SC EP:1289 The Triangle Series II

Derek will be returning for part two of the The Triangle Series. Derek Condit, an author, researcher, psychic intuitive, inventor, U. S. Army veteran, and former Washington State correctional officer. Based in the Pacific Northwest, Derek explores the fascinating intersection of documented history, eyewitness testimony, unexplained phenomena, folklore, and personal experience. His work examines the stories and events that challenge our understanding of the world around us. Derek is the creator of The Triangle Series, a collection of books investigating regions associated with unusual activity including UFO encounters, Bigfoot and cryptid sightings, paranormal experiences, unexplained lights, historic mysteries, and other events that defy easy explanation. Check Out The Triangle Series https://www.amazon.com/Seattle-Triangle-Strange-Unsolved-Cascades/dp/B0HDL7SM57/ref=sr_1_1?crid=21JMUA91SY8FN&dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.4SluV6FHHMQTqMnraVugCHej-7JC1RG-XQnM2Bvo5OphEQJwB1RXH0o0OPmWA6dllPEdtq0p8pBhWmTeYaDAK34cJJkILri19xkErVB5FnIr2eG72lDDyfSXYkUPXqP8MKDFUMc5lVh_LdEcijGfta9Zn3_o6vf5oGoPLv2KrYq7DIXrKp0gCvsgiWI-y2fa4zpy0uby_rZuqfTp6J0aSr9mkbrEtcXGTejlH8lLxIE.jwJk-ZnN7esmz3eoa-uISuqq_GP3N4NnpPOBzD_GDXk&dib_tag=se&keywords=Derek+Condit&qid=1787609644&s=books&sprefix=derek+condit%2Cstripbooks%2C179&sr=1-1 His approach is open minded and story-driven. Rather than dismissing experiences simply because they fall outside conventional understanding, Derek allows witnesses to share their stories and examines the possibilities surrounding what they encountered. His interest in the unexplained is also deeply personal. Derek has experienced unexplained phenomena firsthand, including a Bigfoot encounter in Washington State. As Derek explains: "My connection to these subjects is also deeply personal. Both my 87-year-old father, a former NSA agent, and I have had our own Bigfoot encounters. Mine occurred in Washington State, while his took place in Northern California." Derek's 16 years as a Washington State correctional officer also provided him with numerous unusual experiences. Some occurred inside the Washington State Reformatory, while others took place during night-shift assignments outside the prison. These firsthand encounters, combined with years of research, have shaped Derek's unique perspective on the unexplained. Cosmic Shungite: https://www. CosmicShungite.com https://www.cosmicshungite.com/ Bigfoot's Gems: https://www. BigfootsGems.com https://www.bigfootsgems.com/

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:03Speaker 00

  It looked like somebody was bent over and had their head in the window of the deer blind. It either heard me or smelt me and he pulled his head out of the tent and stood straight up and that shocked me.

• 0:24Speaker 00

  They don't make people that, that big.

• 0:31Speaker 01

  The way it moved, almost as if it was gliding across the beach. I've never seen anything move like that in my life.

• 0:45Speaker 01

  They were screaming at each other in gibberish.

• 0:49Speaker 01

  It sounded like a language and they were chuntering away, back and forwards, back and forwards, back and forwards.

• 0:57Speaker 01

  I know what a bear looks like and there is no way on this planet that what I saw bears.

• 1:14Speaker 02

  911, what are you reporting?

• 1:16Speaker 03

  Jesus Christ, you better, Karen, see ya.

• 1:19Speaker 02

  Hello?

• 1:20Speaker 03

  Get somebody out here.

• 1:22Speaker 02

  What's going on now, sir?

• 1:23Speaker 03

  That son of a bitch is about six foot nine, I don't know.

• 1:26Speaker 02

  Do you see him now, sir?

• 1:27Speaker 03

  Yes, I'm looking right at him. Uh-oh.

• 1:37Speaker 04

  This is Boston Billy. You're listening to Sasquatch Chronicles. Let's go, baby.

• 2:11Wes Germer?

  Welcome to the show, everyone. Thanks for being here tonight. On last night's member show, I spoke with Ben, who is from Georgia. And Ben shared his encounters on his property, not only his encounters, but family members who had run into the creature. And as Ben and I were talking, I was kind of looking at the area of his property and it hit me. He basically lived next door to the, uh, where the Elkins Creek cast was taken. You guys remember episode 148, when I interviewed Deputy Jim Atkin? He kept getting called out to this property where this old couple lived.

• 2:54Wes Germer?

  And they would constantly call 911. They lived out in the middle of nowhere. And Jim didn't believe in Bigfoot. He thought it was all complete nonsense. And every time he went out there, he kept finding more and more evidence that this old couple was telling the truth. And I don't know if you guys remember episode 148. Jim talked about the creature coming up to this old couple's home and calling for their dog. Their dog's name was Peanut. Here's a clip from episode 148. The audio is terrible because I had no clue what I was doing at the time, but take a listen.

• 3:33Speaker 06

  The mother of little dog inside the house's name was Peanut. And this is where things I knew had taken a strong, strange bent. Because he reported on that one, on that particular one, he said, they come up here, you know, they tap on the house, they hit the house. And he said, that son of a gun, he's making fun of me. And I said, what do you mean he's making fun of you? Because he said, he's whispering Peanut's name through the wall. I said, what? He's whispering your dog's name? Yes.

• 4:08Speaker 06

  He said that whoever it was would get outside of his bedroom. And, you know, he said it had a real low voice and go Peanut, like that. Well, during the daytime, not at night, the little dog, he was a little chihuahua mix. He'd let Peanut out to use, you know, the bathroom, do his business. And when he called him back, he'd stand on his front porch and yell Peanut, Peanut, Peanut, you know? Try to get the dog to come back to the house. Well, I knew then, I said, okay, if we're dealing with a human being now, because he's heard a voice, he's heard somebody.

• 4:50Speaker 06

  I don't know. I mean, to tell you, because I didn't believe in this. And I don't know about you, Wes, but you know, every once in a while, I still don't believe in it. It's almost like this couldn't be, this is a part of my reality. It's so alien from what I believe about the world that it shifted how you see things now.

• 5:17Wes Germer?

  You know, after I talked to Jim, I was thinking, God, I would love to talk to a neighbor in that area to see if they're experiencing what this older couple was talking about. And Ben lived right there and he had a lot of encounters to share. So thank you, Ben, for coming on. And tonight I'll be welcoming back to the show, Derek Cunden. He's the author of the Triangle series. And it's a collection of books investigating regions associated with UFO encounters, Bigfoot, cryptid sightings, paranormal experiences, any strange mysteries in a particular area. And I've been reading the Seattle Triangle book. I'm actually still reading it.

• 6:02Wes Germer?

  And I have actually really enjoyed reading Derek's books. If you get a chance, I'll include a link below. Go and check out his books and I'll include a link for Derek's website and also his store, Bigfoot Gems. If you've had an encounter and you'd like to be on the show, shoot me an email. My email address is [email protected]. And if you get a chance to check out sasquatchchronicles.com, you can become a member and get additional shows. Let's jump into part two of the Triangle series. Derek, welcome back to the show.

• 6:42Speaker 07

  Yeah, thanks for having me back. I'm looking forward to it.

• 6:44Wes Germer?

  Yeah, I appreciate you being here. And I know last time we really didn't get a chance to pull very many accounts from your books. And so tonight, what I thought we'd do is kind of, I know you have some accounts pulled aside. If you would, for the audience, would you kind of share one of the accounts that you've pulled?

• 7:05Speaker 07

  Yeah, the first one, so what I did was put together some, a couple of short summaries of a few of the stories. And the first one can be found in the Oregon Triangle book and it's called the Lake Harriet Mine Creature. That's actually one that started relatively recently, um, because a lot of these stories go back or encounters or events, you know, decades. This one's from 1996. And it was actually, like I mentioned in Oregon, the Lake Harriet region, it was a, a young couple entered an abandoned mine. And then when they entered that mine, they, the first thing that grabbed their attention was the odor of decay, like a wet animal or a sewage smell. And then what they did was continue in and they had their flashlights out and what it showed was a,

• 7:49Speaker 07

  they came up on a large silver gray haired figure sitting about 12 feet in the mine. And it was sitting there and they don't say anymore other than it was a figure and they could tell it was not an animal exactly, but they had that scent and its knees were raised. Uh, its arms were wrapped around them and around itself, um, with its head lowered. So you can kind of visualize,

• 8:15Speaker 07

  a humanoid figure with long gray silver hair, again, just kind of sitting there with its knees up and arms wrapped around. Uh, and that was what they encountered. And then they, what it was, they of course got terrified at the scene because it wasn't clearly a person just sitting there or anything like that. So investigators, um, they contacted a group and they showed up two days later and found a, a large oval bed. It was put together from sticks and leaves and mushrooms, all sorts of things. And they could see that there were certain plant stocks that were in the area that were, that were growing miles away that had been brought there. And whatever this thing was had been eating.

• 9:00Speaker 07

  So it was really interesting from that perspective that it wasn't obviously a human. It was, it was un-edible plant stocks that, you know, people wouldn't eat. And that they had that direct sighting, um, even using their flashlights. So they didn't stick around, just like I wouldn't. If I walked into a, a mine in the, any region and all of a sudden this like, you know, almost demonic like figure is just kind of sitting there all just curled up, sitting down. Um, and then again, they, they'd contact somebody, they came back and realized that, yep, something was living there and they, and it was recently eating. And there's a whole lot more to the story in the book, of course, but I wanted to bring that one up because

• 9:41Speaker 07

  the books aren't just about UFOs and Bigfoots. They're about these just unexplainable, unusual. I don't even know what to say, but figures that sometimes people come up on. And in this case, in an abandoned mine in a, I think I mentioned the Lake Harriet region of Oregon.

• 9:57Wes Germer?

  Yeah, that is creepy and fascinating. Did the creature react at all to them?

• 10:03Speaker 07

  It didn't jump up and run at him or anything like that, but it did move. So there was some movement there. So they knew it was something living. But it basically just kind of stayed hunkered down and pulled tight, kind of. Again, I guess the impression would be like a, for lack of a better term, a demonic like figure. Um, that was down there. That was clearly not a human. It wasn't like some, you know, old guy out there living in the mine. Um, does let his hair go. It was, it was something paranormal or, you know, I don't know a better way of putting it. So, but yeah, and there was no more of a description of what they gave in that one, because again, they pretty much, when they came up on it,

• 10:43Speaker 07

  uh, they kind of left there real quickly and ran away. And then it was until they contacted a, a group that went in there and did some paranormal investigation and found that, yeah, oh yeah, something's definitely in there. It wasn't just a, a visual, you know, phenomenon. They didn't have a, you know, they weren't imagining anything. There was something large enough that was again, eating the foliage that could only be found several miles away. So that was another unusual part of it too. So you know, it was coming and going. But no, it didn't jump up and, and, you know, start screaming or chatting with them or anything like that. So that was a kind of a, one of those creepy creature stories that are in that Oregon book.

• 11:22Wes Germer?

  Yeah, that is a creepy one. You know, as you were describing it, my mind went to Sasquatch. I wonder what it was about it that made them think paranormal or demonic?

• 11:35Speaker 07

  Um, basically because it was, and they didn't jump on the Sasquatch aspect of it because they could tell that it was, you know, just not, not an animal looking. It was just the way it was. So they, they basically called it a creature. Because it was the long silver gray hair. Um, and it was, again, it was only sitting about 12 feet from them. So they were, that's really close. You can definitely tell what it is or isn't to some degree when you're that close to it. Um, but yeah, it was just, just because the smell is again, as I mentioned, the odor of decay and the sewage and just, I mean, they're, they're trying to describe the smell, just like I, when I try and describe

• 12:17Speaker 07

  the Sasquatch smell that I encountered, you can't really, because it's really an accumulation of stuff or just, you know, a mixture. It's, it's an unknown smell. It wasn't, you know, identifiable. And then the other thing was they found different mosses and lichen and mushrooms and things like that that were laying around there as well. And then they, the demonic, you know, for lack of a better way of putting it, aspect was because it was not responding. From what I gleaned from the story that I read from the actual encounter was it thought it couldn't be seen. So it was just kind of sitting there hunkered up, like I said, sitting down and trying not to be, you know, noticeable.

• 12:59Speaker 07

  And then the feeling they had from it as well, but you know, you can imagine coming up on anything in a a dark abandoned mine, it's, you know, might trigger your senses pretty quickly and be a little bit scary. So that was, and then again, the fact that the researchers came in two days later and found its, its bed. It was made from everything from sticks to leaves to cedar and maple ferns, all sorts of things. Um, and it'd been chewed up and turned into the bed. So it wasn't just like, oh, there's a cedar branch laying there and it's, it's laying on it. No, these things were all chewed, from how they put it, chewed up and then turned into the bed. So that was another unusual aspect of it.

