3 BIGGEST MYTHS to The Law of Attraction: Manifest Your Reality

How can our thoughts and beliefs truly shape our lives, and what are the biggest myths surrounding The Law of Attraction? Rhonda Byrne, the visionary author of "The Secret," shares her insights on how thoughts and beliefs can shape our lives. Rick Rubin, a nine-time GRAMMY-winning producer, explores the intersection of creativity and manifestation, drawing from his extensive experience in music and personal development. Jen Sincero, author and motivational speaker, delves into the power of words, the energetic nature of money, and the crucial role of resilience and self-awareness in achieving personal greatness. In this episode you will learnHow to effectively harness the power of your thoughts to create your desired reality. The impact of your spoken words on shaping your life's outcomes. Understanding money as a dynamic form of energy that reflects your life's intentions. Strategies to cultivate a resilient and empowered mindset for personal and professional success. The importance of self-awareness in modifying your thoughts, behaviors, and beliefs to align with your goals. For more information go to www.lewishowes.com/1610For more Greatness text PODCAST to +1 (614) 350-3960Full episodes featured in today’s mashup:Rhonda Byrne – https://link.chtbl.com/1525-podRick Rubin – https://link.chtbl.com/1536-podJen Sincero – https://link.chtbl.com/1492-pod Get more from Lewis! Get my New York Times Bestselling book, Make Money Easy! Get The Greatness Mindset audiobook on SpotifyText Lewis AIYouTubeInstagramWebsiteTiktokFacebookX

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Lewis Howes?

  Welcome to this special masterclass. We've brought some of the top experts in the world to help you unlock the power of your life through this specific theme today. It's going to be powerful. So let's go ahead and dive in.

• 0:14Rhonda Byrne?

  When you're in joy, you will manifest so fast. It's a really high frequency and you will manifest really, really quickly. The thing is, if you're in grief and despair, it's very slow.

• 0:29Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 0:29Rhonda Byrne?

  And that is, so that's a protective mechanism for all of us. Because I had one time in my life where I hit depression and because I was extremely worried about my daughter and I just, there was just like this black cloud and I, and I thought, I have completely thought myself to here. I could see all of the scary thoughts that I believed and that, and, and I am here now, here is where I am. And I knew I was here because to experience it so I could help people out of depression. And so

• 1:12Lewis Howes?

  So no one else created you to get there.

• 1:15Rhonda Byrne?

  Oh, I did it.

• 1:16Lewis Howes?

  You created yourself to be.

• 1:17Rhonda Byrne?

  Oh, yeah. I tried everything that I knew, which was to be grateful and to think positive thoughts. So I tried thinking positive thoughts. I could feel how weak they were.

• 1:31Lewis Howes?

  What do you mean by that?

• 1:32Rhonda Byrne?

  Like they, they didn't have a lot of power behind them.

• 1:35Lewis Howes?

  So they were like, I'm happy, but I'm not really happy, not feeling it.

• 1:40Rhonda Byrne?

  Because the depression was, you know, it was strong. And so what I did was I decided to not resist the depression, but to love it.

• 1:54Lewis Howes?

  Tell me more.

• 1:55Rhonda Byrne?

  And it melted away.

• 1:56Lewis Howes?

  What does that look like if someone's going through three to six months of depression?

• 1:59Rhonda Byrne?

  So I had to imagine this. I had to, I had to create like a picture of this. But I, I kind of, like, I could feel the sensation of it because depression is just a sensation. All of my feelings are just sensations and they're not actually us. They're just, they're just a sensation. But I could, I, I would get that sensation and I would feel that sensation of depression. And then I just imagined putting my arms around it and pulling it into me. And that was hard to do.

• 2:35Lewis Howes?

  Not pushing it away or resisting it?

• 2:36Rhonda Byrne?

  Yeah, because that's what we do. You see, we push away bad feelings because we don't want to feel the pain. Right?

• 2:43Lewis Howes?

  We numb them. We try to escape from them.

• 2:46Rhonda Byrne?

  Exactly. We do everything. But I did the opposite because I knew what you resist persists. Right?

• 2:52Lewis Howes?

  Yes.

• 2:53Rhonda Byrne?

  And so I just imagined putting my arms around. The moment that I did it, it just evaporated, that whole feeling of depression. And then a couple of hours later, it started to come back, not nearly that same level. Did it again in three days, was totally gone.

• 3:13Lewis Howes?

  How long had you been experiencing the depression for? Was this weeks? Was this months?

• 3:17Rhonda Byrne?

  About, it was like a couple of weeks.

• 3:21Lewis Howes?

  Couple of weeks. And if you would have resisted it or numbed it or tried to escape it.

• 3:27Rhonda Byrne?

  Yeah, I'd still be there.

• 3:28Lewis Howes?

  Really?

• 3:29Rhonda Byrne?

  Yeah.

• 3:30Lewis Howes?

  So what I'm hearing you say is that you embracing the sadness, the pain, the grief, the loss, whatever it might be, but embracing it and, and creating a relationship with it.

• 3:40Rhonda Byrne?

  Yeah.

• 3:40Lewis Howes?

  As opposed to pushing it away.

• 3:42Rhonda Byrne?

  Yeah.

• 3:42Lewis Howes?

  Allowed it to flow through you and leave you.

• 3:45Rhonda Byrne?

  Yeah, it can't stay because nothing negative can remain in the face of love.

• 3:52Lewis Howes?

  Wow.

• 3:54Rhonda Byrne?

  Love is the light and everything negative you could say is darkness is one way to look at it. And so if there's love, the darkness just disappears. And that's why it just evaporated. It was the most incredible feeling. And I knew I'm experiencing this so I can share it with people.

• 4:15Lewis Howes?

  How does someone, I mean, The Secret, thirty four million plus copies, you know, tens of millions of people will watch the movie, all the other books and programs and products that you have have been, you know, sold by millions of people have been bought these things. How does someone believe they are worthy of great things the way you have been able to do great things in your life and impact the world in such a magnitude that you have done? How can someone know and trust that something is destined for them? Maybe it's not at this level, but something as great is destined for them. How do they know

• 4:59Lewis Howes?

  that? And did you know this your entire life leading up to this, that something like this was supposed to happen?

• 5:06Rhonda Byrne?

  No, I didn't.

• 5:07Lewis Howes?

  Really?

• 5:08Rhonda Byrne?

  No. But the moment I discovered it, I knew it. I absolutely knew it. I knew this is why I was here. I knew it with every fiber of my being. Yeah. So, but prior to that, I didn't. I was really ambitious. Okay.

• 5:27Lewis Howes?

  You were driven, you had a business.

• 5:29Rhonda Byrne?

  I was driven. But when I say ambitious, I was only wanting to perfect, be great myself. I wasn't in competition with anybody. I wasn't trying to be better than that person or I just wanted to be the best that I could be. And so I did it. But after I discovered The Secret and my whole life turned completely around three sixty. I look back on my life and I saw that every single thing in my life was leading to this.

• 6:00Lewis Howes?

  Really?

• 6:01Rhonda Byrne?

  Yes, because just even things like I worked in the newsroom for a radio station. And um, and so when the secret went crazy, like crazy, and I just had every news media outlet in the world, in every country, coming at us. And I did very little. And because I knew that what happens, what can happen is that the media will build you up to tear you down.

• 6:35Lewis Howes?

  Wow.

• 6:36Rhonda Byrne?

  And I knew that because I had worked in news and I'd worked in media and so.

• 6:41Lewis Howes?

  You'd seen it.

• 6:41Rhonda Byrne?

  I had seen it.

• 6:42Lewis Howes?

  Is that why you did very, you did Oprah and that was really it?

• 6:45Rhonda Byrne?

  I did Oprah and I did Oprah because I knew Oprah lived this. And you see, I didn't want to go onto anything where, I didn't want to have arguments with people because I'm not trying to convince you to do anything. I discovered something and I wanted to share it. And if you find that it's incredible for your life, then I'm so happy. If you, if you don't want to hear about it, that's fine too. So I didn't want to get into situations with people where they're like, oh, this is, you know, as if the mind can do this. This is all there is is mind, you know, they don't even realize like, it'll be hundreds

• 7:25Rhonda Byrne?

  of years before, before it has realized what the substance of the universe really, really is. But right now, we can use this knowledge to completely create the life we deserve to have.

• 7:38Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 7:39Rhonda Byrne?

  And what you were talking about, about being this great greatness, I think some of us were born to do something like this. But then there are others, and I think about this with my mother, right? My mother stopped working when she was like nineteen years old and she had five children. But my mother achieved greatness because she was an incredible mother and she was an incredible wife. And so her, her level was different. And I think. You know, what you did or what I did, not everybody is prepared to take the risks. You took risks.

• 8:18Lewis Howes?

  Yes.

• 8:19Rhonda Byrne?

  You can't, you can't do it without the risks.

• 8:21Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 8:22Rhonda Byrne?

  Yeah, I took huge risks. I, I put everything on the line. I put every, I would have been on the streets, you know, I, I, I like mortgaged, overdraft. I did everything possible to get the secret out to the world. And I, I didn't care, honestly, what happened to me after it. I just wanted to get it to the world and that was it. And, and so you, you have to have, there's something within you that really pushes you. But then there are people that they might love what they do, you know? And they don't want to be running a company. They don't want the stress of that.

• 9:03Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 9:04Rhonda Byrne?

  They love their family. They want to spend as much time with their family as possible. They just really love to have a better house or, you know, um. And I think, and, and I think honestly, if you can live your life and you can bring joy to other people just by your presence, just by your presence. If you can do that, oh my God, you've lived the greatest life possible. You really have because every single person, their true nature is joy and their true nature is love. And that's why you feel so good when you're in joy.

• 9:41Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 9:42Rhonda Byrne?

  Right?

• 9:43Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 9:43Rhonda Byrne?

  And that's why we feel so good when we're loving and being loving is smiling to that person like you did, you know? I'm opening the doors and I'm in a smile.

• 9:53Lewis Howes?

  Absolutely.

• 9:54Rhonda Byrne?

  Yeah.

• 9:54Lewis Howes?

  I mean, you talk about kindness. This is the next thing on top of here. You just said kindness. We're, we're in sync right here.

• 10:00Rhonda Byrne?

  We're in sync.

• 10:01Lewis Howes?

  Kindness, kindness changes everything. Want to see your life change for the better today? Then be the kindest you've ever been to every person you encounter. When you do that, it's hard to have a bad day.

• 10:14Rhonda Byrne?

  Or you can't. It's not possible. That's why.

• 10:18Rhonda Byrne?

