#616 - Retired Boston Detective

Kara Connolly is a former detective and police officer who recently retired following a 30+ year career in the Boston area. After her time as a patrolwoman she transferred to the Human Trafficking Division where she worked undercover. Kara joins Theo to talk about some of her most unique cases as a detective, going undercover on Backpage to target sex-buyers, and her thoughts on why crime enforcement has softened in recent years. ------------------------------------------------ Tour Dates! https://theovon.com/tour New Merch: https://www.theovonstore.com ------------------------------------------------- Sponsored By: Celsius: Go to the Celsius Amazon store to check out all of their flavors. #CELSIUSBrandPartner #CELSIUSLiveFit https://amzn.to/3HbAtPJ Rocket Money: Go to http://rocketmoney.com/theo to cancel your unwanted subscriptions. Blue Chew: Go to http://bluechew.com and use code THEO at checkout for your first month free. Sonic: For a limited time, redeem a free large drink when you purchase a Sonic Smasher: https://www.sonicdrivein.com/menu/burgers/sonic-smasher/ Valor Recovery: To learn more about Valor Recovery please visit them at https://valorrecoverycoaching.com/ or email them at [email protected] Perplexity AI: Ask anything at https://pplx.ai/theo and download their new web browser Comet at https://comet.perplexity.ai/ ------------------------------------------------- Music: “Shine” by Bishop Gunn Bishop Gunn - Shine ------------------------------------------------ Submit your funny videos, TikToks, questions and topics you'd like to hear on the podcast to: [email protected] Hit the Hotline: 985-664-9503 Video Hotline for Theo Upload here: https://www.theovon.com/fan-upload Send mail to: This Past Weekend 1906 Glen Echo Rd PO Box #159359 Nashville, TN 37215 ------------------------------------------------ Find Theo: Website: https://theovon.com Instagram: https://instagram.com/theovon Facebook: https://facebook.com/theovon Facebook Group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/thispastweekend Twitter: https://twitter.com/theovon YouTube: https://youtube.com/theovon Clips Channel: https://www.youtube.com/c/TheoVonClips Shorts Channel: https://bit.ly/3ClUj8z ------------------------------------------------ Producer: Zach https://www.instagram.com/zachdpowers Producer: Trevyn https://www.instagram.com/trevyn.s/ Producer: Nick https://www.instagram.com/realnickdavis/ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Theo Von?

  You ever realize that you spent your entire morning thinking about lunch? It's 9 a.m. and somehow I'm already in negotiations with myself about how I'm gonna spend $20 on a sandwich at noon. And then I eat it, or you eat it, or somebody eats it, and then an hour later, you're just standing in the kitchen worrying about what you'll do for dinner. And that's one reason why I've been into Huell. The Black Edition Powder is a complete meal you have instead of food, not a shake on top of food. Their powder starts at less than $3 per meal, has 40 grams of protein, and mixes with water or milk in about 30 seconds. I like Huell's shakes because they're clean and it's quick.

• 0:41Theo Von?

  I just want to make sure I have everything I need to keep going the way I want to keep going in a healthy manner. So with Huell, basically, lunch went from a daily logistical problem to a thing I can solve in about 30 seconds. Make healthy eating simple. New customers get an exclusive offer of 15% off online with my code WEEKEND at huell.com/weekend. That's H-U-E-L dot com slash weekend. Thank you to Huell for partnering and supporting our show. Before we begin, I'd like to say that some of the conversation from today is kind of graphic in nature. We're talking about police work and detective work, and some of it's intense.

• 1:24Theo Von?

  If those types of conversations are not for you, then please make that choice for yourself. Thank you. Today's guest is a retired Boston police officer and detective. She had over 20 years on the force before she joined the human trafficking unit and fought criminals in that world. We learned a lot about what it's really like out there, and I want to thank her for her service. Today's guest is Ms. Kara Connolly.

• 2:10Theo Von?

  Yeah, my hair, I've been losing some hair because of stress.

• 2:13Speaker 01

  Yeah, it happens. Sucks.

• 2:14Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 2:15Speaker 01

  You just go in the sink and you got handfuls.

• 2:17Theo Von?

  Yeah, you just wake up and it looks like you look back and you're like, oh.

• 2:19Speaker 01

  On your pillow? Yeah.

• 2:20Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 2:21Speaker 01

  It's gross.

• 2:21Theo Von?

  Your pillow's got sideburns on it or something? You know, your pillow's using a curling iron?

• 2:26Speaker 01

  Seriously, it's a mess. Yeah.

• 2:27Theo Von?

  There's way too much. You've dealt with it?

• 2:29Speaker 01

  Yeah, in the past, yeah.

• 2:30Theo Von?

  Yeah, and was it stress from work?

• 2:33Speaker 01

  Uh, yeah, and other things, but the, the minoxidil definitely helps because I was, I called my doctor and like, oh, she can't see you for nine months. And I was like, oh, my fucking hair's falling out. And they're like, well, you could see the nurse practitioner in two months. I was like, no. So I went to one of those online things and they sent me minoxidil and like, three months I had little bald baby hairs sprouting out and it came back. So it does help.

• 2:51Theo Von?

  Yeah. Yeah, yeah. That's what I'm realizing. I just gotta, uh, yeah, just taking some time just to enjoy, do things just that I enjoy. That's what I'm, that's like my focus right now is just to do things that I enjoy. Um, because I'll, I'll let added stress stay on me as well, you know?

• 3:06Speaker 01

  Yeah, of course.

• 3:06Theo Von?

  That's what I'll do.

• 3:07Speaker 01

  It builds up.

• 3:07Theo Von?

  Yeah, and not realizing that everything's gonna be okay, you know?

• 3:11Speaker 01

  That's my, my boyfriend's here with us and when I was nervous about today and he's like, it's all gonna be okay.

• 3:16Theo Von?

  Yeah. It really is.

• 3:18Speaker 01

  My little platitudes.

• 3:19Theo Von?

  Yeah, everything's gonna be okay. Um, Kara Connolly, thank you so much for joining us. You are a retired, uh, police officer and detective from Boston.

• 3:28Speaker 01

  That's correct.

• 3:29Theo Von?

  And, uh, you were on the forces for thirty?

• 3:32Speaker 01

  Thirty-one years.

• 3:33Theo Von?

  Thirty-one years.

• 3:34Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 3:34Theo Von?

  And you started out in Dorchester, I think?

• 3:37Speaker 01

  Yeah, when I graduated the police academy, um, they send you to a couple of different places to tell you you're on probation or whatever. And I went to a part of the city called Dorchester.

• 3:46Theo Von?

  Wait, probation? They send?

• 3:47Speaker 01

  So when you, you join the police department and you go through the police academy.

• 3:50Theo Von?

  Okay.

• 3:50Speaker 01

  And then when you get out, now they do it for a year, but when I did graduate it, it was six months. And they have you, um, you basically, it's probationary period to see if you're, you know, good enough, behave enough, or do the right thing, um, for like six months. So they send you to a couple of different places, like one busy district, one quiet district.

• 4:08Theo Von?

  So they start you like a probationary period somewhere?

• 4:10Speaker 01

  Yes. And you might stay there, they might move you, but that's how you're on probation for six months and then you're, you know, a full-time police officer after.

• 4:17Theo Von?

  Okay. And what were those first years on the force like, um, like in South Boston, was it?

• 4:23Speaker 01

  Yeah, so I was actually born in South Boston. So I was in Dorchester and I was in South Boston. So Boston at the time was a quieter district. Dorchester was very, very busy. In the nineties was like in Boston was a ton of shootings and gang stuff going on. Um, so comparatively speaking, South Boston was was a quieter place to end up for several years.

• 4:40Theo Von?

  And what were the demographics of that area like where you were servicing?

• 4:44Speaker 01

  Uh, kind of everywhere. Um, Dorchester is a different, um, different demographic than South Boston. Um, population wise, now South Boston's very hip and like it's all young kids. But at the time, I would say it was like all just kind of families. Um, pretty quiet place at the time compared to other districts where like, you know, shooting every couple of days. So.

• 5:04Theo Von?

  And is it mostly white, black, Latino, Asian?

• 5:07Speaker 01

  Dorchester at the time, when I was first there was, um, a lot of blacks, some whites, some Asian. Um, and South Boston at the time was mostly white, but with some black and Latinos.

• 5:18Theo Von?

  Got it. And who were the people they call Southies? Cause you hear that a lot.

• 5:22Speaker 01

  Southies is not a thing. Um, you could say you're from Southie, but it's not, it's not, it's not pluralized. There's no S on the end of it. But, um, so I'm from Southie, but I never said that growing up. We always said South Boston. But most people said I'm from Southie.

• 5:35Theo Von?

  Okay.

• 5:36Speaker 01

  It's just a nickname for the part of town.

• 5:38Theo Von?

  Right. But so you're not like, but do other people call you Southies or the Southies?

• 5:42Speaker 01

  No, people from like out of the city who hear about it became popular because it was in Goodwill Hunting, was in South Boston. So that's kind of what put it on the map. So when people started moving there and didn't know any better, that's how they would say it. But people who grew up there back in seventies, eighties or whatever, didn't say it like that. That pub that they, you know, they filmed in became like a big thing, L Street Tavern. And, and, uh, that was like around the corner from where I grew up.

• 6:05Theo Von?

  And, and were the people there distrustful of police at the time? What was the relationship like between?

• 6:09Speaker 01

  No, people in Southie like, like the cops, so compared to other parts of the city, I think, in my experience. I mean, it was a quiet place when I worked there. Most of the stuff that kind of good stuff that happened or whatever, crazy or calls I've been on happened when I was a detective. Patrolman was pretty quiet.

• 6:25Theo Von?

  Do you remember one of your first like big like calls as a patrolman that was like, oh, this is real? Like, do you remember that, like, a first moment where you're like, this is pretty real?

• 6:33Speaker 01

  Well, a lot of the calls, it's funny, a lot of the calls when it comes in, like, you know, person with the gun call, like, I still remember my first person with the gun call, I was shitting my pants because I was like, oh, my God, you know, and it turned out to be bullshit, it wasn't even real. So, a lot of the calls are like that, you don't know they're fake until you get there. So, you're like an adrenaline dump in the car and you're like, oh, my God, this is real. And I remember being like, what am I gonna do? Nothing, it was a big nothing burger.

• 6:55Theo Von?

  Were you putting lipstick on or what? I mean, what are you gonna do?

• 6:57Speaker 01

  No, no, there was no lipstick when I was a patrolman, no.

• 7:00Theo Von?

  Yeah, like, would you like powder up your face a little bit or something?

• 7:02Speaker 01

  No, no one powdered their face on the way to a call, huh?

• 7:05Theo Von?

  That wasn't it?

• 7:06Speaker 01

  No, that wasn't a thing.

• 7:08Theo Von?

  Yeah, that's just in Charlie's Angels, huh?

• 7:10Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 7:11Theo Von?

  What was it like being an officer in the 90s in that time period? Like, was that way different than you think it is now?

• 7:17Speaker 01

  Yes, I think so. I mean, obviously, the, the gang, the, the rate of shootings in Boston was much higher than, I forget what our highest homicide rate was in the early 90s, it might have been like 150, 160 people. Now, Boston has like 35 a year. So, it was a big difference. It's, it's become much safer, whether everyone, the gangs kind of aged out and they all went to jail or, you know, got shot or moved on in life, whatever happened, it became much safer, I'd say.

• 7:45Theo Von?

  There's no money in being in a gang either. I think a lot of people are like, oh, this is a shitty business, you know? This says 1990, the homicide peak, Boston's homicide count hit an all-time high of 152 cases with much of the violence concentrated among youth and in, and involving firearms. The spike was driven by gang violence, crack, cocaine epidemic, and easy access to handguns.

• 8:07Speaker 01

  Yeah, so 90s are a little different than now, for sure.

• 8:10Theo Von?

  Compared to then, how do you feel like police work is different between now and then? Do you have any thoughts on that?

• 8:16Speaker 01

  I don't know. I mean, the whole like community policing aspect aspect started when I was new. So that that's kind of still progressed along. I think.

• 8:23Theo Von?

  What does that mean, community policing?

• 8:25Speaker 01

  Well, that's what they call it. At the time, they had walking beats. So when I got on, um, you wouldn't be in a cruiser, like you'd walk the neighborhood, kind of like they do in in New York City. They have people walking around. There's not a lot of cruisers. And so they they would put peoples in certain parts of the city. Like when I got on, for example, and I worked in Dorchester, I think there were like seven or eight walking beats up and down like kind of the main street in the town. And now, excuse me, there's only a couple and they just put those on again. So they're kind of trying to get back to that. Um, so that was very different. Like people who did the walking beats full time, like knew everyone in the neighborhood. That was the whole purpose is to get people into the neighborhood. So people feel comfortable speaking to the police. Except the neighborhoods where they put the walking beats were usually the worst neighborhoods and people didn't give a shit. They didn't want to talk to us. So.

• 9:10Theo Von?

  Oh, it didn't matter anyway?

• 9:11Speaker 01

  No, not the parts of the city where they had them. Now it's it's different. Um, they don't have as many walking beats at all. They they push a lot of the social media stuff like the dance, the dancing cops is the fucking worst. It's so cringey. And they the department, all the police departments do that. They put it out to try to be like, look, we're excessive. Oh, see, it's so, so embarrassing.

• 9:30Theo Von?

  I haven't even seen this.

• 9:32Speaker 01

  It's just, it's so goddamn cringey.

• 9:34Theo Von?

  Are these real cops?

• 9:36Speaker 01

  That's usually the, I don't know about them. Yeah, it says they are.

• 9:41Theo Von?

  Oh, my.

• 9:41Speaker 01

  Well, at least, at least they can dance. Like when I, when our department puts it out, it's like, she's like, right, cops like, oh, we're playing basketball with the kids and, you know, what let's all do, especially during COVID. It's just, it's so cringey. They just put on the other day from female, uh, woman, police law enforcement day. And they had like women dancing and some of my girlfriends and I sent it back and forth. Like this is so embarrassing.

• 10:03Theo Von?

  Dude, the last thing I want is my cop dancing over there.

• 10:06Speaker 01

  Is that what you're looking for when you call for help? Someone to show up and start dancing? Like you want someone who's gonna give you a hand?

• 10:12Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 10:13Speaker 01

  It's just, I know they're trying to soften their image. They don't want to look like paramilitary anymore. They want to look friendly and not scary and whatever, whether it works or not, long term, I don't know.

• 10:22Theo Von?

  Yeah. You get promoted to detective in 2005?

• 10:25Speaker 01

  Seven, 2007, yeah.

• 10:26Theo Von?

  Okay. And what is, what, what does it mean to, to become a detective? What does that mean exactly?

• 10:31Speaker 01

  So to become a detective, back then you had to take an exam. So it's like a six month, two year long process. You have to study for several months and there's like six or seven textbooks you have to read. So you take the exam and then they do kind of like an oral interview, depending on how you score on the test. And then they kind of combine your years of training and experience, your test score and your interview to say, okay, these people have been high enough scored to get made detective. So, and then you do like a month's worth of training back at the police academy to, because being a detective and versus a patrolman is very, very different. First of all, you don't wear a uniform, which is my favorite part, but it's just completely different job. Like you're now responsible. Cop gets a call, they go to the call, they write a report and that's the end of it until they have to go to court.

• 11:14Speaker 01

  If the report that the cop writes about, it gets assigned to a detective and now you own that. Like, so you have to follow through, you have to follow up and go to court or take out criminal charges or whatever. So it's, it's a very different job.

• 11:26Theo Von?

  Is there a lot of lobbying to become a detective? Like whenever you're like on the force or people like, I want to be detective? And, and then do people, is there any way to manipulate things so it betters your chances of becoming a detective? Or is it not like that?

• 11:40Speaker 01

  Not like that. So everyone, if anyone's a patrolman, doesn't want to be a patrolman for long. I was a patrolman for 13 years, which was a long time. We had, usually they do the detective's exam every two or three years. For some reason, we had a seven year break because I didn't take it. I just had a child and I was like, I'll take the next one in a couple of years. And it was seven years. So I was a patrolman for a long time. So people.

• 11:59Theo Von?

  It was seven years to the next promotion?

• 12:01Speaker 01

  Yeah, till the next exam.

• 12:02Theo Von?

  Oh.

• 12:03Speaker 01

  So it was a long wait. But people want it just because it's better than being a patrolman. Some people love being a patrolman and will do that their entire life, but most people either want to take an exam and become supervisor, like a sergeant, a lieutenant, and keep kind of going up the chain, or people are interested in being a detective. So it's definitely desirable, you know?

• 12:22Theo Von?

  Do you remember an early case as a detective that really kind of stood out to you?

• 12:26Speaker 01

  Um, yeah, I had a good armed robbery once. Um, you know, that sounds like an oxymoron, a good armed robbery.

• 12:31Theo Von?

  Great. It'll have a good armed robbery.

• 12:33Speaker 01

  It was on Halloween, uh, which is always one of the worst days of the year to work. Fourth of July. Halloween sucks. They're always crazy. But we had an armed robbery of, it was of a cellphone store in the morning. It was in the morning. It was like nine thirty in the morning. The store just opened up. And these two dudes went in and there was some girl, a young girl, early twenties, working there by herself. It was in a shitty part of town. And they literally tied her up with like telephone cord around her wrists and her ankles. And they stole, it was like eight hundred bucks or seven hundred eighty-five dollars, whatever it was. But the feds ended up taking it because it was T-Mobile. And they can kind of loop in the Commerce Act like by saying that because commerce was halted with other states, it becomes like a federal case.

• 13:18Speaker 01

  But the guys ran off and the girl, it was like something out of a movie. It was all in video. She literally hopped over to the phone, all tied up with her ankles. And they put a gun to her head and everything. It was two got firearms. And she was terrified. And they, she hopped over to the phone and like knocked it off with her head and was like calling for help.

• 13:36Theo Von?

  At least she's in a phone store though, like at least.

• 13:39Speaker 01

  But she was able to do that. And then it came in quick. So a couple of the guys from work, everyone, I worked with the best people on earth in Dorchester. They really were great, great cops. And they just kind of flood the area right away and they had descriptions going out. And one of the officers, it's actually one of my police academy classmates, ends up seeing these two guys walking down the street. And a description had been given out to clothing. They left like a trail of clothing down the street. They tried to drop everything and change their appearance.

• 14:07Theo Von?

  It's hard to run and change at the same time.

