Are Your Boundaries Killing Your Love Life (and Social Life)?

Have we optimized to the point of loneliness? We’re breaking down the question “Are my boundaries killing my love life?” and discuss whether a routine (and unwillingness to stray from it) could be impacting your ability to have fun, have friends, and date. We reminisce on millennial party culture and discuss how times and priorities have changed, offer solutions for an “over boundaried” life, and provide baby steps to getting out there more. We also discuss how a lot of today’s dating advice is hurting more than it’s helping. Before we get into the topic, Rayna gives a relationship status update, Ashley shows off her foster dog, we recap our summers, and unpack the Gen Z stare. Enjoy! Follow us on Instagram @girlsgottaeatpodcast, Ashley @ashhess, and Rayna @rayna.greenberg. Visit girlsgottaeat.com for more. Thank you to our partners this week: Noom: Start a GLP-1 program for $39 and have it delivered in as little as 7 days at https://noom.com. The Secret Lives of Mormon Wives: Watch the new season now streaming on Hulu and Hulu on Disney+ for bundle subscribers. Ladder: Get a free 7-day trial and $10 off your first month at https://ladder.fit/gge. Skims: Get our favorite cotton pieces at https://skims.com/gge. BetterHelp: Get 10% off at https://betterhelp.com/gge. Hungry Root: Get 40% off your first box and free item in every box at https://hungryroot.com/gge with code GGE. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Rayna Greenberg?

  I feel for people who are like, I'm optimizing everything. I'm wellness, routineing everything. I'm boundary everything and I'm not happy.

• 0:23Ashley Hesseltine?

  This podcast is a Dear Media production.

• 0:25Rayna Greenberg?

  Hi, guys.

• 0:26Ashley Hesseltine?

  Hi, guys.

• 0:27Rayna Greenberg?

  Welcome back to another episode of Girls Gotta Eat.

• 0:29Ashley Hesseltine?

  Welcome back. First day of fall ish. The internet says it's the 22nd and I just am a 21st first day of the season, girlie. I don't want to fuck around. Is it, what day is it? It's a 21st. It's June 21st, September 21st, December 21st, March, March 21st.

• 0:49Rayna Greenberg?

  Yeah, that's it. Also, I thought the first day of fall was September 8th. So you know, I got a little extra. I just, I thought the day after Labor Day, summer's over. I didn't know.

• 0:58Ashley Hesseltine?

  Yeah, that's unofficial.

• 0:59Rayna Greenberg?

  I feel like we do this every year.

• 1:01Ashley Hesseltine?

  We do this every year and summer is Memorial Day to Labor Day.

• 1:04Rayna Greenberg?

  I don't know, September 9th, I'm like, we should break out the Halloween decorations. Like it's Thanksgiving. Basically, it's Christmas, September 9th.

• 1:11Ashley Hesseltine?

  Yeah, that is how I also see it. Shashank started asking me, can we put the pumpkins out in July? And I said, we have to wait till after Labor Day. We have these like wire pumpkins. I don't know. They're still not out though. So he was just playing with me because they're still in the garage. But I was like, after Labor Day.

• 1:30Rayna Greenberg?

  Is he really good at carving pumpkins? Can you remind me? I feel like this would be a skill he has.

• 1:34Ashley Hesseltine?

  I'm glad you asked because it is a part of our story. Like we did carve pumpkins our first October together in 2023.

• 1:41Rayna Greenberg?

  I thought so.

• 1:42Ashley Hesseltine?

  And we went to the pumpkin patch the next year. It's also like around his birthday, but he likes it in theory and he does an okay job, but I wouldn't say it's like a talent of his. He's not going to do some intricate crazy pumpkin, but he's good enough. I'd say he's intermediate. I'd say he's not beginner and he's not advanced.

• 2:00Rayna Greenberg?

  Feels like a skill he would have, like intricate pumpkin carving.

• 2:04Ashley Hesseltine?

  The first year we did carve pumpkins, we carved two and then we were going to do a third and then we just painted it.

• 2:10Rayna Greenberg?

  That's what you gotta do. You paint it. Or you buy those fucking stencils. Those also seem like a good idea until you're like halfway into it. It's like painting your own house. It's like, I could do this. And then you get into it. You're like, I don't want to do this.

• 2:22Ashley Hesseltine?

  I like to paint a pumpkin. Yeah.

• 2:24Rayna Greenberg?

  I think it's fun.

• 2:24Ashley Hesseltine?

  Paint it, like silver paint, paint it gold. Much easier.

• 2:29Rayna Greenberg?

  I mean, I live in a building now. What am I going to do with pumpkins?

• 2:31Ashley Hesseltine?

  You could put it outside your door.

• 2:33Rayna Greenberg?

  Actually, there's so many kids here. There's like a thousand kids on my floor. Do you think for Halloween I have to like, I have to like open my door and do like New York City, like Halloween candy? Well, well, we're, listen, we'll cover it when we get to it, you guys, but I'll let you know.

• 2:44Ashley Hesseltine?

  That would be cute, but you should get ahead of it and find out if that's the thing your building does.

• 2:50Rayna Greenberg?

  I'm going to leave town. I feel like that's, actually I will be out of town. Thank God. I actually will be out of town. So we're safe.

• 2:56Ashley Hesseltine?

  Oh, yeah. Rayna Greenberg.com for her tour tickets.

• 2:58Rayna Greenberg?

  All right. Well, we've a lot of stuff to get into. We'll just thank our partners real quick and then we'll get into it. Thank you to Skims. Get our favorite cotton pieces at skims.com/gge and Noom. Start a GLP1 program for $39 and have it delivered in as little as seven days at noom.com. At BetterHelp, get 10% off at betterhelp.com/gge.

• 3:16Ashley Hesseltine?

  And the secret lives of Mormon wives, season five. Watch the all new season of the original Hulu series now streaming on Hulu and Hulu on Disney Plus for bundle subscribers. And thank you to Hungry Root. Get 40% off your first box and a free item in every box at hungryroot.com/gge with code GGE. And Ladder, get a free seven day trial and $10 off your first month at ladder.fit/gge. And Cody is here with us. It just wants to be on my lap. So you guys probably saw him on Thursday as well, but he is back for his first Monday episode.

• 3:53Rayna Greenberg?

  Cutie.

• 3:55Ashley Hesseltine?

  Look at him. Could you just die?

• 3:57Rayna Greenberg?

  No, I love him.

• 3:59Ashley Hesseltine?

  I love him so much. I don't know what to do.

• 4:02Rayna Greenberg?

  Maybe you keep him.

• 4:04Ashley Hesseltine?

  Maybe I meet him.

• 4:05Rayna Greenberg?

  Struggling with it.

• 4:07Ashley Hesseltine?

  Maybe you keep him, right? I really, I know you would fall in love with this dog, like, but it's fine. It's, that's not your truth, but I just know you would. He's just.

• 4:16Rayna Greenberg?

  How would I even get him?

• 4:17Ashley Hesseltine?

  Well, I'll bring him.

• 4:19Rayna Greenberg?

  You're going to bring him across the country to me?

• 4:21Ashley Hesseltine?

  Are you allowed to do that? No, you can't like transport a foster. I don't think. I was thinking, asking.

• 4:28Ashley Hesseltine?

  So as we record, I am in New York and I will have just been in Boston for the weekend and we will have went to the Dermot Kennedy concert, which is just one of our favorite artists. Our wedding song was Dermot Kennedy. Our first dance was to a song called Blossom. We weren't able to see him last year, just with like the tour, the wedding, all the things. So we were so excited to see him and see him in Boston, which just feels really special. So I'm sure that was amazing. And then be in New York this week and we will be recording and running around and doing stuff. And then I will be in Delaware this weekend with my family. And today, as we record, was Jay's first day of school. My nephew, I can't believe it. He's starting like a little preschool and he got his little haircut.

• 5:09Ashley Hesseltine?

  His first day of school fit. I'm just dying. So I'm excited to be there and just, I can't wait to sit down and talk to him about school, like his first week of school. I can't wait.

• 5:19Rayna Greenberg?

  No, I was like, should I come with her and go just to see Jay and Aaron?

• 5:22Ashley Hesseltine?

  You can.

• 5:23Rayna Greenberg?

  You know, I've had some separation anxiety lately. You know, I just like, don't like being away from you. You've been like hanging out with people without me. I don't like it.

• 5:31Ashley Hesseltine?

  You have been.

• 5:32Rayna Greenberg?

  Yeah, I know, but I don't like it.

• 5:33Ashley Hesseltine?

  You've been doing stuff.

• 5:35Rayna Greenberg?

  I keep, these things keep happening and I'm like, I hate that I'm telling these stories without you. Like, I think we are so fun to tag team a story. Like, I mean, we've done this for a decade. We're storytellers, but like, there is nothing I love more than tag teaming gossip stories with you. And like, I don't get to do it all the time. I hate it.

• 5:50Ashley Hesseltine?

  I know. So just a lot has happened this summer and we'll recap the highs, not so much the lows, that like people in our life don't really like all know about. So you got to really recap with Andrew Collin recently and I was just so jealous because he's so fun in that type of situation and his reactions. And I wish I could have been there with you. And then Rob, I got to be with him. Yesterday, we had this brunch and like Raina, literally, he didn't know anything from the summer. Like, he is one of my best friends and I just miss him like as a friend, you know, like he's traveling all over. He's busy with work. He's got two kids. And so we are in communication, like texting always, but not like, here's what's been happening in our lives. Like, let's sit down. Let's have some drinks. Rob had four glasses of wine.

• 6:35Rayna Greenberg?

  Of course he did. Of course, in the middle of the day, of course he did. No one can drink more than this guy. It's insane.

• 6:40Ashley Hesseltine?

  Three rosés. This is the person who introduced me to rosé in like 2011. Three rosés and then he ended with a red.

• 6:47Rayna Greenberg?

  That's, it's, I mean, it's just, I don't understand what it's like to be like that. I'm envious of people that can just like drink that much and then go about their day. I mean, also, he's like a rugby player. He's like 6'5". So he's a little bigger than I am, but two glasses, it's lights out for me, baby.

• 7:02Ashley Hesseltine?

  I had two mimosas, but uh, yeah, it was fun. So we'll talk about some stuff from the summer as we get into it.

• 7:09Rayna Greenberg?

  Oh, I had the best summer.

• 7:11Ashley Hesseltine?

  But what's going on with you?

• 7:12Rayna Greenberg?

  Nothing.

• 7:16Ashley Hesseltine?

  Okay, that's it. We'll see you guys next week. Nothing's going on. That is so funny on a podcast. What's going on with you? Nothing. Hey, did you forget we were recording? Did you forget we prepped for this moments before on what you were going to talk about?

• 7:30Rayna Greenberg?

  I forgot this isn't a voice note. I just forgot that I have to tell you guys what's up with me. Well, um, last week I told you guys about staying at the Four Seasons. So right now I'd like to tell you about going to the US Open. And I had the craziest experience yesterday at the US Open. Um, I experienced the Gen Z stare for the first time, Ashley. And have you experienced this in real life?