  Just do that, you know, like I'm like, just do do that one thing and you don't take my word for it. Try it for yourself and just see for yourself what happens.

• 10:29Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 10:30Rhonda Byrne?

  I remember this person contacted us and really early on and he said, he decided that he was just going to be happy. I think it was a hairdresser and he said, I'm just go, I'm making a decision that I am going to be happy and I'm in a C Y happens. And it was incredible what happened in his life, got his own hairdressing salon and all of just because he made a decision to be happy. Why? What's on the happiness frequency? Everything that you want to make you happy.

• 11:04Lewis Howes?

  Absolutely.

• 11:05Rhonda Byrne?

  You know, so.

• 11:06Lewis Howes?

  I'm I'm curious about after the secret came out and every news outlet in the world wanted to hear more about what you were creating.

• 11:16Rhonda Byrne?

  Wow.

• 11:17Lewis Howes?

  You do Oprah, which that, you know, blows up everywhere. You you're time one hundred most influential person in the world. You're selling tens of millions of copies within the first few years. This message was everywhere. You could not go into a store without seeing this book.

• 11:34Rhonda Byrne?

  Yeah, true.

• 11:35Lewis Howes?

  How did you navigate the success and not let that weight or pressure break you?

• 11:43Rhonda Byrne?

  Ah.

• 11:44Lewis Howes?

  Because some people want the impact, this the success, but then they're not ready for it. How did you prepare yourself and was that a conscious decision not to do a lot of interviews after that to not be picked at or try to be pulled down in certain ways?

• 11:59Rhonda Byrne?

  That was a conscious decision. It was, um.

• 12:04Rhonda Byrne?

  But.

• 12:05Lewis Howes?

  Like, did you feel ready for the success? Do you feel prepared or or did you feel this was a little overwhelming?

• 12:10Rhonda Byrne?

  I never felt it was me.

• 12:13Lewis Howes?

  What do you mean?

• 12:14Rhonda Byrne?

  I just, I just, it was the message. That was the star.

• 12:19Lewis Howes?

  Interesting.

• 12:20Rhonda Byrne?

  And I never felt that it was me, like even writing the secret book. I absolutely knew that and making the documentary, like it was a miracle what happened making that documentary. The way everything that we ever needed just landed right at our feet. I, it was, it was so spectacular. It was the most incredible thing I've ever seen. And I just knew the universe, you know, just putting that in that most affectionate way. I knew the universe was with us and so.

• 12:53Rhonda Byrne?

  And writing the book, it was the same thing. Like I felt such a rush. Uh, in writing that book, I couldn't write it fast enough, all the things that I'd learned and practiced. And I wanted to share with people. Um, but you know, I had like, I got a burst blood vessel in one of my eyes. I had my feet got all cracked. Um, all the skin on my feet got cracked from the high frequency in writing that book.

• 13:22Lewis Howes?

  Really?

• 13:23Rhonda Byrne?

  Yeah.

• 13:24Lewis Howes?

  Cause you said, you were telling me before off camera that you wrote this book in Santa Monica in an apartment.

• 13:29Rhonda Byrne?

  I did, I did.

• 13:29Lewis Howes?

  Just a few miles from here.

• 13:30Rhonda Byrne?

  With my laptop on my lap.

• 13:32Lewis Howes?

  With your laptop on your lap in a small little apartment. Were you on the beach? Were you off the beach? Were you, what was your environment like?

• 13:40Rhonda Byrne?

  Off the beach, it was a very simple little corporate apartment. Um, the documentary had been released and, and I was writing the book and I had. Uh, it was, it was just the perfect situation. I knew exactly everything that I wanted to say. It was really just rushing through me and.

• 14:03Lewis Howes?

  And because of the frequency you had like, you know, so you had, your body was feeling.

• 14:07Rhonda Byrne?

  My body really, yeah.

• 14:08Lewis Howes?

  That is fascinating.

• 14:09Rhonda Byrne?

  After it, I was a white.

• 14:11Lewis Howes?

  You were like exhausted, you were like energetically drained.

• 14:14Rhonda Byrne?

  I energetically drained, yeah. And so then with each, then with each book that I wrote was I tried to manage that more. You know, that I, that I wasn't so wiped out. Now I can write a book and not at all.

• 14:29Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 14:30Rhonda Byrne?

  Yeah.

• 14:30Lewis Howes?

  But were you a writer before this?

• 14:32Rhonda Byrne?

  No, do you know what?

• 14:34Lewis Howes?

  Was this your first book? The Secret is your first book and you sold thirty four million copies? That is crazy.

• 14:40Rhonda Byrne?

  I know, right? I remember when Beyond Words contacted me and said, we want you to do the secret book. Well, I knew there'd be a secret book because I'd seen it in bookstores in my mind all around the world.

• 14:53Lewis Howes?

  Wow.

• 14:53Rhonda Byrne?

  In the front window, I'd seen it. I didn't know what it looked like, but I could feel the book. And, and I said, yes, like I knew there'd be a secret book. And, and I said, okay. And they said, and we want you to write it. And I said, I'm not a writer. And guess what? I heard those words. And I'm like, yes, I am.

• 15:18Lewis Howes?

  Hmm. You switched it, yeah.

• 15:21Rhonda Byrne?

  Because I'm not a writer means that you will not be a writer, right? And I'm like, yes, I am. Because I can do anything that I put my mind to. You, I, I knew everybody can do anything they put their mind to. And so I, and, and so I wrote and I, I was very specific. I wanted to write to people as though I was just talking to them.

• 15:48Lewis Howes?

  Mm hmm.

• 15:49Rhonda Byrne?

  And not, you know, any kind of incredible, huge words or anything like that. I just, I wanted it to be super, super simple because law of attraction was a hard concept to get your head around at that time. It's a lot, it's understood a little more these days, but.

• 16:11Lewis Howes?

  And this is, this is what I love about what you did because you first said you saw it in your mind and you felt the book in bookstores. Right? You felt it, so you were connecting the thought, the visualization of what you saw in your mind and the feeling. You had those two things connected, it sounded like. And this is where I think some people. Get wrong about the law of attraction or the secret is they, you know, you had those two things, the thoughts and the feelings as if it was already happening, but then you took action. You wrote the book. You didn't just say it's magically going to like be in bookstores. There had to be some action somewhere, whether it was you or someone else.

• 16:51Rhonda Byrne?

  Yeah, but I had the publisher come to me to say, you're gonna write the book.

• 16:57Lewis Howes?

  You drew it in.

• 16:57Rhonda Byrne?

  Now, so I attracted that, but do you know what? With that book, I honestly feel like I was just a stenographer.

• 17:05Lewis Howes?

  You were just dallying it.

• 17:06Rhonda Byrne?

  That's why in answer to your question, how did I manage all of that? Honestly, I never, I just felt like I was the luckiest person in the world to be a part of that journey. But I know without a doubt, the universe was just there. It just, it, this had to come out into the world and it was there to help at every tone.

• 17:28Lewis Howes?

  If someone is applying these principles and think they're not drawing in the person, the publisher, the, the, the right person to hire, the thing

• 17:40Rhonda Byrne?

  Yeah.

• 17:41Lewis Howes?

  to support them in manifesting what they want. Does that mean they're not ready for that thing to come out into the world? Is it not the right timing? You know, because you could have wanted this 20 years prior, but it didn't happen then. It happened at the moment you were ready for it, it sounds like.

• 17:58Rhonda Byrne?

  Yeah.

• 17:59Lewis Howes?

  So how can people let go of their frustration of really wanting something to happen now?

• 18:04Rhonda Byrne?

  Yeah.

• 18:04Lewis Howes?

  Versus knowing when it's the right timing for it to come into the world.

• 18:08Rhonda Byrne?

  Right. So the difference is just simply belief. So you have to believe you have it already. So can, if I explain what my belief was like, my belief was a notch above believing it had already happened.

• 18:24Lewis Howes?

  Hmm.

• 18:24Rhonda Byrne?

  Mine was knowing it had already happened.

• 18:27Lewis Howes?

  What's the difference between believing and knowing?

• 18:30Rhonda Byrne?

  Because one, because knowing is the highest you can get. And it's actually knowing is beyond the mind, but believe, but you can manifest with believing too. So I didn't just believe this had happened. I absolutely knew it.

• 18:47Lewis Howes?

  Wow.

• 18:47Rhonda Byrne?

  And I knew it and I knew what it was going to do. And I, I.

• 18:58Rhonda Byrne?

  How can I, it felt, I knew it so much that I felt like I had already lived the entire journey of making it and it coming out and that I had such a great time that I was reliving it.

• 19:17Lewis Howes?

  Oh, that's pretty cool.

• 19:18Rhonda Byrne?

  That's how, that's how it felt.

• 19:20Lewis Howes?

  This is, this is fascinating what you just said. This unlocked something for me.

• 19:25Lewis Howes?

  The difference between believing and knowing.

• 19:27Rhonda Byrne?

  Yeah.

• 19:28Lewis Howes?

  I grew up in a religion, the religion of Christian Science, which is all about healing and applying healing thinking and applying the mind to the material world. But really, there is no material world anyways. But one of the things that I would hear over and over again, when I felt like something was off in my life, or I felt like I was feeling a pain or something physical in my body was off, out of alignment.

• 19:55Lewis Howes?

  We would have Christian Science practitioners, spiritual practitioners, that would give us prescriptions, but they weren't medications. They were spiritual medications essentially, right?

• 20:07Rhonda Byrne?

  Gotcha.

• 20:08Lewis Howes?

  And it was, and they were always called truths. And they would always say, know the truth. They didn't say, believe this. They would say, know the truth. And when you know it, it is true and it is a reality. And it was hard, it was confusing as a kid because I was like, well, but I feel this thing and there's this pain, but how can I know it? But what I'm hearing you say is believing can, can really help you in a big way. But knowing is what unlocks manifestation into another level.

• 20:39Rhonda Byrne?

  Yeah, knowing it's just done. I mean, there have been times for everybody when they knew something.

• 20:48Rhonda Byrne?

  They absolutely knew something was going to happen before it happened. So let's say.

• 20:55Lewis Howes?

  And how do they know that?

• 20:56Rhonda Byrne?

  Yes. How did you know that? And you don't know how you knew it.

• 21:00Lewis Howes?

  It's like an intuition or a feeling or something.

• 21:03Rhonda Byrne?

  Yeah, right. You knew it like somebody's having a baby and they don't know what sex it is. But you're like, oh, I know it's a girl. I absolutely know it's a girl. And everybody thinks you're just guessing like everybody else. No, you're like, I know it. I know it's a girl. Or there's a spinning wheel and you all of a sudden you're like, I know it's going to be number 11. I know it. And it's number 11. But you knew it. You absolutely knew it.

