LA Clippers Ty Lue Going From Player to Coach, NBA Playoffs, AI, Kobe, Jordan & Lebron

FOLLOW THE PIVOT PODCAST: MERCH | https://pivotpodcast.com YOUTUBE | https://www.youtube.com/thepivotpodcast INSTAGRAM | https://instagram.com/thepivot TWITTER | https://twitter.com/thepivot TIKTOK | https://tiktok.com/@thepivot FACEBOOK | https://www.facebook.com/thepivotpodcast FOLLOW HAPPY DAD: https://www.instagram.com/happydad FIND HAPPY DAD: https://www.happydad.com/find Enthralled by the journey of a young man who made it out of Mexico, Missouri, Ryan guides the conversation from Coach Lue’s upbringing to his close relationship with his family to the power of sacrifice and finding success through gratitude. Because of that, his responsibility to take care of his family, especially mother and grandmother, fuels his work dedication. Coach Lue recalls the moment his life was changed when he was drafted to the league and how it became his purpose to take care of his family and continue to evolve as a man through playing in the NBA. Playing with basketball royalty in Kobe and Jordan, Ty never took for granted his opportunities but also learned quickly the value of hard work. Lue explains the infamous Allen Iverson “step over” moment and how he attributes the longevity of his career to that play. Using his leadership skills from being a teammate and playing with some of the biggest personalities and most skilled in the game, Ty talks about how he got into coaching and who gave him the final nudge pushing him to know that he would be a great fit for the job. From experiences with Kobe, Shaq, Michael Jordan, LeBron James, Doc Rivers and many more, Ty Lue shares personal stories that truly highlight his career and the respect he has for them game and the game has for him. Being known as more than just a coach, Ty Lue is focused on being an example that young black and brown kids can be something special and make it if they work at it. Winning a championship with the Cavs, Coach hopes to duplicate that success in the west with the Clippers and is very confident with his team in the post season. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:01Speaker 00

  Every game day, you show up for your team. Now, it's your time.

• 0:11Speaker 00

  Ask your prescriber about Wegovy. Semaglutide injection, 2.4mg a GLP-1. Call 1-833-4-WEGOVIE or visit wegovie.com to view the medication guide and to learn more about Wegovy. Why wait?

• 0:30Ryan Clark?

  What's up, Coach?

• 0:31Channing Crowder?

  You good, bro?

• 0:33Fred Taylor?

  What's up, boss? Last time I seen you was 20, 30 years ago in Nassau.

• 0:39Ryan Clark?

  Me and Ty Lou close, I might be able to back him down. That's my best friend.

• 0:46Ryan Clark?

  I might be able to back him down, Chan. Boss in the house. Where am I sitting at, right here? You're right there. Man, look, see? God, you made it to the big time, bro. I told you, this basketball different, man. Yeah, it's a little different. Basketball different, Chan. Look at you, we got two of y'all.

• 1:04Channing Crowder?

  We took over the world, baby. Coach, when Barack and Drake.

• 1:09Ryan Clark?

  And Drake.

• 1:10Channing Crowder?

  And Drake, yeah, it was over. It was over, man.

• 1:14Channing Crowder?

  It was over. I started walking different in the mall.

• 1:17Ryan Clark?

  We hit him.

• 1:20Ryan Clark?

  Hey. You see him up there somewhere, somewhere around there. Cut it out, cut it out. You know that ain't never happened.

• 1:26Channing Crowder?

  Boy, it's bad on me in the mall now. Ladies at Chick-fil-A's.

• 1:31Ryan Clark?

  Hey, my non-mary thing. So, because you thought when she said "my pleasure", she meant she wanted to holler. They say that at every Chick-fil-A, bro.

• 1:41Channing Crowder?

  No, it's different when they look me in the eyes, D.

• 1:44Ryan Clark?

  What's up, Coach? Man, we appreciate you sitting down with us. No, no problem. I know during the season, you got a lot of work to do. They were explaining to me y'all workdays and, you know, how much goes into each and every day. Them boys say, Coach, they don't know when the weekend is.

• 1:58Speaker 04

  No, they don't get, especially the guys in the video room. They never get days off, you know, and so they kind of keep everything going just from, you know, breaking down film, the scouts for the next teams and next games. And so they're here every day, like they'll never, never get a day off unless we say, you know, today is a blackout day, nobody comes in. And so most of the time, they still come in anyway, but they, they work hard. They, they do all the grunt work, you know what I mean?

