#622: Jason Williams "Bitcoin: Hard Money You Can't F*** With"

Jason Williams is an investor and entrepreneur. He has built and sold numerous companies, including an approximately $500 million exit in the healthcare space. Jason and Pomp have also worked together to invest more than $100 million in the bitcoin and crypto industry. In this conversation, we discuss bitcoin mining, alternative power sources, renewable energy, tire recycling, Saudi Aramco, personal finance, real estate, and debt to income ratios. ======================= Whether you're an experienced crypto trader or just starting out, Kraken has the tools to help you achieve financial freedom. With the new Kraken app, you can easily buy and sell over 60 of the most popular cryptocurrencies in just a few minutes. Featuring a sleek new design and an easy-to-use interface, you can now take your crypto portfolio with you on the go, 24/7. Visit kraken.com/pomp to learn more or search "kraken" in the app store. ======================= With over $1B AUM, Amber Group is a world-leading crypto finance platform helping institutions and individual investors to buy and sell cryptocurrency, earn yield, manage risk and access liquidity. Amber App new users only - earn 16% APR on BTC, ETH and USD stablecoins! Click on the link to sign up now: https://www.ambergroup.io/?utm_source=10508 ======================= Cosmos is building the Internet of Blockchains, marking a new era of interoperability, scalability, and usability. The free flow of assets and data between blockchains with bridges to Ethereum and Bitcoin will unleash the potential of DeFi, NFTs, and much more. Dive into Cosmos at cosmos.network/pomp

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:02Anthony Pompliano?

  What's up everyone, this is Anthony Pompliano. Most of you know me as Pomp. You're listening to the Pomp Podcast, simply the best podcast out there. Now let's kick this thing off. Jason Williams is an investor and entrepreneur. He has built and sold numerous companies, including an approximately $500 million exit in the healthcare space. Jason and I have also worked together to invest more than $100 million in the Bitcoin and crypto industry. In this conversation, we discuss Bitcoin mining, alternative power sources, renewable energy, tire recycling, Saudi Aramco, personal finance, real estate, and debt to income ratios. I really enjoyed this conversation with Jason, and I hope you do as well. Before we get into this episode, though, I want to quickly talk about our

• 0:45Anthony Pompliano?

  sponsors. First up is Kraken. For the last 10 years, Kraken has been one of the best platforms for trading crypto online. Now with the new Kraken app, it's easier than ever to buy and sell Bitcoin in over 60 of the most popular cryptocurrencies on the go 24/7. Simply download the Kraken app, connect your bank account, and start investing for as little as $10. Just a minute is all it takes to get started. With the new Kraken app, you have your portfolio in your pocket wherever you go. Monitor your investments, track winners and losers, keep tabs on your favorite projects, or view the most traded cryptocurrencies of the day. It's got all the features you need with none of the complexity. It's a simpler way to invest in crypto. Visit kraken.com/pomp now to learn more, or search

• 1:28Anthony Pompliano?

  Kraken in the App Store. Again, kraken.com/pomp now, or learn more by searching Kraken in the App Store. Kraken, they're OGs of the space, and you should be using their products. Go check them out at kraken.com/pomp. Next up is Amber Group. With low yields and looming risk of inflation around the world, it's no question crypto is the alternative. With Amber app, you can easily earn high yields on your crypto assets. Amber app is an all-in-one crypto finance app designed to help you earn, swap, trade, and invest in crypto. You can earn interest instantly simply by depositing assets to your wallet and receiving daily interest payouts. You can also customize fixed term investments between 1 to 360 days

• 2:10Anthony Pompliano?

  Enjoy higher yields with flexible redemptions. Whether you're a long-term holder or trading on market moves on Amber app, you can earn interest on your own terms and do more with your crypto. Go check them out by clicking on the link in the description or going to ambergroup.io. Last but not least is Cosmos. Cosmos is building the internet of blockchains, marking a new era of interoperability, scalability and usability. The free flow of assets and data between blockchains with bridges to Ethereum and Bitcoin will unleash the potential of DeFi, NFTs and much more. Dive into Cosmos at cosmos.network/pomp. Again, cosmos.network/pomp. Go check out what they're building.

