Lunchtime With The Simpsons (Reheat)

Dan’s dreams come true when he visits The Simpsons writers’ room to talk about the role food plays on the show and behind the scenes. Turns out the writers are just as obsessed with food as all of the show’s food jokes suggest. Plus, Simpsons creator Matt Groening explains how new technologies have changed the show’s food jokes over time.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Dan Pashman?

  As someone who has been lucky enough to go to Napa Valley, I can tell you it's everything people say it is. Beautiful scenery, quaint, beautiful towns, and phenomenal food and drink everywhere you go. I don't even know that much about wine, but I know that every glass of wine I had in Napa Valley was excellent. I mean, there's no bad glass of wine and no bad meal. Choose between hundreds of wineries, tasting rooms, and chef-led restaurants from a low-key lunch on a vineyard terrace to a full tasting menu paired by the winemaker. Plan your trip at visitnapavalley.com. Start the day strong with Quaker Protein Products. Quaker makes it easy and delicious to get a good source of protein. No matter what the day has in store, Quaker Protein Products give you a variety of ways to reach your protein goals.

• 0:43Dan Pashman?

  Oatmeal, granola, bars, and rice snacks in flavors you already love like maple and brown sugar, and blueberries and cream. Quaker Protein helps fuel you to start whatever's next. Get your protein with Quaker. Available at a store near you.

• 1:08Dan Pashman?

  Hey, everyone, it's Dan here, and on February 15th, listen to this, my favorite show of all time, The Simpsons, will release its 800th episode. Now, I can't claim to have seen all 800, but I've seen a lot of them, okay? So you can understand why I was extremely excited when I had the opportunity to go into The Simpsons writers' room, meet some of the writers, meet Simpsons creator Matt Groening, and to talk with them about their favorite food moments in Simpsons history, including an episode in which Bart, Lisa, and Marge become food bloggers. So for this week's reheat in honor of The Simpsons 800th episode, we're pulling out my special trip to The Simpsons. Now, of course, remember, if there's an episode of The Sporkful you want to hear, we'll pull it out of the deep freezer for you.

• 1:53Dan Pashman?

  We do take requests. Drop me a line at [email protected]. Thanks so much, and enjoy.

• 2:10Dan Pashman?

  I love The Simpsons. It is the seminal comedy of my formative years. If you're half as big a fan as I am, you know that food has always been a huge part of the show.

• 2:21Speaker 01

  I like pizza, I like bagels, I like hot dogs with mustard and beer. I get the picture. I'll eat eggplant, I could even eat a baby deer.

• 2:32Dan Pashman?

  Food on The Simpsons is also a big deal behind the scenes. You know, TV writers are notoriously food-obsessed people, and Simpsons writers are no exception.

• 2:42Speaker 02

  Everyone orders salad in the morning, and then by the time lunch comes around, it's like, this is the last thing in the world I want to eat. What am I gonna do? My whole day's screwed.

• 2:50Dan Pashman?

  Today on The Sporkful, I visit The Simpsons writers' room to talk about the role of food for the writers and The Simpsons themselves. This is sort of a dream come true.

• 3:00Speaker 01

  We're looking for a new food critic, someone who doesn't immediately poo-poo everything he eats. No, it usually takes a few hours.

• 3:15Dan Pashman?

  This is The Sporkful. It's not for foodies, it's for eaters. I'm Dan Pashman. Each week on our show, we obsess about food to learn more about people. The Simpsons is my number-one show of all time. I remember in 7th or 8th grade, the Lions Club Carnival came to town, and the best prize you could win at the carnival was a Bart Simpson t-shirt that said, "Don't Have a Cowman." And I feel like as I matured, The Simpsons matured too. When I got into college, I remember in Boston, there were repeats of The Simpsons on every weeknight on two different channels. So if you played your cards right, you could watch The Simpsons at 6:00, 6:30, and 7:30 every night. And at 7 o'clock was Jeopardy. So that two-hour block, for me and my roommate Jake, we planned our day around that two-hour block.

• 3:58Dan Pashman?

  And we actually even, I'm gonna date myself, we had a VHS player, and he would buy blank VHS tapes and tape all these repeats of The Simpsons. We had like 15 or 20 VHS tapes worth of old Simpsons episodes. Did we ever... Watch them? No, because there were already three episodes on a night. I don't know what we thought we were gonna do with them, but we were ready. Okay, ready for the Simpsons apocalypse, I guess. And it may not surprise you to learn that my all time favorite Simpsons joke is food related. It came in one of the early Halloween episodes. Those are always really twisted and weird. And in this one, Homer tries to fix a toaster and he gets electrocuted and gets sent back in time to the age of the dinosaurs.

• 4:40Speaker 01

  Don't panic. Remember the advice your father gave you on your wedding day. If you ever travel back in time, don't step on anything because even the tiniest change can alter the future in ways you can't imagine. Fine, as long as I stand perfectly still and don't touch anything, I won't destroy the future. Stupid bug, you go squish now. But that was just one little insignificant mosquito. That can't change the future, right?

• 5:12Dan Pashman?

  Homer gets sent back to the present, which has been altered since he sipped on that bug. And now it's this 1984 type scenario where Ned Flanders is like big brother. So Homer goes back in time again to try to fix things, but he screws up something else. So when he comes back to the present now, all the people are giants. So he goes back to the past, messes up something different, comes back to the present, walks into his house and.

• 5:35Speaker 01

  Hey.

