Ep. 857: Turkey Season Changes, the Death Valley Super Bloom, and Bad Poachers

Steven Rinella https://www.instagram.com/stevenrinella/?hl=en and the MeatEater crew discuss: The Turkey Week Giveaway Sweepstakes https://store.themeateater.com/pages/giveaway-sweepstakes?srsltid=AfmBOoqQf9WL0BtkeWYE9BU5UbGignE3RDLR-FbCCta7lkAiBdmErXKF; a giant moray eel; biking and fly fishing; Delta Waterfowl hen houses https://deltawaterfowl.org/what-we-do/duck-production/hen-houses/?gad_source=1&gad_campaignid=18040194656&gbraid=0AAAAABb10mV7oQ7U9oye9ukcshNZAO8iV&gclid=CjwKCAjwhLPOBhBiEiwA8_wJHPLZVRdrlQYkHgCcTcqSrz0OgweIiT8Pr3YMpwPjpyhhpCx86hdKMxoCmtsQAvD_BwE; more on TSS and tungsten; nibbling on nuts; turkey season changes; the Death Valley Super Bloom; bad poacher dudes; Shiras moose; and more. Outro credit: "The Screaming Song" written by George Alan Sparhawk Connect with Steve https://www.themeateater.com/authors/steven-rinella and The MeatEater Podcast Network https://www.youtube.com/@MeatEaterPodcastNetwork Steve on Instagram https://www.instagram.com/stevenrinella and Twitter https://twitter.com/stevenrinella?lang=en MeatEater on Instagram https://www.instagram.com/meateater, Facebook https://www.facebook.com/StevenRinellaMeatEater/, Twitter https://twitter.com/MeatEaterTV?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor, and YouTube https://www.youtube.com/@MeatEaterPodcastNetwork See omnystudio.com/listener https://omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

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• 0:04Speaker 01

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• 1:04Steven Rinella?

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• 1:45Steven Rinella?

  Welcome to the news show. On this week's show, we got an interesting tale about a big-ass Moore a eel. Spencer Newharth can't ride a bike and fish at the same time. Testicle jerky news. Are Shiras moose going away, but not in the way you think? Poachers get serious in North Dakota, and Max gets serious about reporting on those poachers. Spencer Newharth stops to tell the flowers. Get it?

• 2:12Speaker 03

  We'll see if we get it.

• 2:14Steven Rinella?

  Nate Mason has a report on TSS and more, but first, the Moore a eel. Let's hear it. Okay. This is the R news. Listen to this.

• 2:27Steven Rinella?

  Uh, we were down in the, the, we went to the Bahamas for spring break. Um, folks who watch the show, we filmed the episode some time ago with Cameron Kirk Connell. And Cameron Kirk Connell, if you're, um, such a listener that you listen to our Close Calls story, stories, the Close Call series. There's a Close Calls where a guy, a spear fisherman shoots another spear fisherman in the fin. Who's passed out, he's blacked out, shallow water blackout and he's sinking to the bottom of the ocean. Cameron Kirk Connell is able to get close enough to him, he's on his way up and he sees his buddy sinking, dying. And he shoots him in the fin with a spear gun. And then they were able to hoist him up and they resuscitate him and save his life.

• 3:13Steven Rinella?

  We're with him and his family, my family, his family in the Bahamas spearfishing. And we were primarily, uh, hole hunting. Like you go down there, you just kind of go over the reefs, you kick or drift in the current over the reefs. And now and then you'll catch a hogfish out doing his business. But you spook a lot of groupers. And when you spook a grouper, you just follow them. And that grouper is going to move and move and he'll go into a hole, but he won't like it and he'll leave the hole. He'll try another hole. He'll go into a hole and a little grouper will come out of the hole, then he'll come out of the hole. And eventually you follow him, follow him, follow him and he'll find a hole.

• 3:49Speaker 03

  And a hole up.

• 3:50Steven Rinella?

  And you hover over the hole until you're like, he's in that hole. And then you start hole hunting them. And it could turn into, chasing them into a hole is one thing. Killing them is a whole other thing and then getting them back out of the hole is a whole other thing. So it, it turns into like a real, it could turn into a real fistfight. So my kid goes down, we get a big black grouper in a hole. My kid goes down and, and, uh, it was a 30 pound grouper. My kid goes down and like glances it in the head, but doesn't like wings it in the head, but doesn't even hurt it.

• 4:29Steven Rinella?

  Cam's kid goes down and gets at the tail.

• 4:34Steven Rinella?

  It's fighting around and all of a sudden, and I go down to try to get it out, but the spear shaft has pulled free of the grouper's tail. The grouper comes out of that hole and goes into a new hole. Cam's now with his flashlight, trying to look around and find them in this new, it's like, some of these things are like Tora Bora. I don't know if you remember back to the war in Afghanistan. They're like the Tora Bora cave complex. You're appreciating. Oh, yeah. Nate Mason's appreciating. Oh, joined today by Max Barda, Nate Mason, Crinch Neiders here, Spencer Newhart, Brody Henderson. So,

• 5:12Steven Rinella?

  he's down looking around with his light and I see he's like looking into one hole and it's this Tora Bora complex and some of these holes have chimneys in them. And you could sometimes you get them into a hole and you'll sometimes peer into a chimney and locate them.

• 5:28Steven Rinella?

  He's got his head and he's to his waist in a hole, looking around. It's 30 feet of water. So I'm on the surface and I see a moray eel, the likes of which, I mean, like this eel just keeps coming and coming and coming and he, cause he knows the troubles are brewing. They're like sharks. Like he knows. A big one, though. Yeah. He knows what's up. How big you think? How big? Yeah. Probably six feet long, bigger round as your, bigger round as your thigh. Hmm. I mean, like enough of a one, he comes and all of a sudden he enters the same, not the same entrance that Cam's in, but another entrance to the same hole.

• 6:12Steven Rinella?

  My boy dives down to alert him, cause they'll bite you. And as my boy's descending to alert him, Cam's coming up, but I can tell by his body language, he doesn't know, he didn't encounter the eel. He's coming up casually. Okay? He comes up casually like, oh my God, dude, I thought you were gonna get bit in the face. That big eel went into the cave complex.

• 6:39Steven Rinella?

  He have it. I don't know. I'm just hanging around like I don't, you know, this guy is the master. Um, he's, you know, one of the, one of the like, this is gonna sound like, like he's among the top handful of spear fishermen that there are. Okay. So he's like, oh, he's in the hole. And he says that grouper's coming out. And we're just hovering there. And a while later, here comes a crab out of that hole that doesn't like being in that hole. And my boy goes down and gets the crab. And we wait a while and wait a while. And sure enough that here comes that grouper out substantially more wounded.

• 7:20Steven Rinella?

  Like was getting mauled, was getting mauled in the hole. By the eel.

• 7:28Steven Rinella?

  And he's not in a good, he's not in a good place anymore.

• 7:31Speaker 03

  That thing was just down there taking chunks out of him.

• 7:34Steven Rinella?

  You know, we. After getting shot twice. So then we went down and shot, then we went and shot the grouper for real. Then he went into another hole. Wow. And then I was able to wrestle him out of that hole, but he was not, Cam, just Cam said, just like instantly, he's like, oh, he's coming out. You know how you got like bird dogs? Yeah. You need like grouper eels. Yeah. Oh. Yeah. Train them. That's a good idea. If you had an eel in your pocket. And that grouper goes into that network and you just. Sick boy. Yeah.

• 8:05Speaker 04

  You can't, you, can you spear a more eel? I don't know. I've, I've seen them.

• 8:10Steven Rinella?

  I've talked to people that have done it. You got your hands full when you do that. I've been told.

• 8:15Speaker 04

  Okay.

• 8:16Steven Rinella?

  I can't even imagine what would be like to have. Cam said in a, in an extreme situation. Cause Bahamas is pole spear only. You can't use a spear gun. So it's all pole sprees, but they have slip tips on them. Like a harpoon head, a detachable head. He said, if you had to.

• 8:37Steven Rinella?

  Um, and you were protecting yourself, you might, but you're just probably just gonna forget about your spear. Like, you're not gonna get it.

• 8:45Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah.

• 8:46Steven Rinella?

  And this thing, I mean, no. I've been bit by those suckers. They hurt, man.

• 8:51Speaker 05

  How'd the grouper taste?

• 8:53Steven Rinella?

  You know, I didn't eat that particular grouper, but I think Brody did. Did you eat a bit of grouper flay that was kind of missing a chunk on the tail?

• 9:01Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 9:01Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, the maul'd end.

• 9:02Speaker 03

  And you could see where it was messed up a little bit.

• 9:04Steven Rinella?

  Okay, yeah.

• 9:05Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 9:05Steven Rinella?

  You, you enjoy it?

• 9:07Speaker 03

  Oh, yes.

• 9:07Steven Rinella?

  Okay.

• 9:08Speaker 05

  That thing had the, like, dark cutter equivalent end of life.

• 9:11Steven Rinella?

  I don't think that works on fish, man.

• 9:13Speaker 05

  Wildly stressed.

• 9:14Speaker 03

  Yeah, cuz all fish die, like, stressed out.

• 9:16Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, I don't think that works on fish.

• 9:17Speaker 03

  Whether you rod reel them or not.

• 9:18Speaker 05

  Hmm, sure.

• 9:19Steven Rinella?

  But he had a, yeah, he had a good, we, we, we messed with that fish for probably forty-five minutes.

• 9:24Speaker 05

  Damn, what an adventure.

• 9:25Steven Rinella?

  Though, they turned into some wrestling matches, man. Uh, alright, you did, you did a bicycle trip, Spencer?

• 9:31Speaker 05

  Mm-hmm. Yeah, I've been, I've been working on planning this for like a month, just getting my, my gear ready for it. I was going to bike and fly fish at the same time. Um, the fly fishing was no good, though. I was in Yellowstone National Park this time of year. Ninety-five percent of their water is closed to angling.

• 9:47Steven Rinella?

  Why's, why's that?

• 9:48Speaker 05

  Um.

• 9:49Speaker 06

  Spawning purposes or not?

• 9:50Speaker 05

  I think to protect some native spawners. Um, just to, like, in general, give fish a break down there. So, I don't think it's uncommon even in, like, Montana on non-national park.

• 10:00Steven Rinella?

  What is, is there, like, an opening day or something?

• 10:02Speaker 03

  There is.

• 10:02Speaker 05

  There is an opening day, yep. Uh, that comes around in May, I think, for most of the water, but other parts have different openers. Anyway, so, like, five percent of water is open right now, so I was going to bike into there, as well as, like, probably eighty percent of their roads are closed as well.

• 10:17Steven Rinella?

  Did Mrs. Newharf come with you?

• 10:18Speaker 05

  No, no.

• 10:19Steven Rinella?

  Solo?

• 10:20Speaker 05

  Uh, me and a, me and a buddy from town here. Um, was fixing to bike and fly.

• 10:26Steven Rinella?

  It's weird, I never got a...

• 10:28Speaker 05

  You don't like Yellowstone though.

• 10:30Steven Rinella?

  That's true. I like to say no. I like to be able to say no.

• 10:33Speaker 03

  He would take his e-bike.

• 10:34Speaker 05

  Next time, next time.

• 10:35Steven Rinella?

  I like to be able to say no.

• 10:37Speaker 05

  Uh, so I, I biked in, um, started fishing. The fishing was no good. Runoff has started a little early this year. And that's like 5% of water that I could fish. It was just too dirty, uh, too turbid, couldn't, couldn't turn up any fish. Had one off.

• 10:52Steven Rinella?

  So when you pitched this segment, I think Brody pitched it on your behalf.

• 10:55Speaker 05

  Well.

• 10:56Steven Rinella?

  It was, it was in anticipation of all the fish you were gonna catch.

• 10:59Speaker 05

  Oh yeah, man. It was gonna be good. Listen, I was gonna, I was gonna get so distracted. Yeah, I was gonna be so distracted with fishing that it was just gonna be a fishing trip. It wasn't gonna be a bike trip anymore. The other thing happened. The fishing was so bad that it was just a bike trip. So I ended up biking 48 miles.

• 11:14Steven Rinella?

  Oh, really?

• 11:15Speaker 05

  In Yellowstone this weekend. Yeah.

• 11:16Steven Rinella?

  Okay.

• 11:17Speaker 05

  And I spent four hours fishing, uh, with no fish caught.

• 11:19Steven Rinella?

  Not a nibble?

• 11:21Speaker 05

  Uh, there was a nibble. I, I had a trout off, read a streamer, had him on for probably one and a half seconds and he was gone.

• 11:27Speaker 03

  Long distance release.

• 11:28Speaker 05

  Long distance release. Yeah. Couldn't, couldn't even identify.

• 11:31Steven Rinella?

  Did you see anything crazy?

• 11:33Speaker 05

  Crazy? No. Bison, I mean, what you'd expect to see in Yellowstone.

• 11:37Speaker 03

  No dead, no dead critters laying in rivers with bears on top of them?

• 11:40Speaker 05

  No, I was ready for bears though. They had, uh, bears show up earlier this year, five days sooner.

• 11:45Steven Rinella?

  My neighbor just had one in his garbage. Couldn't believe it.

• 11:47Speaker 03

  Really?

• 11:47Steven Rinella?

  You know, already.

• 11:48Speaker 05

  Bison, elk, coyote, muskrat. Uh, just some standard Yellowstone.

• 11:52Steven Rinella?

  Saw some scraps, did you?

• 11:54Speaker 05

  One, one. We got a good view of him because I was on a bridge looking down. I never seen him do this before, but at one point, he spent probably like 30 seconds, uh, he just gave himself to the current and floated down the current and he looked like he was totally careless. And then he dove under after that.

• 12:10Speaker 03

  I heard a river trap is real good in national parks.

• 12:13Steven Rinella?

  No, we do it hard, dude. We do great down there.

• 12:15Speaker 05

  I bet you do okay.

• 12:16Speaker 03

  Can't we have a story coming up on something about that?

• 12:19Steven Rinella?

  Oh, we stack them up down there, man. It's weird because no one else hits it.

• 12:23Speaker 05

  It's a good season.

• 12:24Steven Rinella?

  We can never figure out what's going on, you know?

• 12:26Speaker 05

  The season never closes.

• 12:27Steven Rinella?

  You always feel like you're doing something wrong.

• 12:27Speaker 05

  Mm-hmm. Yeah, yeah.

• 12:29Steven Rinella?

  Uh, all right, Spencer, tell us about the hunt giveaway, man.

• 12:31Speaker 05

  Uh, well.

• 12:32Steven Rinella?

  Is that your job? Or is that my job?

• 12:34Speaker 05

  You, you do that one.

• 12:36Steven Rinella?

  Oh, okay.

• 12:36Speaker 05

  And then I'll cover the next one.

• 12:37Steven Rinella?

