Helmets Are the Future

It's been an action-packed week in tech, and we're here to keep the adrenaline pumping. Micah Singleton and TC Sottek join Nilay Patel and Sam Sheffer to reflect on daily life with Apple Watch, the leather backed LG G4, the future of HoloLens, and what exactly Hadoop is, anyway. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:06Nilay Patel?

  Hello and welcome to The Vergecast for the week of whatever week it is. The week of April 27th. Sorry, here, once again, I'm supposed to say we're recording this on April 30th, but for years, what we've done is say we're, it's the week of whatever. And I still don't know which one people prefer. Hello, this is The Vergecast. It's a show about The Verge. Today, it will mostly be a show about Windows 10. Let's be honest. I am Neelai Patel. I am joined...

• 0:34Speaker 01

  By Micah Singleton.

• 0:35Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 0:36Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 0:37Nilay Patel?

  TC. And I got Sammy in the hype desk.

• 0:39Speaker 02

  Ayyyy.

• 0:42Speaker 02

  This shot is, oh man, this needs work.

• 0:44Nilay Patel?

  What is happening?

• 0:45Speaker 02

  We didn't test the shot beforehand because I was periscoping, but it was worth the periscoping.

• 0:49Nilay Patel?

  I will say that Sam, in an effort to be thirsty on every platform possible, literally before the show began, was in the control room, periscoping John, clicking a button on a computer that makes the stream go live.

• 1:03Speaker 02

  I'm getting tweets right now.

• 1:04Nilay Patel?

  And then he ran from the control room into the studio, sat down in time for me to say Sammy in the hype desk.

• 1:10Speaker 02

  Ayyyy.

• 1:11Nilay Patel?

  And then do that.

• 1:12Speaker 02

  The thirst is real, guys.

• 1:15Nilay Patel?

  To be commended in many ways. But anyway, this is The Vergecast. I'm excited you're here. Dieter is on vacation, a well-deserved vacation.

• 1:24Speaker 03

  Kind of.

• 1:25Nilay Patel?

  Dieter sucks at being on vacation.

• 1:27Speaker 02

  Yeah, he's always on Twitter.

• 1:28Nilay Patel?

  He has, no, he's in Slack with me, he's texting me. He sent me a random email about the LG G4 a couple of days ago, like during the event. He's like, "Make sure we get review units." And I was like, "Yes, Dieter, it's my first day." But he can't help it. God, God bless him, but he's on vacation. Ziggy is in San Francisco, looking at a Ford.

• 1:51Speaker 03

  Are we calling him Ziggy now?

• 1:52Nilay Patel?

  I haven't called him Ziggy for years.

• 1:53Speaker 03

  I'm not, I'm not down with that.

• 1:54Nilay Patel?

  Well, as soon as we started my new policy of only hiring people named Chris, they all need different names. That's what you do. That's how you torment people named Chris. You all bring them into one organization and then you give them, you assign them nicknames.

• 2:10Nilay Patel?

  You don't...

• 2:11Speaker 03

  Sure. I think we should call him Chat.

• 2:14Speaker 03

  After legendary Canadian singer Chad Kroeger.

• 2:17Nilay Patel?

  I'm done with this Nickelback.

• 2:18Speaker 03

  Of Nickelback fame.

• 2:20Nilay Patel?

  I have to say, this is the least, let me just give some backstory here. The people at The Verge are not funny. Some of them are, some of them are. But sometimes they find a joke that is so profoundly unfunny and disturbing, and then take it to even more profoundly disturbing unfunny levels. For example, Nickelback is just a piece of our lives here at The Verge now. Chad Kroeger appears. I will say that if you have the proper permissions on The Verge, you can change user pictures at will. It's the backend of the system. Many of our authors have turned into Chad Kroeger over time. Very disturbing. Also, Nickelback should be just outlawed. As a nation, I think we should, we should, as Americans, be allowed to say

• 3:05Nilay Patel?

  that we don't want Nickelback within our borders.

• 3:09Nilay Patel?

  I'm with you. All right, let's talk about Apple. Oh, by the way, Mike is here. How you doing, man?

• 3:12Speaker 01

  I'm doing well.

• 3:13Nilay Patel?

  Yeah?

• 3:13Speaker 01

  How you doing?

• 3:14Nilay Patel?

  All right. You're like, you know. Micah just shows up.

• 3:17Speaker 01

  I just fly in, come by.

• 3:19Nilay Patel?

  The last time Micah was in our office, he literally, it was like, what, like 10 to 5? And Micah just rolled in drinking a beer. And we're like, hey, Micah's here. And he drank his beer and left.

• 3:32Nilay Patel?

  There goes Micah.

• 3:33Speaker 03

  I'll learn something about how to work.

• 3:35Nilay Patel?

  There is actually a tremendous amount of news we need to get to. Not least, all of the stuff that happened with Microsoft to build. But first, we should talk about the little bit of Apple news that happened this weekend. So, Apple had its earnings. The second biggest quarter for Apple ever. The iPhone continues to skyrocket.

• 3:53Speaker 03

  Which of course means it was a massive disappointment to everybody.

• 3:55Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, of course.

• 3:56Speaker 03

  In the investment community.

• 3:59Nilay Patel?

  You know, I gotta say, the Apple investment, like, people out there in the world right now are, they're just the most annoying. Right? Like, that feedback loop where you invest your money in Apple, and then you're committed to Apple's success because that will make you money. And then you're just out there being like, I'm an independent analyst.

• 4:15Speaker 03

  It's like finding a $10 bill on the ground outside and being like, it's not a 20. Life sucks.

• 4:20Nilay Patel?

  Oh, no, I'm coming at it from a different perspective, which is that if you are a huge investor in Apple, you should probably not sit around telling everybody how Apple's the greatest all the time.

• 4:31Nilay Patel?

  Anyway, so huge earnings for Apple.

• 4:33Speaker 03

  Apple watch burn.

• 4:34Nilay Patel?

  Apple watch burn. And then, like, literally the next day, The Wall Street Journal reported that the watch is the reason it's so supply constrained is because one of the suppliers that builds the Taptic Engine, a phrase that I love to use, they're having problems and defective parts have been delivered.

• 4:54Speaker 03

  Which, by the way, is an interesting thing not to tell your investors.

• 4:58Nilay Patel?

  Well, I mean, if they caught it early and they're like managing, managing expectations, like, maybe.

• 5:05Speaker 03

  Yeah, but how genuine is your, is your, is your customer satisfaction status if half the people who want to get your product can't?

• 5:12Nilay Patel?

  Well, then you're managing your customer satisfaction.

• 5:15Speaker 03

  Right.

• 5:15Nilay Patel?

  You're not, you're like, you know, you want one? How about a broken one? That's cool. Now, that's, I mean, look, it's a new product. New products have problems. I think what's more interesting is the weird reporting around it. So, Apple hasn't really commented to anyone. The Wall Street Journal ran this based on their sources, obviously, the various suppliers. And then Recode followed up with, like, a quote from an outside analyst. They're all insistent that no bad parts have made it to customers, but then John Gruber definitely had a broken one that he and I have been joking about for a while. There have been another couple broke. It's like, broken ones have made it out there for sure. I don't know. It's the watch. Are you, do you still wear yours?

• 5:59Speaker 01

  I have one that had got delivered today and I'm not home to use it, so.

• 6:03Speaker 03

  Right, because I'm making you work.

• 6:05Speaker 01

  Yeah, exactly.

• 6:07Nilay Patel?

  I gave, yeah, I'm not wearing mine.

• 6:10Speaker 02

  I'm wearing mine.

• 6:11Nilay Patel?

  Are you wearing yours, Sammy?

• 6:12Speaker 02

  Hey.

• 6:12Nilay Patel?

  Yours, you got spray paint, tell us a spray paint story real quick.

• 6:15Speaker 02

  Oh, so there's a filmmaker on YouTube, his name is Casey Neistat, and he emailed me, like, three days before the Apple Watch came and was like, "I need an Apple Watch." And I was like, "LOLY." He's like, "I'm not gonna tell you." And then he was like, "I want a spray painted gold." And he made a video about it. And the video, if you type in "how to turn your Apple Watch gold" on YouTube, that is my watch. It's chipping off. It looks fine. I think we're gonna have him redo it. The video has, like, 2 million views in about a week, which is crazy. But, Apple Watch?

• 6:46Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, wait, tell me not.

• 6:47Speaker 03

  Hype check Apple Watch.

• 6:48Nilay Patel?

  No, so I had this.

• 6:50Speaker 02

  It's a Gen one product. It's nice.

• 6:51Nilay Patel?

  Hype check Apple Watch.

• 6:53Speaker 02

  Six, seven, maybe. It's I've I've spent, yeah, about it's almost a week and it's like, yeah, I see notifications on my wrist and that's basically all it does. And I haven't ran with it yet, uh, cause I don't want to get this thing sweaty with the spray paint, literally.

• 7:09Speaker 03

  I made it very, I made it very controversial.

• 7:10Nilay Patel?

  Is that a first world problem? Like a, like a, like a YouTube filmmaker sprayed painted my Apple Watch gold?

• 7:16Speaker 02

  Yeah, I can't.

• 7:17Nilay Patel?

  I can't run with it because I'm afraid the finish will play.

• 7:19Speaker 02

  Uh, I really, the tactic engine.

• 7:21Nilay Patel?

  I don't think that counts as a first world problem. That's like an entire, like, that's like a, like a whole, like, tangent world problem.

• 7:28Speaker 02

  Look.

• 7:28Nilay Patel?

  That's like a thirst world problem.

• 7:30Speaker 02

  The cheese.

• 7:32Speaker 03

  Waterworld 2.

• 7:35Speaker 02

  Welcome to the. The tactic engine on here is awesome. I let people, I let people try it on and everyone freaks out with the heartbeat thing. They're like, oh, my God, that's my heartbeat. And, and I, you know, I have them send, like, if you ever get random heartbeats from me and Eli at like two in the morning, that is probably from some person wearing my watch.

