Mark Booth

Mark Booth is an author, editor, and publisher who also writes under the pen name Jonathan Black. He studied philosophy and theology at Oxford and built a publishing career working with authors including Rupert Sheldrake, Graham Hancock, and Lorna Byrne. His bestselling The Secret History of the World explores history through esoteric and mystical traditions. His latest book, The Secret History of the Universe, examines the relationship between spiritual belief and modern science through the lives and ideas of pioneering scientists. ------ Thank you to the sponsors that fuel our podcast and our team: AG1 ⁠⁠https://DrinkAG1.com/tetra⁠⁠ ------ LMNT Electrolytes ⁠⁠https://DrinkLMNT.com/tetra⁠⁠ Use code 'TETRA' ------ Squarespace ⁠⁠https://Squarespace.com/tetra⁠⁠ Use code 'TETRA' ------ Lectio 365 ⁠⁠https://Lectio365.com⁠⁠ ------ Sign up to receive Tetragrammaton Transmissions ⁠⁠https://www.tetragrammaton.com/join-newsletter Follow Tetragrammaton: ⁠⁠⁠⁠https://x.com/tetranow⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠https://www.instagram.com/tetragrammaton.now⁠⁠ Follow Rick: ⁠⁠⁠⁠https://x.com/rickrubin⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.instagram.com/rickrubin

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:02Rick Rubin?

  Tetragrammaton.

• 0:23Speaker 01

  We have exaggerated ideas about how separate we are from everything, how cut off. We have exaggerated ideas about our own originality, perhaps. I think in all areas of life, we like to take credit for ideas we have, if they're brilliant or funny. But we don't know where they come from. They swim into our mental space. And if we were more aware, as ancient spiritual teachings asked us to be, we would realise that we are little semi-local extrusions of a universal intelligence.

• 1:08Rick Rubin?

  Was there a time when humans didn't think of themselves as separate from either each other or the things around them?

• 1:16Speaker 01

  Yes, I believe there was. In the Christian church, it's called the "Fall". According to Christianity, we are spiritual beings who fell into matter and became encased in material bodies. Generally, that is conceived of in terms of falling into a material realm which was already formed. The esoteric philosophy is slightly different, and that is that the material world only gradually hardened after we had sunk into it.

• 2:02Speaker 01

  And of course, all religions around the world have myths which describe forms morphing and changing, and one creature developing out of another, and the animals and plants that we're familiar with coming into being. The myths refer to a time when solid matter was not fixed, as it is today. And the human beings who remember that process

• 2:42Speaker 01

  and started the process of putting those myths into human language would have completely understood that we are part of a whole. Then if you go to the Siege of Troy, for example, Homer describes the armies fighting battles on the plains in front of Troy, being able to see and interact with the gods who are present, who are striding across the plains with them and prompting them to do stuff. In Homer's worldview, it's not that I get angry and decide to hit someone with my sword,

• 3:28Speaker 01

  it's that Mars, the god of war, prompts me to do it. And so in Homer's time, they had very little sense of the interior life. Everything was happening out there. We were part of this whole which included the gods. And then if you move on to the Odyssey, we see the seeds of change. Because the great hero of the Iliad is Achilles, who is very large, very handsome, very strong, he's a pretty kind of straightforward guy.

• 4:09Speaker 01

  The hero of the Odyssey, Odysseus, is very different. He's smaller, he's a bit awkward-looking, but he's clever. And Odysseus, not Achilles, won the Trojan War, and he did it by means of the Trojan Horse, which was perhaps the first trick in history. If it hadn't been the first trick, why on earth would the Trojans have been taken in by it?

• 4:42Rick Rubin?

  Yeah.

• 4:43Speaker 01

  And then, as we follow his adventures, he is all the time using his cleverness and his trickery to defeat the monsters and the sorceresses and the other creatures he meets on his journey. And interestingly, one of the most famous episodes is when he is imprisoned in a cave by a giant with an eye in the middle of his forehead.

• 5:17Speaker 01

  And while the giant is sleeping, he gets a giant pole, sharpens it, and jabs it in that eye. And I think that what Homer is describing there is human beings beginning to lose that third-eye faculty of being able to see our connection with all the different gods and spirits.

• 5:44Rick Rubin?

  Do you think of them as fictional stories or something else?

• 5:47Speaker 01

  No, I think that they're factual accounts of things that happened before matter was fixed. Because as matter became harder and harder, it became more difficult for high-level spiritual beings to squeeze down into the material realm and interact with us.

• 6:11Rick Rubin?

  Do we know why this happened?

• 6:13Speaker 01

  Yes, we do. I think esoteric philosophy gives a very good explanation. Our material bodies and our skulls are there to filter out spiritual influences. If we were like angels and had no material filter, we would be completely aware of all the other spiritual beings and of God, and we would have no free will, because we would always do exactly what God wanted us to do. Angels do not have free will.

• 6:57Speaker 01

  We have sunk into matter, into these material bodies, in order to develop faculties such as free will and conceptual thought, which may not exist anywhere else in the universe. We may be in that way at the evolving tip of the universe. On the question of conceptual thought, if you consider angelic communications, as they come in visions in the Old Testament or in the Book of Revelation,

• 7:35Speaker 01

  they are always messages told entirely in symbolic language. There are no concepts. I think probably angels and other spirits think entirely in symbolic terms, and they don't have the capacity for symbolic thought that we have, and that's one of the reasons why we're so important. Now, obviously, this faculty of free will means that sometimes we get it wrong.

• 8:06Rick Rubin?

  Is there a relationship between that angelic world of connection and what we refer to as the coming singularity?

• 8:16Speaker 01

  We discussed earlier how human beings are, in a sense, little local extrusions of a universal intelligence. Science is saying pretty much the same thing these days. If the universe is intelligent...

• 8:41Speaker 01

  If intelligence is woven into the fabric of the universe, then we were always quite likely to evolve. According to classical science, the old Newtonian science to scientism, we are a complete freak of nature. It was always very, very unlikely, almost it was vanishingly unlikely that something like human beings would ever evolve. Because so many different laws of nature, so many things had to come together that some scientists posit that there are infinite number of universes.

• 9:25Speaker 01

  We just have to, we just happen to live in the one where it all comes together.

• 9:30Rick Rubin?

  If it did come together in the way that science says,

• 9:35Rick Rubin?

  that would be a miracle.

