Cosmic Queries – The Deep

Why are we here? Who are we? What is the meaning of life? Neil deGrasse Tyson and comic co-host Chuck Nice answer fan-submitted Cosmic Queries on a range of topics that stem from the deepest thoughts, ideas, and feelings we share about our place in the universe. Originally Aired September 27, 2019.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Hey Startalkins, Neil here. You're about to listen to an episode specially drawn from our archives to serve your cosmic curiosities. Check it out. Welcome to StarTalk, your place in the universe where science and pop culture collide. StarTalk begins right now. Today it's Cosmic Queries. That's one of our favorite forms of the show.

• 0:32Chuck Nice?

  Everybody loves it.

• 0:33Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Everybody loves it.

• 0:34Chuck Nice?

  Everybody loves it.

• 0:35Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Everybody loves it. And we are in fact educated people.

• 0:42Chuck Nice?

  Yeah, I know. My mom is spinning in her grave right now.

• 0:46Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So, but this is Cosmic Queries of a topic we've never solicited before.

• 0:51Chuck Nice?

  No, we have not.

• 0:52Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah.

• 0:53Chuck Nice?

  And the topic is the deep, deep space, deep thoughts.

• 0:59Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Deep questions.

• 1:00Chuck Nice?

  Deep questions.

• 1:01Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Well, Chuck, you gotta give it in your deepest voice.

• 1:05Chuck Nice?

  Okay, here we go.

• 1:06Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And by the way, we did this once.

• 1:07Chuck Nice?

  Yes, we did.

• 1:08Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And I think, I, I think I beat you by a half a tone or something. Just bear, let me hear it.

• 1:13Chuck Nice?

  Here we go.

• 1:14Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Right.

• 1:15Chuck Nice?

  Deep thoughts.

• 1:16Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Deep thoughts.

• 1:17Chuck Nice?

  Yeah, you got me already, yeah. See, I gotta drink scotch the night before.

• 1:21Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And smoke a cigar.

• 1:23Chuck Nice?

  Yeah, I gotta smoke a cigar and drink some.

• 1:24Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Smoke and alcohol just fix that right up.

• 1:26Chuck Nice?

  But then it becomes like a Deep Boys and like somewhat Harvey Fierstein.

• 1:31Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Oh, raspy.

• 1:32Chuck Nice?

  Yeah. It's like raspy. Deep thoughts.

• 1:35Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Thoughts.

• 1:36Chuck Nice?

  Oh my god.

• 1:37Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  If you put on the accent.

• 1:38Chuck Nice?

  Deep thoughts.

• 1:40Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Thoughts. Scotch doesn't give you the Harvey Fierstein accent.

• 1:46Chuck Nice?

  That'd be pretty cool if it did, a couple scotches.

• 1:51Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Deep, deep.

• 1:52Chuck Nice?

  Can someone call me an oob? I've had too much to drink.

• 1:57Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Deep.

• 1:57Chuck Nice?

  All right.

• 1:58Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  All right, let's get deep.

• 1:59Chuck Nice?

  Let's get.

• 2:00Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I like deep thoughts, because usually there isn't a right answer, so you just get to sort of play with it and see where it takes you.

• 2:05Chuck Nice?

  Yeah, man, so this is deep questions only.

• 2:08Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  All right, let's do it.

• 2:09Chuck Nice?

  So, uh.

• 2:10Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So, is it from our fanbase?

• 2:11Chuck Nice?

  It's from our fanbase, and here's the question from Jonathan Wax. And Jonathan says, or asks, what boggles your mind more than the thought of endless time or the thought of endless space? So it's impossible to truly contemplate endless time, because you would spend the rest of your existence doing so.

• 2:37Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Well, here's, two things boggle me.

• 2:42Chuck Nice?

  Okay.

• 2:44Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  There's a beautiful frontier of research going on in the field of neuroscience.

• 2:49Chuck Nice?

  Oh, interesting.

• 2:51Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So I have two questions related to that, that boggle my mind.

• 2:54Chuck Nice?

  Okay. I'm gonna write these down.

• 2:57Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Can the human brain

• 3:03Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  figure out the human mind?

• 3:07Chuck Nice?

  It's a great question.

• 3:08Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  If it is the human brain.

• 3:10Chuck Nice?

  That actually creates the human mind.

• 3:11Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Creates the human mind.

• 3:12Chuck Nice?

  Hmm. That's a, that's a good question.

• 3:15Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  That's what I'm saying.

• 3:15Chuck Nice?

  Yeah.

• 3:15Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Or do you need something outside of that?

• 3:18Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 3:19Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  That is greater, smarter, different, so that it can come in and then understand that as its own test, test kitchen?

• 3:27Chuck Nice?

  Wow.

• 3:29Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Now, Carl Sagan has famously said.

• 3:31Chuck Nice?

  Go ahead.

• 3:32Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  That humans are the universe's way

• 3:37Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  to understand itself.

• 3:40Chuck Nice?

  The universe is understanding itself through humans.

• 3:43Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Through humans, correct. Without humans, there'd be no thoughts.

• 3:46Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 3:46Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  To do that. But however, that elevates us higher than I'm prepared to do so.

• 3:53Chuck Nice?

  You think so, yeah.

• 3:54Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Because who says we are the measure of what is intelligent in this universe?

• 3:58Chuck Nice?

  Well, we do.

• 3:59Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah, we do, exactly.

• 4:00Chuck Nice?

  So.

• 4:01Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Exactly.

• 4:02Chuck Nice?

  Yeah.

• 4:02Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So.

• 4:03Chuck Nice?

  That, so that statement, that Carl Sagan statement, is kind of like a cosmological Descartes. That's like the universe, the Descartes.

• 4:12Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Oh, I think therefore I am, kind of thing?

• 4:14Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 4:14Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Okay.

• 4:15Chuck Nice?

  But it's like, we think, therefore you are.

• 4:17Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Ooh, ooh.

• 4:18Chuck Nice?

  Yeah.

• 4:18Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Oh, Chuck.

• 4:20Chuck Nice?

  Every once in a while I'll do something.

• 4:22Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  We think therefore you are.

• 4:24Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 4:24Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Rather than I think therefore I am.

• 4:26Chuck Nice?

  Yeah.

• 4:27Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Oh Chuck, that was beautiful.

• 4:29Chuck Nice?

  Oh, thanks.

• 4:29Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  We should end the show right now. We ain't surpassing that. Thank you for watching StarTalk.

• 4:36Chuck Nice?

  Exactly.

• 4:36Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  It's downhill from here. So I wonder whether there is a level of intelligence out there where we are today, what chimpanzees are to us.

• 4:50Chuck Nice?

  That's interesting. So wow, oh, that's terrible.

• 4:53Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait.

• 4:54Chuck Nice?

  Oh, I hope not.

• 4:55Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Well, you can go to a chimpanzee and say.

• 4:57Chuck Nice?

  Yeah.

• 4:58Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And say, tomorrow morning at 8:30, let's go to Starbucks and have a cup of coffee. Nothing in that sentence makes any sense to a chimpanzee.

• 5:07Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 5:08Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Or ever will.

• 5:09Chuck Nice?

  I'm pretty sure there's a chimp, chimp Starbucks. I'm just pretty sure there is a chimp Starbucks somewhere. I'm just saying.