• 5:36Speaker 03

  Good morning, Father dear. Hope you're well. Are we taking the new Lexus to Aunt Patty and Summer's funeral today?

• 5:42Speaker 01

  Hmm, fabulous house, well behaved kids, sister's in law dead, luxury sedan. Woohoo, I hit the jackpot. Marge dear, would you kindly pass me a donut? Donut? What's a donut?

• 5:58Dan Pashman?

  Homer runs screaming from the house to go back in time. Then Marge looks out the window.

• 6:03Speaker 04

  It's raining again.

• 6:05Dan Pashman?

  And it's raining donuts. Genius. So I think you get the point. I was extremely excited to get to hang out with The Simpsons writers. Food is such a big part of The Simpsons, partly because it's not just a show. The town of Springfield is a whole fictional world, complete with its own food brands, Duff Beer, Krusty O's Cereal, and Chef Lonely Heart's Soup for One. There's actually an Instagram feed called Springfield Cuisine devoted entirely to foods from The Simpsons. Then, of course, there's Homer, the ultimate eater. Mmm, go nuts. Who can forget Homer at the candy convention stealing the gummy Venus de Milo?

• 6:47Dan Pashman?

  Or the time Homer intentionally gained 61 pounds so he could go on disability and work from home. Classics. All this was on my mind when I met up with Rob Lizebnik, who had invited me there in the first place. He's been a writer and co-executive producer on The Simpsons for 14 seasons. But he was a fan way before that.

• 7:07Speaker 05

  25, 27 years ago, there's an episode early on where Homer, you might remember, Homer gets a 10-foot sub from a picnic that Mr. Burns throws and he brings it home and he just relentlessly eating it and eating it and eating it.

• 7:22Speaker 04

  You've been eating that thing for a week. I think the mayonnaise is starting to turn.

• 7:27Dan Pashman?

  Two more feet and I can fit it in the fridge.

• 7:30Speaker 05

  It just killed me. I just remember from that long ago, just being killed. At one point, he says he's in bed with Marge, just trying to convince him to be, to get rid of it because it's going to make him sick.

• 7:41Dan Pashman?

  I'd like to be alone with the sandwich for a moment.

• 7:44Speaker 04

  Are you going to eat it?

• 7:46Dan Pashman?

  Yes.

• 7:48Speaker 05

  So I wish I'd been there for that whole experience. I bet that they were dying when they wrote that because I was what I watched.

• 7:54Dan Pashman?

  You wrote that scene with the mayonnaise dream?

• 7:59Speaker 05

  Yes. I'd wanted to do a show about spider pigs. We really hadn't featured him. And so we did this episode, I did this episode where a spider pig gets hurt on Mr. Burns's property. Mr. Burns decides to take care of him so he won't be sued. And Burns or Smithers says, if it doesn't work here, we'll take him to the Mayo Clinic. And Homer looks off and says, the Mayo Clinic, eh? And then it goes into Homer's fantasy about what is a Mayo Clinic like? And all the doctors are jars of mayonnaise. And they are, they're resuscitating the pig with the mayo. And it's just this like avalanche of mayonnaise.

• 8:37Speaker 01

  Should we slice them diagonally or just cut off the crust? Who cares? It's hopeless.

• 8:42Dan Pashman?

  I was interested that you had both Hellmann's and Best Foods represented.

• 8:45Speaker 05

  Yes.

• 8:46Dan Pashman?

  Which are the same mayonnaise, they're two different labels.

• 8:49Speaker 05

  Right, and in fact, isn't one's west of the Mississippi, one's east of the Mississippi?

• 8:52Dan Pashman?

  Something like that, yeah.

• 8:53Speaker 05

  We even had that, at one point that was in the show, and that's why those labels were there, because there were jokes about the fact, "What do you know, you're Best Foods, you know, I'm the real thing, I'm Hellmann's." But I think that got cut for time, so the vestige of it was for sharp-eyed viewers like you, were the labels.

• 9:08Dan Pashman?

  But then Miracle Whip comes in.

• 9:10Speaker 05

  Yes, and Miracle Whip comes in at the very end.

• 9:12Speaker 06

  You fools, I'll save him like I've saved a million lunches.

• 9:16Dan Pashman?

  And Miracle Whip is actually the one who unscrews his lid and...

• 9:19Speaker 05

  And starts spooning...

• 9:21Dan Pashman?

  Miracle Whip onto the sandwich to save it.

• 9:23Speaker 05

  Exactly, a slightly queasy-making scene.

• 9:30Dan Pashman?

  And then collapses in the ground. And says something like, um... It gets harder every time.

• 9:36Speaker 05

  Exactly, thank you for remembering.

• 9:39Dan Pashman?

  Yeah.

• 9:39Speaker 05

  There are too many shows.

• 9:40Dan Pashman?

  Yeah, I hear you. Are you a Miracle Whip fan, Rob?

• 9:43Speaker 05

  No.

• 9:44Dan Pashman?

  So why explain this plot twist to me where Miracle Whip saves the sandwich that Hellmann's and Best Foods cannot save?

• 9:50Speaker 05

  Anything for a laugh, yeah. I do have experience with, a lot of mayo experience, because I grew up in the Midwest, and my mother was, I think she would have said by her own admission, a terrible cook. And in fact, the first time I took my wife home to meet my parents, my mom had made a special dessert for her, which was, I'm not kidding, Jell-O with mayonnaise whipped into it. And my wife was like desperately looking at me like, "What do I do? How do I avoid this?" So yeah, the mayo stuff is deeply in my roots, and I probably, a lot of my body is mayo. Thanks, Jolene.

