Peter Rosenberg TV and Radio Personality: Everything Sports, WWE, Commanders, Hip Hop, Beyonce and opens up on depression from divorce to finding peace in his destiny

"Mine wasn't one of alcohol or drugs, it was an addiction of needing to be validated by others." Peter Rosenberg In this episode, Ryan, Channing, and Fred sit down with radio legend and WWE personality Peter Rosenberg, a man who has spent his life connecting with audiences through music, sports, and culture. New York’s long-time Hot 97 radio personality, Rosenberg, grew up a Jewish kid who immersed himself into the hip-hop culture, forging an unlikely path into music, sports and living his truth even in a world where he didn't fit the norm. Defying the cultural optics, Rosenberg paved a way into media by using his voice to make an impact and resonate with listeners around the world as his words came to life through his passion and respect for all things music and sports. Growing up in the suburbs of Maryland, Rosenberg has been a life long Washington football fan, even through all the team's low points as he shares his thoughts on this new regime led by Head Coach Dan Quinn with Quarterback Jayden Daniels at the helm. With the NFL wildcard weekend upon us, Ryan, Channing and Fred talk football and get Rosenberg's inside picks on who will make it through and his sure choice for Rookie of the Year. From breaking new artists on Hot 97 to becoming a staple in WWE commentary, Rosenberg shares his journey of staying authentic in an industry where the spotlight can be unforgiving. Battling stereotypes and criticisms, Rosenberg never gave up on his dream to be a voice for everyone and found that place through sharing his vulnerability and learning from shortcomings, not allowing them to define him. Rosenberg discusses his failed marriage, the feeling of almost losing everything and opens up what his turning point was that allowed him to let go of the past, ignore public perception and move forward again with faith and finding joy in unlikely situations. On the verge of becoming a first-time father, Rosenberg shares his how he's looking forward to parenting with the love of his life and reveals his fears of not having a child, but the delivery room. In a funny moment, Channing offers words of wisdom in ways only Channing can do that has all of the guys laughing. Continuing to make noise in the media space, His admiration of Beyonce backed with his facts and love of history led him to start a podcast dedicated to her unique stature in entertainment. Being someone who is not only respected in the music field but trusted, He gives his inside perspective about Kendrick Lamar's upcoming Super Bowl Half Time show. Discussing all the key moments in Rosenberg’s career and personal life, this conversation explores what it truly means to Pivot and find promise in pain and discover hope in despair. Tap in and hit the subscribe button on YouTube to be the first to know special guests and exclusive shows. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

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• 0:30Ryan Clark?

  Okay, you coming with the jacket though, huh?

• 0:31Speaker 03

  You already knew the vibes?

• 0:33Ryan Clark?

  Yeah.

• 0:34Speaker 03

  You knew the vibes?

• 0:35Fred Taylor?

  What up, brother?

• 0:35Ryan Clark?

  What up, man?

• 0:36Speaker 03

  What up, my dog?

• 0:37Fred Taylor?

  Trying to see where you pulled that jacket from. They was hiding them things a couple of years ago.

• 0:42Speaker 03

  Oh, yeah, they, I got on the list at some point. Where can I throw this jacket, you man?

• 0:45Ryan Clark?

  You sure you don't want to keep it with you, man?

• 0:47Speaker 03

  No, listen, I'm feeling good. I'm not going to be, it's a heavy coat, you know?

• 0:50Ryan Clark?

  No, it's a heavy, it's a heavy coat.

• 0:51Speaker 03

  It was, it was problematic, though. It was old school. That was Snyder era, respectfully. So it had the wrong dates on the Super Bowl year. So I don't know if you know that.

• 0:59Ryan Clark?

  No, I did not know that.

• 1:00Speaker 03

  Yes, on the jackets that they sent out to celebrate the new team, it said the Super Bowl wins were all, they did it in the year that the game was played, which is not how you celebrate Super Bowls. We, we won the 87 Super Bowl. It was played in 88. Anyways.

• 1:17Ryan Clark?

  So you're saying Snyder didn't understand how Super Bowls...

• 1:21Speaker 03

  Nothing at that point with the franchise, as you probably know better than me. At that time in the franchise, just every little thing was wrong. And, and as a fan, I thought I was doomed with that literally for the rest of my life. Because Snyder's like 15 years older than me. And, you know, rich people last forever. So I'm like, I'm going to be 80 years old. This man's going to be 95 years old, still ruining my football team of my youth. So honestly, as excited as I am about Jaden and Adam Peters and everything else they've done, maybe the biggest joy was just the fact that we got to do ownership.

• 2:15Ryan Clark?

  Well, the voice you hear and the face you see is Peter Rosenberg. I know you guys probably think he's from New York, but what would you call it?

• 2:24Speaker 03

  I now consider myself a New Yorker in some ways.

• 2:26Ryan Clark?

  Okay, but you're a Maryland guy.

• 2:27Speaker 03

  But I'm a Maryland guy.

• 2:28Ryan Clark?

  A Maryland guy.

• 2:28Speaker 03

  I am DMV to the core through and through.

• 2:31Ryan Clark?

  I've made so many mistakes saying certain things were DMV that wasn't. That's why I said, what would you call it? Just so I could know where I was.

• 2:38Speaker 03

  Yeah, I'm DC suburbs, so I'm from Montgomery County, Maryland. And so when you're from the DC suburbs, you are DMV. It gets a little frisky when you start talking about Baltimore and like, we get sensitive because when people hear I'm from Maryland, they go, oh, I have friends from Baltimore. And I'm like, I'm not from Baltimore, I'm from DC. But you know, it's a different, it's just a different, I'm not a Ravens fan.

• 2:58Channing Crowder?

  My wife went to Howard and now it gets all mixed up.

• 3:02Speaker 03

  Well, listen, all I know about any time anyone goes to Howard, all you have to safely say is the real H-U every time.

• 3:07Channing Crowder?

  You know.

• 3:08Speaker 03

  That works every time. By the way, and then if you meet from, if you meet anyone from Hampton?

• 3:14Ryan Clark?

  Just say the same thing.

• 3:15Speaker 03

  You get the same pop every day.

• 3:16Ryan Clark?

  Well, this is Fred Taylor, Channing Crowder, I'm Ryan Clark, Pippin fam. Thank you for pivoting with us. I know Freddie T, you had something for him already, so.

• 3:25Fred Taylor?

  Nah, it's quick, really. Who the Rookie of the Year, man? Unbiased.

• 3:30Speaker 03

  I'm gonna go with my guy, Jayden Daniels. He's a transcendent player, you know, and he's frankly more than people even realize. Honestly, I think if you're watching his game from afar and you're a national, you know, football fan, you see the highlights, you see the last second wins, you saw the Hail Mary, and you think you know the guy, but when you really follow this team closely, it's so much more than that. Like, you know, respectfully, he's not Robert Griffin III, he's not Cam Newton, he's not J- he really is his own guy. In terms of his armability and his pocket ability, the way the guy goes through progressions at the age that he's at.

• 4:14Speaker 03

  I have some discomfort with the amount that they choose to run him, but frankly, that's really what's working for them offensively right now. They're not getting a lot otherwise. The kid takes a licking, keeps on ticking. He is smart about the kinds of hits that he takes generally. And more than that, he's just a good person. Like, you can just tell, like, this is just a good quality kid, man. And I really think that it all starts with the top in an organization.

• 4:39Ryan Clark?

  Right.

• 4:39Speaker 03

  Ownership, GM, head coach, all the way down. But that quarterback is, obviously, we know, so critically important. It's the most important position in all of professional sports, and nah, he's the rookie of the year.

• 4:50Ryan Clark?

  You know, we've had many conversations about it. And you're almost hesitant to fall in love with the team or a group of individuals because you've been jaded by what's happened in the past. You'll see a little bit of success, and then, again, at those times, Daniel Snyder would strike.

