coming in at a whopping $2 billion in fully diluted valuation, which is a 1:1 ratio of its $2 billion of TVL, which is actually like kind of meaningfully lower than what other layer twos are being valued at. $2.3 billion valuations, excuse me. 50% of the total distribution will go to quote unquote "the community", that is like incentives that will get like spun out over time. That's also probably some sort of like DAO, community run DAO.

• 39:59David Hoffman?

  25.5% to the core team, 16.5% to investors and 8% to a foundation. Also Blur, which was Pac-Man's first project, was also allocated 3% to Blast, who they say will go to Blur traders and Blur holders in season 3, and even more in season 4 as well. A take out of Olympio here says airdrop quota 17% is far above the standards, and that looks very good, but these vesting mechanics, although good for the chain to keep usage in TVL, are detrimental to top users who are the most responsible for the TVL used to boast metrics and receive funding, AKA, this is an important part of this. For the top 1,000 wallets that received the airdrops, the top 1,000 airdrop recipients who got the most, they are locked up.

• 40:43Ryan Sean Adams?

  Oh, really?

• 40:44David Hoffman?

  They are vesting. They are vesting. And so there's like a friction here that Olympio is citing. It's like, well, these are your most committed loyal people who really boosted your metrics the most, and you locked them up.

• 40:54Ryan Sean Adams?

  Well, if they're loyal, then do they have a problem with being locked up?

• 40:57David Hoffman?

  Maybe. Maybe. I don't know.

• 41:00Ryan Sean Adams?

  Then why not be so loyal?

• 41:02David Hoffman?

  You have 30 days to claim. That's actually a relatively short claiming window. There, you can definitely use bankless claimables. Don't click any scary links. That's why we have bankless claimables. There is a link in the show notes.

• 41:14Ryan Sean Adams?

  Can I ask you a question, David?

• 41:15David Hoffman?

  Sure.

• 41:16Ryan Sean Adams?

  Knowing that TVL was about 2 billion on blast, it was like one of the top 5, at least, Layer 2s. I don't know where it sits right now. I could go check that, but it's like a big Layer 2.

• 41:29Ryan Sean Adams?

  What did you expect the fully diluted valuation to actually be?

• 41:34David Hoffman?

  I would say 2 billion is lower than my expectations. Knowing that Arbitrum and Optimism are coming in at $8 billion, though, like, it's not that much lower. Like, 3 billion, maybe, but like, we're in the ballpark.

• 41:48Ryan Sean Adams?

  It's all surprising, actually.

• 41:49David Hoffman?

  We're not doing, like, big valuations this year.

• 41:52Ryan Sean Adams?

  Not for Layer 2s in particular, right? So like, 2 billion DVL and 2 billion FTV? Wow, that's low. Even like, last week, we were talking about ZK Sync coming in at, like, what is it, 4 billion? FTV?

• 42:04David Hoffman?

  Yeah.

• 42:05Ryan Sean Adams?

  I mean, not big for these Layer 2s right now.

• 42:08David Hoffman?

  Not massive, yeah. But like, honestly, like, a lot of, like, TVL, like, or, excuse me, a lot of valuations have always been inflated in crypto, so I don't mind that we're, like, doing less of that.

• 42:17Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah.

• 42:18David Hoffman?

  Yeah, exactly. Like, yeah, we're not, we're not... Yeah, we're starting low. Start low, go high.

• 42:23Ryan Sean Adams?

  I promise it's not cope, guys. I promise it's not cope.

• 42:27David Hoffman?

  All right, coming up next, we're gonna talk about Reth. Reth Client 1.0 and this new client, this new highly optimized Ethereum client going live. We'll talk about what that means for the Ethereum landscape. Ryan is gonna talk to us about Mica while I scroll my phone.

• 42:42Ryan Sean Adams?

  Mica's important!

• 42:45David Hoffman?

  And Gary Gensler takes 3 Ls? 3 Ls? 2 Ls? Did Gary Gensler take some Ls?

• 42:50Ryan Sean Adams?

  Not enough.

• 42:50David Hoffman?