• 10:25Speaker 07

  You're welcome, bye-bye.

• 10:27Dan Pashman?

  By now, it was mid-morning. Pretty soon, it would be time for the table read, when the actors sit together and perform an early draft of a script to see how it sounds. Before that, though, came something even more important: ordering lunch. For the writers, this is a focal point of the day: a ritual. They order in the morning, then eat together in the afternoon. Rob was joined by fellow writer Ryan Ko. There were two options that day: the studio commissary, which is like the cafeteria, and a local Mexican place.

• 10:57Speaker 02

  This is Juliette. Did you meet them?

• 10:59Speaker 08

  I'm Juliette. Nice to meet you.

• 11:02Dan Pashman?

  Juliette, how annoying is it to have to take the right of food orders every day?

• 11:05Speaker 08

  Oh, it's the worst. No.

• 11:07Dan Pashman?

  Go on.

• 11:08Speaker 08

  It's totally cool. You get to use a cool clipboard. It's very exciting.

• 11:12Speaker 02

  Some people take way too long to decide.

• 11:14Speaker 08

  Absolutely.

• 11:15Speaker 02

  That's a big...

• 11:15Speaker 08

  That is probably the biggest issue we have. Yeah, we should have a timer or something.

• 11:19Dan Pashman?

  What about Rob and Ryan? Where do they rank in the annoying scale?

• 11:22Speaker 08

  Oh, they're not too annoying, so...

• 11:25Speaker 02

  I often get buyer's remorse. Like, after you call in lunch, I'm like, "No, no, call them and change it. I don't want chicken. Why did I order chicken?"

• 11:33Dan Pashman?

  Why do you think that happens to you, Ryan?

• 11:36Speaker 02

  Because lunch is very important to me, and so I don't want it to ruin my whole day if I, you know, order... You know, salad is... Everyone orders salad in the morning, and then by the time lunch comes around, it's like, "This is the last thing in the world I want to eat. What am I going to do? My whole day's screwed."

• 11:51Dan Pashman?

  Isn't that... That's kind of a parable for life, though. Like, you start off with all these good intentions, right? Like, "I'm going to be... I'm going to clean up my act today. It's a new day."

• 11:58Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 11:59Dan Pashman?

  And by lunchtime, you're like, "Melt some cheese on something right now."

• 12:02Speaker 02

  Yes, yes. But it works out great, because then I sort of just eat half of the healthy lunch and maybe like two or three cloud bike bars, but...

• 12:11Dan Pashman?

  So you manage to get the non-healthy stuff?

• 12:13Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah. I get my calories.

• 12:14Dan Pashman?

  Okay. So let's place some orders.

• 12:16Speaker 02

  Okay, let's do it.

• 12:16Dan Pashman?

  Rob, what are you going to order?

• 12:17Speaker 05

  Okay, "From commissary, please, this white bean and chicken sausage soup."

• 12:21Speaker 08

  Perfect.

• 12:21Speaker 05

  Sounds great. And nothing pairs better with that than tacos.

• 12:25Speaker 08

  Oh, perfect.

• 12:26Speaker 05

  I think.

• 12:27Dan Pashman?

  Well, you're getting tacos on top of that. So you're doing soup from the commissary plus tacos?

• 12:30Speaker 08

  So this is very, very common.

• 12:32Dan Pashman?

  Really?

• 12:33Speaker 08

  Also, commissary can do fruit plates and veggie plates, so people, even if they're ordering from the restaurant, will throw in, "I'm going to get some watermelon and grapes. I'm going to get whatever fruits or vegetables they want on the side."

• 12:45Dan Pashman?

  Really? Because it sounded to me for a minute like Rob was being kind of difficult there. But you're telling me that wasn't difficult?

• 12:50Speaker 08

  Yeah, he's a simple guy. It's easy to work with Rob, for sure.

• 12:55Dan Pashman?

  Ryan, what are you going to have?

• 12:57Speaker 02

  The spinny is a little tough, but I'll get the chicken enchiladas. And then what's good with that is a rainbow roll sushi.

• 13:05Speaker 02

  Those are classic, classic combinations.

• 13:07Dan Pashman?

  Is that really an order?

• 13:07Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 13:17Speaker 01

  Yeah, was that great?

• 13:19Dan Pashman?

  The lunch order was in. Rob took me to meet another writer and just walking around the place was amazing. This is the Fox lot in LA. It's like its own city. There are rows and rows of basically airplane hangars with movie and TV sets inside. We're talking 20th century Fox, you know?

• 13:41Dan Pashman?

  You get the idea. This is where they filmed The Three Musketeers in 1939 and where they do American Horror Story today. Miracle on 34th Street, Young Frankenstein, Moonlighting, The X-Files, Arrested Development, and Dr. Dolittle 2. Hey, they can't all be hits. Then there's another area where it's all bungalows and low slung buildings that almost look like motels. And those are the offices and writers' rooms. Rob had told me that if there was one person on the Simpsons staff I had to talk with while I was there, it was Matt Selman. In a writer's room full of food obsessed people, Matt reigns supreme. He's an executive producer and the episodes he oversees almost always have food jokes.

• 14:24Speaker 09

  It's always fun for me, and I believe most of us, to come up with gross, fake foods. We have two wing chains. These are not famous things beloved by Simpsons fans, but guess what? I like them. And like, one is called Garbage Wings, where the theme of it, the wings come in dumpsters and the dipping sauces are in little garbage cans. And I just think that's cute and funny. And then we have also one called Utica Wild Thies, which is a competitor of Buffalo Wild Wings from nearby Utica, where they take all the disposed of thighs not used by the wing restaurants and deep fry those.