• 2:49Anthony Pompliano?

  Their internet of blockchains marking a new era of interoperability, scalability and usability. Cosmos.network/pomp. All right, let's get into this episode with Jason. I hope you enjoy this one.

• 2:59Speaker 01

  Anthony Pompliano runs Pomp Investments. All views of him and the guests on his podcast are solely their opinions and do not reflect the opinions of Pomp Investments. You should not treat any opinion expressed by Pomp or his guests as a specific inducement to make a particular investment or follow a particular strategy, but only as an expression of his personal opinion. This podcast is for informational purposes only.

• 3:22Anthony Pompliano?

  All right, we're back. For those of you that don't know Jason, Jason and I have known each other for five years, give or take, maybe six years, five, six years. We just get along. We're like spirit animals. Like whenever we met, we were just like, yep, we're gonna be friends. That's great. We've done a bunch of investing together over the years, spent way too much time together. I've got basically five people that I could just call at any point and they'll answer and I could just shoot the shit. Four of them happen to have my last name and then Jason. So we're gonna bring him up here and there he is.

• 3:57Anthony Pompliano?

  Jason.

• 3:57Speaker 02

  Yo, what's up?

• 3:58Anthony Pompliano?

  All right, let's talk about PRTI. We were just talking about Saudi Aramco. So before I get your opinion on that, tell us what PRTI does and then how you guys got into the Bitcoin mining and crypto mining.

• 4:09Speaker 02

  Yeah, so PRTI is a really cool company. We were going after a global problem of what do you do with trash tires and light truck tires at their end of life? When you start to think about a circular economy, the best thing to do with those trash tires would be to recover them, recycle them, and reintroduce them in some capacity to be resold or reused, right? So PRTI takes these trash tires and heats them in a patented process over about 11 hours. When you heat a tire, it's a semi-solid, so it'll go to a gas phase pretty quickly if you can get the temperature and pressures correct.

• 4:52Speaker 02

  And then at PRTI, we do just that. We heat these tires, we're able to capture that vapor stream. That vapor stream is full of calories, it's synthetic gas, it's got methane, butanes, all the tans in it. Then we just run a condensation reaction on the back end, cool that gas down, and we capture a fair amount of high sulfur oil. It's kind of like a bunker fuel or like a shipping fuel. And then the rest of the synthetic gas that we don't capture as liquid oil, we can combust and, you know, turn a generator, turn our liquid fuels back into power generation.

• 5:33Speaker 02

  Then we have a solid fuel, it's like carbon, it's equivalent to mid-grade Appalachian coal. So we can also combust that as well. And then we have some steel that's in the tire and we just send that to scrap. So the tire is fully consumed and recovered. All of this is done in a, like, under pressure, under a vacuum, so we're not having any escaping gases. So you've seen a lot of images of these massive tire fires or like a...

• 6:07Speaker 02

  Tire pile on fire. Everything we're doing is under vacuum. We're controlling all of those gases and recovering all the thermal and the energy inside the tire. And, you know, we run the plant we have now with the amount of energy that it would take to to run like a three bedroom house for a year. So it's super efficient on the front end. And then we get, you know, massive amount of power on the back end. So that's really PRTI outside of any crypto mining.

• 6:37Anthony Pompliano?

  So when I think about PRTI, just from the power generation, what you're essentially doing is you're taking car tires, you put them in this process, and you are one getting them out of landfills, getting them out of the ocean, you know, like diverting them from going into these bad environmental situations. You then take it and you're basically getting oil, steel, carbon, syn gas, right? You're taking the oil and the steel, you sell that through various kind of strategies.

