#2416 - Dan Farah

Dan Farah is the director and producer of "The Age of Disclosure," a documentary revealing a 80-year global cover-up of the existence of non-human intelligent life, and a secret war among major nations to reverse-engineer advanced technology of non-human origin. See it now in select theaters and streaming on Amazon Prime Video. www.theageofdisclosure.comwww.youtube.com/@TheAgeOfDisclosure Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:01Speaker 00

  The Joe Rogan Experience.

• 0:14Joe Rogan?

  What's up Dan, how are you? Good to see you.

• 0:15Speaker 02

  Good, good to see you man.

• 0:16Joe Rogan?

  Good to see you again. First time I saw you was the first time I saw your documentary, which is fucking excellent.

• 0:21Speaker 02

  Thank you bro.

• 0:22Joe Rogan?

  The Age of Disclosure, really good. Can't recommend it enough. If you're a UFO dork like myself, and you're in and out, like sometimes like this is bullshit, maybe it's real, this is bullshit, maybe I'm wasting my time, maybe it's real, maybe it's... Go see The Age of Disclosure, and then you'll be fully in the "I don't fucking know, but who... something's going on." That's where I am right now. I don't know, but something's going on.

• 0:45Speaker 02

  Definitely something going on, it's a real situation.

• 0:47Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, it's a real weird one. When you see all these like, high-level government employees talking about secret access programs, and back-engineering programs that have been going on for decades and decades in secrecy, and you're like... Your documentary did a fantastic job of highlighting a couple of reasons why I always... When people are skeptical, and they go, "Okay, if there was a program like this, why wouldn't they just tell us?" You have to really understand the consequences of what they've done. Because what they've done is lied to Congress, for a long time. It's misappropriation of funds, clear felonies.

• 1:24Speaker 02

  Yeah, lied to the public, lied to Congress, lied to sitting presidents.

• 1:27Joe Rogan?

  Just the money stuff, and also, let's just be really... Let's be just honest about human nature. If you have complete access to enormous amounts of money that's not under any oversight at all, for sure, some of it, some of it went in the pockets of people that probably shouldn't have got it. A hundred percent.

• 1:49Speaker 02

  I think it's safe to say.

• 1:50Joe Rogan?

  A hundred percent, has to.

• 1:52Speaker 02

  Everyone I've talked to who's aware of the details of the deeply-hidden legacy program says that it's at least over a trillion dollars spent since the 40s.

• 1:59Joe Rogan?

  Oh my god.

• 2:00Speaker 02

  It's an enormous amount of money.

• 2:01Joe Rogan?

  Oh my god.

• 2:02Speaker 02

  And it's a much bigger program than people would suspect. You're talking thousands of people, full-time jobs, then going home to their families, the guy sitting next to your kid's Little League baseball game, you know, normal people on the outside are involved in this deeply-hidden program. It's bonkers.

• 2:17Joe Rogan?

  And the idea, this is another thing that drives me nuts, the idea that people can't keep secrets... Shut the fuck up.

• 2:23Speaker 02

  No.

• 2:23Joe Rogan?

  Yes, they can.

• 2:24Speaker 02

  If you're told your reputation.

• 2:25Joe Rogan?

  Some people, some people can't keep secrets. But by the time you get to be a high level operative in the United States government, I'm guessing you can keep a fucking secret.

• 2:34Speaker 02

  Yeah, and if you're told.

• 2:35Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 2:36Speaker 02

  Hey, you could disappear one day. Or you can have your reputation ruined.

• 2:40Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 2:40Speaker 02

  You're gonna get blackmailed about this or that. You're just gonna keep quiet.

• 2:44Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, people can keep secrets. And by the way, not everybody does.

• 2:47Speaker 02

  No.

• 2:48Joe Rogan?

  The Bob Lazar story, to this day, is like, that documentary by Jeremy Corbell was the reason why I went all the way back in with UFOs. I'm like, alright, goddamn it, I believe Bob.

• 2:59Speaker 02

  It's a great doc.

• 3:00Joe Rogan?

  It's a great doc!

• 3:01Speaker 02

  It's a great doc.

• 3:01Joe Rogan?

  And that one's available, it's Area 50, Bob Lazar, Area 51 and Flying Saucers, is that the name of it, the title of it? Something along those lines? Fantastic documentary.

• 3:10Speaker 02

  For me, like, I, look, my childhood was the 80s and early 90s, so I grew up on movies like E.T. and Close Encounters, and TV shows like X-Files and.

• 3:17Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 3:17Speaker 02

  Movies like Fire in the Sky, remember that movie?

• 3:19Joe Rogan?

  Oh, yeah, I had Travis in here.

• 3:21Speaker 02

  Yeah, you did, I loved that interview.

• 3:22Joe Rogan?

  Fantastic.

• 3:23Speaker 02

  That movie, that movie gave me nightmares.

• 3:25Joe Rogan?

  Crazy, cuz.

• 3:26Speaker 02

  Kept me up as a kid.

• 3:26Joe Rogan?

  All those, a couple of those guys on that crew hated him. Like, one of them he got in a fistfight with that day.

• 3:31Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 3:32Joe Rogan?

  And that guy had the exact same story that everybody else had. He got hit by a beam of light, they went back to get him, he was gone, then five days later, he shows up. He's not malnourished, he's not like, he's not, hasn't been sleeping in the woods.

• 3:45Speaker 02

  It's crazy.

• 3:46Joe Rogan?

  And he's got this fucking insane story about being repaired on a UFO.

• 3:50Speaker 02

  Yeah, and all those guys passed lie detectors.

• 3:51Joe Rogan?

  Yes, all of them did.

• 3:53Speaker 02

  The, you know, like, movies like that, I'm sure for millions of people around the world, same thing, it just made me curious about this, you know?

• 3:58Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 3:59Speaker 02

  My whole life, I'm like, are we alone in the universe? Does the US government know more about this than, than we do, right? And I always wished that there was a documentary that only interviewed people who have direct knowledge of the topic as a result of work for the government. And that was, that was the real drive of making this film. Everybody fits that criteria.

• 4:16Joe Rogan?

  Here's the fear that everyone has, including myself, and it is the way, this is the main fear that I have whenever I sit down with any whistleblower. Um, how many of them are?

• 4:28Joe Rogan?

  On purpose, that their directive, that their objective is to spread misinformation on purpose, on behalf of the government, that they're there to just bullshit you.

• 4:38Speaker 02

  Yeah, no, of course, I had that, I had that thought, but for me, I stopped worrying about that when I met one intelligence official, government official, military official after another, who had completely different ideological views, different political beliefs, they weren't associated with each other, and they were all saying the same thing. And so, I just don't, the alternative to everything these people are saying in my film being true is that thirty-four people of different political parties, different government groups, with different aspirations, all got together four years ago and decided to tell this elaborate lie randomly with me in a movie. And for what end? It doesn't make any sense.

• 5:22Joe Rogan?

  Well, there is a couple ends, right? One of them could be they're being told to do this because this is a real thing, but it's different than what they're saying, and they're trying to get one narrative out there. Well, right, let's imagine that there's a current coordinated effort with the United States government and some sort of alien intelligence. Wouldn't it behoove you to make it more of a mystery? Like, we've been trying, we've been, we have found things, but we don't know what they are, and we're back engineering, but we don't know much, but meanwhile, they know way more.

• 5:58Speaker 02

  Well, yeah, look.

• 5:59Joe Rogan?

  Like, that's just one scenario.

• 6:00Speaker 02

  That could be a scenario, but in this case, you have people who, like Rubio, who found out what's going on.

• 6:06Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 6:07Speaker 02

  Who think it is very urgent that the public get caught up and find out the base facts. His biggest fear, clearly, is we are in a high-stakes technology race, a Cold War race, with adversarial nations like China to reverse-engineer technology of non-human origin. And his fear, he literally says in the film, is that if we don't get our act together and take this more seriously as a country, we're gonna wake up one day, we're gonna find out the hard way that China got there, we won't know when or how, but to quote him, "We will be screwed." And he, you could feel it, like, I did all the interviews myself, I'm like, this close to him, his chin buckled when he said it. He was dead serious, and he was super concerned, and you could feel it. And that was the vibe with Senator Rounds, Senator Gillibrand, Jim Clapper, guys never

• 6:50Speaker 02

  talked about this topic in his life, he's in his eighties, he was the head of Air Force Intelligence, he was the director of National Intelligence. Never publicly spoken about UAP. He goes on, he comes out and does the interview and he told me, excuse me, he told me that he was doing it because it was important to do and that the people needed to know. And he drops the bomb in the film that UAP activity over Air 51 is real. It's in fact real. And he goes on the record saying that the Air Force has had a program to investigate this stuff, whereas the Air Force is saying they haven't had a program since Project Blue Book. So I think the people that I interviewed really felt like a weight on their shoulders to get this off their chest. And to give you more context on Clapper, the poor guy's wife was in the hospital dying. He left the hospital to come do the interview.

• 7:35Speaker 02

  And I actually said to him, I was like, are you sure you want to do this today? And he's like, no, I want to do it. It's important.

• 7:39Joe Rogan?

  Wow.

• 7:40Speaker 02

  So, like, I think, I really felt it. These people all felt like the public needed to know the base facts that they could lawfully disclose. And to me, the more wild thing is, if this is, if what they reveal in this film, the fact that there's been an 80-year cover-up of non-human intelligent life, that we're in a secret high stakes race with adversarial nations, if that's what they can lawfully disclose, dude, what's on the other side of that line?

• 8:01Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 8:02Speaker 02

  What's the stuff they can't disclose?

• 8:03Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 8:04Speaker 02

  You know?

• 8:05Joe Rogan?

  Yeah. When you're talking to these people, how many of them have had personal experiences that they either can or cannot talk about? Or how many of them, has anyone had some sort of personal experience with either a craft or scenes? This episode is brought to you by The Mosquito Bowl. Here's a story that's pretty incredible. After Pearl Harbor, four of the best college football players in America walk away from promising NFL careers to enlist in the Marines and fight in World War II. And the craziest part, it's a true story. These guys had their whole lives ahead of them, but traded the glory of the gridiron for the brutal reality of combat, where the stakes were life and death.

• 8:49Joe Rogan?

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• 9:32Joe Rogan?

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• 10:58Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah.

• 10:59Joe Rogan?

  So... That they couldn't talk about?

• 11:01Speaker 02

  That they... There were some scenarios that they couldn't talk about, and then there were some scenarios they could talk about. But yes, Jay Stratten, for example, who ran the US government's UAP Task Force, he was the director of the UAP Task Force. He co-founded OSAP with Jim Mikatsky, which grew into ATIP. He has seen with his own eyes non-human craft and non-human beings.

• 11:27Speaker 02

  Some situations that he can't talk about, some situations that he can. And I know he intends to talk about those in the very near future.

• 11:37Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, I've talked to him. So, is that the only one that saw a non-human being that you talked to?

• 11:46Speaker 02

  No, talked to a couple of people who have.

• 11:49Joe Rogan?

  And were they similar stories?

• 11:51Speaker 02

  They were similar stories. They described the beings looking... The reference point they gave me was very similar to the beings depicted in Close Encounters.

• 12:06Speaker 02

  That is the description they used.

• 12:07Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 12:08Speaker 02

  The, um...

• 12:11Speaker 02

  In terms of crafts, one of the interviews in the film that I'm really proud of, an Air Force security guard who worked at Vandenberg Air Force Base, who's never gone public, witnessed with his own eyes, along with five other security forces members, a giant UAP the size of a football field that came over Vandenberg Air Force Base, hovered over them, and then shot off at thousands of miles an hour. And he went on the record on camera. He's never talked about it publicly. He's never pursued press or, you know, tried to do anything with this experience.

• 12:46Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 12:47Speaker 02

  And he broke his silence in this film because he thought it was really important that the world know the truth.

• 12:51Joe Rogan?

  Did you ask him if there's any footage? I would imagine Vandenberg has some pretty tight security.

• 12:55Speaker 02

  Yeah, he thinks that there is, uh, security camera footage of this.

• 13:00Joe Rogan?

  But he's never seen it?

• 13:00Speaker 02

  He's never seen it, no.

• 13:02Joe Rogan?

  Good lord, people.

• 13:02Speaker 02

  Him and five, it was him and five other guys saw it with their own eyes. They all reported it. There's official, um, Air Force police blogger reports of it. I got ahold of the police report. We put it on screen in the film.

• 13:14Joe Rogan?

  That's what drives me crazy. All this could be cleared up if they released the whatever high-resolution security camera footage they have. I would imagine they have top-notch security camera footage around major military facilities.

• 13:27Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 13:27Joe Rogan?

  Right?

• 13:27Speaker 02

  Yeah, that's one of the hurdles we have to get past. We have to

• 13:30Joe Rogan?

  These motherfuckers are holding on.

• 13:31Speaker 02

  start declassifying this stuff.

• 13:32Joe Rogan?

  They've got this fucking... It's just like, that shouldn't be yours. Like, that should be... Be the United States government.

• 13:38Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 13:39Joe Rogan?

  Has an obligation to give that to the people of the world. That's what that should be.

• 13:42Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 13:42Joe Rogan?

  You have footage of a fucking UFO, a real one.

• 13:45Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 13:46Joe Rogan?

  And you really have a video of it going thousands of miles an hour, just disappearing into the sky.

• 13:50Speaker 02

  Yeah, hundred percent. I mean, I don't think any government or organization or religion, anyone should be able to gatekeep these fundamental facts, you know?

• 13:58Joe Rogan?

  I know, but the problem is until you see it, it's just talk. You know, if you saw it and you know that you you know, the like the chain of command, like where it came from, or a chain of custody, rather, where it came from. It hasn't been molested, have analysts tested, it's not AI, it's not bullshit, it's not edited. Okay, what is it?

• 14:16Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 14:16Joe Rogan?

  And then we can talk. But until then, like, what do we have? We have the Go Fast footage, we have the Gimbal footage. And we have the very kind of grainy weird TikTok footage. It's hard to tell what it is because you're looking at it from the instrumentation of the fighter jets.

• 14:31Speaker 02

  Yeah, but there is also other, um, there is also other, uh, data on the Tic Tac incident that's classified that shows this was a real object that was really there.

• 14:42Joe Rogan?

  Jamie showed me something. What did he show me, Jamie?

• 14:43Speaker 03

  This is Ryan Graves talking about the big red UFO that hovered over Vandenberg in two thousand and three.

• 14:50Speaker 02

  Yeah, so that happened in the afternoon, and then that night, this giant craft came over the base that is revealed in my film.

• 14:58Joe Rogan?

  So it says right here, the executive director of the Graves, who's been on the podcast for.

• 15:03Speaker 02

  Yeah, Ryan Graves is awesome.

• 15:05Joe Rogan?

  Uh, sighting occurred around eight forty-five AM, followed by a second sighting only hours later. He said witnesses provided him with information about the mysterious incidents as they held on to official documentation and records from the event over the years.

• 15:17Speaker 02

  Yeah, and so later that night.

• 15:19Joe Rogan?

  Mm-hmm, it says right here, later in the evening, post sunset, there were reports of other sightings on base, including some aggressive behaviors. These objects were approaching some of the security guards at rapid speeds before darting off.

• 15:32Joe Rogan?

  Like Close Encounters, like literally like the movie.

• 15:35Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 15:36Joe Rogan?

  I just wonder how much Steven Spielberg, I love to talk to him about that, how much he dove into it before he made that film. Cause you know, he had the Jacques Vallée character, that French scientist.

• 15:46Speaker 02

  I think he learned a lot in the seventies. People forget, he also wrote Poltergeist.

• 15:49Joe Rogan?

  Right, yeah.

• 15:50Speaker 02

  This guy knew what was going on, um, early on. But put yourself in the shoes of those security guards at Vanderberg. Can you imagine just being a normal guy, you're working your security shift, you look up and there's something the size of a football field over you?

• 16:02Joe Rogan?

  Hovering silently.

• 16:04Speaker 02

  No windows. It's fucking terrifying and it's crazy. And it changed, he says, uh, we did a New York City premiere, uh, a couple nights ago, Tuesday night. We did it on the Intrepid aircraft carrier.

• 16:14Joe Rogan?

  Oh, wow.

• 16:14Speaker 02

  It was awesome. And Fravor and Graves came, it was great to be on an aircraft carrier with, you know, Fravor and Graves.

• 16:18Joe Rogan?

  That's awesome.

• 16:20Speaker 02

  Fravor loved it. He's like, I'm back on a carrier, baby. The, uh, it was, it was classic. But, um, the witness from Vanderberg came and he, you know, we did a little talk after for, for the audience and he said it changed his life. He just completely looks at everything differently now.

• 16:34Joe Rogan?

  Oh, how could it not?

• 16:35Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 16:36Joe Rogan?

  How could it not? Yeah. I mean, if you see something like that.

• 16:38Speaker 02

  Totally humbling and also, you know, eye opening. There's several people in the film, military, military guys who talk about what they experienced and saw on military bases. Especially nuclear bases. Which is, which is, goes back to one of the biggest concerns the leaders in my film have. Almost all the activities over on nuclear weapons sites and military bases. Our defense capabilities and our nuclear progress essentially are being monitored. And why is that?

• 17:14Joe Rogan?

  Cause it's dangerous as fuck.

• 17:15Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 17:16Joe Rogan?

  Cause as Terrence McKinnon described us, we're territorial, uh, apes with their own nuclear weapons.

• 17:21Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah.

• 17:22Joe Rogan?

  It's ridiculous position.

• 17:23Speaker 02

  Yeah. And so that's clear to me too. And, and then you think about, okay, well, where does all this go? Like it comes to a crossroads, right? Like they've been here a long time. They've been monitoring us a long time, but now we've evolved to be dangerous. And we're either at, through secret programs, their level, or we're about to be. And then that's when you get to a crossroad. So I. I think that's one of the things driving officials like Rubio and Rounds and Gillibrand and Jay Stratt and to come out and say what they legally can because it's a set of circumstances that the human population really needs to know about and then it's become a humanitarian issue. How do we deal with this?

• 18:00Joe Rogan?

  Right. And what is it? Right? What is their purpose? If they are real, are they here to help us? Are they monitoring us? One of the creepiest things that Bob Lazar said is that they look at us like containers.

• 18:13Speaker 02

  Yeah, I mean.

• 18:14Joe Rogan?

  And I was like, what does that mean? Like, containers of souls is what I interpreted from it, but that's just me. But like, what does that mean? Containers? Like, it seems like human beings have an insatiable desire to innovate and create better technology. And that seems to be leading us into AI and seems to be leading us into probably what connects us with the rest of the universe, the rest of the intelligence of the universe. But the stuff that got us here is being these territorial apes, you know? That's why we developed cities and that's why we developed agriculture. That's why we had enough free

• 18:55Joe Rogan?

  time to innovate. We had enough free time to invent things and change things. But our nature is really what holds us back because we're still constantly warring. Like, it hasn't changed at all.

• 19:06Speaker 02

  No, it's crazy that we're still threatening a nuclear war 80 years after, you know, dropping the bomb on Japan. We're still invading sovereign nations.

• 19:12Joe Rogan?

  We're involved in a proxy war. We're, you know, we're helping Israel. It's like there's so much chaos and death going on in the world because of human beings and the decisions that they're making that if I was an intelligent life species from somewhere else, I'd be very concerned.