• 7:54Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 7:55Speaker 02

  And I think the vibration, that whole thing is really cool, uh, but it definitely feels like a Gen one product in the sense that why is it so thick? Uh, and, um, yeah, battery's really great, though. I took it out, took it off the charger this morning, eight o'clock in the morning, and it's at 78% and that annoys me too. This, this whole wrist deal.

• 8:16Nilay Patel?

  What you're, what the people in their cars are not seeing is.

• 8:19Speaker 02

  Right. It's me flicking my wrist like a bozo.

• 8:22Speaker 03

  That's definitely something I've noticed with everybody talking about the Apple Watches when people ask you, like, how much did you spend on this? And they're like, $600, $1,000 or something. Explain why it's good. And then they list off a list of things that like people thought were cool for five seconds. It's like, okay.

• 8:41Nilay Patel?

  Yeah. No, I mean, the thing that I've noticed the most is we've all become a, a society of Apple Watch users who are flamboyantly checking the time.

• 8:49Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 8:49Nilay Patel?

  Hello, I do have a notification.

• 8:53Nilay Patel?

  Uh, it's just like, cause getting the thing to flip on is really hard. Like, you've got to like, let it know.

• 9:01Speaker 02

  My name is Long Johnson.

• 9:02Nilay Patel?

  I'm gonna look at you.

• 9:03Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 9:04Nilay Patel?

  Uh, and then Chris wrote that thing about turning off all the sounds.

• 9:06Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah.

• 9:07Nilay Patel?

  Because there's literally nothing worse than like, cause it's a really loud ding and then it taps you. And Apple's got this whole story about, and it's, it's true. Apple's like, the sound and the vibration work together. It's really cool. We love it. We thought about it a lot and they're right. But what they didn't think about is that normal human beings should not alert the people around them that they're about to flamboyantly check their wrist. Like, it's like ding and you're like, I'm not paying attention to you now. It's awful. I turned it off.

• 9:36Speaker 03

  It's the television computer interface theory of.

• 9:39Nilay Patel?

  I don't know.

• 9:40Speaker 03

  Everything has to make a noise if it's digital.

• 9:43Nilay Patel?

  Right. It's very like old school. Um, so I will say, so there's a watch. The watch is obviously just out. Um, Mike, what do you think about their earnings?

• 9:53Speaker 01

  Well, they sold a ton of iPhones, as was expected.

• 9:56Speaker 02

  They sold a lot of iPhones.

• 9:57Nilay Patel?

  And they sold a ton in China.

• 9:59Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 9:59Speaker 02

  And what is it, 60 million?

• 10:01Nilay Patel?

  Yeah. And I think it's shocking though, that the total number of iPhone sales is still not above the total number of iPad sales. Like over time, that's crazy to me. But then the iPad is like tanking now.

• 10:11Speaker 02

  Well, relatively tanking.

• 10:12Speaker 03

  When did the iPad come out?

• 10:13Nilay Patel?

  Well, the, no, iPad growth is like, it's like 10% year-over-year. It's like some tiny number now. Um.

• 10:20Speaker 02

  Well, they, how many iPads did they sell this quarter?

• 10:22Speaker 01

  Uh, 12.6 million.

• 10:23Speaker 02

  Yeah, that's, that's a big number. It's like, how many, how many surfaces do you sell, Microsoft? One, one million, a hundred thousand?

• 10:31Nilay Patel?

  Right. Okay. So in Q2 of 2013, they sold 19.5 million iPads. Uh, in Q2 of 2014, they sold 16.3 million. And in Q2 of this year, they sold 12.6. Like, those numbers are just going down.

• 10:42Speaker 02

  But also the iPads keep getting better. So where, what is the compelling reason to get a new iPad?

• 10:47Nilay Patel?

  Well, so I think the most important thing about this is that they now make more money from the Mac, which obviously sells even fewer units.

• 10:53Speaker 01

  Than the iPad.

• 10:54Nilay Patel?

  Than the iPad, which is bonkers. And I think probably everyone on the Mac team is like, just running around, just like spiking MacBooks at the feet of the iPad people. It's like, what now?

• 11:03Speaker 02

  Totally pictured that in my mind. Awesome. Bunch of nerds running around.

• 11:08Nilay Patel?

  Multitasking.

• 11:11Nilay Patel?

  I don't know, like, I, I think that, that's what's interesting to me is it doesn't really matter what else Apple does, because the iPhone will just carry them forward forever. I don't know about that. I don't know about that watch. You don't know?

• 11:23Speaker 01

  I don't even know why I bought it. Still don't know.

• 11:26Speaker 02

  Like, didn't you buy the new MacBook also?

• 11:28Speaker 01

  I love the new MacBook.

• 11:30Nilay Patel?

  Huh?

• 11:30Speaker 03

  Said y'all are suckers.

• 11:31Nilay Patel?

  Why are we suckers?

• 11:32Speaker 03

  Because you bought something that no one needs, including you. Like, I've asked all of you. I've asked you. I think, I think your real-life impression of the watch is far lower than the public score that we gave.

• 11:44Nilay Patel?

  Here's what I'll-

• 11:45Speaker 03

  And I'm putting you on the spot to admit it.

• 11:46Nilay Patel?

  Here's what I will say. Uh, here's what I will say. I gave it a score. I'm gonna be very charitable. I gave it a score. It's, it's true. It's a fact. And everybody can go on the website and look at it. I encourage you to read that story once again, share it with your friends.

• 12:04Speaker 02

  Apple Watch review.

• 12:05Nilay Patel?

  Mail us a dollar.

• 12:08Nilay Patel?

  A lot of people spend a lot of time on it. I think that review, and I, you know, I've been reading a lot of, like, Matt Honan wrote this great thing in BuzzFeed this week about how we're in a time of great uncertainty. And like, that uncertainty, did you read it? It was good. It was called "No One Knows," which is amazing.

• 12:22Speaker 03

  No, I just think that the significance of that headline is just hilarious in the context of-

• 12:27Nilay Patel?

  Like, media and BuzzFeed.

• 12:27Speaker 03

  Something about a watch.

• 12:28Nilay Patel?

  Yeah. Fair. What time is it? I don't know. I have to, like, it hasn't turned on yet. And the whole, he was like, no one will come out and say what they really think of the watch. And then I thought of my review, and I thought, well, there, there's an intro, but literally the first words of analysis that exist of the watch are, "Hey, it's slow," and the last words are, "You probably shouldn't buy it."

• 12:52Speaker 03

  Fair.

• 12:53Nilay Patel?

  Right? And then I gave it a number, and that number is, I think, fair, but I, I believe that we should live in a world of no sevens. Do you know this? When you ask people to rate something 1 to 10, a thing that you can do to get the truth out of them is demand that you live in a world of no sevens.

• 13:11Speaker 03

  Right.

• 13:11Nilay Patel?

  And, uh, Lockhart Steele, the editorial director of Vox Media, does this to me. He says it all, "The world of no sevens," and I have to sit there, and then I have to usually be brutal. Uh, that's it. Those are some facts I know.

• 13:26Speaker 03

  Alright.

• 13:26Nilay Patel?

  I'm not, you can, those are some dots. And I'm saying you can, you can connect those dots into a picture of a puppy. Uh, you can connect them into a solar system. You can draw whatever picture with those dots that you want, however you want to connect them. But the dots are on the table.

• 13:43Speaker 01

  I mean, I've asked people for months.

• 13:45Nilay Patel?

  You're such a troll, man.

• 13:47Speaker 03

  What are you saying, Mike?

• 13:48Nilay Patel?

  I've asked people. You're fired.

• 13:52Speaker 01

  I've asked people for months to give me a like a legitimate use case for the watch.

• 13:55Nilay Patel?

  I don't think there is one. Did you read this long John Guber thing? And by the way, we're supposed to talk about earnings. We're just like lost in this watch. They, so they didn't announce, and they're not going to break out watch sales for a long time. That's just, I mean, other.

• 14:06Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 14:06Nilay Patel?

  Um, but not, not even because it's like their first earnings after the watch's launch, which we're used to. The new product comes out, they don't tell you about sales because they need time to collect, all this stuff. But the watch will just be in like other.

• 14:18Speaker 01

  Other services.

• 14:19Nilay Patel?

  For a while. They're not going to break out individual watch sales for a while, which I think is crazy.

• 14:24Speaker 02

  I don't know if that's true. Didn't they do that with a iPad? Didn't they break out iPad in their first earnings when they first, first iPad?

• 14:31Nilay Patel?

  This is like an old Steve Jobs quote. He was like throwing shade at Amazon. He's like, the reason Amazon doesn't tell you how many of, anything they sell is because they don't sell any of them.

• 14:39Speaker 02

  Yeah, but Apple's, Apple's probably sold, I, I would, I would bet Apple's gonna do first month sales.

• 14:45Nilay Patel?

  Well, I, I, I'm certainly curious.

• 14:48Speaker 02

  What's, what's gonna stop them from, from putting out a press release, you know, next month?

• 14:51Nilay Patel?

  I think they got expectations of sky high for it. And they gotta deliver the actual products.

• 14:55Speaker 02

  That's also true.

• 14:57Nilay Patel?

  They got, they got, they got a little bit of a road ahead of them.

• 15:00Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 15:00Nilay Patel?

  Uh, I mean, I'm, I hope they do. I'm dying to know. I just think it's funny that they're, right now, Apple's business is just, it's like the iPhone and this incredible growth in China, resurgent Macs, and this like middle zone of like, here's a new product, we hope it does well, here's this iPad, something is gonna happen. And I, I think the iPad is just like a fascinating thing. Like, I would love my iPad to be more useful, and it's just not. Yeah. I think they've gotta get there.

• 15:30Speaker 03

  What Apple's gonna do is put up a chart at WWDC or something that shows the Apple Watch against other watches, which is like, then it's gonna look great.