• 7:02Speaker 02

  Or we hold the oil pump, or we hold the oil and use it for power, right?

• 7:06Anthony Pompliano?

  And then you generate power. And then what you do with that power is where the mining comes in. But you could sell it into the grid, you could mine, you could do all kinds of different stuff with it. And so really what you have is you have an off grid renewable alternative power source, and then you're vertically integrating it with a miner, right? Because you control when you give it tires or when you don't. So you've got some controllability there. And then it's completely off the grid, meaning that you're not reliant on the local electrical business. All you're doing is you're taking car tires and creating power. Fair?

• 7:37Speaker 02

  Yeah, very much so. So you have a decentralized power plant that doesn't necessarily have to have an interconnect agreement with the grid. You can wheel your power and use it 100% for parasitic load, mine cryptocurrency, wheel it to a power hungry neighbor. It's a pretty efficient little system. It generates 6.15 megawatts of base load power off of a feedstock that we get paid to take.

• 8:07Anthony Pompliano?

  So people also are saying in the comments that you have a windshield on your face with those glasses. But talk about Saudi Aramco. We were just talking and it sounds like it's a no brainer for them to do this, to basically take the waste streams off of their oil production, and then mine Bitcoin. Like, you, one, would divert it from damaging the environment, and two, is you would have a really profitable revenue stream. Is that your read on this situation?

• 8:36Speaker 02

  Yeah, I mean, there's, there's been a number of companies that have popped up and have hooked Gen sets up to flare gas in the Permian. Some of your friends are doing that right now. And when you're talking about the world's, what, second or third largest oil producer in the world, they have a tremendous amount of flare gas coming off as a waste stream byproduct of oil refinery. So yeah, makes total sense for them to get in the space. You know, the operating conditions are pretty harsh where they, where they're located. So, but it's not impossible to set up, Pop.

• 9:14Anthony Pompliano?

  Yeah. And when you think about PRTI or Saudi Aramco, both of these are power generation businesses, and kind of have unique aspects to them. Is it your opinion that every single power generation business is eventually just going to go and have some aspect of their business be Bitcoin mining or crypto mining? Or do you feel like that's just a kind of Bitcoin and crypto dream that people think that's going to happen, but it's unlikely to actually occur?

• 9:41Speaker 02

  No, I think anyone who runs a business, a for-profit business, is looking to, you know, expand their margins and to create efficiencies. And if you're given an opportunity to take a waste stream, a real liability, actually, sometimes you have to shut down your oil refinery because you're not managing your flare correctly. So imagine if you can take that flared gas and combust it in a way that's, you know, EPA friendly and also monetizable now. It's not, it's not something that's a loss leader or a, you know, this environmental concern, but now you're generating revenue with it. It makes absolute sense

• 10:21Speaker 02

  that anyone in this business would connect the gen set to a mining rig and, and get in the business, set up a prop desk, and they already have a prop desk, I'm sure, but make that happen. Total no brainer.

• 10:36Anthony Pompliano?

  Yeah. And then what do you think is likely to be the downside to a decision like this? Right? It's different for PRTI, for example, as a private business where you and a number of other shareholders that kind of you're close with are shepherding a business and building it from scratch to become successful versus a $1.8 trillion business that is, you know, watched by every single person in the world. What do you think some of like the decision-making processes there? Or what are some of like the downsides?

• 11:05Speaker 02

  Yeah, I mean, there's a number of things, you know, off the cuff I can think of. One is scale. I mean, you're talking about such a massive business, thinking about, think about, I think, you know, check my numbers, Pomp, but if Saudi Aramco got into mining business, they would contribute one half of all the power that the network is using right now. So just the scale is enormous. And they're not in that business. They're an oil refining business. So they're going to have to either acquire a company to come in, you know, buy versus build thesis. They've got significant, you know, regulatory pressures

• 11:43Speaker 02

  around the world. And, you know, they'd be creating a lot of money here if they were Bitcoin miners. So I'm sure they would have to deal with different regulatory pressures from their competing, you know, from the competition in the space. I think it's, it's more complicated than even I've considered at this point.