• 5:08Speaker 03

  Yep.

• 5:08Ryan Clark?

  Josh Harris is now the new owner, owner of that management group, Adam Peters, Dan Quinn. How long throughout this season, or when in this point in the season, did you go, okay, we got something?

• 5:21Speaker 03

  So, I guess it's kind of two parts, because

• 5:25Speaker 03

  I probably thought we had something.

• 5:30Speaker 03

  The Bears game, maybe. Once the magic of the Hail Mary happened, I was like, oh, this mojo is actually different. We're in a different place. But the truth is, I've been saying this, I go on the radio in DC with my boys, Brian, the great Brian Mitchell and JP Finley. I go on with them every week. And I always tell them, stop with the other shoe's gonna drop. The witch is dead. Like, I don't believe in curses. Dan Snyder wasn't some sort of, like, curse in a silly way. It was a real thing. It was bad leadership and bad karma. Again, apologies if y'all have a friendly relationship. We don't.

• 6:12Ryan Clark?

  Okay, good.

• 6:12Speaker 03

  You're good. I didn't think so. But, most don't. So, like, it wasn't...

• 6:18Speaker 03

  The curse of the Washington franchise, I maybe attribute a little bit to the bad karma of the name. I do think that was a real thing. But even more so, I attribute it to the ownership. So when everyone's like, oh, when's the other shoe gonna drop? We've been through this before. I'm like, guys, that was a different thing. He is gone. The name is gone. Every bit of bad karma we had around this team is gone. So it was two things. I realized that we had a team probably five, six weeks in, but the whole year I've been on some, whatever happens, this is a new organization. We're gonna be a winning team again. I truly believe it. I know it.

• 6:54Channing Crowder?

  They have a jump. And Jayden, we know his mom, we know his pop. Like, we know the people around him. He is a good man. But is this a step in your mind? Or can they really compete? Because...

• 7:06Ryan Clark?

  Playoffs? No, too.

• 7:07Channing Crowder?

  They in the playoffs, but, bro, that NFC is nowhere. They ain't no bitch over there now. They got some dogs over there playing right now. I watched the Lions beat the hell out of the Vikings the other night.

• 7:17Speaker 03

  So they're right in between, I think. I think it's a step.

• 7:22Speaker 03

  However, on the right week, if Jaden does the right things, and if his receivers choose to catch the football, everyone besides 17, of course, he always catches the football. But if everybody else catches the football for him, they are scary. The team that worries you the most in that conference is unfortunately the team we play twice a year in Philadelphia. You know, and if Jalen Hurts is healthy, and Jalen Carter, I mean, there's just a lot to worry about with that team. But could they go in and beat a Tampa? Could they go beat, in one day, an LA or a Detroit? I think on a given day, they could. But no, I don't think they've taken the step yet. I think there is some beefing up that needs to be done over the next year or two. But this is all gravy to me, bro.

• 8:03Ryan Clark?

  Bro, you're so funny to me in the sense that, like, you are a diverse, multi-layered human. Like, you have all of these different loves and passions. And one of them, obviously, being hip-hop. And everything I looked at, I was like, okay, let me see how he started and where it was. So much of it says... The token Jew. Or the Jewish kid that fell in love with hip-hop. And then you take that to Maryland and you're a DJ there. How did that love start? Because I know if I would tweet something ever about true hip-hop, you was always like, "Nah, RC, you gotta go listen to this." How did you find that love for hip-hop, bro?

• 8:46Speaker 03

  It came to me as a kid. And this is a very different time. You know, this is a fully different era where like, honestly, being a white kid or a Jewish kid who's into hip-hop is really not a novelty anymore. But at the time, when my brother and I got into it in the 80s, it was actually something of note. And like, so my brother had friends at school who got him into it, you know? And then we would go visit my dad's parents in Queens, in Rockaway Beach, Queens. And we would turn on the radio. And I got to hear Magic. Like, we got to hear Red Alert and Marley Marl in the literal, like, you got to hear the foundational moments of a culture really coming to the mainstream, right?

• 9:30Speaker 03

  You know, like, we might have not been in the park in the Bronx in 1977, but listening to the radio in 1987 in New York and getting to hear what was happening, it just sort of immediately struck us. And like, my brother is four and a half years older. He got the bug first. I was so sports-focused. And it was osmosis. It was the background, like, my brother loving, and I'm hearing EPMD, and I'm hearing Jazzy Jeff and the Fresh Prince, and, you know, Cool Mo D and LL Cool J, and all this stuff's happening, NWA. And I liked it. And I was like, "This is really, really cool." And then as the years, as I hit those more formative music years, 12, 13, 14, now Funkmaster Flex is on the radio on Hot 97.

• 10:14Speaker 03

  Now we're getting to like, another awesome era of hip-hop. That next era, that Biggie, Jay, that Bob Deep. And I'm just like, "Oh, my God, this is..." This is magic. And I think also, it was a lens into a culture that was really different than my upbringing. You know, being a Jewish kid from the suburbs of Chevy Chase, Maryland. Obviously, I had a very diverse group of friends at school. But you know, at home, I happened to have awesome, progressive, open-minded, wonderful parents. But like, I'm still not aware of what is going on in the streets of Compton, California. Because my parents couldn't tell me stories.

• 10:59Speaker 03

  I mean, you know, listen, so to me, what made hip-hop amazing was, is to be into it, was to really open your brain to different people's lives. And it shaped everything about me. It shaped the way I see culture, the way I see race, the way I see politics, the way I see everything was shaded by it. And that's one of the reasons I'm so protective of hip-hop, even if people don't always want me to be the one who's being protective of it. But I feel like that if we're too loose and we let anybody have a loud voice on hip-hop who doesn't care about it in that way, it's a really dangerous thing for a genre and for a culture.

• 11:39Speaker 03

  And so I try my best in whatever voice, even being a, I'd like to describe it as a welcomed guest in hip-hop. I'm loud and proud with my voice and I try to, I try to get it right when I talk about it.

• 11:52Fred Taylor?

  Much like RC, a lot of people don't know, he studied journalism. And you did too, at the University of Maryland.

• 11:57Speaker 03

  Yeah, but he has an Emmy already and I'm just sitting here, you know, trying to survive.

• 12:02Fred Taylor?

  Yeah, but, but there's, you know, we have these dreams and passions. I wanted to play football. There was nothing to study other than, you know, going and practice football a whole lot. I really didn't have a plan B. RC's always said he knew what he wanted to do. He's the first active player to be on ESPN. I don't know all those different types of things. You had the passion for radio and all of that. Was studying journalism a double down for you? Did it actually make you that much better at what you're doing now?

• 12:35Speaker 03

  First of all, it's interesting that you say that Fred, because I remember now when RC was doing those hits while he was still a player. And I just had one of those weird moments. I can picture where I was when he was on TV. Random hit, not a big deal. It was... When that happened, you were a Steeler or Redskins?

• 12:53Ryan Clark?

  It started when I was a Steeler, but when I signed back with Washington, I was the person that reported on DeShawn Jackson signing with Washington.