• 15:40Nilay Patel?

  I think WW, they've gotta do apps. Uh, yeah, they've gotta start doing the native app store at WWDC.

• 15:47Speaker 03

  I'm just talking about sales, sales numbers.

• 15:52Speaker 01

  I don't know if they're gonna do that. I mean, expectations analysts have been putting out numbers forty, forty million, fifty million this year. I don't know if they want to deal with that.

• 16:00Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 16:01Speaker 01

  Like, that's a lot of pressure for them.

• 16:02Nilay Patel?

  We'll see. We'll see. All right. We've done enough Apple. I do want to get to all of Microsoft's stuff. So, any other final Apple points? Hype check Apple, right now.

• 16:11Speaker 02

  I mean, the stock is fat right now. I mean, it's like, eight and a half, I would give it.

• 16:17Nilay Patel?

  Business Shepherd just shows up.

• 16:19Speaker 02

  Business Shepherd, that's a new one.

• 16:21Nilay Patel?

  Corporate Sam.

• 16:22Speaker 02

  All right, there it is.

• 16:23Nilay Patel?

  Corporate Sam is like...

• 16:24Speaker 02

  I think, no, I think WWDC will be really interesting because of the watch. They're gonna, they can talk about whatever the hell they want with the watch. Like, imagine they roll, they probably won't do this, but imagine they rolled a sick software update out for it. I'm trying, I'm trying to remember what happened, because I remember the original iPad came out in April, and then they had WWDC, like, two months later. Trying to remember what, what iOS version was that? Did the iPad ship with iOS 5?

• 16:51Nilay Patel?

  The iPad shipped with iPhone OS 4.0.

• 16:54Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 16:55Nilay Patel?

  It was still called iPhone.

• 16:56Speaker 02

  iPhone OS 4. And then they announced iOS 5, and everything got that, right, including the iPad. I feel like they might do that. We'll see. When is WWDC? June 8th, right?

• 17:08Speaker 01

  June 8th to the 12th.

• 17:09Speaker 02

  June 8th to the 12th, cool.

• 17:10Nilay Patel?

  I mean, they've gotta do real made of apps.

• 17:13Speaker 02

  You've gotta do watch stuff.

• 17:14Nilay Patel?

  Because of the apps on their watch right now. The one thing that I knew...

• 17:16Speaker 02

  They're, it's bust.

• 17:17Nilay Patel?

  So, this is, here's, I'll throw you another dot on my map. I had predicted that the second wave of reviews would come out, and they would be brutal, and they're starting to come out, and they're a little bit brutal.

• 17:28Speaker 02

  Yep. See, on gadgets today?

• 17:30Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, and gadgets, Michael Gorman.

• 17:31Speaker 03

  I see what you did. I connected all the dots. It looks kind of like a butt.

• 17:35Nilay Patel?

  I said, you can draw whatever picture you want, man. I think it looks like a kitten. I think it looks like, like sunshine and cupcakes. You just want a butt on the mind? I don't know what that means. All right.

• 17:46Speaker 03

  Speaking of that...

• 17:47Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 17:47Speaker 03

  Do we have an ad to talk about?

• 17:49Nilay Patel?

  Time to make some money.

• 17:52Nilay Patel?

  Today's episode of The Vergecast was brought to you by Tripcase. Tripcase helped brilliant people take over 30 million trips last year by collecting their flight, hotel, and other trip items into a single app on your phone or tablet. You also get free flight notifications if you're delayed or your gate changes, and their support for Pebble and Android Wear, so you'll always be up to date. To get started, just go to tripcase.com/vergecast to sign up. If Timothy doxed you are still not convinced...

• 18:17Speaker 03

  Oh, I'm convinced.

• 18:18Nilay Patel?

  By the way, I like the idea that your first name is doxing you. Here is why Tripcase is a place where trips live. There's Uber integration. Tripcase automatically fills in your pickup and drop-off locations based on your trip, shows Uber rates right within the app. You just click the button. Get a ride.

• 18:35Speaker 03

  How easy is it to click a button?

• 18:37Nilay Patel?

  So easy. There's free flight alerts. Tripcase will automatically alert you of any changes to your trip, like a flight delay or a gate change, via email or notification on your phone, tablet, or smartwatch. You can share your trip with a coworker or loved one. You can stop talking about whether your flight is delayed and start telling them how much fun you're having. Yeah. When people start being polite and start being real about fun on trips. You can remember places, so when you go on a trip, you can save restaurants. You can check the weather at your destination. You can do seat maps on your plane. Seat maps on planes. There's a real opportunity there for a company like Tripcase.

• 19:13Speaker 01

  Definitely.

• 19:14Nilay Patel?

  Anyway, here's what I'm saying. You can listen to me talk about it. You can wait for me to talk about Windows. Or you can go to tripcase.com/vergecast, check it out today. Back out of the cash lane. That's a joke that literally no one could possibly understand. When I was in college, and I was studying to take the LSAT, my friend John and I would drive every day to another college and park in a parking structure. And it would be like 8:00 in the morning because we were going to our LSAT prep class. Like, literally the least fun you can have. 8:00 in the morning on a Saturday, driving to an LSAT prep class. But we would always... This is so dumb. We would always make sure there was a huge sign in the parking structure. There was like

• 19:58Nilay Patel?

  the credit card lane and the cash lane and we always went through the cash lane and would yell cash lane and high five at eight in the morning. That's for you, John Connolly. I hope you're, I hope you're out there somewhere.

• 20:09Speaker 02

  Was this car a convertible so you can like reach up and do it?

• 20:12Nilay Patel?

  No, yes, my friend John was 25 feet tall. He was just saying, no, it was like a regular sign up here.

• 20:19Speaker 02

  No, I'm saying, wait, you high five the sign or you?

• 20:21Nilay Patel?

  We high five each other.

• 20:22Speaker 02

  Right, so.

• 20:22Nilay Patel?

  Like it wasn't like a.

• 20:24Speaker 02

  Never mind.

• 20:25Nilay Patel?

  It was my car.

• 20:27Speaker 02

  It was your car? It was a convertible Mustang?

• 20:28Nilay Patel?

  It was not. It was regular.

• 20:29Speaker 02

  Regular Mustang.

• 20:31Speaker 03

  Sam, hype check this anecdote.

• 20:36Speaker 02

  We're approaching dangerously low levels.

• 20:40Nilay Patel?

  I'm just saying, man. Live life in the cash lane with Neil Hattel. That's my autobiography.

• 20:45Speaker 02

  Wow, imagine there was a show called.

• 20:46Nilay Patel?

  Actually, that should be Micah's. Yeah, that's Micah's new show.

• 20:49Speaker 02

  Life in the Cash Lane.

• 20:50Nilay Patel?

  Thursday nights on WGN. Life in the Cash Lane with luxury Singleton. Just Micah getting on and off jets. That's it. All right. All right, Micah, you want to tell us about the G4? That's like the other big thing that happened this week, but it was a small thing.

• 21:05Speaker 01

  Yeah, I mean, LG's put out their new flagship phone, the LG G4.

• 21:09Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 21:10Speaker 01

  This is nice. 5.5 inch, 2560 by 1440 QHD display. It has leather on the back, which is, I guess, something. Why leather? I don't get this leather thing.

• 21:22Speaker 03

  You're the luxury correspondent you tell us.

• 21:23Speaker 01

  I don't, leather and phones don't go together. I don't.

• 21:27Nilay Patel?

  No, they went, they have a whole, there's a whole series of quotes about how all the other phones are like more machine-like and they want to be more organic.

• 21:36Speaker 03

  Which is organic, nothing says organic like.

• 21:40Nilay Patel?

  Leather.

• 21:40Speaker 03

  Strapping the flesh of a beast to a metal chassis.

• 21:46Nilay Patel?

  I think you just described the Terminator.

• 21:51Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, cool Terminator cow. No, there's a whole thing. You know, we keep talking about,

• 22:01Nilay Patel?

  I don't even know how to explain the text message I just got. Joanna Stern just texted me. I'm doxing her too. She just texted me, there's a cute Indian kid on my flight. Made me think of you.

• 22:11Speaker 02

  So racist.

• 22:13Nilay Patel?

  That's not racist.

• 22:14Speaker 02

  I mean, it kind of is.

• 22:15Nilay Patel?

  I mean, at my wedding, she definitely like chased around one of my cousin's kids for like a while. She's like, they're so cute. And like ran after it. God bless you, Stern. Anyway.

• 22:23Speaker 03

  Did you have a selfie stick? Cause that'd be scary.

• 22:25Nilay Patel?

  No, it's like years ago. This is way before selfie sticks entered the mainstream. They were on the fringes in 2011. Only radicals use selfie sticks. Now, the G4, I feel like there's a moment where like LG is doing a fashion thing. They're doing an organic thing. Right? They're using all these words. And I think they're just like, what if we put like materials on it? And that's as close as they can get to like fashion.

• 22:53Speaker 01

  I just think they're trying to be different because they want to stand out.

• 22:56Nilay Patel?

  Right.

• 22:57Speaker 01

  Um, I don't want a phone with leather on it.

• 22:59Nilay Patel?

  No.

• 23:00Speaker 01

  I really don't.

• 23:00Nilay Patel?

  The leather is a bunch of colors too, right?

• 23:02Speaker 01

  Uh, yeah, it comes in light brown and a black. It looks like.

• 23:08Nilay Patel?

  I'm trying to, I'm trying to make you hype for this.

• 23:10Speaker 01

  I can't.

• 23:11Nilay Patel?

  You gotta deliver some excitement here.

• 23:12Speaker 01

  There's a reason phones are made out of metals because it's good. I mean, you don't need to change that.

• 23:17Nilay Patel?

  But if you could change that.

• 23:19Speaker 03

  You could have any material on the back of your phone.

• 23:22Speaker 01

  I mean.

• 23:22Speaker 03

  Materials that haven't been invented yet. What would it be?

