850 Tony Gonzalez: What it Takes to Become The Greatest of All Time

THE CRITICS ARE COMING. People understand that there will be challenges and fear when they chase their dreams. But they’re not willing to be embarrassed. Are you willing to look like a fool? To go all-in and fail? It’s a guarantee when you go after the thing you want. You have to keep putting your head out there knowing that it could get chopped off. The more you face your fears, the more self-confidence you’ll have. You will fall. You need to have the grit to use it as fuel to get back up. On today’s episode of The School of Greatness, I talk about relentlessly pursuing your passion with one of the most successful football players in history: Tony Gonzalez. Tony Gonzalez is a Pro Football Hall of Famer, retired All-Pro NFL Tight end, and father of four. He is currently an analyst on Fox NFL’s pregame show. During his career, he only missed two games and lost only two fumbles on 1,327 touches. Tony is open about his struggles with depression and self-doubt that he might not be good enough. But by working through these emotions, he has come out a more authentic and heart-centered person. So get ready to learn how to get into the flow of life on Episode 850. Some Questions I Ask: How do you get connected to the heart when there is so much ego? (8:00) When did you experience the most self-doubt? (16:00) How do people stop caring what people think about them? (31:30) Who was the most influential for you growing up? (43:00) In This Episode You Will Learn: How to get into the flow (6:00) How to use criticism as fuel (20:00) About Tony’s struggle to transition from football to commentary (22:00) An exercise for opening your heart (32:00) About the letters Tony wrote himself before games (35:00) How to parent with your heart (52:00) If you enjoyed this episode, check out the video, show notes and more at http://www.lewishowes.com/850 and follow at instagram.com/lewishowes Get more from Lewis! Get my New York Times Bestselling book, Make Money Easy! Get The Greatness Mindset audiobook on SpotifyText Lewis AIYouTubeInstagramWebsiteTiktokFacebookX

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Lewis Howes?

  This is episode number 850 with NFL Hall of Famer Tony Gonzalez. Welcome to the School of Greatness. My name is Lewis Howes, former pro athlete turned lifestyle entrepreneur. And each week, we bring you an inspiring person or message to help you discover how to unlock your inner greatness. Thanks for spending some time with me today. Now let the class begin.

• 0:32Lewis Howes?

  Helen Keller said, "Avoiding danger is no safer in the long run than outright exposure. The fearful are caught as often as the bold." I am super excited about this interview with my man, Tony Gonzalez. We just got back a week ago from the Summit of Greatness, and it was the four-year anniversary of the Summit of Greatness. An incredible weekend. Thousands of people flew in from around the world, and I'm so grateful. I'm still on a high reflecting on what that weekend was like. If you enjoyed that weekend, I've been seeing so many people posting about it on Instagram and Twitter.

• 1:11Lewis Howes?

  It was just a powerful time, and it shows me how powerful and inspiring this community is. Coming together, creating lifelong friendships. People were coming who had gotten engaged, meeting previous years, business partnerships, building seven-figure businesses in the last couple of years. So much inspiration. So I just want to say thank you for everyone who came. And if you haven't got your ticket for next year, we've already sold 2,000 tickets in the first week for next year. Go to summatofgreatness.com, check it out, and I can't wait to get back there and see all of you in person. Just amazing. So thank you guys so much. I am pumped about my man, Tony Gonzalez.

• 1:53Lewis Howes?

  I've got to spend some good time with him over the last six months, and he's actually my next-door neighbor. He lives about a couple of blocks away, in a much nicer home than mine. But he is just such an inspiration and such a good guy, a great husband. Great father and one of the greatest of all time, former NFL tight end, who was just inducted in the Pro Football Hall of Fame this year. He was a 14-time Pro Bowl selection and holds the NFL record for total receiving yards by a tight end and the second all-time in receptions. And following retirement, Tony became an analyst on CBS's NFL pregame show,

• 2:35Lewis Howes?

  NFL Today, where he worked until the end of 2016 season. And he's currently an analyst for Fox NFL's pregame show, Big Time. And he's got a brand new podcast called Wide Open. He dives deep into conversations with the brightest minds and worlds of business and entertainment to discuss health, wellness, and mindset. Make sure to check out Wide Open. In today's interview, we dive in deep as well. We go wide open and talk about how Tony stays open with his heart in an ego-filled industry and how he differentiates himself by staying in that heart-centered space. Talk about visualization, discipline, and other tools to finding your routine for success.

• 3:18Lewis Howes?

  Facing your fears to figure out what you really want in life. The things Tony wishes he had done differently for his team and how it has transformed him as a leader and a father. And the greatest lessons he's learned from his wife and his children. We dive into that and so much more. I am super pumped. Make sure to share this with your friends. Episode number 850. Make sure to text this to one friend, lewishouse.com/850. Post it on your Instagram story and tag Tony Gonzalez as well, as I'm sure he'd love to hear your thoughts about this.

• 3:53Lewis Howes?

  Welcome everyone to the School of Greatness Podcast. We've got Hall of Famer Tony Gonzalez in the house. My man, good to see you, brother. Good to see you. Super excited about this. We got connected, uh, when was it, a couple of months ago? A few months ago? I don't know. How did we get connected? I was thinking about that on the way over here. Someone made an email intro. It was Catherine Woodward-Thomas, I believe. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm not sure where you met her originally, but she had come on the show like years ago and, and. For people out there, because Catherine Woodward, she does. She's a therapist. The therapist, yeah. She's a therapist that does marriage counseling and things like that, I believe, still. But I remember I went to a session with her like five years ago.

• 4:31Speaker 01

  Uh huh.

• 4:31Lewis Howes?

  When I was going through a breakup, a couple girlfriends ago. I'm trying to figure out what was wrong with me.

• 4:37Speaker 01

  You got a lot of girlfriends, huh? That's probably one thing that's wrong.

• 4:40Lewis Howes?

  I know. It's finding the right girlfriend, which I think I found right now. So I remember going to her because I was just like, am I broken? What's wrong with me? Why am I attracted to these women? What's, you know? What do I need to work on in my inner stuff? And she was amazing.

• 4:52Speaker 01

  Uh huh. Yeah, she was great. I, I'd met her at a Mine Valley event.

• 4:56Lewis Howes?

  Okay, yeah.

• 4:56Speaker 01

  Which is Vishen Lakyan.

• 4:58Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, he's great.

• 4:59Speaker 01

  And I've become friendly with him. So anyways, yeah, that whole room was filled with people like her.

• 5:02Lewis Howes?

  Amazing people.

• 5:03Speaker 01

  It was good room to be in.

• 5:03Lewis Howes?

  Yeah. She connected us over email, I guess.

• 5:06Speaker 01

  Yeah, because she was just talking to me. And so I had seen your stuff before, School of Greatness on, on the, on YouTube. You know, I'm, I'm a big YouTube guy.

• 5:14Lewis Howes?

  Sure.

• 5:14Speaker 01

  And so I've been admiring your stuff for a long time. And then it's funny how you meet somebody and she's like, you know, somebody that you kinda remind me of is.

• 5:23Lewis Howes?

  This big jock guy?

• 5:24Speaker 01

  Yeah. And she goes, yada, yada. And I go, yeah, yeah. And she.

• 5:28Lewis Howes?

  That's how.

• 5:28Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's cool.

• 5:29Lewis Howes?

  So. So, so we connected over email. Final, I think it came, we met up for lunch and then it came over to your place a few times and.

• 5:37Speaker 01

  Yeah, I used my cold tub.

• 5:38Lewis Howes?

  I did, man, because I was trying to. I, I know, I love that. I'm gonna come over more. It's got an amazing place. We have some things in common. You were an all-American football player.

• 5:47Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 5:47Lewis Howes?

  So was I. You went on to play in the NFL. I just played kinda semi-pro football, arena league.

• 5:53Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 5:53Lewis Howes?

  And we're both over six-four.

• 5:55Speaker 01

  Both over six-four.

• 5:55Lewis Howes?

  And we both hold football records.

• 5:57Speaker 01

  Really? What, what records, uh, do you hold?

• 6:00Lewis Howes?

  Well, I mean, I've got some school records at small schools that don't mean anything. You've got actual NFL records, but, uh, I still hold the record for the most receiving yards in a single game.

• 6:09Speaker 01

  Really? At your high school?

• 6:10Lewis Howes?

  In college.

• 6:11Speaker 01

  In college?

• 6:12Lewis Howes?

  And it was an all-division record, four hundred eighteen yards in one game.

• 6:15Speaker 01

  Get the hell out of here. You had four hundred eighteen yards in one game.

• 6:18Lewis Howes?

  For ten years, it was, uh, maybe eleven years, it was an all-division record. I don't think anyone in pro had ever done it, or high school, or college. And then someone in D2 broke it like four years ago.

• 6:29Speaker 01

  How the hell did you have four hundred eighteen yards in one game?

• 6:31Lewis Howes?

  You know what's crazy? At the end of the game, we lost. I scored, we scored, I scored four touchdowns. I scored like a two-point conversion. I was kicking field goals and extra points. I was like punting, kicking off defense. I was doing everything. It was D3. And they had two or three guys on me and I remember at the end, I was so focused on the loss that I thought, I was like, yeah, I had a good game. Maybe I had like 150 yards like, and they were like, no, you had 418 yards. And I was like, are you sure the stats weren't messed up? It was like 17 catches, 418 yards. And it was one of those games, I'm sure you've had this where I just felt like no one could stop me. I just said, throw me the ball. I mean, every receiver says, throw me the ball all the time. But I was just like in the zone. They had one guy on me, then two, then the safety over top. And it was just like, it was always perfect placement.

• 7:15Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 7:16Lewis Howes?

  I just caught the ball.

• 7:17Speaker 01

  Isn't that a good place to be?

• 7:18Lewis Howes?

  It's amazing, man.

• 7:19Speaker 01

  That's, that's the place that I try to get. Daily, can you get into that?

• 7:24Lewis Howes?

  That zone.

• 7:25Speaker 01

  Zone, that flow, that heart, that whatever. Can you do that daily? Is what I'm after. That's the question I always have for people. Always. Always. Cause I felt like that during games.

• 7:35Lewis Howes?

  Yeah. How did you get into that? And when did you know that you weren't into it?

• 7:39Speaker 01

  You get into it, first of all, at each level. You know, as you keep leveling up, you, you have those type of games. I mean, you're a kid out there and I remember being back in, in junior high playing basketball. I was a horrible football player, but in basketball, I was like, okay, this is something I can do. And where you feel unstoppable and you are, you are unstoppable in that moment. And then you level up and then you start getting your ass kicked again. And then you start developing and then you start kicking ass again. And then, you know, you keep going up. And then when you get to the professional ranks, I didn't feel like that ever for the first two years of my career. And I've talked about the story before where the whole reason, I think I'm, the only reason I'm sitting here is because I went through that shitty time after my second year where I led the NFL and dropped passes. It was bad. Look at the Hall of Fame speech if

• 8:22Speaker 01

  you want to know more about that. But that, that was kind of my transformation, uh, uh, power of crisis, you know, as the quote goes.

• 8:30Lewis Howes?

  You led the NFL and dropped passes?

• 8:32Speaker 01

  Led the NFL and dropped passes.

• 8:33Lewis Howes?

  Do you remember how many it was?

