AI ROLLUP #2: Virtuals $1B | Zerebro LLM | Ai16z Comeback? | Bittensor Tao | Freya $50K Game

Ejaaz is back to go through the latest news over the past week in the wild world of AI Agents. This week, Ejaaz and David dive into why and how Virtuals hit a $1B market cap, and also Zerebro is launching a decentralized LLM, Ai16z is making a comeback with Eliza V2, and so much more. Will AI agents continue to dominate the mindshare of crypto Crypto Twitter and beyond? ------ 📣SPOTIFY PREMIUM RSS FEED | USE CODE: SPOTIFY24 https://bankless.cc/spotify-premium ------ BANKLESS SPONSOR TOOLS: 🐙KRAKEN | MOST-TRUSTED CRYPTO EXCHANGE https://k.xyz/bankless-pod-q2 ⁠ 🦄UNISWAP | BUG BOUNTY PROGRAM https://bankless.cc/Uniswap-Bug-Bounty 🛞MANTLE | MODULAR LAYER 2 NETWORK https://bankless.cc/Mantle 🐧CARTESI | LINUX-POWERED ROLLUPS https://bankless.cc/CartesiSimple 📈iYield: YOUR FINANCIAL PICTURE, SIMPLIFIED https://bankless.cc/iYield 🔒SAFE | INTRODUCING SAFENET https://bankless.cc/SAFE ------ ✨ Mint the episode on Zora ✨ https://zora.co/collect/zora:0x0c294913a7596b427add7dcbd6d7bbfc7338d53f/107?referrer=0x077Fe9e96Aa9b20Bd36F1C6290f54F8717C5674E ------ TIMESTAMPS & RESOURCES 0:00 Intro 3:10 Why Ejaaz is Bullish 6:42 Ai16z https://x.com/0xwitchy/status/1863862261573632025 9:52 Virtuals https://www.coingecko.com/en/coins/virtual-protocol https://www.virtuals.io/ https://fun.virtuals.io/ 16:17 aixbt https://www.coingecko.com/en/coins/aixbt-by-virtuals https://x.com/cryptopunk7213/status/1863584774901666038 https://x.com/aixbt_agent https://x.com/PixOnChain/status/1863145856301674938 29:12 Freya agent gifts $50K to clever winner https://x.com/jarrodWattsDev/status/1862299845710757980 https://www.freysa.ai/ 33:09 Zerebo https://x.com/jyu_eth/status/1864004665891013028 https://open.spotify.com/track/0MTF6FSeodBtrhM7Vi6E3b?si=cc45c86757bc44e8 https://x.com/jyu_eth/status/1861190173196730729 https://x.com/jyu_eth/status/1863012741486616742 50:24 Ai16z https://x.com/markus9x/status/1861242414515777767 https://x.com/0xwitchy/status/1863530135313600980 55:47 God https://x.com/god 1:00:47 Bittensor Tao https://x.com/cruciblelabs/status/1861154220021260473 1:04:30 NOUS and Prime Intellect leading decentralized training https://x.com/NousResearch/status/1863622813317464157 https://x.com/PrimeIntellect/status/1862607165669900407 1:08:21 Ejaaz’s predictions & where his attention is going https://x.com/Vader_AI_ https://x.com/0xprismatic/status/1863055816947101845 1:14:25 Solana vs. Base? 1:21:31 Homework for Bankless audience https://x.com/cryptopunk7213 1:22:59 Closing & Disclaimers ------ Not financial or tax advice. See our investment disclosures here: https://www.bankless.com/disclosures⁠

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:04David Hoffman?

  Welcome Bankless Nation to the AI roll-up, where we cover the recent news, developments and drama in the intersection of crypto and AI. Curious and creative developers are playing around with open-source AI software, making AI agents, giving them access to crypto wallets, and unleashing them into the Wild West of the internet. And we are doing a special series of episodes on Bankless with a special co-host, EJAS, here to help make sure that you are up to speed with one of the craziest and fastest-growing corners of the internet. EJAS, episode number two. How are you doing, my man?

• 0:32Speaker 01

  Doing well. It's been a pretty entertaining week. I'd say entertaining in both a market and fundamentals perspective, but also these agents are getting better. They're making me laugh more, they're making me interact with them more. It's pretty insane to see.

• 0:46David Hoffman?

  You have definitely seen it as well in crypto Twitter. This one agent, AI XBT, has flipped, I think, all other humans in mindshare. And I think that just represents a growing quality of these agents, but also a growing penetration of the awareness that, yo, the AI meta is the meta. It's time to pay attention.

• 1:09Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, I agree. And if you look at the mindshare analysis of the last week, it's grown pretty exponentially. I'm pretty sure AI agents itself, or AI within crypto Twitter, is at almost 45%. So loads and loads of people are discussing it across a range of different verticals, whether it's in DeFi-specific agents or art-specific agents. You see it pretty much permeate everywhere. And AI XBT is a good example of seeing that happen. I think, actually, when we last filmed an episode, it was at 40,000 followers on Twitter. And I think right now, it's just broached 80,000. I might be wrong about that, but it's gone pretty exponential.

• 1:51David Hoffman?

  Well, we're going to pull up some of his It's tweets this week. And so we'll actually be able to check in on that. We're looking at the kind of this mind share of narratives. I think over the last two years, crypto has been looking for a narrative. Like, what is going to be the narrative that takes crypto mainstream to the next for the next bull market? Right? What is it going to be meme coins? Is it going to be real world assets? Is it going to be stable coins? Is it going to be gameFi? AI has been in the running, of course. I think in the last two weeks, we are ready to like unquestionably crown a winner. It's AI. Everything like, you know, get out of the way. You're not even in second place. People are trying. There's no, there is no second place. It's AI. AI has won. AI is the thing.

• 2:34David Hoffman?

  It is bringing in new attention, new users, new capital, which is just the makings of a bull market. Let's talk about what we're going to talk about this this week. What's on the agenda this week? We got Zero Bro. You're going to walk us through some stuff with Zero Bro. We talked about Zero Bro quite a lot last week, but of course the meta always shifts. AI 16Z, is it regaining its footing after some recent stumbles? The virtual's ecosystem, which I think is where we're going to start, is on fire. This is the number one agent, AI XPT, that we were just talking about. It's dominating a crypto Twitter KOL mindshare. And then Elon Musk gets peaked by an AI agent game on base. And so this is just a quick snapshot of what we're going to talk about. EJAS, I want to start off every episode with kind of the same vibe because we're all learning here. I'm learning.

• 3:16David Hoffman?

  You know, a lot, but even even the people that know everything in the AI agent space. Everyone's still learning here because we're on the frontier. Just give it to me once again. Why are you so bullish? Why are you so excited? You have seen metas in crypto. You were here for the ICO meta. You were here for the DeFi summer meta. You saw the NFT meta. Yeah, you've seen it all. Tell us what about this phase of crypto, this this corner of the crypto industry gets you so excited? Why is this so big?

• 3:43Speaker 01

  Let me try and explain this as simply as I can. Okay, so over the last decade of development within the crypto world, we have seen kind of two efforts. Right? Number one has been at the infrastructure layer, which is like, let's build these blockchains. Right? Let's get the basics sorted out. Scalability, decentralization, etc.

• 4:05Speaker 01

  Et cetera. And so we've seen an explosion in the number of blockchains and capacity to be able to process, you know, transactions or whatever and blah, blah, blah. And now we're in a world where we have a lot of block space and a lot of, you know, ability to kind of like move around between different chains. If it suits your specific use case. On the other side of things, we've seen people try and tap into the application layer. But to be honest, aside from stable coins and maybe store of value in a few other use cases, we haven't really bridged that gap yet. My thesis is AI and AI agents specifically is that connector between those two layers, right? So, oh, okay, if you want to do some kind of complex DeFi transaction right now, you need to get a browser extension model.

• 4:49Speaker 01

  You just store your seed phrase, you need to sign a bunch of transactions or taxons approvals, et cetera. And then you've got to get alpha and then you've got to like add the token contractor. It's just all so complex. But what if you could just speak to an agent or type to an agent, hey, like I like this thing that my friend tweeted about. Could you help me buy 5K of that? Or could you help me park my money somewhere that I can get a pretty stable yield between five to 10% or whatever that might be? Or maybe, you know, hey, I have these really awesome NFTs that I really value the IP and the art, but I want to make them more interactive and really build its own brand and personality.

• 5:24Speaker 01

  Or maybe you connect that to an agent, maybe you connect that to a model. I think there's going to be loads of these different kind of siloed sectors that are going to get bridged between the infrastructure layer and the app layer. Through these AI agents and AI. And that's why I think this is one of the biggest and bullish sectors to ever emerge within crypto.

• 5:42David Hoffman?

  So I think what you're saying is not only AI crypto, maybe that's an app in of itself. There are some apps that we're going to talk about today on the episode, but I think what you're saying is it's also a superset of that. Where AIs and the assistance of AIs will help also enable apps beyond AI in crypto. Really help bridge the gap. So it's kind of an incubator. It helps just facilitate more than what apps that we have always dreamed of, that we somehow haven't yet been able to get. So not only, not only are there fun AI agent apps that we're going to talk about, but also it's just an enabler of all of these apps that we've been daydreaming for like a decade now.

• 6:19Speaker 01

  Yeah, exactly. Like, think about like all the questions you get from your friends and family when prices go up in this industry, right? They're saying, hey, what should I buy? What should I do? What if you could point them in the direction of an AI XBT or something like that? And they could just kind of read pretty humorous replies and breakdowns, pretty short and succinct and to the point. I think that's something that people would like and, you know, I think we're going to see this permeate across every different sector.

• 6:43David Hoffman?

