What To Do After You’ve Done Wrong | Ask DS

Seneca should have owned up to it. We’ve talked about this. He was 13 years in Nero’s service before he broke with the clearly broken emperor. It is to Seneca’s credit that he walked away. More to his credit still that he was at least partly involved in the Piso Conspiracy to unseat Nero, as we talked about recently (and is also told at length in Lives of the Stoics). But where in Seneca’s voluminous writings is there anything about taking responsibility for his role in such a corrupt and evil regime?---And in today's Ask Daily Stoic, Ryan answers questions during an audience Q&A session after his talk to a collection of corporate leaders. Topics covered include how to reconcile self-confidence with humility, what Ryan believes the meaning of his is, tips on putting your emotions away, and more.💵 Visit dailystoic.com/wealth to sign up for The Wealthy Stoic wealth management course today.✉️ Sign up for the Daily Stoic email: https://dailystoic.com/dailyemail🏛 Check out the Daily Stoic Store for Stoic inspired products, signed books, and more.📱 Follow us: Instagram, Twitter, YouTube, TikTok, FacebookSee Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info. 📢 Share | ⚙️ Manage Subscription

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:02Ryan Holiday?

  Welcome to the Daily Stoic Podcast, where each day we read a passage of ancient wisdom designed to help you in your everyday life. While on Thursdays, we not only read the daily meditation, but we answer some questions from listeners and fellow Stoics who are trying to apply this philosophy just as you are. Some of these come from my talks. Some of these come from Zoom sessions that we do with Daily Stoic Life members or as part of the challenges. Some of them are from interactions I have on the street when there happened to be someone there recording. But thank you for listening, and we hope this is of use to you.

• 0:45Ryan Holiday?

  What to do after you've done wrong? Seneca should have owned up to it. We've talked about this. He was 13 years in Nero's service before he broke with the clearly broken emperor. It is to Seneca's credit that he walked away. And more to his credit was the fact that he was at least partly involved in the Piso conspiracy to unseat Nero, as I talk about at length in Lives of the Stoics. But where in Seneca's voluminous writings is there anything about taking responsibility for his role in such a corrupt and evil regime? Sure, Seneca's violent plays do dance around the topic, sort of subtweeting his former boss, but Seneca could have and should have written more.

• 1:28Ryan Holiday?

  Generations could have learned from his example. A worse Stoic in this regard is the infamous Diotymus, also profiled in Lives of the Stoics, who, caught up in some sort of philosophical feud, fabricated a number of letters designed to destroy the reputation of his Epicurean rivals. He was caught, but the historical record shows us only a defiant Diotymus. We hear nothing of an apology, nothing of an attempt to pick up the pieces, to make right, to help others learn from what was, although inexcusable, a bit of human folly. We all make mistakes. We all get caught up in things. We strike back at people who have struck at us. We are tempted, blinded, led astray. Seneca certainly was. It happens.

• 2:13Ryan Holiday?

  What matters most, though, is what happens next, what we do after we have done wrong, how we try to make it right. Do we take responsibility? Or do we take refuge in denial? Do we throw ourselves a pity party? Do we rage against cancel culture? Do we get to work on ourselves? Or better yet, get to work making this less about ourselves? And more about the people or cause we have harmed?

• 2:47Speaker 01

  You talk about having cautious self-confidence as a form of power. But how do you reconcile that self-confidence with the humility you need to be able to iterate? And recognize that you have shortcomings, that you need to evolve?

• 3:07Speaker 02

  We have to see it as a spectrum. So on the one end, there's like crippling self-doubt. There's imposter syndrome. There's feelings of worthlessness and inadequacy. On the other end, there's ego, right?

• 3:19Speaker 01

  Right.

• 3:20Speaker 02

  But weirdly, these, it's actually not a spectrum. It's more of a horseshoe because they're very similar. It's an obsession with the self and thinking that everyone's watching you and cares about you. And when they're not, everyone's busy with themselves, right? But I think in between these two points is what we would call confidence.

• 3:39Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 3:40Speaker 02

  So confidence to me is an understanding of where one has weaknesses and flaws and vulnerabilities. But also simultaneously awareness of what our strengths are, what our assets are, what our capabilities are. And that to me, that confidence is important. Ego is the enemy, right? Ego gets in the way. Ego makes you complacent. Ego makes you an asshole, right? Ego makes you none of the things that people like working with. And certainly none of the things that sustainable success depends on. Conversely, sort of cowardice and doubt and all this sort of, I'm not good enough. That makes it hard to do stuff. But in the middle there to me is what you really want to cultivate, which is a strong sense of self.

• 4:23Speaker 02

  A strong sense of what you've got, what you're put here to do, what you're going to be able to do. And it should be based on what you've done before, right?