• 21:29Lewis Howes?

  How does that happen?

• 21:30Rhonda Byrne?

  Yeah. Cause it's above the mind.

• 21:33Lewis Howes?

  Hmm.

• 21:34Rhonda Byrne?

  It's above the mind. So you, you, you definitely know it. So you.

• 21:41Lewis Howes?

  That's crazy. How?

• 21:42Rhonda Byrne?

  So you don't have to be at knowing to manifest. You just have to be believing. And might I just say that you, you just have to be more believing than not believing. So that person who's not, you know, they're waiting and it hasn't manifested and they're here and here. The difference is they're not believing it is done already.

• 22:11Lewis Howes?

  What's your thoughts on manifesting? And manifesting something you want and alchemizing it into the world? Do you believe in manifesting? Do you believe in a, uh, you know, artists should be thinking in that way? Or what's your thoughts on it?

• 22:25Rick Rubin?

  I believe in it a million percent. It's something

• 22:33Rick Rubin?

  that I've experienced before I knew what it was. So I, so when I say it's like a.

• 22:42Rick Rubin?

  I feel like it has to do with the purity of the intention behind what you're doing. If your intention is pure and you're doing it for the right reasons, it seems like things tend to work out.

• 22:56Lewis Howes?

  Uh.

• 22:57Rick Rubin?

  And that ends up being um

• 23:02Rick Rubin?

  a manifestation mindset, but it didn't start for me that way. It just was like, I really believe in what I'm doing. I really care about it. I want to be the best it could be for me and I'm excited to share it. And the results have shown me that you can manifest things. It happens. It's it, but I'll say when I do it, it's never based on the outcome.

• 23:28Lewis Howes?

  Oh, what do you mean?

• 23:30Rick Rubin?

  I'm never asking for a result.

• 23:34Lewis Howes?

  What are you asking for?

• 23:35Rick Rubin?

  I'm asking for to to rise to the occasion to make the best thing that I can for the thing that I make to be great. Great is a vague word. I don't know what great means. I came to realize recently what great means, but I didn't know. Most of my life I was aiming for great, but I didn't know what that was. And I've come to realize that great means it's it's a devotional. It's a devotional kind of greatness. It's a gift to the universe. It's a gift to God.

• 24:03Lewis Howes?

  Wow.

• 24:04Rick Rubin?

  If you're making, if you're making a gift to God, there's no greater.

• 24:12Rick Rubin?

  You can't put more into it than that. You know, you can't. What about the single? What about, what about what someone's gonna say? Who has anything to say if we're making a gift for God? That there's, you're putting all of your purest intention into this thing for the universe.

• 24:31Lewis Howes?

  Wow.

• 24:32Rick Rubin?

  That's where it's at. I didn't know that. I came to realize that recently. I, again, my word was greatness. Greatness. That was the word of what I was shooting for. But I've come to realize what it is.

• 24:44Lewis Howes?

  Wow, you have, you have a whole, you know, kind of section about greatness and success in the creative act, a way of being, which is, which I loved your explanation in there.

• 24:54Lewis Howes?

  That is fascinating. So greatness for you, what I'm hearing you say is a, is a, is a pure gift of yours to God.

• 25:01Rick Rubin?

  Yes, and it's a, it's a gift of yourself to God. It's like, this is the best I can do. This is my offering. This is what I have to offer.

• 25:13Lewis Howes?

  Hmm. If you think of a formula for manifesting as an artist, what would that formula be?

• 25:22Rick Rubin?

  I don't think there's a formula.

• 25:23Lewis Howes?

  Is there an art to manifesting?

• 25:27Rick Rubin?

  I don't know. I don't. I think um,

• 25:31Rick Rubin?

  it sounds like a shortcut, and I don't think there are shortcuts. I think it's always a

• 25:39Rick Rubin?

  a version of doing the work, of finding your way into what it is that the universe wants you to do, and then really dedicating yourself.

• 25:53Lewis Howes?

  How do you know what the universe wants you to do and when to do it? The right timing? Because you could be like, I have this idea for this thing. Maybe it's the right time now. Maybe it's five, 10 years away from now. How do, how do we really tap into that knowing?

• 26:07Rick Rubin?

  I think it's, it's, it's situational. And I think, again, if you're tapped into the universe, it tells you, it, it directs you. An example, I may have three different ideas that I'm, I'm excited about. And I kind of get them all going. And then one of them just seems to take off on its own. And one of them, no matter how hard I work on it, it never seems to come together. Can't find the right collaborators, impossible, some obstacles in the way. When that happens, I feel like it's the universe saying now is not the time.

• 26:44Lewis Howes?

  Interesting. Because, you know, I

• 26:49Lewis Howes?

  I love this, and I also hear the other side of the, I guess, the coin where, you know, I don't know if you know Ryan Holiday.

• 26:56Rick Rubin?

  Yeah, I do.

• 26:57Lewis Howes?

  The obstacle is the way is his kind of stoic philosophy of like, when the obstacle is there and presents itself, and you also feel like this is something you want to do. Like, you've got to kind of go through that pain and then, you know, overcome it.

• 27:10Rick Rubin?

  That is part of it. I'm not saying to turn away from the obstacle.

• 27:14Lewis Howes?

  Oh.

• 27:15Rick Rubin?

  But I'm saying when the obstacles become insurmountable consistently, and there's another path.

• 27:21Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 27:22Rick Rubin?

  That's going smoothly. And you feel the same about both of them, you know?

• 27:26Lewis Howes?

  Go for the effortless way. Yeah.

• 27:28Rick Rubin?

  Well, pay attention. See when.

• 27:31Rick Rubin?

  When is the universe giving you a push? When is the, when is the wind hitting your sails the right way? There's something to it. I, I, I'm, I'm, I would never suggest not fighting through the work. It's, it's, it's grueling no matter what. It's grueling no matter what. That said, sometimes it feels like now's not the time.

• 27:56Lewis Howes?

  Uh huh.

• 27:57Rick Rubin?

  It's like all, everything you throw at it gets deflected.

• 28:02Lewis Howes?

  Right. But this other thing is guiding you.

• 28:05Rick Rubin?

  Taking its own, taking on its own life. Earlier you, you asked about what I perceive to be a shortcut. And a shortcut is how little can I get away with doing? And I think that the real question is, how much more can I give to the thing I'm making?

• 28:28Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 28:29Rick Rubin?

  What else can I give to it? And, and thinking in terms of how much more can we do? Not how much less can we do? It's not about shortcuts. It's not about getting it done. You know, it's not about a four hour work week. I loved it. You know, I loved it, but that's not, it's like whatever it takes for it to be all it could be. Commitment and total commitment and dedicating your life to making the best things you can, whatever it is.

• 29:04Lewis Howes?

  Yeah. That's beautiful, man. And so you, so you think that as artists, we should be thinking about manifesting, but not in the terms of doing less, but putting the maximum into making it great?

• 29:21Rick Rubin?

  Doing anything that's within our power. If it, it doesn't have to make sense.

• 29:29Rick Rubin?

  Nothing has to make sense. You know, it could be, when I wear these purple socks, I can write a better song. Great. Doesn't matter. Don't question it. Just do whatever works, do it.

• 29:44Lewis Howes?

  Hmm. Is it really art if you're making money off of it?

• 29:49Rick Rubin?

  Absolutely. Does it? Doesn't matter. The out, it's not about the outcome. That's what I'm saying. Like you, if you don't make money or if you do make money, that has nothing to do with the art. Art is the art and then whatever happens after, happens after. If you make something that you love, I know if I make something I love, if more people like it, that's only a good thing. Now, I wouldn't change a word of it for someone else to like it.

• 30:17Lewis Howes?

  Hmm.

• 30:19Rick Rubin?

  Do you know what I'm saying? It's like, I make the thing I love and then present it to the world. And then if the world likes it, great. And if more people like it than less, better. Why not? We're sharing something we love, something we think is beautiful.

• 30:35Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 30:35Rick Rubin?

  So the more people who embrace it. But again, I would never change it for anyone else because that's not what it's about. It's not about that.

• 30:43Lewis Howes?

  Right. With the artists you've worked with that you knew before they were global successes or their art, their music or, you know, was known by many. What did you see became their biggest challenge once they became extremely successful? Because a lot of artists, I would think, want their art to be liked and listened to by people. They want to make a living and more people like it typically, that's a good thing typically. But sometimes we see artists who have this incredible rise of success and then seem to struggle with whether, whatever, depression, anxiety, maybe the pressure. Can I do this again?

• 31:27Lewis Howes?

  Will I be able to have these many hits again? What is the biggest challenge you see with artists becoming successful?

• 31:34Rick Rubin?

  Probably the biggest one is, um,

• 31:38Rick Rubin?

  Nobody prepares you for success. And you may have a dream of what it's like. And you may think the success is gonna fill some hole you have in your soul. And then the success, and you work your whole life for this success that's gonna fill the hole. And finally, you get the success and the hole's the same. And it's it creates hopelessness.

• 32:09Lewis Howes?

  Wow.

• 32:11Rick Rubin?

  Cause you always, you're working towards this goal that's gonna fix the problem. But it's, the goal doesn't fix the problem. It, I would say, I can't, I can't, I can't say never, but I would say almost never fixes the problem.

• 32:32Lewis Howes?

  What fixes the problem for people?

• 32:33Rick Rubin?

  It's something else. It's, it's something inside themselves. It's something inside themselves.

• 32:41Lewis Howes?

  So do you think success can almost hurt someone more than before they have it, after they have it?

• 32:48Rick Rubin?

  It, it just, it depends on the person's temperament. You know, for some people, being famous is the greatest thing, is all they ever wanted. And for some people, they become famous and it's the worst nightmare. That's not what they wanted. They miss their privacy. They miss their anonymity. They miss being able to go and do whatever they want and not be singled out or pointed to or talked to or even if people are nice, like it's a different, it's different. Um, and no one teaches you how to do that or you wanna, you know, go do something with your family. And then there are photographers there and it's, it's very awkward.

• 33:30Lewis Howes?

  What, what advice do you have for people that want to be famous? You know, success is one thing, but fame is another thing and they don't always happen together. For someone that wants to be famous, what advice would you have for them?

• 33:43Rick Rubin?

  I don't know. I would say, I would look at why that is. I would maybe see, you know, consider therapy.

• 33:51Lewis Howes?

  Have you ever done therapy yourself?

• 33:52Rick Rubin?

  I've done, yeah, I've done all kinds of therapy.

• 33:55Lewis Howes?

  What has been the biggest lesson you learned through therapy for you?

