Why Trump’s Corruption Matters — ft. Hillary Clinton & Anthony Scaramucci

Live from New York City on the final stop of the tour, Ed Elson and Scott Galloway are joined by surprise guest Secretary Hillary Clinton to discuss the state of negotiations with Iran. She also shares her thoughts on the future of the Democratic party, and why young people are rejecting capitalism in favor of socialism. Then, Anthony Scaramucci takes the stage to break down President Trump’s grifts, declining faith in markets, SpaceX’s IPO, and consequences of the fast entry rule changes to the major indices. Subscribe to the Prof G Markets Youtube Channel Check out our latest Prof G Markets newsletter Follow Prof G Markets on Instagram Follow Ed on Instagram, X and Substack Follow Scott on Instagram Send us your questions or comments by emailing [email protected] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

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• 0:30Speaker 01

  A payday candy bar is miles and miles of peanuts. Salty crunchy peanuts, sweet, sweet caramel, wrapping you up with every bite. Enjoy the tasty journey, my friend. Payday Peanut Caramel Bar.

• 0:45Speaker 02

  Chronic migraine, 15 or more headache days a month, each lasting four hours or more, can make me feel like a spectator in my own life.

• 0:51Speaker 03

  Botox, onabotulinum toxin A, prevents headaches in adults with chronic migraine. It's not for those with 14 or fewer headache days a month. It's the number one prescribed branded chronic migraine preventive treatment.

• 1:03Speaker 04

  Prescription Botox is injected by your doctor. Effects of Botox may spread hours to weeks after injection, causing serious symptoms. Alert your doctor right away, as difficulty swallowing, speaking, breathing, eye problems or muscle weakness can be signs of a life-threatening condition. Patients with these conditions before injection are at highest risk. Side effects may include allergic reactions, neck and injection site pain, fatigue and headache. Allergic reactions can include rash, welts, asthma symptoms and dizziness. Don't receive Botox if there's a skin infection. Tell your doctor your medical history, muscle or nerve conditions, including ALS, Lou Gehrig's disease, myasthenia gravis or Lambert Eaton syndrome, and medications, including botulinum toxins, as these may increase the risk of serious side effects.

• 1:39Speaker 02

  Why wait? Ask your doctor. Visit botoxchronicmigraine.com or call 1-800-44-BOTOX to learn more.

• 1:45Scott Galloway?

  Today's number, 1.3 square miles. That's the landmass of Central Park, greater than the nation state of Monaco. Ed, you guys may not know this, but Ed actually went to Princeton. And Princeton is credited with more sex research than any university in the world. I went to UCLA. At Princeton, they invented sex. At UCLA, we introduced it to women.

• 2:11Ed Elson?

  That's pretty good. Yeah, this corner likes it. Some people up there don't like it. My Princeton buddies in the crowd, they don't like it either.

• 2:23Scott Galloway?

  All right, who wants a dick joke? So the mooch is here and and he and I were at the urinal and he looks over and he's like, circumcised? And I'm like, nope, that's just the wear and tear.

• 2:53Ed Elson?

  Well, Scott, it's great to be here finally in New York City, the final stop on the tour. You know, at each city that we've been doing this show, we like to sort of begin the show with a little bit of data about the city, usually some economic data. So, you know, in Los Angeles, we were talking about Hollywood and in Miami, we're talking about crypto. So I would like to share some New York City specific data of my own before we get into the show. So my first number to give you today, Scott, is 27. 27, that's how many years have passed since the New York Knicks last made it to the NBA Finals. Today's other number is 53. That's how many years have passed since the New York Knicks

• 3:36Ed Elson?

  last won an NBA championship. I heard a lot of boos there. I can't tell why that's happening, but all I can tell you, Scott, I have three words. Let's go Knicks.

• 3:52Ed Elson?

  That's right. Scott, will you be tuning in?

• 3:55Scott Galloway?

  Be honest with this ad, does it look like John Santa's gonna bust through and I'm gonna be a 650 first make a wish? Seriously, look at me right now. Look at us.

• 4:04Ed Elson?

  You look good.

• 4:06Scott Galloway?

  No, this is what you call, this is what you call birth control.

• 4:12Ed Elson?

  Well, okay. Now that we have our pandering to the audience out of the way, now that we've gotten on your side, I hope, I'm going to launch us into our first story.

• 4:20Scott Galloway?

  Great.

• 4:21Ed Elson?

  Okay.

• 4:23Ed Elson?

  It's been 94 days since the US first launched strikes on Iran and the path ahead is still unclear. Iran is reportedly still reviewing the latest draft of a potential agreement with the US and has yet to issue a response. Trump also posted on Truth Social that talks were, quote, "going on." However, rhetoric from Tehran continues to harden. A senior Iranian military official said Tuesday that renewed hostilities with the US appear inevitable, adding that the Iranian nation will never surrender. Meanwhile, the Strait of Hormuz remains effectively closed, continuing to disrupt one of the world's most important energy corridors. So, Scott, week 13 of the war. We've talked about inflation, which continues to rise. The numbers do not look great.

• 5:07Ed Elson?

  The Strait remains closed. What do you make of these recent developments in Iran and where do you see this all heading?

• 5:15Scott Galloway?

  Well, the justification for doing this to begin with was such that Iran would never have access.

• 5:19Speaker 07

  Oh, my God. You do not know what you're talking about.

• 5:25Ed Elson?

  Who's that?

• 5:26Speaker 07

  Also, your dick joke is old, just so you know. This is the voice of God talking to you, Scott Galloway.

• 5:38Ed Elson?

  I think I recognize that voice.

• 5:43Speaker 07

  First of all, you cheat on me with a younger man. And I happen to be in New York.

• 5:51Speaker 07

  So.

• 5:53Speaker 07

  Hey, everybody.

• 5:56Speaker 07

  Hey.

• 6:05Speaker 07

  It's okay, it's alright. The other man, the other man. So I'm actually not the surprise guest in my ongoing... That was an old joke.

• 6:14Scott Galloway?

  Yeah, by the way, that was, and just so you know, he's a better kisser.

• 6:17Speaker 07

  Okay.

• 6:19Scott Galloway?

  But this is just likely, like you, you criticize when you don't come up with... You're not, that's not that helpful. Who would you have to talk about this?

• 6:29Speaker 07

  Yeah, yeah, who would I have? Well, anybody but you for first.

• 6:31Scott Galloway?

  Okay.

• 6:32Speaker 07

  Because, you know, you're frequently wrong but never in doubt. But, but I, you know, I wanted to bring you a special surprise just to show, as always, I am the top and you are the bottom. And so I programmed your very special guest. And I thought, who, who, who could I bring? Who knows something about Iran and about Ukraine and about the entire world? So I would like to introduce the author of Project 2029, I hope. The most badass woman I know, someone who probably should have been president, Secretary Hillary Clinton.

• 7:28Speaker 07

  Alright.

• 7:32Speaker 07

  Alright, everybody.

• 7:39Speaker 07

  We will now, we will now hear actually what's happened in Iran. And my work is done. I maintain the hegemony over Scott Galloway. Have a great time.

• 7:50Scott Galloway?

  Thank you, Carla Swisher.

• 7:54Speaker 08

  Whoa. Yeah, she asked me to meet her here.

• 8:00Speaker 08

  Oh, that Kara, you know all about that.

• 8:03Ed Elson?

  Well, this is shocking, exciting. I can't really believe it and we're so glad to have you here. Thank you for joining us. Scott, I'm going to let you bust into our first question here. And then we'll get into our conversation. Thank you so much for being with us, Secretary.