• 4:37Speaker 02

  We've just lived through a historically significant event that will be written about in books for hundreds of years, right? It's akin to World War II or, you know, economic crises and wars and all the like, we just lived through a thing that our children and grandchildren are going to ask us about. And we made it, right? We're still here. We adapted, we improvised, we overcame, we're still here. And that should give us some sense of our ability to deal with future obstacles and difficulties, just as all the things that you've gone through in your life, you've learned from. And you can use that now with what you're going through.

• 5:22Speaker 02

  So to me, this sense of like, I know where I come from, I know what I've done, I know what I bring to the table, that's a really, really empowering thing. When I sat down to write my first book, I didn't think, I'm a genius, this will be easy, of course I could do it. That would have been ego, because I was doing something that I'd never done before. But what I did bring to that was a sort of cautious sense of, I'm not a quitter. I've practiced, you know, I want this very badly, I have good mentors and advisors, I know how to ask for help, like we're talking about, I know how to ask questions, I know I'm good at problem solving, I know that if I don't quit, I can get through this, right?

• 6:07Speaker 02

  That's what you want to bring, I think, to life's problems and difficulties, and also just, you know, life itself.

• 6:14Speaker 01

  Let me extrapolate that into a corporate setting, where, you know, maybe you're an industry dominant player that has been able to deliver consistent results above anyone in the competition. That's what I mean with, you know, maybe having too much confidence, it can turn into ego.

• 6:31Speaker 02

  Well, that can be, yeah, sure. Like when you think about like prize fighting, right? The underdog beats the overconfident champion.

• 6:40Speaker 01

  Right.

• 6:41Speaker 02

  But then what happens? They become the overconfident champion. That's what ego is. Ego makes us complacent. It makes us entitled. We don't do the work, right? We don't sense or see our vulnerabilities, right? The precisely the thing that our competitors are, you know, laser focused on. So you have to have that humility, that awareness of where you can get better, of what you're not doing well. A desire, willingness to change and adapt and be something new, to reinvent yourself. You have to be willing to do that. And the people that endure and last, that's what they have. So sure, you could look, you could look at yourself as the, you know, the dominant player in your space. And that could be sort of a weakness because you're tired.

• 7:24Speaker 02

  But you could also look at, how long has this company been in business?

• 7:27Speaker 01

  Eighty years.

• 7:28Speaker 02

  Eighty years. Think of what you were eighty years ago. Think of what you were ten years ago, twenty years ago. And think of what's happened in the world, in this country, and in all the individual markets you've been. Think of the, just the sheer magnitude of stuff that you have endured, that you've adjusted to, that you've figured out. The technological changes, the demographic changes, the market change. Like if there's one thing this company should be competent in, it's your ability to adapt and evolve and change. And so when we talk about perspective, it's not just like, oh, I zoom out, it's not so bad.

• 8:09Speaker 02

  But it's like, what assets or traits do you value in yourself, right? Is it, we're great, we're going to stay in business because we've got the most resources? Well, that's probably, you know, a bad handle to grab. But if you go, no, we're the ones with a culture of change and adaptation and like, or just like, we're survivors, like we're hard to kill.

• 8:34Speaker 01

  Are we survivors? Yeah.

• 8:37Speaker 02

  That's an adaptive like growth mindset that I think makes you better.

• 8:44Speaker 01

  I love it. Ryan, in about 2018, you wrote an article about 12 questions that will change your life. And the last one is, what is the meaning of your life? And with your trajectory and everything that you've accomplished, I would love for you to share, what do you think is the meaning of your life up to now?

• 9:08Speaker 02

  It's interesting. So Viktor Frankl survives three different concentration camps. He loses his wife and his family in the Holocaust. The worst things a person can go through. He sort of comes out of it, he's a psychologist, and he's sort of asking himself, like, you know, what is the meaning of life? This is the, you know, essential question of the human, what is the meaning of life? And he ends up kind of flipping it on his head. And he says, perhaps it's life that's asking us the question. And we answer it in the things that we do, right? Like how you spend your life, what you do, answers whether it is meaningful or not. And I think about that a lot. The Stoics say acta non verba, like actions, not words.

• 9:52Speaker 02

  So obviously, you know, writing and it's a lot of words. But I try to think more about like, what am I doing? Where, how am I making a positive difference in the community that I live? You know, and the people around, how am I making a positive difference there? So I guess telling you guys about my decision to make a bookstore, or open a bookstore. I certainly wasn't opening a bookstore because I hope to make a lot of money, right?

• 10:16Speaker 01

  Right.