• 33:59Rick Rubin?

  Um, I learned how to express my feelings clearly, like, um, when I, the first time I went to therapy, I didn't even know how to talk. I didn't know how I felt about anything.

• 34:08Lewis Howes?

  How old were you then?

• 34:10Rick Rubin?

  Maybe twenty six.

• 34:12Lewis Howes?

  So you learned how to express your feelings then?

• 34:14Rick Rubin?

  Yes, and to not only, yes, express them, but also to actually, you know, feel them in myself, to understand, not just feel like blocked off or frustrated or like what's beneath it, what's actually going on.

• 34:28Lewis Howes?

  And what is the biggest lessons that meditation or meditation practices has provided for you?

• 34:35Rick Rubin?

  It, it provides a quiet space where the chatter, you realize that your, your thoughts are not you. And that left your own devices, there'll be a lot of voices in your head just going all the time. And they're not you. And they don't mean anything. And they're really repetitious. And they're not, uh, working in your best interest.

• 35:07Lewis Howes?

  So if your thoughts aren't you, then what are you?

• 35:11Rick Rubin?

  I suppose you are the unchanging part of yourself that's always there.

• 35:21Rick Rubin?

  From, probably from the time you're born till the time you die and maybe before and after. It's the, it's what's really inside. It's not, um,

• 35:38Rick Rubin?

  it's not changeable. It's what you came with.

• 35:45Lewis Howes?

  It's not the, it's not the, uh, the thinking mind. It's almost being the observer of the thoughts.

• 35:53Rick Rubin?

  The one who sees the thoughts. That sounds right.

• 35:56Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 35:56Rick Rubin?

  Observing the thoughts.

• 35:57Lewis Howes?

  Thank you. Yeah, that's what I was hearing you say. Um, when do you feel the most loved, Rick?

• 36:05Rick Rubin?

  I would say in general, I feel loved. It's a good feeling. Like, I feel I feel spiritually connected. And that's a, that gives me a great feeling of peace.

• 36:19Lewis Howes?

  Where do you think you'd be in your life if you weren't a meditator?

• 36:25Lewis Howes?

  And where do you think you'd be if you allowed yourself to play with drugs and alcohol?

• 36:34Rick Rubin?

  Yeah, can't, I can't really predict. I would say meditation, without meditation, I don't know who I would be. It's such a big part of who I am.

• 36:45Rick Rubin?

  Informed so many everything. My, my understanding of the world is based on learning to meditate when I was young. So I don't know who I would be without that.

• 36:58Lewis Howes?

  Do you think you would have as much internal harmony and peace and external success without meditation?

• 37:05Rick Rubin?

  No, certainly not internal peace. I don't know about success.

• 37:11Lewis Howes?

  I wanted to ask you a question about comparison. You know, you mentioned the, the NBA basketball player needing to post more on social media based on what their, their team or the coaches, or maybe not the coaches, but maybe the general managers wanted them to do. With, with artists, I see a lot of people competing and comparison, being in comparison versus just sharing their truths in an authentic way. And sometimes on social media, people are vulnerable because it gets attention and then they're over vulnerable. And then that becomes a game in itself. But in a world where everything is over saturated seeming, and there is a lot of competition for attention.

• 37:55Lewis Howes?

  How can an artist stay true to their inner voice? And not be in comparison, but be willing to collaborate and also see success in others and be okay with it?

• 38:06Rick Rubin?

  Yeah, I think, I think staying, staying out of it, you know, like not participating in that game. That's, it's someone else's game. That's someone else's game and to just play your own game. I can remember having a conversation with a, a big, one of the biggest artists in the world, who described an album that they were gonna make. And, uh, and I had just seen them play in a stadium full of people screaming and crying. Um, and it was not Paul McCartney.

• 38:38Rick Rubin?

  And the album that they were describing was one that none of those 70,000 people screaming and crying wanted to hear. It was clear to, it was clear to me.

• 38:48Rick Rubin?

  And, and I remember saying, "That's not your hand." Like you play, when you're playing poker,

• 38:58Rick Rubin?

  it's not, you can't just play any cards. You play the, you play your hand based on the cards you've been dealt. So depending on the artist you are, like, um,

• 39:13Rick Rubin?

  it'd be like, there was a, a time, I think, when Metallica felt like, "We don't really wanna be a heavy metal band. We wanna be a pop band, because pop bands are what's popular." And we have reached a ceiling being a heavy metal band. That did not go well. That was a bad idea. They weren't playing their hand. They weren't, they weren't embracing Metallica. And I think if you embrace your part, it's your best chance

• 39:43Rick Rubin?

  being true to yourself, not saying, "Oh, well, those people over there are getting popular doing this other thing. I don't really like it, but it's really working for them. Maybe I could try that." Recipe for disaster.

• 39:55Lewis Howes?

  So don't chase something that's not your hand.

• 39:57Rick Rubin?

  No.

• 39:58Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, but it sounds like, correct me if I'm wrong, you know, the the example I'm thinking of is like Lady Gaga came onto the scene doing, I guess, pop music and became very popular, but then said, hey, I want to do this more kind of jazzy, bluesy, like Tony Bennett thing.

• 40:15Rick Rubin?

  She was being true to herself.

• 40:16Lewis Howes?

  And that's what I want to do. And I don't care if anyone likes it.

• 40:18Rick Rubin?

  Perfect.

• 40:19Lewis Howes?

  But it's what I want to do with this season of my life.

• 40:21Rick Rubin?

  True to herself.

• 40:22Lewis Howes?

  And it may lose money.

• 40:24Rick Rubin?

  She but she was not doing it because I think people like this.

• 40:28Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 40:29Rick Rubin?

  This is working over here, so I'm gonna try to catch their heat. She was not doing that.

• 40:35Lewis Howes?

  She probably knew people wouldn't like it, only a small audience.

• 40:38Rick Rubin?

  Didn't care.

• 40:38Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, she didn't care.

• 40:39Rick Rubin?

  She didn't care. True to herself. This is what she wanted to do, and she did it.

• 40:43Lewis Howes?

  Wow. Were you in touch with her at all during that that season or?

• 40:48Rick Rubin?

  I can't remember if we talked about that.

• 40:49Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, I'm curious, but that's I'm curious if she's just said, hey, I'm gonna do this and this is my thing and.

• 40:55Rick Rubin?

  For sure.

• 40:56Lewis Howes?

  That's pretty cool.

• 40:57Rick Rubin?

  Yeah, no, I love it when artist does something unexpected, whether it works or not, you know, it's like it's they're being true to themselves.

• 41:04Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 41:04Rick Rubin?

  They get to be a better artist doing that.

• 41:07Lewis Howes?

  Whereas the other example is someone, you know, whether it's Metallica or whoever, is like chasing a bigger audience or something. Now, if that's true to them, that music, then cool, there's an audience there, go for it.

• 41:18Rick Rubin?

  But it's also something about staying true to yourself in terms of,

• 41:26Rick Rubin?

  if you come up making a certain kind of music and you get popular making that music, a feeling of, well, this is all anybody wants from me, so even though I don't care about it anymore, I have to keep doing it. That's a disaster as well.

• 41:40Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 41:42Rick Rubin?

  It that that doesn't work.

• 41:44Lewis Howes?

  Who has been the most musically gifted artist that you've been able to work with? Or maybe a few people that you're just like, they were so musically like talented and gifted. It was just.

• 41:56Rick Rubin?

  There've been a lot. Yeah, there've been a lot. I can say the first time I was in the studio with Carlos Santana and he started playing guitar, it felt like this is coming from another planet. Or John Frashanti, when he plays from the guitarist in the Red Hot Chili Peppers, when he plays guitar, it's a transcendent experience.

• 42:17Lewis Howes?

  Spiritual.

• 42:18Rick Rubin?

  Yeah. And then there's a drummer named Chris Dave, who's best drummer I've ever heard. And no matter what he plays, anything he plays is the greatest thing you've ever heard, the simplest thing. He can make anything interesting, just the way he plays it, not the parts. Doesn't have to be complicated, doesn't have to be, look at me, just the touch, the feel, the tone is miraculous.

• 42:43Lewis Howes?

  Something you said before is the only goal is to be the best version of ourselves.

• 42:51Lewis Howes?

  Is there anything blocking you from becoming the best version of your yourself moving forward?

• 42:57Rick Rubin?

  I don't think so. Yeah, I wouldn't say I'm there.

• 43:01Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 43:01Rick Rubin?

  But I'm always striving, always. Anything I can do to get closer, I'll do.

• 43:06Lewis Howes?

  Well, yeah, you're, you're willing to learn something new, you're willing to try something on.

• 43:11Rick Rubin?

  Or change anything.

• 43:12Lewis Howes?

  Right. What do you think is the, the best habits that an artist can have? That maybe you have individually, but also that you see in other artists?

• 43:21Rick Rubin?

  I would say dedication to the craft, whatever, whatever their craft is, dedicating themselves to it, taking it very seriously and being free to play in it. You know, like taking it seriously at the time, at the time when it warrants being taken seriously. And having fun and being free in a play way to allow the thing that's worthy of being taken seriously to appear. Right. Taking it seriously and also allow yourself to play in it as well. Yeah, well, the play always is where it starts. It starts in this playful way where nothing is serious and there are no stakes. And then through that, something appears. Uh huh.

• 44:03Rick Rubin?

  And then, in order to get that into condition to share, there's a grueling effort. Yeah, take that seriously. And sometimes it's, sometimes you do a grueling effort and then you realize, oh, that thing that happened the first day, that's the best version of it. But you don't know that until you've maybe banged your head against a wall for six months working on it. And then you realize, you know what? That first five minutes was the best. That was it. You can't know that until you go past, you know, you have to work past it to see this was the one. This is the best version. How often is it the first version is usually the best for you? I'll say the first version is often, if it's not the best, it's very instructive

• 44:46Rick Rubin?

  and holds a magic in it that is to be retained no matter what else changes. You know, a big part of it is just not screwing up what's good. Not messing it up. No, there are all these stories of, you know, the demos being better than the album. It's easy to not know why something is good. You know, you make a demo and you think, okay, now when I get the professional musicians to play it, it's going to be great. It's going to be that much better. Maybe yes, maybe no. We don't know. We never know. We never know what's going to happen when we do anything. Yeah. So to stay neutral and to keep every iteration along the way and be willing to

• 45:27Rick Rubin?

  look back after you just spent months refining something to then say, you know what? It was better three months ago. Throw that all away. Wow.

• 45:40Lewis Howes?

  What was the book that really inspired you the most?

• 45:43Jen Sincero?

  The Science of Getting Rich by Wallace Waddles.

