SC EP:1217 Memorable moments from 2025

Merry Christmas! Wishing you peace, warmth, for this holiday season. May your days be filled with good stories, good company, and moments that stay with you long after the lights come down. I wanted to share with you some memorable interviews from 2025.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:03Speaker 00

  It looked like somebody was bent over and had their head in the window of the deer blind and it either heard me or smelt me and he pulled his head out of the tent and stood straight up and that, that shocked me.

• 0:24Speaker 00

  They don't make people that, that big.

• 0:31Speaker 01

  The way it moved, almost as if it was gliding across the beach. I've never seen anything move like that in my life.

• 0:45Speaker 01

  They were screaming at each other in gibberish.

• 0:49Speaker 01

  It sounded like a language and they were chuntering away, back and forwards, back and forwards, back and forwards.

• 0:56Speaker 01

  I know what a bear looks like and there is no way on this planet that what I saw bears.

• 1:14Speaker 02

  911, what are you reporting? Jesus Christ, you better... Karen, see ya! Hello? Get somebody out here! What's going on now, sir? That son of a bitch is about six foot nine, I don't know. Do you see him now, sir? Yes, I'm looking right at him, uh-uh.

• 1:38Speaker 03

  Ho, ho, ho! Merry Christmas!

• 2:07Wes Germer?

  Merry Christmas, wishing you peace, warmth, and a little bit of wonder this holiday season. May your days be filled with good stories, good company, and moments that stay with you. I wanted to share with you some memorable interviews from 2025. The very first one that came to mind was Andy, who is a retired NYPD police officer. He moved to Pennsylvania and went fishing late one night. As he approached the dock, he saw what he thought was a bear. Andy says, "I saw it from behind, and it was bent over with its

• 2:48Wes Germer?

  arms in the water. This thing was making strange sounds, like it was talking to itself." If you've had an encounter, and you'd like to be on the show, shoot me an email. My email address is [email protected]. And if you get a chance, check out sasquatchchronicles.com. You can become a member and get additional shows. Andy later said, "I never believed in Bigfoot until I saw it."

• 3:21Speaker 05

  I'm originally from New York City. I moved out here about maybe, oh, just about five years now. But I really like it out here. It's quiet. I like the nature. I wanted to get out of New York. But I never thought that these things were real. You know, in New York City, the most we have, you see out there are raccoons, maybe once in a while at nighttime, or a rat or something like that.

• 3:45Wes Germer?

  Yeah, I've heard New York has some pretty big rats.

• 3:48Speaker 05

  Oh, yeah. Rats and dogs and things like that. And occasional homeless people, you say. But this was something totally different.

• 3:57Wes Germer?

  Well, if you would, take me back two years ago, uh, kind of start from the beginning. What were you doing and, and what happened? What'd you end up seeing?

• 4:05Speaker 05

  Okay. Well, about two years ago, well, I live in, I live in a part of Pennsylvania called Kingston. And the Sasquah River separates Kingston and Wilkes-Barre. And, um, the Sasquatch always had good fishing and about two years ago, a guy caught a, a record sized catfish. And he was in the news and he explained that he'd go out in the nighttime and shine light and caught a nice big sized catfish. And I, when I was in New York, I enjoyed fishing. Um, so I picked up my fishing license and I said, you know what? I'm gonna go out there early. Um, very early, like Sunday night going into the morning time.

• 4:47Speaker 05

  I went out about three o'clock and to get over to Wilkes-Barre, so you have to cross a bridge. And there's like, there's a college community on the side. And there's steps that you can walk down going to where the Sasquatch is at where you can fish. So I parked my car, got all my gear together and I go up on the steps. As I'm walking up the steps to go down, down to where the fishing area is that I hear like mumbling, um, like mumbling and grunting and I'm thinking maybe somebody's already down there fishing. You know, I purposely picked Sunday because out here it's kind of old fashioned.

• 5:30Speaker 05

  People sleep late on Sunday. Nobody would be out there. I thought I'd be by myself. When I went over and I started going down the concrete steps and I looked down, they have lights that's all along. I don't know if you would call it a pier or, it's like a park area within this woods and then there's a river. And the lights is not directly there, but you can see what I thought I saw, um, was a bear bit over. And right away I'm thinking, were there any cubs around? You know, I don't want to get attacked by a bear. But this pier was like grunting and, and, and mumbling. It would.

• 6:16Speaker 05

  How to explain it? It was like, like he was talking to somebody like he would make noises like

• 6:24Speaker 05

  and then he did it with snort and grunt and pull back like he was pulling something out of water. So I stayed quiet and I watched it. And as I'm watching it just then, the light that was above me on the steps clicks on. And that's when this thing stood up, turned his torso and looked at me. And I'm looking at it. And I'm trying to figure out what it is. This is not a bear. Um, I dropped the fishing rod. And I remember I dropped the rod and I stepped on it because I

• 7:09Speaker 05

  didn't want it to roll down the stairs where it was at. It looked at the rod and then looked back up at me. And it and did like a, like showed its teeth like, like, do you ever see how the chimpanzees show their teeth? Like, you ever seen that show BJ and a Bear?

• 7:31Wes Germer?

  No, I don't think I've seen that one.

• 7:33Speaker 05

  BJ McKay, he was a trucker and he had a pet chimpanzee. It was called BJ and a Bear. He used to come home when I was little. And every time he would say something, it would like smile at him and show his teeth. Like, you know how the chimpanzees do?

• 7:46Wes Germer?

  Yeah.

• 7:47Speaker 05

  They like this. Yeah, it it did something like that. It had like these square teeth. I didn't see canines or nothing. And it looked at it looked at my fish and pole looked at. Then it raises its arm. And it has like this long hair. It's dripping wet. And it raises this arm and it pulls up a catfish. It was about maybe, I don't know, a foot, foot and a half long. And it starts swaying back and forth. And I'm looking at it and I'm, I'm still, my mind is like, like, what the hell is that?

• 8:27Speaker 05

  And it had big round eyes, very muscular. Um, the, the, the, the fur or the hair or whatever you want to call it was because it was wet. It was clinging to his body, but you could see the muscles, like, you know, the thigh muscles and the, um, shoulder muscles, um, very skinny waist. And I went down slowly to pick up my fishing rod, but I'm not, I'm keeping my eyes on it. And it's swinging back and forth and it starts swinging the fish in the water.

• 9:09Speaker 05

  And when I couldn't, cause I'm, what I'm watching it, I couldn't see where the rod was at. I looked down to pick up the rod. When I look back up, it's going underneath the bank of where the, the river is, like crawling underneath there somewhere.

• 9:26Speaker 05

  And that's when I grabbed my, uh, my rod and I went back and I went back to the car and I sat down and I'm, I'm like, what, what did I just see? And it's, it's been bothering me ever since. Um, but that, that was pretty much the whole, uh, the whole experience, but I wasn't that far away from it. I was maybe 15 feet.

• 9:50Wes Germer?

  15 feet's pretty close, man. It's really close to one of these things. Uh, when the creature made its exit, wh- what did it do? It crawled underneath the bank?

• 10:01Speaker 05

  Have you ever been by like the bank of a river and it's like you can go underneath the bank? It looked like it did that. It looked like it crawled. I don't know if it has a cave up under there or it dug out a hole or something, but it crawled up under there. And, um, I, I turned around and I, I went back over and I went to my car and I was like, you know, what did I just see? Um, I know it wasn't a homeless person. Um, it looked like.

• 10:32Speaker 05

  You you it looks like you you never see like a person that has like mental issues like a mental retarded person. It looks like somebody like that had sex with an orangutan. It had that type of look in the face, very wide mouth, but the eyes had that type of. You know how I'm trying to think of like people with Down syndrome. You know how all the Down syndrome people look alike, no matter what race they are, they have that type of look. It had it had that type of look around the eyes.

• 11:02Wes Germer?

  Yeah, I've heard that from other eyewitnesses as well. Uh, when they talk about it, you know, they'll say it kind of has that look. And I've wondered over the years if it's something with the eyes, because you know, other people will describe the eyes as being kind of sunken. Uh, so when you walk up on this thing and you're watching it, are you at an elevated position?

• 11:24Speaker 05

  Right, right. I'm looking down at it. I'm because you have to go down the stairs. To get to the where the river's at, where you can stand on a. I don't know what you would call it, I guess, right on the bank of the river and fish. So I'm looking down at it and um. It.

• 11:43Speaker 05

  When the light come on, when the light came on overhead of me, for some reason that light that wasn't on, it clicked on. I dropped a pole, it heard the pole. And it turned around like greased lightning, um, its whole body, not its head. That is at the top, perhaps his body turned and legs turned around like one, two, and it just looked at me. Then it looked at the stuff in my hands and looked at the pole.

• 12:11Speaker 05

  And raised its arm like. Like to show me the fish. I I don't know if that's what it was doing. Raised its arm and then I could see the hair hanging from the arm that was dripping water off. And it held the fish, then it started swaying back and forth, swaying and slapping the fish in the water. Like if to say, oh, look what I got, don't come down here or something like that. You're not getting this fit. Uh, that's the impression I got. I don't know if that's what it was doing, but it was swaying back and forth. And it showed me his teeth. I don't know what that means in the primate world. I know if a dog shows you his teeth, he's gonna bite you. Um. And something told me to freeze, like, don't move.

• 12:52Speaker 05

  Because I've been around other type of animals and I didn't want to want this thing to set off, uh. You know, you run and it starts to go after you. It starts like a, a, a, what do you call it? Like a prey drive or something? So, um. I just froze. And when I slowly went down to pick up the rod. And I was so busy looking at it, I didn't see where I was reaching. I looked down for two seconds. Two seconds to grab the rod. I looked up. I saw the back of it going up under the bank of the, um, the river. That's how fast it moved. It was two seconds.

• 13:26Wes Germer?

  Yeah, you know, when non-human primates smile at you and show you their teeth, that's not a good, it's not a good sign. I think we're actually the only primate that shows its teeth and smiles. And it doesn't mean I'm going to kill you. Um, you know, I was curious about the swaying. Was it swaying from side to side?

• 13:46Speaker 05

  Yeah, it's swaying from side, just like the chimps do when they. I don't know if you watch these National Geographic things and they, they grab something and they swing and they're swinging it. And he does what he's doing. He's making a grunt and snort noises and. And some, something like, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, something like that. And everyone's like, oh. And do that. Um. That, I, that was pretty much the, the whole thing. Is that the color? Was a tannish color, but the, the, the skin was like, uh. It was like, uh, I wouldn't call it a gray, like a slate. Maybe a slate color, a light gray. Kind of leathery looking. Um, I saw the skin on the face.

• 14:32Speaker 05

  Then the rest was hair. And then what, then you could see the, the belly skin. And the rest was in standing in the water.

• 14:40Wes Germer?

  Yeah, my opinion is when they're swaying like that from side to side, I think they're nervous. This is my opinion, of course, but you'll see it in gorilla behavior. They'll rock often rock themselves if they're stressed or anxious or and even we do that. We'll kind of humans will and as being primates, we will rock ourselves too. As kind of a comforting behavior, but I kind of think when these things do that, they're swaying from side to side. I almost think it's like a nervous, a nervous reaction. He did a pretty good job at describing it, but when you were looking into the face,

• 15:23Wes Germer?

  what other details can I stay with you today, even beyond the face? What, what kind of details stay with you today? And did it remind you of a human?

• 15:33Speaker 05

  It, oh, the eyes didn't look human. The eyes were like big, round eyes. I didn't see any whites, like big, round, black eyes. Um, so as human,

• 15:48Speaker 05

  the only thing I could say is that Down syndrome thing, it sticks in my head. It, uh, and the mouth was, was really wide, like the, there was the eyes, nose and the mouth went from cheek to cheek. And when it smiled, it had square teeth. Uh, smiled or, or showed me his teeth. If they were square teeth, I, it, it looked like,

• 16:14Speaker 05

  it looked like, like I said, a Down syndrome person had sex with an orangutan. That's just, just what it looked like. When I dropped the, the rod, the rod and reel, it looked down at it. It, it like it, it was watching me and it, it looked, it saw it, it's like it followed it fall. It looked down at it. They looked back up at me. I looked down at it and I, it was my rod was going to fall down the stairs. I didn't want it to, to go near it. I didn't want to threaten this thing in any way. I stepped on it.

• 16:51Speaker 05

  And I reached down to like to pick it up and it watched me and it started swaying like, I don't know what it thought the rod was. Did it though? I was gonna try to hit him with it. I don't know. And it starts splashing the fish in the water. I looked down to grab the rod. When I look up, it was almost gone.

• 17:14Wes Germer?

  I know your background is from New York and your former NYPD and you know, cops, especially in New York are very no nonsense and I get that, you know, but you're having this encounter now. You're in Pennsylvania and you're seeing this thing. Before any of this happened to you, what was kind of your take on the whole subject of Sasquatch? What was your feelings about the subject?

• 17:41Speaker 05

  You know, it's funny. When I first moved out here about five years ago, I saw these guys in these cars and they were like, if you've seen a Sasquatch, contact us. And they had the numbers on the cars. I laughed at it. I didn't know what these guys were talking about. But I would always see them driving around Sasquatch hunters, our numbers, such and such. If you've seen a Sasquatch and blah, blah, blah. Um, I didn't think anything of it. I didn't, I didn't, you know, I always thought it was a joke. I always thought it was somebody dressed up in a suit, trying to do things for YouTube, trying to do, um, but then after this, I've been doing research upon research. I've listened to your show, YouTube videos.

• 18:26Speaker 05

  Um, on my lunch break, I go on a thing and I just trying to make sense of it, trying to, and then I find out that, um, these things are all over the world. People have seen these things. But I, I saw one with my own two eyes, so I know they're real.