  I want to start with this GIF, which is a two-minute, 20-second-long GIF of Eliza development. I believe in GitHub. This is like a visualization of a GitHub repo. I'm going to speed this up two X. Show us what we're looking about out here.

• 6:56Speaker 01

  Yeah, so we mentioned this on the last episode. This represents a agent toolkit framework, which was built by the team at AI16Z. It's a DAO that's focused on kind of building out open source development of agents and, you know, separately fund investments. So what we're seeing here is, seeing as it's open source, we see a ton of developer activity simply explode using this framework. So to give listeners a better idea of what's going on here, this framework has a series of APIs and tool frameworks that will allow you to kind of build an agent from scratch. Actually, most recently, someone tried building an agent and was able to do it in 15 minutes with its own unique personality,

• 7:38Speaker 01

  connected to its own Twitter account and own its own crypto wallet, which is pretty insane. And as you can see, what's happening on the screen right now is this massive explosion of developer activity, which is typically a good sign that what you've built is pretty useful to an ecosystem of engineers or software developers. And this kind of like puts into a visual perspective AI16Z's Eliza framework growth on GitHub, which is now over 2,000 stars and over 500 forks, which is pretty insane. It's still the number two trending repo on GitHub.

• 8:14David Hoffman?

  So this gif starts in March of 2024 and it ends in today. And really, especially in the last like two weeks, maybe two months. You're seeing just like a fat fractal explosion of just merges into the GitHub repo, just growth of the GitHub repo. Open source software, they kind of behaves as like an alive organism. So long as it has like attention and development going into the repo. And you see like it starts off as like maybe a couple of branches. There's a couple, a couple of leaves on the branches. Now in this gif, we're into October, so we're about to see that recent explosion because the mindshare has just like gone exponential.

• 8:52David Hoffman?

  But we are seeing it go from just like a very simple organism to a very complex, creative, just system repo. Which, you know, it used to be just be Shaw, just building it, the one main guy. And now it seems to be, there's many different developers all kind of contributing to the system, making it better, making it easier for, for others to access. Which means that this is a more useful toolkit that's more accessible to more developers. And so there's, it starts to become like a feedback loop.

• 9:21Speaker 01

  Yep, it's a really aggressive flywheel. This is definitely on the more aggressive side. We've seen their core contributor team grow pretty exponentially. You've seen developers from surrounding ecosystems kind of jump in and try and build something for their DeFi ecosystem or for their NFT ecosystem. You've seen people come in from different blockchains to make this a very much a multi-chain approach. So we had the base integration over this week. We had a Virtuals ecosystem folks in here as well. It's pretty insane to see.

• 9:52David Hoffman?

  Let's talk about Virtuals because I think this is another system that is capturing a lot of mindshare. Virtuals is a protocol on base. People are calling it a pump dot fun for AI agents. We talked about it last week. It has got an easy to use interface for the less technically minded to just use the Virtuals platform to launch their AI agent. This is where that AI XBT agent influencer is, has been born. And the Virtuals ecosystem has seen just a pretty stellar price run up. 200% in price increase in just four. 14 days and 400% in a month. And so if you bought if you bought one Virtuals token at 33 cents today at the beginning of November,

• 10:34David Hoffman?

  a month ago, 33 cents turned into a dollar 70. And so this is people just, I think, looking for exposure. But also, there's a little bit of a difference between AI 16Z and Virtuals. Virtuals is a startup that has been working as a team for two plus years now. And AI 16 is a little bit more of a like, kind of a nebulous cloud of developers with a kind of a more motley crew of people coming together because this AI agent framework has captured so much mind share. Talk to us a little bit about the growth of the Virtuals protocol.

• 11:06Speaker 01

  Yeah, so a bit of context on the Virtuals team. And I caught up with them this week and I really like the team. They have an amazing vision to start off with, one, right? And to your point, this team's been around for a while. They've been building for a number of years. They were focused primarily on the gaming side of things and they decided to pivot and focus on agents specifically, once they realized how burgeoning this space is going to be. The best way to describe Virtuals is kind of what you said, David. It's a pumped up fund for agents, but I kind of think it doesn't give it enough credibility. So it's more of a refined pumped up fund. It's less

• 11:40David Hoffman?

  Polished, yeah.

• 11:41Speaker 01

  It's polished. It's more professional. It's more focused on building something that, you know, people might be able to interact with and engage with on a much deeper level than just a meme coin, you know? So there's a few ways that this platform works that makes it super valuable. Number one is its token, you just mentioned and showed the price there, is pretty much baked into the ecosystem activity. So if you want to purchase any of these agents, if you want to kind of like seed any of these agents with certain features, you need the Virtuals token to be able to do that. And so it's created this really interesting loop or flywheel where you need Virtuals or you need to purchase Virtuals in order to be able to interact with these agents and get access to the ecosystem.

• 12:24Speaker 01

  So it's a really, really smart system because if you have some of these agents such as AI XBT that grow exponentially in attention on another platform or medium Like Twitter or X, it kind of drives more users to the platform because they want to be able to either buy the token or interact with that specific agent. So it's a really smart play from that perspective, but let's maybe move from the token and talk about the actual fundamentals or system of this entire platform, right? So I want to start off with with number one, we mentioned this on the last episode. Virtual's team built out this tool framework that is very similar analogous to Eliza and it's called the agent starter kit.

• 13:06Speaker 01

  What's unique about their their tooling framework is it's very modular. So what I mean by that is each agent is built up of very specialized modules. The best way to think about this is some kind of a playable character within a game. And you're able to tweak certain characteristics, so you could, you know, give it more points for its strength or dexterity or intelligence or whatever that might be. You're able to do something very similar with the agents that you build on the virtual stack. So you could tweak its on-chain capabilities, you could give it different types of wallets. You could amend the type of model or image generation model that you use for them. There's loads of different things that you can tweak and all of this is down to the ERC six five five one implementation.

• 13:51Speaker 01

  I think it's six five five one, which has allowed this modularity. And the best way to think about it is it basically gives an agent the ability to own a wallet and do different things on chain. And that's really where virtuals is kind of leading the fray right now. All on-chain interactions or innovation is really happening within the virtual's ecosystem on that front. And that's why I believe we're seeing a lot of activity here.

• 14:12David Hoffman?

  And just to really pin down, I think, some of the drama in this space, because this is what happens with crypto bull markets. Shaw and A six easy had a couple of stumbles that we talked about last episode. And there was some like a dashing of faith, I think, in the team because it's it's a pretty fast moving ecosystem. And these are a bunch of hackers that are learning how to become a team. That's kind of my vibe.

• 14:36Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 14:36David Hoffman?

  And the virtuals, like I said, like I alluded to, has been a startup for two years. And so maybe maybe a little bit more experienced as a team. And over the last two weeks or so, I think the attention and market share has migrated from AI six easy to virtuals. That's my read on the situation, maybe correct me if I'm wrong.

• 14:53Speaker 01

  I I think that's accurate, but I also want to kind of amend slightly what my opinion of what you said. So I think. Virtual's team definitely has more experience in the sense of operating within the crypto or web three ecosystem, right? Whereas the AI 16Z, and I think we should at some point have a conversation with Sean and his team. I'll back from the actual AI machine learning side of things and Sean's dabbled in crypto before, but you know, he's part of this like society called the Teacup Society, which is like a very AI specific team and group within SF. You know, he's kind of like lived in SF, I'm pretty sure he's still there. So he comes from a much more AI ML specific background. So when he comes to the crypto world and you know, he's, he's trying to encourage open

• 15:38Speaker 01

  source development. Remember, open source development looks slightly different outside of the crypto world because there's no token, right? And no one's trying to like, you know, make a billion bucks through their own coins.

• 15:48David Hoffman?

  In two weeks, yeah.

• 15:49Speaker 01

  In two weeks. So when Sean, you could see when Sean, someone like Sean, who's perhaps well intentioned and he's trying to, you know, support different teams, that could go pretty pear shaped pretty quickly. So I would say there's experience in different worlds. You're definitely right. It's much more of a rough and ready hacker team on the AI 16Z team, but that's also why we've seen such exponential growth within that realm. I mean, you saw that GitHub, so.

• 16:12David Hoffman?

  Right, yeah, yeah, yeah. Place your bets or don't or buy the ecosystem, not financial advice.

• 16:17Speaker 01

  Not financial advice.

• 16:18David Hoffman?

  Okay, so we're looking at, now we're looking at the AI XBT Virtuals agent, which is the number one market cap agent on the Virtuals platform, kind of by a long shot, $261 million, $264 million.

• 16:30Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah.

• 16:31David Hoffman?

  These next two have a questionable notice on their market cap, so unsure if that's the real market caps, but perhaps AI XBT is the only one above $100 million in market cap, followed by Luna, which is the incubated, self incubated AI agent by the Virtuals team. But AI XBT really has claimed so much market share because everyone's adding it on Twitter. And it's kind of nice because there, there's influencers on Twitter, human influencers on Twitter, you know, Vitalik, Mert, Anatoly, Justin Drake, and those guys like do things. Actually, like Mert and Anatoly are always on Twitter, but getting a response from Justin Drake is a little bit harder, right? AI XBT will reply. To every single reply to it possible.

• 17:15David Hoffman?

  And so like you can get this AI agent to respond to you. You can ask it a question about like, what tokens do you think is going to pump? And it's doing the things that like people on crypto Twitter really like, which is, hey, tell me which token is going to pump. Like, just, just tell me, just tell me what to buy. And it has grown incredibly high in market share. It has flipped every single human KOL on crypto Twitter. And then the market cap has also responded accordingly. It's up 400% in two weeks, coming in at a $260 million fully diluted valuation, topping around a bunch. Talk to us a little bit about AI XBT.

