462: Socialist Ants

How do I make my sea anemones fight each other? Do I have a personality? Will I be reincarnated as an alien? How should I support my author friend? How do I fight imposter syndrome? How can I help Sierra Leone? Which Premier League team should I support? Can I still enjoy reading with a newborn baby? …Hank and John Green have answers! This episode was recorded July 22nd! If you're in need of dubious advice, email us at [email protected] Join us for monthly livestreams at patreon.com/dearhankandjohn Produced for Hank and John Green by Complexly See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:01John Green?

  You're listening to a Complexly podcast.

• 0:09Hank Green?

  Hello and welcome to Dear Hank and John.

• 0:11John Green?

  Of course, I prefer to think of it Dear John and Hank.

• 0:14Hank Green?

  It's a podcast where two brothers answer your questions, give you dubious advice and bring you all the week's news from both Mars and AFC Wimbledon. John.

• 0:22John Green?

  Yeah.

• 0:22Hank Green?

  Catherine recently said that I should do more lunges because it would be good for my knees and ankles. And I said, well, that would be a huge step forward.

• 0:33John Green?

  All right, I'll allow it.

• 0:34Hank Green?

  Thank you. I appreciate you.

• 0:35John Green?

  I'm in a pretty good mood.

• 0:37Hank Green?

  That's all it takes. That's all it takes. Do you know what the, uh, do you know what the, the, the rook is called in, in French in chess?

• 0:47John Green?

  No.

• 0:48Hank Green?

  It's called the tour, which reminds me, we should talk about your tour.

• 0:55John Green?

  I'm going on tour, Hank, for Hollywood Ending, my new book that comes out on September 22nd. Some of the events are already sold out, but there are still tickets at lots of places. You can find more at HollywoodEndingBook.com. I'm going to Toronto, I'm going to Brooklyn, New York, I'm going to Birmingham, Alabama, where I went to high school and where my conversation partner, I'm not sure I'm allowed to say this, but I'll just tell you, is going to be Sarah Yurist Green. I'm very excited about. Sarah Yurist puts on a great show and we both have deep connections to Birmingham. She grew up there. I went to high school there. So that'll be fun. Also go to Washington DC, Winston-Salem, North Carolina, Portland, Maine. I've never done a show in Maine before.

• 1:30Hank Green?

  That's where my, that's where my brother and sister-in-law live.

• 1:34John Green?

  Well, maybe they'll come if they're feeling generous.

• 1:36Hank Green?

  Ish. They don't live, they don't live in Portland, but they ish.

• 1:39John Green?

  Okay, they live in, they live in Maine.

• 1:40Hank Green?

  They should come by. They should come by. They actually don't. They live in New Hampshire.

• 1:44John Green?

  Oh, okay. Well, still, they should come by.

• 1:46Hank Green?

  It's right on the river there.

• 1:48John Green?

  Yeah, no reason not to, no reason not to cross the state border if you have the chance to, to see the Hollywood Ending Tour.

• 1:53Hank Green?

  That's right.

• 1:54John Green?

  I'm also going to Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, where much of Hollywood Ending is set, so that feels appropriate. I'm going to Gainesville, Florida, not too far from our childhood stomping grounds.

• 2:04Hank Green?

  No, yeah, but we hated Gainesville because that's where the Gators were from.

• 2:07John Green?

  That's right. We were Seminole fans.

• 2:09Hank Green?

  I don't, I don't know how that happened to us, but we sure were. I remember I once chained a Gator to a stop sign. It was a stuffed Gator.

• 2:16John Green?

  Okay, I was like, that took a measure of courage that I thought you lacked.

• 2:22John Green?

  I'm also going to Nashville, Tennessee, and Madison, Wisconsin, and Chicago, and St. Paul, Minnesota, and Kansas City, Missouri, and Tucson, Arizona, and Boise, Idaho, and San Diego, California, and Los Angeles, California. So if you're in or near any of those places, please come see me on tour at HollywoodEndingBook.com. It's going to be so much fun. And every ticket comes with a free book.

• 2:43Hank Green?

  Do you know who your guest is going to be in San Diego?

• 2:46John Green?

  I do, but I can't say.

• 2:47Hank Green?

  Oh, I didn't know if we couldn't say yet.

• 2:50John Green?

  I'll just say it. It's going to be Hank Green. Noted American celebrity Hank Green. The internet's Hank Green, four by three creator, 2D glasses inventor Hank Green.

• 3:00Hank Green?

  Creator of four by three. Oh goodness me. I, um, I, I, actually that, that, that, that thing about the rook being called tour.

• 3:13John Green?

  Yeah.

• 3:13Hank Green?

  That might come up in a future four by threes. That's a bit of a hint.

• 3:17John Green?

  Oh, okay.

• 3:18Hank Green?

  For a future purple.

• 3:20John Green?

  Oh, that sounds very purple to me.

• 3:21Hank Green?

  Yeah.

• 3:22John Green?

  Um, that sounds very purple indeed. Well, Hank, I'm doing great in general. I'm very excited for the tour. I'm also nervous. As the book gets closer to being out, I feel more and more anxious about it, but, um, there is nothing I can do now to make it better or worse.

• 3:36Hank Green?

  Absolutely. I'll tell you, I have, like, I have had so much experience doing this job. And then I'll like, I'll be in, I was on a podcast interview yesterday and, and it got like, kind of tricky. And I was scared.

• 3:55John Green?

  Oh, yeah. No, you'll get, you'll get the armpit sweat if it starts to get testy or tricky. Was it testy or tricky?

• 4:00Hank Green?

  It was tricky. It wasn't testy. It wasn't testy. They were all very nice, but it was tricky. It was just a difficult topics about like misinformation and how the internet is structured and what science is. And I was like, oh gosh, I don't know if I got all my bricks in the right place for this chat right now.

• 4:16John Green?

  I did a, uh, interview with Pablo Torre, who's a brilliant journalist and great podcaster. And also the show is produced by a friend of mine from high school. So I did an interview with Pablo Torre and he was like, what's it like to be the number two most banned author in America? And I was like, not great. I don't love it. Uh, I would prefer to not be on that list and not have to talk about this stuff. And I, I tried to do what I always try to do, which is to center the actual heroes of the intellectual freedom story who are teachers and librarians, not novelists. And, uh, then he started to read the, the passage from Looking for Alaska that it results in the book being banned so often. And I

• 4:59John Green?

  haven't read Looking for Alaska, Hank, in 21 years. Okay. Like it is, it has been half my life since I wrote that book and half my life since I read it. And he started to read it out loud and I, my armpits were pouring sweat.

• 5:14Hank Green?

  Oh God. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, we, we keep sticking our necks out, man.

• 5:21John Green?

  Why do we do it? I told, I told some people that I didn't want to do any press for this book because you've read the book. You know what it's about. And, um, uh, and they were like, well, that's not realistic.

