390: Part 1: “Turn Around & Close Your Eyes” | Angelique Robledo

When Angelique Robledo was 18 years old and pregnant, she thought she had found a friend in another woman who seemed to be going through the same experience. But that friendship was hiding something far more sinister. In this episode, Angelique shares the terrifying story of how someone she trusted was allegedly planning to kill her and steal her unborn baby; a rare but horrifying crime known as fetal abduction. From the early red flags to the day everything changed, Angelique walks us through what happened, how she survived, and the lasting impact it’s had on her life. She also opens up about the complicated legal outcome, her experience speaking publicly about the case, and how she’s using her story today to raise awareness and help others trust their instincts. This is a story of betrayal, survival, and resilience.⚠️ Listener discretion is advised.. If you’re new here, don’t forget to follow the show for weekly deep dives into the darkest true crime cases! To watch the video version of this episode, head over to youtube.com/@annieelise. .🔎Join Our True Crime Club & Get Exclusive Content & Perks..🎧 Need More to Binge? Listen to both of my weekly true crime series 10 to Life & Serialously with Annie Elise wherever you get your podcasts on the Annie Elise Channel!🍎 Apple Podcasts | Where you can also unlock access to 100+ and growing extra exclusive deep dives.💚 Spotify🔴 YouTube🎙️ All Other Platforms.📸 Follow Annie on Socials Instagram: @_annieeliseTikTok: @_annieeliseSubstack: @annieeliseFacebook: @10toLife.👗 Shop Annie’s Must-Haves! ShopMY: bit.ly/AnnieElise_ShopMy Amazon: bit.ly/AnnieElise_Amazon.🫵🏻 Get Involved or Recommend a CaseAbout Annie: www.annieelise.comFor Business Inquiries: [email protected].📚 Episode Sources Arizona Psychiatric Security Review Board | Maricopa Police Department | Pinal County Precinct 8 Justice Court | Pinal County Superior Court, Arizona ••••••••••••••••••🚨Disclaimers1️⃣ Some links may be affiliate links, they do not cost you anything, but I make a small percentage from the sale. Thank you so much for watching and supporting me. 2️⃣ Sources used to collect this information include various public news sites, interviews, court documents, FB groups dedicated to the case, and various news channel segments. When quoting statements made by others, they are strictly alleged until confirmed otherwise. Please remember my videos are my independent opinion and to always do your own research. 3️⃣ The views and opinions expressed in this video are personal and do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of any other agency, organization, employer, or company. Assumptions made in the analysis are not reflective of the position of any entity other than the creator(s). These views are subject to change, revision, and rethinking at any time and are not to be held in perpetuity. We make no representations as to the accuracy, completeness, correctness, suitability, or validity of any information on this video and will not be liable for any errors, omissions, or delays in this information or any losses, injuries, or damages arising from its display or use. All information is provided on an as-is basis. It is the reader’s responsibility to verify their own facts.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

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• 0:33Speaker 01

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• 1:00Speaker 02

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• 1:25Speaker 03

  My name is Angelica Rappletto, and I am a survivor of attempted fetal abduction.

• 1:29Speaker 04

  There are gruesome headlines that read like a made-for-TV movie, but for the victims, they are all too real. Teen in Arizona attacked pregnant friend, tried to cut baby out of her womb.

• 1:41Speaker 03

  ...that can't share their story because they didn't survive. And that is how tragic this crime is.

• 1:49Annie Elise?

  Hey, true crime besties. Welcome back to an all-new episode of Serial Insane.

• 2:12Annie Elise?

  Hello, hello, hello. Welcome back to an all-new episode of Serialist Lee. It's me, your host and your true crime BFF, Annie E. Lys. And we are here to talk about another case today. I hope you all had a fantastic weekend. Hopefully, you're having a good start to your week, whether you're listening to this on Monday or a different time throughout the week. I'm just happy that you're here. So, thank you so much for being here. Now, today's case, I want to just give a little bit of a warning, okay? It is extremely triggering, graphic, and very personal. Now, what I want you to do for me for just a minute here is I want you to close your eyes, not if you're driving, but if you're in a safe space, close your eyes and imagine being 18

• 2:56Annie Elise?

  years old and imagine being 18 and pregnant and being in the final months of your pregnancy, preparing for what is supposed to be the most exciting and happiest moments of your life, while unbeknownst to you, somebody that you trust and you think is your friend, is secretly plotting to kill you and steal your unborn baby. Now, I know that it sounds like the plot of a Lifetime movie or some sort of true crime movie, but for Angelique Robledo, this was her terrifying reality. In 2011, Angelique was a pregnant teenager living in Arizona, and she befriended another woman who appeared to be going through the exact same experience.

• 3:39Annie Elise?

  So, the two of them bonded over their pregnancies and also what felt like a shared journey into motherhood. However, behind that friendship was a very disturbing plan, one that investigators say involved murder and an attempt to cut out Angelique's unborn child from her womb. Now, crimes like this are known as fetal abductions, and they are relatively rare, although unfortunately, we have talked about quite a few of them on here. We've talked about Rebecca Park, Heidi Bressard, Reagan Hancock. So, unfortunately, more common than anybody would like, but even though- They're rare. When they do happen, they are some of the most shocking cases in true crime. And speaking of the case of Heidi Broussard, I would imagine many of you are familiar with that name in that case.

• 4:23Annie Elise?

  She was a young mother in Texas who was killed by someone she believed was a close friend of hers. Then that person abducted her newborn child and tried to pass the baby off as her own. Now Angelique's story, it could have ended the very same way. But thankfully, it didn't. She survived. And today, we're lucky enough to have Angelique in the studio to share her experience firsthand. So please join me in welcoming Angelique. Hi, Angelique. Thank you so much for being here and welcome to Serialously.

• 4:55Speaker 06

  Thank you. It's so nice to be here.

• 4:57Annie Elise?

  It's nice to have you. So what I would love to do before we get into everything and your experience and everything that you went through, I would love to just start with what high school was like for you. If you could just walk us through that.

• 5:08Speaker 06

  Yeah, absolutely. So high school, it was interesting. I I ran with like a really bad crowd, I guess you could say. So I kind of started off with, I moved here from, I moved from California to Arizona. And so I felt like I was out of place a lot of the times, like a lot of things in California were just different. So I tend to, people please, I guess you could say, and I tend to like fall into the peer, what is it called?

• 5:33Annie Elise?

  Peer pressure?

• 5:34Speaker 06

  Peer pressure, yeah. So I fell into a lot of peer pressure as like a teenager. So I did a lot, I feel like I wasn't myself a lot. So I kind of ran with the wrong crowd, got in a lot of trouble.

• 5:45Speaker 06

  And it kind of, like I went through like a lot of trauma when I was younger. So I got arrested by the cops and things like that. And it was just like, like minor things, just for like getting into a fight or I think at one point, maybe I shoplifted something. And so it was a very small town, so everybody knew each other.

• 6:02Annie Elise?

  In Arizona, in your new town?

• 6:04Speaker 06

  In my new town, yeah. Everybody knew each other. So it kind of falls in line because the detective that ran my case had arrested me like

• 6:12Annie Elise?

  Wow.

• 6:13Speaker 06

  And she, so she's been in my life for over like five or six years.

• 6:16Annie Elise?

  Oh, so she saw it come full circle.

• 6:17Speaker 06

  She saw it come full circle, yeah.

• 6:19Annie Elise?

  So when you say you ran with a little bit of a tough crowd, in addition to maybe the fight Or the shoplifting. Was there anything else that you would, goes it just like house parties and things like that?

• 6:28Speaker 06

  It was, it was just like house parties. And then I kind of started, when I hit like 10th grade, I started to run with like, I say run with, but like I started to hang out with different people.

• 6:38Speaker 06

  And I feel like I kind of drew away from like the old crowd that I was hanging out with. But unfortunately, like even going through all of that, I was going through a lot of stuff at home. And hanging out with like the new friends that I was, like I feel like I did get more of a high school experience. Like I was going to football games. I played soccer. So it kind of like.

• 6:56Annie Elise?

  It was nice to get that like typical high school experience from when before it was a little bit tougher.

• 7:01Speaker 06

  Exactly. So like I started actually doing like going on like, I remember like we would go and like, um, go to, like run, right, ride quads. And we would go to Country Thunder. So like I started to like be able to like feel like what it was like to actually be a teenager and be with friends who were genuine and. It was, it was a good experience. It really was. Um, unfortunately, at the end of my high school though, before I got pregnant with my son, I did fall into an addiction. So I, I did fall into an addiction with meth. And when I got pregnant with Ryland, I was, um, I was doing meth at that time. So I feel like Ryland saved my life in a way.

• 7:36Annie Elise?

  That's amazing. Well, let's walk through that a little bit. When did you discover that you were pregnant? Where, and were you, was it a surprise? Were you with a boyfriend? You were 18 at the time.

• 7:46Speaker 06

  So I was 17.

• 7:47Annie Elise?

  Oh, 17.

• 7:48Speaker 06

  I was 17 when I got pregnant. Um, and I, me and Ryland's dad, his name is Josh, it's my husband now, but. His name was Josh and we were just friends at the time. And it was one of those things like where it just happened. And then we just didn't talk. Because I ran more, I, I was doing drugs at that time. So from then, me and him kind of just didn't talk at all. And I ended up, I was working at Jack in the Box and I remember there were a few friends there that I was doing like the drugs with. And I remember sitting there thinking like, something's wrong. And they were like, what do you mean? I was like, like when I do this, like I'm not able to stay up, like I'm vomiting, like.

• 8:26Annie Elise?

  It's not having the same effect.

• 8:27Speaker 06

  It's not having the same effect. Yeah. So I wasn't feeling like how I was. And I remember my coworker was. Was like, well, do you like, what do you think? And I was like, I feel like I think I'm pregnant. And he was like, no. And I was like, yeah.

• 8:38Annie Elise?

  Wow.

• 8:38Speaker 06

  And so I remember I didn't take a test or anything because I was too scared, but I actually came home that night. And my mom was already in my room with a pregnancy test.

• 8:47Annie Elise?

  Oh, wow. Mother's intuition.