• 23:25Speaker 01

  Not leather.

• 23:26Nilay Patel?

  Not leather.

• 23:27Speaker 01

  Not leather.

• 23:28Nilay Patel?

  Well, there's a metal back. There's a plastic back. I mean, this is just like one option, right? I mean.

• 23:32Speaker 02

  With the one, the one we have is a, uh, it's the plastic back.

• 23:36Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 23:37Speaker 02

  Dan has it. We have it.

• 23:40Nilay Patel?

  How embargoed is that information, Sam?

• 23:42Speaker 02

  Zero.

• 23:43Nilay Patel?

  Zero?

• 23:43Speaker 02

  Yeah, they gave them out at the event. They had like a gigantic pile of phones. Did you not see this? There was literally a pyramid of phones. And we, we, we, we put it on Snapchat at Periscope while you were probably sipping martinis on the beach.

• 23:56Speaker 03

  Sam, you didn't know, well, first of all, you didn't know that periscoping Game of Thrones while it aired live was illegal. So I don't, I don't trust you to honor an embargo, quite frankly.

• 24:06Nilay Patel?

  Is Periscope scoff flying a thing? You're just wandering around?

• 24:09Speaker 02

  They're actually cracking down on the Periscope.

• 24:11Nilay Patel?

  How do you crack down on that?

• 24:13Speaker 02

  There was an article about it. They were like, there was some, some, I pass it on to TC. But in any event, yes, we have one. It is a, uh, it is the plastic back one. The phone's really fast.

• 24:23Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 24:23Speaker 02

  Um, it's running Android 5.1, um, skinned. Uh, camera's good. It's got the.

• 24:29Nilay Patel?

  Uh, I disagree about the camera. I played with the camera for a minute.

• 24:32Speaker 03

  Looks good. Looks good. Looks like something that would be featured in Hammacher Schlemmer.

• 24:38Speaker 01

  A what?

• 24:38Nilay Patel?

  You know, it's funny because it can actually give you a Shiatsu massage as well. It's perfect for dads. Dads and grads. That's all. It's a Shraparage and Hammerkursch. They literally only exist in June and then they go away. Like, when does, does Brookstone sell anything at any other time? We gotta do a deep dive into Brookstone.

• 24:59Speaker 01

  We really should.

• 25:00Nilay Patel?

  And just like blow it up. Micah, get on it.

• 25:02Speaker 03

  Do they still have physical stores?

• 25:03Speaker 02

  Yeah, I think there's one in the Freehold Mall in my hometown.

• 25:06Speaker 01

  They're everywhere.

• 25:08Nilay Patel?

  And they, they sell crazy things.

• 25:10Speaker 03

  I don't get.

• 25:11Nilay Patel?

  Like, the last time I went to Brookstone was when I was home in Chicago and I went to a mall and like, literally the front display was like, "The world's best Bluetooth speaker." And then like, "Here's a drone." And then, literally, the third big front of store display was like, "The world's most fascinating goo."

• 25:30Nilay Patel?

  That's cool goo.

• 25:33Nilay Patel?

  It does feel like sand.

• 25:36Nilay Patel?

  I don't know what to do with this. Alright, so Micah, why are you so un-hyped about this phone?

• 25:42Speaker 01

  It seems like, you know, they were in the lab and someone said, "Make it interesting," and someone had a leather bag on the table. I'm like, "Let's put this on the back of the phone." And I don't like, like, I like the S6, the Samsung X6. Samsung did a really good job with that, but this seems kinda basic.

• 25:58Nilay Patel?

  I mean, they've definitely toned down the software, which is all I ever want them to do. And then they've got, they've got their like, laser focusing camera. So I disagree with you, Sam. I played with it for a minute. And it took like, four blurry pictures in a row. And like, that's the, it's just that the one thing I wanted to do is like, focus really fast and take a photo. Obviously, Dan has it. I mean, we'll review it at some point. He's spending this week with it. But I will say, they've toned down the software, which is nice. If they do, I mean, they still have crazy LG stuff all over this.

• 26:28Speaker 02

  Yeah, they do.

• 26:28Nilay Patel?

  Like, the, all the settings are like, have been rearranged. Which is just, that's like, here's my theory. It's like, they abuse you into understanding where they've put the settings. And then you use a different phone? You know, I don't know how to turn on the brightness on this phone. Better go back to LG.

• 26:43Speaker 02

  I can't sleep at night wondering why companies... I lose, I lose sleep over wondering why companies just don't put stock Android on their phones. They make the hardware, don't mess with the software. There's a reason why Google bought Android. There's a reason why Android is good right now. You don't have to dress it in your garbage crap.

• 27:04Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 27:05Speaker 02

  That is it.

• 27:06Nilay Patel?

  I mean.

• 27:06Speaker 02

  If the LG, okay, like if the G4, if the S6 Edge or regular S6 were running stock Android, I would definitely buy one of those devices to carry around with me, but no.

• 27:17Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, I'm still, I'm definitely still on my Nexus 5. Like, just have it.

• 27:21Speaker 03

  Oh, me too.

• 27:23Nilay Patel?

  TC, your phone is the biggest hunk of garbage ever made.

• 27:26Speaker 03

  Oh, it's a great phone.

• 27:27Nilay Patel?

  The last time I was out with TC, he just, he was like, my phone's so broke, it's his, the screen of his phone is so shattered.

• 27:34Speaker 03

  Can we roll that beautiful bean footage?

• 27:36Nilay Patel?

  No, you can't. It's an audio show. You have to describe it.

• 27:41Speaker 03

  Oh, it's jacked. It's jacked up.

• 27:43Nilay Patel?

  The last time I was out with TC in a bar, he, I will say, he had a few drinks. And he's like, what? Let's see if we can break my phone. And then just began throwing it violently on the ground. And I'm like, look, it's fine.

• 27:54Speaker 03

  Broken already.

• 27:55Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 27:55Speaker 03

  So I'm at the phase where it can't be broken anymore.

• 27:58Nilay Patel?

  Broken.

• 27:58Speaker 03

  I'm free.

• 27:59Nilay Patel?

  Aren't you like cutting yourself using this thing?

• 28:01Speaker 03

  Only a couple of times.

• 28:03Nilay Patel?

  This thing is, nothing serious.

• 28:05Speaker 01

  I think Samsung has sort of separated itself from the pack of Android OEMs.

• 28:09Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 28:09Speaker 01

  I think this is just, they're just better.

• 28:11Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 28:11Speaker 01

  This is not on that level.

• 28:13Speaker 02

  It took them, what, five, six years?

• 28:14Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, but they got there.

• 28:15Speaker 02

  They, they're there.

• 28:16Nilay Patel?

  Do you remember the, the, the G3? It came out and they're like, we put the button on the back.

• 28:21Speaker 02

  And we were like, lol, why?

• 28:23Nilay Patel?

  And then, I don't, where's that coming from, Sam?

• 28:26Speaker 02

  They're making them hysterically laugh for no reason. It's awesome.

• 28:30Nilay Patel?

  It's just, what, what kind of spinning text gif is that? No, but it's funny because the buttons on the back of the G4 and zero conversation about it.

• 28:40Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 28:40Speaker 03

  When you go home to Seder, it's like how you talk to your bubby. You go lol, bubby. That was a funny story.

• 28:47Nilay Patel?

  What?

• 28:49Speaker 03

  I'm just saying, like, do you talk, do you say LOL out loud to anybody?

• 28:52Nilay Patel?

  Who goes home to Sater, like, multiple?

• 28:54Speaker 03

  I don't know.

• 28:55Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, I think, I think we all just learned something about YouTube.

• 29:00Nilay Patel?

  Poor Sam. I love you, Sam. I've checked the G4, and we get, well, then we'll do another ad.

• 29:03Speaker 03

  LOL G4.

• 29:05Nilay Patel?

  LOL G4.

• 29:06Speaker 02

  Like, who, who's gonna buy it? Who's gonna buy a G4? I mean, you know, the Android nerds will buy it, but what's compelling about that next to a S6? What's compelling about that next to an iPhone 6? I don't know. The bonds are on the back. Oh, isn't that gonna be hard to hold? Okay, put that down next phone. Because that's how people shop for phones still.

• 29:24Nilay Patel?

  Right. I actually think Samsung.

• 29:28Nilay Patel?

  I just, I keep getting baby updates from Stern. Like, I don't even know what to say.

• 29:34Nilay Patel?

  Fine. I will say Samsung, they, like, did, it's, like, not, it's morally defensible, right? But they, like, definitely just ripped the iPhone 6 in many ways, which is a genius move.

• 29:49Speaker 02

  They literally did.

• 29:50Nilay Patel?

  They're like, "Oh, you don't want this iPhone? How about this other iPhone?"

• 29:54Nilay Patel?

  And it's fine. And, you know, there's all those pictures of the, the S6 that are like, "Look at how the stuff isn't lined up." Have you seen these? They're amazing. And they're, I agree. Like, that, that would drive me crazy. And like, why is there, like, a rando Qualcomm sticker that's not at the right angle on it?

• 30:10Nilay Patel?

  But it's like, you know, who doesn't care is most people.

• 30:12Speaker 02

  Exactly.

• 30:13Nilay Patel?

  They're like, "Look at this kind of pretty, cheap, other phone that looks like an iPhone." And that, it's working for them. All right. One more ad, and then we, we're gonna do it. As promised, we're gonna deep dive into Windows 10. I'd like both of you to prepare talking points during this time. Ready?

• 30:32Nilay Patel?