• 2:20Speaker 05

  Hold up. Limited, niggas tell me I'm pinning it. I thought they here to witness it. Got my people feeling militant. Way I'm feeling got me up. On the mission got me up. Knowing me, I got the key. Only vision I can trust, trust. Limited, niggas tell me I'm pinning it. I thought they here to witness it. Got my people feeling militant. Way I'm feeling got me up. On the mission got me up.

• 2:43Ryan Clark?

  It's, it's a, a big moment for us. This is our first NBA head coach. We got Channing, Freddie T. I'm RC. Thank you to everybody that supports the show. For everybody that's been pushing us to our partners. Happy Dad to our sponsors, DraftKings. We, we appreciate you. Coach, I, I have a question. I know it would be a crazy thing if we said, hey, yeah, this guy made it to the league from Mexico. And they would be like, oh, he Mexican? No, he's from Mexico, Missouri. Tell us a little bit about trying to achieve this dream, but being in a place, in a city where they, where there's not a lot of cats to look up to that have made it from Mexico.

• 3:23Speaker 04

  It was tough, you know, I think, you know, growing up in a small town, 11,000 people, and only 1,100 black people. And so when you come from a small town, you know, when somebody dies, everyone's affected because you know everybody in the community. But it just was, it was tough because not a lot of scouts are coming in, watching, you know, high school games for our school. Not a lot of talk about, you know, the players around it's that small town because our small town, they're going to play well. If you have them 25 or 30, like, oh, what's a small town? They're 2A or 3A, it's not the big class. And so it, it's hard, you know, it's hard. And so it's not a lot of guys to look up to, you know, for our younger youth and our, our younger kids. And when I was younger, it wasn't a lot of people to look up to. You know, I had to move to Kansas City my sophomore year in high school where I moved in with my uncle Kevin Graves.

• 4:07Speaker 04

  And I was able to start getting recruited, start being seen by more colleges. And I played my first AAU, on my first AAU team when I got in 11th grade, you know. And so we didn't have that in Mexico. We didn't have AAU teams. We wasn't traveling. We didn't have a budget or money to do that. And so I didn't even know what it was until I moved to Kansas City and kinda like saw what it was all about, about traveling and first time be on the airplane, uh, my junior year going into my senior year. And so it was a big difference. It was a big jump and going from a small town to a big city like Kansas City. Um, it was a huge jump for me, you know, but it was a jump I needed to take. Like I said, if I wanted to get to where I wanted to get to. And, um, I thought I had the talent. I really didn't know, but I thought I had the talent. But until you play against, you know, inner city kids and guys that are, you know, six, eight, six, nine, seven foot.

• 4:52Speaker 04

  We played against all small guys in my town. So until you actually see that and actually play, um, you really don't know how good you are. And so, um, I needed to take that jump and take that leap. And it was hard for me to leave my family and my mom and it was a tough situation. But, um, it all panned out. It's, it's better for the whole family now that I did make that move.

• 5:09Channing Crowder?

  That story usually ends different. That guy in the small town that balls out and whooped the hell out of all the little kids around the area. Usually 20 years later, he's working at the pumping stop down the road telling those stories. What made you different as a player, as a champion, a coach as a champion? You come from that and now you're doing something, cause you just talked about the head coaches, but also a championship player. How did, how, how did you become that from Mexico, Missouri?

• 5:34Speaker 04

  I think it's my upbringing. And in Mexico, when you're from a small town, um, everybody has a hand in raising you. You know, it's not just your parents. It's not your mom, your grandma, your grandpa. Like everyone has a hand in raising you and trying to get you to where you want to get to. And so I ran with the wrong crowd sometimes, you know, we all, we've all done that. But then I had some, some great guys who were part of the wrong crowd, but taught me a lot like, listen, you're not going this route. Like you're one of the guys that could actually make it. Like, so we're gonna protect you. We're gonna do everything we can to keep you away from this life. So you can go ahead and further your life and do the right thing. And so just instilling that in me, like I think from the older guys that taught me that. And then my mom, you know, my grandma, my grandpa, my uncles and aunties and family around me who taught me that. Um, it helped to go a long way. And I wasn't perfect, you know, but I never had a drink in my life.

• 6:17Speaker 04

  I've never had a smoke in my life, never tried it, you know, but.

• 6:20Channing Crowder?

  Just like you, Chan.

• 6:24Speaker 04

  But I've never.

• 6:24Channing Crowder?

  His name's Chan.