• 7:51Ashley Hesseltine?

  Well, we talked about when I went to a restaurant and the hostess did not really understand what I was there for. It was a Gen Z stare. I don't know, she could have been a young millennial. I don't know how old she was. She looked late twenties, twenties, 27, 28. But we talked about how she just kind of, yeah, there was a stare. There was just a refusal to communicate and do her job, I guess. But, and it was funny, you know, I wasn't like dragging her. I was like, this is a funny interaction to have when you roll up to a restaurant and the hostess doesn't seem to understand why you're there.

• 8:26Rayna Greenberg?

  Like, yes, if you guys look up TikToks about the Gen Z stare, it's always like a millennial, just like begging for niceness from a Gen Z employee. And it's like, just this very funny standoff of like, everyone's acting crazy. And like, I thought it was a joke. I didn't really think this existed in the wild. I forgot about the hostess situation and you didn't call it the Gen Z stare, but that's what it was. And I finally experienced it yesterday. So I was at the US Open. I wore these shoes that were so painful. They had sliced the back of my feet open and the front of my feet. And I was like bleeding from both of my feet. And I was like, I'm, I feel sick from how much pain I'm in. Like, I will do anything. And then I was like, oh yeah, there's like grounds outside of the stadium and there's all these stores. And I was like, I'll, I'll find the cheapest pair of shoes I can find.

• 9:08Rayna Greenberg?

  I'll buy a pair of flip flops, whatever. So Alana and I went down to one of the shoe stores, like on the grounds and I see this pair of slides. I'm like, great. I'll just buy these. They're cheap. And I grabbed the employee, like the store employee, and I'm like, hey, do you have these um, in a six? And she just looks at me and goes, I don't know. And I was like, um, is there a way to find out? And she's like, that's the smallest size probably. And I was holding like a 10. And I was like, okay. So I pointed to the next cheapest thing. I'm like, do you have this in a six? And she goes, I'm not sure. And I was like, okay.

• 9:46Ashley Hesseltine?

  Situations are like, I'm truly like, am I on candid camera? Like, is, am I being filmed? Cause how could this be real life?

• 9:57Rayna Greenberg?

  And like in shoe stores, they always have that thing in their hand and they like check. So I go, could you check? And she goes, what size are you? And I was like, a six. And she's like, okay. But what size do you want me to grab? And I was like, a women's six. And she, she walks away. She's gone for three minutes. She comes back. Ashley, I promise you I'm not making this up. If Alana hadn't been standing next to me, I would have thought I hallucinated it because I was so drunk. She goes, what size are you typically?

• 10:29Ashley Hesseltine?

  What?

• 10:30Rayna Greenberg?

  I'm like, I have since said six three times. And I, so I said it to her. So I said, I'm a woman's six. And she goes, okay. So she walks away. She comes back. She's like, we don't have it. And I go, I realized I'm holding a size six, which means they do have a size six in the store. And I go, this is a size six. Do you, so do you just have the other one of these? And I'll buy this. And she goes.

• 10:57Ashley Hesseltine?

  Buy the sample.

• 10:57Rayna Greenberg?

  I would have to ask a manager.

• 11:01Rayna Greenberg?

  And I was like, um, so can you like, I don't, am I, am I hallucinating here? Like I have said my size four times now. And I was like, this isn't like outside of the realm of like what you normally ask people for at a shoe store. Like there's a display and you tell people with size and then they get, they go to get the size and they either have it or they don't.

• 11:21Ashley Hesseltine?

  Some would say that's your one job.

• 11:23Rayna Greenberg?

  It's, that's it. It's just that.

• 11:25Ashley Hesseltine?

  You're working the floor at the shoe store. Some would say that is your main responsibility.

• 11:32Rayna Greenberg?

  Like I didn't know I needed to shepherd somebody through like, when they said like, I'd have to ask a manager. Like, I didn't know that I had to like, do the extra work of being like, but could you?

• 11:41Ashley Hesseltine?

  No, it's so funny when the energy is the audacity of you to request something of me.

• 11:45Rayna Greenberg?

  Like, I was so stupid.

• 11:48Ashley Hesseltine?

  Yeah.

• 11:48Rayna Greenberg?

  Also, it's funny because like, I just wanted to buy these shoes. Like if, if I owned the shoe store and I was like, this person is actively getting in the way of selling these shoes. Like, yeah, I was like, I could just leave here, I guess, but I'll keep asking questions. It's just, it's so jarring when it happens. And if you guys, if this happens to you and let us know where it happened. A friend of mine told me it happened in Sephora the other day. Like I find these interactions so funny. Cause you feel so stupid. You feel so dumb, but you're not doing anything wrong and do anything wrong. I was nice and kind. I was asking normal questions.

• 12:19Ashley Hesseltine?

  Did you get the shoes?

• 12:21Rayna Greenberg?

  Yeah, they're great. I finally got the shoes. This was like a 10 minute back and forth to figure out, could I just like get a size six of slides?

• 12:28Ashley Hesseltine?

  I think sometimes when I interact with Gen Z sales associates, I overcompensate with my energy.

• 12:36Rayna Greenberg?

  And that's, that's, yeah, of course.

• 12:37Ashley Hesseltine?

  But I usually do win them over. Like at the Vivrel Kiff store in the Hamptons, those girls behind the counter were, gee, we just did not want to fuck with work that day. And I get it. They were probably sitting there gossiping, recapping their night. And we come in, questions are being asked. They had to go get me so many sizes. And then they were like happy to do it. They went and got a bunch of sizes, but every time I needed like another size, there really was kind of a little bit of a, do I have to? Energy. And then I did like spend a lot of money. And then when I bought that little Prada bag that was really inexpensive, I think, because it had been gently used. It was at Vivrel. It's like I said, they have a Vivrel and Kiff women, like did this little pop up in the Hamptons.

• 13:19Ashley Hesseltine?

  And now I sound like Raina. I'm just like, you know, when I was like in the Hamptons at the, and so it was so much less expensive than retail price. And you didn't like it, but it's bright yellow and I love it. And it's this little tiny bag and they loved that I bought it. And one of them, at the end of me pain, she was like about the bag. She was like, I hate to watch her leave, but I love to watch her go. And I laughed. I was like, okay, we have some jokes. It was like a very funny, which is also funny if they make commission, like even funnier.

• 13:48Rayna Greenberg?

  Yeah. Then they're nice to you.

• 13:50Ashley Hesseltine?

  Yeah. So I won them over, but then I'm like, am I spending a lot of money to impress them?

• 13:55Rayna Greenberg?

  Cause you start overcompensating. I started literally spiraling. I was like, I'm so sorry. Like I'll go to the stock room. I'll get the shoes. Honestly, like, can I talk to your manager? Like, I'll just ask them if it's okay to take these shoes. Like, I don't want to bother you at work at your shoe store. I'm so sorry.

• 14:09Ashley Hesseltine?

  And I'm telling you, this is, I feel like this is the, the point. They're like, if we just don't do anything, they will eventually leave or do it for us.

• 14:17Rayna Greenberg?

  They will embarrass themselves so badly and this will be amusing for us. We'll tell our friends later that we held a straight face while they humiliated themselves.

• 14:26Ashley Hesseltine?

  It's funny that their goal could be to try to get us to overcompensate. Like they're like, if we just keep treating them like this, they'll start to get a little uppity. Like, you know?

• 14:35Rayna Greenberg?

  It's funny because like, you know that you can make people do it sometimes. So we are having one of my best friends, one of your friends, one of my best friends on the show in a couple of weeks, Emily. And I always like laugh because I'm like, I know that you will get so anxious about quiet space in a conversation that you will fill the space. So I always say to her, like, when we're around people and I don't want to talk, I just get quiet and I know she'll take care of it because her anxiety will take over and she'll fill the space.

• 14:59Ashley Hesseltine?

  She'll pick up the emotional labor.

• 15:01Rayna Greenberg?

  Yeah. She's like, fuck you, Raina. I know you're doing this.

• 15:03Ashley Hesseltine?

  Okay. So, and you met somebody at the US Open?

• 15:06Rayna Greenberg?

  I met this kid, this, this man, this boy.

• 15:08Ashley Hesseltine?

  Not the kid.

• 15:11Rayna Greenberg?

  So I was seeing somebody and I am not anymore and I will address that later.

• 15:15Ashley Hesseltine?

  Oh, not right now?

• 15:15Rayna Greenberg?

  Huh? I mean, I guess I could have just addressed it right now. I mean, I was seeing somebody throughout the summer. He is.

• 15:19Ashley Hesseltine?

  I'm carrying this episode on my back.

• 15:22Rayna Greenberg?

  And honestly, I'm not even really that hungover. Um, I guess I was like, I will talk about this later. It's like, why we're here. Why don't we just talk about this now?

• 15:31Ashley Hesseltine?

  That is set up on this equipment. Table that for now.

• 15:34Rayna Greenberg?

  Just tease the rest of the episode later. Well, I was, I, we always want to like, you know, update you guys, keep you in the loop. I'm not going to talk too much about it. But I was dating somebody. He's really wonderful. He's like the most wonderful person. It was a personality mismatch and we decided to go our separate ways. And it was really nice to have like a relationship for the time being that just made me feel like calm and appreciated. And he's just like a really nice, wonderful person and it's not going to work out, but there's like no hard feelings and that's it. You know, we had an amicable conversation and that's that.

• 16:03Ashley Hesseltine?

  Mm hmm.

• 16:04Rayna Greenberg?

  Um, so this guy that I met yesterday.

• 16:06Ashley Hesseltine?

  So that's, and that is that.

• 16:08Rayna Greenberg?

  That's that. I mean, I just, I, I couldn't even possibly think of like one negative or like, it's just, not everybody is for everybody. And it's like amicable. And I like, I mean, anybody who ends up with this guy is like so lucky.

• 16:20Ashley Hesseltine?

  It really was like a summer romance. I don't even want to say fling because I think there were real feelings there, but it's what it is, you know? Labor day came around and new season. Right. I brought the hammer down. No, I'm just kidding. No, he's really wonderful. And you know, maybe kind of at a later date, we'll talk about this in a broader scope of just like how tough it is for something to end. That's good.

• 16:43Rayna Greenberg?

  That's great. Yeah.

• 16:44Ashley Hesseltine?

  That are really good people and there's no fighting and the sex is good. And you're just like, what are we doing? And it's just not the right person.

• 16:52Rayna Greenberg?

  People are like, wait, that sounds amazing. Yeah. I mean, we never had like one conflict. It wasn't like, it's easy to end relationships when you like hate the person. I mean, what, what a gift. Um, but yeah, I think it's a broader topic. We'll talk about that at another date.

• 17:04Ashley Hesseltine?

  Okay.

• 17:05Rayna Greenberg?