• 8:18Speaker 08

  Absolutely. Glad to be with you.

• 8:21Scott Galloway?

  Yeah, welcome. So you have a lot of experience in the region. Set the table. What do you think is going on in the quote unquote war room right now? And do you think we're close to some sort of agreement?

• 8:33Speaker 08

  Well, I think, number one, this was so ill conceived and even more poorly executed in terms of any outcome that is going to restrain Iran, enhance our security and our other interests, particularly our economic interests. You know, I was stunned when reporting started coming out about conversations in the White House because in, you know, the years I was on the Senate Armed Services Committee and I was Secretary of State, anytime we talked about Iran, any kind of war game scenario

• 9:14Speaker 08

  that we discussed, among the very first questions was, what if they closed the Strait of Hormuz? What do we do? And then from the reporting, it sounded as though that just hadn't been really discussed or at least not brought to the highest levels of the administration.

• 9:36Speaker 08

  And I think now, sadly, and I really do say this with a lot of regret because this should be an American, you know, issue that we have to deal with together, not a partisan issue. I think we are in a weakened position. I think Iran is in a stronger position than it was before we did this. I actually approved of the strikes on the nuclear facilities back in June, a year ago. They had a clear objective. They were carried out effectively. They didn't accomplish all that they claimed, but they did accomplish enough to argue that the nuclear weapons program was setback.

• 10:19Speaker 08

  But now, I think the Iranians are really playing a stronger hand vis a vis Trump. And he's kind of flummoxed. He doesn't know what to do. I mean, on his truth socially, talks about how he doesn't find it interesting pursuing these peace negotiations. He's bored by it. And, you know, when you think about the hard work of both waging war and everything that it entails, and then trying to extricate yourself from a conflict with some sort of

• 10:55Speaker 08

  advantage, that's really hard work, and that's not being done. So I can't tell at this point where we're going to be in a week, or two, or three. But if we end up, number one, where the Iranians control the Strait of Hormuz and are actually, you know, exacting tolls from commercial shipping, if we don't get any kind of realistic agreement, certainly not one better than the one I worked on when I worked with President Obama and started the negotiations that led to the agreement, and if we don't really have evidence that

• 11:38Speaker 08

  we have seriously damaged their ballistic missile and other drone capability, then what have we gained? And it just will further weaken us. And if you're sitting in Moscow, or you're sitting in Beijing, and you're following this, you are, you know, just, first of all, probably dumbstruck that any American president would do this, because I know from my own experience, we were often urged to do it, but did not for all kinds of reasons. And I really worry about not just what it means for the relationship in the region,

• 12:18Speaker 08

  and specifically what Iran can continue to do, but what message is it sends to everybody else. So I guess my bottom line would be that... And I don't think this would happen. It would be extremely reassuring if we had a real team of negotiators who knew enough about what needed to happen with Iran, and they had the patience and the discipline and could drive a very strong argument as to why Iran would suffer consequences if they didn't reach an agreement. But Iran is not only on the ground stronger, but they're playing a really effective social media game.

• 13:01Speaker 08

  I don't know if you've seen their Mr. Explosive, the explosive Lego character that they are using that is all over social media, and it is just mocking us. And it's not just mocking our current president, it's mocking our country. So I would like to see a serious, dedicated effort to try to actually get as much out of this unfortunate situation that we could right now.

• 13:28Scott Galloway?

  But you'd have to create, if there's a deal to be had, you need leverage.

• 13:34Speaker 08

  Yes.

• 13:35Scott Galloway?

  How would you, what would be your strategy for coordinating with allies or economic sanctions? Let's assume that someone were to call you and say, okay, we broke it, can you help us fix it? How does America gain the type of leverage it needs to in some way declare victory and leave, if you will?

• 13:50Speaker 08

  Well, I can give you an analogy from my own experience. When I started the secret negotiations that tested whether we could negotiate with Iran, I did it through the good offices of the Omani government, the then Sultan of Oman. And Oman, as you know, is on the other side of the strait. We have leverage with Oman. We have unfortunately misused it, but we have leverage. And the other argument I made, which ended up getting a UN Security Council resolution imposing universal sanctions, was to make the case, particularly to China and to India, that there will be a price to pay if you don't help us rein in Iran.

• 14:34Speaker 08

  Our goal is to prevent them from ever getting a nuclear weapon arsenal. So you have to demonstrate, you know, real allegiance to that idea, because if we launch a nuclear arms race in the Middle East, that is not good for any of us. And I think that kind of tough diplomacy, none of which I heard coming out of the recent meeting that Trump had with Xi Jinping, would lead to putting together a coalition of diplomatic support for exercising leverage with the Gulf States, with China, in a way that makes it very clear, we may have given that away, but if we could rebuild it to

• 15:15Speaker 08

  basically say, you know, we want to get back to free navigable waters in the strait, that's in your interests, you're the one who's buying most of that oil, you've got a way in. You could look at this and see all the different players who have their own individual leverage, and then aggregate that and begin to put it together. It doesn't happen overnight, it would be painstaking diplomacy, but it could be done if we had the right approach.

• 15:41Scott Galloway?

  Something that doesn't seem to get a lot of media coverage, but you could argue is really a wonderful thing for the West, is that it feels as if in the last eight or 12 weeks, Ukraine has gone from playing defense to offense. Can you talk a little bit about the war there and what it means for the West?

• 15:57Speaker 08

  Look, I think it means the difference between a peaceful, secure Europe, and what that means for a peaceful, secure United States, and a further opening of a door to Russian aggression, if we are not on Ukraine's side. It is one of the great tragedies of modern history, that we have a president who doesn't support the Ukrainian people. But the Ukrainian people have demonstrated, through their own sacrifice, how worthy they are of everybody's support. And what they have done in building up their own military-industrial complex in the midst

• 16:42Speaker 08

  of a war, is nothing short of remarkable. I mean, the only thing I can think of, Scott, that is even comparable, is when the blitz started against Great Britain.

• 16:52Speaker 08

  You know, when the Luftwaffe planes were, you know, bombing the heck out of London and other sites, you know, Britain was not prepared. They didn't have the kind of air force to fight back. But, boy, did they put it on a fast burner. And pretty soon, you know, within months, they were, you know, sending up fleets of, you know, airplanes to do battle with the German aircraft. Well, what the Ukrainians have done is certainly the help that they got since they were first invaded in February of 2022, they put to very good use. But then they quickly realized that they had to be as self-reliant as possible.

• 17:31Speaker 08

  So what they have pioneered with drone technology in particular is the new form of warfare, and we all should be learning. In fact, you know, Zelensky went to the Middle East, he went to the Gulf States, he went to Saudi Arabia and the UAE and others to give them support when they were all of a sudden being attacked by the same kind of drones that Iran had sold to Russia. And those drones were being used against Ukraine, now they were being used by Iran against the Gulf States. So we all should be expressing a great debt to Ukraine for, number one, holding out, and, number two, demonstrating what modern

• 18:12Speaker 08

  warfare is going to evolve toward, whether people are ready for it or not. But, number three, and most importantly, they have held the Russians at bay. Now, if you're running a country the way Putin is, and you could care less how many of your, you know, young men are killed in battle, and he doesn't care, and he's emptied the jails, and he's, you know, dragooned people off the streets, and he's, you know, giving bonuses to people in, you know, men in Africa to come fight who didn't know what they were doing, and he's taken North Korean troops. He has thrown everything he knows to throw against the Ukrainians. And the Ukrainians have held the line, and, you know, it's like a back-and-forth, almost World War I situation, where it's, you know, a couple of feet here, a couple of feet

• 18:57Speaker 08

  there. But now, because of Ukraine's own development of weapons, particularly missiles and more advanced drones, they are starting to hit sites within Russia, and not just border sites, but, you know, much further. So I think that... Now is the time, and I'm glad to see, you know, Europe is stepping up. I think that Ukraine, partly because of what they offered and delivered to the Gulf States, including trainers, to show them how to use these drones, how to defend against the Iranian drones. I think that Ukraine can withstand this barrage, you know, this constant nightly aiming at civilian targets, again, like the Blitz.