• 5:16Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  You think Starbucks figured out?

• 5:17Chuck Nice?

  Yeah, Starbucks has gotta be selling chimps coffee somehow, some way.

• 5:22Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Is that why they're so hyper at the zoo?

• 5:23Chuck Nice?

  Exactly. You know what I mean? You go to get your coffee and he's just like, Curious George? Curious George? Decaf latte for curious.

• 5:34Chuck Nice?

  Okay, sorry.

• 5:35Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  All right.

• 5:36Chuck Nice?

  But go ahead.

• 5:37Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So.

• 5:38Chuck Nice?

  So, so.

• 5:38Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So, so, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. Here's why I say that. And I've said this many times, I've written it and I would tell you to your face now.

• 5:43Chuck Nice?

  All right, good.

• 5:45Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So there's about 1% difference in DNA between humans and chimps.

• 5:50Chuck Nice?

  Okay.

• 5:50Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  All right. Yet we like to think of ourselves as.

• 5:53Chuck Nice?

  Highly superior.

• 5:54Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Highly superior intellectually to the chimp.

• 5:56Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 5:56Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Maybe the difference in our brain power is as small as that 1% indicates.

• 6:02Chuck Nice?

  Ugh.

• 6:02Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So that pulling termites out of a mound with a stick that was carefully chosen from a branch.

• 6:07Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 6:08Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Is from a, from a bush, maybe that is not very far from.

• 6:14Chuck Nice?

  Space travel.

• 6:15Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  The Hubble telescope. Right.

• 6:18Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  No, no, wait, think about it. No, no, I know this sounds crazy.

• 6:21Chuck Nice?

  Oh my god!

• 6:22Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  No, no, think about it. Maybe, maybe-

• 6:24Chuck Nice?

  Oh, look at those cute little humans in their telescopes they're putting up there. Look at that. Is that a space shuttle that they just launched?

• 6:32Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Okay, so now watch. The smartest chimp-

• 6:34Chuck Nice?

  Yeah.

• 6:35Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  That are studied in labs-

• 6:36Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 6:36Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  That are brought and forward into chimp societies, right? You bring them forward and what do they do? They'll stack boxes to reach a banana.

• 6:42Chuck Nice?

  Mm-hmm.

• 6:43Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  They might put up an umbrella. They'll do some things, okay, have rudimentary sign language. Our toddlers can do that.

• 6:49Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 6:50Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  But those are the smartest chimps!

• 6:52Chuck Nice?

  Oh, but you're right.

• 6:53Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  But our toddlers do that.

• 6:54Chuck Nice?

  Same thing with dogs. Dogs, dogs have about-

• 6:56Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I know, I could, I could do this example for dogs as well, but chimps is, is simpler.

• 7:00Chuck Nice?

  Cause they're closer to us.

• 7:01Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Even closer. So watch.

• 7:02Chuck Nice?

  Got you, got you. See what you're doing.

• 7:03Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  You see where I'm going. Okay, so watch. If the smartest chimp equals our toddler, and there's only 1% difference in DNA between us-

• 7:11Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 7:12Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Let's go 1% beyond us.

• 7:15Chuck Nice?

  Ooh, that's scary.

• 7:17Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  That's what I'm saying. If we go 1% beyond us in that same vector of intelligence-

• 7:21Chuck Nice?

  Yeah, they're traveling at the speed of light.

• 7:23Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Then-

• 7:24Chuck Nice?

  They've, they've figured out light travel.

• 7:25Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Then the smartest human, they'll roll forward, they'll take, they'll take Stephen Hawking, and they'll say, "This human is slightly smarter than the rest, because he can do astrophysics calculations in his head."

• 7:39Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 7:39Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Like little Timmy over here who just came home from alien preschool.

• 7:42Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 7:43Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  The toddler.

• 7:44Chuck Nice?

  The toddler, right.

• 7:46Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And he'll say, "Oh, you just composed a sonnet, isn't that cute? Let's put it up on the refrigerator. Oh, you just derived the principles of calculus. Oh, isn't that cute?"

• 7:54Chuck Nice?

  No, that's funny.

• 7:55Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So if, so if the smartest human does what their toddlers can do-

• 7:59Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 8:00Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Their average people will have thoughts. They will have sentences that will rise above and beyond our most brilliant capacity to understand. And I stay awake at night wondering whether the universe has complexities in it that are out of reach of the neurosynapses of the human brain.

• 8:21Chuck Nice?

  Wow.

• 8:22Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  That's my answer.

• 8:23Chuck Nice?

  So there's information out there that we just cannot conceive or perceive.

• 8:28Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  We don't even know how to ask the question about it.

• 8:32Chuck Nice?

  To get an answer.

• 8:33Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Correct.

• 8:33Chuck Nice?

  We don't know the answer, we don't know the question to get an answer.

• 8:36Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  To get an answer.

• 8:36Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 8:37Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And not that we don't know it because we haven't been told it yet.

• 8:39Chuck Nice?

  No, we just can't conceive of the question.

• 8:40Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Can't conceive it. You go to a chimp and say, go to a chimp and say, um- Uh, what would it be?

• 8:47Chuck Nice?

  Oh, uh, uh, something as simple as navigating the stars to get someplace. Just can't do that.

• 8:53Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Stars, what, navigate, what, what spaceship, what rocket, fuel, what? None of that, none of it. You can't even have that conversation.

• 9:03Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 9:04Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So that's my point.

• 9:06Chuck Nice?

  Now I'm thinking that this whole thing might be some type of like science experiment by some alien kid now.

• 9:13Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yes.

• 9:14Chuck Nice?

  That just.

• 9:15Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Why not?

• 9:16Chuck Nice?

  Ugh.

• 9:16Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  We are all a simulation in an alien kid's basement. Who hasn't moved out of, out of the house yet.

• 9:21Chuck Nice?

  That's so funny.

• 9:24Chuck Nice?

  We're the Minecraft of some other.

• 9:26Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yes, Minecraft. Yes.

• 9:29Chuck Nice?

  Wow, wow, that, yeah.

• 9:32Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And then when things get too peaceful and stable, they stir the pot.

• 9:35Chuck Nice?

  Stir the pot.

• 9:36Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  They throw in a politician, a war, a crazy person, throwing thing, and then, oh, now it's entertaining. So we're just entertainment for.

• 9:44Chuck Nice?

  This is the best video game. Okay. Uh,

• 9:50Chuck Nice?

  wow, wow, that's a, well, listen, that's a great answer to what boggles your mind. That's a really, ugh.

• 9:56Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  It doesn't so much boggle my mind, it upsets my mind.

• 9:58Chuck Nice?

  Yeah, I was about to say, it's very upsetting.

• 10:00Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Are we not?

• 10:01Chuck Nice?

  I'm mad, I don't even know why.

• 10:03Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Here's my one out.

• 10:06Chuck Nice?

  What, what? Go ahead.

• 10:08Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Because

• 10:11Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  for humans, our knowledge is cumulative.

• 10:14Chuck Nice?

  So true.

• 10:15Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  You don't have to invent calculus. Somebody else did that.

• 10:18Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 10:18Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  You just have to use it.

• 10:19Chuck Nice?

  Use it, right.

• 10:19Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Learn it and use it.

