Iconic NFL QB Michael Vick graces Madden Cover 20 years later and shares how the fall from the top humbled him but the climb back was even harder on him.

FOLLOW THE PIVOT PODCAST: MERCH | https://pivotpodcast.com YOUTUBE | https://www.youtube.com/thepivotpodcast INSTAGRAM | https://instagram.com/thepivot TWITTER | https://twitter.com/thepivot TIKTOK | https://tiktok.com/@thepivot FACEBOOK | https://www.facebook.com/thepivotpodcast Everything about quarterback Michael Vick’s game was electric. He was a human highlight-reel who made infamous plays in every game he was under center. And in 2003, he was named the cover athlete for Madden 2004. Little did EA Sports know that Vick’s legacy as a quarterback icon would face as many bumps as it did. 20 years later, Ryan, Channing and Fred sit down with legend Michael Vick to honor the anniversary of him being named to the Madden NFL cover. Hailing from Virginia, Michael Vick always dreamt differently, thinking about a future of success from a young age. He tells the guys the difficulties of being a trailblazing quarterback at Virginia Tech, and about how being drafted to the Falcons was a blessing, even with its downsides. Remaining close to home became detrimental for Vick, but the man who revolutionized the game had to reset himself during his time in jail. He tells a story of coach Tony Dungy’s sincere visit to him at a federal prison in Kansas, and how a meeting with Dungy, Andy Reid and Roger Goodell gave his career a second wind. The 2010 Comeback Player of the Year truly reset his game, and life. Vick explains how he has become an animal welfare advocate while also holding football camps for kids. A young Michael Vick once had a goal of only being drafted to the NFL and he touches on how grateful he was to be named the Madden NFL 2004 cover athlete. Ryan, Channing and Fred have played alongside and against some impactful athletes, but they talk about how Vick transcended the game with there being few comparable players ever. The same kid who ran around the streets of Newport News, Virginia has been running around the screens of Madden users for over two decades, and despite his two-year absence from football, he will go down as one of football’s all-time stars. New episodes drop on Tuesdays at 12 p.m. ET and Fridays at 3:30 p.m ET on YouTube, with audio available on all streaming platforms including Apple, Spotify and Amazon. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:01Speaker 00

  This episode is brought to you by Michelob Ultra. Good times mean competitions between you and your friends. Like seeing who can throw some pigskin the farthest, or rush the field the fastest. Winner gets an ultra. Because it's not just a superior light beer, it's also giving fans superior access to their favorite sporting events. Superior is worth playing for. Visit michelobultra.com/superioraccess to enter. Enjoy responsibly. Copyright 2026 Anheuser Busch InBev Michelob Ultra Beer, St. Louis, Missouri.

• 0:30Ryan Clark?

  Fast people over there.

• 0:31Channing Crowder?

  The slow side.

• 0:32Ryan Clark?

  This the slow side over here, Chan?

• 0:33Channing Crowder?

  It's not the slow side.

• 0:34Ryan Clark?

  Chan, you ran 4.6.

• 0:36Channing Crowder?

  I probably could beat you in the race.

• 0:37Ryan Clark?

  Now?

• 0:38Channing Crowder?

  At our, no, at our prime? No, I could gun you.

• 0:42Ryan Clark?

  No, Chan.

• 0:43Channing Crowder?

  I think so.

• 0:44Ryan Clark?

  I ran 4.48 when it came out.

• 0:47Channing Crowder?

  You ran 4.48?

• 0:47Ryan Clark?

  Mm-hmm. The two times were 4.48 and 4.5 flat.

• 0:52Channing Crowder?

  4.5 flat?

• 0:53Ryan Clark?

  Yeah, I'm not, I'm not Mike or Fred, but I'm not, I wasn't jerk kinda slow.

• 0:57Channing Crowder?

  What you ran?

• 0:59Ryan Clark?

  4.48. You ran 4.4. 4.48, 4.5 flat.

• 1:03Channing Crowder?

  I ran a 4.52.

• 1:05Ryan Clark?

  Oh, that's close.

• 1:05Channing Crowder?

  We were, but I was 2, 450 and you were 170.

• 1:09Ryan Clark?

  You were a better athlete.

• 1:11Channing Crowder?

  I could gun you. He gave you that. Yeah, like. He gave you that. If he, if he, bro, think about it, if he ran a 4.48 and I ran a 4.52, but I'm lining up next to him, 40 pounds heavier than him?

• 1:22Ryan Clark?

  Bro, I didn't tell you what Jay C did to me.

• 1:24Channing Crowder?

  That's impressive. I would gun him. Because you would be so intimidated by me, you wouldn't be in the run.

• 1:30Ryan Clark?

  No, I would split you. I'm not tripping on that.

• 1:32Channing Crowder?

  Bro, I would gun you.

• 1:33Ryan Clark?

  It's fine.

• 1:34Channing Crowder?

  It's the cup.

• 1:34Ryan Clark?

  Oh, this is hot, pretty tea. Thank you, bro.

• 1:36Channing Crowder?

  I love the cup. Yeah, we, we work. He did it the most.

• 1:38Ryan Clark?

  Thank you, bro. Um, Chan, y'all saving air conditioning?

• 1:42Channing Crowder?

  Thanks, bro. Y'all want a little more?

• 1:44Ryan Clark?

  It is very hot in here.

• 1:46Channing Crowder?

  Appreciate it. I can, I can turn, what's your, what, what temperature do you keep your house? I'm a 74 guy.

• 1:52Ryan Clark?

  Yeah, I'm 74.

• 1:53Channing Crowder?

  Oh, here?

• 1:54Ryan Clark?

  I'm 74 to a bedtime.

• 1:55Channing Crowder?

  I can see 72, bro.

• 1:57Ryan Clark?

  72?

• 1:58Channing Crowder?

  God.

• 1:58Ryan Clark?

  It's hot in here, Chan.

• 1:59Channing Crowder?

  Well, you got that bread.

• 2:02Channing Crowder?

  Nah, it's only on certain, like, in certain spots. Thanks, thanks, man. Appreciate this, bro.

• 2:08Fred Taylor?

  Nah, nah, nah, definitely new one. Oh, yeah, for sure. Yeah, that's some new, uh, a little, little new thing.

• 2:13Channing Crowder?

  Just wanted to say before we stop, man, proud of y'all, man.

• 2:16Ryan Clark?

  Appreciate you, bro.

• 2:17Channing Crowder?

  You watch from afar. Appreciate you. Proud of y'all.

• 2:18Fred Taylor?

  Still grind, man. We love it.

• 2:20Channing Crowder?

  My AC was at 74.

• 2:24Ryan Clark?

  It was hot, bro.

• 2:25Fred Taylor?

  You got freon?

• 2:27Channing Crowder?

  I hit it. Fred, how the fuck else I'm gonna have an ass?

• 2:31Fred Taylor?

  But you could, because 74, you would think, alright, it gotta be nice and cool in here. 74, and it's structured. Wait, 74? It's a little on the warmer side.

• 2:40Channing Crowder?

  You a 72 guy.

• 2:42Fred Taylor?

  It's not cool outside, so when it's cool outside.

• 2:45Channing Crowder?

  You can get a 70.

• 2:46Fred Taylor?

  Your 74 should be fairly.

• 2:47Channing Crowder?

  72 is for rich people. 72, that's a, that's a refrigerator.

• 2:54Fred Taylor?

  And teach you how to save money. Your AC, kinda suspect, 74, kinda like this. So you get your wetback, pull off the little cap, the PVC, in your, in your handling room. Put that down in there, hold it, but turn it off first, don't you wanna shock yourself. And then just stuff all of the water and shit out, change your filters, go do it to your unit outside too. Machine running like brand new.

• 3:20Channing Crowder?

  Fred, who do you think I am?

• 3:23Fred Taylor?

  HVAC people gonna show up and do that for a low ski whoa.

• 3:26Channing Crowder?

  Hey guys, you think, you think I'm about to do that shit myself?

• 3:29Ryan Clark?

  Chan.

• 3:31Channing Crowder?

  I work, bro.

• 3:32Fred Taylor?

  No.

• 3:33Ryan Clark?

  Chan, we're here.

• 3:34Channing Crowder?

  Fred, I'm not, I'm not doing that personally.

• 3:37Ryan Clark?

  Guys, we're here to talk about the fact that it's the 20th year anniversary since Michael Vick was on the cover of John Madden. That's what we're here for. EA, John Madden.

• 3:48Channing Crowder?

  The Vick family, like, yeah.

• 3:50Fred Taylor?

  It's a cool HVAC conversation though.

• 3:52Channing Crowder?

  Yeah, Fred wanna tell me that I need to HVAC my goddamn AC, I'm not HVACing nothing.

• 3:58Ryan Clark?

  Nobody knows about HVACing.

• 4:00Channing Crowder?

  Fred said he does.

• 4:01Fred Taylor?

  Yeah, I mean, I know a little bit, cuz my homie does it. You know, shout out to Will, I appreciate you, he saved me money.

• 4:07Ryan Clark?

  So he not saying he's gonna do it, he's saying you should find someone that can do it.

• 4:11Fred Taylor?

  I'm teaching him how to do it.

• 4:12Ryan Clark?

  Like, people are now, watch this segue, TV, like, people are now finding quarterbacks that could try to do some of the things Michael Vick did.

• 4:20Fred Taylor?

  They can't.

• 4:20Ryan Clark?

  Before they allowed it in the offense.

• 4:22Channing Crowder?

  The closest thing I seen Lamar though.

• 4:25Ryan Clark?

  Yeah, for sure.

• 4:26Channing Crowder?

  Yeah, the closest I seen Lamar.

• 4:27Ryan Clark?

  Speaking of, Lamar Jackson said that he played with the Falcons and Michael Vick or Madden.

• 4:33Fred Taylor?

  The only person couldn't play with me was me.

• 4:36Speaker 04

  But I love being on the company.

• 4:37Ryan Clark?

  Was it a rule that you couldn't play with yourself?

• 4:39Speaker 04

  Nah, just when I played with myself, I was just like always trying to run like I ran. I tried to play it like a video game.

• 4:45Fred Taylor?

  Right.

• 4:45Speaker 04

  Like the actual game, you know what I mean? Like how I would play it in the game.

• 4:49Ryan Clark?

  I actually sucked at Madden because of that. On third and six, I'm trying to call fire zone. Cause I'm thinking it's, you know, third and intermediate.

• 4:57Speaker 04

  Yeah, you're trying to.

• 4:58Ryan Clark?

  Get burnt up.

• 4:59Speaker 04

  You're trying to do it in the real game.

• 5:02Fred Taylor?

  So I gotta echo Mike and y'all might not.

• 5:05Speaker 04

  Was y'all pretty good? Was Jackson good?

• 5:07Fred Taylor?

  Pretty good. Man, we was dogs. Jimmy Smith, Brunel, myself.

• 5:11Speaker 04

  When I was a 98, speed 99.

• 5:13Fred Taylor?

  Yeah, yeah. I had a couple of seasons like that, but I'm gonna cut to small talk, cause guess what I brought?

• 5:18Speaker 04

  Fred, don't do this.

• 5:19Ryan Clark?

  That's hard. That is hard.

• 5:21Speaker 04

  You rarely see these.

• 5:24Fred Taylor?

  Hey, bro.

• 5:24Ryan Clark?