• 14:09Speaker 01

  Yeah, so they, they were just kind of, yeah, walking down the street and really not, it's actually a little teeny, it's a nice neighborhood in this bad section of town. So they kind of stuck out. And, but then he sees the trail of clothing, jackets and hats and shit left behind. So he called it in. These guys, one of them had on gloves, but the other one had Band-Aids and tape around his fingers. So he wouldn't leave any fingerprints. And as the guys, everyone went up there, the patrolmen were talking to him. He notices them only they're picking away to try to get the Band-Aids and tape off their hands. And then another officer in the area was searching. She's looking in trash cans and she found the guns. And then someone found the box, the money box. So it was, that was, that was a, that was a pretty good one.

• 14:48Theo Von?

  It was an exciting one.

• 14:49Speaker 01

  Yeah, it was just, it came together nicely. Everyone worked like, did so well together. Everyone was like, everyone was there at the right time to do the right thing. And then the feds took it and they had, they had serious criminal records, both of them. One of them been doing armed robberies all over the city. It was like the same guy hit like five or six places. So we were glad to get him. They got, because it was federal, they got like 20 something years each. One of their brothers was a truck driver and he, that's how they got the guns. He was a cross-country truck driver and he would, he bought guns in Arizona and then brought them back here.

• 15:20Theo Von?

  So that's what made it federal? Is that they were transporting guns across state lines?

• 15:24Speaker 01

  I think they didn't end up prosecuting him because he basically testified against his brother.

• 15:29Theo Von?

  But what made it such a big, what made the sentencing so severe?

• 15:33Speaker 01

  Because they were, um, the way the feds do it in federal court is, um, they basically add up, it's a point system and depending how many charges or cases, how many times you've been found guilty, then you were considered armed career criminal, um, and you get extra time added on.

• 15:48Theo Von?

  Ah, got it.

• 15:49Speaker 01

  Um, but yeah, for 785 bucks, they went to jail for like 20 something years each. It was crazy.

• 15:54Theo Von?

  It's idiots.

• 15:56Speaker 01

  Yeah, pretty much. And that poor girl was terrified. I always felt bad for her.

• 16:01Theo Von?

  Yeah. Oh, that would be so scary, dude. I don't know what I would do if someone did something like that, like pulled, like, you know?

• 16:07Speaker 01

  She didn't even want to identify them. We were trying to do like a, we'd do a bring back or show up your bring, because we brought them to say, have her identify them. And she was like hiding behind the blinds in the store. We'd usually they'll have them like, go out on the sidewalk and the person will like look through her car window, but she was literally hiding. She was absolutely terrified. The worst thing. She's crying and everything.

• 16:26Theo Von?

  Well, how important are fingerprints? Is that a real thing? How important is that when you were detective?

• 16:30Speaker 01

  Well, that, that's a real thing because everyone's are different.

• 16:33Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 16:33Speaker 01

  So if you get found at a scene, whether it's a break-in or, um, a robbery or something like that, and they find your fingerprints, well, you, how, what other excuse do you have for being there? So it's, it's a pretty good, especially now people like in court, when cases go to court, they don't want witness identification. They want, because of all the CSI shows, they think we all have this bags of evidence to show when it comes to court. So juries want to see forensics. They want fingerprints. They want like cellphone records. They want DNA left behind because of the TV shows makes it look like that's left at every scene. But these guys covered their fingerprints. They had masks on, like they put, you know, bandanas around their face. But the girl identified

• 17:15Speaker 01

  them from the clothes. One of them didn't have a mask on. But so fingerprints are definitely very important.

• 17:20Theo Von?

  And what's the process of actually lifting fingerprints? What is that? And you hear the term lifting fingerprints?

• 17:24Speaker 01

  So different surfaces use different tools. Like this surface, the grain of the wood would be no good. You need like a smooth surface. Like they train us on like granite, like countertops.

• 17:35Theo Von?

  Oh yeah, granite's nice.

• 17:36Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's very smooth. It's shiny. So if someone leaves a fingerprint, you have, whether you have dry or oily hands, you're leaving oil behind. And you could take your powder and you spin the little powder on like a smooth surface and literally the fingerprint pops. And then you just take this kind of clear square of like sticky tape and then like press it down and then lift it up. So it transfers onto, the outline transfers onto, there you go.

• 18:00Theo Von?

  Can there be fingerprints in a place, like could you look at a counter or something and see nothing and there could actually be fingerprints there?

• 18:05Speaker 01

  Yeah, you can kind of, if you use a flashlight, sometimes you can see it if it's a clean surface. If it's like a shithole house or filled like, bank robberies, we don't do fingerprints because so many people go up to every teller. Like even if a bank robber comes in and puts his hands down, there's 10,000 other fingerprints there from the people that came before you.

• 18:24Theo Von?

  Right.

• 18:24Speaker 01

  So they don't, we don't bother with something like that. Cause you have to be able to show it's a suspect. So they won't like put it into the system to see who it even belongs to.

• 18:32Theo Von?

  Could a surface be so dirty that then the print itself actually makes it clean? And that, you know what I'm saying?

• 18:38Speaker 01

  Yes, on dirty windows, we get those on a break in. When they push up, push up a window and leave them behind. And you can literally see them because you can see sometimes they'll smear the dirt. Sometimes it's so dirty though, the dust won't, the dust won't adhere to it.

• 18:51Theo Von?

  Got it. What, what's a person who picks up the fingerprints? What do they call that person?

• 18:57Speaker 01

  Uh, well, we do it. Detectives do it.

• 18:58Theo Von?

  Detectives do it.

• 18:59Speaker 01

  They do it in Boston. Yeah. Some in other places like the crime scene tech will come out and other departments, but we do it ourselves. Unless it's like a major incident, like a homicide, uh, then the homicide unit will call the forensic unit, like, and they'll, those, those are civilians. They're not police officers, but they'll, they have gone to school for that. So if it's like a major, you know, like I said, a homicide or something, they'll call in the crime scene techs to do it. They don't want to mess with us.

• 19:22Theo Von?

  And you ever have a day where it's just busy and like, ah shit, I gotta get to my kid's birthday or whatever. I don't know if I can just, we'll hope for the best of this when you take off.

• 19:29Speaker 01

  Yeah, it sucks. Like you could be, your shift ends at four o'clock if you work days and it, you know, three forty-five, someone, a person stabbed. Alright, I won't be home till midnight. So.

• 19:38Theo Von?

  Oh, you say, oh, so you stay or?

• 19:39Speaker 01

  You stay.

• 19:40Theo Von?

  Oh, yeah. I, I was saying like, if you ever had a thing where it's like, ah, I gotta get out of here, you know, I'm, instead of doing the work, you know, instead of dusting for these fingerprints, I'm gonna hit the road, you know?

• 19:49Speaker 01

  You can't do that.

• 19:49Theo Von?

  You can't?

• 19:49Speaker 01

  No. It's on you. It's your, if it's your case, if you got, if you're on, on, um, call, we call it catch day in Boston, but detectives, like certain squads have, are in charge of all those calls that day. So, you know, five things could come in. We could get a shooting, a stabbing, an armed robbery, and, you know, missing person, and they're all assigned to you. But it's not that busy, um, but it can be. You might have a day, like you don't even go pee, you don't even eat lunch. I mean, it's few and far between, but it definitely happens.

• 20:17Theo Von?

  Wow. So you're just cruising like that?

• 20:18Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 20:19Theo Von?

  How much, you mentioned television a little bit ago. How much has television and what people think and expect, how much has that affected like the prosecution of cases?

• 20:27Speaker 01

  Ruined it, absolutely destroyed it. Yeah. Cause everyone has such high expectations. If they watch, you know, CSI Miami or whatever the hell it is, and see they solve everything instantly and, um, they have cooperative witnesses or they have all this piles of evidence and like I said, people in, because of that, people in regular juries and regular court cases expect, oh, do, they literally come back with notes saying, why don't you have fingerprints? Why don't you have DNA? Like, why don't you have that? Well, not every case has that. Like I said, a bank robbery comes in, they don't touch the counter. We have no DNA. We have no fingerprints.

• 21:00Theo Von?

  You have no semen either, surely.

• 21:01Speaker 01

  We have to go eyewitness identification and videos now everywhere. Video's huge. Video's a huge help, but it's definitely the shows have been a detriment to. Prosecuting cases, for sure.

• 21:10Theo Von?

  So you think it's made her, that the shows have made it harder to prosecute cases?

• 21:14Speaker 01

  Absolutely, because people have higher expectations. The juries do.

• 21:17Theo Von?

  The juries do, and they're like, oh, there's not enough here.

• 21:19Speaker 01

  Yes, they'll be like, it's not, you don't have anything. Where is all, where is everything? It's like, well, we have, you know, we've got the video and we've got this and that. And like, no. So it's tricky, yeah. It's not been our friend.

• 21:30Theo Von?

  It's fascinating. It's, yeah, it's fascinating because it kind of glorifies the sport of being a detective, but at the same time.

• 21:37Speaker 01

  Ruined it.

• 21:39Theo Von?

  That's, a lot of things happen like that. Once things get glorified so much, kind of they get ruined sometimes. I think that's almost a general rule of things, it feels like, except for God, probably.

• 21:52Theo Von?

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• 23:19Theo Von?

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• 24:01Theo Von?

  And we thank BlueChew for sponsoring the podcast. You always, you always hear, uh, like the show's The First Forty Eight, right? Um, and my friend Chris D'elia, he's a comedian. He's, uh, he has this great joke. He's like, the first forty eight, and I'm paraphrasing. He's like, the first forty eight, it's like, the, these detectives have forty eight hours to solve the crime, but really they have as much time as they want.

• 24:24Speaker 01

  Yeah, they do, we do. You know, sometimes you're waiting on video, like it doesn't, obviously if you don't have a suspect like right away, um, but if you work at it, sometimes the evidence is out that you just have to find it. It might not slap you in the face at ten minutes after the incident.

• 24:40Theo Von?

  Right, but do you really only have forty eight hours?

• 24:42Speaker 01

  No, we have all the time you need, except, except it gets busy. And if I have, you know, three cases that day and if like I gotta work on it and then two days from now I get another big one that like a shooting or a stabbing or whatever, now your, your, your attention is split. So time is of the essence because something else is always gonna happen.

• 25:04Theo Von?

  It's gonna happen.

• 25:04Speaker 01

  Something's coming and whether you have a leisurely amount of time to work on the case, like, cause then you're working overtime, then you're working a double to try to stay and work on this case because another one could come in tomorrow. So it is, this point to it, like the forty eight's are important, but I think more so because something else is coming. So it's gonna take the attention away and then you can only be in so many places at once, you know what I mean? You can't, you can't.

• 25:29Theo Von?

  Yeah, I, yeah, I never thought about that part of it. Well, how do you prioritize what cases are most important?

• 25:37Speaker 01

  I mean, obviously, like if someone gets shot or stabbed, like that's a violent crime and you want that person who it's more defendant based, like the kind of person that's gonna do that, you want them.

• 25:47Theo Von?

  Off the streets.

• 25:48Speaker 01

  Right.

• 25:48Theo Von?

  Right, understood.

• 25:49Speaker 01

  And if, you know, compared to, you know, identity fraud, well, that's not an emergency. That that's can wait, you know what I mean? So those kind of like, because we get a ton of fraud, that check fraud and all that shit, bank fraud is a nightmare, because it's a lot of the times it's not even taking place. We have our victims in our city, but suspects are all over the country or all over the world.

• 26:09Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 26:09Speaker 01

  So you can't prosecute them.

• 26:11Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 26:11Speaker 01

  So it's it's hard to chase down. So those are kind of, to the victim, it's not a lower priority. They're the one that had their money stolen or whatever.

• 26:19Theo Von?

  Of course.

• 26:19Speaker 01

  It's not the same as being shot or stabbed or.

• 26:22Theo Von?

  Or having a criminal that's out there.

• 26:23Speaker 01

  Yeah, violent armed robbery or something like that.

• 26:25Theo Von?

  We gotta find this guy now, because obviously they're in heat for crime.

• 26:28Speaker 01

  Yes, exactly.

• 26:29Theo Von?

  Wow. So are there days when you kind of get to the end of your shift almost and you look and you're like, oh, my God, there's still that one missing person I didn't reach out about? Or there's still this one thing?

• 26:38Speaker 01

  Yeah, there's always a pile.

• 26:38Theo Von?

  And now I have to go do that?

• 26:40Speaker 01

  Yeah. You very rarely get to go home at the end of your of your shift. You're always staying.

• 26:47Theo Von?

  And how, what's what's that effect like on on your home life? Like, were you able to have kind of a home life? Like, what was that like for you?

• 26:53Speaker 01

  Yeah, I mean, it's it makes it trickier for sure. You need help at home. It definitely makes it more difficult.

• 26:58Theo Von?

  And were you able to have a family stuff? Do you have children?

• 27:00Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 27:01Theo Von?

  Nice. Oh, your daughter's here.

• 27:02Speaker 01

  My daughter's here.

• 27:03Theo Von?

  Oh, nice, I forgot. Yeah, I didn't forget, but I think I just didn't know if she wanted to say it or not, maybe too, so. Yeah, what so, yeah, how do you how do you manage that? Was that?

• 27:13Speaker 01

  It's tricky. It was difficult.

• 27:14Theo Von?

  It was.

• 27:14Speaker 01

  I'm not gonna lie, it was it was hard, yeah. Because you're expected to come home, I get you to help them with some project or you've got to make supper and you have to call and be like, I'm not, I'm not gonna make it. Someone got stabbed or I gotta stay late. A lot of times you know you're gonna be like, okay. Those days, I know I can stay late because I have coverage with the kids or whatever.

• 27:32Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 27:33Speaker 01

  Um, but it's, it's, it's not easy.

• 27:35Theo Von?

  But at least you had a good excuse.

• 27:37Speaker 01

  Yeah, I mean, I wasn't out, you know, getting my nails done or getting shitfaced, but.

• 27:42Theo Von?

  Yeah, I'm getting my nails done or I'm getting, yeah.

• 27:44Speaker 01

  I'm working.

• 27:45Theo Von?

  Yeah. At least it wasn't like, yeah, I'm drinking or something, or Upliss is on third base. I can't, you know, I'm not gonna be home on time. Yeah.

• 27:53Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 27:54Theo Von?

  Do you start to see where family life suffers? Do you see it like, you know, cause that's also a common theme in a lot of like, uh, police serial programming and films and stuff where the detective is working late and then there's the family thing starts to suffer, you know?

• 28:09Speaker 01

  I mean, I'm sure it did, but like I said, you've, you've kind of figured it out. You make it work. You do what you can. Like I was a detective in a busy part of the city and that's why I transferred to the human trafficking unit because that was like a Monday through Friday job, not a rotating schedule. Cause I worked holidays. We worked every Christmas. You got a holiday off every six years. So every, but you'd get all the holidays off that year. So that year you're getting, you know, excuse me, you're getting Easter, excuse me, please, Thanksgiving, Christmas, New Year's. You'll get all the biggies off, but then it's six more years until you get another one.

• 28:41Theo Von?

  Wow.

• 28:42Speaker 01

  So, um, I went to human trafficking.

• 28:44Theo Von?

  Drink some water real quick. Feel my, you're good.

• 28:46Speaker 01

  Horrific.

• 28:47Theo Von?

  Sorry, miss. I, you are a detective, you are, I don't want to tell you what to do anything. Thank you for your service. That's what I'm saying. So it's six, so that, wow, I just, that's wild.

• 28:56Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 28:56Theo Von?

  So that time you get to spend with your family, it's really crucial.

• 28:59Speaker 01

  Yeah, especially holidays, you know, but if you're working different shifts, if you work in the midnight shift, you can kind of go home and start to sleep for a couple of hours and then, you know, meet everybody at Thanksgiving. So that's how Boston worked. Obviously different cities do different things. We just had six squads rotating days off, but some units, like the human trafficking unit is Monday through Friday. So it's a little more normal if you have young kids or a family and you want to be a regular person, as I call it, and have Saturday and Sunday off like everybody else. Those units are better for, for something like that.

• 29:27Theo Von?

  Got it. And I know you ended up in that unit and I want to talk to you about that in just a second. Take me through a couple more detective calls that were, uh, interesting to you or that really stood out.

• 29:37Speaker 01

  Um, I'd say I always, my joke was always gonna be, I was gonna write a book and the name of it was gonna be Dick on the Sidewalk and Other Stories From the Street. The last few, the last few years I was a detective, I got like three of the craziest cases of my life, the, after third, in year 31. Um.

• 29:57Speaker 01

  We had some guy cut off his own dick and threw it on the sidewalk.

• 30:01Theo Von?

  Oh, for what?

• 30:02Speaker 01

  Cause he was, he was crazy. He was mentally ill, but we don't know any of this. So the call came in, in the morning, I was on the way in, it was early in the morning. It was cold out. I remember that.

• 30:11Theo Von?

  Oh, yeah.

• 30:12Speaker 01

  I had the radio on and I hit the dispatcher, call a car and then start to laugh. And then she says disregard. We don't know what's happened. So I'm driving to the station and then a call comes in again, sending a different car, cause it was like the midnight shift ending, sending a different car, hey, can you go to this location? Someone said there's some male and a piece of male anatomy on the sidewalk. And we were all laughing. We thought it was, we just thought it was a dildo. We thought it was a joke. That's why the dispatcher was laughing.

• 30:37Theo Von?

  He just thought it was like a WNBA game or whatever.

• 30:38Speaker 01

  Exactly. It wasn't green. Um, call comes in like 10 minutes later and my detective that I was working with at the time, looked it up on the computer to see the text of the call. Like, what does this actually say? And then we saw that the caller was from a nearby health center. And it said, there's, you know, it appears to be a penis on the ground. There's blood everywhere. We're like, oh shit, that's, that's not fake. So the patrolman.

• 31:02Theo Von?

  Yeah, that's real.

• 31:03Speaker 01

  The patrolmen go up there and so that's our starting point. We don't know anything else. And literally there it is. I wasn't there yet. The patrolmen see it on the sidewalk and there's a blood trail. So they start following the blood trail and it went, it went a long way, several hundred yards.

• 31:17Theo Von?

  What?

• 31:18Speaker 01

  And it gets worse and worse. So it, that's how it starts. So we, that's our starting point. And the patrolmen follow the blood trail and then they're following it up the stairs of this three family houses, like three apartments in one house. And the blood gets bigger and bigger. They knock on the door. This guy opens the door, completely naked, a hole where his dick used to be. And he's just standing there, not talking. And they're like, hey buddy, you okay? Like, and he's just like, he doesn't speak. He just stares at them. So that they're new, they were newer guys. I felt so bad for them. That, that's a, that's a tough call. They weren't brand new, obviously, but that's a lot for young, young guys to see this, right?