• 6:27Speaker 04

  Now, so the decisions I've made, you know, in my life, I was always prepared. I always knew what I was doing. I never was altered in any kind of way. And not saying that, you know, drink, you do what you want, but I just never did that. And so that helped me along the way as well, too.

• 6:40Fred Taylor?

  You spoke about not being on AAU until your junior year. We had T Mac on the show and he broke down his old experience, you know, when he started playing basketball and getting to the AAU and wanting to go after the best guys there to show that he was ready for that. In this environment now, fast forward, I guess, 20, 30 years since you've been there. Uh, from a budget standpoint and having the money to be able to do that. Can guys achieve the next level of success without having the notoriety of being on AAU programs?

• 7:12Speaker 04

  I think, I think so because like it's so much social media now. So you like, you know, I heard of a guy and you look, it's like, you know, a million views of a guy jumping over somebody dunking. Like, so you don't really need the same play. Like when I, when I came out through AAU, like we heard of guys like Chauncey Billups, but you never knew what he looked like.

• 7:29Fred Taylor?

  Okay.

• 7:29Speaker 04

  Like you heard of Stephon Marbury or Ron Mercer, but you'd be like, you go to the gym like, man, which one's Chauncey? Oh, it's the guy with the part in the middle of his head with the, but you didn't know what he looked like. But like nowadays, you can just click on social media, you can see everything you want to see. And so today, I don't think AAU is as important as it was back when we were coming up, but it's still a big platform as well.

• 7:49Fred Taylor?

  Right. And you mentioned the, the social media play and these guys are almost crowned before they actually get out there and do their thing. Do those players really got it? Like, do they really have it? Or is it just, you know, they just create this following because maybe they're cool or fashionable or, you know, they seem like they can be the next guy. Do they really have it?

• 8:09Speaker 04

  I think a lot of them have it, but I think also a lot of them, they get a lot of things, so they're giving a lot. Like when we came up, you know, you had to grind all the way through.

• 8:17Fred Taylor?

  Right.

• 8:18Speaker 04

  But now you in eighth grade, they take you, no, you're going to go to private school, we're going to protect you. You got your own shoes, your car. Like, we didn't have all that growing up, you know what I mean? So I think now, once you, they say, okay, he's six, eight in the eighth grade. Oh, he's a pro. So we're going to take him, we're going to protect him, we're going to do. Everything we want to do to try to make sure he becomes this next prospect. And so I think those kids kind of like they lose a lot of their hunger. Because like they get everything, you're giving them everything from eighth grade on through. Well, we had to grind from fifth, sixth, seventh, eighth, ninth, tenth, eleventh, twelfth. And so that could be a big difference as well.

• 8:50Ryan Clark?

  Makes sense. You mentioned your uncles earlier. Your Uncle Jay said he realized you had talent because you could suck your thumb and dribble a basketball.

• 8:59Ryan Clark?

  At the same time and it not get taken away. And the, the type of hunger from going from Mexico to KC, then now Nebraska. And then drafted by the Nuggets, traded to the Lakers. When you finally get to that point and you say, okay, the kid from the small town who had to make a tough decision in high school to go live with his uncle, makes it to the NBA. What was that moment like for you? And you were stepping into a team with Kobe Bryant and Shaquille O'Neal.

• 9:29Speaker 04

  So actually I was at my agent's house in New York, Andy Miller. I got drafted, you know, said 23rd pick, you know, Denver Nuggets select Teron Lou. And like, it just felt unreal, like it was, it was crazy. And I, I was in shock because to see a name called by David Stern, like you never thought that day would come. And it was, it was actually here. 10 minutes later, so I'd been traded to the Lakers. I jumped up on the couch, I'm going crazy, I was jumping over and my agent killed my high, right? Like, oh, now this changes everything. You go into a class A organization, you could be out of the league in three years if you. I got, now I went from a high to scared to death, like man, like damn, like you just took. I'm getting drafted tonight and 10 minutes later, I'm scared to death, you know? And so he kind of blew my high with that. But, um, you know, for me, it was like a dream come true. You know, I put the work in, I was dedicated to the game.

• 10:15Speaker 04

  Had a lot of help along the way, like I said, family, friends, Mexico, you know, who raised me. And, um, I just wanted to get to the point where I can take care of my family. My mom, my grandmother, my sister, brothers, aunties, uncles. And when I got drafted, you know, uh, my mom and grandma, they ain't worked another day in their life. They been getting a check for twenty-five years, every month, like, you know, so.

• 10:35Channing Crowder?

  It's a blessing.