• 8:48Speaker 06

  Mother's intuition. She was like, she like threw the test at me and she was like, take it. And I was like, no. Like, no, why are you throwing this at me? She's like, you haven't started your period. And I was like, why are you tracking my stuff? Like, how dare you? You know, then I became very defensive. Like, how dare you my privacy? Like, how dare you do that? And she was like, your period hasn't started. Like, I think something's going on. And so I remember I like, I was in a panic and I was shoving her out of my room. And I took the test and I went into the bathroom. And I remember I smoked that day. Like, I remember and I was in the bathroom and I was smoking meth. And I took the test and not even like within five seconds, the test came out positive.

• 9:26Annie Elise?

  Wow.

• 9:27Speaker 06

  And so that was like a really big realization of like, holy crap, like what is going on?

• 9:31Annie Elise?

  What did you feel in that moment? Were you scared, excited?

• 9:35Speaker 06

  I was terrified. I was extremely terrified and I immediately called Josh and.

• 9:40Annie Elise?

  You had said you had stopped talking at this point, right? And was he using it all?

• 9:44Speaker 06

  No, he was not using it all. So that's why me and him didn't talk because I was running, he was more like, oh, I heard you're doing things like.

• 9:50Annie Elise?

  Oh, and he was more on the straight and narrow with, okay, I see. And so you got, how long had it been that you hadn't been talking at this point?

• 9:56Speaker 06

  About two months.

• 9:57Annie Elise?

  Okay.

• 9:58Speaker 06

  So I was about like eight weeks pregnant when I found out.

• 10:00Annie Elise?

  Okay, so relatively early in the pregnancy. Okay.

• 10:03Speaker 06

  So then.

• 10:04Annie Elise?

  So you called Josh?

• 10:05Speaker 06

  I called Josh and I told him like, hey, like I'm, I took a test and I'm pregnant and I'm saying it very nonchalantly. And he's like, what? And I'm like, yeah. And he's like, well, what do you want to do? And I was like, oh, I want to get rid of it. And he, I was like, are you on board with me? Like, I wanted to make sure that we were on the same page. And he was like, yeah. And he actually was throwing up on the phone, like the news just like made him like throw up.

• 10:25Annie Elise?

  How was, is he your same age? Was he older, younger?

• 10:28Speaker 06

  Two and a half years older than me. So I was seventeen and he, I was turning eighteen though. So he was twenty.

• 10:33Annie Elise?

  Now, let me ask this, not that it matters, I'm just curious. If you hadn't been talking it to, for two months at that point, what made you feel like you wanted to call and share the news with him?

• 10:43Speaker 06

  My mom had told me, so I got, I missed that part after my mom found out that, so when I took the test, I went into my room and she was like, what's going on? And I was like, I'm pregnant. Are you happy? And I threw the test at her and she was like, you need to call the dad and tell him, like, you can't just do this on your own. And I was like, I don't even want this baby. Like, it was a whole commotion between me and my mom. Um, but I was also, I was also high at the time. So like, I was very like, not in the right state of mind. And so I called because my mom told me like, I should call. So I did it like, kind of in the room all by myself. And when I did that, he was just like, I mean, like I said, he was vomiting, like when I told him the news. And then I told him, don't worry, like, I'm gonna get rid of it. And he was like, you're gonna, you're gonna have an abortion. And I was like, yes. He's like, I'll help you pay for it. So he was on board with everything.

• 11:26Speaker 06

  And I remember that night, my brother, my stepbrother was visiting us from California and he's about a year older than me, but he started to, he was, he kind of had a idea of what was going on with me, like what I was doing. So he had went like, searched my whole room, grabbed all my stuff and flushed it down the toilet. And that night, I remember going into the bathroom and staring at the toilet and I was so like out of my mind and so just like, I wanted to figure out how to get that stuff out of the toilet. So I like turned the water off. I came out with like a wrench, like I thought I was gonna take apart the toilet. And I sat there on the floor with like water everywhere. And like realized like, holy crap, like I'm, I'm trying to take a toilet apart right now. Like, is this where my life has gotten to? Like, this is what I want? Like, I'm willing to

• 12:09Speaker 06

  do all of this for drugs? Like, that's crazy. And so as like the come down started happening, you know, I stayed up all night, but then I finally fell asleep. And when I woke up, I texted Josh and I said, meet me at the park, like meet me at our spot, like, we were friends prior, so he already knew like where we would meet at. So he met me at the park and I remember walking down the street. And I was in a big hoodie and I had glasses on because I was coming down at that time. And I remember like pull, I remember seeing him and he's like, what's going on? Like, do you need the money right now? And I was like, I'm not gonna have the abortion. And he's like, why?

• 12:39Annie Elise?

  So this wasn't even 24 hours later that you had this realization? Wow.

• 12:43Speaker 06

  Wasn't even 24 hours later. And I remember taking up, like taking off my hood, taking my glasses off and being like, look at me. And he's like, yeah, you look like crap. And I was like, exactly. I said, I'm high. Like I'm coming down right now. And I said, I don't want to, I don't want to do this. Like, I don't want this to be my life. And if I don't have this baby, I'm going to continue and I'm not going to stop and it's going to ruin my life. And you don't have to be a part of it. You don't have to agree with it. But like, I'm going to have this baby because I, I, I need, I want my life back. And even if that means of having a baby helps me, then that helps me.

• 13:14Annie Elise?

  I have to say, at seventeen years old, because you were seventeen when this happened, that is pretty courageous and admirable to be, have come to that realization on your own and realize like this baby will essentially save my life. It will stop me from using and to have that determination to within twenty-four hours, just while you're coming down. That's pretty incredible because even grown adults don't have that, you know?

• 13:44Annie Elise?

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• 14:26Annie Elise?

  probably a year and a half ago at this point to Mint Mobile. And when I tell you, not only was it the best decision of my life, I now have like service in places my husband doesn't even have service, but it was so easy. It took me fifteen minutes, kept my phone, kept my phone number. It was the best. So for a new wireless plan, starting at fifteen bucks a month, go to mintmobile.com/ae. That's mintmobile.com/ae. Forty-five dollar upfront payment required, equivalent to fifteen dollars per month. New customers on first three-month plan only. Taxes and fees extra. See Mint Mobile for details.

• 15:06Speaker 06

  I come from a family of addicts and so like I've I've seen it. I've seen the lifestyle of it and and like I just I didn't yeah, I didn't want that for myself and I I sit there, I replay that that night all the time like because like you said, like a 17 year old doing that like normally they don't care. They're very selfish. They I was very proud of myself.

• 15:24Annie Elise?

  They know everything. Yeah, you should be. You should be incredibly proud of yourself.

• 15:27Speaker 06

  Thank you.

• 15:28Annie Elise?

  Did your mom know when you that you were had been using leading up to this?

• 15:33Speaker 06

  No, uh, well, she had an idea because there were moments that like I within that two months, like I had ran away. I had tried because my mom found out I was doing drugs and I was she was like, you need to stop. And of course, like, you know, just teenager like, no.

• 15:45Annie Elise?

  Yeah, you think you know everything.

• 15:47Speaker 06

  I would run away to people's not run away to people's houses that like she knew and bad thing was is like those parents knew I was doing that and they just let it happen. So I knew this would become like just a cycle.

• 15:56Annie Elise?

  Yeah.

• 15:57Speaker 06

  And living in a small town, it's sometimes it could be good. Sometimes it could be bad just because everybody knows each other and then you know which like who you can get away with things with.

• 16:05Annie Elise?

  Absolutely. So you tell Josh, you know, I'm not going forward with determination. I want to keep this baby. I'm going to get clean and you can be as involved as you want or as little as you want. And what was his response to that?

• 16:17Speaker 06

  He said that he would support me and he would be here for me. And I remember at the very end, he gave me a hug and he like kissed my forehead and I said, but there's one like there's one stipulation. And he said, what? And I said, we are not together. I said, I do not want you to pity me and be with me because I'm having your baby. If you do decide to be with me, I want it to be later down the line because you want to be with me. I don't want you to feel like I put you in a situation that you're stuck in. So for the it's funny because like for like five months, I refused to call him my boyfriend. So people would be like, oh, your boyfriend. I'd be like, he's not my boyfriend. He's just the father of my child.

• 16:51Annie Elise?

  Hard headed woman. I get I I respect it. I love it. So what was that like then? In the couple of months after you decide we're going to keep this baby, we're going to, you know, maybe rekindle, see where this goes. How often were you two speaking? How challenging was it to get clean? How were those first few months?

• 17:11Speaker 06

  They were very, um, it was a, it was a struggle. It really was. Um, I came clean to like my OB. I told them I was very open. Um, so I told them, you know, I, I have been using like I'm stopped, like I'm stopping and you know, I'm feeling, I, I was, I was like a hundred and six pounds. Like I was very, very little. Um, I, I'm normally like a hundred and thirty. So that's just like what the drugs did to me. And so it was basically just trying to build up like my nutrition. I smoked cigarettes a lot too, but the, I was having like a lot of panic attacks and anxiety. So they told me like basically like take a cigarette and like take a couple of hits and then put it out and keep doing that throughout the day until you start to like wean yourself off because like weaning yourself off meth and also like being pregnant can sometimes just,

• 17:51Speaker 06

  I guess, like just shock your body. So they were very helpful with teaching me like how to do that. And within like a week or two, like I was fine.

• 17:58Annie Elise?

  Okay.

• 17:58Speaker 06

  I feel like I started to gain weight. I got my friends back. Like a lot of my friends that I had become like the ones I was going like out, like on quads and like going to country thunder with and you know, they had taken like they, they left me because I was obviously going down a different path than they were. And so I, you know, they came back and they were here to support me.

• 18:16Annie Elise?

  That probably felt really good.

• 18:17Speaker 06

  It really did. Um, I still worked at Jack in the Box too. And my coworkers, even if they were doing something, they were very supportive of me. And I kind of just lived, I, I was in high school, so I was a senior. I did drop out. It was just really overwhelming, like coming off of everything and like getting the classes. So I took myself out of high school and I ended up getting my GED. Um, but I still continued to work and I kind of stayed to myself, to be honest. I had like maybe four or five friends that I talked to. But that's what I needed. Like I needed to get myself out of everything in order to feel like confident that I wasn't going to use again.