• 19:41Speaker 08

  These are not military targets. These are civilian targets. And Russia and Putin need to be defeated, and Ukraine is on the front line of doing that, and we all should do everything we can to help them succeed.

• 20:02Ed Elson?

  We'll be right back.

• 20:09Speaker 00

  The new LinkedIn Hiring Pro can't undo your last hire. The no-show. Who set you back because they didn't show up on day one, or day two, or ever again? And now your product launch is delayed because you're talking to alien abduction podcasters to track them down. But LinkedIn Hiring Pro can help make sure your next hire sticks. In fact, businesses who use LinkedIn are 24% less likely to reopen a role in the next 12 months. Hire right the first time with LinkedIn Hiring Pro. Post a free job today at LinkedIn.com/quality.

• 20:39Speaker 01

  A payday candy bar is miles and miles of peanuts. Salty crunchy peanuts, sweet, sweet caramel, wrapping you up with every bite. Enjoy the tasty journey, my friend. Payday Peanut Caramel Bar.

• 20:54Speaker 02

  Chronic migraine, 15 or more headache days a month, each lasting four hours or more, can make me feel like a spectator in my own life.

• 21:01Speaker 03

  Botox, onabotulinum toxin A, prevents headaches in adults with chronic migraine. It's not for those with 14 or fewer headache days a month. It's the number one prescribed branded chronic migraine preventive treatment.

• 21:12Speaker 04

  Prescription Botox is injected by your doctor. Effects of Botox may spread hours to weeks after injection, causing serious symptoms. Alert your doctor right away as difficulty swallowing, speaking, breathing, eye problems, or muscle weakness can be signs of a life-threatening condition. Patients with these conditions before injection are at highest risk. Side effects may include allergic reactions, neck and injection site pain, fatigue, and headache. Allergic reactions can include rash, welts, asthma symptoms, and dizziness. Don't receive Botox if there's a skin infection. Tell your doctor your medical history, muscle or nerve conditions, including ALS, Lou Gehrig's disease, Myasthenia gravis, or Lambert-Eaton syndrome, and medications, including botulinum toxins, as these may increase the risk of serious side effects.

• 21:48Speaker 09

  Why wait? Ask your doctor. Visit botoxchronicmigraine.com or call 1-800-44-BOTOX to learn more.

• 21:59Ed Elson?

  We're back with Prof G Markets. We are here in New York, which is the center of capitalism, the center of Wall Street. And yet, we also just elected a mayor who describes himself as a democratic socialist. And what we've seen among young people, among Gen Z, my generation, is that interest in socialism, belief in socialism, alternatives to capitalism, that is on the rise in America right now. I'd just love to get your views on what do you make of Mam Darney's election? And do you think it says something about the future of the Democratic Party and the future of progressivism in the United States?

• 22:41Speaker 08

  Well, first of all, I think he is a brilliant politician. And I think he ran an absolutely superb, modern campaign and caught the imagination of voters, as you say, and particularly young voters. The day after the election, I didn't endorse anybody. I didn't get involved. You know, I certainly congratulated him and wished him well because I love New York and I really, really want him to succeed. I don't care what label he puts on his politics or himself, as long as he proves that his brand of politics works.

• 23:16Speaker 08

  That's what I'm interested in. I, you know, look, I am a very pragmatic person. I can look at somebody and say, "Prove to me, you know, show me that what you think will work to better people's lives, to, you know, create the investments we need to prosper together, to keep us secure, to give us opportunity to inspire young people, everything you want from good political leadership." I want to see that, and I see some of it, and the jury is out. I want to see what he can actually produce. You know, Mario Cuomo famously said, "You campaign in poetry and you govern in prose."

• 23:57Speaker 08

  The campaign is fun. It's exciting. It's a roller coaster ride. Having done a few myself, it's incredibly exhilarating, and either works or it doesn't, but nevertheless. And so, then the hard work starts. I mean, you just work 24/7 to get yourself elected, and it's like, you know, the dog that catches the car, and all of a sudden, you're like, "Okay, how am I going to actually govern?" And I see some good things. A lot is still unclear, but I really hope, for the sake of, you know, this city that I love, and

• 24:37Speaker 08

  that I was proud to represent for eight wonderful years, that we really can see New York be a laboratory of democracy. For if he wants to promote his policies, prove them. Let's have proof of concept. You know, call yourself whatever you want, but let's show that what you are standing for and implementing is actually going to work. And I am like that with, you know, people across the political lines. You know, if you have a good idea, I want to hear it, and I don't really care, you know, where it comes from. But I do think there's a cautionary lesson, you know, don't govern to your base. Trump has governed to his base, and he's driving, you know, a stake through the heart

• 25:20Speaker 08

  of American democracy. He's undermining the, you know, the incredible engine of the American economy, in my opinion. But he's satisfying the 35% of the people who are still with him, not others. And that doesn't work. It doesn't work in America. And so... Broaden your aperture.

• 25:42Ed Elson?

  Yes.

• 25:42Speaker 08

  Get a broader base of people because these are the people whose policies you are implementing are going to be affected by.

• 25:49Ed Elson?

  My final question, we talk about a lot of economic issues on the show. Some of our biggest themes are wealth inequality, housing prices, and housing policy, mental health, social media, loneliness. When you look at the United States in 2026, what are the issues in our nation that you are most concerned about today? And what kinds of policies would you want to implement to start to resolve those issues?

• 26:12Speaker 08

  Everything you just said, I mean, obviously, and I would add our international position because I think it has an impact. And then I would also, you know, mention, you know, what I consider to be the two overriding themes, affordability and accountability. How do you make life affordable for particularly young people? Because it does seem to me that, you know, we've given them a really tough deal in terms of what they can expect and whether they can feel that their future is going to be, you know, better than their present. And certainly is it going to be better than their parents or their grandparents in terms of not just aspiration, but actual reality. But I honestly think that you got to look again to the cities in the states.

• 26:56Speaker 08

  Right now, the federal government is broken. And a lot of what Trump has done has rendered it dysfunctional, you know, cleaning out experts who knew anything. This Ebola epidemic, boy, I hope it doesn't get as bad as some of the folks whose opinions I respect say that it could in terms of its spread. But, you know, we got rid of our surveillance. We got rid of the infrastructure we had built over decades to be alerted to these kinds of things and act on them. So it's both international and national, but focusing just here at home, I want to see states and cities do a lot more. And let's see what a good housing policy in New York looks like.

• 27:38Speaker 08

  Let's see what a good, you know, economic mobility plan from Illinois looks like. I know you guys were in Chicago with my friend JB Pritzker last night. Let's see what the states do to govern AI because the federal government isn't doing it. So let's turn back to laboratories of democracy, you know?

• 28:03Scott Galloway?

  So Democrats are feeling really good about the midterms. But I would never underestimate our ability to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory.

• 28:13Speaker 08

  Yeah. I know something about that, too.