  You rarely see these, man. Bring it back.

• 5:26Fred Taylor?

  Pick a color.

• 5:27Ryan Clark?

  That's hard.

• 5:27Fred Taylor?

  Huh?

• 5:28Ryan Clark?

  That's hard.

• 5:29Fred Taylor?

  You think I ain't? He my neighbor. I could've went down the street and grabbed it, but since we here, I might as well.

• 5:34Ryan Clark?

  Freddie T, did you still have it?

• 5:35Speaker 04

  Sell me this, Fred.

• 5:36Fred Taylor?

  Bro, sell you it. After you put your signature on it, it is mine.

• 5:41Speaker 04

  Frame this one.

• 5:42Ryan Clark?

  You'll see it on eBay.

• 6:08Ryan Clark?

  Thank you so much for being here. This is something.

• 6:10Speaker 04

  Thanks for having me, man.

• 6:11Ryan Clark?

  I can't tell you how many DMs we've gotten, how many comments we've gotten that we needed to have you on the show. So I'm excited that we finally got to do it. Welcome to the Pivot. Obviously Freddie T, Chan, I'm RC. You need no introduction, but it's what we do on the show.

• 6:29Ryan Clark?

  A four-time Pro Bowler, 2010 Comeback Player of the Year, Virginia Tech Hall of Fame. More importantly to me, a man that changed the look of a league and a position. The same way Allen Iverson, another Virginia boy, did it for the NBA. I think it goes understated, the cultural influence you had on a game of football. But I think we had to start before that, your high school coach said that you told him. You wanted to go to college like the big cuz Aaron Brooks.

• 7:03Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 7:04Ryan Clark?

  And that you finally got your chance the middle of your freshman year. Talk a little bit about that drive, man, and what it's like to be for such a talent-rich

• 7:14Speaker 04

  driven.

• 7:15Ryan Clark?

  Part of the country.

• 7:17Speaker 04

  Yeah, first off, Aaron Brooks was like my big cousin, man. He was like everything to me. Like, watching him in high school, it's like all I could do was just envision myself doing everything and I watched him. He was four years older, but it's, you know, it's almost like when you, you watch guys and, you know, you're a young kid and you idolizing an NFL player. When I went to see him play high school ball, because that's what, you know, that was the transition from, you know, Pop Warner, that was the next step. Like, I wanted to be just like him. And, you know, I heard he was getting all the scholarship opportunities and just doing it the right way. Like, you know, you dream as a kid, you know, you dream with others. And I, Aaron was one of the guys I dreamt with and I seen

• 8:00Speaker 04

  him against scholarship offers and everything was kind of like falling into place for him. So, I'm like, if I can measure up to that, if I can just emulate everything that he did or try to, you know, duplicate everything that he did on the field, off the field, then my dream of going to college might come true. Because, you know, that's all you, I wanted coming from where I came from, an opportunity. I knew a scholarship would grant me an opportunity. Didn't know it would go in the direction that it went, because it got crazy once I got to college, but, you know, God was good.

• 8:34Channing Crowder?

  You do interviews, people talk to you, you on all the Saturday shows. But, bro, what do people not know about you? What do people not know about young Vic? Because there's a lot of, there's a lot of people that can be Michael Vick.

• 8:48Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 8:48Channing Crowder?

  That don't know they can be Michael Vick. What do people not know about you growing up? Marcus, your mom, all the people I know.

• 8:56Ryan Clark?

  Mm-mm, mm-mm, don't say that.

• 8:58Channing Crowder?

  What's that?

• 8:58Ryan Clark?

  There are not a lot of people that can be Michael Vick.

• 9:00Channing Crowder?

  There are some people that can be Michael Vick.

• 9:02Speaker 04

  I see what you're going with it. Me and all my homies, we was all on the same playing field growing up. I just felt like, you know, a couple of us dreamt different. Like, I was like, um, like 12, 13 years old, like looking deep into the future. So, like, every time I stepped on the field, me and my brother, we was like, we gotta be different. We gotta do something different. Like, we used to watch. NFL, college football, Saturday, Sunday, me and my brother spent all day in the house. Halftime, commercial breaks, we run outside and just give it to each other real quick. Go deep, you know what I'm saying? That's why my brother played quarterback too, because just, you know, helping me, you know, with my craft, he became, he developed an arm that was, you know, not a similar arm talent,

• 9:47Speaker 04

  but it was good enough. Me and bro like, super close growing up. Moms, family, real close. And so, my mom knew what I wanted to do in my life. Like, she knew I wanted to play in the National Football League, but she also knew how tough that was gonna be. So, I think she spent a majority of my upbringing trying to, you know, soften the blow just in case it didn't happen. You see what I'm saying? Like, "Well, you know, you can always go do this." Nah, they make millions doing that. You know, I'm reading the newspaper when I'm young, I'm seeing contracts, you know,

• 10:30Speaker 04

  you know, really, I ain't really, we ain't had cable sometimes, so I couldn't even catch ESPN, Channel 17, but, you know, just, um, you know, having that, like, tight-knit family, man, like, I think kept me grounded, kept me focused, and I, you know, I knew, in order to get out of where I was at, man, I had to dream big, think big.

• 10:53Fred Taylor?

  Right. You spoke, you mentioned Channel 17, it made me think of Plex. He said that's the reason he selected 17.

• 10:59Speaker 04

  Because ESPN?

• 11:00Fred Taylor?

  Channel 17.

• 11:01Speaker 04

  Yeah, I'm saying, yeah, because that's where I got all my, you know, that's where I got all my, my football, NBA.

• 11:07Fred Taylor?

  He was, uh, he was actually our very first guest. We held him for a while, but he was our first guest when we started.

• 11:15Speaker 04

  Yeah. Shout out to Plex.

• 11:17Fred Taylor?

  You can, he will slow you down, that Virginia has absolutely the best athletes from football, basketball, the whole gamut. What is it about that area, Newport News specifically, where you came up at?

• 11:30Speaker 04

  Yeah, respectfully, we, uh, you know, we put out some great athletes. I mean, I don't take anything away from the state of Florida, Texas, Georgia. Pennsylvania got, you know, got tough football players. Texas, California, we got a melting pot. You know, a lot of us succumb to, you know, sometimes the pearls of what, you know, the environment that we, we grew up in and we lose focus. But I can say this, just as many as we put out, it's a lot that it could have been triple that number. You know what I'm saying? And, and I came up with a lot of these guys and just, if you lined us all up, and I'm

• 12:11Speaker 04

  like in the middle, you know, wrong path, wrong path, wrong path, wrong path, straight path, wrong path. So like four of us made it out. Why did you make it out? I knew that, you know, I knew, I just knew, you know, what was, like I said, I was always into the future, man. I was padding my pockets when I was, when I was young, I'm like, I, I need what, if I could perfect my craft and make it there and this all I gotta do, what I'm doing out here in the neighborhood every day? I could live a good life, man. So like I said, I was really into the future in terms of, you know, success and what I wanted it to look like and what I wanted it to look like for my family and, and my brother

• 12:54Speaker 04

  and, you know, how we, me and my brother used to stay up late just talking, you know what I mean? Like he was four years younger, but I'm like, bro, man, you can both accomplish this. So we was just always, man, next level.

• 13:07Ryan Clark?

  He asked, why did you make it out? I want to ask how, right? Because those are two different things.

• 13:12Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 13:12Ryan Clark?

  You really spoke about the focus you had on the craft.

• 13:17Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 13:17Ryan Clark?

  How did that focus on your craft keep you from taking the wrong paths? Because we've seen, I've seen people be hyper focused on reaching a goal.

• 13:27Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 13:27Ryan Clark?

  And so they have the discipline when it comes to the sport or the career, but they don't necessarily have the discipline in their personal life.

• 13:35Speaker 04

  Right.

• 13:35Ryan Clark?

  So how did you keep those things separate to give yourself an opportunity to catch Frank Binger's eye?

• 13:40Speaker 04

  I, I will, to be honest, man, it was rough. You know, I was suspended a lot, you know, especially early, you know, second grade, you know, I think I got suspended like fourth grade, you know what I'm saying? So it was kind of like, it was up and down, but. When I got out of school, because I wasn't really, you know, super focused on being a great student. I didn't have that, like, my mom was preaching it on us, but I just didn't, you know, I didn't really take to it. You know, I just felt like when I stepped away from school, football was everything. And so I put all my energy into that, and I'm like, you know, my coach used to come pick me up on Saturdays,

• 14:22Speaker 04

  take me to throw through the tire, I'd be dragging, mad as hell. Yo, I don't, this, I don't want, you know what I mean, like, I don't want, I want to sleep in, I want to watch, get up and watch whatever show about the college football. He got me working, so as far as the craft, like, I was working on it. Two, two other guys used to come with us, my friends, and, uh, you know, I remember one, one guy, I won't say their names, but complained about his arm was hurting. And the other one was trying, but he just lost interest. But me, I just kept, I, I'm like, yo, I gotta hit that dude crossing. I'm throwing through that tire, I gotta hit him from this side. So I'm like, I'm going, coach, pick me up. Sooner or later, it was just me. Wow.

• 15:06Speaker 04

  But I'm like, into the future, though. Like, yo, damn, man, like, if, if I can continue to do this and be great, I'm pretty sure John Elway doing this, you know what I'm saying, my idol, Steve Young, I'm pretty sure they doing the same, no, they did, they probably did this when they was, when they was young. So I just had a little perspective, and I was just kind of riding it out.

• 15:24Channing Crowder?

  Bro, when did you know you were a generational talent? Like, when did you know, you talking about that, like, you throwing, and it's funny, because you using your left arm. And most of us use our right arm when we talk about stories, so you using your left arm, bro.

• 15:37Speaker 04

  It's because he's left-handed.

• 15:38Channing Crowder?

  I know he's left-handed, but like, but, yeah, it is, that's weird, I, I hate left-handed people.

• 15:44Speaker 04

  It used to be, it used to be a deformity. I'm right with my right hand, so technically, I don't know what I am.

• 15:49Channing Crowder?

  But, yeah, even, we, we were drinking, we, we was hanging out the other day, and you were drinking with your left hand, and I, I want to punch you in your mouth.

• 15:58Speaker 04

  You know, like the Michael Vick experience? Yeah. Has never happened again. I didn't know. I didn't know, man. I didn't know. When I came into the league, it was like, is this sustainable? Yes. So I'm, I'm reading articles. I'm paying attention because you know, you gotta pay attention to the scrutiny and how, you know, how it's all, how the chips falling because I'm like, I wanna, I wanna do this right. Can this last? Should he continue to run? Should he continue to be? And I'm like, man, all this, man, I'm picking up first downs. We winning games, basically. We winning games. There you go. But it's all this circulating and I'm like, man, you know what? I'm just telling him, I'm just gonna play my game.