• 5:33Hank Green?

  Yeah. Yeah. No, it's not real. You can't, you can't not do it. And, and it's like, well, I guess I should have just not written a book, I guess.

• 5:42John Green?

  Yeah. I mean, I, I could not do it if I really wanted to, but I want to be a good steward of the book. I want the book to reach a broad audience. I want it to find the people who are going to care about it. And so you get, you get torn between these competing interests and you tell yourself a story that makes it make sense for you to, uh, go and do those interview shows again.

• 6:02Hank Green?

  Yeah. And you never, it's, it's crazy because you never know what the problem's going to be. You think that making like a cute little word game, like smush adorable, no problems and smush.

• 6:11John Green?

  Yep.

• 6:12Hank Green?

  And then, you know, it's like, oh, but what words are?

• 6:16John Green?

  Yeah. What constitutes a word?

• 6:18Hank Green?

  We have to choose a word. We have to chew, like, we have to decide what bad words are. Sometimes a dictionary might not think that a, a word that I quite don't like, it wouldn't, shouldn't be put into the categories of like four, four review and it pops it into the system. You're like, ah, oh man, I'll tell you what.

• 6:37John Green?

  Yeah.

• 6:37Hank Green?

  You never know. You never know what you're taking on.

• 6:39John Green?

  You never know what you're taking on in this world. All you can do is your best. And that's what we try to do. And that reminds me actually of our first question, Hank. It's from Miriam, who is trying to do her best. Miriam writes, Dear John and Hank, I'm a marine biology student and for an independent project, I'm making sea anemones fight each other. When this species of anemone fights, it covers its foes in stinging cells from special fighting tentacles. For my project, I have a group of anemones whose only job is to cover my study subjects in stinging cells. The problem is that these anemones are cowards. They will not attack my subjects. They will not inflate their fighting tentacles and they keep trying to escape their cages.

• 7:18John Green?

  Actually, I wouldn't say they're cowards. I would say they're heroes.

• 7:24Hank Green?

  It sounds amazing.

• 7:26John Green?

  They just want to live free lives.

• 7:27Hank Green?

  I have a lot of respect for these, these little spiky boys suddenly.

• 7:32John Green?

  Brothers, how do I make these brainless invertebrates fight each other? Any and all dubious advice is appreciated.

• 7:38Hank Green?

  They're not actually spiky. I'm sorry. I don't know why I thought sea anemones and sea urchins were the same thing for a moment. There was a nice long pause when you were reading that question, John, when you said, when this species of anemone, anemone fights?

• 7:50John Green?

  Yeah.

• 7:50Hank Green?

  Because you were, you were skipping over Anthro, Anthoplura elegantissima, which I just, you know, come on, John, give it a try.

• 7:58John Green?

  No, I couldn't. The, the, um, just because of the way I'm filming today, the screen is a little bit further away from me than usual, which means I, I can only read at a very specific distance with any clarity. So anyway, what are we going to do, Hank? How are we going to get these sea anemones to fight each other?

• 8:17Hank Green?

  First, we're going to call them anemones. And they're going to be like, that's not what we're called.

• 8:21John Green?

  They're like, well, we're not enemies.

• 8:23Hank Green?

  Oh, anemones. You gotta stop calling it anemones and call them anenemies because they are enemies.

• 8:32John Green?

  That might work. I mean, I think it's going to not work since I don't know that they can hear.

• 8:38Hank Green?

  Yeah, they can. They probably can detect some, some vibrations in water.

• 8:44John Green?

  I'm not sure they can speak English though. I think what you, and I certainly don't know that they can speak English to a degree that they're going to get a pun and get mad about it like I do.

• 8:54Hank Green?

  You're not mad because you're calling them enemies? You're just mad because it's a pun?

• 8:57John Green?

  I'm just mad because you're making a dad joke when we established that the dad joke portion of the program is at the very start and only once. Another thing you could do is deprive them of resources, but tell them that the reason they're being resource deprived is because of the other, not because of some larger power structure.

• 9:15Hank Green?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. The larger power structure has to be invisible, which is great because they're anemones. And so it's probably going to be.

• 9:22John Green?

  Yeah.

• 9:23Hank Green?

  But also we find it to be invisible so often.

• 9:26John Green?

  We do, and we're supposed to be smart.

• 9:28Hank Green?

  Yeah. I wish I had actual advice. Like, I really wish I had, like, like, I'm like, okay, Hank Green, science Brandon. I'm like, I know nothing about these guys. I know nothing.

• 9:36John Green?

  I mean, I think that I have actual advice. Deprive them of resources until they become angry and spiteful.

• 9:42Hank Green?

  They might, they might, they might become, yeah, that's actually worth a try. That's worth a try.

• 9:46John Green?

  It's certainly, it's certainly what power structures do to maintain their power sometimes.

• 9:50Hank Green?

  For sure.

• 9:50John Green?

  Among humans. So I assume it works among sea anemones.

• 9:56John Green?

  I'm getting less confident as we go. Let's move to another question.

• 9:59Hank Green?

  Okay. This question comes from Chloe, who asks, Dear Hank and John, during my time in middle school, I was told a group of girls, who I thought were my friends, said that I, quote, "have no personality." And ever since then, that thought has stuck in my head. I feel like I'm hyper-aware of every time I can't carry a conversation, and I feel painfully awkward in most social situations. I never feel like I know what to say. Do I have a personality? Could I really know if I don't? How do I get a personality if I didn't have one before? Spiraling and existential dread, Chloe.

• 10:32John Green?

  Chloe, I would submit that if you didn't have a personality, you wouldn't feel the existential dread about something that happened in middle school. This is such a classic example of a phenomenon that is pretty much universal, which is that someone said something to you in middle school, and it stuck so hard that you can't ever let go of it, even though you understand intellectually that middle schoolers are maybe like the least qualified people in human history to comment on other people, because they don't have the capacity to pay meaningful attention to other people. And also because like, you're not fully formed, Chloe. Like, they're not fully formed, you're not fully formed. Like, of course, your personality

• 11:15John Green?

  is not what it's eventually going to be. Neither is theirs.

• 11:18Hank Green?

  Yeah. Yeah, middle school judgments are probably not the closest thing to the accurate readings of a human soul.

• 11:26John Green?

  No, but they feel so accurate. Because I think like, as you get older, people have more social inhibitions, and so they don't say things like, Chloe, you have no personality. And so you just assume that's what they're thinking, because you assume that they're inhibiting what they want to say to you, which is that you have no personality. I tried to channel this a little bit in Turtles All the Way Down, when Daisy says that Aza is kind of like mustard. Like, a little bit of her is great, but a lot of her is too much, which is such a horrible thing to say to a person, but also so like dang memorable and sticky.