• 12:07Anthony Pompliano?

  Yeah. What else are you excited about in Bitcoin crypto world?

• 12:13Speaker 02

  Man, there's a ton of things going on. Like, I know I take a lot of flak for being focused in the NFT space. I think it's a huge innovation that's going on. I'm going to stand by that. You know, I've seen probably three or four great disruptive innovations in my time. One was the first company I started. Second was the internet. The third was Bitcoin. And I actually think NFTs are a big deal. So I don't know. I'm not trying to make friends.

• 12:41Anthony Pompliano?

  Give us the 30 second pitch on why you think NFTs are the fourth technological revolution behind Bitcoin.

• 12:48Speaker 02

  Yeah, and again, I don't even know if it's behind Bitcoin. I don't know where NFTs will reside. It's probably not an efficient place to put them in Bitcoin's block reward. But beyond that, I think the fractionalization of assets is really intriguing to me. And, you know, I'm just watching it happen with silly JPEGs at this point.

• 13:13Anthony Pompliano?

  Yeah. And so the idea around fractionalization is similar to like what the collectibles, Rallyroads, Alts, what other ones do we know? Like, there's a bunch of businesses like that. What? Masterworks, etc. Like, they're all creating fractional ownership of various assets. What you're talking about is doing that for digital assets through the NFTs versus doing it with the physical, like collector items or pieces of art.

• 13:38Speaker 02

  Yeah, I mean, Masterworks doesn't have a blockchain behind it in any way at this point. They're just creating, they're buying a piece of blue chip art and they're making an LLC and distributing shares.

• 13:49Anthony Pompliano?

  Got it. And then in terms of how you spend your time on a daily basis, a lot of the young people who watch this, we talk to them about personal finance, investing, etc. You're a wealthy guy who built an incredible business and have really learned how to invest. What are like the big takeaways in your mind for folks who are trying to figure it out, right? You spent a lot of time balancing being an entrepreneur and an investor. Like, any kind of lessons that you've learned over the years that you think are worth people knowing?

• 14:21Speaker 02

  Yeah, I mean, you and I talk about this a lot, but I think people focusing on debt to income ratio is a wonderful lesson that you can teach them. You know, if you're making $60,000 a year, don't spend $65,000. You know, I'm making it a hard, fast example here, but we could spend an hour talking about this. But it's something worth talking about, really focusing on debt to income ratio, saving appropriately, and living within your means.

• 14:46Anthony Pompliano?

  Joe, John, you guys got any questions?

• 14:48Speaker 03

  That was my question, but.

• 14:49Anthony Pompliano?

  Was what?

• 14:50Speaker 03

  What advice he would give him, like, thinks about, like, he's obviously doing well for himself, right? I'm talking to Jason now, but.

• 14:59Speaker 03

  But yeah, it was just that, like, I think a lot of the younger people that watch the show, right? They come out and they say, uh, maybe I don't have a business idea. Maybe I'm not an entrepreneur. Maybe I'm just, you know, working, uh, saving, investing, stuff like that. And there's no get rich quick, but like, what are the tools that I need to be able to invest intelligently? What should I be focusing on? Should I be just investing in the S and P? Should I be looking at, uh, alternative assets, stuff like that? But it seems like, uh, Jason just wants the people to know not to spend more than you make.

• 15:29Anthony Pompliano?

  What, what do you think about, uh, from an investment standpoint, Jason?

• 15:33Speaker 02

  What, in terms of stocks?

• 15:34Anthony Pompliano?

  No, just like, like the various asset classes. Like, if you were 25 years old today, how would you think? Yeah, how would you think about making more money and then also where you would put that money?