• 15:02Dan Pashman?

  That's actually probably better. I feel like thighs are better than wings.

• 15:05Speaker 09

  Thighs have weird fat pockets that when deep fried do not always melt into the chicken. And so you're eating it and the skin will peel off and there's a kind of wet chicken meat underneath with lots of gross gloppy thighs thigh fat in the chicken.

• 15:22Dan Pashman?

  I guess you and I have different opinions about thigh fat, Matt.

• 15:25Speaker 09

  The fried chicken thigh is a challenging piece of meat. I'll just say that.

• 15:29Dan Pashman?

  One reason I was excited to talk with Matt Selman is that he wrote one of my favorite Simpsons episodes of recent years called The Food Wife. In it, Bart, Lisa and Marge become food bloggers, but Homer isn't interested.

• 15:42Speaker 01

  Oh, and here's my favorite restaurant, La Fridge. It's open 24 hours a day and there's no dress code.

• 15:55Speaker 03

  What kind of American man doesn't want to explore global food culture? And then brag about it on the internet. We should start our own food blog. Oh, The Three Mouth Cutiers.

• 16:07Dan Pashman?

  What inspired that episode?

• 16:09Speaker 09

  Well, certainly I was like, you know, more foodie phase of my life then. And food blogs and were kind of a big deal and, you know, it was an exciting time to be in LA and like drive around and eat at this taco place or this Ethiopian restaurant or this Korean bone neck stew place that was just so, so specific. It's like you could really have a, you know, real worldly experience and.

• 16:33Dan Pashman?

  But, but, um, what I loved about the episode was the way that it skewered foodie culture.

• 16:37Speaker 09

  Right. And it sort of made fun of, the idea was, okay, there was a certain amount of smugness and self-importance and bragging about that kind of foodie culture. But, you know, there is kind of, you know, where the Simpsons, we like to make fun of things. So it's like, if there's a smugness or a self-importance or like a bragging element of it, let's make fun of that. And, and that's where there's that rap song in the middle.

• 17:10Speaker 09

  A lot of rap and hip-hop is about bragging and a lot of foodie stuff is about bragging. So to bring those together, it's not just random to do a hip-hop song about what you've eaten. It's actually, there's kind of a commonality there.

• 17:37Dan Pashman?

  And did you feel like, in a way, you were kind of making fun of yourself?

• 17:40Speaker 09

  Sure, of course. Self-loathing is a huge part of what we do. But like a sort of a creative breakthrough, when we were thinking about the episode and how it would be, like a really obvious way to go would be Homer the foodie, because Homer likes food, right? But once we sort of said, wait a minute, he's like a blue-collar guy. He really just likes pizza and cheeseburgers and more than anything. And he's highly suspect of pretentiousness and sophisticated things and foreign things and things that make him feel like he doesn't get it. So like, to have him be like anti-foodie for much of the show and be able to voice that

• 18:21Speaker 09

  kind of regular guy opinion, you know, gave the episode really good conflict.

• 18:27Dan Pashman?

  And I, my favorite scene in that episode is the scene in the Ethiopian restaurant where Marge and the kids go in there.

• 18:34Speaker 03

  They're using pancakes as spoons. Ooh, let's see what else they do wrong.

• 18:41Dan Pashman?

  And Marge is so skeptical.

• 18:49Speaker 04

  They're selling CDs in the restaurant. Back to the car.

• 18:53Speaker 10

  What can I get you?

• 18:54Speaker 04

  Oh, I'll just have a side salad.

• 18:57Speaker 10

  We have no side salad.

• 18:59Speaker 04

  Back to the car.

• 19:00Speaker 03

  Relax, Mom. Be adventurous. Yeah, just have fun.

• 19:03Speaker 09

  It's certainly fun to make fun of people's fears, especially when we can portray them as being irrational, but yet relatable. Like, I just love that Marge was afraid of the fact they were selling CDs in the restaurant. It's just a funny observation and that anyone would be scared of that is, you know, is funny, is ridiculous.

• 19:25Dan Pashman?

  I mean, yes, there are some lines that that sort of poke fun at Ethiopian food, but I feel like they more poke fun at the ignorance and suspicions of white people about Ethiopian food.

• 19:36Speaker 09

  Sure, sure, sure, sure, sure.

• 19:37Dan Pashman?

  And so in that scene in the Ethiopian restaurant, it is the white people who are the butt of the joke.

• 19:42Speaker 09

  Right.

• 19:43Speaker 04

  What's the craziest thing on the menu?

• 19:44Speaker 03

  She means the most authentic.

• 19:47Speaker 10

  Well, that would be the zenzel mincha tala chawat.

• 19:51Speaker 04

  Then I'll have that.

• 19:56Speaker 04

  Okay, Marge, you test drove a convertible once, you can do this.

• 20:02Speaker 04

  Holy casserole, that's good gloop.

• 20:07Dan Pashman?

  At this point, a bunch of white food bloggers come in the door of the restaurant.

• 20:10Speaker 09

  Wait, wait, wait, what is she eating? They've never served me that dish, and I wear indigenous beaded headgear.

• 20:16Speaker 04

  Oh, this? It's just a little zenzel mincha tala chawat. It's all I ever eat here.