• 31:53Theo Von?

  Oh yeah. Just see some cock down the street or whatever.

• 31:55Speaker 01

  They're like, hey, why don't you, why don't you come in and sit down? So they, and turns out it was like a group home for mentally ill people, but there was no staff members or anything. There's, so there's three people in the house. It is a bloodbath. There's blood everywhere in the bedroom, the floor, the sink was full of it.

• 32:09Theo Von?

  Oh.

• 32:10Speaker 01

  So they find that and they get on the radio and they're like, get us an ambulance, whatever. Cause we don't know, how does someone alive, right? So. He's alive. So I got called and me and another detective, my boss went down and it's on the sidewalk and they're taking photographs or whatever. And they call, once the ambulance find out he's alive, they just assumed somebody had bled out somewhere and was dead, or someone did it to somebody else. He's like, no, I did it. Like, oh shit. Okay.

• 32:39Theo Von?

  So he's being honest?

• 32:40Speaker 01

  Yeah, but he's just completely and utterly mentally, at some other point, he'd like caught off his own nipples. He's like to let the devil out. So the poor thing was very mentally ill. He was young, early twenties. So, once the EMTs find out this person's alive, now they want to try to collect it to see if they can reattach it to the hospital. So we had done our photos. I actually have a video of this whole thing. I pulled video from the street, nearby surveillance video. That's how I know kind of everything after the fact. They come down to reattach it and we had just done the photos. I didn't look directly at it. We, I can do.

• 33:13Theo Von?

  Oh, never stare into it. I know that.

• 33:15Speaker 01

  You do like a weird blurring. It's almost like when someone blurs out somebody's face and went, that's what your brain does. You're like, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm gonna see that.

• 33:22Theo Von?

  Yeah, I wanna see all of it.

• 33:23Speaker 01

  It was, it was big. It was nasty. So they tried to come down to take it off the sidewalk. He goes to pick it up.

• 33:29Theo Von?

  And what are they using, a spatula or whatever?

• 33:31Speaker 01

  No, I, he had gloves on. He was using his hand. And he had this weird like.

• 33:34Theo Von?

  That guy's a pervert.

• 33:35Speaker 01

  Clear cylinder. He was an EMT. He had this like cylinder thing he was gonna put it in.

• 33:39Theo Von?

  Like one of those bank, remember at the bank, you would put that check in the thing and send it back up through that?

• 33:42Speaker 01

  Literally like that. So he goes. He goes to pick it up and it's been so cold, he's tugging it and it was frozen to the sidewalk.

• 33:54Theo Von?

  No way. Like that guy from Christmas Story. Bring that up.

• 33:56Speaker 01

  Like his tongue? That's what happened to the poor guy.

• 34:00Theo Von?

  Bring that up real quick, cause people forget that that can happen. Oh, yeah. Oh, and let's get, just, just to give us a, a descriptive visual, what kind of wiener are we talking about? And if your wiener's, I don't know if it's still, what kind of, uh, what kind of wiener, sod, like, cause that's just a sidewalk wiener. What kind of wiener are we talking about?

• 34:21Speaker 01

  It's big.

• 34:22Theo Von?

  It was.

• 34:22Speaker 01

  It was big and it looked purple.

• 34:24Theo Von?

  Ooh.

• 34:25Speaker 01

  It was, yeah. It was, it was a black guy and it almost looked purple.

• 34:28Theo Von?

  Ooh.

• 34:28Speaker 01

  But he went to tug it and because it froze, he gave it a second tug. And then it like, he didn't let go of it. It like went in the air and this thing came out. I don't know if it was urethra. I don't know what the fuck it was. I. Compared later to like a balloon streamer came like flying out the end.

• 34:44Theo Von?

  Oh, that's some party confetti, baby.

• 34:45Speaker 01

  And I just turned and dry heaved into the street. I've never thrown up at the job. I've never done it. I dry heaved into the street. I was like, what the fuck? And some young patrolman who was there, and this is all in video, he's in his uniform. And he does this little kicky uncomfortable dance because he's like, oh my God, that was horrific.

• 35:01Theo Von?

  Oh, he couldn't handle it like that?

• 35:02Speaker 01

  No, exactly. And then later I pulled the video from the street. We're like, how did this get there? How did this guy get back to the house? He had cut it off several hours before in the house, walked down the street and he's completely naked. Nobody called police. This is the best part. There's people going to work. It's like three or four in the morning. Busy, busy street, driving down the street. He's completely naked. What? No one called 911. And he's walking down the street and I have video of it. He leans, he'd cut it, but it wasn't off altogether.

• 35:31Theo Von?

  Oh.

• 35:32Speaker 01

  So he leans down.

• 35:34Theo Von?

  Wow, bro, that's, whoa.

• 35:35Speaker 01

  Tugs it and then threw it on the sidewalk.

• 35:37Theo Von?

  No. Oh. So he, tell me that part again. He what? So he?

• 35:42Speaker 01

  So I'm watching this video.

• 35:43Theo Von?

  So he leans, tell me that part again.

• 35:44Speaker 01

  So I'm watching the video and try to find him, like what time did this happen? And you just see this form. It's dark and he's completely naked, walking down the street. And all of a sudden he leans over. I'm like, what's he doing? And he's in the direction, it's kind of from the side. Direction of his crotch, you see his arm move like a tug and then he just fucking threw it. And I, I remember when I pulled the video, I didn't know this had happened. I watched it and I pushed my chair back from the desk and screamed. I was like, what the fuck? The worst part is he came, so if you could believe something's worse, he came back about a half an hour later. He walked like a mile. They said that's what saved him. Why he didn't bleed to death. It was so cold. It coagulated the blood, so he didn't bleed to death.

• 36:23Speaker 01

  He came back and he's walking down the street and as he sees it, he walks over to it and gets down on all fours. And leaned over and kissed it.

• 36:34Theo Von?

  Nuh uh.

• 36:34Speaker 01

  And then got up and walked away. I thought he was gonna eat it like a dog bone, honest to God. I was like, what is happening? What is happening? He bent down, gave it a smooch and got up and walked home.

• 36:44Theo Von?

  Oh, God.

• 36:45Speaker 01

  It was fucking crazy.

• 36:46Theo Von?

  Oh, my God.

• 36:48Speaker 01

  The poor bastard.

• 36:49Theo Von?

  Oh, let me tell. Cause I gotta go through a couple of beats to that story and dear God, let me just say that out loud. So God knows that we're just alarmed by this. First of all, the fact that he cut it and it was just hanging there.

• 37:00Speaker 01

  He didn't do the job.

• 37:01Theo Von?

  Just like a piece of Memphis mistletoe just hanging there. That's so wild.

• 37:05Speaker 01

  Yeah, it was nuts.

• 37:07Theo Von?

  Like mistletoe at a Diddy party or something dude. And then he tugged it off. I can't even imagine. Because you've had like a little hangnail and you pull it off.

• 37:15Speaker 01

  Chills.

• 37:17Speaker 01

  And this is like, there's a lot of nerve endings down there.

• 37:19Theo Von?

  The ultimate hangnail. That's the most hang-

• 37:23Speaker 01

  That should be the name of my chapter, not dick on the sidewalk, the ultimate hangnail.

• 37:26Theo Von?

  That's the most hangiest nail.

• 37:28Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 37:29Theo Von?

  That there is. I, when you said that, it got so visceral like that for me and I'm sure for anybody listening.

• 37:34Speaker 01

  Most men get the same reaction when you tell them.

• 37:36Theo Von?

  And then I wonder what flew out of it. Pull that up on perplexity. Cause I'm thinking that's just a little-

• 37:41Speaker 01

  You know what it looked like in the photo and when I saw it come out, you know what like sausage casing looks like before? There's a sausage in it. It's almost like skinny, opaque kind of almost, um, I don't know how else to describe it. It's, it's like kind of gray and translucent. It was like a little smaller than my pinky and this thing just flew out. I just could not even, I-

• 38:02Theo Von?

  Yeah, that's just a little wiener funfetti, homie. Let's look at a, no, give me a gander at it, man. I'm trying to ga- I'm trying to get a gander. Yeah, just look at the, but let's look at the parts here. Cause it's, it's fascinating to know what is that.

• 38:13Speaker 01

  Yeah, I don't know what, I don't know what the fuck it was.

• 38:15Theo Von?

  That's a vagina, oh no, that's a wiener, sorry.

• 38:17Speaker 01

  Come on, man.

• 38:18Theo Von?

  These days you can't tell. The other day, my buddy showed me a picture of his naked wife. She has a wiener and I was like, alright, well, that's a surprise.

• 38:26Speaker 01

  Yeah, maybe it's an urethra. Yes, cause see the urethral opening goes down to the end. That's what it was.

• 38:30Theo Von?

  God, boy.

• 38:31Speaker 01

  Yeah, it was, it was dicey. It was a dicey. And I remember when we got the call and I remember standing over it, thinking like, where did I go wrong in my fucking life that it's 7:45 in the morning and I'm looking at someone's dick on the goddamn sidewalk?

• 38:46Theo Von?

  You know?

• 38:46Speaker 01

  I was like, where, what did I do? What did I do to deserve this?

• 38:49Theo Von?

  It's a question as old as time.

• 38:52Speaker 01

  You know?

• 38:52Theo Von?

  It really is.

• 38:53Speaker 01

  Poor bastard.

• 38:54Theo Von?

  I think a lot of women have asked themselves things like that overall, you know? And in hindsight, how does that even follow up? Do you guys keep that in evidence?

• 39:03Speaker 01

  Well, no, they tried to reattach it at the hospital. So they rushed him to the hospital with it and they did attach it, but it didn't take, it was like a month later, they had to like take it off. Yeah.

• 39:12Theo Von?

  Imagine that month. Oh my god.

• 39:15Speaker 01

  So like, it's funny because of the group home, we were trying to find out, what is this kid's story? What's his name? Because the other kid in the house was not with it at all, couldn't even, he was just sitting there playing video games.

• 39:23Theo Von?

  Of course.

• 39:23Speaker 01

  It was like a bloodbath. So we're like-

• 39:26Theo Von?

  It's hard to get the kids off the games.

• 39:27Speaker 01

  Right, so, but these guys, they're like 20s, so I called the supervisor, the group home, and I was trying to get some information. He's like, oh, him, we're trying to find him an in-house, an in, a placement in a hospital or a psych ward, because he's, you know, he's been exposing his peanuts in group classes or whatever, in group meetings. And I said, well, you're late, you're a little late, because he cut it off and threw it on the side with the guys. Like, what? Like, you could tell he shit himself, because that's his, how someone's supposed to be supervising.

• 39:55Theo Von?

  Yes, obviously, somebody's supposed to be there.

• 39:57Speaker 01

  Someone failed.

• 39:58Theo Von?

  Making sure at the very least, someone's not lopping off their own wiener.

• 40:01Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 40:02Theo Von?

  And I just can't, well, I can't even imagine the month wait to know if it's gonna take or not, you know?

• 40:06Speaker 01

  I don't think he cared.

• 40:08Theo Von?

  But still, just as I think-

• 40:10Speaker 01

  He was obviously crazy. I mean, I know that's not the technical-

• 40:13Theo Von?

  But you don't think he cared, why?

• 40:14Speaker 01

  I mean, he cut off to begin with. He said he was letting the devil out. Like, he's just extremely mentally ill, and I don't think he even-

• 40:21Theo Von?

  Kind of. I mean, I think there's a part of a lot of people that think the devil lives inside of their genetics.

• 40:24Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 40:25Theo Von?

  For some people.

• 40:25Speaker 01

  Yeah, and like I said, he cut his, he cut his nipples off, he like carved something in his forehead, like, this poor kid was, was really messed up.

• 40:33Theo Von?

  It's heartbreaking that people go through so much, and I, I just, but I can't imagine that month where you're waiting to see, right? Like, the bandage is on, it's almost-

• 40:41Speaker 01

  I can't imagine doing it. Like, how do you-

• 40:43Theo Von?

  Oh, yeah, I can't-

• 40:43Speaker 01

  Sit there, well, and saw it off, and he did it, and like-

• 40:47Theo Von?

  Did he use a saw knife? Let's ask-

• 40:48Speaker 01

  No, it was just a big, long kitchen knife. But you know, it was dull as dishwater, it was in some shitty group home.

• 40:53Theo Von?

  Was it?

• 40:53Speaker 01

  It's not some nice Henkel's knife, you know what I mean? I'm sure it was-

• 40:56Theo Von?

  Well, it's not like hands those scissors he was using or something?

• 40:58Speaker 01

  It was like some plastic handled shitty kitchen knife, it was like this long.

• 41:01Theo Von?

  You got to see the knife?

• 41:02Speaker 01

  Yeah, we were up in the apartment.

• 41:03Theo Von?

  Was it a basically knife you get, like, if just if you made your kids dinner, you give them a knife for your husband dinner?

• 41:07Speaker 01

  No, not a steak knife, like, a little bit longer, like, it would come in your knife block for, like, carving or whatever. I don't remember that.

• 41:14Theo Von?

  Hmm, God.

• 41:15Speaker 01

  I don't think it was serrated.

• 41:16Theo Von?

  I hope it was, otherwise.

• 41:18Speaker 01

  Hmm, serrated might be more jagged.

• 41:20Theo Von?

  But yeah, I think you would get it done pretty quicker. I don't know if we can, I mean, the more we talk about this.

• 41:24Speaker 01

  God only knows how long he was working at it, because the bed, the whole bedroom, so the kid I was working with, thank God, he had been in the crime scene unit. So he would go into scenes all the time, like, he, we, he put on Tyvek suit to go in because there was so much blood.

• 41:37Theo Von?

  Oh.

• 41:37Speaker 01

  To, you, we go stepping through it.

• 41:39Theo Von?

  Oh, the wiener holds a lot, baby. That's the Lord's spigot.

• 41:42Speaker 01

  The Lord of lots that day.

• 41:44Theo Von?

  God, boy, you, definitely. God, and who was the other kid, just some honky sitting there playing double dragon or something?

• 41:51Speaker 01

  Some, he's sitting there, it was like a grown man with his legs crossed, like, so you know that's weird, the crisscross applesauce.

• 41:56Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 41:57Speaker 01

  He's sitting there like trying to, we were talking like, hey, do you know what happened? He's just like trying to look past us, like, because we're in the way of his game.

• 42:04Theo Von?

  To play the game?

• 42:04Speaker 01

  All right, this guy ain't, this guy's not gonna help.

• 42:06Theo Von?

  What game was it, do you remember at all?

• 42:07Speaker 01

  I don't know. I was concentrating on other shit.

• 42:09Theo Von?

  Wow.

• 42:10Speaker 01

  Yeah, he's literally just trying to look around us.

• 42:12Theo Von?

  I bet it was one player, they didn't have a lot of two-player games at that time. Wow, oh my God, but the worst, imagine you're, you're, you're waiting, you're, they wrap your wiener, they, they do the repackaging, and I bet at that point, it's almost like the Masked Singer, you're just waiting, they take it off, and you're seeing like, okay, is this, what do we have here, you know?

• 42:30Speaker 01

  Yeah, what's the result?

• 42:32Theo Von?

  Yeah, do we have a Shaquille O'Neal here, or do we have a Muggsy Bogues here, you know? I think you're just waiting to see.

• 42:37Speaker 01

  What you're gonna end up with.

• 42:38Theo Von?

  Oh, that must have been horrible, the big reveal, you know, and they're like, move that bus. And then the bus takes off, and your wi, and your, and your cock doesn't work, dude, that's the frickin' worst. God, I hate that.

• 42:51Speaker 01

  That was a, that was a day.

• 42:52Theo Von?

  I hate that. Oh, that's harrowing.

• 42:57Speaker 01

  Yeah, that was one.

• 42:58Theo Von?

  That's harrowing, and it's cold, was it so cold outside, was it hard to stand outside, was it that cold?

• 43:04Speaker 01

  Uh, we weren't outside that long. Once we took the photos and when the EMT came down and collected it, uh, there wasn't else much to do at that scene. So then we went up to the house and it wasn't cold in there. We were outside for maybe an hour, forty five minutes. I don't even remember.

• 43:21Theo Von?

  Because the, the-

• 43:22Speaker 01

  It wasn't like twenty below.

• 43:23Theo Von?

  Right. But it was chilly, right?

• 43:24Speaker 01

  Yeah, it was cold.

• 43:25Theo Von?

  But the, the, the part for me, I think that'd be the wildest is say you are, you know, you're so cold, you run out there, you're looking at the cock and then it gets too cold, you gotta run back into your car and warm up.

• 43:34Speaker 01

  No, there was no running back in to get warm.

• 43:36Theo Von?

  And you're like, you're like texting, like, all right, let's meet out there again in thirty seconds. Like, you know what I'm saying? Like you're having a battle with the cold so much.

• 43:41Speaker 01

  No, not at that case.

• 43:42Theo Von?

  You're like, oh, yes, yes, dude.

• 43:43Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 43:44Theo Von?

  It's a black cock and you have to go sit back in your car. Like, that's the part that would get, you know, having to build up the, just to war, stay warm out there. God, that's insane, dude.

• 43:54Speaker 01

  Yeah, it was fucking crazy.

• 43:55Theo Von?

  And it is, and that's the kind of shit, it's like, you know, you're sitting there and then you're watching your kid blow out some birthday candles or something.

• 44:02Speaker 01

  You go from that to something else.

• 44:03Theo Von?

  Oh.

• 44:04Speaker 01

  That was a day.

• 44:05Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 44:06Speaker 01

  We went out for drinks after work that day.

• 44:07Theo Von?

  Oh, yeah, dude.

• 44:08Speaker 01

  We were like, we're going out tonight.

• 44:09Theo Von?

  Yeah, off a black and tan, huh? That's what I'm saying, dude. I love some Johnny walk out with a, a. Um, there was another story to pivot. I know that you had mentioned whenever, uh, our producer Nick had, had reached out to you and thank you so much for coming.

• 44:26Speaker 01

  Of course.

• 44:27Theo Von?

  I want to say thank you so much. You look lovely today, too. It's a really great outfit. Who chose that? You did?

• 44:31Speaker 01

  I did.

• 44:32Theo Von?

  Yeah, you did a great job.

• 44:33Speaker 01

  Thank you.

• 44:34Theo Von?

  Um, there was a, a story you talked about finding, uh, of someone had left a, a child?