  So our friend Alana and I went to the men's finals game and our friend Hank was there, Salt Hank, um, in New York City. If you guys have had his sandwiches, but he was like, I'm in his suite. Anyways, he was there with some friends and this guy starts talking to me and he's like, very cute. And we talked for like a long time and I'm trying to figure out how old he is because he looked like pretty young, but like I couldn't figure out, there was no like tells in terms of like, I've lived in this place for X amount of years. Like I've been doing this job for. No Gen Z stare. So charming. Like couldn't have been more charming. He was so cute and wonderful to talk to. He was asking me all these questions. We just had like such a fun day. He was just like standing with me for the whole time. And then we all like drank a lot. We were like, we need to eat. So like, we went out to dinner afterwards, me and him and Hank and his girlfriend and Alana.

• 17:49Rayna Greenberg?

  We went to this like fun place in Queens. And then I asked Hank, like, just like, uh, like I, he like went to the bathroom, whatever. And I was like, Hank, how old is he?

• 17:58Ashley Hesseltine?

  No, no, no, no.

• 18:00Rayna Greenberg?

  21.

• 18:01Ashley Hesseltine?

  Raina, no, he's not. No, he's not.

• 18:06Ashley Hesseltine?

  Shut your mouth. I was like, she's going to say 23 or 24. 21?

• 18:15Rayna Greenberg?

  21.

• 18:16Ashley Hesseltine?

  Is he in college?

• 18:17Rayna Greenberg?

  He like.

• 18:18Ashley Hesseltine?

  Could be your son.

• 18:19Rayna Greenberg?

  He just got out of college and I'm sitting there.

• 18:23Ashley Hesseltine?

  He might be jet alpha. I don't know what they're doing.

• 18:26Rayna Greenberg?

  I think he just graduated in May. I mean, he just graduated and I am like, I am 20 years older than this person.

• 18:34Ashley Hesseltine?

  Yeah.

• 18:34Rayna Greenberg?

  Like it's crazy. And it's like washing over me that men do this all the time. I was like, this feels, yeah. This feels predatory. Like I could literally be his mom. It wouldn't even be that crazy.

• 18:45Ashley Hesseltine?

  I don't think it feels predatory and I'm sure he was flirting with you and it would have been totally fine.

• 18:50Rayna Greenberg?

  Oh, he was super flirting with me. So then we're going to leave and like.

• 18:54Ashley Hesseltine?

  I gotta, I need to see a picture because aren't all you guys wondering like, Raina, there must've been signs. There must've been signs in the way this guy looked. How, did you think he was like 28?

• 19:04Rayna Greenberg?

  I thought 25 or 26. He's, looks really young.

• 19:07Ashley Hesseltine?

  And you were like, fuck it.

• 19:09Rayna Greenberg?

  But I was like, all right, that's legal. That's, that's pretty legal. Okay. Do you want me to send you a photo of him now?

• 19:14Ashley Hesseltine?

  Yes. Yeah. So I can be the judge.

• 19:16Rayna Greenberg?

  He's so cute, Ashley.

• 19:18Ashley Hesseltine?

  Oh my God. I can't even rent a car.

• 19:21Ashley Hesseltine?

  Raina fucking Greenberg, are you serious?

• 19:25Rayna Greenberg?

  Cute, right?

• 19:26Ashley Hesseltine?

  He's so cute, but he looks like a child. And you know what I never want to hear again? I never want to hear you say shit to me about the shows I like to watch that are about high school and early twenties, because this looks like every guy on all those shows. And if you watch those shows, you would know. If you watch the summer, I would turn pretty. If you watched Sterling Point, then you would know that that's what they look like. You don't understand because you're not in the culture and anyone who watches these shows would understand that that's a fresh 21 year old.

• 19:58Rayna Greenberg?

  He is giving Chalamet-esque. I mean, he was fresh out the box, but I was like, maybe he's 25 or 26.

• 20:05Ashley Hesseltine?

  Also, fresh out the bar. He can only barely drink.

• 20:08Rayna Greenberg?

  Also Hank is 32 or 33 and I was like, he's probably closer in age to Hank. I didn't think he was like 11 years younger than Hank is.

• 20:17Ashley Hesseltine?

  Well, right. That's so true. Like, cause when we first met Hank, which was seven years ago, he was like a young baby.

• 20:25Rayna Greenberg?

  He grew up. Um, so at the end of the night, Hank and his girlfriend, um, are going to stay at the restaurant for a little bit. Alana had to go back to Brooklyn and I was like, I'm going to go back to the city. And he was like, can I hop in the car with you? And I was like, yeah, sure.

• 20:38Rayna Greenberg?

  I, he was like, I'll just like get out in front of your place and just like walk. Cause I was like, do you want me to drop you somewhere? And he's like, no, don't worry about it. And he was like, I have to take the six. And we pulled up in front of the six and I was like, do you want me to have the car pull over? And he was like, no, it's okay. We can just go to your place. And we like pulled up in front of my house and like got out and no, this is nothing crazy is going to happen. We just, we got out of the car and I was like, there was a moment where he was like, so what are you going to like do for the rest of the night? And I was like, nothing. Like, and he, then he was just like, okay, have a good night. Like we hugged and he like laughed, but like for a moment I was like, could I do this?

• 21:16Ashley Hesseltine?

  You know what? I think you are the problem. You just ended things with a full adult, a homeowner, a man with a great career. And you're like, should I make out with this 21 year old on the

• 21:32Rayna Greenberg?

  The point is that I didn't. I didn't. Okay. It crossed my mind. I didn't do it. Okay. He came on to me and I didn't do anything.

• 21:40Ashley Hesseltine?

  That's what they all say. Well, what were you wearing? No, we all know. A little tennis dress.

• 21:46Rayna Greenberg?

  Very tight tennis dress. But when I realized like how young 21 is, it just like washed over me like I for a literal child and like, how old do I seem to you? Like when I was 21, people that were 30 were so fucking old. It was in, I was like, how could you get that old? That's crazy. How could anybody be that old?

• 22:05Ashley Hesseltine?

  It really is so crazy. But you know, times have changed and I like this. Maybe he's got an older lady kink.

• 22:10Rayna Greenberg?

  I don't think I've talked to a 21 year old in like a social setting for a long period of time in ages. When was the last time I had a long form conversation with somebody that age?

• 22:21Ashley Hesseltine?

  Yeah, this is no shade. It's just very young because you really haven't been out in the world. Like we, I talk about the fucking this 23 year old in my special and I was 40.

• 22:32Rayna Greenberg?

  39.

• 22:33Ashley Hesseltine?

  I was 39. Yeah. Okay. Oh, so twenties and thirties wasn't that bad. But it, yeah, I guess it felt different than if I was 43. He was 23, like a full 20 years. So yeah, 39, 23. But he had a job, but like he'd been in, working in finance for a couple of years. Like it's still very young and we did not think he was that young. He was so tall. He just looked like he'd been out in the world. Like 21 is just so crazy. And I just also think what I was like a 21.

• 22:59Rayna Greenberg?

  Yeah.

• 23:00Ashley Hesseltine?

  Anyway, we are going to talk about some of this today. It was really such a relevant intro with talking about just Gen Z and age differences and the way people party and socialize in the world and everything. But we just kind of wanted to like recap the summer a little bit. I feel like this summer was a pretty good run because it started so strong in June with the Knicks and all that excitement. And then you moved to New York and I was in New York a bunch around the Knicks and the World Cup. And that was just so, so fun. And then we took this trip and then I feel like we had our travel chunk of the summer with going to France and going to Dewey and a couple of other things we did. And then I

• 23:44Ashley Hesseltine?

  really stayed in LA all of August and just really enjoyed it. And I feel like I'd been gone so much. And every weekend we were here in August. We did really, nothing crazy, but just had really fun weekends and enjoyed LA, went to a bunch of new restaurants and shows and did all kinds of stuff. And for me, I did experience the loss of my friend and it made the summer really feel like a roller coaster because there was all these highs. And then I was also spent days crying and couldn't get on bed and, you know, feeling guilty for having fun and having that type of feeling. And there was a lot of compartmentalizing that I did with just can't let this like take over

• 24:26Ashley Hesseltine?

  your brain all day, every day. And, you know, going and doing the celebration of life for her. And it was a roller coaster in that way. It just highs and lows. But the fun and the social stuff that we did was, I feel like one of my favorites. I don't know. We just had a good time when we had a good time. And there was, and there was some drama and I just feel like there was drama around me a lot that I feel like wasn't, I wasn't at the center of. And I kind of, I feel like there was moments where we were like helping friends navigate different things going on in their life and stepping up for them and trying our best to just, you know, be there for people when they were going through stuff and not get too involved, not let it drag us down. And

• 25:09Ashley Hesseltine?

  that was the theme of the summer too. And maybe some friendships that were recalibrated. And I don't know. I look back on the summer like just, it was a lot. I don't know. It felt like a lot. It was just really high highs, a low, low, personal low, drama, chaos, fun. It was a little crazy.

• 25:30Rayna Greenberg?

  It was, I think, my craziest summer and my favorite summer that I've had in memory. And I really feel like my favorite part of the summer was how much time I got to spend with you. And I I've lived here for, I've lived here for three months now. And I really was like worried in April and May, like, what is our life going to look like? What's our friendship going to look like? What's our business going to look like? Like, you and I have never separated ever. And I was just like, what does this do to our friendship? What does this mean that we have like separate lives? And like, you're a limb on my body. Like, what does that look like? And I spent more time with you than I've ever spent with you. I traveled more with you. And it's just like, it was my favorite thing of the summer.

• 26:12Rayna Greenberg?

  We had so much fun together. We got to just like be friends and like not have to just be like business partners and coworkers. Like, we just spent so much time being friends. And I think when you like work with somebody so closely all the time, you can forget sometimes that like the core of all of that is your friendship. And you and I just got to like have fun and be friends. And I feel like we like bonded over other people's crazy behavior so much. And

• 26:38Rayna Greenberg?

  we just like went so many places. I feel like closer to you than like I ever have. And I've just like on a friendship level. It's just been really nice. I feel the same way. It's just, it really was like that. And we don't need to get like all the logistics of the way that we run this business and record and all that kind of stuff. But it's just like, we had to kind of make a point to be together and record, get it done, whether it was virtual or in the studio that we were running by the hour. And that was that. And so I feel like we really were able to schedule work time in a way that we haven't before. And the lines always get so blurred. And then on the rest of the time, just be friends and travel. And it just, it really is crazy because people have been asking me about how's it working and without Raina? And I'm like, I have not missed her a day.

• 27:22Rayna Greenberg?

  It just, I don't even, and I think there was a point where I was like, it's going to be a while before we see each other again. But then you came here. And when you were here, I feel like it was like, we really have a strong run going where we're like every other week. And so it has been really nice. And yeah, I just, I obviously feel like our friendship is better than ever. And you know, it's just, I've had some stuff I've really like leaned on you about this summer, like stuff, you know, I don't really talk to anyone else about. And thankful for you and our friendship. And I see this continuing. Like, I think it wasn't just for the summer. I'm like, have plans to come to New York. You have plans to come here. And then, I don't know, it's going to get cold there. Maybe you'll spend more time here. Like, I think we've kind of figured it out for now, for the next couple of quarters.