• 8:34Speaker 01

  16. Oh, yeah. And then I remember my, uh, my offensive coordinator named Jimmy Ray, who was amazing, a great guy. But that year, he was in front of the whole team. He goes,

• 8:46Speaker 01

  You've you dropped 16 balls this year and you've probably led to 32 missed opportunities for this whole team or something like that. He's like, you gotta step it up. Uh, and and that was kind of, you know, that was deep into my depression during that year.

• 9:00Lewis Howes?

  In front of everyone.

• 9:01Speaker 01

  In front of everybody, in front of everybody.

• 9:02Lewis Howes?

  That's amazing.

• 9:03Speaker 01

  And that's the thing about sports that is so great. It doesn't matter what sport you play, but you you are on full blast. Uh, whether I don't care if you're in Pop Warner High School, it doesn't matter what level. You can be on your your rec team at your local YMCA.

• 9:15Lewis Howes?

  Yep.

• 9:16Speaker 01

  It it doesn't lie. I mean,

• 9:18Lewis Howes?

  You drop a ball, everyone sees it.

• 9:19Speaker 01

  You drop the ball, that's you. And so it's embarrassing if you're the type of person, I mean, there's guys you can call out and think like, I don't give a shit. But for me, it meant something to me because I really wanted to be good at it. But I was I was in the wrong place. I was in my head and I was working my ass off. I was working hard and I was logical about my approach. I'm like, okay, well, I'm gonna go five steps and then cut it in and cut it out. But you can't play that way. I mean, when the ball snapped, I think just like anything, when you were playing that game and you had 418 yards, you're not thinking about the next play, you're not thinking about the last play. Uh, you're not thinking about what the crowd thinks, you're not thinking about your steps. It's like you're just just going, you're just going. And for me, over the years, I

• 10:00Speaker 01

  learned how to put myself in that zone, in that flow, uh, where I could get there pretty quickly when I needed to. Uh, now, I mean, you you're gonna have bad games, but you'll you'll be consistent if you can get into that state. And that's one of the proudest things that I am of my career is that I was able to stay, I was consistent. I I think that's the hallmark of greatness, is consistency.

• 10:22Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, you missed like two games your whole career.

• 10:24Speaker 01

  Yeah, I missed two games. But even when I played, like, you could count on me that I'm gonna catch probably around

• 10:29Lewis Howes?

  Eight balls.

• 10:30Speaker 01

  75 to 85 balls a year. I'm gonna have close to 1,000 yards. I'm gonna have almost 10 touchdowns. It's a year in and year out. And I knew that, no matter what. Uh, that's what I was gonna bring. It's because I was able to to get myself into that that mental and that heart connection, you know, that that's that's what you have to connect.

• 10:47Lewis Howes?

  How do you get into that after the two years of dropping everything and being humiliated, humiliated in front of the team and

• 10:53Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 10:54Lewis Howes?

  feeling disconnected? How do you get connected to the heart after that in an industry that is all about ego?

• 11:00Speaker 01

  Well, I think sometimes, at least for me, and and and you've probably noticed this more than me, because you've been at this game where you're interviewing these these movers and shakers. Majority of people, they have that story of Of just depression, that that story of like it all went to shit for me. And where, you know, you stop believing in yourself and you suck and you're just not good. Where it can bring you to your knees.

• 11:26Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 11:26Speaker 01

  And that's what happened to me. I was brought to my knees.

• 11:29Lewis Howes?

  Literally or figuratively?

• 11:30Speaker 01

  Literally where, I mean, there's clips of me dropping another ball and just hitting the earth, the grass out of frustration. And I would go home that night and I would be crying in my room, drinking a bunch of alcohol and crying and just spiraling out of control. And a lot of people, maybe they don't, they go through it differently, but I think that's, that's part of the process. I mean, that's part of you coming face to face with who you really are. And what is, what are you gonna do about it now? And I think from there, that's how you learn. Uh, at least that created a, a real hunger for me to go out and actually study the great ones, you know, study the people that have had great success. Because it leaves clues.

• 12:15Speaker 01

  I don't know who quoted that. That's not my original. Success leaves clues.

• 12:17Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 12:18Speaker 01

  Uh, but whoever said that was, it's wise. Because the formula for success is there. But we all have these stories that you can, I'll come in here and I can tell you my story. There's underlying, like there's always stories of jealousy, there's stories of, okay, I'm not good enough, there's stories of, of I don't have what it takes and you, and the self doubt and all that, envy and all that stuff wrapped up in different stories. And that's just mine. And I was able to start reading books, reading about people's lives, biographies. Uh, then you start reading mind, body and spirit, those type of books, books I like to read. And then learn in the, from that. And then you start learning how to, to use vision. You know, close your eyes. That's really been, that helped me a lot.

• 13:02Speaker 01

  Was just getting to where every morning and every night, kind of the first thought on, on my brain was, okay, how am I gonna get better at what I do? I, I, maybe that's, that's a feeling of love too. Of like, I love playing football. I don't love practicing per se, but I love catching footballs. And I fell in love with that. And I fell in love with the process of what it takes to be great. I came up with this routine of success. I called it that. That was my routine of success. And I did the numbers. I wish I had them. I should have brought them. But just to put it in perspective, because I fell in love with the sport. Because if you're not in love with what you do. You're gonna have to use a lot of discipline.

• 13:45Speaker 01

  And I always say, if you love what you do, the need for discipline will disappear. Hmm. Uh, discipline is great in a lot of areas of life and you need it. But when it comes to what you are doing for a living. You're excited to go. You wanna be excited. You wanna be like, okay, yeah, it's a grind and I'm working my ass off, but where else would I rather be? And so I went from catching maybe thirty balls a practice, which as a receiver, you know this. Uh, most guys go out there, they'll catch about ten balls to warm up. And then throughout practice, as a starter, if you're one of the main guys who catches balls on the team, you'll catch seven balls at the most during practice. At the most. The play doesn't fall apart if everything goes your way.

• 14:27Speaker 01

  We're talking seven on seven. Uh, you're not catching anything nine on seven. Like really, you don't catch that many ball. And then after practice, everybody goes in. So I'm catching maybe thirty balls like the rest of the NFL does. Believe it or not, that's all they catch a day. Where I said, you know what? I gotta come up with a different routine. Cause Michael Jordan does this. Michael Jordan gets a thousand shots. You know, Kobe Bryant gets three thousand makes. Makes, not shots. Makes. Three thousand makes a day? Something, that's what I read. Wow. You know, you see, you, like I said, this, those, you wanna be like Jerry Rice. This is what I started studying Jerry Rice's routine. I'm like. Freak. I'm like, holy shit, these guys are, are putting in overtime. And, but you have to love what you do in order to do that. Otherwise you'll quit. You'll do, I've had guys that watch me and they go, oh, I wanna do what you do. And they quit. They'll do it for about two, three weeks.

• 15:12Speaker 01

  It's because they haven't fallen, fallen in love with some aspect of the game. And if you don't do that, you won't, you won't do it. So I caught thirty balls. I went from catching thirty balls a day to now catching probably three hundred balls a practice. And you add that up. And the difference, I did it over my career. I remember this number, it's somewhere around this number. If after that third year, so fifteen years, I played seventeen years, after that going in for my third year to the end of my career, if I would've kept doing the routine that I did before, I would've caught twenty thousand balls over my career. That's including practice and then games or whatever. Who knows?

• 15:47Lewis Howes?

  Thirty balls a day.

• 15:49Speaker 01

  At thirty balls a day. The way I did it now, since I'm catching three hundred over the four days a week or whatever it is, and don't do, I have the numbers. So people out there are like, ah, that math doesn't add up. Math's not my strong suit, but I did it. It was like two hundred and forty-five thousand balls.

• 16:04Lewis Howes?

  Wow.

• 16:05Speaker 01

  So you just do the math, twenty thousand to two hundred and forty thousand dollars, uh, balls caught over a fifteen year span.

• 16:12Lewis Howes?

  Wow.

• 16:13Speaker 01

  That's what will make you a Hall of Famer. But let's not just, let's not fool ourselves. You won't do that if you're not in love with your sport and you're not doing the vision, the, the confidence, uh, closing your eyes, putting yourself in that game speed, uh, that, that smell of the grass, looking up at the crowd, seeing the happiness from my coaches. Like I would do this before I even played the game. I do this with my kids and I have four kids and I do guided meditations and I've seen a result.

• 16:40Lewis Howes?

  Amazing.

• 16:40Speaker 01

  It changes everything when you play the game in your head before you go out there, but it has to come from your heart. And I try to open my heart when I do these visionary exercises or meditations or whatever you want to call it, because that's the most powerful thing on your body. That's what your coach always says. Get your head out of your ass. Get out of your mind. You're too in your mind and play with heart. And that's what that means. And that's, that's when you can get to that point and there's plenty of ways to do it. I have my ways and it like everything takes off.

• 17:11Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 17:12Speaker 01

  Everything takes off.

• 17:13Lewis Howes?

  Do you think you'd been a Hall of Famer if you just stuck to thirty balls a day?

• 17:16Speaker 01

  No.

• 17:17Lewis Howes?

  Cause, cause people would say, well, you're so talented. You're six, five, you're two hundred and fifty pounds. You've got to get natural athletic ability. You don't think you would have made it?

• 17:25Speaker 01

  No, I, well, judging off that year, I mean, I dropped all those balls doing it that way. And like I said, let's not mistake, don't act like I wasn't that guy who was out partying and, and chasing girls and stuff like that. I mean, I, I did a little bit of that, but I was in control. It was, it wasn't.

• 17:40Lewis Howes?

  You were disciplined, you were showing up.

• 17:42Speaker 01

  It wasn't hard. It wasn't because I wasn't working hard. I worked hard as soon as practice started, you know, for that two hours, I'd go out there and bust my ass, just like the rest of the guys on the team. But I didn't do anything before that and I didn't do anything after that. It was like, that was it. And then I'd go home and I'd be back in my regular, regular space where you can't do that. It doesn't, it doesn't work that way.

• 18:01Lewis Howes?

  It might get you in the league. It's not going to help you excel in your league, whatever industry you're, or business you're in.

• 18:06Speaker 01

  Whatever industry or business talent is, they say talent is overrated.

• 18:12Speaker 01

  And it really is, don't get me wrong, you need some talent and pick what you're good at. But if you want to be excellent, you want to be a mover and shaker, you want to be somebody that that has a legacy at what you do, if that's important to you, you this, this is the way to do it.

• 18:26Lewis Howes?

  When, after that third year, when did you face the most self doubt?

• 18:32Speaker 01

  Honest, honestly, after that, it self doubt never got in again.

• 18:37Lewis Howes?

  Wow, really?

• 18:38Speaker 01

  Never on the football field. Like I said, I was gonna, I was gonna go out there, it was all, it was all routine now.

• 18:46Lewis Howes?

  Big, big games, Monday night games, playoff, nothing.

• 18:49Speaker 01

  Never, ever, ever. In fact, the bigger the game, the more honed in I got, my better games came when the stage got brighter and bigger. In fact, you'll go from a point where now when the, when the games you're supposed to win, the level, the competition's not as high, that's, that's what you have to concentrate on.

• 19:07Lewis Howes?

  Oh yeah, because you bring your, your game down.