• 13:03Speaker 03

  Exactly. So like, I remember there was some controversy, being like, wow, that's crazy. He's actually doing both, and he's actually good at it. The journalism part to me, it was always tied together. It was simultaneous. It was, I want to be a broadcaster. Where can I do that? Oh, at the University of Maryland, they have, within their journalism school, they have a broadcast focus. So you can do that. Now, when I got to Maryland, I thought I was gonna do sports. I thought I was gonna just be the sports guy. And I showed up to the radio station, and I met the guys who were doing sports. And these guys were so intense. And I've gotten to know some of them now, right? You meet these guys at ESPN, like, we meet them, they're our colleagues. Non-athletes who make it to broadcasting in sports,

• 13:48Speaker 03

  like, who are really good at it, they're intense about getting there. They really do have to put in... It's a competitive field. And I was like, this is too much for me. I was like, I don't think I'm as intense as these guys are. I think I'm gonna go do this hip-hop thing. Because over there, in that room, when I saw the sports guys, they all looked like me. It was like a room of like, short Jewish guys, being like, I wanna do this! And I got to the... When I saw the guys doing the radio show, I was like, oh, I'm something here. Like, when I walk in the room, people, they may question me, they may not be sure about me, but there's attention on me. And like, I have an opportunity to, I think, stand out a bit more. And it also was already where like, my passion was. I was already gonna have a show.

• 14:31Speaker 03

  Like, I did my first college radio show when I was 17, before I even started at Maryland. Like, I was bringing records to the radio station. So I was like, you know what? Why don't I just pursue this and see where it could go? And then I ended up getting the opportunity to intern for Big Tigger at WPGC, which was a staple in DC radio. And Tigger's a legend, obviously. And the rest is kinda history, as they say.

• 14:58Channing Crowder?

  The cultural appropriation and all that stuff, where you walking in the hip-hop clubs... Where it's all black folks and it's like, hey, the little Jewish dudes here and all that. Was there any transition to that or kind of figuring out where to be or any pushback from, from, from honestly, the black folks of like, bro, why y'all got this white dude up here spinning the records?

• 15:20Speaker 03

  I'm gonna tell you the truth, man. The only time I started getting real pushback in a real way. Now, don't get me wrong, before I got to that radio station, my man DJ Stylist, who's a friend to this day, who was at the station, was already doing the hip hop show. When I reached out to them, I sent an email, I was like, I want to come do hip hop. They did this show called Soul Controllers, it had been on for years. I'm like, I want to be down with y'all. He did hit me back with, yo, write an essay, right? And, and by the way, so I'm, I've always split the difference between being like nerdy and deferential, but also having some level of, of swag and sort of, um, some level of privilege also probably that was built into me that I didn't understand it as that yet of like, I'm not writing an essay.

• 16:04Speaker 03

  Listen, I want to be there, but I'm not about to write an essay for a kid who's a year older than me. So I did get little pushback, but then I didn't write the essay, but I showed up every week. And even though my show was on at 3 a.m., I got there at 6 p.m. when their show started. And I stayed every Friday from 6 p.m. to 6 a.m. And the essay didn't matter after a little while, I was like, oh, this guy just wants to be here.

• 16:26Channing Crowder?

  He's real, right?

• 16:27Speaker 03

  And, and, and so, and he's real. So until the recent days, like the last five years of the internet and social media becoming so divisive, I would say in the last five years, after I finally established myself and have actually contributed something, this is when I've gotten the, the most negative feedback. All those years coming up, honestly, it was a real recognized, real situation. Like honestly, I, I hate to be boring for like all the white people out there who think like, oh, it must have been crazy, you're going in the club. No, it wasn't. Everyone was cool. Everyone treated me like, you, you obviously care about this and you want to be here. Oh, you're good? Oh, you know, this guy knows a lot.

• 17:12Speaker 03

  Like, he's actually doing, he's, he's doing more work than I am. This guy really wants to prove it. No, everyone showed me love. It's only in the last few years that I feel like I'll give an opinion and it's just a reminder of like, hey, you're white. And I'm like, oh my God, I should, I feel like I should have been getting this. Thirty years ago. I was white back then. But hey, listen, I signed up for this. And I want to be a part of this. And I still, even being now in my 40s, I still want to be a part of this. And if that is sort of the era we're in right now, where it's a lot of quick hitting naysaying on the internet, I'm not going to cower and run now. They're going to fade away. The hate will fade away. Every time. I'm still going to be here contributing in five, 10 years, whatever it may be.

• 17:54Ryan Clark?

  The best part about it is, he's a white dude and he got a white man voice. Like, like when he said, "I'm sorry to all the white guys that wasn't walking in." He had to change his voice to be white. My dog been doing hip-hop so long, he had to change his voice to be a white man.

• 18:12Speaker 03

  By the way, code switching is the funniest, most like underrated conversation. Everyone acts like code switching is this thing that not everybody does. It's a real thing. But we all do it in different ways in our life. And today, I'm doing my morning show with Ebro and Laura from my house. And a guy comes to the door, he's supposed to paint our, our, our, our guest room that's becoming the nursery. This guy shows up to the door, I'm having a conversation with him, I'm not thinking about it, right? Older black dude, working class guy, you know, got the toothpick in his mouth, his paint pales or whatever. And when I come back to the computer and put on my headphones, Ebro is doing this impression of how I just sounded.

• 18:50Ryan Clark?

  Right.

• 18:50Speaker 03

  He was like, "You just changed to a whole old southern black man voice." I was like, "What?" He was like, "I heard it." He was like, "You were calling out to your wife, 'Hey baby, come on in.'" I was like, "I did not." But the, the beauty, the beauty of our job and our show is, and that I, I love about our friendship is, like, we get to have those conversations together in a public place. And there just aren't that many, even in 2025, there are not that many public platforms where multiracial people talk openly and honestly with like love and, and empathy. And also can make jokes.

• 19:30Ryan Clark?

  How much do you feel having a level of respect for one another's culture plays into that? Because... I myself am willing to have those conversations with anyone, right? But the divisiveness of it does put us in a situation where now people are standing on one side, you're standing on the other, and there is no collaboration, understanding, or compromise between that. You having such a respect for the hip-hop culture. I know there's a ton of times, man, that I've listened to your words, whether it be on Alton Sterling, I'm in Baton Rouge at the time, and I'm like, this dude gets it more than a ton of people who are my color have gotten it.

• 20:14Ryan Clark?

  How much do you think your respect for the culture, the way you've presented publicly for the culture, plays into being able to have those meaningful, fun, but also informative conversations?

• 20:28Speaker 03

  Well, I don't think I'd be in the room having the conversation with the people I'm having the conversation with if that wasn't my personality or my upbringing. But the truth is, I feel like it's less about the culture, and by that I mean like hip-hop culture, and more about like basic human respect and empathy. You know, like literally in my comments. So I've been on a big Beyoncé kick, right? I started a pop-up podcast myself. Go check it out, it's called This Ain't Texas. I'm producing it myself. No, it's just me on my own. I want to talk about how Beyoncé, the biggest artist in the world, made a country album in 2024. She's up for a Grammy. If she doesn't win, it'll be the fifth time she didn't win Album of the Year.

• 21:12Speaker 03

  It is the Album of the Year, and it's not being talked about in a really big way. I want to talk about it, right? So I've been putting up a lot of Beyoncé content. And I'm telling you, you put up Beyoncé content, it really brings out a lot of interesting stuff. And I always get racially charged messages from all, from every group. I get white folks who hate me, I get black folks who hate me, it's all in the comments. But white people, this happened yesterday. On the air, I said, I said I have a new word for people who really actively dislike Beyoncé. I have a new word, active, not like you don't like her music. You actively dislike her, you have a problem with her. I said I have a new word for those people.

• 21:57Speaker 03

  It's called racist. That is the word. Because I do think that she is representative of sort of this... You know, beautiful womanhood, blackness, all of these things people are scared of. And she's unabashed about all of it. And so it makes people have these feelings that come out really strongly. So I'm giving this theory on the radio. And the first comments I see right away is like, "God, it's so sad, listening to Rosenberg having to try to, you know, kiss ass of black people." That's what, every opinion that I give, this is the thing that blows my mind about racists. They're so obsessed with race that they don't believe I'm telling the truth. They believe it's because I wanna have black friends?