• 45:45Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, that's a good one.

• 45:46Jen Sincero?

  I mean, not only because it's like this big because I'm super impatient, but I mean, and it's super cryptic. It's like, it's all about the universe being a thinking stuff. And when you impress your thoughts into the thinking stuff, it becomes real and material world. And I just, I just, it really, really, really spoke to me. I've read it hundreds of times.

• 46:05Lewis Howes?

  Really?

• 46:06Jen Sincero?

  Yes. Yeah.

• 46:07Lewis Howes?

  What was the biggest takeaway from that book?

• 46:09Jen Sincero?

  Oh, so happy you asked because I talk about this line all the time is to think what you want to think is to think the truth regardless of appearances. So this is everything, right? So mindset is everything. So regardless of appearances, regardless of the fact that I'm living in a garage in an LA, driving a car with no grill, like those are the appearances. But to think what you want, and I think the want is so key too, because that's your, that's your authenticity. That's not like thinking what other people think you should do and how you should live your life. To think what you want, the purpose that you were put on planet earth to live out, that's the truth. That is the truth. So your desires are the truth, not what's physically around you.

• 46:54Lewis Howes?

  Wow. So how do we know that we are in harmony and congruency with our desires? That it's for something not just selfish and self-serving by itself or ego-driven, but more, I don't know, driven by something greater, you know? Because if someone says, well, I want to make a lot of money, or I want to make a hundred thousand dollars in a year, or 500,000, or whatever it is, or millions. How do we line up our desires with our authentic selves so that we don't hurt ourselves in the process of making money, or it become overwhelming, daunting, or draining?

• 47:32Jen Sincero?

  I think you always come back to, is it fun?

• 47:37Jen Sincero?

  Does it give me energy or deplete my energy? And does it have meaning? Those are the three things that I'm really living my life by these days. And I think that if you're in alignment with those three things, and other things certainly, but those are sort of my big three.

• 47:54Lewis Howes?

  Is it fun? Does it give me energy? And does it give me meaning?

• 47:57Jen Sincero?

  Yeah, and is it meaningful? Yeah.

• 47:58Lewis Howes?

  Is it meaningful?

• 47:59Jen Sincero?

  Yeah.

• 47:59Lewis Howes?

  I like that.

• 48:00Jen Sincero?

  Yeah.

• 48:01Lewis Howes?

  And where were you at 39? Doing things that weren't fun? That drained your energy and didn't give you meaning?

• 48:06Jen Sincero?

  Yeah, pretty much. I mean, I was a freelance writer hustling my butt off. And then like when I really did the math, I was like, the amount of time I spent hustling for this gig, and they don't pay that well, like magazine articles, come on. I was making like, I was probably losing money, quite frankly. So, um, yeah, no, there was, there was none of that. It was not fun. It was exhausting. It had some meaning, but you gotta get all three, you know? Yeah.

• 48:31Lewis Howes?

  Or at least start working towards it. Cause you may not be able to at this season, but you gotta focus on, can I, can I get one?

• 48:38Jen Sincero?

  Can I get one? And is it leading in the direction of something that is fun? That is gonna give me energy and has meaning? Cause you're right, like when you're building a company or when you're doing something like, it is exhausting. And, but if it's still exciting and fun and has meaning, then yeah, yeah, it doesn't get to be a picnic all the time.

• 48:54Lewis Howes?

  When was the biggest aha moment for you then? Like, was it after you made a certain amount of money? Or a client paid you something? Or was it just a feeling you had? Like releasing all of it in the process of working? Like, when was that moment where you're like, I'm actually emotionally and mentally free around the idea of money?

• 49:12Jen Sincero?

  Oh, interesting.

• 49:15Lewis Howes?

  Maybe I'm not abundant of money.

• 49:17Jen Sincero?

  I will tell you, no, I actually did. And I did put it in You Are a Badass. I put it in one of them. It was when I, I had, oh my God, it was such a cool moment. So. Because money is currency and currency is energy, right? So we're really gonna get woo woo with the money.

• 49:32Lewis Howes?

  I like it.

• 49:33Jen Sincero?

  Really shifting the mindset around money. And I, and bring me back to my story if I go off on a tangent because I'm about to go off on a tangent. I want to remember, but I.

• 49:43Lewis Howes?

  Money is currency and currency is energy.

• 49:45Jen Sincero?

  Yes, money is currency, currency is energy. And I've had so many clients that have told me, and it's happened to me too, where they manifest when they get into the meditation and they start to raise their frequency.

• 49:54Lewis Howes?

  Yes.

• 49:55Jen Sincero?

  And they focus on the amount, the exact amount comes in from outer space that you didn't even think of. And so my story is around that where I was working with my coach and we were really gonna shift my money reality. And so she's like, you know, what amount of money would be really great for you to make right now? Like what would have a lot of meaning? And I was like $10,000 because I'm $10,000 in debt on my credit card and I hate being in debt. She's like, perfect. And so she's like, okay, so how soon are you gonna make it? And she goes, you know, like about a week, two weeks. Because I, you know, and I was at the time making like 30 grand a year. I was like, my God, if I made 10,000 in a week, that would be incredible. And I was like, but you know what? I gotta do it in two days because I know myself and I won't keep myself in that frequency. Like I'll lose steam and I'll decide that like, nah, it's not, I can't do it or whatever.

• 50:40Jen Sincero?

  Like I knew that the stuff would start creeping back in. So I was like, all right, 10 grand in two days. She's like, great, okay, so how are you gonna do it? And at the time I had this little online coaching business that I had just started coaching writers. And I was like, I'll get three private clients, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. So then we're, you know, putting all the pieces in place. And then she's like, okay, and is there anything else? And I was like, well, you know, there was this guy that I was coaching years ago. He was my first private client. I was charging him like 50 bucks an hour. And I was like, I could also call him and see if he wants to work with me again. And she's like, okay, great. And we're still on the phone and I checked my email and he has written me. I have not thought of this matter, communicated with him in years. Email, he's like. You know, are you still coaching? Can you help me?

• 51:25Jen Sincero?

  When can we start?

• 51:27Lewis Howes?

  Wow.

• 51:27Jen Sincero?

  And so she's like, okay, here's what we're gonna do. We're gonna put together a $10,000 package for him and you're gonna sell it to him right now.

• 51:33Lewis Howes?

  Holy cow.

• 51:34Jen Sincero?

  I know, and I was like, $10,000. I was charging him 50 bucks an hour. I was, and I really adore him. He's such a special person. And I was like, felt like, you know, a greedy pig. Blah, blah, blah, all the things. Fraud complex, gigantic.

• 51:50Lewis Howes?

  Imposter syndrome.

• 51:50Jen Sincero?

  Oh, beyond, beyond. And so she's like, and what we'll do is we'll put together $15,000 package and a 10 so that the 10 looks cheap. And I was like, I can't do 15. She's like, all right, 12. Pain in my ass. So did a 12, sent it to him and literally wanted to throw up. I was just like, if he, I, cause I really cared about this guy. He bought the 12.

• 52:10Lewis Howes?

  Holy cow.

• 52:11Jen Sincero?

  I know.

• 52:13Lewis Howes?

  You're like, it should have been a 15.

• 52:14Jen Sincero?

  I know, exactly. I know.

• 52:16Lewis Howes?

  Well, here's the thing, you know, it's not like he would charge you on 12 hours on an hour. Obviously you created a position and a packaging of services that would over deliver, that would serve him a big way.

• 52:26Jen Sincero?

  I worked with him for five years after that.

• 52:28Lewis Howes?

  Exactly.

• 52:28Jen Sincero?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 52:29Lewis Howes?

  So it's not like, I'm just gonna charge some number and give very little.

• 52:33Jen Sincero?

  Oh, no.

• 52:33Lewis Howes?

  You made sure that the value was there.

• 52:36Jen Sincero?

  Totally.

• 52:36Lewis Howes?

  How did you learn to package and position your value to be able to charge for what you wanted?

• 52:40Jen Sincero?

  My coach helped me put it all together, but then I had to rise to that frequency. And I'll tell you, you know, when you're charging something that scares the hell out of you, you show up with your A plus game like, and he did too. Like it was a lot for him too. We knocked it out of the park.

• 52:53Lewis Howes?

  Cause you pay attention to what you pay for.

• 52:54Jen Sincero?

  Yes, yes, yeah, totally.

• 52:56Lewis Howes?

  You'll rise to the occasion, like, I gotta focus.

• 52:58Jen Sincero?

  Yes, yeah.

• 52:59Lewis Howes?

  I gotta show up on time. I gotta deliver the results on time.

• 53:02Jen Sincero?

  Absolutely.

• 53:03Lewis Howes?

  Give my best here.

• 53:04Jen Sincero?

  Yep.

• 53:05Lewis Howes?

  Interesting. So now here's, I'm curious about the next thing. Was that everything to the story first off? I'll make sure I get it.

• 53:11Jen Sincero?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 53:12Lewis Howes?

  Okay. Money is currency and currency is energy. I'm curious about the next thing. So once this happened and you sold a $12,000 package and you were like, this is crazy and this is more money than I've ever made in my life, essentially, in two days. Did you fall back at any point? Or did you stay focused?

• 53:29Jen Sincero?

  Oh, interesting.

• 53:31Lewis Howes?

  Cause sometimes people get an opportunity. And they decided and then, well, I tried it again and it didn't work. So maybe this is a fluke, maybe this is a one time and then

• 53:41Jen Sincero?

  Right.

• 53:41Lewis Howes?

  The thermometer goes back down to what they're comfortable and familiar with.

• 53:44Jen Sincero?

  Very common, very common. I did not, but only because I continued to get coaching. And I got bigger and bigger and bigger packages. I mean, I was paying six figures by the end.

• 53:55Lewis Howes?

  Hundred grand for like a year of coaching or? Wow.

• 53:58Jen Sincero?

  So I just, because I knew myself, I was like, I am rickety in this whole sort of

• 54:02Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 54:03Jen Sincero?

  Wealth consciousness department. So I knew that I had, it's like getting a personal trainer, right? So I just kept investing in the coaching and now, now I'm good, but I do still have to work at it. I mean,

• 54:12Lewis Howes?

  It's different levels.

• 54:14Jen Sincero?

  It's different levels, you know?

• 54:15Lewis Howes?

  You feel comfortable at this level, but if you want to break through.

• 54:17Jen Sincero?

  Exactly, exactly.

• 54:19Lewis Howes?

  Do something you've never done, it means you've got to have a different frequency still, right?

• 54:22Jen Sincero?

  Exactly. You get, you know, yep, oh, there's always more growth to be had.