• 10:20Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 10:21Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So I have the feeling that we are, every next generation that has sort of brilliant people contributing to our understanding of the universe, they're adding a rung to a ladder.

• 10:30Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 10:31Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And then we all sort of climb up that, and then just get that next rung. And then climb that, and then the next rung.

• 10:38Chuck Nice?

  Well, with that in mind, I think that the next, um, evolutionary stuff for human beings is that we will create an intelligence greater than our own. That's really the deal.

• 10:49Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  This scares the hell out of everyone.

• 10:51Chuck Nice?

  Yeah.

• 10:52Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Because that intelligence will say, we don't need you.

• 10:56Chuck Nice?

  You know what, and we'd have to say you're right.

• 10:58Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  That's what happened in The Matrix.

• 11:00Chuck Nice?

  Yeah.

• 11:02Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  You're a virus on this earth.

• 11:04Chuck Nice?

  Mr. Anderson. I smell you, Mr. Anderson.

• 11:09Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  No, he was smelling Morpheus.

• 11:11Chuck Nice?

  Oh, that's right. That's right.

• 11:12Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Get your Matrix. If you're gonna go there in front of me?

• 11:15Chuck Nice?

  I'm in front of the wrong person.

• 11:16Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  That's my favorite movie?

• 11:17Chuck Nice?

  That's true.

• 11:17Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Don't even.

• 11:18Chuck Nice?

  Yes, he was talking about Morpheus when he was tied up in the chair. Yes.

• 11:21Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  It's the smell.

• 11:24Chuck Nice?

  You know what? You gotta have some really serious B.O. for a computer to tell you you stink.

• 11:31Chuck Nice?

  I'm just saying. I'm just saying. All right, let's.

• 11:35Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  You got through the electronics into the.

• 11:39Chuck Nice?

  So this is AlexGreg56 from Instagram, and AlexGreg says this. If the universe needs not make any sense to us, then what is the point of doing science? Is science not in fact the discipline of trying to grasp what's around us? By the way, is this statement not equal to the old one, which is? God has his reason to make it that way, so just don't ask.

• 12:12Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Ooh, of course, I never heard that expression. But that, the shorter version of that is, God works in mysterious ways.

• 12:19Chuck Nice?

  That is so true.

• 12:20Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  When you can't explain it.

• 12:21Chuck Nice?

  Well, God, the Lord works in mysterious ways.

• 12:24Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Right, and if you can't explain it using God, then you do, right? Oh, God has blessed you, you blessed God. It's something, you know, then there's a tsunami, takes out a quarter million people.

• 12:33Chuck Nice?

  God hates you.

• 12:34Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  No one says that.

• 12:35Chuck Nice?

  No one says that? Why don't we say that? We should say that, you know? I wanna start saying, you know what? I think God hates you.

• 12:41Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Well, the most hateful God in our culture is the one represented on insurance forms.

• 12:49Chuck Nice?

  Oh, that's so true.

• 12:51Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Acts of God.

• 12:51Chuck Nice?

  Acts of God.

• 12:52Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Right. It's only eve- it's very bad things. No one says, uh, flowers bloomed in your garden, an act of God.

• 12:59Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 12:59Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  No, it's tsunami took out your house.

• 13:01Chuck Nice?

  That's an act of God.

• 13:02Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Homeless on the street, act of God.

• 13:03Chuck Nice?

  Wow, look at that. This moment of God hates you, bought to you by Farmers Insurance.

• 13:09Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Stay farm.

• 13:15Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  What's that one? Um, uh, Nationwide.

• 13:18Chuck Nice?

  Is not on your side. Nationwide is on your side. God is not. All right, okay, that's enough.

• 13:24Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So.

• 13:25Chuck Nice?

  I'm gonna get some hate mail now. God chunk, you, you hate God chunk, is that it? Okay, sorry. So, the, so is science in fact the discipline of trying to grasp what is around us?

• 13:39Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Okay, so what he started, he started quoting me where I said, I opened my book, The Astrophysics of People in a Hurry.

• 13:46Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 13:47Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  With the quote, "The universe is under no obligation to make sense to you."

• 13:53Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 13:53Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Okay. What that means is, your five traditional senses, which rose up out of the Serengeti.

• 14:01Chuck Nice?

  Okay.

• 14:02Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Which help us not get eaten by lions.

• 14:04Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 14:05Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Right? They're very good at that. They're not as good at contemplating infinity. They're not good contemplating time scales much longer than your life expectancy.

• 14:14Chuck Nice?

  So true.

• 14:15Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  You don't, you can't intuit billions of years. You can't intuit infinitesimals. There are things that are hard for us.

• 14:22Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 14:22Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  There are things that may even be impossible for us. Can you picture a five dimensional cube?

• 14:27Chuck Nice?

  No, I cannot.

• 14:28Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  No, you cannot. Can you picture a four dimensional cube?

• 14:29Chuck Nice?

  Uh, probably not. No.

• 14:31Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Actually, the, the, the tesseract is close.

• 14:33Chuck Nice?

  Yeah.

• 14:33Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  That's like a.

• 14:34Chuck Nice?

  I can, I can actually picture that. Cause I've seen a drawing.

• 14:38Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I, I have a tesseract.

• 14:40Chuck Nice?

  Do you really? Get out.

• 14:42Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah.

• 14:42Chuck Nice?

  Oh. All right, well.

• 14:45Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I'll bring it in one day.

• 14:46Chuck Nice?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 14:46Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Another episode.

• 14:47Chuck Nice?

  Another episode.

• 14:48Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  It'll be, uh, the episode of higher dimensions.

• 14:50Chuck Nice?

  Sweet.

• 14:50Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Do a whole thing on just higher dimensions.

• 14:52Chuck Nice?

  You know, that's a good episode.

• 14:53Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Can we do that?

• 14:53Chuck Nice?

  Yeah, I like that. We did that?

• 14:55Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  We did that already. How come I don't remember? Man, I'm getting old.

• 15:00Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Did I have my tesseract in my hand?

• 15:03Chuck Nice?

  Well, now we gotta do it again.

• 15:05Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Updated, but I took this from Thanos. So, what it means is, if you are going to deduce what is or is not true in the universe.

• 15:16Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 15:17Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Your senses are not the most reliable measure of whether it's true.

• 15:22Chuck Nice?

  So true.

• 15:22Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Because the senses give you a restricted understanding of what's actually going on in the universe. Your eyes, you would never trade them for anything, yet they only expose your, your mind to a very tiny, narrow strip of all the electromagnetic energy that's out there.

• 15:40Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 15:40Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  You can't see infrared, you can feel it as heat, but you can't see it.

• 15:43Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 15:44Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Uh, ultraviolet, you can't see that either. You can feel that in a delayed sense by getting sunburn and skin cancer. It's not telling you in that instant, it's a time delay, but keep going out. There's infrared, ultraviolet, x-ray, gamma rays, can't see any of that. But the universe is talking to you in that. So are you gonna say, "My senses give me everything that there is in the universe, and therefore it makes sense?" No, as long as we detect things that fall outside of our senses, it's a challenge for you to declare that what we say, do, and discover makes sense. The very statement makes sense means your senses can contemplate it.

• 16:24Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 16:24Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  That your senses have experience. If I let go of a ball and it floats up, you'll say, "That doesn't make sense."