• 9:36Speaker 01

  Yes, exactly, exactly.

• 9:38Rick Rubin?

  It's funny, the idea that old science would prove a miracle. It's an interesting idea.

• 9:44Speaker 01

  Yeah, well Einstein thought about this matter and he said that the most incomprehensible thing about the universe is that it is comprehensible to us.

• 9:54Rick Rubin?

  Yeah.

• 9:54Speaker 01

  How come we're so intelligent that we can think about these things? That is a miracle. It's very mysterious. If on the other hand, intelligence is woven into the fabric of the universe and there is an intelligence behind it, we're always likely to happen.

• 10:14Speaker 01

  By the same token, so are other forms of intelligence. And there's a computer scientist and physicist called Stephen Wolfram, who would say that sitting here, you and I are probably surrounded in this room by many different types of intelligence that we do not have the language, whether mathematical or in physics or verbal or visual, to perceive or understand.

• 10:49Rick Rubin?

  Yeah, we perceive a narrow band of information. There could be some form of life in those other bands that we're not aware of.

• 10:56Speaker 01

  Yes. It's interesting to look at AI in the context of that. Computer intelligence was of course originally invented on the model of human intelligence. And of course, it has in some ways evolved beyond that and improved on that. When Demis Hassabis, who created DeepMind, asked a computer to learn how to play chess so it can beat any human being, he just gave it the rules of chess and said, now play against yourself for as long as it takes. It took nine hours. That just shows how fast AI can develop.

• 11:42Speaker 01

  So it may be that these evolving AIs themselves may be interacting with the universal intelligence in the same way that we are, which would be a hopeful sign.

• 12:03Rick Rubin?

  The idea that consciousness is outside of us and we access it.

• 12:09Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 12:10Rick Rubin?

  And you're saying that if it gets to the point where AI has consciousness, the only way that's possible is that if it too is tapping into this universal consciousness?

• 12:22Speaker 01

  I think I'm just saying that's one of the ways it might develop. I think that the part of our our insularity and our kind of collective egotism, which has come about because we are in separate individual material bodies, is that we think that other forms of intelligence or consciousness have to be like ours. But we don't apply that to a dog or a cat, for example, do we? So I think there's no reason why an advanced AI may have a very special and advanced form of consciousness, which isn't however like ours. And if there are these different forms of intelligence evolving all around us,

• 13:07Speaker 01

  some of which will have been evolving since the Big Bang, so they may be pretty intelligent. Some of them may have been meant to be by the great cosmic intelligence. That may be what angels are, for example, or gods. But there may be others which were not meant to be in the same way. And they may be closer to what we think of as as aliens. We might imagine for a moment an unembodied intelligent entity swimming through the universe

• 13:48Speaker 01

  and becoming curious what it would be like to experience the material world in a sensuous and sensual way.

• 14:00Rick Rubin?

  Like a ghost, not a ghost coming from a human, but a ghost-like entity.

• 14:06Speaker 01

  Yes, well, I think that some aliens may be like that. And they they want to know what it feels like to to touch and to to have sex and to smell and to taste. And maybe, let's imagine them coming across human beings at an early stage of evolution, looking at the human brain and thinking, oh, that looks like a nice little cozy nest.

• 14:33Rick Rubin?

  It's like Mount Olympus. This story exists.

• 14:35Speaker 01

  Yes, yes, yes. And of course, the story of the watchers and the mighty men of renown in the Book of Genesis and the Book of Enoch. There are stories all all around the world about gods and divine beings mating with humans. And there are several different meanings you could ascribe to that. But one is, that is how we each come to have a divine spark in us. And mystics would say it is because we have this divine spark in us that angels are attracted to us.

• 15:22Speaker 02

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• 17:36Rick Rubin?

  What is the new high strangeness?

• 17:40Speaker 01

  These days, statistical surveys show that you are as likely to experience an encounter with an alien as you are to encounter an angel or a spirit. And I think that what's happening now is that after a couple of thousand years, when we in the West have been dominated by monotheistic religion, by the belief that there is only one God, what is happening right now is a shift back towards

• 18:23Speaker 01

  the polytheism that the Greeks and the Romans and Indian religion taught. Because people are experiencing many different types of alien, angels, cryptids.

• 18:41Rick Rubin?

  In the Psalms, there's the phrase, "The God of Gods" is the monotheistic Bible.

• 18:49Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 18:51Rick Rubin?

  And it says, "The God of Gods."

• 18:52Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 18:53Rick Rubin?

  It's an interesting phrase.

• 18:54Speaker 01

  It is, isn't it? I don't think the Bible is a monotheistic document, but we've been taught to believe.

• 19:02Rick Rubin?

  But when you hear "God of Gods", maybe in all of the polytheistic religions, there's still a God of Gods. Maybe there is the Godhead or the Father. In the same way that in the Christian Bible, there are angels below God.

• 19:20Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 19:20Rick Rubin?

  Maybe those angels are a version of the gods of the polytheistic religion. Maybe it's all the same.

• 19:27Speaker 01

  I think it is all the same. When Paul talks about the powers that be, he is referring to the same entities as the gods of the planets that the Greeks and the Romans discussed. I think it is also the case that the spiritual realms evolve in the same way that the material realm does. And I think also there are regional variations. So that, for example, in a Japanese or Korean horror film, a demon is going to look very different to the way a demon looks in an American or an English horror film.

• 20:12Speaker 01

  Well, is that culture? Or might it be the case that they are actually different in different places of the earth? And I think similarly, the higher beings evolve, and some fall by the way. I worry when I hear about some occultists today who actively cultivate gods and other entities from previous ages, gods who have nothing to do with modern spiritual evolution. I think that is probably quite harmful.

• 20:48Rick Rubin?

  Plants are not the same all over the world. It's not unreasonable to think in the spiritual realms, that could also be the case.

• 20:58Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 20:59Rick Rubin?

  Because it is, it is life.

• 21:00Speaker 01

  It is. Yeah, taking that thought for a walk, I think it's interesting to consider how ideas about what happens to us after death have changed. If you look at Greek myths or the Old Testament, the Psalms, there's no idea of heaven there. What happens is that the spirit of the dead goes to a place of shades, to a dark valley, where it has a sort of half-existence. And ideas of heaven, as they're talked about in modern Christianity, that's a very recent idea.