• 28:02Ashley Hesseltine?

  Yeah, we're, we're going to be good for a couple of quarters. And you know, listen, it was great. We went to a lot of places. I checked some stuff off the bucket list in terms of travel. I got a boyfriend. I un got a boyfriend, you know?

• 28:13Rayna Greenberg?

  Now she's going to enter her cougar era. But it was really nice also to just remember that there are really wonderful men in the world that will treat you well, that will show up for you, that will be consistent, that will be honest, that just cheer for you. And like, he was all those things. And it's just nice to remember that those people still exist. And not everybody's going to be for you. Just you're not going to have the same temperament as somebody always. But like, I think it's just nice to remember there are like great people in the world because we like shit on men, not you and I, but like globally, we all shit on men so much and how terrible everybody's behavior has gotten. But like, there are people that will think the world of you and you should hold out for those people.

• 28:47Ashley Hesseltine?

  They are not in New York and LA, unfortunately.

• 28:51Rayna Greenberg?

  They are in other cities.

• 28:52Ashley Hesseltine?

  You do have to find them elsewhere. And I will stand on business forever with that.

• 28:59Rayna Greenberg?

  Oh yeah, they're not here. This is how they are. I'm so sorry, you guys. If you live in New York and LA, no, actually there are not good guys. But, um, you know, we can suggest other cities where they might live. Maybe Austin, maybe Nashville, maybe Denver. I mean, true, anywhere else. Besides New York and LA. Yeah. Go somewhere else.

• 29:19Ashley Hesseltine?

  Yeah. You don't have to move there. You just have to go get them. I did it. Raina tried it. It was to be done. You don't have to give up your life, ladies. We're not saying that.

• 29:28Rayna Greenberg?

  No, I mean, I love a long distance relationship, not seeing everybody all the time. Oh, it is the perfect balance between self-care and boundaries and being in a relationship. So while we're recapping the summer, there's something I like wanted to talk about. And I think it's just like a time when we're all thinking about our bodies a lot, you know? And like, how do we feel in our bodies? Like, you know, clothing is skimpy. You just think about it a lot in the summer. At least I do. So I wanted to talk about my GLP-1 usage. And I've alluded to it a little bit on the show before. And I think that if you look back at old clips, I've clearly lost weight. And I've been on and off GLP-1s a few times throughout the years. And my experience has been really positive, to be honest. I haven't had a lot of negatives. I can't speak to other people's experiences. I'm not a doctor.

• 30:09Rayna Greenberg?

  But my experience has been really positive. And, you know, it's not just that when you take them, you're less hungry, which also is, you know, a benefit if you want to lose weight. But I know a lot of people say like the food noise, this and that, but it has been a real problem psychologically my whole life is just thinking about food constantly. And one thing that GLP-1s does is help you manage that food noise. And again, I've had a really positive experience with it. It helped me to like eat a little bit less. But when you think about like long-term GLP-1 use, I think a lot of people's question is like, can I stay on this forever? How do I ever get off of this? And I think some programs that you do for GLP-1s sort of lack that. And I've gotten them from different places over the years. But

• 30:54Rayna Greenberg?

  I had never really found anything that helped you with like diet plans and eating. And this is like the long-term strategy for like feeling and being healthy until I found Noom. So I'll tell you guys a little bit about Noom. And if you're curious, so Noom helps people lose weight and keep it off. So Noom is the leading behavioral change company. It combines GLP-1s to kickstart your weight loss with healthy habits to help you keep. Keep it off, even if you stop the meds. So you know, your goal might be to lose a little bit of weight, but then make this a sustainable thing in your life. So that if you do want to get off GLP ones one day, that you know what to eat, how to exercise and how to kind of think about food. And Numa has always said they're psychology based. It's science-backed programs. It pairs GLP ones with behavioral changes, daily lessons and food logging to support weight loss that lasts.

• 31:38Rayna Greenberg?

  So when I signed up for it, you immediately like get an email. There's an app that you can log into and there's so much help in terms of like, understanding and managing food noise and feeling confident, making food choices without overthinking every menu item or every bite. And what GLP ones were able to help me do is like manage the amount that I ate. But you know, that doesn't fix the long-term habits. I think that, you know, the goal is to have a better relationship with food, not just to have no relationship with food. And it was nice to take a break psychologically from thinking about food all the time, but they're going to help you to find movement you genuinely enjoy, navigate happy hours, vacations, brunches, date nights. I mean, so much of life revolves around food. And I didn't want to feel like I couldn't enjoy myself on

• 32:21Rayna Greenberg?

  vacation or at dinner because I just didn't have an appetite and didn't want to eat. And they'll help you also figure out your personalized weight loss plan. And they have expert coaches that support you through the journey and just incorporate habits and mind shifts and routines that build around just like a healthier life.

• 32:36Ashley Hesseltine?

  Yeah, I just, I think that is like so important is like people start this and it changes the way that they've been looking at, thinking out, approaching food, maybe their whole lives. So you need support surrounding it. You might not, but I think some people do. And I think that's like their goal is to offer that. And I mean, to your point, yeah, I think that I've obviously been on this journey with you and it hasn't felt like you go to dinner and you're not enjoying yourself or, you know, I think there was some of your habits have changed for the better. And you have said you don't eat a bag of pretzels at night, you know, in your bed, you know, there's like little things like that. But I like that they offer that support and how to like manage

• 33:21Ashley Hesseltine?

  it in all areas of your life. And it's not just like, here's this drug and figure it out.

• 33:27Rayna Greenberg?

  Yes. And I feel like GLP ones were so like the Wild West a couple of years ago, where like, all these people are prescribing it, but a lot of people's fear and my fear was like, if I want to get off of this one day, I again, I'm not a doctor, you don't have to get off of it. But if I want to get off of this one day and have a sustainable relationship with food and exercise, like, how do I do that? And Numa is the only people that are doing this that I've ever seen. So I love what you're doing. And simply put, Numa is designed for like real life, helping people stay on track, even when life gets kind of busy. And you can lean into your progress in terms of just like driving towards perfection. The Numa GLP one program starts at $39 and medication can be delivered to your door in as little as seven days. Initial one month subscriptions from $39

• 34:07Rayna Greenberg?

  plus tax and $99 plus tax per month thereafter. Cost of the medication not included. Final pricing depends upon program selection. Not all customers will clinically qualify for medications. Individual results may vary.

• 34:20Ashley Hesseltine?

  Okay. I am going to tell you guys about Ladder. So I really love to work out at home. Like I will go out and do a workout class once to twice a week. But other than that, I absolutely love my outdoor space at my house. And nothing makes me happier than going out there and doing a workout class. And I really do love what Ladder offers. And I think that it's great to be able to do something at home and get a workout in that feels like you could have gone to the gym with a personal trainer. So Ladder is an expert strength training plan. It's not just a content library. So you are going to get a new plan every week that builds on the last. That's where the name comes from. The workouts connect. Each week progresses from the one before through structured training blocks. But if you want to just go in and take a workout, you can do that too. They're not forcing you into any sort of routine, but that really is how it's supposed

• 35:03Ashley Hesseltine?

  to work. And it feels like having a coach right there with you, any sort of training style. So you want Pilates to strength, bodybuilding, you want to lift heavy, you want to lift light, you want to focus on your glutes. I really love that kettlebells, pre and postnatal. And again, you can take this to the gym too. You can do this at home, or you can take it with you and go do it at the gym when you have all the equipment there. I'm looking right now on the strength workouts. There's Hilary Duff's tour workout with dumbbells. So if you want, she looked amazing. So I love that. I really love the glute workouts. I really am always on a butt journey. So Ladder also now includes a nutrition tracking, no extra cost. There is a community behind it. There's a group chat. We love that. Your team has a group chat where your coach answers questions and members motivate each other. So that's really nice too, because sometimes you're doing stuff

• 35:45Ashley Hesseltine?

  solo, but you still want that sense of community. It costs less than $1 per day. And again, it's a structured workout plan, not just like random exercises. So we love the plan part of all of it. And that it feels like you have a personal trainer for the cost. So we just love the ladder app. You can remove the guesswork with ladder and get a real coach in your ear telling you exactly what to do for every workout. No thinking, everything planned for you. If you have an iPhone, head to ladder.fit slash GGE and take a quick quiz to find your perfect ladder plan. Use our link and get a free seven day trial with no credit card and $10 off your first month if you join. And I'm telling you guys about The Secret Lives of Mormon Wives, season five. You know, this is one of our absolute favorite shows. We have been talking about it for years. Season

• 36:30Ashley Hesseltine?

  five is out now. You can binge the entire thing. I want to say I binged it over two days, but honestly, it was one. And we are just obsessed with it. As you know, this is the women of mom talk. This started four years ago. They started out by making TikToks and then life started pulling them in all these different directions. And you're seeing where their career goes. This season, Whitney is on Broadway in Chicago. And there are all these group dynamics, all their relationships. We have Taylor Frankie Paul and everything she is going through and Jessie and Macy and Michaela and Leila and seeing where the group stands when they all come back together. You have heard all the rumors, but now it is time to see what's actually going on. If these women can still trust each other, are there any friendships left? Will mom talk survive?

• 37:14Ashley Hesseltine?

  This is always the question. So we are just obsessed. This season is incredible. So you can watch the all new season of the Hulu original series, The Secret Lives of Mormon Wives, now streaming on Hulu and Hulu on Disney Plus for bundle subscribers. Terms apply. And let's get into our topic.

• 37:30Rayna Greenberg?

  So it's really interesting. I feel like you and I just talk about this sort of like in pieces here and there, just about like, all the therapy advice that's out there in the world and how it's made everybody boundary up like crazy. And there just being like so much advice out there in the world. Like, what do you even listen to? And if we just like boundaried ourselves out of like having relationships at all. And we came across this advice column in the cut and a letter somebody had sent into the cut, an email, if you will. It's called, "My boundaries are killing my love life." And this is sort of twofold and we'll, we'll give you the, the high notes, but are your wellness routines and just your general life routine boundering you out of relationships? And is all this therapy speak boundering you out of it? And Ashley and I have had some like interesting talks about like what our twenties and early thirties were like, and just how much

• 38:13Rayna Greenberg?

  the world has changed. And this isn't just like a Gen Z thing. I mean, it's everybody. It's all of us and how different the world is than when I was younger.

• 38:23Ashley Hesseltine?