• 19:26Speaker 02

  Yeah, I'd be like, here's this group of monkeys on a, you know, trajectory.

• 19:30Joe Rogan?

  About to make a digital god. They're real close to having superintelligence in digital form. And these idiots are still blowing themselves up from the sky.

• 19:39Speaker 02

  Yeah. Which also is why one of the current dilemmas exists, right? So this technology exists. Private defense contractors have this technology. Elements of the government have this technology.

• 19:50Joe Rogan?

  You're convinced.

• 19:51Speaker 02

  Beyond convinced.

• 19:53Joe Rogan?

  And what do you think that technology consists of?

• 19:56Speaker 02

  I have been completely convinced by multiple members of the intelligence committee, the military, senior leaders in government, people who are running the Senate Armed Services Committee, the Senate Intelligence Committee, someone who sits on the White House National Security Council, that our country has recovered dozens, dozens of crashed craft of non-human origin and done so since the 40s. And there has been success for reverse engineering elements of this technology. And the same thing has been happening in China and Russia. And it's a very real situation. It's a high-stakes situation. It is referred to as the atomic race on steroids. And I am completely convinced of that. And the contractors that, the defense

• 20:39Speaker 02

  contractors that people like Jay Strattanen, Lou Elzondo, and people on the Senate Intel Committee have told me are involved are Lockheed Martin, Northrop Grumman, Raytheon, Battelle, big companies that have a lot of resources and are advancing this technology, but it's all so classified and so deeply hidden that it hinders progress. And the fear that if this technology got out, it'd be used by bad actors to create weapons of mass destruction, has sort of prevented the scientific progress that could be better for mankind, that could be good for mankind. Like, this technology, to quote Hal Puthoff in the film, he says,

• 21:22Speaker 02

  this is the key to interstellar travel. This is the key to exploring the galaxy. This is the key to, you know, things that sound like science fiction, like teleportation. All these things that could just revolutionize humanity and like the trajectory of our species are being held back out of the fear that the technology will be used for evil, right? And so, you know, I love Hal Puthoff. I've gotten very close with him and, you know, he makes a really- Fascinating guy. Fascinating guy. He's the most interesting person I've ever met in my life. He makes a great point in the film of saying, he believes, despite the risks this technology could be used for bad, he believes we should make it known and make it a humanitarian issue

• 22:06Speaker 02

  of how we all collectively go about safely using this technology to change the world for the better and avoid destruction. And we've done that. We have a blueprint for that with nuclear technology, right? Like, there are nuclear weapons, that stuff's classified. We wish they didn't exist, but it does exist. And then we also use nuclear energy for good.

• 22:26Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, um, the question would be,

• 22:30Joe Rogan?

  if we're holding back because we're worried that bad actors are going to get it, is China taking the same approach? Because I would imagine they're not.

• 22:37Speaker 02

  They're not.

• 22:37Joe Rogan?

  I would imagine they're full bore, full steam ahead.

• 22:40Speaker 02

  Yeah, and that's, that's, that's one of the problems, like-

• 22:42Joe Rogan?

  That's the same thing with a lot of other technology, right?

• 22:45Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah, yeah. Rubio and Rounds and Gillibrand, three of the most senior leaders in our government, talk very openly about their concern about China and them getting ahead of us on reverse entering this technology. Rubio says it keeps them up at night. Rounds very animatedly says in the film, "Do you think for one second that they wouldn't use this technology for their domination if they didn't think we had access to the same technology?"

• 23:17Joe Rogan?

  How is everybody getting these crashed UFOs? What's the story behind that?

• 23:20Speaker 02

  So here's an interesting thing.

• 23:23Speaker 02

  One of the, one of the unexpected things I learned in talking to sources, like real credible people, is that some of the cra- some of the, the crashes were actual crashes, where just, you know, crashes happen, just like they do for, you know, you could drive as safe as possible, fly as safe as possible, crashes are going to happen. But some of them were actually caused by elements of our military intelligence community and elements of foreign military intelligence community, community, people. So like,

• 23:54Speaker 02

  one of the realizations early on was that

• 23:58Speaker 02

  atomic weapon test, nuclear weapon testing, atomic weapon testing create, has a ripple effect that can down these things.

• 24:05Joe Rogan?

  Especially high altitude nuclear testing, which is one of the things that they did in the 1950s in particular.

• 24:11Speaker 02

  Yeah, and so they started doing it.

• 24:13Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 24:13Speaker 02

  To like shoot fish in a barrel, basically.

• 24:14Joe Rogan?

  They did it on purpose?

• 24:15Speaker 02

  Yeah, and so did-

• 24:16Joe Rogan?

  That's why they were doing it?

• 24:17Speaker 02

  Yeah, and then Russia, Russia started doing it.

• 24:20Joe Rogan?

  No.

• 24:20Speaker 02

  Yeah, and then, one of the-

• 24:22Joe Rogan?

  It's like throwing dynamite into the river.

• 24:24Speaker 02

  It's like fishing with dynamite, yeah.

• 24:25Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, fishing with dynamite, oh my god, that's so crazy.

• 24:28Speaker 02

  And which is crazy on multiple levels. A, you could accidentally provoke a nuclear conflict with another party that doesn't know what you're doing. B-

• 24:37Speaker 02

  You're, you know, you're picking a fight with a more intelligent, superior species, right? Which is probably not gonna work out great for anybody.

• 24:47Joe Rogan?

  They probably couldn't believe we were using nukes in the sky. These fucking idiots nuked some of our spaceships.

• 24:53Speaker 02

  And the ocean.

• 24:54Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, we nuked the ocean a ton of times, right?

• 24:56Speaker 02

  And there's a ton of UAP activity in the ocean.

• 24:58Joe Rogan?

  Right. That's something that Tim Burchett recently talked about. Did you see that?

• 25:02Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, I've, I've talked off the record with admirals and sub commanders and been told that these giant football-sized crafts that were seen over Vandenberg, for example, have been seen under the ocean.

• 25:15Joe Rogan?

  Whoa.

• 25:16Speaker 02

  Moving at crazy speeds, tracked by our subs.

• 25:18Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, they, it said there was one story of one that was the size of a football field that was going 500 knots.

• 25:24Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 25:24Joe Rogan?

  Underwater with no ripples.

• 25:26Speaker 02

  Yeah. So it makes, starts to make you think, like, not only was Spielberg tipped off early on, but maybe, maybe James Cameron was too. Maybe the abyss is a lot closer to reality than

• 25:34Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 25:34Speaker 02

  than, than we ever thought.

• 25:35Joe Rogan?

  Well, there's always stories about things coming from the ocean. And there was always stories of people that lived in, like, the Pacific, like, on the coast.

• 25:42Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 25:42Joe Rogan?

  Of seeing things come out of the ocean, particularly somewhere around San Diego. There's, there's always stories around San Diego.

• 25:47Speaker 02

  There's a hotspot there, yeah. Congressman Carson, Andre Carson, who's on the House Intelligence Committee and on the House Committee for the CIA, he goes on the record in the film saying that these UAP that come out of the ocean are otherworldly things. He says they are not man-made aircraft, they are not,

• 26:07Speaker 02

  rockets. These are otherworldly things, he says. And that's a significant, that was a significant moment for me when he went on the record and said that. And I, I think, I think it's, going back to the, the, the nuclear stuff, it's scary to think that anyone thought it was a good idea to intentionally take down the aircraft of a more intelligent species.

• 26:28Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 26:29Speaker 02

  It seems like a very foolish decision.

• 26:32Joe Rogan?

  Well, if that's true.

• 26:33Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 26:33Joe Rogan?

  I know that there was a lot of high-altitude nuclear bomb testing for whatever reason. And then there was that Operation Midnight Prime. Is that what it was? No. Uh, Starfish Prime, where they were blowing holes through the Van Allen radiation belts. They were just launching nuclear bombs into space.

• 26:50Speaker 02

  Well, I'll tell you something that I don't, I don't think people know about, but, um, the UAP Task Force, which Jay Stratton ran. They put in place, based on that data of, you know, the connection with nukes.

• 27:03Joe Rogan?

  Mm-hmm.

• 27:03Speaker 02

  They put together a plan to lure in UAP with nuclear elements. So, nuclear aircraft carrier with some nuclear weapons on it. And they had all these data collection systems in place and, and it worked.

• 27:19Joe Rogan?

  Whoa, so they like put out bait?

• 27:22Speaker 02

  They, yeah, without causing, without doing a test.

• 27:26Joe Rogan?

  Just the fact that they had nuclear weapons.

• 27:28Speaker 02

  Existed and was being put into place. It attracted and they caught a lot of data on it.

• 27:34Joe Rogan?

  Whoa.

• 27:35Speaker 02

  And, you know, we shouldn't think that that was the only time they did that.

• 27:38Joe Rogan?

  Well, I would imagine, you know, they probably saw the testing, the stupid shit we did in the ocean.

• 27:43Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 27:43Joe Rogan?

  The, the fact that, like, we were talking about this last night. John Wayne did a terrible movie called Genghis Khan. I don't know if you ever saw it?

• 27:51Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, I saw that.

• 27:52Joe Rogan?

  It's one of the worst movies of all time. And that's what killed him. That movie killed him. He got cancer from that movie. And so did almost, like, I think it was like close to a hundred people on the set. Some very large number of people on the set got cancer. Because they did this all downwind from where the government was detonating nuclear bombs. They filmed it all in Nevada, in the desert.

• 28:11Speaker 02

  Horrible.

• 28:12Joe Rogan?

  Horrible. So like, they blew up, so, yeah, I'm sure you've seen the video of the, where it shows like a time lapse of all the nuclear tests over the years. And you just go, yo, what are you doing?

• 28:23Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 28:23Joe Rogan?

  What are you doing in Nevada? Nevada just boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom. And if I was from another planet, I'd be like, that's when I would start going, oh my God, these idiots. Not only do they have it, but they're just blowing them up in the ocean.

• 28:37Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 28:37Joe Rogan?

  No consideration for the fish, the whales, the dolphins, whatever the fuck happens to be there. When they drop that thing down, like, they're, they're clearly irresponsible.

• 28:46Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, no, it's concerning. An analogy that. Multiple people actually use with me. They said, "Put yourself in the shoes of advanced, non-human intelligent species." Here's the analogy. Imagine you're a zookeeper and you see this gorilla in a cage and you love this gorilla. It's sweet. You watch it evolve over the years. You see it communicate. It waves to you, you know? You have no issue with this gorilla. You don't wish it any harm. But what happens if one day you come in and the other security guards say, "Hey, last night the gorilla got out of his cage, walked around the park, was playing with the gun cabinet, and then he went back in his cage." You're like, "All right, that's concerning. Let me keep an eye on this," right? And then what happens if, you know, a month later you come in and they're like, "Hey, the gorilla, this time he got in the gun cage.

• 29:31Speaker 02

  He was playing with the gun, and then he went back in his cage with the gun." What do we do here, right?

• 29:36Joe Rogan?

  It's even worse than that.

• 29:38Speaker 02

  So it's like, "We'll take the gun out of his hand. We'll put it back. We'll change the lock on stuff," right? But then what happens if it evolves to a place where sometime later, you come out of your house on a Sunday, you're not even going to work, you got your daughter's hand in your hand, and the gorilla's standing in your front lawn with a shotgun? Then you've got to make a choice really quick, right? Like, do I just take this thing out? Or do I try to communicate with it and risk my daughter getting shot? And this analogy's been used with me multiple times to describe the dynamic we have with non-human intelligent life and the situation we're barreling towards.

• 30:06Joe Rogan?

  Yeah. It would almost be like you went to the cage and the gorilla was welding. The gorilla's got gauze on. He's making a bore. He's putting together a shotgun. He's figuring out dynamite on his own. Yeah, that would be the real issue. You're like, "Oh, my God, they figured out guns." Because the thing is, we figured it out. It's not like somebody gave it to us.

• 30:25Speaker 02

  You know, look, a couple of people in the film reveal that some of the UAP activity we see is non-human intelligent life, but some of it is reverse-engineered craft from our program, the legacy program, and some from adversaries. So I personally think we have cracked this technology a lot more than people realize. I don't think you spend over a trillion dollars and have thousands of people working on a deeply hidden program every year for 80 years and not make progress.

• 30:54Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, God, I would love to know what it is that they've done and whether the Tic Tac is one of ours.

• 31:00Speaker 02

  I don't think it is.

• 31:01Joe Rogan?

  No?

• 31:01Speaker 02

  No. I talked to everybody who ran, actually ran the investigation of Tic Tac from various agencies and to the pilots. No one, no one thinks it's manmade. And also, if it was manmade, that would mean that someone cracked a new energy source that far back, which is like, what, 20 years at this point?

• 31:22Speaker 02

  And has never used it to benefit our country or another country to solve the energy crisis, to make a superior craft that we've seen used. It's just, it's just hard to believe that no one would use that to like, fuel their economy. I mean, it'd be, it'd be like a total, you know, restart of everything if you had that technology.

• 31:42Joe Rogan?

  Right. Yeah, that's interesting, right?

• 31:46Speaker 02

  I mean, the craft with that, that Tic Tac was going from sea level to 80,000 feet, which is space, and hovering at, in space, going back down, hovering at sea level, and doing this for hours. We, we don't have anything. The, one of the scientists who was involved in one of the UAP programs for the government in my film does the math and says, the energy required to do that is the electrical output of the entire United States for, he said, a week? Some stupid amount of energy required?

• 32:17Joe Rogan?

  I think it's even more than a week, but yeah, I remember him saying that.

• 32:20Speaker 02

  It's, it's bonkers.

• 32:21Joe Rogan?

  And that's just the trip up.

• 32:23Speaker 02

  Yeah. Yeah. And they were doing that all day.

• 32:26Joe Rogan?

  All day.

• 32:26Speaker 02

  Yeah. It's crazy. It's crazy.

• 32:28Joe Rogan?

  Right. If they had that in 2004, which is the Tic Tac incident, you would think there would be some just insane progress.

• 32:34Speaker 02

  Yeah. Yeah.

• 32:36Joe Rogan?

  So if it's not ours.

• 32:37Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 32:38Joe Rogan?

  What, what is the predominant theory of what they are?

• 32:44Speaker 02

  The predominant theory is that "they" is multiple species. And there's no one answer. Everyone I talk to who has real visibility to the crash retrieval program says the non-human bodies that have been recovered in some of these crafts all look different. There are multiple species. The universe is full of life.

• 33:02Joe Rogan?

  How many different species?

• 33:04Speaker 02

  I've heard of at least four body types that were recovered.

• 33:06Joe Rogan?

  So all I've heard of is the grays, which is like the Close Encounters of the Third Kind ones, the Nordics, which is also known as like the tall whites, right? Is that the same thing?

• 33:17Speaker 02

  I've heard people say that.

• 33:17Joe Rogan?

  And then there is the reptilians. People talk about reptilians being the scariest one.

• 33:23Speaker 02

  No one's ever used that word with me, to be honest.

• 33:24Joe Rogan?

  Really?

• 33:24Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 33:25Joe Rogan?

  And then there's mantis. There's ones that are like insect-like.

• 33:29Speaker 02

  I've heard people say that, yeah.

• 33:31Joe Rogan?

  I haven't heard of any more than that.

• 33:32Speaker 02

  Yeah. Well, I've also heard multiple military people talk about little beings that almost look like ET little bots that don't seem sentient, that seem like they're almost like a...

• 33:51Joe Rogan?

  Like a robot?

• 33:52Speaker 02

  Yeah, like a robot, almost, yeah.

• 33:54Joe Rogan?

  Some artificial creation?

• 33:55Speaker 02

  Maybe.

• 33:55Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 33:56Speaker 02

  Maybe.

• 33:57Joe Rogan?

  You would imagine, if you get to genetic engineering and when there's cyborgs and you integrate technology with this genetic engineering, you're going to be able to create like workers.

• 34:07Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 34:08Joe Rogan?

  Like little... That's what many people have thought the grays are. Like, there's small grays that are more in a like a workforce capacity.

• 34:16Speaker 02

  I've heard that.

• 34:16Joe Rogan?

  They just do the bidding of the taller grays, which seem to be more intelligent.

• 34:19Speaker 02

  I've heard that. You know, one of the really interesting things is that there's no one answer, right?

• 34:26Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 34:27Speaker 02

  Some non-human intelligent life that's here might have benign intentions and some might have bad intentions.

• 34:34Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 34:34Speaker 02

  We don't know. The other reason I am extremely convinced that this situation is entirely real is the access I got when making the film was really at an unprecedented level. Like, I got very close with the leadership of the Senate Intelligence Committee and the Senate Armed Services Committee. They were introducing me to people. They were opening doors for me. And some of the people that I met through them...

• 35:02Speaker 02

  We're actually involved in recovery programs. And we're gonna do interviews and then ultimately decided not to in that they thought they thought it would cost them their lives. Two people used the same words with me, actually. It was very interesting. Two people used the words, "After careful consideration, I've decided I will be forfeiting my life if I participated on camera in your film." The word forfeiting, which I had never heard anyone use in that kind of a context, right? So put yourself in my shoes, like, I'm a normal guy from Jersey making a movie about something I'm interested in. The last thing I want to hear is something like that, you know? So...

• 35:39Joe Rogan?

  That's the most sure way to get people to keep secrets.

• 35:43Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah. So I, of course, was like, "That's shocking and disappointing to hear. Obviously, we should stop talking."

• 35:49Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 35:51Speaker 02

  "I don't want you in this movie."

• 35:51Joe Rogan?

  Don't die.

• 35:53Speaker 02

  "Do not want that on my conscience." But it also was another sign of how real all this is.

• 36:00Joe Rogan?

  Without naming any names, is there anything that you couldn't talk about in the film that you could tell us? Without quoting anybody or pinning it on anybody?

• 36:10Speaker 02

  Yeah, I mean, there's a lot of stuff I learned off the record. Hopefully, it all comes out and people can legally talk about it at some point, but...

• 36:19Joe Rogan?

  Can you talk about it without...

• 36:21Speaker 02

  I know there's been multiple contact events.

• 36:24Joe Rogan?

  Coordinated contact events?

• 36:25Speaker 02

  Yeah, like, straight-up contact events. One of them is revealed in the film, actually, but there are more. There was this... Several people in my film talk about an event that happened at Hallam and Air Force Base where two non-human crafts approached the base. One landed. Beings walked out and interacted with Air Force officials and CIA officials. And a couple people go on the record talking about that in the film. But there have been other events, I've been told.

• 36:48Joe Rogan?

  How are those beings described?

• 36:50Speaker 02

  They were described as tall, slender humanoid. And the... Another thing that I heard that gave me chills was that someone involved with a recovery interacted with a non-human being that was dying and heard thoughts in his head that said...

• 37:18Speaker 02

  You humans don't know your full potential. And that was said to me by a very senior, older guy from the intelligence community. And I thought that was pretty incredible. Also, just the extent to which the legacy program is real. It's not, this isn't like 50 guys, you know, sitting in a quiet, dark room. You're talking about a massive program with thousands of people going to work every day and dealing with this. And to me, that is mind blowing, you know?

• 37:48Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 37:48Speaker 02

  You know, the guy, you know, the guy next to you at the pizza place, you know, on a Saturday night might be working on this door in the day, you know?

• 37:54Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 37:54Speaker 02

  The guy who, you know, the other father at your kid's like, you know, Little League game.