• 44:40Speaker 01

  Someone, um, put a baby in a trash can and I preface this right away by saying the baby lived, the baby was fine.

• 44:47Theo Von?

  Okay.

• 44:48Speaker 01

  Um, but, uh, that call came in, uh, for patrolman. There was like a senior housing on our district and there was a gentleman who lived there, an elderly man, and he had someone who used to come and clean his house for him. And he called nine one one because he said someone just had a baby in his house and then left with it in a bag and it was crying. So the patrolman goes to the call and he goes up and talks to him. The apartment is pristine. There's no sign of a baby being born. He said she was in the bathroom. He's like, it's- No, nothing happened.

• 45:22Theo Von?

  Nobody had a baby in here.

• 45:23Speaker 01

  So he called, the officer called an ambulance for a psyche valve, saying it's this guy, the old man, something's wrong, or it's, he maybe has dementia, just wanted to check on and make sure he's okay. So as the ambulance is pulling up, again, I have this on video, that's how I remember the sequence, the ambulance pulls up and pulls in, there was like a horseshoe driveway, and they pull in the driveway, and just as they're doing that, a girl is walking down the street, maybe fifty, sixty feet away, maybe a little more from the apartment. And it's a very busy street in Dorchester, it's Dorchester Ave, and she's walking on the street, and there's a wrought iron trash can in the street, and she walks by and she hears something. She thought it was like someone put puppies or something in the trash, she hears something

• 46:08Speaker 01

  crying. She sees the ambulance, goes running over and waves them down, and says, I think there's a baby or something in the trash can.

• 46:15Theo Von?

  Wow.

• 46:16Speaker 01

  So the EMT comes walking down the street, you could tell he thinks she's full of shit by the way he's walking, there's no urgency.

• 46:22Theo Von?

  Everybody in this neighborhood's full of shit.

• 46:24Speaker 01

  There's no urgency to his gait, he's just like, okay, because they get, they inundated with calls, they are buried all day long, he's like, alright, we're here for this, but okay.

• 46:34Theo Von?

  You got a haunted trash can or whatever, it's typical shit.

• 46:36Speaker 01

  He goes walking over, and he goes in.

• 46:37Theo Von?

  The typical haunted trash can in Dorchester.

• 46:39Speaker 01

  He goes in, and you can see his reaction, he picks it out, and then, it's crazy activity, he puts it on the, you could see, this was all in the video, but you can't see exactly, you could see insane movement, all of a sudden, he's on the air, and at the same time, the officer was up in the house, said like, what's the ETA, my ambulance, he never showed up, and at the same time, the girl had called 911 and said, there's a baby crying in a trash can, so this like, is all kind of happening at once. So then we all go flying up there, when they're like, yeah, there's a baby, we don't have a mother, we don't know what's going on. The, the woman, we spoke, I spoke to the gentleman in the house, he said, it was this cleaning woman, he had a different name for her that wasn't her real name, because we're trying to track her down, like, is she bleeding out somewhere?

• 47:22Speaker 01

  Is she hurt, does she need help, it's like, what is the story?

• 47:25Theo Von?

  Yeah, she just had a child, maybe.

• 47:26Speaker 01

  So, he said she was in the bathroom for a couple hours, he thought she had stomach problems, and then she asked him, do you have a pair of scissors? And then she asked him for a bag. And then, cause I interviewed him, me and my partner, and he walks, he said she walked out of the bathroom and she had like a big tote bag with her, like her purse. And the baby was in the bag and he could hear her crying. He's like, what's that? Is that a baby crying? She's like, oh, this is nothing.

• 47:51Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 47:51Speaker 01

  And then walked out the door.

• 47:52Theo Von?

  Or whatever.

• 47:53Speaker 01

  So.

• 47:54Theo Von?

  That's crazy.

• 47:54Speaker 01

  Then on the video, you can see her walking down the street and there's people coming toward her and there's a gentleman passing her just as she gets to the trash can. She waits for him and as he goes past, she looks around and pulls it out and goes right, right in the trash can. So turns out she had gone in there, had the baby. She was in her 30s. She wasn't a kid. It's like she, and she wasn't not mentally ill. She just, but didn't plan on keeping the baby. She had the baby. How alone, I do not know. And then cleaned the bathroom. That's why it was so pristine.

• 48:24Theo Von?

  When people think of women, like that's the power. I mean, women, it's just like.

• 48:28Speaker 01

  How she did that, I do not know. She sat in the tub and had, had a baby with no help.

• 48:35Theo Von?

  Women are powerful, man. And then to clean up the bathroom.

• 48:39Speaker 01

  Cleaned it up.

• 48:40Theo Von?

  But she also is a cleaning lady. I can understand, you know.

• 48:42Speaker 01

  That's why it was so nice. Yeah. When the crime lab.

• 48:44Theo Von?

  But also she, I guess, has to hide her, I guess.

• 48:46Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 48:46Theo Von?

  Is, is, did you determine that she's mentally unwell?

• 48:49Speaker 01

  No, she was fine.

• 48:49Theo Von?

  It's so heartbreaking.

• 48:50Speaker 01

  She just didn't want the baby.

• 48:51Theo Von?

  You did not want the baby.

• 48:51Speaker 01

  But we don't know any of this at the time.

• 48:53Theo Von?

  Got it.

• 48:53Speaker 01

  So we, all we have is a phone number. She signed in on like the log at the senior housing and she put a phone number down. And one of the patrolmen working at the scene, they blocked off the street. They were like helicopters overhead. This was like news. It was on the news. And one of the officers who was blocking the street, the traffic, we all get the phone number and he starts looking through reports, cause he's sitting there blocking the street. He starts looking through reports, cause we don't have the right name. That guy gave us the wrong name, like the wrong age. He said she's a girl. She was in her 30s.

• 49:24Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 49:24Speaker 01

  So him, she was a girl, cause he's in his 80s.

• 49:26Theo Von?

  He's a pervert too. I'm not judging, I don't know him.

• 49:29Speaker 01

  He said she's a good looking girl, so maybe you're right. Um, the officer, the patrolman starts looking through reports and finds a phone number attached to a different name. So then we start looking for, we find the driver's license, like this again, all took like over an hour. Cause we're, there's a lot going on and headquarters is calling and everybody's like, this is huge, you know? So this kid finds the kid's real, woman's real name and phone number. And they start pinging the phone. So it turns out she, after she put the baby in the can, walked down the street and got on the trolley, took the tea back to, like to Mattapan, the train station, and then got on a train or a bus and went to her house in Milton. So we knew what her address was while she's in transit. We're following, they're following the ping and she's like moving through the city.

• 50:12Speaker 01

  And then my supervisor and a couple of detectives, at least one, met her at the house with an ambulance. So like this lady, we don't know what's going on with her. So they met her at the house and said like, hey, you gotta go to the hospital. Are you okay? Like what's going on? They went in the house, she had like rented a small in-law or something in the house. They said there were no baby items. It was full term baby. There was no crib. There was no diapers. There was nothing. So it was, she did not plan on keeping this baby. She had no intentions of doing that. Obviously she didn't have a single thing in the house, but they took her to the hospital. She was fine. They kept her in the hospital for a few days. But I mean, she, she literally tied the bag in a knot, like she tried to kill the baby.

• 50:50Theo Von?

  Oh.

• 50:51Speaker 01

  And that girl who walked him by was, saved it because it was cold that day. She saved that. She saved that baby.

• 50:58Theo Von?

  That's unbelievable.

• 50:59Speaker 01

  They might never have been found, like the city comes and dumps those trash cans. That baby's gone.

• 51:03Theo Von?

  The odds that that girl haven't even walked in by and hear it?

• 51:06Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 51:07Theo Von?

  And do they repartner that child and that mother?

• 51:11Speaker 01

  Well, I think it, she tried to kill it. So I don't know. The homicide unit came and took the case. Why? I don't know because,

• 51:19Speaker 01

  you know, the baby lived, but it's obviously a biggie. So they ended up taking it. It took four, like four years to go through court. It was during COVID. I remember people wearing masks when it was on the news.

• 51:30Speaker 01

  But it took like four years to wind its way through court. No jail time. I'm like, that's attempted murder. She tried to kill that baby. There's nothing wrong with her. She wasn't scared 16 year old. You know what I mean? She was just, her defense attorney tried to say that it was cultural. And I'm like, do people throw babies in trash cans in her culture? What the fuck?

• 51:48Theo Von?

  Was it a black or Asian Mexican?

• 51:49Speaker 01

  She was, she was Haitian. She was from Haiti.

• 51:52Theo Von?

  Hmm.

• 51:53Speaker 01

  Like, that's not cultural. Oh shit, there she is.

• 51:57Theo Von?

  Mother allegedly abandoned newborn and trash bin and Dorit has to charge with attempted murder.

• 52:01Speaker 01

  Yep, that's her. She didn't serve any time.

• 52:05Theo Von?

  No way.

• 52:06Speaker 01

  She got probation. Yeah, none of we weren't very happy with that.

• 52:10Theo Von?

  Well, yeah, because you just like the psychology of that person that's out in the world. How could they value life?

• 52:14Speaker 01

  Yeah, she doesn't, at least not that life.

• 52:17Theo Von?

  Yeah. And how could you probably value one of the most precious lives unless maybe there was some, I wonder if there was an extreme circumstance of how she had that child, but.

• 52:24Speaker 01

  We weren't told. We were in communication with the DA. Like, they never told us, other than it being cultural. We're like, what the fuck culture is that? That's not a culture anywhere.

• 52:32Theo Von?

  Yeah. Well, the media makes likes to make it easier.

• 52:36Speaker 01

  Yeah, but I think it took so long because court cases were just dragging on because, you know, nobody worked during COVID except us or whatever. It think it like everyone just gets tired of it and wants to go away. I don't know. Crazy.

• 52:50Theo Von?

  Yeah, I mean, I mean, stuff like that's harrowing, you know? I don't know how you can, I don't think there's a way to shed that skin if you're a police officer or a detective. Even though it may seem superficial, like in some ways you could just move on and finish your day, there's got to be a part of you inside of you that stores a lot of that uncomfort and like.

• 53:11Speaker 01

  Sure.

• 53:11Theo Von?

  And illness. It's gotta be.

• 53:13Speaker 01

  You'll kind of, I'd say you learn how to deal with it. I dealt with things better years on my job than I did when I was new. You know, stuff that used to upset me. You have to. It's your brain's safety mechanism to so you don't lose your goddamn mind, you know what I mean? You learn how to. That's why cops laugh at murder scenes. Like, it's, it's, it's tension release. We're not laughing at a murder scene. Like, people are trying to talk and say, okay, everything's normal here. You know what I mean?

• 53:37Theo Von?

  Yeah, when Brad White was in, he was saying.

• 53:37Speaker 01

  His brain's on the street and you're like, so, you know, what are you going to get for lunch later? Like, we have to do something to distract, distract your brain and you get better at it.

• 53:47Theo Von?

  Yeah, that's, uh, this, this officer that we had in, um, who came in was talking about, he worked in Los Angeles and he talked about this one story where he had. A mother had called her son was going to commit suicide. She was worried and.

• 54:00Theo Von?

  And he gets there and the mother comes out to greet him, tell him what's going on. My son's inside. While they're outside talking, the son kind of steps into the doorway behind a screen door, kind of, and takes his own life with a shotgun.

• 54:11Speaker 01

  Oh shit, shotgun's messy, man.

• 54:14Theo Von?

  So then they're, now he's standing out here with the mother. So he has to console the mother at the same time and now go approach this situation.

• 54:21Speaker 01

  Right. So you, you have to do many, like, you're like, oh shit, I just saw someone blow their head off with a shotgun. And then the mother's screaming and on the ground, I'm sure. But yet it's still like, not a crime scene.

• 54:32Theo Von?

  But it's an active situation.

• 54:33Speaker 01

  It's an active scene. You have to lock it down. And there's a lot, there's a lot. It's, they're chaotic, you know, and if you're, especially if you're alone, there's only one or two of you and there's a lot going on. They're very chaotic.

• 54:43Theo Von?

  Yeah, I can't even imagine how things go from seeming real and normal to absolutely surreal. Like in a moment, almost like you're in a movie or a video game. I remember he said he walked into the, he had to push, the door wouldn't open all the way because the body was right there.

• 54:57Speaker 01

  The body was too heavy. Yeah, you have to push him out of the way.

• 54:59Theo Von?

  So he's pushing this and then he steps inside and part of the brain matter had hit the ceiling and it fell down the back of his shirt.

• 55:06Speaker 01

  Oh, I think this was a Vegas guy. This was the Vegas sergeant. I think I saw that on your podcast.

• 55:10Theo Von?

  Well, I think Brad, he may have done, he may have been in Vegas for a bit. He may have been in LA, I believe. But, um, but he, but just.

• 55:15Speaker 01

  It's gross. Like I've stepped in that. Like, well, like, how do you, like you said, how do you?

• 55:19Theo Von?

  Really?

• 55:20Speaker 01

  There he is.

• 55:21Theo Von?

  Oh no, it wasn't him. That was Chris Curtis.

• 55:23Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 55:23Theo Von?

  Um, this other guy was Brad White, but just fascinating, fascinating story. But just here, like, I don't think, nobody else goes to work and has this horror movie that can happen once, once in a while.

• 55:34Speaker 01

  Please, CMTs, fire. That's kind of it. Yeah.

• 55:37Theo Von?

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• 56:20Theo Von?

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• 57:05Theo Von?

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• 57:50Theo Von?

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• 58:34Theo Von?

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• 59:19Theo Von?

  or email them at [email protected]. Thank you.

• 59:29Theo Von?

  Um, how much does the DA, you mentioned having a DA. What is that like? Do police work better under certain mayoral and district attorney?

• 59:38Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 59:39Theo Von?

  Leadership?

• 59:40Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 59:41Theo Von?

  They do? What's that whole relationship like? Like, break it down for me what that's like.

• 59:44Speaker 01

  Well, it, you know, obviously, things are very politically charged right now, more so than they've been in the past, I think, in my experience. So it depends on if your mayor is supportive or not. Historically, I mean, I had several mayors on in 31 years as a police officer and some were more supportive than others. And some DAs get elected that are just like, oh, we're not going to make vandalism is no longer a crime, larceny is no longer a crime, shoplifting is no longer a crime. Well, the people in the stores are still calling us when someone's stealing $10,000 worth of shit, but the DA is like, not prosecuting. So now that's why shit's locked up in all these stores. It's the DAs who are like, you know, whether it's the Soros DAs or whoever the fuck they are that got elected that are softer on crime or whatever, that's your job as a district attorney to prosecute.

• 1:00:29Speaker 01

  Crimes and those are state laws on the books. So if those laws are still on the books, then why aren't you prosecuting it? So that's why shit is locked up in CVS. Because people can indiscriminately steal all over the country. They're not getting prosecuted. We had one guy, he, it was him and his brother doing it. They were like two man wrecking team. Every CVS and Walmart, Walgreens. We added up just like one kid in one month. It was like $30,000 worth of shit he stole. Now, how is Target or CVS recouping that? They're not, that's gone. But the DA doesn't care. So if you have a, like, right now, there's, you know, there's a good DA in Boston, I think. And he's doing more to, to make, you know, working with the officers as a team. Like, we're on the same team here.

• 1:01:13Speaker 01

  We're just trying to prosecute criminals and help victims. And if, you know, the DA is not supportive of that, like, what about all those victims whose houses are getting broken into? Or their properties vandalized?

• 1:01:24Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:01:24Speaker 01

  And the DA is like, yeah, we're not going to prosecute that crime anymore. What about the people whose shit's getting stolen and ruined or whatever? Like, don't you care about them?

• 1:01:31Theo Von?

  Right. And don't you care about how they feel then about their city and about their country?

• 1:01:35Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:01:36Theo Von?

  And then you guys are the ones that have to deal with it on the street level.

• 1:01:39Speaker 01

  Oh, everyone hates us.

• 1:01:39Theo Von?

  They take it out on you, but, but still, if someone hates them, they take it out on the police. You know what I'm saying? It's like, and you guys kind of can't probably speak up on it sometimes because you're in a position where you're working under that regime.

• 1:01:51Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:01:52Theo Von?

  Um, yeah, I think about that, about the border too, sometimes with like, you know, people illegally coming across the border. And then people can have whatever thoughts they want about people coming over, right? I think everybody needs to be legally documented that's here, however they figure that out. But you know, but the people that matter most, that their, whose opinion matters most to me are the people who live, right? What about the guy right there?

• 1:02:13Speaker 01

  What about the border town?

• 1:02:14Theo Von?

  Who's trying to put his kids to sleep at night and they want to be able to feel safe that just, just because they bought a house somewhere.

• 1:02:21Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:02:21Theo Von?

  Um, that there's not people running through their neighborhoods. Whether those people have good intentions or bad, but just with the fear.

• 1:02:27Speaker 01

  It shouldn't happen.

• 1:02:28Theo Von?

  The fear that, that it puts in their families, you know?

• 1:02:30Speaker 01

  Yes, exactly. It's all quality of life stuff. It's all quality of life issues and they don't seem to get that because it doesn't bother them. If they're living in some, you know, multimillion dollar house somewhere or a nicer part of the city or state. It's not happening around them. Like you said, the people in the border towns, they don't have a choice.

• 1:02:46Theo Von?

  Yeah, especially and if you, if, what about the guy who's worked at CVS for 20 years and he loves it, right? And he loves seeing people come in and he loves like, that's something, he knows some of the older people, he's watched them get older and come in and get their medicine. He's watched one of them lose their spouse over the years and now they come in alone. But he's like a smile in their life once in a while when they come in. And now he has to be a deterrent to crime.

• 1:03:10Speaker 01

  Yeah, they come in with trash bags.

• 1:03:12Theo Von?

  Oh, it's unbelievable.

• 1:03:13Speaker 01

  And literally just clear the shop. They go and sell all their stolen shit at like the smaller bodegas and convenience stores. So they still, when they steal all the detergent and, you know, all that, they still, and baby formula's been locked up for years. They go and sell it someplace else.

• 1:03:27Theo Von?

  I mean, babies are so skinny.

• 1:03:28Speaker 01

  The bodegas is buying it off them. They know it's stolen shit, so they're a fault too.

• 1:03:31Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:03:32Speaker 01

  But like I said, the employee, what about him? Like, he doesn't want to do that when he goes to work.

• 1:03:36Theo Von?

  No, and then he has to...

• 1:03:37Speaker 01

  He's not a cop. He doesn't want to do that.