  We'll count them when we get there. Not enough, yeah. But first, I'm gonna talk about some sponsors that make this show possible, especially Mantle, a Layer 2 with plenty of yield and dApps. So go check out the link in the show notes to get started with Mantle. Let's go hear from them right now. New projects are coming online to the Mantle Layer 2 every single week. Why is this happening? Maybe it's because Mantle- Has been on the frontier of Layer 2 design architecture since it first started building Mantle DA, powered by technology from EigenDA. Maybe it's because users are coming on to the Mantle Layer 2 to capture some of the highest yields available in DeFi, and to automatically receive the points and tokens being accrued by the $3 billion Mantle Treasury in the Mantle Reward Station. Maybe it's because the Mantle team is one of the most helpful teams to build with, giving you grants, liquidity support, and venture partners to help bootstrap your Mantle application.

• 43:34David Hoffman?

  Maybe it's all of these reasons all put together. So if you're a dev and you want to build on one of the best foundations in crypto, or you're a user looking to claim some ownership on Mantle's DeFi apps, click the link in the show notes to getting started with Mantle. Arbitrum is the leading Ethereum scaling solution that is home to hundreds of decentralized applications. Arbitrum's technology allows you to interact with Ethereum at scale with low fees and faster transactions. Arbitrum has the leading DeFi ecosystem, strong infrastructure options, flourishing NFTs, and is quickly becoming the Web3 gaming hub. Explore the ecosystem at portal.arbitrum.io. Are you looking to permissionlessly launch your own Arbitrum Orbit chain? Arbitrum Orbit allows anyone to utilize Arbitrum's secure scaling technology to build your own Orbit chain, giving you access to interoperable,

• 44:18David Hoffman?

  customizable permissions with dedicated throughput. Whether you're a developer, an enterprise, or a user, Arbitrum Orbit lets you take your project to new heights. All of these technologies leverage the security and decentralization of Ethereum. Experience Web3 development the way it was always meant to be: secure, fast, cheap, and friction-free. Visit arbitrum.io and get your journey started in one of the largest Ethereum communities. Have you ever felt that the tools for developing decentralized applications are too restrictive and fail to leverage advancements from traditional software programming? There's a wide range of expressive building blocks beyond conventional smart contracts and solidity development. Don't waste your time building the basics from scratch, and don't limit the potential of your vision. Cartesi provides powerful and scalable solutions for developers that supercharge app development.

• 45:02David Hoffman?

  With a Cartesi virtual machine, you can run a full Linux OS and access decades of rich code libraries and open source tooling for building in Web3. And with Cartesi's unique rollup framework, you'll get real-world scaling and computation. No more competing for block space. So if you're a developer looking to Push the boundaries of what's possible in Web3. Cartesi is now offering up to $50,000 in grants. Head over to Cartesi's grant application page to apply today. And if you're not a developer, those with staked CTSI can take part in the governance process and vote on whether or not a proposal should be funded. Make sure you're vote ready by staking your CTSI before the votes open. Releasing RETH 1.0, this is a tweet out of Georgios Konstantopoulos, the CTO, now partner at Paradigm.

• 45:46David Hoffman?

  He tweets out, "After almost two years of development and a successful audit by Sigma Prime, we are finally releasing RETH 1.0, the first production-ready release of our blazing-fast Ethereum execution client. We invite our PC providers and stakers to run RETH." RETH is Rust Ethereum. There's GETH, which was Go Ethereum, which was the first execution client for Ethereum. Now there's RETH. Georgios has been on this RETH mission. There's the Rustations for all the people working on Ethereum RETH. That's kind of like their meme. That's why the RETH is the symbol of a crab for the Rustations out there. RETH is just Rust is just a really highly optimized coding language, to what I understand. People love RETH. RETH developers are in very hot demand.

• 46:31David Hoffman?

  Now Ethereum has a RETH client. This is probably going to impact the Ethereum Layer 1 not that much, although it's always cool to add clients to our client diversity. I expect RETH to become the dominant client for Layer 2s. Totally agree. Because it's an execution client. Yeah. And so this is really going to allow Base to turn up the juice, every single Layer 2, to really turn up the juice. You put the execution client on the execution layers, and now we got the execution client to do that. This has been like Georgios's pet project for, like he said, two years now. We finally get 1.0 out the door. And really, this is actually where the game starts, because now people are going to start to use this client, and now the Peloton can start to grow. Like, Georgios and a few other people have been...

• 47:15David Hoffman?

