Set up solar, or save a tree? It’s complicated

To solar or not to solar? That is the question for this latest episode of our monthly series Nature Quest. For listener Darcey Hughes, installing solar panels isn’t just about keeping her utilities free of fossil fuels – it’s also a way to become fully self-reliant and save some money each month. But there’s a catch: She might have to chop down a large, shading cedar tree. Today, we investigate: When is solar worth it? And is it worth the price of an old, majestic tree? Do YOU have a question you have about your local environment? Send us a voice memo telling us your name, where you live, and your dilemma… we may make it the next Nature Quest. We’re reachable at [email protected] mailto:[email protected]. Want to learn more about easy-to-install solar? Check out NPR climate correspondent Jeff Brady’s reporting on plug-in solar panels https://www.npr.org/2026/03/12/nx-s1-5737287/solar-panels-utilities-energy-saving. Listen to every episode of Short Wave sponsor-free and support our work at NPR by signing up for Short Wave+ at plus.npr.org/shortwave http://plus.npr.org/shortwave. See pcm.adswizz.com https://pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for sponsorship and to manage your podcast sponsorship preferences. NPR Privacy Policy https://www.npr.org/about-npr/179878450/privacy-policy

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

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• 0:16Emily Kwong?

  You're listening to Short Wave from NPR.

• 0:21Speaker 02

  Happy spring, short wavers. I'm producer Hannah Chin, and my Nature Quest buddy Emily Kwong is also here.

• 0:27Emily Kwong?

  Hi, Hannah.

• 0:28Speaker 02

  With a story about an age-old question for homeowners. Namely, should I cut down that big tree in my front yard?

• 0:36Emily Kwong?

  Yeah, to chainsaw.

• 0:39Emily Kwong?

  Or not to chainsaw? That is the question. Darcy Hughes lives a few miles north of Seattle, Washington, and has got this big, towering cedar tree that grows right next to her house.

• 0:50Speaker 03

  And right now, we've got a few birds up there and a few crows, of course.

• 0:59Speaker 03

  It's generally pretty peaceful here.

• 1:02Emily Kwong?

  Cedars are evergreens, so all year long, this tree casts a long, dappled shadow over her front yard.

• 1:11Speaker 03

  Really, no direct sunlight comes through these branches at all.

• 1:16Emily Kwong?

  And Darcy wants to know, should she keep the tree or cut it down to install solar panels on her roof?

• 1:24Speaker 02

  OK, so really, the question should be to solar or not to solar?

• 1:28Emily Kwong?

  Yes. Now, there are nearly 6 million solar energy installations in the US alone. And when it comes to home solar, a lot of people make the switch because most public utilities rely on fossil fuels.

• 1:40Speaker 02

  Like coal, like natural gas.

• 1:42Emily Kwong?

  Yeah, but Darcy is in this really unique situation because in Homish County, most of its energy comes from hydro-powered dams. So 90% of her energy is already carbon-free.

• 1:52Speaker 02

  Got it. Wait, so then what's the point of installing solar?

• 1:56Emily Kwong?

  She wants to be self-reliant, and it wouldn't hurt to lower her electric bills by making her own energy. But at what cost? And is it worth the life of a tree? So today on the show, when to make way for solar? We get into the nitty-gritty.

• 2:11Speaker 02

  Of how solar works and how to choose a solar system that's right for you. I'm Hannah Shen.

• 2:17Emily Kwong?

  And I'm Emily Kwong.

• 2:18Speaker 02

  And you're listening to Short Wave, the science podcast from NPR.

• 2:28Speaker 04

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• 3:12Speaker 04

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• 3:18Speaker 00

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• 3:52Speaker 02

  OK, Emily, so today we are focusing on a solar crisis. This is Nature Quest, our series answering environmental questions from listeners like you. Whoop, whoop. And I guess we got to start with solar panels themselves. I got to be honest, because I'm a renter, I'm like, not totally sure how these work. I do know I think they're kind of ugly. Like, when I pass them, they look like giant flat-screen TVs that are, like, stuck to the roof.