• 1:03:39Theo Von?

  He's not a cop.

• 1:03:39Speaker 01

  Yeah, he doesn't want to chase people.

• 1:03:41Theo Von?

  Yeah, that's the thing. They've made it so that almost every person has to feel like a cop and then also that every, that there's not a lot of support out there. Who, and that's a sick thing and our government does that from the top down and I believe that they, there is a reason they do that. They want to erode a sense of community and they want to erode a sense of normalcy. And they're doing it.

• 1:04:04Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:04:04Theo Von?

  You know? Who's the mayor that they have now over there that's been supportive, do you feel like, Kara?

• 1:04:08Speaker 01

  Uh, we haven't had a supportive mayor. That's the DA, Kevin Hayden. He's supportive. Our mayor, I don't...

• 1:04:13Theo Von?

  Okay, hey, boy out of Newton, huh? What's Newton like? Is it good over there?

• 1:04:17Speaker 01

  Uh, Newton's a very, very nice city outside. It's, it's a different city than Boston.

• 1:04:23Theo Von?

  Down in Newton over there, I definitely caught some...

• 1:04:26Speaker 01

  Newton's high end.

• 1:04:27Theo Von?

  Newton is?

• 1:04:28Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:04:28Theo Von?

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:04:29Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's big money to live in Newton.

• 1:04:31Theo Von?

  Fig Newton, they call it, huh?

• 1:04:32Speaker 01

  It's big money to live there.

• 1:04:34Theo Von?

  Oh, God, look at that.

• 1:04:37Theo Von?

  Bunch of people probably.

• 1:04:38Speaker 01

  Yeah, he's, he's from there. I think he lives in the city now. He's Suffolk County. He's not attached to the city. He's Suffolk County.

• 1:04:43Theo Von?

  Over there.

• 1:04:44Speaker 01

  But our prior, our prior DA was, it was atrocious.

• 1:04:47Theo Von?

  I bet every kid over there has a signed Tom Brady football, huh? That's that kind of place.

• 1:04:51Speaker 01

  Well, he, he lived in Chestnut Hill, which is part of Brookline and Newton. It's like all sandwiched right in that neighborhood there.

• 1:04:56Theo Von?

  TV 12, baby.

• 1:04:57Speaker 01

  He lived in Chestnut Hill.

• 1:04:57Theo Von?

  Yeah, I bet all those kids have that, dude.

• 1:05:01Theo Von?

  Yeah. How was the DA support been over there? So this is a district attorney now?

• 1:05:04Speaker 01

  Yeah, he's good.

• 1:05:05Theo Von?

  And was he, was he during your term?

• 1:05:08Speaker 01

  He was there when I retired, yeah.

• 1:05:10Theo Von?

  He was appointed by Charlie Baker, preceded by Rachel Rollins.

• 1:05:13Speaker 01

  Yeah, thumbs down on her.

• 1:05:15Theo Von?

  Oh, she was another?

• 1:05:16Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:05:16Theo Von?

  District attorney?

• 1:05:17Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:05:18Theo Von?

  And now, so she?

• 1:05:20Speaker 01

  She became a US Attorney.

• 1:05:21Theo Von?

  Okay.

• 1:05:22Speaker 01

  Under Biden, and then she was, um, I believe fired.

• 1:05:25Theo Von?

  Hmm.

• 1:05:26Speaker 01

  From US Attorney with some ethics violation or some such.

• 1:05:29Theo Von?

  Oh, Biden wouldn't hire anybody. He was asleep. He fucking dude.

• 1:05:33Speaker 01

  What?

• 1:05:34Theo Von?

  He was fucking, yeah, dude would hire Fred Flintstone to fucking sing him to bed at night.

• 1:05:38Speaker 01

  Thought she was a good, uh, fit.

• 1:05:40Theo Von?

  So she?

• 1:05:40Speaker 01

  Oh, I'm sorry. She resigned before she was, uh, she was canned.

• 1:05:43Theo Von?

  Rachel Rollins was not formally fired, but resigned from her position in May 2023 following multiple ethics investigations. Um, and yeah, and I don't know exactly what happened here, but what, what's it like from one DA to another? Like, how can a DA affect?

• 1:05:54Speaker 01

  Well, she's the one that decided we weren't going to prosecute larcenies, shoplifting, vandalism, the minor crimes. And she, he used to say those aren't, right, those aren't, I forget which, what verbiage was used. It was like they're not, like, not victimless crime, but they're trying to say that. No, they're not. Even if it's CVS or Target, a big corporation, they're still losing millions of dollars.

• 1:06:15Theo Von?

  It's totally victim.

• 1:06:15Speaker 01

  It was her. She, she, she was one of the ones that was not supportive.

• 1:06:20Theo Von?

  And do you think it's a DA, in that space, do you think she's making her own choices? Or do you think that's coming down from a higher, do you, allegedly, do you think it's coming down? Cause it just seems crazy to say, we're not going to prosecute crime.

• 1:06:30Speaker 01

  Yeah, how do you do that?

• 1:06:31Theo Von?

  It's fucking.

• 1:06:32Speaker 01

  It's a state law. How do you decide what you're?

• 1:06:35Theo Von?

  During her campaign, Rollins pledged to decriminalize certain offenses such as shoplifting, drug possession.

• 1:06:40Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:06:40Theo Von?

  Wanton. Oh, wanton or malicious destruction.

• 1:06:45Speaker 01

  Wanton and malicious, yeah.

• 1:06:45Theo Von?

  Or property, drug possession intent to distribute. What?

• 1:06:49Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's crazy. That's why Mass and Cass, you've heard of the part of Boston, I don't know if you've heard of the part of Boston called Mass and Cass. It is a disaster down there. There's, there's drug addicts everywhere. They're all over the streets, destroying property. There's needles all over the city, in South End and that area. It's kind of, it was, it was focused there. And now they've tried to kind of break it up the last few years because it was insane. And they, now they've pushed it out. Yeah, there was tent cities down there. Look at this shit.

• 1:07:15Theo Von?

  Yeah. And look, and some people say this is just a Bill's.

• 1:07:17Speaker 01

  They have safe shoot up zones there. They're letting them shoot up heroin to, in safe places.

• 1:07:23Theo Von?

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:07:23Speaker 01

  So now the needles are all over the South End and the poor people in the South End, they pay a lot of money to live there. There's the beautiful brownstones and now there's people shitting in their front yards. Throwing needles everywhere, breaking, say one guy was breaking into a house while people was under construction, the second floor. This was just a few weeks ago. And there's a guy's family there with his kids and they were, they had like an old key or something and they were breaking in and going to like shit in the floor on the second floor that was under construction. He went up and there's like a pile of human shit. In his house, he's like, what is going on? They put up cameras. The guy was going in and out every night to like sleep on the floor in this house under construction and then shit on the floor.

• 1:08:00Theo Von?

  It's like the emoji or whatever.

• 1:08:01Speaker 01

  Yeah, like what is wrong with you?

• 1:08:03Theo Von?

  What?

• 1:08:04Speaker 01

  So that, that, that part of the city, I feel bad for people who live down there. That's Atkinson Street.

• 1:08:09Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:08:09Speaker 01

  Near the jail. It's Atkinson Street. It's near the jail.

• 1:08:12Theo Von?

  Yeah. Well, and look, and a lot of people say this is just a Bill's tailgate or something over here. I'm not saying that. Some people say this is a Pinto tailgate. I'm not saying that. What we're saying is that this is a lot of drug use, uh, that's happening over there in, uh, in, in this town in Boston.

• 1:08:28Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:08:28Theo Von?

  But here's another thing though. They have this everywhere now.

• 1:08:32Speaker 01

  Oh, it's everywhere.

• 1:08:32Theo Von?

  Every city has this.

• 1:08:33Speaker 01

  Every democratically run city, I think. I could be wrong.

• 1:08:37Theo Von?

  Well, we don't have one here. I know that. I hope not anyway. I don't know.

• 1:08:40Speaker 01

  Austin got ruined. Austin was a blast. And I, I took my daughter there several years. I'd been there 10 years ago. And I was like, this is the coolest place. Reminds me of here a little bit, like 6S, 6th Street, where all the bars used to be. And then I went back a few years later, because my daughter's way into music. I wanted to take her. And she was afraid to get out of the car, which there were homeless people sleeping in hammocks strung from street signs in the street. And it was just rampant. Before they, like, if you were homeless, you got arrested there.

• 1:09:05Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:09:05Speaker 01

  Which isn't the best thing, but you've got to do something. They're like throwing bricks through all the windows that have been there a long time. Austin got ruined. I mean, Seattle's a shithole. Portland.

• 1:09:14Theo Von?

  Yeah. Portland is, um, I'll have to sneeze, but, um, Portland is a shithole, but also it's awesome. I will say this.

• 1:09:21Speaker 01

  Yeah, I was up there. I, when I do landscape photography as a hobby, or used to, and I try, went up to Oregon and, and, um, in Washington, and I love, it's the coolest place. Like, it's such a cool vibe, you know?

• 1:09:31Theo Von?

  But yeah, I do think that, that element that's out there, it's like, why are we, it's like.

• 1:09:36Speaker 01

  I don't know their end game. Like, what is the point of ruining all these cities?

• 1:09:39Theo Von?

  I think they wanted to just, they, they want us to deteriorate. They want us to have no sense of purpose, right? They want us to like not have any pride in the places where we are, because they've been so riddled. They get people addict, you know? Um, the opioid epidemic was put on America and was allowed to occur, right? They want this.

• 1:09:57Speaker 01

  It wasn't like that when I was young.

• 1:09:58Theo Von?

  No, they want this to happen. It is a, there is, it's no doubt to me that this is an organized agenda.

• 1:10:05Speaker 01

  Yeah, I don't get it.

• 1:10:06Theo Von?

  But I believe that people can fight back, and I believe that.

• 1:10:09Speaker 01

  I think it started a little bit.

• 1:10:10Theo Von?

  I think so, and I hope so. And also, it gives you a sense of purpose in the world. It's like, you're here to defeat evil, you know? And we are all can be a part of that. And I think it's something that, that makes us feel that way. Let's pivot a little. Um, you ended up in the, oh, quick question. Did you ever see Irish Mickey Ward? Did you ever run across him when you were running around over there? Did you ever hear about him or anything?

• 1:10:30Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah, he's a boxer.

• 1:10:31Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:10:32Speaker 01

  Yeah, I don't, I never ran across him.

• 1:10:33Theo Von?

  That's cool.

• 1:10:34Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:10:34Theo Von?

  Yeah, I was just watching, uh, The Fighter the other day. And, uh.

• 1:10:38Speaker 01

  That's about him, right?

• 1:10:38Theo Von?

  About him, yeah.

• 1:10:39Speaker 01

  Wasn't he in it? Didn't he play as the coach or some shit?

• 1:10:41Theo Von?

  Oh.

• 1:10:42Speaker 01

  Or something? No, he, I thought they gave him a part.

• 1:10:44Theo Von?

  He was in it at the end.

• 1:10:45Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:10:46Theo Von?

  Christian Bale, Mark Wahlberg.

• 1:10:49Speaker 01

  Skinny for it, yeah.

• 1:10:50Theo Von?

  Such a great movie. But, and all the sisters and stuff, they did such a great job in that film. I got to go to watch Laney Wilson last night.

• 1:10:58Speaker 01

  Oh, that's right, the concert. How was it?

• 1:11:00Theo Von?

  I should have got y'all tickets. I didn't even know we're here.

• 1:11:02Speaker 01

  Oh, no, goodness, that's okay.

• 1:11:04Theo Von?

  Uh, it was so great. It was so great. Jelly Roll was there, so I got to see him. Ella Langley, I got to meet her. Uh, she has a beautiful voice. Um, it was just great. It was like a special time.

• 1:11:18Speaker 01

  Nice.

• 1:11:18Theo Von?

  Yeah, and Laney's just a boss. She's just turned into like a... Some people start to step into whatever gift they were given in the world and some people kind of uh, meander around the outside of it, I think. And in no way is like a vic is better than the other, really. I think it's all by person. But she has just really embraced this role of just being like this onstage presence.

• 1:11:42Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:11:43Theo Von?

  It was really powerful to watch. She does a great job. Um, pivoting, anyway, that's, uh, you ended up in the human trafficking unit.

• 1:11:53Speaker 01

  Yeah, so I was-

• 1:11:53Theo Von?

  Is that the safe term or how does that work?

• 1:11:55Speaker 01

  So I was in a district detective at Dorchester and then I went for several years, like five years or so, to the human trafficking unit and then I went back to Dorchester. But yes, I had a five-year stint in the human trafficking unit as a detective.

• 1:12:07Theo Von?

  So what is your definition of human trafficking? Let's just get that clear. Because you hear so much, right? Like, a few years ago, you would hear this social kickball that was big. This was big four years ago and everybody notices it's gone now, right? Notice how the kickballs fly.

• 1:12:19Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:12:19Theo Von?

  It's like, oh, that's the big thing. Everybody's commenting on it online and now it's gone, right? It's really out of the zeitgeist. I know it's still, there's still things happening. But notice how that happens, right? And everybody's like, you'd see memes online. It's like, tonight while you sleep, one and a half million children will be, uh, taken on trains across America being human trafficked. And you're like, what in the shit, dude? So what did you really see? What were you expecting when you got into that space?

• 1:12:45Speaker 01

  So I didn't know, like everybody else, I didn't really know what that meant. I just, you know, I knew, um, someone asked me if I wanted to join the unit and, you know, I didn't know a lot about it. I thought it was just like the movies, like, you know, people being snatched off the street and forced into, um, to be prosecuted. In my experience, at least when I did it, that was not the case. Um, so- I guess human trafficking is like when someone's trafficked for the purpose of to sell sex, right, against their will through, you know, coercion or force or threats or whatever. But when I got there, a lot of the cases we had, it's funny, there were just several pimps that kind of ran the city that were involved. You always came back to the same like six or seven guys who always had all these different women working for them.

• 1:13:29Speaker 01

  And it was always girls, not always, I shouldn't say that, mostly it was girls from the neighborhood or just outside the city, like the suburbs or whatever, and something in their life like was fucked up. Whether it was, you know, a parent situation where they had one parent or they'd been like sexually abused as kids themselves. Or there was like a DCF, which is Department of Children and Families, like there were foster kids. It was always kind of something missing. It could just be they weren't getting attention at home or they weren't happy. And the pimps, a lot of them could be very charming. And they would meet these girls, they'd just meet them in the street, go to the train station, they hang at the T in Boston. Or I had one girl, it was a guy I started talking to when she's walking down the street. And like, oh, you're pretty, want to be in a music video?

• 1:14:12Speaker 01

  And she's like, she's like a teenage girl, yeah, that'd be cool. And she went, like, they shot the video. And then like say, like, we have to finish the video. And then they like make her go to another state. And like, like, oh, we're gonna take pictures of you and put you online and you're gonna, you know, have sex with these guys for money. They don't get any of the money. The pimps get all the money. So that was a situation where it was kind of, she was not a lot, she was not willing, like, that was kind of a quick one, like over a week or two. But a lot of them, they groomed the girls for a long time. They, oh, you don't have any money? I'll give you some money. I'll take you to get your nails done, honey. I had one guy, I literally had text messages for like a month's worth and you could see him grooming her. She worked in a store. I think her dad, her mother was deceased and her dad now wanted to be a woman.

• 1:14:56Speaker 01

  And it was like fucking with her head. And he like changed his name to Susan or something. And then she met this guy working in a store and he was like, he's like, oh, you're working today, honey? I'll bring you a tuna sandwich and I don't want you hungry. And it was, you could see it was like, you know, this progression of a relationship. And like a month later, she was like, oh, that's my boyfriend. A lot of them think this pimp's their boyfriend. And like a month later, you could see the messages. He's like, all right, we have seven guys coming in. And, um, you know, you're gonna do all seven of them at a party. There's like a bachelor party or some shit. And then she's like, can I keep, you know, a hundred bucks for the piggy bank? And he's like, no, it's all mine. It was like a thousand dollars. So it's like, they see something missing in their lives and they just manipulate them or they're like, they're a little messed up to begin with.

• 1:15:39Speaker 01

  They're like, they're in a bad situation. They don't know how to get out of it. They think these guys are boyfriend. You'll do this if you love me, kind of shit.

• 1:15:46Theo Von?

  So that was a lot of the sex trafficking you saw, huh?

• 1:15:48Speaker 01

  Yeah, that's what, that was in my experience, yes. There wasn't a lot of people being snatched off the street. Like, no one's being shipped in in a shipping container from Russia and all these girls getting, you know, the nail salon, the, the, the spas are a little bit different. The Asian women, they were moving them around.

• 1:16:04Theo Von?

  Yeah, that's more like Jackie, Jackie, yeah.

• 1:16:07Speaker 01

  But those were tough because the second we try to like, go in and

• 1:16:11Theo Von?

  They move.

• 1:16:12Speaker 01

  They're gone. They're gone to New York, New Jersey. It's different women. They're gone. They don't know their names. There's like, how many different dialects of

• 1:16:19Theo Von?

  Can't pronounce the name.

• 1:16:19Speaker 01

  Chinese and you're trying to get our Chinese officers, hey, can you translate this? And they're like, it's a different dialect. Like, it was a disaster. So. Those were, those were tough.

• 1:16:28Theo Von?

  No. You're like, we're looking for

• 1:16:31Speaker 01

  So we did those.

• 1:16:32Theo Von?

  Yeah, that's crazy. That kind of shit's wild. And I don't like those kind of places. I'll say that. I walk into one of those salons or whatever. I say, if anybody jerks me off, I'm jerking them off. That's what I tell them. No homo. I'm just saying. But I'm, you know what I'm saying? I put the pressure on everybody in the building.

• 1:16:47Speaker 01

  Just so everyone knows what you're going into.

• 1:16:48Theo Von?

  Don't even jerk me off. If somebody tries to even sneak up on me and jerk me off.

• 1:16:52Speaker 01

  Some of these girls would sleep in there. They would sleep on the bed at night when it closed.

• 1:16:56Theo Von?

  Wake up and jerk you off. That's the problem.

• 1:16:58Speaker 01

  But one of them had, we went in one of those sink, there were baby turtles in the sink filled with water swimming around. We're like, what the?

• 1:17:03Theo Von?

  They liked the animalia in there. They love aqua animals, a lot of aquarium.

• 1:17:07Speaker 01

  Soup out of, I don't know what the hell they were doing. I don't know what they were doing with those things. We're like, what the fuck? I don't know, you know, and we also did part of human trafficking and we did John, what we call John stings. We target the sex buyer rather than that's kind of a, it was a European model that they found to be more effective rather than, you know, cops used to arrest the prostitute. Well, what about the guy paying for it?