• 54:26Lewis Howes?

  Do you feel like you're kind of at like a block right now? Because again, you've sold, you know, I don't know, five or 10 million copies of your books. You've got coaching program, you've got all these success, financial freedom, all these different things. But is there like a level you've reached that you feel like, okay, well, can I break through? This is so much now and I feel abundant, but could you break through?

• 54:47Jen Sincero?

  If I want, if I could decide what I want the next thing to be yet, I'm still in that sort of incubation period of like, what would be fun, give me energy and that meaning. I'm getting there. Like I definitely feel like I'm getting there and I'm doing a lot of things that meet those requirements in the meantime, but it's not the big.

• 55:04Lewis Howes?

  What's your biggest, what's your biggest fear or insecurity around money right now?

• 55:08Jen Sincero?

  That I don't know what to do with it when I make it. Like I'm good at making it. My bookkeeper called me one day and she's like, would you please just open a savings account at your bank? Cause I had like a million dollars in my checking account. This was a while ago. I finally got my, so I've hired financial plan, like I've hired people who are grownups who know what they're doing with money, but like, I'm teaching myself about it, but I find it boring. I find investing boring and confusing and out of my league. So luckily there are amazing people who know what they're doing. So I have finally gotten that team together.

• 55:40Lewis Howes?

  Gotcha.

• 55:41Jen Sincero?

  Um, and there is a little tiny part of me, if I gave it any attention, that is a little scared it's all gonna go away.

• 55:49Lewis Howes?

  Really?

• 55:49Jen Sincero?

  Yeah, but I don't, I'm not, it's not that bad and I probably should not even speak it out loud.

• 55:53Lewis Howes?

  Right, right, right.

• 55:54Jen Sincero?

  Yeah.

• 55:54Lewis Howes?

  Well, you're being, you're being honest about it. I think. There's one thing about speaking it out loud so it doesn't happen, but another thing about saying it so it doesn't have power of you.

• 56:02Jen Sincero?

  Right, oh, yeah, okay.

• 56:03Lewis Howes?

  You know, it's like, if you're afraid of it, like you're afraid to have the conversation around money.

• 56:07Jen Sincero?

  Yeah.

• 56:08Lewis Howes?

  I'm all believer, like, don't speak into something into this, as you don't want that to happen, but I think, you know, when I started talking about my fears, my shame and my insecurity, it actually felt like the poison was coming out of me. And now I can see it outside of me, or I could have a conversation with it as opposed to it being in me and afraid to talk about.

• 56:27Jen Sincero?

  Right.

• 56:28Lewis Howes?

  And then I could get coaching about it.

• 56:30Jen Sincero?

  Right.

• 56:30Lewis Howes?

  And then I could, okay, let me create a game plan. Okay, well, I'm afraid of it, but now I have a coach to help me, you know, invest it the right way and whatever I need to do.

• 56:39Jen Sincero?

  Yeah.

• 56:39Lewis Howes?

  You know, so.

• 56:40Jen Sincero?

  Yeah.

• 56:41Lewis Howes?

  As opposed to ignoring it and just, I hope I don't lose it, but I don't want to speak about it.

• 56:45Jen Sincero?

  Right. That's a good point. That is a good point. Okay, I'll tell you another one.

• 56:49Lewis Howes?

  What's the other one?

• 56:50Jen Sincero?

  We're airing out my internal. The other one is that I'm gonna make too much of it and I won't, and it is, it's kinda like the same as the first one, but I won't know what to do with it. Like, I'm scared of it coming in too fast and too much, because it's gonna bury me alive almost. Yeah, I know, I know.

• 57:06Lewis Howes?

  Holy cow.

• 57:07Jen Sincero?

  So I.

• 57:08Lewis Howes?

  Bury me alive.

• 57:09Jen Sincero?

  Kind of, yes.

• 57:11Lewis Howes?

  Why would it bury, why would money bury you alive?

• 57:14Jen Sincero?

  Just tell it all what I.

• 57:15Lewis Howes?

  Well, this is the interesting thing, Jen. I think it's powerful that you're talking about this because there's different levels of insecurities or fears at the stages of money we make. And when I was broke on my sister's couch, I had a lot of fear and insecurity, uncertainty of the future. And then I remember one day I made sixty-two hundred dollars in an hour doing like a live webinar, selling a program. This is in 2009.

• 57:37Jen Sincero?

  Okay.

• 57:37Lewis Howes?

  Before there was like courses and webinars, all this stuff.

• 57:39Jen Sincero?

  Yeah.

• 57:40Lewis Howes?

  And I go, I'm the richest man in the world with sixty-two hundred dollars. And I had to split that with the person who promoted this, this training for me, but I still felt like thirty-one hundred dollars in an hour. I go, I could do this every day for the rest of my life, right? Because I was sleeping on my sister's couch.

• 57:55Jen Sincero?

  Yeah.

• 57:56Lewis Howes?

  But there was still, I never made six figures. And so there was still a challenge, like, how do I do this? And how do I manage it? And I understand it. And now taxes, what? All my money's gone. I just made money. I have zero again, and this fear of like, this tax thing. And then you get to the next level, the next level, and next level. And I just think there's different challenges or things we get to overcome at every level of money as well.

• 58:19Jen Sincero?

  Sure, yes. New level, new devil, right? Yeah.

• 58:23Lewis Howes?

  So one of the fears is, little of the money bury me alive.

• 58:27Jen Sincero?

  Yeah.

• 58:27Lewis Howes?

  Why do you think that is?

• 58:29Jen Sincero?

  Gosh, why do I think that is? I think it's my insecurity about not knowing what to do with it. When I had, when I had very little of it, I could manage it, right? That was easy. And then as I started getting more and more, and so I do have pieces in place, but I've opened, I've hired a new financial team. So I can make, like, build the nest and it will come. Because I was like, if I don't take care of this, I will literally block it. I will energetically block it if I'm scared of it coming in and think it's going to bury me alive. Like, that is not a abundant mindset, you know?

• 59:00Lewis Howes?

  Sure.

• 59:01Jen Sincero?

  So, yeah, so I, I just created the nest. So now, bring it on, universe.

• 59:06Lewis Howes?

  Right, right. So now you can, you have, you have a foundation for it to come in.

• 59:10Jen Sincero?

  Yeah, yeah, so it's not scary anymore. Because I know where it's going to go. Yeah, but I realized that. I was just like, wow, I am kind of scared of it coming in too much. I know. It's interesting, isn't it? Yeah?

• 59:21Lewis Howes?

  I think it's fascinating. I think we all get to experience at different levels how to break through. Otherwise, wouldn't it be interesting if it was just, I don't know, if there's no obstacle, if I like, you know?

• 59:31Jen Sincero?

  Yeah.

• 59:32Lewis Howes?

  What do you think are the key things that abundant mindset people around money do differently than scarcity mindset people around money? If you had to say three or five kind of key things?

• 59:46Jen Sincero?

  They...

• 59:49Jen Sincero?

  Appreciate it, as you said, that is a biggie. They appreciate it and they speak about it. As they love it, they're not weird about it. They're also generous with it because when you pinch yourself off from giving, you, that is sort of a subconscious way of saying there's not enough to go around and it's not gonna, I'm not in the flow. So when you don't give generously, it's because you're scared that it's not gonna come in anymore. They take risks, you know, you gotta take risks. You are where you are because you've been doing what you've been doing. So if you want to change your life, you've got to do stuff you've never done.

• 1:00:24Jen Sincero?

  What else? Wealthy people, they learn about money. Like you, you focus on money. Like that was such a big thing for me too. Like when I was broke, I, I never wanted to think about money, right? I was all about writing songs and, you know, doing much, you know, more noble things.

• 1:00:38Lewis Howes?

  Sure, sure.

• 1:00:39Jen Sincero?

  But then, but when you're broke, all you think about is money. Like I don't really think about money that much now that I have it like, but every single decision you make when you're broke is about.

• 1:00:46Lewis Howes?

  So I have enough to pay for this.

• 1:00:47Jen Sincero?

  Exactly.

• 1:00:48Lewis Howes?

  Can I afford it? What happens if I don't?

• 1:00:49Jen Sincero?

  Right, you wake up in the first thing in the morning in a panic because you gotta pay your bills. So you're always thinking about money. So it is really just sort of getting in the flow with that and just, you know, being on good terms with it and focusing on it. And, and you know, how are you gonna make it? Like being realistic about your income streams and you know, and if you want to make it, you've gotta coax it in, you know?

• 1:01:12Lewis Howes?

  Right, right.

• 1:01:13Jen Sincero?

  Yeah.

• 1:01:13Lewis Howes?

  I'm curious about this. Okay, you, you're a starving artist. You wanted to do noble things, which about art and making art and all these different things.

• 1:01:24Lewis Howes?

  What would have happened if someone would have said, Jen, you know what? I love that you're an artist. I love that you have this, you know, passion for art and you want to keep doing this. And this is the way you've been for 40 years and we don't want you to change. Here's a hundred grand a year for the rest of your life. Don't worry about money up to a hundred grand.

• 1:01:44Jen Sincero?

  Uh huh.

• 1:01:45Lewis Howes?

  What would that have done to you if someone would have given you a hundred grand a year? And you would have just been like, okay, I'm gonna write and do whatever I want. And how do you think it would have been mentally, emotionally, spiritually versus? You having to risk emotionally and mentally.

• 1:01:59Jen Sincero?

  Yeah.

• 1:01:59Lewis Howes?

  You getting to heal, let go, overcome.

• 1:02:03Jen Sincero?

  Right.

• 1:02:04Lewis Howes?

  Challenge yourself into asking for money and to becoming something greater than that limiting belief. What do you think, where do you think you'd be now?

• 1:02:12Jen Sincero?

  Probably would have spent it on beer, honestly, back in those days.

• 1:02:15Lewis Howes?

  Really?

• 1:02:15Jen Sincero?

  Yeah, yeah, I mean, I wasn't, you, you're absolutely right. It's an, it's an, it's a frequency. You know, it's like, it's like, uh.

• 1:02:25Jen Sincero?

  I don't know. I mean, I always, I always had. I guess I'm gonna say gall. That's not the right word, but I did, I did do a lot of stuff that was pretty edgy and I, I pushed the envelope a lot. So I may have gotten there. But I don't think it would have been as exciting as it was to do it myself. You know, there really is, you do grow and they, they say, you know, starting your own business is the best personal development course you can possibly take. Cause all your stuff comes up, right?

• 1:02:55Lewis Howes?

  All of it.

• 1:02:55Jen Sincero?

  So.

• 1:02:56Lewis Howes?