• 19:08Speaker 01

  Yeah, you want, you don't want to bring your game down, you have to excel. Uh, and I think it's all, it's all routine and, and just that Michael Jordan, Kobe, uh, Richard Branson, uh, Michael Jackson, he was another, I mean, I could, I could show you clips from Michael Jackson where he's like, I don't know where it comes from, he'll tell you. And that's how it is, you feel like that as an athlete, like you're just out there in that flow, it's just flowing through you. Uh, and I remember Michael Jackson, they were interviewing some of his dancers and, and they were talking about Michael's, how he prepares for each show. And they were saying, oh, Mike, I too, they would rehearse until two and three o'clock in the morning, they'd start around six

• 19:53Speaker 01

  o'clock at night and go till two, three in the morning, the same routine, the same routine, over and over. And then they know they got it. And then Michael back, come on, man, let's just do one more, let's just do one more. And I remember going, wow. And, and Michael even explained it, he's all, you just, you love it, like this is, now you are where, and, and the hard part is finding that, is finding that passion, finding that love. But I believe, especially for young people, if you just, you just gotta keep putting your head out there and be willing to get it chopped off, because it's gonna come. You could, I wrote a letter to my kids at the Hall of Fame. That that the critics are coming, the pain is coming. There's no, you have to go through that. That's where beauty is, or the fear. And I always talk about that, like, life takes

• 20:36Speaker 01

  off on the other side of fear. And you have to be able to, willing to sit there in it, and ride that wave.

• 20:42Lewis Howes?

  Yeah. When you started to get criticized a lot for maybe those first few years, and I'm sure you got criticized from the next 15 years after that for certain things, how did you face the judgment, the critiques, the, you know, he's washed up, or whatever, they, you know, different ages, you know?

• 21:00Speaker 01

  I love it. I mean, that's all fuel. When people tell you that you can't do something, for me, the way you take that and say, okay, well, I guess I got to show you that I can't do it. And, and, and when that self doubt comes, you, I got into a, a good place, a good rhythm, where for football, that doesn't matter. Now, and I'm sure we'll get to it. Now, the transition, after I get done playing, that's where all that, all that self doubt comes back, and that fear comes back, and the anxiety, it all come, it came back to me.

• 21:31Lewis Howes?

  Did you feel that right after you retired?

• 21:33Speaker 01

  You feel that, yeah, right after you retired. And I, and I had a job. I had, I mean, I went straight into, to working for CBS, being on national television, the main desk, that every job, uh, job that every player who wants to do television wants. But I had to go through the same thing again. I got beat to my knees again.

• 21:50Lewis Howes?

  Really?

• 21:51Speaker 01

  Huh. Yeah.

• 21:52Lewis Howes?

  How so?

• 21:53Speaker 01

  I remember I was, after my third year working for CBS, and I, and I loved it over there.

• 22:01Lewis Howes?

  Sing a theme here, three years.

• 22:02Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's funny. Three. It's funny. The same thing when I was younger, too. Two years of pop Warner football, and finally took off my third year in freshman year, three. But I was, um, I was, I made the transition, I'm working for CBS, I'm on the main desk. My contract is coming up, and I loved, I loved working there. It was shot out in New York, but I did not like getting on the plane, going back and forth. And even more than that, I wasn't giving them everything that I could give them. Uh, not because I wasn't trying either. I was trying.

• 22:29Lewis Howes?

  Meaning what?

• 22:30Speaker 01

  Working my ass off.

• 22:30Lewis Howes?

  What weren't you?

• 22:31Speaker 01

  Meaning, I wasn't coming from a place of, of, in my heart. I wasn't. Like on the football field, that flow never happened for me when I was over at CBS.

• 22:40Lewis Howes?

  It was kind of a little bit forced here and there.

• 22:42Speaker 01

  Forced. Oh, it was in my head the whole time. Like, hey, well, if I if I say this joke here and I punch it with this word, then it's gonna get a laugh. Or when I am talking about, you know, Rob Gronkowski running his routes, I'm gonna talk about it from this angle and you can do all that. Uh, but if it's not here, it comes off as rehearsed. It's it's it's not a good performance.

• 23:04Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 23:05Speaker 01

  Your performance, it's just not good. And it doesn't feel good to me. That sucks. I I was having anxiety before shows.

• 23:11Lewis Howes?

  Wow.

• 23:12Speaker 01

  And I don't want to feel that way. I mean, I don't get me wrong, you're gonna have that that excitedness. I mean, you need to have a little bit. That helps you run faster. That helps you perform better. You want you want a little butterflies. But mine was from fear. I was I was so scared that I was gonna screw up every time and scared of showing who I really am. Because what if that's not good enough? And so you work your ass off trying to to to do it funny or to do it with without stuttering or whatever it is. I mean, a lot of guys struggle. Just watch players that make that transition to TV. It is hard because you have to show who you are. You have to put everything out there, just like you're on a football field.

• 23:52Speaker 01

  Just like I'm talking to you right now, whatever. I don't care if you're a doctor, you're a lawyer, you're you're a construction worker. It's it's hard to let everybody see who you really are.

• 24:02Lewis Howes?

  It's even harder because it's your singular voice and you on camera, maybe with one or two other guys or girls, as opposed to a whole team, you know, twenty something people on a field being criticized. You can't hide as much.

• 24:17Speaker 01

  Can't.

• 24:17Lewis Howes?

  On camera, right?

• 24:18Speaker 01

  No, you can't hide it all. They're picking up everything.

• 24:20Lewis Howes?

  Voice, yeah.

• 24:21Speaker 01

  You can't.

• 24:21Lewis Howes?

  You don't have to speak on the field, but you just, you know, you just use your talents.

• 24:24Speaker 01

  And that's where a lot of people, it's like, well, on the football field, I can do, I can just be physical. But here, I gotta use my mind now and I got I you want it to be entertaining and you want to say something good and something profound. Uh, but that talk right there, it's like, shut up. Just shut up and go and just just speak, just talk. You know this game. And that's what I would tell all these guys. And they gave me this guy that I had to work with. I'm not gonna say his name, but it just wasn't for me because it just puts you more in your head. And maybe you have to go through that. But I remember I was, it hit me. I was sitting, uh, we're on vacation in Spain, just me and my wife sitting in in a in a courtyard in a cafe. She starts talking about the contract negotiations with CBS and I'm almost done with my contract negotiation and I'm gonna negotiate another three years.

• 25:08Lewis Howes?

  Wow.

• 25:09Speaker 01

  But I kinda don't wanna be there. And I never told her, I never told my management team or anybody else. And I'm sitting there and the wife's all, yeah, so you gotta be pretty happy with it. It was a good deal they offered me and I'm like, yeah, yeah.

• 25:22Lewis Howes?

  Good money, great deal, yeah.

• 25:24Speaker 01

  And all of a sudden, this wave of just fear came over me. Like my body started getting cold and I started sweating, but at the same time sweating. And I had like, I don't know if it's a nervous breakdown, but I was like, oh shit. And it was the feeling of fear, just like absolute fear. And the thought came into my head that, what if I peaked? What if the best of me is over? And that's a scary feeling to be in.

• 25:54Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 25:54Speaker 01

  I didn't, I did not like that. And I started, I started crying and she's like, what's wrong with you in the middle of Spain? And I'm not bawling or anything like that, but I, I started tearing up and I'm like, and she's all, I'm, I just don't know. I, I have, over the last three years, I have not felt how I felt, that aliveness, that excitement. I haven't felt it, felt it in three years.

• 26:19Lewis Howes?

  Wow.

• 26:19Speaker 01

  For what I do. Because, and this is a lot of football players go through this.

• 26:23Lewis Howes?

  A lot of pro athletes.

• 26:24Speaker 01

  Pro athletes.

• 26:25Lewis Howes?

  People transitioning into the next stage of life, yeah.

• 26:27Speaker 01

  Anybody transitioning.

• 26:28Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 26:28Speaker 01

  And because I've, I've talked about that. I've told that story before in front of groups. And after the show, I've had, um, men come up to me with tears in their eyes and they're like, I've felt that same way. I had a company that was successful for 10 years and then I made the transition out because I wanted something new.

• 26:45Lewis Howes?

  Even if you sell a company for a hundred million or whatever, it's like, now what?

• 26:49Speaker 01

  Where do you, and how do you get back? And then you doubt yourself. You're like, I'll never, I'll never be great again like I was on the football. And, and obviously I had a great career. It's like a Hall of Fame career and you're like, so now I never get to experience that again. And I'm forty years old at this time and I'm like, I got forty more years to live, fifty more years to live and I'm gonna be talking about football games, talking about old like.

• 27:13Lewis Howes?

  Thirty years from now, yeah.

• 27:14Speaker 01

  It was.

• 27:15Lewis Howes?

  Glory days.

• 27:16Speaker 01

  It was, it was a scary feeling and but I'm glad that that happened because off of that, uh, I called up my, my manager, Con- uh, Constance Schwartz, uh, and I called up my agent, my television agent, uh, Jim Ornstein, and I said, uh, hey, guys, I, I, I think I don't wanna, they're like, yeah, it's a good deal, it's good, we're on, we've been negotiating back and forth, it's over and they're like, I think I'm, I think I'm having second thoughts, I don't wanna do it. And, uh, they were both like, shut up. Yeah, right, right? My agent was like, this is a mistake. I mean, these jobs don't come along and you're, you're not gonna, you're not gonna get a job at Fox. I mean, that's Terry Bradshaw, Howie Long and Jimmy and.

• 27:53Lewis Howes?

  Strahan.

• 27:53Speaker 01

  And Strahan, like, it's, there's no room over there and, I mean, what are you gonna do? And I said, I don't know, but I can't, I cannot do this. I cannot live like this. I'm so tired of being afraid. Being afraid when I'm on air, uh, I'm tired of being away from my kids because that was getting to me, you know, flying back and forth to New York for twenty-six weeks a year from LA. That's, that's a long hike. And I was like, I'm, I'm, I'm out. I don't know what we're gonna do, but I gotta, something's gonna work. And that, that really changed my life. That was like another pinnacle moment in my life that I could either go this way or I can go that way. And I was like, I'm going that way. I'm gonna go to the road that I don't want the sheer thing,

• 28:34Speaker 01

  you know, I had people close to me, the loved ones are like, you're, are you a fool? Like, you can't, you can't walk away from that. And I'm like, well, something's gonna work. And that's what, that's where the phrase life takes off on the other side of fear. I was like, I am afraid right now. There's no doubt about it. This is scary. But I believe that's where the good stuff is. That's where the gold is. That's where the diamonds are made. That's where, that's where you will achieve greatness. If you go up to what you're afraid of, but you know in your heart you have to do.

• 29:06Speaker 01

  But you go anyway. I'm not talking about skydiving if that scares the out of you and you're like, I don't want to. But that's not in your heart anyway. You don't want to do that and it scares you. I'm talking about the stuff that you want to do, but you're scared to do, but you feel it. That's where you gotta go. And that's where you gotta have the, the cojones or whatever you want to call it, the mozzie, balls, whatever you want to call it. You gotta have that and go through that. And there's steps out there and there's people that will help you if you just ask for help. And there's books and there's School of Greatness podcast. There's wide open.

• 29:40Lewis Howes?

  Wide open, baby.

• 29:41Speaker 01

  My podcast, there's, it's all over the place. It's all around you. And the only thing that's stopping you is that fear and just go for it because that's where the beauty is.

• 29:53Lewis Howes?

  You know, I love that story and it's, I think it's so hard. I think people understand that there's going to be challenges and fear that they're going to have to face to have what they want. But I don't think they're willing to be that embarrassed or emotionally like insecure through being dropped to their knees. Because either way, you've got to drop to your knees.

• 30:10Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 30:10Lewis Howes?

  You've got to fail. You've got to look like an idiot or, you know, make fun of yourself or something's going to happen where you don't look good.