• 1:17:28Theo Von?

  Of course, yeah.

• 1:17:29Speaker 01

  So then you target that angle of it. Like, we're gonna tell you, if you don't have buyers, then no one's gonna be selling it. They tried to do it kind of backwards that way. So we would do what we call John stings and we'd put ads online, Backpage doesn't exist anymore, but we'd put them on that. It was Craigslist first and then it was Backpage. I don't know how they're doing it now, whether it's on Insta or, you know, TikTok. I don't know where the hell they're doing it now. I've been out of the unit for about six years now.

• 1:17:54Theo Von?

  You'd have parties and people would find people on Backpage and invite them over, you know, and like, they would hire strippers and stuff like that to come and dance or hang out. So it was definitely a place where people were kind of eliciting illegal activities.

• 1:18:06Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah, that was there. When you put an ad in, you could pay extra to bump it at the top. So it was so prevalent when we were doing it. Like, we'd put an ad in the morning. Say I put my ad on. We, like, three or four of us in the office would do fake ads. And you'd have to do, like, real photos, because the guys who were doing it all the time, like, we'll do reverse Google image search to find out, did this picture appear someplace else? So they know if it's a fake photo, because then maybe you're a cop or you're not gonna look like who you're pretending you look like. So we'd all put our ads up. And then, you know, you put on eight, at eight thirty, your phone's ringing. It's crazy. Eight thirty in the morning, they're already starting to call. And we'd set up our dates for the day, like, we'd have a hotel room. And we'd be waiting in the hotel room. And we'd have dates set up every half an hour to show up.

• 1:18:46Theo Von?

  And were y'all hiding under the bed?

• 1:18:47Speaker 01

  No, no, it's hiding under the bed. I would have to open the door and, and there'd be like guys, like, in the bathroom, officers in the bathroom, behind the wall. So I, my trick was, I was at, like, forty-five, forty-six when I was doing it, and my ad, I'm supposed to be thirty-four. I didn't fucking look thirty-four, but I'd open the door, I'd have, like, my hair.

• 1:19:03Theo Von?

  You would be the girl?

• 1:19:04Speaker 01

  Oh, I was the prostitute, yeah.

• 1:19:05Theo Von?

  What?

• 1:19:06Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:19:06Theo Von?

  What? Were y'all?

• 1:19:07Speaker 01

  So I'd have to talk to them on the phone.

• 1:19:08Theo Von?

  Were we all understaffed or something? They just shouldn't have you, also the detective?

• 1:19:12Speaker 01

  Well, no, you have to have, you're the one, you're the one establishing probable cause. So it, if someone else is doing it, and then you have to, like, go testify in court, well, you're not the one that had the interaction with them. So what we do, we put our ad on the line, online. You'd put your photos and some stupid saying, like, you know, what you're offering and how much it costs. And of course, it's acronyms for everything. That's what I did. Know anything about this before I start, about GFE, which is Girlfriend Experience, which means they'll kiss you. Um, full service means like sex and a blowjob. And then there's like Russian and Greek and there's all these stupid acronyms for everything else. And they, they thought they were being clever by saying, oh, I want GFE. So they're not asking for sex.

• 1:19:52Theo Von?

  Oh, I see.

• 1:19:53Speaker 01

  So by them saying, I want GFE, or I want Russian, or I want this, they think they're being clever. Except you can say like, well, based on my training experience, I know Russian means titty job. Like, or whatever. And then so Utah, they call you on the phone.

• 1:20:06Theo Von?

  Titty job.

• 1:20:07Speaker 01

  Yeah, that's a Russian, by the way. I didn't know that.

• 1:20:09Theo Von?

  I'll take it. I mean, whatever they're getting, you know, I mean, it is, I'm sorry. Yeah, it's okay.

• 1:20:13Speaker 01

  So you'd, you'd basically talk to them on the phone. They call you and some of them are real nervous, obviously. You could tell the long timers, they've got right to business. And some of them want to flirt with you on the phone or whatever. Can you send pictures of your eyes or your feet? The, the foot fetish guys are out there big time. But, and then you're like, the more you do it, I'm like, I don't have time for this shit. Like, do you want to come, you were showing up or not? So you'd basically make the arrangement. So once they showed up, you already had probable cause. They always already agreed to pay you for sex before they ever showed up. So then by them showing up at the hotel, they're like basically completing the entire, um, the elements of the crime. They showed up, they already agreed to pay you for such and such, so then you can arrest them.

• 1:20:51Theo Von?

  Right when they get there, really?

• 1:20:52Speaker 01

  Yeah. But like depending where we do it, if we did it like nights or downtown parts of the high end hotels would let us use their rooms.

• 1:20:58Theo Von?

  Oh, yeah. High end, you do anything in there.

• 1:21:01Speaker 01

  Every time we did it, we got a doctor. Every fucking time. The Brigham Hospital, one of the best hospitals in the world allegedly, the Beth Israel. One guy showed up in scrubs with like Beth Israel Hospital on it.

• 1:21:13Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:21:14Speaker 01

  Like, what the fuck, you on lunch break? It was crazy. We got a doctor every time.

• 1:21:18Theo Von?

  Why you think?

• 1:21:19Speaker 01

  I don't know, too busy, too busy to get a girlfriend? I don't know. I don't know.

• 1:21:25Theo Von?

  Are there, yeah, I, I wonder what that is.

• 1:21:27Speaker 01

  I don't know. It was, we always got, and it's, and when we did it in like the not so nice parts of town, then we'd get like, you know, the cable guys and the, the plasterers and for some reason I always felt bad for them. They didn't have any money, but it's the same crime, so I shouldn't have felt bad for them. They were just, you know, but I did. The rich guys, because they've got very arrogant when you try to arrest them. They were all arrogant. We had a, one guy was a Northeastern University professor. And he was on the phone with me saying, I'm a professor. And he was trying to talk me down on my prices. I don't make a lot of money.

• 1:21:59Theo Von?

  Oh, yeah, that's what I would do. I would text him like, look, how about this? Seventy dollars. I have some ladies coming up for seventy dollars. I'm like, Jesus. And now I'm like, I was like, I would.

• 1:22:10Speaker 01

  He was bargaining with me. I don't make a lot of money. Meanwhile, I made more money than me.

• 1:22:14Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:22:14Speaker 01

  But he, I always laugh. He wanted me, he's like, will you put me in yoga positions? That's what he wanted. These fucking freaks. I'm like, yeah, I got my Lulu's on. Come on over. Like you just, he wanted to be in yoga positions, me to put him in them and then aggressive kissing.

• 1:22:27Theo Von?

  And when you get some weird requests or anything like that?

• 1:22:29Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:22:30Theo Von?

  Like, what, anything pretty wild? Like, were they, any, like, people you'd enjoy them and their wife, like, join something like that?

• 1:22:35Speaker 01

  No, nothing. We never got those. We got a lot, almost everybody was married. One of them, we did. We met him in a bar. He said it was the end of the night. He was too nervous to come to hotel. He said he'd never done this before or whatever. So we agreed to meet him downstairs. The hotel had a bar downstairs and we, I was just sitting there. And now, again, I'm supposed to be thirty four and even ten years ago, I didn't look thirty four.

• 1:22:54Theo Von?

  I think you look great.

• 1:22:55Speaker 01

  Well, I fucking look thirty four, but thank you. But so I'm sitting at the bar waiting and the signal is for like me to touch my hair. And there's two cops down the end of the bar. And he comes in, I see him walk past. He comes in, and the bar is crowded. I see this guy walk in. I said, that's him. I knew it was him. You could tell like his face was, he was, he wasn't like, hey, I just got to a bar and he's all chilled. He was like intense and he walked right past me and went to the men's room. I looked at him like, that's him. He's got his fucking Burberry scarf on and his, you know, four hundred dollar jacket.

• 1:23:22Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:23:23Speaker 01

  And he came over and approached me and he tapped.

• 1:23:24Theo Von?

  A librarian's son over there.

• 1:23:26Speaker 01

  He tapped me and it's, you know, said all my name or whatever. And then when they came up to arrest him, he fainted. We had so many guys faint or like clacks on the bed. He's, he went, his face, he was white as a ghost and he just went down. So the officers like drag him out to the vestibule of the bar. We're like, we gotta call, Scott, an ambulance. But he's snapped too and he's crying and shit and he's like, oh, he's like thirty years old. And like, dude, and he's like, oh, I'm so anxious all the time. I'm trying to get my wife pregnant. I was like, you think you're gonna get her pregnant by fucking a prostitute? Like, what is wrong with you?

• 1:23:57Theo Von?

  I mean, it's worth a shot. You know what I'm saying? I'm not saying that, but I'm just saying.

• 1:24:01Speaker 01

  You go fuck a stranger and they, none of them, nobody wants to use a condom. That was bareback. That was another code.

• 1:24:06Theo Von?

  They were doing barebacks, huh?

• 1:24:08Speaker 01

  Yeah, that was a code. BBBJ's bareback, bareback clothes. So they, they didn't want to, oh, there you go.

• 1:24:14Theo Von?

  Here you go, bareback sex without condom.

• 1:24:16Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:24:17Theo Von?

  BB.

• 1:24:17Speaker 01

  And they'll, they'll ask you how much extra, like, how much will you charge me for a bareback? So none of them wanted to use a condom. So they're all going home to their families after fucking some rando who's got to having sex with five people that day.

• 1:24:28Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:24:29Speaker 01

  Like, how many diseases?

• 1:24:29Theo Von?

  Not to mention, in what township is it in?

• 1:24:31Speaker 01

  This is Boston.

• 1:24:32Theo Von?

  Yeah, oh yeah.

• 1:24:33Speaker 01

  So this guy's bringing the, oh, I'm trying to get my wife pregnant. What are you bringing home?

• 1:24:38Speaker 01

  Yeah. Bottom bitch. That's the pimp's main, main girl. She's the one who runs it for him.

• 1:24:43Theo Von?

  Really?

• 1:24:43Speaker 01

  I see that in the terminology, yeah.

• 1:24:45Theo Von?

  Let's see some more, uh, terms here. The in-call, the escort.

• 1:24:48Speaker 01

  That's only B, see? They go on forever.

• 1:24:51Theo Von?

  Huh.

• 1:24:53Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:24:53Theo Von?

  And were, were people ever asked, so I'm trying to think of anything, were, were people ever asked for like golden showers, urination type of things?

• 1:24:59Speaker 01

  I never had. I never got asked for those. One thing they asked you for, the guy's like, will you do a handy? And I was like, is that a quick handjob? Like, I had no idea what the fuck it was. And my partner at the time is like Googling on the Urban Dictionary, like, what's that? It was some crazy thing about choking and she's on top and then you flip and he's on. I was like, how the fuck do they come up with these names? Like, what does that even mean?

• 1:25:20Theo Von?

  That's all that Cirque du Soleil shit people are doing now.

• 1:25:22Speaker 01

  It's crazy. Like, how is that a handy? Because I was like, is that a, like, what is that?

• 1:25:25Theo Von?

  That's all that welterweight stuff, I think. I don't know what it is. What about, was there a lot of stuff like, people want you to touch their, the hole in their butt or anything like that? Like, any weird stuff like that?

• 1:25:33Speaker 01

  No, they never got that specific on the phone. They, but they would ask for anal. That was Greek. They were like, will you do, one of them, their clever way, they're like, ooh, do you speak any languages?

• 1:25:40Theo Von?

  Oh.

• 1:25:41Speaker 01

  So then I'm supposed to say, yeah, I speak Greek and Russian. That's what I mean. They think they're clever. They have all these weird online forums where they talk about the prostitutes. They rate them. I forget what the page they used to rate them on. So that's why we had to change up our photos and use real stuff. Because these guys all talk to each other. The long, the guys that do it all the time. Not the one timers.

• 1:26:00Theo Von?

  The lifers.

• 1:26:01Speaker 01

  Or, yes, or dabblers like yourself.

• 1:26:03Theo Von?

  Dabblers, yeah.

• 1:26:05Theo Von?

  In and out, in and out.

• 1:26:06Speaker 01

  Yeah, they talk to each other and rate the girls. It's crazy. It's a crazy life.

• 1:26:11Theo Von?

  And when would a night like that for you guys end? Like, was there a certain point where you guys?

• 1:26:14Speaker 01

  Yeah, we kind of call it. So like, the calls would start coming in the morning and we'd like, we'd have, you know, higher overtime to transport all, because they'd be showing up. Sometimes they show up at the same time, like, oh shit, they come into the same room. So we try to stagger the dates, um, dates. And we'd have them schedule the area hour, every half hour, whatever. And after like eight or 10 hours, the boss would call it. Um, we always did it Super Bowl weekend. It was, um, Cook County in, in Illinois did a big funding thing for it. They got money from the feds and they all kind of agreed to do it. So at certain times of year, Super Bowls were always when we did it. So we'd call it a night after like eight, after we arrested like 12, 14 people or whatever. She'd be like, alright, that's enough.

• 1:26:51Theo Von?

  So on Super Bowl weekend, you guys are, so, so on most, so on most Super Bowl weekends, you guys are doing that?

• 1:26:56Speaker 01

  We were when we were in the human trafficking, yeah. But it's, we got one guy, he was, he was, I was talking to him on the phone. I'm like, this guy is so fucking old. Now, I'm laughing, I was very shy about it when I first started doing it. I don't know who the, who the hell, I'm not a prostitute, I don't talk to these people. So I'd be all anxious, like hiding in the bathroom. So there's just eight cops in there. I don't want them listening to me like, yeah, you could stick in my ass for an extra 50. Like, I was embarrassed. And then I got more comfortable and they would just be laughing. Like, I'd just be like, yeah, this is what you want? Okay, and everybody's laughing.

• 1:27:24Theo Von?

  Yeah, come on my forearms or whatever for 30 bucks, yeah.

• 1:27:27Speaker 01

  Sounded so old. And he's like, you gotta, you know, yeah, yeah, I'm an older gentleman. And I remember saying, that's alright, I'll take it easy on you. And then he shows up, he's like, shorter than me. Turns out he's like multimillionaire philanthropist from Beacon Hill, on the boards of like Children's Hospital and all this crazy. He laughed, he burst out laughing when he got arrested. He was a tiny little guy with glasses. He laughed, everyone else shits himself or gets angry. Um, but he laughed, he's the only one, he didn't give a shit. He's like, yeah, I'll pay the fine, I don't, I don't care. Just get my phone back. We, we take all their phones. And I remember I was doing a detail at Fenway Park. And he was in contact, he's like, I paid my fine, can I get my phone back? Because we take their phones as evidence, we have to show their text messages or whatever. And if they plead, pay the fine or plead out, they get their property back because the case is, is, is done.

• 1:28:12Speaker 01

  But if they're fighting it, then we keep the evidence because we have to, you know, do a search warrant on the phone and all this stuff. He's like, yeah, I paid my fine. He literally, he showed up at the red, I'm like, I'm working a detail, like, you can come and get it. So I was in uniform that day, because normally I'm not in uniform. And he showed up and he's laughing in the car. I'm like, here's your phone. I'm like, what's the matter with you? Like, why don't you got, we got money. Go get a girlfriend. He's like, ah, it's not worth the trouble. I was like, all right, have a good day. He did not give a shit.

• 1:28:38Theo Von?

  Wow.

• 1:28:39Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:28:40Theo Von?

  Gosh, dude.

• 1:28:44Theo Von?

  Did you, did you ever just like accidentally just hook up with one of them? Like, did that ever happen?

• 1:28:49Speaker 01

  No, no, that didn't happen.

• 1:28:51Theo Von?

  Like, did one ever show up and you were like, oh, this guy's kind of cute. I wish it wasn't like this?

• 1:28:55Speaker 01

  No, I never thought I wish it wasn't like this. But yeah, some of them weren't, you know, that's what we say. Some of them are good looking. You're like, what's, go get it. What's wrong with you? Like, you're good looking. We used to say, like, you're a good looking dude. You can get a girlfriend. Some of them are like fucking grotesque. Like, you could see why they're paying for it. Like I said, the doctors don't have time, maybe. I don't know. They don't want the commitment, but some of them would be good looking dudes. Like, what's wrong with you?

• 1:29:16Theo Von?

  I think for some guys, they, they have a, their sexual experience, especially if it starts off with pornography, a lot of times is really skewed.

• 1:29:21Speaker 01

  Well, that's an issue now. They don't know what's real life, you know?

• 1:29:24Theo Von?

  Right, but they don't, but then it's, save like, you know, if it starts off with pornography, it's very skewed, right? Because this is a, an environment that's kind of like, um, you can get exactly what you want out of pornography. You can just put the terms in, you get what you want, and uh, that's your intimacy. So that's how you build it, right? So then, it almost makes, it doesn't, it's not right. Doesn't make anything right or anything like that. And some people, you know, like prostitution is one of the oldest businesses in the universe, right? It's always been there. Um, but some people, they, the next, the closest way they can get somebody is almost just trying to create the same thing, but in real life, right? So like, I need to create the same thing where it's like, I can kind of get what I would like.

• 1:30:04Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:30:05Theo Von?

  Um, these are my Google terms. These are the things that I like, and I'm going to pay for that.

• 1:30:09Speaker 01

  They don't want to waste time, maybe. I don't know.

• 1:30:10Theo Von?

  Oh, I think some people for sure, it's time. It's like, I don't want to have a big relationship. I just want to have some sex.

• 1:30:15Speaker 01

  I don't want to take someone out to dinner every, you know, twice a week and spend hundreds.

• 1:30:17Theo Von?

  And there's a lot of that that goes on, and I don't look down upon any of it. I just think it's, it's interesting that, you know, but yeah, the laws are the laws in those, and that's just what your experience was like with them.

• 1:30:26Speaker 01

  Yeah, so what I learned, like, I, you know, it's like, hey, if a girl wants to do it, but in reality, I think 99% of the time, they're not making a dime. So they're doing it all and the pimp's taking all. All the money. So that's why I was like, well, that sucks. Like we, I had like one girl who was like, no, this is how much I make. And she does what's called sissy play. And I was like, what's, guys who like want, not want to get hurt, but close to, not like sadomasochism or whatever. But um, she made a lot of money. She's like, I make, you know, $500 an hour or whatever.

• 1:30:55Theo Von?

  That's weirdo guys.

• 1:30:57Speaker 01

  Yeah, I mean, my partner be like, we need a new job when we retire. Like, what the hell?