• 22:41Speaker 03

  I hope to one day be accepted? Like, they don't believe in these sort of honest feelings. So it's a really long way of saying, "I think you can have conversations with anyone if there's genuine respect and empathy." The reason that we would never, at any point on our show, myself, Ebro and Laura, we would never talk to Candace Owens. We would never talk to Tommy Loren. We would never talk to any of the race baiters, regardless of their race. We don't think it's a legitimate conversation. We think the starting point is illegitimate. I'm not coming in here on our platform to have a conversation to legitimize people who don't have, they're not coming at things from empathy. They're not coming at things from love.

• 23:26Speaker 03

  They're coming at it from race baiting and kissing up to white supremacy. We're not going to do that. And people really don't believe it. Like, it's really sad when you think about it, that there are people who like, race is actually on their mind that much, that there could be no organic feelings of like, love between people of different races. It's wild to me. It's still wild to me.

• 23:49Ryan Clark?

  You know, clearly, I get it a ton.

• 23:52Speaker 03

  I would imagine you do.

• 23:53Ryan Clark?

  I get it a ton. And I had to, I had to reach that point, though. I had to reach the point of... Understanding that when I am speaking for equality, right? When I am speaking for equity, when I am speaking for diversity, which is in no way saying I want anybody's life to be lessened. It's just saying I want us all to be on the same level playing field. That when you do that, you now become a racist. And so, in the sense of if I say simply, "I think Lamar Jackson should win the MVP this year, and here's why." It's, "Oh, of course you want the black guy to win because you're racist." And it does get to that point to where people are trying to tell you,

• 24:37Ryan Clark?

  "You're always focused on race because they're always focused on race."

• 24:41Speaker 03

  Exactly right, and that's what's such a crazy and frustrating feeling. And I really think the biggest thing, when we talk about what could potentially solve in racism in America is probably not a thing. But, when you talk about American racism, which is very specific, and it's unlike, I mean, we got that, we got that top-tier racism here. This is, you could go to Europe, you could go to lots of different places. What we got here-

• 25:06Ryan Clark?

  They answer what ours?

• 25:07Speaker 03

  Yeah, no, come on, stop. Jim Crow? No one did racism the way America did it. So, what I really do think could take a step in that direction, though, and this is, this is so frustrating to me. White racists never want to acknowledge that racism ever existed.

• 25:26Speaker 03

  WWE did a show in Berlin recently, and I was lucky enough to be a part of it. And I went out to work, and I was there for two days, right? And if anyone out there has Jewish parents and you're going to a place like that, your parents are going, "You gotta go, you gotta go to the Holocaust thing, you gotta go to the synagogue, you gotta go do the Jewish stuff. That's where our family's from, you gotta go do that, the history there." The amazing thing about going to Berlin was, and everyone in WWE kinda had the same experience, you didn't have to go find it. Like, you get off the plane in Berlin. This amazing city, which by the way was an amazing city well before World War II. Like, Berlin was popping when World War II happened. And you get to this awesome city, and by the way, I know Germany has their own far-right wing now,

• 26:11Speaker 03

  and there's a lot of things going on there, too. But, you get to that city, and they immediately tell you, "Welcome, we have a great city here in Berlin. We'd like to show you all the fucked-up things that we've done in the past." It is all right there for you, like- Yo, the, the, the, I don't want to get it wrong, but the Holocaust memorial that's there, that's really beautiful.

• 26:37Speaker 03

  It's like made of these stones that fills, it's almost like a cemetery, but it's not. It's these stones, it's really interesting looking. Really recommend it if anyone goes there. It's literally called like, "The Memorial for Murdered Jews." They don't play with it. This is what happened here. Like, we're gonna be real about it. And I think as a result of that, even though the Holocaust is much more recent than slavery, you have people there who have been forced to reckon with their past in a way that like, they don't play with Nazi symbolism. No one does. Like, you can't play with it, it's not to be played with. Again, there is a rising right wing now, which we're seeing across the whole world in every country. But generally speaking, that has been the way there. No one plays with that, because they take it seriously.

• 27:22Speaker 03

  Here? Eventually, we opened an African-American history museum, and within that museum, you could go find, there's not "The Slavery Museum." You don't get here and we show you, "Look at all the terrible things that happened in this country." As a result of that, no one wants to acknowledge that anything happened. So there's a constant struggle between those of us, and that includes, I think, black folks and allies, who say, "Please just hear the voices. Please just look at the history of this country." And you have everyone else who's going, "La, la, la, la, la, la, nothing's ever happened, la, la, la, la." To me, that is the essence of where a lot of the problems come from. And if we could just start from a point of being like, "Can we at least acknowledge

• 28:07Speaker 03

  that the foundation here was really problematic for black Americans? Like, the whole thing is come, it was built on slavery? I think that would really go a long way in this country." And, and being in Berlin, I was really like, "Wow, you can do it." If, if you're willing to look at yourself honestly as a country. You really can't do it.

• 28:26Ryan Clark?

  Fellas, it's a new year. We gotta try new things. So one of the things I am gonna try is ExpressVPN. Man, you know how it is, bro. I'm always rolling around. Whether it's unsecure or unencrypted Wi-Fi, especially public Wi-Fi, ExpressVPN always protects me and keeps me safe.

• 28:39Fred Taylor?

  Yeah, especially when you're traveling internationally. It's secure online. The anonymity, Channing, anonymity, the anonymous that it gives you. When I'm trying to stream, they don't know where you are. And you can use it in all these different countries, no matter where you are. That's my benefit in it.

• 28:51Ryan Clark?

  And Freddie T, what's really crazy about that, you know me, man. I'm always tapped into movies and how they have all of these hackers that get your information, jump into your phone, where ExpressVPN can't actually protect you from all of the hackers. It truly can't protect you from most, especially when you're on some of those common and public Wi-Fi's.

• 29:06Channing Crowder?

  Man, let me break it down simple. Going online without ExpressVPN is like driving without car insurance. You might be a good driver, but it's folks out there that can't drive. Or you know what? Even better, it's like having sex without a condom. You can't just run up in everything. You know what I'm saying? Raw dog is gonna catch you sooner or later. ExpressVPN is the condom of VPNs. Find out how you can get four months free by going to expressvpn.com/pivotyoutube.

• 29:28Fred Taylor?

  You said it'll never happen here.

• 29:30Speaker 03

  Doesn't feel like it.

• 29:31Fred Taylor?

  Because the ones that want it to go away are the ones that are gonna try and dilute the message. You know, when you was talking about Beyonce, I listened to it, talking about her intentionality, using her platform, you know, no matter where. You were talking about the performance, the recent performance, the halftime.

• 29:50Speaker 03

  Beyonce Bowl, yeah.

• 29:51Fred Taylor?

  The Beyonce Bowl, right. And when you use your platform, it comes as a threat to those who are racist.

• 29:59Speaker 03

  But it doesn't have to.

• 30:01Fred Taylor?

  It doesn't have to.

• 30:01Speaker 03

  That's what's so annoying.

• 30:02Fred Taylor?

  But that's the thing. They aren't gonna allow you to because they're gonna continue to pretend to be blind to it.

• 30:09Speaker 03

  But why, like, I just don't get it. How is it benefiting your kids? Like, how is it benefiting your kids to lie about the past? Why? How does, all of it's cowardly. And we live in a cowardly society right now. You realize that those of us who stand up... For other people's beliefs are called snowflakes? Like, we're the ones that are weak?

• 30:31Channing Crowder?

  Yeah.