• 37:58Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 37:59Speaker 02

  This is what he deals with, right? The fact that that is a thing and, you know, we had, we had a similar dynamic for the Manhattan Project. There were all these people working on it and they kept it secret, right? And their neighbors and friends didn't know, but this is that on steroids. So, you know, after the Manhattan Project, which was built, had a budget in the billions, this situation arose and it had to be even more secret than the Manhattan Project because the Manhattan Project, we found out in hindsight, leaked, right? There were moles.

• 38:22Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 38:23Speaker 02

  So, we needed to make this even more secret and give it more money and more resources.

• 38:27Joe Rogan?

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• 39:11Joe Rogan?

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• 39:36Joe Rogan?

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• 40:21Joe Rogan?

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• 40:35Speaker 02

  The more, you know, counter intel.

• 40:39Joe Rogan?

  And more threats.

• 40:40Speaker 02

  Which is counter intel, yeah.

• 40:41Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, I mean, threats if you reveal those secrets. But it's like more, the more this stuff gets discussed, the more I go back to what Lazar said. Because Lazar's describing from the 1980s is exactly what these people are saying now. They've had these things, they've been trying to figure them out, they've been working on them. At least in the 1980s, they hadn't totally cracked it yet. But they did know how to operate them and that they would do these tests. But everything was so compartmentalized. He said he wasn't allowed to talk to the metallurgist. He was the, there was different people that were assigned to it. What they were assigned to do was to try to figure out how the propulsion system worked.

• 41:24Joe Rogan?

  And then there was other people that were assigned to try to figure out how the metallurgy was formed. Because whatever it was seemed like it was 3D printed. It didn't have any seams. And when he talks about it, it sounds exactly like what people are talking about today, which is really bananas. Because this is late 1980s and he's the first guy to crack through with this stuff.

• 41:47Speaker 02

  Everything is so, in that secret program, everything is so siloed out, where you could have one team of defense contractors working on one thing. They're not even told it's from an alien spacecraft. They're just told, here's the thing. It might be Russia, it might be China, tell us how it works. And they're just kept in a little, in a little bubble. And one of the issues now is that everything's become so over classified and so siloed that it's it's actually hurting progress.

• 42:15Speaker 02

  And that's a lot of the scientists in my film are voicing that. And you know, one of the other things I learned recently that isn't in the film, Jay Stratten, you know, who ran the UAP task force, he told me that during during that time, he had started a talk with one of the senior scientists at Lockheed, who was frustrated by how over classified everything was. It made them it even made it hard for the defense contractors to get the right manpower and brains on it because not everyone can be cleared to do the work, right? There's all these like red tape hurdles to progress, right? And so they had made a plan to move one of the crafts that had been recovered that was

• 42:58Speaker 02

  in Lockheed's possession into the possession of the UAP task force. And then the task force was going to be able to put more brain power towards it. And then the head of science and technology at the CIA shut it down in the middle of the transfer. They had actually secured a hangar on a military base and prepped it to to be a classified hangar that would hold this craft and they were stopped. So the issue of over classification-

• 43:23Joe Rogan?

  Did they know what happened after that?

• 43:25Speaker 02

  Yeah, the CIA just shut the CIA shut the shut the whole transaction down and the craft stayed in Lockheed's possession. And then that particular leader within Lockheed died about two years later. So the effort kind of stopped. It had cancer. The the over classification is definitely a hurdle for this. And our competitors don't necessarily have that. Like she, you know, there's no free will in China. She she can just be like, hey, you're the smartest guy graduating your class. You're going to go work for the nation on this, you know?

• 43:56Joe Rogan?

  Right, period.

• 43:57Speaker 02

  And here, the problem is no one no one knows it's real. One of the things I hope the film changes is it makes the scientific community know that this is a valid area of inquiry. This is real. It's a real situation and there's a ton of problems for the next generation of engineers and scientists to solve, you know? And so hopefully it inspires them. And helps us make progress because there's a lot of progress that could be made here.

• 44:22Joe Rogan?

  Well, it certainly seems like it, but it's like how, one of the things that you guys propose in the film that I think maybe the only way forward is some sort of a mass amnesty. To all these people that did lie to Congress and probably misappropriated funds and maybe I guess stole a little bit here and there. Like if you, if that doesn't happen, no one is going to push to make this public. No one's going to push for like actual full disclosure because it leaves them too exposed. And if they do have the kind of power that they must have to be running an organization of thousands of people working on something with unbelievable amounts of money being transferred to these programs. They don't want to let that go.

• 45:01Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 45:01Joe Rogan?

  Like this is like, it's a honeypot that they're drawing from, right? And they're probably still taking too much or it's, there's no oversight. It's still, you're still lying to Congress. And you'd have to, you'd have to have some national security amnesty program saying, look, in the interest of national security. It's critically important that we get all of our best people working on this. The only way we're ever going to really do that is to completely reveal that this is actual, really, this is actually really happening. This is real crafts from somewhere or something. We have them, we'll tell you where we have them. And let's, I think right now, people wouldn't even freak out.

• 45:45Joe Rogan?

  Because I would think that people would freak out if there was some sort of official narrative of disclosure, but that's sort of been breached, right? The New York Times breached that in 2017.

• 45:55Speaker 02

  I think this film is that. I mean, there's, this is 34 incredible people saying, putting their reputation and name on the line, which, which I honestly, Joe, I think it's more, it's stronger evidence than any video or photo. These days, you could put a 4K video of a giant craft over Vandenberg and half the human population will say it's AI.

• 46:12Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 46:12Speaker 02

  Or creating some visual effects program, but someone of, of, of note, putting their name and reputation on the line, their career on the line, the rest of their lives on the line. To say, this is what I know to be true, to me, that's the greatest evidence that, that exists. But I do think, to your point. Amnesty is something that's gonna have to be figured out because while it's hard for anyone to accept letting people off the hook for wrongdoings, right? It is, it does seem like it's in the best interest of the bigger picture.

• 46:45Joe Rogan?

  100%.

• 46:46Speaker 02

  Because these people just aren't, they have no incentive to come forward with what they've learned. And so to quote Rubio on the film, he says, "Look, this is not a endeavor to go and punish anyone, but we need to know what they learned."

• 46:58Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 46:59Speaker 02

  And I think he's totally dead on and, you know.

• 47:02Joe Rogan?

  Is he in favor of some sort of an amnesty program as well?

• 47:04Speaker 02

  Yeah, he says, he says on camera in the film, he's like, "I'm not, I'm not trying to punish anyone. I need to know what they learned because taxpayers paid for this and it's in our, our interest to know what's going on." But the other thing that's needed is real whistleblower protection, not, not, not the whistleblower protection that's been passed so far, like mu- much stronger legal protection so that people like, you know, like the folks I talked to, the special forces guys I talked to, were gonna come forward and then decided they thought to be forfeiting their lives. You've gotta change that set of circumstances. You gotta make those people feel like that's not gonna happen to them.

• 47:41Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 47:42Speaker 02

  And, and, and what I think ultimately is gonna have to happen, and I wouldn't be surprised, man, if it happens soon after the film comes out, I think a sitting president has to step to the microphone and say definitively, humanity's not alone in the universe, we have recovered technology of non-human origin, so have other nations, there is a high stakes, secret Cold War race to reverse engine this technology, we need to win this race and the US intends to lead in this new chapter. I think that needs to happen, like a level set of basic facts, and I really, I really do think it will happen.

• 48:13Joe Rogan?

  Well, if that is gonna happen, I think Trump might be the only guy that's willing to do something that crazy.

• 48:18Speaker 02

  I think, I think, I think it's very likely that he does that. I know that, I know that he is aware of the film, I know he's aware of what people in his administration say.

• 48:27Joe Rogan?

  Has he watched it? You know that?

• 48:28Speaker 02

  He has not watched the film, but I know he's very aware of it and I know that they are discussing internally how they're going to react to the film publicly. And I also know that he has recently, very recently tasked Tulsi Gabbard with getting to the bottom of the situation and finding out for him what he needs to know that he doesn't know.

• 48:51Joe Rogan?

  Really?

• 48:52Speaker 02

  Yeah, and as Rubio said in the film.

• 48:55Speaker 02

  Rubio says on camera, on the record, on the film, that this has been kept from sitting presidents. And he goes into detail on how that's been done. And how it's the career bureaucrats in certain elements of the government that control this information and just wait presidents out and don't feel like they have a need to know.

• 49:13Joe Rogan?

  Right. Well, there were some people that tried to find information out in the beginning of the Trump administration. Who was it? There was someone that talked about it on record and said he was told at every turn that you don't have the clearance.

• 49:25Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah. But here's the thing, Trump actually found out about the base facts in his last presidency and was contemplating stepping to the microphone then.

• 49:37Joe Rogan?

  What base facts?

• 49:38Speaker 02

  So Jay Stratton, who, you know, ran the task force, he says on camera in my film that he briefed, that Mnuchin, the Secretary of Treasury, asked for a briefing on the lay of the land because Trump asked him to get the briefing. And Trump had already known that the base facts, that we're not alone in the universe, that there's been recovery of crash craft, right? He knew those base facts. And he told Mnuchin that he was thinking about going public. And so Mnuchin reached out to Stratton to get a briefing. And he told Stratton that the reason he wanted the briefing is because he needed to be able to evaluate what the impact would be to the economy if the president decided to step

• 50:23Speaker 02

  to the mic and tell the world we're not alone. Stratton tells the story on camera in the film. And I've heard a lot more about it off camera. So we know Trump contemplated doing this already. Now, I think the release of this film and Rubio's involvement puts enough on the table that it makes it easier for him to do.

• 50:42Joe Rogan?

  I think they would have to have some sort of a plan in place if they were going to say that, right? Like, the amnesty plan, the idea behind it, would have to be in place.

• 50:51Speaker 02

  Or at least grab control of the situation and say that this is real and the US intends to lead the way. Because the other factor that the White House has to keep in mind is you don't want Xi or Putin being the guy to do that.

• 51:02Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 51:03Speaker 02

  You don't want them to have that moment, right?

• 51:06Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 51:08Speaker 02

  You know, something I always think about with regards to that moment of a president stepping to the mic, when we entered the space race, Kennedy gave that big famous speech, right? He was like, "We're gonna lead in space, technology, like, you know, space technology, like, nuclear technology has no conscience of its own, it's up to man to use it for good or bad, and we're gonna make sure it's used for the betterment of all mankind, and we're gonna lead the way." That was his whole rallying speech, right? And it made the whole scientific community be like, "We're gonna help US win," like, you know, rah rah rah, right? I think that's needed in this race. Like, we need all the support of the scientific community, of academia, the kids coming out of MIT, we need them putting their brain power towards this, and I think the White House knows that.

• 51:52Speaker 02

  And it's also the greatest, that's the greatest TV moment a leader could have in the history of humanity.

• 51:58Joe Rogan?

  How much do you think Elon knows?

• 52:01Speaker 02

  Look, I've seen him, obviously, talk to you about it, I think he knows a lot.

• 52:05Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, me too.

• 52:06Speaker 02

  I don't think you get the contracts and the clearances you need to operate in space without some horse trading.

• 52:13Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, when I went to SpaceX, I'm like, "Motherfucker, you know everything." There's no way you're launching these fucking things into space without them keying you in on exactly what's going on. He's just sly about it.

• 52:27Speaker 02

  Well, I did a-

• 52:28Joe Rogan?

  He goes, "Well, if they are aliens, they're certainly all subtle." That's what he says, like, "Are they really? I don't know, man."

• 52:34Speaker 02

  I think it's impossible to operate in space like he does and not be aware of everything. And also, at the level he operates, clearance-wise. I held a secret screening at the National Space Symposium earlier this year, which is the Super Bowl of the space industry. It's like 60 people, heavy hitters from the space industry, we didn't promote it or publicize it at all, but there were a dozen guys from SpaceX there, and they all, and they all seemed very aware of everything revealed in the film.

• 53:01Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, I'm positive.

• 53:03Speaker 02

  Yeah?

• 53:04Joe Rogan?

  And he's my friend, and he won't tell me.

• 53:05Speaker 02

  He's a legend.

• 53:06Joe Rogan?

  He keeps a lid on it.

• 53:08Speaker 02

  He's a legend.

• 53:09Joe Rogan?

  But how would he not know? If it is, and, you know, some people have told me he knows, that know he knows some things, so whatever. But the point is, people are good at keeping secrets. That's real.

• 53:22Speaker 02

  Hundred percent.

• 53:23Joe Rogan?

  Even people that aren't notoriously good at keeping secrets are good at keeping secrets when they have to be.

• 53:28Speaker 02

  Do you think, if you put yourself, you've interviewed Trump, do you see him doing that? Stepping to the mic and telling us the truth.

• 53:35Joe Rogan?

  Someone talks to him about it and convinces him it's a great idea. Like if I had an hour with him.

• 53:42Speaker 02

  I mean, it's literally the single, in my opinion, the single greatest moment a leader could have.

• 53:47Joe Rogan?

  Well.

• 53:48Speaker 02

  In the history of the world.

• 53:49Joe Rogan?

  If he could be the guy that blows the lid off of it, that would definitely help with his legacy too, which I think would be a good way to convince him. You know, and also that the people would be excited about it.

• 53:59Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 54:00Joe Rogan?

  You know, it's just, I think there's probably a lot of forces that we're not totally aware of that would fight very hard to keep this from being revealed. You know, there's a lot of people whose reputations would probably be in jeopardy. A lot of people that may never get trusted again, even if they get amnesty. We, if there's any evidence of impropriety, any evidence of embezzlement, and which I can't imagine there's not some fucking funny money flying around here and there. It just, no oversight, come on guys, like, oh, you're above board totally, with no oversight at all? And a trillion dollars, fuck off.

• 54:40Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah. I mean, I do think

• 54:46Speaker 02

  I've come to understand that he is borderline enraged at how much has been hidden from the White House. So, that alone might motivate him to just step up and say the truth. It's also the most bipartisan issue of our time, so.

• 54:59Joe Rogan?

  I'll talk to him about it.

• 55:00Speaker 02

  Have support. Yeah, you could make a big difference.

• 55:02Joe Rogan?

  I'll give it a crack. I'll talk to him about it. It's just so many other things to talk about.

• 55:05Speaker 02

  You get a Nobel Peace Prize for that, Joe.

• 55:07Joe Rogan?

  No, I don't want one of those. I'll never show up. Give it to me, you're gonna have an empty stage.

• 55:12Speaker 02

  You know, I think, I really, I'm excited to see what happens on the other side of this release, because I think it's gonna, I think it's gonna awaken the public. I do think they're gonna make a ton of demand on elected leaders and representatives to go take this more seriously, and it's gonna put pressure on the White House. People have never seen someone like Rubio step up and say what he says in the film, you know? The other thing about Rubio, you gotta remember, he's also the National Security Advisor, and that's never happened in the history of the United States, other than Henry Kissinger for two years. This guy's in a very powerful position, very influential position, and aware of a lot more than he was even when he was on the Senate Intelligence Committee as a senator.

• 55:47Joe Rogan?

  Interesting. And also motivated and fascinated by it. So he's engaged in the information.

• 55:54Speaker 02

  Totally. What, what, what, what, what do you find, like, what do you think?

• 56:02Speaker 02

  If you could choose what happens after a movie like this comes out, what would you like to see?

• 56:07Joe Rogan?

  Some mass congressional hearings and a real conversation about amnesty. Because I think it's the only way to get to the bottom of things. Because otherwise, I think you're gonna have every fucking possible legal and hierarchical, hierarchical, whatever the word is, hurdle, like at every step. Everyone's gonna block your access to information. They're gonna lie, they're gonna burn records, they're gonna hide things, they're not gonna tell you where anything is. People will get assassinated, they'll be whistleblowers, they'll be in grave danger. I think there's too much money involved. And you gotta think about it like a criminal organization. Because if you turn them into criminals, they're gonna act like criminals. If you, if you say, "Hey, you might go to jail for the rest of your fucking life because you lied to Congress,

• 56:51Joe Rogan?

  and now we know you did, and you know, there's $250 million that your company got, and $300 million this company got over the course of X amount of years, and we know. We know that you got, you're in trouble, like, we're gonna put you in jail." And then, if that, if you make them criminals, they're gonna act like criminals. I think you're dealing with people that have enormous amounts of money, and probably, they make weapons, they're probably gonna have the most respect for life. You know, if there's a real discussion where it makes it look like it's their idea as well.

• 57:25Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 57:25Joe Rogan?

  That they have this obligation to the American people. They were held under secrecy for so long, but now, through this administration, and through this openness that we've all decided through the scientific community, we're gonna release this shit.

• 57:38Speaker 02

  Yeah, I think, I agree with you, and that could change the world. The other thing to remember is, these aren't villains, they're not like, this isn't some like, dark group of evil people. They're, they're, they're normal people that were given a job to do and then did it, right? And they weren't the decision makers. And, and they, and they're navigating a situation that is unprecedented, and there's no playbook for, right? So they think they're doing the right thing.

• 58:01Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 58:01Speaker 02

  And, and I think that's important to remember, you know?

• 58:06Joe Rogan?

  Do you know, you know the put-off thing, it's in your documentary, with, um,

• 58:10Speaker 02

  The Bush Story.

• 58:11Joe Rogan?

  Bush Senior, he talked about it on the podcast, I mean, that is such a fascinating story.

• 58:14Speaker 02

  It's amazing.

• 58:15Joe Rogan?

  Back then.

• 58:16Speaker 02

  Early, right after 9/11.

• 58:17Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, Herbert Walker Bush, no, it was Herbert Walker. I believe.

• 58:22Speaker 02

  No, the panel was, the panel was, uh.

• 58:24Joe Rogan?

  It was George Bush, it was W?

• 58:26Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 58:26Joe Rogan?

  Oh, I thought it was Bush Senior.

• 58:28Speaker 02

  Yeah, no, it was right after, it was right after nine eleven.

• 58:30Joe Rogan?

  Okay, so during that time, so, I'm confused. So, but imagine, so let's imagine two thousand one. Where would we be twenty-four years later if we had real disclosure from the White House? So for people that didn't see the documentary yet, or watched the podcast with me and Hal Putoff, what he said was, it was him and a bunch of other thought leaders. And they were all brought together with a numerical value for pros and cons related to disclosure. So basically, they said to them, we have, we have acquired crafts that are not of this world, and we have biological entities that are not of this world. These are real. We want to know if we disclose to the general public that alien life is real,

• 59:13Joe Rogan?

  what would be the negative impacts on our society, on our government, on our religion?

• 59:18Speaker 02

  Economy, every, every element of society.

• 59:20Joe Rogan?

  And they put a numerical value to everything. And overwhelmingly, all the people asked had way more con than pro.

• 59:27Speaker 02

  And they determined it was a bad idea?

• 59:29Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, which is so wild.

• 59:31Speaker 02

  Wild that there was this think tank.

• 59:32Joe Rogan?

  Rip the Band-Aid off, kids.

• 59:33Speaker 02

  Over a couple of days where a bunch of people got together and decided the fate of humanity.

• 59:37Joe Rogan?

  Isn't that fascinating?

• 59:39Speaker 02

  It's crazy.

• 59:39Joe Rogan?