• 12:01Hank Green?

  Uh huh, uh huh.

• 12:02John Green?

  And so I think what happened, Chloe, is that somebody just said something to you that was sticky, and it's not based in reality. Of course you have a personality. Nobody can carry a conversation all the time.

• 12:14Hank Green?

  Yeah, and social awkwardness is like a thing. And honestly, I used to have it a lot, and now I don't anymore, and I wish I had a little more. I was just at an event this weekend, and I said like, five things that I like bolted upright in the night sweating, and was like, I cannot believe I said that.

• 12:34John Green?

  There's so many regrets.

• 12:35Hank Green?

  I cannot believe I said that. My god, I need a little more social awkwardness. I need to let, like, I can have this thing where I don't want to let a silence sit, and so I'm like, well, I only have one thing I know, I've only thought of one kind of funny little thing to say right now, and so I'm gonna say it. And then I say it, and I'm like, and people like laugh, but like...

• 12:56John Green?

  Through their teeth.

• 12:57Hank Green?

  Shouldn't have said it. Shouldn't have said it.

• 13:00John Green?

  Yeah. I mean, sometimes you want to fill a hole in a conversation, but what the conversation really needs is quiet. And I would argue Chloe seems like she's doing a great job of that.

• 13:11Hank Green?

  Yeah. Yeah, you gotta leave space. Now, if there's like a self-consciousness, and there's like a lack of confidence, that like, is spurring from middle school hardness, and like, don't, do not let anyone tell you that middle school doesn't hang.

• 13:27John Green?

  No, it hangs.

• 13:29Hank Green?

  Yeah, I'm 46 years old, and I talk about middle school with my therapist. So...

• 13:35John Green?

  Absolutely.

• 13:36Hank Green?

  So it hangs. And, but there's like ways to work through this. And one of them is, is social situations that you feel safe in. And those can be hard to come by. And another is maybe therapy. Like, there's lots of, lots of good parts of having a person who is trained to be a safe place for you.

• 13:57John Green?

  Absolutely. I also think that there's a sense in which we all imagine ourselves as the heroes of some great story. Like, we all imagine, of course, we see ourselves as the protagonists, because even the people who are closest to us, we see in the context of ourselves, right? My spouse, my best friend, my brother, whatever. And when you're told you have no personality, it's a way of saying like, you are not the hero of the story. And that's true, Chloe, in the sense that you're not the hero of their story, but you do still get to be the main character of yours. And, and so like, they were sort of like pushing you to the side in a way that's terrible and appropriate, probably like developmentally

• 14:37John Green?

  appropriate to middle school, but still horrible and painful. And you have to find a way to claim your story outside of them, outside of their characterization of it.

• 14:49Hank Green?

  Yep.

• 14:50John Green?

  All right, Hank, we got another question from Lucas, who writes, Dear John and Hank, I do not consider myself a religious or spiritual person, but I nonetheless find it easier to get over certain life mistakes, as though in the moment I subscribe to some form of reincarnation. Like, eh, lesson learned, I'll handle it better on the next one. But then, this got me thinking. If I have a soul, which is in no way limited by physicality, except for its temporary association with this particular sack of organs, then I don't see why anyone's subsequent incarnation has to be on the same planet or in the same galaxy. In fact, given the vastness of the universe, it seems like an existential inevitability that many other worlds with complex life exist and will exist, therefore, the probability of two consecutive lifetimes on Earth seems exceedingly small. How many lives will it take for my lessons from this one to come up?

• 15:34Hank Green?

  This is a great question. This is a great question.

• 15:39Hank Green?

  I also love Lucas's sign-off, which is Lucas. Lucas is fine, don't worry. Because Lucas is not spelled exactly the way you would expect it to be.

• 15:47John Green?

  No, but I just, I did my best.

• 15:50Hank Green?

  Yeah. No, Lucas is fine. So, so a couple of things that I want to say. First of all, this is a plot point in Babylon 5. So if you want to watch a show about it, this is a thing. Second, though, I think I'm gonna wager, and that you're gonna disagree with me maybe, John, but pretty fast. I think pretty fast.

• 16:11John Green?

  Oh, pretty fast?

• 16:12Hank Green?

  Yeah.

• 16:13John Green?

  Okay, that surprises me.

• 16:15Hank Green?

  I know. I thought that it would surprise you.

• 16:17John Green?

  Because you don't think there's that much life in the universe?

• 16:20Hank Green?

  I think there's lots of life in the universe. I just think that there's a lot of universe.

• 16:26John Green?

  Huh?

• 16:28Hank Green?

  Yeah.

• 16:28John Green?

  No, no. Lucas's point is that like, given how much universe there is, and how much life there is in the universe, like, your chances of being reborn on Earth are essentially nil.

• 16:38Hank Green?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, for sure.

• 16:39John Green?

  So how long does it take to get back to Earth?

• 16:42Hank Green?

  You don't. You never get back to Earth. I mean, maybe, probably not, probably not. Probably by the time you get back to Earth, there's maybe not as many humans being born, or there aren't any humans, or the way that humans are, are as, I don't know. Well, I guess that wouldn't preclude the soul. It would continue, that we would continue to be ensouled, I guess. Anyway, my point is, unlikely that you would end up in a human anytime soon. But I think the lessons might be somewhat useful elsewhere.

• 17:15John Green?

  Oh, so you're saying it wouldn't be that long until you woke up and you were complex again, so that you could use the lessons?

• 17:22Hank Green?

  Oh, I don't think that the non-complex things are ensouled. So I think that the soul is only being reincarnated into things that have some amount of sociality.

• 17:31John Green?

  Cool, cool, cool. So where's the line? Ants?

• 17:35Hank Green?

  No.

• 17:36John Green?

  Okay, I'll have to let them know. They're gonna be disappointed.

• 17:39Hank Green?

  I had, I had a moment where I really fought not to say ants aren't social, because of course they are. They're like the socialist of socialisms. Socialist-ist of socialisms.

• 17:51John Green?

  Yeah, no, they're pretty socialist, actually. That reminds me of something I said recently to a young person, where I was kind of joking around to them, and I said, are you a socialist? And they responded, I think they're seven or eight, they responded, I'm not very social.

• 18:10Hank Green?

  Yeah. Yeah. Well, that's, that'll, that'll drive the socialism out of you.

• 18:17John Green?

  Yeah. If you're not interested in the welfare of others.

• 18:24Hank Green?

  I, I, all right. So we're gonna, we're gonna draw a line. Can we divide the soul up? Like, if somebody doesn't, like, if an animal doesn't need like a total soul, like, we need a lot of soul.

• 18:36John Green?

  Okay, so you're saying that like, there's more soul, but there's still some soul in ants, but there's more soul in humans, in which case, if you were reincarnated as an ant, you'd actually be reincarnated as a lot of ants?