• 10:35Speaker 04

  Yeah, and so that was a blessing for me, to be able to take care of them and to see where we come from and all the struggles we had. You know, being poor and being raised and everything they had to do to try to get everything that we wanted. And so, um, my grandma, my mom, man, like, I mean, they could have anything. And so, I know coming to the league, I got my financial advisor, like, man, you give a lot of money to your family. I said, man, I'd rather be broke. I don't wanna be rich and my family be broke. I'd rather be broke as long as they're successful, as long as they're happy, then I'm okay. You know, and so that's kinda like how I live my life.

• 11:03Channing Crowder?

  Not to this day now.

• 11:05Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 11:05Channing Crowder?

  Still giving away money?

• 11:06Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 11:07Channing Crowder?

  Why? They had to find something to do with the money you gave them.

• 11:10Speaker 04

  They did a lot of raising.

• 11:11Channing Crowder?

  Invest or invest in something to capitalize?

• 11:14Speaker 04

  No, I'm just saying, if you just see all the things they did for me to get to this point, I mean, and I owe them everything. And so, I mean, I made a lot of money and I'm, I'm secure, you know, with my money and everything, so, um, not having any kids or nothing like that. So, it goes to my family.

• 11:28Channing Crowder?

  I wanted to ask too, you talking about this, you getting to L.A. and that first-class organization. A guy, you just were able to rent a car, and now you're playing with Kobe Bryant and Shaq, you know what I'm saying?

• 11:37Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah.

• 11:38Channing Crowder?

  But how, how was that, like, for a young dude to walk in, you just back up and just be a fly on the wall? Or do you have to purposely prove yourself to a guy like that?

• 11:46Speaker 04

  I think the biggest thing that helped me was, when I first got to L.A., um, I had a chance, uh, met Nick Van Exel, who I got traded for. Um, I actually lived in his apartment, uh, when we got here, and it was right next door to Eddie Jones. And so Eddie Jones took me under his wing and like kinda showed me the ropes and taught me everything. And so, the first week I got in town, um, he took me to the Century Club. And I went to the Century Club and I met Shaq, like, the first night. And so, Shaq was like, man, glad to have you, wanna come to the house tomorrow, I'm gonna have a big, you know, meal, whatever, whatever. And so, we go over to Shaq's house the next day, he gives me, I think, twenty thousand dollars cash. Like, I know you ain't got no money, I know it's a lockout, you know, take care of yourself, you know, fed us well. And then, that kinda helped me out, because I would've been at all, you know, like, I don't know what's, what I would've expected

• 12:31Speaker 04

  if I just walked into practice and seen Shaq and Kobe, you know, and so, um, Shaq just made me feel welcome right away. You know, the first, the first time I met him, and it kinda, you know, went on from there.

• 12:40Channing Crowder?

  Did you pay him back?

• 12:41Speaker 04

  No, he didn't, he said he didn't want it back.

• 12:44Speaker 04

  It was a lockout. I got half my money. Like, it was, oh, it was crazy. Yeah, it was, it was a struggle that first year or two, but, you know, I finally got together.

• 12:52Fred Taylor?

  So a- as a player coming in to a prestigious organization like the Lakers, how do players defer to the superstar players on the team? I understand you have to find yourself a role. Is it challenging to fit into that spot?

• 13:06Speaker 04

  Yeah, it is challenging. I think everyone that comes from college and goes to the NFL, goes to the, you know, NBA, you probably were the man on your team. So you used to, you know, I averaged 23 points a game in college, and so you're used to shooting the ball whenever you want to. But I would come into practice and play great, you know, every day and not see the floor. Like, I was in a suit the first 35 games of the season. And I might understand, like, damn, like, I'm playing good, I'm balling, but now I gotta find other ways to get on the floor. And so it ain't gonna be my offense. Like, we got Eddie Jones, we had Glen Rice, we had Kobe, we had Shaq, Rick Fox. So what can I do different? What can I bring different to get on the floor? And that was, you know, picking up full court, being a defensive player, and, um, which I never did in college or high school, but I like, you know, I gotta get on the floor.

• 13:48Speaker 04

  Like, so I started picking up full court, and I became like a defensive player, which I never was that throughout my career, like, far as high school and college. But it changed my career as far as, you know, going against AI and everybody talking about the step over and all that stuff, but, like, he made my career. If it wasn't for AI, like, I don't know where I would be, because that challenge, like, helped me get my next contract, and it allowed me to stay in the league for 11 years.

• 14:09Fred Taylor?

  Explain that. You said he made your career. The step over.