• 16:42Speaker 04

  If I throw it, I gotta, if I gotta throw it, I gotta throw it. If I gotta pass it, I gotta, if I gotta pass it, I'm running, I'mma run it. That's what it's gonna be. Whatever is wired that day, whatever's, whatever I'm feeling, you know what I'm saying, internally and, and so, you know, I continue to learn the game, you know, got introduced to some new offenses, which was good because it helped me. You see certain things and then you just gotta match it up. But I was like, man, you know, I'm just gonna be me, man. I don't know what that mean, but it might've turned into a generational type of talent, you know, phrase or saying, but I couldn't see it because I was struggling with the perception of my game. Like, I hated coming to a stadium like, bam, man, you know,

• 17:26Speaker 04

  if I don't run, if I don't run it enough, I ain't being myself. If I'm passing it too much, they're like, you trying to be a pocket passer. But for the greater good, the game is in a great space now because I made the decision like, yo, man, it's gonna be, Bobby Bellin said, he was like, it's gonna be more quarterbacks like Mike Vick, you know, after the championship game. And I never forgot that. And I was, it, it was always like a reference, something I drew back on and I was.

• 17:50Speaker 04

  Bobby Bowden said that.

• 17:52Channing Crowder?

  Right.

• 17:53Speaker 04

  Might as well do it. Now, my man said generational type of time. I'll take that though.

• 17:57Channing Crowder?

  I'm just saying, bro, at some point you had to know you were special.

• 18:00Speaker 04

  Oh, I knew I was special in college.

• 18:02Channing Crowder?

  No, I'm just saying at the point that you knew you were Mike Vick, like people like

• 18:06Speaker 04

  Well, I said in college.

• 18:07Channing Crowder?

  Kids reference you. Everybody reference you now.

• 18:10Speaker 04

  In college, I used to do some things in practice, bro, that like if we pulled that tape out, y'all wouldn't believe what y'all was seeing, but, because I couldn't believe it's half of the time.

• 18:18Channing Crowder?

  Shit, we.

• 18:19Speaker 04

  But yeah, but I was like, you know, I was always like, man, is this gonna translate to the pros? Like, they gonna be faster, you know, stronger, you know, linebackers running on four or fives, you know what I mean? Boy, hey, I just kept, I just kept going, just kept at it, man.

• 18:34Fred Taylor?

  Right. You, you mentioned that Steve Young was the one quarterback you looked up to.

• 18:38Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 18:39Fred Taylor?

  There are also some other really good black quarterbacks in the game, you know, coming up during your time.

• 18:45Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 18:46Fred Taylor?

  Was the correlation to Steve Young that he was a lefty in that?

• 18:49Speaker 04

  Yeah, Steve's a lefty and I, one number eight. San Francisco was my favorite team. It's a great question, because, you know, a lot of people, I get that all the time. People like, why not Warren Moon or why not Cunningham?

• 18:59Fred Taylor?

  Mm-hmm.

• 19:00Speaker 04

  But when I was in the backyard, and as I'm into the future,

• 19:06Speaker 04

  it's, I'm throwing it and scrambling.

• 19:08Fred Taylor?

  Right.

• 19:09Speaker 04

  So I'm, so all I see is Steve. I'm like, Steve, like Steve broke a long run against Minnesota, if y'all can recall.

• 19:15Channing Crowder?

  I do.

• 19:16Speaker 04

  And I was like.

• 19:17Channing Crowder?

  We did the same thing.

• 19:17Speaker 04

  Yo, he ain't just do that first of all, you know, it's a white quarterback running like that. This is my favorite team, but he was replacing Joe Montana, so I really won't fill in it. Because, you know, I was a big Joe Montana fan, obviously being a 49ers fan. Warren, I used to, I used to root for him hard, and then Philly, that was my uncle's favorite team, so they got a lot of airtime in the career too.

• 19:41Ryan Clark?

  You know, fast forward that to 2004, I think it was, second in MVP voting, obviously a Pro Bowler, but before that, there is the run against Minnesota, something you had in common with Steve Young, and he actually.

• 19:59Ryan Clark?

  Was asked about that on TV.

• 20:02Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 20:02Ryan Clark?

  And he said that you were changing the game and were a Hall of Fame. Talent. And as soon as you said it was that he was your favorite player, I knew exactly why. It's so funny and I know people are always like, don't bring race into everything, but we started the conversation. I make the joke that Steve Young was the first black quarterback. In the sense of the way that he played the game.

• 20:23Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 20:24Ryan Clark?

  Right? The way that Steve Young played the game was thought to not be able to transcend from a college to the pros.

• 20:30Speaker 04

  Right.

• 20:30Ryan Clark?

  Corey Moore.

• 20:32Speaker 04

  Corey Moore.

• 20:32Ryan Clark?

  Who you played with, a hell of a rush in.

• 20:35Speaker 04

  Yeah, great leader, too. Great man.

• 20:37Ryan Clark?

  He said, one week, you were supposed to be Donovan McNabb at practice.

• 20:41Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 20:41Ryan Clark?

  And he said, when you were being Donovan McNabb at practice, he said, nah, because Donovan McNabb ain't that good.

• 20:47Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 20:47Ryan Clark?

  When you look back at your time at Virginia Tech, that red shirt year where you are becoming Michael Vick, what was that time in your life like?

• 20:56Speaker 04

  It was special because, you know, I really got to a point, I had a dark, really, really dark place when I was in college, man, because just learning the offense, I didn't come from, you know, offense in high school where, you know, intricacies. And I'm, you know, you gotta learn a lot, man. Crowd adjustments, blitzes, defense, shot, you know, the play clock, formations, signals, there's a lot going on. I'm like, man, it was just, it was overwhelming. You know, my coach just kept saying, keep coming to the meetings, keep trying to, you know, just keep working at it. And, and so Corey Moore, scout team, like is where I, you know, one day it just clicked, like, you know, single high, two high, all that. And I went and tried it on the scout team.

• 21:39Speaker 04

  So I'm going against Corey Moore in there, but now I'm on the scout team knowing exactly what I'm doing. You know, running the other, the opposition plays. But now I know what I'm doing. Single high, I'm hitting outs, cover two, I'm working down the middle, down the seams. And I'm remembering their stuff. And so that's why Corey referenced that, but I just knew like, okay. And this, you know, this is for, you know, any young quarterback who was running a scout team. That's where you can learn and perfect your craft.

• 22:10Speaker 04

  Doing them dirty every day. Win scout team player of the week two weeks in a row. I'm like, man, I got something. Now, all I gotta do is really like learn what the deep, learn our offense. It's because I mastered the defense. I think part of, you know, what was so confusing about everything is that, man, I'm still trying to think about our offense, but I'm trying to learn what the defense doing too. So if you can't ma, you gotta, it take time to pad it up. And so, once I finally, you know, it was finally in sync, I was like, man, this game can't be this easy.

• 22:43Ryan Clark?

  It's actually not.

• 22:45Speaker 04

  I'm serious. I was like, hold on. If all I gotta do in the moment is do that, oh, man, my mind was hit 10 years ago.

• 22:56Ryan Clark?

  You, you get to, you get to that point. You're the number one overall draft pick in Atlanta. It's the, it's the perfect marriage, Mike.

• 23:05Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 23:06Ryan Clark?

  You know, it's, it's a city that is full of African-American people.

• 23:10Speaker 04

  Yep.

• 23:11Ryan Clark?

  It's a team that they love and you bring what turned into a cultural icon.

• 23:17Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 23:18Ryan Clark?

  As far as what you were able to do on the football field and the way that you did it.

• 23:23Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 23:24Ryan Clark?

  Your time in Atlanta and becoming a guy who was good enough or popular enough to be on the cover of Madden, what do you remember most about that?

• 23:33Speaker 04

  I remember starting with the draft, just the night before the draft. Supposed to go to San Diego on the night. It was before the draft. It was a trade. They make the trade, I'm like, it's gonna be really cool, you know, when I get this, probably save a lot of money, you know, it's not, you know what I'm saying, transporting the family back and forth, commuting them back and forth from Virginia to San Diego. And they'll be, they'll be close to me, they can see me play. That was a plus. And then, you know, I thought about the city and the culture and I'm like, all right, you know, Deion Sanders just left and they need a spark. Thought about that, you know, plus two.

• 24:12Speaker 04

  Then I thought about the negatives, pros and cons. Can't be a bust, you know, you gonna hurt, it's too close to home. Not a really, really good, not a good team. Because, you know, they was transitioning, you know, just went to the Super Bowl and I'm like, damn, more pressure. But I'm like, man, I should have known that this was, it was gonna be more pressure on draft day. And so, you know, I think I went in with a premise of just not being a disappointment, man, and, and wanna turn it around, you know, and I'm green, I don't really know where to take. I gotta come in, I'm starting from ground zero, I'm starting fresh.

• 24:55Speaker 04

  You know, just learn from Chris Chandler, finally got, he played a little bit as a rookie, but my confidence was down because I, um, I didn't have a lot of success. Brian Urlacher and the boys, they beat, what, Mike Brown, the safety Mike Brown?

• 25:08Channing Crowder?

  Mike Brown, played for Nebraska.

• 25:09Speaker 04

  Man, you had a run, he had like a little five or six year run. Man, I'm talking about, beat me down, and that, I'm talking, killed my confidence, I walked off, I felt dis, I felt small.

• 25:18Channing Crowder?

  Right.

• 25:19Speaker 04

  Oh, man, I'm questioning, I can't do this, but you know, you gotta keep working at it, you gotta fall, you know, you know, I know how it is, you gotta, that Mike gotta come and knock you down one time, if he can knock you down, he was a little bigger, but, you know what I'm saying, you know? But you gotta learn from the, you know, from the mistakes and, you know, overcome the little, the nuances and, man, once I figured out the offense by week 15 of my rookie year, went out against, went out against Miami, had a great game, and then played against the greatest on turf, week 16, and, and pretty much had a good day in a loss, and it was enough for them to see, all right, he's ready. And from there, 2002, came back there next year, man, and just was really, really calm, felt like I, I felt at Virginia Tech.

• 26:03Channing Crowder?

  What could you do in the difference? Like, what, what could you do if you could talk to that, that young Mike, that drafted Mike? Because you was, you was a bad man, but you had to take that time to figure it out.

• 26:16Speaker 04

  Yeah, I think, um, any quarterback, you gotta spend more time around the building than anybody. And a lot of times, you know, I was flying back to Virginia. You know, I'm a mama's boy, man, straight up. So I miss my mom, I miss my sisters. I was still a little homesick in college. I was still kind of like, everything happened so fast. I was, I felt like I was just in a transitioning phase and tired. So I was just always going back home and then, you know, for, you know, a lot of times not for the right reasons. And so all that time I spent away was the time I could have been, you know what I'm saying, with that collective, you know what I'm saying? Going through that defense. Oh, they blitz, oh, they, just ahead of the curve. I feel like every quarterback got to stay ahead of the curve.

• 26:59Speaker 04

  You get in on Wednesday, you go game plan with the coaches. Find out what the game plan is, you know what I'm saying? Talk to them, don't let, just let them send the game plan to you. That only work when you got a great offensive coach, like an Andy Reid or somebody like, you could just, you know what's coming in, it's gonna be dialed up. But I think that just, I slowed down my learning curve. Success happened quickly because I, you know, using my legs and I had an advantage. So overcome, it overcame some of the, you know what I'm saying, some of the things that I probably didn't do so well, I needed to grow at.

• 27:34Ryan Clark?

  Right.

• 27:35Speaker 04

  So, yeah, man, it was, and I knew it too. That's crazy part, consciously, I was like, man, how much longer I'm gonna be able to get away with this? But every year I'm getting away with it. Every year I'm inching close to a thousand yards.

• 27:47Ryan Clark?

  Right.

• 27:48Speaker 04

  I'm like, okay, the milestone's still coming, I ain't tripping.