• 30:16Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 30:17Lewis Howes?

  When you go after the thing you want, right?

• 30:18Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 30:19Lewis Howes?

  Like you're gonna not look good. People are gonna make fun of you. They're gonna criticize you.

• 30:23Speaker 01

  People and, and sometimes the people that are criticizing you are your, your, your closest relatives, your loved ones, your husband, your wife. It's just, and it's done out of love too. They're like looking out for you.

• 30:32Lewis Howes?

  So how do people manage that emotionally internally, knowing that they're going to face criticism, judgment, embarrassment and being laughed at when they go after what they really want?

• 30:43Speaker 01

  The greatest thing is to understand that it is coming. So you're not shocked.

• 30:46Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 30:46Speaker 01

  Okay. Just know that, that, that, that, that rose, those roadblocks are coming and embrace it. And that's where I always say, close your eyes, calm your breathing down. This is what I did on the football field. And this is what it, what has dawned on me over the last couple of weeks is you already know how to do this, at least for me.

• 31:06Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 31:06Speaker 01

  And if you haven't learned, this is a great technique for me, is you close your eyes, slow your breathing down. Relax every part of your body. Do it one at a time. And then you open your heart up. And you say that I am opening my heart because when you're in your heart, there is no fear of judgment. There is purpose. There is authenticity. Uh, time will stand still when you're in your heart. And now you've opened up your heart now. Says love, peace, joy, just whatever you, that, that's what that means to me. There, and that's unshakable confidence in there too. And then you put in the vision of whatever it is that you want to do. See the highest version of yourself.

• 31:50Speaker 01

  See yourself dominating it, what you do. See yourself, see yourself in the moment saying the, the greatest thing that needs to be said. If you're a person who's a personality on TV or whatever it is, or making the great business deal.

• 32:02Lewis Howes?

  Or making the catch.

• 32:03Speaker 01

  Or making the catch and see that the, the happiness that that gives you, the happiness that gives the people around you. See yourself enjoying every aspect, the highest version of yourself, the greatest version of yourself. And to me, that takes, first of all, that can take five minutes or 20 minutes, whatever you want to do, but at least the very least, it's only takes five minutes. It's a great way to calm yourself and breathe. When you breathe slowly, deep breaths, you send a message of calmness to your body. When you're breathing fast and out of control, that's why I look at, you know, teammates and all this stuff. It's like, just watch Tom Brady in the fourth quarter zone.

• 32:39Lewis Howes?

  He's relaxed.

• 32:40Speaker 01

  They call it poise, whatever it is in the poet, what poise means to stand in the pocket. He's just breathing slowly and he's calm and he's fearless in that moment. And that's what you have to have. You have to be fearless and it's, who cares what people think? Tell yourself that I got what it takes. I got this over and over and over again, repetition. And they're proving this now with studies, meditation clinics, like self-talk is huge.

• 33:06Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 33:07Speaker 01

  It's huge and it works wonders. And then go out there and learn from the greats. Like I said, just YouTube it.

• 33:13Lewis Howes?

  That's it, man. So much easier now to learn these things because it's so available than when you were growing up, probably, right? I remember I had like one CD from some weird like doctor or psychologist that no one was really studying and I was just like grabbing onto anything I could find, but now that stuff's everywhere and accessible.

• 33:32Speaker 01

  Yeah. But there's much more judgment and criticism than ever than ever because everyone's online with a voice. Yeah. You know, and everyone can judge you online now as opposed to just at your school or in your, your company or at your work or something. But my thing is who gives a [BLEEP]. Yeah. I don't care. Yeah. How do people get to a place of not caring? That's a practice. A lot of people care about what other people, how they judge them. I was that person too. I've been that person. So how did you get from caring to not caring? And those are the people that are in their head, and that's me. I'm an in the head type guy. Yeah, yeah. You gotta get out of your head. And like we said, the coach says, play with your heart. But, and, and that's what that means. You know, I mean, you're, you're seeing a theme now from me talking about this, but if you're a person who's in your head, you have to work now.

• 34:17Speaker 01

  And just like anything else, it's like catching a football or doing a jump shot or doing a presentation, the more you do it, experience, experience is going to make you better. But the way you accelerate that experience into knowledge and wisdom is by letting go of what people think and letting go of what you think. Like really trying to put yourself in that flow, in that, in that spirit of calmness. That, that's how you do it. And it takes time. You're not gonna, more than likely, there's people that have that, you know, that overnight realization. They call that the transformative power of crisis. Go to Bag, I read a great book a long time ago and they, and you can get there. You can, you can do it. Um, maybe you can do it in one night with, people talk about psychedelics. Yeah.

• 35:01Speaker 01

  You can talk about journeys, talk about ayahuasca, you can talk about mush, psilocybin. Deep meditation. Deep meditation, you could do it. Rhythmic dancing, rhythmic breathing. There's places to. Chanting, whatever. Chanting, whatever. Sweat lodges. Sweat lodges, all that stuff. And there, there's ways to do it. Um, but ultimately, I think if you set the goal, you write it down, I believe in writing down all my stuff. Uh, and you see it every day. You read from that every day. You give yourself a blueprint for success that you wrote to yourself. I write myself, I used to write letters to myself the night before games. Oh, that's big. I used to write a whole letter, like you're here, they're doubting you. When I, I used to write, they're getting, you're getting old, you know, they're gonna be ready for you. You know, you're gonna have to be double teams tomorrow, but you got this because you're one of the greatest and you're one of the greatest that's ever, ever lived, ever to make this game.

• 35:46Speaker 01

  Give me chills now. Let's go. And, and so I'm writing this to myself. To me, this is from me to me.

• 35:54Lewis Howes?

  Would you read it later or would you just?

• 35:55Speaker 01

  I'd read it. It would be on my notes for the week. So I would sometimes I'd write that the beginning of the week when we get in there on Wednesday morning and I'd read it all week. And I would be like, I want six catches. I want two touchdowns. I want 125 yards or whatever it is. That's my goal. If I don't get it, I don't care.

• 36:08Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 36:09Speaker 01

  But that's what I'm going for.

• 36:09Lewis Howes?

  That's where your focus is.

• 36:10Speaker 01

  And I want to grade out 90%. So I do believe that when it comes to abundance, training or greatness, training, whatever it is, write where you want to be. Write, write out what your goals are. Uh, and then when you hit those goals, then it's time to reset it, baby. Let's go. Let's keep climbing. Let's keep leveling up. And let's keep ma- you know, in every aspect of your life. It's not just, uh, work. I mean, that's just a piece of the pie. It's a good piece, but you gotta do that with your relationships. And that's where I've missed the mark too before. You know, you gotta do that with your kids. You gotta do that with just strangers on the street, just looking people in the eye and, and connecting. It's so much more fun to be there. And the only reason you're not doing it, the only reason you're not doing it is because you're afraid of something.

• 36:53Speaker 01

  You're afraid to talk to the, to the neighbor or you're afraid to, to open yourself up to people. Uh, but the way you get out of that, if you want to get out of that, some people might be comfortable where they are. And go ahead. If that's comfortable where you're at, as long as you're not hurting anybody, I don't have a problem with you. But if you do want to get out of that, which I think most people do, that there, that's how you do it. Just set the goal and then practice every single day. Practice with the person in the elevator. Say hello. You know, you want to put yourself in fearful situations.

• 37:19Lewis Howes?

  Yep.

• 37:20Speaker 01

  And go through it. Just keep putting yourself in those fearful situations. Uh, and you'll keep leveling up. I promise you, there's, there's no, there's no doubt in my mind. It's already been proven.

• 37:29Lewis Howes?

  I know. This is a, I'm writing a new book about eliminating self doubt. And I think self doubt comes from people that aren't willing to put themselves through enough fear. Just like you said, you're saying everything that I'm talking about in my book where I tell people to give yourself a 30 day challenge of whatever the thing you're most embarrassed or insecure about and do that thing every day. Whether it is talking to the person in the elevator every day or talking to a stranger you would never talk to. But you gotta do it over and over until the fear disappears.

• 37:55Speaker 01

  Just like anything else.

• 37:57Lewis Howes?

  It's a jump shot. That's it, man.

• 37:58Speaker 01

  It's a jump shot.

• 37:58Lewis Howes?

  And when you get past that fear, you go to the next one.

• 38:00Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 38:01Lewis Howes?

  And you just keep doing it. And you become a kind of bulletproof, the more of those fears that you overcome.

• 38:05Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 38:05Lewis Howes?

  I think that's the key.

• 38:07Speaker 01

  I jumped out of a plane. That's scary. Last year. Yeah. That last year. Maybe I'll wait till I'm forty or something when I do that. Do you want to do it, though? I don't care to do it. Okay, well, then you probably shouldn't do it. Yeah. But for me, I've always wanted to jump out of a plane. I wanted to do a parachute. But I was scared shitless. Yeah. What if I don't know? You know? And so I finally did it. The opportunity came up and I was like. Were you terrified? I was, at first I said no, and then I thought about it. I said, you know what? I gotta do this. I got to do this. Yeah, I could die, but more like I'm not going to. Sure. But anyway, long story short, you're flying up there. The hardest part about jumping out of a plane is you're scared the whole time. You're nervous and anxiety and all that stuff. But when you're up at thirteen thousand feet, whatever it is, and then they open that door.

• 38:52Speaker 01

  Oh, my gosh, man. And you're like. You're like, I'm about to jump out of a damn plane. Like, this is about to happen. Wow. And you're scared. My heart was going so fast. And I was the first one out. Oh, man. Which I'm glad. That's good. I don't watch other people. Send me back down. Send me back down. And I was like, screw it. Let's go. And you jump out. And by the way, when you do go through that fear, you always find out that it's not as bad as you thought it was gonna be. And the cool thing of that, I did it with the Golden Knights, which are experts at this. Right. And they're jumping, and some guy jumps out and he's videotaping you. And he's looking the whole time and he starts doing this, like, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And I'm like, you're right. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I'm enjoying it and I'm jumping out.

• 39:35Speaker 01

  But when I got to the bottom of that, when I landed and I got on the earth.

• 39:41Speaker 01

  Safe and sound, I was. Something clicked in me that I was like, I got this. Because I've been wanting to do this my whole life and I was scared to do this. And I did it. And it really changed my life. Like, I was like, I think everybody. It's mandatory. Oh, man. Jump out of a plane. You talk about facing your fear. Um, most people are probably scared to do that, but it was exhilarating. It was awesome. Uh, would I do it again? Maybe. I'll tell you right now, probably not, but, cause I already did it once. Yeah. Uh, but maybe I'd do it again. I, I, I'm telling you. What opened up for you after that? What, what changed? I felt like I could do anything. I remember I walked in the room, uh, with all the guys, cause it was an air force base. It was for Fox.

• 40:26Speaker 01

  And, um, and I remember they're like, how was it? How was it? And Michael Strahan. Did he went with you? No, he didn't go. He said he couldn't go. He said he wanted to go, but he couldn't go. And I said, man, I feel like I can do anything. I feel like I can honestly, I feel like I can do anything. And he's like, all right, do a backflip. And I'm like, well, that doesn't count, cause I don't want to do a backflip. Right, right. Anything you want to do. But I mean, like, like you really feel I can accomplish anything because that's all it is. Like I said, and that's why I add whatever you're afraid of, but you, that, but you want to do. You feel like a calling to do it, but you're afraid to do it. That's probably, that's your life's, that's life giving you that clue. That that's, that's the little push right there. That's where you should go. That's, that's where you belong, whether it's starting a new business, whether it's quitting your job and saying, you know what?