  It was the fate, well, at least, I don't think really the fate. I think what it did was just retard everything. It just slowed the growth of access to this. And I really give the New York Times a lot of credit, because I think publishing in two thousand seventeen that, that piece that they did on the front page was so huge, because the New York Times is arguably the most respected newspaper in the world. And for them to address it like it's a real issue. And like, these pilots are seeing these things, they're behaving in ways that don't make any sense.

• 1:00:11Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:00:11Joe Rogan?

  With propulsion that we do not understand, and these are real.

• 1:00:15Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:00:15Joe Rogan?

  And this is New York Times. Like, that, that was, so many people texted me after that, called me after that, because they know that I'm a UFO nut.

• 1:00:23Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:00:23Joe Rogan?

  And they're like, hey, man, this might be real. Like, like, serious people that I'm friends with.

• 1:00:27Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:00:28Joe Rogan?

  And I'm like, I think it's real. Maybe there's something there.

• 1:00:31Speaker 02

  Yeah, and it's, and it's helped us get us where we are now.

• 1:00:33Joe Rogan?

  Yes.

• 1:00:36Speaker 02

  I don't think, the mainstream media support I'm getting from, for this film right now, I don't think it would have happened if it wasn't for that.

• 1:00:41Joe Rogan?

  No, I think the Times article was the, that burst the membrane and allowed more data to come, it's just more rational discourse about it, because I think before then it was just so dismissed and so ridiculed, and you just didn't want to be attached to it because you were a fool. You'd have to be a fool to be considering it.

• 1:01:00Speaker 02

  Yeah, but the Times still is one of those legacy media outlets that still hedges their bets. Like, that article, you know, the original headline, I think, was "We're Not Alone in the Universe," and they changed it to, you know, I think it was like "Black Projects and Hidden Money" or something like that.

• 1:01:15Joe Rogan?

  Hmm, yeah.

• 1:01:15Speaker 02

  You know, they had to dial it down.

• 1:01:18Joe Rogan?

  Well, because they don't know, right? We might not be alone in the universe. These things might be China's. It's not likely.

• 1:01:24Speaker 02

  Well, that's the other thing. If it, if we open ourselves to the possibility that these advanced aircraft penetrating our nuclear weapons sites and our military bases are China, that's fucking terrifying, and that should be the biggest issue of our time, hands down. Because we know the intention of the Chinese Communist Party, and it's not good, right? They're not our friends, they're adversaries. And, you know, Xi has made public statements about wanting to replace the United States at the top of the world order, like, it's a stated goal, right? So, if it is China, even the possibility that they have some of these crafts alongside non-human crafts existing, right?

• 1:02:02Joe Rogan?

  Yes.

• 1:02:03Speaker 02

  Even that possibility, it requires the US government to take this so much more serious. Here's an analogy that General Jim Clapper made to me, you know, he was the Director of National Intelligence, he's in the film. He's like, "Before 9/11, we didn't put the right amount of money towards counterterrorism, and we weren't properly sharing information in the intelligence community. Then this horrible thing happened, and the public was outraged and said, 'We gotta throw money and resources at counterterrorism.' Every elected representative was beating that drum. We started the Director of National Intelligence position so that the agencies would all share information and you would minimize the chance of intelligence gaps, right? And we threw tons of appropriated funds towards counterterrorism. We now spend more money on counterterrorism than we even need to."

• 1:02:46Joe Rogan?

  Hmm.

• 1:02:47Speaker 02

  And his point was, he hopes it doesn't take something bad happening on this front, like China...

• 1:02:55Speaker 02

  Cracking this technology in a way we haven't and then using it against us. Or non-human intelligent life taking an action that isn't favorable to us before we then throw resources towards it. And it's essentially the same thing Rubio said. They think we need to get ahead of this problem, not wait for it to happen and then react to it.

• 1:03:13Joe Rogan?

  Well, of course. I mean, it would be a horrible loss, both in terms of our national pride of being the innovators and being at the head of technology. If China came out and said, "We've cracked this. We have UFOs that we back engineered and now we can fly them around and we can go visit other solar systems."

• 1:03:35Speaker 02

  And we've created a new energy source. We're gonna save the planet.

• 1:03:38Joe Rogan?

  Yeah. We would be, we would look like fools.

• 1:03:40Speaker 02

  We'd also be set back.

• 1:03:41Joe Rogan?

  And if we realized that there had been a bunch of people that were working on this stuff the whole time, but they had been handcuffed by all this secrecy and that this has all been done with defense contractors and lying to Congress, it'd be a fucking national disaster. We would look completely incompetent.

• 1:03:59Speaker 02

  I really legitimately think a lot of the people in my film stepped up because they don't want to be a left hole in the bag and have people saying, "Why didn't you say something sooner?"

• 1:04:07Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 1:04:08Speaker 02

  I really think this is-

• 1:04:09Joe Rogan?

  Because it's that close.

• 1:04:10Speaker 02

  Cover your butt, because it's that close.

• 1:04:11Joe Rogan?

  So, when people talk about the successful back engineering of these things, what are they saying? Are they saying that they can fly around Earth? Are they saying they can go outside of Earth's atmosphere and go into deep space with these things? Like, what have they said we are currently able to do with these back engineered crafts that we've supposedly-

• 1:04:35Speaker 02

  People that I can attribute this statement to that were very credible sources told me that some of the UAP activity in space specifically-

• 1:04:47Speaker 02

  Is reverse engineered technology.

• 1:04:48Joe Rogan?

  Okay, does that mean in space in low earth orbit? Or does that mean traveling through the solar system?

• 1:04:56Speaker 02

  The, what was implied to me was traveling through the solar system.

• 1:05:00Joe Rogan?

  Geez.

• 1:05:01Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:05:02Joe Rogan?

  So, are these manned?

• 1:05:05Speaker 02

  Here's another thing, someone, that same person said to me, by the way.

• 1:05:07Joe Rogan?

  Yes.

• 1:05:08Speaker 02

  Before I forget. That their belief is that the technology we have would not be pulled out even to stop a world war. It would not, those cards would not be shown until moments before, like, a nuclear war situation.

• 1:05:29Speaker 02

  So they wouldn't pull it out to stop like any of the wars we've experienced in the last, you know, since World War II. Um, they wouldn't, you know, regardless of how many.

• 1:05:36Joe Rogan?

  It has to get to nine.

• 1:05:38Speaker 02

  It has to get to a level where there's no.

• 1:05:40Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 1:05:40Speaker 02

  There's no other option.

• 1:05:41Joe Rogan?

  Wow.

• 1:05:42Speaker 02

  Cause it's show your cards.

• 1:05:44Joe Rogan?

  Now, when they say that they've traveled through the solar system. Is this biological human beings? Or are these drone crafts? Like, what are they saying?

• 1:05:53Speaker 02

  I, I, I never got any of that. I never got any of that. All I was told is there's some of the, some of the UAPs that are seen, that have been seen by our astronauts on space missions. Are non-human intelligent life? And some are reverse engineered craft. That's what I was told.

• 1:06:08Joe Rogan?

  But we don't know whether there's a person inside of them.

• 1:06:11Speaker 02

  I, I don't.

• 1:06:12Joe Rogan?

  If they are reverse engineered and they are ours, and we've figured out how to make our own.

• 1:06:16Speaker 02

  That I don't know.

• 1:06:17Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, I need to know that.

• 1:06:18Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:06:20Joe Rogan?

  That's kind of important.

• 1:06:21Speaker 02

  Yeah, there's a lot.

• 1:06:21Joe Rogan?

  Is there fucking some dude named Bob flying through space? Some Top Gun guy?

• 1:06:27Joe Rogan?

  Given the task of.

• 1:06:28Speaker 02

  Wouldn't surprise me.

• 1:06:28Joe Rogan?

  Traveling to Venus real quick?

• 1:06:30Speaker 02

  Wouldn't surprise me. You know, one of the other things that, you know, we were talking about Clapper and Ruby and what they said about China. Something else that they both said, despite these guys being completely ideologically opposed, right? Like, they have no, nothing else in common. Um, they both spoke to how we as a species, not just our country, but the entire human species is held back by this.

• 1:06:53Speaker 02

  There's something, the fact that there's something in the human psyche that says I can't prepare for or wrap my head around something I haven't experienced yet.

• 1:06:59Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 1:07:00Speaker 02

  And how that leads to strategic surprise because you're not preparing for something that can ultimately end up happening. And Rubio makes great examples. He says, you know, we didn't think the Japanese could torpedo us at Pearl Harbor till they figured it out, and they did, right? We didn't think that terrorists were going to come here and learn how to fly commercial airplanes and use them in a terror attack until they did. And with this, he's like, we don't want strategic surprise to lead to a disaster on this front. We need to be ahead of it. And he very powerfully says, you know, often strategic surprise changes the course of human history.

• 1:07:31Joe Rogan?

  So this is the question. If we have craft that we can travel through the source, we meaning someone in the United States of America, does China, do they have the same ability right now? Is there an understanding of where they're at in the race versus us?

• 1:07:49Speaker 02

  Everyone who talked about the race with China was extremely concerned about how close they were. And multiple people talked about how these incursions over our sensitive bases and nukes could in fact be reverse engineered Chinese craft. So it is, it is a scary situation. I mean, look, you can ask the average person the common sense question. Knowing what you know about the dynamic between China and the United States, would you be okay if they were the only country that had a nuclear weapon? The answer is no, right?

• 1:08:17Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 1:08:18Speaker 02

  So would you want them to be the only country that has technology more powerful than a nuclear weapon that could be weaponized in a way that's more destructive than a nuclear weapon? No.

• 1:08:28Joe Rogan?

  But what technology do they have, other than the ability to travel? What other observed technology do they have?

• 1:08:34Speaker 02

  Well, if you weaponize this technology, like, let's just take something like the Tic Tac. Imagine you could, imagine you could

• 1:08:42Joe Rogan?

  Travel instantaneously anywhere in the world.

• 1:08:44Speaker 02

  Yeah, and put a nuclear weapon in there.

• 1:08:45Joe Rogan?

  Right. You would instanta, you would have a nuclear weapon that goes off in less than a second on the other side of the world.

• 1:08:50Speaker 02

  Completely undetectable to any sensor system. You can't react to it.

• 1:08:54Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 1:08:54Speaker 02

  You know? Bad news. Also, these vehicles display the ability to be transmedium. So you could put a nuke through any environment. It's very scary.

• 1:09:06Joe Rogan?

  Well, so transmedium, does that mean, I know that it can go in the air and in the water, but does that mean it can go through actual physical objects?

• 1:09:14Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:09:14Joe Rogan?

  So this is one of the things, and one of the crazier Jacques Vallée stories, that I've read a few of his books, and one of the more bizarre ones, this woman found this object in, on her property, some large property, oh, I want to say it's Nevada, I forget where it was, California, Nevada, but anyway, this, in this egg-shaped, large object, and that as it took off, it flew through the trees.

• 1:09:41Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:09:41Joe Rogan?

  She said it didn't disturb the trees, it just went right through them.

• 1:09:44Speaker 02

  Yeah, so that's, I mean, look, one of those, if you remember in the film, there's this great scene where Hal Poudoff and Eric Davis, who are two of the senior scientists involved with the government UAP programs, they break down how they figured out how these craft work, and how they are warping spacetime in a localized area, and they're basically creating a bubble that the craft operates in, and the bubble separates the craft from the environment around it. The environment becomes irrelevant. So, can move through physical space, could move from air to space to the water, frictionless, there's no splash, but the environment outside the bubble is irrelevant. They're creating their own spacetime, essentially. They're warping spacetime and creating a bubble around the craft. And when

• 1:10:25Speaker 02

  you start to think about how that could be weaponized, it's really terrifying.

• 1:10:30Joe Rogan?

  And what is he saying that they're using? Like, how are they?

• 1:10:33Speaker 02

  He's saying that they're creating an immense amount of energy in this localized area to create the bubble, and there's two prevailing thoughts on how that energy's created. One is they're tapping into so-called zero-point energy, which has only been theorized at this point by humans, right? Or they're using quantum entanglement to pull energy from a far-off source to the local area, the bubble. And...

• 1:10:58Speaker 02

  That's what they figured out.

• 1:10:59Joe Rogan?

  And do they have any knowledge of these generators? Or how they're acquiring this amount of power? What they're using to like, how are they harnessing zero point energy?

• 1:11:08Speaker 02

  No, no, no.

• 1:11:10Joe Rogan?

  But if we've got one and we back engineered it successfully, clearly someone must know.

• 1:11:15Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:11:15Joe Rogan?

  So someone knows.

• 1:11:16Speaker 02

  Look, Hal and Eric got very close with the scientists in the legacy program. And we're sharing information. And that got shut down by the CIA. So before it got shut down, they learned a lot about what we've been doing secretly and what we've been figuring out.

• 1:11:35Joe Rogan?

  Jeez, so it's the fucking CIA?

• 1:11:39Speaker 02

  Well, look, the film, the film, the film reveals that the, uh, the legacy program, the craft retrieval reverse engineering program, it has several elements. It's elements of the air force, it's elements of the Department of Energy, it's elements of the CIA, and it's defense contractors. And the CIA is the quarterback of the whole thing. The air force is used for recovery, like field work essentially. They have the teams that can, you know, react fast and go to a site and collect materials and classify it. And they have the aircraft to bring it back to a base. The defense contractors have the technology, know-how and the engineering skills to do the reverse engineering. The Department of Energy has laws that can be used to classify the material outside of, you know, the president's reach and Congress's reach.

• 1:12:24Speaker 02

  They also have, you know, people who are experts at anything that gives off a lot of radiation and energy. And then the, um, the CIA quarterbacks still think, think of them as like operational control. And this is revealed by a number of people in the film and, um, every single source I talked to. There were a lot of people, Joe, that I talked to in very senior positions that thought the film was important and the only way to bring the truth out to the public. But they couldn't be on camera. And they guided me, you know, filled in gaps for me, helped me understand the lay of the land. There were some people that told me not to interview. There was a couple mole, there was a couple people that were sent to me. I was, people wanted to trick me into including them in the film.

• 1:13:05Joe Rogan?

  Really?

• 1:13:06Speaker 02

  Cause they were crazy people. Um, and I didn't, I didn't, I didn't, I didn't include them. I got tipped off by people, don't stay clear of that. That's someone's agenda, trying to sink your ship.

• 1:13:14Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 1:13:15Speaker 02

  Um, but, uh, yeah, I had a lot of folks helping. The Senate Intelligence Committee and the Senate Armed Services Committee were extremely supportive. And.

• 1:13:25Speaker 02

  You know, I really don't think I would have been able to pull off making the film I did if not for their help. And Rubio, when I started my process, was the vice chairman of the Senate Intelligence Committee. And he had already learned a lot about what has been hidden from Congress and thought that what I was doing was really the only way to bring it out. Because none of these, none of these people on their own would go out on a limb by themselves and become subject to ridicule. They didn't want to be the one guy out there saying all this extraordinary stuff, right? Not only because there's this antiquated cultural stigma where they can be made fun of, or their reputation can be damaged, but there's also this security system around the deeply hidden crash shield program

• 1:14:03Speaker 02

  that for years has just targeted anyone who speaks up. And so what I basically put together was a way for them to safely do it and have strength in numbers and be arm in arm with, you know, several dozen other people. And once Rubio leaned into that, I just started getting tremendous support from the Armed Services Committee and the Intelligence Committee. And then Senator Rounds became very helpful behind the scenes. Intelligence officials who worked this topic, like Jay Stratten and Lou Elzondo and Hal Poudoff, were extremely helpful behind the scenes, opening doors, introducing me to people. And yeah, I think that, I think this is really the only way this is, we were going to, we

• 1:14:47Speaker 02

  were going to get this level of information out by giving people that safety in numbers. And then after this, it's going to require the kind of amnesty we talked about.

• 1:14:55Joe Rogan?

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• 1:15:40Joe Rogan?

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• 1:17:01Speaker 02

  Because this is only what they can lawfully disclose. There's so much more.

• 1:17:07Joe Rogan?

  So when it comes to underground, or excuse me, underwater stuff, this is what Tim Burchette was talking about when that person was famously interviewing him and everybody was like, "What? You're just walking across the street casually talking about bases?"

• 1:17:21Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:17:22Joe Rogan?

  Where they're coming out of the ocean?

• 1:17:23Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:17:24Joe Rogan?

  What do they think that is?

• 1:17:28Joe Rogan?

  Is that different from what's going on in the sky?

• 1:17:30Speaker 02

  No, they think it's the same, they think it's the same craft.

• 1:17:32Joe Rogan?

  So they have a base?

• 1:17:35Speaker 02

  More simply put, if you were here with advanced aircraft and you wanted to hide from humanity, the most logical place is the ocean. It's the majority of our planet. We've barely, we've barely studied it, we've barely, we've, we've, uh, one of the admirals in my film says, "We've scanned the surface of the moon in more detail than we have the bottom of our oceans." It's crazy how much is unexplored, right? And so, it's the most obvious place to hide. There's a lot of activity that happens in the oceans. Um, one of the, one of the, one of the people I talked to thought they would be in the film and then decided it was too risky for them, was a special forces guy who was involved in a recovery of a craft that was in the ocean.

• 1:18:19Speaker 02

  And when they were recovering it, a giant craft came up next to them. Like a functioning craft. And the helicopter pulled out and they dropped the line and the helicopter took off. And the SEAL was in the water and watched this thing take off. And then he had to be recovered out of the water. That's crazy.

• 1:18:37Joe Rogan?

  And the craft that they were trying to recover? Went down? And did the, the big ship take it or anything?

• 1:18:44Speaker 02

  They said, actually, they actually literally said that. They said it took it and went back down.

• 1:18:48Joe Rogan?

  Yo.

• 1:18:49Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:18:49Joe Rogan?

  How big was the big one?

• 1:18:51Speaker 02

  They said it was big.

• 1:18:52Joe Rogan?

  Just big?

• 1:18:53Speaker 02

  That's the only word they used, to be honest. Yeah. And the guy was rattled because the guy was, the SEAL was in the water, hooking a line to this craft. And then when the helicopter pulled out, he said he was in the water just shitting his pants. And taking in this extraordinary experience. And then, um...

• 1:19:09Joe Rogan?

  Was he wearing a vest?

• 1:19:12Speaker 02

  I'm, I'm sure, I'm sure he's wearing his, like, frogman outfit.

• 1:19:14Joe Rogan?

  Fucking doggy paddling.

• 1:19:17Joe Rogan?

  Leave him there in the fucking water. These guys panic and pull out. Maybe the UFO would have let you take it.

• 1:19:23Speaker 02

  All these, all these situations are really bonkers.

• 1:19:26Joe Rogan?

  I wonder what would have happened if they were like, "Fuck you, we're taking it." You know?

• 1:19:31Speaker 02

  What I often wonder is if any of the guys on that shop are snap video of this thing. You know, there's a lot of video that exists that is either classified at a crazy high level, or people are just terrified to share, you know? And that's one of the other things, like, we need a declassification process that's real and sincere, and rigorously goes through what's there and what can be showed that won't hurt our national security, right?

• 1:20:02Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 1:20:02Speaker 02

  And just start being transparent with the public. This encounter of the SEAL reminded me of another thing that I think is really important and speaks to the accountability issue. There's a number of military personnel and scientists that have worked for defense contractors who have had, and intelligence officials, who have had encounters and then end up with biological effects, like, real issues. Cancer, autoimmune, you know, autoimmune issues. A number of people died of cancer after being around these things, and that's a whole nother level of accountability, you know? There's people whose medical bills should have been paid for, they shouldn't have been

• 1:20:46Speaker 02

  put in those situations, you know? There's families growing up without a dad because dad encountered a UFO on behalf of the US government and died.