  Yeah. And we have a few of those disclaimers. This is a Gen Z versus millennial. This is a millennial quote unquote, problem too. And it also doesn't have to be a problem. If you're happy and you're at home and you're a routine and you're an introvert and that's how you want to live your life and you're genuinely happy, then that's great. And stick to that. You know, I think that if you're like, I'm too shy, I'm too anxious to go out and meet people in the wild and date, and I prefer to use dating apps. That's what they're made for. You know, you do you. So it's just like, we wanted to do this episode for people who feel like maybe they aren't totally content with their lives and wondering if they can live with some more excitement and socializing and spontaneity. But if you're like, I don't want that, then stop listening. No, I'm

• 39:05Ashley Hesseltine?

  just kidding. But it's just kind of like, I feel for people who are like, I optimized like I was told. I'm optimizing everything. I'm wellness routineing everything. I'm boundering everything and I'm not happy. And I feel like I don't have the community I want and I don't have a love life. And like, did I over correct? And I also just want to say before we get into it, I think that like, the word boundary can be misused. And whatever, you can think it can be interchangeable, like a boundary is like, I'm not saying you did. I'm saying like even in some of the comments on this article in the cut, we're like, let's guys, everything's not a boundary, but like, boundary, you know, you can't treat me like that. I won't be attending this family gathering. I won't be responding to work emails after seven. Like, those are boundaries, not like I have to go to

• 39:49Ashley Hesseltine?

  Pilates Monday, Wednesday and Friday. That's a routine or a regiment. And so I just think we may use them interchangeably throughout this episode, just a heads up. But I think we know the difference between a boundary and a routine, but they can go together. You know, they can be like, this is my way I live my life and I'm not really willing to stray from it. And then that kind of gets into the world where it's a boundary. So I did just want to say that.

• 40:14Rayna Greenberg?

  Yeah, obviously, I think that we've overused the word boundary and we've overbound. Obviously, but I was thinking like, you know, we've always done this podcast since like day one, like build a life you're really proud of with like hobbies and interests and goals and routines and friends and like a partner will be just kind of the cake on top of that. But like, I think the question is like, have we gone too far? Yeah. Have we walled off other people? And if you're like, what I really want is romantic partnership. Have you walled that out of your life? There's plenty of people that don't care about it. I think I might need romantic partnership a little less than the average person. And I'm not complaining about being single. I mean, obviously, I just, I had a boyfriend and now 21 year old. But I think we've always said that, but I think

• 40:58Rayna Greenberg?

  some people are like, okay, I did all the things I was told, but I don't have, like you said, the community around me that I want. And, you know, it's interesting because like when I was in my twenties and you in your twenties, like a routine, a routine would never have occurred to me in my entire life. I didn't even wash my makeup off before I went to bed. Not a chance in hell. I never thought like, should I not stay out for these six drinks because I have to go to work tomorrow, or I have to work out tomorrow? Like, if I didn't go out on a Saturday night, trying to create a web of lies to explain that to my friends, I couldn't even imagine it.

• 41:31Ashley Hesseltine?

  Raina, we did have routines and it was getting drunk every weekend. We stayed pretty strict to our routines. Like, we prioritized partying. We didn't know boundaries with work, optimizing. What the fuck did that even mean? Like, we did hustle. We did party. We did show up to work, hungover as fuck. Like, it did suck. We were underpaid. It was stressful. It was chaotic. I felt like shit. I looked like shit. I could have been healthier. I could have had more balance. I could have had more wellness, but I regret nothing. And I was able to figure it out and find success. But, and that's just how I was built. And I'm not even saying I recommend that, but like, our generation really did prioritize, not everybody, but the people we know, we surround

• 42:12Ashley Hesseltine?

  ourselves with, really did prioritize partying and socializing and hustling. And we did somehow do it all. And it was toxic at times, for sure.

• 42:25Rayna Greenberg?

  So this is not to advocate for drinking. Like, I think that we just need to find more places to socialize today. It doesn't have to be like, we're not, not drinking is great. It's great for you physically and mentally and all. I think we have a lot of information about alcohol. We also did not have back then. I certainly wouldn't have been accessing it.

• 42:42Ashley Hesseltine?

  Whatever. AI is gonna kill you before alcohol is, but yeah.

• 42:46Rayna Greenberg?

  I, one night, was like, out with some friends and I had a work trip the next morning. I had to be at the airport at like 7:00 AM and I could have gone home, but instead I stayed for like eight drinks. I slept for one hour and then went to the airport. I was throwing up on the plane. Like, it wouldn't have crossed my mind to like, make a good decision for myself, because I had to like, go home, do my skincare, get eight hours and like, wake up refreshed.

• 43:09Ashley Hesseltine?

  I mean, but I regret nothing and we have the stories and we have the friends and these things bonded us. I saw this TikTok or thread or whatever it was about bachelorettes, Gen Z versus millennial. And this is not everybody, by the way, but it was just like, some Gen Z girl talking about hearing the lore of millennial bachelorettes and how it's like, crazy blackouts and hookups and crazy stories, sitting around talking about dicks and penis straws and all that stuff. And like, these girls came in and they like rented the Airbnb or whatever and they immediately came in and started sharing all their traumas and did yoga the next morning. And it's like, that sounds terrible for a bachelorette party. That's not what I want. I love to sit around and trauma bond also, and also do yoga too. But like, I feel just so lucky of the way

• 43:51Ashley Hesseltine?

  we grew up and had it, having those experiences with the way that we had that type of culture, especially surrounding milestones like bachelorettes and whatnot.

• 44:01Rayna Greenberg?

  Yeah. And, you know, you and I want to validate all day long that like, this is just a different world today for millennials and Gen Z and everybody. Like, you and I could like, go out, fuck up, recover, and the world wouldn't find out about it. Like, Gen Z has grown up in a world and we are living in a world now. There's like, this possibility that like, the worst 15 seconds of your life, the drunkest, craziest, wildest, will be used as content for millions of people. Like, I understand like, the genuine fear. I have a fear of it, of course I do. You know, there's like, this constant feedback loop and judgment and everything that you do is like, cringe and everybody has like, an opinion about what you're doing, what you're wearing, who you're talking to, how you act. And it's just, it's like, constant. And on top of that, like, wellness has become this status symbol too, which I don't know if that's a bad thing or not, but like,

• 44:46Rayna Greenberg?

  social media in general has glamorized wellness. And so, it's like, but if I don't do those things, is there something wrong with me? And am I cringe if I'm not doing the matchas and the skincare routine and the yoga? And I think there's just so much different about the world.

• 44:59Ashley Hesseltine?

  And maybe overcorrected on wellness and also demonized drinking. Like, let's not do that either. Like, yeah, like, heavy problematic drinking, sure, but like, let's not demonize the people that want to go out and drink still and party and be hungover. This is one thing I love about Tinks. Tinks is a fucking baddie, uber-successful, fashion girl, all the things, gorgeous, really doing it. And she's like, I'm hungover, I got wasted last night. Like, it's refreshing, because she's really still doing it. But I always give grace to Gen Z. They just grew up differently. Social media, of course, a less safe world. Fully going to school in a whole school shooting era, which we're still in. COVID, Trump, AI, all of the things. Like, I can't even

• 45:43Ashley Hesseltine?

  begin to pretend that I would be the same person if I was a Gen Z. Like, let's be so for real. And we talk about some of the Gen Z women that we've gotten to know that have worked for us, namely Bella and Tessa. And I just have all the respect in the world for them. In terms of what we see and like, a stereotype, they are not that and they're built different. And they went out and had so much fun and really grabbed life by the balls and dated a ton. Like, we just love the way that they lived their life and we know they're not the only ones. So we do know that there are younger generation girls in their twenties that are still going out and doing that and thriving and like, having fun and they're really happy. Neither of them had this like, crippling anxiety, the way

• 46:26Ashley Hesseltine?

  they dated. I mean, Bella just got engaged, we loved to see it. And we just love that they, I don't know, they felt like they weren't crippled by the way that they grew up, which I think would be easy to do. And you can't like rewrite history and change the generation that you grew up in and the world that you grew up in, but you can certainly try at any point to live a little looser life, less regimented, less bound to read, all the things. Gen Z or millennial or Gen X, whatever you are. And this is easy to get into this routine. I mean, someone might fall into this type of life in their 50s and be like, I don't want to live like this. I want to get out more and experience more life and find somebody or get married again or find new friends, all of that.

• 47:08Ashley Hesseltine?

  But the article, I wanted to just cite a couple of things. I mean, she writes in and she says, my calendar is color-coded, my mornings are optimized, my weekends are full of all this self actualizing stuff, the run club, pottery class, all this stuff. And she's just worried that she is protecting it too much. I say no to after-work drink or random invite to go out because it's not in the calendar. I'm in bed at a certain time every night to ensure I get enough hours of sleep and I monitor those hours with my Oura ring, like there's some sort of test I'm trying to pass. And she said this, she ran into a guy, he tried to strike up a conversation and instead of leaning into it, I realized I was thinking, oh, he's gonna make me late to the farmer's market, which is like, a nice thing to go to, but you don't have to be there on time or even go at all. And she's replaying an encounter like that and other ones. And she said her entire friend group is like this.

• 47:50Ashley Hesseltine?

  They're all accomplished women, they could be millennial, who say they want to date, yet none of them are actually dating. They get dinner, booked three weeks out naturally and it's the same conversation and every time. Nobody's meeting anyone, nobody has the time. We've all read the same advice about protecting our peace and holding our boundaries and we followed it by the book. We've turned our lives into these beautiful airtight fortresses. And this really stuck out to me. She said, these boundaries were supposed to shield us from being confused and strung along, or from the guy who doesn't text you back for days each time. And it's true, I think boundaries have saved us from many heartbreaks and wasted efforts, but I worry now that we're almost too protected to fall in love or at the very least to have an unexpected meet, cute and flirt. I don't want us to look back on this time in our lives and not have stories to tell because

• 48:30Ashley Hesseltine?

  we were so focused on being productive and safe. And I remember, I think this was the end of 2019, and I use this metaphor that I felt like I was in this snow globe of perfection and my life was perfect and everything, this is before COVID, and everything was so wonderful and we had the best year ever and I had the best friends ever and our career was thriving and I lived in New York City and like, everything was so perfect and I did not want a guy to come in and smash the glass or fuck things up in any way. And I was like, I don't want to date. And that was okay at that time. And we've talked about this too. It's like, you can decide that those moments for yourself, like, I am living this type of life right now and I don't want to be bothered. But when it goes on for months, for years, for a really long time, and then you really are unhappy and you've gone

• 49:15Ashley Hesseltine?

  too far, then you need to make some changes. But like, I really do understand that feeling of like, this is great and I don't want to be bothered. And I feel like you have felt like that at a lot of times. And it didn't stop you from meeting someone and dating him this summer. You know, like, I would say you were in that headspace last year, earlier this year, off and on, where you're like, I don't want to be bothered.

• 49:39Rayna Greenberg?