  Oh, that's right. All right, uh, right now, turkey week. Turkey week is, uh, now at the meat eater store. Uh, so help you get ready to spring. We've rounded up some of our favorite gear for chasing gobblers. Whether you're chasing them Miriam's or them, uh, them, them hard gobbling Easterns.

• 12:56Steven Rinella?

  I heard one rip the other day from my house. In Easter?

• 12:58Speaker 03

  Yeah, I told you they were going and then we had bad weather and they just looked sad and like there's nothing worse looking than a wet sorry looking just.

• 13:06Steven Rinella?

  You know, before anyone gets excited about coming hunting by my house, I'll save you the hassle. It's not a hunting area.

• 13:12Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 13:13Steven Rinella?

  But it does get town. It gets like town birds. Yeah. Town bears too. Yeah, cause town bears, town birds. Anyways, I'm out there. Nice, perfectly nice morning and up the hill. Up the hill there.

• 13:26Steven Rinella?

  And I call my neighbor. I'm like, sons of bitches are gobbling early.

• 13:30Speaker 03

  Did you call back to that bird at all?

• 13:32Steven Rinella?

  No, I ran in to call my neighbor. I don't know why. I'm like, they're gobbling early, damn it. He's like, we gotta go quicker. And then it snowed.

• 13:42Speaker 03

  Yep.

• 13:42Steven Rinella?

  And I'm like, this is gonna knock the gobble right out of them. There's a good amount of birds up there. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Uh, what was I saying? Oh, turkey week. We got brand new meat eater, logoware, logo ware and seasonings, turkey calls from Phelps, uh, game calls. I'm holding the the prime cuts pack right here. Signature Yanni. So it's, it's clay from top to bottom. It's Steve signature cut, which isn't in there because mine's right here. The Yanni and the clay. So from bottom to top, it's best caller, second best caller, worst caller.

• 14:21Steven Rinella?

  Right? That's the way to think about it. But think about it like this. My cut is meant for dudes who just want to make good turkey sounds. And they're not like gonna be out of competition. Cause it's just an easy, low pressure cut. You know what I'm talking about?

• 14:36Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 14:37Steven Rinella?

  It's a low pressure cut.

• 14:39Speaker 03

  Did they stop making the Jake break?

• 14:41Steven Rinella?

  I don't know if they still, that was a low, that's a low pressure cut too. It's like, it's like easy, it's easy. My cut makes it easy to, to, to be not, to, to be a novice diaphragm caller and get where you're making some sounds because you don't have to have so much, ugh. And you don't have, it's just an easy to use call.

• 15:01Speaker 05

  Phil Robertson always said that a live mallard would not win a duck calling contest. And so that's what

• 15:06Steven Rinella?

  Sure.

• 15:07Speaker 05

  Steve

• 15:07Steven Rinella?

  Oh, people's, yeah.

• 15:08Speaker 05

  He's not looking to win a turkey calling contest.

• 15:10Steven Rinella?

  No, I kill, I kill a lot of turkeys.

• 15:12Speaker 05

  Mm hmm.

• 15:13Steven Rinella?

  But I would never win a turkey calling contest.

• 15:14Speaker 05

  Sure.

• 15:15Steven Rinella?

  But I, but I think of the calling as being like a part of a whole bunch of other parts.

• 15:19Speaker 05

  Mm hmm.

• 15:20Speaker 06

  I want to ask to try it out, but I know where it's been.

• 15:24Steven Rinella?

  Yep. Where was I?

• 15:27Steven Rinella?

  Camel from First Light decoys from Dave Smith decoys packs and accessories from FH F geared a whole lot more. Up to 20% off right now. Okay. Uh, also first light has the ultimate spring turkey giveaway going on. It's worth over 13,000 bucks. From now until Sunday, April 5th. Is that Easter?

• 15:49Speaker 05

  It is.

• 15:50Speaker 03

  Mm hmm.

• 15:51Steven Rinella?

  It's like early this year, isn't it?

• 15:52Speaker 06

  Very early.

• 15:53Steven Rinella?

  Okay.

• 15:55Steven Rinella?

  You get double entries for every $25 spent. So 20 entries for every. Does that make sense? You get double entries for every

• 16:04Speaker 03

  It was 10 per, now it's 20 per.

• 16:06Steven Rinella?

  Oh. You get a whole bunch of entries when you buy stuff.

• 16:09Speaker 05

  Mm hmm.

• 16:10Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 16:10Steven Rinella?

  And, um, part of the turkey hunt giveaways, you win a hunt.

• 16:15Steven Rinella?

  So you can win a hunt and all the gear to go hunting at this deal. Check it out now through April 5th at store dot the meat eater dot com. Over to you, Spencer.

• 16:28Speaker 05

  Uh, there's another giveaway on the meat eater.com. This is a photo contest regarding uncommon turkey colors. Uh, the article is called odd turkey plumage photo contest where you can enter a picture of the rare turkeys that you've seen or killed. This is supporting the work that Dr. Mike Chamberlain is doing with the Wild Turkey Lab to do research on wild turkey DNA, genetic diversity, inbreeding, potential gene flow and hybridization. Uh, the Wild Turkey Lab wants you to send genetic samples of your turkey's tongue, but our turkey plumage contest is just for photos. You can go enter them on our website and there are only two entries so far. You have until April 6th to enter the contest.

• 17:10Speaker 03

  Pretty good odds right now.

• 17:11Speaker 05

  There's three top prizes.

• 17:13Steven Rinella?

  Cause you gotta shoot a weird colored turkey.

• 17:15Speaker 05

  Or see one, or see one. Uh, and there's three prizes we're giving away, uh, all sorts of really good gear. So if you, if you have a photo of a cool turkey you've killed or seen, you should go enter it. Now, if I was entering it. Here's what I would submit. This was a turkey I saw in 2014. I was leaving work, heading to class, and this was at a go-kart track. And this turkey was hanging around. And I turned around.

• 17:38Steven Rinella?

  Kind of a domestic-y vibe to it.

• 17:40Speaker 05

  Well, so this, this area has some colonies that are known for their large turkey populations. So this could have been one that had like crossed with a domestic or- What do you mean colonies? Uh, like a Hutterite colony. Um, they raise a lot of domestic turkeys.

• 17:57Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 17:57Speaker 05

  Guys, we'll talk about if you want to kill a smoke-faced turkey, you go hunting near the colony.

• 18:03Steven Rinella?

  This is a good question for Chamberlain. When I, people are always sending me these.

• 18:07Speaker 05

  Uh huh.

• 18:07Steven Rinella?

  So far, two people this spring have sent me the, the smoked turkey, smoked face.

• 18:12Speaker 05

  It's the most common of the uncommon plumage.

• 18:15Steven Rinella?

  What I see when I'm seeing that, and I'm open to corrections, and you might win yourself a prize. What I see when I'm seeing that is domestic introgression.

• 18:22Speaker 05

  Sure.

• 18:24Steven Rinella?

  There he goes again.

• 18:25Speaker 05

  Whatever you say, Steve.

• 18:27Steven Rinella?

  Spencer, it hit me last night. When you're telling Spencer stuff, he'll sometimes say, sure. And I was like, there's something about it. And Brody says, it's the same thing as going, whatever you say, buddy.

• 18:43Speaker 05

  I'm just trying to be a good, active listener, tell you that I'm, I'm here.

• 18:47Steven Rinella?

  And I was like, that's it. Brody hit it. It's, it's, whatever you say.

• 18:51Speaker 05

  Sure.

• 18:52Steven Rinella?

  Sure, yeah, whatever you say.

• 18:55Steven Rinella?

  Sometimes it's honest. Sometimes it's like, whatever you say, buddy.

• 18:59Speaker 05

  So go enter that contest, themeaditor.com. Uh, show Steve all of your smoke-faced turkeys.

• 19:04Steven Rinella?

  Yep. And I'll say to you, yeah, looks like domestic introgression. But there's gotta be something to it, and I'm sure, we'll, we'll ask Chamberlain. We'll ask Mike Chamberlain if we need to. Uh, Max came to me, uh, the other day and said, hey, um, well, first off, we have a pond. We, our office has a pond.

• 19:22Speaker 05

  You have a couple of ponds.

• 19:23Steven Rinella?

  Yeah. Uh, we're on a little, it's like a, I don't even call it like a-

• 19:26Speaker 06

  Business park?

• 19:27Speaker 05

  Yeah, business park.

• 19:28Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, we're like in a campus. There's a, there's a, there's a little ditch that comes through it, and there's a couple dredged out ponds. And Brody estimates the trout population at four.

• 19:36Speaker 05

  Four to five.

• 19:38Speaker 06

  Not many.

• 19:39Steven Rinella?

  Brody believes there to be four to five trout and one muskrat is in our pond. Last night, there was two geese in it. Hmm, we should start tagging the fish.

• 19:46Speaker 04

  I saw a dead raccoon floating.

• 19:48Speaker 06

  On that north pond?

• 19:49Speaker 04

  Yes.

• 19:50Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 19:50Steven Rinella?

  Okay, there's a dead coon in there. There's two geese, there's a pair of mallards.

• 19:54Speaker 03

  Sounds like a bona fide farm pond.

• 19:56Steven Rinella?

  It is. There's no garbage because we cleaned it out last year.

• 19:58Steven Rinella?

  There's a new piece of garbage. I was looking at it. At first, I thought it was something floating dead and I realized it's new garbage. We gotta do a new cleanup because there's new garbage in the pond. It keeps moving back and forth from side to side. Max said, hey, who do I gotta ask to put a nesting box on the pond? And I said, I don't know, but yes.

• 20:20Steven Rinella?

  So talk about that, Max.

• 20:21Speaker 06

  Yeah, so, uh, we're trying to raise, uh, some ducks this year, this spring. Um, Delta Waterfall, um, came up with these houses. They're called hen houses where it's just a wire cylinder. Um, basically on a pole over the water.

• 20:39Steven Rinella?

  Mm-hmm.

• 20:40Speaker 06

  And the reason why they came up with these.

• 20:42Steven Rinella?

  That's a T-post, right?

• 20:43Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 20:43Steven Rinella?

  Okay.

• 20:44Speaker 06

  And the reason why they came up with these was, um, due to habitat change and predator increases, nest success dropped. And so they thought, oh, why don't we put something above the water that these nest predators can't get to? And so they came up with this hen house, um, back in like the 1990s. I think they've been around for like 35 years.

• 21:05Steven Rinella?

  That's that old of a design.

• 21:06Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 21:06Steven Rinella?

  Cause you do have to be like a crack commando raccoon to get yourself up that T-post.

• 21:11Speaker 06

  I mean, it would be like, it would be like a squirrel climbing up a bird feeder almost, but it's like a really skinny pole.

• 21:16Steven Rinella?

  Yeah. In water.

• 21:18Speaker 06

  Yeah, in water. Um, and so these were designed specifically for mallards.

• 21:24Steven Rinella?

  Is that right?

• 21:25Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 21:25Steven Rinella?

  What makes them that way?

• 21:27Speaker 06

  I guess I don't have an answer for that.

• 21:29Steven Rinella?

  But it fits what they like.

• 21:31Speaker 06

  Yeah, so, um. Uh, like, people think that mallards nest like, or ducks nest in water, but they actually nest away from the water. And then they hatch their duck lanes and walk to the water. Uh, but these hen houses put them right over the water. So those duck lanes, the first thing they do, they're right in the water. They don't have no traveling to do, um, no predators can get them. And so, um, I think I researched some, um, stats here and, um, sixty percent higher in a hen house than just a regular old nest.

• 22:07Speaker 03

  Survivability, I mean.

• 22:09Speaker 06

  So, yeah, successful nest. Um, so yeah, a hen can start using one of these and have a twelve, twelve times better odds as rather than six, uh, nesting in just the ground.

• 22:20Steven Rinella?

  No kidding.

• 22:21Speaker 03

  Has anyone been poking around back there?

• 22:23Speaker 06

  I look every single morning.

• 22:24Steven Rinella?

  What, what are the odds? You think a blackbird just makes a nest in there instead?

• 22:28Speaker 06

  Uh, that's a great question. I hope, I hope it doesn't. I'll shoot it out of there.

• 22:31Steven Rinella?

  I haven't seen any red winged blackbirds down there.

• 22:33Speaker 03

  I've seen, uh, Canada geese nested in elevated platforms.

• 22:37Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 22:38Steven Rinella?

  Oh, they have something phone poles?

• 22:39Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 22:40Speaker 06

  Yeah, but yeah, this is just like a wire cylinder. And so like, it's a perfect size for a duck to get in there. And that's it.

• 22:47Speaker 03

  So she's gotta fill it up with nesting material?

• 22:49Speaker 06

  No, yeah, it's already filled with straw, um, grass. And, um, that's another thing too. Mallards don't bring any kind of nest material to their nest.

• 22:59Steven Rinella?

  Hmm. Are you serious?

• 23:01Speaker 06

  Yeah. So like a robin or like a bald eagle, they'll go around collecting sticks and like build a nest. A mallard will just like, sit there and like peck around and like.

• 23:11Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, I guess like, not, cause I was saying, I, I stumbled into them hunting more else.

• 23:15Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 23:16Steven Rinella?

  I never thought about that.

• 23:17Speaker 06

  Yeah, they never bring.

• 23:17Steven Rinella?

  They're not supplementing it. It's just in a little dish in the leaves.

• 23:21Speaker 06

  Yep. So, um, yeah, I'm hoping we can raise a, um, some duck lanes and, um.

• 23:29Steven Rinella?

  Be great. If that, if that happens. First thing we'll see is we'll see a duck sitting on top of that thing.

• 23:33Speaker 06

  In it.

• 23:34Steven Rinella?

  I'm thinking we'll see one standing on it. That's gonna be, in my mind, the day it happens. Is gonna be, someone's gonna see one standing on it.

• 23:42Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 23:42Steven Rinella?

  I don't know why.

• 23:43Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 23:44Steven Rinella?

  My little mind movie, that's what happens.

• 23:45Speaker 04

  We should set up a trail cam.

• 23:47Speaker 06

  Well, no, I've, well, we could do that, but if a, had mallard nest in there, I'm gonna be sitting there with the camera for a couple hours each day and just wait for those ducklings to come out of there. Cause I think it would be just an epic shot of ducklings just popping out.

• 24:02Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, well, you could push them out, you know?

• 24:04Speaker 06

  You could do that.

• 24:05Speaker 03

  Swim out there and give that thing a shake.

• 24:08Speaker 05

  Do you envision a local or a migrator?

• 24:11Speaker 06

  Probably a local, for sure.

• 24:12Speaker 05

  Okay.

• 24:13Speaker 06

  Yeah, there's like a group, I mean, I wouldn't say a group, but there's probably like five to six pairs on our ponds right now. And so I'm hoping one of those hops in there. So.

• 24:24Steven Rinella?