• 28:17Scott Galloway?

  What advice would you have for the Democratic Party around messaging? And do you see any... What are you optimistic about and what are you worried about in terms of the midterms?

• 28:32Speaker 08

  Well, before the tsunami of redistricting started at Trump's demand to Texas, I was extremely optimistic. I saw all of the ingredients for a big midterm win for Democrats. Obviously, what the states themselves did and then what Democratic states responded with and then what the Supreme Court did in what I view as a truly disgraceful decision throwing out the guts of the Voting Rights Act means that it will be harder, but I am still very optimistic. And the reason I'm very optimistic is, number one, if you look at the elections that have

• 29:16Speaker 08

  been held over the last year, Democrats have done really well. And not just, you know, the governor of New Jersey, the governor of, you know, Virginia, the redistricting votes in places like California, but, I mean, public service commissioners in Georgia and preserving Supreme Court justices in Pennsylvania and getting really into the nitty-gritty of who was winning and where those victories were happening. So I think that the underlying conditions are still very favorable, but I also think that you've got to stress these two big overriding themes: affordability and accountability. And I mention them both together because on affordability...

• 30:03Speaker 08

  I think a lot of people who voted for Trump actually thought that he cared enough about them to do something about affordability. And low and behold, that was not the case. And so their disappointment, or their feeling that, wait a minute, you're doing stuff I didn't vote for, and you're not paying attention to what I need, and now you're starting a war that has already raised gas prices, and by the time we get done with fertilizer and supply chain disruption and everything else, it's going to cost all of us more. So I think that on the affordability issue, the Democrats have a pretty wide-open door. And I think, again, what you say and how you say it may differ from district to district

• 30:47Speaker 08

  and state to state. And it's not a national campaign exactly, although you need a national umbrella message like a presidential campaign is. So when you're running to defeat a Republican incumbent in a purple swing district, you're not going to say the same thing that somebody who is running in a deep-blue district is going to say. And you just have to accept that. That's the way politics works when you're running for the midterms. You've got to make your case in language that your voters will agree with. And then on the accountability issue, I just want to say a quick word about the Hungarian election, because I think there's a real lesson to be learned.

• 31:31Speaker 08

  So other opposition parties and leaders tried to defeat Orban over a couple of election cycles and were unsuccessful. So what made it different this time was not only a charismatic, effective, really hard-working candidate with Madyar, who was a truly dedicated opposition figure, having come out of Orban's party, but...

• 32:00Speaker 08

  He was able to tie the corruption of the Orban government to the lives of the Hungarian people. I mean, when you look at the explosion of corruption in this administration, you know, I know some people have a tendency to say, "Ah, you know, they're all politicians, whatever." That's not true, but I can understand why people might think that. But with Trump, it's corruption that is hurting people. You know, because while war is being waged in Iran, members of his family are making money from some of the very same interests and parties involved in this war.

• 32:39Speaker 08

  While you have the very clear economic disparities and the wealth inequality exploding because of the big, beautiful bill that they passed, you know, all of a sudden, people are feeling like, "Wait a minute, what is happening to me and my family compared to, you know, the top 1/10th of 1%?" So I think that there is a lot of correlation between the corruption and the accountability that needs to be expected, not in a partisan way, not in a using prosecution to settle personal grievance way, but in a rule of law way.

• 33:20Speaker 08

  If we do not restore the rule of law, and I was so encouraged to see that the pushback on this terrible grievance fund that they were setting up to reward people like the January 6th instigators. And so, there is, finally, a kind of recognition that the corruption personally benefits the president and his family, rewards people who committed crimes, and really went after our democracy as well as all the other, you know, things that they did. That is encouraging.

• 34:04Speaker 08

  And so, I really think the messaging needs to be focused on what we're going to do to actually help people and solve some of these problems, and what we're going to do to restore the rule of law. And so, I am optimistic as long as people turn out and vote. That's always the big question.

• 34:31Scott Galloway?

  So there were several people with earpieces who looked like they were ready and willing to kill me. That said, you have 20 minutes and you got to end your next game. But before we let you go, Secretary Clinton, I just want to put an image up. Do we have the image? So this is me in 2016. I've only gone door to door for one person.

• 34:52Speaker 08

  Oh, wow.

• 34:54Scott Galloway?

  That's me and every other Democrat in West El Rey. So all eight of us

• 35:00Scott Galloway?

  were knocking on doors, trying to get people to show up.

• 35:03Speaker 08

  Oh, thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Wow. Thank you.

• 35:10Scott Galloway?

  So it is.

• 35:14Scott Galloway?

  You know, my wish for the nation is that character incompetence makes a comeback. Really appreciate your service, Secretary Clinton.

• 35:20Speaker 08

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• 35:23Ed Elson?

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• 35:31Ed Elson?

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• 37:33Ed Elson?

  We're back with Prof G Markets. So this is a show, as you all know, about the markets, which sit at the center of almost every part of our lives. We created this show, it's getting on close to four years now, which is crazy, with a simple goal, to help people better understand how markets work. But it is getting harder to do that at a time when faith in the system itself is starting to erode. Only 54% of Americans today say that they have a positive view of capitalism, which is the system that runs markets, and it's increasingly not hard to understand why. Over the past few months, we have seen repeated evidence that markets may not be truly fair and transparent.

• 38:18Ed Elson?

  President Trump recently disclosed more than 3,700 trades in American companies during the first quarter, most of which were made before he revealed these key developments related to the companies. Millions of dollars of unusually well-timed trades were also made right before he made major announcements related to Iran, related to Venezuela, related to the tariffs and Liberation Day, much, much more. In sum, as Secretary Clinton pointed out, insider trading in this administration at least is alive and well. So tonight, we wanted to speak with someone who is uniquely qualified to answer the questions many are asking right now. Why should ordinary investors believe in the markets when it feels as if they're rigged? As the founder and managing partner of Skybridge Capital,

• 39:03Ed Elson?

  he spent decades navigating markets and helping investors make sense of them. He famously served in the Trump administration and has since become one of the president's most outspoken critics. Ladies and gentlemen, please welcome to the stage our very good friend, Anthony Scaramucci.

• 39:33Ed Elson?

  He's wearing the hat. We love it.

• 39:36Anthony Scaramucci?

  I hope I get a chance to keep it. That's fair enough. Okay, I got Nixon five. Okay, that's my bet.

• 39:43Ed Elson?

  Nixon five. That's good. How you doing, Mooch?

• 39:46Anthony Scaramucci?

  I'm doing great. I mean, I thought the secretary was on point. Is she running, Scott? If she's running, I'll knock on doors with you. How about that? Okay, I'll go out there.

• 39:54Scott Galloway?

  Hey.

• 39:55Anthony Scaramucci?

  I've done that once or twice before.

• 39:56Scott Galloway?

  I find that pretty much anyone who agrees to come on my podcast is running for president.

• 40:02Ed Elson?

  Hey, I'm really. The question is, when are you running out there?

• 40:04Anthony Scaramucci?

  I'm really, yeah, when are you running, Mooch? I'm just running for reelection to my marriage, by the way. I'm running for president. But anyway, all right, go ahead. I mean, I, and by the way, I could be, I could be term limited in marriage. You gotta be careful. It's a constant campaign. All right, but go ahead. You don't have to, you don't have to worry about that, Ed. Scott and I have.

• 40:22Ed Elson?

  You don't worry about it?

• 40:22Anthony Scaramucci?

  Scott and I have had that experience. We've had that obviously.

• 40:24Scott Galloway?