  You can run the tape. I've said this a million times on the show, so I don't want to be contradictory. There's been so many times in the show, I've said like, my life is really great and I have these like, incredible friends. I don't need to run the list. But like, I have a life I really love and like, I don't want you to come in here and mess it up. Or like, why would I get up off the couch at the end of the day after I've worked and I've like, done things that are good for my body and I've talked to my friends and I called my father and like, why would I go meet a stranger? I'm exhausted. Like, I am so guilty of it. I've been guilty of this, you know, for years, but I want different things in life. First of all, I don't want children. So, the the drive towards finding somebody, there's not a time clock on me. So like, I adhere to like, a different set of standards for myself. And I think I haven't felt a huge deficit in my life

• 50:22Rayna Greenberg?

  without romance, but if I did, I would have to break the glass, so to speak, of what you said. Like, I think that dating is inherently scary and being in the gray area with somebody is scary and I think it fucks up your routine. Just having somebody in your life fucks up your routine. Do you want somebody in your life? It's gonna fuck your routine up. It is. And I validate that people want to like, feel good and work out, get eight hours of sleep. I know that exact feeling of like, I have to get to the farmer's market before these two vendors like, sell out of this thing that I buy every week. And like, I can see myself like, running out of there. And sometimes I'm just like, why? Like, I always joke, I'm like, not the fun friend. I always go to bed early. I never want to go to the next place. But like, when I say yes, I always enjoy it and I'm in spaces where I like,

• 51:04Rayna Greenberg?

  me, actually, the guy that I met who I was dating, I almost skipped the trip where we met him. I was like, I don't need to go to this.

• 51:11Ashley Hesseltine?

  Yeah, we weren't gonna let you skip that trip, but you did try.

• 51:14Rayna Greenberg?

  I did try. But like, saying yes to things is important. And when I do, I'm like, really excited about it. And I think it like, introduces me to people I would have never met and it puts me in spaces that I would have never been in. And I just don't want to be contradictory with what I've said, because many times on the show, I've said like, I don't want to be bothered. And like, that's a real feeling. But if you want to find a romantic connection, you have to be bothered. You just have to.

• 51:37Ashley Hesseltine?

  Yeah. And again, like I guess my point is like you can kind of ebb and flow and you can take a pause from dating if you're feeling exhausted by it. But the advice columnist says, it sounds like you haven't just boundaried yourself out of dating, you've boundaried yourself out of living and out of pleasure and out of the friction of life that's uncomfortable, but worth it. And it's not all about dating and finding somebody and centering men. It's just even having fun nights out with the girls or these core memories of those nights. And listen, sometimes you say yes to a thing and you go out and you stay out all night and it sucks. And you're like, I wish I'd never left the house. But if you live like that, you're never going to have the good moments too. And her advice was just to start small,

• 52:21Ashley Hesseltine?

  to take baby steps towards full, full on ferality. Put it in the counter that you'll have a chaos night with a particularly spontaneous friend and say yes to a last minute invitation. Like, I do think these things can start with baby steps. I mean, maybe you need a vacation. If that's something that you can afford, you have the time off to really let loose, like a trip, especially a slutty trip can really be a reset. We had Alyssa, our friend on years ago, who talked about this vacation she took, really unlocked something in her and she found her husband the second she got back. I think she matched with him on Hinge when she was on the trip. Like, it just made her feel really free and good about herself and confident. And so I think it's just clocking it. The person who wrote this in and anyone else is feeling that way, if you are recognizing this, you're already on the right path. The

• 53:06Ashley Hesseltine?

  next time you just want to rush off to the farmer's market or you get a last minute invitation, you're like, oh, but I have Pilates in the morning or whatever. Like, just think about it. Just think about doing something a little bit differently every once in a while and making those like small changes, even going out on a weeknight. I mean, that's another thing we wanted to cite was this Instagram post from the Every Girl who said, we used to go out on Tuesdays. What happened? The death of the casual weeknight hang, which just, you know, it's like, go off for a drink on a Tuesday and you say like, you'll be tired tomorrow, or you have groceries at home, or you have Pilates the next morning. So you stay in and it says, we accidentally made hanging out on a Tuesday feel irresponsible.

• 53:46Ashley Hesseltine?

  So what really replaced happy hour? Crunchy wellness routines, meal prepping, sleep goals, protein goals, not wanting to drink, laundry, hobbies, work from home. And they gave some stats as well. Even the stats say that we've become more boring. Gen Z millennials drive 41% of all US wellness spending. Americans spend 50% less time at parties than they did 20 years ago. We spend just 35 minutes a day socializing. Adults under 35 are drinking less than ever, 72% to 62% in two decades. So it dropped 10%. And 35% of workers now work from home, making after work plans less spontaneous, which that makes sense. Like, we didn't work from home back in our day either like that. I had a few times where

• 54:31Ashley Hesseltine?

  I did, but I still prioritize my partying. But I understand too, that if you're working from home all day, then you really do have to like go out. But we found this post really interesting.

• 54:42Rayna Greenberg?

  The, the work thing is such a difference between like how life was. I mean, I just, I was already out in my twenties. I didn't have to like go out. It was easier, you know, and I want to validate that. I was dressed, I had makeup on, I was at the office, I was around people my age and it was just natural and normal to like go out and socialize. And I think about all the times that I want to just like stay at home because I love my home. I have designed it to be wonderful and comfy and getting enough sleep is so important to me and not waking up with a hangover is so important to me. But like, even this weekend, like I did a bunch of stuff that I was like, oh, I don't want to go do this. But then I did it. And I was like, I connected with people, I had great conversations. Like, I'm not having any new experiences in this apartment. I am watching the same TV shows. I masturbate and go to sleep. Like, I'm not living life. I feel good in the morning and that's great.

• 55:26Rayna Greenberg?

  But to me, like, life is lived in those tiny moments when I actually leave the house. And it's important to me to like, have stories and have things to talk about. I think it just makes you a more resilient, interesting person in general. Nothing interesting happens to me here. I'm not becoming more interesting or dynamic in this house at all.

• 55:42Ashley Hesseltine?

  In this house, yeah. And I mean, listen, I certainly don't drink as much as I, I used to. I don't want to feel bad. You know, I hate it. And so I understand that too. This wasn't really something I cared much about when I was younger. I didn't get as bad hangovers. And I was like, I just dealt with them differently. But I understand you don't want to feel bad. You don't want to feel these things. And so it doesn't have to be about drinking, you know, it can just be about like leaving the house. And it doesn't have to be expensive. You know, there was a lot of pushback on that post of money or lack thereof, which obviously is a huge part of the conversation. And I do understand and empathize. And if you can't do a thing because you truly cannot afford it, that's fine. This does not always go to an expensive dinner on a Tuesday. Maybe that's not in the cards and I didn't really

• 56:26Ashley Hesseltine?

  take that as the takeaway from this post. I, I think that we're talking more about the sentiment of, I don't want to be tired or I have a workout or it's just skipping anything spontaneous with your friends because you have to stick to your routine. And I want to say, I really do empathize with having a job that you feel overworked and underpaid and tired. And I had a job like that in my twenties where I was like, I have to work all the time. I don't love this job and I'm not making money. That's the worst. Because you're like, I'm not having fun at work and I'm annoyed that I'm even here, but this is where I may spend all my time and I'm not making money. Like, and I can't go to the mall this weekend and blow off some steam. And I can't afford this fancy dinner without overdrafting my account. I mean, I still probably went. But, you know, like I was

• 57:10Ashley Hesseltine?

  irresponsible. But it's just like, it sucks. And so I just want to validate that. And people aren't making enough money to live these days. And so I do get it. But the answer is not just to stay in and beer recluse. I mean, you can go to trivia and get a couple pitchers of cheap beer. You can host people at your house. You can go to the park on a nice day. Right? I've never been to the park in New York City on a beautiful day and not met people at the picnic next to us. Like, stuff is just getting outside sometimes. Like, that's it.

• 57:39Rayna Greenberg?

  I think actually probably my number one social activity is taking walks. Do you know how many walks I take with our friends? That's like, that's the activity. And yeah, I really, we both do want to validate how fucking expensive everything is. I mean, even in the last couple of years, I have noticed just like the price of menu items, the price of flights, hotels, just everything. And then you add in this like extra pressure of like social media and this like desire to like, look really great. And so you have to spend more money on outfits and on makeup and skincare routines. And it has gotten so expensive to walk out the door because you want to like look a certain way. And I don't know what the answer to that is. Just like, I go out looking ugly all the time, you guys. Who cares? You know, just like spend less and go out looking ugly. But I understand that things have costed a lot more. But you don't have to go out and drink and do all

• 58:24Rayna Greenberg?

  this stuff. I mean, Emily and I sat on her couch on Saturday night and we walked and got ice cream and then went back to her house. We didn't drink. And it was just like, a nice sober night with one of my best friends. And I'm like, so glad that I went out and did that, connected with somebody, you know?

• 58:37Ashley Hesseltine?

  Yeah. Can you go out to dinner and sit at the bar with your friend and try to people watch or meet new people or whatever? And for the cost of the Pilates class, probably. How much these workout classes cost? You know, like, if you feel like you have no money to spend recreationally at all, that's understandable. But are your priorities out of whack? How much are you spending on workout classes? If you belong to Equinox and you don't have a social life and you're not dating, suck with Equinox and spend money going out and getting drunk. I'm just kidding. But it's just like, think about where you want to just like be out in the world. And I can't stress enough that it's not necessarily all about drinking. But if you are in the house doom scrolling, go get a coffee with a friend

• 59:21Ashley Hesseltine?

  or alone. Like, go to a coffee shop and sit there and be in the world. Because it will make you feel better than being at home alone on your phone or being a home alone meal prepping.

• 59:31Rayna Greenberg?

  I think we're just like so much like, I don't want to disturb my peace. That's what everybody's like boundaried up. I don't want to disturb my peace. And I think you have to accept some like very low stakes discomfort. And maybe it is just like staying out for that extra hour in the evening or skipping the workout class or just like doing something to break your routine. I know it's annoying, but like, I wrote down this quote, like, I want to find a life that is well-lived and not just well-managed. And

• 59:56Ashley Hesseltine?

  Hmm. Oh, I love that.

• 59:59Rayna Greenberg?

  I want to like, I want to look back and feel like I did all these things and I didn't just spend my life trying to like, boundary up and feel physically good. Those things are very important to Ashley and I, especially as I get older, I'm just not out as much. But like, I want to look back and be like, I had so much fun this weekend. I did all these things. I saw all these people, I connected with all these people. It doesn't have to be drinking. Like, I mean, we have demonized drinking and partying. And I've been seeing all these TikToks that make me laugh, like the Gen Z party girl renaissance. And it's so funny that like, we have to like, give permission to people to go out and party.

• 1:00:31Ashley Hesseltine?

  Sad.

• 1:00:31Rayna Greenberg?

  It is. If you really want to go out and party, like, join them. And if you don't want to do that, don't demonize it. Because it's nice, those experiences. I just like, I was walking Emily's on Saturday night and I walked all through the West Village and then the East Village. And I just saw so many girls out, just like packed into a table, just looking beautiful. It's like perfume everywhere. And like, I just thought like, man, it is so wonderful to like be that age and be out in the world and like slam like eight girls into a booth if it's four and just like share all these stories and make mistakes and wake up the next morning and you're on the group chat talking shit about it. I feel like nostalgic for how beautiful those times are with your friends. It's like important to do them.

• 1:01:08Ashley Hesseltine?

  Totally. And I think that correcting on the binge drinking culture that we had is still good.

• 1:01:15Rayna Greenberg?

  Yeah.

• 1:01:15Ashley Hesseltine?