  I don't know if people understand the Peloton metaphor. Do people understand the Peloton metaphor? I do. I've heard you say it dozens of times on Bankless. 50 times? I love it. Okay. The Peloton is the line of bicycles that when you're watching the Tour de France. Yeah. It's very efficient because everyone is drafting in this one mob of people. So like it takes you almost no energy to bike in the Peloton and you are going like max speed. The Peloton is fast. You cannot keep up with the Peloton if you are sprinting solo. So Georgios and a very few number of people have been building RETH. But now like optimism gets to use RETH, like Base gets to use RETH. And so all these people are joining the Peloton and it's going to increase in its like usefulness and utility.

• 47:56Ryan Sean Adams?

  This is how you optimize for it. You know how Jesse came on from Base and told us they're trying to get to giga gas? They're going to do this with the help of RETH really, right? Like that's core to RETH's roadmap. And by the way, on the venture side, David, we've seen so many different projects that are trying to build like a parallelized EVMs as well, right? So like run multiple, like compute resources in parallel and you know, challenge the SVM, I guess, on that dimension, bring that to the EVM. A lot of them are basing it on RETH as well. So this is like infrastructure to supercharge the execution layer of Ethereum. And I think it's like underhyped right now. It's going to be huge. It's all open source too.

• 48:38Ryan Sean Adams?

  Your Peloton metaphor, MIT license, anyone can like snag it and use it, build on top of it. I was really excited about it earlier this week. And speaking of excitement, let me tell you about Mika, David.

• 48:48David Hoffman?

  Oh, boy.

• 48:49Ryan Sean Adams?

  You ready for this?

• 48:50David Hoffman?

  All right. What do I need to know? Get me excited about Mika.

• 48:52Ryan Sean Adams?

  Actually, not too much. I'm like, honestly, I'm not that excited about it. In fact, I have a like a counter take that's just not too excited. But what you need to know is Mika has gone in place just for stable coins. That has just like now happened. Some of the requirements are, this is EU legislation, by the way, if you're not familiar with this.

• 49:07David Hoffman?

  For all the European listeners out there.

• 49:09Ryan Sean Adams?

  Some landmark crypto legislation that that happened in Europe. Some folks in the US were kind of like praising it. It's going to be interesting to see how it's implemented because this is what they're doing with stable coins. So it's going to prohibit any stable coin that does not adhere to a one-to-one reserve ratio. Okay. Prohibit it from like the exchanges, like anyone in the real world. I guess they can't touch DeFi. I don't know what that that means, but also banning Elgo stable coins. So sorry, Daquan. I don't know what this means for MKR. Like, is that a? Elgo stablecoin? I'm actually not sure about that. Also, you have to obtain a license for your stablecoin, right? From the Electronic Money Institute, whatever that is. Also, you need regular audits.

• 49:51Ryan Sean Adams?

  Some of this is good, right? I think some of this is good, but like some of it could be a bit heavy-handed, in particular, the reserve requirements. So one of the challenges here is that some stablecoins might not fit, check all of the boxes on MICA, at least from day one, like Tether. Tether's huge. And so Tether is categorized right now as an unauthorized stablecoin, so you're actually-

• 50:13David Hoffman?

  Unauthorized stablecoin. What a word set.

• 50:16Ryan Sean Adams?

  So you're actually seeing Tether delisted on some major exchanges, or not completely delisted, I should say, but just like only available for certain products, okay? So like, really diminishing. This is a comment from the head of research at Outlier Ventures. "Because the majority of all stablecoins are USD-pegged, it is unlikely that many of them will be able to comply with MICA in the short term. So, European citizens might face limited access to trading, poor liquidity, and no access to more exotic crypto-native investment opportunities." I mean, in the end, there's a question of like, well, maybe Europeans just don't have access to stablecoins on exchanges? And it's like, is that what Europe is trying to do here?

• 50:59Ryan Sean Adams?

  Here's a take from Seth Hurtline, who's actually like bearish on a lot of this MICA legislation. He's been involved in the trenches. He works over at Ledger's. He says this, "Many Americans who don't understand Europe still point to MICA and suggest that the US is falling behind. But I'm a big proponent of beer systems theory, that the purpose of a system is what it does. And what it's doing is making the EU uncompetitive in yet another emerging tech sector." So he cites Bitstamp. You know, like, Europe does not have any major exchanges at this point. Bitstamp just got like snapped up by Robinhood-

• 51:35David Hoffman?

  Any native major exchanges?

• 51:36Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah, exactly.

• 51:37David Hoffman?

  Kraken is the biggest exchange in Europe.

• 51:40Ryan Sean Adams?

  And they're based in the US.

• 51:41David Hoffman?