  Early voting is pretty ugly.

• 40:28Anthony Scaramucci?

  The polls weren't great a few years ago, let's face it, but anyway. All right, go ahead.

• 40:33Ed Elson?

  So Mooch, I want to just review some of the corruption that we've talked about. These 3,700 trades. You and I talked about this on a show a few weeks ago, but I just want to make sure that we're all on the same page and that we're not in belief that, I don't know, that I have some sort of Trump derangement syndrome or something. I just want to go through what we have actually seen in the last few months. So Trump made 3,700 trades in the first quarter. He bought Oracle right before he finalized the deal for Oracle to buy TikTok. He bought Nvidia right before he approved Nvidia to sell chips to China. He bought Dell right before Dell signed a $10 billion contract with the Pentagon. Stock is ripping right now. His sons invested in these drone companies right before they also

• 41:16Ed Elson?

  signed contracts with the Pentagon and right before we went to war. He made almost a billion dollars selling crypto. His family has made an estimated two and a half billion dollars since he took office. Do you think it would be fair to call this the most corrupt administration we've seen? And if so, what does it mean for investors?

• 41:34Anthony Scaramucci?

  I mean, listen, there's, there's a lot there. So it's obviously it's a very corrupt thing that they're doing. You could go back through our history. The Teapot Dome scandal was very similar, also very corrupt. And what they're, what they're doing, and Trump said this, I don't know if anybody caught this, but he was outside in a press gaggle as he was going to the helicopter, and somebody called him out on it, and that almost similar to what you were saying, but much, you know, what you're doing is unfair. He looked at the people said, well, first of all, I have the right to do it. It's questionable whether he does or not, but there is a scene there which I can share with you. And then the second thing he said is, it's peanuts. He always says that, like, it's not that much money, one or two billion dollars. But, but that's what he

• 42:19Anthony Scaramucci?

  said. Okay. And then the third thing that he said, which should scare everybody in the room, and it has to get you awake, and you have to get motivated on this. He said, and I quote, "And people don't care." Okay. And what they're doing in Washington is they're using our collective apathy as permission to do certain things. So if Hegseth is going to fire John Fallon, as an example, he goes to Fallon and says, hey, I want to build these ships. We've got to build them super fast. Trump wants to build them super fast. And Fallon says, well, the law requires me to put the bid out, the three or four vendors and get the low cost bid. And then Hegseth says, no, no, no, I want you to put it out to one.

• 43:05Anthony Scaramucci?

  Bitter, because that's going to expedite the process and probably there is a little bit of a vig going to Trump and his family members in that bid. And Phelan says no, and then Phelan gets fired. You see, see what I'm saying? And again, general apathy about the whole thing. So, yes, it's very, very corrupt, but if the people in this room don't get motivated and people around the country do not get motivated and say, "We've had enough," it's sort of like networks. Scott and I are old enough to remember network. Remember, I'm mad as hell and I'm not gonna... I know what you're talking about. I'm mad as hell and I'm not gonna take it anymore. That's the messaging, okay? But I want to, I want to talk about something that people should understand. 60 Minutes is in the news right now.

• 43:47Anthony Scaramucci?

  In 2011, 15 short years ago, 60 Minutes did a special on congressional insider trading. And Peter Schweitzer had actually wrote a book about this whole thing. And they voted to negate congressional insider trading. And there was an eight-month period of time where the Congress could not participate in insider trading. And you know what they did, guys? They went by voice vote, so they would be off of C-SPAN. And they did a voice vote into the telephones and they voted it back in. Yeah. Okay? And so people don't remember this, because again, they did it on the sly. And I'm going to tell you the silver lining to all this.

• 44:28Anthony Scaramucci?

  Trump has been so wildly egregious that maybe this will now be the opportunity where people will take everything that he's doing and say, "Okay, he broke every norm and standard, so now let's codify the country to protect the next person that takes that job." And that's what you gotta hope, whether it's, honestly, you gotta hope that, whether it's Secretary Clinton, if she becomes president in 2028, Pritzker, Gavin, pick the person that becomes president, you gotta hope and pray that that person is a transformational and in some ways, post-partisan leader, where they say, "Okay, it's not going to be left or right, it's going to be what's right or wrong for the country."

• 45:09Anthony Scaramucci?

  And these were norms and standards that were adhered to from George Washington up until Barack Obama, and then for a four-year period of time, Joe Biden. And he came in with like an orange wrecking ball and smashed these, okay? And so we're going to repair them first before we do anything else. I think that's necessary. And, and recognize...

• 45:33Ed Elson?

  And recognize that it's happening on both sides. And you and I have talked about this. I mean, the Pelosi index has been absolutely crushing in recent years. Perhaps the only index doing better is the Trump index.

• 45:43Anthony Scaramucci?

  Listen, I got, I got a couple billion under management. I can't beat Nancy Pelosi. I got, I got buddies that got 70 billion under management, 25 offices, getting their asses kicked by Nancy. Okay. I mean, you gotta just, I mean, it's unbelievable.

• 45:56Ed Elson?

  Smart investing mind. I just want to point out one statistic. You, you point out how, how the American people, Trump says, the American people don't care. This was a, some survey data that I cited in Miami that just really struck me. They did a poll. They, they asked Trump voters about this issue. Half of Trump voters think that Trump hasn't profited in this presidency whatsoever. They, they genuinely believe this, that, that he hasn't made a dime. And, you know, I've gone through the data. You can either say that the data is fake news. You can say it's, it's a lie, whatever you want to think. I mean, I guess my question to you, is it a problem of we're not talking about it enough?

• 46:38Ed Elson?

  Or people don't want to hear it? Or I guess as Trump says himself, people just don't really care?

• 46:43Anthony Scaramucci?

  It's all those things. But again, it's, you know, you, you've got, you're under your crowd, this audience here, us, I would say we're high information voters. We're consuming the information. We're looking for the information.

• 46:55Ed Elson?

  Right.

• 46:56Anthony Scaramucci?

  Average American is not doing that. On the 4th of November, 2024, the evening of the election, November 5th being the election, the most searchable term was, did Joe Biden drop out? Because I just want you to think about that. The average American coming home tired, maybe blue collar worker. Okay, I'm going to go vote tomorrow. My union needs me to go vote. Who the hell is running? Biden's the president, right? Oh, wait a minute. Who's, oh wait, did Joe Biden drop out? Okay. So I just want to give you a sense for where the country is.

• 47:31Ed Elson?

  Right.

• 47:32Anthony Scaramucci?

  Okay. And by the way, you can like or dislike Donald Trump. We've got to talk honestly. He went into those territories of the country. He went in there with his MAGA hats. He went in there with his YMCA song and all the different things that he did. And so we laugh about it, but they show up for it. Okay, and I will tell you that the Democratic Party that I grew up with here in the city of New York, you know, Secretary Clinton mentioned Mario Cuomo, obviously, my family knew his family, Lyndon Johnson, Jack Kennedy, Bobby Kennedy, they were focused on those people. They went into those towns and said, "We're gonna make your lives better, and we're gonna do that."

• 48:15Anthony Scaramucci?

  And, you know, people are not gonna like this, but I want to share this with you because I want to leave this with you. And I only remember one thing I say tonight, remember this, and it doesn't reflect well on me. When I was with Donald Trump, I went to New Mexico with him in May of 2016, and I went into the Albuquerque Civic Center, and he had Secret Service with him, and so we had to wear these day pins, and I said to the Secret Service guy, "What is this, sir?" He said, "Well, if the shooting starts, we know you're with us, we won't shoot at you." I'm like, doing it like this with the pin. I took the pin off, I crossed the security perimeter, and I went into the crowd. And I started asking people why they were there.