  Like, we were like blacking out. And I don't recommend it. You know, like, I think that this happy place could be really healthy for a lot of people who are of a certain age, you know, your twenties, your early thirties. I mean, I don't drink a ton now in my forties. But like, I think there needed to be a little bit of, of correction and we've overcorrected and let's meet back in The middle where we're you're you're going out and you're having a good time again. Don't drink if you don't want to, but it's not what we did because I wasn't healthy either. We had fun, but I don't remember a lot of those nights. I was always getting injured, broke my foot, didn't have health insurance.

• 1:01:51Rayna Greenberg?

  Ashley, I left my phone in a cab like the other day.

• 1:01:53Ashley Hesseltine?

  Oh, my God. I couldn't keep a phone for six months. I mean, it was so bad.

• 1:01:58Rayna Greenberg?

  I cycled through them.

• 1:01:59Ashley Hesseltine?

  Oh, my God. Nightmare. A lot of this stuff was traumatizing. I think we're glamorizing a little bit, but you know, we survived it. Okay. Well, let's just take a quick break and then we will pick it back up.

• 1:02:11Rayna Greenberg?

  All right. I'm telling you guys about truly the only bras that I wear, the only pajamas that I wear, and that's Skims. I mean, I just love what they're doing and their cotton fabrics are the best. I wear all of their pajamas, but they have these cotton jersey fold over pants that Ashley and I love. And you can pair them with these cotton rib tanks and the quality is so fantastic. I don't know what they're doing over there at Skims, but like it holds up when I like, I wash it time and time and time again. It's unbelievably soft. I've had some of this stuff for years and I love that they're constantly like creating new styles. There are a ton of colors to choose from and there's a ton of sizes. So they're very inclusive in everything when it comes to sizing, which is really important. And there's a lot to choose from. And truly like when it comes to cotton basics, nothing beats Skims. I just love what they got going on. The T-shirts. So anything like cotton jersey

• 1:02:56Rayna Greenberg?

  fabric, fantastic. And this is really good gift, I think, for people. So like, if you're ever wondering, like, I mean, Ashley and I like took a trip with a friend. We're like, what should we get her? And I was like pajamas. Like, it's just such a nice gift to get somebody or a significant other. Everything feels great. It's the only bras I wear truly. And you guys can shop Skims Cotton and all of our favorite pieces at skims.com. After you place your order, be sure to let them know we sent you. Select podcast in the survey. Be sure to select our show in the drop down menu that follows.

• 1:03:25Ashley Hesseltine?

  Yeah, those fold over pants with the rib tank. I have like, like gray, pink and black, the set, like to wear around the house.

• 1:03:31Rayna Greenberg?

  Jealous of you, all those colors.

• 1:03:32Ashley Hesseltine?

  Okay. Well, I'm telling you guys about Hungry Root. Listen, we still want you to be making food at home and staying healthy some nights of the week. And that is where Hungry Root comes in. It makes it so easy to eat healthy and have your groceries delivered to your home. So you don't have to go out and make a bunch of trips to the grocery store. So we just really love it. And this is great as we head back into the fall, back to school. Maybe summer was a little chaotic, like we were mentioning, and now you do want to get back in a little bit more of a routine, especially with what you're eating. So I have been doing a lot of high protein. I love like a protein, like a ground beef with like a sweet potato, like the cottage cheese, the avocado, the hot honey, like that bowl. So I love meals like that. And just, we've been doing a lot of bowls around the

• 1:04:16Ashley Hesseltine?

  house and I love their meats. I think that quality meat is so important, especially in this day and age, knowing where it comes from and knowing that you can trust it. So I really love to get the meat and the chicken and the fish. And also the vegetables are really great, too. The snacks. Hungry Root keeps getting more personalized by learning your taste and dietary needs over time. It knows what you actually want and keeps refining what you get. And there are over 50,000 chef crafted recipes. Many are ready in just 15 minutes and the variety never gets old. There's always something new to try. So we just love it. Again, there's all these recipes. They're going to send you everything. You can make them. They're super, super easy if you want, but you can get more complicated ones as well. And this is just really going to help your eating, get consistent, staying healthy. No better time than to try this out for the fall. You are going to love Hungry Root as

• 1:04:58Ashley Hesseltine?

  much as we do. For a limited time, get 40% off your first order plus a free item in every box for life. Go to hungryroot.com/gge and use code GGE. That's hungryroot.com/gge code GGE to get 40% off your first box and a free item of your choice for life.

• 1:05:13Rayna Greenberg?

  This episode is sponsored by BetterHelp. So think about if you could wake up tomorrow and make one thing better, what would it be? And this episode is perfect for that because it is just like, what are tiny routines I can change in my life to just feel better? Obviously, if you want to talk about socializing or your romantic life, therapy can really, really help you suss out these things. Better is a feeling defined by you. And for BetterHelp, it's a BetterHelp therapist who really gets you. It's a focus on global emotional wellbeing with thousands of therapists and millions of members in over 100 countries. It's progress and it's getting better, whatever you want it to be. Maybe you want to be more present with your friends or your kids. Maybe you want to shop less online. Maybe you want to figure out how to work your routine into also dating. So how can I

• 1:05:58Rayna Greenberg?

  get better at, I want to work out and be good at my actual job and I want to sleep well, but I also want to like date and I want to figure out how to like, cut through the noise of all this advice that you get online about dating and where your boundaries should be. And therapy can really help with that. You can sign up and get 10% off at betterhelp.com/gge. That's betterhelp, H E L P, dot com slash G G E.

• 1:06:23Ashley Hesseltine?

  You know what I did want to say is when we talk about the drinking and the way that culture has shifted is the good news is if you aren't into drinking and you don't want to, there are so many other options that we did not have. Like, that really was what you went out and did. Like, I didn't know anyone in a run club, you know, like I didn't know there was sober bars, like there was nothing like that. So I feel like I didn't know anybody that was sober, even sober curious back in my 20s, really. But that's so much more prevalent today. And there's so many more social activities to do that don't involve drinking.

• 1:06:55Rayna Greenberg?

  Yeah.

• 1:06:56Ashley Hesseltine?

  So it's just like, you can leave the house and do all these things and socialize and date and everything with more options.

• 1:07:03Rayna Greenberg?

  You want to qualify this as a couple times episode, but like, obviously, we're not advocates for like getting hammered drunk and pounding alcohol. And so many of our friends don't drink. I mean, we have more sober friends than ever, but it doesn't stop me from being around them. And we will have an episode with a friend of ours who has gotten sober and she will talk all about like what that's been like to, you know, learn how to socialize in spaces where either people are drinking and she doesn't want to, or just finding other alternative activities. And I think the world, fortunately, is now built to have more activities that don't include that. I mean, that is something I miss about living in California. I mean, it is just really optimized for outdoor activities.

• 1:07:39Ashley Hesseltine?

  And just less drinking in general, like when you're out, like every time you go out, there's a mocktail menu, you know, and which I do think mocktails should be less expensive, but sometimes they're not. And it just seems like it really caters to that audience, which is nice.

• 1:07:54Rayna Greenberg?

  I agree. I think the other part of this is that like, not only have we like boundaried up with our routines, it's just that there's, we've talked about this before, there's so much noise on the internet about what you should do in dating. And every single person with access to like a chat GPT script is on the internet yelling at you like, you should do this and draw this boundary. And if he says this, then you do this. And I am bothered by it because I think it is making every single person be so nervous about what is going to happen. And you just sort of forget the human aspect of dating. Like, people are just human and they're going to make mistakes and you can't boundary up all the time. And Ashley and I could not advocate more for you guys to be treated well and with dignity and to feel safe all the time. But like, outside of that, I was watching this TikTok

• 1:08:39Rayna Greenberg?

  and this girl was like, so I had this really good date the other night. He was awesome. And for our second date, we were making plans and at 7:00 PM, I was like, okay, so when are you going to send a car? And he was like, I wasn't going to send a car. And I canceled the date on him. And now I'm having a wonderful night at home with my skincare and my glass of wine alone. And I, I thought like, okay, I mean, if that's what brings you joy, then that's great.

• 1:09:01Ashley Hesseltine?

  Is that rage bait?

• 1:09:03Rayna Greenberg?

  I hate this advice of like people. I mean, I've always hated this advice that people owe you money. And if you want your boundary to be that every time you go on a date with somebody, you have to send an Uber. I mean, you're welcome to do whatever you want. But I hated this advice of like, I met this person who's a nice person that I liked. And because they didn't spend enough money, maybe they were going to pay for the whole date. Maybe they're going to Uber you back home.

• 1:09:23Ashley Hesseltine?

  Yeah, they probably were.

• 1:09:24Rayna Greenberg?

  It's crazy advice. And I think so much of it's also contradictory. And I have a friend that's like dealing with this guy right now. And she's like, I like everything about him, but I don't hear from him. He's just not a good texter. And like, I will text him and I won't hear back for like eight hours. And every piece of advice on the internet is like, he doesn't like you. Cut him off. If he doesn't check in with you every single day, all day long, fuck that guy. And she was like, I feel that I'm inundated with all this advice that says he doesn't like me, but all of his other behavior says he really likes me a lot and he values me. And she was like, I'm a smart adult and even I like get stuck in the noise of all this. So I think it's just hard to push through that noise.

• 1:10:02Ashley Hesseltine?

  Yeah. And it's so much of that, again, a lot of it's been written with AI and it lacks nuance completely. So there is that. And we're going to talk about this next week with Cal T. And I just think, like, You gotta marry the guy that checks the boxes, most of them treats you a certain type of way. But if you're just dating, like, I don't know, sometimes it's not that deep. You really don't want to date people that make you feel bad about yourself. But sometimes you can let them get away with a little bit of bad behavior and this, you want to get laid or have a good night out. I don't know. I just think it's like, again, I'm not advocating for giving your time and energy to shitty people, but it's just like,

• 1:10:44Ashley Hesseltine?

  I do think there's a world in which we all can just relax a little bit, you know, and maybe everyone is not checking every husband box, but they're not terrible and making you feel terrible about yourself and you can have fun, you know?

• 1:11:00Rayna Greenberg?

  Yeah, I think that we're constantly, and I'm guilty of it too. I think all people are guilty of it. You go on a date and you're like constantly looking for every red flag and every deal breaker. And you're like, okay, I clocked this one hour in. And so I'm not going to go out with them a second time. And it's like, life is more nuanced than that. You kind of don't always know, like, why somebody acts a certain way. And there are certain things that are like a no go for me. If somebody says, all my exes are crazy. I mean, you kind of just know that that's the way that they see everybody that they date. And that could be a problem, you know? I think we're always like, I don't want to get hurt. So let me collect every single piece of information and clue. And I do think it has just kind of walled us off from just letting, letting people just be people a little bit. Like, I can't imagine what it is, but I'm sure that I do things to piss

• 1:11:42Rayna Greenberg?

  people off and that gives somebody the ick on a date. And like, I would like the grace of somebody just getting below the surface a little bit more before writing me off entirely. Like, I don't know. I mean, I think that people might be like, I want my person to have a specific relationship with their family. I want them to have a good relationship with both of their parents. And I worry about telling people that I don't have a relationship with my mother on a first date, because like, what that says about me. But they have no idea why I don't have a relationship with my mother and why that might be and how hard that's been for me. And it's so deep and nuanced. And I think that

• 1:12:12Ashley Hesseltine?