• 13:39Wes Germer?

  Yeah. I mean, obviously I wasn't there, but my mind still goes to Sasquatch. And I get the demonic thing. Um, you know, I've heard they smell like sulfur. I've heard they smell like, oh, like what you were saying, Derek. It's always a combination of things, rotting flesh, some of the worst smells ever. But you'll often hear of accounts from eyewitnesses where they'll come in and out of caves, uh, in and out of mines, in and out of abandoned buildings. And if you listen to encounters, what people say, like hunters and hikers and that sort of thing, Sasquatch doesn't react the way people think it's going to react. You'll often hear of them freezing like a statue.

• 14:23Wes Germer?

  And it's weird, it's weird behavior. I don't know why they do that, but you'll often hear that. And it makes me wonder if what they actually ran into was a Sasquatch. It's a weird account either way.

• 14:35Speaker 07

  Yeah, yeah. It's hard to like, you know, put your finger on it. Say, well, it's exactly this because, well, I mean, all they knew was, wasn't a typical human. Or again, you can maybe think, well, you know, an old mountain guy just living in the, the mountains kind of thing in this cave, but no, they were within 12 feet. So they knew it wasn't that, but they couldn't exactly, you know, pinpoint on what it was exactly either. They knew it was living and, and you know, there, but outside of that, they didn't have much of an explanation. I don't know that I would either.

• 15:04Wes Germer?

  Yeah, it's a strange account. Tell me about the next one.

• 15:09Speaker 07

  Yeah. The next one was kind of interesting because it was again, a little more recent. So this one was 2003. And it's, uh, titled the Deloma firefighters. So what it was, was there was a 2003 Loma fire in Northern California, where the firefighters had camped beside the river, several miles from the active fire. And then what they reported, and this is from the firefighters, was near dusk, multiple crew members watched a tall, muscular, brown haired figure walking upright opposite the bank, about 25 yards away. So we're not talking about up on a mountain or hillside where you're, well, I'm kind of seeing that. I'm not sure how big it is. Um, but the primary witness estimated that stood about seven feet tall.

• 15:52Speaker 07

  Um, and the hair all over it was several inches long. So just like you probably right now, me, it's, you're kind of narrowing that one into a Sasquatch kind of thing. And what it was, more firefighters actually gathered. So there was multiple witnesses. They had their flashlights. Uh, and then the figure remained visible for several minutes. So once the, again, the figure, which I'm going to assume was a Sasquatch, because that's exactly how they basically describe it. Um, it, over a short period of time, just a few minutes, it appeared to recognize the attention from the firefighters and retreated into the trees. Now again, these were trained outdoor workers. Um, yeah, they were in a remote country.

• 16:37Speaker 07

  But they're trained and it wasn't their, their first time. So it wasn't their first rodeo, you can say. Um, but it was definitely, they saw it and it was again, not more than 25, what feet away, yard, I'm trying to read it, yards away. Um, and that was interesting because it had so many independent witnesses as well. And then just a group of firefighters where it was in that area. So it kind of looked like, I would have visual of, well, it was, you know, moving away as anything alive would from the fire. And then it had nowhere else to go other than towards their encampment. So that was a, a pretty interesting one as well. And nothing more exciting is if it went at them or anything like that, because I didn't come across many of those stories to where

• 17:22Speaker 07

  a Sasquatch, you know, was aggressive and even my own encounters, not aggression at all, actually. More of a, an interest going both ways between the Sasquatch and the human or the human and the Sasquatch.

• 17:35Wes Germer?

  Yeah, that's an amazing account, especially with the multiple witnesses. You know, over the years I've interviewed woodland firefighters that have run into these creatures. And it's odd because every other animal in an area where there's a forest fire, they've left, they're gone. You know, years ago, I interviewed this deputy sheriff named Ash and he'd made friends with one of these woodland firefighters. They actually became really good friends. And back in the day, they would have to go sit in a fire tower and kind of watch over an area. And that's what uh, Ash's friend, I believe his name was Dobbs. That's what he did. He would go sit in these fire towers.

• 18:17Wes Germer?

  And so Ash would drive them out there, drop them off and pick them up after a shift. Well, when Ash goes out there to pick them up later that night, a huge forest fire had broken out. And Dobbs would always be waiting for him at the end of the trail. While this particular night, Dobbs wasn't there. And so this deputy sheriff goes up to see if, make sure he's okay, find out where he's at. And this is what happened.

• 18:46Speaker 06

  And I distinctly had the feeling that I'd been watched, that something was wrong. And this, this is why I didn't turn around and go back to my car and call in the fire. And I moved forward at this point and I started yelling out my buddy's name, you know, Dobbs, Dobbs. And I got concerned for him and I got all on up the trail and I got to an area where there was a clearing. Now, at this point, I'm almost up to the fire tower. Cause I'm almost up to the ridge. I certainly should have seen these guys. And at this point, the smell of smoke is heavy. There's an orange glow in the sky. We had a little moon. The moon had finally come out. And, you know, I didn't just have to use my flashlight to see, but I could see that orange glow in the sky. And I knew we had a forest fire.

• 19:29Speaker 06

  And as I moved up on the ground in front of me, something caught my eye and I bent down and it was Dobbs's hat. It was a ranger hat and had a little pin on the front that, you know, had reflected and I'd seen it. And I got very concerned at this point and I, I yelled his name as loud as I could. I just yelled Dobbs as loud as I could and screamed it over and over. And very close to me, I hear a voice that says, shut up, it'll hear you.

• 19:58Speaker 06

  And that scared the fire out of me because the voice was, you know, 10 feet away from me. And I turned around and looked and I took my flashlight and I'm shining around and I, and I finally saw him. And he was, he had his back up against a rock and due to the steepness of the trail, this rock, he could kind of lean on it and stay on his feet. And there were some scrub cedars and he was kind of crouched, leaning backwards on this rock. And I just looked at him and he said, turn that light off. Get over here, it'll hear you. And so I did what he said and I was walking over to him and that's when it hit me. But what do you mean, it will hear us? And we got over there and he just pointed and he had his gun in his hand.

• 20:38Speaker 06

  And so, you know, I raised my, my, my carbine and I'm looking around and he, he points with his gun and I look. Now this is a small oval shaped clearing. So, you know, from our side of the clearing, we were just inside the woods. To the far side was maybe 35 yards. Not a long distance. I had, I had shot that distance with a handgun easily. And, you know, the, the, the smell of smoke was heavy in the air. The orange glow from just over the ridge. I knew if we, if you'd walked over top of that ridge, you'd been able to see the fire. And there was just enough moon to where when we looked across that clearing and standing right at the edge of the clearing, we saw it.

• 21:22Speaker 06

  It was tall. It, it, you know, dark. It was more backlit than frontlit. So I really didn't get a lot of facial features or anything like that, except that I could see that it was tall. Its arms extended pretty low, like, like, like down almost to its knees, if not past its knees. And it apparently was moving diagonally, which would be the, the way the slope would go. But it had seen and heard me. And so it turned at the waist and it was standing there frozen, just like we were.

• 21:58Wes Germer?

  And so even with that clip, you know, we're talking about the behavior of them freezing, they kind of freeze in place. And that's what this creature was doing. But what I find odd about it is you would think Sasquatch would flee an area, especially if there's a major fire going on. I mean, every animal on the planet does. But here is a forest fire raging. Dobbs is on its way down to the car. And yet the Sasquatch is like, you know what? I'm gonna screw with this guy for a little bit. You would think firefighters out there in the forest would never run into Sasquatch because they'd be long gone. But in most cases, they're not. It's odd behavior.

• 22:40Speaker 07

  Yeah. And where I kind of fallen on that one, again, partially from my own experience, and then from a lot of the different stories I've encountered. I mean, a lot of the evidence looks like they don't have to necessarily just run from a fire. They can, they can move. You can say teleport. I'm not sure exactly what's going on, but they do do things like that. And it's a lot of encounters to where all of a sudden it's here, and then it's over here where I know they can move fast and they take large steps and all of that, but it wasn't gonna cover that distance in the time that's there, be it a few seconds or a whole mountainside in a minute or two. So, you know, I don't know. It's hard to fall in on that one. But I'm like, there's something to the whole paranormal aspect of them to

• 23:24Speaker 07

  where they can go from A to B and then to C without being seen. So, you know, that's, that's pretty much where my mind goes is because again, during my one, the one encounter on Mount Baker, we talked a little bit about where I know it didn't run through that area because I would have heard it as I heard it initially. And all of a sudden it was up further. And I, there was no other explanation for it.

• 23:48Wes Germer?

  Yeah, I've heard that theory thrown around a lot. And I guess that makes me wonder how that works. And really, if that's true, then what is Sasquatch? Because it sounds more like a spirit. And you know, Sasquatch is very physical. I, you know, I guess I used to think, you know, if something is more spiritual, it's not physical. But I've been proven wrong in that.

• 24:11Speaker 07

  I personally think they can, because again, from my personal sessions and the readings I've done, and to where so I, again, I have to sometimes invent my own lingo for it. So I'll call it different channels, kind of like different channels on the radio. You know, you turn your focus on to one, your dial, you have country, turn a little bit more, blues, rap, disco, whatever, all in the same space. So the way I would then word it to somebody who's given me either these encounters firsthand, or again, mine, is they can somehow focus their frequency onto another channel or density is all sometimes term it. And then they can turn it back on in a different location. So that's, again, the best way I can wrap

• 24:54Speaker 07

  my head around it to kind of put words to it is they just basically change their frequency or energy. So they're off this physical channel that we experience for the most part of our lives. And then they tune in somewhere else. So when I do a psychic medium session, well, I know that the, the spirits, entities, past loved ones, whatever somebody wants to call them. Well, they're not getting in an Uber, coming to Bigfoot's gems and, you know, for the session kind of thing. They're there instantaneously because I have no idea who a client wants to communicate with. Because usually I only get, half the time, I don't even get the person's first name. They're just boom on zoom instantly or their physical session. And then they go, well, I want to talk to so and so. And then in a fraction

• 25:38Speaker 07

  of a second, I mean, basically, by the time they're done thinking about it, that individual is here, and I'm able to communicate with them. So then, again, for, for me to wrap my head around it, I just started describing it as, well, they're just on a different channel. And they put more focus on this, and some people call it dimensions, but I like the word density. This density or channel, we, most of our focus is on, because we're usually experiencing reality through our five physical senses, and not our sixth sense. But once you turn that one on, well, then the whole spatial part of it is a mute point, because they're here instantly. So I kind of think Sasquatch does the same thing.

• 26:20Wes Germer?

  Yeah, I struggle with that. I mean, there's no doubt that there's weird stuff that goes on in people's encounters. When people encounter these things, sometimes they'll report very paranormal, odd behavior that doesn't seem like anything from this planet. But the bulk of their behavior, you know, they eat, they poop, they break trees, they bang on trees, and they have like this weird technology to where they can teleport somewhere else. I, I struggle with that. It's hard to wrap your head around.

• 26:56Speaker 07

  I'm with you 100%. Because I have no, I just know that these certain things happen, but how? Because I'm with you on that. Once you think you're in that physical vehicle we can call a body, well, then you're stuck and limited to this. But I also learned, well, I didn't actually kind of preempted and tell you, I didn't believe any of this was real. I was again, a commercial deep sea diver, Army veteran, the correctional officer, not into all of this, wasn't reading ghost stories or books or listening. I wasn't into none of this. I was living my life on that. And then all of a sudden, when I got thrust into it, then all of a sudden I had to go, okay, well, I guess there is something to this. And I'll tell you, every single, I was gonna say year, but every month at least, something

• 27:40Speaker 07

  new happens or occurs, or the, for example, in a session, well, this may actually tie into what we're talking about. I'll have, again, I term them entities. I don't mean like ET, but just an entity or spirit would be another term. So if I'm doing a session, let's say in person, and there's a person sitting on the couch, I'm kind of referencing right here to my right. And I'll talk to them, and all of a sudden I get to see somebody and they start chatting and they go, well, what does it look like? Blah, blah, blah. Or what are they wearing? And when the person realizes who they are, well, what's been happening is that person, so I'll see the entity come up and sometimes maybe hug the person in front of me. Well, that person feels it. They literally have felt it. And

• 28:23Speaker 07

  I've seen things move in the room. So for example, somebody wanted to maybe communicate with a past pet of theirs, a dog or a cat or something. And I didn't know this was even real. I don't even know how to wrap my head around it. But all of a sudden, on the seat of the couch, sitting next to the person, we will in physical reality, see that cushion or the, the place on the couch indent as if something just got there. And I'll see it in my, I'll call it psychic eye on my sight, because I'll get a perspective about that, knowing that the client can't see anything. And sometimes they'll feel something emotionally. But when they also see it physically, like leave that impression

• 29:04Speaker 07

  on the, the bed or the couch or something like that, it's, I don't even know how to wrap, and I don't, and they don't see it. So it's not like all of a sudden, let's go with the cat one, because that's a strong one. A lot of people connect with. They'll, they'll think about their cat, will start trying to communicate or something like that. I'll see the cat come over and actually either jump on their lap or, or get around their, sometimes sits on their shoulder, things like that. And the person will go, and I'll watch it and they'll go, I just felt it on my shoulder. And they're physically feeling it. They're not, this is before I tell them anything. I'll say, well, your spirit kitty just climbed over here and sat there. And then they go and say, well, I just saw, no, it's the opposite. So I know it's a thing, but now how to describe it,

• 29:48Speaker 07

  I, I wouldn't even know how to begin.