• 41:11Speaker 01

  I've been there for seven, eight years and, uh, I'm getting a little tired of it. I would love to go over to this, to do this for a living, but I'm scared because the, you know, I got the family and I know there's good excuses. Of course. I got kids, I got this. Got kids, got family, that'd be irresponsible of me. But I'm telling you, I do believe that that's, you, you need to make a plan. Yeah. Cause you'll be so proud of yourself. Uh, and yeah, there is that danger of it not working. Yeah. But imagine the feeling to see yourself, see it working for you. And that might not be what you ultimately want. I wanted to be an actor, you know, when I first got that plane. Right. And you talk about humiliating.

• 41:48Lewis Howes?

  Try auditioning.

• 41:49Speaker 01

  Oh, man.

• 41:50Lewis Howes?

  Get rejected over and over.

• 41:51Speaker 01

  Over and over, over and over again. It, that brought me to my knees. That was another where literally I was like, oh, this hurts.

• 41:57Lewis Howes?

  Yeah. Cause your show used to being the man, the guy.

• 42:00Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 42:00Lewis Howes?

  The stud, the all-star, they're all pro, whatever. But now they're just like, okay, you're one of a hundred coming through audition and we don't care.

• 42:06Speaker 01

  And the way to get good at it.

• 42:08Lewis Howes?

  And your name isn't good, you know, good enough for us.

• 42:10Speaker 01

  They don't care about your name. Tony, who cares?

• 42:12Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 42:13Speaker 01

  We, we gotta make money on this movie. And you suck, you suck. And so that's another lesson that, that it taught me that you have to get out of your head. Because I was one of those guys, I'd study the script and I'd look at it and I'd go over and I'd beg, okay, well, I'm gonna, when it, when it comes to this, when it says legends, I'm gonna say legends, you know, and this and this. And then you rehearse it, rehearse it, rehearse it. It's like giving a speech.

• 42:33Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 42:33Speaker 01

  Uh, that's red. Uh, this is why I don't like reading speeches. Uh, people are like for the Hall of Fame, they're like, hey, we need your speech, we need, I'm like, well, too bad. I'm not, I'm not reading.

• 42:42Lewis Howes?

  Writing it out for the day.

• 42:43Speaker 01

  From here. Uh, because I believe when you, you can learn it and you can perfect a performance. And I was doing that with acting and then I'd go in there and I'd get crushed. Because the moment you miss that rehearsed, like you start getting in your head, you're like, well, I didn't say that right. That's not how, that didn't sound like that in rehearsal. And now I'm in my head.

• 43:05Lewis Howes?

  Tighter.

• 43:06Speaker 01

  Tight. Now you start, now you're thinking about that in the past, instead of thinking about in the future, where true acting, or true performing in anything, whether you're a doctor, whether you're a singer or athlete.

• 43:18Speaker 01

  The good stuff comes when you're completely in the moment and you're not thinking about the past or the future. I've already said this. Uh, and then the ad lib that comes off of that. The, when you're in the moment, if you get an impulse, you just go with it. That's what Leonardo DiCaprio.

• 43:32Lewis Howes?

  The improv, yeah.

• 43:33Speaker 01

  Yeah, the improv, that's in football. It would be boring to watch, okay, Tony, you're gonna go 10 yards and turn out. And we want you to catch it and then more likely they'll tackle you right there. I don't think fans would, they would be like, ah, it's okay, it's fun. Cool, but you wanna see me, okay. When I got to the top of that route, the defender was waiting there. So I had to juke him up and come underneath. And you're not thinking this.

• 43:53Lewis Howes?

  You're just reacting.

• 43:54Speaker 01

  Some people, a lot of athletes do think this, and that's where they're not as good. But you're just reacting now. And then when you catch the ball, okay, now you gotta move and now you gotta start ad libbing. You gotta start. That's where the beauty comes. And the people that can ad lib the best are the people that are in their heart. And those are the ones that make the performance. That's Michael Jordan when he goes up for the dunk. He's like, uh oh, you know what? I'm gonna switch it and I'm gonna put it right here now.

• 44:13Lewis Howes?

  So clean.

• 44:13Speaker 01

  And that's when we as fans are like, whoa. It's the ad lib. It's the ad lib where, where the magic happens.

• 44:20Lewis Howes?

  That's true.

• 44:21Speaker 01

  So that's, that's, and the only way you'll get there is if you're completely in the moment and you can train yourself to get into that flow.

• 44:28Lewis Howes?

  Yeah. And that takes doing lots of reps over and over again.

• 44:32Speaker 01

  Experience.

• 44:32Lewis Howes?

  Experience, the best teachers. Now, success leaves clues, you said, someone else said, but for me, that means that you had a lot of great insights growing up. There was someone or someones who taught you and maybe it was coaches or teachers or parents, friends. Who was the most influential for you growing up and what was the greatest lesson they taught you?

• 44:52Speaker 01

  Okay, before I answer that, by the way, Jared Pobre, a buddy of mine who's a successful business, he's the one who told me success leaves clues.

• 44:57Lewis Howes?

  Okay.

• 44:58Speaker 01

  I'm having dinner with him tomorrow night. I'm gonna go, where did you get that?

• 45:00Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, exactly.

• 45:00Speaker 01

  Because I copied you unknowingly, but you know, he said that. But the, the people that affected me the most um, is my mother. Probably she is the, the rock of my life. And the more I look at this woman, I see, you talk about an example of living with your heart. Cause my mom doesn't, you know, she, she's, she's not the most, um, um, how do I say this? Uh, scholastic person or whatever it is. I don't get me wrong, smart woman.

• 45:32Lewis Howes?

  Academic.

• 45:33Speaker 01

  Academic. That's a better word. But she is all this.

• 45:36Lewis Howes?

  Mine.

• 45:37Speaker 01

  You know, me growing up, I have three adopted brothers because of my mom's heart. Like she brings people in, you know, I remember we moved around a lot. We, we didn't have a lot of money. We weren't poor. We just didn't have a lot of money. I think there's a difference there. I always felt like we were, we were good.

• 45:52Lewis Howes?

  Mm hmm.

• 45:52Speaker 01

  Uh, even though we were on welfare at times. But she is somebody that, that takes no from anybody. She stands up for what she believes in and she'll love you fully, like the best hugs, hugs and kisses. She was like a, you know, masculine and female, perfect into, into one woman. And so she is somebody that will tell me the truth always from her. I'm not saying she's right either.

• 46:18Lewis Howes?

  Her truth.

• 46:19Speaker 01

  People out there with moms know what I'm talking about. And, and you need somebody like that in your life. And so she's, she's really, really helped me. And then my, uh, my brother, Chris, my older brother, Chris, he's the one who got me started in football. Uh, I will say this, that we haven't had a relationship in five years, but doesn't take away the fact what he did for me when I was younger, uh, really getting me in football and getting me into that mindset of what it takes to be great on a, on a football field.

• 46:44Lewis Howes?

  What was, what was the best lesson that he taught you?

• 46:47Speaker 01

  Really the consistency, I think, and the understanding that people are coming for you. And when you get on top, you know.

• 46:56Lewis Howes?

  Coming even more.

• 46:57Speaker 01

  The tall poppy syndrome or whatever.

• 46:58Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 46:59Speaker 01

  It's, yeah, they're coming for you. And so you better make sure that you, that you're, you're taking care of business, um, because you can't relax. Don't get me wrong. I went all over the world and I went out and had fun and I was single for a while and I was doing all the things that single men do, uh, unapologetically, you know, and having a good time. But at the same time, when it comes time to lock in, you know, it's an expression of football, lock in and lock out, you know? It's, it's, it's time to, it's time to get to work. And so he really helped me out with that.

• 47:28Lewis Howes?

  Yeah. And the greatest lesson your mom taught you was that?

• 47:32Speaker 01

  I, I don't know if she ever, she's not the type to give you like, okay.

• 47:35Lewis Howes?

  But what was the thing that you learned? Yeah, but what was maybe the lesson you learned from her experience or her way of being?

• 47:41Speaker 01

  I think just really letting it hang out without caring and, and really it's come into, to picture for me lately.

• 47:47Lewis Howes?

  Really? How so?

• 47:49Speaker 01

  Lately, I don't, it just, over the last few weeks, I've just had some, a couple realizations about stuff that I already knew and stuff that I've done before, but really being cognizant of it. And I see that example a lot in my mom. I think. She is so free. She does not care what anybody thinks. And she's she'll stand up for what she believes in. And and I've been afraid to do that at times. I was afraid. I'll be talking about what would I have changed or what I went through as a football player. One thing that I really wish that I could have done more of is not been so afraid to be a leader to my teammates.

• 48:34Speaker 01

  I could have been a better leader for them. I could have spoke up more. I could have helped my coaches out more. But the only reason I didn't do that is because I was afraid that nobody would even listen to me. It's kind of like me starting a podcast now, like where the reason I would never have wanted to do this before is because like, who the hell am I? Or who am I to say? You're Tony Gonzalez, Hall of Famer, man. I know. Greatest tight end of all time. It shows you how insecure I was with everything. And I was like this as a player. I mean, and that's probably that also gave me an edge too. To work harder. To keep working harder and to keep proving everybody wrong. And it keeps going, I am, I belong here, I belong here. Uh, you know, you went to five Pro Bowls now. Well, I gotta go to six. Okay, six, I gotta go to seven. It just kept adding up. And then I got to 14. And I'm in. You missed a few. I missed. You're not good enough.

• 49:19Speaker 01

  You're not good enough. What's the record of Pro Bowls? Uh, that right there is tied. Uh, well, I had the most at the time when I retired, but I think Peyton has 14 as well, which is good company. Good company. Uh, so, yeah, it was, it's, it's, my mother really put that in me that, that you just need to, she just laughs. She danced. She can't dance. I can't dance, but she'll dance. She doesn't care how she looks. Me, I'll sit on the sideline. I used to, but now I'm getting to the point where, you know what? I'm gonna go out there and dance. And yeah, you can make fun of me. Who cares? But yeah, you got all that ethnic blood in you, but you can't dance. I'm like, why catch football? That's true.

• 49:56Speaker 01

  So that's what I mean, like you, and you know what, um, um, a movie that I'll use that has really hit home with me? I went and saw it with my kids a couple of weeks ago. They had the remake of it. It's Lion King. Oh, it's so good. Remember who you are. Remember who you are. It's cool. Simba, remember, remember. And that's what it is. I think you have to remember you as that little kid because we all have this. I have four children and when they're up, one's eighteen, the other one's eleven, nine, and then we have a four year old. And she's still in that. When you have to remember who you are, she's still there. And you know, when you're younger, you're honest. You can tell people, you know, when you're hungry, you can ask for help. You go to sleep when you're tired.

• 50:41Speaker 01

  You, you dance like nobody's watching. You sing like nobody's watching. There is no racism when you're a child. There is no, there's, the motions come and they go. They filter through you. So we're not saying you're going to cut off emotions, but they come right through you when you're a child and you have to remember that. And remember what is, and when you can combine that with your life experience, and by the way, you're going to get broken. You have to go through those broken stages. That's what adolescence and teenage and all that stuff is about and starting out new. But in the end, that's why I love getting older now. Somebody was complaining to me, she was turning twenty eight, Toby, my wife's sister. And I was like, twenty eight. Like it is so much better because now you're combining that life, that life experience.