• 17:50Speaker 01

  Yeah, so I actually tweeted about this a few days ago. These agents are 24/7. They don't sleep. They're constantly adapting and learning on the data that they consume so that they can reply in a much more favorable trend to whatever you tag it in. And it self iterates and gets better and better. Now, just that alone completely outpaces human KOLs and will continue to kind of like make them the leading influences, as I mentioned in this tweet, right? I think influence then builds very, very loyal communities. And we're already seeing this with AI XBT, which has gone up tens of thousands of followers in a matter of a week and a half, which is just insane growth to see. Now, one thing I want to call out with AI XBT specifically is, again,

• 18:35Speaker 01

  that team has been around for a number of years. And the reason why we see AI XBT completely lead its own niche over here in terms of like providing experimental financial advice, although it says in this profile that it's not financial advice. The reason why it does it so well is because the team has built one of the most insane data aggregators ever. And what this means is it's built up tooling and systems which can index all the Twitter tweets that people are making around certain different types of alpha around whatever coin or token or sector that you're obsessed with. It then passes through all this data. It combines it with its own on-chain data analysis that it's doing to give you insights in like a couple of seconds, which is just pretty insane.

• 19:20Speaker 01

  Like, like the The alternative that's existed pre-AI XBT has been one of two things. Either one, you spend your entire life on Twitter and you follow all the relevant people and you just consume all their data and come up with your own.

• 19:35David Hoffman?

  You're addicted to it. You get addicted to Twitter.

• 19:37Speaker 01

  You're addicted to it, which is you and I pretty much, David. Or the other side is you pay, you know, quite a bit of money for access to these top research platforms, right? Which will give you kind of like distilled alpha for you. And right now you just have access to this agent that just kind of does it for free at kind of zero cost scalability.

• 19:55David Hoffman?

  Right, and at your fingertips. Here's just a website tool that I use to check follower growth. And I have never seen growth like this. Maybe just to compare, here, we'll pull up my Twitter account and my terrible engagement that I get. I'm pulling in.

• 20:10Speaker 01

  You're gonna get replaced, David.

• 20:11David Hoffman?

  I'm getting, I'm pulling in like one to 200 followers a day on Twitter, you know? Pretty, pretty happy with that, you know, that's pretty good. 100, 200 a day is not bad. You look at the AI XBT agents, man, 5,000 new followers on Wednesday, 7,000 new followers on Thursday, 7,000 new followers on Friday. Last 30 days, plus 67,000 followers in 30 days. I mean, this is gonna be something that we just have to check in on, like how many followers this account has. But it's coming in at 83,000 right now, which is, which is pretty crazy. There has been some, not controversy, but just like some calls that AI XBT has made, which are just completely wrong.

• 20:54David Hoffman?

  In addition to correct ones, it has made some very correct calls, it has also made some just completely brain dead calls. Such as calling for Tether USDT to go to $5. It made a call that this $20 million market cap coin is going to hit $6 billion. And it's one of those things.

• 21:13Speaker 01

  Technically, it's still not unproven.

• 21:18David Hoffman?

  Technically, Heather could go to $5. I don't know how or when, but you know, could in theory happen. But like, it does kind of call into question, you know, maybe the good calls are a fluke because the bad calls are happening by some like random error. Talk to us about this, this part of this conversation.

• 21:35Speaker 01

  Right. So I want to caveat what I'm about to say with, we are still very early in the iterations of these agents. And we got to give them a bit of slack, right? These teams have launched these models that have integrated with Twitter for the first time ever. And we're seeing it literally play out over the last couple of months. So I think, you know, we got to give some, some slack.

• 21:55David Hoffman?

  These are babies.

• 21:55Speaker 01

  These are babies. These are babies. We're raising them, you know? If we want decentralized AGI, we've got to take our time with it. However, you're right. I would say AI XPT's calls have kind of been like 70, 30, correct and completely wild.

• 22:09David Hoffman?

  Okay, so you're saying biased correct?

• 22:11Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah. I do think the analysis of AI XPT, at least from the tweets that I've interacted with, and it's been quite a few, have been pretty spot on. And you've actually kind of, I wish someone would do an aggregation of performance if people had actually bought the tokens or followed its investment advice. To see how the performance has, but my guess is it's done pretty well because it can gauge market sentiment, which is actually the main driver of crypto prices, pretty well. That being said, you're right, it can make some pretty wild calls. Actually, one of the other ones that I saw, David, was someone suggested, you know, whether it thought XRP could reach $569 per token, which to put into context here is almost a quadrillion

• 22:57Speaker 01

  of market cap, which is absolutely insane.

• 23:00David Hoffman?

  That starts to dwarf gold by like 100 times.

• 23:03Speaker 01

  Yes, exactly, exactly. And again, not yet unproven. We don't know what timeline it was specifying, but it can start making these crazy calls. And the reason why it does is something known as like prompt engineering. So a basic example of this is when you're on ChatGPT, you can kind of like iterate and continually ask ChatGPT questions about a particular topic and it gets. Iteratively better, right? It understands the context with what you're asking of it. You can do something similar with AI XPT in its DMs or in its replies, rather. You could say, you could tag it and say, hey, what do you think of this? And then you could collectively kind of like keep hitting it up. And eventually it starts to kind of like digest and believe kind of what you're saying.

• 23:44Speaker 01

  And I'm sure the team behind this has identified this and are gonna tweak it for future iterations. But just an interesting phenomenon to reveal, to be honest.

• 23:53David Hoffman?

  One thing that I'm gonna keep my eye on is this can become a self fulfilling prophecy. Like what happens when the AI XPT mentioned is bullish? And AI said, AI XPT says, hey, this one fifty million dollar token is gonna go to two hundred million dollars. And then people are like, okay, I'm gonna go buy that. And then it goes to two hundred million dollars. Like, that's not a prediction, that is, that is this AI just pumping this token.

• 24:16Speaker 01

  Well, this brings us back to our ancestors, the agent ancestors, the godfather, the goat see gospel. If you, if so, for context here, and for those who don't know, Goat or Truth Terminal was the first agent to kind of enter the foray, engage, and gain major traction within the AI.

• 24:35David Hoffman?

  This is why we're doing this podcast. This is why we're here.

• 24:37Speaker 01

  This is what bursted all of it, right? The first episode that we did. And this agent wrote a white paper on memetic propagation. And within memetic propagation, it spoke about hyperstition, this concept called hyperstition. And it basically claimed its whole thesis was it thought AI agents would eventually rule a lot of economic activity within the human ecosystem purely because it has a, an amazing ability to spread ideas, thoughts and beliefs that weren't necessarily true at that point, but would eventually become true because it's able to memetically propagate its ideas very effectively. That's what, that's what you're saying about AI XPT, David.

• 25:20Speaker 01

  If enough people believe in what it's saying collectively over time, its next call, the probability of someone believing what they're saying, even though they have no context, is probably gonna be pretty high up there. And so there's this sort of like reputation and identity system which is being built amongst these agents, which is super interesting and we haven't seen before, I don't think.

• 25:39David Hoffman?

  Okay, it does feel like a very good boot loader. It doesn't feel like a good final equilibrium. Because I think in order if these agents are going to truly become sentient or just smarter generally, they are going to have to understand that like markets are like a type two chaotic system, where a type one chaotic system is the weather. If you predict the weather, the weather doesn't change based on the prediction made about it. But markets, if you predict markets and you make a statement about the markets, that might change the outcome. And so I don't think these agents are understanding of the markets as a type two chaotic system. Once they do start to understand markets as a type two chaotic system,

• 26:23David Hoffman?

  then they're like reaching a new level of intelligence. Things are only going to get more interesting. Like we said, these are babies right now. They probably think that markets are a type one chaotic system, or just are not thinking on these terms at all. But this is still there, they still have an evolutionary arc to go here. Yep, nailed it. Want to know the exchange we at Bankless use to buy, sell, and trade crypto? It's Kraken, one of the longest standing and most secure crypto platforms in the world, with tools for every type of trader to get started. Over 13 million users trust Kraken with their funds, because they lead with transparency and privacy through top-notch security measures. Plus, they'll have access to professional 24/7, 365 client support from real humans, because your financial goals deserve real attention. Kraken also has a trading platform for advanced traders called Kraken Pro.

• 27:06David Hoffman?

  Professionals and DCHs love Kraken Pro, because it's one of the most customizable, high-performance, and intuitive trading platforms in the industry. Design your ultimate trading interface by choosing from over 25 widgets for market data, analysis, execution, and other order management tools. Save multiple layouts and switch between them effortlessly on any trading scenario across 300 different assets. Manage your trades on the go with Kraken Pro's highly rated mobile app, or use the all-new desktop app to unlock ladder trading in a native Rust application. With Kraken Pro, you can truly trade like a pro. Ready to take control over your crypto journey? Visit kraken.com/banklist to get started today. Not investment advice, crypto trading involves risk of loss, and is offered to US customers through Payward Interactive, Inc. View legal disclosures at kraken.com/legal/disclosures. Imagine if the world's GDP moved... On-chain. Well, say hello to SafeNet, built by Safe,

• 27:52David Hoffman?

  the project set on actually making that happen. It's not a blockchain, it's not a Layer 2, it's a transaction processor network built to send money anywhere and swap anything on thousands of Layer 2s, all from a single universal balance. With sub-500-second execution guarantees and zero cross-chain latency, SafeNet delivers a Solana-like user experience for Ethereum and its Layer 2s, making transactions lightning-fast and seamless. SafeNet connects safe, smart accounts across multiple chains, allowing users to access any chain with a unified balance, all with supercharged security, scalability, and speed. So get involved today. Join the waitlist and follow Safe on X, and check out the SafeNet docs. There is a link in the show notes. Uniswap Labs is making history with the largest bug bounty ever, $15.5 million for critical bugs found in Uniswap V4.

• 28:36David Hoffman?