• 4:19Emily Kwong?

  Fair, but Hannah, I'm going to change your mind. Because solar panels are actually glorious. They are the end result of humankind's enduring ambition to harness the power of the sun.

• 4:28Speaker 05

  Turning sunlight into electricity. Scientists of the Bell Laboratories at Murray Hill, New Jersey demonstrate a solar battery which converts light into power.

• 4:36Emily Kwong?

  These scientists at Bell Labs back in the 1950s used the photovoltaic effect.

• 4:42Speaker 06

  Photo as in light, photo and then voltaic, voltage, electricity.

• 4:47Emily Kwong?

  This is Jenny Heinzen, master electrician and the curriculum director at the Midwest Renewable Energy Association. And she went full teacher mode in explaining to me how this photovoltaic effect turns the energy of the sun into an electric current. So first, you need a material. And it was Bell Laboratories in New Jersey that figured out you could use strips of silicon, the same stuff found in sand.

• 5:09Speaker 05

  Principal ingredients of ordinary beach sand. Enough light from a lamp to power this toy Ferris wheel. Lights on, she works. Lights off, the motor stops.

• 5:19Emily Kwong?

  Silicon ended up being such an efficient and scalable material that it is what modern solar panels are made out of.

• 5:26Speaker 06

  They're very much like computer chips. They are silicon-based semiconductors.

• 5:31Emily Kwong?

  So basically, the solar panel has a positive side and a negative side. It's designed that way. And the positive side is what absorbs the sunlight. The sun's energy travels as photons. Those photons, when they hit the solar panel, they knock electrons free. So then there's all these free electrons, which then travel through the solar panel to the negative side. And the flow of electrons, as we know, is electricity. And this process is happening across hundreds of cells on any given solar installation.

• 5:59Speaker 06

  And now those electrons are being used to light your house and do your laundry and make toast and do everything else.

• 6:06Emily Kwong?

  Of course, you need a device to accept these electrons. A lot of people use solar inverters. These are magic boxes that convert that direct current into an alternate current. So if you need more electricity, it pulls from the utility. If you make extra electricity, that will actually flow back onto the grid to power your neighbors' homes and businesses. But if the power goes out, lights out. Wait, so...

• 6:33Speaker 02

  Solar doesn't work during a power outage?

• 6:36Emily Kwong?

  No, because the inverter recognizes something is wrong with the grid and shuts down. So Jenny has seen a lot of people add batteries to their systems as a backup power source. So that would allow you to truly live off the grid.

• 6:48Speaker 02

  Oh, OK, so now I understand how solar panels work. Maybe I appreciate them a little bit more than I did before.

• 6:55Emily Kwong?

  Yay.

• 6:55Speaker 02

  But Emily, I still want to know the answer to Darcy's question. Like, should she cut down the tree to make way for solar panels?

• 7:03Emily Kwong?

  OK, so for this, I wanted to cast a wide net. I talked to five people in different parts of the country who are all connected to the solar industry. The five include a journalist, a policy person, a trade person, a master electrician, and someone at Darcy's local public utility.

• 7:18Speaker 02

  What'd they say?

• 7:19Emily Kwong?

  Asked them all the question, and I expected them to say, you know, "Break out the chainsaws. Solar forever." But instead, I got this.

• 7:27Speaker 05

  I would not make that as the first move, for sure. If a tree is shading their home, it's doing a really good thing for them.

• 7:33Speaker 06

  I wouldn't cut down a tree that I loved in my yard to do solar. Maybe this isn't the right answer as a solar advocate.

• 7:41Speaker 02

  Wait, OK, this does surprise me that all of them are so pro-tree.

• 7:45Emily Kwong?