• 51:25Speaker 01

  And if you can remember who you are, that fearless kid who used to jump off the top of a roof, used to say hello to everybody. And like I said, dance and sing and play and talk to everybody and be free. That's where your life is. It's like, so, so Lion King has been great to me. Wow. And just remembering who I am, I write that on top of my journal is remember who you are. And what is that though? And write that down, right? Who are you? Who is that? Who are you? And for me, that's, that's, that's fearless. That's, to me, it's, and it changes and it keeps changing and it should keep changing. It keeps evolving, just like everything else in this world.

• 52:06Speaker 01

  World keeps evolving, you know, the continents shift and there's cycles and there's there's rain, there's sun.

• 52:13Lewis Howes?

  Seasons, yeah.

• 52:13Speaker 01

  Seasons, but you never, you always, you always keep changing and that's me and I wanna, I'm fearless, I have an open heart, I'm loving, I'm not afraid to connect to people, I'm not afraid to be me, I'm not afraid to dance anymore.

• 52:26Lewis Howes?

  That's good, man.

• 52:27Speaker 01

  I'm not afraid to sing.

• 52:28Lewis Howes?

  You gotta start salsa dancing with me.

• 52:29Speaker 01

  Salsa dancing, I'll do it. And going after what I truly want in life and what I'm, but that I wanna do, like I said, that's, that's the, that's the formula for me.

• 52:38Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 52:39Speaker 01

  Is not being afraid to go after what's in my heart.

• 52:43Lewis Howes?

  What's missing in your life?

• 52:45Speaker 01

  Right now, honestly, it's, I'm feeling really good.

• 52:49Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 52:49Speaker 01

  You know, wife, kids, family, but I have my goals, you know? So, but I don't count that as missing.

• 52:55Lewis Howes?

  Right, right.

• 52:55Speaker 01

  Cause I'm enjoying the process and it's, it's coming, it's coming. I look at these goals and, and I know they're gonna come and if it's not that, it's gonna be something even better.

• 53:03Lewis Howes?

  Right. How long you been married for?

• 53:06Speaker 01

  Fifteen, well, 12 years.

• 53:08Lewis Howes?

  12 years.

• 53:08Speaker 01

  15 years together.

• 53:09Lewis Howes?

  You're 15 years together. Do you think you would've had as successful a career without being married?

• 53:15Speaker 01

  Um, I don't know.

• 53:18Lewis Howes?

  So if you were single the whole time or just, you know, dating different people?

• 53:24Speaker 01

  Yeah, I think, I think so.

• 53:26Lewis Howes?

  You still have the same career, you think?

• 53:27Speaker 01

  I think, well, because I was on my way to that anyway, before I met her, I was single 10 years. My first 10 years in the NFL, I mean, I was married the last seven. And I did have a child, the older one, from a previous relationship. And he lived out in, in California while I played in Kansas City. I'm still very close to him, obviously, he's my son. Uh, but I was, I was out there living la vida loca off the field.

• 53:51Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 53:52Speaker 01

  And, and enjoying myself.

• 53:53Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 53:54Speaker 01

  So, yeah, I think I could've been able to do that, but there is something about that I've noticed too, and I'm wondering, I would love somebody to do the research on this. When you fall in love. Uh, you know, like everything gets greater, right? The sky is blue and the colors and everything. Everybody's in a good mood and all this good stuff. Uh, and then guys play better. I've seen guys that when they're engaged. When they're in love, like their game gets better.

• 54:19Lewis Howes?

  Wow.

• 54:20Speaker 01

  Or they have a child, their game gets better.

• 54:22Lewis Howes?

  Why do you think they play better when they're in love?

• 54:24Speaker 01

  I think because.

• 54:26Lewis Howes?

  Their heart.

• 54:27Speaker 01

  Oh, I'm telling you, I'm telling you, I've been thinking about this.

• 54:30Lewis Howes?

  Wow.

• 54:31Speaker 01

  That there is a reason that these guys excel when you're, when you're there. Um, when, when, because I told you, there's no fear of judgment when you're there.

• 54:38Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 54:39Speaker 01

  You know, when you're in love, you'll tell everybody, I just want to shout it from the rooftops. You just don't care.

• 54:43Lewis Howes?

  Don't care.

• 54:43Speaker 01

  And so, yeah, I think my wife has absolutely helped me become a better person. Um, in other aspects of my life. Uh, in football, I kind of figured that out because I was in love.

• 54:55Lewis Howes?

  You were good.

• 54:55Speaker 01

  I was in love, already in love. I didn't. It's funny how some guys need that to, to, to help approach their football. But for me, I think, just like if you said Kobe or Jordan or, or Tiger Woods or whatever. I mean, I think they would have been fine if they never got married. It's just these, those guys are assassins and they figured out how to.

• 55:15Lewis Howes?

  Machines.

• 55:16Speaker 01

  Put everything out. And I feel like I'm, I'm in that same boat. I consider myself one of them.

• 55:22Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 55:22Speaker 01

  Cause when I was on that field, nothing else is there. It's just complete time stands still.

• 55:28Lewis Howes?

  What's the greatest lesson your wife's taught you about yourself, about life, about?

• 55:32Speaker 01

  Same thing. You know, they always say you marry your mother and my wife is absolutely in her heart.

• 55:38Lewis Howes?

  Hmm.

• 55:39Speaker 01

  And I love that about her.

• 55:40Lewis Howes?

  She's got a big heart.

• 55:41Speaker 01

  She's got a huge heart and that's why everybody loves her. That's why, you know, she's doing a podcast called Keep On. Uh, and that's, she's so raw, genuinely cares about you. When she's talking to you. She genuinely cares about you because she's interested. She's one of those, you know, they talk about, are you an introvert or you're an extrovert? And I'm an introvert. That's all there is to it. Like when I leave a party or whatever it is, I get tired.

• 56:06Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 56:07Speaker 01

  Because I'm in there and I'm trying to get to the point where she is. Cause she leaves these things and goes, all right, where are we going now? You know, because she draws energy from people because she loves people. And so she's also taught me it's not about where you come from. Cause her life is, was a tough one. I mean, her mom died of a heroin overdose when she was younger. Uh, so she, you can get caught up by looking at her because she's beautiful.

• 56:28Lewis Howes?

  Mm hmm.

• 56:29Speaker 01

  And go, oh, she's one of those pretty girls, football player wise, but it's not that at all. She's got some deep stuff going on in there. Cause she's been through a lot. I don't know if that's why. And I, it doesn't mean that, you know, just cause she didn't meet her dad until she was nine.

• 56:44Lewis Howes?

  Hmm.

• 56:45Speaker 01

  You know, they were on welfare, you know, cops being called like she's, she's gone through a lot. And that was one of the things that, that stood out for me, that she can still have this great personality. And this unbelievable ability to connect with everybody. She's, she's my secret weapon. I'm like, I want to bring.

• 57:00Lewis Howes?

  Should go do the work for you.

• 57:01Speaker 01

  Yeah. Tell me, you gotta come with me to this. Cause, cause they're all gonna, they're gonna love her.

• 57:05Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 57:05Speaker 01

  Uh, cause she's so open and so nice. And that's what I try to emulate. She's kind of a hero for me.

• 57:10Lewis Howes?

  Oh, that's cool.

• 57:10Speaker 01

  When it comes to that.

• 57:11Lewis Howes?

  Wow, that's cool. What do you want your kids to say about you when you're long gone?

• 57:16Speaker 01

  Uh, uh, I wonder what they will say. They're probably gonna say, he lectured a lot. That's what my 18 year old says, I don't know, lecture, here we go.

• 57:23Lewis Howes?

  What do you want them to say?

• 57:24Speaker 01

  Uh, I want them to say that, I mean, hopefully, and I, I mean, I believe this with children too. That it's more about how you conduct yourself. It is, I mean, it's proven now that I can sit there and talk to them till I'm blue in the face. That's why I don't believe people say, uh, do as I, um, don't do as I do, do as I say.

• 57:43Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 57:44Speaker 01

  Uh, it's like, I don't care because I've made all the mistakes. So now, dude, even though I'm still screwing up, it's like, well, kids aren't gonna listen to you and people aren't gonna listen to you.

• 57:51Lewis Howes?

  They're gonna follow your actions.

• 57:52Speaker 01

  They want to follow your actions. And so my kids, hopefully I've been that good example for them and I think they will. Like they'll, they'll see a good example of how to live and nobody's perfect.

• 58:02Lewis Howes?

  Mm hmm.

• 58:03Speaker 01

  Uh, and who knows, you know, what the future holds for me, I'm fine.

• 58:06Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 58:06Speaker 01

  But I think they'll definitely say that this guy was somebody who.

• 58:14Speaker 01

  Kept trying to level up. You never ever wanna be, there's no status quo.

• 58:18Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 58:19Speaker 01

  I wanna keep, either you're getting better, you're getting worse, to me. Then you look around, nature and all that stuff, it's constantly moving. And you constantly have to keep searching. I think, curious. I hope they say that I'm, that he was a curious man and, and followed that curiosity.

• 58:36Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 58:36Speaker 01

  Until he found an answer.

• 58:38Lewis Howes?

  Wow.

• 58:38Speaker 01

  And that's what I want from them. Because that'll take you a long way. If you're number one, Tom Bear, you came on, on my podcast. And he's talked about it before, but he said, if anything, I am a learner. And I love his explanation of why, because you can't screw with him. Can't, can't with him anymore. When somebody says I'm a learner. Because if you tell me I suck, or I'm not good, you're like, okay, great, I'm, you know, you think that. But tell me how I'm gonna get better. Tell me what to do, so I can go learn to get better.

• 59:07Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 59:07Speaker 01

  And that's how I feel, like, and I was like, I, I agree with you. I'm curious. So, except, I wasn't as evolved as him. Sometimes you could, you could hurt my feelings back in the day. But I am getting to the point where it's like, alright. You can say whatever the hell you want, I'm gonna keep getting better and I'm gonna keep trying. And so, I want my children to be curious. But I know they gotta get broke.

• 59:29Lewis Howes?

  You gotta have some.

• 59:30Speaker 01

  All the parents out there, just understand.

• 59:32Lewis Howes?

  I mean, the hardest thing is being like, uh, I don't know what the quote is, but it's like. You never want your kids to grow up with like wealthy parents. You know, it's like, because they're always kind of given things, it's, it's probably gonna be the hardest thing to like make sure they work hard.

• 59:47Speaker 01

  I tell my kids that though. I tell them, I go, you guys are rich, you guys got cash.

• 59:50Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, you got cash.

• 59:51Speaker 01

  We're not, we're not billionaires and like that, but you guys got cash.

• 59:54Lewis Howes?

  Take care of, yeah.

• 59:54Speaker 01

  And people are gonna doubt you, because your last name, first of all, they're gonna compare you because of your last name. Second of all, they're gonna think you're just rich and you got it all. I feel, I feel bad for all those kids. I mean, of, of successful people.

• 1:00:06Lewis Howes?

  It's tough if you're poor, it's tough if you're, I mean, it's, there's a challenge either way.

• 1:00:10Speaker 01

  But that's.

• 1:00:10Lewis Howes?

  There's different challenges.

• 1:00:11Speaker 01

  I agree.

• 1:00:12Lewis Howes?

  You might have a nicer home and nicer food and this and that, but there's different mental and emotional challenge.