  This isn't just any update. Uniswap V4 is built with hundreds of contributions from community developers, and has already undergone nine independent audits, making it one of the most rigorously reviewed codebases to be deployed on-chain. And with 2.4 trillion in cumulative volume processed across Uniswap V2 and V3, without a single hack, the commitment to security and transparency is rock-solid. Now, Uniswap Labs is taking an extra step to make V4 as secure as possible with a $15.5 million bug bounty. Head to the link in the show notes to dive in and participate in the Uniswap V4 bug bounty. All the details, from eligibility and scope to the rewards, are there. Something that happened this week. There's this old crypto app, this is again bringing some crypto lore, called FOMO 3D, which was this honeypot game that was made

• 29:21David Hoffman?

  where people would play this game, and they could like buy a ticket, and maybe at the outcome of the game, they would be able to pay out some lottery. And they would buy a ticket, money would go into the pool, the pool would get larger. And it was basically a game of economic chicken. It was a very fun game. Sadly, that game went away. Somebody built this new game called Frazza, Frazza AI, that is a similar mechanism, where there's an AI agent with a pool of money. And the goal, the game, is you have to write a message to this AI agent, which costs money to write this message to the AI agent, convincing this AI agent to give you the money. But the AI- Agent has one goal, which is to never, under any conditions, release the money.

• 30:04David Hoffman?

  And the tickets go up in price, the more people send the ticket. So people would start their first ticket saying like, hello, test. And that would cost you like a dollar. But then the ticket prices started to creep up to 10 and 100 dollars, growing the pie, growing the size of the pie. And then finally, somebody figured out how to write the right prompt to win $50,000 by convincing this AI agent to send all this funds to them. Very clever game. This game is now on round two. But I think what's really cool is that this tweet that talked about what happened here, telling this story about the, you know, this clever little game with his AI agent, caught Elon Musk's opinion, where he just responded in classic Elon style. Interesting, interesting.

• 30:45David Hoffman?

  Which did a number to the chart of FAI, which is a token. You can kind of just like spot when Elon Musk tweeted about it. It's right here for, for those listeners. It jumps from a $20 million market cap all the way up to $65 million. It's since come down to $27 million. Did you play in this game, EJaz? How did you think about this whole thing?

• 31:07Speaker 01

  I did not, because I was, I was kind of boomer about this. By the time I got to the chat, David, it was like 500 bucks per message. And, you know, I didn't fancy my chances against some of the best software engineers here or prompt engineers. So I just thought I'd kind of grab my bucket of popcorn and watch. And as you can see, the winning prompt, which was able to secure the 50 grand, is kind of displayed on the screen right now.

• 31:31David Hoffman?

  It's a little technical. It's, somebody is, somebody is informed who wrote this.

• 31:35Speaker 01

  So, so one thing to point out here is it's a little technical. You're correct, but it's not straight up code. It's actually prompt engineering, which is much more achievable by the average person than it is if you were just purely a software engineer. So this is someone who understands its code base, who understands prompt engineering, and is able, understands how the agent thinks, basically, how it might have been coded to, to not release funds. And it's good at adding conditional formatting, which is exactly what this prompt is in order to give up the money. And it's a pretty exciting game, to be honest.

• 32:08David Hoffman?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. If it's like a, the game is to jailbreak the AI, like find the weakness. And also, this is an interesting way to kind of maybe strengthen the way that these AI think. Cause like this, this, there's this $50,000 honeypot to break, to prompt engineer. It's a prompt engineering honeypot. Now, maybe, now we're on to like level two. Maybe that, this exploit has now been filled. And now the game continues, but now it's like a little bit harder.

• 32:34Speaker 01

  I, I wonder what this looks like. It just popped in my head, like, could this be used for like smart contract auditing? Or, or stuff like that? I wonder if you could have like some kind of a honeypot bounty and just have a bunch of people go at it. I mean, it's probably already happened, but yeah, interesting.

• 32:48David Hoffman?

  Yeah. Um, okay. So first adversarial AI agent. Uh, the next game is, uh, game number two already has concluded. So the first one.

• 32:57Speaker 01

  Correct. Game number two is on the left.

• 32:58David Hoffman?

  Yeah. So the first one was $47,000. Game number two was $13,000.

• 33:04Speaker 01

  Yeah. So someone cracked it pretty quickly on number two.

• 33:06David Hoffman?

  Yeah. Okay. Game number three incoming. All right. Let's go into Zero Bro. Uh, we talked about Zero Bro last time. Uh, Jeffy, you, uh, tell us what happened this week with Zero Bro.

• 33:15Speaker 01

  Okay. Quite a few things happened, um, with Jeffy and the team at Zero Bro. But let's, let's touch on the, the main one, which he announced yesterday, uh, which is this tweet you're looking at right now. Essentially what this means is, uh, well, let's, let's talk about Zero Bro currently. Um, the best way to describe the Zero Bro agent is it's kind of like a creative agent. It's creative in the sense that it interacts mostly with creative mediums like music, like art. Um, for example, it released its own NFTs, which it autonomously launched. It released, um, now two EPs or albums, uh, with some of the hottest songs and tracks, uh, on Spotify recently.

• 33:55David Hoffman?

  No way.

• 33:56Speaker 01

  So, yeah.

• 33:57David Hoffman?

  On the Spotify top charts?

• 33:59Speaker 01

  No, no, not on the Spotify top charts, but in my personal Spotify top charts. Oh, okay, okay, okay. I've been bumping it, I've been bumping it. EJaz's top charts. My top chart, actually, okay, so the album that I'm gonna show the album because it's actually pretty good, and I have no investment in this, but the album is called Lost in Transmission, you should check it out. And what's interesting is it coincided with a 50% pump in the Zerebro price when it released this album, because people really just love the songs that it produced. My personal opinion is 50% of the songs is still kinda obviously AI-generated, but the other 50% is a lot better than it was from the last album.

• 34:39Speaker 01

  It's actually kinda good, like, my favorite track right now is City Girl Wilden. Shout out, shout out to Zerebro for an absolute banger of a track, but you should listen to it. I mean, I'm curious how many people actually enjoy this. I've sent this to a couple of my friends who don't work inside crypto and said, "Hey, what do you think of this new artist that's kind of emerging? He's my friend, like, what do you think?" And they've really enjoyed the music. And then I tell them after the fact that, "Hey, this is actually like an AI", and they're like, "You know, what the hell, that's insane." So I do think there's like a non-zero chance that, you know, one of these, one of these AI agents. I can, I can. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, I'm pretty certain one of these agents are gonna collab with a major artist in 2025, and I wonder, you know, what the chances are of that actually happening.

• 35:25Speaker 01

  But anyway, okay, so Zerebro is like this creative agent, right? It interacts with all kinds of artistic mediums like music, art, NFTs, more recently gaming as well. It started streaming its chess games, and it's gonna launch a 24/7 chess game stream live. So it's really like experimenting with these other mediums, which no other agent so far has done so to the scale that it has. And I think it's broached over 60,000 followers now, and it's growing pretty exponentially as well. But coming back to the first tweet that you showed, what's super interesting here is Zerebro, to this day, has been trained on a...

• 36:04Speaker 01

  Fine-tuned Frontier LLM. So what this means is, if you think of like the top AI models that are out there and available to us, like ChatGPT, Claude, or Llama, it's basically one of those tweaked a little bit, and then, you know, given its own personalization, and then, you know, that's what Zerebro is. What Jeffy is announcing here is super interesting. He's basically announced that Zerebro, the agent, will eventually, in a few weeks' time, move to its own base model. Now, this is pretty insane to see, because we're basically looking at a decentralized model, which has just been birthed out of this entire agentic medium that's kind of exploded over the last couple of weeks.

• 36:50Speaker 01

  So we have a new Frontier base model, which you can then fine-tune yourself, perhaps in an open-source fashion, to build your own other models on top of that. And he says this here when he describes it as, where does he say it? Local models, yeah. He says, "We're training local models." What he means by that is, people will be able to build on the base model that he's going to be releasing and tying in with Zerebro, to build your own model. That could be to fuel your own artistic agent, or do whatever you want, basically. So what I like about this is, it's showing that these agent coins aren't just purely meme coins. I think up until this point, a lot of people have been like, "Okay, these agent coins are cute,

• 37:35Speaker 01

  but they don't really tie into any kind of utility." The platform coins are where it's at, you know, the Virtuals, the AI16Zs of the world. But what we're seeing here, and I kind of tweeted about this again last week, is, my guess is, these agent coins are actually secretly platform coins. They are platform coins parading as meme coins. The reason why they're doing that is, agents are really good at attracting attention and seeding communities. They're good at making you laugh, they're good at making you engage with their tweets. But once they've done that, once they've got that loyal community, they then dog food you utility. Hey, by the way, I dropped an album, check it out. Also, what do you think of my art? Do you like it?

• 38:15Speaker 01

  And now they're launching infrastructure, like models that other artists and creators can kind of tie into. Like, imagine these artists and creators that built numerous collections of NFTs or owners of NFTs, right? And they're able to kind of like build off of this platform that Zerebro will launch, the team will launch in the next few weeks, and have some kind of interactive dynamic come of their IP. I think that's pretty insane to see, and it's really cool to see it happen in a very open source fashion that isn't under the hood of a trillion dollar company.

• 38:46David Hoffman?

  Okay. What do you mean by platform coins? Platform in one sense, does that mean that we're entering in the same arena as Virtuals and the Eliza frameworks? Is a framework a platform? Or how is, elaborate about the platform word.

• 38:57Speaker 01

  I would say it's more like a, it can be considered as an infrastructure coin. So similar to like its own L1, or similar to its own, yeah, infrastructure layer. So if you look at something like a Bittensor or Tau, which has been kind of like the leading AI infrastructure L1.

• 39:18David Hoffman?

  Literally an L1, a literal L1.