• 27:51Ryan Clark?

  Yeah.

• 27:52Speaker 04

  And then I got with Bobby Petrino. He came in after Jim Moore got fired. And he really taught me a little bit more about the passing. I was really serious in that 2007 season. And this is after all the Madden stuff and everything, I had my own shoes, like I, you know, I had everything I wanted in football, but I just ain't had that hardware. So I was like, man, okay, it's time to chase that. The old seven season was about to be crazy, I just never made it, made it to. You was in Pittsburgh, 2005?

• 28:21Ryan Clark?

  We played, we played in 06, in the dome.

• 28:24Speaker 04

  Yeah, I was, I was going to sleep the other night while trying to go to sleep, and I was just kind of going through the channels and the game was on.

• 28:31Ryan Clark?

  I don't know if you remember this, my favorite play of that year, we were in fire zone, Troy was in the hook.

• 28:37Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 28:38Ryan Clark?

  And you were, and you scrambled.

• 28:39Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 28:40Ryan Clark?

  And both of them, both of them other effers took off, Chan, and I stopped playing. Bruh, I stopped playing.

• 28:47Channing Crowder?

  I see.

• 28:47Ryan Clark?

  Cause they was flying.

• 28:49Channing Crowder?

  You heard my Vic story?

• 28:52Ryan Clark?

  Uh-uh.

• 28:53Channing Crowder?

  They put me as the spy on this motherfucker in Miami. Alvin Crumpler was there.

• 28:58Speaker 04

  Oh yeah, I think I went for 300 that day passing.

• 29:01Channing Crowder?

  You and Alvin, you and Alvin, Alvin had like two or three that game.

• 29:06Speaker 04

  Y'all tried to hit me with a cover zero down in the red zone.

• 29:08Channing Crowder?

  We tried to zero.

• 29:10Ryan Clark?

  It's crazy as football players.

• 29:11Channing Crowder?

  Zing, zing.

• 29:12Speaker 04

  It was sweet, fellas.

• 29:13Channing Crowder?

  They put me on the 40 yard line. It's crazy. I can get going. We were going south. Y'all offense was going south and they had me as the spy.

• 29:22Speaker 04

  I don't know which way that was, Chaney, or something.

• 29:24Channing Crowder?

  It's okay. You going, you going right from the visitor sideline. And your ass, your ass took off and I was the spy. And I was deep, I was 15 yards away from you. And you ran right and I took off running left. And then you ran right and you, I was, and I went to the sideline and cut the DC out.

• 29:45Speaker 04

  That was in my heyday.

• 29:46Channing Crowder?

  I said, Coach, this motherfucker is fast.

• 29:50Speaker 04

  You know what's so crazy?

• 29:51Channing Crowder?

  I said, do not spy me anymore. It was Jeremiah Bill was the safety. I said, spy Jeremiah, let me cover the tight end because I don't want to chase this dude around no more.

• 29:58Speaker 04

  Yeah, I know, I feel you. I mean.

• 30:02Speaker 04

  I'm being real. It's funny, like when I watched me in Philadelphia and watched me in Atlanta. I see so much of a big difference from what that two years off did to me. I mean, I came back a better passer. You know, a more, you know, knowledgeable and cerebral quarterback. Like I'm trying to, you know, it's different, you know, different tiers to the West Coast system. And he was just leveled up.

• 30:57Speaker 05

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• 31:28Speaker 04

  And so I was like, I mean, I don't know if, yeah, but I definitely lost a little speed, man. So you just caught me at a bad time. I said, I'll let this happen.

• 31:36Fred Taylor?

  Even with that, a couple of things jumped out. I'm just sitting here listening and admiring everything. First of all, Channing, when we started, you say you were 452. He's a 433, I believe, right? Coming out in '01?

• 31:47Channing Crowder?

  I took a bad angle because when he took off, I had his way. I should have, I should have headed towards the locker room. I had the baseline.

• 31:57Speaker 04

  I wasn't, I wasn't as, I didn't have long speed. I had like bursts. Yeah, I just had the bursts. I get from here to there in like a split second, but you can walk me down if we gotta go, you know?

• 32:08Fred Taylor?

  So it was, it was.

• 32:09Channing Crowder?

  I'm never, I'm never gonna walk you down.

• 32:11Fred Taylor?

  No, you wouldn't. It was the speed that stood out, obviously. You mentioned Bobby Petrino. Bobby coached Lamar at Louisville. Bobby coached Lamar, which is crazy now that I'm sitting here thinking about, he had an opportunity to coach two of the most electric quarterbacks that the NFL game has ever seen.

• 32:29Speaker 04

  At the end of that season, well, the season, I've never made it through the season. At the end of the training camp, I can, I was already in the future in that season. It was gonna be some great things, but Hugh Jackson was our offensive coordinator. He was like, you know, he'll be the MVP next year. After OTA's mini camps, I had that type of camp, but that's the system Lamar ran in college is a really good system. And I'm surprised Bobby Petrino didn't try to become a coordinator.

• 32:58Fred Taylor?

  Well, he was an OC in Jacksonville.

• 33:00Speaker 04

  But he did great with a lot of quarterbacks. And I was kinda, he was the first coach that ever really like screaming at me like at the top of his lungs. I don't know. I think that's something they must have talked about, like you're a new coach, you need to chastise Mike in front of everybody. And one day he was just like, what the fuck, what are you doing here? And I was, he's like, I was, and but what he did was.

• 33:24Speaker 04

  Man, it got me on my Ps and Qs. It made me respect him even more. He did that in front of everybody. And I was always good at taking criticism. Like, I felt like one of my best attributes in college was, like, I had a coach that all he did was, "Yeah, I love him to this day, man." Like, love him to death. Brett, Ricky Bustle. And, man, he was just in I A every day. But I, you know, I heard what I needed to hear. You know what I'm saying? I think we gotta be like that sometimes. So, when he did that, man, it really kinda like, it sparked something in me, man, and just triggered another level.

• 33:57Ryan Clark?

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• 34:13Channing Crowder?

  And y'all know I love the same-game parlays. Y'all know what I do, the same-game parlays. Bet on the team, bet on the over, the under, whatever you think's gonna happen. But also, the no-sweat bets. So even with the parlays, no sweat. When you lose that, you get a bonus bet right then. If you lose, hey, y'all are set.

• 34:31Fred Taylor?

  Chan, I've been on those no-sweat bets too, brother. But listen, get the app, get your phone, download the app today. Do like me, you can even put the sportsbook right next to the daily fantasy. So if you're not in a place where they have the sportsbook, just pull out and play the daily fantasy. Same great game.

• 34:48Ryan Clark?

  Like he said, download the DraftKings Sportsbook app. Any new customer signing up right now, you place a $5 bet, you instantly get $150 in bonus bets. Use the promo code PIVOT.

• 35:00Fred Taylor?

  Mike, you're a cultural icon, right? And the time you went to Atlanta, the hip-hop scene in the South was just going here. Like, you got the likes of Jeezy, obviously, you was probably sitting in the club across from BMF a couple nights. You got Jermaine Dupri, Gucci Mane, all of the guys. What were those, what were the TI, what were those moments like, being as big as some of the biggest entertainers in the world? Here you are, sitting there, a young guy, sitting there across from him, same party, same everything.

• 35:34Speaker 04

  Starstruck in a lot of ways. You know, a lot of those guys, I had their tapes, I had their music, I listened to them in college, I listened to them before games, and then actually be in that city where it's like a mecca for... Hip hop, you know, it was, uh, it was really cool. Cause you know, you get to see him perform. They want you to come hang out with him. You go hang out for a night. You see, man, they just, they cool, just like us. It's a lot of camaraderie, you know what I'm saying? It's a lot of, you know what I'm saying? Like, you know, fellowship and, you know, they, we all took care of one another. If I'm having something, you know, you more than welcome to come. You know what I mean? We get invited to each other's events and just that time was special. Cause it, it helped us on the field too. Like the, the Georgia almost like a concert.

• 36:17Ryan Clark?

  Yeah.

• 36:18Speaker 04

  That's what we called it. We called it a concert, like it was the game, but, uh, bro, that's where it was popping at. Like you can come and it's plethora of things going on. It's, you know what I mean?

• 36:28Ryan Clark?

  This is, uh, this, this show is- He said plethora.

• 36:33Ryan Clark?

  He's on TV now, it's ACT work. This is, this is the pivot, man. And we have real conversations. You mentioned to Channing, the years off took something away from you. But the hopes are, when you spend 548 days in Leavenworth, it also, it also adds something.

• 36:53Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 36:54Ryan Clark?

  What were those times like, man? Your freedom gone, not being able to do what you were best in the world at, at a time. During those moments, what were your thoughts?

• 37:08Speaker 04

  Yeah, it was like, man, damn, I hit, really hit the reset button. Now you playing a video game, you hit that reset, you go all the way back to the beginning. You can be all the way at the end of the game, start to finish it. I'm like, now I gotta get back into the future. But, you know, um, really difficult, you know, in the beginning, but, you know, grew stronger each and every day. You know, had to reset the goals and all that too. And, um, it's funny, cause that's really where I learned decision making and how important it was. You know, I had, I knew I had a responsibility as a role model. Cause I'm like, damn, now I really realized what a role model really was about. I had a bunch of people telling me, including my judge, Henry Hudson, shout out to Henry Hudson.

• 37:51Speaker 04

  He knew I needed something, uh, in my life at the time. And he, as bad as he didn't want to sentence me to what he sentenced me to, he knew I needed it.

• 38:02Speaker 04

  You know what I'm saying? He knew I needed to be humble. You know what I'm saying? In a lot of different ways, man. People see me as a humble guy, but sometimes, you know, little money can make you think different. People perceive it different. It might not be like what I'm trying to portray, but they'll look at it and they'll say, oh, man, he's self-centered. You know, I learned decision-making. Reset the goals. And it was like, this time when I come out, man, I'm gonna be the best role model that I can be.

• 38:28Ryan Clark?

  You mentioned going to Atlanta instead of San Diego. And decision-making is sometimes a group effort.

• 38:36Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 38:36Ryan Clark?

  Right? Like, if you're around the right people?

• 38:39Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 38:40Ryan Clark?

  They'll help you in decision-making.

• 38:42Speaker 04

  Right.

• 38:42Ryan Clark?

  Right? If he loves me, and I truly love him, he could tell me when I'm wrong. He could tell me when I'm doing something that's not gonna benefit me.

• 38:50Speaker 04

  That's a boss. That's a boss.

• 38:51Ryan Clark?

  Yeah.

• 38:51Speaker 04

  And a boss and a boss.

• 38:52Ryan Clark?

  Yeah. How much was it of still being close to home and keeping people around you that may not necessarily had what was best for you in mind in the sense of, I'm gonna help Michael do the right things and get to the right position?

• 39:07Speaker 04

  Yeah. I think definitely being close to home probably was a detriment. You know, now that I think back on it, I think we probably would have not had so much access to... 'cause now I'm a million miles away from home, and now I could just focus on, you know, being the best that I... It ain't no back and forth, you know? And so, you know, I always looked at it as, we're a group that's gonna grow. We should grow together. Obviously, the decision-making, as you make the decisions together, it's like, somebody gotta step up. And ironically, people stepped up. But it was because I, you know, I was like, you know, in a superior position. Nah, man, I got it. Nah, it's good.