• 21:44Speaker 01

  The idea that we go to this place where we hang about with angels and we're greeted by our relatives, that originated with Swedenborg in the 18th century. And it only really became popular in Victorian times. And in a way, it's a very materialistic way of thinking about heaven. It's heaven as an embodiment of all the nice things in this life.

• 22:11Rick Rubin?

  Have the great scientists always been believers?

• 22:14Speaker 01

  Yes, they have. I think up until the 1960s, probably. When John Maynard Keynes discovered Newton's cache of diaries and his notebooks and discovered how obsessed he was with magic and alchemy, he said that Isaac Newton was the last of the magicians. Well, he was wrong. If you look at the extraordinary lives of the scientists that I describe in The Secret History of the World,

• 22:58Speaker 01

  they were all deeply interested in the esoteric and the occult. They were strange people. They are very good examples of the idea that genius is next to madness. Not only did they have to find new modes of thought to understand the data, the results they were seeing, they needed to have other forms of consciousness, too. And some of them achieved these different forms of consciousness by spiritual practice, some by means of drugs.

• 23:43Speaker 01

  Nikola Tesla was a very good example of that. I mean, he had a form of consciousness which is very different to most people's. He had something like an electrical storm going on inside his head all the time. And images, often of scientific equipment, which had yet to be invented, appeared to him in minute detail. And sometimes he had to reach through them to see if they were really there or not. He had a vision of his mother dying at the exact moment that his mother was, in fact, dying on the other side of the Atlantic.

• 24:28Speaker 01

  He was very interested in Indian mysticism, in Advaita Vedanta, which these ancient Indian texts were only recently translated into European languages. And European intellectuals, Tesla, and in fact, all the great scientists of the beginning of the 20th century were absolutely fascinated by it. And Tesla was strange in other ways. I think a fly landing on a windowpane next to him would be deafening to him.

• 25:08Rick Rubin?

  Highly sensitive.

• 25:09Speaker 01

  Yes. He said he couldn't touch a woman's hair except perhaps with the barrel of a gun.

• 25:20Speaker 01

  His closest relationship, when he was living in America, was a pigeon. He used to go and feed pigeons in Central Park. And he took a wounded pigeon back to his flat and looked after it. This pigeon was his constant companion. And when that pigeon died, he said he saw a brighter light than he had ever seen before in his life, including in all his experiments with electricity and light. So he was mad by most people's definitions, but he was also a genius. And by inventing alternating current,

• 26:04Speaker 01

  he made the great advances of the 20th century possible. And he was also, I think, because of the influence, or partly because of the influence of Indian teachings, he was also a great idealist. He was working on ways of finding energy which would be available for free for everyone. And some people would say, there are, or there were industrialists who didn't want that.

• 26:35Rick Rubin?

  How did you come to write this book?

• 26:38Speaker 01

  The Secret History of the Universe is a result of having written The Secret History of the World. I was working in publishing in London at the time. And I had been fascinated by esoteric ideas for many years. And I'd been looking for this book in secondhand bookshops, new bookshops. When it became clear it didn't exist, I thought, somebody needs to write this. So I did. And what I did was that I looked at esoteric and mystical ideas about history from around the world

• 27:23Speaker 01

  to see what they have in common. Because if something is universally believed to be true, that doesn't make it true, but it makes it more likely to be true.

• 27:34Rick Rubin?

  Yeah.

• 27:35Speaker 01

  And I didn't try to prove any of it because I think to prove, actually, even a small part of it would have taken more books than all the books on the many hundreds of miles of shelves in the Vatican Library of the Occult to prove. I just told it as a story. And what I was saying to people was, does this resonate with you? Does this describe the universe as you experience it? And it did resonate.

• 28:10Rick Rubin?

  I love that book. That's how I came to learn about you.

• 28:14Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 28:14Rick Rubin?

  Beautiful book.

• 28:15Speaker 01

  Thank you. It very nearly didn't happen. I was working in publishing it, and my agent was going to send it out. And I thought, God, if everyone in publishing reads this proposal, they might think I'm completely bonkers, and it might ruin my career. Or they might just think it's rubbish. And he sent it out. And it was rejected by every single publisher in London.

• 28:46Speaker 01

  And then a new publisher started up. And my agent sent it to him. And he said, I've been looking for this book for years. But I think what's interesting about that is that it only just squeezed through from the realm of ideas into physical reality. It might very well not have done. And publishers sometimes say, any script which is worthy will find the publisher. I see no reason to believe that's true. I just think that's complacency. But it did get out there. Thank goodness, many people responded to it. And one of the things that happened then was that various people from different walks

• 29:30Speaker 01

  of life began to get in touch with me. Obviously spiritually inclined people, but artists and writers, soldiers, spies, spies love a good secret. I mean, there's always been this connection since Dr. Dee through to Crowley, but this connection between the occult and spying. But perhaps the most surprising was scientists. Some of them confided in me about their very well-developed interest in the esoteric and the occult, even extending to taking part in magical ceremonies. Quite senior scientists, professors in at major universities. I have to be very careful not to give clues because I think in the present climate, they'd

• 30:15Speaker 01

  lose their jobs. They very kindly and carefully began to explain to me why the book resonated with them and what was happening in modern science, which also resonates. And it was, I think it was difficult for them. I realized that many of them don't think in words, they think in mathematics. And if they have to explain the ideas to a dunce like me, I mean, I hated physics at school. I think I, I only, I just got a grade above fail. To explain it to me, they have to translate it into words. And then I, I thought it was my job to try to turn those words into visual images.

• 30:59Speaker 01

  Because I think if you can visualize something, then you understand it on, not on the level of maths, but on quite an important level. And it's the level you need to understand it if you're to understand it's philosophical and spiritual implications. So there have been, there have been books in the past which have talked about the relationship between science and spirituality. Some of them may be a bit vague. Richard Feynman has this phrase, hand waving, which is when people don't really completely understand it, but they say, oh yeah, well, this all, you know, the quantum realm and

• 31:42Speaker 01

  spiritual experience is sort of like this. So I was pointed in the direction of the right materials and the book. I think it has about a hundred pages of notes where the scientists themselves are quoted so that there is no question about the reality of what is happening with the new physics and its spiritual implications.

• 32:08Rick Rubin?

  You said you were pointed in the direction of the information. How do you mean?

• 32:11Speaker 01

  The scientists who are helping.

• 32:13Rick Rubin?

  I thought it was maybe more.