• 18:52Annie Elise?

  And just have a tight circle, close knit. And your mom, I would imagine was very supportive through all of this.

• 18:56Speaker 06

  My mom was very supportive through this whole thing. Uh, my mom was my best friend. My mom had my, to believe it or not. You know, when they say you follow your parents' footsteps, my mom had had the exact same thing at seventeen years old. She was doing meth and she found out she was pregnant with me and she got clean and sober. So I almost wonder self-conscious, like if I, if I did that because like my mom did that. And I saw the courage. I saw like that she could do it. And it was like, if she can do it, like I can do it.

• 19:20Annie Elise?

  Yeah, she did it for me. I could do it for my child.

• 19:23Speaker 06

  Exactly. So it was like a full circle moment. So I think her moment was like, I'm so proud of you. Like, and my mom, me and my mom were really close, even though if people ask in high school, like, we fought a lot.

• 19:32Annie Elise?

  Of cour- I mean, that's typical. When it's, yeah, when you're a girl and you're in high school, that's same with me and my mom. We, and I ran with the bad crowd too, made a lot. It was very similar in that regard. And we, I also thought I knew better than anybody else. And I remember you had mentioned earlier how you like threw the pregnancy test at her and how you were mad. You're like, why are you going through my thing? And my dad had once told me a saying that sticks with me to this day. Fear generates anger. So that if you're scared or paranoid in that moment, or you're scared of what's happening and getting caught, you out, you lash out at the ones who love you the most and it just generates anger. So I think that every, I would argue that most girls' high school experiences were similar in the sense that they maybe didn't see eye to eye with their mom all the time.

• 20:13Speaker 06

  That's good. Yeah, I, I've noticed that too. And especially being a mom now, like I have three kids. So I, yeah, I've.

• 20:18Annie Elise?

  Do you have any girls?

• 20:19Speaker 06

  I have one daughter. She's my youngest, but man, like she's, she's eight going on, on 16 right now. So.

• 20:25Annie Elise?

  You know, you're going to be in for it.

• 20:26Speaker 06

  I know I'm going to be in for it.

• 20:28Annie Elise?

  Oh my gosh. So, okay. So the first few months of pregnancy, you have your tight circle, everybody's supportive. You're getting healthy. You have weaned yourself off of drugs. And then when did you and Josh start reconciling in a bigger way and spending more time together?

• 20:42Speaker 06

  So I feel like once we hit, once I hit like six months, give or take, like he was, um, working on, it's called the, we call it the Zabala farm. It's, um, just cause like Maricopa, basically think of like a big circle and there's only two ways out of our town. So you have the Casa Grande Highway, which takes like 25 minutes, and then you have the 347, which takes like 25 minutes. So you're stuck. And then you have this one road that takes you to like the farmland.

• 21:04Annie Elise?

  Okay.

• 21:05Speaker 06

  So he lived out there. Um, and there was this, he had friends that owned like the farm. So he worked out there. And I remember it was, uh, they called it picking season because it was, they, they would pick cotton in, in the season. And so he, I remember he would work constantly, um, like literally day and night. So he, I remember he started to, when I started to like, kind of allow him to be more a part of my life, he would come and like, see me for like 10 minutes and then have to go back to work. So.

• 21:31Annie Elise?

  Oh, wow.

• 21:31Speaker 06

  It was constantly like, I didn't see him for like a couple of weeks and it was just like that. And then my dad also wasn't very inviting. He was like. No, like I don't want to meet him. So all the time my dad had rules like you can go outside and talk to him, but he's not welcome in our house. Like I'd have to like

• 21:46Annie Elise?

  And why was that? Because he came from, he had more of a calm background, right? Josh Stewart did?

• 21:52Speaker 06

  Uh, to a sense, yes, but my dad was just very, very strict.

• 21:57Annie Elise?

  Okay.

• 21:57Speaker 06

  We come, I'm, I'm, I'm full Hispanic and so I come from the Mexican household and I'm the only girl. And so things were just, I hate to say it, but I feel like most, most Mexican women can say this, like, you're treated differently. The daughter is always treated, it's always more strict. Like the boys can kind of do whatever they want and they can

• 22:15Annie Elise?

  And your dad's just more protective over you?

• 22:16Speaker 06

  My dad's way more protective over me. And so like, it just was like that. And he did not like the fact that I, I mean, he still couldn't come to terms that I was pregnant. So it was like, dad, I'm, I'm six months now.

• 22:26Annie Elise?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 22:28Speaker 06

  But after a while, I remember my dad, so after like that picking season, I think we hit, whenever this, there was a football game in, in Arizona and my dad had let me invite Josh. That was my dad's first time like meeting him.

• 22:41Annie Elise?

  Okay.

• 22:42Speaker 06

  And it happened to be with like all of our family. So my, he got to like go out to like a family event with all of us.

• 22:46Annie Elise?

  How was that?

• 22:47Speaker 06

  It was fun. It really was. It was fun. Um.

• 22:49Annie Elise?

  And did your dad like him? Did they get along?

• 22:52Speaker 06

  My dad doesn't trust everybody. I will, I'll tell you this right now. I got married in 2020 and I'm, I'm actually, I don't even know if he, my dad would have actually gave the okay. Like he was, he's still like, I'm not sure if I trust him. And I'm like, dad, it's been, it's been 15 years.

• 23:08Annie Elise?

  You're always gonna be daddy's little girl.

• 23:10Speaker 06

  I'm always gonna, yes. So for the most part, like they have a good relationship now, but my dad was always very wary of, of guys. And I think it was just being very protective. So I don't think my dad really like, was inviting of Josh until the incident happened to me because that was more of like a

• 23:26Annie Elise?

  Everybody kind of

• 23:27Speaker 06

  Everybody came in together. Yeah. But before that, it was like a, so he met him that one time and then it was like, okay, like I'm good. I don't need to talk to him again.

• 23:33Annie Elise?

  Okay. He, but he's like aware of who's, what's going on, who Josh is. So around what month of your pregnancy, did you meet your new friend who you bonded over?

• 23:44Speaker 06

  Yeah. So friend wise, like I, I, I think I told you, like I had like my, my group of friends. There was probably about like four or five of them that like were in my inner circle. And nobody could really

• 23:56Speaker 06

  Relate to me. Nobody was pregnant at that time. We maybe had like maybe two other girls that had babies like earlier. But for the most part, like, nobody was pregnant. So I didn't really have anyone to talk to and like relate to me and everybody else. It was senior year. So all my friends, like, they all were in high school. They were all doing the senior things, like senior prank and, you know, homecoming and prom and like just all these different things that I kind of missed out on. And so my friend Hannah, she had called me one day and she was like, hey, um, I met this girl. Her name is Cassandra. Uh, she's pregnant and she's just like you. She just moved to our town. Um, I thought maybe you would like to meet up with us, you know, I, I told her about you and I thought you guys would kind of hit it off. And I was like, yeah.

• 24:36Annie Elise?

  That's great. Somebody like minded, going through something similar. And how did Hannah know Cassandra?

• 24:41Speaker 06

  Hannah had met Cassandra. And I actually just found this out because I've never asked her, but um, I guess she met her like just like at a, like at a friend's house, like a kickback, I guess.

• 24:49Annie Elise?

  Okay.

• 24:50Speaker 06

  So I don't know too much of-

• 24:50Annie Elise?

  It's so funny you say the word kickback because literally, I was recording an episode yesterday and I was talking about like, it wasn't a house party. It was a small gathering. When I was in school, we used to call it a kickback where it's like 10 or 15 people.

• 25:02Speaker 06

  Yes, yes, the kickbacks. It's funny. I told my, I, I, whenever I tell my, my 15 year old now, like some terminologies that we use, they're like, huh? I'm like, yeah, it's a kickback. Like, there's not too many people there. You can't call it a house party, but enough.

• 25:13Annie Elise?

  But it's not just like a close circle friend. Okay. So they were at a kickback and they met each other?

• 25:18Speaker 06

  Yeah, they met each other. I, and I don't know too much about like the backstory of that. I think what happened from what I understand is that Cassandra moved to Maricopa. And somehow she met like other friends of ours and she kind of had the story that like, her sister lived out there, but she had the story that she had like nowhere to live. So at some point she lived with one of my friends named Sebastian. And I-

• 25:40Annie Elise?

  While she was pregnant?

• 25:41Speaker 06

  While she was pregnant. And so I don't know the too much of the dynamic of that, but I do know that Hannah met her there. And so Hannah was like, oh, like Hannah, Hannah was one of the teen moms that like had a baby early. So she had a baby like a year and a half, two years prior. And so- She was like, oh, like I, I, you know, I have a son, but like, I know what it's like to be pregnant and alone. Like, let me introduce you to my friend, Angelique. And so she was like, oh yeah, I would love to enter, like, love to meet her. And I want to say that Cassandra asked, like, if there was anybody that was pregnant. And lo and behold, I was the only one.

• 26:11Annie Elise?

  Yeah. Small town. Yep.

• 26:14Speaker 06

  Small town.

• 26:14Annie Elise?

  Okay. So tell me about your first time meeting Cassandra and what made you two click with one another?

• 26:21Speaker 06

  So Hannah had picked me up and we went to Chandler. So Chandler was about like a 25, 30 minute drive and we went to, it's like right off the I-10. It's a Denny's. And I remember Hannah picked me up and Cassandra was in the car also. So we had talked a little bit before we got there. Uh, once we got there, we kind of just like hit it off and you know, I feel like we were able to, um, connect and just relate on each other, like, oh, like morning sickness or, you know, uh, my back hurts. Or I'm getting a lot of heartburn. Like I heard that means that they have a lot of hair. Like, it was just really nice to be able to talk to somebody and I felt really good about it. Like it felt, it felt really good. I didn't think anything weird or anything was wrong.

• 27:00Annie Elise?

  And was she similar in terms of the, her, uh, how far along she was?

• 27:05Speaker 06

  So she, I think at that moment, I met her like the end of November, maybe beginning of December-ish. And I was about six months and she was about three months.

• 27:15Annie Elise?

  Okay.

• 27:15Speaker 06

  Three to four months.

• 27:16Annie Elise?