• 39:49Ryan Clark?

  Yeah.

• 39:50Speaker 04

  You know what I'm saying? So now I'm brushing them off. Like, real talk, I'm brushing them off. Hey, yo, I got it. And they like, all they can do is probably just drop the hair, like, damn, I told, bro.

• 39:58Ryan Clark?

  Damn.

• 39:58Speaker 04

  You know what I'm saying? So realistically...

• 40:02Speaker 04

  I was getting some, I was getting the advice, not using it correctly. And thinking this money, you know what I mean, money to solve all the problems, but, you know.

• 40:13Speaker 04

  It only made it worse, so, you know, I had to reevaluate even the value of a dollar, man.

• 40:19Channing Crowder?

  Right.

• 40:19Speaker 04

  After going through everything I went through, paying back a lot of money. Like, damn, very unfortunate.

• 40:27Channing Crowder?

  Right.

• 40:27Speaker 04

  Unfortunately, you just look at your family, you just gotta apologize, man. Mom should have listened, my mom told me plenty of times like that. You know how moms tell you that?

• 40:35Channing Crowder?

  Yeah.

• 40:36Speaker 04

  Think you're wrong, you think you know everything?

• 40:37Channing Crowder?

  Yeah. With that situation, the whole dog thing, and everybody know the story, you talked about it a number of times. Bruh, do you, do you resent anyone from that situation? Because like, bruh, that was a Hall of Fame career derailed.

• 40:51Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 40:52Channing Crowder?

  Bruh, everybody loved you, like, you were football, you were the face of football. Do you still, at this day, what you, forty-three?

• 40:59Speaker 04

  Forty-three.

• 40:59Channing Crowder?

  Do you resent anybody from that situation?

• 41:02Speaker 04

  Nobody, nobody, because I made this, I made a lot of decisions, you know what I'm saying? I resent what I did, I take responsibility for my actions. Random thought the other day, I'm just laying down, trying to take a nap to go to sleep. You know, I used to get random thoughts, this is a random thought, oh, Hall of Fame, what you think? Like, to myself.

• 41:20Channing Crowder?

  Yeah.

• 41:20Speaker 04

  Ah, nah, this ain't happening, this ain't happening, that ain't happening. Possibility. Man, if you wouldn't have had those two years off.

• 41:32Channing Crowder?

  Yep.

• 41:33Speaker 04

  I'm gonna kill your ass to sleep.

• 41:36Speaker 04

  Stop thinking, stop thinking. Positive energy.

• 41:40Channing Crowder?

  Yeah.

• 41:41Speaker 04

  You know what I'm saying? So I gotta consistently reinforce that on myself, cuz, you know, I mean, I lived through some things that, you know, a lot of people don't live through. And, like you say, round us five hundred and forty-eight days, it was a long time.

• 41:55Channing Crowder?

  Yeah.

• 41:56Speaker 04

  And so, you know, naturally, for, from a mental health standpoint, you know, I gotta stay positive, I gotta stay encouraged, I gotta always, you know.

• 42:09Speaker 04

  Just uplift myself, you know, because I got to deal with certain, a lot of things that people don't have to deal with neither, even on a, you know, successful level.

• 42:17Ryan Clark?

  Mm-hmm.

• 42:18Speaker 04

  You know, still get it, I still get it sometimes. It ain't go, I mean, I can't say it don't go away, I just try to, you know, always be conscious of it, oh, this ain't happening probably because of that, or these people don't think this because of that.

• 42:31Ryan Clark?

  Friday Fred said that on the show, he was talking, we were talking about Deshaun Watson, and I don't want to compare the two situations, but I don't know, you could probably speak to it more Fred, but you mentioned that those things, once people have that perception of you, or believe a certain thing about you, they never allow that to go away.

• 42:51Fred Taylor?

  Yeah, no, that's very true, it'll follow you for a while, but I think in your case, Mike, we know the obstacles that you face, you know, and those adversities, we've seen that you're very, you've been very resilient, you know, you're even on TV and you're doing a whole lot of stuff, but what are, what are your determinations, you know, and what are your goals going forward? What do you try to do, not that you're out to prove to anybody that I gotta save face and be this type of person, but you yourself specifically as an individual, what are some of the things that you're trying to achieve to prove to you that you are a better person?

• 43:30Speaker 04

  Yeah, well, I think for me, it started at home, man, within the family, you know, my wife, and trying to be the best husband that I could be, communicate with her, give her, you know, time to be great within the household, my kids, who every day, you know, I feel like they, they take my advice, because I'm, you know, I try to be as fair as a father as I can be, so that's really important, so I think it started right there. If I come out the house and I ain't happy with something that's going on inside the house. Then I'm already a wreck. I know in my household, as y'all probably know, you know, in your household, you like, we dictate the energy. You know what I'm saying?

• 44:15Speaker 04

  We the alpha. Sometimes we gotta cater to everybody else's feelings and kind of.

• 44:22Ryan Clark?

  That's the job.

• 44:22Speaker 04

  We gotta simmer the mood, yeah, we gotta be.

• 44:24Ryan Clark?

  That's the job.

• 44:24Speaker 04

  It's really being the man of the house.

• 44:27Ryan Clark?

  Yeah.

• 44:28Speaker 04

  Daddy, I appreciate, you know, you listening or appreciate you talking to me or, you know, not blowing up when you, when you felt like you was right or knew you was right or whether I was right or wrong, you know. Thanks for taking into consideration my thoughts. I started off with that and then, you know, just from career goals, I'm still young. It's a lot I want to accomplish. I always want to, you know, be the best analyst that I can be. You know, keep working at that and, you know, hopefully, you know, at some point lead a lot of young men.

• 45:01Ryan Clark?

  Yeah.

• 45:02Speaker 04

  If it comes to it and, you know, I've been asked about it, you know, coaching and would I ever do it? You know, probably will at some point.

• 45:12Channing Crowder?

  How you gonna coach somebody to do what you did?

• 45:15Speaker 04

  It's easy. You hear me say the game is easy earlier?

• 45:19Channing Crowder?

  It's exactly what you. And you gonna tell a young man, Vic, just tell him, you gonna tell him, okay, well, go Duke out six more.

• 45:26Speaker 04

  I said it earlier, I said the game is easy.

• 45:29Channing Crowder?

  You can't teach nobody what you did.

• 45:31Speaker 04

  Well, I can't expect nobody to be like me. I want them to be better than me. I want him in that film room.

• 45:37Ryan Clark?

  Yeah.

• 45:38Speaker 04

  Studying when I'm, you know, when I'm handling some other business. I want to be able to come to him and hit him, Andy Reid used to hit us with questions random. Hey, you seen this look, you seen this look, what's you? Oh, you better be on, you better be quick to answer. Have the right answer. I got some good ethics.

• 45:52Ryan Clark?

  Yeah, I got a question about that. During those days, Tony Dungy becomes a confidant.

• 45:59Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 45:59Ryan Clark?

  And a mentor, someone you spoke with and talked to. And Andy Reid actually called Tony to ask him about you. Ask him, did he think you'd learned? Ask him what type of human you were. And Tony Dungy, who is a man that tells the truth, but also shows compassion, said, no, I believe Mike has grown.

• 46:18Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 46:19Ryan Clark?

  And Andy, because he had dealt with some things with his sons. Wanted to have a conversation with you, wanted to give you a second chance. You know, you mentioned him being a genius or him coming to you with questions. But what do those two men mean to you? What do Andy Reid and Tony Dungy mean to you? Because in order for you to have these goals and things you want to accomplish now, you had to have somebody give you a second chance.

• 46:44Speaker 04

  Yeah, well, it started with Tony Dungy coming and visiting me when I was in Leavenworth. And you talking about a man sitting across from you, just ask you the questions that, trying to get the answers, looking you straight in your eyes. I'm talking about not even blinking, he want to know, like, is this sincere? And I'm like, but I was, I had already rehearsed it. Once again, I was in the future. So when it was time to recite whatever I was, you know, thinking, it was easy. I mean, first of all, I was, I had to thank him for being there. I was like, you didn't have to come. But yes, all of these things. He left out, he felt like I was contrite. And, you know, I guess he had his conversations with, you know, Roger and then Andy.

• 47:28Speaker 04

  And Andy, you know, he felt like I could come in and, you know, learn. He wanted to see me learn from my mistakes. He wanted to see me become a leader of young men. The locker room was younger. It's like, this, this your locker room, along with Donovan. And, you know, Donovan was a big inspiration and a big part of me coming to Philadelphia. So I got to thank Donovan. He co-signed it too. And so Tony and Andy created a really, really comfortable situation and Roger. And so now I got three men that I feel, I hold myself accountable in all aspects of life because I know they watching.

• 48:09Speaker 04

  When I walked out that room, from the first meeting with Roger, Tony, Andy, when I walked out, the biggest word I could take away from anything that they said, accountability. You know what I'm saying? Right now, I'm gonna give. And it wasn't always, it was, it was, it was hard for me too because I was still young and I'm still, you know, I'm still transitioning back into. And I just never forget Roger told me, man, look, man, whatever you doing, man, just know, don't nothing good happen after 12 o'clock. Slam the door.

• 48:43Channing Crowder?

  That time in, in, in prison, jail, I don't know what you call it. Bro, what was that like? Because you went from the top of the world to sitting in a goddamn cell.

• 48:55Speaker 04

  Very uncomfortable, man. It was very uncomfortable.

• 49:01Speaker 04

  Like I say,

• 49:03Speaker 04

  I'm never gonna glorify it.

• 49:06Speaker 04

  You know,

• 49:08Speaker 04

  it's really confusing because I, like I say, I learned decision making life. I don't want this to be interpreted in the way where kids think like, oh, it's, you know, that's some time, it's, it's a little time out, time to get yourself together. No, it's wasted time, like, it's wasted time.

• 49:22Channing Crowder?

  Yep.

• 49:23Speaker 04

  For real, it's boredom, around a bunch of dudes. And,

• 49:29Speaker 04

  you know, man, if I wanted to learn to play chess and dominoes, man, I'd drove myself, man, you go crazy in there. So, you know, I mean, you gotta find a way to a- adjust. But, man, it's, I spent a lot of time in like isolation because I couldn't be around other inmates. So, you know, I was, I don't know if it affected my mental health back then. I wouldn't say now because I feel like I grew from it, you know what I'm saying? But it's still a part of my life that I, this is a lot of self time. So, you know, I was, obviously sitting there just like really not, not believing that I was in that situation. You know what I'm saying? So, a lot of times I had to look at myself and, man, it's real when you look yourself in the mirror, you see that reflection and you know who you are.

• 50:14Speaker 04

  You look at yourself and you see that reflection, you got a jumpsuit or a black and white shirt. You're like, I'm a prisoner, bro.

• 50:20Channing Crowder?

  Yeah.

• 50:20Speaker 04

  Nah, this ain't me. Like nah, this ain't me. You gotta tell yourself, nah, this ain't me. I'm just. I still hit the Air Force Ones on with the suit though. We sold them on the commissary.

• 50:34Ryan Clark?

  That's what Big Cuz played football in. Aaron Brooks played football in New Orleans in high top Air Force Ones.

• 50:40Speaker 04

  Oh yeah, you remember that on the turf.

• 50:42Ryan Clark?

  On the turf.