• 15:45Speaker 02

  Yeah, so for me, like, I, I, I think people should feel very comfortable working more than one job. Again, not popular. People are trying to get that luxury life, you know, and they want to take it easy and travel and everything. But for me, um, you know, having one, two, three jobs, creating multiple revenue streams, creating passive income streams, you know? If you're going to buy a place, buy a place, maybe that has two meters so you can rent one side of it out and live in the other. You know, leverage, uh, that against the mortgage. There's just so many different strategies. I like real estate, um, but, you know, at this point, uh, I keep going back to Bitcoin as like the, uh, as digital real estate,

• 16:29Speaker 02

  as highly liquid real estate, um, not too much into the stock market, pulled everything out in like 17, 18. So I've been on the sidelines there for the most part and, uh, just got a bunch of venture, um, early stage venture, which is hard to get into until you make money. It's really hard to invest, but, you know, if I was a young person starting off, focus on debt to income ratio. Don't be afraid to work hard, multiple jobs, always improving the job. So better benefits, better salary until you can get out of the job, uh, the job race or, um, kind of the job cycle and have enough, uh, passive investments producing for you so that you can keep leveling that up.

• 17:12Anthony Pompliano?

  People are asking at the moment, where do you stand with El Prez from Barstool? I see the Barstool hat and I think they've seen the gazillion memes, let his hands, the whole thing. What is the current state? Friends? Frenemies?

• 17:26Speaker 02

  Yeah, so you know, Dave, Dave is holding a Bitcoin. I'm not a fan of the whole safe moon stuff, but I'm letting that slide. Got a super hot girlfriend. He's got the red rhino, whom I'm a huge fan of as well. I'm trying to get a job with him. I need my eighth job. So we're good. I just need to get on that payroll, Dave. Let's go.

• 17:50Anthony Pompliano?

  How many jobs are you trying to get right now?

• 17:52Speaker 02

  I told you, I'm just trying to level up the jobs. I get a better job, I'll get rid of another job. But no, I don't mind working.

• 18:01Anthony Pompliano?

  John, what questions you got?

• 18:02Speaker 04

  What's up, Jason? I've actually never met you, so nice to meet you virtually. But one, I love your Bitcoin ticker, I believe, that you can see.

• 18:11Anthony Pompliano?

  That, yeah, the Bitcoin clicker talk, Bitcoin clicker, whatever.

• 18:17Speaker 04

  Ticker.

• 18:18Anthony Pompliano?

  But one thing I think we kind of skipped over, not many people, I don't think, like, know you and kind of like, can you talk about your start and how you, how you got to this point in your life?

• 18:27Speaker 02

  Yeah, so my beginnings were in healthcare and thought I wanted to be a doctor, became a PA, was off to do a surgical residency at Yale. And while I was there, came up with the idea for retail medicine and urgent care, primary care, that would be placed in an environment like a Starbucks, that would provide 80% of the services that you'd find in a US-based emergency department. And we would leverage advanced care providers to provide that care. So we would cut costs down. At the end, we were doing what you'd find in an emergency room, those services for one tenth the cost, seven days a week,

• 19:08Speaker 02

  with advanced care providers doing most of the care and ended up selling that business a number of times, ending in 2015 for right about a half a billion bucks. So it gave me an opportunity to hang out with pomp, drink beers, buy a McDonald's, turn it into a laundromat with some friends and learn about Bitcoin mining and Ethereum mining.

• 19:30Anthony Pompliano?

  The McDonald's that we got.

• 19:33Speaker 03

  He threw that in there very casually.

• 19:36Anthony Pompliano?