• 30:32Speaker 03

  I'm a snowflake because I believe in justice. I believe in everyone getting an equal opportunity. Yo, I'll be the first one to tell you, the time that I started getting into sports, media, it probably wasn't the sexiest time for a straight, white male who doesn't have a sports background to be getting time on air. It wasn't the sweetest time, and my agents would keep it real with me. They're just like, "Hey, they're not looking for a straight, white guy right now." And I'd be like, "Oh, cool." Because I get it. I want to be, that's what I want. I want there to be an even playing field. There wasn't one previously. So, I personally chose to be in a field where I was being told, like, "Hey, opportunities are a little limited right now because we're trying,

• 31:14Speaker 03

  media is one place where we're trying to even things out a little bit. You might have to fall back a little bit. Do your thing, work hard, be good at it, you'll get your opportunity." And I'm like, "Bet." I want that to happen, I'm gonna work my ass off and one day I'm gonna get there. And I'm the woke snowflake? You got people out there, they've never been affected by this DEI thing in their life. It's a made-up boogeyman. They've never lost one opportunity, and they cry about it all day. And I'm the snowflake?

• 31:48Channing Crowder?

  My radio co-host is Hockman, he's a Jewish dude. And when I say anything about, you know, Judaism, or the, you know, like you say in the Holocaust and all that, I'll get the tweets or the texts, or the real Israelites and all that stuff. And it's almost like, "Why do you care?" And that's what they say, like, "What are you talking about? Why do you care? Why do you care about black people? Why do I care?" I think you already answered it. I care about human beings. And no matter what your race, your religion, your whatever it is, I care about human beings. And I think the racist you're talking about, it can't click to them. That I don't give a damn, I just care about this human that's standing here next to me, and the shit doesn't turn over for him.

• 32:26Speaker 03

  And I don't know whether to credit that is our upbringing, or the culture that we were exposed to. I think our parents probably, although you do meet people who have racist-ass parents. I love, nothing impresses me more. And I think we all probably know people like this.

• 32:39Ryan Clark?

  I do.

• 32:39Speaker 03

  Then when you meet folks whose parents are bigots and they're not at all, you're like, yo, you're just like a

• 32:45Ryan Clark?

  Alien.

• 32:45Speaker 03

  Good person. You did, yeah, you just found.

• 32:47Ryan Clark?

  Good people.

• 32:48Speaker 03

  Yeah, an alien.

• 32:48Ryan Clark?

  Like, how'd you figure it out?

• 32:50Speaker 03

  How'd you figure it out?

• 32:51Ryan Clark?

  Yeah, yes.

• 32:51Speaker 03

  Like, I, I was, it was a cheat code. I mean, my parents were, I was raised, you know, like, I, I was, I have a story that I always remember. One of the most powerful stories of my life was, I was a little kid, I was like six years old, and I'm hanging out with a friend of mine at Hebrew school. And he's a sweet kid, he's a good kid, like, at least that's how I remember him. And he tells me a story about how he got into a fight with a kid at school. And he's like, yeah. And then I called him and he said the N-word. Bro. I was like, I'll, I'll never forget, I was six years old, I was flabbergasted. I was like, oh my God, no. I, I was like, you, you, you can't, you can't. And I went crazy, I'm a six-year-old, and this kid started crying. And he's a little kid, like, they, kids don't know what they're doing.

• 33:37Speaker 03

  And he starts crying and he's like, what do I do? Oh my God, I didn't know, is that bad? I'm like, yes, like, you have to apologize. And like, he did, I remember this so well, this kid, when he apologized, this guy turned out to be the sweet, lovely person. He heard it from other places, he didn't understand it. But my parents had already ingrained in me, there are certain things that are like evil, that you cannot say and you cannot do. And that's one of those things. And by the way, I didn't come in here with my intention being, let's have a talk about how anti-racist I am.

• 34:10Ryan Clark?

  I actually had a question, though, about the Beyonce thing.

• 34:13Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 34:13Ryan Clark?

  You were very vocal during the beef, right, with Kendrick, and I know you love real hip-hop.

• 34:19Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 34:20Ryan Clark?

  You called it the Beyonce Bowl, but that happened on Christmas, bro. Somebody has to perform at the Super Bowl. So what does Kendrick do now that Beyonce basically gave us the Super Bowl performance during a Christmas game?

• 34:34Speaker 03

  It's gonna be very hard to, to touch what she did from a performance standpoint, like, respectfully to the, to the art form I love the most, hip-hop. I don't know that there's a rapper that's been born yet that could do what Beyonce does. Because I don't know that from a live performance standpoint. The art of rapping can supersede the notes that she's hitting while dancing the way that she's dancing. Like, I just don't know that it's possible. That being said, Kendrick is gonna be alright, no pun intended. Um, like, everyone's gonna be waiting to see "Not Like Us." He's, he's gonna do a version of it, he has to. It's the biggest song of the year, I'm sure he'll, he'll edit it in some way, I don't know how. He will have features, I'm sure.

• 35:17Speaker 03

  Um, I mean, let's not forget, he's about to go on tour with, with SZA. So like, I'm sure they're gonna do a smash hit, and that'll be great. And then I'm guessing he'll pull something out the sleeve that none of us are expecting? And I think it will, will wow everyone. That guy is in a place where like, you know when basketball players will talk about like, the zone and the, the rim, like, I, I forget who it was Larry Bird who it was, but he's like,

• 35:42Fred Taylor?

  It's Michael Jordan, he said.

• 35:43Speaker 03

  The rim's that big? Yeah, Jordan. He's like, "The rim's that big." The rim's that big for Kendrick right now, guy. I mean, like, that GNX album, I mean, you can see, he's just, he's just dancing off people, he's just having fun. So, I'm not even, not even worried about it. He's, there'll be two separate things, it'll be Beyonce did what Beyonce did, and Kendrick did what Kendrick. In fact, Beyonce could always pop back out to do freedom, you don't know.

• 36:09Fred Taylor?

  Let's pivot real quick. Um, relationships. In the moment you were about to be divorced, and your creativity and everything you got going on, versus being remarried now and, and finding new life and a new relationship, that, that, how, how did it affect you, your creativity and everything?

• 36:30Speaker 03

  The moment my marriage came unglued, I, um, I was on my way to see a therapist. My ex is texting me crazy shit, and she's, she's like, going off on me, like, we, we weren't communicating, the only way we were communicating were text messages that were like, very intense. Anyone who's been through a, a bad divorce, like, I won't say it was a bad divorce, but any, any breakup, a sharp- Quick breakup knows how intense things can be. And I'm like, I'm a mess. I'm an absolute mess. Like, I'm still hoping I can save this thing. Of course, I don't know at that point what God has planned. You're just doing, you know, whatever you can. I'm heading down to therapist. And this therapist was all the way downtown in a big ass building above the Trinity Church.

• 37:14Speaker 03

  It's like 70 floors, like a New York. And I get out and there's a huge line. Tears rolling down my face. I need to get to this therapist now. Like, I think he's gonna like save me somehow. I don't know what I thought he was gonna do. I mean, shout out to my guy Paul, he did a great job. But I don't know what I thought he was gonna do in that moment. And I'm getting in the elevator. Tears running down my face. And as I get in the elevator, two people are like, Rosenberg? And I was like, I spent all this time wanting to be somebody so bad. And like, I just don't wanna be any. I just wanna hide so bad. I wore a hood. Legitimately wore a hood.

• 37:57Speaker 03

  Every time I left my house for like three, four months. I just, I didn't wanna be seen. I, and the idea of creating on the radio, it was a nightmare. Cause my, my character's myself. Like, I don't, I'm not a fake. I'm on the, I don't play a part. I'm me. So now I'm miserable. And my life is, as I know it, my life is crumbling. At that time, we were about to have children. All of these things I really wanted. I wasn't a young man then either. I was 39 years old. And everything was coming unglued. I was, I was walking out of phone, I was walking. I'm sad, I'm bad. But guys, if you can't tell, breakups are not my thing. And I tell my wife all the time. She's stuck. There ain't no more breakups. This is, I, my lifetime doesn't have anymore.