• 1:20:54Joe Rogan?

  Jesus.

• 1:20:55Speaker 02

  So that's a whole other side of this.

• 1:20:57Joe Rogan?

  So is this them getting cancer from being around the object, or being around biologics?

• 1:21:02Speaker 02

  Or both? The object. Because, once you understand that these craft are warping spacetime in a localized area and creating immense amount of energy, getting close to it's like getting close to a, you know, a huge electrical system, or, you know, it's just, it's bad.

• 1:21:18Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 1:21:19Speaker 02

  You know?

• 1:21:19Joe Rogan?

  That's the Travis Walton story.

• 1:21:20Speaker 02

  It's a lot of stories.

• 1:21:22Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, well, Travis Walton in particular, that's what, you know, he said happened. He got close to the object and something zapped him, and, you know, whether it was an actual, like, targeted attack, or whether it was just something, a reaction to him being so close to this energy, that he was thrown back, knocked unconscious, gravely hurt, and that they took off.

• 1:21:42Speaker 02

  Yeah, I've spoken, I've spoken off the record to some intelligence officials who have managed to actually get the government to take accountability and give them anonymous health injury status, AHI status, which has only gone to... Victims of quote unquote Havana syndrome.

• 1:22:03Speaker 02

  And it's it's a real situation, but not everyone has the relationships or the ability to get escalated to the Secretary of Defense and get that AHI status. The Secretary of Defense has to give you the AHI status.

• 1:22:13Joe Rogan?

  This is gonna sound crazy, but is there a particular protocol for dealing with the kind of cancer that you get from getting in contact with a UFO?

• 1:22:20Speaker 02

  The only thing that I know of, I wouldn't call it a protocol, but I do know that there is a couple specific people, doctors, who have become a part of the intelligence communities looking into this, and they've become the go to doctors for people having biological effects and they, if you have a relationship with them, if you can get to them, they show up pretty quickly and do the appropriate tests and documentation of it and have the right doctors to send you to. Gary Nolan, who you interviewed, is one of those people.

• 1:22:58Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, Gary Nolan, who's done some groundbreaking research on cancer.

• 1:23:02Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:23:03Joe Rogan?

  Gary.

• 1:23:04Speaker 02

  The other, the other guy, I shouldn't say his name, but he used to work for, he used to work for one of the big intelligence agencies that's deeply involved in this.

• 1:23:19Joe Rogan?

  The other thing that Gary has that's really fascinating is the research on materials, like some of the, some of the allegedly retrieved materials from crash sites and how bizarre they are.

• 1:23:33Speaker 02

  Yeah, he's from studying the isotopes, but the, the, the stuff that Gary's gotten into that I find the most mind blowing is he has real classified documentation of encounters that military and intelligence officials have had with UAP and biological effects it's caused, and some of them are crazy, like a Department of Defense official who had a UAP above his house and went out in his backyard and looked up at it, and then the thing zapped him with a directed energy weapon. And he has all of the medical signs of a directed energy attack, and this is a super senior credible guy who had recently been made aware of the UAP issue, and then he has this experience.

• 1:24:15Joe Rogan?

  Wow.

• 1:24:15Speaker 02

  Yeah, it's pretty wild.

• 1:24:19Joe Rogan?

  So what are the effects of a direct energy weapon? Like, what's the, what are the consequences?

• 1:24:24Speaker 02

  Cancer.

• 1:24:25Joe Rogan?

  That's what he's getting? Cancer.

• 1:24:26Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:24:27Joe Rogan?

  Wow.

• 1:24:28Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:24:28Joe Rogan?

  Do you know about the Varginia Brazil story? Do you know about the James Fox documentary?

• 1:24:33Speaker 02

  Yeah, James, I'm excited to see James's follow-up.

• 1:24:35Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, he's got a new one.

• 1:24:36Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:24:37Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, he's got a follow-up with, I think it's the actual doctor.

• 1:24:41Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:24:41Joe Rogan?

  That worked with the patient, so.

• 1:24:44Speaker 02

  He was at the hospital that night and interacted with, with the being, yeah. I'm excited to see that.

• 1:24:48Joe Rogan?

  So the story is that this police officer, that they found this crash and the documentary is excellent. If you haven't seen that, folks, it's called Moment of Contact. It's really good. And one of the things that's really good about it is the eyewitnesses. When the eyewitnesses returned to the scene of the crime, I'm like, or excuse me, the scene of the crash. I was like, either that guy is an amazing actor.

• 1:25:09Speaker 02

  No, it's great.

• 1:25:10Joe Rogan?

  Or he's really crying because he's remembering this insane moment in his life.

• 1:25:15Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:25:15Joe Rogan?

  And there was eyewitnesses that saw a live one of these things. And this police officer found one that was injured, carried it, put it in the car, physically carried it. They brought it to a hospital. That hospital told them, we don't know what to do with this. You gotta take it somewhere else. They took it to a second hospital and the second hospital, this is the doctor allegedly that examined it.

• 1:25:34Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:25:35Joe Rogan?

  That police officer had a horrific bacterial infection that they could not cure. And he died within weeks.

• 1:25:42Speaker 02

  It's horrible.

• 1:25:43Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 1:25:44Speaker 02

  It's horrible. There's, there's so many examples of these interactions going bad. But it's also like, you know,

• 1:25:51Speaker 02

  imagine you didn't know what a fighter jet was and there was this, you know, giant flame coming out of the back of it. And you walk behind it, you're gonna be toast, you know? It, it, it's not, I don't think it's an intentional thing. I think it's, we're interacting with a technology we don't understand and.

• 1:26:05Joe Rogan?

  And you're getting too close to it.

• 1:26:06Speaker 02

  Yeah, we're getting too close to it.

• 1:26:07Joe Rogan?

  Don't go walk up to it.

• 1:26:08Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:26:09Joe Rogan?

  If it's floating in the air.

• 1:26:10Speaker 02

  Totally.

• 1:26:11Joe Rogan?

  That means it's got an insane amount of power that's carrying this fucking.

• 1:26:14Speaker 02

  Totally.

• 1:26:14Joe Rogan?

  Two thousand ton thing.

• 1:26:16Speaker 02

  The other crazy story that was in, so James Fox's movie, The Phenomenon, which, you know, he directed it.

• 1:26:22Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 1:26:23Speaker 02

  He's totally responsible for making that movie. I was a producer on it with him, but it's all James. James a hundred percent made that movie.

• 1:26:31Speaker 02

  One of the coolest stories in that film was the aerial school phenomenon story at the end. These kids in Zimbabwe.

• 1:26:38Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 1:26:39Speaker 02

  At a school in like, I think it was eighty-nine or ninety, ninety-one, something like that. Maybe it was ninety-four, around that time. These kids. Like between the ages of like seven and thirteen or something like that. They all saw this this craft come down during their recess and they all say they experienced the same thing. They all saw these beings that looked like they were moving in slow motion around the craft and they saw this craft take off at thousands of miles an hour after. Years later, they're all saying the same thing. The stories didn't change. They didn't try to like, you know, make money off this at all. It's a wild story. But now when you look back at that story through what guys like Cal and Eric are revealing about

• 1:27:22Speaker 02

  the warp bubble, do you know what would make someone look like they're moving slow? If they were inside of a warp bubble next to the craft where time and space is moving differently than outside the craft. That's literally what it would do. For the same reasons why the craft in the bubble could just be cruising along, but to us, it looks like it's going at these impossible speeds. You're in a different spacetime environment. So all these things that people saw at Ariel, you know, in Brazil, they get they get explained by these reveals that are starting to come out now. And that's, to me, that's wild, seeing how these things all connect, you know?

• 1:27:58Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, it is crazy. And it's essentially this description of the way these propulsion systems work is essentially the exact same way Lazar was describing it.

• 1:28:08Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:28:09Joe Rogan?

  Which is really nuts. That in 1989, he was proposing that there's some sort of a gravity-defying device.

• 1:28:16Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:28:16Joe Rogan?

  And that it was using element 115 and then it was radiated and somehow another this is creating this gravity drive that just sends it to wherever it wants to be rather than propels it.

• 1:28:27Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:28:28Joe Rogan?

  The way he described it is like if you took a bowling ball and you put it in a very soft cushion, it would just push through. And then that's what these things do. It just pushes through to wherever it's supposed to be.

• 1:28:38Speaker 02

  Yeah. Similar the other the other explanation is like.

• 1:28:44Speaker 02

  Like a ball rolling downhill.

• 1:28:46Joe Rogan?

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:28:46Speaker 02

  Like a surfboard pointed down, riding a wave.

• 1:28:49Joe Rogan?

  When did they first start to become aware of underwater activity? And when did they first start to suspect that these things were in fact having at least some sort of a base underneath the oceans?

• 1:29:00Speaker 02

  I don't know the exact first, but I do know from people I've talked to that as far back as the 80s.

• 1:29:08Joe Rogan?

  Wow.

• 1:29:08Speaker 02

  Yeah. Which is incredible.

• 1:29:11Joe Rogan?

  Well, the crazy thing is that they've really been studying this stuff and retrieving things like back from Roswell, which was 47. They've really been doing this stuff for that long. It's...

• 1:29:22Joe Rogan?

  It's kind of crazy that they were able to actually keep a lid on it for so long.

• 1:29:27Speaker 02

  I mean, it's not that crazy when your life's being threatened, you know?

• 1:29:31Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 1:29:31Speaker 02

  Like...

• 1:29:34Joe Rogan?

  And it's kind of got a lid on it, right? Kind of, but not really.

• 1:29:38Speaker 02

  I mean, there's been people leaking...

• 1:29:39Joe Rogan?

  Because we all know about Roswell.

• 1:29:40Speaker 02

  Yeah, there's been people leaking over the years, information. But I think now we're at a tipping point where... Like, I really believe the release of this film is the singular tipping point. Where you have this many credible, high-level people saying, yes, this is real. I mean, even Clapper talking, going on the record, saying that UAP activity over Area 51 is real. The biggest conspiracy globally, that there's UFOs over Area 51. That 90% of humanity has written off as bullshit, right?

• 1:30:06Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 1:30:07Speaker 02

  Here's the guy who was Director of National Intelligence and Head of Air Force Intelligence saying, no, that's real. Like, it's like... So, I think this tipping point, Rubio going on the record, second most powerful guy in the world arguably, saying that the presidents are kept out of loop on this and that defense contractors have taken this over. And that even, he even says that every now and then advancements made get slipped into commercialized product that some defense contractors make a bunch of money on for their own best interest, not for the benefit of the nation and national security. Like, these are bombs dropped at the most credible level possible. And I think that because we've had all the leaks over the years, it's gonna resonate with people. People are like, oh shit, all those things that have been slipping out over the years, it's real. And these guys are validating it. And it'll be really interesting to see what's, you know, what's on the other side of that.

• 1:30:52Speaker 02

  And the other wild thing, Joe, is when you go down the rabbit hole of the UAP topic with people in the intelligence community and military, you start learning about adjacent things, you know, that are equally bonkers.

• 1:31:03Speaker 02

  Like remote viewing, which you've talked a lot about, right?

• 1:31:05Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 1:31:06Speaker 02

  You know? I mean, I don't think it's a coincidence that Hal Poudoff, you know, was the guy who created Stargate and ran Stargate, backed by the DOD and the CIA, and also was deeply involved in the UAP topic for decades, you know? There's a lot of overlap. And the remote viewing topic is fascinating. It's another one of those things where you, more you learn about it, and you're like, there is a there there, it's a real situation, and it's extraordinary.

• 1:31:30Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 1:31:30Speaker 02

  Makes you think how much more is, you know, hidden from us that we've...

• 1:31:33Joe Rogan?

  I definitely want to talk about that, but I want to ask you, were there specifics when they talk about technology that was acquired, that was then rolled into...

• 1:31:41Speaker 02

  No. No one, no one, no one said it on the record. I was, I was shocked when, when Rubio said that on camera, when he went there, like, clearly, clearly, clearly stating that, I mean, I think, to word for word, I think he says, "And every now and then, an advancement gets made and gets commercialized, and some company's making a ton of money on it for their own interests."

• 1:32:01Joe Rogan?

  But is there any suspicions when you...

• 1:32:03Speaker 02

  Yeah, no, I've heard, I've heard, I've heard suspicions.

• 1:32:06Joe Rogan?

  Like what?

• 1:32:06Speaker 02

  Like, you know, how it could, has impacted hypersonic missiles, I've heard things about, you know, early days of fiber optics, I've heard things about night vision, but, you know, no one, no one would go on the record, say something definitive. The, the thing people were comfortable saying, and Rubio said, is that defense contractors have been in control of this over the decades, congressional oversight has, Congress has lost congressional oversight, and essentially, these programs are just moving, moving along, and keeping it to themselves. And when you keep something to yourself, it's easy to slip a win into your commercialized side of your business, you know?

• 1:32:45Joe Rogan?

  Right. I would like to know what that is, though.

• 1:32:47Speaker 02

  Me too.

• 1:32:48Joe Rogan?

  That would be really interesting. Do you know the...

• 1:32:50Speaker 02

  And who knows, by the way, if it's even public? It might be something that they made...

• 1:32:53Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 1:32:54Speaker 02

  That isn't public, that they're using to get bigger contracts...

• 1:32:58Joe Rogan?

  Right, right.

• 1:32:59Speaker 02

  In exchange for shutting up about it.

• 1:33:00Joe Rogan?

  Ah, right, of course. Why wouldn't you? Let's go deep. Put that fucking chint- chintefoil hat on, securely. Do you know about the conspiracy about Bell Laboratory?

• 1:33:12Speaker 02

  Yeah, I've heard, I've heard, I've heard a lot about that. You, you, um, the, the tinfoil hat thing is a good reminder. That has been, that, the, one of the things I learned is that the stigma around this was created by the people covering this up. So.

• 1:33:26Joe Rogan?

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:33:27Speaker 02

  In the early 50s, late 40s, the CIA, when they took control of this, they were like, we gotta make sure people don't ask about this. How do we do that? It's just psychological, psychological operation, like, make people think they're crazy, make people think they're a wacko, make tinfoil hat jokes. And then that gets, you know, built into our culture and different generations grow up thinking, oh, you're a nut if you talk about this, it'd be embarrassing, you're gonna have your career ruined. And now here we are, where, like, you know, people giggle when you bring up this serious issue, right? And, and.

• 1:33:54Joe Rogan?

  Still.

• 1:33:55Speaker 02

  Yeah, and it's been used against people inside a government, so here's, here's a good story. This is, uh,

• 1:34:02Speaker 02

  yeah, I'll, I'll just tell you, so, so Jay, Jay Stratton told me about an event that happened on the military base that is Top Gun, the Top Gun base, where a craft came down. I don't know the exact, how high, exactly how high it was, whether it was in the air or in space, but came down from very high, dropped to above the tarmac in front of the base commander and his number two. And they documented it with video recording. And this was when Jay was running the UAP task force. And they reached out to him and saying they wanted to report this. And Jay went, Jay went and talked to them in person and they were gonna do an, these are super, super senior guys that were gonna do an official, on the record, um, testimony about what they saw with their own eyes.

• 1:34:44Speaker 02

  And Jay told a senior guy in naval intelligence, who he thought was on the right side of history. And before these guys could come in and testify, the naval intelligence official, who was actually part of the cover-up, sent these guys tinfoil hats and told them that's what they'd be wearing the rest of their lives if they spoke up.

• 1:35:05Joe Rogan?

  Wow.

• 1:35:05Speaker 02

  And the guys reached out to Jay and said, we're not providing the evidence, we're not gonna talk about this, let's pretend it never happened. So, you know, that kinda stuff really holds back because it's very easy to deter a military, somebody's put their, devoted their whole life to them, to climbing the ladder in the, in the military.

• 1:35:24Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 1:35:25Speaker 02

  And you're gonna tell them that you could just end their career path in an instant? Why would they keep going forward?

• 1:35:31Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, why would they?

• 1:35:32Speaker 02

  Makes no sense.

• 1:35:33Joe Rogan?

  I wouldn't.

• 1:35:34Speaker 04

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• 1:36:05Joe Rogan?

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• 1:37:14Joe Rogan?

  That's what a lot of these guys wind up doing. They retire, and then they start talking.

• 1:37:19Speaker 02

  I do think that we're gonna see more people come out. I really, I've already started, I've started receiving, since the trailers have been out there, I've started receiving incoming DMs on social media sites from super senior people, where like, I look up who they are, and I'm like, holy shit, you know? And they're like, hey, we should talk in person sometime, there's some things I want to share.

• 1:37:38Joe Rogan?

  Whoa.

• 1:37:38Speaker 02

  And I don't know what's gonna come out of that. I haven't, I haven't done those, those, those meetings yet, but I imagine people are gonna come out of the woodwork, because this stuff is real, and it's been hidden so much. And I know there's some big people coming out next year. Stratton's book is gonna be a big thing, too. I've actually, I've been, I've been working with him on it, developing his book. And it's gonna come out in the spring. Harper Collins is publishing it. And it's, it's fucking bombshell. It's bonkers.

• 1:38:06Joe Rogan?

  Wow.

• 1:38:06Speaker 02

  So much detail. One of the other things that I didn't include in the film, Joe, that's,

• 1:38:13Speaker 02

  I mean, it's, it's, it's bonkers to think about. All of the intelligence officials who actually investigated this for the government, like, the people involved in OSAP and ATIP and UAP Task Force, they all started having activity at their homes when they were investigating non-human intelligent life.

• 1:38:31Joe Rogan?

  What kind of activity?

• 1:38:33Speaker 02

  Orbs in their houses. Orbs interacting with their family, causing medical issues for family members, ending up in the, family members ending up in the hospital due to orb activity.

• 1:38:43Joe Rogan?

  What, what issues due to orb, orb activity?

• 1:38:46Speaker 02

  One of the senior intelligence officials that I spoke to, and I'll let him tell his own story when he's ready, but his son got extremely impacted by an orb, black and blue over his whole body, had to go to the hospital. Looked, looked like someone took a bat to his chest.

• 1:39:06Speaker 02

  I didn't include this in the film, this section, because I feel like when you get into the stuff happening in people's houses, I think it's a bridge too far for a lot of people. And you gotta, like, set the table with the base facts first, which is what my film does. And then they can open their minds to these other things. But what I found really interesting is when I would do these interviews with people and they would all talk about this activity they started having at their houses that in some cases caused medical issues. It was all after they started looking into non-human intelligent life. And their takeaway was that non-human intelligent life was looking into them because they were looking into non-human intelligent life. And they made the analogy of if a Russian spy comes to DC to spy on Congress, our intelligence community spies on the Russian spy. And so that was their outlook.

• 1:39:51Speaker 02

  And I thought that was... It's really interesting and uh almost implies like a a human level of thinking, you know?

• 1:40:01Joe Rogan?

  Or maybe some attempt to make contact.

• 1:40:03Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:40:04Joe Rogan?

  You know, there was a guy that I interviewed at Skinwalker Ranch, who lived outside of the ranch, who had an orb experience. And I talked to a few people there that were clearly out of their fucking mind and maybe on meth. But a few people that seemed pretty credible, and this guy was the most. Just a regular guy with a regular job, interesting guy, cool to talk to.