• 32:16Speaker 01

  Well, I think, I think that it's certainly true that large sections of the secret history of the world kind of downloaded themselves. And I have this spiritual practice, which is part of my spiritual practice, that I find that when I wake up in the morning, if I lie there still, I will often find that new ideas, new sentences, new paragraphs have come to me during the night and that they're in perfect form. And that, and that is true of this book as well.

• 32:59Speaker 01

  And the esoteric explanation of that would be that during sleep, your soul and your spirit arise partially out of your body. And this enables spiritual beings to talk to you without the filter of the material body. And so that's quite a good way to get informed about stuff.

• 33:23Rick Rubin?

  How does the book begin?

• 33:25Speaker 01

  Well, the book begins by saying that most people want to believe there is something beyond the material world, but we have been brought up to believe that science is a barrier to that. So that I've written this book to try to show that that is not the case. And the story begins at the end of the 19th century, when scientists were discovering new things in science and in the spiritual realms. Many of the great scientists, for example, Marie Curie, were very interested in spiritualism.

• 34:10Speaker 01

  Now, these days, we might tend to look down on spiritualism, but in fact, at that time, it was very advanced thinking and it represented a movement to try to examine spiritual phenomena in a scientific manner. And when the originators of quantum mechanics were enabled to follow up on Marie Curie's discoveries about the energy content of atoms, when they were enabled by the technology

• 34:54Speaker 01

  to look at things at a smaller and smaller level, they began to see some really weird things. They began to see particles popping in and out of existence, which raises the question, where, how did they come from? They would see particles passing through a solid object and coming out the other side unchanged, like a ghost going through a wall.

• 35:21Rick Rubin?

  This doesn't work happily with the materialist worldview.

• 35:25Speaker 01

  No, not at all. No, it's completely contrary to it. They saw that particles long distances apart could coordinate their behavior, although there seemed to be no possible causal connection. They saw that you could change the behavior of an object just by looking at it, which suggests something which in other contexts is called psychokinesis. And as you've just said, classical science was completely ill-suited and unfitted to

• 36:03Speaker 01

  explain these phenomena, which would count as supernatural if they happened in the realm of human affairs. And that is why Niels Bohr and Heisenberg and Schrödinger and Pauli looked to the Kabbalah, to Indian mysticism, to Rosicrucianism, to find new models of thought and new forms of consciousness. They looked to alchemy to try to understand how just looking at a particle could change its behavior.

• 36:43Speaker 01

  This way of looking at things reached a crisis in the Second World War. Because of Hitler, many great scientists fled from Germany and other parts of Europe, which were under threat. In the early 20th century, most of the great scientists were German and they were also German Jews. And it's interesting to speculate that if Hitler hadn't been anti-Semitic, the international language of science today would probably be German.

• 37:17Rick Rubin?

  Interesting.

• 37:18Speaker 01

  But they fled some to England, most of them to America. And some of them knew that Heisenberg, who had chosen not to leave, had chosen to stay despite the things he knew were going on. They knew that Heisenberg was helping the Nazis to develop the atomic bomb. And they knew that if Hitler had the atomic bomb first, that would be curtains. Einstein and others wrote to the American president and said, look, you've got to fund

• 38:02Speaker 01

  us to make an atomic bomb first. And that is how the Manhattan Project started. And it was led by, of course, J. Robert Oppenheimer.

• 38:15Rick Rubin?

  It sounds a lot like the AI race now.

• 38:17Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 38:18Rick Rubin?

  We, we need to develop faster than China.

• 38:20Speaker 01

  It is, it's very like that. It's very like that. And there are other esoteric parallels we can go into, I think.

• 38:26Rick Rubin?

  When I hear you describe this group of German scientists, I'm hearing that at that point in time, science had become supernatural.

• 38:35Speaker 01

  Yeah, that is, that is right. And it was about to get a lot more supernatural. Oppenheimer was a very, was a very weird guy and I really enjoyed the film. But the film obviously needed Oppenheimer to be a hero so that we could root for him. But he lived a life of barely suppressed mania. He tried to kill people on two separate occasions.

• 39:00Rick Rubin?

  Really?

• 39:01Speaker 01

  Yeah. He was on holiday with a friend in, in Paris. And when that friend told him he planned to get married, Oppenheimer made a very serious attempt to strangle him.

• 39:14Speaker 01

  He was working as a post-grad student in Cambridge under a physicist who would later win the Nobel Prize for his contribution to inventing the atom bomb. This physicist didn't reflect back to Oppenheimer his own estimate of his abilities. And Oppenheimer injected an apple with cyanide and gave it to the professor, which luckily he didn't eat, but there was a huge scandal. And Oppenheimer's parents had to come and sort it out with the college authorities. I've no idea if any money changed hands. But, you know, here was another very strange man.

• 39:59Speaker 01

  And at the same time that the Manhattan Project was in progress, there were some English magicians, Aleister Crowley and others, who were performing magical ceremonies in Ashdown Forest and New Forest to try to keep Hitler at bay.

• 40:22Rick Rubin?

  Is that widely known?

• 40:24Speaker 01

  Yes, it is, it is. Gerald Gardner, the founder of Wicca, was also involved in that. But a much deeper and more effective form of magic was taking place in the Manhattan Project. Because what Oppenheimer, John von Neumann, and the others were doing was that they were taking these supernatural phenomena in the underworld and finding ways to coax them up into the realm of human affairs and amplify them. So they were like magicians in a story by Lovecraft, summoning up monsters from the deep.

• 41:08Speaker 01

  And the result was Hiroshima.

• 41:13Rick Rubin?

  And Oppenheimer famously says it.

• 41:17Speaker 01

  Yes, yes. I have become the destroyer of worlds, yes. So science then and now, as you say with AI, brings these supernatural phenomena into the realm of human affairs on a very large scale.

• 41:36Speaker 01

  And they can potentially bring enormous benefits. And they have. But they also take us to a crossroads.

• 41:46Rick Rubin?

  They are dangerous tools.

• 41:48Speaker 01

  They're very dangerous, yes, yes. In esoteric tradition, in the mystery schools of the ancient world and the secret societies, a lot of care was always taken so that the powers that people gained through their practices would never outrun their moral and spiritual development. But I think that what we see in the world today is not that. That the enormous power resides in the hands of very few people. And we don't know

• 42:32Speaker 01

  how moral and spiritual their intentions are.