  That's great.

• 24:25Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 24:25Steven Rinella?

  I can't wait.

• 24:26Speaker 05

  Steve's got the best view of them.

• 24:27Speaker 03

  Make it more ducks, Max, that's great.

• 24:28Speaker 06

  Yeah. Um, yeah, and, uh, people can look at, uh, delta waterfall dot org, um, to find out more about these hen houses. And there's different programs where you can, um, donate some money and not actually like get hen houses.

• 24:41Steven Rinella?

  See, that's what I was telling you, I want a couple. I know Just Wrong will put mine.

• 24:44Speaker 06

  Well, I, I know a guy.

• 24:45Steven Rinella?

  Yeah.

• 24:46Speaker 06

  My buddy Garrett Humphrey, who helps out with the local chapter here in Bozeman, um, he's got a pile of them, so.

• 24:51Steven Rinella?

  Yep, I'd like to do that.

• 24:53Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 24:53Steven Rinella?

  Just where to put them.

• 24:55Speaker 01

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• 25:25Steven Rinella?

  I travel quite a bit, and when I'm home, it's very easy to stay on a rigid food routine and eat the right kinds of food at the right time. But when you're on the road, it's hard to stay in your routine and like diet can really start to fall apart. I've seen it, and that's why I like Athletic Greens. Now, AG1 is already the standard for daily foundational nutrition. AG1 Pro is what's next.

• 25:49Steven Rinella?

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• 26:27Steven Rinella?

  Visit drinkag1.com/meateater and get an AG1 Pro Yeti Shaker in your AG1 Pro Welcome Kit. Again, that's drinkag1.com/meateater. Grab yours now. If you spend a lot of time outdoors, you got dogs, you got kids, you know how hard it is to keep the floor of your rig clean. A thing we do in our, in our little fleet of vehicles that I have in my household, if you go look, open the door on any one of them, they all got WeatherTech. We get a car, we throw the mats out and put in WeatherTech. Cause that way, when there's a mess, it's like your kid's fault, your dog's fault, it's the weather's fault, doesn't matter. You take them suckers out and hose them off and you're back to being good as new. I'm telling you, if you got a vehicle, put WeatherTech in there, you're gonna be happy you did it.

• 27:12Steven Rinella?

  And check this out, American made floor liners and cargo liners, okay? They laugh in the face of all weather. Go take a look for yourself today at weathertech.com. Okay, it's time for corrections. Oh.

• 27:26Speaker 07

  Corrections. Corrections.

• 27:29Steven Rinella?

  Okay.

• 27:32Steven Rinella?

  Corrections today, the winner of today's corrections wins a set of Tacovus boots. I'm holding one up right here. But you can pick whatever ones you want. These may be Miss Sespin out on paternity leave. What size are those?

• 27:45Speaker 05

  10 and a half.

• 27:46Steven Rinella?

  10 and a half?

• 27:47Speaker 05

  No, I was just guessing.

• 27:48Steven Rinella?

  Sespin out on paternity leave, but he, he wears a, he wears a square toe. Every time I touch this, I feel like I'm touching Seth's foot.

• 27:56Steven Rinella?

  You can pick what you want. I'm telling you what though dude, just the leather.

• 28:02Steven Rinella?

  Smells like brand new leather. Go pick out any Tacovas you want if you win the corrections. Now, we, we had to do something a little bit different. So, oh, Nate Mason's here. Nate Mason came up with this joke, a little late, but he came up with it. Better late than never. Yeah. Shit kickers for nit pickers. Oh, it's great. I love it. Most genius thing I've heard all week. Shit kickers for nit pickers. Uh, but here's the deal. So many corrections came in about TSS. Brody's, who, did you do TSS report? Lot of people fired up about TSS and don't worry because we're going to talk a lot about TSS today in the news segment here. So we're going to do a quick showdown.

• 28:41Steven Rinella?

  Of, when, in order to win the boots, there's three corrections. But we're doing like a deal this week where there's, we gotta do a competition to enter the competition. So very quickly. Three TSS. The winner of this goes to the finals. Well, March Madness. It's like golf. No, it's like March Madness.

• 29:00Speaker 03

  I'm telling you what, this next round here, this first TSS round of corrections, these are some nit pickers, man.

• 29:09Steven Rinella?

  Okay, shit kickers for nit pickers. Okay, so for a, for a spot in the finals. TSS correction one. My name is Ian and I'm, where's my glass? And I'm from upstate New York. While listening to episode eight, five, three, and you were talking about TSS ammo and we're not totally sure on when they were introduced. And again, a clarification, an omission, a, a, that's corrections. Sure. He says, 2018 federal premium became the first large manufacturer to produce TSS. Great. 2018. Thank you.

• 29:50Steven Rinella?

  TSS two. Slight correction to the claim, I believe it was Brody's claim. That tungsten is very heat resistant. Well. He goes out, the corrector says tungsten is actually the most heat resistant pure metal.

• 30:11Speaker 03

  Which is also very.

• 30:14Steven Rinella?

  No, no, no.

• 30:17Speaker 03

  Very, very.

• 30:17Steven Rinella?

  It is a huge difference. If I, let's say I'm friends, let's say I'm friends with the tallest man on earth.

• 30:27Steven Rinella?

  And he comes in and I go, this is my buddy. He's very tall.

• 30:31Steven Rinella?

  Right? And someone's like, well, he's the tallest man on earth.

• 30:36Speaker 03

  I, I think they're the same thing.

• 30:37Steven Rinella?

  It's just, no, it's different. I would say, here's my buddy. He's the tallest man on earth.

• 30:43Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 30:44Steven Rinella?

  It's just different.

• 30:46Speaker 07

  There are a lot more men than there are kinds of metal.

• 30:49Steven Rinella?

  Okay. The melting point is six.

• 30:55Steven Rinella?

  The melting, get this, get just pick, close your eyes and picture this. The melting point is six thousand one hundred ninety-two Fahrenheit, seven hundred degrees higher. Than tantalum.

• 31:08Speaker 03

  What's the temperature of the sun?

• 31:10Steven Rinella?

  A lot. It's, I'd go so far as to say it's the hottest thing.

• 31:16Steven Rinella?

  Uh, ten thousand degrees. Tantum.

• 31:18Speaker 03

  It wouldn't survive the sun.

• 31:22Steven Rinella?

  That's why it's used as an electrode when TIG welding, which was introduced in the nineteen forties. He goes on to say very heat resistant, huh?

• 31:33Speaker 03

  It actually says very heat resistant is not an incorrect claim.

• 31:38Steven Rinella?

  Oh, that's what it says?

• 31:40Speaker 04

  But it doesn't do the metal justice.

• 31:43Steven Rinella?

  Okay, so Brody underselling tungsten.

• 31:46Speaker 03

  Oh, yeah.

• 31:47Steven Rinella?

  TSS number three.

• 31:48Speaker 03

  Next I oversell it.

• 31:54Steven Rinella?

  Bro, TSS number three.

• 31:57Steven Rinella?

  He, he starts out, I appreciate this. He starts out, says, I don't have the cred, the credentials to offer this correction. He says, in fact, I'm horrible at science related subjects, but that just goes to show that any person can do good.

• 32:09Speaker 03

  Regular Joe.

• 32:09Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, but Brody can't do good.

• 32:11Speaker 03

  No.

• 32:13Steven Rinella?

  Yeah. This guy says, I have a forty year old. Why does that matter?

• 32:19Speaker 04

  Like a cousin who's maybe not a kid.

• 32:20Speaker 03

  Maybe he's very young and he's trying to establish bona fides because his cousin is older. Well, he's gonna tell you about a Christmas thing.

• 32:28Steven Rinella?

  Yeah. His cousin's forty. I don't care. You know what? It could be that he's like, we've been cousins so long.

• 32:36Speaker 03

  Hmm.

• 32:37Steven Rinella?

  You know?

• 32:38Speaker 03

  I don't think that's it.

• 32:39Steven Rinella?

  Um.

• 32:41Steven Rinella?

  Okay, he's got a forty year old cousin that asked for.

• 32:46Steven Rinella?

  This cousin asked for Christmas. Oh, I get it now. What kind of forty year old guy? Yeah, something a six year old would ask. Okay, that's why it's goofy. His goofy forty year old cousin requested a one by one inch piece of tungsten.

• 33:00Speaker 03

  Hmm.

• 33:02Steven Rinella?

  This guy says, it is heavy.

• 33:06Steven Rinella?

  He says, it's so heavy. They talk about that it like it has its own gravitational pull. Which it does, but he's not a science guy.

• 33:19Steven Rinella?

  Yes, you're right. That is gravity pulling on your cube.

• 33:25Steven Rinella?

  He goes down with this correction. When Brody last week said that T S S is twice as dense as lead.

• 33:34Steven Rinella?

  I kept thinking, there's no way.

• 33:37Speaker 03

  I would like to go back because I think I said about twice as dense, but maybe not.

• 33:42Steven Rinella?

  No, he said twice. Cause he says, there's no way. Cause I've held a two point two pound cube of tungsten. And in fact, Brody was wrong. Tungsten isn't twice as heavy. It's one point tie, one point seven times as dense.

• 34:01Speaker 03

  In math, that's a long ways, I guess.

• 34:04Steven Rinella?

  He says, I know this is split in hairs, but if it was two X, then it would be the debt. Here's where the rubber hits the road.

• 34:11Speaker 03

  This is where it gets mean.

• 34:13Steven Rinella?

  No. If it was two X as Brody claimed. It would be the densest naturally occurring material on earth.

• 34:23Speaker 03

  Why can't we have some of this stuff?

• 34:24Steven Rinella?

  But it's not. It's, that is held by osmium. Which is 1.99 times as dense as lead. So not only was Brody wrong. When he said two times, but the thing that's more dense than it still isn't two times.

• 34:45Speaker 03

  That's right.

• 34:46Steven Rinella?

  He was very wrong.

• 34:47Speaker 03

  But you know what I want?

• 34:47Steven Rinella?

  Very wrong, but this person pitches the idea of osmium super shot.

• 34:52Speaker 03

  Exactly.

• 34:53Speaker 07

  OSS.

• 34:55Steven Rinella?

  OSS. I don't know what osmium is going for these days, but I've never heard of it, which makes me think it's not.

• 35:02Speaker 03

  Extend that range out to a hundred.

• 35:04Speaker 07

  I've got a correction for his correction though.

• 35:07Steven Rinella?

  Well, here, can you hold it? Cause there's a problem. These guys aren't even in corrections. Who do we vote for to advance to the finals? We have Brody being wrong about, Brody being wrong about not knowing when it came out. We have Brody being wrong about how hot you gotta get it to melt.

• 35:29Speaker 03

  I like the, yeah, the last one.

• 35:31Steven Rinella?

  And we have Brody being wrong about how dense it is. OSS, baby.

• 35:35Speaker 03

  I like the last one because.

• 35:37Steven Rinella?

  OSS. Clear winner. Okay, so he's into the finals.

• 35:41Speaker 07

  I, I like his, I like his flavor text at the end about osmium too.

• 35:44Steven Rinella?

  No, he did a really good job. Yeah. And he's the guy that's not a science guy.

• 35:49Steven Rinella?

  Okay, so he's in the finals. So that is correction number one, osmium.

• 35:53Speaker 03

  He's gonna have to give one of his boots to his cousin though.

• 35:59Steven Rinella?

  Who knows? Maybe they, I don't know.

• 36:05Steven Rinella?

  Maybe they only have one, I don't know. Who knows? We're kind of, I don't know what kind of accident.

• 36:09Speaker 03

  Same size foot, they can just share.

• 36:11Steven Rinella?

  I was watching a movie the other night and it was, and it was mostly cast with just non-actors. Okay, it's a phenomenal movie. Um, and there's a, one of the main characters is missing an arm and one of the main characters is missing a leg. And I was thinking to myself, that's such an interesting call. And then I read that they didn't use professional actors. They just cast it from people. That they saw and they introduced themselves to and cast the movie that way. You don't want to tell us what it's called? Serat.

• 36:41Speaker 04

  That French movie?

• 36:42Steven Rinella?

  It's, it's a lot of French, a lot of Spanish. It's a dude trying to find his daughter who is vanished into the, into the Moroccan desert rave scene. And it has mega Mad Max overtones and gets very stressful. Hmm. Netflix or? No.

• 37:01Steven Rinella?

  I, I bought it on, I've been, every day I, I checked to see if it was available. It became available. I bought it for a lot of money on Apple, on, you know, the iTunes store, whatever they call that nowadays, the Apple store. Go on. Apple TV. Brody's gonna offer a correction.

• 37:15Speaker 03

  Uh, okay, here we go.

• 37:16Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, that's right. Apple TV.

• 37:18Speaker 03

  Hopefully you guys were listening a couple of weeks back when we talked about the Colorado fur ban. We've got a correction from Jeff. I don't have his last name, but we'll, we'll figure it out if we need to. Okay. I just listened to the news podcast where you talked about the Colorado fur ban petition voted on by the CPW commission. During that bit, Steve remarked that nuisance beavers and other fur bears taken for nuisance reasons will now be left to rot with no fur taken. That's actually not true. That's the insane part of this story that's not being told. And honestly, I'm not sure if it should be told. I'll let you be the judge.

• 37:52Steven Rinella?

  I like this because he's saying, I messed up. But it's because it's so insane that it's excusable that I messed up.

• 38:00Speaker 03

  Well, I don't know if he's using you.

• 38:02Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, it lets me off the hook.

• 38:03Speaker 03

  Okay. When the call, when the commission adopts the regulation banning the sale of wild animal furs in Colorado, it will only apply to fur bears taken recreationally. Statutes are already in place that state fur bears taken for damage or agricultural purposes can be retained or sold by those taken.

• 38:23Steven Rinella?

  Those that have taken-

• 38:24Speaker 03

  Those that have taken that. Statutes trump regulations. This is in both Title 33 and Title 35 of the Colorado Revive statutes. Yada, yada. It is an enforce- unenforceable law and the commission was told as much by CPW law enforcement. As soon as a bobcat is sealed, there's no way to know if it was harvested recreationally or through damage purposes. This is the part that makes me uncomfortable with those for the ban. I don't want them to know this loophole.

• 38:54Steven Rinella?

  Uh oh.

• 38:55Speaker 03

  There's any- there isn't any way to find out if any fur bear was taken for damage purposes. You can still harvest fur bears recreationally and nothing says you can't sell them in another state either. This whole thing is ridiculous and the commission shamed CPW in this ridiculous process.

• 39:12Steven Rinella?

  Oh, he goes a little thanks to Brody. Read that part, Brody.

• 39:15Speaker 03

  Thanks, Brody. I can tell you that CPW is as frustrated with this as you are, which is- is good.

• 39:21Steven Rinella?

  Job, Brody. That's correction number two. So to recap, we got osmium super shot. Brody screwed up on the fur ban.