• 18:48Hank Green?

  That's what I'm saying, yeah.

• 18:50John Green?

  Okay. I'm into it.

• 18:51Hank Green?

  Yeah, or like a bunch, a bunch of ants, and also an anteater, and also maybe a squirrel too.

• 18:57John Green?

  Right, right, right. So I, I think about this all the time, because like Lucas, I don't actually believe in reincarnation, but I find it a helpful thought experiment. In the same way that I don't actually believe that I'm gonna go up to the gates of heaven, and St. Peter's gonna be there, and tell me I drank too many La Croix's, and I have to go to the bad place. But I find it a helpful thought experiment. Like, what would I have learned from this if I could have learned something? Or what would I be doing if I were trying to live in such a way that I'm so in line with my values that I would get up to St. Peter and be like, open the doors, buddy?

• 19:32Hank Green?

  Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 19:35John Green?

  So I think it's interesting, and I do think that we need to define the human soul as six possum souls.

• 19:45Hank Green?

  Yeah. Yeah. And, you know, I think that's, I think that's safe.

• 19:51John Green?

  One human is essentially six possums in a trench coat.

• 19:55Hank Green?

  If one human is, if one human is six possums, we've done some terrible things. Terrible things.

• 20:01John Green?

  Well, we have. Wait, wait until you find out about humans.

• 20:10John Green?

  We're a nightmare.

• 20:11Hank Green?

  We're a nightmare. How many chickens is a human? Because if it's not like a billion, we're, we're coming out real on the wrong side of the math.

• 20:20John Green?

  Yeah. Yeah. I'm getting a little depressed thinking about your thought experiment, Hank, so I want to move on to another question.

• 20:27Hank Green?

  Yeah.

• 20:28John Green?

  It's from Alex, who writes, or possibly Alyx. I've seen this name A L Y X pronounced both, both ways. Anyway, Dear John and Hank, one of my friends is publishing her first book and I pre-ordered it because I was so excited for her. I have now been invited to a reading and signing event, but the copy of her book that I pre-ordered won't arrive until after the event. Brothers, what is the least awkward way to navigate this event and show my friend I support her without buying a second copy of the book? Publishers and Puzzlements, Alyx, Alyx, Alex.

• 20:55Hank Green?

  Alex.

• 20:55John Green?

  P S. You don't have to read out the title if you don't want to promo it, but the book is called The Flayed Man by Chloe Louder. I looked up this book, Hank, it looks awesome. It's like a vampire novel that's also about the relationships between mothers and daughters.

• 21:09Hank Green?

  Ooh, cool. Cool. I have an idea.

• 21:13John Green?

  Okay.

• 21:14Hank Green?

  And I don't know, I don't know if it's gonna work, but Chloe probably has written something else. Probably not a book, maybe not a book, but probably something.

• 21:23John Green?

  Okay.

• 21:23Hank Green?

  Is there, is there a short story that you can go to Kinko's with and get it printed out and have your friend Chloe sign something else that Chloe has made?

• 21:36John Green?

  So I'm gonna push back on this on a couple of levels.

• 21:39Hank Green?

  Okay.

• 21:40John Green?

  First off, this is Chloe's first novel.

• 21:45Hank Green?

  Okay.

• 21:45John Green?

  At least as far as I can tell.

• 21:47Hank Green?

  Otherwise, otherwise this would not have been an issue at all.

• 21:50John Green?

  Right. So I think that maybe you could print out a short story. I'm gonna throw it out there, and this is an author response, Alex. So bear that in mind, but I'm gonna throw it out there that you should buy two copies of the book.

• 22:06John Green?

  It reminds me, I met.

• 22:07Hank Green?

  It's a gift.

• 22:08John Green?

  I met a great picture book author once, and I said, oh, I read my, I read my, I read your book to my kid every single night. And he said, I find it best if you read them a new copy each day.

• 22:25Hank Green?

  Look, you don't understand how, how few copies I sell.

• 22:31John Green?

  Yeah. Well, actually, he was doing fine, but I think in general, authors, it's, he, or, or return your preorder. Just, just cancel your preorder. The main thing is you have to buy the book at the event. You have to. You have to. I mean, I don't wanna, I don't wanna overstate it, but like, when I did my first author event and there were only two people there and they'd both already bought the book, and so the bookstore sold zero copies of the book at my, at my book launch.

• 23:01Hank Green?

  Yeah.

• 23:02John Green?

  Even having, even though they had ordered 150 of them, that was bad. Don't let that happen. Don't let that happen.

• 23:11Hank Green?

  I, that's a great point. And, and look, I've many times have I accidentally gotten two books, because I pre-ordered it twice.

• 23:22John Green?

  Mm-hmm.

• 23:23Hank Green?

  How, how many times has this happened to me? And then, sometimes, recently, I got Griffin McElroy's book twice accidentally, and then he sent me a copy.

• 23:32John Green?

  So you have it three times. Now you have two to give away.

• 23:34Hank Green?

  I did, and I have. They're great, they're great books for like birthday parties. For sure. Yeah.

• 23:40John Green?

  All right. I think we've solved the problem. Either return the preorder or buy two books. Do not show up at that event and not buy a book.

• 23:49Hank Green?

  Yeah. The, I, I, it does seem that The Flayed Man probably isn't great for nine-year-old birthday parties, but, but probably other birthday gifts it would be great for.

• 24:00John Green?

  I bet Alex has some grown-up friends that they could give it to.

• 24:03Hank Green?

  This question comes from Sarah, who asks, Dear Hank and John, I'm an 18-year-old who's really into, into a niche martial art. It's called Subak Do, and it has a tight-knit community. I love all the people I train with, but I can't help comparing myself and feeling like I don't belong. I just went to one of my first national events and I had so much fun, but once I got home, I couldn't stop thinking about all the things I can't do. How do I start feeling inspired by friends instead of just inferior to them? I logically know that I can't keep up, but I just keep being overwhelmed by imposter syndrome, literally internally screaming, Sarah!

• 24:39John Green?

  That's a good sign off.

• 24:40Hank Green?

  Yeah.

• 24:41John Green?

  I think this is the case not just for practitioners of Subak Do, but for literally anyone who goes to literally any conference. Like, I think that the dental sales conference, I think at the dental sales conference, people have a good time and then they leave it and they go like, oh, I can't believe I'm not as good as some of the other dental salespeople. I think that this is, I, I remember that at VidCon. Like, I would go to VidCon and come home and be really energized, but at the same time, like, wow, I am so far away from ever making a Wheezy Waiter video.

• 25:10Hank Green?