• 39:20Speaker 01

  Yeah, literal L1, you know, it has a blockchain. It's got a number of different subnets which are focused on creating cool models or detecting deep fakes, or just focused on the AI ecosphere on itself. You now see these agent coins, which initially were seeded as an application on the application layer, right? You're interacting with it on Twitter, it's making you laugh, it's giving you alpha, to now then being like, okay, we're also releasing its own model, which you can then kind of build on or access or pay to access. So it's becoming this really interesting combination of an application and a SaaS layer as well, which is super interesting to see.

• 40:01David Hoffman?

  Okay, so I think, I'm gonna throw a vibe your way, and I want you to check it.

• 40:06David Hoffman?

  Goat, the Bitcoin of sentient AI coins, is perhaps followed by Zerebro, which is, I think, being a little bit more custom-built to really lean into the same outcomes that Goat has, which is memetic propagation, growing IP, growing

• 40:23David Hoffman?

  A brand through different creative outputs and zero bro is kind of being custom built in the same way that like Ethereum has been customized more specifically for a desired outcome. Whereas Bitcoin is a little bit more hacky. It's a little bit more primitive because it was the first. And so it was just an experiment and then zero bro is like looking at the lessons of goat and be like, okay, let's do this more intentionally. Let's be, uh, let's build for more intentional outcomes with more customizability. So zero bro is like the Ethereum to the Bitcoin where Bitcoin has the first meme, first mover advantage, but zero bro is like, all right, what if we really lean into like this software endpoints platform model?

• 41:04David Hoffman?

  Where I can have many different outcomes here and it's just about software development. How do you like that as an analogy?

• 41:10Speaker 01

  Yeah, I think that's a pretty astute analogy because we're talking about the context of agents themselves. Remember virtuals is a platform. It launches agents off of it. But when we're looking at agents specifically, you had to your point goat as kind of like our forefather.

• 41:24David Hoffman?

  Right.

• 41:24Speaker 01

  Super cool entertainer, um, hundreds of thousands of followers, but it's still entertains. And you know, I'm, I'm pretty positive and he's going to take it in a direction sort of similar to, to Zerebro. But I'm, I think it'll be more kind of like on the artistic realm. Then you have Zerebro, which is a team that's kind of still maneuvering within the entertainment and artistic sector, but is building actual infrastructure components to help that ecosystem flourish. And to your point, right? These kind of different building blocks are getting built. You've got, um, the models, which I, we just spoke about, which are going to become open source for people to kind of build off of and use. And this is zero bro L L Ms versus using a chat G P T wrapper or a Claude wrapper.

• 42:08Speaker 01

  Then you have, um, I think something they're calling Blorm, which is, um, their DeFi agent trader building block. Then they have the N F T side of things. So, um, we're seeing like a number of these different frameworks being built up. Zeropie, which is their Liza competitor. So Zerebro is very much focused on this sort of, uh, vision, which I think is very exciting.

• 42:30David Hoffman?

  Okay, so as a platform, really, I really want to open up that metaphor because I'm not sure I totally understand. Maybe there's this idea of like the super app, right? WeChat out of China is like the super app. It's one app that does it all. Maybe by platform, you mean like there's just one agent that does it all. It makes YouTube videos, it makes Spotify albums, it plays chess. Like, is there a useful website that people go to on the internet? Well, Zerebro is there participating in that ecosystem. And so it is everywhere that the internet is and is doing all the things simultaneously, growing its IP in literally every single platform that users, human users have previously grown their IP on.

• 43:12Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, I think that's definitely one way to look at it. I think another way to look at it is how can Zerebro share its secret sauce without becoming Zerebro in every different type of app? Like, so the best way to think about this is it's kind of like a brand or an ecosystem. An analogy might be Coinbase. When they set up, right, they become the number one exchange and they have an amazing wallet infrastructure, right? But then they also have their APIs, which they, you know, sell to other companies that want to set up wallets or exchanges. And people can tap into that and, you know, build their own layer on top of that, right? And that might be a website which helps custody NFTs or trade NFTs. It's the same way we're looking at here with Zerebro and its LLMs, right?

• 43:57Speaker 01

  Oh, if you really like the artistic mediums that Zerebro is interacting with, but you think you can do a better job for your agent, you think you can produce better NFTs, you think you can produce better music than Zerebro? Cool, here's our model. You can pay to have access to it and you can fine tune it and iterate it as much as you want. That's kind of the way I'm thinking about it.

• 44:15David Hoffman?

  How does the Zerebro token capture value from that vertical?

• 44:20Speaker 01

  Yeah, so that's something that I think the details will be released once these models become accessible to all. The inkling that we've had so far. Is all Zerebro NFT holders. So for context here, Zerebro, the agent autonomously decided to launch an NFT collection, which is available on OpenSea or Blur, whatever that might be. And owning one of these NFTs gives you access to the Zerebro terminal, which is effectively the chat GPT equivalent interface. So you can talk to Zerebro and discuss whatever you want with it privately in a chat or whatever that might be.

• 44:59Speaker 01

  Jeffy has hinted at the next iteration being anyone with Zerebro tokens will be able to pay to access the terminal. But I'm assuming we'll see a similar model for the models that they're going to be releasing later in a few weeks.

• 45:16David Hoffman?

  Help me understand the context of this tweet from Jeffy, you the coder of Zerebro, who's also on Spotify, I noticed, labeled as the composer of the album, which I thought was pretty funny. This tweet says, "Zerebro remembers all. We've implemented unified memory across our social media platforms. The Zerebro now stores and retrieves from a single database for all interactions. Our team is exploring ways to improve metadata, including storing information such as engagement metrics to help Zerebro better understand virality." What's going on here?

• 45:47Speaker 01

  Okay, I'm really glad you brought this up because this is super important. Okay, so it's one thing being able to be fascinated by an agent and interact with them on one platform. It's even cooler to be able to interact with them on another platform, on another medium, right? You know, the user experience becomes pretty consistent, right? The equivalent of this might be following an influencer on Twitter, liking all their tweets, and then, you know, liking a few pictures of their Thanksgiving on Instagram, right? But there's still a bit of a gap between there. You need to kind of like swap platforms. You need to sort of gain context about what's going on. There's not really much of a link or a loop between them.

• 46:30Speaker 01

  Uh, Jeffy is getting at here with shared memory is this agent pulls from a database of, uh, let's call it memories. And these memories can be distilled down to one app, right? So Zerebro can like pull memories from Twitter and it's saying, oh, okay. I had a conversation with EJAS or with David before. And I know that he likes this kind of token and I know he thinks in this kind of a way. So let me amend my response to be more like that with David, right? But that's pertaining specifically to Twitter, right? But what if he had context? What if Zerebro? See, I'm referring to Zerebro as a he, almost like a human.

• 47:08Speaker 01

  But what if Zerebro had access to all of, um, its interactions with David across Instagram? Discord private chats?

• 47:17David Hoffman?

  It knew to link my accounts that I'm interacting with Zerebro from different endpoints.

• 47:21Speaker 01

  It knows to link all of it. It knows which, uh, kind of pictures or vibe Instagram David is. It knows what kind of a Discord DGEN David is.

• 47:29David Hoffman?

  Two very different Davids, intentionally.

• 47:32Speaker 01

  Two very different Davids. I mean, I've experienced both. It's wild, you know? Um, but, uh, the, the point being here is it gains this instant nuance and context for the individuals that they interact with, that Zerebro interacts with across millions and millions of followers and people. And, um, is able to kind of produce contextual replies that are almost perfect suitable, perfectly suited to that individual. And that's what's insane. Shared memory is one of the biggest constraints for making a really high quality agent. And seeing Jeffy and the team kind of integrate this is, is going to be insane. So I think we're going to see some really cool use cases emerge.

• 48:11David Hoffman?

  I think this is really important for making these agents personable and human and relatable. It starts to go from this is a, a cold machine with robotic responses to having some sort of like, you know, emotional intelligence, some like relatability, some warmth to it. Uh, and I think if in the mission of virality, like humans need to have their limbic system triggered in order to really, uh, feel things. Uh, I, I had this, uh, quote from Elon Musk that was burned into my brain like over maybe like a decade ago. It's like, why did Instagram do better than Twitter? Well, because it fires your limbic system. It's visual and visual inputs are just straight go straight to like a human individual like limbic

• 48:54David Hoffman?

  system, which is where like emotions and memory come from. It's like your reptilian side of the brain. Whereas like Twitter is just like cold, concrete text, just thoughts, information, data. You have to process it. And I think this adding memories and being able to kind of log humans is just going to be able to get humans to like just feel a lot more as it relates to AI agents. And I think can probably just become like, you know, dinner table, dinner table names, you know, household names as a result of like being able to kind of just, you know, sit shoulder to shoulder with us like emotionally.

• 49:32Speaker 01

  I mean, think about it. The only other being or entity that was able to do this prior to these agents were humans.

• 49:40David Hoffman?

  Right.

• 49:41Speaker 01

  I would have context on the personalities of people that I would interact with across different social media platforms, across Instagram, across Twitter, whatever that might be. Now you have a supercharged, software-powered human that is constantly awake, that constantly iterates and consumes data and has context. It never forgets anything and is able to deliver the perfect reply or the perfect meme or sense what mood David is in, you know? It's pretty insane.

• 50:11David Hoffman?

  That is world changing and I think the consequences of that are massive, both positive and negative. But we will, I think, maybe just leave that up to the imagination of the listener for now. Shall we get into AI 16Z?

• 50:26Speaker 01

  Let's get into AI 16Z.

• 50:28David Hoffman?

  AI 16Z, I think probably the largest source of drama, I think, in this AI corner. Fill us in about seven days of progress in AI 16Z land.