• 1:00:17Speaker 01

  Yes. And, and that's your, and, and it's just gonna be your path, okay? If it's not one thing, it's gonna be another thing, because you're a human being. And that's why we're all down here, is to have this human experience. And you're gonna have to get broke, and you have to get cracked apart. It's seasonal, just like life is.

• 1:00:32Lewis Howes?

  It'll pass.

• 1:00:34Speaker 01

  It'll pass.

• 1:00:34Lewis Howes?

  Eventually.

• 1:00:35Speaker 01

  And the sun's gonna come out, but you gotta keep willing to get into the ring. And. You don't want to be sitting in the stands. It's better to get into the ring, get your ass knocked out. And then to be sitting in the stands watching it. Get involved, get in the game and let's play it. And don't be afraid. And just know that you're gonna take some shots. It's just like sports, it's just like, there's anybody out there listening.

• 1:00:58Lewis Howes?

  They're hitting their ribs, man.

• 1:00:59Speaker 01

  You have children, you want to complicate your life, have some kids. You haven't had kids yet, right?

• 1:01:04Lewis Howes?

  No.

• 1:01:04Speaker 01

  Are you probably, are you gonna have kids one day?

• 1:01:06Lewis Howes?

  I think so, yeah.

• 1:01:07Speaker 01

  Yeah, well, get ready, okay? Cause shit ain't easy.

• 1:01:10Lewis Howes?

  What's the lesson you can give to me as a potential father in the future? What would you say as your advice?

• 1:01:17Speaker 01

  Well, you just had, your son just broke his arm and you're running around and... Oh, man, and they're fighting this morning, now he's pissed off because he broke his arm, so he's mad. He's yelling and fighting with his sister and whatever. So, yeah, kids, complicate everything. It really is, it really is tough.

• 1:01:31Lewis Howes?

  That's why I haven't had kids for as long as I have.

• 1:01:33Speaker 01

  Oh, I believe it's the, it's the, that and finances is the number one reason for divorce. Cause you talk about all these different person, especially the more kids you have, it's tough. Uh, but, but it's the best thing that ever happened to you too. It opens your heart up even more. And so, I would say, approach being a father, or a mother, whoever's listening, just like you would approach your job, using all the principles that I'm talking about. Uh, realize it's gonna be hard, it's gonna bring you to your knees sometime. But there's so much information out there on how to be the best parent you can be. Uh, and really connect to them. Don't try to bring them up to your level. Go to them, and this is something I had to learn the hard way. It just took me a while to, to, to learn this, but get down on your knees, look those kids in the eye and listen to them.

• 1:02:19Speaker 01

  And open your heart when you're talking to them. And dance and play with them. Become a little kid with them. Cause they're not ready to come to your level. And I know people out there, I'm not saying you have to do baby talk and all that stuff.

• 1:02:30Lewis Howes?

  Right, right.

• 1:02:30Speaker 01

  And people out there, well, I treat my kids like, uh, like they're an adult, like this, because it helps them get ba- older and better, wiser, faster. And I'm like, who cares? Little prodigies, most prodigies don't work out.

• 1:02:39Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 1:02:40Speaker 01

  Just know that, look up the stats.

• 1:02:42Lewis Howes?

  LeBron's one of the few.

• 1:02:43Speaker 01

  One of the few, I mean, don't get me wrong, it works sometime, but you look at, that's incredible, and you look at all these shows. Tiger Woods was on there when he was younger, yeah, it worked out. But most of those kids are dribbling, you see them on YouTube, and running fast, and juke and all the kids.

• 1:02:54Lewis Howes?

  Never hear about them again.

• 1:02:55Speaker 01

  They fizzle out. They feel like, so enjoy, enjoy it, enjoy being a parent, enjoy. Uh, really try to look at it as just fun. Uh, and your kids will love you a lot more for it. Uh, and you can't force the flower open. I always... Feel like children are little flowers and you water them and you put the good fertilizer, you put the good food down there for them to grow, but you can't force it open. You have to wait for them to open.

• 1:03:22Lewis Howes?

  It might take a long time for them to build roots underneath, right?

• 1:03:26Speaker 01

  My eighteen year old took, this is the first year I've seen this kid just blossom. Because and my other kids are different. They're way, everybody's different, there's all these different personalities. Um, and, and you can't blanket parrot. Every kid is unique and individual, just like if somebody works for you.

• 1:03:44Lewis Howes?

  Sure.

• 1:03:44Speaker 01

  You have to really hone in on what their gifts are.

• 1:03:47Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 1:03:47Speaker 01

  And grow it.

• 1:03:48Lewis Howes?

  This is beautiful. I've got a couple of final questions for you.

• 1:03:50Speaker 01

  Sure.

• 1:03:51Lewis Howes?

  Uh, this is called the three truths. So imagine it is your last day on earth.

• 1:03:55Speaker 01

  Uh huh.

• 1:03:55Lewis Howes?

  And you're as old as you want to be. You get to pick the day, but eventually you gotta leave the physical body.

• 1:04:00Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:04:01Lewis Howes?

  It could be a hundred, two hundred, doesn't matter. Modern technology, thousand, whatever it is, you gotta go at some point. And um, you've created and achieved everything that you've written down in your, your journal every week, like it's all come true.

• 1:04:14Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:04:16Lewis Howes?

  All the success you want, the love, everything, it's happened. But for whatever reason, you gotta take all of your accomplishments, your work with you. So no one has your podcast anymore, anything you've written down, any video access to you. It's all come with you. But you get to leave behind a piece of paper that has three things you know to be true about your life. That would be the lessons you would leave behind.

• 1:04:40Speaker 01

  Uh huh.

• 1:04:41Lewis Howes?

  Three lessons that the world would have, and this is all they have to remember you by.

• 1:04:44Speaker 01

  Uh huh.

• 1:04:45Lewis Howes?

  What would you say?

• 1:04:46Speaker 01

  Words?

• 1:04:47Lewis Howes?

  Like a lesson, like a lesson. It could be a sentence, it could be a paragraph. But just three different lessons, like come from your heart, could be a lesson.

• 1:04:56Speaker 01

  Yeah, well.

• 1:04:57Lewis Howes?

  Always give your best, you know, whatever, whatever your truth is. What would be the three things you'd want people to have as lessons from you?

• 1:05:05Speaker 01

  When it comes to what you love, life takes off on the other side of fear. I think relentlessly pursue what you love, I guess.

• 1:05:17Lewis Howes?

  You guess or you know?

• 1:05:18Speaker 01

  No, I know. Relentlessly pursue what you love.

• 1:05:23Speaker 01

  And when speaking and listening, do that with your heart. Hmm. That's the third one. Yeah. When speaking, listening. Do it with your heart. I like it. Yeah.

• 1:05:36Speaker 01

  Like your mind, your heart, prosperity and fun come when your

• 1:05:44Speaker 01

  heart becomes the filter to your mind's thoughts. Hmm. What do you mean by that? So I believe everything you want will come when you can filter what comes up into your brain and filter that down through your heart and let your heart speak it. Ooh. So I got, yeah, fun, fun and prosperity come when your mind, when your heart can become the filter for your mind's thoughts. Hmm. That's good. I've never heard it said that way. Quote Tony Gonzalez.

• 1:06:18Lewis Howes?

  Okay. What is the thing you are most proud of that most people don't know about you?

• 1:06:24Speaker 01

  That most people don't know about me? I think that's a hard one. Louis, what the hell?

• 1:06:29Lewis Howes?

  Hey, we're trying to get wide open here.

• 1:06:30Speaker 01

  I know. I love it. But I'm like, okay, what the hell? Most probably I'm trying to think because I'm, because I am pretty wide open. Like most people, I'll just tell them.

• 1:06:37Lewis Howes?

  Like something, like something that I, I saw your actions was like, when I was over your house, you were like, yeah, I make breakfast for my kids every day.

• 1:06:45Speaker 01

  Ah.

• 1:06:45Lewis Howes?

  Like five days a week. I'm not sure what, how many times, but you're like, pretty much every day. I'm getting up, I'm making gourmet bread. I'm doing the pancakes. I'm doing everything.

• 1:06:52Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:06:53Lewis Howes?

  And I'm really proud that I do that for them. And I was like, that's pretty cool because you could have a chef doing this. You could whatever, have them do it. But you get up and you make breakfast for those kids. I think that's, that's something that inspired me as a future father. It's like, wow, I want to be, I want to be like that.

• 1:07:09Speaker 01

  Uh huh. That's a good one.

• 1:07:10Lewis Howes?

  Not like I want to be a Hall of Famer, but like, I want to be like a dad that makes kids for his breakfast.

• 1:07:15Speaker 01

  Uh huh.

• 1:07:16Lewis Howes?

  I think that, that gets me like, you know, emotional.

• 1:07:19Speaker 01

  Well, that's a good one. You know where I got that from? It's funny, you know, you ever seen Casino? With, with, uh,

• 1:07:26Lewis Howes?

  In the wall.

• 1:07:26Speaker 01

  With Robert De Niro and Joe Pesci?

• 1:07:28Lewis Howes?

  Yes.

• 1:07:28Speaker 01

  So Joe Pesci in there, he's like narrating it and he goes, no matter what, no matter what we did, I'd always go home and I'd make breakfast for the kids.

• 1:07:35Lewis Howes?

  Wow, there you go, yeah. I'm shooting people in the middle of the night.

• 1:07:38Speaker 01

  Yeah, shooting people in the middle of the night, you know, lock you out, a couple of people, but I'm gonna go home and make pancakes for my kids.

• 1:07:43Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 1:07:43Speaker 01

  Um, so that's where I got that from, and that's a good one. Um, I would say that, um, because I, that is pretty unique. I don't know anybody else who, who does it, but I really love doing that for the kids. Uh, I got a date it this morning.

• 1:07:55Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 1:07:55Speaker 01

  I like being the short order cut for all four of the kids, or whoever friends they have there.

• 1:08:00Lewis Howes?

  That's cool.

• 1:08:00Speaker 01

  Uh, I love opening up my home to people. Uh, I get that from my mother. So yesterday we had probably 20 kids at the house.

• 1:08:08Lewis Howes?

  Wow.

• 1:08:08Speaker 01

  And if you get to know me, you're like, like you, you've come over a couple of times, come on over and I'll have other people there. I love hosting people, uh, at my home.

• 1:08:16Lewis Howes?

  That's cool.

• 1:08:17Speaker 01

  Uh, and then I, I love to read. Most people, I guess maybe you probably do know that, but I love to read, um, um, I've always want a book in my hand.

• 1:08:26Lewis Howes?

  That's cool.

• 1:08:27Speaker 01

  About something, uh, mind, body, spirit related.

• 1:08:30Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 1:08:31Speaker 01

  Could be a story, but I wanna, I wanna learn.

• 1:08:33Lewis Howes?

  I love it, man. It's good stuff. I love learning this about you. Okay, we've got a new show that's coming out soon.

• 1:08:39Speaker 01

  Uh huh, yep.

• 1:08:40Lewis Howes?

  Wide open.

• 1:08:41Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:08:41Lewis Howes?

  Hasn't come out yet, right?

• 1:08:42Speaker 01

  Wide open podcast.

• 1:08:43Lewis Howes?

  Coming out soon, and they can get it where? Where, where can they get it? Where do you wanna send people to?

• 1:08:47Speaker 01

  Well, I think we will be on Facebook, uh,

• 1:08:50Lewis Howes?

  Be on iTunes, be on Apple.

• 1:08:51Speaker 01

  I got my little cheat sheet here.

• 1:08:53Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, Spotify. It's on everywhere, podcasts.