• 18:41Wes Germer?

  Let me ask you, you know, you, you went from not really believing in this and not really putting too much thought into it and kind of maybe thinking it was a little nonsense and, and that's okay. I mean, I think the overall idea of Sasquatch does sound ridiculous until you run into one. Uh, but how did this kind of affect you afterwards?

• 19:04Speaker 05

  Changed my life. Um, I don't, I used to, when I first see, I, I retired from the police department in New York. When I came up here, I bought a two family home and the home needed some, some work and I would do a DoorDash job. And the best time at DoorDash, DoorDash out here is the nighttime, Fri- Thursday, Friday, Saturday, Sunday nights. People order all the time, you make a nice bit of money. I couldn't go out at nighttime anymore. Um, there's a place called Mountain Top where it's pretty much like country. And the people order, I'm in the city party and you drive up there and they pay you a big tip to bring the food. But soul trees, there's no lights up there, there's no anything. And one night I went and this guy had a cab and he says, well, leave the order on, on, on the porch.

• 19:49Speaker 05

  And as I get out the car, I got that feeling like something's watching me. I got the same feeling as when I stared in the eyes of this thing. I'm looking around, it's pitch black. I can't see anything. I put the order on his porch and I ran to the car. As I'm driving, I'm looking at all the trees from side to side. I was like, I'm a nervous wreck. I don't, I don't go out at night. Uh, I stopped in the DoorDash job. I got a job with the hospital police and the guy since your hospital up here. And I, um, I work from seven to three. I get home, I come inside, I put spotlights in my yard. I have a couple of dogs. I won't let them out until I make noise and put the lights on if anything's back there.

• 20:32Speaker 05

  Um, like we never had a couple of dreams about it. Right? It's, it's like your, your brain is trying to figure out something that's not supposed to be real.

• 20:42Wes Germer?

  Yeah, that's exactly what it's like. And I was curious if you had dreamed about it. I think it's a pretty common thing. I mean, even after my encounter, I dreamed about it for months. And I think maybe it is a way of the brain, kind of our subconscious trying to heal or trying to. Maybe deal with what we've seen. You know, I always say fishermen get the brunt of the aggressive behavior. You technically weren't fishing. You walked up on one that was actually trying to get food and you would think that would be very dangerous. You know, a lot of times with these things, when it comes to hunters, they're aggressive, but not quite like the way

• 21:27Wes Germer?

  they are with fishermen. And I kind of think it's because of the gun. You know, I even had a eyewitness on the show one time. He had a walking stick and he had kind of pointed it towards them like you would a gun and they reacted like it was a gun. And it makes me wonder, you know, in this situation, you drop your rod and reel and then you're reaching down to pick it up. I almost wonder if it was thinking that's a weapon and then it kind of quickly exited. I mean, why do you think it quickly exited and just tried to get out of there? Obviously, you weren't a match for it.

• 22:03Speaker 05

  I think that's what it was. And you know, it's the foot and thing. I don't go anywhere. This is a, this is a concealed carry state. I don't go anywhere without my, my nine millimeter on my hip. I had it that day and didn't even think about using it. I had it right on my side the whole time. It's like your brain freezes. People say, well, why didn't you take a picture? Why didn't you take it? It's like seeing a ghost or something. Your mind freezes and you're trying to process it. Um, I think that when somebody reached for the rod, it probably thought it was

• 22:41Speaker 05

  something. But it was gone within two seconds. I just caught the tail end of it going up under the bank. Now I don't know if it has a cave up under there, but I remember since I've had this experience listening to shows, I don't know if it was one of your shows or another show, but a gentleman was talking about how he lived in the South and his grandfather told him, don't go to a certain lake because the boogers live up under there. And he went there with his friend, something grabbed his friend's leg and pulled him down. And he saw the thing was like up underneath the bank. And they had caves. So I don't know if this is something they do, if they live up under the caves,

• 23:25Speaker 05

  up underneath the banks and then dig out caves and but when that, when I heard that it kind of clicked and I'm like, well, maybe that's what this one is doing. I, I, I don't know.

• 23:37Wes Germer?

  Yeah, I do remember that now. I can't remember which episode it was, but I do remember that. You know, what's fascinating is the creature was smart enough to uh fish, kind of like they do in the South. I think they call it noodling when they're trying to get catfish. You put your arm down there and the, the catfish basically bites onto your arm and you pull the fish out. That's kind of sounds like that's what that thing was doing. Um, you'd mentioned the chattering. You were kind of hearing this weird chattering and then it would snort like a pig when it was trying to pull the fish out. Did it remind you of the Sierra sounds at all when you were hearing that chattering?

• 24:17Speaker 05

  Sierra, what is that?

• 24:19Wes Germer?

  Yeah, I know you're kind of new to the subject. The, the Sierra sounds, you'll hear people refer to it as like the Samurai chatter. Uh, this gentleman, Ron Moorhead, a great guy. Uh, he captured them back in the early seventies. I want to see the activity actually started in the late sixties. Where they were interacting with these things and the guys ended up setting up recorders and they captured these things vocalizing back and forth to each other. You hear them in the intro of the show when Claire is talking. Claire's from Great Britain. When she's talking, I plug in some of the Sierra sounds. Actually, you know what? I have a different clip for you. This is um,

• 25:01Wes Germer?

  Ron Moorhead Sierra sounds, but this is a little bit different than what you hear in the intro. Um, this is when the two creatures were actually fighting over food. Um, is this kind of what you heard?

• 25:48Wes Germer?

  And you know, listening to that again, and you talking about having that pig snort, I swear I've heard, I heard some of the pig snorting in there, or what I would interpret as that. But was that kind of what you heard, something like that?

• 26:02Speaker 05

  Yeah, it was, it was like,

• 26:06Speaker 05

  I don't know, like something like that, but more like a lumix type would talk, like somebody that had mental. It was like, oh, oh, oh, every time it would tug, it would make a snort sound. And I sit there and watched it. It must've been like three minutes before that light clicked on. And it would, you know, pull back and it was hunched over. So I'm seeing the, the rear of it. And it looked like, like a bear. And it was bulky like that, like a bear's reached over that a hunch in its back. And I'm watching it and I'm like, what is it, what is it doing? Was it trying to pull? Is it stuck? Is it, then the light clicked on? It, it, it, it raises up.

• 26:48Speaker 05

  And twists, turns torso and looks up at me. And we just lock eyes.

• 26:54Wes Germer?

  Have you ever come back to that place?

• 26:57Speaker 05

  I've gone back in the daytime. And I've seen people fishing there. And I just sit and watch them and I look all around and watch it because I've, I've talked to other people about this and they look at you like you're crazy. You get all type of, I told a buddy that I grew up with, he's like my little brother. We grew up a little together. And he'll joke, he'll call me names. He'll call me Bigfoot guy, this and that. He'll send me funny things to my phone. They don't take you seriously. Um, so I just stopped talking to people about it. But it really, it really shook me up. Um, like I said, I won't go, if I go out at night, I'm in the car. And I'm there, I won't go anywhere, there's any woods or anything. Because this thing looked like it could rip me to pieces.

• 27:40Speaker 05

  Just a muscular friend. It didn't look like I've heard stories there like, oh, the nine, 10 feet tall. It wasn't that tall. Maybe. I'm, I'm a big guy. I'm, I'm six foot, about 280 pounds. This thing looked like it was maybe six, six, four, six, five, but it was all muscle. No fat, no.

• 28:02Speaker 05

  It looked like the legs looked like he could have leaped up onto the stairs and jumped on me. That's how, that's how muscular the thighs were.

• 28:09Wes Germer?

  Yeah, listening to the behavior of kind of what it was doing makes me think that it was a juvenile or a younger one. And hearing that it was probably six, five makes me even more think that it was probably a juvenile. Uh, when you went back there, did you kind of look over the edge to see if you could see where it went?

• 28:31Speaker 05

  No, I, I couldn't work myself up to do that. I would, I'll go by the stairs and I'll watch the people fish. I'll look over, but I won't, um.

• 28:41Speaker 05

  I won't, it's just the way this thing looked at me in the face like, it looks like if it, if it bites you, it'll bite your wrist off or something. I, I couldn't do that. Um. There's only one gentleman that took me seriously to job that I'm working at now. He told me a story about how before he was doing this job, see where I live at, there was a lot of coal mines. And before they can build buildings on the coal mines, they have to fill them up with concrete. So it does, I guess the foundation is strong enough for the building will collapse in or whatever. And that was his job. He was a driller and he would fill up. And he said, a lot of places he went to in remote areas, they would start to drilling. He would see them run out the caves.

• 29:24Speaker 05

  Um, and how I got to meet him is because I would go on a lunch and I would listen to your show. I listened to your, and he says, you always listen to this stuff. He said, you seen one? And I decided to tell him, I said, yeah, I saw one. He said, I used to see him too. And that's when he told me the story about the job he did. So I guess these citizens live in the mines. They live in the caves underground. They come out and. Do what they do. I don't know.

• 29:52Wes Germer?

  Yeah, Andy, you know, there's a lot of reports of them and it looks like they're utilizing caves or abandoned buildings as kind of a shelter or a temporary shelter. It makes you wonder sometimes, you know, I've been in this for a little bit of time now. And sometimes it feels like you're chasing a ghost. Sometimes it feels like it's like, where do they go? I was real curious if there was some sort of cave system up underneath that, you know, cliff or the edge of the water. But I get why you didn't go back down there and take a look. I really think that you ran into a juvenile of one of these things. And even with your description,

• 30:34Wes Germer?

  you know, a lot of eyewitnesses will describe the teeth like you did. And it's probably the most common way people would describe the teeth. They'll say they look like chiclets. Sometimes other people run into what I think is a subspecies of these things. And the teeth are very different, but I've had eyewitnesses go, yeah, their teeth look like chiclets. And when it opened its mouth, this thing looked like it could put a couple of baseballs in its mouth. No problem.

• 31:04Speaker 05

  This thing looked like it could fit a can of a pumpkin and just chop it in half. That's how wide the mouth was. Softball, easy. Like I'm, I'm just looking at it like, the hell is that? I'm thinking did an orangutan escaped from zoo? But then when I look in the face, I'm like, that's not a, is that a person? It looked like both. That's the only thing I can say. It looked like both. I don't know if there was another one there and it was so, because I was fixed on this one. And it could have been another one there like this is three something in the morning.

• 31:45Speaker 05

  And maybe, I don't know, because it's nothing but woods all up and down the um, Susquehanna.

• 31:52Wes Germer?

  Yeah, through eyewitness testimony, I mean, I can tell you my opinion, of course, I don't think that they're ever really alone. This one being what I think is a juvenile, the way it was acting, how it reacted to you. You know, the one thing that really stays with me about your encounter, I've had other eyewitnesses report uh, the pig snorting sound, where they'll say it sounded like a pig, but it wasn't quite a pig. And just now, listening to the Sierra sounds again, that other clip I played for you. Uh, and maybe I'm, maybe I'm dreaming, but when you listen to that, there's a few times where it sounds like it snorts like a pig.

• 32:35Speaker 05

  Yeah, what is it doing? At first, I thought it was stuck. I thought it was a bear and it stuck. But then I'm like, there's no talk. What is, what is, they want to turn on and look to me. It's like, my heart stopped. Your brain is trying to process something that shouldn't be there. That's the only way I can describe. I think these things, like I've been doing my research, I think these things sit and watch people.

• 33:05Speaker 05

  Um, I've heard a lot of stories where they say they uh, they'll be in the woods and they watch everything you do, they watch you. I had, I had a gun on my hip, I had the fishing pole, and I had a knife also, the knife was in my pocket. But I had the fishing pole with the little um, bucket, I had a bucket, and I had a little, little tackle box. And I, I don't know, maybe you figured the pole was a weapon. And when I went to pick it up, it took off. Um, I'm glad it didn't attack me.

• 33:39Wes Germer?

  Yeah, I'm glad it didn't attack you either. You know, and, and like I said before, I think most of the time they'll leave you alone. It's only when you engage with them, people get hurt. Um, I know that you're kind of new to the subject, Andy, and I ask everyone on the show, what do you think Sasquatch is? And there's no wrong answer, of course, because no one really knows. But what is your opinion? What do you think Sasquatch is?

• 34:06Speaker 05

  This is the part that that bothers me like because I believe in God, believe there's a creator. But since I've been doing my research on these things, I honestly, I think these things are the original.

• 34:20Speaker 05

  Neanderthals that everybody thinks is extinct because they're they have them here. They have in Russia, what do they call it, the Almasti or something? They have in China, uh, what's it called, the Yaren? They have. Uh, in the Himalayas, what is it? The uh, Obambo Snowman, the Yeti. Well, I think there's even a little one on, I think they never really went extinct. And maybe something. Or aliens or something came down and messed with their DNA and. And we're the out, we're the, we're the outcome of it. I don't know. I'm, I'm thinking they, I think the Neanderthals didn't really go extinct.

• 35:05Speaker 05

  I think they're original inhabitants and maybe we're. We're the abominations and they stay away from us and maybe they're waiting for us to kill ourselves over so they can come back out, maybe. They don't have children as frequent as we do. That's why we don't see as much of them. Maybe they go into their, their females go into their uh. Their cycle once every couple of years or something like that. I don't know. But um, I think they're, I think they're the uh. They're the um, what would he say? It was the Neanderthals and uh. And us, right? And then we were supposed to, we killed them all out. But I think what they didn't, I think uh, because I watch a lot of this stuff like I was watching a program where.

• 35:47Speaker 05

  A whale washed up on a beach, it was a blue whale or a gray whale and it was bitten in half. What, what the hell bites a whale in half? It's gotta be like a megalodon or something like that, but those are supposed to be extinct, right? Um, they're still around. I think, I don't know, the same thing I can think of that would bite a whale in half. I think that there, a lot of this stuff we, we think is not, is gone. Maybe it's all not gone, maybe still here. We're so busy on day to day lives. Maybe we should just stop and take a look. You know what I mean?