• 48:57Anthony Scaramucci?

  And one young gentleman said to me, "Well, you know, my father was at a factory for 30 years. I was working there for 12. They closed the factory." "Anthony, you think you're in New Mexico?" "Well, no, new New Mexico, that would be Mexico, because that's where the factory went to." "I'm out of a job. I'm working at Lowe's, the home improvement center, delivering pizza at night." And I got hit in the head with a rock, because I grew up, my dad was a crane operator, my mom was a makeup artist. I'm MAC 5, that's my color scheme. If anybody wants to get me a Christmas gift, okay? Scott's a little lighter than me, in case, you know, okay, probably 6.

• 49:39Anthony Scaramucci?

  But anyway, I looked at that young man, and I said, "So, what should we do?" He said, "Well, I don't know."

• 49:47Anthony Scaramucci?

  But we were once, blue collar, economically aspirational. And today, we are now, blue collar, economically desperation. And guys, I missed it, okay? Because I went to Tufts and Harvard, I grew up in a blue collar family, but I started to pick up the collective biases of the people that I was hanging out with. So I went to Goldman Sachs, and I was in the salons of the wealthy, and I built a hedge fund. And I missed what was going on in a very large portion of America. And I just insist that everybody think about this, and whoever the presidential candidates are, he or she, you gotta go and meet these people, and you have to accept these people,

• 50:32Anthony Scaramucci?

  and embrace these people, and try to bring them back into the system. I think it's very, very important for us to do that. And I'll just tell you, I missed it, Scott. And when you go to those places, you'll be sad. You'll be like, okay, you know, people feel a sense of economic desperation, you know? But the secretary didn't mention, because she probably didn't have enough time, we're gonna take 17 million people off the healthcare scrolls. Right after the midterms, they did it. Think about the pathology of that, and the premeditation. The SNAP benefits, you know, I work alongside of the Civil Health, maybe you guys have heard of it, it's one of the largest food banks in the country. We have over a million people.

• 51:15Anthony Scaramucci?

  It's out in Brooklyn, my wife and I were there on Friday, talking about the organizational structure, and how we can raise more money. You have 1.2 million people in this city, think about this city, and the glory of this city, we have 1.2 million people in this city that are food insecure, over half of them are children. Okay? We also know, when we go into the schools, we go into the public schools, and you say to the kid, "Well, why aren't you doing well?" And you know what the kids say? "I'm hungry. I'm starving." You know, I can't think about the lesson, because I got to the school hungry, and we're slashing all those food programs.

• 51:55Anthony Scaramucci?

  Now, again, in New York, we're not, Hochul held the line on that, Mondani held the line on that. You were talking about the popularity of socialism for a second. If we don't figure out ways to create a bigger platform of equal opportunity in the country... You're gonna lose the capitalism because you know, I'm okay with the unequal outcomes, but you better get some sense of fairness going, no matter who's born into whose family and what the zip codes are, because if we don't do that, you're gonna lose the structure that has made the country so prosperous.

• 52:37Scott Galloway?

  Let's double click on that, because you have kids, I have kids, and there's a lot of times when my boys think something, and I literally just wanna grab them by the lapels and shake them and go, "Just trust me, you don't understand how stupid you're being."

• 52:56Anthony Scaramucci?

  I need to have you to come over to my house. I need some help with that. I'm basically a pussy as a parent, but go ahead, keep going.

• 53:04Scott Galloway?

  Well, you realize, I talk a bit, yeah. You realize, you realize that doesn't work. And I feel that way whenever I hear someone his age talking about socialism. And it's like, do you have any sense of history of how superior capitalism is a system in terms of generosity, creating tax revenue, leveraging the most powerful aspect of our species and that is self-interest, such that we can create the revenue to help the poor and lift them up? What, I mean, how do we, how do we get Gen Z and millennials? What is the messaging around, okay, you know, capitalism is, what's going on now is not capitalism, it's cronyism.

• 53:48Anthony Scaramucci?

  Yeah, we both know that.

• 53:49Scott Galloway?

  How would you communicate to someone that's younger than us? I'm Gen X, you're a baby boomer, you're much older than me.

• 53:57Anthony Scaramucci?

  But I actually am older than him, okay?

• 54:00Scott Galloway?

  Yes.

• 54:00Anthony Scaramucci?

  And he doesn't have any hair, but I'm dying my hair, okay? So this is Latin American dictator brown, if you go to the colorist.

• 54:09Scott Galloway?

  Look at that hair. Seriously, look at that hair.

• 54:12Anthony Scaramucci?

  I was just letting you know.

• 54:13Scott Galloway?

  It's too good.

• 54:14Anthony Scaramucci?

  I was using Maduro black until he got arrested. I think I better lighten it up a little bit. Okay, keep going, Scott.

• 54:30Scott Galloway?

  What do you think the message is to young people around capitalism being the worst system of its kind, except for all the rest, as Churchill said?

• 54:39Anthony Scaramucci?

  Okay, so I would say a couple of things. We gotta teach them our history. And one of the great books about this is H.W. Brands' book, The Traitor to His Class. And it's about the great aristocrat Franklin Delano Roosevelt, who looked at the structure of the capitalism, some of the cronyism that was going on, the rigging of the markets, guys. You know, Joe Kennedy made a fortune rigging the markets, lots of insider trading. And he said, okay, what we need to do is we gotta make it fairer. So if we regulate it, if we end the corruption, the Trump-like corruption, people will think it's fairer, number one. Number two, if we provide some baseline help, social security, lots of the

• 55:18Anthony Scaramucci?

  work projects that went on in the 1930s, and one of the greatest inventions for middle-class aspiration in the history of the world, the GI Bill, which was an accidental thing, guys, okay? And so these GIs, you had Jews from East New York, Italians from Brooklyn, you had Irish guys from Hell's Kitchen. They came back to New York. Their parents never went to college. And they now had this opportunity to go to college. And they went from blue-collar jobs and laboring-oriented jobs to white-collar jobs. And so the message should be, there's

• 55:57Anthony Scaramucci?

  a harmony between the government and business. I'm all about capitalism. I want there to be capitalism. We agree on that. But there has to be a regulated capitalism, because greed in a society always overcomes wisdom. And what we find, when you get an oligarch-like figure, they'll create a funnel at the top. And they'll all sit around and they'll spin the dial and they'll they'll create wealth for themselves and they'll leave everybody else behind. And so, one of the great things about the structure of the government was its decentralization. You know, this is a Madisonian, Jeffersonian structure to protect every citizen and to endow you with your

• 56:39Anthony Scaramucci?

  individual liberty, which gives you the right to execute the capitalism. But when you are in a structure that is damaged like this, it needs to be reset. And I would go out to all these guys and talk about Roosevelt, talk about the Kennedys, talk about the Civil Rights Reformation in the 1960s. I say we're at our best when there is a harmony with the government, where the government's helping the public schools, the government's helping to feed people, balance the system, hand check the super greedy, so that every person in the room can seek their aspiration. And so, again, I'm for unequal outcomes. You guys have done an amazing job with your podcast, all your great businesses. You should certainly

• 57:21Anthony Scaramucci?

  have economic rent associated with that. These entrepreneurs should always benefit from that. But the flip side is, I didn't pick the place that I was born. I don't think you guys did either. This is a rich enough society, and this is a very generous culture. If you look at the philanthropy in the United States, we have to set the culture up, so no matter where you were born, you get a package of services, some food and some healthcare and some basic education, so that you can get to the starting block, so that you can go up against people that have their family names endowed on libraries and stuff like that around the country.