• 29:51Wes Germer?

  Can I ask you a question? And don't take offense to it. I watched this guy on YouTube. He comes up in my feed every once in a while. I think it's called Santa paranormal. Anyway, he goes around and he cleans gravestones. And while he's there, he has a spirit box. And he, he'll, he'll interact with the spirits. One time he's out there, and the spirit said to him, this is a seance. And he goes, no, no, no, no, this isn't a seance. And the spirit goes, this is a seance. When you're interacting with these spirits, how do you know who you're talking to?

• 30:32Speaker 07

  Well, now it varies because I get to, and I kind of jokingly call it, I get to cheat because I have, I get to actually see different entities or figures or things who all know who I'm communicating with. But I can also watch, in fact, I did it with my wife yesterday. It was, oh, Expedition X, some show on, I think it was Discovery Channel, where they were getting out those, I'll just call them spirit boxes. Well, even I, I can't wrap my head around this one either. But it doesn't matter if it's a TV show that's recorded, I can still tune in to whomever they're speaking with. So it'll vary sometimes. I don't think, and I'll tell you, and I have some of those boxes. In fact, I got one sitting next to me, somebody gifted me thinking, well, the hell, this is the right guy to give one of these,

• 31:16Speaker 07

  you know, I'll just call it a ghost box or spear box. Well, mine, I don't even turn on because it won't stop. It just goes crazy, just words coming in all the time, but my ears will start ringing. So it's almost, you know, useless for somebody like me, and I don't exactly know why, other than maybe a whole bunch of them are trying to communicate. But I'll tell you, it's not always who people think they're communicating with when I have seen that. Or I've gone on a location with, I'll just call them ghost hunters or paranormal investigators and things like that. Because I can walk in and the first things I'll do is just feel it. I'll just say, I guess emotionally would be the best way to put it.

• 31:57Speaker 07

  I'll feel emotion of another person, just like if you were talking to somebody and they were getting upset about something. Well, that empathic energy, you'll feel it to a degree. And then often it'll turn physical and then it'll, and then I'll get what's called download. So just random information, because I don't know who the heck I'm going to encounter. And then information comes in and then I'll get a visual. So it's kind of like all your senses, when you get a plate of food in front of you, well, you're going to see it first. Okay. And then you're going to maybe feel it and then you're going to taste it and smell it. And then it just goes on and on and starts hitting more senses. But I can just tell you from my own experience with individuals doing that.

• 32:39Speaker 07

  Cause I'll sometimes see somebody, let's just say, trying to chat through their spear box or ghost box. It's not who they thought it was. It's, it's sometimes somebody different. So there are what some people call tricksters out there, you know? I think that's kind of a nice way of putting it. But there's a, there's a lot of, as I ordered earlier, channels or, you know, stations out there where different entities do come through and try and connect with us, sometimes via those boxes. I mean, there's, there's lots of ways of doing it.

• 33:09Wes Germer?

  Have you ever had a bad experience doing this?

• 33:14Speaker 07

  Yeah, I have. And it was, um, the, the one that I claimed that, that was before I learned what I call ethereal hygiene or armoring. And many people call it protecting themselves energetically or ethereically. But before I was really aware of that, again, I was doing the thing, the session kind of thing. And all of a sudden, and it's not typical from, at least for me, my perspective to tune into what many, and I'm always trying to watch my wording here. So tune into what we would typically call demons or, you know, negative entities, things like that. Generally either deceased loved ones or sometimes animals like I mentioned.

• 33:55Speaker 07

  But in this one particular one, and I found out after the session, because again, I don't ask any questions. It's this session's just scheduled online, you know, all I know is your name at best. If I have a chance to pull that up before I sit down and do it, and often I don't. But this one was a session and then they told me after the fact, and I'll, I'll get into the actual story part of it or the explanation in just a moment, but they were telling me, well, yeah, we do tend to go to old cemeteries and do what you just mentioned, séances or communication and things like that. And one of their friends evidently was a little more on the darker side, I'll say, the more demonic stuff.

• 34:36Speaker 07

  So in a session, I sat down, they sat down, I sat down, I started tuning in, started seeing who I pick up on. And all of a sudden, and it's unusual from my perspective, because I don't, fear doesn't hit me. I'm just not one of those people. It's not a, a thing that happens all the time. I've just done too much stuff and I'm a skydiver, again, commercial deep sea diver. And a lot of things where that whole fear aspect just isn't a normal sense of mine. So when I do feel it, I know something's up and I'm obviously not fearing the client in front of me. So we tuned in, I tuned in, all of a sudden I start feeling that. And then for whatever reason, when I, and I'll, I'll describe more in a moment.

• 35:17Speaker 07

  But when I pick up on those type of entities, they're, I guess, if you, to make a visual, if the client's sitting in front of me, their past loved ones will be kind of directly behind them, maybe a little bit raised. And I have no idea why, but that's the thing, they're a little bit raised as if they're off the ground. But when the more, as, as I'm definitely where these ones, demonic ones, they're higher. They're up in the air. I'd say if it was a, if there was something you can measure, I don't know, maybe six or seven foot above them. And they're kept that way anytime when I perceive them. So in this case, I started chatting with the person and she asked me, or they asked to him. They asked me, well, you know, and this is why they made the session, but I didn't know this at the time.

• 36:02Speaker 07

  They started saying, well, do we have any attachments? Is there anything evil around us or something like that? And I'm like, oh, okay. That's not an everyday question, but let's check and see. And all of a sudden, I do start picking up on again, that, that anxiety and or fear kicked in immediately. Not because of, in my logical head, I'm thinking, well, we're going to tune into some bad guys. I better watch out. That's not my personality. I just did it all of a sudden, just like I explained, us sensing or experiencing food. It, your senses start turning on. I could sense that. And then all of a sudden I got a visual and I realized, and it wasn't a good one. It was just what maybe somebody would typically think of a demon.

• 36:43Speaker 07

  It wasn't, I don't know, I'm, I'm trying to describe it. I don't want to give it too much thought either. Cause you never know how much that stuff tunes back in. Um, but I haven't had an issue since that session, just a darker, it was reddish face. Um, humanoid, meaning it had a face, had eyes. I could see it from the torso up. And it was just, I guess what you'd say, evil looking. And then I realized that. So then immediately, and different energy workers or psychics or mediums have different ways of doing this. And it may sound a little bit corny, but love energy is a thing. And again, I wasn't, I wasn't brought up thinking that or white light this. I wasn't, I had no training whatsoever.

• 37:26Speaker 07

  But over all the sessions, I realized that, well, if I literally just decide or focus on what I'm calling love energy inside of me and putting it around the person, that has an effect because I'd had hundreds of circumstances where I've done that, you often not even tell them the person. So let's say somebody walks in the store and they have an issue or an attachment or an injury or something. All it's, I get made fun of by my family and coworkers because they go, you didn't tell them, did you? And what I say is, no. So I'll surround them with white light or love and instantly they'll respond. Again, not knowing that, you know, psychic Derek's standing over there doing this. No, I don't tell them anything because I'm just not that guy. I just, I really don't want the attention to be honest.

• 38:10Speaker 07

  Um, unless it's like during a session, then it's, I tell them a little bit more. So I'll do that and the person will respond immediately, almost as if like it was a show on TV set up to have that happen. So after hundreds of those experiences, I know it's a thing. And I'll tell you, in that confidence of knowing that I have, it makes it stronger for some reason. Where I don't have to question everything, it just is. And then when I go at it doing that, it gets stronger. So on these two people, I surrounded them with just, I imagine literally, and anybody can do this. Imagine just white light of, and I said love would be the word I use on my head.

• 38:48Speaker 07

  Because I kind of preempted that or, you know, I, most of us think of that term as a good thing, positive energy. And I'll tell you, that way we think about things is what affects those frequencies. So then I surrounded them with that. That demon-like figure was not happy. He started to fade away a little bit. And I'll tell you, not a whole lot more happened with that figure in the session. He eventually, matter of seconds, just disappeared out of my sight, couldn't see him anymore. And I'm like, okay, well, that's a good thing. Went on with the session, did whatever they asked me, you know, communicate with or, you know, if they asked questions, whatever it was, didn't give it any more thought.

• 39:27Speaker 07

  Until after the session, I walked out of my office and I was heading into my, um, where my wife was up in, I'll just say the front office, and all of a sudden I picked up on that sensation again. So it was almost like smelling something bad or evil, the same anxiety and stress I did in the office. And all of a sudden, something invisible thing as we were to grab my arm and it literally, and it's the first time this ever happened, felt like my arm was being broken. It was my right arm. And I was sitting there, I took everything I had not to scream out loud. And I'm looking, I'm going, oh my God. And they knew something was wrong because I don't just respond like that. And all of a sudden, so we're looking at my right arm and something, it can't have been my bone.

• 40:12Speaker 07

  I, I mean, again, I can't wrap my head around it, but something started pushing up out of the spot to where as if something grabbed my arm and near the wrist and near the elbow and just started breaking it. So if you visualize like maybe your arm being broken and the bone pushing up out of the skin, that is exactly what happened on my arm. And we have a photo of it where I'd say an inch and a half. It never broke the skin, but it started pushing up while I was in this extreme pain. I was literally wanting to yell, um, pushing out of my arm. And then basically I had to get my wherewithal and realize, oh, this is what they would term a psychic attack. But somehow it was turning physical to where those around me could actually see that.

• 40:56Speaker 07

  I'll just say, and when I say bump, that doesn't do it justice because it was more like a finger poking from inside my arm out. It was that distinct. I did, again, when I keep wrapping my head around it, calm down a little bit. I'm like, okay, and I went, I went in a, a room, actually, that I called the Shangai room. So I painted this specific room with Shangai paint. I don't know if we talked about that, but went in there for just a extra protection to stay in that energy of Shangai. And then I got to focus on it being just letting go, not doing it. And then over, it was moments, not, not like, so I'd say a minute, a minute or less. All of a sudden that huge, again, what looked like a large bump or about the size of your

• 41:38Speaker 07

  finger trying to poke out, which gave me the impression it was my bone somehow doing that, went away. And then the pain started to dissipate when I started, again, surrounding myself with white light, um, putting my thoughts around that entity that I just dealt with, you know, maybe the half an hour before, in the beginning of the session, and then the session ended, and got rid of it, and then it started to taper down. So that would be what I would term, I wouldn't even term this psychic attack, but it was, but it was somehow it manifested physically and was literally, as far as I could tell, trying to break my arm. But my arm wasn't broke after the fact. This only lasted a few minutes. By that point, I had done hundreds of sessions and would have never said that was possible.

• 42:22Speaker 07

  I'm just a blunt guy, just drive with it. Said, no, it's all going to be an energy thing. You know, it's all going to work in our intentions and what we call our imagination, even though you'll still feel it and it's real, but usually it's not a physical thing. But after that day, it's a hundred percent, I know it's a thing, that those darker or evil entities can affect us physically as well. And that was my first experience realizing that.

• 42:47Wes Germer?

  Let me ask you, and then we'll get back to the book. The Apostle John describes God as love. The actual statement is God is love. He's describing the core essence of God. No one says Derek is love. No one says Wes is love. They might say Wes is loving or Derek is loving. These are actions, but it's not our core essence. If I die and I'm stuck here roaming around as a spirit, or like the guy we talked about last time, when you worked in corrections, how that one prisoner had died and now he haunts the jail.

• 43:30Wes Germer?

  Or I've had people on the show where they'll say, oh, my daughter plays with a spirit ghost. You know, it was a little girl that died a long time ago in this home, and my daughter plays with her. Very nonchalant. If you follow those encounters, in the end, that little spirit girl becomes something very, very dark. It was never a child's spirit. But if God is allowing the dead to be stuck here, then John's a liar and God is a liar because that's not love. You can't have it both ways.

• 44:09Wes Germer?