  We went to Charlotte and I'll never forget this. We pulled up to it and Jason was like, this is a good one. And I was like, what? And it was like, kind of run down. He goes, yeah, let me show you. And the three things that he immediately called out was, one, it was like a structurally sound building. It was really big, the whole thing. Two was it had a massive parking lot. And then three was, I remember he said something to the effect of like, look around. And we looked around, there's all these other businesses. He goes, if everyone goes down, we all go down together around here. Like, it's just like, McDonald's put it here, right? Like, they must have done a bunch of studies and all this stuff in terms of foot traffic and driving and the demographics of the neighborhood, like all that. And McDonald's wasn't leaving the area. They were just going

• 20:19Anthony Pompliano?

  across the street. So it ended up, he was like, yeah, look, you got a structurally sound building. It's really big. It fits what we need. It's got a big parking lot. And like, I think it was an acre or two that it came with. And then it basically wasn't McDonald's. So that all the demographic studies, he's like, we just ride their coattails. Appreciate you studying the local area for us.

• 20:36Speaker 03

  Yeah, you don't want to.

• 20:37Speaker 02

  Yeah. And it goes back to the original question you asked me around, like, if I was a 25, 30 year old, what kind of strategy would I deploy? This is one of those strategies. Because I'll ask Pomp as a young person who got invested in a pretty significant piece of infrastructure, commercial real estate. How many mortgage payments have you made on that, Pomp?

• 21:00Anthony Pompliano?

  Zero.

• 21:00Speaker 02

  Zero. Zero. So you don't need money to make money. You just need to have the right people together with the right vision and the right business. And you can leverage all that up and do that over and over and over again. Because not only did Pomp and I do that with that McDonald's, but I kind of did that 127 times over with FastMed when we were building that.

• 21:22Anthony Pompliano?

  So a lot of people don't know this about your story, which is, everyone knows the FastMed story. Was these kind of a chain of retail locations focused on urgent care. Jason and that company pioneered that model. But there was also a real estate element to it. So they would. Go and they would find specific types of pieces of real estate that they identified. They would buy it, then they would lease it from the company, like this whole thing. And so, Jason, maybe talk a little bit just from like the real estate side, how you thought about like what locations to actually go into? Cause I think you guys were like going into like old banks or something. And then in terms of how you would try to finance those deals as a business owner versus just an individual investor.

• 22:03Speaker 02

  Yeah, so when we decided or got to the point where we were going to rapidly grow, we were very fortunate that as we were growing, Blockbuster Video was collapsing. So we were able to kind of go into that market and Blockbuster Video stores were in a, most of the time, a pretty acceptable location for us to place our FastMed. So, man, we just went in and pre-leased and warehoused as many of these Blockbuster Video stores as we could. If I could buy them, I'd buy them. If I had to just lease them, I'd lease them. But it turned out to be a really great opportunity and a good fit for us. We were going into, you know, secondary and tertiary markets, cleaning up real estate blight.

• 22:46Speaker 02

  This was just vacant, dead property and we could go in and revitalize it. And those businesses exist today. I think FastMed now, you know, since I've been gone since 2015, but it's continued to prosper and grow. I'm very proud of that. And they have 200 or 300 locations now, Pom.

• 23:06Anthony Pompliano?

  And if you had to look at real estate and that strategy, like what would you do today if you were a young person interested in real estate? Like, how would you think about where to actually go look for real estate? And then like how to finance it if you didn't, you know, have a ton of money to go do it?

• 23:21Speaker 02

  Yeah, so if you, if you have a business, most of the time, a bank will allow you to owner finance a property. Now, they won't let you do it over and over again until you start to generate real revenue in the company. But you, you should have a shot at, at owner financing. Like, I'm doing a startup right now with a hospital system. And fortunately or unfortunately, the, the real estate I've targeted or

• 23:50Speaker 02

  Community banks, they're, they're going out of business left and right. They fit perfectly for what I'm trying to do, which is an iteration of FastMed. It's called MyCare365. And we're able to provide primary care services with extended hours, nights and weekends, seven days a week,

• 24:11Speaker 02

  in community banks, which allows for the flexibility of a drive-through component. If you can imagine, testing for COVID, et cetera, immunizations, not having to come into the facility. So it's, uh, it's been a lot of fun to, uh, to be on the sidelines for a little while, but now, uh, come through and, uh, be able to, uh, do some cool things with telemedicine and primary care, uh, for example.