• 50:42Speaker 04

  Bro was talking about that yesterday. It made it look good too.

• 50:45Ryan Clark?

  On the turf.

• 50:45Speaker 04

  It looked good.

• 50:46Ryan Clark?

  I'm from the end though.

• 50:46Speaker 04

  I don't know about the ankle support, but.

• 50:50Speaker 04

  Cuz pulled it off.

• 50:51Fred Taylor?

  Yeah, him and Rasheed Wallace.

• 50:53Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 50:53Fred Taylor?

  Rasheed was the same way on the court. But much like all big fans around the world, man, I sympathize with that entire situation. And I can only imagine how tough it was, but I wanted to ask you though, because it was your experience. What was tougher? You sitting down for that 548? Forty-eight days? Or the redemption tour, coming out, you know, trying to redeem yourself, trying to show people that I am, I have matured, I have grown. I am a better person, yet at the same time, time hearing fans, you know, leaving the stadium with your family, hearing fans. Dog this, that, you know, calling names, slanderous terms and all that. What was toughest?

• 51:35Speaker 04

  Real life is.

• 51:36Fred Taylor?

  The moment you were sitting down or trying to get back everything that you lost?

• 51:40Speaker 04

  Man, that might be the question of the year, man. That's a great question. All y'all ask good questions. I love good questions. But that one right there. I never even thought about it until just hearing you say it now. And you know. The 548 days was easy compared to the comeback campaign.

• 52:03Speaker 00

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• 53:02Speaker 04

  And I said all that to say, man, you know, it's noise. First of all, you know, you got these people who really loud and they believe in what they believe in. I gotta learn to respect it as much as we might not like it or think it's not, you know, right. Or they got every right to feel the way they feel. I had to learn that and not be, you know what I'm saying? So rebellious, you know, against it.

• 53:28Speaker 04

  Knowing that I, you know, I had to make amends. And so it's like, what's that path like? So I had to go on that path. How do I get back into the league? You know what I'm saying? I filed for bankruptcy. Had to pay the Falcons back all their money. So that forced me into a bankruptcy. Starting from the bottom, man.

• 53:45Ryan Clark?

  Yeah.

• 53:45Speaker 04

  You know what I'm saying? Starting from the bottom to more getting out, man, like $0 in my bank account.

• 53:52Speaker 04

  Me and my wife just looked at each other and just laughing. We checked the balance on the account. We couldn't even, man, bro, it was funny. It's like, man, don't get no worse than this.

• 54:00Ryan Clark?

  It's different, though.

• 54:01Speaker 04

  You know what I'm saying?

• 54:02Ryan Clark?

  We all, we all started with $0, Mike. But we all didn't get $100 million contract and then go back to $0.

• 54:11Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 54:11Ryan Clark?

  And, you know, yeah, you might chuckle about it with your wife, but the, the reality of that had to be difficult for you.

• 54:20Speaker 04

  Oh, man. And then, you know, I had people in my corner. Like, T.I., instantly wired me some bread. Like, you know what I'm saying? Helped me out. I knew I had some things going on. Big bro, once again. Homeless from the South.

• 54:36Speaker 04

  And um, yeah, man, I just, we all know what it's like to give up a lot to gain a lot and you gotta, you know what I'm saying? Set the goals and go get them. Like, we all in here got individual goals there. And we still striving. So, that, football, along with family, along with off the field and the comeback campaign, it's like when I had to tread lightly, stay free,

• 55:05Speaker 04

  you know, got all these eyes on me. And um, man, still going, still 29 years old.

• 55:12Ryan Clark?

  What about your 30th birthday party?

• 55:14Speaker 04

  Yeah, remember the 30th? Yeah, still young.

• 55:16Ryan Clark?

  Yeah.

• 55:17Speaker 04

  30th birthday party.

• 55:18Ryan Clark?

  Quanis Phillips, whoever gets shot.

• 55:20Speaker 04

  Yo, bro, yeah, bro, showed up, man, and he was just trying to have a good time. You know, you uh, you know, my wife, after the party, she like put some cake on my, yeah, she like, now you smear the cake, it's cute. Smear the cake, it was cute. She did it to me and my homie.

• 55:35Ryan Clark?

  Yeah.

• 55:36Speaker 04

  And it was real cool. And then uh, then bro came and did it and it was like,

• 55:42Speaker 04

  come on, bro, for real, like.

• 55:46Speaker 04

  One, you probably shouldn't even be here right now, and two, I guess it's a little over the top. She got away with it. She can get away with it. Like, yo, that was, it was a good laugh. But now, and then that escalated, and then people just, man, people was already mad, you know what I'm saying? So, everybody just

• 56:03Speaker 04

  like, man, we gotta put ourselves in better situations. And Roger told me, nothing good happens after 12. Here I am, having a birthday party after 12 o'clock, Cinderella moment. Nothing good happened that night. And I'm like, man, he, he told me straight up, man, this is it. Now, I remember calling Tony Dungy, I, I had um, a football camp the very next day. I'm doing the camp, football camp that weekend, amazing camp at Hampton University. I got about 400 kids out there. And we teaching all day, we going two days strong. And I, I'm over in the corner dealing with this. I'm like, man, it's just immature, that's why I say still 29, still learning, still, I'm back. Uh, he ain't back. It was just the beginning.

• 56:49Ryan Clark?

  What do you tell kids now? Good day, I mean.

• 56:53Ryan Clark?

  They won't, every kid you meet now will not, they will never know what it was like to watch you do all that live, right? Like, we have, and I'm just gonna be honest, we have so much grace for the things you went through because of how you made us feel. Like, I just remember watching the Sugar Bowl. You know, I'm from the N.O. I'm watching the Sugar Bowl and I'm like, "It's the best play I've ever seen in my life." Right? And when you have that feeling and when all of the news comes out about what you're going through, all, like, I'm so, at that moment, in my immature mind, I'm like, "Ain't nobody that's that damn good at football gonna do none of that."

• 57:33Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 57:34Ryan Clark?

  Right? But the kids don't know, they just know the story. They know that, "My dad says Michael Vick was this." It's like the Vince McMahon meme they got going around where they say, "Dad, what was it like to watch Michael Vick?"

• 57:45Speaker 04

  You know that face?

• 57:46Ryan Clark?

  You know what I mean? Like, that's what I felt like. When a kid asks you though, when they're like, "You know, Mr. Vick, what would be your advice to me?"

• 57:55Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 57:56Ryan Clark?

  What do you tell them?

• 57:57Speaker 04

  Listen to your parents, man, I think first, or your guardian, 'cause, you know, a lot of kids growing up in different situations, but, you know, your guardian or whoever it is is never gonna tell you anything wrong. Something that can, you know, cause some type of detriment in your life, I feel. You gotta trust people, you gotta trust those people, and dream too, man, like, I think everybody wanna make money quick these days and they want it, they want it easy. I gotta get on my kids about work ethic and the value of a dollar and what it really takes to go out and find your level of success.

• 58:40Speaker 04

  And so, you know, I always tell them to dream and, you know, think the unthinkable, 'cause that's what I did, and I can only draw off my personal experience, like, you know, when I was six years old, I told my grandmother I wanted to do something and I went and did it, but I didn't, I didn't know the road was gonna be like this, you know what I'm saying? Trajectory, you know what I mean? It was rigorous, it was rough, you know what I'm saying? It's like a plane, it was the turbulence, you know what I'm saying? The turbulence getting there was, was rough. And then all of a sudden, you know, I was cruising at altitude. But, man, I stressed school a lot too. Like, I could've been a better student. I know, looking back...

• 59:22Speaker 04

  I could apply myself a little more. I could have made the honor way more than what I did. I would have learned more and applied myself. So I tried to teach, man, be so many things like, if I had a kid who was a football player, he came to me and asked me that same question, we probably wouldn't even talk about football because I feel like football is easy. If you apply yourself to learn it, y'all know, it's mental, more mental than physical.

• 59:45Speaker 04

  Not really, but it's a balance. You know what I'm saying? You gotta know what you're doing in order to play fast.

• 59:50Ryan Clark?

  Yep.

• 59:51Speaker 04

  And so, you know, in life, man, you gotta, you gotta play, you can play fast, but you just gotta know what you're doing.

• 59:56Ryan Clark?

  Hey, man, it's the holidays, fam. And listen, I'm undrafted. You know what I mean? I ain't like Freddie T. I'm just, I'm just getting on this jewelry. I didn't fool around and fall on lightboxjewelry.com. I'm finna go crazy. They got them lab grown diamonds too? All right, when I come around here icy, don't say nothing to me.

• 1:00:15Channing Crowder?

  Everybody ain't like Fred T. with the chain on, but listen, you gotta go. You can get them layered, you can get all the options you want, and it is gonna be perfect for the holidays. Y'all need gifts? You gotta go to Lightbox.

• 1:00:30Speaker 04

  Listen, it's 2023. I'm going to give me some lab grown diamonds. I still got my hose in my ear. I need some of those diamond studs.

• 1:00:38Ryan Clark?

  I like it. Hey, listen, go to lightboxjewelry.com and use the promo code THEPIVOT to get 10% off site wide.

• 1:00:47Channing Crowder?

  Bruh, and I love you as a father, because I was just at Lil' Mike's birthday party. It was just bullshit the other night. And you have your daughter who's in college. You got to, all your kids are in there.

• 1:00:58Speaker 04

  She ain't listening right now.

• 1:00:59Channing Crowder?

  She ain't listening.

• 1:01:00Speaker 04

  Yeah, we go, yeah.

• 1:01:01Ryan Clark?

  We go, hey, I've been, I got a 24-year-old about to be 25. I get it.

• 1:01:06Speaker 04

  It's gonna come back, it's gonna come back around from what I hear.

• 1:01:08Channing Crowder?

  I met her boyfriend.

• 1:01:09Speaker 04

  Jada, we watching.

• 1:01:11Channing Crowder?

  I met her boyfriend. He seemed like a nice guy.

• 1:01:13Speaker 04

  Good dude.

• 1:01:14Channing Crowder?

  He a good dude. What do you say to your kids about that path? Like, we talking about your path and all, like, do the kids ask about it? Because Lil' Mike, what, he just turned six?

• 1:01:21Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:01:22Channing Crowder?

  But then you have grown kids. Like, what's, what's that like explaining the story of Michael Vick to your children?

• 1:01:29Speaker 04

  Yeah, well, I always find a way to reference something. You know, man, when I try not to talk about the prison part, but sometimes it do come out.

• 1:01:38Speaker 04

  Man, when I was, we used to do this. And they don't wanna hear that. They don't be wanting to hear them stories. Cause they, and then they, then they do be like, I mean, like times they be like, daddy, what was it like when, you know what I'm saying? They ask the same question. And I hate answering the question, but I try to, you know, spark them, put a little fear in them a little bit, you know what I'm saying? Even though they're good kids and, you know, put it in your memory bank and go tell your friends, you know what I'm saying? Spread the word. Yeah, it's not a good place. But they, they really understand it, man. They, they do their research too. They, they probably a little more tech savvy and good, a lot better than social media and stuff than me. So they probably, they see everything.

• 1:02:20Speaker 04

  That's another reason why I had to really like pay attention to my actions and what I was doing, you know, as, as a father, as a dad. Cause whatever happens to me, it reverberates to my whole family. The same for all of us with our brands. You know what I mean? So you just gotta be extra conscious, extra careful and, you know, be real.