  You can't say God's essence is love, but he leaves behind the spirit of children to roam the earth or be stuck here.

• 44:20Wes Germer?

  If I was the devil, I wouldn't show up with horns and a pitchfork and be terrifying. I would show up as a child. I would show up as a loved one. It's hard to deceive people when you show up with a pitchfork and horns and fire and brimstone, because you'll never deceive anyone. And I'm curious, Derek, what are your thoughts about God?

• 44:44Speaker 07

  Great question. Um, I'll, I'll tell you this, so I grew up neutral. So I've joined no religions. It just wasn't something that was in my family at the time. I wasn't, I'm not anti them. It just wasn't a thing that I was, um, you know, brought into or aware of. It was just, so I'd say neutral perspective. So I didn't really know anything like that. Um, so again, I'm not coming from a religious background or teachings or upbringing, but I'll tell you, there is something to that. And I like how you described it as love, but I'll, I'll, and I'm also going to agree with you on that. I'll just say if the bad guys come in, yes, sometimes they do, where the persona of someone else, less threatening, because I have seen that.

• 45:28Speaker 07

  Now, I'll also say, because I have communicated, I've communicated with, I don't even know how many children now. Well, but they're not ghosts. They tune into this frequency or energy when I reach out to them or the client starts thinking about them. So it's not that they're stuck here, at least in my experiences. They're not stuck here or anything like that. It's more of when they're thought about, well, then they put enough, again, I have to invent ways of saying it, but they put enough of their focus here to where someone like me, they can see off of the visual spectrum. And there are devices that can do this too. Um, but some of us, for whatever reason, can, again, that's just how I word it, perceive or see off the visual spectrum.

• 46:10Speaker 07

  They tune in enough of their focus here on this reality to where we can pick up on it, but that doesn't mean that they're stuck here. Because I've never come across, um, again, as I worded entity, or some people say ghosts, that has been stuck. I've seen replays of scenarios and things like that. Or if I go to this area and I know that so and so died here, there's just that and the other, well, yeah, I can tune into that, that person, because they're not limited to being stuck in the, their body. That's just a vehicle. So once they're out of that physical vehicle, well, then they're on the metaphysical reality, so non-physical, and they can be tuned into.

• 46:53Speaker 07

  But I haven't seen, again, what some people say, so if a, a little kid dies there and they get stuck or something like that. No, it's usually me tuning in to more of themselves that has moved on, but that's not to say there are, I'll just say reruns of scenarios that happen down here. Because like that, and we talked about in the prison, that Baker Unit Ghost, as he was called, he didn't appear stuck. It's more of a, um, I don't even word this one. I'll put it this way. So it depends on the, the entity or the spirit, on, on what their thinking or understandings are. So once they have that realization, there is more, well, then they're not stuck here.

• 47:36Speaker 07

  But if somebody, for example, let's say dies and they're just dead set in their thoughts that there is nothing more, there is no God, there's no blah, blah, blah, whatever their belief system tells them, well, then they're not willing to accept that and they can maintain their focus here. So I have seen that as well. So it's kind of, there's, there's a lot of aspects to that. So some that, like the inmate one, he never tried to communicate with me. We just saw him, so heard him, and then he'd stand over there, but there was no communication, chatting. Um, and I didn't tune in to him at the time, because that was kind of early on, when I was first having my senses heightened, you'll say. Um, so I didn't try communication. It was more like, oh my gosh, am I actually, you know, experiencing this?

• 48:19Speaker 07

  Is this really, I did, again, I know psychic teacher or anything like, I didn't even believe in any of that. I thought the whole psychic thing was BS. All I knew was Miss Cleo, when I lived in California, which was some 1-800 psychic on TV that would come on there, and I'd go, yeah, okay, scam. And it was a scam, but I'm just saying, that was my only introduction to it. So I would be literally what you say a non-believer, until all of a sudden my senses heightened and I started having the experiences. Well, then there's just no denying it whatsoever. Um, but yeah, I'd, I'd have to say, I kind of agree with the way you kind of termed it, that God would be love, because again, if, if I'm totally honest, I'd have to say, no, I didn't believe in God.

• 49:00Speaker 07

  Uh, and so I would say a higher energy, and that's not to say there isn't, but it's always that play of words on what you call God. So I like the way you termed it as far as love, because I've communicated with people that have come through and said, I don't want to get too specific, because I know some of my clients will be listening to this, but so I'll be kind of vague, but say enough to where it gets across. Let's say somebody has a, a loved one that was tragically killed down here, and they come in, they go, well, so and so just, just passed, I want to chat with them kind of thing. Well, that happens easily and directly, and then that person will pass on their messages or have me acknowledge something the person has in their pocket or this, that and the other.

• 49:43Speaker 07

  Um, again, I don't want to get too specific here, something like that, where the person knows absolutely that there's no way Derek had any idea about this, um, or that I had this secret thing in my pocket, or I'm wearing their special jacket or whatever. And then the person comes in, the spirit, I'll just use that term, comes in, gives her messages, communications, and then all of a sudden, they basically disappear and I'll just, again, for lack of a better way of putting it, go to where they want to go. And that just rang my ear, right there, just saying. And that's part of it too, as when I do this stuff, even now, I'm trying not to focus too much on any one particular reading, because then I'm literally, and that's all it takes.

• 50:27Speaker 07

  And then literally I'm tuning in back into that person. And then I'll, I'll start having them, you know, be a part of it kind of thing too. So that's kind of what I'm doing. But once they, once they think about love, they're, they're not stuck here. They just have to have that realization.

• 50:42Wes Germer?

  I was muted out when you brought up Ms. Cleo, but I was busting up laughing. We must be around the same age because I remember seeing her on TV too, thinking this lady's insane. You know, as I get older, and maybe it happens to people who are listening to the show, because I never thought about it in my twenties and most of my thirties, my twenties, I was gonna live forever. But I think the older you get, the more you start to think about what happens when we go. And I've had a lot of loss in my life. I've had a lot of people pass. I've seen my parents pass, friends, grandparents.

• 51:26Wes Germer?

  And when I kind of started on my journey, and I'm not trying to convert you to anything here. I'm, I'm a sinner. I'm, I'm nobody. But when I very first started on my journey, as I got older and was thinking about death, I was thinking about what happens when we go. You brought up the metaphysical. So when Derek passes and leaves this world, what happens next? God forbid, by the way.

• 51:56Speaker 07

  Yeah, no, I know. I appreciate that. I get it because you know, it's gonna happen to all of us. And before I could do what I do now, I was, I'd have a little bit of fear there. I think, oh my gosh, you know, I, whatever this and this is happening, am I gonna be in some dark place? Do I have to find some tunnel or blah, blah, blah? There's countless stories out there and often what I've learned, not just from the psychic medium sessions, but from hypnotherapy sessions and things, usually people experience initially what they have already believed in or thought about so that it's a more comfortable transition. So if all of a sudden somebody dies and they plan on seeing their, their dead grandpa or grandma

• 52:36Speaker 07

  or whomever kind of thing too, well, often that entity will be the one that shows up to make that. Or maybe they'll want to see a, a Jesus figure or a Buddha figure. Or again, depending on their belief system, they're gonna see that entity. It really just depends on their, their willingness and openness to it. But eventually, everything I've noticed, they, and I haven't released it yet, but I actually wrote a book on, it's free on the internet, but not in published form, on near death experiences to where I researched and analyzed, you know, I don't know, it's hundreds of them. And when all is said and done, I wish I had it up here in front of me, but it's in the high eighties, something percentile.

• 53:20Speaker 07

  People will encounter a previous loved one and they'll have a chat with the person, things like that. So it really varies, but for me, I, because I'm so hyper aware and I've talked to so many entities and things, I'm gonna go exactly where I decide to. And that, and it's not a place, again, it's a, a channel or a focus is where it would be. So some people may say, well, okay, well, my happy place where I want to end up going, at least initially, because then you'll get your, it's not gonna quite make sense. You'll get your footing or wherewithal once you've transitioned and then have more realizations and realize you're not limited to a place.

• 54:03Speaker 07

  You can invent a place or a way of being. So let's say somebody wants to end up in a grassy field because that's their happy spot, just surrounded by flowers and loved ones. Well, then that's what happens to them. But ones that have transitioned to where, let's just say they've done a bunch of bad things in this life. And I'm not saying they're gonna end up in the spot because of that, but because they believe they are, they usually will perceive sometimes not a great scenario. Because let's say somebody dies and go, well, I'm going straight to hell or I'm going to where the bad guys roam, or you know, however they want to wrap their head around it. That's typically what happens is it goes to whatever their, their thoughts are at the time or their, their belief system. So it can vary for everybody.

• 54:48Speaker 07

  And for me, I'm gonna have all my past animals because I'm already hyper aware. I don't have to believe anything. I know it. It is just a fact of reality. We're on one fraction of what's actually out there, you know? Maybe 10% of reality is physical, physicists will say, and 90% is metaphysical. Well, the 90% is a whole lot and it's not something you experience physically. It's metaphysically and how you do that is with your thoughts and intentions and feelings. So again, I'm hyper aware of that. So basically I'm gonna have, I know, I actually kind of got to tell you this part too. So I've done, I don't know how many sessions now where sometimes it's with the person transitioning

• 55:30Speaker 07

  or the family member comes in, for example, they say, well, grandma is in the hospital right now and you know, I want to check on her. Well, sometimes when I do that, I pick up on or perceive the person in both areas, kind of like they're, and I don't care if they're in a coma and they're just totally non-responsive or they have, you know, just Alzheimer's or something like that to the nth degree where they can't communicate or know anything where they're at. That's not where they're stuck. I'll put it that way. They're not stuck in their body or again, as I worded a vehicle, there to where their thoughts are. So then I can communicate with that person as well.

• 56:12Speaker 07

  And I'll kind of word it like, well, you know, they're, they're kind of, I won't say transitioning, but they're on both sides right now. Yeah, they're somewhat in their body, but much of them, because sometimes I'll see the person, let's go with the, um, the memory issues or Alzheimer's or they're getting ready to pass. Well, I'll see them come in, in what we would call spirit form. And they'll already be with, let's say the example is it's a lady who's having that issue and her husband already died, because that's a scenario that's happened a lot of times that I've come across. She'll already be with him on the other side and she'll start giving me messages, even though she's physically alive, she'll go, no, don't worry about it. You know, and I'm gonna kind of paraphrase here, don't worry about it.

• 56:54Speaker 07

  I'm, I'm with who I need to be, you know, let my, let's say it's the granddaughter in here with me. Let her know that, you know, I'm doing just fine and you know, she has nothing to worry about. I'm not stuck there or something like that. So I've seen those scenarios play out time and time again. Well, again, it just varies per person. I've never, I may have a limited perspective. I don't know, but at least in what I've experienced, I've never seen somebody stuck somewhere or eventually not after they died, have the realization they can move on from that. It's just getting them to realize it, if that makes sense.

• 57:32Wes Germer?

  You know, I actually spent a lot of time, a lot of time, a lot of hours looking into near death experiences. The one thing I found fascinating is a lot of these eyewitnesses were atheist. They believed in Islam. They believed in, you know, Buddhism. They believed in, there was nothing really in their background that would make them think that when they're, when they die, they're going to hell. And I wasn't even really sure that, I mean, and this is many years back. I really wasn't even sure that I bought into hell, which makes no sense when you think about it. Because Jesus spoke more about hell than he did anything else.

• 58:14Wes Germer?

  It was the main topic he talked about in the New Testament. A lot of these people who died on an operating table or a terrible crash or, and again, I'm talking non-Christians atheist. People really don't have that concept of hell or don't really buy into it. Most of these near death experiences, most of these people went to hell. And what shocked me, when they come back, they're describing hell, but they're quoting scripture. And they don't even know they're quoting scripture because they've never read that portion or they had no interest in anything in the Bible.

• 59:00Wes Germer?

  But when they're describing hell, they're quoting from the New Testament. And it shocked me to see that. Now, not everyone went to hell, but a lot of these people went to hell. So these people who are atheist, you know, they believe in Buddhism. They believe in different religions that don't teach hell, or maybe they don't believe in anything. These eyewitnesses are very consistent from one to the next on their experience in hell. They all overlap. So not really buying into hell, coming back and describing it in a manner of quoting scripture that they've never read is strange to me. And I'm sure you've come across that.

• 59:45Wes Germer?

  And I know you had said you had written a book and really looked into it. There's no doubt in my mind you've come across that.

• 59:53Speaker 07

  Yeah, no, you're absolutely right. I have. And again, as I worded as a channel. Well, and I did not again, even believe that that there was a hell or this, that, and the other. I thought it was all just stories made up by humans. Well, there is a channel out there that some of us do visit when, why, you know, they'd be just, um, you know, I wouldn't know exactly why, other than how I see this again, what the person's thinking or believing. And again, like you mentioned, they don't have to even know about a hell. But yes, there is that density or channel of what most of us would say was evil and darkness and not good stuff.