• 39:31Speaker 03

  No, you did.

• 39:31Steven Rinella?

  No.

• 39:33Speaker 04

  But it's okay.

• 39:34Steven Rinella?

  Here's the last one. This is- this is a good one. This is an important one. On the most recent news podcast, Bear Newcomb mentioned that Oklahoma was working toward approving the release of captive deer that are, and Bear used this word, that are immune to CWD into the wild.

• 39:58Steven Rinella?

  I- I wish I would have caught that. I didn't catch that. Very rightfully, the guy says the correct term would be resistant. Okay? Even though that is still in question. And he talks about how we ourselves covered that in episode 766 in the podcast titled The Truth About Chronic Wasting Disease. Okay? So according to the National Deer Association, deer that carry the 96SS genotype-

• 40:26Steven Rinella?

  Could experience a longer incubation period prior to perishing to the disease. But this does not prevent them from getting it. So resistant or delayed, but not known to be immune. Okay, so there's the three things.

• 40:44Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 40:44Steven Rinella?

  The, the.

• 40:45Speaker 03

  Gotcha.

• 40:46Steven Rinella?

  Brody being wrong on tungsten. Me being understandably mistaken on the Colorado fur ban. Or Bear Newcomb not choosing his words carefully on chronic wasting disease. Yeah, this is a tough one, man. Give Bear a break. Okay, votes for the new pair of COVID's boots. Let's go around the table, Max. Uh, no, no, you don't vote like that. Oh, come on. I want to build up tension. Tungsten? Tungsten. Yeah, I gotta vote for. Oh, it's decided that quickly. Wow. Oh, hold it. Phil, what'd you vote for?

• 41:24Speaker 08

  I was gonna vote for number two.

• 41:25Steven Rinella?

  Same. Oh, so you didn't vote tungsten? Oh, it's not decided. I'm sorry. Tungsten? Four. Oh, it's decided. You guys caved.

• 41:31Speaker 04

  Four V three.

• 41:32Steven Rinella?

  Okay, just, I'm just out of curiosity. What were you gonna vote for?

• 41:34Speaker 08

  Number two.

• 41:35Steven Rinella?

  I do CWD. Oh, well, you guys lost. Yeah, that's fine. So, the tungsten guy, not only did he win the playoffs. He won twice. Yeah. Wow.

• 41:47Speaker 04

  Chris Lund.

• 41:49Speaker 08

  But he did have a mistake.

• 41:50Speaker 04

  We will reach out to you.

• 41:51Speaker 08

  His cube dimension should be one inch by one inch by one inch.

• 41:55Speaker 04

  Oh, yeah.

• 41:57Steven Rinella?

  Oh. Take that, Chris.

• 41:59Speaker 08

  If it's a cube, then it's implied by only two dimensions, correct?

• 42:02Speaker 07

  Just say a one inch cube, not a one inch by one inch.

• 42:04Speaker 08

  So, Chris, you know, just check it out.

• 42:06Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, yeah. Let's send him some, uh, send him one, and then he has to decide. Yeah, we might have to like scuff him, like scuff him up a little bit or something before he gets those boots. Got to scuff him up. That's a great point. Yeah, one inch cube. That covers it.

• 42:25Steven Rinella?

  In his face.

• 42:27Speaker 03

  He did say he doesn't have, he lacks credentials. So come on.

• 42:30Speaker 07

  Well, is redundancy, you know, is that something we need to correct, you know?

• 42:34Steven Rinella?

  Yeah.

• 42:35Speaker 07

  Okay.

• 42:36Steven Rinella?

  If someone wrote in and he says, hey, I got a correction about redundancy, I'd let it slip in there. He might win some boots. I don't know.

• 42:41Speaker 07

  Great.

• 42:42Steven Rinella?

  All right, Brody, uh, audience emails, Brody, a kid wrote in about some lambs.

• 42:45Speaker 03

  Yeah, this is great because it's not an email. It's actually handwritten letters. I love this kid already. Um, we just got this today, breaking news. Um, okay, here we go. Hello, my name is Easton Sutter. I'm 12 years old. And I am a sixth grader at Fort Recovery Junior High in Fort Recovery, Ohio. This kid writes a great letter. Fort Recovery is a small rural farm town in the middle of nowhere that nobody has ever heard of.

• 43:11Steven Rinella?

  I like it because he really sets the scene, you know?

• 43:13Speaker 03

  Yeah. I love hunting, fishing, and pretty much anything in nature. This past year I went turkey, rabbit, and deer hunting with my dad. This past deer season, I shot my first buck. My favorite part of hunting is spending one-on-one time with my dad. When you're riding the car, the first thing we typically do is turn on the Meat Eater podcast or trivia. But sadly, we have not gotten to try Meat Eater Turtle. There you go, Spencer. You haven't tried your, your wordle turtle.

• 43:40Steven Rinella?

  He's a word.

• 43:40Speaker 03

  Um, my dad is really good at trivia and would make a great addition to the Meat Eater crew. Love that. Um, I'm an active member. This is where it gets real good. I'm an active member of 4H and this year my project, for my project, I have to show, I have two show lambs. Their names are Steve and Brody. There was a third named Yanni, but it had a bummed leg and was sent to the chop house.

• 44:11Steven Rinella?

  Sounds about right.

• 44:12Speaker 03

  I wanted to know if you would like to bid on my lambs. So if you guys want to figure that out, the audience, you could bid on his lambs. The money I will make will go into, uh, future college expenses. And if you are interested, I have enclosed the information to do so. Thank you for your time and I look forward to hearing back from you. Here's to lots more car rides with Meat Eater on the radio.

• 44:34Steven Rinella?

  So does he ship those lambs, the lamb meat to us?

• 44:38Speaker 03

  I'm not sure. We'll have to get in touch with him. He, he's, he used snail mail, so we're gonna have to figure it out.

• 44:44Steven Rinella?

  Huh. Hope someone buys the land.

• 44:45Speaker 03

  Easton Sutter, if you're listening to us, send us an email so we can, uh, we can figure some stuff out for you.

• 44:52Steven Rinella?

  Someone I know offered to my, they have a bunch of pasture and they offered to my daughter that she could raise a cow on there. So she's telling everybody she's gonna start raising cattle for money.

• 45:04Steven Rinella?

  I'm like, let's look into this a little bit.

• 45:08Steven Rinella?

  There's a couple of complicating factors here we need to consider.

• 45:10Speaker 03

  She should raise one named Yanni for the chop house.

• 45:14Steven Rinella?

  Uh, okay. Just thought of, here, here's another one. Oh, this is just an update. Remember, if you guys listen to the show, you remember we were really pushing that mountain goat raffle in Alaska? Um, man, that came in. That, that was a great fundraiser for the organization. They raised, you guys really, you guys did two things. Everyone that, that came into support and we, we drove a bunch of support there, you did two things. You helped them raise a bunch of money and you also shot your odds to all to hell.

• 45:40Steven Rinella?

  On, on the, on the Alaska mountain goat raffle, they raised a hundred and ten thousand, seven hundred and ninety-five thousand dollars. Says the far and away, the most money raised with an Alaska goat tag.

• 45:51Speaker 03

  Damn.

• 45:53Steven Rinella?

  They're real happy with all that. Now I noticed that I have not gotten my tag in the mail.

• 45:58Speaker 03

  Hmm.

• 45:59Steven Rinella?

  And it might be because I don't know, I'm no statistician, but these odds are rough. On top of this, the Delta Junction bison tag, get this, two hundred and thirteen grand, four hundred and forty thousand dollars.

• 46:10Speaker 03

  Unreal.

• 46:12Steven Rinella?

  That's, that's what I like to see is I like to see those raffles.

• 46:15Speaker 03

  Yeah, cuz that's getting up into governor's tag money there.

• 46:18Steven Rinella?

  Yep, because you got this whole, we've talked about it a hundred times on the podcast. You got the governor's tags, they auction it to the highest bidder and it brings a lot of money for stuff, but it's just like, like, oh, oh, oh, Joe Blow working dude is not in the running on a governor's tag.

• 46:34Speaker 03

  Not.

• 46:34Steven Rinella?

  And it puts the conservation groups in a pickle. You could do a raffle and have anybody have a chance to win, but you're not gonna raise much money. You do a governor's tag and, and, and you have like a handful of billionaires have a chance to win. Um, and it's a bunch of money. So to see these really successful, like really successful raffles is cool because like anybody can participate. Everybody's got a chance to win and then you still get a nice price tag toward conservation work.

• 47:02Speaker 06

  What was the price for putting in for the raffle?

• 47:05Steven Rinella?

  Can't remember. I bought, I bought.

• 47:07Speaker 03

  Twenty-five bucks.

• 47:08Steven Rinella?

  I bought an undisclosed dollar amount worth of entries.

• 47:11Speaker 06

  Okay.

• 47:14Steven Rinella?

  Not that I I didn't I didn't.

• 47:15Speaker 05

  You didn't go crazy.

• 47:16Steven Rinella?

  I'll disclose about a hundred bucks worth of entries. Yeah. About a hundred bucks. Um, oh, Brody.

• 47:24Speaker 03

  Oh, yeah, it's Turkey Week. Um, I covered this a little bit in the first part of this in Radio Live, I think, a while back. Um, but I'll I'll I'll start over and cover both parts.

• 47:38Steven Rinella?

  Oh, no, no, we didn't eat the, damn it. Where's the part where we eat the jerky?

• 47:46Steven Rinella?

  Yeah.

• 47:47Speaker 04

  I missed that.

• 47:48Steven Rinella?

  Okay.

• 47:49Speaker 03

  You want to start over?

• 47:50Speaker 04

  Oh, wait, audience.

• 47:51Steven Rinella?

  No, I don't have to do it. So remember we were talking on the news show about making jerky out of nuts? Deer nuts?

• 47:58Speaker 04

  Mm hmm.

• 47:59Steven Rinella?

  Okay. He sent us the nuts and I was saying, don't poison us.

• 48:05Steven Rinella?

  He said, um,

• 48:09Steven Rinella?

  the guy wrote in, one grown man to another, sending you a dried deer nut is one of the weirdest things I have done.

• 48:16Steven Rinella?

  Now, my wife told me to send you some of that dried heart. Unfortunately for you, I have eaten the heart. It was excellent. You are one of the few hunters that, uh, uh, he said some nice stuff. Um, he fought fire up here and he goes on the jerky. I dry smoke and preserve meat as folks has for generations before me. In my neck of the woods, the Caddo and Comanche tribes dried strips of meat that sustained them throughout the year. So here's the nut. So he's got one nut says, normal, non-nut jerky, contains no nuts. You guys try that.

• 48:50Speaker 05

  Hmm, okay.

• 48:51Steven Rinella?

  This is just meat. And then here's the dried testicle. This is deer nut jerky.

• 48:58Steven Rinella?

  He wrote a note to saying that it's, he didn't poison us, not because of it was like technically hard. He says he's not that kind of guy.

• 49:06Speaker 05

  Ah, it'd be easy to pull off, though, if he wanted.

• 49:09Steven Rinella?

  So you're saying like if he wanted to poison us, he would have, but he's just that, not that kind of guy. So here's the nut. This is the, this is a dried nut.

• 49:16Speaker 04

  I'm surprised it has that texture because when it's.

• 49:22Speaker 03

  Carve me off a hunk of that, or does it break?

• 49:27Speaker 04

  Does it just taste like smoked teriyaki flavor?

• 49:33Speaker 05

  It looks the same as the rest of the jerky.

• 49:35Speaker 04

  Which like.

• 49:36Steven Rinella?

  Ain't like jerky.

• 49:37Speaker 04

  But nuts are, nuts are.

• 49:38Steven Rinella?

  Who else wants a chunk?

• 49:40Speaker 04

  Much whiter than.

• 49:42Steven Rinella?

  You can give the sponsor a name. It's off putting finish.

• 49:46Steven Rinella?

  It's you sponsor.

• 49:48Speaker 05

  Off putting finish.

• 49:49Speaker 04

  This jerky is tough as shit. Ow.

• 49:53Steven Rinella?

  I'm surprised at a nut.

• 49:55Speaker 04

  Dog treat.

• 49:56Steven Rinella?

  I'm surprised the testicle dries up like that, to be honest with you.

• 49:58Speaker 04

  Right?

• 50:00Steven Rinella?

  You didn't slice it at all? Very pasty, very pasty finish.

• 50:04Speaker 05

  Mm-hmm.

• 50:05Steven Rinella?

  Hmm. You don't think he sliced it up at all? Oh, it's sliced. Okay.

• 50:08Speaker 03

  And that, that, uh.

• 50:09Speaker 04

  Oh, it smells like.

• 50:11Speaker 03

  Whatever you wanna call that on the outside.

• 50:13Steven Rinella?

  It's not very good.

• 50:14Speaker 04

  Max wanna split it up with me?

• 50:16Speaker 03

  Well, I don't think it's like as bad as you guys are saying it is.

• 50:20Speaker 04

  No, you gotta try this.

• 50:21Steven Rinella?

  No. Okay.

• 50:22Speaker 04

  Just cut that in half and give me.

• 50:23Speaker 05

  I, I wouldn't need to eat that ever again.

• 50:25Steven Rinella?

  Here, here's how I like to think of bad foods.

• 50:28Speaker 03

  I, I'm not offended.

• 50:29Steven Rinella?

  But here's a measure of bad foods. Um.

• 50:34Speaker 04

  Thank you.

• 50:34Steven Rinella?

  My wife recently bought these salted dried, uh, I don't know why she bought them, salted dried prunes. And I was like, my god, that's bad, when I ate one, but then I put, left it in my truck.

• 50:46Speaker 04

  Sorry.

• 50:47Steven Rinella?

  And a few times I drove around and I'd eat one. And I'd think to myself, my god, that's bad.

• 50:53Speaker 03

  But you kept eating them.

• 50:54Steven Rinella?

  And I eventually threw it away.

• 50:55Speaker 04

  Hmm.

• 50:56Steven Rinella?

  If he sent me a sack of those nuts.

• 50:58Speaker 04

  Oh.

• 50:58Steven Rinella?

  I would probably another time eat one and be like, my god, that's bad. Oh, Corinne spitting it out.

• 51:06Speaker 04

  And like, I eat a lot of stuff.

• 51:08Speaker 03

  Really, Corinne?

• 51:08Speaker 04

  Yeah, I don't like.

• 51:09Steven Rinella?

  Well, yeah, you're big talk. You didn't even clean your plate.

• 51:13Speaker 04

  That's disgusting.

• 51:14Speaker 03

  It's a little chewy.

• 51:16Steven Rinella?

  Brody's all like, oh, I quite like it.

• 51:18Speaker 03

  I know, I did not say I like it. I just don't think it's like the worst thing I've ever had.