• 1:02:45Fred Taylor?

  And that's why I, I personally, when you were going through what you were going through, obviously I understood that it was very sensitive for those, especially pet owners or what have you. But a lot of it, I contribute to the things you just mentioned about kids. What you see, your environment, your community. I came from a small town, Belgrade, and quite naturally, I didn't understand it then. Even when your situation came about and you got in trouble. I didn't know that it was illegal, you know, because it was common. That's what I saw and that's what people did. And, you know, I didn't look at it either type of way.

• 1:03:29Fred Taylor?

  But you do have to, you know, feel better about giving your kids an opportunity to steer clear of that sort of upbringing because that matters. It plays a big role.

• 1:03:40Speaker 04

  Yeah, you know, it was illegal to fight dogs?

• 1:03:42Fred Taylor?

  Bro, when I was coming, when I was that age, when I was young and I saw it, I didn't know.

• 1:03:47Speaker 04

  Really?

• 1:03:48Fred Taylor?

  When I was young, not, not then, but when I was young and come growing up, I didn't know.

• 1:03:53Speaker 04

  But you see, this, this the thing my situation did, it raised awareness. To like, man, I went on a whole campaign, passing laws and everything, going to Congress and, you know, really, like, being an advocate, you know, and so, you know, that's my foundation. We, we target animal welfare now. We work with special interest groups and we do, just make a lot of donations, but the quiet is kept, but we, I'm doing a lot of teaching in that field too, to educate kids, because I feel like I didn't get that, you know, education.

• 1:04:23Ryan Clark?

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:04:23Speaker 04

  Even though some things, you know, and you know, like, that's wrong, you know, and then you, you know, do kind of try to pay attention to what's, you know, happening around you, but my kids, you know, young men and women, that's what our community outreach is about, you know what I'm saying? And obviously, I was a part of, you know, I gotta be big in the prison reform space too, so, you know, helping kids and helping them understand, you know, in the community outreach, you know, field and, animal welfare, you know, I'm a big time animal lover, so that's what's so conflicting about it to everybody, you know, I can't explain it, so I just let, you know, my actions, you know, speak louder than my words these days,

• 1:05:04Speaker 04

  and then, you know, prison reform, man, I know what that's like too, and I'm trying to prevent that. And if you go through that, how can we make that, you know, a comeback campaign for just people who don't get the opportunity, like, like I might have had, because, you know, I had people around me, Tony Dungy, Andy Reid. So, of course, the track gonna be a lot faster to, you know, to the finish line.

• 1:05:32Ryan Clark?

  On that too, CJ Stroud recently, his father went to prison when he was a young man, and he is very early on in his career.

• 1:05:42Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:05:42Ryan Clark?

  Whereas number seven.

• 1:05:43Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:05:43Ryan Clark?

  Just like you did, he's playing extremely well, but he took the time. In his post-game press or in a press conference last week to say, you know, like, there needs to be prison reform and the conditions that they live in, the rehabilitation process and all of those things need to be looked at, they need to be upgraded, there needs to be awareness brought about and he, I know he's extremely close with Michael Rubin as well, who along with Meek Mill are big into prison reform.

• 1:06:12Speaker 04

  And NFL.

• 1:06:13Ryan Clark?

  To have a voice like yours as well added to that is huge, you know. We asked this question, Freddie T. ask it most time, I think I've been stealing it from him so much, I gotta stop saying that.

• 1:06:23Speaker 04

  This is our thing.

• 1:06:24Ryan Clark?

  But it's a Freddie T. question. It's about what's your biggest pivot, right? Like what moment in your life has affected you the most, has shaped you the most, has motivated you the most, or broken you down to the point we had to learn to motivate yourself? What would you point to that was essential to Michael Vick sitting here today?

• 1:06:46Speaker 04

  Yeah, I would think just answering that candidly, man, had to be when I went to prison, for sure. Like I say, I was on a mission. All my years of football, I never, you know, as a young man to being drafted, it was always, the goal was always to be drafted. It was never an ambition to be draft, get drafted, go win a Super Bowl. So I didn't set that goal, but in 2007, I set that goal. Like probably with your new coaching coming in, you see all these coaching changes, I know what that mean, in a minute, you gonna be next. So I'm like, so I'm gonna prevent that.

• 1:07:28Speaker 04

  I love the city of Atlanta, I love Arthur Blank, I love what the culture we've built. And so you know what? Ambition changed. I'm about to look into the future, I'm going with me a Super Bowl. And so the focus shifted and then the past caught up with me. Didn't even make it to the season, so that pivot right there, you talking about, complete 360. I mean, I'm talking about going the other way. That was supposed to happen like, like way back in the day. I supposed to then overcome that. The pivot.

• 1:08:09Channing Crowder?

  And we talk about sitting at Lil Mike's birthday party the other day. Y'all know how Barbershop. Yeah. Y'all know the man sitting around. Yeah. Mike, you said you were the best college football player ever.

• 1:08:23Speaker 04

  Yeah, I said it. Let me say it again.

• 1:08:27Channing Crowder?

  I just, I need, I want to bring the boys in on this conversation because we gotta.

• 1:08:32Speaker 04

  We can have a debate about it.

• 1:08:34Channing Crowder?

  Well, let's just talk about it.

• 1:08:35Ryan Clark?

  I actually got an idea. Let me, let me. Mike, I don't need to debate. I want to hear you say it. I want to hear you talk about it.

• 1:08:41Speaker 04

  When I think back to what I did in college in a 24-game span,

• 1:08:48Speaker 04

  I don't think nobody who had the ball in their hands every play was able to do what I did.

• 1:08:54Speaker 04

  The lead the nation in passing efficiency.

• 1:08:58Speaker 04

  Bunch of good things happened. National championship.

• 1:09:04Speaker 04

  And you know what? I never draw back on my, um, my highlights and all that, but,

• 1:09:12Speaker 04

  you know, I think the way I'm perceived as a player, people don't recognize me from championships. They think about them highlights and what it looked like.

• 1:09:21Speaker 04

  And so, you know, I did that in college, but won, but won consistently. Didn't even lose for real. And so, um, yeah, man, you can compare my highlights to anybody. You probably can go watch them and you ain't gonna see nothing like it. Lamar Jackson might be the closest as far as a guy with the ball in his hands. And then Reggie Bush was dope. Vince was dope.

• 1:09:43Channing Crowder?

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:09:44Speaker 04

  Know what I'm saying? There's a lot of good guys out there, but as far as electricity, nah.

• 1:09:50Ryan Clark?

  I will, I will.

• 1:09:51Speaker 04

  Bo Jackson, you know.

• 1:09:52Ryan Clark?

  Do I get to have a?

• 1:09:53Speaker 04

  Very, yeah, yeah.

• 1:09:54Ryan Clark?

  Do I get to have an opinion?

• 1:09:55Speaker 04

  Yeah, absolutely.

• 1:09:56Ryan Clark?

  Do I get to have an opinion?

• 1:09:57Speaker 04

  Absolutely.

• 1:09:57Channing Crowder?

  Yes, same, because I love to bring this to this platform because I was arguing with Mike the other day.

• 1:10:03Speaker 04

  He arguing with me. He arguing me down with.

• 1:10:05Ryan Clark?

  So here's my opinion. I don't, I think the best is subjective, right? Like, I think people are gonna have different people that they think are the best, and they're gonna judge those people on different things.

• 1:10:15Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:10:16Ryan Clark?

  Here's what I think about Michael Vick. I think Michael Vick was transcendent. Which to me is more important. To me, that's something that's tangible. When, when we saw. Michael Vick is the reason that Lamar Jackson's exist. Michael Vick is the reasons that Cam Newton gets to be. And I think, to me, that's more impactful because what Michael Vick did has allowed people now to build offenses around his talent. Because even though he had that talent, folks then start doing zone reads and we didn't get into this spread offenses. We didn't do those things.

• 1:10:58Ryan Clark?

  They tried to make him fit into the around peg, fit into a square hole, right? And say, no, we're gonna let you do, or we're gonna force you to do what all of these other quarterbacks do. He was just so talented, he made it look different. And I think that's what stands out the most to me about Mike. And also too, like, I was just contemporary. And as a contemporary, I watched him like we didn't play the same sport at the same time, in the same universities. You know, and I think, I think that's what was, that what was, is what was different about him. And so for him to feel like he's

• 1:11:36Speaker 04

  I like it, I like that transcendent, because everybody else kinda came after him.

• 1:11:40Ryan Clark?

  Yeah, like what he did, you know? And now, yeah, if he, if you put him in Bobby Petrino's offense that Lamar Jackson was in, it's the same thing or better.

• 1:11:50Channing Crowder?

  If you put him in prime Vick in Baltimore right now?

• 1:11:55Speaker 04

  Yeah, our offense in college was oriented too. It was catered to the run. That's why I ran, so, you know, the option, running speed option, we run via option. We ain't even, the things that, I can't even believe half of the things I did because I was really in a box. You know what I'm saying? I was really in a box. And so, we never got into four wides, call it a flush. We never got into four wides. When we did, it was all passing, but it was, everything was, we never got into three wides. So, it hashes in college is a lot, you know?

• 1:12:26Channing Crowder?

  So, if you got speeds, you gonna What's the best, what's the, what's the most advantageous offense for your ability that you ever, you ever played in college NFL?

• 1:12:37Speaker 04

  When I got to Philly with Andy. And then Dan Reeves' offense was amazing too. John Elway ran it, they went to four Super Bowls, so I was running all that. It was real successful, we went to the.

• 1:12:48Ryan Clark?

  What about your 2010 resurgence though? Like what about that? The play from that year that I think everybody remembers is Deshaun talking to Leron Landry before the game.

• 1:12:59Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:12:59Ryan Clark?

  And then you damn near threw the ball out the stadium.

• 1:13:02Speaker 04

  That was, um, that year was like, I was so focused though that year. Cause you know, when you learn in the new system, you just gotta be on top of everything. And so, uh, Andy always liked to add stuff every week. So the offense is always evolving. So I was more dialed in, I had a play caller that I can like, I could relate to. When I was running this, the West Coast system from 2004 to 2006, there was a lot of things I couldn't relate to. And so, you know, that's why in 06, we, we, and that's when we brought the zone read to the league and that's when I ran 4,000 yards. But I still wasn't progressing as a passer.

• 1:13:44Speaker 04

  And so I got to a point where I got with Andy, I learned 2009, I learned behind Donovan. And I'm like looking at everything they're doing, I'm like, man, I kill it, I really kill this offense. And I got a chance to do it and come back player of the year and, you know, just, just a good, solid season, man. I wish I'd have had more of those.

• 1:14:03Fred Taylor?

  So what's the secret sauce with Andy Reid with Big Red though? Because we've seen him turn, McNabb was a great player, obviously. What he has in KC now with Patrick Mahomes. Hell, even with Alex Smith.

• 1:14:16Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:14:16Fred Taylor?

  He was amazing. Then he went to DC, he wasn't so great, but, you know, and then yourself, you know, you became a better passer in your career. What is it?

• 1:14:25Speaker 04

  I think, I think you just know how to surround quarterbacks with talent. If you look at Andy's track record, he won a lot of games with backup quarterbacks too. And um.

• 1:14:34Fred Taylor?

  But that's the.