• 16:29Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 16:29Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Because your senses always told you, if you let go of a ball, it drops.

• 16:32Chuck Nice?

  It drops, right.

• 16:33Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And in fact, the very statement, "Let it go," not the, the, the-

• 16:37Chuck Nice?

  Frozen.

• 16:38Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Not the frozen version, but just, "Let it go," means drop it.

• 16:43Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  They mean the same thing.

• 16:44Chuck Nice?

  Mm-hmm.

• 16:45Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  But that can only be true on Earth with a force of gravity pointing down. In space, in free orbit, you let go, it just floats there.

• 16:52Chuck Nice?

  Stays right there.

• 16:53Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Stays right there, so-

• 16:55Chuck Nice?

  Like my problems.

• 16:56Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Stay right there.

• 16:57Chuck Nice?

  Yeah. I must be in space, because all my problems, somebody says, "Drop it," and I say, "I did that right, it's still here."

• 17:03Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And you let it go, and it's still there.

• 17:04Chuck Nice?

  Exactly.

• 17:05Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So, my point is, the methods and tools of science give you a way to understand what is true.

• 17:15Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Without it being hinged on whether your senses think it's true.

• 17:18Chuck Nice?

  Nice.

• 17:19Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So the message until the signs are access to truth. Where you can still probe the universe, whereas God works in mysterious ways, kind of ends that conversation. Whereas I say, I've developed a new instrument that can see in ways humans cannot. Oh my gosh, that opens entire worlds of investigation. Entire branches of science.

• 17:41Chuck Nice?

  Alright.

• 17:55Speaker 02

  I'm Ali Khan Hemraj and I support StarTalk on Patreon. This is StarTalk with Neil deGrasse Tyson.

• 18:14Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Okay Chuck.

• 18:15Chuck Nice?

  Here we go. So this is from probably asleep.

• 18:20Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  That's the name of the person?

• 18:20Chuck Nice?

  The name of the person.

• 18:21Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Okay.

• 18:22Chuck Nice?

  I like that.

• 18:23Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Your mama didn't like you.

• 18:26Chuck Nice?

  How long do you think the human race will actually survive? Wow, I mean, there's precedent for that, right?

• 18:32Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Well, so you can look at what is the average life expectancy of mammals? Mammal species.

• 18:37Chuck Nice?

  Exactly.

• 18:37Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And last I checked, it was around 2 million years, something like that. And so we've been around.

• 18:43Chuck Nice?

  We have a long way to go.

• 18:44Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  We have a long way to go. We've been around, you know, a couple hundred thousand years in our, in our current anatomical form, Cro-Magnon form.

• 18:50Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 18:50Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And so that means we have a long way to go, but this presumes that the species is not smart enough to kill itself.

• 18:58Chuck Nice?

  Well, then it's over. It was nice knowing you guys.

• 19:03Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah, we have invented multiple ways to kill ourselves.

• 19:06Chuck Nice?

  Yeah.

• 19:06Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And I don't think the elephants did, or you know, nobody else did this.

• 19:10Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 19:11Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  The mice, no, they're not killing themselves.

• 19:13Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 19:13Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Humans, yes.

• 19:15Chuck Nice?

  Yeah, maybe, maybe cockroaches invented human beings.

• 19:18Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Why?

• 19:18Chuck Nice?

  Cause when everything's gone, they're gonna be the only ones left and it's like.

• 19:22Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  No, no, then they don't have to invent us in the first place. What kind of reasoning are you using here?

• 19:26Chuck Nice?

  They want everything else gone.

• 19:28Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  No, they need us to build the structures that they then move into.

• 19:30Chuck Nice?

  Right, that they move, yeah.

• 19:34Chuck Nice?

  I don't mind it. Um, yeah, that makes, that makes perfect sense. Yeah, we are, yeah. Uh, but so I think what he's really asking is in your estimation, from your sage opinion,

• 19:45Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I give us.

• 19:46Chuck Nice?

  How long do you think we will last?

• 19:49Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I, I give us 20 years.

• 19:56Chuck Nice?

  That's funny.

• 19:57Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  No, I, I think we're good.

• 20:01Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  This is why many people want to become a two planet species. Terraform Mars, send some humans there. So if something bad happens on Earth, you still have humans somewhere else.

• 20:10Chuck Nice?

  Wow. That is not encouraging at all.

• 20:13Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Not for half the people who aren't on the planet. There's not, so if an asteroid comes, if a killer virus, if AI goes out, gets out of hand.

• 20:21Chuck Nice?

  So I understand seeding something with a remnant for survival of the species. That's extraneous. I mean, that's, that's something that's outside of our own destruction, you know, uh, even though we could stop an asteroid from hitting us if we put.

• 20:36Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  We know how, we just, we know, ain't nobody doing it, but we know how.

• 20:39Chuck Nice?

  If we put the resources into it, we could stop even that from happening.

• 20:41Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So what, what's the example you're giving?

• 20:43Chuck Nice?

  So, so what do you mean? To stop the asteroid?

• 20:45Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  No, no, what, so.

• 20:46Chuck Nice?

  So what I'm saying is, you know, will we ever get to a place where the, as the Buddhist monks call it, the so-called monkey brain that causes us to do so much destructive, work to each other and to the planet? Will we ever get to a place where we overcome that or we're able to train those who come behind us to overcome that?

• 21:15Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Okay.

• 21:15Chuck Nice?

  Now, it does happen in some people.

• 21:18Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I get it. I, first, I've never heard a Buddhist monk say the phrase monkey brain.

• 21:25Chuck Nice?

  Really?

• 21:26Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Is this a thing?

• 21:27Chuck Nice?

  This is a thing. That is a thing.

• 21:29Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I go to 10 more monasteries.

• 21:32Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  You feeling monkey brain today? Alright, so I've heard of reptilian brain, but not monkey brain.

• 21:37Chuck Nice?

  Yes.

• 21:37Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Okay, so the reptilian brain is reference something primal.

• 21:42Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 21:42Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  That goes on within you. So if we follow the reasoning by Steven Pinker in his book, The Better Angels of Our Nature. He studied the likelihood of you dying before maturity, or dying before adulthood, or just dying

• 21:56Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  from at the hands of another human, from early days of tribal warfare to modern days of of state sanctioned global warfare. And what he found is that the likelihood of you dying in that way has been dropping ever since.

• 22:14Chuck Nice?

  Okay.

• 22:15Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So tribal warfare, you could, you would kill maybe a third or half of the other tribe, and or the entire tribe, and then you win and you get their land. That doesn't happen today.

• 22:26Chuck Nice?

  True.

• 22:26Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  The state surrenders before that happens.

• 22:30Chuck Nice?

  True.

• 22:30Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Saving the lives of the rest of the population. If you look at, I did this just recently. If you look at what countries had the greatest percent of their population die in the Second World War. I was at Belarus, one of them is very high, it's like a third. Alright, I forgot the exact numbers, but they're high. But they're not a half. And you keep going down and you get to to even combat Germany, even ones that were heavily bombed, Germany, Japan, a fraction of the total population. That is not how it used to end in tribal warfare. So now consider that even so, during the Second World War, between 1939 and 1945,

• 23:11Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  1,000 humans were killed by other humans per hour, for every hour from 1939 to 1945. Is that going on today? No.