  Yeah, many of them talked about how trees sequester carbon from the atmosphere, which Darcy well knows. But this point about sequestration is interesting to me because, pound for pound, solar panels are significantly more efficient than trees at offsetting carbon.

• 7:58Speaker 02

  Mm-hmm.

• 7:59Emily Kwong?

  And yet, everybody begged Darcy, "Unless this tree is sick and rotting and a hazard to your home someday, do not cut it down."

• 8:06Speaker 02

  Yeah, I gotta say, this feels like more of an emotional argument rather than a logical argument. It just doesn't really totally make sense. Did they explain why?

• 8:16Emily Kwong?

  Yeah, it is a logical argument.

• 8:17Speaker 02

  Got it.

• 8:18Emily Kwong?

  Yeah, I'll let John Farrell at the Institute for Local Self-Reliance speak his piece.

• 8:22Speaker 07

  Having a tree is amazing, and especially if it shades your house, and especially if you have, you know, high-energy bills in summer months.

• 8:28Emily Kwong?

  Trees provide natural cooling, and a sustainable house isn't just about whether you have all the gizmos and the solar panels and the electric car and the heat pump, whatever. It's also about, like, your home's natural environment and how much energy it uses. And a home with more shade is going to use a lot less AC and have to, you know, tap the local utility less.

• 8:52Speaker 02

  I mean, I'm from Oregon, and my parents and the folks I grew up with have been experiencing really unprecedented heat waves for the past couple of summers. Plus, a lot of homes in the area, including mine. Are older and so they don't have AC. So the shade that the trees provide is really invaluable.

• 9:09Emily Kwong?

  Yeah, the Pacific Northwest is historically very cool, but it is getting hotter. And I was reminded of this while talking to Suzie Oversvy, who runs solar programs at Darcy's local public utilities, Snohomish County PUD. We're getting more extreme and more frequent heat events. And so we are at the utility seeing more and more customers installing air conditioning.

• 9:30Speaker 02

  OK, so because of the shade, don't cut down the tree. End of episode?

• 9:36Emily Kwong?

  Don't cut down the tree, but not end of episode. There are other pathways for Darcy to explore solar. I've come up with a three-step plan. Do you want to hear it?

• 9:43Speaker 02

  Yes, I love a three-step plan. What's step one?

• 9:46Emily Kwong?

  Call up a solar installer and have them come to your house. Maybe the shade isn't as significant as Darcy assumes. Solar panels can work in cloudy weather. Also, there are places besides her roof where she can put panels. There are ground-mounted systems, pole-mounted systems, even plug-in solar panels.

• 10:06Speaker 05

  And so you can put them on a balcony, you can put them in your backyard. You can hang them from a porch or something like that.

• 10:13Emily Kwong?

  This is Kevin Lucas. He works for the Solar Energy Industries Association, like the big trade group that represents the solar industry.

• 10:20Speaker 05

  The installers can come to their house and look at the trees and determine exactly how much sunlight they get through the year. And then with that information, along with the quotes of a couple of different reputable installers, she can make a decision as to whether this makes sense.

• 10:34Speaker 02

  I didn't even realize this was something that you could do. Basically, like phone a trustworthy expert.

• 10:39Emily Kwong?

  Yes, trustworthy is important because NPR'S Jeff Brady, who has been covering the solar industry for years now, says there are some high-pressure sales tactics out there.

• 10:48Speaker 02

  OK.

• 10:48Emily Kwong?

  So Jeff suggests finding a local solar installer who's been doing this for a long time. He likes this website called The Amicus Solar Cooperative for finding that trustworthy local person.

• 10:59Speaker 02

  Got it. So step one, get an expert. Call a reputable solar installer. What's step two?

• 11:05Emily Kwong?

  OK, if your property is a good candidate for solar, break out your calculator because solar installation ain't cheap. If you're spending $20,000.

• 11:13Speaker 06

  Up front to put solar panels on your house. You got to sit down and do some figuring. Is this going to save me money over the long run?