  Leadership training, it's leadership training, it's inner child training, everything.

• 1:02:59Jen Sincero?

  Everything, totally.

• 1:03:01Lewis Howes?

  Pushed.

• 1:03:01Jen Sincero?

  Totally, so, so it wouldn't have been as satisfying, I don't think. I think I still would have done it though, cause that is kind of my personality. When I'm ready to change, I'm ready to change and I do it.

• 1:03:11Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 1:03:11Jen Sincero?

  So, but I think it wouldn't have been as glorious and I'm definitely, I probably wouldn't have written You Are a Bad, which totally changed my entire life, so.

• 1:03:18Lewis Howes?

  It changed yours, but it also changed other people's lives.

• 1:03:21Jen Sincero?

  Yes.

• 1:03:21Lewis Howes?

  So it's who you become, the lessons you learn, the wisdom you have.

• 1:03:24Jen Sincero?

  Yes.

• 1:03:25Lewis Howes?

  To then be able to be of service and teach.

• 1:03:27Jen Sincero?

  Yeah.

• 1:03:28Lewis Howes?

  From your own experience.

• 1:03:29Jen Sincero?

  Exactly. Yeah, the book about me getting a hundred grand a year, just for being, would not be that interesting to people.

• 1:03:34Lewis Howes?

  Right?

• 1:03:34Jen Sincero?

  Yeah.

• 1:03:35Lewis Howes?

  Right, that's interesting.

• 1:03:36Jen Sincero?

  Yeah.

• 1:03:37Lewis Howes?

  What has been the biggest lesson? In the last 10 years, cause that was 10 years ago when you wrote You Are a Bad, right? And you've written two or three books since then, I believe. What has been the biggest lesson, three books since then?

• 1:03:49Jen Sincero?

  Yeah.

• 1:03:50Lewis Howes?

  What has been the biggest lesson in 10 years since You Are a Bad? To now? Personally?

• 1:03:57Lewis Howes?

  Physically and financially.

• 1:04:00Jen Sincero?

  Oh, man.

• 1:04:02Jen Sincero?

  Let me think. Okay, the biggest lessons since I wrote you.

• 1:04:06Lewis Howes?

  Because when you, because when you get more money, more impact, more celebrity fame in an industry. People change around you. Some people don't, some people do.

• 1:04:17Jen Sincero?

  Right.

• 1:04:19Lewis Howes?

  You get to make different choices with your, with your health.

• 1:04:22Jen Sincero?

  Right.

• 1:04:22Lewis Howes?

  In positive or negative.

• 1:04:23Jen Sincero?

  Right.

• 1:04:25Lewis Howes?

  You have more abundance to do bad things or good things.

• 1:04:27Jen Sincero?

  Yeah.

• 1:04:28Lewis Howes?

  And you get to see how you show up emotionally, spiritually as well.

• 1:04:32Jen Sincero?

  That's such an interesting question. You know, I definitely feel like, since it came out and has had the success, you know, that I've gotten better and better. It really, this sounds cold, but like not caring what other people think about me. Like that is something that I'm really dedicated to right now where it's like, the one star reviews and the five star reviews, you know, it's like, believe me, I'm so grateful. Anybody reads the book, but the five star reviews are the real dangerous ones, right? Where you're just like, I'm so cool. People think I'm funny and smart. You know, really getting good inside, like just being like, it doesn't matter as long as I think it's good.

• 1:05:09Jen Sincero?

  And I think it's funny and I think it's helpful. That's it. And so that has been really important to me because it is weird. I mean, I'm sure you too, like people know who you are and it's like, it's, it's a little uncomfortable sometimes. I mean, it's great too. Like I love meeting my readers, but it's just like, I can't get too wrapped up in their opinion of me because it's about my opinion of me. So that's been a really big one.

• 1:05:33Lewis Howes?

  Not, so not letting the opinions of others be the opinions of you about you.

• 1:05:38Jen Sincero?

  Right. Yeah.

• 1:05:39Lewis Howes?

  Interesting.

• 1:05:39Jen Sincero?

  This really coming.

• 1:05:40Lewis Howes?

  The high hype and the low low.

• 1:05:42Jen Sincero?

  Yeah, definitely. Cause you hear a lot about the low lows, like don't focus on the criticism, but you really got to watch it with the five star stuff too.

• 1:05:48Lewis Howes?

  That's interesting.

• 1:05:48Jen Sincero?

  Yeah. Cause then, cause then if it goes away, you're screwed, right? You're totally screwed. I mean, that's why so many celebrities wind up in rehab, you know, especially if you, I always think about this too, that I'm so glad for me anyway, that it started when I was older. If I was twenty, when I was getting all these accolades, I would be such an idiot. I know, like no ways. I'm really, I'm so grateful for all of it, my God.

• 1:06:13Lewis Howes?

  Um, and that's personally, what about biggest lesson financially?

• 1:06:18Jen Sincero?

  Financially? Um, I guess I, I, I love giving money away. Like I didn't, I really honestly never thought I was that generous of a person. But I am, but so I'm very happy to find that out about myself because I didn't really think I was. But also that I, um, I was just making fun of this this morning with a friend of mine that I'm still kind of cheap with myself in ways like I'm not great at like. I mean, I have a nice house, I have a nice car, I certainly spend plenty of money on myself. But I can just be like, I'm not good at being rich and like getting room service and like.

• 1:06:52Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 1:06:53Jen Sincero?

  Spending, I'm just, I'm still kind of, you know, the Italian immigrant's daughter who sort of pays attention. So not that that's bad, but.

• 1:07:00Lewis Howes?

  It's interesting, I, I have a little bit of that in me, although in the last couple of years, I've started to learn how to take care of me, like with travel and food and convenience and saving time.

• 1:07:10Jen Sincero?

  Convenience.

• 1:07:11Lewis Howes?

  Whereas for, I don't know, the first five years of my business. Uh, when I was making money, right? It's like, not like I didn't have money, but I was so afraid to lose it also that I was just stacking it. Every time I travel, I would try to find who do I know in this, this town that I can sleep on their couch?

• 1:07:29Jen Sincero?

  Yeah, isn't it funny?

• 1:07:30Lewis Howes?

  Cause I was like, I'm not gonna pay 200 bucks a night for a room. What are you talking about? Like.

• 1:07:33Jen Sincero?

  Yeah.

• 1:07:34Lewis Howes?

  I can use that money and I can put it somewhere else.

• 1:07:36Jen Sincero?

  Yeah.

• 1:07:37Lewis Howes?

  And I was always like, how do I just get on the cheapest bus fare?

• 1:07:40Jen Sincero?

  Right?

• 1:07:40Lewis Howes?

  How do I get like the middle backseat on Southwest? Like, how do I get the $39 flight?

• 1:07:46Jen Sincero?

  Yeah.

• 1:07:46Lewis Howes?

  And just sit there for six hours in the middle and just, you know, crammed.

• 1:07:49Jen Sincero?

  Yeah.

• 1:07:50Lewis Howes?

  As opposed to, you know, convenience and, and saving time and, and having my health optimized and using it to do those things. But I was afraid to lose it, so I was just work, work, work to make it, but I was afraid to lose it for a while.

• 1:08:03Jen Sincero?

  Yeah, and also like the, the value, like I still, and I make myself do, but I hate paying for parking. I would rather, and we're talking like $2 in a meter, like I'm so weird about that, I'm like.

• 1:08:13Lewis Howes?

  You'd rather roll on the block five times to try to find a place.

• 1:08:15Jen Sincero?

  Yes, waste gas, waste my time, like it's so stupid, but I, and I crack up like, but, but I also have this thing where like, I'll spend 60 grand to put solar on my house, but I won't spend $15 on a wooden spoon. Like I'm just, I don't know, it's just kind of funny catching yourself where you're.

• 1:08:31Lewis Howes?

  Well, I think there's a, there's a, there's a power in being mindful with your money and being, I would call it frugal, I guess, maybe in certain ways, but abundant in other ways.

• 1:08:42Jen Sincero?

  Yeah.

• 1:08:42Lewis Howes?

  Right? It's like. Be abundant in certain ways, but don't just overspend on everything because you have the money.

• 1:08:47Jen Sincero?

  Yeah, I guess. I know. So.

• 1:08:48Lewis Howes?

  Be mindful of certain things.

• 1:08:49Jen Sincero?

  Finding, you know, at whatever level you're at too, you know, like when you don't have money, you also don't want to be pinched off and stingy with it. Like, it really is about, this isn't just, you know, two people with money talking about it. It really is about figuring out where you're at and how to stay in that abundance mindset and in the flow and leaving an extra dollar when you tip or whatever, you know, but just really catching yourself when you're pinching it off. Because it doesn't matter how much we're talking about, but it's that pinching off. If money is currency and currency is energy and you're pinching it off, that is not going to do well for you.

• 1:09:22Lewis Howes?

  Blocking it. What was the big lesson about relationships in the last 10 years?

• 1:09:29Lewis Howes?

  Whether it be friend, colleague, intimate relationship?

• 1:09:32Jen Sincero?

  Yeah, you know that people are still really uncomfortable with money and I, I do feel like it's being of service to talk about it freely and openly and joyfully. And it totally turns people off all the time and close friends, absolutely. And but taking a stand and doing it anyway. And really like, I kind of do have to, I have to be a little careful because it can be braggy. But again, like if I lost 100 pounds and I was telling you about losing 100 pounds, people would be happy for you. This is the same kind of thing. Like, it's something that really is an achievement that helps me be healthy and happy.

• 1:10:12Lewis Howes?

  Yes.

• 1:10:13Jen Sincero?

  And why shouldn't I talk about it? And the fact that you're uncomfortable with it doesn't mean I shouldn't talk about it.

• 1:10:18Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 1:10:18Jen Sincero?

  And sink down to your level, right? So that's been interesting. And I have lost friends over that. Absolutely.

• 1:10:23Lewis Howes?

  Wow. It's interesting because we'll see, you know, on social media, these physical transformations of people. Here was me six months ago. Here's me now.

• 1:10:31Jen Sincero?

  Yeah.

• 1:10:32Lewis Howes?

  And a lot of, you'll see a lot of people celebrating that, right? Like, congratulations. It's amazing. It's the encouragement. It's like, look what I was able to do and I'm so proud of myself. And I wish more people would do that around money too. Look, like I was $30,000 in debt and look at my bank statement now. Like, I'm debt free and I've got a thousand bucks in the bank.

• 1:10:49Jen Sincero?

  Oh, my God.

• 1:10:49Lewis Howes?

  You know, whatever it is. And I think Dave Ramsey celebrates that for people in his, you know, kind of community where it's like when they get out of debt, he brings them on the radio show and they kind of announce it. But I don't see this on social media that much.