• 20:22Speaker 01

  They have prepared her a dish from the non-translated page.

• 20:28Speaker 04

  So grab a pancake and slurp some slop.

• 20:30Speaker 01

  Foodies, heed my call. Comments ripping and dipping.

• 20:36Dan Pashman?

  But but that's why I found it so so cutting is, and clever is because of the way that it sent up all of that. Like, the guy who says, "We discovered Korean barbecue."

• 20:47Speaker 09

  Right, what does he say? He says?

• 20:48Dan Pashman?

  "We discovered Korean barbecue in this town."

• 20:51Speaker 03

  Uh, before the Koreans?

• 20:54Speaker 09

  Oh, sure, they cook it, but they don't get it. There is a funny slash sad weird thing where it becomes almost competitive to like, you can just stuff your face with what and then tell people about it. But who cares?

• 21:08Dan Pashman?

  Where do you think that comes from?

• 21:12Speaker 09

  I don't know. I love foodies and eaters and people who are passionate about gorging themselves. And Homer is the king of all food lovers, right? But, you know. You just try to find that little crack in their foodie armor and stick a wedge in it and have some fun.

• 21:44Dan Pashman?

  Coming up, lunch arrives and we'll hear why writers might be the pickiest eaters in the world. Plus, I meet Simpsons creator Matt Granin and he tells me how new technology has changed the show's food jokes. Stick around.

• 22:19Speaker 11

  And now, a delicious word from our sponsors.

• 22:28Dan Pashman?

  When you're cooking, ingredients matter, right? You use higher quality ingredients, you usually get better results. And if you're listening to this show, you're probably the kind of person who puts some thought and effort into your ingredients. But ingredients don't just matter with food, they also matter with laundry detergent. Of course, the cleaning job needs to get done, the odors and stains have to be tackled, and I want to feel good about the detergent and the ingredients in it. Because remember, whatever's in your laundry detergent is essentially in your clothes, and then you're putting those clothes on, you want good stuff in there. And All Free Clear uses only essential ingredients. It's 100% free from dyes, perfumes, parabens, and irritating residues. Check out the label and see for yourself, it lists all the ingredients and what they do. We've been using it in my house, we're very happy with it, and let me tell you, family of four, two teenagers,

• 23:11Dan Pashman?

  we do a lot of laundry, so we have put All Free Clear to the test. It's a powerful clean that you can feel good about. All Free Clear is the number one detergent brand recommended by dermatologists for sensitive skin. When it comes to laundry detergent, the choice is clear: All Free Clear. Pick up a bottle for your next laundry day. Start the day strong with Quaker Protein Products. Quaker makes it easy and delicious to get a good source of protein. No matter what the day has in store, Quaker Protein Products give you a variety of ways to reach your protein goals. Oatmeal, granola, bars, and rice snacks in flavors you already love, like maple and brown sugar and blueberries and cream. Quaker Protein helps fuel you to start whatever's next. Get your protein with Quaker, available at a store near you.

• 23:55Dan Pashman?

  I grew up on Lando Lakes Cheese. I still remember going to the supermarket deli counter with my mom and her ordering Lando Lakes American Cheese. And now, Lando Lakes Cheese and Butter are a huge part of my home. There are so many easy weeknight recipes using Lando Lakes Cheese and Butter that bring delicious restaurant taste right to your table. From chicken parm to weeknight shrimp pad Thai, Lando Lakes has plenty of quick dishes that'll have the whole dinner table talking. Visit landolakes.com/reцепes/collection for easy weeknight dinners. Last year, right around this time, I got a new jacket from Quince, a lightweight fall jacket. And it has turned into my favorite jacket. And this is why you need a lightweight jacket, and probably a new one, because it's time to freshen up your look. You need a lightweight jacket from Quince,

• 24:39Dan Pashman?

  because the beauty of a lightweight jacket is you can wear it in the early fall, you can wear it in the early spring, but also it goes over a sweater, over a sweatshirt. And then suddenly, your lightweight jacket is a great accessory for pretty much the whole winter. Bottom line, when the temperatures start to drop, Quince makes it easy to build on those everyday staples with versatile layers designed to keep you warm and comfortable all season long. They make elevated everyday essentials using premium materials and designs that are timeless, thoughtfully crafted, and made to be worn again and again. So find your next fall favorites at Quince. Download the Quince app for app-exclusive offers or go to quince.com. Get free shipping on your order and 365-day returns, now available in Canada and the UK, too. And when Quince asks where you heard about them,

• 25:23Dan Pashman?

  let them know it was this porkful. It's the best way to support the show.

• 25:36Dan Pashman?

  Welcome back to The Sporkful. I'm Dan Pashman and I want to let you know that we have two live Sporkful tapings coming up. March 19th in Brooklyn with special guest Kenji Lopez Alt and May 1st in Boston at WBUR City Space. Don't know the guest yet in Boston, but when we did a live show in Boston two years ago, we had a packed house and a lot of enthusiasm. Man, we got a great crowd in Boston, so I cannot wait to see all the folks in Boston and Cambridge and Somerville and wherever else you live. So again, March 19th in Brooklyn, May 1st in Boston. Get info on tickets at sporkful.com/events. All right, back to the show. It was time now for the table read, which was one of the coolest things I've ever seen.

• 26:18Dan Pashman?