• 57:57Scott Galloway?

  So, speaking-

• 57:58Anthony Scaramucci?

  So, it's a history lesson in there, as well as economics.

• 58:01Scott Galloway?

  Speaking of starting block, I want to move on from something more important than the future of our country. I want to talk about upcoming tech IPOs.

• 58:10Scott Galloway?

  Just curious, you're a markets guy.

• 58:12Anthony Scaramucci?

  Yeah.

• 58:12Scott Galloway?

  Curious to get your take on Anthropic. $150 billion raised, $4 trillion valuation SpaceX, Anthropic, OpenAI. Just curious to get your thoughts about those IPOs and the respective valuations.

• 58:25Anthony Scaramucci?

  Okay, well, I've listened to, I listened to Prop G, so I don't want to over be redundant to what you guys said about the S1 for SpaceX, but obviously that business is not worth that kind of money. But let me say something as a market participant for 40 years, Elon Musk is a human meme. And if you understand what I mean by that, he is game stock or he is a, he's a meme. And so for whatever reason, there's always a bee swarm of retail activity around the stuff that he's doing. And now we could agree with that or disagree with that. Certainly Kara, who left the stage a few minutes ago, doesn't agree with it.

• 59:01Scott Galloway?

  But if you got allocation in the IPO, 1.8 trillion, would you buy in?

• 59:05Anthony Scaramucci?

  Yes, I probably, I probably would because I believe that he has a lot of execution gifts. And I said this, actually, I think I subbed for you on Pivot when the, when the S1 was announced and I said, listen, I fully disclose, I own some SpaceX. I bought it a few years ago. It's obviously up a lot in valuation. And so, yes, I would probably participate in the, in the IPO because I think he is an execution oriented guy that would figure it out. Anthropic's a totally different beast.

• 59:38Scott Galloway?

  So hold on, there's a difference between execution and rah rah and figuring out a way to create a meme stock out of something going out at 100 times revenues. But you think there's execution that can backfill that kind of valuation?

• 59:52Anthony Scaramucci?

  Well, he did it once before in Tesla and I watched the hedge fund manager buddies of mine get their faces ripped off in Tesla. And if we were sitting up here 10 years ago and we went through that S1, it'd actually look worse on a comparative basis to SpaceX. So I, I guess what I would say to you, the paradigm has shifted in the markets and you have to sort of see that. John Maynard Keynes said something way better than me, so I'll paraphrase it. And John Maynard Keynes is a brilliant stock market speculator. And he said, you know, I'm one of the judges at a beauty contest, but it's not for me to judge beauty. It's for me to think about what the other judges think are beautiful.

• 1:00:33Ed Elson?

  Yes.

• 1:00:34Anthony Scaramucci?

  And once I figure out what that is, that's where I'm going to make my selection. And it's a way to think about the markets. And so I may not agree with the beauty of SpaceX. But when I talk to my hedge fund manager friends, my institutional investors, my former, I used to work at Goldman, investment bankers at Goldman, pricing the deal, I'm like, okay, this will have some buoyancy to it, it'll have a leg up on others. And so I, I don't want to, certainly wouldn't be short it, let me put it that way. I've seen people really get hurt shorting assets like that, even though they look fundamentally inferior.

• 1:01:09Ed Elson?

  Along those lines, it's really interesting you bring up the Keynesian beauty contest, which I also love. But that also seems to be a little bit of a signal of a bubble. What's that?

• 1:01:19Anthony Scaramucci?

  What was that?

• 1:01:20Scott Galloway?

  I just said Princeton, I don't know.

• 1:01:22Anthony Scaramucci?

  Princeton.

• 1:01:23Ed Elson?

  That seems to be a little bit of a signal of a bubble, the idea that you're, it's not that you find the product or the company beautiful, but everyone else does. And if everyone else does, then maybe I should too. And I think the other, the thing that people are probably getting worried about when it comes to these IPOs, I mean, you don't have to buy SpaceX if you don't want to, if you think the fundamentals aren't in shape. And so, you know, I'm not going to buy it. But they are changing the rules for the index funds, specifically the NASDAQ, so that SpaceX automatically does go into these passive index funds. So what they're going to do is they're going to, they're calling it fast entry rules for these mega cap companies, essentially rewriting the rules of passive investing so that you can invest immediately

• 1:02:06Ed Elson?

  in SpaceX, in Anthropic, in OpenAI. And that gets to a point where now we actually don't have a choice. Whether I think it's a good company or not, if I own the NASDAQ and even the S and P is considering rewriting their profitability rules in order to include SpaceX, you have to own it anyway. That seems to be a concern and it goes back again to this idea where we talk about the markets seem to be, the rules of the game seem to be rigged. We seem to be kind of shifting the rules around what Trump wants or around what Elon wants. He's the one who pushed for this with the NASDAQ. Concerned about that at all from a

• 1:02:41Anthony Scaramucci?

  Okay, so this is, this is, first of all, it's great analysis, but let me provide some historical context, because this is important. We had something called Sarbanes-Oxley, I think you guys would remember that, it was extra regulatory process, it created a tremendous burden on private companies if they were to go public. And we had the global financial crisis added another layer. And ladies and gentlemen, if you go back, something like SpaceX would have gone public with a $300 billion market cap, or $150 billion market cap, under a different regulatory rubric. But what happened is, because it was so difficult to go public, under the current regulations, the retail participants,

• 1:03:24Anthony Scaramucci?

  unfortunately, were left out of it. Okay, and I think there was an unfairness to that. And if I were, not that I would ever be the SEC chairman, but I would say to people, we gotta be very careful to over-regulate, because we want to make sure that the retail investors have an opportunity to participate in these things. So, all of these things, from a 40-year perspective of the markets, as long as I've been in the markets, they're coming public too late. And they're coming public with these very high valuations, which is unfair to the retail investor. So now, think about it this way, the company's already a trillion-dollar company, okay? And so what should have happened, it should have went public at 150, the rules would have applied, it got itself to a

• 1:04:08Anthony Scaramucci?

  trillion, and then it entered. You see, you see what I'm saying? So, so I'm just saying to you, I see both sides of it. I would have argued against it, I would have said, no, the rules have to stay, and they have to not be in, they can't get fast-tracked into the S and P. But Ed, and ladies and gentlemen, Ed just proved my point, why I want to be a part of it. Because let me tell you what happens in our society. If it goes in the S and P, all the institutions, all the 401ks, all the people that buy the S and P, guess what happens? They buy it. And you'll be stepping in front of a freight train, you'll be trying to pick up a penny in front of a steamroller. So, I can't live in a society the way I want it. I've just accepted that, you know? I tell my kids,

• 1:04:53Anthony Scaramucci?

  hey, you want to curse, we're cursors, I'm an Italian from Long Island. Okay, but there are two words, you know, and I got fired from the White House for fucking cursing, can you believe that? In the, in the, in the Trump White House. Can you fucking believe that? I mean, come on. I, I somehow forgot about that. All right.

• 1:05:11Scott Galloway?

  I think you're being hard. I think you got fired for other reasons.

• 1:05:14Anthony Scaramucci?

  But, but I did, I actually, I actually did get fired for way more other reasons, but, you know, you guys, you guys don't have the time for all those reasons and, you know, I tell my therapist that shit. But anyway, let me.

• 1:05:26Scott Galloway?

  Go ahead, sir.