  That's ours, baby. USA, let's go.

• 51:43Ryan Sean Adams?

  Robinhood, based in the US. He's basically saying that like, this type of legislation, regulation, like chokes it out, and Europe has a history of doing this. So like, don't make the same mistakes in the US. So, there you go. There's your MICA update.

• 51:58David Hoffman?

  Great. It wasn't very optimistic at all. It's kind of a bummer, actually.

• 52:02Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah, I guess there's maybe a double-edged sword, but it could be more negative than positive, at least for Europeans who just want access to stablecoins.

• 52:10David Hoffman?

  Speaking of negative regulators, we got a tweet to talk about with Gary Gensler, who says, actually, let's just play this clip. Let's just play it. This is a clip about Gary Gensler talking about the crypto industry. He's talking about us.

• 52:22Speaker 02

  This is a field that the leading lights from a couple of years ago are either in jail, about to go to jail, or waiting extradition. Think about it. This is that field. That's the field right now where the public has really been harmed. And there's significant non-compliance in the field.

• 52:43David Hoffman?

  He just like keeps on doubling down on like the public's like lack of awareness of crypto. Like, most people don't pay attention to crypto. And they're like, oh, yeah, like that SBF guy, he went to jail, he was a fraudster. And maybe, maybe this Terra Luna thing that they might know about, otherwise it's just SBF. Yeah, so he's like directionally correct. He's calling the leading lights of this industry. I don't know who he thinks is the leading lights of this industry. My leading lights of this industry are Brian Armstrong, Vitalik Buterin, Jesse from Base, like Kraken, anyone who's like fighting, anyone who's fighting the SEC, honestly.

• 53:21Ryan Sean Adams?

  Hayden from Uniswap, like all the, check your lawsuits.

• 53:24David Hoffman?

  Extremely compliant. And he's just like throwing shade at like all of our, all of our like leaders who are doing things extremely nobly. Like Eric Voorhees's comment, like the Uniswap deserves a Nobel Peace Prize for having like orderly and efficient and fair markets.

• 53:41Ryan Sean Adams?

  Did you hear him say, I've heard him say something like this before. This is totally a prep take. You know, the leading lights are either like waiting extradition, like in jail, like he, this is a canned take from him, and he is like propagating this narrative wherever he has an opportunity.

• 53:55David Hoffman?

  Catherine Minaric, who's the chief legal officer over at Uniswap Labs, the new chief legal officer over at Uniswap, says, "This is an irresponsible way for a regulator to characterize the leaders of an entire industry, which includes so many individuals deeply committed..." To making the world a better place for everyone, not to mention multiple US public companies. Anyways, moving on to other Gary Gensler Ls. The Supreme Court has just ruled in a 6-3 vote that the, uh, when the SEC seeks penalty for fraud from someone, when they go after someone for fraud, a defendant is entitled to a jury trial in federal court as opposed to being subjected to the agency's in-house legal proceedings, AKA you gotta win in the wild. You don't get to just like hire

• 54:40David Hoffman?

  your own judges to do your own legal proceedings. Kind of like crazy it wasn't like that in the first place, uh, but either way, like Gary's like, no, Gary, you're gonna have to, you have to fight on fair terms.

• 54:50Ryan Sean Adams?

  This is great. This is the courts like slapping them back a little bit and just like rogue regulators that, um, you know, over express their power and just, you know, like restoring some balance to, to the court system, I think is incredibly healthy and that's what this does.

• 55:04David Hoffman?

  Remember that court case, uh, debt box or something where the, the judge just got furious with the SEC lawyers for like lying to the judge. Yeah. Um, this might be like blowback from that. Uh, this is a meme out of Miles Jennings, which is the say the line Bart, uh, Twitter format, except Bart is actually, uh, Burns, who looks a lot like Gary Gensler. And the line is, uh, I unlawfully exceeded my authority. And we're not done yet. We're not done yet. Coinbase is suing the SEC and the FDIC for quote, crippling crypto. So Coinbase has filed a lawsuit against the SEC and the FDIC. The FDIC is in the part of the Treasury Department alleging that these federal regulators are

• 55:46David Hoffman?

  attempting to undermine the cryptocurrency industry. The lawsuit claims that these agencies have pressured banks to deny crypto firms access to the federal banking system, which Coinbase argues is a deliberate effort to cripple the digital asset industry. Sounds like 2.2.0. That's exactly what this is. Uh, as a result of this suit, Coinbase seeks to obtain internal documents through a Freedom of Information Act to shed light on these regulatory actions. So basically Coinbase is suing to be able to see documents to see what, what the conspiracy was and see if we can. Like see anything like what skeletons do they have in their closet is basically what's going on.