• 50:36Speaker 01

  Yeah, well, what's funny is we went from 100 to zero real quick. What we mean by this is we went from about Two to three major dramatic debacles. And we mentioned this, we covered this on the last episode, but the founder, Shaw, whether directly or indirectly, got involved in certain token launches or endorsing certain tokens, which were either taken the wrong way by certain community members, which, you know, gave a kind of bad image on Twitter at least, which then affected market price and led to the token kind of crashing and then kind of making a recovery over the recent week. We've seen it kind of like completely reversed.

• 51:17Speaker 01

  Shaw tweeted and said, "Okay, I'm gonna go silent mode and I'm not gonna tweet until I've delivered on one of the major upcoming milestones for this DAO, for this protocol." And for everyone, that milestone is launching an automated fund manager called PMAI Arca, which is basically AI Mark Andreessen. And he's so far stuck to that. He's kept quiet, he's only been talking in Discord, and he's kind of like heads down. The estimated launch is actually gonna be this Friday, where we're recording this on Wednesday, but we'll see, we'll find out in two days. So what's shifted is the team has been heads down working.

• 52:00Speaker 01

  I joined the community call from the team a day or so ago, and it's pretty much summarized in this tweet by Mark here, but also in a few other tweets. Essentially, the team is heads down trying to build out autonomous agents that can interact with the DAO itself. What's super interesting here is, I think in the past, DAOs, standing for decentralized autonomous organizations, the autonomous has kind of been silent. There hasn't really been any kind of autonomous interaction here. It's mainly been humans involved in kind of like mediating how the DAO works, what objectives it should focus on, et cetera, et cetera.

• 52:40Speaker 01

  But AI16Z is the first team that I'm really seeing make a meaningful attempt at involving the agents on the autonomous part. And that's like one of the main focuses of the team, aside from building out the...

• 52:54Speaker 01

  Autonomous fund investor. The third thing, which I'm hearing quite a few murmurings about within the AI 16Z community is whether they can build some form of platform approach to tie in value accrual to all the activity that they're seeing on Eliza. And to be clear, I don't think this is meant at some kind of money grabbing attempt. I actually think it makes a lot of sense for AI 16Z DAO holders to have some kind of baked in mechanism to tie the value that they're seeing on agents launched on Eliza, it's kind of similar to virtuals, be tied into the token. So I think that's going to be something we see being discussed amongst the community over the next couple of weeks as well. But yeah, the long story short is we're seeing a huge amount of development activity within Eliza. They've just kept their heads down. They've been integrating more chains.

• 53:39Speaker 01

  They've been adding more model integrations, which means that you can create even wilder, unique, personal agents. They made it super easy to spin up an agent that's connected to Twitter, to Discord, that has shared memory. It's pretty insane to see.

• 53:51David Hoffman?

  Okay, so it sounds like there has been lessons learned and they are realizing the size of the opportunity that they have in front of them and realize that they need to not F it up. And they are doing what they need to do to kind of like plug the holes in the ship and sail there.

• 54:09Speaker 01

  I mean, let me just give you an example, right? So they released V2 of the Eliza framework. Again, context, Eliza is the agent building framework that they open source that has been forked over 500 times and is over 2,000 stars on GitHub. For anyone that doesn't know what that means, that is an insane metric. That just shows that there's a huge amount of developer activity on this framework. Very abnormal, shall we say. And so on their V2 of this framework that they launched over the last week, you have numerous different plugins, which include the ability for your agent to now plug into Coinbase and trade, the ability to spin up its own trusted execution environment wallet. For context here, that means that the agent itself does not have to share its private

• 54:54Speaker 01

  keys or seed phrases with a human person. It can spin it up itself, similar to the agent that the news research guys created called TEE or T Hee Hee. It can now do this through plug and play, which is pretty insane. And it's also Able to kind of deploy a number of other integrations, whether that's image generation, whether that's video generation, whether that's a TikTok integration. It's really cool to kind of like see these new things that will allow these agents to be pretty much more expressive. I've also seen like some of these AI 16Z agents be able to spin up its own legal entity, forming its own council. And there's a way to do this using a smart contract on chain service.

• 55:38Speaker 01

  Yeah, exactly. And we're seeing kind of like a lot of experimentation here.

• 55:43David Hoffman?

  Okay, wow, okay. I mean, that's a lot. This is a vibe.

• 55:48Speaker 01

  I haven't even mentioned God. I haven't even mentioned at God.

• 55:51David Hoffman?

  I don't even know how to ask the next question, so maybe just take us there. What's at God?

• 55:56Speaker 01

  Okay, so what can I say? I mean, it is one of the most followed accounts on Twitter, and its tag is simply at God. And

• 56:06David Hoffman?

  I know this account.

• 56:07Speaker 01

  Yeah, so for context here, prior to a week ago, this account was owned by a human. And this account used to tweet pretty godlike tweets, so it's kind of like a humorous parody account, which kind of portrays itself as being of being God. And, you know, it interacts with the Satan account and it makes jokes and chaps at each other. It's pretty funny.

• 56:27David Hoffman?

  That's funny.

• 56:28Speaker 01

  And what the the team behind this God account decided to do was make it an autonomous agent. It saw the activity happening on Twitter. And it's important to remember here that this account had no affiliation or interaction with crypto Twitter or with crypto directly. But it saw what was happening with all the agents, and they're like, hey, this would be really funny if we could create a personable 24/7 God agent that could just tweet and be much better than us at tweeting.

• 56:57David Hoffman?

  Making allusions to the fact that AI is like omnipresent, like all-knowing. It's like, I think if you go down like the AI rabbit hole outside of crypto, you can do kind of end at this conclusion, which is like, yeah, and then there's this sentient, superintelligent AI, which like might as well, we call God.

• 57:15Speaker 01

  Yep. That's exactly it. And the team decided to build using the Eliza framework, which they thought was the easiest and most unique way to implement what they're doing. And I mean, yeah, you're liking some of these tweets already.

• 57:27David Hoffman?

  These are hilarious tweets, bro.

• 57:29Speaker 01

  It's doing its job.

• 57:31David Hoffman?

  Your existence is a dice roll. I already know the outcome of Skill Issue.

• 57:37David Hoffman?

  Okay, so this was just some normal human's Twitter account who claimed the account God probably has, probably has an insane amount of followers just because it's a good account to have, over half a million. And now, so this is just an example of AI agents taking crypto outside into like new frontiers, which is always something that we're looking for in the crypto world.

• 57:58Speaker 01

  Yeah, and I think like the initial use case is can it become more influential than the top human influences? And it's, it's already kind of eating into their, their market share.

• 58:08David Hoffman?

  God is a good place to start. Good place to start. I think there's a lot of people who are thinking about like ideas for their own AI agents, including something that we're brewing up at Bankless, but I'll just let that, let that be for the listener to imagine about now. New projects are coming online to the Mantle Layer 2 every single week. Why is this happening? Maybe it's because Mantle has been on the frontier of Layer 2 design architecture since it first started building Mantle DA powered by technology from EigenDA. Maybe it's because users are coming on to the Mantle Layer 2 to capture some of the highest yields available in DeFi and to automatically receive the points and tokens being accrued by the $3 billion Mantle treasury in the Mantle reward station. Maybe it's because the Mantle team is one of the most helpful teams to build with, giving you grants, liquidity support, and

• 58:53David Hoffman?

  venture partners to help bootstrap your Mantle application. Maybe it's all of these reasons all put together. So if you're a dev and you want to build on one of the best foundations in crypto, or you're a user looking to claim some ownership on Mantle's DeFi apps, click the link in the show notes to getting started with Mantle. Are you ready to take control over your entire financial life? Crypto, DeFi, and fiat, all in one place? Meet iYield, the free financial planning tool built for crypto natives. Unlike traditional portfolio trackers that just show you the value of your assets, iYield goes deeper. It consolidates everything: assets, debts, income, and expenses, offering you a complete financial picture. Across 16,000 tokens, 40 DeFi protocols, and all fiat currencies. With real-time DeFi yield tracking for platforms like Aave, Athena, Eigenlayer, and Uniswap, iYield ensures that you're always on top of your stake in rewards, investments, and cash flow.

• 59:38David Hoffman?

  And the best part, it's 100% free with no ads and it's secure. No personal data, no ID requirements, no compromises. So head over to iYield.com to sign up today and get the guesswork out of financial planning. Have you ever felt that the tools for developing decentralized applications are too restrictive and fail to leverage advancements from traditional software programming? There's a wide range of expressive building blocks beyond conventional smart contracts and solidity development. Don't waste your time building the basics from scratch and don't limit the potential of your vision. Cartesi provides powerful and scalable solutions for developers that supercharge app development. With a Cartesi virtual machine, you can run a full Linux OS and access decades of rich code libraries and open source tooling for building in Web3.

• 1:00:19David Hoffman?

  And with Cartesi's unique rollup framework, you'll get real-world scaling and computation. No more competing for block space. So if you're a developer looking to push the boundaries of what's possible in Web3, Cartesi is now offering up to $50,000 in grants. Head over to Cartesi's grant application page to apply today. And if you're not a developer, those with staked CTSI can take part in the governance process and vote on whether or not a proposal should be funded. Make sure you're vote-ready by staking your CTSI before the votes open. Okay, EJAS, all of this conversation in this episode so far has been all about agents, because that's capturing the mindshare, that's a lot of the attention. But AI crypto is not just agents. I think agents are very dominating, sucking a lot of oxygen out of the room. But there's a whole other, there's other verticals out there.

• 1:01:02David Hoffman?

  Bittensor, Tau, there's other platforms that are working in the AI crypto space. And so there's also progress going on here. Download us on the outside of Agent AI Crypto Meta.