  And I say that with a little bit of hesitation, only because I feel bad because I can't share it with you. They wouldn't let me record it. It's top secret. But here's what I can tell you. It's in a big conference room. All the actors who do all the voices, they sit around a table with their scripts with all the writers. And then there's probably 50 more people filling the room, some standing, pressed against the walls. These are other writers, friends and family members, studio executives. They just sort of like, they want to create an audience in the room so they can test what gets laughs. It's sort of like a focus group. And so I got to sit there and watch the actors perform an episode of The Simpsons. And the episode they were doing the day I was there was about Krusty the Clown joining the circus.

• 26:59Dan Pashman?

  So it's sort of like, can this pampered TV clown cut it in the down and dirty world of an old time circus? And Nancy Cartwright was there doing Bart. Yardley Smith was there doing Lisa. Dan Castellaneta was there doing Krusty and Homer. And really, the most amazing thing of all was that it gave me a newfound appreciation for what talented voice actors they are. Because you know, when you watch the cartoon, yes, intellectually, you understand that the voice is not actually coming from the picture. But your brain kind of makes that connection. When you hear them reading these lines separate from the images, you hear how the slightest little pause or intonation or, or the way that they deliver a line just makes it so much funnier.

• 27:42Dan Pashman?

  Watch an episode of The Simpsons with your eyes closed. You'll see what I'm talking about. After the table read, I caught up with writers Rob and Ryan. You heard them order lunch earlier. I wanted to ask them about one of the food jokes in the episode from the table read. It was about Krusty the Clown's writers and the spice turmeric.

• 28:00Speaker 02

  A sort of a joke about how spoiled the writers are that if they don't get a good grade on their show from the reviewer, they will be cut off from their turmeric boosts.

• 28:09Dan Pashman?

  So turmeric is sort of like the annoying homeopathic ingredient of the moment. Not that not turmeric is an ingredient, it's delicious, but like, you know, there's all these special powers that are being attributed to it right now that I'm sure will be, you know, I'm sure that the trendy health food, uh, health fooderati will have moved on to the next thing, uh, soon enough. Do you ever worry that you're going to put a joke like that in and that by the time the episode airs, like turmeric will be old news?

• 28:35Speaker 02

  Well, maybe it'll be funnier after it's been debunked. It'll be like, oh, that, that was a funny trend that happened. I don't know. It's too hard. The show comes out in nine months, so yeah, a lot of things are going to be dated by nine months in that turmeric joke. Yeah, that's just the sort of high risk you have to take at this job. We have several swings down the line at rewriting too. So it's like, uh, we'll take one more pass at this a month before it airs, maybe six weeks before it airs. So we often are kind of, kind of catching a couple of things like that. It's like, wow, we, you know, that, that already feels old. That's amazing. Oh, let's see.

• 29:07Dan Pashman?

  Just then, Matt Selman came in. He's the guy I spoke with earlier who wrote the food wife episode. Matt, what'd you think of that table read?

• 29:13Speaker 09

  Pretty well. Just one step on the road to production, the road to airing, you know?

• 29:20Dan Pashman?

  Matt, what's one food related Simpsons joke that you wish you had written?

• 29:26Speaker 09

  I can't remember. Can't remember anything that we ever did.

• 29:29Dan Pashman?

  I think one of my, one of my all time favorites was, um, in the episode where, um, they go to the all you can eat seafood buffet. They run out of food and then they sue for false advertising.

• 29:39Speaker 12

  Mrs. Simpson, what did you and your husband do after you were ejected from the restaurant?

• 29:45Speaker 04

  We pretty much went straight home.

• 29:47Speaker 12

  Mrs. Simpson, you're under oath.

• 29:50Speaker 04

  We drove around until 3 a.m. looking for another all you can eat fish restaurant.

• 29:57Speaker 12

  And when you couldn't find one?

• 29:59Speaker 04

  We went fishing.

• 30:04Dan Pashman?

  Did these sound like the actions of a man who had all he could eat?

• 30:12Speaker 09

  But I would say that's not a food joke. That's a greed joke. It's about gluttony, the sin of gluttony. A food joke has a specificity of the food itself. I mean technically, yes. It's about food, but.

• 30:26Speaker 02

  There's a great line, now of course I don't remember it entirely, from Food Wife, where Homer is talking about sorbet? My kids do not eat sorbet. They eat sherbet, and they pronounce it sherbert, and they wish it was ice cream.

• 30:43Dan Pashman?

  Yeah, that's a food joke.

• 30:44Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 30:46Dan Pashman?

  Although, well, I could argue, Matt, that it's more a joke about, uh, class and, uh, pretentiousness.

• 30:54Speaker 09

  Mm-hmm. But it uses specificity of food to tell that joke.

• 30:59Dan Pashman?

  Right.

• 30:59Speaker 09

  We're gonna ruin the argument a lot. He thinks the fried chicken thighs are good. And that's obviously the worst piece of the fried chicken.

• 31:08Dan Pashman?

  Ryan, response?

• 31:10Speaker 02

  This issue comes up at least once a month. And, uh, it's a very sensitive issue for my boss about the amount of goo that's in a chicken thigh.

• 31:19Dan Pashman?

  Oh, I didn't know. We really tapped into something, Matt, yeah.

• 31:23Speaker 02

  So, I mean, I like the moistness of the meat, but saying more about it, I think, would have me lose a lot of standing in the show, so.

• 31:32Dan Pashman?

  And then, finally, it was time for lunch, which at The Simpsons is signaled to all the buildings in the area with the latest in lunch technology.

• 31:47Dan Pashman?

  And Juliet, what typically happens after that bell? I mean, I, I, I expected when that happened, I would see all these doors fling open across the lot and a stampede would occur.