• 11:21Emily Kwong?

  Jeff says read those contracts carefully before committing to that solar installer.

• 11:26Speaker 06

  It's like a long term relationship. It's going to last for 20 or 30 years, hopefully. I heard one person say that most solar panel relationships last longer than most marriages.

• 11:38Speaker 02

  Falconer's thing to say.

• 11:40Emily Kwong?

  I know.

• 11:41Speaker 06

  So you really want to choose closely who that person is.

• 11:45Emily Kwong?

  And also, check if your area has incentives. So state or local policies that allow you to lower the installation costs or even to offset your energy bill. Like, if you produce energy for the grid, you might get a discount on your electric bill.

• 11:58Speaker 06

  Once you build it, it's there. It's sitting there. You've spent the $20,000 and now the fuel is free and you're generating electricity for free.

• 12:07Speaker 02

  Right. Free is a great price.

• 12:08Emily Kwong?

  True.

• 12:08Speaker 02

  But Emily, I remember hearing that the Trump administration and the big, beautiful bill recently gutted the biggest financial incentives for renewables. That was the 30% federal tax credit on new solar installations.

• 12:21Emily Kwong?

  Yeah, that cut was made at the federal level and the growth of the solar industry did slow down last year.

• 12:26Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 12:27Emily Kwong?

  And yet, solar still produced 7% of US energy last year. That was unthinkable to Jeff 20 years ago. So he told me, even with these cuts, he thinks solar is here to stay.

• 12:38Speaker 02

  So basically, we'll see what happens with the solar industry in the future.

• 12:42Emily Kwong?

  Indeed.

• 12:42Speaker 02

  But Emily, you said this was a three step program. What's your third step for Darcy?

• 12:47Emily Kwong?

  Darcy, third step? And this is especially if your installer is like, actually, there's no place for you to put solar. Check out community solar. Basically, any shared solar projects. These are where a group of people finance the installation of solar panels in another place. It's good for people who rent or people with trees. Jenny, the electrician, put it this way.

• 13:08Speaker 06

  So there's a plot of land and you go in together and you all garden together. You can do that with solar, solar gardens.

• 13:12Emily Kwong?

  So even if the sun isn't shining directly on your house, it is always shining somewhere.

• 13:17Speaker 02

  I love a community solution. Emily Kwong.

• 13:20Emily Kwong?

  Yeah.

• 13:20Speaker 02

  Thank you so much for bringing us this story.

• 13:22Emily Kwong?

  Hannah Chen, you're very welcome.

• 13:24Speaker 02

  Short waivers. If you liked this episode, check out Jeff Brady's recent reporting on plug in solar panels. We'll link it in our show notes.

• 13:31Emily Kwong?

  And be like Darcy. Send us whatever question you have about your local environment. Just record a voice memo with your question and we'll go on a quest. Email it to [email protected].

• 13:42Speaker 02

  This episode was produced by me, Hannah Chin, and edited by our showrunner, Rebecca Ramirez. Tyler Jones talked the facts. Sam Paulson wrote the Nature Quest theme music. The audio engineer was Robert Rodriguez. I'm Hannah Chin.

• 13:56Emily Kwong?

  I'm Emily Kwong. Thanks for listening to Short Wave from NPR.

• 14:05Speaker 04

  Stay tuned for the following announcements and messages from our sponsors.

• 14:10Speaker 00

  This message comes from Mint Mobile. While others have been hiking your bill, Mint Mobile has kept their wireless plans starting at $15 a month. Switch to Mint Mobile and get three months of premium wireless service for $15 a month. Go to mintmobile.com/switch. Upfront payment of $45 for three-month plan required. $15 per month equivalent. New customer offer, first three months only, then full-price plan options available. Taxes and fees extra. This message comes from Data IQ Agent Management. Most enterprises can't count their AI agents, let alone manage them. Data IQ Agent Management lets you do both from a single view. Visit dataiq.com to learn more.