• 56:22Ryan Sean Adams?

  It's so good to see crypto going on the offensive. It's not just doing it in kind of like the courts. It's also doing it with respect to political races. Like you're seeing the super PACs being active that are crypto funded. Also, I don't know if you saw this this week, David, the Winklevoss twins donated $2 million in Bitcoin to the Trump campaign.

• 56:42David Hoffman?

  Almost.

• 56:43Ryan Sean Adams?

  It turns out that they went over the donation amount. So you can only donate 844,000 according to like the law.

• 56:51David Hoffman?

  But they maxed it out.

• 56:52Ryan Sean Adams?

  They maxed it out. They give some of that back. And this in general is like the Winklevoss has been super active in the 2024 election campaigns. Whole bunch of crypto people have. This is why Trump has come out as the pro crypto president against, as he says, like Biden's anti crypto army. One question I had, so we're recording this on a Thursday. Apparently I just learned about this. I don't know where I've been, but there's a presidential debate going on tonight.

• 57:18David Hoffman?

  Tonight.

• 57:18Ryan Sean Adams?

  Biden and Trump. What do you think the odds are that there's a crypto question in there? Like given Trump's rhetoric, given like, maybe we are overly focused on this and it's like no one else cares about crypto and it won't be asked. But like, what are the odds you think that there's something to do with crypto in this debate?

• 57:35David Hoffman?

  I'm gonna go on the minority likelihood on that one. I, because.

• 57:40Ryan Sean Adams?

  So you say no.

• 57:41David Hoffman?

  I don't think Trump will, it's not smart to hang crypto over the head of Biden and say, I'm the crypto president. Because like the people watching that, like we are, the industry is already watching Trump be, be quote unquote, the crypto president. The marginal viewer who's watching that, I don't think it's going to be swayed by Trump like boasting his like crypterness. And I don't think it's gonna, I don't think it's gonna come from the moderator. The moderator is not going to ask a crypto question because they probably don't care.

• 58:10Ryan Sean Adams?

  That's a good take. However, I'm going to say that it does, there is a question. And I just think that either Trump injects it.

• 58:19David Hoffman?

  Can I get my bragging rights NFT back if I win?

• 58:22Ryan Sean Adams?

  That sounds fair, actually. Actually, so first, you have to, in order to do this, though, you have to mint the NFT and give it to me.

• 58:28David Hoffman?

  I have to go do that.

• 58:28Ryan Sean Adams?

  Because I won the ETH pitch. Do that. But let's, let's make an official, uh, let's make an official bet.

• 58:33David Hoffman?

  Bet number two?

• 58:34Ryan Sean Adams?

  You can get that thing back. Yeah. If, if, okay. I get to keep it for some period of time. You can't just, we only had it for a day.

• 58:39David Hoffman?

  You get to hold on to it for as long as time as I forgot to mint it and give it to you.

• 58:42Ryan Sean Adams?

  So let's set the rules. So if crypto is mentioned in some form of a question, or Trump or Biden mention crypto.

• 58:48David Hoffman?

  Yeah.

• 58:49Ryan Sean Adams?

  Then I get it. And like, that's my, and you're saying that it's not mentioned at all. Nothing to do with crypto.

• 58:54David Hoffman?

  It's not mentioned. Crypto is not mentioned.

• 58:56Ryan Sean Adams?

  All right, fair. We'll see. This is, now you're going to get me to watch a presidential debate. I guess I have to now.

• 59:01David Hoffman?

  No, if, if it does get mentioned, Twitter will just blow up.

• 59:04Ryan Sean Adams?

  Perfect. David, some raises on the week. Uh, first, Mega ETH. What is Mega ETH?

• 59:09David Hoffman?

  Mega ETH is a pretty hot deal that's been going around the VC space. Mega ETH is a layer two on Ethereum that is kind of uniquely different. They are trying to take, they're trying to just go the hyper centralized sequencer with like decentralized prover route, but just like, the whole point of layer two is like, you get to actually be like meaningfully decentralized, just to have your powers checked by provers.

• 59:29Ryan Sean Adams?

  Sure.

• 59:29David Hoffman?