  But still, so you're relating on the symptoms you guys are going through, probably being like, how was your first trimester? And here's what mine was like. And it felt nice to have someone that you could talk to and share that, those moments and experiences with.

• 27:28Speaker 06

  Yes, it felt really nice. And like I said, nobody else could really relate to me on that. Like, except, you know, my mom could tell me things from that, you know, from my brothers and me. But it just, I don't know, I feel like as a pregnant woman, sometimes you feel like you're, like, everything got taken away from you. You made this choice, but like everything got taken away from you and you feel alone. So it was just really, really nice. You know, you see nowadays where people go onto mom groups and they want to get friends. And especially when you have a baby and you want somebody to like be there with you that has a child that's the same age as yours. Like, it's kind of like the same thing. I felt like really relieved and I felt like, wow, I made a really, like, I made, I made a good friend. We even, that even later on that day, we went to baby. Babies are us.

• 28:07Annie Elise?

  Mm hmm.

• 28:08Speaker 06

  And, you know, um, we got that like that little gun and you like run around and start scanning.

• 28:12Annie Elise?

  Scanning for the register to register.

• 28:14Speaker 06

  Exactly. So we both created our registries that day and we.

• 28:17Annie Elise?

  Oh, my gosh.

• 28:18Speaker 06

  We did like our like, we just did like a little bit of things that we found. So that was really nice. Um, and then after that, we went home and we exchanged, you know, numbers. And at that time, socials was just like MySpace.

• 28:28Annie Elise?

  Yeah.

• 28:29Speaker 06

  I think Facebook was just coming around. So like we exchanged like our Facebooks.

• 28:32Annie Elise?

  Okay.

• 28:33Speaker 06

  And we honestly stayed in contact, um, all the way until the incident. We, we texted all the time.

• 28:38Annie Elise?

  How often would you see each other? You would text all the time. How often would you guys get together and see each other? Because you, at that point, you said you were what, around six months?

• 28:45Speaker 06

  Mm hmm.

• 28:46Annie Elise?

  So you had, I guess, three, but technically probably like four more months to go.

• 28:49Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 28:50Annie Elise?

  Um, so how often would you guys get together and what would you do?

• 28:54Speaker 06

  So we actually never got together after that.

• 28:57Annie Elise?

  Oh, you didn't? You would just talk via social media and text message?

• 29:00Speaker 06

  Just social media, just text message. Um, I worked and I also just didn't. I don't know. I, it was, it was really hard getting me out of the house. I felt, I, I kind of like self-isolated myself.

• 29:11Annie Elise?

  Mm hmm.

• 29:11Speaker 06

  For a while, just because for, there was no reason about it. Just like I felt, I wanted to stay away from things and she lived in a house that had kickbacks and she was living with our friend Sebastian. So like I just stayed away from there. Um, but we talked all the time, you know, she would fight with her. I do remember she has a husband. So that's one thing that was like very different. Um, obviously like I had Josh. I think at that time I started to call Josh my boyfriend.

• 29:34Annie Elise?

  And was she your age?

• 29:35Speaker 06

  She was nine days younger than me.

• 29:37Annie Elise?

  Okay. And was this her first pregnancy as well?

• 29:40Speaker 06

  This was her first pregnancy as well.

• 29:41Annie Elise?

  But she was married?

• 29:42Speaker 06

  She was married. She dropped out, I believe, like her sophomore year or maybe even junior year.

• 29:47Annie Elise?

  Okay.

• 29:48Speaker 06

  And so this guy, she, well, the story that she told us was like that she had been talking to this guy since she was like in like middle school. And so they had gotten married and she was having his baby. That was the whole reason. Like they got married because she was pregnant with his baby. But he lived in like Chandler, I believe, and she lived in Maricopa. So about a 35 minute like drive. And everybody knew about this guy. So everybody knew who Edwin was. Nobody had ever talked to him. Nobody had ever met him.

• 30:14Annie Elise?

  But they had heard about him.

• 30:15Speaker 06

  They heard about him. We would. Hear him on the phone, like she was always talking to somebody in Spanish.

• 30:20Annie Elise?

  So what did anybody ever ask her? If you're married? Yeah, I guess thirty five minutes is kind of a drive, but not really. If you're married and if you're pregnant with his child, why aren't you guys living together? Why are you couch surfing and living on at Sebastian's house?

• 30:33Speaker 06

  So those were questions that like we asked, and I think I feel like she said that he was working and like his mom didn't like. She had like a story like along the lines of like, he still lives with his mom, like she doesn't like her. I I do know that like Cassandra's mom had passed away, which I did find out was like a hundred percent true. She did pass away. The dad, I believe, lived in Mexico. And so she was live, she was supposed to be living with her sister in Maricopa. I don't know like what happened or why. She never really opened up about like that situation.

• 31:02Annie Elise?

  She was kind of on her own.

• 31:03Speaker 06

  She was kind of on her own. So she was just couch, yeah, couch surfing because she would stay at Sebastian's and then she would stay at Hannah's. So she would kind of go back and forth.

• 31:11Annie Elise?

  Okay, so you guys would talk, you were friendly, you would share even through the upcoming months, seven months, eight months, nine months. Here's how I'm feeling. How are you doing? Did you get your registry? Did you have a baby shower, things like that?

• 31:23Speaker 06

  Yes.

• 31:24Annie Elise?

  Okay.

• 31:24Speaker 06

  And then I even invited her. So my baby shower was like.

• 31:30Speaker 06

  My baby shower was in February. I think I was due in March. Yeah, I'm pretty sure.

• 31:35Annie Elise?

  So it was very close to it. And she didn't go to your baby shower, though.

• 31:38Speaker 06

  She didn't. I invited her. She did sound like she was gonna come and then she didn't. I didn't even notice that she didn't make it because we had so many people between Josh and I, between our families, like. My whole house was filled. I was very, very blessed. Like I got double of things off my registry, like. It was.

• 31:54Annie Elise?

  You had a lot of support. That's amazing.

• 31:56Speaker 06

  And I, it's crazy because I felt so alone, but that day of my baby shower, I felt like, oh, my gosh, all my friends, like.

• 32:01Annie Elise?

  They're showing up.

• 32:02Speaker 06

  They're showing up just because they couldn't. It was kind of one of those things where it was like, we're in high school, like they have things that they're doing too. And that's kind of like why I wanted a friend because.

• 32:09Annie Elise?

  Yeah.

• 32:10Speaker 06

  We're we're in two different lifestyles.

• 32:11Annie Elise?

  You're on this more like expedited adult grown up path while everybody else is still having keg parties or going to the tailgating at the football game. And so.

• 32:20Speaker 06

  Going to the high bridge. Yes, everything.

• 32:22Annie Elise?

  It probably felt nice to finally be back and be like, okay, I'm not so different. It's I'm not, it's not as isolating.

• 32:29Speaker 06

  So it was really, yeah, it was really nice.

• 32:31Annie Elise?

  Oh, good.

• 32:31Speaker 06

  And then I realized she sent me a text message later that day and said, hey, I'm so sorry. I wasn't feeling good, like I wasn't able to make it, but I would love to like make it up to you.

• 32:38Annie Elise?

  Oh, okay.

• 32:39Speaker 06

  And then I think that just I had my baby shower and then. I want to say Valentine's Day happened on the 14th. And then she messaged me on the 15th and was like, can I come over tomorrow? I have a baby shower gifts for you. Like, I'm so sorry I wasn't able to make it, but I would love to spend a day with you.

• 32:59Annie Elise?

  Trying to make up for not being there.

• 33:01Speaker 06

  Yes, and I actually, she wanted, specifically, she wanted me to come to her. So she did want me to come to her house, but I told her.

• 33:07Annie Elise?

  At Sebastian's?

• 33:08Speaker 06

  Okay, sorry, I jumped ahead.

• 33:10Annie Elise?

  No, that's okay.

• 33:11Speaker 06

  She had gotten kicked out of Sebastian's and she went back to live with her sister.

• 33:15Annie Elise?

  What did she get kicked out for?

• 33:16Speaker 06

  So Sebastian, um, I never, and the funny thing is, I never asked. Um, I actually found out from one of the ID channels, uh, they interviewed Sebastian. And I guess he just said that because she wasn't doing anything.

• 33:26Annie Elise?

  Oh, she was kind of a deadbeat hanging around?

• 33:28Speaker 06

  He called it, she called it squatting.

• 33:32Annie Elise?

  Okay, so she moves back in with her sister and she's like, I'm so sorry I couldn't make it to your baby shower. I want to make it up to you. I have gifts. Can you come over? And at this point, did you feel like anything was off with her?

• 33:45Speaker 06

  No, I didn't feel like anything was off. She was very. I feel like she, I'm trying to figure out the words, how to use it. I feel like she was very needy.

• 33:55Annie Elise?

  Okay.

• 33:55Speaker 06

  Um.

• 33:56Annie Elise?

  And in, how so, in the way of wanting to know where you're going, what you're doing, wanting to talk to you, having like ownership over your time?

• 34:03Speaker 06

  It seemed like she always, when she would text me, if I didn't text back right away, like she would be like, hey, like, are you, are you going to answer me? Like, hey, like, I'm just checking on you. And I'd be like, oh, sorry, like, I was in a doctor appointment or hey, like, sorry, I had work, like.

• 34:14Annie Elise?

  How many text messages would you say she sent you a day?

• 34:18Speaker 06

  Hmm.

• 34:20Speaker 06

  If I didn't answer, it was like, just like, like a follow up. So it wasn't, it wasn't crazy. It wasn't like a lot, like, because she'd even go days without talking to me. So like, it was just, it was random. But when she would talk to me, like, sometimes we'd get into like a texting conversation and we would, you know, just go on. But if I, if we were in like a conversation and I did not answer her back, like, she'd be like, hey, like, hey. And then she'd call me like, hey, I, I just, I had, I had that question. Can you answer it? And as a teenager, like, it was annoying.

• 34:46Annie Elise?

  Totally, 100%. I get that.

• 34:54Annie Elise?

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• 35:39Annie Elise?

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• 35:50Speaker 07

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• 36:28Annie Elise?

  And would you guys talk on the phone as well, or just mainly text message?