• 36:21Wes Germer?

  You know, I do remember that blue whale that was bitten in half. That was like 10 years ago or something like that, maybe a little bit more. Um, and a blue whale, if my memory is right, they're like 110, 120 feet long. I think they weigh over like 300,000 pounds. Um, and I do remember that because they stacked a bunch of school buses and it was several school buses for the length of this whale. And it was bitten in half. I mean, it, it does make you wonder.

• 36:52Speaker 05

  What bites a whale in half? It's gotta be like a megalodon or maybe a prehistoric, something that's still in the water. Um, I think that a lot of this stuff is still out there and we as people, we think that we're the only thing. I was watching another thing where they have pterodactyls in the Midwest. People say they see things like pterodactyls in the, in Arizona hills and the mountains that come down in the nighttime and hunt like, and in the Congo, there's supposed to be dinosaurs still around way like, uh, some type of thing that, that, that chases off elephants and hippos. Who says this stuff all died out? You know what I mean?

• 37:30Wes Germer?

  Yeah, I definitely understand where you're coming from. It reminds me of, uh, what was that fish?

• 37:37Wes Germer?

  The sealacanth, uh, that fish that they rediscovered, quote unquote rediscovered. I think it was back in, I want to say 1940, might've been 39. Uh, but it was this fish that scientists said, oh yeah, that thing, you know, it's been gone for 360 million years ago is the last time it was on this earth. And sometimes I wonder where they get some of those, those timeframes. But I think it was a bunch of guys in Asia that were catching them. And they're like, oh yeah, we eat them every night. What are you talking about? These things are extinct. You know, uh, they had no clue. So I do understand where you're coming from. I can tell you my hangup with, um, Sasquatch being a Neanderthal,

• 38:20Wes Germer?

  but I'll, I'll come back to that in a second. You know, you had mentioned they're all over the earth. I mean, there's Reports in Russia, there's reports in Australia, there's reports in Asia, they're everywhere. You know, when you read a report from Russia, like with the Almas, it sounds like a Bigfoot report from North America. They're seeing the same thing we are. It might be slightly different, but generally speaking, it's the same thing. And you know, even when I have people who have these things on their property, and it's not one encounter, they're seeing it multiple times over multiple years. And even then I'll ask them, where

• 39:01Wes Germer?

  do you think that they're going? This is your property. You know your property well. Where do you think they go at night or wherever? And the answer is always, I don't know. Can I ask you, I mean, why do you think it's so hard to catch up with them?

• 39:17Speaker 05

  Um, I think, I think they use the night. I think they've become nocturnal because of, I guess, people or machines or weapons or stuff. Maybe they use the night, they can use the night to hide and move and do what they gotta do. Most of the times we sleep at nighttime. I think they're just masters of their environment. And he moves so fast, like, you're not gonna outrun this thing. You're not gonna outmuscle it. If you got a gun, you better have good shot placement or something like that can blow off its arms or something like that. Because from the way they're built, they're gonna rip you to pieces. I just think that's what it is. They, they come out at night, do what they

• 40:02Speaker 05

  gotta do. Then they go back and sleep during the daytime. Like, I, I, I remember hearing, um, watching a program and the Native Americans said that they would, they would come and they would smell them in the nighttime and they would kidnap their, their wives and their kids and stuff like that. But they would always come out at nighttime. They would come out of the mountains.

• 40:23Speaker 05

  So maybe that's just maybe they're nocturnal.

• 40:26Wes Germer?

  Yeah, it could be, could be. I'm more skeptical, I guess. It just seems weird to me. And I have thought about them being a Neanderthal before, and I actually like that theory a lot, Andy, but where I kind of get hung up with the Neanderthals is they weren't that big. I think your average female was about five foot tall. I think your average male was about five, five. Your average Sasquatch report is like seven feet tall. So that's my only hang up with um the Neanderthals, you know, not only height, but I don't think they were as big as like Sasquatches reported or eyewitnesses have seen.

• 41:10Wes Germer?

  The Neanderthal, while more stocky than us, uh, more sturdy, more thick than us, doesn't come close to a Sasquatch. That's my opinion, of course.

• 41:22Speaker 05

  But is it the one that they found? What is that total of all of the Neanderthals? I remember they showed the uh, the hobbit, the hobbit people they had set there. Uh, it was, her name was Lucy. She was a hobbit person. She was only four foot something. Maybe another region they grow bigger. Maybe, I don't know. It's just like people, we come in all shapes and sizes. Um, maybe the one that they've, the, the skeletons that they found were five something. But then I heard stories of them finding skeletons of giants that are eight, nine, 10 feet. Like, I don't know.

• 42:01Wes Germer?

  Yeah, you're right. You're right. It's hard to argue with that. We do pull uh giant skeletons out of the earth and it makes you wonder what they are. You had brought up Lucy. Lucy was actually in Australia Pithecus. She wasn't actually a Neanderthal. You know, for whatever that's worth. It's such a weird fossil record we have. And you know, I just kind of got caught up on the Neanderthal thing when I researched them. This is many years ago. There's actually a guy named uh, Danny. Vinder Meany, he wrote a book called Them and Us and he talks about the Neanderthal. And he thinks that they're alive and well, even up until today. I tried to get him on the show,

• 42:45Wes Germer?

  but he didn't want his theory being confused with Sasquatch. So he wouldn't come on, uh, which is okay. You know, let me ask you, I mean, if you had the chance, would you want to see another one?

• 42:58Speaker 05

  I would, but I'd have to be more prepared. Um, I have to, I don't, I don't want to see one by shock. I want to, I want to know that I'm going to look and it's going to be over there to have the right firepower, defend myself. And I would just

• 43:16Speaker 05

  want to be able to take a photo or just sit and watch. And cause it's like, you're looking at, it's like seeing a ghost, you know, you're looking at something that I've, I've never seen a ghost in my life, but I guess this would be the equivalent of seeing one. Like, what is that? Is that supposed to be? Is that what is, is a million questions go through your head and you just freeze? You just freeze.

• 43:41Wes Germer?

  Yeah, you're right. You do freeze. You do freeze for sure. I've often said it wouldn't be bad to see another one, maybe from a helicopter or from a tank or something like that. Um, it's an amazing account. And I want to thank you for your service as a police officer. And I know that's a tough gig. I know many years ago I thought about becoming a cop and now I'm kind of glad that I didn't. Uh, but I do respect the guys that serve our country, put the badge on and, and try and keep order. You know, after all your years as a cop, is there one call that kind of, um,

• 44:22Wes Germer?

  stays with you today? You know, something like you couldn't forget. It was a real odd call.

• 44:29Speaker 05

  Um. One call that I can remember was we got called for domestic violence. And we showed up to the house. Woman was screaming, but it was towards the back of the yard. And we ran around the back up on the porch. They had a sliding, uh, you know, those sliding glass doors where you can go into the, the, the deck to the kitchen. We looked through the glass door and there was this guy attacking the woman. So we broke through the glass to stop him. This guy was like, uh, he felt like, uh, wrought iron.

• 45:13Speaker 05

  Like, uh, like a piece of steel. Took four of us to hold him down.

• 45:20Speaker 05

  Um, these people were, they were, uh, Latin. And when one of my partners looked around the house, there was a lot of, what do you call that stuff? The statues of the Latin saints, Santa Maria, all this stuff. Um, pent, it's not pentagrams, but they have the statues of the Latin saints and candles and stuff. Apparently she was telling us that he was possessed. We thought he was on drugs or something like that. Um, he took him, they took him to hospital, they tested him. There was no drugs in his system.

• 45:57Speaker 05

  Um, she, she told us he was possessed by a demon. He, they wound up taking him to the psych psychiatric place over in New York City. But that, that's the one thing that stands out the most, that story. But I'll never forget how strong this guy was.

• 46:15Wes Germer?

  Lila, who is from Tennessee, writes, "I grew up knowing about these things. They were on my grandfather's property. He used to feed them. I was terrified of them. My grandfather told me, if you don't hurt them, they won't hurt you. I don't believe that." Lila describes growing up on her grandfather's farm.

• 46:41Speaker 06

  Well, my grandparents owned eighty-nine acres here. And we lived with them while I was growing up. And the first thing I really remember was my bed was next to the wall and the window. And I can remember every night just about looking out the window and thinking this man was standing outside looking at me. And when I finally got old enough to tell my grandfather, I said, "Why is this man watching me every night?" And he was like, "What?" I said, "There's a man watching me every night when I go to sleep. Sometimes there's two." And after I told him that, he, uh,

• 47:26Speaker 06

  the window was like a big picture window. And it wasn't very long after that that he redid that window to where it was just a tiny window up on the wall instead of reaching down nearly to the floor. And I, I would see things in the windows occasionally after that, but never when I'd go to bed, see him actually watching me after that.

• 47:55Wes Germer?

  Yeah. Do you think your grandfather knew what it was?

• 47:58Speaker 06

  Oh, I know he did. He didn't speak to me very much about him, but he would feed him. And I'm, once I got old enough, I would tag him on. And, uh, he told me he was feeding dogs.

• 48:17Speaker 06

  And we were, we, he had set the plate on the ground. And I saw they would stay in behind the bushes where we couldn't see them. And I saw the arm come through the trees and grab a chicken leg. I remember it was chicken leg and go back in. And I turned around, looked at him, I said, "Grandpa, that's not a dog."

• 48:40Speaker 06

  And he says, well, let's just say it's my special dogs. And that's when I knew he knew, but he wasn't gonna really tell me. And the only last after that that he ever say anything to me. Once this when. I was a teenager. And I heard what sounded like a newborn human child crying in the woods. And it was the middle of the night. And I walked in the house and I said, grandpa, I said, there's a baby over there crying in the woods. He goes, that's not a baby you wanna go find, stay inside. We had a trailer. And we kept the um. Lawnmower in underneath the trailer.

• 49:24Speaker 06

  In a door where it was underpinned.

• 49:28Speaker 06

  And I went to go get the lawnmower out to mow farm. And one of them was laying up in underneath the trailer. It looked like. A piece of rolled up. Dad carpeting, a light tan color. But you could tell the back was to me. And you could tell it was the outline. Of what looked like. A man laying there. But. He was the same, his fur looked like that old chad carpeting from the seventies. And it. He never turned around when I opened the door. And when I seen him, I slammed it shut. But he was just.

• 50:13Speaker 06

  Like laying on his side with his back to me. And he couldn't have been more than fifteen feet from me when I did that. And just the minute I caught side, I slammed the door and I. I went back around. And I came back out and come around and grandpa says, I thought you was gonna mow the lawn. I said, I'm not getting it with that thing in underneath there. And he said, he laughed and he says, it's not gonna hurt you. And he went and got the lawnmower for me.

• 50:42Wes Germer?

  Yeah, I've had a few accounts like this before Lila, where coincidentally enough, it's usually the World War II generation. You know, the, the men now are grandfathers or women are grandmothers. And you'll hear accounts like this. I mean, there have come forward in the last like 10 years. Makes me wonder why he was feeding it. Growing up on this property, did you ever have run ins with them when you were out running around on the property? I know they had come up to your window, but did you ever encounter them when you were out just playing in the woods?

• 51:19Speaker 06

  They, I did it with some people that our next door neighbors married a woman from Mexico. And her family had come up to visit her and they didn't speak English. And we always pick blackberries in the summer because this place is full of them. And we were picking the blackberries. And I was saying, the one woman started screaming. And we said, what's going on? What's going on? And she goes, there's a face in the bushes. My grandfather laughed. He says, oh, it's just a cow. And she was going, no, no, this was a human.

• 52:00Speaker 06

  This is not a cow. And I finally got her sister to ask her, you know, how do you know it wasn't a cow? She goes, I've seen cows. This is not a cow. And they left and never came back. The one time that I really seen one good face to face, I was playing and felt like something was watching me. And I looked up and there's, I was in what we call carport. And it was across the road in the woods looking at me. And it scared me so bad that I crawled up underneath the car. I stayed under that car until I heard

• 52:42Speaker 06

  voices. And when I came out, there was some men standing in almost at that same place. And they were a good two feet shorter than what I had just seen. And it was at least seven and a half foot tall. Had black hair and the hair on its head was longer than the hair on its body. And the head hair was kinda curly. It was totally, it was so black that it kinda shone blue in the sunlight.

• 53:17Speaker 06

  It had brown eyes, I remember that.

• 53:21Speaker 06

  And it was just sitting there or standing beside a tree staring at me. It didn't move when I seen it.

• 53:30Speaker 06

  And it, it didn't really have any facial expression, just staring.

• 53:37Speaker 06

  And like I said, it scared me so bad, I went up and underneath the car. And I remember I went underneath the car because I thought it could get under the truck. But the car was slow enough to the ground where I didn't think it could get its arm up and underneath it to get to me.

• 53:52Wes Germer?

  What was it about it that scared you so much, do you think? Cause you already knew at this point they were there.

• 53:57Speaker 06

  Right. The fact that it was that close. Just the way it was staring at me. Plus how big it was, cause when I was little, I didn't realize how big they were when I was looking through the window.

• 54:13Speaker 06

  It wasn't until several years later that I realized, okay, wait a minute. This window is a good four to five foot off the ground. And where I'm laying, I'm looking up at the top of the window, which was about three to four foot tall. And this, the head is over the top of this window.

• 54:38Speaker 06

  And it, it didn't really hit me until I seen the one staring at me, just how big they were.

• 54:44Wes Germer?

  Did you ever touch your grandmother? What was her thoughts on it?