• 38:42Speaker 03

  And especially not with the greatest woman I've ever known in my life. My wife now, this, it's never happening. So, I'm, I'm in commercial breaks. I'm calling my brother just to like get through it. And my brother's telling me, hey, don't think about yourself. Go in the room. Be of service to your co-hosts. Don't think about what you're gonna do right now. Think about how you can serve Laura and Ebro. Just be of service to other people and other things will come. And I tried my best to, to listen to that. And I'll never forget it. Um, one day, on the same day, coincidence.

• 39:15Speaker 03

  Ebro in the morning and Michael Kay, my now former co-host in the afternoon, on the same day, they didn't know each other at the time. Both of them pulled me aside. And were like, so, uh, you gonna start like pulling it together? I was like, in my brain, I'm like, are you kidding me? It's been, it had been two weeks. I was like, it's been two weeks. I'm alone now. I'm in the house by myself. I don't know why. I wasn't, sorry, I wasn't in the house. I was in a hotel. I was like Tom Hanks in the movie Big when he's staying in Times Square and there's gunshots and he's hiding under the pillow. I was on my own. I was, I was a little boy again is what I felt like. But I realized that

• 39:59Speaker 03

  I play a part on two shows. And the quarterbacks of those shows were like, you're my number one receiver, bro. Like, you haven't been able to catch the ball for two weeks. Like, I need you. And, and at that moment, I was like, I basically just, you know, sucked it up and dug deep, went hard with my therapy, went hard in every way that I could, um, to, to try to really dig deep and, and get myself out of it. Cause I thought, I remember another thing my brother said to me. He was like, hey, bro, you lost your wife. Do not lose your career. And, and it was, it was the only time that I really realized how people, normal, together people can lose it. Cause if I'd had one more thing fall,

• 40:42Speaker 03

  I, I don't know. I don't know. If I'd, like, let's say they fired me, had enough. And now I'm starting from no relationship, no jobs, complete start over. I was like, oh, is this how people end up in the looney bin? I see the pathway now. It's over there. I knew I wasn't gonna go. Like, I knew I wasn't gonna take the trip. But I was like, I see how people go left. And I dug deep and thank God was able to perform again and here we are.

• 41:09Ryan Clark?

  Hey, man, the start of the new year is time to get your life in order and also get organized. For me, it's about my financial wellness. And thanks to Rocket Money, I'm getting all these subscriptions in one place. Dog, when I travel, I'm constantly trying to get on different sites and trying to understand and learn about our guests. So I subscribe and I always forget to unsubscribe later. So with Rocket Money, it's putting all those things in one spot and it's really helping me know that some of my financial goals are achievable.

• 41:30Channing Crowder?

  RC, I'm with you. You get that subscription, use it once or twice, and you forget about it. Eighty-five percent of people have at least one subscription that they don't use, but they forget about it and they keep paying month after month. Rocket Money got you with that.

• 41:40Fred Taylor?

  For me, Rocket Money is like my own personal assistant. I can use all my subscriptions in one place. And if I'm not using it, you can go in there and they can cancel it. You can even set it where they can cancel it for you if you're not using it.

• 41:49Ryan Clark?

  Rocket Money is a personal finance app that helps find and cancel your unwanted subscriptions, monitors your spending, and helps lower your bills so you can grow your savings.

• 41:56Channing Crowder?

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• 42:01Fred Taylor?

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• 42:11Ryan Clark?

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• 42:15Channing Crowder?

  All you got to do, go to rocketmoney.com/pivot today. That's rocketmoney.com/pivot. Save you some money.

• 42:22Ryan Clark?

  And now, back to the show. With all that you had done and accomplished, like you said, being the main skill player on two different shows that were extremely successful, what was it about the marriage and your identity as being a part of it that broke you so much?

• 42:43Speaker 03

  See, now I know why this guy wanted Emmy. You know what I mean? That's quality stuff right there. No, seriously, that's a really good question. I ask that because, to be honest, in retrospect, it was far from a perfect relationship. It didn't, it didn't break out of nowhere. Like, now with...

• 43:00Speaker 03

  Five and a half years and an amazing partner and a baby on the way and my life in order. I'm able to look back and go, well, this is where we were supposed to get to. But at the time, I was not a perfect husband. But I took marriage seriously. I took the like bond seriously. And the idea that it's like a complete start over. The idea that this person who was, I've always found this crazy about divorce. You say I love you and you kiss your partner goodnight every night. And then the first person you say I love you to in the morning and all these things. And then, when it happens, no kiss ever again. Not, I did not know, you did not know when you're going to bed that night.

• 43:45Speaker 03

  I'm never gonna kiss my wife or hear I love you from her ever again in my life. Even though I ended up in a way better place with the right person. That idea just broke me. The idea that this partnership and friendship that had been years long, I mean. When I met her, I had nothing. Like I didn't have anything going on. I met her DJing in the club in College Park, right? And so there was no career. So like you built this thing and so even with all the flaws and even though you're kind of taping things up over here and you're ignoring some demons over there. The idea that this thing that I thought was a thing, even though it turned out to be, to be wrong. The idea that it was gone was just heartbreaking.

• 44:30Speaker 03

  And by the way, I still find that stuff sad. Like I, when I watch a movie and I see anything about a relationship ending. I do find it fundamentally sad. I find endings sad. I mean, when the Michael K Show ended two weeks ago, I knew the, starting this past week. Yeah, new show. I have a new show and I have my name on the show and it's Don, Han and Rosenberg. We have our own afternoon drive show in New York. Amazing. I was still sad about, about coming to the end, even though I was, I was kind of ready for the end. And I was kind of ready for something new, but I'm like, oh man, I'm not gonna see Michael every day. Like damn, it's not gonna be the same. So I think it was just fear of change, you know? And it gave me a great admiration for people who have faith. You know, I'm not a deeply religious person.

• 45:14Speaker 03

  And it gave me a great appreciation for people who have faith. Because when people have faith, they know where they're gonna end up landing. They just know it. And I didn't have that. Like, for me, it was, when you're fighting against reality, it is an uncomfortable place to be, bro. And like, you know, people would say, uh... The number one thing people would say to me, they'd be like, "Hey, man, thank God you don't have kids." Everyone loved to say that, "Thank God you don't have kids." And I'd be like, "All I wanted was kids."

• 45:42Ryan Clark?

  Right.

• 45:44Speaker 03

  Like, you just said the wor... They thought they were saying the right thing, and now I... By the way, they were right. They were right. You're right, uh, they were right. But, in that moment, especially as a man, we don't really talk about men wanting to have children and not getting to have them. You know? Like, that's a real thing. And I had fertility issues, male fertility issues. Which I've literally never said out loud because of just the fear of like, "Do I really need to have trolls on the internet have that of all things?" Um, it's like such a personal, hard thing. So to know that there were male fertility issues, and to know that I thought I was on the verge of having children, and to know it was a full start over,

• 46:29Speaker 03

  I was just like, I felt like a little kid. I was like, "Man, even if we get there, it's not gonna be forever." And who's the person gonna be, and how, and why? You know, and if you don't have a deep faith, that's a lonely, scary place to be.

• 46:44Ryan Clark?

  Well, fast forward to today. You walk over here from a doctor's visit with your wonderful wife, and your baby's here in a few weeks. What has it been like to have so many of the things that you wanted? Even with going through fertility issues, which isn't something that men talk about? And to now be there with the right person, having and getting the things that you've always wanted?

• 47:13Speaker 03

  It's an amazing, amazing level of gratitude that I have. I hope I'm forever able to be as filled with gratitude as I am at this moment.

• 47:24Speaker 03

  I know you've been there. All you guys have kids?

• 47:26Fred Taylor?

  Yeah.