• 36:32Speaker 06

  We would talk on the phone also. And then like she would post like, this is when we first started kind of going into Facebook. So like I would post like my ultrasound pictures, and then like immediately after, she would post her ultrasound pictures. And then she'd be like, oh, like my baby, like, and she was, I do know that like with, I didn't get to hang out with her too much. But all my other friends like got to meet her at the kick, I got different kickbacks.

• 36:54Annie Elise?

  Yeah.

• 36:54Speaker 06

  And they said, like, she just constantly always was like, oh, my baby, like, always talking about her.

• 36:59Annie Elise?

  It was like her whole world, her whole life.

• 37:00Speaker 06

  It was her whole personality.

• 37:01Annie Elise?

  Okay.

• 37:02Speaker 06

  Having this baby was her own, like, her whole personality. She wanted everybody to know what she was naming the baby. You know, I'm having this, I'm having that, like.

• 37:09Annie Elise?

  Did she say if she was having a boy or a girl?

• 37:11Speaker 06

  She was having a boy.

• 37:12Annie Elise?

  Okay.

• 37:12Speaker 06

  Yeah, like we're, like me, yes. So we both kind of just, I don't know, people, like Josh even met her once, actually, now that I think about it. He went to one of the kickbacks. I stayed home. And I remember Josh went to one and he came, I think we met up the next day and he was like, hey, I met that girl Cassandra. He was like, she's an odd one. And I was like, why? He's like, she just like talks a lot. And I was like, yeah, he's like, and she's like obsessed with this baby. Like, she's so excited, but like, where is this husband? Like.

• 37:37Annie Elise?

  Yeah.

• 37:38Speaker 06

  So everybody started to have questions.

• 37:40Annie Elise?

  About like, what's the true story of like, her husband, why she's living here, what's going on? Okay.

• 37:46Speaker 06

  Yes. So everybody kind of, but, but we're all seventeen, eighteen year olds that we're all just like, you know, like nowadays, it's like, I'd be like, hmm, like.

• 37:54Annie Elise?

  Now we're exposed to more darkness in the world.

• 37:56Speaker 06

  Exactly. And not that much darkness was, I mean, there was always there. Darkness has always been there. It just was not, there was no platforms, there was nothing. We didn't talk about this.

• 38:04Annie Elise?

  The visibility wasn't there.

• 38:05Speaker 06

  We were taught not to talk about our traumas. So like, people didn't talk about these types of things. So, you know, we didn't ask and question stuff. And after that, it was, that's when she came, so she ended up asking if I can come to her house.

• 38:17Annie Elise?

  Uh huh.

• 38:17Speaker 06

  And I remember I was watching Grey's Anatomy with my mom and I was laying in bed with her. And I like sigh and, and she goes, why? And I was like, my friend Cassandra. And she was like, what? And I was like, well, she didn't come to my baby shower. She's like, oh, are you upset? And I was like, no. I was like, but she has these gifts and she wants me to go to her house and I just, I'm not feeling good. Like, I haven't been feeling good. Um, my pregnancy, we ended up finding out later I have preeclampsia. So it makes sense like why I'm not feeling good, but I don't know this at the time. So I'm just like explaining to my mom, like, I just don't have the energy, like, and she's like, just invite her here. And I was like, oh.

• 38:51Annie Elise?

  And how many months pregnant were you at this point?

• 38:52Speaker 06

  I was nine months pregnant.

• 38:53Annie Elise?

  Nine months. Okay. So you invite, so you're like, I'm not gonna go over there. It's too much. Like, I'm tired, which same, I don't, you couldn't pay me to get out of the house. So I get that. So then you're like, we'll invite her over to our house. And she can bring the gifts. We can

• 39:08Speaker 06

  We can hang out.

• 39:09Annie Elise?

  We can see each other again and it'll be great.

• 39:11Speaker 06

  Exactly.

• 39:12Annie Elise?

  Okay, so walk us through the day that Cassandra came over, just at the very beginning of it.

• 39:17Speaker 06

  So Cassandra texted me and said, I'm gonna be getting dropped off. And I was like, okay, that's fine. You know, I sent her my address. And my brother had, it was like nine in the morning and my brother answered the door and it was February 16th.

• 39:29Annie Elise?

  Sunny, cold, rainy?

• 39:31Speaker 06

  It was sunny.

• 39:32Annie Elise?

  Okay.

• 39:32Speaker 06

  It's always sunny.

• 39:33Annie Elise?

  Yeah, true. It's Arizona. Hello. I don't even know why I asked that.

• 39:36Speaker 06

  We do have monsoon season, but it's.

• 39:38Annie Elise?

  So nine AM on a what weekday?

• 39:40Speaker 06

  So, hmm, I don't even remember.

• 39:42Annie Elise?

  Okay, so nine AM sunny and she's coming over for the day. Okay. So your brother opens the door.

• 39:47Speaker 06

  My brother opens the door and she's being dropped off by a man in like this white van. And that's all my brother saw was like a white van and he's about, my brother was, I'm 10 years older than him, so he would have been eight years old at this time.

• 39:59Annie Elise?

  Oh, wow. Okay. And did you have any other plans that day? Was she gonna come over for just a little bit of time? Was she just gonna come over indefinitely? And you guys were just gonna hang or what was the plan?

• 40:09Speaker 06

  There was like no plan. It was just like, hey, like if you want to come over and hang out with me, like I'll be home with my family. And she was like, yeah, like I would love that.

• 40:16Annie Elise?

  Okay.

• 40:16Speaker 06

  So she came over with no, like I had no expectations of like what was gonna happen.

• 40:21Annie Elise?

  Yep. And who was at the house in addition to you and your eight year old brother?

• 40:25Speaker 06

  So my eight year old brother was there and my 13 year old brother was there and then my mom was there. My dad was at work.

• 40:33Annie Elise?

  Okay.

• 40:33Speaker 06

  So it was just us, us there. So my brothers, myself and my mom. And she had walked in, she had this like big diaper bag with her. It was a really big diaper bag. And she said that all the gifts were in there. And I remember my mom asked like, oh, do you want me to take the bag? She was like, no, no, no, I got it. And we're like, okay. And she was like, well, I want to show you the gifts later. Like I want to talk with you and hang out. And I was like, yeah, that's totally fine. So she puts the bag like away, like in the front room. And she just hangs out with us all day. And to be quite honest, like, we didn't do too much. It was mainly just like, I remember like we migrated from like the kitchen table to like the couch and we just started talking about like, you know, just like certain things.

• 41:14Speaker 06

  We had spent a lot of the day, this is like when Teen Mom was coming, like when, like the OGs were coming out. Like I remember watching like Kale on and you know, just like Janelle, all of them on. And you know, we were talking about all the drama between them and at one point it went to a commercial break and. We started ta- she started asking like questions about like certain things like about she started asking questions about birth and we were making a joke because

• 41:39Annie Elise?

  What kind of questions?

• 41:40Speaker 06

  So we lived about forty minutes away from the nearest hospital. So she would be like, what would happen if like we went into labor? And I'm like, what do you mean? She was like, well, what would happen? Like you, we live so far away from a hospital. Like, I was like, oh, we would probably just go to the hospital.

• 41:54Annie Elise?

  Yeah, call nine one one.

• 41:55Speaker 06

  Call nine one one or something. My mom was like, it doesn't happen. Like, my mom was like, so my mom jumped in and was like, it doesn't happen like the movie state like.

• 42:01Annie Elise?

  Yeah.

• 42:02Speaker 06

  Sometimes it could happen like that, but everybody's different. Normally, you don't just have the baby. Like, once you start getting your contractions. So my mom's like, kind of going into detail.

• 42:10Annie Elise?

  So your mom was very much involved in this hangout session. She was around.

• 42:14Speaker 06

  She was around the whole day.

• 42:15Annie Elise?

  Okay. And what time of day was this now?

• 42:17Speaker 06

  This was probably about like ten thirty, eleven. So earlier, she got dropped off about nine.

• 42:22Annie Elise?

  So it's been a couple hours. You've been hanging out, just talking, catching up, watching TV now. And your mom's been there. Your brothers are there. Okay.

• 42:28Speaker 06

  My brothers are in their room. And so my mom is just outside. My mom, my mom tends to hang out with me and my friends. So.

• 42:35Annie Elise?

  Hey, I love that.

• 42:37Speaker 06

  So she would, uh, yeah, she just basically stayed the whole day with us, just talking and everything like that. And then that's when they were talking about like, you know, the births. But then she was like, well, what happens if we need a C-section? My mom was like, what do you mean? She was, because my mom kept on saying like, what do you mean? Like, needing her to kind of explain a little bit more. She was like, well, how, like, what would happen? Like, what if you needed an emergency C-section? My mom was like, oh, like, same thing. You know, you'd go to the hospital. It's not just like, you need a C-section, they're gonna cut you open like in your house. Like, all of this is done, like, you know, at a hospital.

• 43:08Annie Elise?

  There's a protocol for it.

• 43:09Speaker 06

  Yes. And then she looks at my mom and she goes, wait, have you had a C-section? And my mom goes, yeah, I had a C-section with Angelique's youngest brother, Isaac. And she goes, oh, how, like, how was it? She was like, oh, you know, like, they, you know, they give you, um, like, medicine. You don't feel everything. It's, it's scary, but, you know, it's, my mom just kind of goes into detail of like what, like, like what the C-section felt like.

• 43:29Annie Elise?

  Yeah.

• 43:30Speaker 06

  Um, and I remember this is like where she became very intrigued at the conversation. And she was like, well, how far do they cut? Like, do they cut up and down? Or they cut side to side? And my mom was like, they cut side. Like from side to side.

• 43:42Annie Elise?

  Was anything going off in your mind of like, why are you asking so many fucking questions? Or like, what's going on here? Were you just kind of like, oh, maybe she doesn't have like her mom of her, her mom had passed? Maybe she just hasn't had anybody teach her this stuff.

• 43:55Speaker 06

  I honestly didn't think anything of it because I felt like they were really, I mean, to be quite honest, like me and my mom hadn't even had the conversations.

• 44:01Annie Elise?

  So you were curious too, to hear the answers?

• 44:03Speaker 06

  I was curious to hear the answer because like, we all don't want to have a C-section, like you hear of these things, but like, I don't want to be cut open.