• 42:47Speaker 03

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• 44:15Rick Rubin?

  Why was secrecy always such a big part of the mystery schools and the early esoteric traditions?

• 44:23Speaker 01

  I think it was partly because it enabled the people who were initiated to have powers which they could wield for good or ill. I think it was also a very delicate process. So the mystery schools in Greece and Rome were in buildings which were near the great temples, some parts of which were open to the populace. But nobody was allowed in them unless they were candidates for initiation. They were a bit like Freemasonic lodges in that people knew they were there, but almost nobody knew what went on inside them.

• 45:05Speaker 01

  And out of the Greek mystery schools, which initiated most of the great writers and artists and philosophers we know about, came great changes in human consciousness. Out of the mystery schools came mathematics, geometry, philosophy. Greek drama was the development of the enactment of the deeds of the gods which took place in the mystery schools.

• 45:43Rick Rubin?

  So they were plays for the gods?

• 45:46Speaker 01

  So if you were initiated into a mystery school, after a long period of instruction, during which you would be asked to fast, probably, you would be taken by priests wearing masks, sometimes animal masks, down very long corridors. You would be asked to drink something called the Waters of Forgetfulness, which...

• 46:17Rick Rubin?

  Would that be a chemical?

• 46:19Speaker 01

  People have always speculated, you know, what were the hallucinogens in the Waters of Forgetfulness? You would have to take part in ceremonial and sacrificial rites.

• 46:32Rick Rubin?

  Which were not unusual at that time, anyway.

• 46:35Speaker 01

  No, this would be in a confined space, in a chamber. You might be bathed in blood.

• 46:42Rick Rubin?

  To us, it sounds really foreign.

• 46:44Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 46:44Rick Rubin?

  But in a time when ritual offering was common

• 46:49Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 46:49Rick Rubin?

  in religion.

• 46:50Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 46:51Rick Rubin?

  It wasn't so foreign in that world.

• 46:54Speaker 01

  No, that's absolutely right. Sculpture was another unfolding of the human spirit that came out of the mystery schools. And sculptures were originally conceived of as physical bodies for an unembodied being to inhabit. And it was thought that the god could then speak to you through the statue. So the candidate for initiation was experiencing all these sort of things. They were going further and further down into the earth. At one point, they might be shoved into a snake pit. They might be confronted by monsters,

• 47:36Speaker 01

  a giant snake, apparently with a human head. There's one account of a candidate being attacked by hordes of demons. So they were descending into what, in terms of our culture, we'd call hell. And it was getting darker and darker. Then, when the darkness was complete, they would suddenly feel a blow across the forehead which knocked them over. And at this point, they sincerely believed they were going to die because they had sworn on pain of death in the process of instruction, that they renounced all wickedness, that they were totally good-hearted, and they had told the whole truth.

• 48:21Speaker 01

  And as they're lying there, they're thinking, ah, well, perhaps I didn't. And perhaps I'm about to die. And that's very important because initiation is a form of rebirth, of being born again. And that's where Christian ideas are being born again.

• 48:42Rick Rubin?

  Is that where baptism comes from?

• 48:44Speaker 01

  Yes, yes, it's part of that tradition. And at that moment, when they were in the depths of hell and thought they were about to be extinguished, priests would come again and lead them upwards into a huge chamber of light where they met shining beings they believed to be the gods. And it's said that once you've been through this process, it was impossible to doubt life after death. It wasn't just that they were taught information. The idea was that this would make them enlightened beings so that they could be leaders of the nation in a better way.

• 49:28Rick Rubin?

  Would the Greek mystery schools descended from the Egyptian mystery schools?

• 49:33Speaker 01

  Yes, I think they were. And behind them, there may have been Atlantean mystery schools and Lamyrian mystery schools.

• 49:45Speaker 01

  Those mystery schools existing at a time before matter was fixed in the form we have today.

• 49:53Rick Rubin?

  Have there always been mystery schools around the world?

• 49:56Speaker 01

  I think there have, yes. There are two kind of two different schools of interpretation. Because some people would see initiations in African tribes, for example, of the sort that anthropologists studied in the 19th and early 20th century as being the sort of primary form of initiation. There is an esoteric tradition which says it's the other way around and that those tribal forms of initiation are sort of partial memories of much more formal initiations that took place in Atlantis, say.

• 50:41Rick Rubin?

  Who are some of the other scientists you cover besides Oppenheimer?

• 50:45Speaker 01

  My favorite scientist is Wolfgang Pauli. He was the the generation after Einstein and Niels Bohr. He is probably best known for the Pauli Exclusion Principle, which dictates that no two particles in the same state can be joined together. What arises from that is that the universe is full of a vast array of different types of molecules. If it wasn't for this exclusion principle, we would just be living in a soup without any bits in it.

• 51:26Rick Rubin?

  Could it be as simple as just positive and negative, though?

• 51:30Speaker 01

  Well, that is that is one example of it, yes. Einstein said of Pauli that he was his spiritual heir. I think he was the brightest of the next generation. And he had quite an emotional life. His mother committed suicide when he was in his twenties because she discovered that her husband, Pauli's father, had been having an affair. This was made worse for Pauli because he'd just written a letter to his mother in which he said, "I'm afraid I can't love you in the way you want me to love you because I'm a scientist and a very cerebral sort of fellow."

• 52:14Speaker 01

  So he felt really guilty about that. So he was quite a spiky individual. He was sort of famous for his his put downs, even though he was hypersensitive to the things people said to him. He went looking for love in the red lights district. He was often very drunk and he'd get thrown out and badly beaten up sometimes. And he fell in love with a very beautiful nightclub singer. And he married her and took her back to the university, where she was very quickly unfaithful to him.

• 52:57Speaker 01

  And Pauli said, "Well, I could understand if it was a matador, but a chemist." And he also suffered from something which became known as the Pauli Effect. Scientific equipment and other things like vases would often shatter and break and malfunction in his presence. And one Nobel Prize winning physicist banned Pauli from ever visiting his lab.

• 53:30Rick Rubin?

  So like he would get around electronic equipment and it would malfunction?

• 53:34Speaker 01

  Yes, and sometimes explode.

• 53:36Rick Rubin?

  And and glass would break in his presence?