• 31:56Speaker 08

  It's a little more understated. People kind of dribble. It's more of a dribble, I would say. Here's Joe. Joe's always the first.

• 32:03Dan Pashman?

  Joe's always the first?

• 32:04Speaker 08

  Uh-huh.

• 32:05Dan Pashman?

  Is that true, Joe?

• 32:06Speaker 09

  It is true. I got my lunch and Al's lunch, Al Jean's lunch.

• 32:09Dan Pashman?

  Okay.

• 32:10Speaker 09

  Yeah.

• 32:10Dan Pashman?

  Are you a writer?

• 32:11Speaker 09

  No, I'm Al Jean's assistant.

• 32:12Dan Pashman?

  Okay. Al Jean, of course, the showrunner of The Simpsons. What did he order?

• 32:15Speaker 09

  I don't know what he ordered.

• 32:17Speaker 08

  I think he got chicken enchiladas and rice and beans.

• 32:21Speaker 05

  All right, should we go into the actual?

• 32:23Dan Pashman?

  Yeah.

• 32:24Speaker 05

  Part of the beast?

• 32:26Dan Pashman?

  By "Heart of the Beast," Rob means The Simpsons' main writers' room. I had pictured something very antiseptic, like an office conference room. But it felt pretty warm, with a big, long wooden table in the middle and a screen at one end. It sort of felt like a cross between a ski lodge and a classroom.

• 32:42Speaker 05

  This is Max Pross, another writer. It's Dan Paxman.

• 32:46Dan Pashman?

  My name's Dan, good to meet you.

• 32:47Speaker 05

  Does the Spark Wolf Podcast.

• 32:49Dan Pashman?

  Yeah, yeah. Do you mind if I ask you a couple of quick questions about food and...

• 32:53Speaker 13

  As long as they're off the record, sure.

• 32:54Dan Pashman?

  Well, that's gonna be very fun. Tell me your name, please.

• 32:57Speaker 13

  Max Pross.

• 32:58Dan Pashman?

  And you're a writer?

• 32:59Speaker 13

  I try to be, yeah.

• 33:00Dan Pashman?

  Okay. And what is the role of food for a writer on a TV show?

• 33:04Speaker 13

  It is far too important a role. A legendary comedy writer, Steve O'Donnell, is convinced that writers are the pickiest eaters in the universe, because they're so used to detail and, you know, moving a comma or a word around, that every ingredient counts in food. And since writing in general, it's procrastinating. What better way to procrastinate than thinking about what your next meal is gonna be?

• 33:30Dan Pashman?

  So are you a picky eater?

• 33:31Speaker 13

  Extremely.

• 33:32Dan Pashman?

  What'd you order today?

• 33:34Speaker 13

  I left it to the geniuses who get the lunch for us, because I have standing orders at every restaurant, because there's only one thing I like at each place they go to, so they know what it is.

• 33:47Dan Pashman?

  So what's their thing for this place?

• 33:48Speaker 13

  This is a fish burrito at Pinchase.

• 33:49Dan Pashman?

  Fish burrito?

• 33:50Speaker 13

  Yeah.

• 33:51Dan Pashman?

  Is the fish fried?

• 33:52Speaker 13

  It's kind of fried, fried slightly. You know, they call it grilled, but it's really fried.

• 33:57Dan Pashman?

  I would worry that it would lose its crisp when it's all wrapped up, taken to go like that.

• 34:01Speaker 13

  It does. No, you have to put into consideration the traveling that each food does.

• 34:06Dan Pashman?

  Ryan, we spoke earlier about how you are often plagued by lunch order regret. Now you're eating your classic combination of enchiladas and sushi. How's that panning out for you?

• 34:19Speaker 02

  It's good alternating bites. You're not committing your mouth to any particular one set of flavors, and it's sort of taste confusion, which I think, you know, makes every bite new and refreshing and a little bit gross.

• 34:32Dan Pashman?

  And are you feeling any regret?

• 34:34Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah, yes, definitely.

• 34:36Dan Pashman?

  Also sitting at the table with someone I didn't realize I'd be meeting, Matt Groening, the big boss of The Simpsons, the guy who created the show 30 years ago. Matt, I won't ask you to tell me your favorite food-related Simpsons joke, because I feel like that's an impossible question.

• 34:52Speaker 14

  Mmm, floor pie. Right?

• 34:55Speaker 14

  Yeah.

• 34:56Dan Pashman?

  Are there others that come to mind? Are there personal favorites?

• 34:58Speaker 14

  Well, there was one where Homer found a hoagie or a Subway sandwich, whatever the term is. And it got more and more rotten. And finally Marge threw it out in the garbage and Homer got it out of the garbage can at the curb and tried to eat it and it was rotten. According to legend, that is actually something that happened to Al Jean.

• 35:25Dan Pashman?

  Matt, why do you think food is important to the writers on a show?

• 35:30Speaker 14

  I know it looks calm here, but I would say that being a writer on a TV show is one of the most stressful, anxiety provoking things. So you're trying to be funny and it's like being in school where you've got, you know, you've got to be funny.

• 35:45Speaker 09

  It's like reverse school where the job is to be funny. Where at school you had to study and it could be funny and that was extra. Now the job is the school and we study in the back of the room.

• 36:01Speaker 14

  Well, see now, that joke kind of half landed, but now you'll watch that Matt, someone will rush into the kitchen and start eating Doritos.