• 44:10Annie Elise?

  Yeah.

• 44:11Speaker 06

  So I remember sitting there and I was just like, you know, listening and kind of just like watching my mom. My mom kind of took, took role in it. Like she took control of the whole conversation of with Cassandra when it came to the C-section. And I just kind of observed everything, but I didn't think anything. There was a part of me that just felt like everything was weird, to be honest, but like I do, I do talk about that with my mom after the situation. So she's telling, my mom's telling her like, no, you go from side to side. And Cassandra goes, okay. She literally stands up, lifts her shirt up and goes, can you show me?

• 44:44Annie Elise?

  Oh, my gosh.

• 44:44Speaker 06

  And my mom goes, um, I mean, like mine? And my mom was like, you can't see like where, like where mine is at. Like she's like, you have to understand like your belly gets big and they cut. And then it goes, and then like when you, you know, obviously your belly goes back down and like, I'm not going to show you my scar. She goes, but like from there, like around there. And Cassandra goes like this, like she literally has her shirt up like this and she's just like looking. And I'm just like, then I started, I started to feel eerie at that time. And then she started asking more questions like, well, what happens if the baby's not breathing? And my mom goes, oh, they get the moco sucker. And she goes, what's that? And she goes, you know, like the little bulb is a bulb and they put it in the baby, like in the mouth and they start suctioning out like if whatever there is in there. And she was like, oh, I've never seen one. And I'm like, you've never seen one?

• 45:28Speaker 06

  Like, I feel like everybody has seen like this, like, you know, blue bulb that they give you.

• 45:31Annie Elise?

  I feel like we used to have it when we were younger that they would use for like, if you even rinsing out your ears or like your nose.

• 45:37Speaker 06

  Or doing like the cleanse things?

• 45:39Annie Elise?

  Yeah. So what? Yeah. What are you? I forget what that's called. Where you like shoot the water up and it comes down the other side of your nose.

• 45:44Speaker 06

  A cat, is it a kettle thing?

• 45:46Annie Elise?

  Something like that. But basically for anybody who doesn't understand what it is, it's like very nineties. But it's like baby blue, if I remember, and the bulb is probably the size of not a tennis ball, a little bit smaller than that. And then it has like the big, like, uh, whatever you would call it, like, almost like a, it looks like a turkey baster, kind of, but way smaller.

• 46:04Speaker 06

  That is perfect. That is, yes, that's exactly what it looks like.

• 46:06Annie Elise?

  It's a suction tool.

• 46:07Speaker 06

  They use it as suction tool and you, and you get sent home with those from the hospital to use to like at the boogers, you know, like, we call them mocos, but you know, boogers. And so, yeah, she was very confused about it. And she asked me, did I get one for my baby shower? And I was like, oh yeah, I got one. She was like, oh, reminding you, my baby shower was like three days prior, I think. So we're 16th, 15th, 14th. It was the day before, like, I want to say it was like the day before Valentine's Day or something, whatever that weekend was, is when my baby shower was. And I had not gone through my gifts. There were so many. It was so overwhelming. My whole couch, like I had an L couch, the whole back of the couch was filled.

• 46:44Annie Elise?

  Wow.

• 46:45Speaker 06

  It was so much. And so I hadn't even tried to go through them yet. And she wanted me to dick through them and to go find it for her. And I was like, no.

• 46:53Annie Elise?

  And what was her explanation? She just had never seen one?

• 46:55Speaker 06

  She had never seen one.

• 46:56Annie Elise?

  Know what it looked like. So she's like, oh, did you get one? I want to see. I've never seen it.

• 46:59Speaker 06

  And then she went back. I told her I didn't want to. I was like, I'm not going to go look through that. And she was like, I'll go look. And she like got up and I was like, I got a better idea. My laptop's right here. Let me show you what it looks like on Google, because like, good luck trying to find them in there. Like, I have no idea what bag it's in. And I literally like, pulled it up for her on Google. And she goes, oh, okay, okay. And I was like, yeah. I was like, they use it for like the boogers. Like, that's what, I'm pretty sure that's what you get sent home with. But I'm not an expert on it. So I don't know. And that did make me feel a certain way. I remember after that, I still hadn't talked to my mom at that point, like alone. Then my mom, so it started to hit lunchtime. So my mom was like, let me make you guys some food. We have leftover carne asada and chicken and, you know, let me make you guys some food. Um, and you guys

• 47:42Speaker 06

  can sit down and eat. So we went and we sat down and we started to eat, like she was making us food and we started to get into other conversations, just about like, Like our life and stuff like that. I think, I think at one point we asked her like about her mom. And she kind of told her, told us that like her mom passed away from breast cancer and she told us like how, you know, increased like how much like pain her mom was in and it was really sad, honestly. Like I, she's, she cried, I cried, my mom cried, like. It was just a really sad moment because you know, she was like, I wish like my mom could be here to like,

• 48:10Annie Elise?

  Yeah.

• 48:10Speaker 06

  be with me and like go through this with me. She was like, you're so lucky like to have a mom. And then things started to like, take a turn, not like, not like a turn, but I started to feel, this is when I started to really feel certain ways with her because she started to like mimic my life. So like, I would say something like, for an example, I got arrested for, for hitting my mom. Me and her gone to a fight. It wasn't like a really bad altercation, but I did, I did like get in trouble. And so I got arrested for it and all of a sudden like she had the exact same story.

• 48:41Annie Elise?

  Hmm.

• 48:41Speaker 06

  Um, and it was like to a T though, like it wasn't, it was almost exactly like it, or, you know, I, when I was like 14, like I jumped out my nana's window and ran away for like a week and like, she was like, oh my gosh, I did the exact same thing. Like I went and it was just, everything was

• 48:55Annie Elise?

  Like mirroring everything.

• 48:57Speaker 06

  She was mirroring everything that I did, everything, like any, anything that I, we talked about that we were joking about from like when I was younger. It was, she had the exact same story.

• 49:06Annie Elise?

  Had she done that in the past when you guys were texting and talking, or was this more amplified now that she was at your house?

• 49:12Speaker 06

  This is way more amplified. I didn't, the way I was feeling at my house wasn't the same way like I felt like throughout our whole conversations.

• 49:18Annie Elise?

  So you felt that something was off? Were you feeling scared or were you feeling more like, this girl feels like a stalker, like a weirdo?

• 49:24Speaker 06

  Annoyed. I thought she was weird. I thought she was weird, but she would, and then she would stop and then she would just go back to like, thank you guys so much. Like you guys are such like great people, like the hospitality, like, I wish my family was more welcoming like this. Like she kind of, she, she played with my, my, like with my heartstrings for it. Like, she kept on like trying to like, it made me feel uneasy, but then she was like reeling me back into like reality.

• 49:47Annie Elise?

  Poor girl, like she just needs someone to care for her.

• 49:50Speaker 06

  Yes. And so, and there was this one thing that kept happening. She kept having somebody call her and she would talk to them in Spanish. And my mom understands Spanish. Unfortunately, we don't. They just didn't pass it on. They just didn't teach us. But my mom understands Spanish. So like she would hear her talk and I think at one point there was a joke that was made and she giggled and my mom and she looked at my mom and was like, you understand Spanish? And she was like, yeah, like I understand, like I'm I don't speak fluently. And she was like, oh, so then like all her conversations started happening. Everywhere like she would take the every time a phone call would come in, she would leave the room and she would go somewhere else to have this conversation.

• 50:25Annie Elise?

  Oh, wow. I'm just making notes as we're talking because I want to come back to that.

• 50:29Speaker 06

  Yeah. So that was really odd and weird. But at the same time, I'm gonna I'm gonna kind of reel that back in. It's weird hindsight 2020.

• 50:38Annie Elise?

  Yeah.

• 50:38Speaker 06

  But at that moment, think about us, like if I'm in an important conversation, you speak English, I speak English. I maybe don't want you to hear what's going on. So I'm gonna take the I'm gonna take the conversation in a different a different room.

• 50:48Annie Elise?

  Uh huh.

• 50:49Speaker 06

  So I just thought, oh, okay, like whatever's going on, she needs privacy for. Yes. So she went to go take her phone call and I remember doing dishes with my mom and I looked at her and I said, what do you think about her mom? She goes, oh, she's nice. And I said, you don't think she's weird? Like, I think she's weird. And she was like, well, what do you? Why do you think she's weird? I said, I feel like she's like mimicking me like she like wants my life. I don't know. I was like, I'm just getting this weird like feeling about her that like,

• 51:16Speaker 06

  she's I don't know if like things are being made up or and she was like, Angelique, like, I understand. She goes, you need to understand though, like she doesn't have a mom. She's new to a town. You know, she probably feels like uneasy even being here. Like you can tell that she's a good person and I think she just really wants to be your friend. And I think you're doing a great thing by like being her friend and being there for her. So my mom kind of made me, as a mom would, would bring me down from like how I'm feeling.

• 51:42Annie Elise?

  Yeah.

• 51:42Speaker 06

  And. I thought like, oh, Angelique, you're such, you're like, you're being a bitch. Like, you're kind of just being a mean girl now. Like, so I felt like, okay, I need to take a step back and realize that this girl has gone through a lot in her life. And maybe I, she doesn't have a mom or dad, and she's kind of like, obviously, whatever's going on in her life, this husband of hers isn't like amazing, they fight all the time.

• 52:03Annie Elise?

  She's lost a little bit.

• 52:04Speaker 06

  She's a lost soul is kind of like how I, how I saw it. So I was like, okay, not every friendship is perfect. And maybe she's not going to be like my best friend or like somebody super close, but I can be friendly with her. So that's how my mindset was, like continuing the rest of the day.

• 52:18Annie Elise?

  Okay.

• 52:18Speaker 07

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• 52:48Annie Elise?

  So then walk me through the rest of the day. What happened after lunch?

• 52:52Speaker 06

  So then she wanted to ask, she kept, that time she asked me if I would go for a walk with her. So when she returned back from talking to somebody, she was like, so I saw that there was a park down the street. She was like, do you want to go for a walk? And I was like, oh, no, girl. Like, I, I just ate. Like, I don't feel good. Like, I'm nine months pregnant. Like,

• 53:09Annie Elise?