• 1:00:33Speaker 07

  That absolutely exists. Now, if we want to give it a name and a title like hell, and there's probably other names that I don't know about, because again, I'm not a part of any, any religion of any kind. But it's there. That is a thing. So I would think that the that Jesus and other, I'll just say, aware individuals that have lived lives down here, um, know about that. And they're trying to basically word it the way they can best where we can wrap our heads around it. That, yeah, you want to do more good than bad, because you don't want to kind of default there. But I'll, I'll also say that I've researched and or communicated with individuals

• 1:01:13Speaker 07

  that did end up there, but then have certain realizations. And then they ended up in what you would typically call a heaven scene. So I've seen it both ways. But and again, I would have been, what, it'd be 20 years ago now. I would have laughed, go, oh, sure, there's a hell because I lied to this, that, the other. And this, uh, and I'm not saying people go in there, they lie and stuff, because good luck on making a few life and never lying. Um, that's gonna happen, even if it's called a white lie. But it's more how much the person spins it in their head. But there are, again, I don't know the way of putting it. But there are densities out there that are hell-like, just like there are some that are heaven-like, so different channels.

• 1:01:57Speaker 07

  And it's just what the, what the person believes. And I don't know why some default there, I would think in my, using a lot of my logical head or mind would be, well, you know, it's for them to learn lessons to realize, hey, you might want to do a little bit better. And I'm not saying that that means some bigger entity thrusts you there as a punishment, you know, put you in the corner for a minute. I, I, that's all speculation. I have no idea. But it does happen. Um, and I know for sure that there is a a dark channel that again, we would call hell. I'm always just, it's always a play of words with me because I don't want to, because if you say the word hell, then some people think, well, that means this, this, and this. I'm like, no, I don't know about all that. I'm just telling you what I've experienced.

• 1:02:39Speaker 07

  Um, but yeah, that it, there is that density of entities. And they sometimes, if somebody focuses, like there's different, again, I don't even want to say the certain groups right now, but there are certain groups of people join in life where they do certain negative, I'm not saying all seances are bad, because again, it depends on the person's understanding of that. But if it's more of a demonic one, um, or things like that, or they focus on a Satan figure, well, then, yeah, then they're tuning a lot of their energy to that channel. And then that's what they're going to have more around them, or just the inverse. If you focus more on positivity, and then someone say, well, like attracts like. Well, I learned that is a thing, and that's just not a convenient way of saying it.

• 1:03:25Speaker 07

  Like does attract like your focus, the things you think about can become more of your reality. And some people call it manifesting, that's fine. But the more positive thoughts and things you do and understandings, the more of that that you perceive. So there's, there is something to that.

• 1:03:43Wes Germer?

  If I die, and we'll get back to the book here in a moment. I'm just curious. I want to pick your brain. If I die, I want to go hang out with all the dogs that I used to have before they died. And that green grass thing you were talking about? I could get on board with that. I think that's where I'd like to go. Even though it sounds like I'm God at this point, making my own path. But for people who don't buy into hell, atheists, people who believe in Buddhism, whatever it is. Why, why would they choose hell after death? If everything's kind of a metaphysical realm?

• 1:04:24Speaker 07

  Some because of, they think they deserve it. So I've come across that before too. So people have done enough just really horrifying things in this life. Okay, in my correctional officer days, I'd have inmates. They would say, well, I guarantee you I'm going to hell because of this, that, and the other. And I worked to maximum security. So they were in there for some bad things. I'm not just talking about cheating on their taxes. These were, we had multiple serial killers. We had just horrific things that you don't want to get into on this podcast. But those individuals I did work with, and we would chat, because I was there for sometimes 16 hours a day. We did double shifts, three, four times a week. And then I was one of the correctional officers that would converse with them, or if they just start saying different things, you know, I'd chat to help pass the time and

• 1:05:07Speaker 07

  stuff I learned from there. They'd say, well, I guarantee you I'm going because of this, that, and the other. Well, that person's gonna have that realization or channel when they die. And for at least a time for them, and then they sit in that that part of it. There was a movie decades ago, um, What Dreams May Come. I think that's what it was called. With Robin Williams and maybe Cuba Gooding Jr. I thi- I think I had that right. It's been a long time since I watched it. It's not exactly like that. I'll put it that way. But that movie gets pretty darn close um, on the different, again, channels or places people end up until they have certain realizations.

• 1:05:52Speaker 07

  So it's not a default thing. But if somebody, like I said, an inmate is just, you know, pardon the pun, but dead set on deciding that he's going to hell when they die. Well, then that's what they're going to experience. And everybody's different, but for at least a time. And no time with air quotes there, because time's not really a thing. I found that out too. Um, because I could connect with people, I can't, for lack of a better way of putting it, out of time, which is unusual and hard to talk about. So we have to remove that whole word time from any of our, our recipes or ways of thinking about reality. And then it expands a lot more, but no, they, they typically, and not always, it's, it's not an all or nothing thing either.

• 1:06:35Speaker 07

  So I've had some people that have died in prison and then come back, so they were resuscitated or scenarios like that. Where all of a sudden they saw all their dead relatives and it was all positive, this, that, and the other. So it's, it's not just one, one answer. But the more general part was if somebody does transition and they decide that they're going to see, again, their past pets or loved ones, grandma, grandpa, whomever. That's generally what happens. Uh, from the best of, you know, experiences I've gone through and or sessions I've done.

• 1:07:10Wes Germer?

  And I appreciate you answering my questions, Derek. I know sometimes when I ask questions like this, I come across like a dick and I don't mean to. I really am curious on what other people believe and how they feel and why they feel a certain way. With regard to the metaphysical realm or plane that you're talking about. Within our DNA, every human being can be traced back to one woman. If you don't believe in God and you don't believe in, I guess, Christianity, I'm really, I, I think all religions are corrupt. I wouldn't really say I belong to any religion, or I should say I don't belong to any church or anything like that. But we all can be traced back to that one woman.

• 1:07:55Wes Germer?

  What's your thoughts on creation with regard to the whole metaphysical realm?

• 1:08:01Speaker 07

  That's another good question. But now here's where I'll jump into what, again, because I've had firsthand experiences with what people call extraterrestrials or aliens. So I now, it depends if we're talking, now you said DNA, so that's a physical aspect. So I'll say from my understanding and what I've learned, these human vehicles, our body, and after, I again, have to word it that way for a reason, were created or manufactured by another race to survive and again, hold a spirit in this reality, in this density, this physical plane so that we could have a life.

• 1:08:42Speaker 07

  But it was brought in by others. And I'm not just talking about like, oh, spaceship landed, kicked off. No, but taken from the, the, the, we'll just go generally here, animals, whatever was, you know, around this planet way back when. And those were modified to where there was a acceptable vehicle to where we could experience, procreate, this, that, and the other. And then basically given lives here. And there's a whole lot of scenarios from that, everything from the Anunnaki, that I mean, it goes on and on. But that's what I've come across when I've, I'll just say, remoted it, um, or looked into it. That we didn't originate here. Now that's talking about the physical vehicle. So that it could have enough

• 1:09:26Speaker 07

  cognitive abilities and whatever it is physiologically to, for a spirit or soul to drive the body around for a lifetime. If, I don't even know if any of that made sense. Um, but that's what I've patched together from my experiences and what I've seen, because I know the ET thing is real. Um, now whether they're here before us, after, I don't know any of that kind of thing, but they're a thing. Um, and they go, they predate us. So that's where I kind of patchwork that together in my understandings.

• 1:09:59Speaker 07

  Again, I hope some of that made sense. It's odd stuff to talk about.

• 1:10:03Wes Germer?

  No, I appreciate you talking about it. And where did you get that information again?

• 1:10:09Speaker 07

  Um, some of it's just what I tuned into or remoted, um, because I also do the, it's called remote viewing usually, but I like remote perception because there's a lot more than just viewing, um, from sometimes different sessions. Some people will say, well, I, in one example, a client will say, when I was 10 years, and again, I'm, I'm going to work with the facts here so that any one person doesn't say, that's he me he's talking about. So somebody will say, well, you know, I know I was abducted when I was, say, 10 years old. And all of a sudden I woke up on this spacecraft or this, that and the other. Um, well, I can, and that's when I, and then tapping back into that aspect, I said about time not being a limitation because let's say it was probably 30 years before this happened.

• 1:10:55Speaker 07

  But when I remote in, and we call it remote viewing in the army, but it's remote perceiving because you get a whole lot more than viewing when you do it, or depending on who's doing it. I would remote into that spaceship, let's just say, where the person's talking about it. Well, in one of those circumstances, I had, and I can see, I can feel the energy in there. I can feel what we would call emotions down here. And I could see that, well, okay, this one actually happened. So this person wasn't just watching too many UFO movies or something like that. I've seen that one as well. But the person that actually happened, and then I would see the, again, what we call them ETs on the ship. And sometimes people do think, well, the ETs, they're all more advanced than us. They're all super psychic and this, that and the other.

• 1:11:40Speaker 07

  Well, only one of them on that ship even picked up on that I was there. Remember, I was remoting back 20, 30 years, where the scenario was at that moment. Not right now, but then I had to wrap my head around, well, why is this one ET looking at me? He literally just turned around and started looking, and he saw me like I was seeing them. And that threw me off because I had no idea. I thought I was remoting the past. So, you know, watching a replay, not happening because I wasn't there. The 20 or 30 years ago, when this abduction happened, of course, I was remoting back. So that's one of those aspects where I had to then kind of, well, I guess time's not a thing. Um, because I just remoted back decades. And all of a sudden, this one ET figure saw me, and he literally, what he did was just move his hand up,

• 1:12:24Speaker 07

  kind of like he was wiping a mirror with a cloth or something. And before his hand was even like, I'd say, you know, up in front of him, so he partially moved it. I was gone. I was booted out of there. All of a sudden, I've never experienced that to where another, I'll just say psychic can stop me or limit me. It's just never been a thing with me. I'm just, not necessarily can't happen because clearly it can. But that ET, I would, again, I would say entity, just to generalize anything living in consciousness aware is that, stopped me and removed me from seeing anymore. And that was a, you know, a changing thing for me because again, I had to work with the whole, well, time's not real. And then, okay, well, only that one ET saw me, not the others.

• 1:13:08Speaker 07

  Um, so again, I had to wrap my head around that moment as well. And then tell the client what I could about what happened sort of thing. So it's just, it's, it's a crazy universe out there is all I can say. And we're, we're, we're experiencing a small fraction of it. Um, so yeah, then, then the whole ET part, I, I remote back for, there's no limit either, like I said, on time. So when I've remoted before, I've seen them doing modifications, taking, I'm going to get into that. But I have a whole story too, where I have an abduction scenario and I was in the army and things like that. So I knew that stuff happens. And that was back in 1992, 93, something like that in Germany.

• 1:13:50Speaker 07

  So by then I already knew that it was a thing. They weren't just stories. So, because I'd had my own experience. Um, and then again, just patching it together. From, it's like, you know, eating food in a different country that you have no idea what it's made of. Let's just say, well, that's kind of how I had to do is I'm like, okay, well, I better just perceive it from all senses, including the psychic ones, emotional senses, all of it. And then patchwork it together. Uh, and then I realized that, well, no, there were different creatures down here. No, you can even say Sasquatch. Maybe Sasquatch was one of the ones. Because by the way, they have shown that those have partial human DNA.

• 1:14:30Speaker 07

  So I think we were patchworked together is what it was by, I'll just say even more intelligent beings. Because we're not the first ones to, to pop conscious in this universe.

• 1:14:42Wes Germer?

  Yeah, I'm real curious about your abduction story. Before I ask you about that, you'd mentioned higher beings creating spirits or our spirit and putting it in a body or a vehicle, as you say, what was the purpose behind that?

• 1:15:01Speaker 07

  To, to have an experience and when, again, pulling from all the sessions I've done, I pretty much term this life as a school, a way for us to experience reality from a physical form with its limitation. And not to minimize it, but kind of like a Sims game, if people know what I'm talking about, where you get a character, you get to live a life, do this, learn different things. Um, because I've also learned, and I did not believe it, like I've said a few times in this, um, recording about the reincarnation thing. I, because I had no idea about it. The best I knew is maybe from a show where I heard that, well, you just start as a butterfly and then you get to advance to a, you know, a monk and then blah, blah, blah. That's not what I've come across.