  Right.

• 1:12:12Rayna Greenberg?

  That's just a small example, but like, we write people off for a lot of things. And it's not necessarily what you think it is, I guess.

• 1:12:19Ashley Hesseltine?

  Totally. Yes, there should be some deal breakers. I mean, I think someone should respect your time. I think there are basic manners of dating. And I also think racism, misogyny, all those things, you know, maybe a criminal record depends on what the crime is, certain things like that. Like, you can really call those deal breakers.

• 1:12:34Rayna Greenberg?

  Depends on the crime.

• 1:12:36Ashley Hesseltine?

  The over icking, I think we talked about that with Amy Chan at length. Then you can go back and listen to that episode from a few months ago at this point. And I just think that's really important to remember. And you wrote something in our outline that I really like, that being out in the world and having some of this friction makes you resilient. And when you leave the house, you run the risk of having an awkward conversation. When you, you make plans, especially when you make new friends, you run the risk of those plans falling apart. When you date, you run the risk of being rejected. You know, there's always these risks that you might have to leave the house and be out in the world and be vulnerable and open yourself up to new people and figure stuff out. And

• 1:13:18Ashley Hesseltine?

  you could get hurt or get rejected. But those are what creates resiliency and confidence in yourself and life experience.

• 1:13:25Rayna Greenberg?

  Yeah, I agree. And I think you and I've had so many weird, awkward, funny, insane experiences. And like, I'm proud to have those, even though in the moment, I'm like, what the fuck? Because it's something I'm gonna talk to my friends about. It's just, I don't know, I get joy from it. I'm not doing things for the plot, but like, not anymore, or else I would have fucked that 21 year old. But

• 1:13:46Ashley Hesseltine?

  There's still time.

• 1:13:48Rayna Greenberg?

  But like, I, I love all the experiences you and I have had. Like, I would have never tried stand up at 40 years old if I was like terrified to walk out the door. Just all these things. And also, when you meet people who've like never been through anything, you're just like, ew, what am I going to talk to you about?

• 1:14:04Ashley Hesseltine?

  Yeah. And I, I think, you know, people just want to stay in a controlled environment at all times. I mean, if you really have like crippling anxiety every time you leave the house, of course, I, that's understandable. I think Liz Moody is a great resource for that. We had her on our podcast and she had, is it agoraphobia? Like, she couldn't leave the house. And I, I really love her content. I mean, we've mentioned Tinks, we have mentioned Amy Chan. And Liz Moody is someone that I would really recommend consuming her content. I think she puts out some of the best content on the internet, her podcast, her social media posts, and that she does have anxiety. And she does feel terrified to do things. And she talks about common struggles and never any long-term relationship in marriage, and how she works through those things and challenges herself. And I think those things

• 1:14:47Ashley Hesseltine?

  are like very important, especially coming from someone who's like, I couldn't leave the house. Because I was, it was so debilitating. And here's how far I've come. And I guess like a final sentiment I just wanted to say was, when your life gets too regimented, you run the risk of being able to let someone into it. And I think about this with men and women. We've talked about guys on this podcast for years that too strict of a gym routine, or a diet, or even every weekend, they have to do something the same. Every Saturday, they have to watch football all day. They have to golf every day. Like, that strictness that doesn't allow for the spontaneity, and you have to be so regimented, is just

• 1:15:27Ashley Hesseltine?

  not what I want. And it might work for some people, and those two people might come together and have a beautiful relationship. But it's like, I guess this also boils down to be the type of person you want to date. And so if you find yourself being like, I don't want to date someone that has that too regimented, and I won't be able to fit into their life, don't be that person either.

• 1:15:47Rayna Greenberg?

  I love that sentiment. And like, I think if you're like worried, like, I think I have walled everything off to the point that like, I can't find my way back. Like, you can. I worried about that a little bit myself.

• 1:15:58Ashley Hesseltine?

  Oh, my God.

• 1:15:58Rayna Greenberg?

  I mean, I did really worry about it. And like, I was talking about to the guy I was dating, and I said to him, like, it's nice, like, his shit was just like all over my place. And I was trying to work while he was here. And our plans were like crazy. We're like going to meet a lot of people. And I was like, I said, it's, it's nice to remember that I can like, enjoy those moments, actually. Like, I worried a little bit that like, I need my house to be a very specific amount of clean. And I need to like, do things at the exact same time every day. And like, I remembered that I can be comfortable breaking those routines and letting somebody in. And like, that's a nice feeling. Even if you're like, I think I've walled everything off. Like, you haven't. And it's never like too late to just like make little changes.

• 1:16:34Ashley Hesseltine?

  Yeah. No one's gonna come arrest you because you didn't follow your morning routine. You know, I mean, I think it was Kat Cohen. I think she was on maybe Last Cultureist and like her thing, her like, I don't think so, honey, was just a routine at all. Like, that sounds so boring. How, why would you start your day like that? Why would you start your day in doing the same thing every day? That's, and I'm not saying, I totally agree.

• 1:16:56Rayna Greenberg?

  We do, I do.

• 1:16:58Ashley Hesseltine?

  I love the take that it was just like, ew, what do you mean? You don't just let the day take you where it wants to take you. You only live once. And that reminds me that we did crowdsource you guys. And we wanted to just share a few things from our audience. We did ask, do you feel like your boundaries and/or routine are stopping you from having fun, meeting people, dating, et cetera? And we, we got a lot of responses. I mean, people just saying, yes, like, the anxiety of not having my laundry done, or a house cleaned before Monday. And, you know, someone said, kind of this, kind of echoed the same thing of like, especially on a Sunday, trying to get my life together for the week. Do you know what? Think great. Don't even go out on a Sunday. I think Sunday's gonna be very fun. But like, then don't do that. You know, like, if you were like, if I'm not locked

• 1:17:40Ashley Hesseltine?

  in on a Sunday, it ruins my whole week, then don't ruin your whole week. Go out on a Tuesday or Wednesday.

• 1:17:45Rayna Greenberg?

  But can I tell you, like, this morning, I had this whole plan for my Monday morning. And I was gonna like, go, and I was gonna like, drop my clothing off at the tailor to get alterations done. I was gonna like, have breakfast at this place across the street that I like. I was gonna work on our episode at Soho House. And like, I was just gonna do all these things. And like, I had to not drink, and I had to go to bed in order to do that. And instead, I stayed out really late last night and I drank a ton. And I had the best time. Like, and I, I didn't wake up and do those things this morning. And you know what? I lived. Like, I, it's hard for me to talk myself out of it. Because like, I make this plan. I'm excited to have my little plan. But like, I didn't get my jeans altered this morning. And like, you know what? My life still went on. And I

• 1:18:21Ashley Hesseltine?

  Yes. And nobody arrested you.

• 1:18:25Ashley Hesseltine?

  And I get the bedtime thing. I need sleep too. But like, there has been times when I have not gotten nearly enough sleep, just a few hours. And the night before was so fun. I'm running on adrenaline the next morning. You know, like, that shit keeps you going. Fun times can account for lack of sleep. Someone wrote, no, but recently I started to make it a point to have at least one to two fun weeknight plans. And I can confirm life is better. I really like that. Someone wrote, no, I finally feel fucking peace. And go off.

• 1:18:55Rayna Greenberg?

  Like, great.

• 1:18:56Ashley Hesseltine?

  If you feel peace and contentment and happiness, we support you, whatever you're doing, 100%.

• 1:19:04Rayna Greenberg?

  I just, I don't really want to get to the end of my week and just feel like I didn't do anything. But listen, sometimes I do want to get through three days and not talk to anybody or see anybody. And that is what brings me peace. And I need to reset. Like, you and I have different type of social batteries. Like, you, you would be out socializing seven days a week. Like, you just love to be around people.

• 1:19:21Ashley Hesseltine?

  Yeah. Yeah. And I, I don't, like, if there's been too many nights where we just like cook dinner and watch something, I don't like it. And I'm like, we gotta go do something. If I'm not, Shashank is not like that. Like, he'll go either way. He'll, he will go out every night of the week, or he'll stay home every night of the week. Like, he'd really go with the flow like that. But I just can't do it. A few others. Someone wrote, absolutely, I'm worried I'm becoming too comfortable being alone in my routine. But it's like, the fact that you even took the time to write in and acknowledge it is the first step. And like, I have hope for you. And then someone wrote, sometimes I forget that I'm here once and maybe loosen up the routine of life. Like, that's what it is. You know?

• 1:19:59Rayna Greenberg?

  Yeah.

• 1:19:59Ashley Hesseltine?

  We only live once. We are all gonna die in 10 years, thanks to AI. And why not have some fun? You know?

• 1:20:08Ashley Hesseltine?

  Loosen the grip.

• 1:20:09Rayna Greenberg?

  Well, we support whatever's gonna bring you guys peace. But if you feel like your routine is giving you more anxiety, then, you know, go out, get drunk, do something crazy, make some mistakes, don't get drunk, but like, make some plans, you know, and just like, forget about all this therapy speak and what you should be doing, people shaming you for not partying. Just go out and have fun and enjoy your life.

• 1:20:27Ashley Hesseltine?

  Yeah, be with your friends, date or not, but don't sit at home and doom scroll. Because that's only gonna make your life worse. So, thank you guys for listening, of course. GirlsGottaEat.com is our website. GirlsGottaEat Podcast on Instagram and TikTok. I am Ash Hess on Instagram and TikTok. Raina is Rayna Greenberg, RainaGreenberg.com. You know, get some friends and go to her shows this fall. If you have not gotten tickets, this is such a fun outing. And most of them are on the weeknights. So this is my challenge. If you have not gotten tickets, one friend, two friends, three friends, four friends, whoever it is, get tickets to see Raina and have fun on a fucking weeknight. RainaGreenberg.com.

• 1:21:05Rayna Greenberg?

  7pm shows, 7pm shows, you guys. I, because I would like to be out on a weeknight after this, you know? I go to, I'm at dinner by 8:45.

• 1:21:13Ashley Hesseltine?

  You guys are gonna have the best night. And maybe go to late dinner after, grab a drink after. Can you imagine? On a Wednesday? You can watch a full video on Spotify and YouTube. Share this episode with a friend. Be safe, but have fun out there, you guys. And we will see you Thursday.

• 1:21:30Rayna Greenberg?

  Have a good week, guys.

• 1:21:31Ashley Hesseltine?

  Bye.

• 1:21:58Speaker 02

  Fall never arrives all at once. First the air, then the light. And slowly, the things you love begin to find each other. A jacket meets a dress, a hoodie slips beneath a blazer, an old cap finds a new scarf. Because you don't simply step into the season, you create it layer by layer, until it finally feels like fall. Find fall your way at Ross.