• 1:11:00Jen Sincero?

  Because that's a safe space. Because everybody who's listening to his show is drank the Kool-Aid. Yeah, yeah. You do it in the public space. You are going down. Yeah.

• 1:11:08Lewis Howes?

  Why is that?

• 1:11:10Jen Sincero?

  I don't really know. I don't know. I think about this too. Like, how did that all get started? When did it become such a dirty thing? It has, I'm sure it has to do with some kind of control. Like, some people wanted to control something, so.

• 1:11:21Lewis Howes?

  Right. I'm curious about, you know, if you're down to go there, about intimate relationships. How has making money impacted you intimately in relationship?

• 1:11:31Jen Sincero?

  I am definitely, that is my Achilles heel right now. So that, and it's been a little weird for me because being a very, I have stories around being a very successful woman. And how that's not so feminine and how, yeah, there's a lot of stuff on that. So I'm, that's the, that's the new frontier, which I'm super psyched about.

• 1:11:52Lewis Howes?

  Figuring it out.

• 1:11:53Jen Sincero?

  Yeah.

• 1:11:54Lewis Howes?

  What do you feel like is the biggest struggle around that? You know, is it?

• 1:11:58Jen Sincero?

  My own beliefs around it. Totally. Come on now. I know all this. It's all the same thing. You know, but that's, that's, that's a deep one. And it's kind of a new one, you know, because, because I haven't been a successful woman for a long time. And so it's, it's interesting.

• 1:12:16Lewis Howes?

  Wow.

• 1:12:16Jen Sincero?

  Yeah.

• 1:12:17Lewis Howes?

  So is this like, you know, people just are intimidated by you because you have money? Or what is that?

• 1:12:22Jen Sincero?

  That's what I think. That, because men are supposed to be the providers and supposed to, you know, yeah, be the providers and to be more successful. And I don't really even care about that, you know? But I do care about somebody being at the same level of me spiritually and sort of just, you know, just with what they're into and stuff like that. So that's really important to me.

• 1:12:44Lewis Howes?

  Interesting. Because that might be a block for some women. Like, if I make more money, will I be in a great intimate relationship?

• 1:12:51Jen Sincero?

  I think.

• 1:12:52Lewis Howes?

  If I make more than my partner, right?

• 1:12:54Jen Sincero?

  Well, the way that it's set up, anyway, that is sort of it, you know, that men, and you know, so I just got to find a guy who's either as, as who's, who's got really good wealth consciousness, who's as successful, who's totally out there. But it's, it's my own story. It's always your own story. Yeah.

• 1:13:09Lewis Howes?

  What would you coach another woman?

• 1:13:13Jen Sincero?

  Who says the same thing?

• 1:13:14Lewis Howes?

  Or who's like, they've got a, you know, a successful, growing business, or maybe they're, you know, making a million dollars a year in their business or more.

• 1:13:21Jen Sincero?

  Yeah.

• 1:13:22Lewis Howes?

  And they're like, man, I've been struggling because

• 1:13:24Jen Sincero?

  Yeah.

• 1:13:25Lewis Howes?

  I haven't found a guy who's comfortable with me making this much. They feel like they can't. Add as much value to the relationship.

• 1:13:33Jen Sincero?

  Right.

• 1:13:34Lewis Howes?

  What would you say to that?

• 1:13:35Jen Sincero?

  Well, of course, Lewis, I have had that client because the second you have an issue, that client shows up. I don't know if you find like every time because I'm doing this group coaching course. And, uh, oh yeah, like plenty of people in that group ask me the very questions.

• 1:13:47Lewis Howes?

  So what do you say?

• 1:13:48Jen Sincero?

  It's super easy when it's the, well, I know, I mean, I know the answer, but am I like really going to limit is, uh, watch your thoughts. What are you believing about it? What have you decided is true about you, about your environment, about the way the world works? Like it's all your thoughts. Like if you keep harping on it's hard. He's not out there. I'm to this, I'm to that, then that is the truth.

• 1:14:11Lewis Howes?

  That's what you'll manifest or attract.

• 1:14:13Jen Sincero?

  You know, to think what you want to think is to think the truth. So.

• 1:14:16Lewis Howes?

  That's true.

• 1:14:16Jen Sincero?

  Yeah. So.

• 1:14:17Lewis Howes?

  It's interesting because my, my girlfriend, I was telling you about her a little bit before. She's extremely successful in what she does. She makes a lot of good money.

• 1:14:27Lewis Howes?

  And I celebrate it. I'm like.

• 1:14:29Jen Sincero?

  Yeah.

• 1:14:29Lewis Howes?

  Awesome. For me, it feels great to have someone who's more, uh, you know, energetically aligned or like more of an equal match. Even though my business does more than her business, but she's making a killing, right? In her own way, and I'm excited for her.

• 1:14:45Jen Sincero?

  Yeah.

• 1:14:46Lewis Howes?

  And, um, it doesn't make me feel like I'm not able to provide as much with her making good money also. For me, it doesn't affect that it within me, but maybe 10, 15 years ago it would have. Maybe I would have felt insecure or not enough because I hadn't worked on my stuff.

• 1:15:02Jen Sincero?

  Right.

• 1:15:03Lewis Howes?

  So I think it's just finding, you know, someone who's in alignment, who's a good match, emotionally, spiritually, psychologically as well, who's done the work and doesn't find it intimidating.

• 1:15:12Jen Sincero?

  Exactly.

• 1:15:12Lewis Howes?

  I find it inspiring. I'm like, wow. And here's the, the interesting thing for me. Not to go off on this too much, but for me, something's switched in the last like five to eight years. Where I had this kind of morbid thought where I said, okay, if I'm with a partner and I don't feel like she can be resourceful and I die, can she take care of my kids financially? It was kind of a morbid thought, but I was like, huh? And I struggled in the previous relationships that I was in thinking, would they be able to financially figure it out? If they didn't, if they didn't remarry?

• 1:15:46Jen Sincero?

  It's a great thing to think about.

• 1:15:47Lewis Howes?

  If they didn't find another man to support them financially, if their parents didn't fund them.

• 1:15:52Jen Sincero?

  Right.

• 1:15:52Lewis Howes?

  Whatever happened, if I, we had kids, I died, could they financially be resourceful? Uh, and do things that would make our kids proud of them? You know what I mean? And so, and that's my partner now. So it's like she is financially resourceful and, and creative enough to generate money if she needed to.

• 1:16:11Jen Sincero?

  Right.

• 1:16:12Lewis Howes?

  But I don't need her to make any more, you know what I mean?

• 1:16:15Jen Sincero?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:16:15Lewis Howes?

  Anyway, something to think about there, but um, so that's one of your blocks right now, one of your, your challenges.

• 1:16:21Jen Sincero?

  Temporary block, yes.

• 1:16:23Lewis Howes?

  Releasing the blog very quickly.

• 1:16:25Jen Sincero?

  Yes, I'm just airing all the laundry here. I hope when I leave this room, that it's all, it all stays here.

• 1:16:31Lewis Howes?

  Exactly.

• 1:16:31Jen Sincero?

  Yeah.

• 1:16:32Lewis Howes?

  We'll open the window so it goes somewhere else.

• 1:16:34Jen Sincero?

  Please, get a fan, yeah.

• 1:16:36Lewis Howes?

  What is the, what is the question you get asked by your readers the most? That you wish they truly could hear and believe the answer to?

• 1:16:47Jen Sincero?

  Oh, so many. Well, the one that I said about what do you do when the people closest to you don't support you? Another one is how do you keep the motivation? Like, you know, we go to these seminars, we read books, we listen to the podcasts and we're all raring to go and then.

• 1:17:03Lewis Howes?

  A month later, you go back and you're all.

• 1:17:04Jen Sincero?

  Exactly, yeah, so.

• 1:17:05Lewis Howes?

  So how do you stay motivated?

• 1:17:07Jen Sincero?

  Yeah.

• 1:17:07Lewis Howes?

  On your vision and on your growth journey?

• 1:17:10Jen Sincero?

  Well, I call it going to the spiritual gym. And you've got to have a spiritual gym practice because you do not get to work out physically and then stop going to the gym. Once you're in shape, so just because you got in shape at the seminar or listened to the podcast or whatever, you don't get to stop doing stuff, so. And it doesn't, and you know, I'm working so hard to start my business. I don't want to do anything. I didn't wait, wait, wait. So it's like, it can be 20 minutes. You know, you working out for 20 minutes a day can do a lot of great things. So it's like, spiritual gym workout, meditate for 15, read a self-help book for five. Like, what music are you listening to? Who are you hanging out with? What makes you feel like you could flip over a car? Like, what are those things? And do them every single solitary day for 20 minutes. It's not that big a whoop-de-doo.

• 1:17:55Jen Sincero?

  You know, when you think about that it's going to change your entire life, you know, so and take it as seriously as anything else. Because that work will make everything else that you're taking seriously and trying to achieve so much easier. And, you know, I'm giving a lot of talks right now and the, and the thing that I'm just so excited. And I'm so excited to be speaking right now, too, because it reminds me, it's my spiritual gym, right? Like, we all need it. So, but the thing about, because we are spiritual creatures having a physical experience, right? And if you, and like, instead of just giving it lip service and talking, yeah, yeah, yeah, I know that. But think about it, we are the universal intelligence that created everything that is.

• 1:18:37Jen Sincero?

  We are our thoughts, our universal intelligence and stuff that created everything that is. Why are we not more stuck up? Why are we not feeling so powerful all of the time? If we're really going to believe it, if we're really gonna go steroids on woo-woo and, and go there. And really, like, if you thought about that all day long, about your thoughts being, you know, when you're in alignment, not the garbage thoughts that you think, but when you get quiet and you tap into your inner yippee-skippee, as I like to call it, and you're there and you're in the flow, it's like, it's so exciting.

• 1:19:15Lewis Howes?

  I hope you enjoyed today's episode and it inspired you on your journey towards greatness. Make sure to check out the show notes in the description for a full rundown of today's episode with all the important links. And if you want weekly exclusive bonus episodes with me personally, as well as ad-free listening, then make sure to subscribe to our Greatness Plus channel exclusively on Apple Podcasts. Share this with a friend on social media and leave us a review on Apple Podcasts as well. Let me know what you enjoyed about this episode in that review. I really love hearing feedback from you and it helps us figure out how we can support and serve you moving forward. And I want to remind you if no one has told you lately that you are loved,

• 1:19:56Lewis Howes?

  you are worthy, and you matter. And now it's time to go out there and do something great.