• 51:22Steven Rinella?

  Then eat it.

• 51:23Speaker 03

  I, I.

• 51:24Steven Rinella?

  I like it.

• 51:25Speaker 05

  I know how good like a deer testicle can taste, and it's like a, a, like a very pleasant thing to eat, and this was not that.

• 51:32Speaker 03

  What makes it tough is this like outer mem- this like.

• 51:35Speaker 05

  Hmm.

• 51:36Speaker 03

  Skin membrane it's got.

• 51:37Speaker 04

  Guys, don't do that at home. Not worth it.

• 51:39Steven Rinella?

  Boy.

• 51:40Speaker 05

  But that's a satisfying result. Now I know that like, I don't, I don't need to do that. Deer nut jerky. Yeah.

• 51:46Speaker 04

  Oh, yeah.

• 51:46Speaker 05

  You guys are a bunch of babies.

• 51:47Speaker 04

  I'd rather smell that castor's and castor oil than eat that.

• 51:51Speaker 05

  Yeah.

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• 52:22Steven Rinella?

  If you spend a lot of time outdoors, or you got dogs, or you got kids, you know how hard it is to keep the floor of your rig clean. A thing we do in our, in our little fleet of vehicles that have at my household, if you go look, open the door on any one of them, they all got WeatherTech. We get a car, we throw the mats out and put in WeatherTech. That way, when there's a mess, it's like your kid's fault, your dog's fault, it's the weather's fault, doesn't matter. You take them suckers out and hose them off, and you're back to being good as new. I'm telling you, if you got a vehicle, put WeatherTech in there, you're gonna be happy you did it. And check this out, American-made floor liners and cargo liners, okay? They laugh in the face of all weather. Go take a look for yourself today at weathertech.com. Listen, we're all trying to save up for something. I got buddies saving up to buy their new house.

• 53:07Steven Rinella?

  I got people eyeing a new boat. I know buddies that are trying to switch out trucks and get an upgrade in their truck, whatever. People are always saving up for stuff. In reality, though, we see that it can be hard to actually save money. But that's what's great about the OnePay app. It makes saving money easy. First, you earn 3% cash back on up to $150 in monthly spending. You choose categories, okay? Like Walmart, gas, or dining, and then get rewarded when you spend in those categories. So you're rewarded for what you're already buying. And with high-yield savings, your money keeps growing. Download the OnePay app or visit onepay.com for banking that gives you more for what matters.

• 53:51Speaker 09

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• 54:06Steven Rinella?

  Remember on the we are the world video, they use those little things to protect their microphones?

• 54:12Steven Rinella?

  No, I don't remember that.

• 54:15Steven Rinella?

  Oh, Phil. Don't, don't pull that up, but can you pull the guy up all riled up about going turkey hunting?

• 54:22Speaker 07

  Uh, if you, I, I need a link. I don't even know what to search for.

• 54:25Steven Rinella?

  I'll, I'll send it to you. Okay. All right, bro, to do your thing. Now, folks li- listening at home here.

• 54:31Speaker 03

  This is.

• 54:31Steven Rinella?

  You're gonna, don't, don't think that this is just, don't think that this is just local news for us.

• 54:37Speaker 03

  Right.

• 54:37Steven Rinella?

  Because this is like a, a management strategy you should be aware of. That's what I was thinking.

• 54:42Speaker 03

  A trend that's happening more and more.

• 54:44Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, this is a trend that's happening.

• 54:45Speaker 03

  Regarding non-resident hunters. Uh, last year, Montana Senate Bill 514 was passed. And, uh,

• 54:56Speaker 03

  we, I like somehow went like under the radar for a while, at least for me.

• 55:01Steven Rinella?

  I never heard hide nor hair about it.

• 55:04Speaker 03

  But then I, I caught on to it because I hunt pheasants.

• 55:07Steven Rinella?

  Can I interrupt one second?

• 55:08Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 55:08Steven Rinella?

  You want to know what's wrong with that jerky? You know, when you're eating jerky, normally you chew it a while and you wind up with kind of like a cud.

• 55:15Speaker 03

  Mm hmm.

• 55:17Steven Rinella?

  You're chewing, chewing, chewing that nut jerky. And all of a sudden it's a paste.

• 55:23Speaker 03

  Yeah. Go on.

• 55:27Speaker 04

  Is that still in your mouth?

• 55:28Speaker 03

  Um, okay. So Senate Bill 514. It grants resident upland bird hunters a 10 day head start over non-residents. Now, the reason I, I, again, I caught this was about, it's a regarding pheasant season, but other, other upland birds, sharp-tailed grouse, Hungarian partridge, stuff like that. I think that season for pheasants anyway starts early October. Now, non-resident hunters have to wait 10 days before they can hunt them on public land or on like.

• 56:02Speaker 03

  Private land that has public access programs like block management in Montana.

• 56:07Steven Rinella?

  But they're not jumping the season earlier. It's just your non-residents lose 10 days.

• 56:11Speaker 03

  Exactly. And if those non-resident hunters have access to private, private, they can go hunt. Um, what I didn't realize is that because Montana categorizes turkeys as upland game birds, this rule also applies to spring turkey season.

• 56:29Steven Rinella?

  Hmm.

• 56:30Speaker 03

  So, spring turkey opens April 15th in Montana. Non-residents can't start hunting them on public or, or private with public access till April 25th.

• 56:41Steven Rinella?

  Hmm.

• 56:42Speaker 03

  Um.

• 56:43Steven Rinella?

  Yep. And then weirdly, and this kind of pisses me off.

• 56:48Steven Rinella?

  They exempted mountain grouse.

• 56:50Speaker 03

  They did.

• 56:51Steven Rinella?

  I don't get it.

• 56:52Speaker 03

  The only thing I can think of is there's a bunch of non-resident archery hunters, elk hunters out there that are sticking grouse for.

• 56:59Steven Rinella?

  That's not why they do that.

• 57:01Speaker 03

  I don't know.

• 57:01Steven Rinella?

  I had the same thought as Brody.

• 57:03Speaker 03

  There's just no, there's a very little pressure on those mountain birds.

• 57:06Steven Rinella?

  I don't like it. I think they should have. All or none? Yeah, I don't like, yeah.

• 57:11Speaker 03

  Either way. So, so this is like, you know, it's a pretty big change and it, I think it follows a trend of mostly western states, um, doing what they can to limit the impact of non-resident hunting pressure and doing something where they can like,

• 57:31Speaker 03

  present a regulation saying, we're trying to alleviate this pressure that you guys are talking about. Uh, you, you've seen it. Colorado went away from, uh, over the counter archery elk tags. Uh, Montana cut a number of non-resident mule deer tags. Wyoming has lowered their cap on all non-resident tags. So it's just like this trend that is hap- I, I think it's going to continue too.

• 57:59Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, it's, you have more like, you have a growing number of residents.

• 58:03Speaker 03

  Yep.

• 58:03Steven Rinella?

  As more people leave cities, leave high tax areas. So you're growing numbers of residents in Wyoming, Montana, Idaho. And then, um, and then.

• 58:16Steven Rinella?

  Like the, the, the pie needs to be cut up differently.

• 58:18Speaker 03

  Yeah, and I'd honestly like, as far as pheasant season, like it's nice to be out there the first few days when you're shooting young of the year dumb birds, right? Um, but it's a three month season. You're not losing that much as a non-resident. Turkeys in Montana, there's some years weather wise where you can't hunt the first, or don't want to hunt the first week of the season anyway.

• 58:39Speaker 06

  And like, all the birds are henned up anyway. So it's like, so not a big deal.

• 58:42Steven Rinella?

  Hold on, what?

• 58:44Speaker 06

  I, I personally think that the first like fifteen days of the season, there's a lot of birds, a lot of toms that are henned up.

• 58:52Speaker 03

  I was referring more to like, snowstorms and shit like that, but.

• 58:55Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, but.

• 58:58Speaker 03

  Either way, there you go.

• 59:01Steven Rinella?

  I have thoughts. Uh, this is one of those deals where I, you got, I, I try to, like, so, uh, it's my state, right? Where I live.

• 59:11Speaker 03

  So you like it?

• 59:11Steven Rinella?

  So, um, so, so to myself, I'm going like, sweet dude.

• 59:14Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 59:15Steven Rinella?

  Stick it to them, right? But, so just acknowledging that truth.

• 59:19Speaker 03

  Yep.

• 59:19Steven Rinella?

  I, I, I feel obligated, um, to point out a couple of details or point out a couple of minor counterpoints.

• 59:26Speaker 03

  Yes.

• 59:26Steven Rinella?

  Just to, just to open that all up, to be fair. Where you get into trouble, even though I like this, I like this, because this is, you know, helps, helps me out. Where you get into trouble is non-resident licenses keeps the lights on at the fishing game agency.

• 59:43Speaker 03

  That's why I think you're seeing it with pheasants and turkeys and not elk. Like, they're not going to push rifle elk season back ten days for, that you'll never see that.

• 59:53Steven Rinella?

  They might, but that's what, that's what keeps the lights on.

• 59:56Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 59:56Steven Rinella?

  And it could be that the, that the agency is sitting there saying, what people really want, and it would be enorm, like if you, let's say you did a state, let's say you did a vote and a state referendum. Any state. I don't care. You did Montana, Colorado, any state. Wisconsin. You did a state vote and said, hey, should non residents have to wait 10 days to start deer hunting with a rifle? It would pass everywhere. The agency is gonna be like, but hold on a minute, because all of our funding comes from non resident. You guys are all hunting deer for 30 bucks. These guys are paying 300 bucks to hunt a deer.

• 1:00:30Speaker 03

  And there's also the outfitters to consider. You'd shrink their season, you know?

• 1:00:34Steven Rinella?

  That's who would be pissed.

• 1:00:35Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:00:35Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, you're right. So it's like, it's like you can kind of scratch the itch.

• 1:00:39Speaker 03

  Yep.

• 1:00:40Steven Rinella?

  A little bit, and maybe it's like you're scratching the itch a little bit where you're not gonna hurt the agency's funding model.

• 1:00:46Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:00:47Steven Rinella?

  The other thing is, I look at it like from this perspective, because I jump, I hunt all over the place. Um, you know, I jump from state to state and hunt. So here I'm going like, let's say, like, I go to, uh, we, we hunt the kitty season, we hunt the youth season in Wisconsin every year. If someone said all of a sudden, they says, it's a two day youth season. And someone comes and says, hey, the first day of Wisconsin's youth season is resident only. I would say, oh, man.

• 1:01:17Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:01:19Steven Rinella?

  What? And I'd be all bummed out.

• 1:01:21Speaker 03

  But you'd still go.

• 1:01:22Steven Rinella?

  I wouldn't have this, what could I do about it? It's not even my state. I would feel like it was someone else deciding something and I was not part of the decision making process. I'd be bummed. So I get it, the people are bummed, but at the same time, when, just to be like totally upfront and honest, when I saw this, I'm like, that's cool.

• 1:01:39Speaker 03

  Yeah. Yeah, I mean, I'm not crying.

• 1:01:42Steven Rinella?

  Because there's a self-serving element to everything.

• 1:01:44Speaker 03

  Like, I, look, I think they would do as much of this as they could if they thought they could get away with, but there's a ceiling to it. Like you said, they can only go so far with it.

• 1:01:53Steven Rinella?

  Yeah. The real losers in anything like this, the real losers are, and if you take this state, the real losers, it's Washington and Minnesota. Because those dudes hunt this state hard. Hard.

• 1:02:13Speaker 03

  Yep.

• 1:02:15Steven Rinella?

  Okay. I've got that video if you want to watch it, Steve. Oh, yeah, this is great. I like this guy.

• 1:02:21Steven Rinella?

  Check this out. This is just right now, he said this?

• 1:02:24Speaker 06

  Uh, I think yesterday.

• 1:02:25Steven Rinella?

  Listen to this guy.

• 1:02:28Speaker 10

  I'll kill a turkey in the morning.

• 1:02:30Steven Rinella?

  Could someone say who, oh, could someone that knows about sports say who he is?

• 1:02:34Speaker 08

  Isn't that the?

• 1:02:35Speaker 06

  I thought it was Longhorn coach? Women's, yeah, Texas Longhorns coach.

• 1:02:39Steven Rinella?

  Oh, okay. Texas Longhorns coach.

• 1:02:42Speaker 06

  They just advanced to the final four.

• 1:02:43Steven Rinella?

  He's got a fishing net around his neck.

• 1:02:45Speaker 06

  No, that's basketball.

• 1:02:46Steven Rinella?

  That was a joke. That was a sports joke.

• 1:02:48Speaker 06

  I was making sure. He'll net. I was making sure he knew what it was.

• 1:02:53Steven Rinella?

  He's got a basketball hoop around his neck. They just won.

• 1:02:55Speaker 10

  I'll kill a turkey in the morning. I'll be in the office by 10 o'clock and I'll be in the film, watching film, getting ready. And then the second thing is I'm gonna leave for Phoenix tomorrow.

• 1:03:08Speaker 10

  Just being honest. That's gonna happen. I've earned that right to be in the woods for a couple hours in the morning calling a turkey.

• 1:03:16Speaker 10

  And then we'll get ready for whoever's, you know, whatever's gonna happen after that. But I'll watch film tonight, absolutely. All the way home. I'll watch it till I can't stay awake tonight, just like I've done here for four or five straight nights. But I'm gonna treat myself in the morning to, it might not even take longer than 30 minutes if I can call that dude off the roost.

• 1:03:39Speaker 10

  I'll be in the office and I'll be getting ready for, for UCLA.

• 1:03:44Steven Rinella?

  Amen. Hope he has a good hunt. He got one.

• 1:03:47Speaker 06

  I found out, yeah. I had to like Google it, but on Twitter he posted a photo of he got one the next morning.

• 1:03:54Speaker 08

  He was so into thinking about turkeys, he couldn't remember who they were playing the next day at the beginning of that interview.

• 1:04:01Steven Rinella?

  Uh, okay. I was talking to Nate Mason the other day. He's joining us right now. Uh, he was out patterning his shotgun.

• 1:04:11Steven Rinella?

  Innocently unaware of the turkey, of the TSS explosion, price explosion.

• 1:04:18Speaker 08

  Vaguely.

• 1:04:18Steven Rinella?

  Yeah. Munich, like, you know, you don't need to be a great student of the news to know that, uh, there's a lot of, uh, ordinance getting blown up right now around the world. People dropping bombs all over the place. The military uses a lot of tungsten in ordinance, in, in munitions. They are, there's a tungsten shortage. This kind of ties into us duking it out with China about certain, uh, rare minerals, metals.

• 1:04:51Steven Rinella?

  I had a guy came to me, I don't want to say my source because I could be wrong. A guy that's in the ammo business.

• 1:05:00Steven Rinella?