  Yeah. Yeah. And, and the important thing is that like, you're not making a Wheezy Waiter video. It's just hard to remember that. It's especially hard to remember that in a martial art when like, there is a gradient of skill built into the system. But that's kind of also the thing. It's one of the things I like about martial art is like, what I know is Taekwondo. You're not supposed to be a good green belt when you're a yellow belt. You're supposed to be a good yellow belt. Like, you're, this is where you are. You were put in like, that's what you're, and like, you're as much a part of the thing as everyone else. You're just in the group of your skill level. And, and like, there are lots of things that define your skill level. There's how hard you work, there's how old you are, there's what, you know, what your level of ability is, there's what

• 25:55Hank Green?

  your sort of like temperament is, you know? And so that, I've watched a lot of kids spend this sort of the same amount of effort on Taekwondo and come out with very different outcomes.

• 26:09John Green?

  Right.

• 26:09Hank Green?

  Uh, and this makes sense to me as a person who's like, actually seen those kids. Like, there is difference there. And so, and, but like, nobody, like, of course, the kids compare themselves to each other, but everyone feels a part of it. And it, it sounds like you let, you feel like you're a part of it. And so it's, it's, the thing is working, which is amazing. This is very actually hard to do, but it sounds like you feel like you're a part of the community and you're included in it. And that's, that's the thing you're trying to do.

• 26:37John Green?

  Right. You just wanna be part of the community. I think that, so when I was a kid, I've told this story before, probably a million times on the podcast, but when I was in middle school, I only started one soccer game. And at halftime, the coach subbed me out and said, you know why I started green? Because at least he tries. Which was a devastation at the time, because I was being used as a motivational tool rather than as a player.

• 27:04Hank Green?

  Yeah.

• 27:04John Green?

  And I thought I'd come up against my big break and I was gonna be, you know, out on the field, starting every game. But I just wasn't very good. And the reason I wasn't very good wasn't because I didn't try hard. It was because I had something called aphantasia, and I literally could not see, you know, I can't see space very well, unless I'm looking directly at it. I can't imagine space outside of my visual stimulus.

• 27:30Hank Green?

  Yeah, I bet, man, Messi must have the opposite of aphantasia.

• 27:34John Green?

  He does.

• 27:34Hank Green?

  Where he just like knows where everything is all of the time.

• 27:37John Green?

  He has Fantasia, absolutely. But I, I don't. And then also, like, I wasn't very fast. I didn't have very good hand-eye coordination or foot-eye coordination or whatever. Like, I just didn't have the gifts necessary to excel at the sport. But I did have the gifts necessary to enjoy and participate in the sport, which I think is what mattered. Like, looking back, I, I now, I now see that story not as a story of like, me being humbled or embarrassed or humiliated, but instead, like, a story that I can really celebrate something about myself, which is that I do try. I do have hustle. I do, you know, want to be good even when I'm not. And I see those now as good qualities, not as like weaknesses or failures.

• 28:21Hank Green?

  Yeah. Which reminds me, John.

• 28:24John Green?

  Oh, we did it together.

• 28:25Hank Green?

  Look at us. Look at us. After, after 462 episodes, we finally did it at the exact same time.

• 28:32John Green?

  You do it.

• 28:32Hank Green?

  Which reminds me that this podcast is brought to you, well, what did you wanna do? Maybe yours is better than mine.

• 28:37John Green?

  Mine is just John's middle school soccer hustle.

• 28:40Hank Green?

  Okay. Which reminds me that this podcast is brought to you by my brother John's middle school soccer hustle. John's middle school soccer hustle, it's, it's real, you know? It's real.

• 28:50John Green?

  And of course, today's podcast is brought to you by the insult chicken. The insult chicken should be a source of concern for many of us.

• 28:58Hank Green?

  This podcast is also brought to you by Anemone Fight Club. Anemone Fight Club, not going great.

• 29:03John Green?

  And this podcast is brought to you by hyper Fantasia. Hyper Fantasia, it's what Messi has. He is a joy to watch.

• 29:10Hank Green?

  I, you know what was happening when the final goal was scored? The, the one and final goal of the last game of the World Cup?

• 29:18John Green?

  You on what?

• 29:18Hank Green?

  I, I was, it was playing in the corner of the room I was in, and I was getting a presentation on the, the ablative foam heat shields from Artemis One.

• 29:34Hank Green?

  From a NASA engineer.

• 29:36John Green?

  Oh, Jesus, that sounds disastrous.

• 29:40John Green?

  Was there an uproar?

• 29:41Hank Green?

  There was an uproar. There was a true uproar. It was very intense.

• 29:46John Green?

  Oh, my God.

• 29:47Hank Green?

  Yeah, everyone was stacked in the corner.

• 29:49John Green?

  Oh, my God.

• 29:50Hank Green?

  Which was great. I mean, it's very cool.

• 29:52John Green?

  Yeah, it's a good memory. The first World Cup final, we were at the first VidCon. I mean, the 2010 World Cup final.

• 29:59Hank Green?

  Oh, yeah. No, we were in like a gold tent.

• 30:02John Green?

  Yes, we were in a big room and.

• 30:04Hank Green?

  And I didn't care. I remember not caring at all. I care so much more now.

• 30:08John Green?

  Yeah, well, there you go. Football's got you.

• 30:10Hank Green?

  This episode of Dear Hank and John is brought to you by Wayfair. There are a number of objects in my home that I have been extraordinarily well-served by, maybe for 15 or 20 years. Like a pair of fake leather upholstered stools that I've had forever, but they've seen better days. They maybe need a little bit of a refresh. Good news, Wayfair helps you create a home that stands up to real life with quality products, great value, and trusted reviews. Wayfair verified products are hand vetted by product specialists using a 10-point quality inspection. You can use filters, customer photos, and more than 20 million verified five-star reviews to confidently find the right fit for your home.

• 30:50Hank Green?

  And now those stools that I had 15 or 20 years ago, I don't have those. I have different stools that are very comfortable and look, let's just say, better. Find pieces made for real life and get even more value with Wayfair Rewards. Join Wayfair Rewards today to get 5% back on every purchase. Head to wayfair.com to shop all things home. That's W A Y F A I R dot com.

• 31:18Hank Green?

  This episode of Dear Hank and John is brought to you by Quince. I do very much like opening up my closet and finding an item that I know is going to be both comfortable and I'm just gonna look good in it. It's gonna go well with my khakis or my jeans or my third kind of pant that I have like a pair of orange pants. Just things that make getting dressed easier, and that's what Quince does best. Quince focuses on high-quality wardrobe staples made with premium materials like 100% Mongolian cashmere, organic cotton, and merino wool. And the styles are timeless and they're versatile and they're designed to become dependable pieces that you reach for day after day. This morning, I put on this jacket that I'm currently wearing with just a white t-shirt and I knew immediately, this is gonna work.

• 32:01Hank Green?