• 1:05:27Anthony Scaramucci?

  But I, I just, I just want to make this point, okay? And I want you guys to think about this. The two words that are the worst words are should and ought. I tell my kids, you start with that stuff, I'm gonna cut you right down. You know, the world should be a certain way. I ought to have gotten a 36 on the ACT and I ought to have gotten into Princeton. You know what? The world does not work that way. Life is unfair. You have to deal with the world the way it is and not play the victim. These rules suck. I think it's wrong to do it. But now I'm sitting at the turret. I've got investors, I've got my own money that I gotta worry about, and I have to look at the world the way it is.

• 1:06:12Anthony Scaramucci?

  Now, I can try to reform it. I can try to speak out against it. I can try to give money to politicians or knock on doors for politicians that will try to make the world better. But you gotta be very, very careful in this world as an investor and never use the words ought and should because you're gonna get yourself in a lot of trouble because we do not live in a normalized world. We live in a real world.

• 1:06:35Scott Galloway?

  So just as we wrap up here.

• 1:06:38Anthony Scaramucci?

  Sorry. It deserves to be booed, by the way. But by the way, when you boo, all I hear is mooch, by the way. Yeah, mooch. That's all I hear. That's all I hear.

• 1:06:47Scott Galloway?

  Just as we wrap up here, I have this.

• 1:06:49Anthony Scaramucci?

  Do I get to keep the hat or? Yeah. Yeah. That's yours. Fantastic. All right, go ahead.

• 1:06:54Scott Galloway?

  If I had your hair, I'd be fucking Cher. I'd grow it down to here.

• 1:06:59Scott Galloway?

  Just as we wrap up here, we talk a lot about, I'm part of this Reddit group or in the Zoom group where we talk about brands that accelerate or decelerate.

• 1:07:07Anthony Scaramucci?

  Yeah.

• 1:07:08Scott Galloway?

  Papacy way up in brand equity, Ferrari way down with that abomination, the tech has now infected Ferrari.

• 1:07:13Anthony Scaramucci?

  That was bad.

• 1:07:14Scott Galloway?

  But we talk about people whose brands have gone up and gone down.

• 1:07:18Anthony Scaramucci?

  Yeah.

• 1:07:19Scott Galloway?

  And I argued, or I was making the point that I think you have registered from a few years ago, the greatest brand accretion of almost any individual I know.

• 1:07:28Anthony Scaramucci?

  Thank you.

• 1:07:29Scott Galloway?

  Because you were.

• 1:07:30Anthony Scaramucci?

  Couldn't have gone any fucking lower than I was, actually. I'm in the fucking basement of the town hall, by the way, but that's fine. All right, go ahead.

• 1:07:37Scott Galloway?

  But the lesson I want you to, or what you want to talk about, for people who are, quite frankly, find themselves in a position where the brand just isn't very strong, can you share kind of that moment and any lessons for how to come back? Because I'm very, very serious. Your brand has skyrocketed.

• 1:07:57Anthony Scaramucci?

  Well, first of all, it's very sweet of you, Scott. You know, I love you and if I had your height, the world would have been a way better place. But let me just tell you something, for all you short people out there like me, we have more oxygen down here. Just remember that. Too thin the oxygen, but.

• 1:08:11Scott Galloway?

  See, I look at your hair and I think I'd be polling number two behind Newsom.

• 1:08:14Anthony Scaramucci?

  Well, I'm gonna, I'm gonna set the scene for you. I know we have to go, but I want to take you to one of the worst days of my life. Okay, you ready? It was Monday, July 31st, 2017. Do you guys want to know how I knew I got fired? Do you want to know? They issue you a White House bat phone. This isn't, you know, impregnated, codified phone. You can't get spyware into the phone. You're supposed to only contact cabinet members and other White House staff with that phone. Of course, Pete Hexes didn't get the message. He was using WhatsApp. I got the phone. And on that Monday, when I turned the phone on, it wasn't working.

• 1:08:58Anthony Scaramucci?

  They had cut my air supply at 6:00 a.m., so I knew I was getting fired. I got fired at 9:30. But I want to set the day for you. I'm fired from the White House after 11 days.

• 1:09:10Anthony Scaramucci?

  One Scaramucci, as we all know. You could say 954,000 seconds, sometimes that makes me feel better. Uh, my wife is sore at me, okay? My wife hates Donald Trump almost as much as Melania hates him, and I'm talking aside. That is like, some Eastern European ancestral motherfucking hatred, okay? You know what I'm talking about, okay? So my wife hates him, she filed for divorce on me, I'm not making this up. Okay, guys, on the 24th of July, I missed the birth of my son. Okay, that's a true story. I was in West Virginia with the president. Uh, Deirdre and I were fighting, but I was scheduled to be at the birth.

• 1:09:54Anthony Scaramucci?

  He was due on August 8th, maybe the stress of the whole situation, she gave birth early. There's a 60-mile no-fly zone around Air Force One. I was 70 miles out in the woods at the Boy Scouts summer camp where Trump was making a speech. There, Scott, there was no way back to New York. Okay, guys, everything was going badly. And if you ever need to pick me up and it's not cancer, call me, okay? Because I was having a really shitty day compared to what could happen to you. So I'm now fired, I've got to repair my marriage. I've got to heal the situation by missing the birth of my son. I've got to face the music from the late-night comedians.

• 1:10:38Anthony Scaramucci?

  I mean, you know, Colbert called me a Jersey Shore cast member. I think, uh, I think, uh, I mean, it's fucking funny, you can laugh at it, okay? I, I thought it was funny. Pretty good. Uh, Bill Maher, a show you and I have been on many times, he said, I think he said it was Tony Soprano on the Potomac. I mean, he was, I was getting hit, I was getting hit every which way. Uh, and I think, you know, they were, they were really lighting me up on Saturday Night Live. Somebody called me human cocaine, it was like really bad. Anyway, anyway, now I got to repair this, okay? I go to see this like, PR crisis management person. And you know, the guy who says, the guy who says, "Look, man, this is terrible."

• 1:11:20Anthony Scaramucci?

  You got some dough? Go buy a villa in Italy, we'll see you in five years. Okay, it's not, I mean, you're never gonna recover from this. Come back to the country in 2022. Okay, and I want to leave you with a couple of thoughts. I went right on The Colbert Show. Okay, I went out to Bill Maher. I faced the music of Saturday Night Live. I went back on television. I met Scott Galloway and Ed Elson. And I faced the music, and I can take you through the mistakes I made. And it's nine years later, my son is turning nine on the 4th of July 24th. My marriage is still intact, name of the Father, Son, and the Holy Ghost. You know, thank God.

• 1:12:02Anthony Scaramucci?

  Okay, and we're probably stronger than ever because we were able to not make our relationship disposable. So if you're going through something, and you're in this audience, and you've got some angst going on, stay in it. Don't walk away from it, care less about what other people think, get focused on the things that really matter. And that firing, as hard as it was on me, it made me more psychologically minded, it made me more empathetic, and you probably wouldn't even know who the hell I was, okay, if that didn't happen. And I certainly wouldn't have these two great friends of mine, which I'm very grateful for. And I'll leave you with that.

• 1:12:40Ed Elson?

  Anthony Scaramucci.

• 1:13:07Ed Elson?

  All right. This episode was produced by Prof G Media and Vox Media. Thank you for joining us live in New York. If you liked what you heard, make sure you're following us on YouTube, Spotify, wherever you get your podcasts. We hope to see you again soon. Good night, everyone.

• 1:13:50Speaker 13

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