  How many times have you had a meeting where you waste the first 15 minutes? It's usually because somebody has trouble joining a call. And you can't share your screen, or someone else can't be heard because they don't have the right PIN code. Nothing. But problems. While the people at Hi5 want to give you back the first 15 minutes of every meeting, that is why they built easy-to-use video and web conferencing that you can actually love with your heart, and then send your heartbeat to other people, and they'll worry about your heart rate because of love. The problem with video meetings today: traditional video meeting providers are ridiculous, ridiculous. They're complicated, they're insanely expensive. Most web-only providers completely ignore conference room experience. You get charged expensive monthly fees even if you don't really use the service. You have long PIN codes to remember, you've got cables everywhere, you're wasting your time. If you, for example,

• 31:17Nilay Patel?

  have an IT department, which maybe your company does, they've got to spend time and money setting up and supporting your meetings. But Hi5, seamlessly-integrated hardware and software, cloud solution, lets people work however they want. You have productive meetings in HD video with multiple people. You can instantly start one of those HD meetings from your computer or mobile device. There's no remote to lose, there's no struggle to understand how everything works. You just click on your computer, you swipe on your phone. You can move the video calls from your personal device to the television. Just move them. Get them out of my face and out of that TV, you say, as you move a video call, the greatest of these. Hi5 is only 1/20th the cost of traditional video providers. You can outfit a conference room for $799. That's a one-time fee, Timothy.

• 32:02Speaker 03

  One time. Just one.

• 32:04Nilay Patel?

  Uno. There's no maintenance fees or monthly downloads or overheads. It's just yours. You just have it. Now you have it. Now you're swiping away conference calls.

• 32:12Speaker 03

  And then you have it.

• 32:13Nilay Patel?

  Then you have it. At that price, you can put video everywhere in your company. So what team doesn't want Hi5? I'm just going to be the side end. So what team doesn't want to Hi5 each other at work? You take back the first 15 minutes of every meeting. You get started today. You go to hi5.com/verge and request a free trial. That's Hi5, H-I-G-H-F-I-V-E dot com forward slash the verge. Wait, forward slash just verge. Request your free trial. That's H-I-G-H-F-I-V-E dot com forward slash verge. Request your free trial and start meeting face-to-face with Hi5.

• 32:55Nilay Patel?

  That was a good one. I feel like I really sold it.

• 32:58Speaker 01

  Sounded good.

• 32:59Nilay Patel?

  I was saying-

• 32:59Speaker 03

  And we did the high five.

• 33:00Nilay Patel?

  We did a high five.

• 33:01Speaker 03

  Crucial.

• 33:02Nilay Patel?

  I was saying, this is mostly what I do at The Verge is I spend money. It's like, that's mostly what we do as journalists at The Verge. We actively spend money. This is one of the few times where I feel like I'm-

• 33:13Speaker 03

  Making it.

• 33:14Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, I mean-

• 33:14Speaker 03

  Earning.

• 33:16Nilay Patel?

  Sam's just air trolling me.

• 33:18Speaker 02

  Look at that, just look at that photo of T C.

• 33:20Nilay Patel?

  Alright, alright, alright.

• 33:21Speaker 03

  What's happening? Oh, I don't think I'm on the internet.

• 33:24Nilay Patel?

  That's good. Alright, okay. We have a little over half an hour. A little under half an hour, actually. We gotta talk all this Windows stuff. I've been saving it to the end. I'm excited about it. I will say, I have never been as like hype about Microsoft as I was to watch Build, except for the first hour of Build, which was-

• 33:45Speaker 03

  You mean the first two hours, right?

• 33:46Nilay Patel?

  A nightmare.

• 33:47Speaker 03

  It was like four hours long.

• 33:48Nilay Patel?

  And I get that it's a developer conference and you have developers there, that's the audience. But you do not have to write code to your Hadoop cluster in front of those- It is a choice you can make. You just never have to do that in front of like 5 million people.

• 34:06Speaker 03

  You gotta play to the crowd, though, and they love Hadoop.

• 34:08Nilay Patel?

  I got you done.

• 34:10Speaker 02

  What the hell is Hadoop?

• 34:11Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, right?

• 34:12Speaker 02

  Exactly.

• 34:13Speaker 03

  You know Peter Gallagher, the guy with the big hammer? He smashed Hadoop's on stage.

• 34:18Nilay Patel?

  Come on, man.

• 34:18Speaker 03

  I don't even know. That was the first thing that came to mind. I have no idea what it is. I'm gonna look it up right now.

• 34:24Nilay Patel?

  Alright, um, it's a dynamic cluster array for cloud services.

• 34:29Speaker 03

  Oh, that's what it is.

• 34:31Nilay Patel?

  What? When you have a broad base of innovation, you can-

• 34:34Speaker 03

  I know.

• 34:35Nilay Patel?

  -unleash a range of disruptive solutions with Microsoft's new Docker technology. I, dude, I don't know, like-

• 34:43Speaker 03

  No, I feel you, though. I wrote last time, like, in January, I wrote something called, "Microsoft is ready to be loved again," because they were-

• 34:50Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 34:50Speaker 03

  That's when they showed HoloLens for the first time, and they actually seemed excited about what they were doing.

• 34:55Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, so they did the lengthy Build keynote. Nadella comes on stage, he's like, "We're ready to do this. Let's get into it." And then they like, literally, so there's like a theory and architecture of compression and then- Expansion, do you know this? Like, so like Frank Lloyd Wright did this thing.

• 35:12Speaker 03

  The internal combustion engine?

• 35:13Nilay Patel?

  Yes, yes, the architecture often works like a four cylinder engine. No, no, it's like you walk into a small space like cathedrals do this. You walk into the small space and then it expands and the first hour of build was just Microsoft just compressing you. Just like compressing your expectations. You're like, you're not releasing anything and they they're like, and now the big news. Office is a platform and they're like, here's an Uber app inside of it was just like this endless buildup. And then Nadella was like, let's talk about Windows. Let's get into it. And then that news was really cool in many. Do you want to go through it?

• 35:47Speaker 03

  Through it through.

• 35:48Nilay Patel?

  Windows, Windows 10. Tell me about Windows 10.

• 35:50Speaker 02

  Can we just back up for one second?

• 35:52Nilay Patel?

  Back it up.

• 35:52Speaker 02

  For the people listening that don't know, Microsoft has a developer conference every year. It's called Build. It's where they announce basically all of their software and hopes and dreams for the year. And it's led by Satya Nadella, who is their CEO and now TC explained what happened at Build.

• 36:09Nilay Patel?

  So we're in developer season, right? So it's Build and then it's I O and then W W C is they're all coming.

• 36:14Speaker 03

  Yeah, well, Windows 10 is supposed to be coming, what, this summer?

• 36:16Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 36:17Speaker 03

  At some, they didn't.

• 36:19Nilay Patel?

  That's the one thing we thought they were gonna announce.

• 36:20Speaker 03

  They didn't. But I mean, I guess the T L D R of Windows 10 is that it's like something every really nerdy person who ever used Windows dreamed. What an operating system might be like.

• 36:34Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 36:34Speaker 03

  Which is something that can be on anything.

• 36:37Nilay Patel?

  Right. You can run on a Raspberry Pi, like it runs on hole lens, it runs the Xbox.

• 36:41Speaker 03

  There's no like 14 versions of Microsoft. You have to go through a checklist and figure out what which one you need.

• 36:48Nilay Patel?

  Right. Well, they're probably still gonna do that a little bit.

• 36:50Speaker 03

  Yeah, I mean.

• 36:51Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 36:51Speaker 03

  Who knows?

• 36:52Nilay Patel?

  But like it's, you know, they did, they showed the thing where they they had the tablet, they plugged the tablet in the monitor and turned it into a desktop computer. And they're like, and you'll be able to do it with a phone too. We don't have that phone yet. So this is a simulation.

• 37:02Speaker 03

  The dream of the Motorola Atrix 4G is alive.

• 37:06Nilay Patel?

  Hey, that was a good dream, man. And then they announced Edge, Microsoft Edge, their new web server, which I firmly, or web server. God, I got that hadoop on the brain.

• 37:19Speaker 02

  Sounds like you're on drugs.

• 37:22Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, man, just duping. Just duping all over the place.

• 37:25Speaker 02

  Ha ha, dude.

• 37:27Nilay Patel?

  No, Project Spartan, which by the way, sweet vindication for Tom Warren, who was like, the Internet Explorer brand is dying. And then like, everyone yelled at him. And they're like, what's our new browser called? Microsoft Edge. It has the same logo as Internet Explorer. So we're definitely going to keep both of those things around. And then HoloLens, obviously.

• 37:48Nilay Patel?

  Which is-

• 37:49Speaker 03

  Which is ridiculous.

• 37:50Nilay Patel?

  Which is ridiculous.

• 37:51Speaker 01

  It really is.

• 37:52Speaker 03

  It's silly.

• 37:54Nilay Patel?

  It looks really cool.

• 37:55Speaker 02

  In a good way, you're saying.

• 37:55Speaker 03

  And, uh, yes, also no.

• 37:59Speaker 02

  Explain.

• 38:00Speaker 01

  Okay, who's gonna use HoloLens? This is my question.

• 38:03Speaker 03

  I'm telling you, man, if they make a new like Tamagotchi game, where you have a pet in your living room that you take care of-

• 38:10Speaker 02

  We're gonna go from having real pets to virtual pets.

• 38:12Speaker 03

  I'm saying-

• 38:13Speaker 02

  Pokemon battles would be sick as hell.

• 38:16Speaker 03

  That's what I'm saying. Hype check Pokemon on HoloLens.

• 38:20Speaker 02

  I can't even give you a number.

• 38:21Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 38:21Speaker 02

  It's out of control.

• 38:22Speaker 03

  Yeah. It broke the hype check meter.

• 38:25Speaker 02

  Oh my god, can you ima- And also like Yu-Gi-Oh, and imagine like Magic the Gathering if they got into this, where the monsters were like real things.

• 38:31Nilay Patel?

  Didn't they show one like that at the first HoloLens demo?

• 38:34Speaker 03

  They showed a Minecraft thing.

• 38:36Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 38:36Speaker 03

  Which was like blocks.

• 38:38Nilay Patel?

  Right.