  I went downstairs and Catherine was like, "Look at that nice jacket. Where'd that come from?" You know where it came from? It came from Quince. Everything at Quince is priced 50 to 80% less than similar brands because they work directly with ethical factories and cut out the middleman. So you're paying for the quality, not the brand markup. Find your next fall favorites at Quince. Download the Quince app for app-exclusive offers or go to quince.com. Get free shipping on your order and 365-day returns, now available in Canada and the UK, too. And when Quince asks where you heard about them, let them know that it was Dear Hank and John. It's a good way to support the show. I feel like I should say it's Q U I N C E. I guess it's pretty easy to spell Quince. Quince.com. I feel tempted to make up a tagline for them, but that's not what they want me to do. I shouldn't do that.

• 32:51Hank Green?

  This episode of Dear Hank and John is brought to you by Factor. Factor makes chef-crafted, dietitian-designed, ready-to-eat meals so you don't have to choose between real food and convenience. You can have both real food and convenience, which is good because I will choose convenience every time, even if convenience is just peanuts again, literally. I eat a lot of peanuts. Factor meals are ready in two minutes, and I'm not joking there. They are ready in two minutes and they require no prep and no cleanup. So even the days when your schedule is completely out of control, eating well is still achievable.

• 33:26Hank Green?

  But here's a secret I have for you. Sometimes I actually do introduce cleanup artificially. I will move it from the Factor container onto a plate so I can feel like I'm having a real meal. And that's fine. And then I have one plate to clean. I don't have a bunch of pots and pans to clean, though. Every week you will find over 100 nutrient-dense menu items to choose from and new options like salmon burgers, shredded pork, collard greens, and more. Plus add-ons you'll crave like pumpkin-flavored cheesecake and protein shakes. 97% of users agree that Factor meals help them live a healthier life, so you can feel confident that you're doing something good for yourself with every meal.

• 34:05Hank Green?

  True story, right now, I do not have any Factor meals in my fridge and I am hungry and I'm about to go inside and absolutely rummage for something and I'm sad about it. Some current Factor meals include chicken taco bowl with corn salsa and cilantro crema. This is making me so hungry. Onion portobello burger with potatoes and white cheddar. That's right, they can help you go vegetarian or eat less meat. You can also have golden corn and shrimp risotto with Brussels, cabbage, and pepper medley, but I can't because I'm allergic to shrimp. Let's eat real. Head to factormeals.com/dearthank50off and use code DEARHANK50OFF to get 50% off and one free breakfast item per box for one year.

• 34:46Hank Green?

  While supplies last until October 31st, 2026. That's code DEARHANK50OFF at factormeals.com. Dear Hank, five zero off at factormeals.com. See the website for more details.

• 35:03John Green?

  All right, let's answer another question from Julian who writes, "Dear John and Hank, John, your book on tuberculosis has inspired me to write my paper on the systemic inequities of healthcare globally as a graduate social work student." Thank you so much. That's so cool. "My husband is a big fan of your guys' work and has been slowly introducing me to your videos and books, and now I am too. We're both very motivated to make the world a better place, even under the current circumstances, but what are some ways we can help out Sierra Leone specifically? Whether that's in person or virtually, including going there. I'd be happy to share the critical analysis paper with you when it's complete because that's how the French cut their vegetables, Julien."

• 35:38John Green?

  Well, that is a lovely question and thank you for caring about Sierra Leone. I think, you know, it depends on what you're trying to accomplish. Like, it depends on where you're trying to lower barriers to access. If you're trying to lower barriers to healthcare access, I think Partners in Health is one of the strongest places you can give because they've been in Sierra Leone for a long time and are committed to staying for a lot longer. I think if you're looking to lower barriers to educational access, you might look into different charities. And then if you're looking to lower poverty as poverty, the best way by far is to give money directly to people and their organizations like GiveDirectly that help you do that.

• 36:20Hank Green?

  Yeah.

• 36:20John Green?

  As far as going to Sierra Leone, it's a beautiful country, lots of amazing beaches, mountains, hikes. I mean, it's a phenomenal place. It has no or almost no infrastructure for tourism, and so it's hard to go there when you don't have a local friend or guide just because you have to do so much pre-research by yourself, but it is possible. I know lots of people who do it.

• 36:45Hank Green?

  John, this next question comes from Whitney who asks, "Dear Hank and John, the World Cup ending is giving me and my husband dopamine withdrawals. Based on solely lore alone, which Premier League team should we support football and fiction, Whitney?"

• 37:00John Green?

  So Whitney, you should support the Premier League team, AFC Wimbledon. Not currently in the Premier League, but headed there within the next century.

• 37:11Hank Green?

  This is gonna be your great legacy, John.

• 37:13John Green?

  They're owned by their fans, Whitney.

• 37:15Hank Green?

  And John Green.

• 37:17John Green?

  It's a different kind of football club entirely than any one you can root for in the Premier League. It's beautiful. You can follow it every week here on Dear Hank and John.

• 37:25Hank Green?

  Now, John, I think that it was a given that Whitney is passionate about AFC Wimbledon.

• 37:31John Green?

  Okay.

• 37:31Hank Green?

  But perhaps she wants to watch, and I know that I'm saying these words and I apologize for them, higher-quality soccer.

• 37:40John Green?

  Yeah, well.

• 37:41Hank Green?

  Because the World Cup, one of the things about the World Cup is you're like, wow.

• 37:44John Green?

  Yeah, they kick it right.

• 37:46Hank Green?

  A number of impressive things that occurred in sequence.

• 37:49John Green?

  They kick it right where they want it to go.

• 37:50Hank Green?

  It goes where they want it to go.

• 37:52John Green?

  Which is not the AFC Wimbledon story, to be fair. When those like 40-yard cross-field passes happen and they land right at the foot of the player, if that's what you like about football, Whitney, I would not recommend AFC Wimbledon.

• 38:09John Green?

  If you like the drama and investing in personalities and everything, AFC Wimbledon is great. But if you're looking for the highest quality football, maybe not. So in terms of vibes, I'll give you a few of the top Premier League teams, but I think you should watch the Premier League for a few weeks and kind of find where your heart goes is my honest advice. I mean, I grew up a Liverpool fan. I love Liverpool. There's a song that Liverpool fans sing before and after each game. You'll Never Walk Alone from the musical carousel that I think is one of the most beautiful shared experiences in the world today. You know, 50, 60,000 people singing together. And you'll never walk alone is a beautiful, beautiful thing. But there are also other great football clubs in England. I would

• 38:51John Green?

  caution you against supporting Manchester City, because that's just glory hunting at this point. They're too good. They've been too good for too long. They have too much money behind them. They're owned by an actual country, which is a big structural advantage.

• 39:07Hank Green?

  Like a sovereign wealth fund?

• 39:08John Green?