• 36:15Dan Pashman?

  I brought up the Food Wife episode, the one we discussed earlier that mocks foodie culture where white bloggers say things like... We discovered Korean barbecue in this town.

• 36:24Speaker 03

  Ah, before the Koreans?

• 36:27Dan Pashman?

  Oh, sure, they cook it, but they don't get it. And that scene where Bart, Lisa and Marge go to an Ethiopian restaurant, which I talked about with Matt Groening.

• 36:35Speaker 14

  The Ethiopians I know loved it. They loved just being acknowledged, you know?

• 36:44Dan Pashman?

  And in the Food Wife episode, do you find yourself more identifying with the would be foodie food bloggers, Marge and the kids, or more with Homer who only wants to eat things he already knows?

• 36:55Speaker 14

  I will drive 40 miles for a good bowl of ramen. San Gabriel Valley is the greatest part of Los Angeles that's not considered Los Angeles, but really is. It is miles and miles and miles of amazing regional Chinese restaurants and Vietnamese restaurants and...

• 37:13Speaker 14

  Mexican restaurants where the food here isn't watered down for gringos and locals. It's done for the community where the people live and therefore you get to eat seemingly authentic food.

• 37:27Dan Pashman?

  At this point, lunch was wrapping up and it was time for me to go. But there was one more question I wanted to ask Matt Groening. How has food on The Simpsons changed over the last 30 years?

• 37:38Speaker 14

  If you look back at the old animation of the show, the joke used to be that Marge would serve them glops of food and it was just sort of like a mush and that was kind of the joke. And then gradually we learned that you could draw a certain kind of shape and it would look like a pork chop. And now I think over the years, as our animation has gone into high def, we can actually draw food that you can tell what it is. So I think that's partly a technological breakthrough that has allowed us to do more specific food jokes. I think that part of the reason why food is so important to the show is because it's a universal and also Homer is a really fun character because he is ruled by his impulses and he feels no guilt. And I don't think there's a person alive who doesn't eat a donut without a tinge of guilt, right? But Homer doesn't.

• 38:24Speaker 06

  First, the award for the alumnus who's gained the most weight, Homer Simpson.

• 38:28Speaker 01

  Oh my god!

• 38:30Speaker 06

  How'd you do it, Homer?

• 38:31Speaker 01

  I discovered a meal between breakfast and brunch.

• 38:41Dan Pashman?

  So that was my trip to The Simpsons. It was really, really cool. I especially want to thank Rob Lizebnik as well as Ryan Coe, Matt Selman, and Matt Groening. If you want to see that episode they were working on, it's called Krusty the Clown. It's season 30, episode 8. You can find it on Disney Plus. You can also purchase it on a variety of streaming platforms. This episode was originally produced by Anne Sannie, Aviva DeKornfeld, and me. It was mixed by Dan DeZula. This update was produced by Andres O'Hara and mixed by Jared O'Connell. Our team also includes Emma Morgenstern, Johanna Mayer, and Tracy Samuelson. Music help from Black Label Music. The Sportful is a production of Stitcher. Our executive producers are Peter Clowney and Eric Eddings. Until next time, I'm Dan Pashman.

• 39:21Speaker 15

  And I'm Kiana. I'm 11 years old and I live in Chicago, Illinois. And I'm reminding you to eat more, eat better, and eat more better. Definitely more better.

• 39:42Dan Pashman?

  This reheat was produced by Gianna Palmer. The team that produces The Sporkful today includes me along with managing producer Emma Morgenstern. And senior producer Andres O'Hara. Our engineer is Jared O'Connell. Music help from Black Label Music. The Sporkful is a production of SiriusXM Podcasts. Our executive producer is Camille Stanley. And hey, did you know you can listen to The Sporkful on the SiriusXM app? Yes, the SiriusXM app, it has all your favorite podcasts, plus over 200 ad-free music channels curated by genre and era, plus live sports coverage. Does your podcasting app have that? And there's interviews with A-list stars and so much more. It's everything you want in a podcast app and music app all rolled into one. And right now, Sporkful listeners can get three months free of the SiriusXM app by going to siriusxm.com/sporkful.

• 40:27Dan Pashman?

  Until next time, I'm Dan Pashman.

• 40:35Speaker 16

  At Amica Insurance, we believe trust is earned over a lifetime. With Amica Life Insurance, you can count on us to help protect the life you're building and the loved ones you're building it with. For us, trust is what life insurance is all about. And that's why generations of customers trust Amica to be there in the moments that matter. Visit amica.com to get a customized quote today. Amica, empathy is our best policy.

• 41:04Speaker 17

  Fidelity Active ETFs have the flexibility to shift and transform as markets do the same. So instead of just riding an index, they can seek to outperform it by adapting to market conditions and pursuing new opportunities as they emerge. And while you get the potential outperformance of an actively managed fund, you can still buy and sell it on your terms, just like any other ETF. Markets can change in real time. Make sure your ETF can too. Learn more at fidelity.com/activeetfs. Before investing in any exchange traded fund, you should consider its investment objectives, risks, charges, and expenses. Contact Fidelity for a prospectus, an offering circular, or if available, a summary prospectus containing this information. Read it carefully.

• 41:48Speaker 17

  While Active ETFs offer the potential to outperform an index, these products may more significantly trail an index as compared with passive ETFs. ETFs are subject to market fluctuation and the risks of their underlying investments. ETFs are subject to management fees and other expenses. Fidelity Broker Services, LLC, member NYSE, SIPC.