• 38:38Speaker 03

  But anyway, they showed, so they showed several demos of things happening. And one of them was like, the universal apps thing, where you can have apps that work in the augmented reality vision. So the use case was like, you're in your living room, and you want to put a video on your wall somewhere, instead of looking at a TV, which is what every human being does.

• 39:00Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 39:01Speaker 03

  And then you say you want to get up and move to a different room of the house. The video will follow you to a different room of the house. And it's just-

• 39:08Nilay Patel?

  Well, it's just funny, because during those demos, like, there was obviously a person wearing HoloLens, and they outfitted a camera so you could see what they were seeing, which is all cool, like, all very cool tech. But like, the person is like, and then maybe you just want to walk to another room. And they like, confidently walked away, wearing a helmet. That doesn't seem like how I want to move about my home. Like, it looks amazing. Like, I will say, all of the VR stuff to me is still very nebulous. Like, why are we going to use it? And HoloLens is like, I get it. Yeah. It would be cool to like, that's the promise of Google Glass. That's like what you, that's what everybody wanted Glass to be.

• 39:43Speaker 01

  But like, how are you going to get people to like, wake up every day and put a helmet on?

• 39:47Speaker 03

  At the end of a gun.

• 39:48Nilay Patel?

  Like.

• 39:49Speaker 02

  How do you get?

• 39:50Nilay Patel?

  Nadella.

• 39:52Nilay Patel?

  AR Rangers, walking the streets. Are you wearing your augmented reality headset, sir?

• 39:57Speaker 02

  That, Michael, that would be like asking, how do you get people to wake up in the morning, sit on their couch, press a button, and sit at a, watch a, a screen for two hours before they go to work?

• 40:05Speaker 01

  Yeah, but you don't have to put a helmet on to do that.

• 40:06Speaker 03

  Yeah, that's true.

• 40:08Nilay Patel?

  I mean, the helmet thing, I mean, it is like a helmet. Did you see the video?

• 40:11Speaker 02

  It's huge.

• 40:12Nilay Patel?

  Yeah. And it clicks all the way around your head.

• 40:14Speaker 02

  It's a helmet. It's a future. Future helmets.

• 40:17Nilay Patel?

  Helmets of the future.

• 40:17Speaker 02

  Helmets of the future.

• 40:18Nilay Patel?

  Now, I will say that the HoloLens is the most exciting Microsoft thing I've seen in a long time. One of the most purely exciting things. But the idea that you're just going to run like Skype on it?

• 40:28Speaker 02

  Well, that's boring.

• 40:29Nilay Patel?

  And then you're just like, pin Skype to a wall.

• 40:32Speaker 03

  It's, it's, I feel the same way about this as I did when they first started showing off Kinect. And I was like, dude, yo, Kinect is amazing. I was like imagining 3,000 different games that would be just totally awesome to have Kinect on.

• 40:48Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 40:48Speaker 03

  And then it was like, Kinectimals. It was like one game.

• 40:53Nilay Patel?

  Yeah. Where's the Kinect? That's your favorite Kinect game?

• 40:55Speaker 03

  I can't, I live like, what's the?

• 40:57Nilay Patel?

  Dance Central?

• 40:58Speaker 03

  What else do they have? Okay, Dance Central is good.

• 40:59Nilay Patel?

  Connect Sports?

• 41:00Speaker 03

  Yeah, Dance Central is like the one game for Kinect that would like really clicked and it was like, this is pure, pure Kinect. This is amazing. This is exactly what this is for. Everything else was just kind of like, eh. This is just making things more difficult.

• 41:14Nilay Patel?

  Right.

• 41:14Speaker 03

  Than they need to be. And it's all gimmicky, like.

• 41:17Nilay Patel?

  Well, I mean, but this is like a, I don't know, what do you think? We actually have to get to the biggest Windows news of all. But let's, we just finish.

• 41:23Speaker 01

  I think if they can shrink it down eventually, it'll be great, but like. It's too big right now. That's their issue. Like, you can't get normal people to wear a helmet. Like, that's not gonna happen. Like, plain and simple.

• 41:34Nilay Patel?

  But maybe if it's just like in your house or in your office, just got holograms everywhere.

• 41:39Speaker 03

  I don't know. That's the thing. I don't think you need a lot of normal people to wear it for it to be successful. Like, get gamers to use it.

• 41:44Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 41:45Speaker 03

  And they will make a lot of money on it.

• 41:46Speaker 02

  Yeah, I don't think it's gonna be something we live in particularly. I think you're going to say, "Okay, it's time for HoloLens," and then you wear the HoloLens and you do whatever things you do inside there, and then you're done.

• 41:56Nilay Patel?

  Right.

• 41:56Speaker 03

  Yeah, I think there needs to be like really specific experiences.

• 42:00Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 42:00Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 42:01Speaker 03

  You can give people through that instead of just, "Oh, wear this and stuff will happen." Because it's not gonna happen, if that's what you do.

• 42:07Speaker 01

  I think it'll be great for gaming, but they need to really break down those use cases for outside of that.

• 42:11Nilay Patel?

  You walk, you're in your house, your house has beautiful wood walls with nothing else on them, and you're just...

• 42:16Speaker 02

  Wooden walls?

• 42:17Nilay Patel?

  Every Microsoft demo has wooden walls. Have you not noticed this?

• 42:20Speaker 02

  Oh, my God, you're right.

• 42:21Nilay Patel?

  It's always like a... It always looks like a really nice, like, clothing store. It's like a banana... Nah, banana probably looks a little less.

• 42:30Speaker 02

  Dare I say Abercrombie?

• 42:31Nilay Patel?

  It's like an Abercrombie. That's kind of what I'm thinking, right? It's like a log cabin, you know?

• 42:36Speaker 02

  The Met or Rule. Remember that store?

• 42:38Nilay Patel?

  Like a really high-tech log cabin. Like, you're in the future, but it's really earthy there. Anyway, so like that's every Microsoft set.

• 42:44Speaker 03

  It smells like a middle school dance because of the cologne.

• 42:45Nilay Patel?

  And you're just walking around with your helmet on, and you're just like, "You know what? I do want that app to just be on the wall." You're just flicking it. Just living life.

• 42:54Speaker 02

  But if there's Skype on the wall, they can't see you, right? If you're just... If you're pinned to Skype window to the wall, there's no camera that can see you, right?

• 43:04Speaker 03

  Is there though?

• 43:04Speaker 02

  You could just see them.

• 43:06Speaker 03

  Isn't there, Sam? Isn't there a camera?

• 43:08Nilay Patel?

  I'm just letting this one ride. Let's tease this one out as far as it can go. What if your walls are made of cameras? Because I know... Well, I will say this. The rest of HoloLens, like, it's not just a helmet. It's like a positioning system in your house.

• 43:21Speaker 02

  Right.

• 43:21Nilay Patel?

  There's like things that go on the corners and all this stuff. And then there was a big demo where like a robot rolled out and turned into a bigger robot.

• 43:27Speaker 02

  That was nuts.

• 43:28Nilay Patel?

  I mean, it's all very cool. It's all very tech demo, right? They still won't let us film it or take pictures of it working. The prototypes, like the prototype Tom used last time was basically like a Windows tower strapped to his head. So like they've got to waste again. Okay, biggest news. We gotta do this.

• 43:45Speaker 02

  Oh, here we go.

• 43:46Nilay Patel?

  We gotta do this.

• 43:47Speaker 02

  I know what he's about to say. The headline is big news, colon.

• 43:51Nilay Patel?

  Huge news.

• 43:52Speaker 02

  Huge news.

• 43:53Nilay Patel?

  Uh, every Windows 10 device will have an Android runtime. So you can basically just port your Android apps to Windows. And you can compile iOS code directly to Windows. So they're, they're basically just like giving up on the app front and saying, bring us your apps.

• 44:09Speaker 03

  Oh, cool. So it's the web.

• 44:11Nilay Patel?

  It's kind of weird, right? Oh, Windows 10. Every desktop screenshot of Windows 10 is like little web, little apps everywhere. Like the way, like when you shrink an app on Windows 10, like it's responsive because they're all universal. And they turn into phone apps, which is cool. You're shaking your head at me.

• 44:28Speaker 03

  This is comp, this is too complicated.

• 44:30Nilay Patel?

  It was just too complicated.

• 44:31Speaker 03

  I, I don't think I've ever been on my, I'm not saying that I'm everybody, but I've never been on like my desktop at home. And thought to myself, I wish I could run an Android app on this.

• 44:42Nilay Patel?

  No, but you have probably used a Windows phone and thought to yourself, I wish I could run apps on this.

• 44:47Speaker 03

  That's true.

• 44:47Nilay Patel?

  And that like solves a problem for them.

• 44:49Speaker 02

  So is Microsoft giving up on trying to like woo over developers?

• 44:54Nilay Patel?

  Everything they announced is in the nineties, Microsoft had this, this overt strategy called embrace and extend. Where they would take like web standards, like fuck with them and make them Microsoft standards. Um, and that's like, that's not quite what they're doing here, but everything they announced is. You can run old Windows apps on Windows 10, you can run Android apps on Windows 10, you can recompile your iOS apps on Windows 10. Oh, we have a new browser, you can run your Chrome extensions here if you want to. Like, everything is about just like bringing in everything else you might use into one, this one big unified Microsoft world. Which is neat. But I, I'm very skeptical of like how well it will perform.

• 45:34Nilay Patel?

  I don't know if what you want is to run the same app on your Xboxes on your phone.

• 45:40Speaker 03

  Yeah, it seems, I mean, oh, it makes me uncomfortable.

• 45:44Nilay Patel?

  Why?

• 45:44Speaker 03

  I don't know, it just seems like Microsoft wants to create, or what they're creating is just like. An emulator that will run literally anything that's ever been made.

• 45:53Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, there, there's definitely that vibe a little bit.

• 45:55Speaker 03

  And that's cool.

• 45:57Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 45:58Nilay Patel?

  What do you think?