• 54:48Speaker 06

  I never talked to my grandmother about it until right before she passed away. And that was in, uh, two thousand and six. And she asked me something.

• 55:04Speaker 06

  And she goes, well, how are you dealing with the Bigfoot? And I turned around, looked there, I said, what about the Bigfoot? I said, you, I said, did you see them? I don't know what you're talking about. Well, if you don't know what I'm talking about, why did you just ask me this question? I don't know what you're talking about. And that's all she would ever say to me. My mother, I know saw them, but she would never admit that that's what she was seeing.

• 55:37Speaker 06

  There was a old, I think it was Weekly World News, that back thirty years ago, had a picture of what was supposed to have been the Russian Bigfoot captured on the front page of it.

• 55:51Speaker 06

  And she looked at, and she goes, I've seen something like that. I said, Mama, you've seen the Bigfoot then? No, no, but I've seen something that looks like that. After that, she was coming in home from going shopping. And when she come in the door, she says, that big man just ran across the road in front of me. And he wasn't wearing anything. I said, whoa, I said, the, I said, that Bigfoot just ran in front of you? No, no, it was a big man, he wasn't wearing anything. But he come across one fence, landed in the middle of the road. And she goes, and just pushed off and went over the fence on the other side and down through the field.

• 56:37Speaker 06

  And I said, Mama, that was a Bigfoot? And she goes, no, it was not. It's just that big man. And that's all she would ever admit to me, it's just a big man.

• 56:48Wes Germer?

  Why do you think, um, your grandfather was so open to it as far as feeding them? I mean, was he doing this on a regular basis?

• 56:56Speaker 06

  He was for several years.

• 57:00Speaker 06

  And then, till he got to the point where he couldn't no more. And I don't know why he did it. I think, I don't know if he was trying to form a relationship. If he had a relationship that I just didn't really know that much about. Because apparently he had been feeding them before I was ever born. So I don't know how he came to know that they were here or anything. But we would go up at least once or twice a week to feed them. And but after I saw the arm come out, I would never go with him again.

• 57:37Wes Germer?

  He really didn't fear him?

• 57:39Speaker 06

  He, he didn't seem to have any fear. He let us wander all over this place. And never said, watch out for anything or anything.

• 57:50Speaker 06

  So. I don't know if he. Thought they were harmless. I don't trust that. I'll just be honest with you. I do not trust that they're harmless. Cause they scared up out of me. And like I said, I won't walk around outside at night. I, you can't pay me to go into woods half the time. I have to be with somebody to go into woods. I'm sitting out here right now on the back porch, but I won't sit out here at night by myself.

• 58:23Wes Germer?

  Did you end up taking over that land after your grandfather died?

• 58:28Speaker 06

  I live on the last three acres that's in the family. The rest of it's been sold off, but I have the last three acres.

• 58:36Wes Germer?

  And do you think, I mean, this is many years on this property. And your, your neighbor even had that incident. Did you ever hear any more from the neighbors over the years?

• 58:46Speaker 06

  Uh, well, the lady that lived down from us. She was actually. Her family had been, my grandfather bought this place in forty-four. And her family had already been living here at that time. And by the time I was a teenager, she was in her eighties. And she couldn't get around very well. And she had what? An old root cellar in the back is where she kept all her canned stuff. And she asked me one day, go out to that root cellar and get her some green beans. And I started out her back door and she stopped me. She goes, wait a minute. She goes, make me, let me make certain that damn seat ticket in anywhere.

• 59:29Speaker 06

  And I knew what she meant when she said that, but I'd never heard that word before. And she went and she looked, she come back, she goes, okay, it's safe for you to go out. And it, that always stuck with me that she wanted to make sure I was safe walking out that door.

• 59:47Wes Germer?

  Yeah, it's interesting what she called them. That's actually a Native American word here in the Pacific Northwest. And the local Native Americans, that's what they called them on top of Mount St. Helens. That's the name they use for them.

• 1:00:02Speaker 06

  Right. And I knew her first husband had been a Native American from the Pacific Northwest. So I just always figured that's where she got the word from. And then I found out years later that sure enough, that's from the Pacific Northwest. Um, they're not here like they used to be. And I think it's because there's been a lot of construction and, uh, logging done. But occasionally, I can tell you when they come back through. If you've been around them and they come through, it's like the hairs on the back of your neck just go to standing up. And I'll hear wood knocks occasionally.

• 1:00:48Speaker 06

  And I have heard them whoop occasionally. I know the weirdest thing I ever heard was back a few years ago, my grandparents' old house was empty.

• 1:00:59Speaker 06

  And I walked outside to go to my van.

• 1:01:03Speaker 06

  And I heard what sounded like a two-year-old throwing a temper tantrum on its mother. But it was all gibberish. You couldn't understand what was being said. And it came from their old house. And every once in a while you would hear what I guess would have been the parent grunt. But the, I mean, just like a two-year-old throwing a hissy fit from hell, use my language. And I walked back inside and grabbed my niece's boyfriend. I said, come out here and listen to this.

• 1:01:41Speaker 06

  And he walked out and he goes, I've never heard anything like that before.

• 1:01:46Speaker 06

  And it was so loud that there's no way a child fifty yards from me could be that loud.

• 1:01:56Speaker 06

  Cause it sounded like they was right on top of me. But I could tell they were on the other side of that house.

• 1:02:03Wes Germer?

  And you're talking about your grandparents' home?

• 1:02:06Speaker 06

  Yes. I live about fifty yards from it, but my property is separate from that property now.

• 1:02:14Wes Germer?

  I wanted to ask you, Lila, back in the day, there was all this land to kind of run around, and I know it's been sold off over the years, but did you ever notice an area where they hung out the most? Or do you think they were passing through at certain times? Or do you think they were just there all the time?

• 1:02:34Speaker 06

  Um, they kind of stay in what I call the back forty. The way the property set up is you've got like the house and the barn next to the road.

• 1:02:50Speaker 06

  And there's a ditch line directly in behind the house. Then a field, which is about a five acre field. And another ditch mine and another five acre field.

• 1:03:04Speaker 06

  And then there was woods on the other side of that field. And those woods back there is where they usually would stay. But now, when I was real little, it was woods all the way up to the house. And he cut all that down. I was about five or six years old and um cleared it out and made it into utter fields.

• 1:03:27Wes Germer?

  I got you. On this property, at any point, um, did you ever see any weird lights?

• 1:03:35Speaker 06

  I never saw any weird lights. I've heard, I've listened to your show and heard others talking about them. The only weird light I've ever had is sometimes when I'm laying down trying to go to sleep. You know, you'll be laying there with your eyes closed and it's like a bright flash of light goes across the bedroom. Like somebody just took a picture with one of them old flash cameras. And, you know, I opened the eyes and there's nothing in the room. No reason for there to have been a flash of light.

• 1:04:09Speaker 06

  But I've never seen an orb.

• 1:04:12Wes Germer?

  Yeah, that's strange. Makes me wonder what it is. What do you think that these creatures are, Lila? What's kind of your take?

• 1:04:21Speaker 06

  Well, because I have heard them speak before and actually make out words. I think they are some kind of a human. I don't know if they're a Neanderthal. I know Scott Carpenter thought they were Neptunian, and that's about as good as any big explanation I can come up with. Now, that's changed over the years. I used to think they were the Jack and Hippificus. But just some of the things that I know they did, I don't get that they're just a big ape. They're too smart for that.

• 1:04:58Wes Germer?

  Yeah, I'm really curious on why you feel that way. Is it based on things that have happened that you've talked about? Or was there other things that made you kind of come to that conclusion?

• 1:05:11Speaker 06

  Well, like being able to get in underneath the house. That was a closed up area, and they were able to open that up and get into it. Um, knowing that a freezer held food. They would open the freezer sometimes and get them. We had a freezer on the back porch that was accessible. And they would open the screen door and then open the freezer to get some food out. And I don't know any dog or anything that can do that around here. They just... And then when they would... They wouldn't pop out.

• 1:05:54Speaker 06

  But I could go walking through the fields to get the horses in. And I always, when I hit one area, I'd be walking and all of a sudden it'd be, okay, you need to run now. And it'd be straight from walking, I gotta run. And I always felt like one of them chased me, and he thought he was playing with me. And that's... It was a weird feeling because I'd be running.

• 1:06:24Speaker 06

  At least two or three times a year, I'd go through that area and I'd think, I gotta run. And that went on for about five years. It had to have been a juvenile. And I, I really think that he thought he was playing with me. Because he never tried to catch me. He just would chase me. And I wouldn't turn around and look to see, you know, how close I was like, I don't even wanna see it. I'm just getting out of here. And, you know, dogs, they'll chase you, but you kinda gotta initiate it with them. So that always made me think, okay, these are a lot smarter than any of the other animals.

• 1:07:06Speaker 06

  And we had horses and cows and dogs and cats and goats and a few other animals here. But none of them acted like that towards me. And they knew to stay hidden. I could tell they knew to stay hidden. Um, I'd have to walk through a wooded area to get to the field. And it was when I would walk through that one wooded area about halfway through it. And like I said, it wasn't every time. It was maybe two or three times a year that it would happen. But

• 1:07:45Speaker 06

  it would be, okay, time to run. And it would just instantly, and I just always followed my gut. I took off. But you could hear something moving in behind of you. And like I said, I wouldn't turn around and look. I was too scared to look.

• 1:08:03Wes Germer?

  At any given one time, I mean, how many do you think that there were on the property?

• 1:08:07Speaker 06

  I know there was the, what I would call the alpha and his mate. And then there was the black one that was staring at me and the brown one under the porch or under the house. So that'd be at least four. And I took it that those two were the children of the alpha one and his mate. And they, I think one of those children is the one that still comes through occasionally. And they don't stay more than a day or so now when they come through.

• 1:08:42Wes Germer?

  Why do you think after all the years of being on this property, they were coming up to your window, your neighbors have seen them. And I know there's a few other things we're going to talk about, but after all the years, you know, them pacing you out or chasing you out, why do you think that they never hurt you? Because a lot of the behavior doesn't sound like I want to kill you type behavior. And even going off of your, your theory, Lila, of it being primate, probably something closer to human, you know, even humans will hurt you. There's some bad ones out there, but why do you think it never hurt anyone?

• 1:09:27Speaker 06

  The only thing I can think is because grandpa must have had some kind, because he did feed him, he had been feeding them before I was ever born. Maybe they saw him as a friend and we were just an extension of that.

• 1:09:50Speaker 06

  I know after he passed away and he died in 96, they did tend to be a little bit more aggressive after he was gone. Never outright aggressive, but just breaking branches in behind the house, throwing rocks on top of the house. And they never did that when he was still living. They never came up and hit the house until after he died. So I don't know, because he had finished, he hadn't been feeding them for at least 10 years before he died.

• 1:10:30Speaker 06

  So I know it wasn't just sudden stopping of the food or anything. So it could only have been they got more aggressive after he passed if they respected him or something.

• 1:10:43Wes Germer?

  Yeah, it could be. Makes me wonder why your grandfather started feeding them. And I get it, we're all curious, we're, I mean, human beings are curious and sometimes that's the reason. But most of the time when people live out in the country, if you start asking follow up questions and really drill down on it, what you'll find is a couple of things. One, they will do it to get them to back away from the home or trying to get them to back off. You'd mentioned the freezer, how they would just come up and take food out of the freezer. Or you'd made mention of your grandfather cutting the forest back.

• 1:11:24Wes Germer?

  And, and even with gardens out in the country, a lot of times I'll talk to people in the country and they'll start feeding it so that these things will leave their garden alone. Makes me kind of curious if, if that's why he was doing it.

• 1:11:40Speaker 06

  It might have now. He did keep a garden, but the garden is a half mile from the house. And that garden is pretty much right smack where they would stay. So I don't, I always wondered why he planted the garden so far from the house. And that's the only thing I could ever figure is because he was sharing it with them.

• 1:12:05Wes Germer?

  Yeah, and that could be the case. It, um, that's one thing you'll find very common too, is when people have these things on their property and they have a garden, I'll ask them, you know, where, how far is the garden from the house? And it's always way away from the house. You'll never hear of it being right next to the home. I would love to, I wish your grandfather was still around. I'd love to pick his brain, find out when all of this started and what kind of led up to this whole peace treaty of, hey, I'm going to bring you food.

• 1:12:41Speaker 06

  Well, I never thought about it until you said this. When my mother was a child, there was a fruit orchard in behind the house. And by the time I come along, grandfather had cut every bit of those trees down.

• 1:12:57Speaker 06

  And all that was left was a couple of apple trees in the front yard and a couple of peach trees in the backyard. So I just wonder if maybe he cut them down to keep them from coming up to the house.

• 1:13:10Wes Germer?

  Yeah, cuz otherwise, why would you cut down a fruit orchard, you know, especially on the country?

• 1:13:15Speaker 06

  Right. And I never thought about that before, but I remember my mother telling me that there had been a fruit orchard in behind the house.

• 1:13:24Wes Germer?

  The crazy part is, you know, your grandfather kinda comes across like he really didn't fear them one bit. And, you know, if these things, I was trying to put myself in people's shoes. And, you know, if, if my granddaughter had come in and was basically saying, hey, there's these two guys looking at me through the window, and all these other things that happened, I don't know, your grandfather's a better man than I am, cuz I probably would have put an end to it real quick. But, I mean, he really, it's like you guys played out on this property and why do you think he took you that one day to go quote unquote, feed the dogs?