• 47:26Speaker 03

  Alright, so all of y'all have been there. I don't know what I'm, I don't know what I'm getting into yet. And when I say that, I don't mean about the, all the hard stuff everyone tells you about, like, I got, I know I'm gonna be alright. I know, I know I am. I'm 45 years old. I didn't stumble into this at 22. I'm ready for all that stuff. I don't know what it's gonna feel like to love that much. And, and when I found out, you know, that we're having a little girl, and knowing what my wife is like, and having seen the pictures of my wife as a, as a child, like the wonderment in her eye, and like, I'm just like, oh man, I don't even know how amazing this is about to be.

• 48:10Speaker 03

  I'm feel, I'm just filled with joy and gratitude, you know, um, for the, for the world and, and to my wife, because you know, my, my wife, when she met me, I was not all the way back on the horse yet. I was still sort of stumbling a bit. And she, she was well aware. I mean, she will tell you the story. She will, she met me and was like, oh, he's cute. He should get back together with his ex. He's not, this is sad, you know, that's. You heard the dude on the date talking about, uh, no, no, but just ask her next time. And, and she was like, and thank God for her, like, you know, I think of that, um, this woman's work, like, she, she was like, I'm going to see this through.

• 48:54Speaker 03

  She may not consciously said it, but she was willing to be patient with me, at least for a little while, till I was ready to be like, oh wait, this is the rest of my life, you know? And it took me a couple of months. Like, I knew she was amazing, but I was scared. I was like, it was COVID. I never even got a chance to while out. Like, I was like, wait, I, I don't, what about my run? I gotta go on the, I, I have a little money in my pocket. I finally got my lineup together. Let me go on a run. And I was like, and then I was like, well, what kind of person would you be? If, if God put this amazing person in your life, and you're like, nah, I need some more, nah, nah, she's too great. She's too great. And so we, we got after it and, uh,

• 49:39Speaker 03

  I'm nervous, I'm excited, uh, all the things. That's a go back to back. Listen, again, talk to my wife. It has not been the easiest. Like, there's some people have like morning sickness for a little while. My wife has had all the time sickness for, for basically the whole time. It hasn't, it really never subsided. So, listen, whatever she says is the timeline. Yeah. I'm now, I'm now patient, I'm willing to do whatever it is. I just wanna, I just wanna see what it feels like to meet this one. Yeah, it's, uh, it's amazing.

• 50:12Ryan Clark?

  As somebody, as somebody that, that has, you, you'll actually be surprised that you can love multiple people that much. And in a world that is extremely conditional, that sort of unconditional love is honestly strange.

• 50:29Speaker 03

  For whatever reason, that, that little girl and daddy thing is a crazy love. It's nuts.

• 50:33Ryan Clark?

  The difference is, cause I have, I have both, I mean, we all do. It's the, the level of compassion, care and sensitivity you have to have, which in a lot of life, you probably don't, you have it automatically. You know, there was, like, and my girls, no. Like, there are a lot of things we could disagree on. I could believe that this is the right decision, you could believe that that's the right decision. You are my daughter, like, you are my child, and that's never changing. And, like, to have that feeling in a world where it's like, nah, there's something you can do to make me not wanna talk to you. Right? Them too, like, everybody, right? You were in a, a marriage, and there was.

• 51:17Speaker 03

  There was something that could happen.

• 51:18Ryan Clark?

  There was something that could happen, that could say, you know what? Though I've pledged my life to you, that has to change.

• 51:24Speaker 03

  Yes.

• 51:24Ryan Clark?

  It doesn't change with them. And I think to, to, to feel that, and honestly, to me, to know that level of love was the first time I understood the love of God.

• 51:37Ryan Clark?

  Right? That when people would tell me growing up, no, you can repent, no, you can have changed behavior, and if you have those things, then you can experience life with Christ. I was like, that makes no sense, right? Cause the devil's job was to shame me into not believing I could go do that. And then when you have a kid, you're like, man, this little mother F could do anything. And it doesn't matter, I'm gonna love her, I'm gonna love him, and I think that's the beauty.

• 52:01Speaker 03

  You see it all the time, when you see, anytime there's a court case, right? And there's some horrible crime. You still see that family there crying for the person who perpetrated that crime.

• 52:13Speaker 03

  Like, it's, it's, I know, I'm fa- I'm fascinated by it. I'm a little scared. I hear a lot of stories about men freaking out in the delivery room just a bit. I cannot do that. I have a lot of pre- I, I, I cannot do that. Um, so that part scared, did you freak out?

• 52:30Channing Crowder?

  No, no, no, no, no, no, no. I didn't freak out. Three kids. I'mma tell you, though. There's the danger zone on the other side of that curtain.

• 52:40Speaker 03

  You were, you stayed up top or you went down low?

• 52:42Channing Crowder?

  I was down.

• 52:43Speaker 03

  You went down low?

• 52:44Channing Crowder?

  And people told me just stay up, be on a kiss.

• 52:46Speaker 03

  I'm plan- my current plan is to stay up.

• 52:48Channing Crowder?

  If you stay up, I went down and then seeing the crowning is what they call it, didn't freak me out.

• 52:55Speaker 03

  Didn't freak you out?

• 52:55Channing Crowder?

  The baby popped out. Didn't freak me out. Little Chan, 13-year-old. Then I have 11 and a four. I've seen it three times.

• 53:01Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 53:02Channing Crowder?

  There's an act two. After birth. To the birth. When that, what's that shit called? After birth. Placenta? That placenta fall, don't watch that shit fall out. First one, bro, I'm not gonna lie. I'm good, son. Went over, kissed him and all, laying in the little egg warmer. And just coincidentally, I turned back.

• 53:24Speaker 03

  No!

• 53:25Channing Crowder?

  When that afterbirth fell out. And I didn't believe it. Like, people like, oh, I'm, I get, I got faint. And people like, my knees got weak. I never believed in that. I'm like, tighten up, bro. You're a grown ass man. I saw that, that big ball of snot fall out.

• 53:44Channing Crowder?

  So my wife's on the table, they're getting her together, you know, she just gave birth to a, she, she put a watermelon out of a lemon.

• 53:51Speaker 03

  Yup.

• 53:51Channing Crowder?

  And my big ass is sitting in the corner with a rag on my head.

• 53:56Channing Crowder?

  So I'm telling you, you could watch the baby, but.

• 53:58Speaker 03

  But they get out.

• 53:59Channing Crowder?

  Don't act two is the nastiest shit you'll ever see in your life.

• 54:02Speaker 03

  Were you down low or up top? I was down low. You were down low? Yeah. Down low or top?

• 54:06Channing Crowder?

  Both, both.

• 54:07Speaker 03

  You've done both?

• 54:07Channing Crowder?

  Yeah.

• 54:08Speaker 03

  What do you recommend?

• 54:09Fred Taylor?

  He eat chitlins, I don't know why, just scared of act two.

• 54:11Channing Crowder?

  I eat chitlins, I clean animals, man, I skin animals I hunt, no. Don't watch act two of that bird.

• 54:19Ryan Clark?

  Honestly, too, though, you just gotta have like the understanding of what you're there for. Right, right, and, and once you, once you put it all together that the entire thing is the beauty of bringing your child into the world, like, yeah, it's, it's gross, but it's life.

• 54:33Speaker 03

  I feel like, I feel like you can't go wrong either way. I feel like being there is important. Like, if I'm, I'm gonna be there no matter what. If I'm up top and I'm able to be closer to her where I can like be with her.

• 54:42Fred Taylor?

  You'll be there for that, for sure.

• 54:44Speaker 03

  I, I think that would be a great contribution by me. I think I could really do great. This whole idea of I need to bring the baby into the world, as long as babies have been coming into this world, there have been people to help bring the baby into the world. So if I don't, I don't have to be the man to grab the child, I can see her moments.