• 23:23Chuck Nice?

  No.

• 23:24Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  No.

• 23:24Chuck Nice?

  Well, we're really slipping.

• 23:26Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  No, stop.

• 23:27Chuck Nice?

  So we really gotta pick up our game.

• 23:29Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Just so we can, so the point is, often that era is called the greatest generation.

• 23:35Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 23:36Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Well, because they fought, you know, evil forces and, you know, this sort of thing. Although my father fought in a segregated army, so he's not thinking that was the greatest generation. He has other outlook, other perspectives on that period.

• 23:49Chuck Nice?

  It's the second greatest generation.

• 23:51Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  My point is, is the greatest generation the one where the fewest fraction of everyone dies? Out of hate, we might have a lot of hate. But if the number of people who die from it is lower than ever before.

• 24:04Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 24:04Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Then this arc that you were hinting at, that maybe a next generation learns from the previous one. Maybe that's gonna work. Europe, with all of their turbulence and turmoil, they actually haven't been at war with each other for 70 years.

• 24:18Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 24:19Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Is there another 70 year period in the history of Europe where nobody was fighting anybody?

• 24:24Chuck Nice?

  Not.

• 24:24Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I don't think so.

• 24:25Chuck Nice?

  Not if Twitter has anything to do with it.

• 24:27Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  To foment. What you're saying is, imagine if Twitter existed.

• 24:32Chuck Nice?

  Back then?

• 24:33Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Back then, oh my gosh.

• 24:34Chuck Nice?

  Let me tell you something, the war wouldn't have stopped until everybody was dead. Would have taken, like, people would have said, I surrender. A tweet would have gone out and be like, I take it back, let's keep fighting. Let's keep fighting, I don't care.

• 24:49Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I hate you more.

• 24:49Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 24:51Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So maybe we are getting kinder, kinder and gentler.

• 24:54Chuck Nice?

  Mm-hmm.

• 24:55Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Uh, time still needs to bear that out on a level that would please everyone. But I still worry that this primal brain will always segregate us all by some arbitrary factor and thereby justify doing harm to other groups.

• 25:09Chuck Nice?

  Hmm, interesting, that's, uh, I think.

• 25:12Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Who's the comedian? Was it Franklin Ajay? One of these guys from the seventies.

• 25:16Chuck Nice?

  Back in the day?

• 25:17Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  In the day.

• 25:18Chuck Nice?

  Yeah.

• 25:18Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  In the day. He was talking about who hates who in the world, right? And he, and he says, read the papers? And what? In Northern Ireland? The Protestants and the Catholics are fighting each other?

• 25:36Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 25:36Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And they're both white?

• 25:37Chuck Nice?

  Yeah.

• 25:38Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  He said, you know I don't have a chance, cause I'm black.

• 25:40Chuck Nice?

  That's funny, that's true, yeah.

• 25:42Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Right, if white people divide themselves up in that way.

• 25:45Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 25:45Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Two Christian communities killing each other.

• 25:48Chuck Nice?

  Right, yeah.

• 25:48Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And they're both white and they're both Christian and they're both.

• 25:50Chuck Nice?

  It's over for you, brother.

• 25:51Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  It's over for everybody else. If people can kill each other for those reasons, it's almost no hope in this world. So, yeah, I don't know.

• 25:59Chuck Nice?

  Okay.

• 26:00Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Uh, yeah, so I'm sorry, I don't have a good answer.

• 26:02Chuck Nice?

  No, that was a pretty good answer, the answer is, we're not gonna make it.

• 26:05Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Um. I'd like to think we go thousands of years into the future and possibly outlive the sun.

• 26:11Chuck Nice?

  All right, that'd be great.

• 26:12Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  By star hopping to other planetary systems.

• 26:15Chuck Nice?

  Hmm, that's, uh, you know, I'm just gonna say that's the way it's gonna end, cause I won't be here, so that's great.

• 26:19Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Maybe. It has been said that the first person who will never die is now alive.

• 26:25Chuck Nice?

  What? That's a, well.

• 26:28Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  No, this is how you do it.

• 26:29Chuck Nice?

  I know what you're saying.

• 26:30Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So they get, they get some new thing that makes you live an extra 50 years. So now you live to 150 instead of 100. And then somewhere in there, there's another thing we get. Now you can live another 200 years. So now the 150 goes to 350. Now you can live 500 years. Now you go to 1,000. You can live 5,000 years now. So as we progress in our understanding of what ages you, if we can reverse that or prevent it from ever advancing, the person, there's someone alive today who will benefit from that.

• 26:58Chuck Nice?

  That's pretty cool. I like it.

• 27:00Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So if that happens, you better find another planet.

• 27:03Chuck Nice?

  This is true, yeah. That's the premise of a show called Altered Carbon, where people actually take their consciousness and put it into what they call a sleeve, which is the body. So that's.

• 27:13Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I think I voice over the opening sequence to that show.

• 27:16Chuck Nice?

  Oh, my God. I think we had that conversation once where you told me that. Cause I told you I was a fan.

• 27:19Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I don't remember if it was with the pilot or the other shows, but I did, I, I lent my voice to the cause.

• 27:24Chuck Nice?

  Nice. Wow. All right. Well, let's go to Joey 24, Joey Junior 24. He says this, personal question. Based on all your experiences and knowledge thus far.

• 27:36Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Personal for me or for you?

• 27:37Chuck Nice?

  Personal for you.

• 27:38Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Okay.

• 27:38Chuck Nice?

  Yeah, nobody asking me anything.

• 27:43Chuck Nice?

  He says, based on all of your experiences and knowledge thus far, what do you think the meaning of our human existence is? He just asked you, what is the meaning of life according to Neil deGrasse Tyson?

• 27:58Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Okay. So I, in my next book.

• 28:03Chuck Nice?

  Uh oh.

• 28:04Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah, I don't, you never hear me plug my stuff.

• 28:06Chuck Nice?

  I was gonna say, here's the meaning of life right now. Plug your book when you get a chance.

• 28:12Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  The next one's called Letters From An Astrophysicist.

• 28:14Chuck Nice?

  Uh, you know what? Yes.

• 28:15Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Correspondence I've had with people who've had similar angst.

• 28:20Chuck Nice?

  Yes.

• 28:20Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  About their existence.

• 28:22Chuck Nice?

  Well, that's not just, the book is not about that.

• 28:24Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  No, no, well.

• 28:24Chuck Nice?

  It's about all different kinds of letters you receive.

• 28:26Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  All kinds of letters. But a very recurring theme is that people want to know the meaning of life and their significance of their life in this world.

• 28:35Chuck Nice?

  Yeah.

• 28:35Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And some of them come from religious angles, some are secular, but everybody's got this burning issue.

• 28:40Chuck Nice?

  Yes.

• 28:40Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So here's how I have dealt with it. Others will do it other ways.

• 28:44Chuck Nice?

  Okay.

• 28:45Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  But here's how I deal with it.

• 28:46Chuck Nice?

  I'm interested now.

• 28:47Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Many people are in search of the meaning of life as though. It's behind a tree.

• 28:53Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 28:54Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Under a rock.

• 28:54Chuck Nice?

  Right. Everybody knows it's in a drawer.

• 28:58Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  In the back.

• 28:58Chuck Nice?

  Exactly.