• 24:36Anthony Pompliano?

  Before we let you go, what, uh, what's gonna happen to Bitcoin later this year? Bullish, bearish, sideways, backwards?

• 24:42Speaker 03

  Parabolic.

• 24:43Anthony Pompliano?

  Parabolic, some may say.

• 24:46Speaker 02

  Yeah, uh, no, I, I, I got a pizza and cheesy bread, Domino's Pizza and cheesy bread, uh, bet with Mark Yusko, uh, that Bitcoin's six figures. I, I got the six-figure bet. This thing's going, uh, going to the moon. So, uh, it's, it's the single best investment that, you know, I've ever seen in my life. And, uh, I'm just excited to, uh, to have the opportunity to own a little bit of it.

• 25:11Anthony Pompliano?

  I, uh, uh, have to ask before we let you go, going parabolic, when we first met, your Twitter handle was something else. It was like Jay Williams or something. Where did going parabolic coming from? Cause that it might be outside of trillionaire energy, that might be the second coolest phrase that I've heard in a long time.

• 25:32Speaker 02

  Bro, I, I don't know. I, I think we were just talking about it. The term parabolic came up and then, uh, you know, my Twitter handle was at Jay Williams FastMed, F S T M E D or something. And, uh, no, I just went with it. It, it suits me. I like fast cars, pit vipers, BMX, the whole nine yards, man. Camry Max, like you guys too.

• 25:58Anthony Pompliano?

  All right. Any last, last words of advice for, for young people about Bitcoin investing, risk management? People want to know if Riff Raff is a Bitcoin investor and anything else?

• 26:12Speaker 02

  Nah, look, while you guys are young, you gotta go for it. Like, and I'm sure you guys talk about this on the show, but you know, you've got time. And if you make some mistakes, small, big, you can recover. You gotta go for it. Because you can't get rich working a nine to five. You can't get rich doing a job. So, you know, you may have to, to go out there and, and be self-employed, and then expand that business. You know, get some other people working for you. But you gotta take the risks. You gotta go for it. And that's, that's the big thing that I get concerned about with young people now. They've seen their parents blown out. They've dealt with a lot of weird

• 26:56Speaker 02

  stuff with COVID and etc. And I worry, I worry that their risk tolerance is going to be kind of shut down a little bit. But you gotta keep going for it if you want to be financially independent.

• 27:09Anthony Pompliano?

  Before I let you go, at GoingParabolic on Twitter, and then what about the book? Where can people go buy the book? Tell us about the book.

• 27:17Speaker 02

  Yeah, Amazon. It's, I also have it on Audible. It's crazy, man. I wrote it, one, just for my own kind of selfish bucket list. But it was also a great learning opportunity for myself. I'm doing something cool with it right now, too. So by the end of this year, we'll have some news on the book. But yeah, number one bestseller in macroeconomics, number one bestseller in international finance. You know that I only come strong. So go check it out.

• 27:50Anthony Pompliano?

  All right. Thank you for doing this. I appreciate it. Mr. Science himself with the Pit Vipers. I'm pretty sure that you're gonna be the number one marketer of Pit Vipers before the end of the year.

• 28:00Speaker 02

  Bro, they don't even pay me. They don't even pay me. I'm doing it all wrong. And you guys got SoFi and your sweaters and-

• 28:06Anthony Pompliano?

  SoFi.com/pomp is amazing. Everyone should go to SoFi.com/pomp.

• 28:11Speaker 02

  Right. I'm not getting paid for nothing, man. I'm just out here repping things I like.

• 28:17Anthony Pompliano?

  I love it. I love it. All right. Thank you so much for doing this. We'll talk soon.

• 28:20Speaker 02

  Thanks, guys. Take care.