• 1:40:28Joe Rogan?

  He said that he's had a few weird sightings, but the the weirdest one was one day in his home, this orb that was like a larger than a softball, he said. But came flying into his house and was in the living room with him and it was interacting with him. And then it flew down the hallway and flew right through the walls. It disappeared, but he said it interacted with him. Like it was in front of him, like letting him know that it's there.

• 1:40:56Speaker 02

  Almost, some people say almost in a playful way.

• 1:40:58Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 1:41:00Speaker 02

  And I've heard about this orb activity in intelligence officials' houses, like more times than I can remember, countless times. And the journey of this movie, I not only got to know a lot of these intelligence officials very well, but like went and spent time with their wives, with their kids, with them together. And when you see like a wife completing a husband's sentence, like they're telling you what they experienced together, it's bonkers, man. It's wild, it's like, holy shit, this happened, you know? And then we, when you hear their kids talk about it separately and you're like, that's literally word for word. What, like you guys are all, you experienced the same thing, you have these different POVs.

• 1:41:32Joe Rogan?

  It's not like the family got together with a coordinated lie.

• 1:41:35Speaker 02

  Doesn't feel like that.

• 1:41:36Joe Rogan?

  Trick the kids into doing it, that seems...

• 1:41:38Speaker 02

  Well, that seems a little over the top, because like to what end, right? I didn't even, it's not like I put it in the movie, you know?

• 1:41:44Speaker 02

  But it's, it's, it's really fascinating and the orb activity, um, who knows what it is, man? It could be, it could be another form of the warping of space-time to look like Zaria. Like, once you do that...

• 1:42:01Speaker 02

  Time and space is different in that bubble, so that could be a much bigger craft inside of a energy ball that we see. We might just, this might be what we see is the orb, right? It might be a transportation device, there might be a being in there. And this is just what we're seeing is what's on the outside of this warping of spacetime.

• 1:42:17Joe Rogan?

  Well, that's another thing that one of the eyewitnesses described that was very weird, was a craft that was small, but then when they got inside of it, it was the size of a football field.

• 1:42:27Speaker 02

  Yeah, so that, that also goes with the warping of spacetime. Yeah. Hal says in the film, this was something I was shocked that Hal said, I was really shocked, he says, "The warping of spacetime in the bubble explains a lot of things that, at this point, haven't made sense to us." And he says, like, for example, when a military serviceman goes onto a craft that looks like it's, you know, 40 feet, and then when he goes inside, it looks like it's the size of a football field. That makes sense now, because from outside the bubble, it's one thing, and inside the bubble, it's something else.

• 1:43:01Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 1:43:02Speaker 02

  And, um, that's wild. Yeah, and I've heard that story a number of times from people who have never talked to each other.

• 1:43:08Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, it's like, we have this very simple understanding of objects, and of space, and the ability to move around in them. And this kind of spectacular technology, I think we kind of have to think about it just like all other spectacular technology. Like, if you were around in the 1400s, you couldn't possibly imagine the concept of a nuclear bomb. It would be impossible. Or nuclear energy, or even a cellphone.

• 1:43:35Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:43:36Joe Rogan?

  Now, imagine new breakthroughs happen, and now this bubble gets created, and we start to figure out how to send things to places through these bubbles, and then we realize that what's happening in these bubbles is not what you see on the outside, that it's completely warping, which is also one of the weird questions, like, why are UFOs so blurry?

• 1:43:58Speaker 02

  That answers that question.

• 1:44:00Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 1:44:01Speaker 02

  Because, you know, Hal says it, and I, and I loved when he revealed this, because like, huh, it just checks the box, makes sense. People have trouble taking photos of UAP because they're literally taking a photo through a space. A space-time bubble, basically.

• 1:44:12Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 1:44:13Speaker 02

  The warping of space-time. So the analogy would be like, you know, if you go under the ocean, you take a picture of a fish, you're gonna get better visibility, you're in their domain, right?

• 1:44:22Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 1:44:22Speaker 02

  You're in their environment, right? But if you go above the ocean, right? You're now in a different environment, and you try taking a photo from above the water, it's gonna be all distorted and wacky looking.

• 1:44:33Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 1:44:33Speaker 02

  Because you're taking a photo through a barrier, another environment, right?

• 1:44:38Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 1:44:39Speaker 02

  It's the same basic logic. Like, try taking a picture of koi fish from above the water, you can't do it, right?

• 1:44:44Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 1:44:44Speaker 02

  And so, that's just the simplest answer, like, that's what they're doing. They are warping space-time in a localized area, they're creating a barrier between our environment and their environment, and when you try to take a photo through it, it's not great. It's also the reason why radar has trouble getting these things. Because the radar detector, a radar detector, the way it works is radar is emitted towards an object, it bounces back to the radar detector, and that's how you track where it is, right? But the radar is just going around the bubble. And it's not going back to the radar detector. Because it's just going around the bubble.

• 1:45:18Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 1:45:19Speaker 02

  It's a different environment, right?

• 1:45:20Joe Rogan?

  And supposedly, we can do that now?

• 1:45:22Speaker 02

  Well, the interview subjects clearly imply that some of the, not imply, they state that some of the UAP we're seeing might be our reverse engineered technology.

• 1:45:33Joe Rogan?

  Might be. And is there, is there any theories about other potential methods of propulsion, rather than just this bubble? Is anything done in a more traditional way, or like, is there levels of these things? Like, when it comes to the technological abilities?

• 1:45:51Speaker 02

  Not that I've heard. Everyone I interviewed that was willing to talk about the technology was convinced this is what they were doing.

• 1:45:57Joe Rogan?

  That they're all doing a very similar thing?

• 1:45:58Speaker 02

  And it was a unifying, and it was a unifying theory, it explains everything we've ever observed. Like, all the, the, the, all the performance characteristics we've observed UAP displaying.

• 1:46:09Joe Rogan?

  And so, the theory is that all of these advanced beings, from wherever they're from, the various different species of them, that all of them have this particular type of technology?

• 1:46:21Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:46:22Joe Rogan?

  Huh.

• 1:46:23Speaker 02

  Which if it's the key to interstellar travel, then.

• 1:46:25Joe Rogan?

  Kind of makes sense, but it's like, are they all figuring out, are they getting it from each other? Like, is this just a natural pathway to curious, intelligent, innovative creatures? That they ultimately eventually stumble upon this technology?

• 1:46:39Speaker 02

  Well, one of the, one of the things shared, shared that I, I found fascinating was this idea that some of the craft that we've recovered and adversarial nations have recovered

• 1:46:50Speaker 02

  weren't crash crafts and weren't crafts that they caused to crash. They were crafts that just appeared outside a military base, almost like a gift.

• 1:46:57Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, Diana Pasulka discusses them as donations.

• 1:47:01Speaker 02

  So gifts, donations, but the, the, the thought, if you, if, okay, so if you try to explain that, why would anyone do that? Maybe some more advanced species is trying to help advance us and try to like put a carrot on a stick.

• 1:47:12Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 1:47:12Speaker 02

  Maybe it's, you know, survival of the fittest for the nations of, of, of Earth, you know? Maybe it's a big IQ test, who knows what it is? But that's an interesting scenario and seems intentional from whoever put it there.

• 1:47:25Joe Rogan?

  Well, it would make sense if they were trying to help, that that would be like the least intrusive way. Instead of like coming down, hello, let me show you how to do this. Instead of doing that, just like, hey, figure this out, stupid. Get all your brightest people and at the very least, you'll figure something out.

• 1:47:40Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:47:40Joe Rogan?

  And maybe that's what they're saying, that these things have gone into some sort of a commercial application. That they figure, I just want to know what those things are.

• 1:47:47Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:47:48Joe Rogan?

  Because this was the thing that I was getting at with Bell Laboratory. So Bell, uh, Bell Labs was, this is the, the conspiracy theory is that some of the material that was retrieved from Roswell was then transported to Bell Labs for some sort of a back engineering program. And that there's a reason why there was a military base right outside of Bell Labs. And the idea was that military base is supposed to be guarding New York City. But the New York City is like, kind of far away. Like, you'd want to be a little closer if you're guarding New York City. And it's much more likely that it was actually just guarding this laboratory. And that, um, there was a company called the American Computer Company. And the American Computer Company, are they still around? See if they still have this page, so very wacky page.

• 1:48:34Joe Rogan?

  So, they would just made, they made made to order computers, like you would call it up, I wanna, you know, whatever, five gigahertz Intel processor, blah blah blah, and they would do it all for you, I want a two terabyte hard drive, they would, they would set it all up for you and send it to you, and then they had a whole section of their website that was dedicated to back engineering technology from Bell Labs and how it all happened. And they were talking about the, the invention of fiber optics and also the transistor, that these things had come specifically from the discoveries that they had made from the back engineering of a craft that was down at Roswell.

• 1:49:15Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:49:16Joe Rogan?

  Which was also, by the way, Roswell was a site of a lot of nuclear testing.

• 1:49:19Speaker 02

  Yeah, I was told that, you know, people say in the film that Roswell did in fact happen, there was a crash, four non-human bodies were in the craft and recovered, and the technology, the craft materials and the bodies were sent to Wright-Patt Air Force Base.

• 1:49:35Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 1:49:36Speaker 02

  In Ohio, which is very close to Patel, right? And, and, and then, maybe that's the reason why Bell Labs is near a military base, maybe it's more about proximity to a base that can have recovery teams quickly deployed, come back with materials, and then get them to a facility close by without the need for, you know, moving them across the country.

• 1:50:01Joe Rogan?

  And that would also, if it was true, would also be one of the first examples of this coordination between government and defense contractors, government and scientists that were commercially working.

• 1:50:13Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:50:13Joe Rogan?

  And that they somehow or another arranged to get these brightest minds to, hey, what's this, how's this work? Is that computer company still around?

• 1:50:29Joe Rogan?

  Another story about the Bell Labs story?

• 1:50:30Speaker 03

  They say a letter from the guy that says he's the head of American Computer Company.

• 1:50:35Joe Rogan?

  What is he saying?

• 1:50:36Speaker 03

  I just, I just found it as you asked the question. Trying to see why this was relevant.

• 1:50:41Joe Rogan?

  This was like back, I want to say it might have been like the 90s? Late 90s or early 2000s when I first started going online. And I found out about him because, you know, I used to make my own computers back then. So I'd go and get a motherboard and hard drive and I'd do all that stuff.

• 1:50:57Speaker 03

  That's cool.

• 1:50:58Joe Rogan?

  It was fun. For gaming, it was really fun because you could like set it up with like powerful video cards and everything like that. Um, but there was a bunch of companies that would sell like really high end, put together computers. So you didn't have to go through all that work. And, uh, so I was just looking at companies that made computers. Made to order Windows computers and I found them and I was like, what? What the fuck is this? Do they still have that up?

• 1:51:21Speaker 03

  That's wild. I, that I don't know. I started to try to find it. I thought I found it.

• 1:51:27Joe Rogan?

  What about, uh, the Wayback Machine?

• 1:51:29Speaker 03

  Well, this article that I found that says it's extracted from Nexus Magazine, 1999.

• 1:51:37Speaker 02

  You know, the thing about, when you think about what could be reverse engineered.

• 1:51:40Joe Rogan?

  Hold on, what is he?

• 1:51:41Speaker 03

  He says everything he talked about.

• 1:51:42Joe Rogan?

  Yeah? Can you see it?

• 1:51:44Speaker 03

  It's just a very, it's very long. It's all written, but it, it talks about Alien Craft.

• 1:51:51Joe Rogan?

  Yeah. Okay. So it said, so now not only do we have a picture of the alleged Alien Craft on our website, talking about alien technologies being transferred to AT, AT&T, but we're also in possession of a very high level, level five, top secret, security clearance, military faxes describing something called Sky Station. What?

• 1:52:12Speaker 03

  Here it says like, we try to be cute. We try to put up a picture. If you go to our website, it's still there. Here's our website. Bottom of the page is a nav bar pointer.

• 1:52:19Joe Rogan?

  Is that website still up?

• 1:52:20Speaker 03

  I'll click on it.

• 1:52:21Joe Rogan?

  Click on it. We'll see what we got here.

• 1:52:25Speaker 03

  Just in case I'm weird.

• 1:52:26Joe Rogan?

  Nope.

• 1:52:27Speaker 03

  That's always not the exact.

• 1:52:29Joe Rogan?

  That's gone, son.

• 1:52:30Speaker 03

  It's a website.

• 1:52:32Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, but that's a bullshit website. That's not the American Computer Company website, is it? No, that's just like, American Priority Payment Systems, what is this?

• 1:52:41Speaker 03

  Who bought them, do you know?

• 1:52:43Joe Rogan?

  Mm-hmm, probably the fucking government, man.

• 1:52:46Speaker 03

  But if this is talking about everything you just said, although that's what I was trying to figure out where, what this is. It's a website's, I don't know, reverse engineering, Roswell UFO technology.

• 1:52:59Joe Rogan?

  Look at this, it says here, "The symbol for the transistor is made up of three pieces, positive, positive, and negative, or negative, negative, and positive. Silicon dioxide doped with arsenic and boron in 1947. Now, 1947 doping things with boron was not easy. It required the sort of equipment that even Bell Labs in 1946 did not possess. They, they had this type of equipment at Lawrence Berkeley Laboratories, but it would have taken thousands and thousands and thousands of man-hours to invent the transistor. If you look back at it historically, what AT&T was claiming was that one day this genius, William Shockley,

• 1:53:37Joe Rogan?

  working with a rectifier, he locked, looked at it and noticed that it had unusual propensities, and there bingo, he invented the transistor. He figured it out right there. And to verify that, the two other geniuses that they got to help work with him on the transistor, Dr. Barden and Dr. Bratton, Brett, Bretain, Bretain? Both said, "Oh yeah, I remember the guy by his name, by the name of the case, was allegedly talking about transistors in 1931, and I knew back then we were going to have them." Said that, that is the history of the transistor at AT&T prior to 1948, other than claiming it was invented in December of 1947 by Dr. Shockley.

• 1:54:23Joe Rogan?

  Anybody believe that story? Me neither. And I knew because the administrative head of the transistor project was Jack Morton, the man at whose house I was staying. To go to school and whose sons I was friends with. And he often commented on the fact that it was really a shame that those three idiots got responsibility for the transistor and he didn't. And I always wondered, because he too didn't possess the scientific ability to develop the transistor. He was a brilliant man who had invented the radio broadcast vacuum tube, the closed space triode, but it appeared that he was brought in to head up the project to try to

• 1:55:03Joe Rogan?

  draw back the transistor in time to radio tubes and the image that Shockley talked about. And it was as if the whole thing was just a ploy and he might as easily have been given responsibility and gotten the Nobel Prize as Bill Shockley. Professional jealousy, it says, question mark. Wow. Yeah, so there's questions about the invention of the transistor according to these guys. But it's also fiber optics and it's the things that, what they're saying is that these things kind of came out of nowhere.

• 1:55:36Speaker 02

  Came out of nowhere, yeah. It's hard not to line it up, you know?

• 1:55:40Joe Rogan?

  Yeah. Well, it certainly lines up time-wise.

• 1:55:42Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:55:43Joe Rogan?

  With the Roswell crash.

• 1:55:45Speaker 02

  And, and, and, you know, the labs working on these things being close proximity to bases that are known for recoveries and reverse engineering. Around Roswell, the engineers, the Army Air Corps engineers that were based at, right, Pat, were literally the expert reverse engineers of the Army Air Corps. Like, that's, that's who was based there.

• 1:56:04Joe Rogan?

  That's so crazy.

• 1:56:05Speaker 02

  Yeah, and people, people forget, at the time, it was the Army Air Corps at Roswell, you know?

• 1:56:09Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 1:56:10Speaker 02

  And the, yeah, I mean, the, the dots all line up, you know? The other thing to think about with, with what technology has been cracked is, just because we haven't seen it yet, doesn't mean that it cracked it. Like, typically, you know, if you just look at like, you know, aerospace, like fighter jets and stuff, our black projects are like 30 years out.

• 1:56:27Joe Rogan?

  Right, right.

• 1:56:29Speaker 02

  So. They might have come up with something truly extraordinary.

• 1:56:34Joe Rogan?

  Is it 30 years out?

• 1:56:35Speaker 02

  That 10 people know about.

• 1:56:35Joe Rogan?

  Thinking about it in like 1990 and 2000 times, or is it 30 years out now? Because technology is obviously moving at an exponential pace.

• 1:56:44Speaker 02

  I mean.

• 1:56:45Joe Rogan?

  It's still, is it really still, because thirty years from now, I feel like we have a digital god.

• 1:56:49Speaker 02

  Yeah, no, it's.

• 1:56:50Joe Rogan?

  I can't believe that they're thirty years out.

• 1:56:52Speaker 02

  It's, it's, it's, it's thirty, for sure.

• 1:56:54Joe Rogan?

  Really?

• 1:56:54Speaker 02

  Yeah, and most, multiple intelligence officials have told me, even the people who are not dealing with UAP, they're just working at like Defense Intelligence Agency, they're like aerospace experts. They're looking at our, they have to be aware of our black projects that are thirty years out, and adversary's projects that are thirty years out. And, I mean, that stuff's wild. I, I talked to a very senior intelligence official who is in his eighties, who in the seventies, mid seventies, was working on quantum entanglement for the CIA.

• 1:57:24Joe Rogan?

  What?

• 1:57:24Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:57:26Joe Rogan?

  So.

• 1:57:27Speaker 02

  No one heard about quantum entanglement, I think, until like fifteen years ago.

• 1:57:29Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, so how was he working on quantum entanglement?

• 1:57:32Speaker 02

  Didn't get in, didn't get into details. That was, that was the headline I got, and it's a super serious guy. But that was the headline I got. He was doing, he was doing fringe, fringe science work, dealing with quantum entanglement for the CIA and the DOD in the mid seventies.

• 1:57:46Joe Rogan?

  And quantum entanglement as, for what, under what end? As a method of distribution of information?

• 1:57:53Speaker 02

  Unclear, unclear. I wouldn't want to, yeah, wouldn't want to assume, but just, that was the headline. And that's the, it was said to me in the context of,

• 1:58:04Speaker 02

  when the public hears about something existing, it's, it's long after it's existed, in terms of black product science.

• 1:58:11Joe Rogan?

  I'm sure.

• 1:58:11Speaker 02

  And, and, so it just makes you think, like, you know, if, if things have come off the back of this technology, and some of it has been commercialized, actually like put into like what, hypersonic missiles, or whatever it is, transistor radio, whatever, what hasn't? You know, what's just been kept in a, in a box?

• 1:58:25Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 1:58:28Speaker 02

  It's pretty wild to think about. But the reality is, I, I, I mean, all of that leads me to just, I really feel like if we get into this air of transparency, and everyone knows it's real, and all scientists know it's a valid area of inquiry, and all the bright young minds out there that are in high school or college right now know this is something they can put their brain power towards, there's so much amazing stuff could come out of it.

• 1:58:46Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 1:58:47Speaker 02

  Like, think about the space race. Thirty-five thousand inventions, they say, came out of the space race. Like Velcro and a bunch of other stuff.

• 1:58:52Joe Rogan?