  Texted me. That he heard from the major ammo manufacturer. That TSS as an ammo, TSS turkey loads, TSS is done.

• 1:05:14Steven Rinella?

  He says it's all going to the government. And it's time to figure out. Your next bullet.

• 1:05:21Speaker 08

  What was it?

• 1:05:21Steven Rinella?

  Your next shot. I don't know. Osmium super shot. TSS is over. I'm explaining this to Nate Mason and I'm, we're talking about that a TSS round is about six times. More expensive than what he uses. And he said, is it six times better?

• 1:05:39Steven Rinella?

  And I said, no, maybe it's like 1.4 times better.

• 1:05:44Steven Rinella?

  And it inspired him to go on and make his own website.

• 1:05:50Speaker 08

  Yep.

• 1:05:51Steven Rinella?

  The TSS test.com.

• 1:05:54Speaker 08

  You can go there right now.

• 1:05:55Steven Rinella?

  He's parked on that domain for one year for a dollar.

• 1:05:58Speaker 08

  It cost me a buck. It cost me 1 18th of a TSS shell.

• 1:06:02Steven Rinella?

  Did you expense that dollar?

• 1:06:04Speaker 08

  No.

• 1:06:04Steven Rinella?

  You ate it.

• 1:06:05Speaker 08

  I'm planning on monetizing this and making a bunch of money off it. Enough to buy TSS maybe. Here's the deal. A couple of disclaimers. Well, this is the common man's guide to TSS. I think we're making a lot of hay out of TSS. When most people don't even. They're not, it's not even.

• 1:06:23Steven Rinella?

  In my social circle, let me tell you something.

• 1:06:24Speaker 08

  I'm saying you're not the common man.

• 1:06:26Steven Rinella?

  Everyone in my social circle. Shoots TSS.

• 1:06:30Speaker 08

  Right. How new are you to turkey hunting? So this is my second disclaimer. Let me, let me tell you. I have never hunted a turkey in my life.

• 1:06:41Speaker 08

  And I'm not a data scientist. But you are a common man. I'm very much a common man. This is ripe for corrections, so get sharpen your pencils, nitpickers. But I think it makes me uniquely qualified to take an objective view of TSS or the lack thereof.

• 1:07:00Steven Rinella?

  So Phil has TSS for the common man pulled up?

• 1:07:03Speaker 08

  Yep, you can go to theTSSTest.com. And this was-

• 1:07:08Speaker 01

  A lot of Ts.

• 1:07:09Speaker 08

  A lot of Ts, yeah. I'm a big alliterative guy.

• 1:07:12Steven Rinella?

  It's high T.

• 1:07:13Speaker 08

  High T.

• 1:07:15Speaker 08

  And it's answering the question, can I justify buying TSS for 15, 17, 20 bucks a shell? Everyone's got different situations, variables, hunts, ethics setups. And so I polled a number of seasoned turkey hunters from across the US and basically asked, what's the average range at which a turkey presents the shot to you? Because that's what really matters.

• 1:07:40Steven Rinella?

  And I thought about this answer long and hard.

• 1:07:42Speaker 08

  Long and hard.

• 1:07:43Steven Rinella?

  And Yanni, I put it to Yanni long and hard.

• 1:07:44Speaker 08

  See, but I also thought about that because I think you're hunting primo spots.

• 1:07:48Speaker 01

  Dude, it has nothing.

• 1:07:51Speaker 08

  So, no, I'm just saying.

• 1:07:52Steven Rinella?

  I want people to understand, again, you're not a data guy, or you're a data guy. You're not a turkey guy.

• 1:07:56Speaker 08

  I'm neither.

• 1:07:57Steven Rinella?

  This is a working draft of a website.

• 1:07:59Speaker 08

  B1.

• 1:08:01Speaker 03

  And you also probably can't argue with experienced turkey hunters over what they're seeing since you're not-

• 1:08:05Speaker 08

  Well, agreed.

• 1:08:06Steven Rinella?

  And I turkey hunt a lot of places.

• 1:08:08Speaker 08

  Right.

• 1:08:09Steven Rinella?

  I don't, I don't want to remind you that I'm a two-time super, what's the slam when you got-

• 1:08:17Speaker 03

  World slam, no.

• 1:08:18Steven Rinella?

  Yeah.

• 1:08:19Speaker 01

  Grand slam.

• 1:08:19Steven Rinella?

  Two-time, no, way more than grand.

• 1:08:22Speaker 08

  World.

• 1:08:24Speaker 03

  World includes the Mexican-

• 1:08:25Steven Rinella?

  What's the one that doesn't include the oscillated?

• 1:08:27Speaker 08

  Super.

• 1:08:28Steven Rinella?

  Two-time super slam holder.

• 1:08:30Speaker 08

  See, I don't even know what those are. That's how little I know.

• 1:08:32Steven Rinella?

  So, what I'm saying is when I give you turkey data, turkey dough, it's from all over, buddy.

• 1:08:38Speaker 08

  Yup.

• 1:08:40Speaker 08

  But all those data points are from Steve's shoes.

• 1:08:43Steven Rinella?

  Okay, go on.

• 1:08:44Speaker 08

  So, in light of that, I factored in a bunch of variables and you can go on here and put in your situation. Whether it's the caginess of your turkeys, the species you're hunting.

• 1:08:55Steven Rinella?

  Click through a little bit, Phil.

• 1:08:56Speaker 06

  Oh, sure. Hold on, hold on. Before I get corrected, Grand Slam is Eastern, Rio, Merriam, Osceola, Royal Slam.

• 1:09:06Steven Rinella?

  That shouldn't even be a thing.

• 1:09:07Speaker 06

  It's all four.

• 1:09:08Steven Rinella?

  Sub- level.

• 1:09:09Speaker 06

  Yeah. The Royal Slam is the Grand Slam pl- plus the Goulds. And then the World Slam is the Royal Slam plus the Osceola.

• 1:09:18Steven Rinella?

  So two-time Royal Holder.

• 1:09:21Speaker 06

  Yeah, the US Super Slam is all forty-nine states. Or sorry, all forty-nine states that has turkeys.

• 1:09:26Steven Rinella?

  You know what bottlenecks me on that is I only got two, uh, I only got two Goulds.

• 1:09:33Speaker 06

  Two more than a lot of people.

• 1:09:35Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, but I mean, that's what's bottlenecking me on not being a three-time.

• 1:09:38Speaker 03

  You ought to start on that forty-nine thing.

• 1:09:41Steven Rinella?

  No.

• 1:09:42Speaker 03

  No? Not interested?

• 1:09:43Steven Rinella?

  Um, I want to get back to Nate's thing.

• 1:09:44Speaker 06

  Sorry.

• 1:09:45Steven Rinella?

  All right. Oh, that was great because you would've got corrected.

• 1:09:47Speaker 06

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:09:48Speaker 08

  So, dude, I think you just pull that sucker up and go through it.

• 1:09:51Steven Rinella?

  Okay, so you go to TSS for the Common Man, Nate Mason's thing. It's a working draft. He's trying to help you find out if it's right for you. You click Find My Shell.

• 1:09:59Speaker 06

  Who's a, who's gonna be our hunter?

• 1:10:02Speaker 08

  Max.

• 1:10:02Steven Rinella?

  Max.

• 1:10:03Speaker 06

  Okay.

• 1:10:05Steven Rinella?

  Okay, Max. Does your hunting spot actually allow for a forty-five yard shot? Great question.

• 1:10:10Speaker 06

  No.

• 1:10:11Steven Rinella?

  Oh, you can't see that far?

• 1:10:14Speaker 06

  I'm, I'm in the trees. I'm in the timber.

• 1:10:16Speaker 04

  Oh.

• 1:10:17Steven Rinella?

  Okay.

• 1:10:17Speaker 06

  Boom.

• 1:10:18Steven Rinella?

  Oh.

• 1:10:21Speaker 06

  Isn't that funny?

• 1:10:21Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, it's already done. Skip the TSS.

• 1:10:24Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 1:10:25Steven Rinella?

  Okay, back up.

• 1:10:26Speaker 04

  You can, you can sell that stash you got, like, make a pretty penny on it.

• 1:10:31Steven Rinella?

  Okay, let's, let's start over, Max. Let's, let's change your story. Let's say you're hunting an area that's like not too heavily timbered.

• 1:10:37Speaker 06

  For the record, I'm just putting myself in spots that I'm not shooting past forty-five.

• 1:10:42Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, like, like woods hunting, like, or like.

• 1:10:45Speaker 08

  You're not shooting.

• 1:10:47Speaker 06

  Yeah, but no, like, even like, out here in Montana, I'm not setting up, um, a hundred yards from a rise. Like, I'm setting up close to that rise. That turkey's coming up. Boom.

• 1:10:58Speaker 03

  In your face.

• 1:10:59Steven Rinella?

  Yes. But I, I, I know just for the sake of the poor guy's website. Max says, hell yeah. He says, hell yeah, he is. Okay. Does your turkey trip cost $1,000 or more? I would hope not. Let's say no. It does not, Phil.

• 1:11:19Speaker 07

  Oh, wow. It's getting intense now.

• 1:11:20Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, dude. Now.

• 1:11:23Steven Rinella?

  Your situation, species, Max, Miriam's? Yeah. Okay, we're doing Miriam's. Using a decoy? No.

• 1:11:30Speaker 07

  No.

• 1:11:30Steven Rinella?

  You don't use a decoy? Depends on the situation. There's a lot of depends.

• 1:11:34Speaker 03

  Right. Well, that's for by trip.

• 1:11:35Steven Rinella?

  This trip is not. Yeah. Okay. Now, how would you rate the caginess of the turkeys where you hunt, Max? I would give them, oh, it's negative five to five. That's a good name. Butterballs, meaning domestics? Yep. Or, uh, old public land rope draggers?

• 1:11:50Speaker 03

  Don't do the thing where people say Miriam's are stupid.

• 1:11:53Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, that, that's factored into the species. Uh, give, give it a two.

• 1:11:57Speaker 07

  Holy cow.

• 1:11:57Steven Rinella?

  Two.

• 1:11:58Speaker 07

  Two. Oh, growing up.

• 1:11:59Steven Rinella?

  So can you change that to old public land rope draggers? Yeah, I'll change that. I'll take those notes. Yep. Next, me too. Okay. Calling skill. I would say. Don't call and then you're Preston Pittman.

• 1:12:12Speaker 03

  Don't sell yourself short here, Max.

• 1:12:14Steven Rinella?

  I would one. Oh, no, you're better now. Slightly above average. I would say one.

• 1:12:18Speaker 07

  Give it a one, five?

• 1:12:19Steven Rinella?

  No, because he's like really good at calling and everything. He's better than me. Okay. Average. Killable gobblers per day. If you hunted a day and had one come through in range, you know, how, how many would you expect?

• 1:12:38Steven Rinella?

  Like, let me give you, for instance, when we go to hunt youth turkey. Okay, if, if we're hunting hard, I would say, uh, not that we're going to get it, not that the kids are going to shoot, but like. I would expect in a day, we're gonna have a bird in range.

• 1:12:52Speaker 06

  You would lay eyes on a bird.

• 1:12:53Steven Rinella?

  Like, I'd be like, if I was shooting, like, I would, you know, or whatever, how are you looking at it? Just one. Yeah, like, you should have had it. You should have had it. You messed up. Defined by as within seventy yards. He had a hen behind him, so you couldn't shoot. He, like, his head came through a clearing and you weren't ready. You, you, your kid didn't see it in time, whatever, killable turkeys.

• 1:13:13Speaker 06

  See, this is so tough.

• 1:13:14Speaker 03

  I would get rid of the yardage thing and just say, because you got it.

• 1:13:18Steven Rinella?

  One, if he hunts hard, he should have, he should have a turkey in range.

• 1:13:21Speaker 06

  Yes, I go, I would say that, yes. I was thinking about more, but it was just.

• 1:13:25Steven Rinella?

  How many days you got to hunt?

• 1:13:27Speaker 06

  Uh, three days on Weekend Warrior.

• 1:13:29Steven Rinella?

  Okay, he's gonna do a three-day hunt. Now, your generic, old-school shell, no TSS, your generic shell, what, what's, what's max range for you?

• 1:13:38Speaker 06

  I'm not shooting past forty.

• 1:13:39Steven Rinella?

  Okay, forty?

• 1:13:43Steven Rinella?

  Okay, this one, here's where I get confused. This is like a mid-range, like a medium, middle of the range. That was like a Kent, like a Kent shell.

• 1:13:50Speaker 03

  Sure. Premium lead.

• 1:13:52Steven Rinella?

  Premium lead, copper plated. Okay, yeah. So copper plated, so now you got, now you got some, uh, you got some long bir, you got some long beard, what is that up there? Long beard XR. XR. Are you still pushing past forty?

• 1:14:06Speaker 06

  See, I feel like this all depends. What gauge are you shooting?

• 1:14:09Steven Rinella?

  We'll do this for your setup.

• 1:14:10Speaker 03

  For you, Max.

• 1:14:10Steven Rinella?

  Twelve.

• 1:14:11Speaker 06

  For my setup?

• 1:14:11Steven Rinella?

  Yep.

• 1:14:12Speaker 06

  Twelve gauge, uh, you could push it out to forty.

• 1:14:16Steven Rinella?

  Well, that was your other, that was your. Those are, yeah. So you don't adjust.

• 1:14:19Speaker 06

  Push it out to fifty.

• 1:14:20Steven Rinella?

  Okay, he's out to fifty now. Now, what's the biggest poke you're gonna take with TSS? Biggest poke? Like, where you gotta get a rest, that kind of shot?

• 1:14:29Speaker 06

  Oh, my gosh, I.

• 1:14:31Steven Rinella?

  I'll answer for him.

• 1:14:32Speaker 06

  No, me personally, I'm not shooting past forty. I don't care what kind of shell I'm shooting.

• 1:14:37Steven Rinella?

  Oh. So then he doesn't need TSS. Okay, then take his fifty back to forty and put TSS at forty. I think we know what the answer is gonna be. This guy's like the worst guy in the world. We already answered it off the rip. I know, but he's the worst guy in the world to, to, like, try to get him to push this system.

• 1:14:52Speaker 06

  Tell you that.

• 1:14:52Steven Rinella?

  This is why.

• 1:14:53Speaker 06

  Right away.

• 1:14:53Steven Rinella?

  I know, but you know what you're not doing? You're not, like, you're, you're like, you're not just kind of, no, I know, you're trying to stay true to who you are.

• 1:15:01Speaker 08

  Just go forty fifty six.

• 1:15:02Steven Rinella?

  You're not just bullshitting your way through the survey. But still, let's see.

• 1:15:06Speaker 08

  Nevermind.

• 1:15:06Steven Rinella?

  Okay, let me, let me, let me override him.

• 1:15:08Speaker 08

  Okay, great.

• 1:15:10Steven Rinella?