  So they're just great, they're just cramming everything into data center, memory.

• 59:34Ryan Sean Adams?

  Putting it in memory.

• 59:35David Hoffman?

  Like, put it in a big data center, put it all in memory, have the little guy be able to, to check the validity of it via proving, uh, and it is going to be the most juice layer two of all time. Uh, so that's why, that's why it's been like pretty hot in the, uh, in the VC space, uh, led by Dragonfly. Uh, Dragonfly has just been kind of killing it this year with participation from Figment, uh, Robot Ventures, Tangent, uh, Credibly Neutral, that is Victor Bunin's fund, uh, and a bunch of angels, including Vitalik Buterin, uh, Joseph Lubin, Sri Ram, Santiago, Kobi Hazu, Mert from Solana, who loves layer twos.

• 1:00:09Ryan Sean Adams?

  That's funny.

• 1:00:09David Hoffman?

  Yeah, right.

• 1:00:10Ryan Sean Adams?

  100,000 TPS, David.

• 1:00:12David Hoffman?

  Yeah.

• 1:00:13Ryan Sean Adams?

  Can you believe it?

• 1:00:13David Hoffman?

  $20 million seed round. They raised $20 million in a seed round.

• 1:00:17Ryan Sean Adams?

  Big expectations.

• 1:00:18David Hoffman?

  It was a juicy, chunky seed round.

• 1:00:20Ryan Sean Adams?

  I think it's cool. I like the architecture. I think it's cool. That's not all, David. A Bankless Ventures disclosure is Conduit just got their Series A. What is Conduit? What's the context here?

• 1:00:31David Hoffman?

  Conduit is a rollup as a service provider. This is their second raise. They host a bunch of rollups. They actually built the rollup.wtf website that we were looking at earlier on the show. We were talking about all the networks being alive. That's their website. They host so many different rollups that you probably are aware of. They host Mode, they host AVO, Zora, DGEN Network is them, Proof of Play. They've got $1.2 billion in TVL on the rollups that they host. It's basically like a easy button to deploy a rollup. And you can literally go to their website and deploy a rollup. You don't even have to talk to them. There's a form you can fill out. Pretty cool business model. They handle 20% of all Ethereum transactions.

• 1:01:12David Hoffman?

  And so if you think that Ethereum will have infinity rollups, of which I do, you would need something like Conduit, a rollup as a service provider. And like I said, they just raised their Series A, co-led by Paradigm, who led their seed round a couple of years ago. And also Katie Hahn Ventures, Hahn Ventures, other investors, us, Bankless Ventures, Coinbase Ventures, also credibly neutral, What's Up Victor, and Robot Ventures. And then Angels Hayden, Adams, Tim Bako, Zaki Mustafa, Nick White, Sri Ram, and Tarun Chitra, as well as others.

• 1:01:41Ryan Sean Adams?

  As we close the thing out, let's talk about a few Bankless citizen updates. The first is, we put a call out to Bankless citizens for podcast suggestions. David, I haven't looked at this. I looked at this once, but it looks like we've got a whole bunch of dozens of submissions here.

• 1:01:54David Hoffman?

  34 suggestions, submissions for a suggested Bankless podcast episode, one of which we will do.

• 1:02:00Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah, okay, so what happens now? So I'm seeing Vitalik and Gavin Wood as a suggestion. I'm seeing Jordan Lyle, prohibition, what's this? Prohibition.art, I think I remember it. Base, I want to see Jesse in Bankless. I did see, someone suggested Mert.

• 1:02:18David Hoffman?

  Yep.

• 1:02:19Ryan Sean Adams?

  Someone's really gonna have to vote that up for us to do.

• 1:02:22David Hoffman?

  Mteam.lens suggests the great sequencing debate with Justin Drake and a few other sequencers. That's my favorite, but I only get one vote as a Bankless citizen.

• 1:02:30Ryan Sean Adams?

  Okay, so what happens now? So these are all the suggestions. Is there like a round two now where Bankless citizens go and vote?

• 1:02:36David Hoffman?

  Yeah.

• 1:02:36Ryan Sean Adams?

  On what podcast episode we're gonna do?

• 1:02:39David Hoffman?