• 1:14:08Speaker 06

  I, I kinda got the impression that he was letting them know that we were his family and not to mess with us. That this was his family. You've got yours, I've got mine. And like I said, he did feed them. He let them take out of that garden. Outside of coming up to the house occasionally, they didn't really bother us unless we were out in the fields. And even then, they didn't really get aggressive. They'd just be, you could tell they were there. Like I said, that one, like he was trying to play. I know they watched the house occasionally

• 1:14:51Speaker 06

  cuz you could, you know when something's staring at you. And you could feel that when you were outside. And I know after he got to where he couldn't feed him anymore, my mother had a trailer in front of the, where he lived at at the time. He had moved in with my mother and then my mother ended up buying another smaller trailer that sat like 20 feet in front of the first one. And it had a sliding glass door on it that faced the woods. And she got to the point where she would not stay in that trailer unless somebody else was with her. Because she said she felt like something was going to come through those

• 1:15:35Speaker 06

  doors after her. The minute he died, she moved that trailer six miles into town. She never did spend another night out here.

• 1:15:45Wes Germer?

  Yeah, it's too bad that your mom is in such denial. You know, a lot of people are. It's, I think it's kind of a coping mechanism that they do. You know, that feeling of being watched in around the home. Sometimes people say they saw glowing eyes. Sometimes people will say it was kind of a reflection. And, you know, your mom specifically saying, hey, I feel like I'm being watched directly from the forest. Did you guys ever see them come in closer to the home and catch eye shine or anything like that?

• 1:16:21Speaker 06

  I never saw eye shine. I think my husband has, but he thinks it was something else. So he won't admit to it. He thought it was actually the reflection off of the law enforcement badge. And I was like, well, where you say that that was at, that's way too tall for somebody with a badge. They were raiding the people next door. And, but it was, he thinks that he saw them before they actually raided that house. Cops raided the house. And he thought, I'd say three or four nights before they raided the house, he came in and said,

• 1:17:04Speaker 06

  I just seen, he goes, the only thing I can think it is, is a reflection off the police badge across the road in the field.

• 1:17:15Speaker 06

  I said, oh, he goes, yeah, he goes, it was in the field and it was above the Explorer. And I'm like, somebody's standing in that field, their shaft is not going to be up above the Explorer. And this was about 10 o'clock at night. And he said, no, no, it, it, he goes, it had to have been a police badge. That's all it could have been. And just, you know, I was sitting there going, but if it was above the Explorer, that's not a badge. Nobody's that.

• 1:17:47Wes Germer?

  Oh, I got you. So he was thinking, he was seeing the sheriff badge kind of twinkle. But from the other side of the Explorer, I mean, I stood on the other side of Explorer, you probably just see the top of my head. Very strange. You know, some people might ask, why do you fear them? Because you grew up on this property. Nothing has happened in all these years. Yet you have this fear for them. And I get it. Believe me, I fear them. So this isn't a judgment call. But you're thinking maybe even that younger one is coming back. Why not kind of explore the, uh, the property? I mean, three acres is still a lot of land and

• 1:18:30Wes Germer?

  to see if they're still in the area, to see if there's still that interaction that might happen.

• 1:18:37Speaker 06

  I've tried to back a few years ago. And it was, it was kind of, uh, okay, you're far enough from the house. You need to go back now. And it's just that feeling, when I do try. My sister-in-law actually was walking through the back field. And she got chased back to the house. And when she came back to the house, I asked her what was wrong. She goes, something big just chased me through the field. I was like, well, did you see it? She goes, no, but it was huge. I was like, well, how do you know it was huge if you didn't see it?

• 1:19:23Speaker 06

  Just trust me, it was huge. And that was about seven years ago. And so I just kind of stay on my three acres and don't venture off of it.

• 1:19:35Speaker 06

  Of the 89 acres that he had, I only have three acres.

• 1:19:40Speaker 06

  So that's all owned by other people and private property. So I don't want to intrude on their property.

• 1:19:47Wes Germer?

  Yeah, I get it. I completely get it. And sometimes I'll ask questions that I think the audience might be thinking. Believe me, I get where you're coming from. You know, your next door neighbor had the experience with them and a lot of time has passed over the years. Have you ever thought about going and talking to some of your neighbors and asking them, have you ever seen any weird running around here, any weird wildlife? You know, that sort of thing?

• 1:20:18Speaker 06

  Well, this is the weird thing. Back a few years ago, my one neighbor came to me and he goes, hey, he goes, you believe in Bigfoot, right? And I said, well, yeah, I do. I've seen him. He goes, well, he goes, I've got something weird in my cornfield. And I said, what do you mean? He goes, there's a circle. He goes, it's not on the edge of the cornfield where the deer and everything will eat at. He goes, it's out in the middle of the cornfield. He goes, and there's this area where the ears have been pulled off the stalks, bitten in half and stacked up. I was like, excuse me? He goes,

• 1:21:04Speaker 06

  they've been broke off the stalk, they're bitten in half through the silks and everything. He goes, and then they're stacked up in like a pyramid shape. I said, well, do you see any footprints or anything? And he goes, no, he goes, the ground's too dry right to me in it. He goes, but I put out cages because he goes, first I thought, you know, maybe raptures or something. He goes, so I put out cages. He goes, I haven't caught anything. He goes, have you ever heard of this before? And I said, well, no, but the neighbor that you rented the house to down next to me, which was my grandparents' old house, they had puppies.

• 1:21:49Speaker 06

  And they, the mama dog had them in the ditch line and when they went to get those puppies, all six of them were laying in a straight row with the back half bitten off and you could tell they were bitten in half. But the back half was nowhere to be seen, just the front half. And I know one other neighbor told me that their son wouldn't go outside because of the bears. And I was like, but the bears are, I'm about, oh, fifteen miles from the Cherokee National Forest and about fifty from the Smoky Mountains where I'm at. And there's no black bears down here.

• 1:22:31Speaker 06

  So that was weird to us.

• 1:22:35Wes Germer?

  That's terrible about the puppies. Makes me hate them even more.

• 1:22:40Speaker 06

  Yeah. My husband suggested maybe a wildcat had done that because there had been mountain lions come through.

• 1:22:47Wes Germer?

  Yeah, nothing about that sounds like a mountain lion killed me. Sounds like the same thing that was down in the cornfield stacking corn. Um, and, and you said it had lined up the puppies?

• 1:22:59Speaker 06

  They were laid out in a row. And there was six or seven of them.

• 1:23:04Wes Germer?

  Yeah, a mountain lion's not going to put everything in a row. Uh, that sounds more like these things. It's, um, they have like a crackhead way of with their food and other things. You'll hear a lot of eyewitness testimony to where they're very particular about stuff like that. Like what was going on in the cornfield with the corn being stacked up in like a pyramid? These puppies eaten in half and lined up in a row. Uh, you know, I really hate to hear that. And I felt like a terrible human being because a lot of times I have more sympathy for animals than I do for human beings, which is a terrible thing to say.

• 1:23:48Wes Germer?

  But growing up on this property, I mean, you had animals. How did your animals kind of react when they were around the property?

• 1:23:58Speaker 06

  Well, we always had German Shepherds. That was the only kind of dog we had growing up. And they would stay close to the house. Now they would walk, if when we'd walk in the fields to get the horses and such in, they would follow us. But like when the one would start chasing me. The dogs would be gone. I, I never would even see the dogs leave that they were gone so fast. And I had a big white German shepherd at that time and she, she disappeared a minute. I'd go, go through those woods. And the horses and cows, there would be times that it would be

• 1:24:39Speaker 06

  very hard to find them on the place. Like they were all like trying to hide themselves. And I'd have to walk, especially for the horses, sometimes I'd have to walk the whole place three or four times before I could find where they were. We had like three horses and they would be like all together and like as far away from certain areas as they could get. Cause usually, you know, with horses, they'll be around the field, standing around the field and they'd all be over in one corner. Now I have uh three dogs now and they'll hit, I have a fenced in backyard

• 1:25:22Speaker 06

  and they'll hit the back fence and then come up and underneath the porch. And I, we don't know what they're barking at. Um, we did put one camera out there in a motion light, but never could see anything.

• 1:25:39Wes Germer?

  You know, one of the things I wanted to kind of pick your brain on Lila, uh earlier you had mentioned hearing that baby crying sound. And I've heard many eyewitnesses report that now, whether Sasquatch is doing that or not is, you know, you can argue that, but I kind of think that they are. I kind of think that they are mimicking that sound and that specific sound. If you ask eyewitnesses, they will say, at first glance, it sounds like a baby crying, but there was something off about it. There's something not quite right. And you know, what's the easiest way to draw a human being out into the forest? Well, I have a baby crying. Anyone

• 1:26:24Wes Germer?

  with half of a soul is going to go looking for that baby. And I've often wondered, I mean, it feels like an ambush, like a trap.

• 1:26:33Speaker 06

  Yeah, that at the time, I was only 16 the last time I heard it. But it sounded like a baby, but it was really loud. And I don't think a baby would be that loud. A human baby would not have been that loud. Especially the distance the woods was from the house. And I mean, babies can get loud, but they can't get that loud. And the youngest person around us at that time was my niece, and she was five. And this definitely wasn't her. So the direction it came from was the older lady that I was telling you about.

• 1:27:15Wes Germer?

  I hear you. Yeah, I, you know, one of the last things I wanted to kind of ask you, Lila. Um, and everyone's opinion changes. I think if your opinion doesn't change, uh, you've kind of put yourself in a box. Because eyewitnesses will come forward and they'll say, X, Y, you know, the creature did X, Y, and Z. And if it's one person, you can go, well, okay. Uh, but if it's multiple people that don't know each other and they're all kind of saying the same thing, your opinion has to evolve throughout this whole thing. You, you would think anyway. And I know you went from this thing being gigantic epithagus to now you're thinking it's some early man.

• 1:28:00Wes Germer?

  And, and you could be right 100%. And I get that because I've had moments like that where I'll hear certain behavior and I'll think, man, you know, I don't know about this thing being an ape. Uh, but you know, as your opinion changed over the years and you had these things on the property, why do you think that they're so hard to catch up with?

• 1:28:24Speaker 06

  Well, I started thinking back over different things that had happened. And I was like, okay, an animal wouldn't do this. They wouldn't have just come up and slapped the house. Or knocked three times. An animal, like I said, I have dogs in the backyard and they hit the back of the house occasionally playing. And it's a totally different sound. And they never do it three times in a row and then wait and do it three more times. And to me, that's intelligence. That's, they're trying to get your attention. Plus, they don't want to be found.

• 1:29:09Speaker 06

  They don't want to be seen. They know to hide from us. And when you think about it, look at how humans treat each other. They're pretty smart not wanting to be around us. And that's why my thinking on what they were saying. They know how to stay away from us. The ones I think we do see are the ones that are curious and the younger ones.

• 1:29:36Wes Germer?

  John and Jane are from North Carolina. Both John and Jane admit they didn't believe in Bigfoot. Until they purchased this home. Things changed in a big way.

• 1:29:51Speaker 07

  So, um, we, we were moving out of our old house. Um, we had the movers there. Um, they were finishing up. And I told, I told my husband, I said, I'll go ahead. I had, my car was full. I'll go ahead and go up to the house and start unloading it before we get there. So, I came on to the house. Um, it was just getting, it was around 4:30. And it was in January, so it got dark early. Um, I got out of the car, was, I had my hands full. I was walking up the sidewalk to come to the front door. And I had a pebble or something that was thrown at me.

• 1:30:36Speaker 07

  And it landed in front of my feet. Um, I thought that was odd and I noticed that it was extremely quiet out. Of course, here I am, um, it's almost dark, um, in an unfamiliar place. Um, so I kind of thought my, that my imagination was kind of running wild with me. Um, I took a couple more steps and another one landed at my feet.

• 1:31:07Speaker 07

  Um, I thought, okay, well, there has to be like an acorn tree or something that is around that I can't see. And it did sound like a pebble or stone that hit. So I went ahead and came on in. I stayed in the house until the movers and my husband come in. And, uh, I went outside and sure enough, there were two pebbles on the, um, sidewalk. And it was a brick sidewalk. Um, there was no other pebbles on it and it was in the same spot that I was at.

• 1:31:46Speaker 07

  So that was my first indication that something weird, that something wasn't right, I guess you might say. Um, I went upstairs to the bathroom, um, because the movers were down here. And I was going to use the restroom and I closed the door and I looked out the window. It was a beautiful view. You could see the, the pond down below. Um, see all the trees. It was, there was no leaves on the trees or anything. And I noticed on the roof there, there was several pebbles on the roof. And I thought, that's weird.

• 1:32:31Speaker 07

  How did, you know, rocks or pebbles get on the roof? Um, didn't think, didn't think anything else about, you know, about it. Um, until we got in and got situated.

• 1:32:42Wes Germer?

  And I can imagine in your shoes, Jane, you're probably thinking, you know, what throws rocks? You know, trying to go through your head on what is actually throwing rocks at you? Even though they're little pebbles, but, and then seeing them on the roof. What about yourself, John? Um, you know, Jane's having all these things thrown at her. She's seeing pebbles on the roof. What were some of the things that you noticed?

• 1:33:05Speaker 08

  Well, she, you know, she, she, she immediately notified me of that. And, and, and when she noticed the pebbles on the roof, she, she showed them to me. And, uh, you know, we've had, we've had things happen before and heard things and, and we've never had us, never seen anything. And, uh, um, the one, the biggest thing that I noticed, uh, because we're, we're a little further out now from where I work and, and I have to get up a little earlier to get to work. Um, the first things I noticed was, uh, you know, my next, next day when I'm going to work, I step outside, everyone else is, you know, she's asleep in the house and, and I

• 1:33:47Speaker 08

  walk out the front door, lock the front door and, and, and I heard, uh, I heard a real short whistle, maybe sounded like it was within 50 yards of me into the woods.

• 1:33:59Speaker 08

  And then I hear another one out toward our driveway. And I'm like, okay, that's weird. I, you know, couldn't, couldn't think a lot of it at the time.