  Just to push the limits.

• 1:15:11Speaker 08

  It's Steve and Max.

• 1:15:12Steven Rinella?

  Max is like forty with my old.

• 1:15:14Speaker 08

  Steve's whispering in his ear.

• 1:15:15Steven Rinella?

  He's like forty with my old man's copper plate force.

• 1:15:18Speaker 06

  Shoot it, he's in range, shoot it.

• 1:15:20Steven Rinella?

  Longbeard XR, I'd stretch it to forty, fifty. TSS, I'm gonna reach out to sixty. Survey says.

• 1:15:30Speaker 08

  Oh, wow, scraps?

• 1:15:32Speaker 06

  This is awesome, Nate.

• 1:15:33Steven Rinella?

  Oh.

• 1:15:34Speaker 08

  The Longbeard XR is the best bang for your buck.

• 1:15:36Steven Rinella?

  Or equivalent. You don't need TSS.

• 1:15:40Speaker 04

  Right.

• 1:15:41Speaker 08

  There you go.

• 1:15:41Speaker 03

  I'll take it all, give it to me. Cause I ain't stopping to shoot that stuff until I run out of it.

• 1:15:47Steven Rinella?

  Okay, the last bit, I told you to check your numbers on shells.

• 1:15:50Speaker 08

  Yep.

• 1:15:51Speaker 04

  Cost per additional point.

• 1:15:53Speaker 08

  So what you're looking at is you're getting a bell curve of where you're gonna get a shot.

• 1:15:57Steven Rinella?

  Yep.

• 1:15:58Speaker 08

  It might walk up to ten, it might hang up at sixty, but on average, they're gonna be about forty yards. And so you can get that done with the, the medium, middle of the road copper.

• 1:16:07Steven Rinella?

  Okay, and what, what costs are you dealing with here? Cause you took like a little.

• 1:16:10Speaker 08

  Yeah, so you scroll down, you'll look at the assumptions, and we can make these variable, but generics are gonna cost you about a buck fifty, your middle of the road two fifty, your TSS is gonna cost you seventeen dollars a shell.

• 1:16:21Steven Rinella?

  Today.

• 1:16:22Speaker 08

  Today.

• 1:16:22Steven Rinella?

  I thought it'd be higher than that by now.

• 1:16:23Speaker 08

  Probably. Um.

• 1:16:25Steven Rinella?

  You know that takes the fun out of shooting, don't it?

• 1:16:27Speaker 08

  Yeah, and you're.

• 1:16:28Steven Rinella?

  Seventeen bucks.

• 1:16:29Speaker 08

  Exactly.

• 1:16:29Speaker 03

  I just don't think about it. You're like, a turkey's worth twenty bucks to me, man.

• 1:16:34Steven Rinella?

  I know, but don't you sometimes feel like just ripping a couple extra shots at the paper?

• 1:16:38Speaker 08

  I do.

• 1:16:39Steven Rinella?

  Yanni Chimani, he says he, when he's, when he's, uh, patterning out, he's patterning out on old schoolers. And then he double checks on his TSS.

• 1:16:48Speaker 06

  Or birdshot.

• 1:16:49Speaker 03

  Yeah, I just use cheap.

• 1:16:50Steven Rinella?

  Yep.

• 1:16:51Speaker 06

  Target loads, yeah.

• 1:16:54Steven Rinella?

  Hit the URL again?

• 1:16:55Speaker 08

  TheTSSTest.com.

• 1:16:57Steven Rinella?

  And what is your pathway toward monetizing this test?

• 1:17:00Speaker 08

  I haven't figured that out yet.

• 1:17:01Steven Rinella?

  How many site visits have you had?

• 1:17:03Speaker 08

  I don't know how to read that data.

• 1:17:07Steven Rinella?

  I bought that sucker and shipped it. I'm afraid that you'll have three site visits and they all came from the same, uh, I, uh, same address.

• 1:17:16Speaker 06

  I like the bottom.

• 1:17:17Steven Rinella?

  Yeah.

• 1:17:18Speaker 06

  There's like bottom, it's almost like in quotes, but it's like immediate or laboratories resource.

• 1:17:22Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, no, it's good. He really branded.

• 1:17:25Speaker 06

  Great touch.

• 1:17:25Steven Rinella?

  He put more into branding than he put into thinking.

• 1:17:28Speaker 03

  You know, you know, you might get an, an offer from Big Lead to buy this website.

• 1:17:33Steven Rinella?

  Big Lead?

• 1:17:33Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:17:34Steven Rinella?

  They got a lot of money. Yeah, I bet you TSS.com. He's in the pocket of Big Lead.

• 1:17:44Steven Rinella?

  Okay. So we covered turkey season updates. We covered the TSS purchase guide. Again, please listeners, go to the TSS test.com and find out if TSS is right for you.

• 1:17:59Speaker 11

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• 1:18:27Steven Rinella?

  If you spend a lot of time outdoors, you got dogs, you got kids, you know how hard it is to keep the floor of your rig clean. A thing we do in our, in our little fleet of vehicles that I have at my household, if you go look, open the door on any one of them, they all got WeatherTech. We get a car, we throw the mats out and put in WeatherTech. Cause that way when there's a mess, it's like your kid's fault, your dog's fault, it's the weather's fault, doesn't matter. You take them suckers out and hose them off and you're back to being good as new. I'm telling you, if you've got a vehicle, put WeatherTech in there, you're going to be happy you did it. And check this out. American made floor liners and cargo liners. Okay. They laugh in the face of all weather. Go take a look for yourself today at weathertech.com.

• 1:19:07Steven Rinella?

  Okay, so buying a new car or a new home starts by building credit, right? So how do you start building credit? It's easy. With One Pay's Builder Card, there's no credit check and no monthly or annual fees, just a card that helps you build credit to reach goals like buying a car or home. Download the One Pay app or visit onepay.com for banking that gives you more for what matters.

• 1:19:33Speaker 09

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• 1:19:48Steven Rinella?

  Over to Spencer.

• 1:19:51Speaker 05

  I'm gonna talk about Death Valley National Park. Death Valley, it's the biggest national park in the lower 48. It's located about two hours west of Las Vegas in east central California. Part of the park spills over into Nevada, but not much of it. When you think of like Death Valley, you're thinking of the California portion. It's the lowest, driest, and hottest place on the continent and all of North America. One part of the park sits at 282 feet below sea level. It averages less than two inches of precipitation every year. And actually in 1929, in 1953, there was no precipitation at all recorded. It currently holds the world record for the hottest temperature ever recorded when it

• 1:20:34Speaker 05

  reached 134 degrees Fahrenheit on July 10, 1913. So now you know all about the, what Death Valley looks like and feels like.

• 1:20:44Steven Rinella?

  Well, I'll tell you one thing you didn't mention that I always liked. Water doesn't leave there.

• 1:20:49Speaker 05

  Hmm, just a basin.

• 1:20:50Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, because it's a below sea, yeah, it's a dead end.

• 1:20:53Speaker 05

  Yeah, I think it's, it's like the remnants of an old lake that used to be 7,000 feet deep.

• 1:20:59Steven Rinella?

  Oh, really?

• 1:20:59Speaker 05

  And now what's left there is Death Valley. Now, despite this intense heat and lack of rain, stuff still grows there. They have mesquite trees, prickly pear cactus, bitter root, whole bunch of succulents and cacti. Then there's a number of wildflowers. Now, most of these wildflowers only show up during a super bloom. The Death Valley Superbloom only happens about every 10 years.

• 1:21:21Steven Rinella?

  Oh.

• 1:21:22Speaker 05

  The last time it happened was in 2016. Prior to that, there was one in 2005 and 1998. Uh, they require perfect conditions. Most notably, you need a wet fall in winter. Uh, and it's precipitation that washes the salt off of the wildflower seeds and wakes them up after they lay dormant for a decade.

• 1:21:42Steven Rinella?

  No kidding. The seeds are salted.

• 1:21:44Speaker 05

  Mm-hmm. And, and that precipitation will take the salt away and it signals, you know, to the seeds. Okay, time to go. You can almost see like the path that the water takes. Hmm, yeah. We're looking at pictures right now. You can see them on YouTube.

• 1:21:57Speaker 03

  How long from moisture to this?

• 1:22:00Speaker 05

  Uh, well, these, these pictures, the super bloom can vary. We'll, we'll get to it in a second. But like when I was there in 2023, I was there in mid-March. Uh, flowers did not start blooming until late March that year. They had, they had an above-average bloom. It was not a super bloom.

• 1:22:16Steven Rinella?

  Were you trying to hit the bloom?

• 1:22:17Speaker 05

  Um, I knew it would be a good time to be, it wasn't like the point of the whole trip.

• 1:22:21Steven Rinella?

  Yep.

• 1:22:22Speaker 05

  But it was like a, a factor in being there in mid-March. Uh, yeah, the, the perfect conditions, mostly it's just a wet fall in winter. Uh, there are about 20 of these wildflowers that participate in the super bloom. Uh, they have a short growing window when they do show up. Now it's similar to predator swamping. Explain what that is, Steve. Predator swapping.

• 1:22:41Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, it's a reproductive strategy that humans interpret as, um, let's say they have a large nesting colony of birds.

• 1:22:52Steven Rinella?

  If they all lay their eggs at the same time, the local predator population doesn't have a chance of getting them all.

• 1:23:00Speaker 05

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:23:00Steven Rinella?

  They'll kind of work the edges of the colony, but they'll never get them all. Whereas if those birds spread their nesting out over a month. You would just have a month of sporadic predation. So predator swamping like when when elk all tend to hit the ground elk fawns all hit the ground on the same day.

• 1:23:17Speaker 05

  Caves, caves, you're gonna get corrected.

• 1:23:20Steven Rinella?

  Elk calves, they all hit the ground the same day. Some are gonna live. If they all hit the ground over the course of six weeks, it could be they all get killed.

• 1:23:27Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 1:23:28Steven Rinella?

  Right? Predator swamp. You're overwhelming predators.

• 1:23:30Speaker 05

  That that would be like a mammal version of that. And I think other, you know, animals will participate as well. The super bloom does a similar thing. It overwhelms the landscape. Uh, because by blooming simultaneously, they'll guaranteed to attract a lot of pollinators, butterflies, moths, bees, hummingbirds. That otherwise aren't going to show up in Death Valley and visit this desert. Uh, now here's why I'm talking about this today. 2026 is a super bloom year. Uh, and this was predicted going back to September, uh, because they got a big rainfall then it was followed by two and a half more inches of rain between November and January. That's that's exactly what you want for a super bloom. Uh, I found a blog post from a Death Valley guide on November 14, 2025, where he said, quote, "I don't recall a setup quite this favorable in the last 15 years."

• 1:24:15Speaker 05

  Uh, and that guide was right. The super bloom started in mid-February. Uh, it's expected to last into May. It likely peaked.

• 1:24:22Speaker 03

  That's what I was gonna ask you. So it lasts a while. It's not like a week and they're all gone.

• 1:24:27Speaker 05

  Once the flowers are up, the biggest thing is heat and wind. Those are the enemies of like a lasting super bloom. Now, this one probably peaked a couple of weeks ago because they had some really intense wind and heat. Uh, it knocked down a lot of those wildflowers, but there's still plenty to see. And it's it also varies by elevation. So obviously the lowest elevation places come into super bloom first, uh, followed by the mid and higher elevations. Uh, and the the higher elevation are where the super bloom will last into early summer. Uh, now if you live in the area, you can go check it out. I visited Death Valley in 2023. Like I said, it's one of my favorite parks.

• 1:25:03Speaker 05

  Uh, it's one of the only parks that has year-round dispersed camping. Uh, it's got the best stargazing I've ever experienced. It's it's super remote. So make sure you fill up on gas first and you have a good spare tire. Uh, and take a trip to the racetrack playa. You'll see the sailing stones that move on their own. And then, of course, this year you'll get the rare super bloom that's happening.

• 1:25:22Steven Rinella?

  Excellent job.

• 1:25:23Speaker 03

  Wow.

• 1:25:23Speaker 05

  Thank you.

• 1:25:24Steven Rinella?

  Didn't need to build no website for that, did you?

• 1:25:26Speaker 05

  No.

• 1:25:28Speaker 05

  No.

• 1:25:29Steven Rinella?

  Excellent job.

• 1:25:31Steven Rinella?

  It's beautiful.

• 1:25:31Speaker 05

  Hottest, driest, lowest place on earth and all those pretty flowers.

• 1:25:35Steven Rinella?

  Not on earth.

• 1:25:35Speaker 05

  I'm sorry. Good, good catch. In North America.

• 1:25:38Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, uh, i- inside of Santiago, somewhere around there, the driest place on earth, like the Alp.

• 1:25:43Speaker 03

  Chili.

• 1:25:44Steven Rinella?

  Sorry, yeah, and chili driest place on earth.

• 1:25:46Speaker 05

  Hmm.

• 1:25:47Steven Rinella?

  Yeah.

• 1:25:47Speaker 05

  Can't even, like, that must be less than an inch of precipitation a year. Wow.

• 1:25:52Steven Rinella?

  Uh, no rain.

• 1:25:54Speaker 05

  Disgusting.

• 1:25:55Steven Rinella?

  All right, Max, over to you, North Dakota poachers.

• 1:25:57Speaker 06

  All right. So, you know how the 1880s had Jesse James and Frank James?

• 1:26:03Steven Rinella?

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:26:03Speaker 06

  Well, 2026 has Tatum and Tyler Defoe.

• 1:26:08Speaker 05

  Oh.

• 1:26:09Steven Rinella?

  Hmm.

• 1:26:09Speaker 06

  Going to my home state, North Dakota. Bad dudes. Uh, Watford City, North Dakota, which is in the northwest part of the state, I would say. Um, the remains of over 30 deer, three bowl, bowl elk, and even a moose with antlers were found by law enforcement at the residence of a Watford City man who is now under arrest and currently being held at the Southwest Multi-County Correction Center in Dickinson, North Dakota.

• 1:26:33Steven Rinella?

  Where in the hell's he getting the moose?

• 1:26:35Speaker 06

  I do not know. There, there's moose in North Dakota.

• 1:26:37Steven Rinella?

  But he like took it home with him.

• 1:26:41Steven Rinella?

  Or at least the head. Yeah.

• 1:26:43Speaker 06

  This.

• 1:26:44Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, I understand.

• 1:26:44Speaker 06

  This article didn't really say how they got it. It was just like.

• 1:26:49Steven Rinella?

  That it's there. He's got it on his place.

• 1:26:50Speaker 06

  Yep. Um, so back in December of 2024, the residence of Tatum, Tatum and Tyler Defoe was being searched by law enforcement on a different warrant. Law enforcement happened to see some untagged, uh, heads there and they notified a local game warrant.

• 1:27:07Speaker 03

  Seems like a lot of poachers get nailed via unrelated charges.