• 28:59Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Near the paperclip.

• 29:01Chuck Nice?

  It's in that drunk drawer, too. It's not like a underwear drawer or something. You know that drawer where you go to look for stamps and stuff?

• 29:08Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah, yeah, that drawer, that drawer. The junk drawer.

• 29:10Chuck Nice?

  The junk drawer.

• 29:10Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Everybody's got a junk drawer.

• 29:11Chuck Nice?

  Everybody's got a junk.

• 29:12Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  It's near the kitchen somewhere.

• 29:13Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 29:13Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So if you are looking for meaning,

• 29:19Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  you may never find it.

• 29:20Chuck Nice?

  Ooh.

• 29:22Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So instead,

• 29:25Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  recognize that you have the power to manufacture meaning. Create it within yourself. And that's what I do. My meaning for life is derived by several simple principles. Have I lessened the sufferings of others today?

• 29:44Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  That brings meaning to me. Because that means the world is a little better off because I was in it today.

• 29:51Chuck Nice?

  Okay.

• 29:52Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  If, after your day is over, the world is worse off, you have subtracted meaning.

• 29:58Chuck Nice?

  I should kill myself.

• 30:01Chuck Nice?

  At the end of every day, somebody is like, that mother.

• 30:09Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So, so lessen the suffering of others in some way.

• 30:14Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 30:15Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Doesn't mean redirect your whole life, mind, body, and soul, but if you can help someone across the street, help an aging person, do, you know, make a little child laugh. Just put a little bit of joy in the world. To lessen the suffering. I also try to learn something every day.

• 30:31Chuck Nice?

  All right.

• 30:32Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Now, I'm a, I like being a perpetual student.

• 30:36Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 30:37Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Most people hated being students. This saddens me. School's finished, and what do you do? You run down the steps. School is out forever.

• 30:46Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 30:47Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Out for the summer. That attitude, captured in that song, is as though you don't want to be in school. And what's your only job in school?

• 30:57Chuck Nice?

  It's to learn.

• 30:58Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  To learn. And somehow, that's a chore?

• 31:00Chuck Nice?

  Yeah.

• 31:01Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I don't blame you for feeling that way. I blame the school system

• 31:04Chuck Nice?

  Yeah.

• 31:05Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  For not instilling within us eternal curiosity. Knowing that you will spend more years of your life not in school than in school. And so if you have curiosity, you can be a lifelong learner.

• 31:15Chuck Nice?

  That's right.

• 31:16Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And so I want to lessen the sufferings of others. And make sure I learn something more about the world today than I did yesterday.

• 31:23Chuck Nice?

  Nice.

• 31:24Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And who's to say whether that extra increment of learning can help me be better at lessening the sufferings of others?

• 31:32Chuck Nice?

  Oh.

• 31:33Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So that is how I make meaning in life. And as a result, I own thousands of books, thousands. And I read a little bit, you know, I have a little stash near my bed and I cycle them out. Um, and every day I try to, it's harder now because I get recognized. Um, but I try to help people every day. Total stranger.

• 31:52Chuck Nice?

  That's nice.

• 31:52Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah. So you can make meaning for yourself. Don't look for it because you may never find it.

• 31:58Chuck Nice?

  Uh, you know, I'm going to say as a philosophy, that is, uh, that's a, that's, that's, that's admirable.

• 32:03Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And that's in the book. I, I wrote that in the book.

• 32:05Chuck Nice?

  Nice. That's, that's.

• 32:06Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Thank you.

• 32:32Chuck Nice?

  From Ninja Janit, whatever, no, Janit, I don't know, said, I keep hearing the phrase, "The vacuum of space." How exactly is it a vacuum?

• 32:44Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Right. Okay. So when I was a kid, a vacuum was a physical object.

• 32:47Chuck Nice?

  Yes, it was.

• 32:47Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  When I heard physicists speak of the vacuum of space, I just imagined all these Hoover's, you know, in, in the sky.

• 32:53Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 32:53Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So I didn't know that a vacuum was a thing, was it, was an, it was a concept. And then you make a machine that duplicates that thing. I just didn't know that until I learned. Okay. So a vacuum is where there's basically no air.

• 33:08Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Okay, you can have objects there. But when we think of a vacuum, it's not a place where there isn't anything. It's a place where there's no air molecules moving typically.

• 33:17Chuck Nice?

  Mm hmm.

• 33:17Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  All right. Generally, you can have some, and we would still classify it as a vacuum. Because you have to distinguish like a regular old vacuum or a perfect vacuum.

• 33:25Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 33:26Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Now, you know what happens if there's an object and you take away all the air molecules? The object outgasses. Their their air molecules embedded in the surface of that object and they start coming out. It's fascinating. Then you heat it, it sends out more.

• 33:38Chuck Nice?

  Mm.

• 33:39Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  It's very hard to make a perfect vacuum. Very hard. So here's an old saying. Nature.

• 33:47Chuck Nice?

  Abhors.

• 33:48Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Abhors a vacuum. These are people who've never been into space. Most of the universe is a vacuum. Nature loves a vacuum.

• 33:54Chuck Nice?

  Nice.

• 33:56Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Did I was I Trumpy in there?

• 33:57Chuck Nice?

  No.

• 33:57Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Love.

• 33:58Chuck Nice?

  Nature loves a vacuum.

• 34:01Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  A vacuum. So.

• 34:02Chuck Nice?

  Perfect. Preferably Trump ran vacuums.

• 34:07Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Trump?

• 34:07Chuck Nice?

  Trump bam, Trump ran vacuums. We suck the best.

• 34:10Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Oh, Chuck. There's another, there's another saying, uh, there's no such thing as gravity. Earth sucks. Have you ever heard that?

• 34:17Chuck Nice?

  Oh, okay.

• 34:18Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So, uh, the point is when there's a source of gravity, all the air wants to go to that source of gravity. And it leaves a vacuum everywhere else. So a vacuum is simply where there's no air. And it's not anything deep. The odd thing in the universe is that you have places where air, where gas molecules collect.

• 34:36Chuck Nice?

  Okay.

• 34:36Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Those are the unusual places in the universe. And they're called stars and gaseous planets and the atmospheres of rocky planets.

• 34:43Chuck Nice?

  Nice.

• 34:44Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah, so they have a vacuum. So Chuck, I want to put, put some closure on this vacuum question.

• 34:49Chuck Nice?

  Okay.

• 34:49Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Okay. This is the second, my third book I ever published.

• 34:52Chuck Nice?

  Oh, okay.

• 34:53Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  It's called Just Visiting This Planet.

• 34:54Chuck Nice?

  All right.

• 34:55Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And it's a collection of, uh, uh, Q and A. I had a column, uh, a pen with a pen named Merlin. People ask fun, really playful questions.

• 35:02Chuck Nice?

  That's cool.

• 35:03Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And I collected, this is like decades old, but there's some timeless content in here. Somebody asked about the vacuum.

• 35:10Chuck Nice?

  Mm hmm. Yeah, go ahead, please. Well, you can't read otherwise.

• 35:14Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Okay. Here we go. The best vacuum you will find anywhere.

• 35:23Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I wrote this. Wrote this thirty years ago.

• 35:26Chuck Nice?

  That's cool.