• 1:31:01Theo Von?

  I know a dude like that.

• 1:31:01Speaker 01

  But she kept her own money, but literally out of everyone else I ever met, they didn't, they didn't keep it. They had to hand it over. So guys think, when we tried to do it as like an education thing, we tell the guys, when we rest them, like, we're not doing this to hurt, because they're always like, don't tell my wife. Like, everyone would panic.

• 1:31:16Theo Von?

  For sure.

• 1:31:17Speaker 01

  Say, look, we're just, it's kind of was supposedly at the time, like an education thing. We're trying to make you aware. These girls, you think if you're doing something and you're paying for the service, they're giving you the service and everyone leaves happy. But the girls weren't getting the money. They were getting the shit kicked out of them half the time.

• 1:31:30Theo Von?

  That's heartbreaking.

• 1:31:31Speaker 01

  So.

• 1:31:33Theo Von?

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:31:34Speaker 01

  Happy stuff. I hate to tell people I worked there because it was like a conversation killer. Like you'd see people's shoulders just droop. You're like, oh, you work in the human, they're like, oh, so, you know.

• 1:31:44Theo Von?

  Well, I'm sure.

• 1:31:44Speaker 01

  Nothing good there. Nothing good happened in there.

• 1:31:47Theo Von?

  Well, it's just interesting how perverse like sexuality can get and the things that cause it in our world, you know? It's another thing, why they even allow pornography to exist. Like, um, I don't know if we need it, like as readily available as it is. We had a woman come on named Lila McIlwate, and she was telling us that a lot of the pornography you see online, it's uh, non-consensual, right? And so a lot of times you could have somebody basically masturbating or watching and, and enjoying uh, a crime and they don't even know it.

• 1:32:16Speaker 01

  They don't know.

• 1:32:16Theo Von?

  So just the whole circle of it all is kind of depraved.

• 1:32:18Speaker 01

  Same thing.

• 1:32:19Theo Von?

  Um, but then I, I have friends that uh, do sex work and they work for themselves and, and they're masterful at it.

• 1:32:26Speaker 01

  Fair enough. If they're, if they're working for themselves and they want to do that and they're making the money. That is victimless.

• 1:32:32Theo Von?

  Yeah, and I think and people may have issues with people on both sides of the transaction probably have some issues.

• 1:32:38Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:32:38Theo Von?

  And may or may not, it could be different, but uh, but anyway. Yeah, that would just be, but yeah, some people are in a weird stuff. I had a buddy, he would hire a woman just to tickle him until he shit himself.

• 1:32:49Speaker 01

  Oh, fuck, this is some weird shit out there. There's a lot of fetishes, man. That's why I found about, I started putting my feet in the photos, cause I was like, I gotta get the foot fetish guy.

• 1:32:58Theo Von?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:32:58Speaker 01

  Cause there's, people want some, like the guy wanted me to put him in yoga positions. How does that do it for you?

• 1:33:03Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:33:04Speaker 01

  It's bizarre, like you said, the guy didn't want to tickle till he got, till he shit.

• 1:33:07Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:33:07Speaker 01

  That's a really specific wish.

• 1:33:09Theo Von?

  Oh, if you tickle.

• 1:33:10Speaker 01

  Like, how do you get there?

• 1:33:11Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:33:11Speaker 01

  How do you get there and go, like, were you tickled as a kid? And like, oh no, I'm gonna shit myself, and then as adult, that's what does it for you?

• 1:33:18Theo Von?

  Probably, I don't know where you watch a funny movie and then you have to pee, like, maybe, I don't know, I don't know how you start.

• 1:33:22Speaker 01

  I don't know how you get there.

• 1:33:23Theo Von?

  But yeah, if somebody tickled me to last shit, I would be upset.

• 1:33:26Speaker 01

  Right?

• 1:33:27Theo Von?

  I think overall.

• 1:33:28Speaker 01

  I think most would.

• 1:33:29Theo Von?

  Did you ever feel like you were, had to be like a protector for these women, or did a lot of them feel like they just, they were in their own space and that's what they wanted and it's not something you can really help with? Like, a lot of the women that were in sex work.

• 1:33:38Speaker 01

  It was a lot of the case, it was a lot of, um, I feel like you're just banging the head off the wall, going nowhere. You'd, you'd help somebody, get them in, you'd get them away from somebody, you'd get them into, it's like a safe home. Like, there was a, a woman who ran a nonprofit, a place to put these people, get them some clothes, like, a lot of them, they'd, they'd steal their shoes and their IDs and their phones or whatever, so they couldn't run away. Um, so you find them a place to stay and, you know, get them target gift cards they can go buy, like a toothbrush and some soap, and then like, in the middle of the night, they jump out the fucking window. So like, you do, you're like, getting called out of your house at 10 o'clock at night to go help somebody, and then they're like, oh, well, she's gone. And so many of them ended that way, or they just disappeared, they wouldn't testify against them, so the cases went nowhere. So it was a little frustrating.

• 1:34:17Theo Von?

  Yeah, I think it's, people, you can't help people till they are ready for some help.

• 1:34:20Speaker 01

  Exactly.

• 1:34:21Theo Von?

  Yeah, did, what about any, was there any gay, was there any gay pimps out there? Was that, that kinda thing?

• 1:34:26Speaker 01

  I don't know.

• 1:34:27Theo Von?

  Or did a guy ever lie and say, like, when you busted him, like, like, say you set him up with a female prostitute, and he, he just like, he was like, I'm, I'm gay, I'm just joking, you know? Happy Halloween, or whatever, you know?

• 1:34:37Speaker 01

  No, they never tried that. I mean, the jig's up as soon as they show up.

• 1:34:40Theo Von?

  God.

• 1:34:41Speaker 01

  Most of them knew it. They'd like, fall on the bed, and a couple of them cry, like, really?

• 1:34:47Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:34:49Speaker 01

  But no, none of them, no one ever tried to show the gay card and be like, it wasn't me. I'm just here for fun.

• 1:34:54Theo Von?

  Yeah, I'm just, I was just joking.

• 1:34:56Speaker 01

  Just fucking with you.

• 1:34:58Theo Von?

  Um, you, you had a, you had an investiga-, you had a three-year investigation that you worked on?

• 1:35:05Speaker 01

  Yeah, that was a human trafficking case that I did with, um, uh, someone from Homeland Security Investigations.

• 1:35:11Theo Von?

  Okay, and what was that? Like, take me through some of that story. You had a three-year investigation?

• 1:35:14Speaker 01

  That actually started with the one I showed you, the girl, the music video.

• 1:35:17Theo Von?

  Okay.

• 1:35:17Speaker 01

  That's how it started. And we, we got a call to Children's from Children's Hospital in Boston, um, saying this girl there said she was raped in Rhode Island. Um, she, I think she was 15 maybe, or 16. That's how that case started. And then we found out, uh, all she had was a nickname. Wasn't even a guy's real name. She had like hi- his Facebook page and a nickname.

• 1:35:39Theo Von?

  Like Smokey or something?

• 1:35:40Speaker 01

  Yeah. I don't want to say it.

• 1:35:42Theo Von?

  Okay, sorry, nevermind.

• 1:35:43Speaker 01

  No, the guy, yeah.

• 1:35:44Theo Von?

  I was just guessing if it was Smokey.

• 1:35:45Speaker 01

  No, it wasn't Smokey.

• 1:35:46Theo Von?

  Okay.

• 1:35:47Speaker 01

  Um, so she, all she has is a nickname and we kind of worked backwards from that. Like, one of the Homeland Security agents drove the girl. She's like, oh, this, this woman drove me to Rhode Island, but she wasn't involved, but she drove me. And this is where she lived. She lived in this neighborhood. That's where I had to meet her. So the Homeland Security guys started driving around and we saw the car in the neighborhood and got the license plate. So then I start looking on my end, because he doesn't have access to Boston police reports. I start looking for the license plate,

• 1:36:14Speaker 01

  um, and a car that matches her description. Because we don't know if it's exact. And I find a car, but it's a guy's name. But then I start looking for reports with someone for that last name. And then I found a woman with that last name and with her first name. She, because she told me the girl's, she knew the woman's first name. All we have is a first name and a red car. So then I find the last name in the car registration. I find old reports with this woman, with her first name and the same last name. And we're like, oh shit, that, then we pull up the, you know, we did a photo array to show the girl. And she's like, that's her. So then we start talking to her and we end up going, it was like a spider web. So these two guys, there were two guys who pimped her out in Rhode Island. Well, she did get raped by some guy.

• 1:36:53Speaker 01

  The guy in Rhode Island, I got like seven years for the rape or something. Um, because she did not go willingly. And... Those two guys worked for another pimp. And he had women, oh, I think, he was in his late twenties. And he had, um, I think like eleven baby mamas and like seventeen kids. Or fourteen kids, something crazy. But he had like twenty-seven, twenty-eight victims, girls that worked for him over a period of time. Including a bottom bitch, she's like the girl that works for him. Who recruits girls and is basically in charge of everything, collecting the money, whatever. She works herself too, usually, the bottom bitch. Um, but that took like three years because we were like in Maine, New York.

• 1:37:38Speaker 01

  These girls went to New Jersey, they went to Vegas, California. Uh, they would drive, they would drive to Vegas and work and then drive back. But he had all these women work for him and he was very, very violent. Like he would beat the shit out of the girls, he would pee on them.

• 1:37:50Theo Von?

  God.

• 1:37:51Speaker 01

  Stole their shoes, their licenses, their cell phones, so they couldn't call home. Like, like I said, some of these girls came from like messed up places. And it took like three years to get enough people to, because every time we found somebody, we found somebody else.

• 1:38:04Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:38:04Speaker 01

  Uh, so, uh, that took a long time.

• 1:38:06Theo Von?

  God.

• 1:38:07Speaker 01

  But that was, uh, that was, he was, he was, I think he got like thirty-three years in jail. Cause that went federal because of all the different states. That was a biggie.

• 1:38:15Theo Von?

  Well, thank you for that.

• 1:38:16Speaker 01

  You're welcome.

• 1:38:16Theo Von?

  Thank you for that work.

• 1:38:18Speaker 01

  Thanks. I liked going back to the district. I mean, I liked it at the time, the schedule worked, but the district is great people, like the patrolmen. Cause when you were in the human trafficking, there's no patrolmen, it's just detectives. So it's like four or five detectives and a supervisor. When you go back to the district, there's, you know, one hundred, two hundred people there. So it's a lot more fun.

• 1:38:34Theo Von?

  Yeah, you're part of life.

• 1:38:35Speaker 01

  We laugh all day and stuff like that, so I was happy.

• 1:38:38Theo Von?

  I realize that kind of stuff. I go, I go hang out with the football team around here sometimes and, uh, it's just like some of the best parts of my week. Because there's just people around.

• 1:38:46Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:38:47Theo Von?

  It's like otherwise my life is very much like kind of by myself, like not by myself, but it's a limited amount, you know?

• 1:38:52Speaker 01

  Yeah, it got, it got, um, it, it got old. And again, all the cases, most of them go nowhere, so that's frustrating and I just wanted to go. You know, back to the district where, and it's great people. They're the best people on earth. And you just had laugh all day, you know, like when it's real shitty, like the one with the guy, you know, two women stabbed and the dog was stabbed in the stomach or whatever, like those are, like we work with really good people.

• 1:39:14Theo Von?

  We're all there together.

• 1:39:15Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:39:15Theo Von?

  Yeah. And you, um, and you won detective of the year for that, right?

• 1:39:19Speaker 01

  Yeah, for the federal, for the three year, yeah.

• 1:39:21Theo Von?

  Let's go, Kara, congratulations.

• 1:39:24Speaker 01

  It's funny, you know, Mark Wahlberg was at the ceremony for the Boston Police Foundation gave him the award. The detectives union did too, but the Boston Police Foundation did, it's like a nonprofit. And at the time they were promoting the movie Patriots Day. And Peter Berg, the director, Mark Wahlberg were there for the award ceremony, gave a picture with them or whatever.

• 1:39:42Theo Von?

  You did?

• 1:39:43Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:39:44Theo Von?

  That's cool. I'm gonna have to, I will.

• 1:39:46Speaker 01

  Yeah, they were, they were promoting that.

• 1:39:47Theo Von?

  I'll text Mark and send him our picture. I don't know if he probably doesn't even know who I am, but I think I accidentally snuck his number off of a sheet one time.

• 1:39:54Speaker 01

  Mark Wahlberg?

• 1:39:55Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:39:56Speaker 01

  Yeah, cause he's from Dorchester where, where I was a detective.

• 1:39:58Theo Von?

  Oh, really?

• 1:39:59Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:39:59Theo Von?

  Oh, then I'll make sure to.

• 1:40:00Speaker 01

  That's where he and his brothers, the family's from.

• 1:40:02Theo Von?

  Not even in a bragging way, I'll just be like, hey, this is awesome.

• 1:40:06Theo Von?

  I just wanted to let you know, I met one of Dorchester's finest today, right here. But congratulations, that's so cool. Did you, did that make you feel a sense of accomplishment?

• 1:40:13Speaker 01

  Yeah, I mean, I worked hard. Again, it was with Homeland Security and a Homeland Security agent, she, she did a shit ton of work, more than me. She, she was great. We worked together on it. And like I said, it was a long, it was a long investigation. So I was very happy to be, have it resolved, you know?

• 1:40:27Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:40:28Speaker 01

  In the process of it, someone, the pimp who was in charge, who thought the first two pimps that got caught with the girl in Rhode Island, that I found through a nickname or whatever, they thought one of them was ratting to the feds. So he had someone shoot one of them in the head.

• 1:40:42Theo Von?

  No.

• 1:40:42Speaker 01

  He lived, but not good. It was like a piece of pie was missing from his head.

• 1:40:46Theo Von?

  Oh.

• 1:40:47Speaker 01

  And he just, he could sing, but he couldn't talk. He could no longer speak. That's when I found out, they said in the brain, like, oh, it's different parts of the brain. He could like sing the alphabet and happy birthday, but he couldn't speak. And he was not ratting to the feds. He was nobody. He was like away in New Jersey with some girl.

• 1:41:02Theo Von?

  Not at that point. You're like, who did it? And he's like, D E F G.

• 1:41:05Speaker 01

  Yeah, I got, I was in court on something else and one of the days it's like, did you, did you hear this guy got shot? And I was like, what's his name? I was like, oh shit, that's, we're looking for him. We have an arrest warrant for him. But that guy had him shot.

• 1:41:19Theo Von?

  Man, to get caught up in such depths of darkness.

• 1:41:21Speaker 01

  Yeah. Yeah, so that was, I was glad to be done with that one.

• 1:41:26Theo Von?

  Is most of your social life with, with police officers and cops and stuff? It is?

• 1:41:30Speaker 01

  It was, until I moved.

• 1:41:32Theo Von?

  Moved where?

• 1:41:33Speaker 01

  I moved out of Boston, I moved to South Carolina.

• 1:41:35Theo Von?

  You did?

• 1:41:36Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:41:36Theo Von?

  No way, what part do you live in?

• 1:41:37Speaker 01

  Yeah, I live just outside Charleston.

• 1:41:39Theo Von?

  Dude, I used to go to College of Charleston for one semester.

• 1:41:42Speaker 01

  Nice.

• 1:41:42Theo Von?

  Yeah, I used to live over on King Street above a buddy's apartment for a while.

• 1:41:45Speaker 01

  King Street's the shit.

• 1:41:46Theo Von?

  It was pretty neat, it was a little bit different, but it was fun. And, uh, it's beautiful over there.

• 1:41:51Speaker 01

  It's gorgeous.

• 1:41:52Theo Von?

  Are you enjoying it?

• 1:41:52Speaker 01

  And I don't want to be cold, so, and I'm not a Florida person.

• 1:41:55Theo Von?

  And your daughter lives over there?

• 1:41:56Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:41:56Theo Von?

  You guys got Folly Beach, that's right there?

• 1:41:58Speaker 01

  Um, yeah, I O P, Isle of Palm, Sullivan's Island, yeah, but they, she lives, we live north of, just north of Charleston, so. Um, yeah, we moved there, so right before I moved, um, I forget where we're going with this.

• 1:42:12Theo Von?

  What was I saying, is most of your social life with?

• 1:42:13Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, until I moved, yes. Um, and it's weird, everyone's like, oh, you gotta have friends that aren't cops, so I have, I have friends that I'm still friends with from high school, that I've been friends with for 40 years, so I have a core group of girls, a few girls that I've known since, um, high school. But it's weird, when you become a cop, like, it's hard to talk to regular people. It only because, I always said I felt like a party trick. If you're out in a large group and someone's like, oh, they're a cop, you got any stories? Did you ever shoot anybody?

• 1:42:40Theo Von?

  Yeah, shoot him.

• 1:42:41Speaker 01

  No, I didn't fucking shoot anybody, and if I did, it was a bad day, so, maybe I don't want to talk about it, so. I think that's why we all just end up hanging together, because we get it, whether it's, you know, cops or nurses or whatever. Um, they get it, because you don't want to feel, you don't, you don't want to be performing all the time, like, I don't want to talk about it, it sucks.

• 1:42:59Theo Von?

  Yeah, you ever wear cuffs?

• 1:43:00Speaker 01

  Some of it's funny.

• 1:43:01Theo Von?

  Just handcuffed sex jokes and stuff?

• 1:43:03Speaker 01

  Dick on the sidewalk sounds funny, but that was a suck morning, you know what I mean? More for that kid than me, but, and baby in a trash can and all this other shit, it's hard.

• 1:43:11Theo Von?

  First of all, a lot of these sound like, uh, like, um, a lot of these sound like baby shower party games too, I do want to say that. And that's not what we're doing here today, guys, it's just kind of some of the way things sound.

• 1:43:21Speaker 01

  Yes, so that's what, those are my, what I call my chapter, my titles of my chapters of the alleged book I'm gonna write.

• 1:43:27Theo Von?

  I love that.

• 1:43:27Speaker 01

  That's why I shortened it like. That but like you don't want to feel like you're on all the time. So that's why we hang together because we all get it and we have a weird sense of humor. We're different people. Like when we have Christmas, I run the, I used to run the Christmas parties for our district. And they'd be like, oh, we can section off a part of the bar. We're like, no, no, no, no, we have to be in our own space. Like, we are not fifth of public society, I used to say, because we say shit that is not funny. And if it's funny to us, but if like random, normal people who just go about their business, heard some of the shit that we say, they'd be horrified.

• 1:43:57Theo Von?