• 53:39Speaker 01

  He was very depressed by this because what was actually happening was that he would feel this buildup of intense darkness within him. And it was when this reached a pitch of intensity that these things would happen. And it was because of that he went to seek treatment from Carl Gustav Jung. And they became firm friends. And they worked together on something which has become a concept which has become very important in spiritual circles, which is synchronicity. And it originated with an idea that Pauli knew

• 54:23Speaker 01

  his friend Schrödinger had talked about. And that is the idea referred to earlier of particles coordinating their behavior, even though they were not attached and even quite far away. At that stage, I think it was 1935 that Schrödinger first wrote about this. He had this idea that something like this might be possible. He wrote it in a letter to Einstein, I think it was in 1935. Einstein didn't believe it at all. He thought it was fuji. And for a long time, people tried to reproduce this phenomenon in the lab to create it.

• 55:08Speaker 01

  And eventually they did. And they found that they could make particles coordinate their behavior over a number of miles. And then people began to think, "Well, actually, perhaps we don't need to create it. Perhaps it happens spontaneously all the time," which is now what physicists believe. So that a physical object, a cup on a table, we might think is supported there by the table beneath it. New physics would say there are other factors necessary. It is attached to other things very far away.

• 55:52Rick Rubin?

  Is that entanglement?

• 55:54Speaker 01

  That is entanglement, that is quantum entanglement. And quantum entanglement goes a long way to explaining why things in the universe are shaped in the way they are and why they behave as they do. Quantum entanglement, leading physicists now think, is what knits the universe together. So we've come a long way from that kind of gleam in Schrödinger's eye. What Pauli and Jung were concerned with was trying to work out how this entanglement might play a part in human affairs.

• 56:36Speaker 01

  Might entanglement, for example, explain mind reading? Might it be the case that because of entanglement, something I feel very deeply materially affects things that are happening out there in the world? So it's about a meaningful connection, which obviously in terms of classical physics is completely impossible. Jung gives an example of it. He was giving this woman therapy. She had a very narrow, materialistic view of life.

• 57:17Speaker 01

  She found her life meaningless, and this was painful to her in the therapy session. She was describing how she had had a dream in which a scarab beetle had appeared, a golden scarab beetle. And just at that moment, a beetle started knocking on the window next to them. And Jung was able to catch the beetle, show it to her and say, "Look, here is your scarab beetle." And so the universe was telling her something. The universe was saying, "Yes, there is meaning."

• 57:58Speaker 01

  Now, Pauli was obsessed by the number 137.

• 58:04Rick Rubin?

  Why 137?

• 58:06Speaker 01

  One over 137 is what in physics is called the fine structure constant. And it's one of those things that has to be in exactly that proportion for the universe we live in to be as it is. It is also a very important number in the Kabbalah. And so here Pauli was again making these connections between ancient spiritual traditions and science.

• 58:36Rick Rubin?

  Did he know it was important in the Kabbalah or no?

• 58:38Speaker 01

  Yes, he was deeply read in the Kabbalah, yeah.

• 58:40Rick Rubin?

  And why is it important in the Kabbalah? What's the meaning of 137?

• 58:44Speaker 01

  Well, in in the Kabbalah, it is the number of the name of God. And it is the number that describes the way the universe is working together. So it's it's it's a very similar concept. Pauli used to see this number wherever he went. And when he was dying, I think he died, he died young. I think he was 56, he had pancreatic cancer. He was lying in his hospital room and people were coming to visit him to say goodbye. And he suddenly noticed the number of the room, and it was 137. And so the universe was telling him something on one level. I suppose it was probably quite grim.

• 59:26Speaker 01

  It was telling him, "You are going to die." But it was also telling him, "Yes, there is something beyond," as mystical traditions teach.

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• 1:01:11Rick Rubin?

  Since classical physics and new physics are at odds, is classical physics now considered obsolete, no longer taught?

• 1:01:22Speaker 01

  I think the sad thing is that the academic establishment, although it would, of course, it cannot deny what new physics has revealed, it still has its head in the world of classical physics.

• 1:01:44Rick Rubin?

  Odd.

• 1:01:45Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's very odd. When I worked in publishing, I used to publish Rupert Sheldrake, who is a fantastically interesting biologist. He was a fellow of Clare College, Cambridge.

• 1:01:58Rick Rubin?

  Morphic Residence.

• 1:01:59Speaker 01

  Morphic Residence, yes. And because he published a book on that subject, which they thought was woo-woo, the whole of academia turned its back on him. Similarly, there's a man called Brian Josephson, who in his twenties discovered something which came to be known as the Josephson Junction. And this shows how, at the quantum level, a small particle can disrupt and be used to control a stream of particles. And it's only because of that we have the computer technology we have today. He made all that possible. But he joined the Society for Psychic Research.

• 1:02:45Speaker 01

  And again, the whole of academia turned its back on him. Grants were canceled. Invitations to conferences and lectures were canceled. And, you know, it was very hard for the guy.

• 1:03:00Rick Rubin?

  It's a real closed-minded, living-in-the-past attitude.

• 1:03:05Speaker 01

  It is, yeah, deeply conservative. Surely, these people must have the same spiritual impulses we all have. Why are they denying them? We were brought up believing that matter is more real, that physical objects are the yardstick of what is real, and that there was a material universe for a very long time before mind or consciousness arose in this planet. And when this planet can sustain human life no more, if we haven't found a way to migrate,

• 1:03:50Speaker 01

  then consciousness and mind will come to an end. So consciousness and mind is a very small, brief island in a vast ocean of matter.

• 1:04:05Speaker 01

  The other view, which says that mind and ideas are what is real, that is the view that everyone throughout history believed in without question. That is how people experience the world.

• 1:04:25Rick Rubin?

  Yeah, it wasn't either-or. That was the understanding.

• 1:04:27Speaker 01

  Yes. People couldn't even conceive of the other way around. I think there were a couple of philosophers in the Roman era who devised a theory of atomism, but it was only a handful of people. And until the scientific method and empiricism and materialism came to dominate, everyone believed that the material world is a small, very temporary island in a vast ocean of mind. And that materialistic view became more and more widespread

• 1:05:09Speaker 01

  until, in the 20th century, it came to dominate. And we now find it hard to imagine why anyone would believe the other thing. One of the reasons I've written this new book is because I think that the belief in materialism will prove to be just a temporary blip because of what is happening in physics and information technology.

• 1:05:40Rick Rubin?

  It's a very limited view of things. Idealism is a grand view of the universe.