• 35:27Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  The best vacuum you will find anywhere, according to four out of five vacuum retailers, and five out of five astronomers, is the void of intergalactic space. But we can then ask, is intergalactic space nothing?

• 35:43Chuck Nice?

  Hmm.

• 35:45Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  No, it still contains space.

• 35:51Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  If you feel obliged to call intergalactic space "nothing", then you must invent a word to refer to the region outside of the universe. In this location, where we presume there to be no space, there can be no nothing.

• 36:09Chuck Nice?

  Wow.

• 36:11Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Let's call it, we're left with no choice, nothing nothing.

• 36:16Chuck Nice?

  Nothing nothing.

• 36:16Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  A place where there's not even nothing.

• 36:19Chuck Nice?

  It's the nothing nothing.

• 36:22Chuck Nice?

  Wow.

• 36:22Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Okay, I'm just saying.

• 36:23Chuck Nice?

  I like that.

• 36:23Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I'm just saying. So Chuck, you want some more vacuum talk?

• 36:26Chuck Nice?

  Of course. I gotta, I feel like you just showed up at my door and dumped some dirt on my carpet.

• 36:34Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  More vacuum talk.

• 36:35Chuck Nice?

  Okay, vacuum talk.

• 36:36Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So, in Death by Black Hole.

• 36:38Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 36:38Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Okay. I don't remember what number book this is. So, in the chapter on being dense.

• 36:44Chuck Nice?

  Okay.

• 36:45Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Okay, that's named.

• 36:45Chuck Nice?

  Something I know a great deal about.

• 36:49Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  The range of measured densities within our universe is staggeringly large. We find the highest densities within pulsars, where neutrons are so tightly packed that one thimbleful would weigh about as much as a herd of fifty million elephants.

• 37:06Chuck Nice?

  Fifty million.

• 37:07Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And then, a rabbit disappears into thin air at a magic show. Nobody tells you that thin air already contains over ten septillion atoms per cubic meter.

• 37:22Chuck Nice?

  Wow.

• 37:23Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Thin air.

• 37:23Chuck Nice?

  Thin air, right.

• 37:24Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Okay. The best laboratory vacuum changers can pump down to as few as ten billion atoms per cubic meter.

• 37:33Chuck Nice?

  Oh, okay.

• 37:33Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Best vacuums.

• 37:34Chuck Nice?

  That's the best vacuum.

• 37:34Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  In a cubic meter, ten billion air molecules are still walking around.

• 37:38Chuck Nice?

  Okay.

• 37:40Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Interplanetary space gets down to about 10 million atoms per cubic meter.

• 37:46Chuck Nice?

  Hmm.

• 37:47Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  While interstellar space is as low as a half a million atoms per cubic.

• 37:51Chuck Nice?

  Wow, that is nothing.

• 37:52Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  That is.

• 37:54Chuck Nice?

  Wow.

• 37:55Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  That ain't.

• 37:55Chuck Nice?

  That is, I mean. Okay. 500,000 atoms?

• 37:59Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  The award, the award for nothingness, however, must be given to the space between the galaxies. Intergalactic space where it is difficult to find more than a few atoms for every 10 cubic meters.

• 38:14Chuck Nice?

  Wow.

• 38:16Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  That wins.

• 38:16Chuck Nice?

  That's, that's almost, that's almost nothing, nothing.

• 38:22Chuck Nice?

  That's almost nothing, nothing.

• 38:25Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  All right. We're gonna go into a deep lightning round.

• 38:28Chuck Nice?

  Really? We only have five minutes left?

• 38:29Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Okay, let's go.

• 38:30Chuck Nice?

  Okay, here we go. Uh, this is Ja Saldana says, uh, right now, what should be the priority in the field of space exploration? Searching for life, searching for potential threats of another kind of search? Uh, or is there just no hurry at this matter at all? Greetings from Mexico.

• 38:46Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Mexico. Thank you.

• 38:48Chuck Nice?

  Mm-hmm. Um, so what is it? Is it, is it, are we looking for life?

• 38:53Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  He wants my opinion? I got an opinion.

• 38:55Chuck Nice?

  Exploration, life, go ahead.

• 38:57Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I got an opinion.

• 38:57Chuck Nice?

  All right, go ahead.

• 38:58Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I wanna do it all.

• 39:00Chuck Nice?

  Why not do it all?

• 39:00Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  What, and?

• 39:02Chuck Nice?

  All of the above.

• 39:03Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  All of the above.

• 39:03Chuck Nice?

  E.

• 39:04Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Because the moment you do this and not that.

• 39:05Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 39:06Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  They say, why are you doing that and not that? Oh, because we voted that way, but maybe you don't know why you should do that.

• 39:11Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 39:11Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And you wanna do that. Some people wanna do that. Here's what you do.

• 39:14Chuck Nice?

  Mm-hmm.

• 39:15Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  You don't build a road just from New York to LA. You build roads everywhere so that, yeah, I wanna visit that forest. I wanna visit this, this, this, this, uh, rocky monument. I wanna do things that are not prescribed by you.

• 39:29Chuck Nice?

  I'm going to see the biggest ball of yarn ever.

• 39:32Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Exactly.

• 39:32Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 39:33Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Right? So what you do is you make a spaceship that is modular, strap on different combinations of rockets.

• 39:40Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 39:41Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  This rocket, this combination gets you to an asteroid, to Minn. It, this gets you to the backside of the moon. This gets you to Mars. So you don't prescribe what it is you're gonna do next in space. You let the creativity and imagination of all those who've ever looked up say, this is what I wanna do. And you say, here you go. Two rockets from aisle B, a booster from aisle C, you're on your way.

• 40:05Chuck Nice?

  Can I put that on a credit card?

• 40:06Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah.

• 40:08Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  That's where I got it.

• 40:09Chuck Nice?

  Here we go. All right. Adam in the airwaves wants to know this from Instagram. How far behind do you think astronomy would be if the earth didn't have a moon?

• 40:19Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Oh, wow. Okay, so it's not how far behind we'd be.

• 40:24Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 40:25Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  It's how far advanced we'd be.

• 40:31Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Okay, so let me split this out.

• 40:32Chuck Nice?

  Yeah.

• 40:33Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I tweeted during Space Week, the 50th anniversary of the Apollo landing. There's a saying that's common in the space circles. It's if God wanted us to explore space, he would have given us a moon.

• 40:48Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 40:49Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Okay, so.

• 40:51Chuck Nice?

  That's a good saying.

• 40:51Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  That's a good saying.

• 40:52Chuck Nice?

  Yeah.

• 40:52Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  But that exploration is not astrophysicists' exploration. That one is people going into space.

• 40:59Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 40:59Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  We, you build a rocket to go where? You don't have a moon to visit. All right. If you're talking about astrophysics, do you know how many stars the naked eye can see at night?

• 41:11Chuck Nice?

  More than I can count.

• 41:13Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  No, it's not. It's about three to 4,000.

• 41:15Chuck Nice?

  Oh, really?

• 41:16Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Unaided, yeah. Binoculars, it's 100 times that.

• 41:19Chuck Nice?

  Yeah.

• 41:19Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Telescopes, it's a billion times that. But eyes, three to 4,000 stars.

• 41:23Chuck Nice?

  Okay.

• 41:24Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  When it's a full moon out, 300 stars.

• 41:27Chuck Nice?