  Oh, I've had very recent experience with some of that and I feel you a hundred percent.

• 1:44:03Theo Von?

  Wow. Was it hard to move away then?

• 1:44:06Speaker 01

  No, I was ready.

• 1:44:07Theo Von?

  You were?

• 1:44:07Speaker 01

  Yeah, I was done and I wanted to be warm. My daughter was already down here, so.

• 1:44:10Theo Von?

  Oh, your daughter lives in Charleston?

• 1:44:11Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:44:12Theo Von?

  Oh, that's great.

• 1:44:12Speaker 01

  So I was, so I wanted to come down.

• 1:44:14Theo Von?

  Is that your only child?

• 1:44:14Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:44:15Theo Von?

  Oh, she's beautiful.

• 1:44:16Speaker 01

  Thank you.

• 1:44:17Theo Von?

  Um, and are you still married or no?

• 1:44:19Speaker 01

  No, it's worse. Years, yeah.

• 1:44:20Theo Von?

  And was that hard to, is it hard to keep them, do a lot of officers married? And is there a lot of dating on the force? What's it, what's that kind of life like for?

• 1:44:28Speaker 01

  It's a little.

• 1:44:29Theo Von?

  It seems very tough.

• 1:44:30Speaker 01

  We spend a lot of time together, so there's always a lot of relationships form in the police department. Like cops end up married to each other.

• 1:44:39Speaker 01

  I'm divorced. I've been divorced for years. Uh, it's funny, my ex-husband and his new, he's remarried wife, they moved down here too.

• 1:44:45Theo Von?

  Oh, nice.

• 1:44:45Speaker 01

  Yeah, so we all get along, so they, so they could be near my daughter and they have a child as well. So she has, she has a brother with him, but um, it's hard, it really, it, it seems easier now. For some reason, cops now, in my experience that I've seen, are more family oriented than they were when I was young. There was a lot more drinking going on then, like guys would stay late in the parking lot and like no one would go home. And now everyone's all about their family. So I think it's morphed, whether it's who they're choosing or who wants, no one wants the job, first of all, by the way. When I took the police exam, like 10,000 people took it. And now they can't even get like 800 people to take the, the test. No one want, I mean, it's terrible. People hate us.

• 1:45:24Theo Von?

  Of course, when you, when your district attorney is not supporting you, when your government isn't supporting you.

• 1:45:27Speaker 01

  All over the country, like, no, we're not the fire department. Everyone, America's heroes, it's a joke. We laugh that no one wants to see us coming. And it's just gotten worse and worse over time because we're not politically supported even nationally. Uh, weren't in the past. It's changed. Um, so it's hard to. Maintain relationships like unless you because we're with each other. We all work 12, 14, 16 hours a day.

• 1:45:50Theo Von?

  I can't even imagine.

• 1:45:51Speaker 01

  And so that's how you a lot of them end up together.

• 1:45:53Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:45:54Speaker 01

  I think. And then again, because they understand it. It's hard for a non-police person to understand what's going through our crazy heads because we're all crazy. And we wouldn't take, we would have taken the job, I think, if it didn't make you crazy.

• 1:46:05Theo Von?

  I can't even imagine. You have to drive in a car that has a siren on it. First of all, this comes time. Sometimes it's kind of aggravating. And then when you get there, you might have to shoot somebody or get shot.

• 1:46:16Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:46:16Theo Von?

  I'm out.

• 1:46:16Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's a lot.

• 1:46:18Theo Von?

  You know?

• 1:46:18Speaker 01

  You know, it can be. So it's a lot for a regular person to live with someone who's, who's dealing with that, I think.

• 1:46:23Theo Von?

  Yeah. Is it hard to keep the work at work for a lot of people or is it not? Is it?

• 1:46:26Speaker 01

  I it's changed. I mean, it varies by person. Some people can shut it off. They don't give a shit. Just go home and shut it off. And some people get really, you know, fucked up over it and drink too much or they're too, you know, mental like depression or whatever.

• 1:46:39Theo Von?

  Mm hmm.

• 1:46:40Speaker 01

  So.

• 1:46:40Theo Von?

  What did you think about Trump utilizing the National Guard to help out in some of these cities?

• 1:46:43Speaker 01

  I thought it was fucking great.

• 1:46:44Theo Von?

  I did too.

• 1:46:45Speaker 01

  I mean, if the mayor's not going to fix it, you can't have that much chaos in the streets. Do something.

• 1:46:50Theo Von?

  I agree.

• 1:46:51Speaker 01

  And the fact that they're fighting it like, oh, how dare you clean up my city. Are you insane?

• 1:46:56Theo Von?

  I would love if there's military in it. I mean, like, especially if it helps us get to a point where we don't need that, where there's a bit of there, you know, where it solves the problem.

• 1:47:04Speaker 01

  People want it. It's funny when everyone was hating on us a few years ago, bad after George Floyd and stuff. Everyone hate us. Videotaping you everywhere you go, cameras, every, every radio call you're at, the phone's out in your face. They're waiting for something to happen and they're cursing at you. Spit not like they spit on you when they talk and that's not, and you can't react to that. You can't be like, you know, you can't get into it with people. And so we're.

• 1:47:26Theo Von?

  What pieces of shit?

• 1:47:28Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:47:28Theo Von?

  Do that?

• 1:47:29Speaker 01

  Everyone. That's who does it. Everyone. Every piece of shit does it. But then you find out like the normal people in the neighborhoods, they want us there. They come out there like, thank you. Thank you for coming, but that's. Doesn't happen as often as you'd like.

• 1:47:42Theo Von?

  And it is interesting. It is like, you know, I think it is a nice reminder to find ways to stop by our police and fire departments and be supportive, you know? One thing that's kind of fun about fire departments, I'll say, is you can walk by and see the guys right there sometimes, right by the truck, you know what I'm saying? So you can go up and say, hey.

• 1:47:56Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:47:57Theo Von?

  You can go up and like.

• 1:47:58Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's not like walking into a police station. You're right.

• 1:48:00Theo Von?

  Yeah, there you're like, okay.

• 1:48:01Speaker 01

  Well, that's, it has to be secure because there's prisoners inside and there's firearms.

• 1:48:04Theo Von?

  That's true. It's different.

• 1:48:05Speaker 01

  Can't be as open and welcoming.

• 1:48:06Theo Von?

  Yeah, and a fire department is just a crock pot full of frickin', uh, ballpark Franks going on. So it's a different. Now, they'll guard those with their life, some of those guys.

• 1:48:14Speaker 01

  It's a different atmosphere. Yeah.

• 1:48:15Theo Von?

  Yeah. Um, and there's the one guy that's like afraid to slide down the pole. He's like, he just waits till everybody else goes and then he just takes the stairs real fast. But it's, none of that's any judgment. These guys are heroes. But that's one thing that's nice. Like, we were in New York the other day and they were even doing a call and we like, took my buddy's son up and he, he like will wear his little fire jacket around town. And he'll just like go get into the fire truck and shit. It's like, they come back and we're just like, this kid's in their truck, but.

• 1:48:40Speaker 01

  Oh, kids love fire trucks and shit. I mean, that's, you know, and cruisers. They like the noise, the noise and the lights.

• 1:48:46Theo Von?

  It's exciting.

• 1:48:46Speaker 01

  They think it's cool, you know?

• 1:48:48Theo Von?

  Um, um, oh, uh, look at this. Here we go. Sean Diddy Combs sentencing live updates. Comes gets 50 months in prison.

• 1:48:58Speaker 01

  That's actually not that much. Four years.

• 1:49:00Theo Von?

  For his conviction on two prostitution-related offenses. What were the offenses? Can you let me know?

• 1:49:05Speaker 01

  He must have been sex trafficking of a minor, maybe.

• 1:49:08Theo Von?

  Of the most, he got acquitted of the most serious charges faced, racketeering, conspiracy and sex trafficking. Found him guilty on two counts of transportation to engage in prostitution. You know, I personally thought that this whole thing was something they were trying to create during the election of kind of like, I don't know what, how they were trying to use it. But I thought it was, they were trying to.

• 1:49:27Speaker 01

  He did some crazy shit.

• 1:49:29Theo Von?

  Oh, for sure. I mean, but do you think he was just a freak that got really addicted to what he was doing and a pow, like a power hungry? From what I hear, he's a very power-controlling type of person.

• 1:49:40Speaker 01

  Yeah, I mean, I obviously don't know the gist of the cases, why they charged him with conspiracy and sex trafficking with the minors involved. So, I don't know why. Yeah. So we got what, just over four years? I don't know what he, uh, I mean, can't get them for sex parties. So there's obviously something there.

• 1:49:56Theo Von?

  That's a good point. And who knows what they kept back? Who knows what got like behind closed doors?

• 1:50:02Speaker 01

  Yeah, stuff gets suppressed, yeah.

• 1:50:03Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:50:03Speaker 01

  Victims don't want to testify. Was he the one with the girl who was kicking the shit out of in the hallway at the elevator? That was pretty bad to watch.

• 1:50:09Theo Von?

  Yeah, never mind. You know what? Fuck that. Give him fucking 10 more years. I am, I'm sorry, I, I, and you know what's messed up? I forgot about that.

• 1:50:19Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:50:19Theo Von?

  You know, there's so much evil shit out there sometimes.

• 1:50:22Speaker 01

  Well, it's nonstop. Every week there's something else. Every day something else comes out, so.

• 1:50:26Theo Von?

  But do you think, okay, so going back to that, so that statement, and I agree with this a lot. But if we go back to like working the beats on the indoor chest when you were starting, like,

• 1:50:38Theo Von?

  there's a better way to do it, right? There's a better way we can be.

• 1:50:41Speaker 01

  Yeah, people have to be human beings, but there's a lot of people that aren't, that are pieces of shit. For whatever reason, whether it's poverty, or their upbringing, or drugs, messes fucks up families to no end, so. I don't know. I don't know what the answer is. It's not what we're doing.

• 1:50:58Theo Von?

  Right. I wonder if it's what we are doing, or what is being done to us that's having more of an effect on us, or, or probably some, some.

• 1:51:06Speaker 01

  Well, yeah, when we can't control it, people are gonna be pieces of shit and bad, like, that's not our fault, that's not your fault. We didn't do anything. We're just going about our business, having a job, getting up in the morning, going to work, or whatever.

• 1:51:16Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:51:16Speaker 01

  The people that choose to, I'm just gonna fucking rob this person. Some people are just bad people.

• 1:51:20Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:51:21Speaker 01

  Some people end up that way because of the way they're raised, and some people are just fucking bad.

• 1:51:25Theo Von?

  They really are.

• 1:51:25Speaker 01

  Just the way they are.

• 1:51:26Theo Von?

  Yeah, and I think sometimes we do get caught in this space of like, oh, we have to recuperate everybody, and we gotta save everybody. Right.

• 1:51:33Speaker 01

  There's real victims out there.

• 1:51:35Theo Von?

  Right.

• 1:51:35Speaker 01

  It's not them. It's not those guys.

• 1:51:37Theo Von?

  That's a good point. Oh, when it came to the prostitute, the, the John, the pimps and everything like that, is there a certain like ethnicity, like, is it Asian, is it black, is it white, is it Mexican? Do you hear like a cer- is that a cer- is that whole universe of a certain world, like where a lot of these, because you always hear like Asian prostitutes? Like, was it a certain, or is it anybody?

• 1:51:55Speaker 01

  So the spas were Asian, the pimps were Asian, but the ones, in my experience, in all of my cases, um, whether they were male or female pimps, because we had a couple females, they were, um, they were black, they were African American.

• 1:52:08Theo Von?

  Really?

• 1:52:09Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:52:09Theo Von?

  Like female pimps too?

• 1:52:10Speaker 01

  They worked, yes. They ended, like, the bottom bitch, they end up kind of working on their own.

• 1:52:15Theo Von?

  The most common ethnicities of pimps in the United States, according to available arrest data and research, are predominantly black, African American, making up about two thirds of identified or arrested pimps. Wow, followed by a smaller proportion of Latino, white, multiracial, mixed people. They'll do, they'll pretty much do anything. And Asian individuals.

• 1:52:31Speaker 01

  Yeah, the spas were, um, the guys, people running those were Asian.

• 1:52:34Theo Von?

  That's kind of crazy. I wonder, well, maybe it has a lot to do with that music that's in that culture, too. Just the way that some of that music is so vulgar and like bitch pimp and that, you know?

• 1:52:44Speaker 01

  Yeah, stuff's glorified.

• 1:52:45Theo Von?

  Yeah, that's a good point. I think that, that culture has the most glorification of the music, of the performers. Now, a lot of the, uh, a lot of the producers and agents of that group are white. Um, so certainly just as much.

• 1:52:59Speaker 01

  Yeah, they're involved, too.

• 1:53:00Theo Von?

  Responsibility, yeah. Thank you so much, uh, for hanging out. I want to know, what do you like to do now? So are you retired now?

• 1:53:06Speaker 01

  I just retired three months ago.

• 1:53:07Theo Von?

  Congratulations.

• 1:53:08Speaker 01

  Thank you so much. Very happy. Put in, you're supposed to put in 32 years to get your full pension, but I gave up after 31.

• 1:53:15Theo Von?

  What?

• 1:53:16Speaker 01

  Yeah, 32 years.

• 1:53:17Theo Von?

  But you get your, you still get a, you still get a pension?

• 1:53:18Speaker 01

  No, I get my pension, it's just not, the most you're gonna get is 80% of your salary.

• 1:53:22Theo Von?

  Okay.

• 1:53:23Speaker 01

  After 32 years. And I stayed till 31 years and I get like 77% or something.

• 1:53:28Theo Von?

  That's fair.

• 1:53:29Speaker 01

  Yeah, I'm down south and I go to the beach, I paint, I do all the painting in my, um, as a hobby.

• 1:53:35Theo Von?

  You do?

• 1:53:36Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:53:37Theo Von?

  Would you do us a little bitty painting and we could put it in here?

• 1:53:38Speaker 01

  No, I'm fucking terrible, I'm just learning. I copy artists that I like, that's how I'm learning, it's like mixed colors and stuff like that. So I copy artists' paintings that I appreciate and I try to recreate them, just in the learning process. I'm terrible, I'm brand new.

• 1:53:51Theo Von?

  If you ever do want to do something even smaller, it can even be years from now, you want to, uh...

• 1:53:55Speaker 01

  I'll send you a little painting.

• 1:53:56Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:53:57Speaker 01

  My niece is an actual painter and I told her I was coming, she's like, "Bring, bring Theo a painting."

• 1:54:00Theo Von?

  Oh, that's cool. That's sweet of her. Well, I'm glad that I asked, that would be really nice to have, because then I can tell people who it's from.

• 1:54:05Speaker 01

  All right.

• 1:54:06Theo Von?

  Um... And thank you so much for your service.

• 1:54:10Speaker 01

  Thank you so much. Thank you for having me.

• 1:54:11Theo Von?

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:54:11Speaker 01

  Thank you for having normal people on and not just, you know, like you, it's nice to have somebody who gives a shit what we're doing instead of, you know.

• 1:54:19Theo Von?

  Yeah, well, I think I'm learning more that that's just so much more important to me sometimes, I think. I don't know. This whole thing has been interesting, like just talking to people and stuff like that. Cause I'm not really the best interviewer, but I do, I am curious about people.

• 1:54:32Speaker 01

  Well, that's what makes a good interview. You ask people questions, you know, you're a great interviewer. Come on.

• 1:54:36Theo Von?

  Well, that's, thank you.

• 1:54:38Speaker 01

  You're welcome. I loved the Amish kid interview. That was great.

• 1:54:40Theo Von?

  Oh, he was good, huh?

• 1:54:41Speaker 01

  He was great.

• 1:54:42Theo Von?

  He was so funny.

• 1:54:43Speaker 01

  He was very well spoken. He was just very direct. He seemed so natural at it. He really did.

• 1:54:47Theo Von?

  I know.

• 1:54:48Speaker 01

  I see your hat there. I like you. I like your remnant.

• 1:54:51Theo Von?

  That's really him. And Louis C.K. just gave me his new book. I give it to your daughter, but it's kind of for boys.

• 1:54:56Speaker 01

  It's a boy book. Is it a novel?

• 1:54:58Theo Von?

  It is. And he did a really great job writing.

• 1:55:00Speaker 01

  All right. He's funny. He's funny shit. I know he had trouble in the past, but he's a funny bastard.

• 1:55:06Theo Von?

  Yeah, he is. Yeah. And I'm so glad he had trouble in the past because that's how he and I got to know each other because we've all had trouble and fucking that and that. So it's good.

• 1:55:13Speaker 01

  That's great.

• 1:55:14Theo Von?

  Yeah. And in the spirit of service, we got a picture of our, this is our Jim Jeffries. He was a comedian that was on. That's his nephew.

• 1:55:21Speaker 01

  Oh, nice.

• 1:55:22Theo Von?

  Lieutenant Max Nugent. Yeah. Who was an officer in the Australian Army and he passed away in a helicopter crash. So he is our, he's our hero. So we're excited to have him.

• 1:55:33Speaker 01

  Nice to have him there.

• 1:55:34Theo Von?

  Yeah, it's nice. Yeah, he's cool. He's got a, he, he, he seems like a neat guy. So I'm sure we'll get to know, uh, channel some thoughts and feelings and energy from him over the years. But anyway, thank you both for your service. Uh, congratulations on your move.

• 1:55:47Speaker 01

  Thank you.

• 1:55:47Theo Von?

  And you look lovely and I wish you a beautiful, uh, second half of your life as it evolves.

• 1:55:51Speaker 01

  Thank you so much.

• 1:55:52Theo Von?

  And thank you for bringing your daughter. And, um, we got you guys set up for dinner and I know at 12:30 club. That'll be fun.

• 1:55:56Speaker 01

  That's lovely. Thank you so much.

• 1:55:57Theo Von?

  Yeah, I appreciate you. Thank you so much.

• 1:55:59Speaker 01

  Thank you.

• 1:56:00Theo Von?

  Yep.

• 1:56:00Speaker 01

  Lovely to meet you.

• 1:56:27Speaker 02

  Welcome to the 50th Hunger Games!

• 1:56:29Speaker 03

  Witness the beginning of the revolution.

• 1:56:32Speaker 04

  Hey Mitch, you've been trying to take down these games from the start.

• 1:56:34Speaker 03

  Filmed for IMAX.

• 1:56:36Speaker 04

  Make them remember you. Ah!

• 1:56:39Speaker 03

  The Hunger Games: Sunrise on the Reaping, November 20th, rated PG-13.