  Right, right. I think the fear would be that the openness would also lead to espionage. You know, because we already have a problem with that. We already have a problem with agents of the CCP that infiltrate technology companies and get busted and it happens at universities. It's an issue, you know, and if it was open transparency and they were just bringing in all the brightest minds like, you know.

• 1:59:17Speaker 02

  Maybe, but maybe it's like the amnesty thing. Maybe it just needs to happen for the for the greater good.

• 1:59:21Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, that's the question. Like if they're both, if both the United States and China are literally on the brink, maybe it's a conversation that needs to be had for the greater good of humanity.

• 1:59:30Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:59:31Joe Rogan?

  You know, that this, this notion that we are the only intelligent life that we've so far observed in the universe is a lie.

• 1:59:39Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:59:40Joe Rogan?

  And that whether, where they come from, whether they're interdimensional, or whether they're interstellar, or whatever they are, there's something other than us that's more advanced than us.

• 1:59:49Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:59:49Joe Rogan?

  That can do things that we can't do and that we've learned from them.

• 1:59:53Speaker 02

  Yeah, and despite our differences, we have a lot in common in this situation.

• 1:59:57Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 1:59:57Speaker 02

  And that we're all in it together.

• 1:59:58Joe Rogan?

  That's the Reagan speech.

• 1:59:59Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:00:00Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, that famous Reagan speech at the UN.

• 2:00:03Speaker 02

  The two famous president's speeches that I now look through, you know, I look at in completely different ways. Reagan's speech at the United Nations where he says, I often think, you know, despite our differences, what will unite us is a threat from outside this planet.

• 2:00:15Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 2:00:15Speaker 02

  You know, that brought us all together and remind us of our common bonds as humans, you know. But the other speech, well, first of all, that one, why do you often think that, Ronald Reagan?

• 2:00:22Joe Rogan?

  Right. Why is Reagan saying that?

• 2:00:24Speaker 02

  You're the president, why are you often thinking this?

• 2:00:26Joe Rogan?

  Gave so many people hope, so many dorks like me, like, yeah, maybe, really.

• 2:00:30Speaker 02

  Well, the other one is the Eisenhower speech about the military industrial complex.

• 2:00:33Joe Rogan?

  Yes.

• 2:00:34Speaker 02

  Where he warned us.

• 2:00:35Joe Rogan?

  Mm hmm.

• 2:00:36Speaker 02

  And he warned us at a time where we now know the legacy program was already getting very powerful and empowering defense contractors.

• 2:00:44Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 2:00:45Speaker 02

  To reverse engineer this technology. And he warns, he says, very, very, very. Clearly that the ability exists and will persist for unchecked power that would threaten our democratic process and get us basically saying well guess who plays for the contractors are going to have more power than Congress and here we are in 2025 with leaders in Congress and our Secretary of State saying that's literally what happened that's literally the situation right now the president is out of the mix Congress is out of the mix the people are the mix and military contractors the military industrial complex is in control has unchecked power and just waits out sitting presidents it's wild to listen to his his full speech through that context and know that that's what he was talking about.

• 2:01:27Joe Rogan?

  And it came to fruit.

• 2:01:28Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:01:29Joe Rogan?

  Yeah and it's 80 years later we're like oh he was right and the thing is that speech was he did that live on the air to the world and people didn't really get a chance to watch it until the internet because most people you'd have to read about it or you'd have to go somewhere and find some 35 millimeter footage and and strap it on to a you know projector and go watch him say that most people never saw it you didn't see it until the internet came around and then people had encoded it and turned it into YouTube videos.

• 2:02:00Speaker 02

  Super powerful speech there's a third one that I looked through a different lens now which is not long before he was killed Kennedy gave a speech about how secrecy is repugnant.

• 2:02:12Joe Rogan?

  Yeah secret societies yes.

• 2:02:14Speaker 02

  Are and he said are repugnant in a free society and they challenge our democratic way of life and we shouldn't allow it.

• 2:02:20Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 2:02:21Speaker 02

  You know.

• 2:02:22Joe Rogan?

  Look where that got him.

• 2:02:23Speaker 02

  Exactly.

• 2:02:24Joe Rogan?

  Yeah he was literally taking on secret societies yeah I mean he wanted to disband the CIA he wanted there was he had a lot of ideas.

• 2:02:33Speaker 02

  Yeah yeah I look I I hope that people involved at like the CIA or at these defense contractors realize like you said they have a moment here to be the heroes of the story.

• 2:02:43Joe Rogan?

  Yes.

• 2:02:44Speaker 02

  And to spin it and just say hey we were taken on a job that no one else knew existed we were doing the best we could we thought we made good decisions. Like any war, there's casualties of war, right? But our intention was to do the best for the United States. And we want to come out and tell everyone what we've learned in a safe way, where we can share some information, educate the base, you know, the public with the base facts, and then keep the rest classified for national security reasons. They would, these people would all just be, you know,

• 2:03:13Joe Rogan?

  Heroes.

• 2:03:14Speaker 02

  Heroes, they'd be, they'd go down in history.

• 2:03:16Joe Rogan?

  We would be stunned, though. I mean, the United States, we, I think if the full extent, if these people are telling the truth, the full extent of this cover-up was ever revealed, we would probably be baffled. Like, wow. Like, they lied for so long. They covered up so much. And then there would be the anger at the misappropriation of funds and a lot of finger pointing. And then there would be the very real problem of defense contractors getting access to back-engineered equipment where other defense contractors were not. So they would have an unfair advantage competitively.

• 2:03:49Speaker 02

  Yeah. I mean, look, a bunch of defense contractors went out of business over the years. You'd also have to, you know, look back at some of the older defense contractors that were given materials in the 40s and 50s and then got acquired by Lockheed or Northrop. You know, Lockheed and Northrop bought all of the smaller defense contractors.

• 2:04:07Joe Rogan?

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• 2:04:52Joe Rogan?

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• 2:05:34Speaker 02

  Has that have been involved with this over the years?

• 2:05:37Joe Rogan?

  Really?

• 2:05:37Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, a bunch of them.

• 2:05:39Joe Rogan?

  So those are the big ones?

• 2:05:40Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:05:40Joe Rogan?

  Lockheed and Northrop?

• 2:05:42Speaker 02

  Northrop, Raytheon, and...

• 2:05:45Joe Rogan?

  So didn't they all have access?

• 2:05:47Speaker 02

  Yeah, elements of them. I mean, you can't look at, just like you can't look at the government as all one big entity. You can't look at like, it's not like everybody at Lockheed Martin knows about the non-human technology, right? But there are people that are in control of that situation. And this comes from multiple people I interviewed in my film. They all said the exact same names.

• 2:06:08Joe Rogan?

  Jeez.

• 2:06:09Speaker 02

  Yeah, no, it's fascinating. The, um, how, did you ever go down, how much of a rabbit hole have you gone down on the remote viewing stuff?

• 2:06:17Joe Rogan?

  I've gone down a few rabbit holes, yeah. It's fascinating what they have actually been able to do with it. The HAL put-off story, but the crashed Soviet craft that they found, that this remote viewer guy found, like, within a three-mile radius, located it exactly.

• 2:06:33Speaker 02

  Jimmy Carter put a statement out about it.

• 2:06:34Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 2:06:35Speaker 02

  There's audio of Jimmy Carter telling that story.

• 2:06:37Joe Rogan?

  See if we can find that.

• 2:06:38Speaker 02

  It's wild, man.

• 2:06:40Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, we'll try to find that, because that is pretty crazy.

• 2:06:42Speaker 02

  The other, the thing that I find the most fascinating about it, aside from just like, it's real, is the connection with UAP. And there are people who have had UAP encounters and then end up with these abilities for remote view. And that is, that as well, it's like, so it's a biological effect of, of an encounter.

• 2:07:04Joe Rogan?

  Hmm.

• 2:07:05Speaker 02

  Yeah, there's a big book that, um, I've been a part of developing that's going to come out next year. It's a memoir. It's been publicized a little bit under a pseudonym. It's Scott Andrews is the name, but that's not his real name. He was a intelligence official who, as a kid, had a UAP encounter. And then, late in life, had a, had a, had a, had a medical issue that no one could explain. And then they found that he had these like amoebas in his body that should have killed him. Like, there was no reason why he should be alive. And he had an immediate brain surgery. And after he had the brain surgery, when he was healing, certain memories started to come back. And all of a sudden, he was able to remote view. And he didn't understand what he was doing.

• 2:07:49Speaker 02

  He talked to some other intelligence officials who told him, what you're doing is called remote viewing. People are trained to do that. But he was doing it like he had done it before. Like Jason Bourne, like, you know, these skills are coming back, right? And around that time, he found, when he was healing, he's out of the hospital, he found a locked file cabinet in his father's office. His father had passed away. In the cabinet was a bunch of files about his life, organized by the year. And amongst the files were his enlistment paperwork in the US Air Force as a child, like 12 or 13 years old, which is not legal. What? And then his honorable discharge at 18. And the service code was Space Intelligence Communications. And the base was the old Space Force base, like, straight up real documents.

• 2:08:32Speaker 02

  And then he went to his mother, who was still alive, and said, "Do you know anything about this?" And she said, "I don't know anything about it." But she's like, "Do you remember when you were a kid and you saw that UFO?" And he didn't really remember. She starts jogging his memory. She said, "You saw this UFO come out of this, this lake, either a lake or a pond." And he's like, "I do, now I do remember it." She's, "Remember, you ran home and you told me and Dad?" And, and she said, "All I know is the next day, like, those men from the Air Force came to talk to you with your dad. And then I never heard anything else about it." And so, where this story goes is... Unpacking this connection between UAP encounters and, you know, while there's some biological effects that are bad, there are some that are also like, if you call it a gift, I don't know if you'd call it a gift or a curse, but like-

• 2:09:15Joe Rogan?

  Unlocking your potential, perhaps.

• 2:09:17Speaker 02

  Unlocking your potential is a great way to put it, yeah. And then the Air Force being, the story also unveils how in, on top of it, the Air Force is. So they went and recruited this young kid and his father to become part of a secret program, where we still don't know exactly what he did, but he was used for this ability, and the service code was Space Intelligence Communications. And it's a wild story, there's a lot more to it, I could talk to you about it for like four hours, but it's one of the most mind-blowing stories ever. This specific person is extremely high-ranking. Like, his resume reads like a movie character. It's like, it's bonkers. He's like, you know, at one point, he was running like, I don't remember the exact title,

• 2:10:00Speaker 02

  but essentially, he was like, running counterterrorism for North America. He's like a really high-level dude. And he ended up getting, because of his stature in the intelligence community, he ended up getting help from people in the Department of Defense to piece together this hidden past he has. And he actually is in the process of getting approved for anonymous health injury status from the Secretary of Defense.

• 2:10:26Joe Rogan?

  So, this program that he was involved in as a child, does he have any recollection?

• 2:10:31Speaker 02

  No recollection. His wife is, was like a gumshoe detective about it. She starts calling, they see in the files, there was records of days of school he missed, excused absences, for huge periods of time. I don't remember exactly whether it was weeks or months, but it was huge periods of time. So his wife calls the school and starts digging and asks, you know, "What was your policy back then? Like, would someone have had to repeat a grade if they missed this much time?" And they said, "Absolutely. Unless you had a really good reason, or some sort of like, serious medical excuse, like, you would have been held back." He was never held back. He has no memory of missing all these days of school. His friends that he grew up with don't remember it, but there's all this documentation on it.

• 2:11:15Joe Rogan?

  His friends don't remember him not being at school?

• 2:11:16Speaker 02

  No.

• 2:11:17Joe Rogan?

  That seems weird, right?

• 2:11:18Speaker 02

  They inquired, yeah, totally weird, totally weird, totally weird.

• 2:11:21Joe Rogan?

  So, has he undergone hypnotic regression?

• 2:11:25Speaker 02

  He hasn't done that. He's been dealing with a lot of serious medical issues, like, very serious, like, almost dying multiple times from a lot of these, um...

• 2:11:37Speaker 02

  The correct word, by the way, is parasites. I think I said amoebas. Parasites. He had parasites in his body that almost killed him multiple times.

• 2:11:44Joe Rogan?

  What kind of parasites?

• 2:11:45Speaker 02

  There were seven different parasites that he and his doctor said, his doctor told him, would have killed him within a month. I don't remember the exact names. I wouldn't pretend to be a, you know, medical scientist or anything like that.

• 2:11:56Joe Rogan?

  Does he have any suspicions as to how he acquired these parasites?

• 2:11:59Speaker 02

  Yeah, he thinks that whatever program he was involved with did bizarre experiments. That's what he thinks. And he thinks that he was supposed to not remember any of this, and when the parasite issues caused brain surgery, the memories came back.

• 2:12:16Joe Rogan?

  Geez.

• 2:12:17Speaker 02

  Yeah, and he ended up, there's a lot more to the story. After he started socializing, what he was experiencing, there were multiple attempts on his life that have been documented and investigated by real intelligence agencies. He's like a serious dude, and he's doing his tell-all memoir. It's a really great book. It's almost done, and Simon Schuster's gonna publish it next year.

• 2:12:41Joe Rogan?

  So there's multiple attempts on his life because of which? Does he have an understanding? Like, was he threatened?

• 2:12:47Speaker 02

  He thinks it's because what he was involved with was supposed to stay in the past. He wasn't supposed to remember it.

• 2:12:52Joe Rogan?

  When he was a child?

• 2:12:53Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:12:53Joe Rogan?

  And so they want to kill him?

• 2:12:56Speaker 02

  Essentially.

• 2:12:56Joe Rogan?

  Wouldn't that make it even more suspicious?

• 2:12:58Speaker 02

  Well, depends on how you, yeah. No, probably not.

• 2:13:00Joe Rogan?

  Probably not, because they could just get away with it.

• 2:13:02Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:13:02Joe Rogan?

  What kind of attempts on his life?

• 2:13:04Speaker 02

  Directed energy weapons.

• 2:13:07Joe Rogan?

  What?

• 2:13:07Speaker 02

  Yeah. Yeah.

• 2:13:10Joe Rogan?

  Like how?

• 2:13:11Speaker 02

  The guy was having the actual symptoms of a directed energy weapon attack, and he knew what those circumstances were from his, you know, from his career. He knew these were symptoms of that. And they, a proper investigation was done by real authorities, and they found evidence of it, like etching in the windows and...

• 2:13:30Joe Rogan?

  Etching in the windows.

• 2:13:32Speaker 02

  If a direct energy weapon goes through glass, it causes etching in the windows.

• 2:13:36Joe Rogan?

  So they're literally physically targeting him with something. From a drone, from space?

• 2:13:40Speaker 02

  Who knows? I mean, that's, these are like the list of questions that this story.

• 2:13:43Joe Rogan?

  So the idea is like, let's just give this guy cancer, or just nuke him and take him out?

• 2:13:50Speaker 02

  That's what it seems, yeah.

• 2:13:51Joe Rogan?

  Because he's talking too much about this program.

• 2:13:53Speaker 02

  That's what it seems.

• 2:13:53Joe Rogan?

  And then if it comes out, we're fucked.

• 2:13:56Speaker 02

  Yeah, that's what it seems.

• 2:13:56Joe Rogan?

  Because probably what they did is highly illegal, especially if they did it to a child.

• 2:14:00Speaker 02

  Well, I don't think you can legally enlist in the military when you're, you know, thirteen.

• 2:14:05Joe Rogan?

  Also, he probably wasn't the only one.

• 2:14:07Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:14:08Joe Rogan?

  And so if they do have some sort of an ability to erase memory.

• 2:14:14Speaker 02

  That's what it would seem. Which also lines up with, you know, I talked to, um, one of the stories I left out of the film. I talked to the base commander from Rendlesham. The, the US, joint US, UK base in the UK, where there was a huge UAP event in the eighties. And the base commander told me on the record, on camera, that the day after the event, an airplane landed. Um, people from the CIA and Air Force Intelligence showed up with authority and demanded to speak to the witnesses. And the base commander was told to leave the room. He didn't know until years later that all those servicemen that experienced this, they were all told to, to, um, share the details and they were given a, a drug, I think it was called, is this correct, sodium pentathal? Is that how you say it?

• 2:14:59Joe Rogan?

  Penethal?

• 2:15:00Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:15:00Joe Rogan?

  Is that it? That's the truth serum, right?

• 2:15:02Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. And they were given that to, to, to, um, share what they, what they experienced. And then they were all asked if they had ever been hypnotized. And someone was there who hypnotized them. As crazy as that sounds.

• 2:15:18Joe Rogan?

  Wow.

• 2:15:19Speaker 02

  This is the base commander telling me this on camera, to my face.

• 2:15:25Speaker 02

  He also said they took away something in crates the next day on this airplane and he never got clarity on what it was. And the third thing that he revealed that I don't think anyone's ever talked about with Randlesham is he revealed that the day after the event, he went and he talked to the people in the communications room, you know, the old school like wires in the wall and stuff. And the head of the communications on the base told him that the entire night of the event, while he was out in the woods dealing with the event, the whole base was on communication lockdown, all lines were shut down except the direct line between the base and the White House. Which it's called, I believe, I believe, I don't want to mess this up, but I believe it's called flash override, which is only used for nuclear war or imminent threat of nuclear war.

• 2:16:09Speaker 02

  So like the most extreme circumstances where you need a direct line between the base and the president.

• 2:16:14Joe Rogan?

  Whoa.

• 2:16:15Speaker 02

  Yeah. So one of the unfortunate things I had to cut for time, hardest thing I've made in this movie, man, was my director's cut was like four hours and I had to get this down, I had to get this down to something that was like consumable.

• 2:16:24Joe Rogan?

  Did you ever think about making it like a Netflix thing or multi-piece?

• 2:16:28Speaker 02

  I did, I did think about it.

• 2:16:30Joe Rogan?

  What about a director's cut? Would you ever do that?

• 2:16:32Speaker 02

  Probably, I'll think about doing that, or maybe let's do a sequel, maybe let's do a follow-up and put some of the stuff that like is like a bridge too far into the next thing, once the table's been set.

• 2:16:40Joe Rogan?

  That sounds good.

• 2:16:41Speaker 02

  You know?

• 2:16:42Joe Rogan?

  This was the question I was gonna get to with that. Now, you've worked on legitimate films.

• 2:16:45Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:16:46Joe Rogan?

  Like, not that this isn't legitimate, but you've worked on some like big blockbuster Hollywood films.

• 2:16:50Speaker 02

  Yeah, man.

• 2:16:51Joe Rogan?

  Ready Player One. Amazing film, I love that movie.

• 2:16:53Speaker 02

  Thank you.

• 2:16:54Joe Rogan?

  Are you locked into this kind of shit now? Cause here's the problem that happens when people start going down this rabbit hole, it kind of consumes them.

• 2:17:02Speaker 02

  Look, it's definitely, it's definitely been a consuming endeavor, this movie. I mean, this thing has consumed my life for four years and I had to, you know, it's a whole nother conversation, but I had to make this movie in secrecy because at the, at the offset, when I started getting real intelligence officials to lean in, they told me to my face, they're like, you, it's not in your best interest to promote the fact you're doing this, don't announce people doing it, don't let the world know about it until you put a trailer out, you know, there's gonna be people who are gonna try to cause problems for you. So I had to make this in secrecy, I ended up doing posts out of my house, which, my fiance, my fiance is a saint, Ali Feinstein is a saint for putting up with that.

• 2:17:36Joe Rogan?

  Did you have a crew at your house?