• 45:58Speaker 01

  I feel the same way.

• 45:59Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, it's too skeptical.

• 46:01Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 46:01Speaker 03

  It's cool for like two people.

• 46:03Speaker 01

  It's gonna be interesting to see how many developers actually use it and start porting over apps.

• 46:06Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 46:07Speaker 01

  That's gonna be the interesting part. Um, I know they want them to do that and then sort of hook into Windows's features. And we'll see how that goes. I don't, I don't think it's gonna work out.

• 46:18Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, but there's like a lot of Windows PCs. I mean, the whole thing is it'll be on a billion devices in three years. If you're like an iOS developer and you could just suddenly get the market of Windows touchscreen laptops by just like doing some work, wouldn't you just do that little bit of work? But I mean, that seems to be the bet, right? If you're an Android developer and you could get the market of Windows touchscreen laptops by just doing a little bit of work.

• 46:41Speaker 02

  Someone just tweeted at you.

• 46:43Speaker 03

  I think that's good for developers maybe, but what about people using those apps?

• 46:46Speaker 02

  There's some limitations with that cross compile, only mobile for Android, only desktop for iOS, still needs, still need to do API work. I'm not sure if that's entirely true. I'm gonna assume it is.

• 46:56Nilay Patel?

  Uh, I mean, they'll get there. I mean, like, it's gonna take him a minute to do all this stuff. I mean, like, but that's the idea, right? Like, they, for better or worse, like, they finally, it's funny, Sam Byford, his whole argument for everything at this moment is they should stop making phones. So like two days ago, he was like, Microsoft should stop making phones. And then last night, he literally wrote Sony should stop making phones. And like his answer to every problem in tech is like, you should stop. And I.

• 47:20Speaker 03

  Yeah, well, I, I like Windows. I've been using it forever.

• 47:24Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 47:24Speaker 03

  Uh, I wanted a Windows phone for a really long time. And every time I went back to look at it when I was making a decision to buy a phone, I said, oh, this looks cool. Does it have Instagram?

• 47:35Nilay Patel?

  Right.

• 47:35Speaker 03

  And the answer was no. And I immediately was like, well.

• 47:38Nilay Patel?

  Right, so if you're Facebook and you could just like port the Android Instagram app to, like, wouldn't you just do it? Like, that seems to be how they're solving this problem. Like, it's not that much more work. We don't have to like pay you to write some custom code you have to maintain. We're just gonna run your Android app and like do some magic to make it look like a Windows app. And then your customers will be so happy that you'll do the additional work of making it more Windowsy. And all of that seems. A little bit pipe tree me. We'll see. I mean, it depends on each company, whether they think they want to give someone that experience. If you could have a touchscreen Windows laptop and you could straight up run in the Android Instagram app on a window and use it like that, wouldn't you do that?

• 48:23Nilay Patel?

  Like, I would do that. It would be, that would, that would like make a number of my extremely limited dreams come true.

• 48:29Speaker 02

  Isn't, yeah, I don't know. I feel like the people browse Instagram on mobile. It's made on for mobile. This is, it feels like a weird going backwards kind of thing. Like, do you browse Instagram? Does anyone in here browse Instagram on the desktop?

• 48:42Nilay Patel?

  We can't. I do sometimes.

• 48:44Speaker 02

  Instagram.com.

• 48:45Nilay Patel?

  No, you can do it. Come on.

• 48:46Speaker 02

  That's.

• 48:47Nilay Patel?

  Who uses Instagram.com?

• 48:48Speaker 02

  No way. I do.

• 48:49Nilay Patel?

  Really?

• 48:50Speaker 02

  Yeah, I check, I check it like maybe once a week, but it's there and it exists and it works and you can like photos from there.

• 48:55Nilay Patel?

  Lauren Katz is sitting here. She's, she works for rocks.com. She runs all their socials with, with their team. Would you ever use Instagram on the desktop?

• 49:05Speaker 04

  I use it to check specific numbers and how folks are doing.

• 49:09Nilay Patel?

  Because it's your job.

• 49:13Nilay Patel?

  Right. This is what I'm saying.

• 49:16Nilay Patel?

  But I'm saying if you could have that app straight up on your computer and you could just like do this, I would totally do that. By the way, when I say do this with the people in their cars, I'm just idly waving my finger at a screen at a non touchscreen laptop. What do you think, Micah?

• 49:30Speaker 01

  I mean, I'm gonna pick up my phone and look at Instagram. Like, the question is, even if they port over a ton of the iOS and Android apps, are you gonna switch to Windows phone? Like, if it had all the same apps, is it good enough to where you're gonna switch to it?

• 49:45Speaker 01

  That's the question. Like, is it gonna really make a difference?

• 49:47Nilay Patel?

  I would.

• 49:50Nilay Patel?

  Yeah. Does it have, is it an Nokia phone with a sick camera? Yeah.

• 49:58Nilay Patel?

  Is there

• 49:58Speaker 01

  That's the question.

• 49:59Nilay Patel?

  Is Google gonna put a Gmail app on?

• 50:01Speaker 01

  I mean, like, no.

• 50:02Speaker 03

  Does it have leather?

• 50:03Nilay Patel?

  Does it have leather? Here's what I'm looking for. I'm looking for an LGG4 that runs Windows. Can it? I mean, like, maybe. It does. Can it? Is it one of the new ones that can do the sick thing where it turns into a computer? Like, all of that, to me, is cool.

• 50:17Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 50:18Nilay Patel?

  Uh, if the Xbox One was not, in my experience, like, a relatively slow and buggy product, the idea that all these apps, like, all of it's there. They did the thing, right? They made it work. Like, they have the one platform. I'm just worried it's all gonna be slow.

• 50:33Speaker 03

  Yeah, it's also really difficult to explain to people why they would ever wanna do what they're demoing.

• 50:40Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 50:40Speaker 03

  Like, I don't know. I don't know anybody, like, I'm not even talking about it, like, oh, you know, people like my mom, who, or parents, or grandparents, or, you know, people. I'm talking about, like, peers that I know. I don't know how I would explain to them why it would be useful for them to have a phone that they could put on a dock, and it comes up on another screen, like...

• 51:00Speaker 01

  Like, I have a laptop. I don't need to do that.

• 51:04Speaker 03

  Phones, because phones aren't, you know, they're still... Look at the newest MacBook

• 51:10Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 51:10Speaker 03

  Air. That still has problems running, you know, even that has problems running stuff, and it's more substantial than what's in a phone.

• 51:19Nilay Patel?

  I think that maybe the phone thing is like, a little, that's like a serious Road Warrior. Like, that's the dream of the Atrix 4G.

• 51:26Speaker 03

  Yeah. I think it's appealing, but I don't think it's, like, broadly appealing.

• 51:30Nilay Patel?

  But like, the idea of the Windows phone, where you just, like, have the laptop show, and you put it in there, and it, like, turns, that's your laptop, and then you're done. You're like, oh, I'm back. I don't know. I don't know what serious Road Warriors do. That's what they sound like.

• 51:39Speaker 03

  What if you wanna pull your phone out? Use your phone as a phone?

• 51:41Nilay Patel?

  No, you're on a plane, man. You're sitting in first class. You're drinking the wine.

• 51:46Speaker 01

  Wine's not good in first class.

• 51:48Nilay Patel?

  Well, you're still, what are you?

• 51:48Speaker 02

  Boom, look at that.

• 51:52Nilay Patel?

  You're still, no, you're still, I mean... Still drinking it. Here's the thing. I'm not saying you're like enjoying it.

• 51:57Speaker 03

  It's like at least it's at least it's still an order of magnitude more complicated than pulling out a laptop and using a laptop that you already know how to use. And more than that, nobody has solved like the battery problem yet.

• 52:08Speaker 01

  I mean, that's the question.

• 52:09Nilay Patel?

  You guys are haters, man. Usually I'm the one who hates on Microsoft.

• 52:12Speaker 01

  It's really interesting, but like, how many regular people are actually gonna wanna?

• 52:15Nilay Patel?

  I think if you told regular people, hey, buy this normals, buy this Windows tablet. It's your only computer and you can just like go plug it into a thing and it becomes a computer. They might be into it.

• 52:29Speaker 02

  They would be like LOL why?

• 52:32Nilay Patel?

  Well, they wouldn't, but then they would be like, where are the apps? This is the problem with every Windows tablet I've ever used.

• 52:36Speaker 02

  Does it have Snapchat? That's the question you're gonna get asked a lot and the answer is no.

• 52:41Speaker 03

  I don't know. I think the Surface is more compelling than a tablet than you put into a monitor.

• 52:45Speaker 01

  Yeah, I would agree with that.

• 52:46Speaker 03

  And even that's more difficult, you know, hasn't been like super clear.

• 52:49Nilay Patel?

  I keep trying to use my Surface Pro 3.

• 52:50Speaker 03

  I like it.

• 52:51Nilay Patel?

  You do?

• 52:52Speaker 03

  I do.

• 52:52Nilay Patel?

  What do you use for it?

• 52:53Speaker 03

  I tried to get one. You guys were like, nah.

• 52:55Nilay Patel?

  And then you got one anyway?

• 52:56Speaker 03

  No, I don't have one.

• 52:58Nilay Patel?

  So why do you? So you just like it from afar?

• 53:00Speaker 03

  I'm using it for Dungeons and Dragons, believe it or not.

• 53:02Nilay Patel?

  Wait, so you do have one or you don't have one?

• 53:04Speaker 03

  I'm using our, our company, our company model.

• 53:09Nilay Patel?

  Sam's breaking embargoes. TC's stealing review units for D and D. It's anarchy right now. Mike is drunk on airplane wine.

• 53:21Nilay Patel?

  This wine doesn't meet my standards. This is the worst first class I've ever been in.

• 53:27Nilay Patel?

  I'm, I think this is crazy. Here's what I wanted, but like the, here's the thing. BlackBerry tried this too, right?