• 1:27:11Speaker 06

  Yes.

• 1:27:12Steven Rinella?

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:27:13Speaker 06

  Um, and then a new search by the North Dakota game and fish, um, that lasted about six hours. Um, and then the warden removed the following from the residence. Thirty-four sets of antlers and heads of whitetail and mule deer. Two elk heads with antlers, so a bowl elk, one moose with antlers, so a bowl moose. And, uh, multiple bags of meat in a bobcat rug. North Dakota game warrants reached out to surrounding states um to see like hey you guys have any licenses? Take a guess.

• 1:27:46Speaker 03

  Montana.

• 1:27:47Speaker 06

  No. No licenses found. Oh.

• 1:27:51Speaker 03

  But didn't they have charges in Montana? Yeah.

• 1:27:54Speaker 06

  Meaning they can't, he can't explain it away by like, oh, I've been hunting all over hell. Yeah. Yeah.

• 1:27:59Speaker 03

  I thought they were connected to some stuff in Montana, but maybe not.

• 1:28:03Speaker 06

  No, um, in the article I read, uh, the warden reached out to both Montana and South Dakota to verify, um, zero big game licenses were found.

• 1:28:11Speaker 08

  What's stopping them from just saying they're a bunch of deadheads?

• 1:28:15Speaker 06

  Great question.

• 1:28:16Speaker 08

  Cause I, I, my buddy brought up this question. Cause he was running around with a new hunter who doesn't know anything about anything and he was like, I don't want to take this deadhead because I don't have a salvage tag for it. And so I thought, I called Montana FWP and they're like, yeah, you don't need a salvage tag.

• 1:28:31Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 1:28:32Speaker 04

  Maybe it depends on what state it's in, you know, if it's like a head that was cut off.

• 1:28:36Speaker 03

  It's like, if, if for some reason, a, a, a, a police officer or game warden is on your property and they see a deadhead or two deadheads versus finding thirty.

• 1:28:49Speaker 08

  Yeah, but I've found five this year. I got all sorts of deadheads all over the place.

• 1:28:53Speaker 06

  So I think this article, when it says, um,

• 1:29:00Speaker 06

  elk heads, I think it's like a mounted taxidermy, you know, it's, it's not a European mounted

• 1:29:05Speaker 08

  Yeah.

• 1:29:05Speaker 06

  deadhead. Um, so yeah, um, going back to this, um, the maximum penalty for a single class A misdemeanor under North Dakota law is three hundred and sixty days in prison, a three thousand dollar fine or both.

• 1:29:19Speaker 08

  Hmm.

• 1:29:19Speaker 06

  The youngest, the youngest of the two, Tatum, was initially charged with fifteen separate class A misdemeanor charges.

• 1:29:28Steven Rinella?

  Wow.

• 1:29:29Speaker 06

  Uh, yeah, he's currently being held in Dickinson, North Dakota. Um, I didn't really find much about his older brother Tyler Defoe. It's the article just said he was, uh, had nearly identical charges stemming from the same incident.

• 1:29:45Steven Rinella?

  Got it.

• 1:29:45Speaker 06

  But that was it. Um, I don't know if he's in jail or what's happening. So, um,

• 1:29:50Speaker 03

  Did they like, did they tie any of those heads to like known poaching cases they were trying to solve?

• 1:29:57Speaker 06

  No. I didn't, this article is very bleak.

• 1:29:59Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:30:00Speaker 06

  Um, so, and I think it's important to note, um, both Defoe's are considered into, considered innocent until proven guilty. So, we'll find out. I'll circle back on this in a couple of weeks and see what happens.

• 1:30:14Steven Rinella?

  That's a lot of charges, man.

• 1:30:15Speaker 06

  Yeah, I know they had a couple of court dates here coming up. So.

• 1:30:19Speaker 05

  Western North Dakota doesn't produce a lot of bull elk and moose. So that like, you know,

• 1:30:24Steven Rinella?

  Makes you wonder, man. That's the things you wonder about, yeah.

• 1:30:27Speaker 06

  Yeah, I know there's like bad like, it's like in the Badlands in Western North Dakota, there's lots of elk, but, um, yeah, having two of those, I, I think it's like a once in a lifetime tag.

• 1:30:36Steven Rinella?

  But I wouldn't be, I don't know what I'm talking about, cause I don't know. But I mean, I wouldn't be surprised if it turned out that those weren't local.

• 1:30:42Speaker 06

  Yeah, like hopping.

• 1:30:43Steven Rinella?

  That's why, that's why they're talking about calling other states.

• 1:30:47Speaker 06

  And well, once you cross the state line, doesn't it turn into a whole other?

• 1:30:50Steven Rinella?

  Lacey, lacy like violation, yeah. Then it's a federal crime.

• 1:30:53Speaker 06

  Um, but yeah, I think.

• 1:30:54Steven Rinella?

  That's kind of what piqued my curiosity about it. Is that, um, you know, not to say that they don't, but those are animals not mostly associated there. And the fact that they're calling other states leads you to believe that that's what they're curious about.

• 1:31:07Speaker 06

  For sure. So, we'll find out.

• 1:31:10Steven Rinella?

  Yep.

• 1:31:12Steven Rinella?

  Okay, lastly.

• 1:31:14Steven Rinella?

  I just got. So I just recently got a, a, um, a moose harvest report. Okay, looking at moose harvest statistics.

• 1:31:24Speaker 03

  For here.

• 1:31:25Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, but it, w- within this report that I got, I got this other really interesting thing about moose.

• 1:31:34Steven Rinella?

  Moose in general on our continent. So, Canada, United States of America, the moose population, in a way that they used to understand moose, in a way that they, the, the, the evolving understanding of how moose came to be. Now, I'll just do a little trivia. What do you, what do you got? What moose do we have here?

• 1:31:52Speaker 03

  Chyris and up in northern, we have a Canadian.

• 1:31:57Steven Rinella?

  Canada.

• 1:31:58Speaker 03

  Or whatever they call them.

• 1:31:59Steven Rinella?

  So. Yeah, so you have, in moose taxonomy, they recognize you have the Yukon.

• 1:32:05Speaker 03

  Yep.

• 1:32:06Steven Rinella?

  Moose, which is the biggest. Then, the Canadian moose. Then you have the Chyris moose. And then I think there's another one they call out east, like the eastern. And maybe, is there a Labrador too?

• 1:32:18Speaker 03

  Newfoundland or Labrador, something like that.

• 1:32:21Steven Rinella?

  So, these, they have these different moose, these different moose branches. In, in moose taxonomy. They used to do this a lot. For, for instance, there used to be, I don't know, they used to recognize a dozen caribou.

• 1:32:34Speaker 03

  Seven different kinds of elk or something like that.

• 1:32:37Steven Rinella?

  Seven kinds of elk, dozen caribou. And they used to think that these things were genetically different. Think about this, the Mexican gray wolf. And then the wolf, the regular gray wolf, okay? So, we have these different genetic distinctions. And what you're doing is you, when they look at the genome of the species, you usually are, are, when, when it's valid, okay? Like, take, let's start with this example, I'm trying to say. Take black-tailed deer and mule deer. Black-tailed deer and mule deer are regarded as legitimately different. They're like, that is a legitimate subspecies.

• 1:33:19Steven Rinella?

  And what, what makes it that way is they can see evidence that there was a, a serious, distinct genetic barrier. Meaning, there was a time when black-tailed deer.

• 1:33:35Steven Rinella?

  Were not able to interbreed. They were, they were physically separated from mule deer at a time.

• 1:33:42Steven Rinella?

  Now they're not. Now they bleed into each other. Like I, I, I've pointed this out before. There's places like in, in California. If a deer is standing on the west side of I five. It's a black tailed deer. If it's standing on the east side of I five, it's a mule deer. But when you look at them genetically, you can tell that these two things were different and they were separated.

• 1:34:07Steven Rinella?

  What was separating them in all these cases in North America, it was what was separating them was like old glaciation. So you had glacial barriers that cut animal populations in chunks. And so areas where we have these like legitimate subspecies, it was because they were separated. When you look at caribou, they had like, I don't know what the, a dozen caribou. Running around. They now think that there are two legitimate caribou subspecies. Barren ground.

• 1:34:36Speaker 03

  And woodland.

• 1:34:37Steven Rinella?

  Barren ground were north of the glaciers. Woodland survived south of the glaciers. The glaciers go away, everything melts, they can intermingle, but they're still like, those are legitimate subspecies. For a long time, people thought that the Chyris moose.

• 1:34:54Steven Rinella?

  Was a subspecies and there was this idea that it had found refuge. South of the great ice sheets and evolved on its own and these other moose evolved to the north. And I was even unaware that this thinking was changing. But they're doing more and more genetic work and it's like. All these different moose, Yukon, Canada, Chyris. What you, when you look at them and you see the differences, all you're seeing is, is habitat. Like distinct habitat and nutrition.

• 1:35:28Speaker 03

  And what's the, uh.

• 1:35:31Speaker 03

  Shit, what is it? The thing north to south or south to north?

• 1:35:34Steven Rinella?

  Bergman's principle.

• 1:35:35Speaker 03

  That could play a role too.

• 1:35:36Steven Rinella?

  Body size. So like in Berg, Bergman's principle, we've talked about this a hundred times, like Bergman's principle, if you look at a mammals range. The largest specimens are on the north end of the range, the smallest specimens are on the south end of the range, which fits. So look at all this stuff like antler configuration of a Chyris moose. The Chyris moose doesn't have different antler configuration. It's just smaller. And they they wound up doing this thing. I'm looking at this map. And it surveyed fossils in North America over fifteen thousand years. And it's crazy because like over fifteen thousand years you have. I'm looking at this map where it's showing caribou fossils coming out of Nebraska.

• 1:36:16Speaker 03

  Well, oh, I I was doing some research for the book where they they've found caribou Tennessee, Alabama, like way down south.

• 1:36:24Steven Rinella?

  Well, this is over fifteen thousand years. So I got caribou fossils over in South Carolina, North Carolina, caribou fossils in Nebraska. Deer fossils, southern Florida, just everywhere. Okay. Elk fossils down in New Mexico. There is no older than fifteen thousand year moose fossil. The the southernmost, the southernmost, over fifteen thousand year old moose fossil found to date sits at the Alaska Yukon border.

• 1:36:58Speaker 03

  So north of the glaciers.

• 1:37:00Steven Rinella?

  Yeah. They other stuff was down. Right? Like, and in this map, there's this huge band across central Canada where there's no fossil, no fossils from over the time because nothing was there. So you had stuff that was north of it and stuff that was south of it. What you had north of it? You had elk. You had moose. You had caribou. South of it. You had deer. You had caribou. You had elk.

• 1:37:29Speaker 03

  No moose. That's wild.

• 1:37:30Steven Rinella?

  No moose. And so they they're saying that like all moose, all moose at the end of the Ice Age came out of Beringia. Spread south and there's never been a point when and you did not have genetic barriers. They've always just been like you would start in one place and you'd travel. And there'd be moose and you'd slowly realize they look different.

• 1:37:53Speaker 03

  Yeah, over time, they just adapted to that habitat.

• 1:37:56Steven Rinella?

  Nutrition, habitat, and they also this this paper also talks a lot about density. That like density is impacting size.

• 1:38:06Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:38:07Steven Rinella?

  High density. Small size.

• 1:38:11Speaker 03

  What's wild is they were moving. Uh, down here at the same time humans were.

• 1:38:16Steven Rinella?

  That's the crazy part too.

• 1:38:17Speaker 03

  Timeline.

• 1:38:18Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, that that's that's kind of like. It would be that if if you always imagine going back, like you want to go back to the Pleistocene to the Clovis age. You could be like the, the first humans that came down out of Beringia and hit the American Great Plains. They, they might've done that faster than, they might've been in a moose-free environment. And then one day it'd be like, wow, there's moose showing up.

• 1:38:40Speaker 03

  What's that thing?

• 1:38:40Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, because the moose came at the same time as humans.

• 1:38:43Speaker 03

  Yep.

• 1:38:45Steven Rinella?

  I think it's fascinating. The map is cool.

• 1:38:47Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:38:47Steven Rinella?

  Yeah. There were no deer, the most, this is what's crazy too, the most northern deer fossils over 15,000 years have come out of like the, the Prince of Wales Island area.

• 1:38:59Speaker 03

  So black tails.

• 1:39:00Steven Rinella?

  Yep. On the coast, on the coast, probably ice free.

• 1:39:05Speaker 03

  Yep.

• 1:39:05Steven Rinella?

  You had some black tails on the coast and then it's like you didn't have northern deer and you didn't have southern moose.

• 1:39:12Speaker 03

  That's super cool.

• 1:39:13Steven Rinella?

  Yeah. It's just a kind of a changing perspective of why, why is a Shiras, because when they look at a Shiras moose, they're like, his antlers are smaller, his coat is different colored. There's these other head measurements that are different and you're like, oh, they must've been different.

• 1:39:30Speaker 03

  Right.

• 1:39:30Steven Rinella?

  But it's like, it's just how the species was reflected, how the landscape changed the species, how the species adapted to the landscape, right?

• 1:39:42Speaker 03

  It'd be interesting to see what other species will, they'll look at and try and follow that same

• 1:39:49Steven Rinella?

  Yep.

• 1:39:49Speaker 03

  trend, you know?

• 1:39:50Steven Rinella?

  Yep.

• 1:39:51Speaker 05

  For size reference, the Boone and Crockett minimum score for a Shiras moose is 140, for a Canada moose is 185.

• 1:40:00Steven Rinella?

  There you go.

• 1:40:00Speaker 05

  Forty-five inch difference. And then for a Yukon moose, it's 210. So this is like a Canada and Yukon are closer in minimum size than Boone and Crockett, than Shiras and Canada.

• 1:40:11Speaker 03

  Boone and Crockett score is kind of weird to envision with moose. I like, spread wise, I would say like a Shiras, a good bull's like 40 inches wide.

• 1:40:19Speaker 05

  If you look at the all-time record, the world record, um, for a Canada is 242, for a Shiras is 205.

• 1:40:28Steven Rinella?

  I'm gonna make people dig this up themselves. I don't want to tell them. But there is a unit in Montana where the average.

• 1:40:37Steven Rinella?

  Fifty inches? The five-year average is a forty-nine inch width. And you look at most of the units, the five-year average is down in the upper thirties. Yeah. Hmm. Like forty's a decent Shire. Hot unit. Yeah. And you know what's funny? People know this because it's a low draw odd unit. People figured it out. They're all low draw. Everything is point oh one percent chance. No, no. No. Not true. Okay. Not true. Thanks for listening to the new show. I know some that are...

• 1:41:04Steven Rinella?

  Thanks, everybody.

• 1:41:06Speaker 12

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• 1:44:06Steven Rinella?

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