• 2:17:38Speaker 02

  Yeah, man.

• 2:17:38Joe Rogan?

  Do it on the post?

• 2:17:39Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:17:39Joe Rogan?

  So you had to do it on the sneak?

• 2:17:41Speaker 02

  All-consuming and, um, and yes, this, this topic is a rabbit hole you become consumed with. I, look, I'm still gonna do movies and TV shows that have nothing to do with UAP, for sure. And I'm developing some and I, and I, and I, and I think I'll probably make some next year. But, um, at the same time, I wanna do more in this space and these adjacent spaces. Like, I'm doing, like I mentioned Jay Stratton's book I'm working really hard on. I'm also gonna develop a series based on Jay Stratton's life, which is this remarkable 16-year rabbit hole of investigating non-human intelligent life and UAP for the US government. I'm working with some other people that are in my film on, on their life stories. And then the book I just told you about, that crazy remote viewing story.

• 2:18:23Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 2:18:24Speaker 02

  I'm developing a movie about that.

• 2:18:26Joe Rogan?

  Oh, like a fiction, like a dramatization?

• 2:18:29Speaker 02

  Yeah, like picture like The Vibe of the Insider, the Russell Crowe, Al Pacino movie. But with that story.

• 2:18:35Joe Rogan?

  Oh.

• 2:18:35Speaker 02

  Like that kind of vibe, right?

• 2:18:36Joe Rogan?

  Who do you wanna play that guy? Do you got someone in mind?

• 2:18:38Speaker 02

  I have a few people in mind. Don't wanna say too soon. There's a few people in mind.

• 2:18:43Joe Rogan?

  What about Russell Crowe?

• 2:18:44Speaker 02

  Russell Crowe would be amazing for it. And he's really into the topic.

• 2:18:47Joe Rogan?

  Oh, yeah.

• 2:18:47Speaker 02

  He's really into the topic.

• 2:18:49Joe Rogan?

  Love it. And he's only interested in doing interesting things now.

• 2:18:52Speaker 02

  Yeah. Yeah, he's got all the money in the world.

• 2:18:54Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 2:18:55Speaker 02

  He, he'd be amazing for it. There's a lot of good ideas for that one. But I do wanna, I do wanna still do, you know, stuff outside this topic, for sure. I'm really fascinated with the remote viewing topic. I think I have a desire to do, in the same way that The Age of Disclosure is the definitive doc on what we now know that can be lawfully disclosed about UAP and non-human intelligent life, I really wanna try to endeavor to do that version of the remote viewing story.

• 2:19:21Joe Rogan?

  That would be amazing.

• 2:19:22Speaker 02

  Like the super credible, nonsensational. It's got, I mean, it's got the coolest setup. Here, here's the setup for this thing. So Hal Pudoff's working for the CIA and the DOD in the mid-'70s. He's doing some spooky stuff, fringe science work.

• 2:19:39Speaker 02

  His CIA handler, who's his best friend and was in his wedding party, comes into his office, knocks on the door and says, "We've got a problem we need your help with." He says, "What is it?" He says, "Our operatives have found out that the Russians have a program that they're 10 years into where they have rounded up the best psychics in Russia and they've trained them to use their psychic abilities to spy on American bases and our most secure facilities and they're getting actionable intel." Hal's, of course, like, "Holy shit. That's the craziest thing I've ever heard, right?" And the CIA guy says, "Yes. You've got a blank checkbook from the CIA and the DOD. You've got X amount of time to catch up on their 10-year program. We've got to beat them."

• 2:20:23Speaker 02

  He then has to figure out like how to go about finding people who have these abilities because it's not like Russia where you just go round up a bunch of people and say, "You're going to do this," right? So he comes up with a clever system to bake into Army Basic Training testing that can identify people with these skillsets. And then you can pluck them up and have them come work for the program. You can help them sharpen their skillsets and you can train them to become remote viewers. To me, that like, that scene, it's like, it's like the Indiana Jones scene where, where the CIA comes into Indiana Jones and says, "You know, what do you know about the Ark of the Covenant?" Oh, my God. "And we've got this situation we need your help with," you know? It's wild, man. It's like the craziest setup of all time. And it's fascinating. And then the fact that they started getting real actionable intelligence

• 2:21:06Speaker 02

  that they were acting on, like the CIA was running missions based on his intel. One, one of, one day when I shot, I did so many interviews with Hal, but one day when we finished talking about the UAP topic, I had, I had intentionally scheduled a few extra hours. And I was like, "All right, Hal, let's talk about Stargate." And I grabbed like three hours of the entire Stargate story. And it's fucking mind blowing. And the, all the specific like little stories of action that were taken based on their intel is so wild and so compelling. And then when Stargate, at the time, Stargate was a deeply hidden program, extremely secret, highly classified. There was some leak, I think, that happened in the 90s where people heard about it. And then essentially the government said, "Oh, it's not real. It didn't work. It was this thing we tried," you know?

• 2:21:50Speaker 02

  And all they did is they just moved it to another agency.

• 2:21:55Speaker 02

  As far as, I've had so many people tell me of their awareness of active remote viewing programs.

• 2:22:00Joe Rogan?

  Wow.

• 2:22:01Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:22:01Joe Rogan?

  Have you tried to do it?

• 2:22:03Speaker 02

  I have not tried to do it.

• 2:22:04Joe Rogan?

  Why not?

• 2:22:05Speaker 02

  But I did, what I did try was someone remote viewing me in a specific place where I was. And they sent me a picture that they sketched out that gave me fucking chills because they described exactly where I was standing when I was talking to them. And I don't think they had cameras in my house, which is the obvious question, right?

• 2:22:26Joe Rogan?

  Oh.

• 2:22:27Speaker 02

  Pretty wild. And I've, and there's others, there's other stories that I've heard from intelligence officials that I, I've gotten close with because of the UAP topic. People who became aware of the remote viewing situation and would tell me these just like little anecdotal stories like.

• 2:22:42Speaker 02

  There was a, there was a, here's like a specific, there was a, there was a pen drive, like a little, you know, little, little drive with some data on it. That had some UAP data on it that an intelligence official literally dropped.

• 2:22:54Speaker 02

  While hiking, out of their pocket, it was in their pocket. And, and they dropped it and they used a remote viewer to help them find it, told them exactly where it was and went and found it. It's crazy. It's crazy, it's crazy, it's crazy. But then you go and you listen to this clip of Jimmy Carter talking about how remote viewers were used to find this down airplane. And you're like, this guy was President of the United States.

• 2:23:13Speaker 03

  I definitely found a transcript in an article, but I think this is audio and I hadn't been able to check it.

• 2:23:17Speaker 02

  There is a documentary.

• 2:23:19Speaker 03

  I tried to find a documentary.

• 2:23:21Speaker 02

  There's a documentary called Third Eye Spy that has it as the opening.

• 2:23:24Speaker 03

  It described it differently than here.

• 2:23:25Speaker 05

  Change and inexplicable event that has been discussed publicly is that one time we had a, a small plane go down somewhere in Africa. We needed very much to find out where that plane had crashed. And we were not able to find it by surveillance from our satellites. So the director of the CIA, he was also director of all the intelligence agencies. Heard about a, a woman in California that was a medium. And he contacted her and she gave him the latitude and longitude of the plane's whereabouts.

• 2:24:10Speaker 05

  And the next time one of our space satellites went over that area, we located the plane where she said it was.

• 2:24:19Speaker 02

  By the way, that's not even the one I was thinking of. He says it about a different thing, about a plane with down, I think it was Russia. And he specifically says, "We went to the remote viewing program for one of the best remote viewers and they found it." But that's crazy. That's a sitting president.

• 2:24:30Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 2:24:30Speaker 02

  Fucking Jimmy Carter talking about a psychic being used to...

• 2:24:33Joe Rogan?

  Yeah. It's... Do you think that that is an aspect of human consciousness that we used to be able to do?

• 2:24:42Speaker 02

  I do.

• 2:24:43Joe Rogan?

  And that we've lost it somehow?

• 2:24:45Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:24:45Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 2:24:46Speaker 02

  I think there's just things we've evolved out of and things we've evolved into. And I think that that's, you know, um...

• 2:24:52Joe Rogan?

  Is that what they think as well?

• 2:24:54Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah. Someone, someone, someone very involved in that topic for the government now told me the analogy they would make is, it's like if, if, if you saw a basketball on the ground, anybody can pick the basketball up. If there's a hoop there, they can throw it at it, right?

• 2:25:07Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 2:25:07Speaker 02

  If you sat back and watched a line of a hundred people do it, some would look like clowns, some would, you know, some would be like, "Oh, this guy has solid potential." And then, you know, one out of every however many, like that would be a Michael Jordan, who's just like, "Boom, swish. This guy's a fucking natural, right? He's got this instinct." So everyone can do it. Everyone can pick up the ball and throw it at the hoop. And some people have a natural instinct to do it better. And that's what they were trying to identify, and that's what they do try to identify.

• 2:25:31Joe Rogan?

  And the weird one is that people who have had encounters...

• 2:25:35Speaker 02

  Yeah, so that's, that to me is like...

• 2:25:37Joe Rogan?

  Like it breaks through some barrier that you have in your consciousness. When they communicate with you, all of a sudden now, you have this wall that has been downed that allows you to have access to this forgotten aspect of human consciousness.

• 2:25:51Speaker 02

  Or it somehow heightens it, you know?

• 2:25:52Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 2:25:53Speaker 02

  The biological effects are real, so we don't, you know, we know about the bad ones like cancer, but maybe one of the other ones is, it heightens this ability somehow.

• 2:26:02Joe Rogan?

  Have you ever taken any time into consideration of the possibility that human beings were, were a product of genetic engineering?

• 2:26:11Speaker 02

  I mean, it's, it's kind of impossible to get out of this, this rabbit hole and not, not have the thought of, "Are we just all a big, it's just a big experiment?"

• 2:26:17Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 2:26:18Speaker 02

  You know, and one day the experiment will end.

• 2:26:19Joe Rogan?

  Or not even just an experiment bore, but an aiding in a process.

• 2:26:24Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:26:24Joe Rogan?

  Like they recognize a process where there's bipedal hominids

• 2:26:28Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:26:29Joe Rogan?

  of various intelligence and they accentuate that.

• 2:26:32Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:26:33Joe Rogan?

  And, and multiple different, probably multiple different attempts.

• 2:26:37Speaker 02

  Yeah. I mean, I've, I've definitely thought about it and I, and I... It would explain a lot, you know, there's all these missing gaps in our history.

• 2:26:44Joe Rogan?

  Well, that's also the weirdness of the Book of Enoch.

• 2:26:47Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:26:47Joe Rogan?

  The Book of Enoch is essentially describing watchers who come down from the sky and mate with women.

• 2:26:55Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:26:55Joe Rogan?

  Well, that, if you told that story for a thousand years and the real story was they came down, they got a hold of human babies and, and human mothers and introduced genetics that were alien into, into these children, that would be like they mated with women.

• 2:27:14Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:27:15Joe Rogan?

  It would be kind of the same thing.

• 2:27:16Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:27:16Joe Rogan?

  You know, and created, well, they, they talk about the Nephilim giants who destroyed everything, but that's kind of us.

• 2:27:22Speaker 02

  Well, the other thing that makes me think of is, uh, a number of the people who have seen crafts, and it's, uh, Jay Stratten and Luis Zondo say it in the film, that the craft at Roswell had hieroglyphics on it. Some kind of ancient writing and they, they actually, uh, I didn't put it in the film, but they talked about how when they learned that to be a fact, they spent a ton of time researching ancient texts and trying to find a match. And they couldn't find it and the closest thing they could find was some old biblical text.

• 2:27:57Speaker 02

  But who's hieroglyphics for these, what was that from, you know? It's wild, man.

• 2:28:02Joe Rogan?

  Well, how much would you give to see one? Tell her, please, I'll, I'll stop making documentaries. I won't talk to nobody.

• 2:28:09Speaker 02

  I know.

• 2:28:09Joe Rogan?

  Just show me, just take me into the hangar and show me this fucking thing.

• 2:28:14Speaker 02

  That's what Spielberg says. Spielberg says he's, you know, all these years, a guy made Close Encounters, he made ET, you know, War of the Worlds, um, TV shows, um, about it and never seen one and, you know.

• 2:28:27Joe Rogan?

  Have you had anything that you've ever seen that you thought was weird?

• 2:28:31Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, I have. I, um, actually out in Ojai. Out in Ohio, my fiance and I were laying on a blanket while I was making this movie, um, looking at stars and saw what looked like a satellite. At first I thought it was going slow, and then this thing just fucking rocketed off way up there. All it looked like was a star. But it was not a star, it was not a satellite, because it moved super fast and just darted across the sky.

• 2:28:56Joe Rogan?

  Out of nowhere?

• 2:28:57Speaker 02

  Yeah, up right above the Topa Topa Mountains in Ohio. And then I, and then I actually, the next day, we said to the staff, we were on those little golf carts getting drove across this hotel property, and we told them we saw, and the guy goes, "Yeah, not gonna lie, we see that stuff a lot out here." I was like, "Wow, fascinating," yeah. But that's the only thing I ever saw. Other, other stuff where I'm like witnessing firsthand the craziness of this cover-up, uh, one of the interview subjects I had at my house in Los Angeles, prepping for an interview, we're in the middle, we're sitting in my living room, I, I live in the suburbs of, of Los Angeles, and, uh, what happened is not normal, heard a very loud helicopter, ran outside, had my phone on me, look, look up, and there's a black helicopter right above my house.

• 2:29:40Speaker 02

  And the guy comes out of the house and looks up, and then without missing a beat, I always remember this, he's like, he's like, "Yeah, that'll happen." I'm like, "What? What the hell did I just get into?" You know?

• 2:29:52Joe Rogan?

  So they're essentially letting you know that they know?

• 2:29:54Speaker 02

  Yeah, there's been a bunch of moments like that, like, yeah. Letting, letting you know, that's, that's the message. I, I immediately asked people on the Senate Intelligence Committee and Senate Services Committee about that, if I should be worried. They're basically like, they're just letting you know that they're aware of what you're doing. It's them sending a message, they're watching you, try not to cross any lines. They're like, "That happens to everybody on the Intelligence Committee."

• 2:30:16Joe Rogan?

  I would imagine that those people, though, kind of want you to succeed.

• 2:30:21Speaker 02

  In a weird way, I think they want you to succeed in a way where you're not crossing your lines. And look, I went to great lengths, I, no one says anything classified on camera for me, there's none of that, I don't want to be, I don't want any part of that, right?

• 2:30:32Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 2:30:32Speaker 02

  They only share what they lawfully can, and I think that, you know...

• 2:30:37Speaker 02

  I assumed after that, that every phone call and every email was being observed.

• 2:30:42Joe Rogan?

  Oh, yeah.

• 2:30:42Speaker 02

  And not only did I assume that, but I was told to assume that.

• 2:30:45Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, I'm sure.

• 2:30:47Speaker 02

  Yeah, the people on the, so there's a guy I'll give him a shout out, John Estrich, who was on the Senate Intelligence Committee staff. He was the senior staffer for Rubio. He was the guy who really led the charge on looking into this topic for Rubio and Warner on the Senate Intelligence Committee staff. He was extremely supportive to me behind the scenes. Helped vet people for me, helped send introductions my way, helped validate me with Rubio and rounds. Extremely helpful. He often had that same kind of activity at his house, every time he'd have an important meeting. Yeah, yeah.

• 2:31:22Joe Rogan?

  And, uh... Oh, God. That'll fucking put some holes in your sails.

• 2:31:28Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:31:28Joe Rogan?

  You know, like, "Slow down, maybe I need to go back to Ready Player Two."

• 2:31:35Speaker 02

  Fuck this. Gonna go develop an Ocean's Eleven-type movie.

• 2:31:39Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, I'm not interested in fucking helicopters being over my house.

• 2:31:42Speaker 02

  No, there's been, there's been, look, there's a lot of people, I don't want to go too into it, but as you can imagine, there's a lot of people that wish this movie didn't exist.

• 2:31:52Joe Rogan?

  I'm sure, yeah.

• 2:31:52Speaker 02

  That wish I never made it.

• 2:31:54Joe Rogan?

  Of course.

• 2:31:54Speaker 02

  That tried to prevent it from getting released and went out of their way to cause problems. There's a lot of people that fit that description. And I became aware of a lot of them. I became aware of a lot of those concerns, and I just kinda like, just kinda put blinders on and like, you know, had tunnel vision, was like, "Right, I'm not doing anything illegal, I'm not gonna do anything that's bad for the United States, I'm not..."

• 2:32:16Joe Rogan?

  I think it's good for the United States. I really do. I think that film is good for just human beings overall. It's really important, man, and I'm glad you did it. It was really excellent.

• 2:32:26Speaker 02

  Thank you.

• 2:32:27Joe Rogan?

  I'm glad I got to see it at South by Southwest, and I was like, "Man, this has gotta get distributed. Like, how does this get out there?"

• 2:32:33Speaker 02

  Yeah. You know, despite, South by, we did two screenings, 1,100 seats at the Paramount Theater, standing ovations, lines around the block. The trailer I put out in January quickly got like 20 million views. Despite that, all the major distributors and major streamers.

• 2:32:49Speaker 02

  They watched it, they loved it, they said all these great things, but then they didn't end up, they didn't end up moving forward. And, and, and you know, I don't think it's naive to think that other parties, you know, might have discouraged people.

• 2:33:04Joe Rogan?

  Yes, I would imagine that. How can people watch it?

• 2:33:07Speaker 02

  So, on Friday, the 21st.

• 2:33:09Joe Rogan?

  Which is tomorrow.

• 2:33:11Speaker 02

  Which is tomorrow, or today.

• 2:33:12Joe Rogan?

  Today. It'll drop today. So it's today for people listening and watching.

• 2:33:17Speaker 02

  Today, February 21st, Jesus, February. Today, November 21st.

• 2:33:20Joe Rogan?

  They've got an amoeba in your brain, bro.

• 2:33:25Speaker 02

  Today, November 21st. Worldwide on Prime Video, you can rent it, you can buy it. I made subtitles for every single major language. It's available in every single country around the world where Prime Video is available. And you can also see it in the movie theater in New York, Los Angeles, and DC. And I really encourage everyone in the world to watch this thing and make it a conversation with their friends and family. I think it's the most interesting conversation you can have around Thanksgiving dinner next week, you know?

• 2:33:51Joe Rogan?

  It is really good, Ben, and you should be very proud of it. And I hope it gets distributed even wider after the success of the Amazon Prime thing because I think it's going to take off.

• 2:34:00Speaker 02

  Thank you, yeah, I, I, I hope that's the case. And then, yeah, I do think there'll be a follow-up.

• 2:34:05Joe Rogan?

  Do have a follow-up, baby. Come back. And definitely if you do a remote viewing one, too, I want to hear about more.

• 2:34:10Speaker 02

  Hell, yeah, hell, yeah, hell, yeah.

• 2:34:12Joe Rogan?

  Thank you very much for being here, man, it was awesome.

• 2:34:13Speaker 02

  Thank you for having me.

• 2:34:14Joe Rogan?

  And your documentary is really, really excellent.

• 2:34:15Speaker 02

  Thank you for having me.

• 2:34:16Joe Rogan?

  I appreciate it. Bye, everybody.

• 2:34:18Speaker 06

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