• 1:34:09Speaker 08

  And then, uh, you know, about every other, every other morning or so, or anytime I go outside, if we haven't been outside in a while, I'm hearing these and I'm, and it just dawns on me. I'm like, well, that's, that sounds like an alert. That's like something, you know, and I tell her about it and, and we kind of start paying a little closer attention to things and we love sitting outside at night and having a fire and, you know, just listening to everything and, and, you know, you never know what you're going to see, you're here. We have all manner of animals around here. But, uh, uh, after the whistles, started hearing whoops on occasions.

• 1:34:49Speaker 08

  Every now and then we would hear a very, you know, some very loud vocalizations, uh, further out, uh, into the woods around us and, uh,

• 1:35:02Speaker 07

  Kind of sound like, it would sound like an angry man sometimes, like,

• 1:35:08Speaker 08

  Just wailing.

• 1:35:09Speaker 07

  Or, you know, like a mumbling.

• 1:35:10Speaker 08

  Yeah, you're mumbling, wailing. That's pretty much the gist of the things that let, you know, leading up.

• 1:35:18Wes Germer?

  So you guys are having a lot of weird things going on, stuff being thrown, you're hearing odd vocalizations. You know, the angry man thing is interesting to me because I've heard other eyewitnesses say that, sound like a really pissed off big man just screaming in the woods. If you would kind of walk me into this night, it was about a year ago, and you guys, it became reality really quick for you guys, because there was not only one creature, but you guys saw several. What were you guys doing and what happened?

• 1:35:56Speaker 07

  So it started a couple of nights prior to the night that we actually saw them. We were both outside. One of our dogs was out there with us, and he was laying, the dog was laying in his bed, me and John were on the couch, and he had fallen asleep. It was probably around 10:30, 11 o'clock that night. It was a beautiful night. There was no clouds, stars were out. It was a good crisp night, and I was sitting on my phone, enjoying TikTok, and from the front

• 1:36:34Speaker 07

  of the house, I could hear walking, and it sounded, I've hunted and I've fished, like I said, since I was a little girl. I know what deer sounds like when it's walking. I know what squirrels and other animals sound like when they're walking, and this did not sound like it. It sounded like people walking from the front of the house to the left-hand side of the house, and there was, all you could hear was just the feet steps and the crunching of the leaves.

• 1:37:13Speaker 07

  As it got to the side of the house to where you could see us on the porch, it immediately stopped.

• 1:37:24Speaker 07

  It got really quiet. Um, there was no more walking for a couple of, for a couple of minutes. I sat there and I was listening and I heard one walk and it would stop. It would walk and it would stop. Then the ones that were behind it walked a little further and then they would stop. Um, until they got in front of where we were sitting, kind of down in the grass area. And I was sitting there and I was trying to wake him up without making a lot of noise.

• 1:38:06Speaker 07

  And I finally got him awake and I, I put my hand up to my mouth as to, you know, listen. And, um, you could kind of hear them walk away, but it wasn't as noisy as what they were. The first time coming around the house. Um, that was the first night. Uh, the second night we were sitting out there. And around the same time, here they come again. And this time I had, I managed to have a flashlight because we had nothing that night. All the thing that we had was our phones. So I thought, I'm gonna have a flashlight. Um, I did take the pistol out there with us, you know, just because it could have been people.

• 1:38:48Speaker 07

  I mean, as far as I know, they were heavy walking, didn't care. And this time there was like, there was communication and I cannot explain. It wasn't, um, it wasn't really speech, but it was, it was a mumbling and it wasn't quiet. It wasn't loud either. It was like, you know, you have a group of people and they're talking with one another. Um, they came around the side of the house. There was no stopping this time. They come on down, come on around and I woke him up and I said, shh.

• 1:39:28Speaker 07

  And we took the flashlights then and was, the flashlight and I was looking around and I did not see anything. And there was no more feet, you know, they had stopped walking. So I knew. That they were in front of us somewhere and we could not see them. We could not see them. We looked up in the trees. We looked on the ground. We looked everywhere and there was nothing out there. And I thought, am I going, I felt like I was going nuts because I knew that I heard a group come around the side of the house. Our dog, which never barks at anything. He just kind of lays there and he was focused or

• 1:40:12Speaker 07

  very alert the whole time. He wa- he was like watching them as they come around. He never barked, never made a peep and he was sitting there, ears perked and he was watching whatever it was down there. We could not see it. There was nothing there. We took the flashlight everywhere. Um, we sat back down. It was a couple of minutes later. We heard them start back up walking and they were walking down towards the pond. We took the lights again. Nothing. And I think he actually, I think he actually come in and got another flashlight. So now we had like two out there. Um, we have cameras back there.

• 1:40:54Speaker 07

  Nothing was picked up on the camera. Nothing was picked up on the camera up front. It was maybe a couple nights later because I think it was on a Friday night. It was on a weekend. This was like Monday or Tuesday. This happened, beginning of the week. So we were sitting out there again. I came in, um, because it was cold that night. We were sitting here watching television and go ahead.

• 1:41:21Speaker 08

  Yeah. So, um, so it was, it was later in the night and it's cold and I went to let the dogs out for the evening. Then we were, we were getting ready to crash and go to bed. And letting them out for the last time, you know, and they stay in the house. We don't leave them out at night. They were both out in the yard. Well, I hear is it very dry? Last fall here where we're at and in our pond, the water level had receded a lot. And so much so that you could walk across areas that hadn't been, that had been underwater since we'd lived here. And I heard, uh, I heard them coming from, I heard something coming from way off to the.

• 1:42:03Speaker 08

  Kind of to the left of our, of our, of our home and it sounded like it was four or 500 yards away. The only way I know how to describe what I heard, it sounded like a whole, you know, I've, I've ridden horses a lot, done a lot of trail riding and stuff. And it sounds like riding a horse through thick brush. I could hear limbs popping and breaking. I could hear stuff brushing around and moving. And this is, like I said, this four or 500 yards away. And I could hear it sounded like somebody talking. My dog, my oldest dog, he was, he was sitting, he came up, he saw me when I heard it and he heard it and he came up next to me and he was focused on it. And um, I called for my other dog to come up and I put them in the house and I yelled

• 1:42:47Speaker 08

  at Jane, I said, you, you need to come out here and grab the lights. I said, they're on their way. And um, so we just kind of sat down on our furniture back there for a little bit and waited and uh, had all the porch lights off and everything. Well, the, the, the hill to the left of our house down to the pond, it's very steep. It's probably 250 yards down to that pond. And it's almost straight up and down and you almost need rappelling gear to get down this thing. We heard, I, we heard them cross, cross this, this valley where the, where the pond is. And, but it was dry at the time. And they just came and, and, and crossed that and were chattering and talking the whole time. Came up the hill toward the house.

• 1:43:32Speaker 08

  And we looked at one another, uh, my wife and I, we knew that we, if they come up here, we got them this time. We're, we're, we're gonna see something. Because I think where we turned the lights off and we're just sitting quietly, they thought we were already in the house. And they weren't being a bit quiet. They were, they were, whatever they were talking about, they must've been having a good time because they just kept on talking. And they moved right in front of us. And they kind of, they kind of paused there for a minute. And we looked at one another and said, all right, let's light it up. So we put two tactical flashlights on it. Where we thought we heard it, didn't see anything. I didn't notice anything.

• 1:44:18Speaker 08

  And uh, I'm moving my light to the left away from where we thought it was. She said, it's right there. And I brought the flashlight back over. And I clearly saw something that judging by this observation deck down here that was standing next to the top of its head was about seven and a half foot tall. I saw the side of its face and its shoulder and eye shine. And no more than I settled that light on it.

• 1:44:55Speaker 08

  It spun and ran straight over this hill away from us. Um, and it covered a lot of ground quick. It probably ran, I know it covered at least a hundred and fifty, two hundred yards in just a few seconds. And I could hear it on the opposite hill behind our house. So we were both kind of, kind of shook. And, and, and we're excited that we'd finally, we saw this, we saw one. So we split up. She goes to one side of the porch and I go to the, to the other.

• 1:45:33Speaker 07

  Because we could still hear them. We could still hear multiple ones.

• 1:45:38Speaker 08

  Movement.

• 1:45:39Speaker 07

  Movement that hadn't ran. So while I'm focusing trying to find the one to the left of the house. He's focusing on the ones that you could hear to the right of the house. By that time, he said, oh my God, come here. And so I ran to where he was standing. Um, he goes, there it is. Can you see it? And I said, at first I said, uh, no, I don't see anything. He goes, it's right there. It looks like a stump. And I said, I still don't see it. Um, about that time, it was laying on the ground.

• 1:46:21Speaker 07

  It looked like it had its arms, like it was getting ready to do a push up is what it looked like. Um, it was solid black. It raised its head up and you could see its eyes blink. And its eyes were like a orangish red. And then it put its head down really fast as to they saw me. That's kind of what we got is it was trying to keep its head down. So it, I guess it thought we couldn't see it. About that time, there was kind of a tree, there was kind of a tree behind that area. There was one behind that tree and it kind of like, it kind of like peeked out.

• 1:47:06Speaker 07

  So you could see its head. Um, and you could see its eyes and it was blinking and it would pop back in behind the tree. Um, it did this several times.

• 1:47:18Speaker 08

  Yeah. You know, as, as we sat there focused on the one that was laying on the ground. Uh, and we saw these two behind it. That, that they were, the only way I know how to describe it is like they were. They were kind of weaving, they were kind of bobbing and weaving peeking out around these trees at us. And the one laying on the ground, it, it wasn't, it wasn't budging anymore. It, it, it's almost as if it knew that, oh, I'm caught, I'm, I'm, I'm caught right here and.

• 1:47:49Speaker 07

  But you could see its head raise up, um, every so, you know, every so many seconds to see if we still had the flashlight on it. Um, by then, I think the one that was to the left that I heard that was trying to get, you know, at the beginning. I think that it had went around the front of the house. Um, to where our buildings were. And you could hear, and it sounded like there was two there. There was one kind of down towards where our path is going back towards the pond. And there was one up closer to where the other building was. And they started raising cane.

• 1:48:31Speaker 07

  They started slapping the building, they were throwing things.

• 1:48:35Speaker 08

  Tree limbs breaking.

• 1:48:36Speaker 07

  There was tree limbs breaking.

• 1:48:40Speaker 07

  And the only thing that I can think of was they are trying to get our attention off of what we're standing here looking at right now. And this went on for maybe a couple of minutes. They, I never did, neither one of us thought to even look over at the building with a flashlight because we were so focused on the ones that we had right in front of us. And to me, and I don't know if John feels the same way, but to me, the ones that were at the building, it was like they were older, because what I was looking at didn't look like a full grown one.

• 1:49:22Speaker 07

  It looked like a person, it looked like it was maybe six foot tall. The one behind it looked like it was about six or seven foot tall. The shoulders were not broad. I mean, it looked like a size of a man.

• 1:49:37Speaker 08

  Yeah, the one, the one on the ground was, was, it was my size. And it's, when it would raise up and look at us,

• 1:49:48Speaker 08

  I almost knew that it was a young one because it looked, it looked fluffy. The silhouette and the look of its face, its hair around its head was like fluffy. And so much so that its head was, almost looked perfectly round looking at me. And so, you know, we're still sitting there trained on it. And these others are, are just going ballistic off in the woods, but behind our buildings. And Jane told me, said, you know, said, they're trying to distract us. You need to take the light off of it and just let it, let them, let them retreat, let them

• 1:50:32Speaker 08

  go back, let them go on about their business. So we did that.

• 1:50:37Speaker 08

  And, and we stayed there and listened. And, and you know, you can kind of hear a little bit of movement. And directly behind where it was laying, there's a pretty deep ravine. I mean, if I walk down, if I go get in the bottom of this thing, you wouldn't see me. But. The best we can tell, it was backing up toward that ravine and we sat there listening and I lit the area back up and it was down in that ravine and it was peeping around a tree at us and, and you know, Wes there, I can't even, I'm still getting nervous about

• 1:51:16Speaker 08

  it because I can't even describe to you what it felt like with this thing staring at us and blinking and its eyes looked huge and we were only thirty-five, forty yards from this thing and we finally just, just killed the light and, and, and we were so excited and kind of awestruck at what happened and you could just hear them start moving off and they grouped back up and they went straight out the, the ridge line, leaving our, our yard and stuff and, you know, I was, I was in shock when, when I saw the one laying on

• 1:52:01Speaker 08

  the ground. I passed over it at first as I was scanning the flashlight and, you know, we bought the property and I've done a bunch of clearing and, and cleaning up of the woods and stuff around the house and the yard.

• 1:52:17Speaker 07

  And I, I think we both were in shock because there was a, we had a dog bowl out there was full of water. It was a metal bowl that the dogs drank when they were outside.

• 1:52:29Speaker 08

  I kept kicking it.

• 1:52:30Speaker 07

  He kept kicking it and, and, and it, it was so loud because the decking is actually concrete, so it would just like rattle on the concrete and he kicked, he kicked it like three times and neither one of us thought, because we were in such shock.

• 1:52:52Speaker 07

  I think, and we just didn't realize, we realized what we were seeing. And it was, we were just in shock. And finally, I was like, stop kicking the ball. And I bent down and I grabbed the ball and I put the ball on the table that was there. It was, it was, I can't even explain the feeling that I had out there. It was a shock and awe. I guess is the best way to describe it. We kind of stood there and looked at one another like, what in the world did you just, we just witnessed? You know, I, did you see what I saw?