• 1:15:42Speaker 07

  It's where I'll just, I can't say human because human would be the vehicle we're in, the body. But we're spirits or souls that emanate, and again, the best I can say is emanate from love. But we get to make the choices and have experiences, um, in different lifetimes or realities. So we get to sing songs on a different channel. Um, and sometimes I've go kind of fast like that, but I think a lot of listeners get what I'm saying. And that's the thing, because I've had, for example, animal, I don't know what to tell you, but animals communicate in English. It doesn't matter. People in other countries that don't speak English that I've tuned into for a, let's say, an English speaking client. And sometimes not. Sometimes we're handing a phone back and forth with Google translator on it.

• 1:16:27Speaker 07

  They communicate in direct English with me. I have no idea how or why. Um, but that's a thing and the same thing with animals. So there's, it's, it's basically a, I'd say a school, I wouldn't say a playground, but it's a school to where we get to have certain lessons. And I've had people, a little off topic here, but say, well, Derek, I've heard that we write a chart before we come in. Or we have this playbook that we set in concrete before we're born and we're going to live it out. It's all pre-planned. Nope. At least again, from this one psychic's perspective, now that I word it this way to some people, I go, well, we make a, you know, for lack of a better way, put in a list of suggestions or

• 1:17:08Speaker 07

  ideas that we're going to do down here, but it's not, I've never seen it to where it's set that, well, you're going to meet your, your, you know, so and so at this year, and then this is going to happen. And nah, I've never seen that kind of thing. There's a whole lot of leeway there, but we do give ourselves, I'll just say a guidebook or a, a list of suggestions or experiences that we're going to go through down here. And then we go through it just to, it's again, lessons learned. It's kind of like picking your class when you're choosing your college courses. You go, I want a little bit of math. I want a little bit of this, that and the other. So that I can relearn it or experience it this way. So that's more of the way that I've seen it, um, manifest down here.

• 1:17:48Wes Germer?

  So if a higher being created our spirit and put us in these vehicles or these bodies to live in this reality, to learn life lessons, that means someone's in charge. Who's in charge?

• 1:18:05Speaker 07

  I don't think anybody put us. I think they're created and then the next, because I've also seen where, let's put it this way, somebody's come in and they, I have to give the stories, otherwise it won't make sense. So somebody's come in and they've had a miscarriage or an abortion or something. Well, and they say, well, and they'll ask me questions about that. I'll get to see the entity. And sometimes they've come in and said, well, and again, from my terms, they'll tell me that, well, I didn't want to do that vehicle because it was going to have this issue or that issue. And I'll tell the person and they'll say, you're right. That's exactly what the doctors told me about. It was born too small of heart or this, this ailment or blah, blah, blah. I don't know. They don't come and tell me anything. The sessions just go right off the fly with no, no loading.

• 1:18:49Speaker 07

  And then I learn and patchwork together myself, but I'll still get to speak to that spirit or soul or entity. And they'll come in that way and say, no, well, I'm going to come back in, in, you know, a couple, few years when, when they're ready again. Well, then of course, a few years later, I'll hear back, well, you were right, Derek. I had a little girl and blah, blah, blah. I'm like, yep, I know. That's what they said. Now, and I've never seen it to where all of a sudden some greater entity, I'm not saying it doesn't exist because I don't know, takes that spirit and crams it into a body and says, you're having this life. No, from all my experiences, it's been an option thing. Basically vehicles coming off the production line. Entities, I'm not saying they're hardcore aligned by any means, because that's not the case when I've learned.

• 1:19:34Speaker 07

  Meaning, well, the next person born, again, vehicle, body. Well, this number two spirit gets in that. No, it's, they get to, there's a pick and choosing there. So you get to choose if you're going to have a life, say, you know, as Asian or Muslim or, and I'm, I know I'm speaking religions and then ethnicity as well, but however you want to choose your playbook. So I've seen it go that way as well. So I don't think that it's a force thing. I think however we exist, I don't know, but we do as a spirit. And then we tune into this channel, see that, as I said, manufacturer plant, meaning just another vehicle, a body, having a baby, blah, blah, blah. And then we choose to go in there. And there may be more to the story on that, but I know it is an option thing.

• 1:20:21Wes Germer?

  I guess I'm having a hard time understanding it. And not that you're not explaining it. I mean, I'm following along. The, the logic isn't clicking with me. And I'm probably a moron. That's probably why I'm not getting it. But you know, if, if we're in a different realm and we're making all these decisions like, oh, I want to come down, live this life. I want to learn this. I want to do that. Most humans I know are idiots. So I mean, I, I guess. I guess from what I'm gathering is from your theory, we're God.

• 1:20:59Speaker 07

  Well, that's how it's worded a lot of the things I'd say that we kind of are, but you use that term loosely because we're all one or connected. And there's lots of ways of saying that too.

• 1:21:12Speaker 07

  But we, yeah, and that's not to say, again, I don't know, but there's a bigger consciousness out there, you know, that's how us little humans have best rapper head around it. It's like having a, a mouse explain how a microwave works, but they're not gonna, they're not going to be able to. So the best we can do from this limited perspective is decide, well, there's another thing that looks just like us that's up there doing this, that and the other. Well, that's a lot of your, your logical, you know, analytical process is happening. But that's not to say that that's what it's limited to. So, but I do know that, yeah, entities have absolutely, so again, spirits or souls. I always have to, you know, explain that a little bit. Choose either not to come in or to leave early. I've had them say, leave early.

• 1:21:56Speaker 07

  Like it was, and not always on purpose. So it's never, so sometimes it's a, so if somebody's in here session, a person died or was killed, let's put it that way. Sometimes I've heard where they'll say, well, I wanted, and I'm talking about the spirit here. I wanted to leave for this and the other reason. And some go, nope, it was too soon. Wasn't a planned thing. Wasn't supposed to happen. So I've seen the whole gambit on that. Um, it just depends on any given session. I don't, haven't seen or perceived any bigger presence that forces us in any which way. It's more like we're given options. Again, like, kind of like a, again, I'm parking a lot of new cars or vehicles. And then they're there and we can jump into the, the four wheel drive pickup truck,

• 1:22:41Speaker 07

  or we can get into the little slow electric car or, you know, whatever. And no, that didn't quite make sense. But what I've seen is that the, the souls or spirits or entities see different options down here and then they enter. So I don't know if that also means some ET presence can force us. I don't think so. As far as I'm concerned, I don't believe that. That there's a, another physical group that decides this spirit or soul gets in there. I think they enter the vehicles, which is why they play with DNA so much. Um, and I've got unusual DNA I know as well. There's different strands of that and different family lines. There is something to all of that. So again, different model of vehicle.

• 1:23:26Speaker 07

  Some are, are produced or, you know, bred together so that that certain entities can enter those vehicles. Again, spirits enter in the body is what I'm saying. So there is something to all of that. And I don't believe for a second that everybody down here, whoever's in charge will just say, um, governments or black ops or blah, blah, blah. Um, they're, they're aware of the, because there's no way they're not aware of that stuff if I am. So, and that's the other part too is, well, I absolutely know this stuff is real. So I don't believe for a second, they don't have their own, and I'll make fun of it, pet psychic. That they, there's going to be a whole lot more perceptive than I, because there's no way I'm the most psychic guy. And again, I'm making fun of things, psychic guy. So

• 1:24:09Speaker 07

  there's got to be somebody, let's just say, level 10 out there. So there's no way they don't know about that kind of stuff. So I think it's more muddling with the DNA down here to again, get the right vehicle. So that if a certain entity that's more aware knows how to drive the car. Um, and so some of us are that way that let's just say lots of times in school get to come down here with a vehicle with more heightened psychic senses. Sometimes to be an example, or, you know, show people more, you know, options. It just, it varies. Again, not sure how much sense that made because I had no training whatsoever. I've never had a psychic reading in my life, if you can believe that. And I think that's a great thing.

• 1:24:54Speaker 07

  Cause that's kind of like some chef handing me their cookbook and saying, here's how you do it. No, there's lots of ways of bacon bread. There's not just one way. And sometimes it's better just to kind of jump in both feet and do it on your own. Then you don't have any pre-loading, um, belief systems.

• 1:25:10Wes Germer?

  Yeah. And I appreciate you indulging me, Derek. You know, we live in a world now to where if you don't believe what I believe, you're my enemy. And I don't buy into any of that. Can I ask you, what, what's the deal with Hitler? Cause I can't imagine someone as a higher entity or a spirit going, hey, I want to go down and be that guy.

• 1:25:33Speaker 07

  Yeah, but also what I've seen too is sometimes, so yeah, I don't think he was the, the friendliest guy in the block, let's say, just to, you know, kind of make light of it a little bit. But sometimes we need to have, because if there is no negative, there's not positive. You have to have the rub. Otherwise, and that's in this reality, that's not everywhere, but in this reality or this classroom, if you don't have negativity, well, then you don't know positivity. So you can say, well, you don't know, you know, light without darkness. There, there has to be that yin and yang, that difference there. Kind of thing too. And I'm not saying that, well, all of a sudden that entity chose, you know, decided all this. No, I think

• 1:26:15Speaker 07

  certain entities, Hitler in this case, came in, was, and then certain scenarios started playing out down here. And then they made whatever choice. And again, now I'm going a little vague. So I'm not just talking. Make their choices. Because I've seen entities come in, and so serial killers. But all of a sudden, you know, let's say 10 years into their sentence, when I was sitting there chatting with them in the day room or something. They regret everything. And then they'll tell me, well, you know, maybe I was into these. I'll just call them clubs. Cause again, I don't want to bring up certain terms here. But anti-religious groups, we'll put it that way. Um, that are more negative, that do try and communicate or tune in to demons and dark entities.

• 1:26:56Speaker 07

  Well, I've heard all those stories from those individuals and what they've done and experienced. And then how they've changed their mind. Not always. Some of them are still doing it in prison I'm talking about. So it's more than I have to again, wrap my head around it. Um, and to say, okay, well, it's a school, we get to make our own decisions. And some people, you know, want to put, I'll just again, be vague and say, put a lot of hot sauce on their food where some of us don't. Because they want to experience what that's like. But I don't, I don't know that anything is absolute or set in stone. Um, as far as what's going to happen.

• 1:27:34Wes Germer?

  Maybe sometimes it's not a choice. Man, people are products of their environment, you know?

• 1:27:40Speaker 07

  You summed up everything I just said, basically in that comment. That was good. Yeah. It is. And so they just started going with the flow. They see, well, this is just what I'm brought up in. This is what I learned. This is what's around me. I'm going to keep doing that. And we can all say that to one degree or another.

• 1:27:55Wes Germer?

  Yeah. Tell me about this abduction that you had in Germany.

• 1:28:00Speaker 07

  Yeah. And that was early on. So like I said, that was the early nineties. Um, when I wasn't into any of this, this was pre all of this stuff. Um, I knew something was up because of, I'll just say, because otherwise it's a whole nother podcast. I'll just say the military knew something was up with this vehicles. I've been worded in this body and DNA and what I could do even before I was, because of just the unbelievable way I was treated in the military. Um, as a private and the exceptions I got. So within one of those exceptions I was given. And I was in the first armored division. I drove a tank. Um, and or loaded it or gun, you know, different roles, armor crewman is what it's called for the listeners that know what I'm talking about.

• 1:28:45Speaker 07

  In Germany. And then I was given a, I don't remember what it was called, but it was a basically gifted a short vacation in a place called Burch's Garden. And there's a reason he brought Hitler. I'll tell you in a moment. Um, Burch's Gardens, Germany. So, and that's where the eagle's nest is, which was Hitler's big hideout up on the top of the mountain. And I got to tour that as well. Brought there and then I was taken to, and I assume they still do it. I don't really know. But basically for some random reason, I'm throwing up air quotes here. I was gifted this exception or vacation to where I was bussed from Mannheim, Germany to Burch's Gardens, Germany. And put up in a hotel room there. And I used to remember the name of the hotel. I don't though. I'm sure it's still there. Um, it can be looked up.

• 1:29:31Speaker 07

  And given a vacation for, you know, four, five, six days there, just a time away from the unit. And there's usually, usually the hotel, and it's a massive hotel. We're talking about like maybe six stories tall or something like that. You know, a couple of hundred rooms. But on this trip, for whatever reason, there were only three that were taken up. And I found that out later. Three soldiers that were there. And we were all US army soldiers from different units. None of us knew each other, but we had all won this special or gifted, we didn't say won, but gifted it for whatever reason. You're never really told. At that point, you're just excited to get out of that unit. You're not working on a tank all day or whatever. So we go there and then as we find, and then there's a, what's called a full bird colonel.

• 1:30:14Speaker 07

  So that would be a lieutenant colonel, but a colonel that has the actual, you know, eagle on there. So they're called full bird colonels that showed up there with us. And I know that was unusual because of the rank. That's not, that's just a high ranking officer. Not typically a thing, especially with just a handful of soldiers. Well, he was, as they told us, a history buff. So he would take us around and we'd go to different parts of, um, uh, that, that area to just different rooms, places. The eagle's nest was one of them. We'd go and tour that. And we went to the hotel and again in Berchtesgaden in Germany and all of a sudden he has a set of keys with us and the next morning of the mornings, I don't remember which one, he says, okay, we're gonna go on a unique tour.