• 10:16Speaker 02

  It's pretty much the worst idea you could possibly have. But it was something like, I've gotten so much out of books and ideas. And, you know, I discovered the Stoics in a bookstore. And I thought it would be really cool to pay that forward. And so I feel like a lot of the meaning that I derive from my life is. Not in writing itself, but in taking ideas that have been personally beneficial to me and bringing them or spreading them to other people. So I, I feel like I have an ability to communicate these ancient ideas in a modern way. And like my, that's, that's what gets me out of bed in the morning is the ability to do that.

• 11:00Speaker 02

  Knowing from my own experience, like what kind of impact those ideas can have on a person. So I, I feel like, you know, if you're doing what you do because, you know, you want to be powerful or important or

• 11:14Speaker 01

  Those are not the good reasons.

• 11:15Speaker 02

  Those are not, those are not good whys. Those are not good motivations. And, and just as like anger, I'm going to prove these people wrong. Like these, that's bad fuel. But I think the more your fuel is about other people, like the more it's about delivering value for other people, making a positive difference in other people's lives. Uh, there's a sign at a park near my house and it just says, instead of saying like, no littering, clean up after yourself. It just says, leave this place better than you found it. And, and I, I love that.

• 11:48Speaker 01

  That really resonates, especially because our slogan, as you know, is mejor a tu vida, which is better your life. And I think it really rhymes well with everything that we've talked about. Um, I wanted to see if you had any questions for us and the public.

• 12:03Speaker 02

  Ooh, that's a good question. Um, I don't know, but what, what do you think I should ask?

• 12:10Speaker 01

  Um, well, how about the audience? Does anyone have any questions that they would like to ask?

• 12:14Speaker 03

  You just mentioned that it's important for you to put your emotions away. But that is, in my opinion, in my opinion, the hardest thing to do. So what are your recommendations in order to, to achieve putting your emotions away?

• 12:32Speaker 02

  I heard a great anecdote once. Someone was asking his grandfather, you know, "Did you ever fight with grandma?" And he said, "We never argued, but I took a lot of walks." And his point was that, you know, there's always points of disagreement. We have the emotions, but sometimes what we need is like the pause before we act on them. So when I was telling you about my day, I try to start my day with like a space for going outside, a little bit of space for reflection. I try to, this is one of the reasons I try to exercise every day. It's great for my physical health, but it's even better for my mental health.

• 13:12Speaker 02

  I want to work out those problems either in the gym, in the pages of a journal, you know, on the soles of my feet, rather than on the people around me or the problems that I have in front of me. I want to create space. So I think space is definitely one way to do it. I do think it's important. The Stoics aren't saying like, "Pretend you don't feel anything," or "stuff those emotions down." But I think it's about processing them or channeling them. Does that make sense? Like, I think if you're just like pretending you're not feeling anything, eventually that kind of comes exploding out. But if you can go, "Okay, well, why do I feel the way that I'm feeling? What is that based on? You know, what can I do about it?

• 13:54Speaker 02

  And then how can I make sure that I'm not reacting?" So again, go to the idea of anger, because I think anger is such a potent emotion. Being angry and doing something out of anger, we can make a big distinction there, right? Like, "I don't like that. That wasn't fair. That's upsetting. That's alarming." Any of the feelings that you have, right, they're here. But then the actions that we take, you know, while those feelings are roiling this up inside, you know, that's very different. So I try to give myself space to feel that emotion, even if that emotion is envy or, you know, I feel it. And then I, when I, before I take action, I try to go,

• 14:38Speaker 02

  you know, "Why am I doing this? Am I doing this because I've been feeling..." ...X, Y, or Z? Or is it because this is something that actually needs to be done? Or is constructive or helpful?

• 14:49Speaker 01

  Or I'm turning this obstacle into an opportunity?

• 14:51Speaker 02

  Yes. And sometimes provocative, annoying, frustrating. These are just opportunities for us to practice having those emotions. Or, you know, the opposite of the emotion. You know, somebody did something to you that wasn't fair, that wasn't right. This is a chance for you to practice patience or forgiveness. Or maybe it's an opportunity to stand up for yourself. You could see it however you want. But I think just making sure that you're not doing things in the full sway of that emotion is really, really important. Like, I've never lost my temper. And then, you know, like a day later, been like, I'm so glad I did that. That was so wonderful for everyone involved, including me. Right? You regret it.

• 15:34Speaker 02

  And so how do we try to interrupt that process is really important.

• 15:39Speaker 01

  Did that answer the question? Yes. Ryan, thank you so much for being here with us. I think we've learned a lot. And we have a five-step process as to how to turn obstacles into opportunities with your book, The Obstacle is the Way. Thank you, everybody, for being here with us today.

• 15:54Speaker 02

  Thank you, guys. Appreciate it.