• 1:53:32Speaker 08

  You know, we spent, we spent twenty minutes on the back porch after they left, asking each other, you know, how, how crazy? Did, did I really just see what I saw? And we were up half the night. We couldn't go to sleep after that. We were so excited about everything that, but uh, um, yeah, like I was saying, I mean, I, if I didn't, if I didn't,

• 1:53:53Speaker 08

  if I didn't take a second look at that thing, I wouldn't have even known it was there. When I saw it laying down, I, I thought it was a log. And then I realized that, you know, I scanned past it and I realized, wait a minute, there, there's no log there. I, I just, I mowed that just a few weeks ago. And I brought my light back around and that's when it peeked up at me for the first time. I saw the eye shine and then I called her over to where I was. And uh, but it made me really think, you know, what, what got me was that as much as time as I've spent in the woods, hunting and stuff my whole life, uh, how many times have I walked by one of these things?

• 1:54:36Speaker 08

  And never would have known.

• 1:54:38Speaker 07

  Yeah, the way this thing was on the ground, it was, it was eerie. It was extremely eerie, but then again, because it didn't look like a person's arms, like, if you were down on the ground and you were getting ready to do a push-up, a person, it didn't look like that. It looked, and I don't, the only way that I could say that it looked, it looked kind of spiderish. I don't know if that makes sense.

• 1:55:07Speaker 08

  Like they were doing fingertip push-ups with a wide, real wide stance is what it looked like.

• 1:55:12Speaker 07

  Right. It was, the arms didn't look natural, the way it was holding itself up.

• 1:55:18Wes Germer?

  Yeah, it's kind of intriguing that you guys saw the spider crawl, as I call it. I don't know what else to call it. It's a weird movement. For the audience, though, would you kind of describe that movement as far as what you were seeing?

• 1:55:33Speaker 07

  So, you know, how when a human comes down and they're laying on their stomach and they put their arms up to do like a to come up in a push up. It didn't look like that. It it it was almost like the arms went out to the side. Um, like a spider would, you know, how a spider walks across and its legs kind of goes sideways. Um, and you can tell the back, the back was not coming up at all. It was just the the front half with its head coming up and the way its head came up. It didn't, it wasn't like, um, the neck, like our neck is kind of long.

• 1:56:17Speaker 07

  It like sw- it like swiveled up. I don't know if that makes sense, but it like,

• 1:56:24Speaker 07

  like our neck, you would have to raise like your chest and everything for you to come up to look that way. This didn't do that. Its head just like

• 1:56:34Speaker 08

  It was a smooth motion.

• 1:56:35Speaker 07

  Yeah, swiveled back. And you could, I could see a little bit of the features of of the face. Um, the light that we had was pretty good. You could see its eyes very well.

• 1:56:49Speaker 08

  You saw the first one's face pretty well.

• 1:56:51Speaker 07

  I saw the first one's face extremely well, and that I think that kind of put me in the shock too. The the face on it, um, it had, it was like it had a beard. And around its eyes and around the bottom half of its nose was skin, but the rest of it was hair. And the hair was kind of long. It looked different than the hair. Of the one laying down on the ground. It it wasn't it wasn't fluffy like the one laying down on the ground. It looked like the hair was lo- you know, longer. Um, and it was it

• 1:57:27Speaker 07

  was so black. The hair was extremely black. It was it was I I I mean, in my mind, I'm trying to describe it, but my my my mouth won't let me.

• 1:57:41Speaker 08

  The the the first one looked a little a little ragged to me. He looked a little shaggy looking.

• 1:57:46Speaker 07

  Yeah, his hair was definitely longer. Maybe it was older. Uh, this is the only thing that I could think of, that he was older than the one that was lying down.

• 1:57:57Wes Germer?

  And I want to kind of come back and ask you guys to kind of compare and contrast the faces. But, you know, when either one of these creatures, when you guys were looking at it, and you know, that one that you're talking about Jane, and then the one that's on the ground that kind of keeps rolling its head up, um, did you guys get the impression like, I'm looking at a human here? Or did you get the impression of, you know, this is an animal? This is some sort of like, non-human primate, like a gorilla, or something like that?

• 1:58:29Speaker 07

  Right. Yeah, the one that I the one the first one that I saw, and I got a really good look at it, was more primate. The skin was dark. Um, the nose was flat. Um, the bridge over its eyes was a little heavier. Um, the one that was laying down on the ground, um, it looked more human than the one that we first initially saw. It was, and it almost had a look of fear, laying down there. And I was getting to the point to where, you

• 1:59:09Speaker 07

  know, when I told, when I told John to take the light off its face, I felt sorry for it. I felt like we had trapped it. And, um, that's when I was, you know, I asked him to just take the light off. Um, it scared.

• 1:59:25Speaker 08

  Um, you know, the two, the, the two behind it, uh, when we were holding the light on the one laying down on the ground and we could, we could, you know, scan it up a little bit and see the ones in behind it. Moving in and out, there was almost a cooing sound going on right before the others blew up. I mean, it was, and I don't know how to describe that. It was, it was like a light, low cooing sound is the only way I know how to describe it. And then it sounded like World War Three hit over there behind our buildings and, uh, um, and after that started, I didn't hear any more of the cooing. It was just odd.

• 2:00:05Wes Germer?

  John, do you think the little one was cooing?

• 2:00:08Speaker 08

  I think the two that were behind it were cooing. I think they were calling. They were trying to get help.

• 2:00:14Wes Germer?

  I got you. It is kind of interesting how you guys got caught them off guard just by being quiet and, you know, turning off all the lights. They probably had no clue that you guys were there, obviously. Um, when part of this actually happening, you had mentioned hearing people talking. Did it sound more like humans talking, like some language you couldn't understand? Or, um, did it remind you more of, and I won't play them at the moment, but Ron Moorhead and the, those Sierra sounds, did it sound more like that?

• 2:00:48Speaker 08

  This, this sounded, it just sounded like a bunch of garbled talk. I mean, like nonsense speech. It was, and they, they, they weren't, they weren't really being quiet about it.

• 2:01:01Speaker 07

  Uh-uh, they wasn't.

• 2:01:02Speaker 08

  They were, they were just, it sounded like they were having the best conversation ever was as they were walking through the woods, you know, to do whatever it was they were doing. And, uh, um, you know, this, the, it didn't sound like Samurai chatter. It didn't sound like, I've listened to all of those sound clips and, and I couldn't hear anything on, on there that, that, that reminded me of it.

• 2:01:26Speaker 07

  Now, not that night, but you know, maybe about back in the spring, I, I have heard, like the start of like the, the Samurai on Ron's, um,

• 2:01:42Speaker 07

  On Ron's uh recording there, how it does that real deep Samurai talk. I have heard that several times, but it it it's cut short. Like it'll start and then it'll stop. But it was different that night. I it almost sounded like they were talking, but they had their hand over their mouth.

• 2:02:04Speaker 08

  Yeah.

• 2:02:04Speaker 07

  It was a it was a mumble.

• 2:02:06Speaker 08

  Muffled.

• 2:02:07Speaker 07

  A muffled mumble. And it was like that the night that I heard them um talking the night before. It was the same way. It was it was deep. Um, you could tell that there was words, but you couldn't. You couldn't understand it and you really couldn't hear it like it wasn't. Like it's not audible. It was almost like it wasn't audible for us. It was so low and so deep. That's the only way I could describe it.

• 2:02:42Wes Germer?

  Can I ask you, can I ask you guys, you know, you're it's kind of fascinating that the young ones held back. While the adults were the ones in front. I know that you guys don't know and I don't know, but what do you think they were doing?

• 2:02:57Speaker 08

  I think they were hunting. I think they were just hunting. And uh uh I mean, this, you know, where where we are is covered up with wildlife. There's anything you want here. And uh I think they were just. They're they were getting ready to to to go out on a hunt and and. You know, let's go check in on the humans, this kind of thing. But uh I I I have the other than that, I have no idea that what they were doing. I mean, they, you know, we've got chickens and stuff like that and nothing's ever been bothered and. You know, so I think there's enough stuff here to support them.

• 2:03:33Speaker 07

  There's tons of deer here, a lot of deer. And it's it's um it's odd because, you know, we've been here almost four years. And the first three or first two and a half years, I've we've never heard them together. Um, we've heard whistles and we've heard like um whoops. But it's always been like maybe one or two, not that many together. Um, and then, you know, all of a sudden last year there was multiple ones. And that's the first time we've ever heard them like that together. So I don't, I don't know if it were, they're just passing through our area um to get to where

• 2:04:17Speaker 07

  they hunt, or if, you know.

• 2:04:21Speaker 08

  Or if they've always been here, we just didn't.

• 2:04:23Speaker 07

  Yeah, we've just never, never heard it. We've um

• 2:04:28Speaker 07

  never really sat outside, maybe, you know, the first year on our porch until we got it. Uh, we redid the house. So um we started sitting out, you know, on the back porch, the last probably two years, wouldn't think.

• 2:04:43Speaker 08

  Yeah.

• 2:04:44Speaker 07

  Um, so I just don't know if we just didn't pay attention.

• 2:04:48Wes Germer?

  Yeah, I was kind of curious about that. I mean, you guys had bought this home three or four years ago, and within the last two years, this activity started kind of leading up to you guys seeing the creatures. Do you, do you notice kind of looking back now at some of the weird stuff, whether it be the rock throwing, or the vocalizations, or, because I know your sighting was um, you know, around this time last year, kind of leading up into September, but is there certain times of the year you guys notice there's more activity, or is it just something that is ongoing?

• 2:05:26Speaker 08

  It seems like they're in, well, I mean, we, we noticed more activity from September to about uh March or April.

• 2:05:34Speaker 07

  Mm hmm.

• 2:05:35Speaker 08

  Um, but all throughout the year at random times, warrior whoops, weirdness going on. But uh, but nothing like we did that night.

• 2:05:44Speaker 07

  Yeah, it's been mainly, it seems like they come through here in the fall, and then we hear them, you, you will be hearing uh the whistles and the whoops in the spring. And I, I've tried so many times to capture it, like the sound on, on recording, you know, my, on my phone, I've tried on the ring cameras.

• 2:06:07Speaker 08

  We, we ordered a digital recorder.

• 2:06:09Speaker 07

  Yeah.

• 2:06:09Speaker 08

  And we've got, we, we got game ears.

• 2:06:12Speaker 07

  And we never have heard anything. And it's weird because I hear, I were, I was working from home at the time. Um, so I was home all the time. And I would take the garbage out or whatever and you would hear a whistle from front of the house and you'd hear a whistle from the back of the house. Or sometimes you would hear a whoop from one side of the house and then a whoop on the other side of the house. And I actually took out the garbage one day. And the garbage can was empty and it was extremely loud when I put it in there. And it actually scared me when I did it because it was it was loud.

• 2:06:53Speaker 07

  Um, as soon as that trash can or soon as that trash bag hit that trash can and the lid come down. In the backyard, there was a loud, a loud whoop. Um, and that's the one that I I sent you. Um, on the Ring camera and I thought, oh, oh my gosh, I hope the Ring camera picked it up. And I stood there and I kept moving in front of the camera to keep it active. Kinda on down, maybe about thirty yards, forty yards on over. Um, kind of on the side of the chicken coop. Um, there was another one and this was different. They sounded a little different. Um, one sounded a little deeper and the other one sounded not so deep.

• 2:07:38Speaker 07

  And it did it several times, several times out there. And I was standing there and I was like, oh, my gosh. And I was praying, I was like, please, please, please, please let the camera pick it up. And came in and looked at it and sure enough it did and I was so excited. He was at work and I sent it to him. You know, directly. I was like, you gotta listen to this.

• 2:08:03Speaker 08

  I pulled it up on my on my computer.

• 2:08:04Speaker 07

  We have, we have trail cameras out. Um, in different areas throughout the property. Just looking for deer, you know, because during deer season, you're trying to figure out what their pattern is coming in and out and what we, you know, when they're coming. So you'll know what time to be out there.

• 2:08:21Speaker 08

  I just wanna see what's moving too.

• 2:08:23Speaker 07

  Yeah.

• 2:08:23Speaker 08

  We've got, we've had bear, bobcat, big cats. We've had a big cat move through here. Um, and, uh, we do, we, we blanketed the place with trail cameras and could never get a picture of anything on a trail camera. You know, while I was being strategic about where I put my cameras and what they're looking at. I kept having, there was one area and it's a remote leach field for our septic system. So it's a good size, open, maybe a third of an acre and keep it mowed real well and everything. It's off in the woods by itself and it's a good spot, you know, you're allowed to bait here in North Carolina for deer. So I keep some corn out there and

• 2:09:06Speaker 08

  stuff, you know, hoping to get a glimpse of something in that field and saw all kinds of deer and all kinds of animals. So I know there's a lot of animal activity out there, but could never get it. All of a sudden, you know, my trail camera would glitch out. I'd go pull the SIMS card out of it and I'd be checking and the last few pictures that the camera would have taken, the pictures would be a real bright pink hue and you couldn't make anything out. And this would be a daytime, you know, a daytime shot from the timestamp on the camera. And then of course, the batteries are dead. So I put

• 2:09:47Speaker 08

  brand new batteries in it and fresh SIMS card and a few days later, go back and check it. And it's the same thing, you know, I'd get pictures of squirrels and rabbits and foxes and everything. And then all of a sudden I'd run into a string of pink pictures and the batteries would be dead again. So I don't know what that's about or why that would happen.

• 2:10:09Speaker 07

  And he even tried, we thought maybe it was the, you know, the camera was messed up. So we put a different camera out there and it would do the same thing.

• 2:10:20Wes Germer?

  A lot of eyewitnesses will report electronics failing and a lot of researchers too, when these things are in the area, their game cams will shut off or the batteries just magically will die. The light, that pink thing you're talking about, was it like a light, John?

• 2:10:41Speaker 08

  No, it's almost, it's almost like.