  I'm not going for a walk to the park.

• 53:10Speaker 06

  Yeah, I was like, I'm not gonna do that. I just don't want to. And she was like, oh, like, it'll be really nice. She kept trying to push me to do it. And I was like, I don't want to. And I feel like at that time, I started, we went back to the couch. And at that point, I started to like fake yawn.

• 53:26Annie Elise?

  To like hopefully get, get her the hint to be like, time for you to go.

• 53:29Speaker 06

  Time for you to leave. Yeah, like I just, it was, even though my mom made me feel better, like I was done hosting. Like, at that point, I really was tired.

• 53:36Annie Elise?

  Yeah, no, I believe it. Tapped out. Yeah, that's a lot.

• 53:39Speaker 06

  I was tapped out. Like, I wanted to stop. So then I just started like fake yawning. And then I was like, oh, like, I'm so tired. And she was like, oh, I'm so sorry. Like, my sister, I don't have a key to the house. My sister's not going to be home till later tonight. I hope it's okay that I stay here. And then I was like, darn it.

• 53:54Annie Elise?

  Yeah.

• 53:56Speaker 06

  I was like, oh, man. Okay.

• 53:58Annie Elise?

  You're all sure. Can I just go in my room and then close the door and like go to sleep?

• 54:01Speaker 06

  Like, can you and my mom hang out and just let me know what happened and I'll be back?

• 54:05Annie Elise?

  Yeah.

• 54:06Speaker 06

  So then I was like, crap. Okay. Angela, like, put your big girl pants on. You still have to host. Like, let's now watch more Teen Mom.

• 54:12Annie Elise?

  Yeah.

• 54:13Speaker 06

  So we started watching more TV, but she had asked me again if I would go, like, wanted to go for another walk. And I was like, no, I really don't want to. Then she tried to bribe me into coming to her house. She goes, well, I can make you cookies. And I was like, I don't like cookies.

• 54:30Annie Elise?

  I thought you didn't have a key.

• 54:31Speaker 06

  Exactly. Exactly. Actually, now that you're saying, I've never even thought about that. Now that you're saying that, that is a full circle that I've never even thought about. But yeah, she kept on trying to get me, what if we go back to my house or like, I can make you like, you know, your favorite meal, your favorite dish. Like, and I was like, no, I'm not.

• 54:46Annie Elise?

  Yeah, I'm here. My mom just made food for us. Like, get out of my face.

• 54:49Speaker 06

  Like, what is going on?

• 54:50Annie Elise?

  She's trying to get you alone.

• 54:51Speaker 06

  She's trying to get me alone.

• 54:52Annie Elise?

  Mm hmm.

• 54:53Speaker 06

  And I don't think she anticipated my whole family being home the whole day. So that's why it felt like now, looking back, she, she cut, there were, there were points where she kept trying to get me to leave. But I kept shutting it down and, and, and at, at some point she finally took the hint, like, we're not going anywhere.

• 55:07Annie Elise?

  Mm hmm.

• 55:08Speaker 06

  So now it's about, I really think we just sat on the couch for like hours, to be honest, because I can't really remember. There was nothing else that stood out to me except for watching TV the whole day. And then it started to hit like four o'clock and at five, I think is like my brother's football practices.

• 55:22Annie Elise?

  Okay.

• 55:22Speaker 06

  So I do remember my mom saying like, hey, girls, like, we have football practice, like, we're gonna go to Pocana, you know? I know, Cassandra, you've talked about like going for a walk. Like, Angela, what do you think? Like, what if I just take you guys to the park and you guys can go for like a small walk? If you feel tired, I'll bring you back home. And I was like, you know what? Yeah, you know what? I could do that. Like, I'm feeling better now. Like, I'm not full. Like, let, let's go for a walk. Like, Cassandra, do you want to go do that? Like, since you, you know?

• 55:48Annie Elise?

  You've been pushing for it?

• 55:49Speaker 06

  Yeah, you've been pushing to get out.

• 55:50Annie Elise?

  Yeah.

• 55:50Speaker 06

  And she was like, you know what? I don't feel good. Is it okay if we just stay here? And I was like, that is fine. Mom, she's not, I'm, we're just trading places now.

• 55:58Annie Elise?

  Yeah.

• 55:59Speaker 06

  I understand where you're coming from because I felt like that earlier. So I was like, Mom, you know what? You guys go ahead. We're gonna stay home. Um, Cassandra, want me to do your nails? Like, I have some, you know, new nail polishes. And she was like, that'd be great. So my mom left and I started-

• 56:12Annie Elise?

  And she had both your brothers?

• 56:13Speaker 06

  She took both my brothers. They both had football practice.

• 56:15Annie Elise?

  So now it is just you and Cassandra in the house?

• 56:17Speaker 06

  It is now just me and Cassandra at the house. It's about five thirty-ish.

• 56:21Annie Elise?

  Okay.

• 56:21Speaker 06

  Um, and I pull out like all my nail stuff. I have like my filing stuff. And I sit there and I'm starting to like file my nails. And then she goes, your gifts? And at this point, my parents had, like, my mom left, everybody was gone. And she was like, your gifts? I want to give you your gifts. And I was like, oh, forgot about those things. Like, I didn't even, like, that's the whole point that, like, the reason why she came. But I completely honestly forgot. I'm doing my nails and she tells me about the gifts. So I'm like, okay, let's go and do these gifts. She pulls out my chair from my kitchen and puts it in the middle of my kitchen and goes, okay, sit in the chair, turn around and close your eyes. And I'm like-

• 56:56Annie Elise?

  Like she was gonna surprise you with them or something?

• 56:58Speaker 06

  And I was like, oh, okay. And so like, I literally, I'm in the middle of my kitchen. I'm sitting in a chair just like this. And I'm sitting there like this with my back turned to her. And one by one, she would come up and then she would like come over my head and like a gift would get dropped in my lap. And so like I would get the gift and I would open it and it'd be like a baby onesie. And then again, she would come back, drop something else in my lap, a newborn, like a blanket.

• 57:24Annie Elise?

  This is so weird. Okay, like, who does this? If I was just sitting in the middle of my kitchen and my friend was like, I'm just gonna drop a gift one by one in your lap from behind. I'm like, what game is this?

• 57:37Speaker 06

  That is what I mean, though. Like, when people ask me, like, they're like, well, what do you mean she was weird? I'm like, you don't, like-

• 57:42Annie Elise?

  This is weird.

• 57:42Speaker 06

  It's weird, like-

• 57:44Annie Elise?

  It's nice, but it's weird.

• 57:46Speaker 06

  Weird, like, and I don't know, like, you know, like when you were in high school and you were just like, you're a weirdo.

• 57:51Annie Elise?

  Yeah.

• 57:51Speaker 06

  Like, it didn't necessarily mean that you're gonna come kill me. It just meant like, you're a weirdo.

• 57:55Annie Elise?

  Yeah.

• 57:55Speaker 06

  Like, you only know what that terminology is if you used it before.

• 57:58Annie Elise?

  Exactly.

• 57:59Speaker 06

  And this was just a weird moment, but I will say the gifts were coming, like, the gifts were coming, like, they were-

• 58:03Annie Elise?

  I was gonna say, no.

• 58:06Speaker 06

  And I remember opening it, but when I opened it, I remember taking like a big whiff of it and like it just reeked like cologne, like a man.

• 58:13Annie Elise?

  The onesie did.

• 58:14Speaker 06

  All of it did. Like the onesie, the newborn blanket, the like the receiving blanket. There was like a, like a, like a pajama set.

• 58:22Annie Elise?

  Were they, did they have tags on them? Were they wrapped?

• 58:25Speaker 06

  They were just wrapped.

• 58:26Annie Elise?

  Like wrapped, um, not like in it's.

• 58:29Speaker 06

  Like in tissue paper.

• 58:31Annie Elise?

  Okay. So even the blankets, bl- blankets, the blankets, they weren't in like, you know how sometimes they come in like a plastic zipper case type thing? They weren't in anything. They didn't have the cardboard on the corners. Nothing.

• 58:41Speaker 06

  So I had instantly come to the conclusion that they were all hand me downs, which.

• 58:44Annie Elise?

  Okay.

• 58:45Speaker 06

  My mom had taught me that you don't throw a fit. You just take what you get and you're just, you be happy about it. You don't say anything, even if you don't like it, you pretend like. You be grateful for what you get. So that's how I was raised and that's how I took it. So I am sitting here thinking in my head like, what is going on? But like they're gifts. They are real things that are happening.

• 59:02Annie Elise?

  Yeah.

• 59:02Speaker 06

  And it, it, it just kept, it was very, it felt like it was in slow motion though, because it just felt like she was walking and then dropping it in my lap. And then like I would open it and I'd be like, oh my gosh, this is so cute. Thank you. She goes, okay, I'm going with the next one.

• 59:15Annie Elise?

  Would you turn around and say thank you to her and like doing her, you would just stay with your back to her and be like, oh my God, this is so cute. Thank you. And then just kind of like wait for the next one.

• 59:23Speaker 06

  Yes. And then just sit there and I was just, she was, it felt like slow mo, but I mean, she was coming to the point periodically, like where I was like, the gifts were just coming and coming. One, two. So there was a baby blanket. There was a baby blanket. There was a receiving blanket. There was a newborn onesie. There was a pajama set. There was booties, a beanie. That might've been it.

• 59:43Annie Elise?

  And they were all individually wrapped?

• 59:45Speaker 06

  All individually wrapped.

• 59:46Annie Elise?

  Okay. So six different gifts that are getting dropped on your lap.

• 59:49Speaker 06

  Mm hmm.

• 59:50Annie Elise?

  At one after another.

• 59:51Speaker 06

  One after another.

• 59:51Annie Elise?

  Okay. So then what was the last gift?

• 59:54Speaker 06

  So there was actually like two last gifts. So there was this, there was, I remember turning around. So after I got the last one, I turned around and I like, I kind of like turned this way, like where my body was on the side. And I was like, like where I could see her. And I was like, thank you so much. Like, these are all so cute. Like, I really appreciate it. And she goes, wait, wait, wait. I also have something else for you. And I was like, okay. So she reaches into the bag and she pulls out like a baby, uh, like a wear, like a baby wearing, um.