• 1:05:46Speaker 01

  Yes, and I think that we experience things which couldn't be true if materialist science explained everything there is. But we're kind of conditioned to screen it out.

• 1:06:01Rick Rubin?

  How does science explain something like love?

• 1:06:04Speaker 01

  If materialism is true, then it cannot be the case that we meet someone, fall in love with them, and that love is meant to be. Because that kind of meaning doesn't exist in a materialist universe.

• 1:06:27Rick Rubin?

  In a materialist universe, is there any meaning?

• 1:06:31Speaker 01

  There's only the meaning that we choose to invest in things. So that in soccer, for example, if you kick a ball between the goalposts, that means a goal. But that meaning isn't inherent in the universe. We have put a mental construct around that activities which gives it meaning. In the materialist universe, there is no intrinsic meaning. And other phenomena, I think that we probably mind-read all the time, but we're conditioned not to notice it. I mind-read a lot.

• 1:07:15Speaker 01

  I think if I say something, if I'm trying to explain my ideas to someone and they don't believe it, I kind of hear a clunk. I can see a visor go down behind the eyes. And I think there's a way to test it, which is on the telephone. If you're on the phone to someone and you're asking a very important question, where the answer will mean a lot to you, I think you should listen to the silence before you get the response. If I ask, "Do you still love me?" or "What do the results of the test say?"

• 1:07:56Speaker 01

  If you listen to the quality of that silence, you know the answer before you get it.

• 1:08:03Rick Rubin?

  That sounds right.

• 1:08:04Speaker 01

  I think that is right.

• 1:08:05Rick Rubin?

  I think that's right. I think we have a knowingness that we don't always embrace.

• 1:08:11Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:08:12Rick Rubin?

  And maybe we've been taught not only not to embrace it, but to ignore it.

• 1:08:16Speaker 01

  I think that's right. And I think we all experience premonitions. And one of the exciting things about new science is that it shows how that might happen as described in the language of science.

• 1:08:32Rick Rubin?

  Tell me about philosophy versus science.

• 1:08:35Speaker 01

  Science and philosophy.

• 1:08:39Speaker 01

  Have always, up until the 1960s, been very deeply intertwined. For example, the great scientists of the early 20th century, Einstein and the founders of quantum mechanics, Niels Bohr, Heisenberg, Schrödinger, Pauli. These were very well, widely read people in literature and philosophy. And they were all concerned to work out the wider philosophical implications

• 1:09:23Speaker 01

  of their ideas for how we understand the world and how we live. And then what happened? I think it's probably happened after the war, and it may be to do with Hiroshima and Nagasaki. I think that people became shy of asking the wider questions about the implications of the science. And by the time you get to the 60s and to people like Richard Feynman, who was a brilliant, brilliant physicist, very well-loved today,

• 1:10:05Speaker 01

  even by especially male physicists, an inspirational figure. He said that the questions philosophy asks are goofy. That was his word for it. He believed that, and Stephen Hawking, who, after him, believed the same thing. They said that science is on the brink of answering all the big questions. If there are any others, they're not worth asking. And there was this catchphrase, which arose at that time, which went, "Shut up and calculate." And what they meant is,

• 1:10:48Speaker 01

  "Keep focusing on the nuts and bolts aspect. Don't ask the bigger philosophy of life questions. They're meaningless." So at that point, scientists were trying to do away with philosophy in the way they thought they'd already done away with religion.

• 1:11:12Rick Rubin?

  Do you think it's because science is something that they can control whereas philosophy is sort of beyond control?

• 1:11:20Speaker 01

  I'm not sure whether science is ever controllable because I suppose the history of science shows something that they were perhaps ignoring, which is the one thing we can be certain of in science, is that the current theory will always be overturned.

• 1:11:40Rick Rubin?

  Yes.

• 1:11:41Speaker 01

  And the history of modern science shows that those overturnings came from very unexpected places. But yes, they certainly wanted to exercise control. And the problem with materialism and scientism is that it leaves you with a very narrow understanding of what the good things in life are. The good things in life are goods. They're material things. They're power, they're sex, they're money. And the higher things in life get screened out.

• 1:12:20Rick Rubin?

  Do you think that math is an overlay on the world we know and see and interact with? Or is math first? And the world grows out of math?

• 1:12:36Speaker 01

  Well, I think very much the latter, yes. In the second half of the 20th century, physics became very maths-led. And that was largely because of the influence of one of the founders of quantum mechanics called Paul Dirac. And he noticed that he would come across immensely complex, beautiful mathematical patterns, considered entirely in the mathematical universe. And he would then find that these patterns exist in nature.

• 1:13:19Speaker 01

  So he instituted a mathematics-first programme, which really drove physics in the second half of the 20th century. And one of the most interesting aspects of that was that people like Dirac, and then today Roger Penrose, who was Stephen Hawking's best buddy, worked with him on discovering great discoveries in the field of black holes. Roger Penrose and others have described how these mathematical patterns come to them. They don't invent them.

• 1:14:01Speaker 01

  They don't methodically put them together. They appear whole and fully formed.

• 1:14:08Rick Rubin?

  They discover them.

• 1:14:09Speaker 01

  They discover them, yes. And Penrose compares this process to an explorer coming across a range of mountains that no one has ever seen before. They pre-existed their discovery by a human being. And perhaps they pre-existed the material universe.

• 1:14:36Rick Rubin?

  So in some ways, these ideas are never ours.

• 1:14:42Speaker 01

  I think that's right, yes. They're never ours. And I think they probably emanate from other intelligent entities. I think that the esoteric interpretation of what Dirac and Penrose experienced is that a great thought being swims into their private mental space. And it is then their job to throw a net on it and to pull it into the realm of human affairs. And by doing that, they have made extraordinary improvements

• 1:15:27Speaker 01

  to human life, to the way we live. And I think they're also bringing spiritual enlightenment as well. We're just beginning to realise that, perhaps. So what Dirac and Penrose are doing is the same thing that great spiritual and religious leaders and great artists have done down the millennia.

• 1:15:47Rick Rubin?

  It seems like the way science happens and the way art happens historically have always been parallel and related.

• 1:15:57Speaker 01

  I think that's true. I think it is to do with an area of ideas I know you're very interested in, which is that, again, it arises from materialism. It arises from the fact that we're, our spirit is sunk into these fleshly bodies. And it means that we have an exaggerated idea of the importance of our individual self.