• 53:32Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 53:33Nilay Patel?

  Does, does your, you have a BlackBerry with you right now?

• 53:35Speaker 01

  Yes, I do.

• 53:35Nilay Patel?

  Does that thing, that ring runs fake Android apps?

• 53:37Speaker 01

  I'm sure it does.

• 53:39Nilay Patel?

  Don't even try.

• 53:40Speaker 01

  I use it only exclusively for email. I don't use this thing for anything else.

• 53:43Nilay Patel?

  Let me see this thing.

• 53:44Speaker 02

  That is like, you are like the person who buys the new MacBook because you did buy a new MacBook. You're like, I'm just gonna casually check email on this thing. It's cool.

• 53:52Nilay Patel?

  It's a BlackBerry classic.

• 53:54Speaker 01

  You can throw it against the wall.

• 53:55Speaker 03

  Right here? Check that out.

• 53:57Nilay Patel?

  Wow.

• 53:59Nilay Patel?

  Can we start a Kickstarter to get TC a new phone?

• 54:03Speaker 01

  I will buy you a new phone.

• 54:05Speaker 03

  I don't want a BlackBerry, sorry.

• 54:06Nilay Patel?

  I mean, wait, this thing, you've got a voicemail here? You've got seventeen LinkedIn messages? This is truly a business device.

• 54:13Speaker 01

  Exactly.

• 54:13Speaker 03

  Let's see this.

• 54:14Nilay Patel?

  Look at this, man, you're doing it.

• 54:17Speaker 03

  Ooh, it's heavy.

• 54:18Speaker 01

  It is.

• 54:18Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, no, it feels, uh, it feels, it's luxury.

• 54:21Speaker 02

  Wait, is the back, what is the back?

• 54:24Nilay Patel?

  Did you see that hilarious? There was a hilarious piece of news this week where it's like John Chen, the CEO of BlackBerry now.

• 54:32Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 54:33Nilay Patel?

  He was just out there, he's like, you know, we'd work with Apple on security software if they like wanted to. I mean, that'd be cool. And then he was just like this, like lengthy CNBC thing, he's like, yeah, I mean, that'd be great. I mean, like, you know, if they want, we're open, totally open to working with Apple. I mean, like, not a problem for us. And the last line was like, Apple declined.

• 54:54Nilay Patel?

  It was like, oh, man, that sucks for you. What do you think? So you, you're, you're like a hater TC?

• 54:59Speaker 03

  No, I think it's a great idea.

• 55:01Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 55:02Speaker 03

  I just am worried that no one's gonna care because Microsoft has always historically been really bad about explaining

• 55:11Speaker 03

  why the new stuff that they do is worth it.

• 55:13Nilay Patel?

  Are we just in a period of bad explanations?

• 55:15Speaker 03

  I, I think that's been the history of Microsoft.

• 55:17Nilay Patel?

  No, no, no, but like, Apple can't explain the phone, the watch.

• 55:20Speaker 03

  When I was a hardcore Engadget commenter, yes, that was a period of my life.

• 55:26Speaker 03

  That happened, for real.

• 55:27Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, I know, I'm aware of the situation.

• 55:28Speaker 03

  Yeah, I used to be a huge like Windows hype person.

• 55:33Nilay Patel?

  You won't even say it.

• 55:34Speaker 03

  I can't say it.

• 55:36Nilay Patel?

  A hype chef.

• 55:38Speaker 03

  Hype surf.

• 55:38Nilay Patel?

  Oh, hype chef. You should do a series with Eater called Hype Chef. And it's just Sam Sheffer.

• 55:43Speaker 02

  My nickname and hi-

• 55:44Nilay Patel?

  Meeting chefs.

• 55:45Speaker 02

  My nickname and hi, so my, Mike, my older brother's nickname in high school was Chef, and my nickname was Susha.

• 55:51Nilay Patel?

  I mean, I get it, but that's not as good as my idea for you doing a series with Eater called Hype Chef? Where you just go and swag out chefs across New York? And it's just you, like, showing off like a backpack full of Supreme gear? And they're like cooking a steak and you're like putting a hat on? Think about what I'm saying. They're like, this is how you make a perfect beef- Start talking like, this is how you look totally dope in the club. It's just those two things happening simultaneously.

• 56:16Speaker 02

  Sign me up.

• 56:16Nilay Patel?

  Hype Shaft with Sam Shepard.

• 56:18Speaker 02

  Do it, Hype Shaft. That's pretty good. I like that.

• 56:20Nilay Patel?

  I'm a font of ideas.

• 56:21Speaker 02

  I like that.

• 56:22Nilay Patel?

  They should have asked me, we did our big ad sales new front stuff. I should have been on stage and like, my newest idea for a vertical I don't control. Hype Shaft. Alright.

• 56:32Speaker 03

  Anyway, I think Microsoft let people like, you know, they, they took the, you know, they were the Google to Apple of the PC world.

• 56:42Nilay Patel?

  Right.

• 56:43Speaker 03

  You know, for a long time, like I would have family members go to Best Buy and get a $250 Hewlett Packard PC with like monitor, keyboard, everything for that much. And they would, you know, a week later, they would be like, why is this a piece of shit?

• 56:56Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 56:57Speaker 03

  Well, because you spent $250.

• 56:59Nilay Patel?

  My new question, when anybody asks me what computer buys, I ask them how long they want to keep it.

• 57:03Speaker 03

  Right.

• 57:04Nilay Patel?

  Because that's how I can like push them to like just buy. For $300 more, you can buy a MacBook Air.

• 57:10Speaker 02

  And it'll last you twice, if not three times as long.

• 57:13Nilay Patel?

  Yeah. They gave away, they gave away Spectres, HP Spectres to everybody at the audience history.

• 57:18Speaker 02

  You know, why do they give away the, the Dell XPS?

• 57:20Nilay Patel?

  I don't know.

• 57:21Speaker 02

  That's a nice computer.

• 57:22Nilay Patel?

  We're about to be in that moment though with Windows 10 where it's like, what is the Windows laptop?

• 57:27Speaker 02

  I said this on another Vergecast, where the hell is Microsoft's laptop?

• 57:30Nilay Patel?

  They're never gonna.

• 57:31Speaker 02

  Cool Surface, guys. Like, I'm glad you're doing that magnet thing, but where is?

• 57:38Speaker 03

  LL magnets.

• 57:39Nilay Patel?

  Hype Shaft's getting mean.

• 57:40Speaker 02

  Yeah, it's like, okay, you can watch Google do it with the Nexus program. Where, they should just make a laptop called Microsoft Metro and it's boom.

• 57:49Nilay Patel?

  Did I tell you that I forgot my laptop at home the other day?

• 57:51Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 57:52Nilay Patel?

  And I used a Pixel for the entire day at work.

• 57:55Speaker 02

  How was that?

• 57:55Nilay Patel?

  It was pretty cool.

• 57:57Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 57:57Nilay Patel?

  I mean, like, I have a, like a classic, I don't do any real work management job. Like, I like gaze at emails and then like yell at some other people, like wander around poking at stuff.

• 58:09Speaker 03

  A tub of grapes.

• 58:09Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, just.

• 58:11Speaker 03

  People kiss your ring throughout the day.

• 58:12Nilay Patel?

  That's, uh, it's weird. It's, it's one of the weirdest parts of our office. It's my grape tub.

• 58:19Speaker 02

  What?

• 58:21Speaker 02

  Oh, so you crush the wine that Micah drinks in first class.

• 58:23Nilay Patel?

  That's weird. Weird relationship for me and Micah to have, but yeah, that's, that's pretty much how that goes. Micah, I made you some body wine. Alright, that unfortunately was the Vergecast.

• 58:37Nilay Patel?

  Don't know why we got to where we got.

• 58:40Speaker 03

  John left the control booth. It was so bad.

• 58:44Nilay Patel?

  He's literally not in there.

• 58:45Speaker 03

  He's gone.

• 58:47Nilay Patel?

  I'm so sorry for what was... The mic is trying to leave me.

• 58:51Speaker 03

  The show's literally falling apart.

• 58:52Nilay Patel?

  It is literally falling apart. So Sam, engage us.

• 58:55Speaker 02

  Engage. So hello, fans and hello, listeners. We are on a bunch of social platforms that you are probably on too. The one that I want you to add us on right now, lolsocial.biz. The one that I want you to add us on right now is Snapchat because I manage that account and I do a lot of fun things on there with everyone in the office. And it is The Real Verge. You've probably seen a tweet about it once or twice. You should add us there. You should also subscribe to our YouTube channel. We are youtube.com/theverge. We post all of our cool videos. Yes, we post videos on our YouTube channel, but we have a lot of good stuff. We actually just put up this awesome 13-minute supercut of the

• 59:39Speaker 02

  history of the Marvel Universe up on our website. You should go find that and watch it. It's good. And now, Neelai, back to you.

• 59:46Nilay Patel?

  Great. By the way, we're gonna start putting PowerPoints on YouTube. Just think about it. Wild. No one will ever expect it. Okay, so we're on iTunes. Please go to iTunes. Give us five stars. This week, your assignment, your iTunes review assignment is to tell us what you would use the HoloLens for. I'm very curious. I don't know the answer. We also have another show, What's Tech with Chris Plant, which is excellent. One of my favorites. It's all at itunes.com/theverge. I am Reckless. Sam is Sam Sheffer. Mike is Michael Singleton and TC is Chillmage.

• 1:00:23Speaker 03

  Word.

• 1:00:26Nilay Patel?

  Thank you so much to Tripcase, tripcase.com/vergecast. Please check it out. And a special thank you to High Five. What team does not want to high-five each other at work? Take back the first 15 minutes of every meeting. Get started today. Go to highfive.com/verge and request a free trial of High Five. That's H-I-G-H-F-I-V-E.com/verge. Free trial. You can finally... Finally start meeting face to face. That is the Verchess. Thank you so much for listening. We'll be back next week. Rock and roll. Bye.