  Yeah, right.

• 41:28Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  The moon wreaks havoc on our ability.

• 41:31Chuck Nice?

  Yeah.

• 41:31Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  To see the rest of the universe. So our observing schedules with huge telescopes are split according to dark time or bright time. If you look at, if you have bright time observations, it's the moon is up and you can only look at bright objects in the night sky.

• 41:46Chuck Nice?

  Wow.

• 41:47Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  The deep universe only comes to us when the moon is not up. So the moon is basically a pain in the ass.

• 41:52Chuck Nice?

  It's a star blocker. Wow.

• 41:54Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yes, star blocker.

• 41:55Chuck Nice?

  Look at that.

• 41:56Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  That's what it is. So astronomy would be probably half again more advanced because we would have had these greatest telescopes in the world looking at the night sky twice as often.

• 42:06Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 42:06Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  In the darkest parts of the night sky. There you go.

• 42:09Chuck Nice?

  Wow.

• 42:09Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Next.

• 42:10Chuck Nice?

  That's a damn good answer. Okay, um, this is.

• 42:17Chuck Nice?

  Uh, ever sit a poor, I don't know what his, who cares? Uh, I'm sorry.

• 42:22Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Whoever that is cares.

• 42:23Chuck Nice?

  Let me tell you something.

• 42:24Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  This is the last time he's gonna be asking you a question.

• 42:26Chuck Nice?

  All right, well, you know what your name is, and I'm gonna call you George. All right, so George wants to know this. What is the shape of space itself?

• 42:34Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Ooh.

• 42:35Chuck Nice?

  That's a good question.

• 42:36Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Well, space can be curved in the presence of matter or energy as prescribed by Einstein's general theory.

• 42:43Chuck Nice?

  General theory of relativity.

• 42:45Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And there's the oft-repeated saying, matter tells space how to curve, space tells matter how to move.

• 42:52Chuck Nice?

  Uh huh.

• 42:53Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So space has curvature in the presence of matter and energy. It curves in towards it, with the ultimate expression of that, a black hole. Where it curves in and it never curves back out.

• 43:03Chuck Nice?

  Wow.

• 43:04Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  If you wanna ask, what is the shape of all of space? That's like saying, what's the shape of the universe, the observable universe? It's basically a perfect sphere.

• 43:13Chuck Nice?

  Wow.

• 43:14Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Because it's your horizon.

• 43:16Chuck Nice?

  Right, okay.

• 43:17Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  It's a perfect sphere the way when you're at sea, your horizon is a perfect circle.

• 43:21Chuck Nice?

  That's right.

• 43:22Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  The same distance in every direction.

• 43:23Chuck Nice?

  That's right, if you're, if you're just out and there's nothing but water around.

• 43:26Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And so what is the three-dimensional version of a circle?

• 43:28Chuck Nice?

  A sphere.

• 43:29Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  A sphere, so in space, you can see your horizon in every direction.

• 43:32Chuck Nice?

  Every direction, all at once.

• 43:33Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Which is at the, uh, we, it makes us think we're at the center of a sphere, but that's no different from you thinking you're in the center of the ocean. Right, just cuz you're in the center of your horizon.

• 43:42Chuck Nice?

  Ah, that's.

• 43:42Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Next.

• 43:43Chuck Nice?

  Ah, that's great, that's good stuff right there. Here we go, this is, uh, Chen Yuan, who says, if we look, if we were to look in all directions, billions of light years away, will we see younger universe in all directions enveloping our bigger one now?

• 44:03Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I have to rephrase that, cuz if, as you look out, you see things not as they are, but as they once were.

• 44:09Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 44:10Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So you are looking at a younger and younger and younger universe. That's the whole point of cosmology. It allows, the fact that it takes light time to reach us, allows us to see what the universe was doing in the past.

• 44:22Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 44:22Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  If light traveled at infinite speeds, you see the whole universe as it is now, with no evidence of what it was once doing. But because it takes light time to move, you look out, you see a younger and younger and younger and younger universe, until you see the Big Bang itself.

• 44:37Chuck Nice?

  Mm-hmm.

• 44:38Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And that is fourteen billion light years' time away from us in every direction.

• 44:44Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Okay, 20 billion years ago.

• 44:46Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 44:47Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Okay, and if you calculate that distance through that changing time, it's 14 billion light years to that horizon. Okay, so, by the way, that horizon is much farther away today.

• 45:00Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 45:00Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Because the universe has been expanding ever since. But you'll see it as it is today. You see it as it was.

• 45:07Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 45:07Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  All right, so, um, I don't know what to say after that.

• 45:13Chuck Nice?

  I, I, I say, um, yeah.

• 45:19Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  One last question, if you'd like to do a quickie, go.

• 45:20Chuck Nice?

  All right, I gotta find one that you can do really quick.

• 45:23Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  You don't know how quick I can answer a question.

• 45:24Chuck Nice?

  Oh, okay, then I'm just gonna, I'm gonna give you one, here we go. This is, oh, what did I spell? This is Basantig, okay, I don't care what this is.

• 45:35Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Chuck.

• 45:37Chuck Nice?

  I'm sorry.

• 45:37Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  You have to at least try, Chuck.

• 45:38Chuck Nice?

  Okay. Basan, Basantig, Basanting, okay, I forgot it.

• 45:44Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I'm gonna read the name, give me.

• 45:45Chuck Nice?

  Here's the name, right there. What's that say? What's that?

• 45:51Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Basanting.

• 45:53Chuck Nice?

  You're right, that's what it is, Basanting.

• 45:55Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Sing.

• 45:56Chuck Nice?

  I just, the sing, yeah, okay.

• 45:57Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Okay.

• 45:58Chuck Nice?

  What if all the matter that we see in the universe is just three dimensional part of some four dimensional matter? And the dark gravity is just the gravity from the 4D part that we cannot see?

• 46:10Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I love it.

• 46:14Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  We are so blind to a higher dimension.

• 46:16Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 46:16Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  It could be that all the mysteries in our three dimensions plus time are completely solved by looking at this stuff from a higher dimension.

• 46:23Chuck Nice?

  From a higher dimension.

• 46:24Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Right.

• 46:25Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 46:25Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Right, just, if you lived in just a, a flat surface, there'd be stuff going on you had no idea.

• 46:31Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 46:32Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And we say, but can't you just see?

• 46:33Chuck Nice?

  Yeah.

• 46:33Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Just look up.

• 46:34Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 46:34Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  What is up?

• 46:35Chuck Nice?

  What is that giant graphite thing making, making, making, creating stuff?

• 46:40Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Right, on that flat surface.

• 46:41Chuck Nice?

  On that flat surface.

• 46:41Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  That's an artist. Where is he?

• 46:43Chuck Nice?

  Exactly.

• 46:44Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  It just shows up.

• 46:45Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 46:45Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Right, right, so, I love it. I, that's the kind of universe I want it to be. Because then when we figure out how to see higher dimensions.

• 46:51Chuck Nice?

  Boom, we figured everything out.

• 46:52Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Bada bing.

• 46:53Chuck Nice?

  There you go.

• 46:53Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  All right, Chuck, we gotta run.

• 46:54Chuck Nice?

  All right.

• 46:54Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  That, that, I enjoyed that, we should do more. Cosmic Cray's Deep Edition.