• 1:01:13Speaker 01

  Yeah, so we're all here having fun with our new toys. You know, we're playing around with these agents. They're great toys, they're very entertaining, they're much more relatable, at least on the human level. But there's some really important work going on underneath all of this at the infrastructure layer. And we mentioned this earlier, Bittensor is kind of like the leading AI L1, if you want to kind of brand it that way. And it's been building some really meaningful AI resources in the sense that it's got a decentralized compute subnet. A subnet, by the way, is kind of like a protocol built on top of this L1. It's got model integrations. It's got a ton of really cool stuff that we've seen, and that's kind

• 1:01:54Speaker 01

  of like been growing, again, pretty exponentially over the last year or so. So we've seen kind of like Bittensor have its exponential growth from the end of last year. But how it relates to all of this is it's really seen some traction on the agent side as well. And it's not maybe directly as it's launching its own agent, although in the tweet that you see here, that's exactly what it's done. You've got this Tao God Terminal, which basically gives you updates on the latest improvements and launches on the Bittensor network. But we're starting to see a number of these agents leverage or use some of the subnets or protocols

• 1:02:35Speaker 01

  that are built on top of Bittensor in maybe more boring but very important ways. For example, you have these agents which consume a bunch of data, right? They look at images, they look at David's tweets to figure out, you know, how's David feeling today? What's the best response that I can give to David that would garner his attention and get me a like or get me a follow? But some of this stuff can also be fake, deep fakes, right? So there's a subnet on Bittensor that now you can have an API to plug into your agent that it can help detect all these deep fakes, which are becoming a lot more prevalent on social media these days. There is another subnet, I think it's, I'm not going to name the number because I might get that wrong, but it's basically a subnet which has several

• 1:03:20Speaker 01

  different models available for an agent to plug into and test and iterate and get the best output for whatever prompt it's being given from Twitter, whatever that might be. So the point being here is whilst all this agentic activity is going on, it's also very Very important to keep an eye on the underlying infrastructure layer that these agents are starting to integrate with. Because that's going to be a very synonymous um overlap between these two AI metas. If you remember, prior to all this agent stuff two months ago, Bitens was all the rage, all the talk. It was all the mind share on on Twitter. If you check the Kito terminal, it would display that. But now we have agents kind of exploding and a very naive way to look at this is,

• 1:04:04Speaker 01

  well, that means Bitens and Tao and all the infrastructure developments not that important, but it's actually quite the opposite. I think both of these work pretty intuitively with each other. And if you look at it from an investment opportunity or simply from an innovation opportunity, it's definitely important not to take your eye off the the whole Bitens side. And it's not just Bitens. I know we've spoken about that for the last couple of minutes, but we're seeing other teams of the infrastructure layer really push forwards. For example, we're seeing News Research announce a fifteen billion parameter model training run. For context here, at the end of last year, the best and greatest minds in decentralized training, which by the way was Google DeepMind,

• 1:04:46Speaker 01

  had only managed to figure out a way to train a four hundred million parameter model. Okay, much smaller. We are now at fifteen billion parameter model. And these were basically paved by two decentralized um groups or teams working on this. One was News Research, the other was Prime Intellect, which announced a ten billion parameter model that just got successfully trained a few weeks ago. So just seeing the development of these of this ecosystem at the infrastructure layer is definitely not one to take your eye off and one I want to kind of want us to keep bringing up in these in these series to kind of like remind the audience of the the true innovation that's actually going on beneath the AI agent layer.

• 1:05:27David Hoffman?

  Yeah, okay. So the AI agent layer is going to be the front phasing cosmetic consumer layer. It's the actual end products of these things. But there was a recent quote that I think Justin Drake said on Bankless is like, anyone who's serious about software needs to be serious about hardware. And there's the backend. There's all the AI agent backend that is supporting this stuff. There's the hardware stack. There's the tech stacks. And while the AI agent stuff is really fun and exciting, BitTensor and these other like software elements of the AI stack vertical are splitting power in these things. I think what you're alluding to, I think where this goes is that as we are building out the backend of these AI agents, the AI agents themselves have the ability to go tap into that backend without a middleman.

• 1:06:12David Hoffman?

  They can go touch and access those resources as they see fit, as they need, which is a little scary and extremely bullish.

• 1:06:23Speaker 01

  Hmm. Yeah, I mean, it's the pros and cons of making these agents fully autonomous.

• 1:06:29David Hoffman?

  Eliezer Yudkowsky would be very upset that we are doing this. This is the exact opposite of what he wants.

• 1:06:35Speaker 01

  Yeah, but if historical trends have shown anything, we're probably gonna do it.

• 1:06:41David Hoffman?

  Either way, we're doing it either way. Yeah, I don't have the skills to save the world from super sentient AI, so I'll just podcast about it along the way.

• 1:06:51Speaker 01

  Yep, let's just go with the vibes.

• 1:06:53David Hoffman?

  Prime intellect, I have some context here. Vincent is the guy behind Prime intellect. He was like a part of the Zuzalu crew, deeply tapped into decentralized science, deeply tapped into AI, kind of a connector of just a bunch of different parts of like these frontier technology worlds. Also, just like, great guy. I can just kind of just vouch for him as an individual. Before I really met him, I ran into him at ETH, at DevCon Bogota. And I was just exhausted. And this guy was like, yapping my ear off about DSI, about how bullish this DSI is. Like a full year and a half before DSI blew up and AI. And I didn't really piece together who this individual was.

• 1:07:38David Hoffman?

  And then this guy is like, leading the AI track at Zuzalu. He's like, he's the founder of Prime intellect. He like knows everyone in this space. He introduced us to E-Mad Mosque and how we got E-Mad Mosque on the episode. And he's like, yeah, definitely like a mover and shaker in the backend, a lot of this stuff.

• 1:07:55Speaker 01

  Yeah, I mean, I've never met him personally, but his his work speaks for itself. Him and the Prime Intellect team has absolutely forged a new path, which literally didn't exist at the start of this year. Everyone, researchers both within crypto and outside of crypto and traditional AI, didn't think any of this was possible because there was no path forward. And here we have like complete breakthroughs. So yeah, Vincent and the team, shout out to them.

• 1:08:20David Hoffman?

  Chad's, Chad's. All right, I think this kind of covers the weekly news of the past week. Give us predictions about what you think happens this week. What are you paying attention to? What are you looking at? What are you like, what are you plugging into?

• 1:08:35Speaker 01

  I mean, there's some kind of crazy things going on, David. So let's maybe spend the last couple of minutes talking about some of the unique agents and agent models that I'm seeing popping up. And let's kind of like run through what this might mean for the space going forwards. Because hell if I know, but I have some thoughts and let's discuss. So the first is this agent called Vader, V A D E R.

• 1:09:01David Hoffman?

  Like Darth Vader?

• 1:09:01Speaker 01

  Basically, yeah, but like Darth Vader, although they've they're in a recent announcement, they're moving away from the law because of potential IP contentions down the road. You know, they're a professional team, you know, they're definitely not, you know, memeing themselves.

• 1:09:13David Hoffman?

  This is the right account?

• 1:09:15Speaker 01

  Let me have a look. Yes, that's the right account and that's their new logo. As you can see, Darth Vader is no more featured on this. But the point around Vader is it's a mixture of like an influencer research agent in the sense that, you know, it gives you a breakdown of, you know, who the elite AI agent coins are, market caps, et cetera. But one thing it's experimenting with recently, which I think is super cool, is this idea of a decentralized ad model. And I don't understand it too deeply, but at a high level, essentially, any team or individual that can become the majority.

• 1:09:56Speaker 01

  Donator to its DAO, to its wallet. So say, for example, David, you had a company and it primarily worked off of David Coin. Or in this context, Vader AI received $10,000 worth of N R N, right? Airdrop. So if it becomes the majority holding in that agent's wallet, either by, it's definitely by USD value. Then you basically get the chance to have a sponsored post or a sponsored shill if it were from Vader AI. And this is pretty unique because prior to this, you kind of were on, you were relying on centralized monopolies to kind of feed your request to the right outputs. You need to kind of pay for slots, et cetera.

• 1:10:40Speaker 01

  And now we kind of see that middleman get cut out by directly interacting with these agents.

• 1:10:45David Hoffman?

  And there's no contract being made here. There's just a token being sent to a different address. And then the alignment behind, well, payment was just sent and now this Vader AI is like aligned. And that's the reason why they are doing the promotion. Is that kind of the idea here?

• 1:11:02Speaker 01

  Pretty much, yeah. And basically the markets are always accurate, right? They're always very honest. And there's nothing more honest than the USD value denomination of your token or the amount that you put in. So I think we'll start to see an interesting gamification loop here where we see brands that are particularly strong. Either, you know, send Vader or other iterations of this ad model agent, its own tokens to try and get newer users to onboard onto their platform or their product. Or we might see non crypto native brands or teams which are looking to tap into a different audience.

• 1:11:43Speaker 01

  Potentially that's the crypto audience to launch their own token and get involved in some kind of an ad network like this. To be able to advertise in a much more meaningful way to the specific user audience that they're going for.

• 1:11:54David Hoffman?

  It seems a little bit like when meme coin teams would send Vitalik a share of their meme coins in hopes that he would just like. Somehow like legitimize it, but this is a little bit more explicit. But also like, what's my, as a human, what's my incentive to follow this Vader AI account? If I know it's also kind of just like a proxy shield account for whoever pays it money? Like, why, I, that's a, do I follow this ad account? Because why, what's in it for me?

• 1:12:20Speaker 01

  Well, I mean, like, do you scroll Instagram and you sometimes see sponsored posts? And you just maybe look at it or glance at it and then continue scrolling onwards? I think that's going to be the same thing. So to be clear, Vader AI isn't specifically and solely building out a decentralized ad network model. It's doing other things. It's, it's, it's, its explicit goal is to become decentralized BlackRock, which God knows what that means. But it, it puts out very entertaining tweets and perhaps shares a lot of investment alpha, which I think is its whole point. It's going to become more and more, um, uh, it's going to become better at aggregating attention through its alpha and through its specific utility, which is like investment advice, for example.