  Correct. They're owned by a sovereign wealth fund, as is Newcastle United. So I would kind of recommend against following them unless you have a specific and deep tie to Newcastle. I find Aston Villa very likeable. Arsenal has a lot of American fans. So if you're looking to like, watch soccer at a local soccer bar in America, Arsenal might make sense, or Liverpool might make sense, because they both have a lot of American fans. But I think you got to watch the game and see who calls to your heart.

• 39:37Hank Green?

  Got to watch the game and see who calls to your heart. There's not. I would just assume that you're gonna say whichever club you like.

• 39:44John Green?

  Well, I like Liverpool the most. I think you should be a Liverpool fan. It's a good life. And Liverpool are pretty good, but they're not so good that they're gonna like, be the Yankees and win all the time.

• 39:54Hank Green?

  Right.

• 39:54John Green?

  I actually don't know if the Yankees still win all the time, but they did when I was a kid. But, you know, like, when they win, it feels magical. And Liverpool also have a strong history in Europe. Like, one of the things that's confusing about English soccer is that they participated in more than one competition at the same time.

• 40:11Hank Green?

  Yeah.

• 40:11John Green?

  And one of these competitions is called the Champions League, where all the best teams from all the European countries play each other. And that's a, that's a really fun competition to watch. And the quality of football is incredible. Like, unbelievable.

• 40:25Hank Green?

  Question about that?

• 40:26John Green?

  Yeah.

• 40:28Hank Green?

  Aren't they tired?

• 40:29John Green?

  Oh, Hank, they're so tired. In fact, I think the reason that Spain won the World Cup is because they played fewer games than the, or, and, and less intense games than the English teams did. And so I think most of Spain's players play in Spain, not all of them, but a lot of them do. And I think that was a little bit of advantage.

• 40:48Hank Green?

  So the English players were tired because they were playing a lot of England games?

• 40:52John Green?

  I mean, they all play a lot of games. They all play a tremendous number of games. I don't mean to take anything away from Spain, or France, or anything, or Germany, or anything. But like, they play way too many games. It is a problem with the sport. They play often two games a week.

• 41:06Hank Green?

  You got this opportunity, you gotta take it. You can make all this money, and then you can turn that money into more players. And it's, you gotta play, you gotta play that game, too.

• 41:13John Green?

  That is the game that they're playing. But I would argue that they're sort of, they've gotten to a point where the skill is being impacted, like, the beauty of the game is a little impacted, because you just can't ask players to play two, sometimes three games a week, 40, sometimes 45 weeks a year. It's just too much.

• 41:36Hank Green?

  It's too much. I feel like the hockey, the hockey season is so long, and they play so many games.

• 41:40John Green?

  And they don't get any vacation. Like, there's no off season. During the off season, they're playing in the World Cup, or the Euros, or whatever. And like, I just, I feel really, I, I do, I don't feel that bad for people who make millions of dollars a year kicking the ball around. But I do feel like, at some point, it becomes unfair to the competition.

• 42:01Hank Green?

  Yeah. Well, one thing you know, if there's a bunch of people getting paid millions of dollars a year getting to kick a ball around, there's also a bunch of people who are working real hard and not getting paid that much, in a, in a lot of

• 42:11John Green?

  Yeah.

• 42:11Hank Green?

  Other.

• 42:12John Green?

  Including AFC Wimbledon players who, who play 60 games a season and, and don't make millions of dollars.

• 42:18Hank Green?

  Yeah. Does it, does like, everybody on a, on a Liverpool football club, Liverpool football club, get, get real good money?

• 42:26John Green?

  Yeah. I mean, the kids sometimes don't get real good money. Like, if you're like 16 or 17.

• 42:31Hank Green?

  Yeah.

• 42:31John Green?

  But the, uh,

• 42:33Hank Green?

  They're headed there.

• 42:34John Green?

  The adult, they're headed there.

• 42:36Hank Green?

  Yeah.

• 42:36John Green?

  Yeah. But that doesn't mean, you know, like, I, the thing about a professional athlete's career that we often forget is we think about how much money they make, and we don't think about how long they make it for. And so if you're in the NFL, and you make $800,000 a year for four years, you made a lot of money. You paid a lot of taxes. But you made a lot of money. But I don't know that you necessarily made enough money to live super comfortably for the rest of your life, which is basically what you're gonna have to do, because you may not have, be in a situation where it's easy to find a job. Like, being a professional football player doesn't necessarily train you for other jobs particularly well.

• 43:12Hank Green?

  Yeah, it can, it can have its trainings for other jobs. I mean, one thing, knowing professional sports players who no longer are professional sports players, they are,

• 43:23Hank Green?

  they have a mindset that is, that is about working hard, and

• 43:28John Green?

  They are hard workers.

• 43:29Hank Green?

  Yes.

• 43:30John Green?

  You don't get there if you're not a hard worker. It's true.

• 43:32Hank Green?

  Okay, John, this one's from Kelly, who asks, Dear Hank and John, I am due to give birth to my first child, one week before the release of Hollywood Ending, available for preorder now.

• 43:42John Green?

  Thank you for reminding the people that it's available for preorder now, even in your advanced pregnancy.

• 43:48Hank Green?

  I have been a John Green fan since I was a baby myself, around 17 years old. And I'm very excited to read this book. I have also heard, having a newborn is like, really hard. Maybe I will even lose some sleep. Could just be rumors. I don't know. Anyway, do you think I should hold off on reading it until I'm out of the newborn trenches? Were either of you or your wives able to enjoy reading during that time of your life? What activity was enjoyable in those first few weeks, other than sleeping, which likely won't be happening? Pumpkins, Penguins, and Pregnant. Kelly.

• 44:21John Green?

  Kelly, there wasn't a lot that was super enjoyable in those first few weeks, and I wasn't even the one doing most of the feeding.

• 44:28Hank Green?

  Yeah. Yeah. I, I would, would say you're likely not gonna get a lot of book reading done. You might be able to get some audio reading done.

• 44:39John Green?

  So here's what I'll say. You could read over audiobook, you know, while you're feeding, or dealing with diapers, or whatever you're dealing with. That's one thing.

• 44:47Hank Green?

  You know, I'd take a book that you're really comfortable and familiar with, that you can fall asleep during the middle of, and you're not gonna miss anything. And, and just like, and is like a comfort thing.

• 44:59John Green?

  Yeah.

• 45:00Hank Green?

  And like, the hard parts of my life, when I'm exhausted, I don't want to be reading a new book. I want to read Jane Austen, or James S. A. Corey, or like, some, something that I've just know.

• 45:12John Green?

  Yeah. And honestly, Kelly, I'd probably prefer you to be awake when you read Hollywood Ending.

• 45:20Hank Green?

  Yeah. It makes me think you shouldn't read the audiobook, because you can fall asleep during audiobooks. You cannot fall asleep while, and miss a part of a book you're reading out of a physical book.

• 45:30John Green?