• 14:12Ryan Clark?

  Doug Collins made it too big of a deal. I was a huge, I was a huge Laker fan. I was hot.

• 14:18Speaker 04

  And Doug was my coach, so after that step over, I signed with the Wizards that same summer. Like, Doug, he was the head coach.

• 14:24Ryan Clark?

  Right.

• 14:25Speaker 04

  But to me, it wasn't like, they act like he crossed me over, I fell down, he stepped, like, he made a shot, I contested it, and then I stepped on his foot and fell down, he stepped over me. But they made it like, oh, he crossed him over and all that, but to me, if Toronto would have won that series instead of Philly, and it was been Vince Carter, then Alvin Williams was a 6'4" point guard, like, I probably wouldn't have seen the floor. Like, I would, I would have never got on the floor, because we had Brian Shaw and Kobe and Ron Harper. We had all those big guards, which Alvin Williams posted up, he was a big guard, so. If it wasn't for AI making it to the finals, you would probably never seen T-Lou. You know, so that's why I always say like, you know, about him making it to the finals and me having the chance to guard him in the finals, that helped my career out.

• 15:04Channing Crowder?

  Did you not wish you had tried to kick him?

• 15:07Speaker 04

  I wish I would have picked him up.

• 15:08Channing Crowder?

  Yeah, yeah. Like the pitcher, man, because you sitting there like, and he cocky like,

• 15:13Speaker 04

  Right. And that's my guy too now, you know what I mean? But like if I had known like what it was gonna be, if I saw like three years, happened three years before to somebody else, I'd have picked him up like, no, we ain't doing this. Like I might have set him down, but we ain't doing this. But I ain't think it was a big deal until Doug Collin, oh, and he steps up. Man, get the fuck out of here.

• 15:33Ryan Clark?

  What's funny about it though, like you've been on record now saying that even though AI was close to you.

• 15:40Speaker 00

  Every game day, you show up for your team. Now it's your time.

• 15:50Speaker 00

  Ask your prescriber about Wegovy. Some Maglutide injection, 2.4 milligrams a GLP-1. Call 1-833-4-WEGOVIE or visit wegovie.com to view the medication guide and to learn more about Wegovy. Why wait?

• 16:09Ryan Clark?

  In age, he was somebody you looked up to. So when you do get that call, because like I always make the joke about Michael Jordan and LeBron, Kobe. Y'all go through y'all shoot around and they telling y'all who y'all got. They like, yeah, you gonna stick 23.

• 16:21Speaker 04

  Right.

• 16:21Ryan Clark?

  And I'll be like, hell no, say his name, his name, Michael Jordan. Right? You know what I mean? When you get that assignment in that type of moment, is, what is your thought? Is your thought, okay, if I go out and play well, it does get me my next contract? Or are you kind of feeling like, all right now, like it's on, it's on national TV?

• 16:37Speaker 04

  What's a lot that goes into it? So when I was playing and Phil Jackson was coaching with the Lakers, whatever, I was with the Lakers. You know, you gotta be put on the playoff roster when you can't play the whole playoffs. And so like now you can just you can rotate every game. But like back then, it's a playoff roster and it's set. So we we go to the war room. And I had been going back and forth with Mike Pinbird. Like I'm I wasn't sure if I was gonna be on the playoff roster or J R Rider was gonna be on the playoff roster. And so it was crazy. So we sitting in the war room. And I'm like, man, I'm praying like, man, please let me be on this. You know what I'm saying? And so we sitting there, Phil goes down the list, goes down the list. And he says my name. And I jump up and go crazy. Kobe goes crazy, Shaq, B Shaw. Like I go crazy, right? Everybody's happy for me. Um, and so that was the that was the first the first challenge.

• 17:22Speaker 04

  Like getting on the playoff roster. Because if I'd have got left off, we could have six people could have got hurt and you still can't be on the playoff roster.

• 17:28Ryan Clark?

  Okay.

• 17:28Speaker 04

  You know what I mean? So that was that was the first step. And then the second step for me was like, okay. Um, the first round we played, I think San Antonio, maybe we played good. I played like eight minutes a game or 10 minutes a game. When we got to the finals, I I wasn't even playing. So the first half, I didn't play at all. And AI, I think, had like 36 points at halftime or something crazy. And then six minutes ago in the third quarter, Phil looked down. I was sitting on the floor, me and Devin George. He looked down and said, Looby, let's go. I'm like, what? I jumped up, so I didn't have time to really think about it. I didn't think I was gonna play, you know? So I jump up and I'm just like, man, this is a guy I idolized, like, you know, like some of the same upbringings, same heights, you know, core, like everything like. And he was somebody that I idolized, like growing, even though he's only two years older than me.