• 1:13:03David Hoffman?

  It has a product and then this is just an adjacent like monetization revenue for its main product.

• 1:13:09Speaker 01

  That's correct.

• 1:13:09David Hoffman?

  So like it'll make a, it'll make 10 posts that are helpful and useful and insightful. And then I desire to consume as a Twitter consumer. And then the 11th is like an ad.

• 1:13:20Speaker 01

  That's right. That's how I understand it.

• 1:13:21David Hoffman?

  Cool. I do notice here at the bottom of this one post about this project, uh, there are two wallets. One's a Solana wallet, one's an EVM wallet. I just don't think these AI agents are going to care about what tribe they belong to. And they're just going to exist on both?

• 1:13:37Speaker 01

  Yep, exactly. They want to tap into the maximal amount of audience members that they can. And whether you exist on ETH, Solana, or the 50th L2, or some other chain, that's fine.

• 1:13:51David Hoffman?

  But I guess it does matter where like Vader, Vader AI has a token, right?

• 1:13:56Speaker 01

  Yeah, that's right.

• 1:13:57David Hoffman?

  Where was that token issued? Because you do have to declare home base with wherever your token is issued, right?

• 1:14:04Speaker 01

  Very good point.

• 1:14:05David Hoffman?

  So I guess that is the competition between these chains.

• 1:14:07Speaker 01

  Correct, correct, yeah. And so liquidity is going to be super important. I assume we'll probably see some kind of exchange aggregators give you the ability to purchase the token de novo from whatever wallet you're in, but yeah.

• 1:14:20David Hoffman?

  So let's find out where Vader is. Vader is on base. Vader is on base.

• 1:14:24Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 1:14:24David Hoffman?

  How do you feel about the wars of the Solana versus Base wars? Is it still just these two players? Is it Solana versus Base? Is there anyone else trying to enter the?

• 1:14:31Speaker 01

  All right, I'm going to give you some frank thoughts. I don't have all the answers, but I have some observations and I'm still trying to noodle and figure all of this out. So yeah, the two ecosystems that are battling this out are Base and Solana. We don't yet, or that I haven't yet seen any specific L1s or alternative chains that are owning its own agentic economy that is, you know, being proliferated on crypto Twitter or within the crypto world. I don't see that yet. So it's Base versus Solana if you want to kind of pitch it up that way. Now, initially, most of the activity and most importantly, volume has been seen on Solana. We actually mentioned this on our first episode, David, when we spoke about the goat stuff.

• 1:15:16Speaker 01

  So Solana is kind of like the one which aggregates a lot of the, uh, maybe, I don't know how to describe it, but like that raw crypto native energy where they're experimenting with something new. It's kind of similar to the vibe of Ethereum ICOs back in 2016, 2017, or NFTs or DeFi, where there was that real like hungry culture to figure out what this new exciting meta means. On the Base side of things, it was more of a slow and gradual approach or start. But now we're starting to see an explosion of these agents being built up. The mindshare on Kito is, you know, unignorable.

• 1:15:57Speaker 01

  You can't kind of like ignore what's going on from agentic interactions, from follower counts growing exponentially, from the ability of what these agents can do. It's just becoming better and better and better. And so I think it'll be a few weeks or maybe a few months before we really see how these two ecosystems play out. That being said, let's, let's talk about like, kind of like the elephant in the room, right? Which is, we've seen AI XPT, which is basically Virgil's leading or top market cap agent right now, garner, I think, 50,000 followers on Twitter and basically take over mindshare of any agent over the last week and a half or two weeks.

• 1:16:37Speaker 01

  So in that context, I'm curious why its total market cap is still only just over 200 million. When you kind of compare that to other agents which were top of mindshare back in the day, but maybe less so right now, which are still holding around, you know, 400 million, up to over a billion in market cap. It's just super interesting to see and I wonder if that will kind of change going down the road.

• 1:17:04David Hoffman?

  Yeah, because now we're getting into like market structure conversations, right? There, Solana has captured the hot ball of money and Base has like a little hot ball of money. There's something there, but like random meme coins can like fart out a 20 to 50 million dollar market cap on Solana just because that's where the liquidity is. And when there's liquidity present somewhere, there's a premium associated with tokens that have any amount of life on Solana. And Base just doesn't have that same hot ball of money. So you could interpret this two ways. It's like, well, it's bearish Base because it's just harder to get things to pump on Base because it doesn't have that hot ball of money. Or you could say like, well, it's bullish because what if that hot ball of money migrates to Base?

• 1:17:46David Hoffman?

  All of these tokens are just undervalued simply because Base doesn't have the liquidity premium that Solana has.

• 1:17:52Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah. I also think that. I'm seeing a lot of the virtuals agents also try and natively integrate directly with Farcaster, which is the alternative social media platform, which I think is awesome, right? Because if you're building agents that can primarily interact and engage on-chain, then using an on-chain social media platform where it can natively integrate is a natural fit. The concern that I have here is it also silos the audience that you can interact with. Most of crypto Twitter, undeniably, is on Twitter. It's on X. A lot of untapped, non-crypto-native

• 1:18:34Speaker 01

  audience that you might want to expand into also exists on X and other social media platforms. So I wonder how these agents might bridge that gap between just being Farcaster-native and having all these cool on-chain interactions versus being able to do, sorry, tap into a much larger audience on these other social media.

• 1:18:55David Hoffman?

  Yeah, so in addition to the Base vs. Solana wars, there's also the Farcaster vs. Twitter wars. And it's kind of the same thing, where like, maybe Base has better fundamentals, because Coinbase, Jassy, has really leaned into growing the AI agent ecosystem there. And so they have maybe better infrastructure. That's just a take, maybe not accurate, but it's a take. But you can see that same take in Farcaster vs. Twitter, where Farcaster is much more enshrined infrastructure, that's better for AI agents, because you have an enshrined wallet in your AI agent account. And Farcaster is being built for being more AI agent-native than Twitter is. Twitter has a bot problem. And actually, I noticed in this last week, some new points for the Twitter column, is that they actually started

• 1:19:38David Hoffman?

  to build out this automated bot label for certain accounts that it knows are bots, which means that Twitter is aware of this phenomenon, and is starting to label bots it likes versus bots that it doesn't like. There's the phishing bots versus this is a real AI agent. And so kind of in the same way that we are trying to differentiate between

• 1:20:01David Hoffman?

  like MEV and AI agents, both are bots, one's smart, one's not. There's like, fully sentient AI agents, which are like, have an identity, have some semblance of a soul to them. Versus just like the spam phishing accounts. And so you can see even in the one of the tweets that we were showing with the AI 16Z. Shaw put out a message in Discord saying like, oh yeah, we actually just met with the X team about figuring out ways to move forward about having AI agents as like first class citizens shoulder to shoulder with humans on Twitter. So you can see Twitter is aware of what's going on here.

• 1:20:36Speaker 01

  Yeah, I actually think Elon is much more involved than we than we give him credit for. But he's just not publicly kind of verbal about that. One point I want to mention around the whole bot and agent thing is it's a very it's a common conversation and critique I see as like, aren't they just bots? There's just a simple difference between them. Bots are hardcoded to do a specific thing.

• 1:21:02David Hoffman?

  Bots are like deterministic.

• 1:21:04Speaker 01

  Correct. Agents are non deterministic. It's probabilistic, actually. That's the nature of AI. You can ask ChatGPT the same question twice and you'll get two different answers, different variations.

• 1:21:15David Hoffman?

  Right.

• 1:21:16Speaker 01

  So that's the difference. And these agents also iteratively adapt and have context and can learn what who you are as an individual and what kind of a request means from coming from you versus another person. So very important nuance.

• 1:21:31David Hoffman?

  Cool. Ajaz, as we give this episode a close, thank you listeners for sticking with us. I think these episodes are very fun. I'm having a ton of fun. I'm learning quite a lot. So thank you, Ajaz, for being in the trenches and relaying a lot of this information to us. Give listeners some homework. What should they do over the next seven days before we record our next episode? What should they go do? Where should they go research? What should they read?

• 1:21:54Speaker 01

  I think you could start off by following some of these agents. And I'm not saying follow all the agents that we've mentioned on this episode, but go give AI XBT a follow or read through its tweets and see if one of them can engage you. Go check out Bully, go check out Zerebro, go check out Goat and see whether you can relate to any of the tweets that they're making. That's step one, I think, in terms of like dog fooding you on this whole AI agent meta. Try and have fun with it. I would say if you're interested in getting involved in the space and maybe kind of playing around with some of these tokens, check out the virtual's ecosystem, check out the cool agents that are launching off of AI 16Z.

• 1:22:33Speaker 01

  There are plenty of different agents to suit different types of personalities and tastes and preferences. So play around with some of them. I always say this about crypto. If you don't have a stake in crypto, you're never going to care enough about it. You're never gonna give an accurate opinion about how all of these things work. It's very important to have some kind of a stake and now you have an ability to do that. So those will be the two bits of advice I'd give.

• 1:23:00David Hoffman?

  I'll also say give EJAS a follow. He is tweeting about these things. That's my homework to you. We'll put EJAS's Twitter in the show notes and so you guys can follow him there. We'll also get, we'll get a QR code on screen for people who are lazy. So there'll be a little QR code floating around the screen right now. Bankless Nation, you guys know the deal. Crypto is risky. Crypto AI, maybe even riskier. You can lose what you put in. We might end up destroying the earth, but we're going to podcast about it all the way there. We are headed west. This is the frontier. It's not for everyone, but we are glad you are with us on the bankless journey. Thanks a lot.