  So yeah, there was a one-week submission period, which is coming to an end by the time Bankless listeners listen to this, that it will have ended. And then there will be a one-week voting period. So if you have, if you're a Bankless citizen and you have your 2022, or 23, or 24 POAP, go to that wallet, and that wallet will have one vote in it, and you'll be able to go vote for one of the 34 podcast episodes. And then we will do whichever podcast episodes come first. Well, I mean, like, if somebody wants Ray Dalio, did they put Ray Dalio? We will also, I also want Ray Dalio. Honestly, I hope to get you that, no matter what. That'd be really cool. So we're gonna do our best. And then if we, if the number one is like Ray Dalio, but we just can't get him, we'll just go down to number two.

• 1:03:24David Hoffman?

  But some, one of these podcast episodes is getting done in order of votes.

• 1:03:28Ryan Sean Adams?

  Also, David, we've got some travel scheduled, at least you do. You've got some travel scheduled in July, including a conference at ETH/CC and a Bankless event. What's this?

• 1:03:37David Hoffman?

  Oh yeah, so Monday of ETH/CC, if you are in ETH/CC in Brussels, and you are also a Bankless citizen, or a previous Bankless podcast guest, or a Bankless sponsor, hit us up because we got drinks on Rooftop Bar. It's gonna be sick. That's Monday, July 8th, that's 4:00 PM Brussels time. So if you're in the Discord, hit us up for the link, or DM me, or something. There's not that many spots left. We're coming on down to like 30 or 40 spots left. And so, yeah, it's gonna be cool to hang out with all of you. It's good to see everyone in person.

• 1:04:05Ryan Sean Adams?

  And then, David, you're gonna go climb a mountain the following week, right?

• 1:04:08David Hoffman?

  That's right. In protest of current prices, I've decided to do something. And so, right after ETH/CC, I'm gonna go over to Chamonix and climb Mount Blanc. Let's ignore the fact that I misspelled Mount.

• 1:04:20David Hoffman?

  Mount Blanc, it's a 15,000-foot mountain, it's pretty cool.

• 1:04:23Ryan Sean Adams?

  Have you done this one before?

• 1:04:24David Hoffman?

  No, but I've done the Matterhorn, which is actually harder than Mount Blanc. But also, it's harder but shorter. This is longer, taller, but easier.

• 1:04:33Ryan Sean Adams?

  Okay, so what was easier, David Matterhorn, like, training for that? Or training for the David Hoffman, Nick Carter fight?

• 1:04:40David Hoffman?

  Oh god, training for the fight was way harder.

• 1:04:44David Hoffman?

  The fight that didn't happen.

• 1:04:45Ryan Sean Adams?

  Did you get broken ribs?

• 1:04:46David Hoffman?

  Yeah, I've never got a broken rib while climbing a mountain.

• 1:04:49Ryan Sean Adams?

  All right, David, well, we wish you well on the mountain climb. And good things happen to crypto when you're gone.

• 1:04:54David Hoffman?

  I hope to bring back higher prices.

• 1:04:56Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah, I think you will. I think you will. Meme of the week, what are we looking at, David?

• 1:05:00David Hoffman?

  This is another Bitwise commercial. We all know the Mac and PC commercials where now we're doing Big Finance and Ethereum. And so let's go ahead and listen to the commercial.

• 1:05:10Speaker 03

  Big Finance, did you change? What? No, I'm always like this. You wanna hang out? When moon, man?

• 1:05:21Speaker 03

  Do you even know what that means? No, I do not.

• 1:05:24Ryan Sean Adams?

  That's great.

• 1:05:25David Hoffman?

  Kind of helps of you watching it on the screen, but yeah, Big Finance is wearing a blockchain t-shirt and he's holding a pudgy penguin, which is kind of a...

• 1:05:30Ryan Sean Adams?

  Did you notice his hat?

• 1:05:31David Hoffman?

  Yeah, an Ethereum hat.

• 1:05:32Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah, Ethereum hat. He's just like totally posing as a, you know, blockchain expert.

• 1:05:36David Hoffman?

  How do you do, fellow kids, kind of thing?

• 1:05:39Ryan Sean Adams?

  That's good. I mean, these...

• 1:05:40David Hoffman?

  They keep rolling them out on Twitter and I love them.

• 1:05:42Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah, they're great. All right, guys, end with this, of course. You know crypto is risky, you could lose what you put in, but we are headed west. This is the frontier, not for everyone, but we're glad you're with us on the bankless journey. Thanks a lot.

• 1:06:13David Hoffman?

  And also, just, what's going on?

• 1:06:17David Hoffman?

  Shut up, Brian.