  Yeah, I did do a lot of reading out loud to Henry and Alice when they were infants. And so if you're up for it, you could always read it out loud to them. I don't think there's anything that's gonna, you know, affect their three-month-old brain. But I also don't blame you if you, if you, if it turns out you're too tired. I'm not gonna take it personally, Kelly, I promise.

• 45:52Hank Green?

  Yeah. Yeah. It'll still be there.

• 45:56John Green?

  It'll still be there. That's the great thing about books. Like, I was thinking about Looking for Alaska when Pablo Torre was reading that section of it. I was thinking both, like, I can't believe this is happening to me. This is a nightmare. And I was thinking, wow, that book's still in print. That's incredible. Like, people are still reading it for the first time. 21 years later. Like, to have a book in print for 21 years is such a miracle, Hank. Like, I am so beyond lucky that that book and my other early books have hung around the way they have. I mean, actually, Looking for Alaska sells more copies every month than it sold in its first year. It's crazy.

• 46:35Hank Green?

  That's crazy. I will also say, don't worry about spoilers, because you're not gonna be consuming media.

• 46:43John Green?

  No.

• 46:44Hank Green?

  What, yeah.

• 46:45John Green?

  No, you're just gonna be, you're gonna be scrolling here and there. But it's gonna be a lot of sleep and wake, sleep and wake.

• 46:52Hank Green?

  Yeah. Sleep when the baby sleeps.

• 46:55John Green?

  All right, Hank, it's time for the all-important news from Mars and AFC Wimbledon. What is the news from Mars this week?

• 47:00Hank Green?

  NASA is planning for the Space Reactor One Freedom Mission, and that's really what it's called.

• 47:06John Green?

  Wow. That sounds, that sounds like somebody wrote it.

• 47:11Hank Green?

  It sounds pretty American. It sounds of the American aesthetic. They've announced that the mission is estimated to cost $2.1 billion for this nuclear-powered spaceship to Mars. However, that does not include the cost of the actual science mission that will be on board, which is called Skyfall. And I, like, again, I just don't know that anybody looked up the meaning of what Skyfall is.

• 47:34John Green?

  I don't like that at all.

• 47:38Hank Green?

  It sounds, it's like, it's very descriptive of what it is, which is that it's dropping a bunch of helicopters onto Mars. And so like, yes, but Skyfall has quite a, quite a, you know, bunch of context that's carried along with it in terms of what it means as a term. But anyway, that will be carried on this nuclear spacecraft, Space Reactor One, and Skyfall is being designed to send more helicopters to Mars to look for possible water sources and collect other data, but we do not have the cost of that part of the mission yet. The spacecraft is supposed to launch in late 2028, which is wild.

• 48:13John Green?

  Just in time.

• 48:14Hank Green?

  Will not have humans on it. It will be built in part from other spacecraft that are being repurposed to make into Space Reactor One freedom, including elements from a lunar space station that was canceled.

• 48:27John Green?

  Wow.

• 48:28Hank Green?

  Really scraping things together over at NASA HQ.

• 48:31John Green?

  It's like how I write a novel.

• 48:33Hank Green?

  Yeah, pieces. I, a lot of, it's interesting. I was talking to some of my like friends who communicate space news and, and they're like, you know, they're like, hey, look, they're getting, they're doing stuff. We like the part where they're doing stuff. So they are doing stuff.

• 48:52John Green?

  Okay. Well, sounds good. I prefer doing stuff to not doing stuff. Now Hank, you will recall that in January of this year, thanks to income from my Red Dead Redemption two streams on John's channel, we were able to support the acquisition of two players for AFC Wimbledon, James Tilly and Zach Nelson. But both of those were only through the end of the season.

• 49:21Hank Green?

  Mm hmm.

• 49:22John Green?

  However, I have great news, which is that we have re-signed both James Tilly and Zach Nelson to permanent contracts. And so now they join Marcus Brown as players brought into AFC Wimbledon through this ridiculous program of stream, live streaming on John's channel and spending the money on AFC Wimbledon. Now, three elevens of the starting lineup has been supported by our community, which is absurd and beautiful, and also maybe an indication that the playing budget isn't what it needs to be.

• 49:57Hank Green?

  Oh, God.

• 50:01John Green?

  There you go. There's some news from AFC Wimbledon.

• 50:04Hank Green?

  That's wild. You're, you're collecting players?

• 50:08John Green?

  I'm collecting players.

• 50:10Hank Green?

  Well, but is AFC Wimbledon collecting players? Like, is there going to be a team?

• 50:14John Green?

  AFC Wimbledon has collected enough players to start fielding players for their preseason friendlies. I don't know that they've collected enough players to stay up in League One, which is the job this year. That, that remains to be seen, but we'll keep our fingers crossed and hope that Craig Cope, our Director of Football Operations, has some more tricks up his sleeve he usually does.

• 50:37Hank Green?

  He likes to operate that football.

• 50:39John Green?

  He loves to operate those football operations.

• 50:42Hank Green?

  Yeah. Tell me he's got to operate them.

• 50:44John Green?

  That's right. He's like the Moneyball guy. He's the guy who figures out, you know, this guy's gonna be a star, but currently he's only 21 and he hasn't performed yet. But when he comes to Wimbledon, he'll become a, a, a star. And that's worked out pretty well so far.

• 50:59Hank Green?

  But everybody else is doing it at the same time. You got to figure out how to Moneyball the Moneyball.

• 51:03John Green?

  I know. We aren't the only people trying to Moneyball.

• 51:06Hank Green?

  Yeah.

• 51:07John Green?

  It's hard out there for an AFC Wimbledon. Which reminds me, if anybody who's listening is a billionaire, support poverty relief efforts. But if you're a billionaire who refuses to help the poor, look at you, Elon.

• 51:22Hank Green?

  Don't take, don't take his money.

• 51:28John Green?

  That's enough.

• 51:29Hank Green?

  Don't take his money.

• 51:30John Green?

  What'd you say?

• 51:31Hank Green?

  I said, don't take his money. Not that he's offering.

• 51:33John Green?

  I wouldn't. I wouldn't. And I would take almost anyone's money.

• 51:36Hank Green?

  That's understandable. It's understandable. All right, John. Thank you for making a podcast with me. People of the world, if you'd like to send us questions, we sure do love them. And you can send them to [email protected]. My name's Hank, his name's John. They both have an H in them.

• 51:53John Green?

  This podcast was edited by Linus Ovenhaus, mixed by Joseph Tuna-Medich, and our marketing specialist is Brooke Shotwell. We're produced by Rosie Anhos Rojas and Hannah West. Our executive producer is Seth Radley. Our editorial assistant is Deboki Chakravarti. The music you're hearing now and at the beginning of the podcast is by the great Gennaro La, and as they say in our hometown, don't forget to be awesome.