• 1:16:31Speaker 05

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• 1:17:14Speaker 05

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• 1:17:57Speaker 05

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• 1:18:47Rick Rubin?

  Tell me a little bit more about you as an editor and a publisher.

• 1:18:52Speaker 01

  I had a fantastic time working as an editor and publisher. I think I was very lucky to be doing it when I did because up till then, British publishing certainly had been a matter of a number of small family firms. And if you're working in publishing and you were not part of the family, or if you didn't have a private income, you would be very poor. But just as I started working in publishing, it became big business. And publishers were bought up by people like Rupert Murdoch. And I think that I was able to meet people

• 1:19:36Speaker 01

  from so many different walks of life. And if you're editing someone's book, particularly if it's an autobiography, you get to know them really well. And sometimes I think you know things about them that no one else does. And that was very good for me, I think, because if it hadn't been for that, you know, working with rock stars and actors and soldiers and spies and criminals, I loved all of that because I was able to then see the world from so many different points of view. If I hadn't been doing that, if I'd just tried to make a living as a writer, I would have just kept on circling around this area of esoteric ideas. So it was tremendously broadening.

• 1:20:21Speaker 01

  It was also great fun because you were working with these people who had quite a high level of erudition often, but also had some commercial nous. And we just had such fun. It was a bit like Mad Men, but with not so smart suits.

• 1:20:39Rick Rubin?

  Besides Rupert Sheldrake, who were some of the other authors that you edited?

• 1:20:44Speaker 01

  The books that people wanted me to edit and publish would be Rockstar's Memoir. So I published Donovan, for example. I loved Donovan as a child. Pete Townsend, Eric Clapton, Holly Johnson of Frankie Goes to Hollywood. I'm still friends with some of these guys. I published quite a lot of military stuff. There was an SAS hero called Chris Ryan, who started a trend of special forces thrillers, which did tremendously well. I published a guy called Sir Richard Shiref, who had been very high up in NATO.

• 1:21:26Speaker 01

  He wrote a book predicting that Russia was going to invade Ukraine in exactly the way they have. Comedians was a huge, huge favorite of mine because I think comedians have a care for language, which is as great as any poet. Because if you're on stage in front of 5,000 people and the words are not in the right order, you're going to suffer. So those were the sorts of books they wanted me to do. And all the time I was trying to slip in these books that they weren't quite so keen on. So there was Graham Hancock, who is still a close friend.

• 1:22:07Speaker 01

  And there's this extraordinary Irish woman called Lorna Byrne, who I met just as I was finishing The Secret History of the World. And she's one of those people, a bit like Tesla, who has a form of consciousness which is very, very different to most people's. And she sees a whole ecosystem of spiritual beings, including angels. But unlike other angel bothering ladies, she doesn't have to struggle to see them occasionally. They are there for her all the time. And if she was sitting here, she would tell you

• 1:22:50Speaker 01

  who your guardian angel is and who the other angels who help you are.

• 1:22:56Rick Rubin?

  Did she write a book?

• 1:22:57Speaker 01

  Yes, I commissioned her book called Angels in My Hair, which was a huge international bestseller. It's her autobiography. And I feel blessed to have known her. I met her just as I was finishing The Secret History of the World. And she told me that everything in it is true. She sort of made a couple of mistakes, but basically, essentially, everything in it is true. She is very dyslexic. She hasn't read a book in her life. She just sees these things directly. And I think that if there is a disaster going on somewhere in the world, she knows about it and she feels it.

• 1:23:42Speaker 01

  And she feels this is part of her role to take some of that suffering on.

• 1:23:47Rick Rubin?

  How did you come to meet her?

• 1:23:48Speaker 01

  She was living in quite hard circumstances in Ireland. She'd had a really rough life. She barely went to school. She married, but her husband died soon afterwards. And so she was bringing out three children on her own.

• 1:24:07Speaker 01

  And the archangel Saint Michael told her she had to write a book. And she said, well, look, this is impossible. How am I in rural Ireland? How am I gonna? And they said, well, somebody will come and help you. And a woman called Jean Callanan, who came to consult her and ask her about her own problems, took a copy of the Artist and Writer's Yearbook. Basically, it's a list of all the publishers and editors in books and in newspapers and magazines. And Jean read out all the names of the editors. And when she got to my name, that's him.

• 1:24:51Rick Rubin?

  Yeah.

• 1:24:51Speaker 01

  And I do believe that no one else in publishing would have taken this on at that time. It would have just been too weird for them. She and Jean came over to see me. And obviously, I wouldn't normally see someone like that, but something prompted me. But I thought, I know, I'm gonna see them in the canteen on the ground floor. Because if I allow them up into my office, I'm never going to get rid of them. And Lorna was there. She was wearing her sort of Irish country clothes. She looked a bit like a country mouse, kind of blinking in the light. I don't think she'd been, she's certainly never been abroad. I don't know if she'd been to a big city before. And I was sort of handed this scrap of paper with a few ideas on it.

• 1:25:34Speaker 01

  And I don't know, something prompted me. Lorna would say I was listening. And I said, but this isn't gonna work. These ideas have got to unfold out of a narrative. You've got to tell your life's story. And that's how it started. And we've been close friends ever since. And I sort of feel blessed and protected by her.

• 1:26:22Speaker 06

  Tetragrammatin is a podcast. Tetragrammatin is a website. Tetragrammatin is a whole world of knowledge.

• 1:26:37Speaker 05

  What may fall within the sphere of Tetragrammatin?

• 1:26:42Speaker 05

  Counterculture? Tetragrammatin. Sacred geometry? Tetragrammatin. The avant-garde? Tetragrammatin. Generative art? Tetragrammatin. The tarot? Tetragrammatin. Out-of-print music? Tetragrammatin. Biodynamic? Tetragrammatin. Graphic design? Tetragrammatin. Mythology and magic? Tetragrammatin. Obscure film? Tetragrammatin. Beach culture? Tetragrammatin. Esoteric lectures? Tetragrammatin. Off-the-grid living? Tetragrammatin. Alt spirituality? Tetragrammatin. The canon of fine objects? Tetragrammatin. Muscle cars? Tetragrammatin. Ancient wisdom for a new age.

• 1:27:25Speaker 05

  Upon entering, experience the artwork of the day. Take a breath and see where you are drawn.