• 55:01Ryan Clark?

  Heath Miller, the tight end from the Steelers. He passed out.

• 55:06Speaker 03

  He passed out?

• 55:06Ryan Clark?

  He passed out, and if you know anything about Pittsburgh sports, like Heath Miller was much more important than a new baby. Right, and so when he passed out.

• 55:15Speaker 03

  People were worried.

• 55:16Ryan Clark?

  When he passed out, everybody ran to him, like the nurses, the doctors, everybody ran to him, and his wife Katie's just on the table. Like, just living life. We trying to, hey, we trying to win a Super Bowl. We trying to win a Super Bowl, bro.

• 55:29Fred Taylor?

  My advice going back to it would be stay up top, comfort her, cause she's gonna be going through it. And then they're gonna give you the scissors to go and cut the umbilical cord.

• 55:38Speaker 03

  And, and cut it.

• 55:39Fred Taylor?

  And then just slightly gradually move over, cut it, they're gonna hand you and her the baby and the rest is history, bro.

• 55:45Speaker 03

  I gotta tell you, I never thought in my life that I'd maybe take some of the most important life advice from a man who I watched run the football successfully so many times.

• 55:55Speaker 03

  Against my own team, by the way. Never, never, you know, I, I never thought, but that sounds like sage advice.

• 56:01Fred Taylor?

  I mean, I think you guys would agree, right? It'll, it'll happen naturally.

• 56:05Speaker 03

  But I like that, I like that idea, though.

• 56:07Fred Taylor?

  It'll happen naturally.

• 56:08Speaker 03

  The cutting's not that gross, right? I'm gonna be, you know, I sound really soft, I'm excited about all of it, my wife is a champion, I'm gonna do all the right things, whatever she says, I got this. And that's my point.

• 56:19Ryan Clark?

  I do think after people listen to this, they gonna be like, man, this man was crying on the elevator. He ain't want people to know his name. He scared to cut the bill before. Like, it's gonna be all under your comments now. Every time you say something remotely tough on the radio, they gonna be like, man, you was that, you was going, what's his name, Paul? Is that you was going see Paul crying, man? They know you ain't tough.

• 56:41Speaker 03

  Nah, we good. What you crying at? No, by the way, I think at this point, we have a joke, so I do a hip hop podcast with my old partner Cypher Sounds, called One E. And we had a growing, a joke that built over time of me going, you know, I'm divorced, because I talked about it for a while. It was like my, my, my, you know, it was like I survived war when I got through that thing, which again, may be a sign of a privileged life. And the one thing I've been learning about watching my wife go through pregnancy, if men deliver children, your, this podcast, The Pivot, it would only be talking about everybody's experience doing it. Like, the level of war that they're going through and knowing what we're like as men, it would be our war story every day. Like, a stranger would come up, like, yo, you wanna hear about the time I gave birth?

• 57:26Speaker 03

  It was, we would never stop.

• 57:30Ryan Clark?

  It's an old saying in Louisiana, though, that giving birth is like having one foot in the grave, one on banana peel.

• 57:36Speaker 03

  That's, that's a saying?

• 57:37Ryan Clark?

  It's a saying.

• 57:39Speaker 03

  Sounds about right.

• 57:40Ryan Clark?

  Yeah, they say, they say, like, they say it's close to death. And, I mean, not to be morbid, but there's a lot of women who have been there because of giving birth. Like, it's a real thing.

• 57:50Speaker 03

  Right, well, that's the thing that makes the whole thing scary, right? It's this beautiful thing, it's life, but it's also a real medical thing.

• 57:56Ryan Clark?

  Yes.

• 57:56Speaker 03

  Which is this underlying thing of like, as excited as I am, obviously I still have nerves, you know? They literally say, the phrase is literally, counting chickens before they hatch. That's literally what the phrase is, right? So like, the whole thing, it's amazing and it's beautiful, but you go into it scary. And especially if you've gone through a long journey, and the IVF journey is a, is a long journey. And like, obviously, I talked about my path of infertility and wanting to have children. My wife is the one who had to sit there giving herself shots, day after day after day, the hormones. You know, this whole process, when you, when you do IVF, your pregnancy feels like it lasts forever. It's not nine months. It's the shot. She did rounds of IVF a couple of months.

• 58:40Speaker 03

  It's basically been a year straight of kind of acting pregnant. So like, yeah, you got that. Once you get there, it's like, oh, my God. It's the culmination of all these things. Not only are you dying inside of like, oh, my God, I'm so excited to meet this child, but also there is that real like, this is a medical thing. I'm in a hospital. It's a little bit scary. There's a lot there, guys. So like, I'm excited, but I'm not gonna lie to you. Yeah, like, when it's time, it's definitely gonna be go time.

• 59:05Fred Taylor?

  Yeah, it's so much we can unwrap, but I won't do that to you.

• 59:09Speaker 03

  Yeah, not today.

• 59:09Fred Taylor?

  Because this thing is already at the head. So I'll ask you the question we always ask. But do enjoy the journey. It's gonna be even more beautiful after she's here.

• 59:20Speaker 03

  Thank you.

• 59:21Fred Taylor?

  Right, you're gonna have to... That's when the game really starts. But your biggest pivot in life, what will you look at as that defining moment that you can say, without this happening, I wouldn't be who I am today?

• 59:36Speaker 03

  Man. Honestly, it really goes back to what we had spoken about earlier. You know, like, if I hadn't, if I hadn't figured out how to move forward from my past, you know, and really get mentally right and emotionally right. Because, you know, the demons that led to the end of my marriage were still things that I needed to deal with. The constant quest for validation, the seeking out of outside sources to try to make myself feel whole, the trying to fill a hole that could just not be filled, you know? And I needed a lot of help to get there. And by the way, it's a work in progress forever.

• 1:00:20Speaker 03

  Like, that's what the journey is. It is forever gonna be... I will always be in program of one way or another. I will always be in therapy of one way or another. I will always be seeking fellowship with other people who understand what it's like. You know, my journey was not one of alcohol or drugs, but it was an addiction of needing to be validated by other people. And if I hadn't found that and found other people who could help me... The gentleman Paul I was referring to among them, understand like what I was seeking out. I wouldn't be able to be living the life that I'm living with Natalie now. You know, I live a life of complete and rigorous honesty now. You know, my wife has my, my wife has every code of mine. She's, I mean, there's no, you know,

• 1:01:05Speaker 03

  I don't have to report on her to all of my moves or conversations or words, but I chose a life of rigorous honesty and to stop seeking out outside validation. And I think we live in a world right now with social media and the amount that all of us, particularly men, are exposed to and seeing constantly. The temptation, the DMs, the comments, the little bit here, a little bit there, the little hit of validation there and here, especially when you're in the public eye. And you know, obviously, you guys are a little different. Maybe Ryan would get a little bit more. I don't know if you guys ever intended for this, but for those of us who intended to be in front of the camera, we obviously already had some desire for validation.

• 1:01:50Speaker 03

  Like that's built into who we are. It drives us in some ways. But that could quickly turn on its head and become a really bad and dangerous thing. So, long way of answering, by realizing that that was a huge issue. That was the biggest pivot for me. And, and it, it truly now has brought me to a place of peace. I wake up, I wake up with my conscience so clear, guys. Anyone out there listening right now who's ever done any, any sort of dirt in your life, the feeling when you wake up and don't feel anything, but I've been a good, honorable man who everyone in my life would be proud of today. To me, that, that's the only way to live, you know?

• 1:02:29Ryan Clark?

  That's a wrap, man. That's a bar. I appreciate you, my dog. That was awesome, man.

• 1:02:35Speaker 03

  Thank you so much, man. You guys are quite good at this. I think this, I think this podcast is gonna work out for you. Thank you, man.

• 1:03:18Speaker 06

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