• 1:30:59Speaker 07

  So we kind of report down to the lobby, show up there and he all of a sudden has a set of keys, goes over to some, just a really thick old wooden door that just kind of tucked back in the, um, an off room of the lobby area, we can't really get to it, and opens it. Nobody else is with us but the three of us. And then all of a sudden, all that's there when you open the door is a staircase heading straight down and it's old. So long story short, we go down the staircase and it ends up, there's a little set of railroad tracks at the bottom and tunnels. It was a little mini railway station that was underground, it was dated back to World War II, all of that stuff happening.

• 1:31:43Speaker 07

  And we would walk through these different, just the walkway going through the corridors and part was an old hospital room, they said all of the equipment in that, there were no people, it wasn't manned or anything, it was just a dilapidated thing that nobody could access unless, you know, he took you there. Um, and this was a special hotel, for whatever reason that Germany set aside for, or the US did, um, to take some of us down there. And later I found out it was the intuitives that they are, and there's a reason they knew about me as well, they would take down there to pick up on what we would perceive, but they don't tell us that, they just say, okay, well, here's a tour and the colonel will just start going, okay, well, this is what happened here, this is the whole hospital ward and over here is this, that and the other.

• 1:32:26Speaker 07

  And they're just watching us as we do it kind of thing. And no more exciting than that down there, other than I was picking up on presences, but we weren't talking about it, it wasn't say, hey Derek, what are you psychically picking up on, none of that was mentioned. I come up, do whatever the heck we did the rest of that day, and it was that night where it gets interesting because we each have our own room, we're just different, I was a, I think I was an E2 at the time, so just low ranked private, I had no rank of any consequence. Um, but we all got our own rooms when we were there. And then all of a sudden, I had not, I kind of figured I had to jump into this part of it because as far as I knew, it was a dream. So all of a sudden, so I'm worried as that and then I'll kind of come back around.

• 1:33:08Speaker 07

  So all of a sudden that night while I'm in my room, I haven't, well, no, nightmare, might as well call it a nightmare because that's what it was, a nightmare all about, I all of a sudden wake up in this, air quotes here again, nightmare, and I find myself literally floating, prone, headfirst going towards the window. And nobody, and there were three other individuals in the room at the time during this, again, nightmare, and they were ETs, I think the little grays you may see in a movie. And I wasn't into ETs, I wasn't giving this any thought, all of a sudden I get into some panic mode in this nightmare, and as I'm literally just floating towards a window and there's three ETs standing, they're not holding me, they're just standing there, nothing else, not saying anything or doing anything.

• 1:33:53Speaker 07

  All of a sudden I'm floating and I go into a panic mode and boom, that's it on the nightmare. And then I wake up in the morning and I'm thinking, wow, you know, I'm pretty worked up because I just had a nightmare kind of thing. And I look over at the, there was a small shelf, let's just say like a nightstand that had some stuff on it, all under the window, all of that and all that I had knocked over when I went into panic mode. So basically I woke up in my nightmare, in my head, and I realized I was being abducted. I woke up, had a fight started, you know, moving around, doing this and the other, then boom, I was gone, that was it, back asleep. And I woke up thinking that whole thing, scenario was a nightmare, until I look over

• 1:34:35Speaker 07

  and realize all that stuff that was on, there was a little lamp, there was a, um, I don't know, a box of something or other, on that nightstand, this kind of thing by the window, was all knocked off of that. So, and there was nobody walked into my room and did that. So that's when I first had to start having the realizations that that wasn't a nightmare, that was something that I woke up during an abduction, because I remoted back in it later, years later, when I started being able to do the remote viewing aspects. And I started realizing that, well, that stuff shouldn't be knocked over because that was me being abducted in a nightmare, so I shouldn't have any physical, you know, manifestations of anything like that happening. And I didn't know any more than that, but I had to, again, just start wrapping my head

• 1:35:18Speaker 07

  around scenarios like that, and that was the first time that happened.

• 1:35:22Wes Germer?

  Why, why do you think the military would put you in that position?

• 1:35:26Speaker 07

  Uh, I'll tell you this way, I didn't pick up on what I went and did read the little ETs, excuse me, there wasn't much consciousness there. I'm not even sure they were real entities. Um, I mean, the military knew about me, my dad was ex NSA, my mom, again, I don't remember how much we talked about in the last recording, my mom was abducted for a day, literally disappeared off the sidewalk for 24 hours, was put back. Um, and then when I received, so like two years earlier before this gifting of the hotel stay, when I got off the plane to show up on my unit in Mannheim, Germany, and there

• 1:36:07Speaker 07

  was probably 50 of us, I literally come up, walk into the room and we have a, the highest ranking, um, non-officer there would be a first sergeant at the time. He, and I don't know any of this, I'm just, you know, a green, again, private E1 at that time, just, you know, scared basically, because, you know, it's new to Germany, new to the army, all of this. Well, from that very first moment walking in the barracks where we were first basically acknowledging we were on this specific unit, whatnot, the first sergeant takes me and he says, and he starts smiling at me, doesn't know me as far as I know from anybody, and tells me from now on, I'm supposed to refer to him as dad, which is weird.

• 1:36:48Speaker 07

  You don't, that's not a thing you do, and he's talking about in front of other soldiers. There was the, uh, commanding officer there, captain, lieutenant, just a whole bunch of just greeting the new recruits, basically. And I'm plucked aside and being told, in front of everybody though, I said, you know, you're gonna refer to me as dad from now on. And he would do it in certain ceremonies at, um, unit gatherings in the morning where you do that, you say, son, come here, and it's, which is, it sounds weird to say, but if you're in the military and you go through the scenarios, that's just not a thing, it's just not that way, um, to where you're, you're given such exceptions and literally the whole, and it seemed weird to me, I felt uncomfortable, heck, calling, he wasn't my dad, that didn't even make sense to me.

• 1:37:33Speaker 07

  But he wanted to make it clear to everybody else, basically, you know, don't mess with this guy kind of thing, and then other exceptions to where usually you're in a barracks room or a dorm, they're called barracks, but then there's certain rooms in there where you're supposed to, especially in my rank, share one with, say, eight other soldiers, not me, I was given my own private room, um, got to come and go as I please, and all of this time, I wasn't feeling like, oh, I'm extra special, I was like, what is this all about? It actually made me nervous because I didn't know why or anything. And I didn't know if that, at the time, I didn't know my dad was even, was an NSA agent, so I didn't know it had to do with that or my name, because they definitely knew who I was when I got there.

• 1:38:16Speaker 07

  And there's different parts of that as well, I had an uncle that was the CEO of Boeing, I didn't find that out until years later, uh, Phil Condit. Um, and then I don't know how many, it's after, long story short, I did a deep AI research on family, um, history, and there were four or five different congressmen that were Condit, senators, literally the governor on the Mayflower, believe it or not, the actual Mayflower was a Condit. Um, the, all of that kind of stuff popped up in that and I had no idea because I wasn't into any of that, I didn't research anything. So I don't know where, at what point it all gets attributed, but that line of vehicles

• 1:38:57Speaker 07

  or DNA goes back very far and there's always been unusual things associated with it. So again, I don't know any more specific than that on why or how, but it wasn't random that, again, I was, I was given those exceptions in the army, but I wasn't told why, I was just given those. If I wanted a different position or job in the military, I was given whatever I wanted kind of thing too. Um, it was just highly unusual stuff that I could never pinpoint on why, it was just, they definitely wanted to keep me happy and keep me in the military. And that was an absolute thing as well. Um, but I was never actually taken aside and told that, well, it's because of your dad, your name, your DNA or that, I had no idea.

• 1:39:42Speaker 07

  Uh, but that was all part of it, that I had to just accept was real and not really understand why.

• 1:39:48Wes Germer?

  Yeah, it's strange, makes me think of, uh, bloodlines.

• 1:39:52Speaker 07

  There, there is something to that, yeah, and I'm definitely not saying I'm extra special because I'm the first guy that'll say, oh, no, no, no, is this vehicle body more aware and heightened over time? Absolutely, why? It's not because I learned some magic meditation or I did yoga this many times, I'm making fun of things now. No, but it's absolutely a thing. Um, now, outside of how that happened or why, I don't really know. Um, but yeah, that, that does happen with certain people.

• 1:40:25Wes Germer?

  The, uh, the first one you fought off, but was there a time that you remember when you were abducted?

• 1:40:33Speaker 07

  Um, okay. Well, you can call them again. I don't think we talked about this last one, but yeah, there were times when I was in middle school, so sixth and seventh grade, I was living in Huntington Beach, California at the time, Talbot Middle School, and again, to try and zoom in all the way for anybody that knows the areas. They would come into the classrooms for at least two years though there and somebody would walk in, they pause the class, they say, okay, Derek, grab your things. And they would literally have me grab my things in the middle of class. So in the middle of the day through the sixth and seventh grade, I would be walked out to, believe it or not, it sounds like a joke, but a white van and driven away to another location to where, and I wasn't the only, I was the only one at that school, but when

• 1:41:15Speaker 07

  we got to the location, I was, they, it was some, I don't remember the wording they did it, but it was extra additional schooling of some kind. There's another term for that. I'm kind of blanking on. But they would take us there and it wasn't like, oh, here's your extra class on math. No, I was put on in a desk and there was maybe, I don't know, I'd guesstimate 20 other kids. So there was like almost a classroom size, all the same age, and we were given puzzles, not, not a puzzle like you put the sides together, but on paper to where you try and figure this out. I mean, I can remember different questions they would give us, different drawings we would have to make. And I can't say, oh, they were

• 1:41:55Speaker 07

  teaching us remote viewing that. No, it was never that distinct, but we were being tested on seeing what we could put together. Cause at that age, I'm thinking, I just want to get back to my class with my friends, you know, let's get this over with, whatever. Not giving any more thought. And I didn't know until years later, my parents never knew about it. This wasn't a, a signed up program because he needs special training or help with this subject or whatever. They had no idea. Cause I'd say, I mentioned it later on in life. I'm like, I'm glad that didn't continue. And they're going, what? And I told them what I just told you. And they're saying, we didn't know anything about that. So basically for a couple of school years there, I was driven away, taken to some

• 1:42:39Speaker 07

  location and with other kids where they were there. And then just, I would best summarize it as being tested. I mean, I don't remember everything we did because that was so long ago. And in my head at the time, it's just, you know, I don't know, just an extra class I gotta take for whatever reason, didn't give it a whole lot of thought. So that would be, when you say abducted, that's pretty much an abduction kind of thing, but no, not a UFO one, other than that one in Germany that I remember.

• 1:43:07Wes Germer?

  Did anyone contact you from the military afterwards with more insight?

• 1:43:15Speaker 07

  Not like that, but I'll tell you what was done, even at the state level. Cause again, I was a Washington State Correctional Officer. Um, and I can't explain that either, but I literally, when I was, and I, I retired once, went up into Nome, Alaska in 2012, um, took some gold dredges and did that whole deal. There was some TV show on it. Um, and came back and then literally had to report, cause then I wanted my job back, basically. Cause I didn't strike you rich up there. Go back in there and let the superintendent, excuse me. So I think the, the head honcho of the prison, I say, well, I want this post. So just like the military, I tell them exact, and there were hundreds of posts or positions at the prison. Um, and usually it's a seniority thing,

• 1:43:58Speaker 07

  or you have to wait years and sign up for lists to see who gets chosen. So basically, any, including up to my newer position, I'm about to start, that I already mentioned earlier, I basically not consciously thinking about it, but go in there and let them know what I want. And I'm giving it to just a very unusual degree. So even at the prison system, when I said, well, I want the perimeter post, which is where then all of a sudden I started seeing a lot of everything from the silent helicopter to the UFOs and all that kind of stuff. I was, you know, randomly, not randomly, put in that position to have those experiences. So that's more how it manifested for me to where I would apply for this out of the other and not, not

• 1:44:40Speaker 07

  having a shot in the dark to get in it, but no matter what, if he wanted it, he got it. And those type of stories go on from the federal level to the state level to just really almost anything, um, towards a lot of them just not believable, even to me, if I hadn't been in it. So that's kind of like one of the running jokes in my family, like, well, okay, you can manifest it, it's going to happen. And there is something to that. So, but again, there's nobody, the superintendent didn't take me aside, say, okay, well, but I literally had to have that, I don't remember what it's called, but like a, a rehire interview, because I retired and then left, you know, again, thinking I was going to strike a reach up in Nome.