• 1:14:34Speaker 04

  Not taking away from what he's.

• 1:14:36Fred Taylor?

  But that's the point I'm trying to make. Is he developing these guys into.

• 1:14:40Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:14:40Fred Taylor?

  Become better quarterbacks than what we are used to seeing.

• 1:14:43Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:14:44Fred Taylor?

  Because, let's be honest.

• 1:14:45Speaker 04

  His system is different.

• 1:14:46Fred Taylor?

  Patrick, he has talented guys that he has to throw to out there in KC.

• 1:14:51Speaker 04

  Yeah, but he's talented.

• 1:14:51Fred Taylor?

  But they're not good as previous years and he's just the guy who's throwing them to become better players than they actually.

• 1:14:58Speaker 04

  But now their defense is better.

• 1:15:00Ryan Clark?

  Mm hmm.

• 1:15:01Fred Taylor?

  That is true.

• 1:15:01Speaker 04

  And so, you know, you look at the defensive personnel and whether you, he hired the coordinator or.

• 1:15:07Ryan Clark?

  Yep.

• 1:15:07Speaker 04

  He did it. He, he helped pick out the talent. I'm pretty sure he got a say so when it's time to sign like, yo, I like that guy. So he helped build, he helped build the structure of the team. And so it's just not offensive driven. Patrick benefit from the defense and what they doing now. They kept him in a lot of games this year, so. Um, I think just his ability overall, I should have said offense and defense. As far as him knowing personnel, knowing what players. You think about his teams over the, over the years from even from Philly, they all look the same. You got a dominant pass rusher, good linebacker, you got a star safety somewhere.

• 1:15:40Ryan Clark?

  Mm hmm.

• 1:15:40Speaker 04

  Whether it's Dawkins or it was Honey Badger or.

• 1:15:43Ryan Clark?

  Yep.

• 1:15:43Speaker 04

  You know what I'm saying? You got, you got solid corners and you got a good defensive scheme. So like when he, um, you remember Jim Johnson, the great Jim Johnson.

• 1:15:51Ryan Clark?

  Jim Johnson was nasty.

• 1:15:52Speaker 04

  Yeah, and then he had Sean McDermott, McDermott under Jim. And so now he got a.

• 1:15:57Ryan Clark?

  He's got spags.

• 1:15:57Speaker 04

  Spags.

• 1:15:58Ryan Clark?

  Yep.

• 1:15:58Speaker 04

  So, man, it's a couple of good defensive coordinators in the league.

• 1:16:01Fred Taylor?

  Last year, when Patty was hurt, Pat was hurt a couple of games, he had Chad Henne looking like.

• 1:16:08Speaker 04

  Yeah, that's what I'm saying, but, but Chad Henne had talent around him.

• 1:16:10Fred Taylor?

  That's Andy Reid too.

• 1:16:12Speaker 04

  Nah, Chad Henne, Chad Henne, if Chad Henne don't got talent around him and Andy Reid's play calling, he's not.

• 1:16:18Ryan Clark?

  Yeah, but I mean, that's why he's a backup. That's how he's a backup. I have a, I guess my last question would be, man, you know, a huge part of the reason you're here though is because it's 20 years since you.

• 1:16:28Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:16:29Ryan Clark?

  Want to cover Madden and EA wants to honor that. When you go full circle and think to yourself where you were. When you were on the cover of Madden then, and now to be 20 years around that with all that you've been through, and EA is still like, nah, man, we rock with you. What is that sort of support from a company like that?

• 1:16:49Speaker 04

  Yeah, shout out to EA, man. Shout out to Tastover for taking this into consideration and even allowing all this to happen.

• 1:16:59Speaker 04

  You know, it's been a major accomplishment. Certainly one of the milestones in my life that I really felt like I was never accomplished. You never think you're gonna be on the front cover of a video game.

• 1:17:09Ryan Clark?

  Hell, no.

• 1:17:09Speaker 04

  Or, you know, have your own signature shoe and stuff, things like that. And so 20 years later, for them to still celebrate that, I feel like, you know, I always try to be fair with people, respect people, respect their space, and that's always been something that I'm gonna hang my hat on. And so I think it just comes back around full circle to respect. You know, it's reciprocated and, you know, they still reach out for a lot of things that include me and Madden. And so it's been a great ride, man. I'm just thankful to have the people around me that continue to put me in advantageous situations. And so, you know, I try to pay it forward.

• 1:17:53Speaker 04

  But I appreciate y'all, man, for having me. This conversation was amazing. I've been watching y'all from afar.

• 1:17:59Ryan Clark?

  Can I get a shot, eh?

• 1:18:02Channing Crowder?

  Look at him, look at him, bro. I tell you, bro.

• 1:18:04Speaker 04

  I want that.

• 1:18:05Channing Crowder?

  The real was nobody. Everybody know, everybody respect you. Everybody know who played you. Everybody know who didn't play you. Young boys, old boys, bruh. Envy, bruh. We know.

• 1:18:15Ryan Clark?

  I wanna say this too, from my perspective and being in the game, you know, obviously playing it against you, and now on the other side, I think the largest respect you get is the fact that when younger quarterbacks now talk about quarterback play, they still bring you up.

• 1:18:32Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:18:32Ryan Clark?

  And what you did wasn't traditional.

• 1:18:34Speaker 04

  Yep.

• 1:18:35Ryan Clark?

  And I think it's also the reason

• 1:18:36Speaker 04

  That'd be forever.

• 1:18:38Ryan Clark?

  That you're a special guy on the cover of Madden is because a lot of times, that guy has won an MVP.

• 1:18:45Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:18:45Ryan Clark?

  Or that guy has won a Super Bowl.

• 1:18:47Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:18:48Ryan Clark?

  You know, for you, it was like, he's so special,

• 1:18:51Speaker 04

  Yep.

• 1:18:51Ryan Clark?

  so dynamic, the world is so... Captivated by who he is as a player and the way that he does it, that he's worth this. And I think that's the reason 20 years later, bro, like people still.

• 1:19:02Speaker 04

  And then the word that you used earlier, transcendent.

• 1:19:04Ryan Clark?

  It was.

• 1:19:05Speaker 04

  People can relate. We might have missed a generation, but somebody's reminded somebody of, you know, the greatness or our greatness or what we tried to, how we tried to be the best in our profession. And so I really respect that.

• 1:19:19Channing Crowder?

  Who's the closest thing to you you ever seen, before or after?

• 1:19:23Speaker 04

  What?

• 1:19:23Channing Crowder?

  The closest thing to Michael Vick. Warren, you can go to Warren Moon or you can go to Lamar Jackson.

• 1:19:29Speaker 04

  Eldridge Dickey. Look him up.

• 1:19:31Channing Crowder?

  Who?

• 1:19:32Speaker 04

  Eldridge Dickey ran a 4.440, 4.340 in like 1967.

• 1:19:36Ryan Clark?

  Yeah, I'm pulling my phone out. And I know a lot of people.

• 1:19:40Speaker 04

  No, all right. So, you know, of course I'm gonna get to Lamar, but it was a quarterback in like 1964, somewhere around that time. I feel like I should know this, but Eldridge Dickey. Cause I always question like, people always come to me like, bro, you changed the game. Like, no, there was a lot of dudes before me that changed the game. You know, I tried to pay homage and... But one day somebody took me way back and Eldridge Dickey was like, he was like me and Lamar in the 60s, bro. And he just didn't get a chance though. You know, the word, the story is he died from a broken heart because he got drafted the same years like Stabler or something and then... I think he got drafted in the first round. I want to say Ryan for real, bro.

• 1:20:21Ryan Clark?

  He got drafted in the first round?

• 1:20:23Speaker 04

  Man, ran a 4.340.

• 1:20:25Ryan Clark?

  Yep. They said he was the greatest HBCU quarterback of all time.

• 1:20:28Speaker 04

  I'm telling you.

• 1:20:29Channing Crowder?

  Really?

• 1:20:30Speaker 04

  I'm telling you, man.

• 1:20:30Channing Crowder?

  And they didn't give him a chance.

• 1:20:31Speaker 04

  Bro, I'm talking about cut, all the stuff that you see, cutting back against the grain, taking advantage of the defense. He was a monster, man. And they just, it was a different day and time.

• 1:20:41Ryan Clark?

  Yeah.

• 1:20:43Speaker 04

  So, and then Lamar, previous?

• 1:20:46Ryan Clark?

  Yeah.

• 1:20:47Speaker 04

  From what I've seen, definitely Lamar Jackson. What about Ronald Curry? Ronald Curry was the greatest high school football player ever in the state of Virginia or just, I don't care how good you were. You were, you were me.

• 1:20:59Ryan Clark?

  I agree.

• 1:21:01Speaker 04

  Oh, you remember Ronald?

• 1:21:02Ryan Clark?

  It's always my time.

• 1:21:03Channing Crowder?

  I had 22 rushing touchdowns.

• 1:21:05Ryan Clark?

  Ronald, bro, Ronald Curry, basketball and football.

• 1:21:08Channing Crowder?

  I had 22 rushing touchdowns in my senior year.

• 1:21:11Speaker 04

  Ronnie Curry, Ronnie Curry was the greatest high school football player ever, man.

• 1:21:18Ryan Clark?

  He was that good.

• 1:21:20Speaker 04

  Man, he was so, man. He was a man amongst boys.

• 1:21:23Channing Crowder?

  He said it's...

• 1:21:24Speaker 04

  I heard it.

• 1:21:24Channing Crowder?

  Did he have 22 rushing touchdowns of his?

• 1:21:26Speaker 04

  He might have had 42.

• 1:21:29Speaker 04

  He might have had 42 rushing touchdowns.

• 1:21:31Ryan Clark?

  Stan, nobody cares that you had 22 rushing touchdowns, bro.

• 1:21:35Speaker 04

  I ran a 4.52.

• 1:21:39Ryan Clark?

  You did not run a 4.52 coming out of college.

• 1:21:42Channing Crowder?

  I ran a 4.52 coming out of high school.

• 1:21:43Ryan Clark?

  My boy. Thank you so much.

• 1:21:45Channing Crowder?

  I ran a 4... I ran a 4.58 at 245 coming out of Florida.

• 1:21:50Ryan Clark?

  Damn.

• 1:21:52Channing Crowder?

  4.61 at the Combine at pro day.

• 1:21:54Speaker 04

  That's easy run over material.

• 1:21:57Channing Crowder?

  Fat out of knock your big ass out.

• 1:21:58Speaker 04

  I'd have ran that shit.

• 1:21:59Ryan Clark?

  Didn't you cut Fred in the preseason?

• 1:22:01Channing Crowder?

  No, I hit him in the back.

• 1:22:04Channing Crowder?

  Preseason, Fred had, Fred had three carries, bro.

• 1:22:07Speaker 04

  You don't get the ball in the preseason.

• 1:22:09Channing Crowder?

  He had three carries in preseason. He got one of them and this, this nigga gonna get the ball and try to back up and try to fight the yard. I hit that bitch square in the back. I hit that bitch square in the back.

• 1:22:19Ryan Clark?

  Did he hurt you, Fred?

• 1:22:20Speaker 04

  Nah, I'm like, God damn, it's the preseason. It's bullshit. Fred used to look so sweet in that uniform in college. Man, with the visor.

• 1:22:28Channing Crowder?

  Hit him square in his goddamn back.