• 2:10:46Speaker 08

  Have you ever seen a trail camera when it's, when it's dusky? When it's right at dusk and it doesn't know if it's daytime or nighttime? Uh, and that's the only time I've ever seen one do that before. But it's like I would get us six or seven pictures in a row like that across a period of day that's not dusky. That's, it'd be two o'clock in the afternoon and I get that.

• 2:11:15Speaker 07

  And most of the time, there would be like a deer actually out there around that same time on the camera. And then you would, the next picture would be that pink wispy.

• 2:11:30Speaker 08

  It's weird.

• 2:11:31Speaker 07

  Yeah, it's weird looking. Pink wispy, um, pictures. And then it would go back around the same time. It would be, the pictures would be perfect again. Um, and then it wouldn't pick up anymore because the batteries were dead. And we switched, we switched the cameras out multiple times thinking it was the cameras and it was not the camera.

• 2:11:54Speaker 08

  One time I had a dozen cameras out.

• 2:11:56Speaker 07

  Yeah.

• 2:11:57Wes Germer?

  Yeah, that's weird about the game cam. Like I said, it gets reported though. Um, there's people who have these things on their property and kind of report the same thing you did. Uh, John, the, the pink kind of streaking you're seeing, most of the time the cameras are just turned off or they die from the battery. Um, that is very, very strange. On this property, have you guys seen the lights by chance?

• 2:12:23Speaker 08

  So the, the, I hadn't really noticed a lot of that until, uh, the night that she, uh, Jane killed her first deer. And we, uh, we, we walked back up, back up to the house and got her, got her four wheeler and a little trailer and we're going down to, to get the deer. And my son was here. I let him know what we were doing and, um, where we were going. And it's probably, I mean, you know, through the trail to where we had to go get the deer is probably a half mile down there, I'd say. And so we're riding down there and it's getting dark at this time. And we fill dressed the deer and get it in the, get it in the trailer and we're coming back up.

• 2:13:07Speaker 08

  And as you're driving back up, you know, our son's on the back porch and he's watching us come out of the woods. And, you know, I hang the deer up in our building and after washing it out a little bit and he says, as I come in the house, my son looks at me and says, "Did you, did you see that behind you all when you were driving up on the four wheeler?" And I said, "No, what are you talking about?" He said, "There was a bottle of light following you out of the woods." I was kind of shocked by it because I've never really, never really thought about it up until that point. And so then I, you know, it kind of raised my awareness and I try to, I try to just keep an eye out for stuff now. And

• 2:13:52Speaker 08

  it was about a week later when we had the sighting in on our backyard. It was about a week after she'd killed her first deer. And ever since that, we see them, we see stuff here and there. It's like a blue flash almost outside when there's no storms, there's no lightning, a clear, you know, clear blue sky day and, you'll be sitting here watching television and you all of a sudden glance out the window and there's be a flash of blue light. And then it's not been three weeks ago. We were sitting here and I don't know why, I turned and looked at the front door. I thought I'd heard something.

• 2:14:38Speaker 08

  And I'm looking at the front door of our home. And I, and through the glass of the front door, I see a, a blue light about the size of a baseball. And, and it just kind of went across the window.

• 2:14:57Speaker 08

  And you know, it kind of made me pause for a second. I looked down and my dog sees it. He's looking at the same thing I am and it's daylight outside. It's not nighttime, it's daytime. And I see this and he, you know, the dog and I look at one another like, did you see that? And we kind of walk over and we're looking out the windows and don't see anything.

• 2:15:20Speaker 07

  Yeah, and you could be sitting here watching television and we have big windows that go all the way across the living room. And then French doors and then more windows that are in like a breakfast dining room. And you can be sitting here watching television and all of a sudden you'll see, and they're all different colors. I've seen green ones. I've seen orange ones. I've seen blue ones. And they rise from the, where the woods are and they kind of go up in the tree. And you can sit there and out of the corner of your eye and you're like, oh, and they're there.

• 2:16:03Speaker 07

  It's like, it's about the size of a, of a tennis ball sometimes. Sometimes they're smaller. Um, it's almost like they're trying to get our attention. Um, I've seen them in every window in the back. Sometimes there, it's a flash. Sometimes they just sit there and hover. We've, we see those a lot and it's only during the time when we hear the whistles when we walk outside. Or when we hear the whoops when we walk outside. It's only during that time that we see it. I haven't seen any in the back for a while. The first ones that we've seen was the front door like three weeks ago, like he was talking about.

• 2:16:48Speaker 07

  Um, that's the first one that we've seen so far going into the fall, I guess, like, you know, since the spring and.

• 2:16:56Speaker 08

  Joke jokingly, I turned to her and said, told her what I'd seen and I said, well, they must be back. We just kind of laughed it off and.

• 2:17:06Speaker 07

  But you know, it it it's kind of changed my perspective. Um, I've never, I've never been scared. I'll go, you know, as long as I have a gun, I'll walk all the way back on our property. Um, you know, um, now I second guess it. Um, I'm even wary about being out in my yard to even walk out there to mow or do anything in the flower beds. Um, I'm, I'm very hesitant and I, and I, I've caught myself not doing it, doing it any longer ever since what we saw in the backyard. I stay right by the doors when I am outside.

• 2:17:49Speaker 07

  Um, and basically it's just sitting, you know, in our rocking chairs out front or, you know, sitting on our patio set in the back. Um, I don't, I don't venture out in the yard any longer.

• 2:18:01Wes Germer?

  Who could blame you for what you guys have witnessed on that property? And you know, many years ago, I would start talking to people who had these things on their property and they would always kind of end the conversation with, oh, and by the way, I'm also seeing these weird lights. And when I first started getting them, I was like, I don't know what that is. Um, you know, but what's weird is you hear these lights being reported more often than not. What's your take, Jane? Well, what do you think that these lights are?

• 2:18:33Speaker 07

  I don't really know. Uh, the only thing that I feel like when I see them is, hey, we're out here, you know, where, why aren't you out here? Um, that's kind of what I feel when I, I see them. I know it's not.

• 2:18:53Speaker 07

  I think it's, I, I can't explain it. I don't, I don't know. I cannot explain it. I feel like it is something, I don't feel like it's like extraterrestrial or anything like that. I feel like it's something tied with what we saw that night. I don't know if it's them traveling here or, you know, getting to where they need to go. Um, or.

• 2:19:24Speaker 07

  If that's how they are when they're not in a form, I honestly, I don't know. All I know is I know what I see it when I see it. And I know that it's a ball of light and you know, that's, that's it. It's hard to explain.

• 2:19:44Wes Germer?

  Yeah, and that's kind of the weird part about the lights because like on people's property, they'll report, you know, everything from red to orange to white to blue. And you're right, they do come in different colors. I've seen the lights, uh, two of them. One was blue, one was kind of an orange, yellowish color. Um, and I didn't know what they were, but it, it's odd that they show up so consistently when people have these things on their property. It makes me wonder, I mean, you know, this is kind of a weird coincidence that keeps happening over and over and over again. Are they related? What, what do you think, John?

• 2:20:28Speaker 08

  I think they're a hundred percent related, but, uh, um, I mean, personally, I don't, uh, I don't think they're traveling through a portal to get here. I might be wrong about that. We may find out one of these days, but, uh, what I saw, to me, uh, I think that they, that they're an ancient being that have always been here. And in that, I think that they know, they may know more about our natural world than we know. And, and if that's a means of them communicating or, or whatever, uh, you know, trying to, try, if they use that for a means of seeing in another area or something, I don't, I don't know.

• 2:21:13Speaker 08

  But, uh, uh, when we've seen them, I know that it's a direct correlation. If I see, if I, if I'm sitting in a house and I see one and I walk outside, I know that I'm on here somewhere. I can, you can write it down, you can just know that that's gonna happen. The property's been here for over 30 years. And, and the fellow that developed it was a, was a, an outdoorsman. It's, it's, it's interesting to me that, uh, you know, I don't know if this place sat empty before we purchased it for a while.

• 2:21:50Speaker 08

  It almost looked like it had because we did a ton of work on the place. I think they've always been here or they've moved through here a lot. And they, you know, if they're out there all the time, they've noticed the activity of us on the property. And we made a lot of major changes outside, too. There's been, you know, we've got a real nice trail that goes down to get down to the pond. And, you know, you want to ride a four wheeler to get down there, it's too far to walk. And it's nothing to walk out there and there'll be a three inch diameter tree across it that didn't come from there. And, you know, I'm a pretty practical kind of guy.

• 2:22:31Speaker 08

  I mean, you know, if somebody's, somebody's trying to fence you off or keep, keep you from going somewhere, that they're, they're going to let you know that, hey, I'm here kind of thing. And, uh, but from, from the perspective of the lights, I don't, I mean, I'll get back to that. I mean, I don't, I know a hundred percent that they're related, but, but I can't explain what they're, what they're using it for other than trying to get our attention. That's the only thing I could think of that they would be, if they, if they have the ability to do that, they're trying to get our attention.

• 2:23:07Wes Germer?

  Kind of an interesting take on the lights, uh, because, you know, when you see the lights, you, at least for me, you feel like you're being watched and you feel like it's something intelligent. And why they would be around when these creatures are around, it does make you wonder. And I was going to ask you what you thought Sasquatch is, and I'll ask Jane here in a minute, but going back to what you were saying with regard to what Sasquatch is, John, do you think it's more in our family tree? Or do you think it's more like a non-human primate? Or do you think it's just something completely separate?

• 2:23:45Speaker 08

  I think they could be a different, I think they could be something completely different. I think that they, that, that they're their own species and they've, and they've been here and they've got their own, their own tree with its own branches, if that makes sense. And, uh, you know, there's, there's species that branch off, branch it off on, on parallel paths. And I almost think that, you know, uh, the primates went in one direction, we went another and this thing went its own path. If that makes sense.

• 2:24:18Wes Germer?

  Yeah, that's a fair answer, John. You know, it is hard to really put them in a category. Uh, but I appreciate your feedback. What about yourself, Jane? What do you think that these things are? Cause you went from being pretty skeptical, thinking the whole thing is kind of nonsense. And not only seeing one, but you've seen a few of them. And you're having all this stuff happen. I mean, it's become a reality for you, living there. What do you think that they are?

• 2:24:47Speaker 07

  I, I, I think it's something, I think they are something that's kind of always been here. Um, what I saw was a, was a full, I mean, full-blooded being of, of some kind.

• 2:25:06Speaker 07

  I kind of, I kind of feel like maybe, and I know this probably sounds weird, that maybe they're not, they don't stay here all the time. I think maybe they come and go. Um, and that might be what the ball of light that we see is them coming, you know,

• 2:25:25Speaker 07

  coming and then taking shape. But other than that, I, I don't, I don't know. I'm, I know that what was standing out there was actually standing out there. Um, and it, it, it wasn't human, but it, it wasn't an ape.

• 2:25:44Speaker 07

  Or a primate, but it was something and I, I can't explain it. You know, I'm, I've read the Bible and I've heard of people talking about the watchers. They're an ancient race that, that's here and supposedly they're still here. And I, I kind of feel in another way that that might be what that is. Um, it, sometimes I, I feel scared that they're out there. There's been times that I've been out at the building getting ready to mow. That something has come over me, an intuition that has come over me or something. Um, that has literally forced me.

• 2:26:25Speaker 07

  It was all I could do to run to the house and it's a pretty good distance. All I could do to get to the house, to get inside. Because I felt like there was something there, there was something behind me. It made me nauseous. It gave me an extreme headache. And this has happened to me twice. And then there's times I go out there and it's, it's fine. So I don't know if, if there's something that's, one of them is coming through that might not be happy that we're, that I'm out there. Um, sometimes, sometimes I feel, you know, like they're there and they're watching, but that's okay. They're staying on their part and we're staying on ours. So it just, it depends.

• 2:27:10Speaker 07

  Like I said, there's, there's been twice it's happened to me. Um, and I don't, I don't venture out too far out of the yard anymore. I just don't feel comfortable. And when I am out there, I always have a pistol, always have my nine millimeter with me. Regardless.

• 2:27:26Wes Germer?

  Yeah, like I said earlier, who could blame you? I wouldn't walk the property unless I was armed to the teeth as well. Uh, kind of a last question I want to ask you guys. Uh, the previous homeowner, do you think that he knew they were on the property? Or have you guys given that any sort of thought?

• 2:27:44Speaker 08

  Um, my, my gut tells me that he did. Um, there's a, you know, there, there's a real nice observation deck built behind the home and, um, you know, we were told by him that, that they built that so that they could watch the herons nesting in the pond and, uh, but knowing what I know now, like since day one, we've been here, we've, we've heard things leading up to what happened last fall. Uh, I don't know how he couldn't have known that they were here or known that something was weird. I mean, you know.

• 2:28:22Speaker 07

  Especially, you know, blocking off property, you know, to kind of save the, he, he says he's saving the trees and so it makes me.

• 2:28:30Speaker 08

  Little nature preserves.

• 2:28:32Speaker 07

  Yeah, it makes me wonder. It makes me wonder if that is what he was protecting. Um, we've talked to him several times. Um, he's always told us that there was bear and stuff out here and he's, he's, he's been explicit saying, when you go outside.

• 2:28:49Speaker 08

  Have a weapon.

• 2:28:50Speaker 07

  Have a weapon. And he's always made it to where because there's bear, you know? So I don't know if he was telling us that to kind of make us have a weapon because of that, because of what we saw outside or, um, we do have bear, um, or if it, you know, was for bear. But he did warn us when we first purchased the place that have a weapon when we went outside.

• 2:29:18Wes Germer?

  If you've had an encounter and you'd like to be on the show, shoot me an email. My email address is [email protected]. And if you get a chance, check out sasquatchchronicles.com. You can become a member and get additional shows. I will see everyone after the holidays. Wishing you a wonderful Christmas and a bright new year ahead.