• 1:45:20Speaker 07

  And unusual experiences up there too, let me tell you. But when I got back, again, the rehiring process, going in there, talking to them, told them the exact position I wanted. All of a sudden, person was moved out, I'm put in it, which it never happens. That's just not a thing. Cause it's a whole seniority or you're a teensters, uh, member then. So things have to happen a certain way, but not if I requested it. And I didn't go in there with such knowing that. I didn't give it any thought. I just, you know, I said, you know, I'd really prefer this post out here and, and this, that and the other, on this shift. And then again, just like the military, they would make it happen no matter what, but not set me aside, go, well, okay, because your name's Condit, you know, nothing like that.

• 1:46:02Wes Germer?

  You know, when we very first spoke and we didn't know we were going to do a part two, I figured you had told me about this job that you were going to start in a week or two. And I remember thinking, it's a type of job that most people who spend 20 or 30 years in the military and have a decade of education, probably couldn't get. And I didn't say anything to you at the time, but I remember thinking, what a high level job for a guy who writes books about UFOs and Bigfoot and

• 1:46:42Wes Germer?

  has a store called Bigfoot Gems. I mean, no offense, but I remember thinking like, I wonder how he got that job. Let me ask you, and I don't want you to say where or what you're doing. But do you have any experience working in that field?

• 1:47:02Speaker 07

  No, no. And that, oh, I can't, I can't kind of be big on that one too. I found out through life, I don't have to. It's pretty much if I go for it or request it. And again, a lot, I wish I could say a lot more of this, but because I'm about to start, I can't even talk about the interview process, which was, should be in its own show. Things just work out and lay out for me, um, to happen. I'll put it that way. So the quick, short answer is no, uh, not at all.

• 1:47:34Wes Germer?

  Yeah. Kind of got the creeps now. Um, I guess for the audience, it would be like me quitting podcasting to go work for NASA as a rocket engineer. I have no experience, but I'll be heading the department. But you're not working for NASA and you're not a rocket engineer. I'm just, yeah, man, that, um, I think some people listening to this might go, wow, that just sounds like a bunch of BS of what you just said, but yeah, I, I'm, I don't know what to say. Uh, and I don't want you to go into what you're

• 1:48:15Wes Germer?

  doing, but yeah, very, uh, very fascinating.

• 1:48:23Wes Germer?

  You know, I used to think remote viewing was complete BS. And I remember I sat down and watched a whole documentary on it and kind of put my bias aside. And I can't remember what the, um, I know his last name is Swan, camera was first name is. Anyway, he's a famous remote viewer and they based that whole movie, The Men That Stir Goats on these guys, but I wish it would have just told the story as opposed to trying to dramatize it. Cause the original story is way more fascinating than, uh, The Man Who Stirred Goats. And you know, by the end of the documentary, I was thinking, wow, there really

• 1:49:06Wes Germer?

  is something to this. And even the government thinks so. You know, the Russians were killing our remote viewers. We were killing their remote viewers. If it's all BS, then why kill people?

• 1:49:20Speaker 07

  Exactly. It wasn't random. And I again, I can safely say with that as well, that topic that did not believe in it, not a thing until all of a sudden I was doing it. So it is absolutely a thing. And then just imagine if somebody was actually trained on it. Yeah. So no, it's because everybody has that psychic sense. It's called intuition. I mean, we may loosely call it gut instincts. But every one of us, I believe, has had those moments where they knew this out of the other, whatever stories in their head. Well, just imagine if you focused on that sense, just like your sense of smell. Well, then you can differentiate between those subtle senses. And the same works for the psychic sense. So it's absolutely a thing. And I know they've they've done that. They've done that for decades. The remote viewing aspect in many countries.

• 1:50:06Wes Germer?

  Yeah, like I said, I was a pretty harsh critic of remote viewing. I mean, it sounded like a bunch of nonsense to me, but I actually believe it. I believe that people can do it. And I can't believe we're almost two hours into it. And for the audience, Derek Cundant, he is the author of the Triangle series. It's an eight book collection investigating UFOs, Bigfoot, cryptid sightings, paranormal experiences, and other strange mysteries that all kind of happen in a certain area. And I've really enjoyed reading it. Is there another story from the book that

• 1:50:46Wes Germer?

  you want to? Man, I feel like I should ask you for like a job reference or hook a brother up. Is there another story from one of the books that you'll share with us?

• 1:50:59Speaker 07

  Yeah, I can talk about this one. This is the the Nimitz, and it's actually been on TV. So the Nimitz Tic Tac Encounter. This was from 2004. So basically, we're talking about UAE or a UFO around. And these were were unidentified flying objects, UFOs, were multiple sightings on radar. It was just southwest of San Francisco, or I'm sorry, San Diego. And then they're basically small unidentified, again, UAEs, as the government calls them now, flying around some Navy aviators. And then there's against on radars on video. There was no rotors, no wings, no exhaust. And for anybody that's watching, there's been, I don't know how many releases of these type of

• 1:51:44Speaker 07

  videos here in the last several months by the US government showing these things and letting everybody know they're not ours. Because if they were, they wouldn't be showing you. Not that we don't have things that can probably do similar type stuff. But these weren't ours. So that makes me wonder why they're being released a lot more now. But the commander's name was David Fray. I kept trying to say Fravor. He was in one of the aircraft that started, they tried to chase these different things. And then the object would circle around the aircraft, the fighter jet, accelerate, and leave view out of sight so fast that they couldn't describe it. And then

• 1:52:25Speaker 07

  basically, the ship's detection system picked up on it, the air, the ones monitoring it did. I'm trying to say, there's even been official acknowledgement of the recording. And it's it basically was intelligently controlled. And there's lots of different stories like this in the various books that will loosely call UFOs, you know, because there are unidentified flying objects, where sometimes it's military like this one, or seen them, or there's other ones here in Mount Spokane, there's different ones, some out here in concrete Washington, where whole groups of people, families in the neighborhood would come out and they would see, again, a lighted

• 1:53:06Speaker 07

  object moving through the sky. And often, some of them would have, like trails coming off of them like a sparkler. Nothing actually hitting the ground, but just going kind of some slow moving through the area in this in this concrete Washington, what I'm acknowledging a little bit right now, to where the families went out, saw this plane size, so larger than a vehicle, so probably a couple hundred feet across, moving slowly through the neighborhood. And with, again, that sparkler effect coming off of the back, but nothing hitting the ground. And where all the animals would go crazy, the dogs barking, and the people out there getting in on video, just like the one I just talked about over the Pacific, Pacific Ocean, where they have it on video as well. They've released that video, the government has. And it's been known about

• 1:53:51Speaker 07

  before they released it. So that's just showing that a lot of these stories that people have talked about, or even videos, are now getting acknowledged for for some reason, people don't believe anything until the government says it's a thing. Well, a lot of that is a thing, regardless of the government says anything. So those are just really interesting ones. And they, again, every single book, be it the Alaska Triangle book, the Seattle Triangle, Oregon Triangle, or just three different California Triangle books, all of them have different encounters like this, where there's, again, the UFOs or UAPs, I real quickly, because I know

• 1:54:31Speaker 07

  we're running out of time. I was maybe 15 or 16 years old, in Huntington Beach, California, and out with a buddy of mine on the pier, dozens of people on the pier, out there at nighttime, and all of a sudden, there was a, I don't know what they call them, but the underwater ones. All of a sudden, what we would call a UFO, came up under the pier, right under where we were standing. So we're on the very edge of it, on the furthest part, just looking over the edge of the pier, doing whatever we were doing at that age. And all of a sudden, a UFO, drive flies, you know, whatever, under it was underwater, not more than a couple feet, because we could see it clear as day, come up under the pier, kind of just staying in that area, a few feet under the

• 1:55:13Speaker 07

  surface. And there were at least a dozen people that saw it. It wasn't just me and my buddy. And then all of a sudden, just kind of slowly take off again with lights where you would think, maybe an engine, it wasn't a boat. I mean, it was clear that it wasn't anything we knew of. But it was a UFO underwater, you I forget they call them, but the underwater ones. So even back in my teens, we saw things like that.

• 1:55:38Wes Germer?

  Yeah, I appreciate sharing that from the book and even your own personal experience. Last question I want to ask you. These aliens, are they spirits put in a vehicle or body, as you say? And what is it that they want flying around in our airspace?

• 1:55:57Speaker 07

  Much of the UFOs, because I have remoted to a bunch of them, they're not entities in there. There's not aliens in there. They're just craft, or things like that. So there was not. There have been several times where, yes, I do get to see. So basically, yes, it would be a different vehicle, an alien body with a solar spirit inside of it, flying the vehicle around. But often, they weren't. They were just like drones or something like that. Sometimes I wouldn't even be able to see into them, because sometimes they would be just, just energy or light where I could remote. I'm like, okay, well, I want to see inside of it now. Well, all I would see is light. I wouldn't see

• 1:56:40Speaker 07

  anything. I wouldn't see like a bunch of moving parts or engines or anything like that. It was just energy. So it's kind of, it spans the whole thing. And sometimes there are, and I've seen seven foot tall ETs. That's a thing. So there's lots of vehicles in the universe. And the best way I would think about it would be, well, if we found, you know, little humanoid creatures living on one of the moons of Jupiter, wherever out there, well, it's the same thing we're gonna do. They're not gonna look just like us. We're gonna fly our aircraft or drones, or whatever they're called at the time, around and check them out. Sometimes, I mean, don't we do that to animals now? Don't we capture certain gorillas, monkeys, things like that, and sometimes test on

• 1:57:24Speaker 07

  them? And sometimes, you know, mess with their DNA? I don't see how that's much different. And because I can't believe for a second, we're the first, this, again, I'll call vehicle, the human isn't the first vehicle on this one planet that is the first to arrive. There's others, especially when you look at the timeframes. So I can just then my thoughts go, well, okay, somebody, some of this, this crew of, you know, people in a different vehicle that we would call alien, became before us, and then they found us, kind of thing, just like we would do.

• 1:57:59Wes Germer?

  You're right. This world is a weird, weird place. It's a weird universe that we live in. And I really appreciate you letting me pick your brain about your beliefs. And we got a little off track. But I really enjoyed chatting with you, Derek. For the audience, go out and get Derek's books, The Triangle series. And I have links below for the books and for Derek's website, and also Bigfoot Gems. I really appreciate you coming back on, Derek. Even it'll kind of creep me out. Good luck on the new job. If you need a assistant, let me know. But thank you again, brother, for coming on. I really enjoyed chatting with you.

• 1:58:41Speaker 07

  No, it's been a lot of fun. I love that we were all over the place. Because, you know, I'm interested in these topics too. And I'm always learning. So yeah, it's been fun.

• 1:58:50Wes Germer?

  Thanks again, Derek. And that's it for tonight, everyone. Remember, if you've had an encounter, shoot me an email. My email address is [email protected]. And if you get a chance, check out sasquatchchronicles.com. You can become a member and get additional shows. Until next time, everyone.

• 1:59:25Speaker 02

  I'm blind

• 1:59:33Speaker 02

  And red clothes

• 1:59:41Speaker 02

  Treading on broken glass, feeling the weight of dark, looking for a white star

• 1:59:55Speaker 02

  I'm fine

• 2:00:02Speaker 02

  I'm a liar

• 2:00:09Speaker 02

  In a peculiar state of mind, traveling back in time, I wanna be a white star

• 2:00:25Speaker 02

  I don't care if I die, moving backwards head and heart

• 2:00:39Speaker 02

  I don't care if I die, moving backwards head and heart

• 2:00:53Speaker 02

  I'm

• 2:01:00Speaker 02

  I'm lightning

• 2:01:08Speaker 02

  Stood at the speed of sound, ready to leave the ground, looking like a white star

• 2:01:23Speaker 02

  I don't care if I die, moving backwards head and heart

• 2:01:37Speaker 02

  I don't care if I die, moving backwards head and heart

• 2:02:37Speaker 03

  I got you guys, I got you guys, everything upside down

• 2:02:43Speaker 03

  Okay, let's, let's drift in like this slowly, okay?

• 2:02:52Speaker 03

  I think you see it, I'm a smart guy

• 2:02:56Speaker 03

  I mean, they are, they're pretty

• 2:03:01Speaker 03

  I can't, I can't, I'm not, I'm not ready, I'm not ready

• 2:03:19Speaker 02

  I don't care if I die, moving backwards head and heart

• 2:03:34Speaker 02

  I don't care if I die, moving backwards head and heart

• 2:03:48Speaker 02

  I don't care if I die, moving backwards head and heart

• 2:04:03Speaker 02

  I don't care if I die, moving backwards head and heart

• 2:04:17Speaker 02

  I don't care if I die, moving backwards head and heart

• 2:04:32Speaker 02

  I don't care if I die, moving backwards head and heart