• 1:08:55Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's on everywhere, it's podcasts, uh, Spotify, uh, Apple.

• 1:08:59Lewis Howes?

  Yep.

• 1:08:59Speaker 01

  All that stuff.

• 1:09:00Lewis Howes?

  And do you have a website yet?

• 1:09:01Speaker 01

  Uh, Tony Gonzalez eighty-eight.

• 1:09:03Lewis Howes?

  Okay.

• 1:09:04Speaker 01

  Is, uh,

• 1:09:04Lewis Howes?

  Are you putting out information there? Are you doing a newsletter?

• 1:09:07Speaker 01

  No, we're not.

• 1:09:08Lewis Howes?

  Not yet.

• 1:09:08Speaker 01

  I got, I got Nisha here, she's helping me, huh?

• 1:09:10Lewis Howes?

  Can they, can they subscribe for your, uh, updates anywhere on your site? Or is it just social media follow you on?

• 1:09:16Speaker 01

  Right now, it's, it's social media.

• 1:09:18Lewis Howes?

  We gotta, gotta get you an opt-in somewhere.

• 1:09:20Speaker 01

  Yeah, Tony Gonzalez eighty-eight, social media, you can, you can, you can check out all information there, and then it's all gonna be coming out. And I gotta tell you, thank you, because you are, you are an inspiration for me to even do the podcast, because I was watching your shit and I was like, this is great. And there's a lot of people that have done stuff like this, but I'm doing it because I love it.

• 1:09:39Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 1:09:39Speaker 01

  Because I, I feel like I do have a lot to share. Uh, and a lot of that is honestly is being inspired by you. I found out in play semi-pro football. Yeah. All these guys, guys. And, and I look at it this way, like, like we're all in this together.

• 1:09:53Lewis Howes?

  Of course.

• 1:09:53Speaker 01

  And you have your crowd. And then Gary Vaynerchuk has his crowd and Tim Ferriss has his crowd. We all have these crowds, but we're all making the, the world a better place by presenting information that we love.

• 1:10:03Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, man.

• 1:10:04Speaker 01

  I appreciate you.

• 1:10:05Lewis Howes?

  Of course, man.

• 1:10:05Speaker 01

  For taking the, the lead on all this stuff.

• 1:10:08Lewis Howes?

  Of course.

• 1:10:08Speaker 01

  How long you been doing this show?

• 1:10:10Lewis Howes?

  Six and a half years.

• 1:10:11Speaker 01

  Six and a half years. Yeah, I'm looking at this wall. I'm like, this is nuts.

• 1:10:14Lewis Howes?

  Eight hundred forty episodes. Yeah.

• 1:10:16Speaker 01

  This is great.

• 1:10:17Lewis Howes?

  And if I could do it, you could do it easily. Trust me. I mean, it took, it took some time to learn how to connect and interview. And I had no clue what I was doing, but I was just curious.

• 1:10:26Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:10:26Lewis Howes?

  You know, kind of like what Tom, Tom talks about is being curious. And I think that's, that's going to be what's going to make your show great too. Is you being curious and not trying to script everything.

• 1:10:35Speaker 01

  Nah, no.

• 1:10:36Lewis Howes?

  Your team, your team was like, oh, send over questions. I'm like, nah, we're going to keep it open. You know, we're going to make sure that it's,

• 1:10:42Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:10:42Lewis Howes?

  That's authentic. And I like to hear that you're like, oh, I actually don't know. Let me think about it for a second. For me, that's the stuff where like the magic comes right after that.

• 1:10:51Speaker 01

  The ad lib.

• 1:10:51Lewis Howes?

  Exactly.

• 1:10:52Speaker 01

  The ad lib.

• 1:10:52Lewis Howes?

  The ad lib. That's where it's at. Uh, so Wide Opens coming out soon. They can follow you on Instagram. You're going to be doing hopefully more stuff on there. I see you doing a little bit more there.

• 1:11:01Speaker 01

  I'm trying to get acclimated. This whole social media thing has been a little bit of a, a, a thing for me. You asked my team about it. The social, I'm kind of, I'm part Charles Barkley.

• 1:11:12Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 1:11:12Speaker 01

  Where Charles like, oh, I need that stuff, you know, but it's also at the same time, I understand the, the, the knowledge that you can bring to people.

• 1:11:19Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, of course.

• 1:11:20Speaker 01

  The help, it's there.

• 1:11:21Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 1:11:21Speaker 01

  And it's fun.

• 1:11:22Lewis Howes?

  It is fun.

• 1:11:22Speaker 01

  I just have a hard time stopping my day sometime going, okay, hey, I need, I need to put something else out there. But I do understand it and I'm getting into it and I'm starting to enjoy it.

• 1:11:30Lewis Howes?

  That's good. Yeah. And your team will support you.

• 1:11:32Speaker 01

  They'll support me.

• 1:11:33Lewis Howes?

  Okay, they can, they can go subscribe to that. How else can we support you? Besides that, you're going to be on TV every?

• 1:11:39Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:11:40Lewis Howes?

  Every week.

• 1:11:40Speaker 01

  Football season, um, is here. And so, yeah, Thursday night football on Fox and then, uh, Sunday football all day.

• 1:11:49Lewis Howes?

  It's amazing, man.

• 1:11:49Speaker 01

  All day. Talking about what I did for a living.

• 1:11:53Lewis Howes?

  The glory days.

• 1:11:54Speaker 01

  The glory days. Uh, and I, I, that's pretty much it. I am working on a book here.

• 1:12:00Lewis Howes?

  Really?

• 1:12:00Speaker 01

  That, uh.

• 1:12:01Lewis Howes?

  Alright.

• 1:12:01Speaker 01

  That, that's.

• 1:12:02Lewis Howes?

  What's that gonna be about?

• 1:12:03Speaker 01

  It's like a little handbook is what I'm doing. That's the, that's the idea of it. It's not really a, a two hundred and seventy-eight page book.

• 1:12:10Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, yeah, right.

• 1:12:10Speaker 01

  That's what they told me last, the last book I wrote back a long time ago.

• 1:12:13Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 1:12:14Speaker 01

  Uh, it was like, yeah, it's gotta be two hundred and seventy-eight pages or something like that. It's a sweet spot, but this is a little bit shorter handbook.

• 1:12:20Lewis Howes?

  That's cool.

• 1:12:21Speaker 01

  On how to.

• 1:12:21Lewis Howes?

  More like life principles or what's gonna be?

• 1:12:23Speaker 01

  Like, like leveling up.

• 1:12:24Lewis Howes?

  That's cool.

• 1:12:24Speaker 01

  Let's, I don't care who you are. Let's, let's, let's get better if that's what you're into.

• 1:12:29Lewis Howes?

  Hmm, I like it.

• 1:12:30Speaker 01

  Giving my, my take on that. And there's a lot of takes out there, but underneath it all, it's all the same thing, just presented differently. And you have to find what connects to you.

• 1:12:38Lewis Howes?

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:12:39Speaker 01

  You have to find what connects to you.

• 1:12:39Lewis Howes?

  I love that. Well, if they follow you on social media and the podcast, then you'll announce that when it comes out in the future. They can get the book.

• 1:12:46Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:12:46Lewis Howes?

  Um, before I ask the final question, do you have any questions for me?

• 1:12:50Speaker 01

  Uh, I told you, I'm gonna bring you on the show now.

• 1:12:51Lewis Howes?

  Okay, we'll do that then.

• 1:12:52Speaker 01

  I'll get wide open on there.

• 1:12:54Lewis Howes?

  I'll have people come listen to that when I go there.

• 1:12:55Speaker 01

  You sit there. I, I wanna see you tearing up a little bit, gone. Okay.

• 1:12:58Lewis Howes?

  I cry all the time on this show, yeah. Um, well, I want to acknowledge you, Tony, for, um, we've only known each other for a few months, but I really acknowledge you for your authenticity and your openness. Like, you came to me and you were like, hey, I have questions for you. Can you help me out with this thing that some stuff you're going through in your life? We've connected at your house a few times. You're just such a giving, generous human being. And for me, that's what matters. The Hall of Fame status, the records, all that stuff. It's cool, but if you don't have the caring, giving nature, it's not as fun to be with someone. So I acknowledge you for your continued curiosity at such a high level. You're so successful in what you've done. You're at the top of the world.

• 1:13:40Lewis Howes?

  And you're still a giver. You're still curious and you don't act like you have it all figured out. And I think that's really hard for someone at your level to do. And I acknowledge that about you. And I just think that, uh, you're just getting started, man. This is all just like groundwick. You're just getting started and I'm excited for, for everything in the future. I'm excited for our friendship and if there's anything I can do to support you, please let me know.

• 1:14:01Speaker 01

  Thank you, bud.

• 1:14:01Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, man. Uh, final question is what's your definition of greatness?

• 1:14:07Speaker 01

  Isn't that what we talked about this whole time? Rewind the damn tape. Definition of greatness, I think, uh, curious, open heart and fearlessness. Think if you can be curious, have an open heart. And to me, open heart means no fear of judgment, total presence. Not worrying about the past or the future. That's what open heart, they're like joy, joy, like really finding joy in other people's joy. That's what I call joy, joy. That's being in your heart.

• 1:14:39Lewis Howes?

  Joy, joy, is that what you said?

• 1:14:40Speaker 01

  Call it joy, joy. That's what I tell my kids. You gotta have joy, joy. And if you can be fearless as you approach that, as you stay in your heart, really, the sky is the limit. You will have whatever you want. Uh, it doesn't mean you're not gonna get your, your ass kicked, but you will have it all. I promise you will. Cause it isn't about, it isn't about the money. It isn't about the, the fame. Trust me, there, there's, there's miserable people that I know that have a lot of money and have a lot of fame. It's about what's in your heart and being fearless as you approach that. And so that's my definition.

• 1:15:16Lewis Howes?

  There you go. Tony, my man, appreciate you.

• 1:15:18Speaker 01

  Thank you.

• 1:15:19Lewis Howes?

  Thanks, brother.

• 1:15:19Speaker 01

  Thanks for having me.

• 1:15:24Lewis Howes?

  There you have it, my friend. I hope you enjoyed this episode with Tony. I love his mindset. I love how much he's been able to constantly grow after all those years in the NFL and consistently stay at the top of his game and get better every single day. Make sure to share this with one friend, two friends today. I don't care as many people as you can, but at least one person. Text a friend this link, lewishouse.com slash eight five zero. Be a champion and a hero in someone's life today by sending this, this valuable information and inspiration. It could truly help someone transform and upgrade their life with this tool and this interview. Again, lewishouse.com slash eight five zero.

• 1:16:09Lewis Howes?

  Make sure to share it on Instagram story, tag me, Lewis Howes, and tag Tony Gonzalez so we can know what you enjoyed most about this. Share it with us. With your friends over on social media. And as always, if you have not left a review yet, please leave me a review over on Apple Podcasts. Over 5,000 plus five star reviews. I don't care if you leave a one star or five star review. I just want you to leave a review and tell me what you think about this show. So we can continue to learn, improve and make it better for you. So make sure to leave a review today as well. A big thank you to Tony again for coming on. Make sure you guys check out his new podcast, Wide Open. He's got some amazing people on there already. And he's going to help a lot of people in this stage of their life. So make sure to check it out. Give him a follow over on Instagram.

• 1:16:54Lewis Howes?

  Send him some love again. Share this with your friends. And as always, you know what time it is. It's time to go out there and do something great.