• 1:00:20Annie Elise?

  Oh, like a Baby Bjorn type like a

• 1:00:22Speaker 06

  Yes, but they want

• 1:00:23Annie Elise?

  Carrier.

• 1:00:23Speaker 06

  Yeah, a baby carrier.

• 1:00:24Annie Elise?

  Okay.

• 1:00:24Speaker 06

  So when I say baby carrier, everybody thinks I'm talking about like a baby like

• 1:00:28Annie Elise?

  Like a car seat thing?

• 1:00:29Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 1:00:29Annie Elise?

  The one you wear on your body like a front backpack.

• 1:00:32Speaker 06

  Exactly. And if you were back in 2011, we didn't have what everybody else has. There's so many cute brands. It was just like generic, you know, it was, it was one from baby, from baby, uh, Babies R Us.

• 1:00:43Annie Elise?

  Okay.

• 1:00:43Speaker 06

  It was a generic black one that probably cost about like $80.

• 1:00:47Annie Elise?

  Yeah.

• 1:00:47Speaker 06

  That made me feel uncomfortable because I had felt, I knew how much that was because we went to

• 1:00:52Annie Elise?

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:00:53Speaker 06

  Babies R Us together.

• 1:00:53Annie Elise?

  And you had made the registries together.

• 1:00:55Speaker 06

  Yeah. So I knew how much that was.

• 1:00:56Annie Elise?

  And was that wrapped or no?

• 1:00:57Speaker 06

  That was not wrapped.

• 1:00:58Annie Elise?

  Okay.

• 1:00:58Speaker 06

  That was just in the bag.

• 1:01:00Annie Elise?

  So she holds it up and says, I have something else for you while you're halfway turned.

• 1:01:04Speaker 06

  Yes.

• 1:01:04Annie Elise?

  Okay.

• 1:01:04Speaker 06

  And I felt uncomfortable because I knew how much that was. I knew that she didn't work. I knew like, kind of like her light, like, like, how did you get this? And I told her, I can't accept this. And she was like, why? And I was like, because I know this costs a lot of money. And I, I, I didn't tell her this, but like, we're not on that type of friendship where I feel like you should be giving me like all like,

• 1:01:24Annie Elise?

  Yeah.

• 1:01:25Speaker 06

  But what you gave me was enough. Thank you.

• 1:01:26Annie Elise?

  Yeah.

• 1:01:27Speaker 06

  And I, I felt bad about it, but she told me, no, she's like, I already had my baby shower. This is actually a duplicate. I got two of them. And then I was like, oh.

• 1:01:34Annie Elise?

  Okay.

• 1:01:35Speaker 06

  Okay. Well, since she said that, I'll take it.

• 1:01:37Annie Elise?

  Yeah.

• 1:01:38Speaker 06

  So I ended up being like, I was grateful. Like at that part, at that point, I was like, oh, cool. Thank you. And I did, I did forget something. At one point she did ask me if there was something I didn't get when we were sitting on the couch. She asked me if there was something I didn't get for my baby shower that I wanted. And I said, you know what? This is going to sound so stupid, but you know, those like infomercials, like where they show like the little pet, Hello Pet? And it shines on the ceiling and it shows like the lights and plays like a lullaby. And she was like, yeah, I said, I really wanted one of those and I didn't get one. Like, I was like, that's probably the only thing that like I didn't get that like I really honestly wanted. So she used that because the very last gift, she goes, I have one last present for you. And I was like, okay. She goes,

• 1:02:21Speaker 06

  but I have to show you in the dark. And I was like, oh, why? She goes, it's a special surprise. And she goes, it's something you really wanted. I go, no, you didn't. She goes, yes, I She goes, I saw like she was basically stating like it was on my baby registry like she was like I but I but I had it specially made for Ryland and I was like, oh, she was like, yeah, so I ha- I want to show you though, because you can only see it in the dark. And at this point, it was probably hitting about like six o'clock. So the sun was coming down. It was getting dark in the house. And so I was like, okay, so we end up going back to my room.

• 1:02:52Annie Elise?

  So you get up off the chair. You guys are walking through the kitchen back to your bedroom.

• 1:02:56Speaker 06

  Yes.

• 1:02:56Annie Elise?

  Who's in front?

• 1:02:57Speaker 06

  She's in front of me.

• 1:02:58Annie Elise?

  Okay, so you're following behind?

• 1:03:00Speaker 06

  Yes, I'm following behind her. We go into the room and she tells me the kind of the same thing, not to sit down and turn around and close my eyes, but to turn around and close my eyes. So she, the way, the way I can visually tell you guys is like when you walk into my room, picture walking in, the left hand side is a closet. Here's just like a.

• 1:03:17Annie Elise?

  Walking closet or like double door closet?

• 1:03:19Speaker 06

  Double door closet.

• 1:03:20Annie Elise?

  Okay.

• 1:03:20Speaker 06

  Uh, well, like the sliding.

• 1:03:22Annie Elise?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:03:23Speaker 06

  And then so like you're walking this way, like there's just like a wall right here and then my bed's right here.

• 1:03:28Annie Elise?

  Okay.

• 1:03:29Speaker 06

  So and then like behind my bed is just like another area you can wa- like, like walking space like this.

• 1:03:34Annie Elise?

  Yeah.

• 1:03:34Speaker 06

  And then right here would be my um, my dresser. So it's a really small room.

• 1:03:38Annie Elise?

  Okay.

• 1:03:39Speaker 06

  So I'm standing like this where.

• 1:03:41Annie Elise?

  In between the bed and the closet?

• 1:03:42Speaker 06

  Yes, and facing the wall.

• 1:03:43Annie Elise?

  Facing the wall or the closet?

• 1:03:45Speaker 06

  The wall.

• 1:03:45Annie Elise?

  The wall and then the closet.

• 1:03:47Speaker 06

  It would be on my left hand side and the bed on my right hand side.

• 1:03:49Annie Elise?

  Okay, so you're facing the wall straight ahead and that pathway is just a small little walking path kind of area. Okay.

• 1:03:55Speaker 06

  So then she's behind me on the ground digging into this bag and I'm standing there. And all of a sudden, I start to have like a conversation with myself in my head.

• 1:04:06Annie Elise?

  You're feeling like something's wrong.

• 1:04:08Speaker 06

  It was, it was wild. It was, what would you do if she were to try to stab you? How would you protect yourself? Would you fight her? Would you be able to fight her? Why am I having these feelings? Like, why am I talking to myself right now? And then I was just like, whoa, like, what's going on? Like, so my brain was.

• 1:04:26Annie Elise?

  Your intuition was trying to tell you.

• 1:04:27Speaker 06

  It was trying to tell me and I was just sitting there and I was like, but why would she try to hurt me? I've been nothing but, no, people don't do this. Like, and I'm literally having just a conversation with myself. And all of a sudden, I start to get the chills. And I'm like, Cassandra, are you, are you almost like done? And she was like, yeah. And I sit there and all of a sudden the voice comes back in my head, you're about to get stabbed, you're about to get stabbed. And I'm just like. So I literally take my phone out of my pocket and I put my, I kinda have my phone like this. And I go Cassandra, my back's hurting. I said, I'm gonna sit on my bed. So remember the bed's on the right hand side, the closet's on the left hand side. I maneuver my body to sit onto the bed.

• 1:05:03Annie Elise?

  To where now you're facing the closet.

• 1:05:04Speaker 06

  And I can see her.

• 1:05:05Annie Elise?

  Okay.

• 1:05:06Speaker 06

  To a sense, she's, it's in the dark, but I can still see like her shadows.

• 1:05:09Annie Elise?

  Okay.

• 1:05:10Speaker 06

  And so I'm like, my back hurts really bad. I'm gonna sit on this bed. So I sit on the bed where I can see her and I'm feeling a little bit better because I can see her.

• 1:05:17Annie Elise?

  Yep.

• 1:05:17Speaker 06

  But then all of a sudden she goes, okay, I'm gonna get behind you. And I'm like, why? She goes, I'm gonna put the light over your head and it's gonna shine onto your closet. And you'll see the name. And I was like, okay. So she does it. She gets behind me on the bed and now all of a sudden it's like.

• 1:05:32Annie Elise?

  Is she on the bed or just right behind in that standing?

• 1:05:34Speaker 06

  She's on the bed.

• 1:05:35Annie Elise?

  Okay, behind you.

• 1:05:36Speaker 06

  Behind me. So I'm, I'm sitting on the edge of my bed and now she's physically gotten on behind my bed.

• 1:05:41Annie Elise?

  On the mattress.

• 1:05:41Speaker 06

  On the mattress and she's physically behind me. I could feel her like, like I could feel her like behind me. And all of a sudden I get like these feelings of like, you're in danger, you're in danger. You're about to be stabbed, you're about to be stabbed. And I'm just kinda like, like just looking around my room. And then I grab my phone, I put my mom's phone number in it and I hold it to my chest. And the thought in my head was so eerie. And I kept telling myself if something bad happens to me, my mom could hear a voicemail of me screaming or can figure out like. I had went so into depth of dying that like, but I couldn't, and I couldn't really understand like what was happening at that time. Like it was, the way I'm telling it to you guys, it feels like we were probably sitting there for like minutes.

• 1:06:21Speaker 06

  This was like happening in like 45 seconds. Like this all happened in very, very fast pace. So finally I go Cassandra, are you gonna show me? And she goes, yes. And she puts one hand on my shoulder, on my left hand shoulder. And she leans me forward so much that my stomach is huge that I can't breathe. And she goes, one, two.

• 1:06:44Annie Elise?

  All right, so we are going to pause the story right here, which I know that is a major cliffhanger, I get it, but trust me, you are going to want to hear what happens next. And don't worry, part two for the audio version is already available right now, wherever you're listening to this podcast. So you can just jump straight into it. You can listen to part two, we just wanted to break it up because it is such a long episode. But if you prefer to watch the full video interview, the entire conversation is available right now on YouTube. It isn't split into two parts either, it's just one really long episode. So go check that out on the video version if you want that. And we are going to pick right back up where we left off in part two.

• 1:07:37Speaker 00

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• 1:08:07Speaker 02

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