• 18:13Speaker 04

  Like I looked up to him, the way he played, the style of play. And um, given my opportunity, like I knew every move. Like I worked on that, everything he did, like I knew his counters. I knew what he was gonna do, if he's gonna snatch back, if he's gonna, you know, spin. I knew everything. And so just study him every day for two weeks and then finally get my chance to get out there and play against him like it was like a dream come true. So I didn't even have time to be scared or shook or none of that. I was just up for the challenge.

• 18:37Ryan Clark?

  Well, I'm telling you what, the whole week, I used to know Randy Moss was on the other side. I was scared as hell.

• 18:43Ryan Clark?

  I ain't even lie, like, hey, Troy, you gotta come over here too now. We both need to be here. Coach, when you win early, as you guys did, you went in 2000, you went in 01. Do you have the feeling at that point, man, you know, winning championships is pretty cool. It's pretty easy, like, like, we're gonna do this. And then you go throughout your career, you play for different teams, and you never get an opportunity to be in that spot again. Is there any part of, of your career that you regret not taking advantage of, or not doing in order to put yourself back in that position?

• 19:17Speaker 04

  I try not to live with regrets. You know, um, my contract was up, and so they offered me a one-year deal to come back. And I had a better deal in Washington. And so I thought, like, okay, I won two championships. Now's the chance for me to, like, get paid and get some money, and have the opportunity to play with Michael Jordan. You know, and so, um, you get a chance to play with the GOAT. Like, you gotta, you gotta take that swing, you know? And so, um, for me, like I said, I won two championships. Now I can go to Washington, play with Michael Jordan, get paid. The biggest deal I had since I've been in the league. I have to do it. And I had a lot of guys I talked to. Brian Shaw was a great mentor, Rick Fox, Robert Ori. Um, and those guys, like, listen, man, I know you wanna be in L.A. I know you love the team, but you gotta take care of your family. If that's what you really wanna do, like, you gotta take this next step. And so, um, that's, that's what I had to do.

• 20:01Speaker 04

  And like I said, I don't regret playing with Michael Jordan, you know? I don't regret my 11-year NBA career, and so, um, I really don't regret it, no.

• 20:08Ryan Clark?

  And now, maybe the 24-year-old Talu wouldn't, couldn't answer this question, 'cause he was too close to it. But you playing, what, nine, eight, nine teams?

• 20:17Speaker 04

  Seven, eight, yeah, yeah.

• 20:18Ryan Clark?

  In like 11 years, why was that? 'Cause you were a hell of a player. We all knew you, we all loved you, but you were jumping from team to team. Nobody was giving you that big deal.

• 20:25Speaker 04

  Well, for me, I think I got traded three times out of it, but a lot of times I was a free agent. 'Cause, you know, I was, I was just a role player. So, back then, you signing two-year deals. And so, now you either come back with the same team or go get more money. And I think, you know, while I won early, I was like, you know what? I gotta chase this money, 'cause I don't know how long my career's gonna be. You know, I wasn't a, a marquee name or a marquee player, so I gotta, I gotta get the money, you know? And so, um, that's kinda how I looked at it. And so, and I like change, too. Like, I don't like being in the same spot, same, every, I, I like change. And so, um, like I said, Lakers came up, I was a free agent. I left, went to the Wizards. My two years up with the Wizards, I was a free agent. I left and went to, I think, Orlando. You know, then I got traded from Orlando to Houston. And then from Houston to Atlanta, that was all in the same year, so it really don't count.

• 21:09Speaker 04

  And then in Atlanta, I was there for four years, and then I got traded to Sacramento. And then it was kind of like, you know, it was what it was after that. I was probably done anyway. So, I think, you know, those are decisions you have to make, and you gotta be able to live with them. And so, when you're a guy like me and my caliber player, like, you're getting two-year deals. So, it's gonna be changed every two years, you know, and so, and I was okay with that.

• 21:28Channing Crowder?

  You don't think you ever worked yourself into a player that wasn't just a role player?

• 21:33Speaker 04

  No, no.

• 21:35Channing Crowder?

  Could you honestly say that? Could you say that back then?

• 21:37Speaker 04

  Yeah, I knew who I was. Yeah, and so, I mean, I've always been a team guy, you know, and so, I remember I got to Milwaukee my last year before I got traded to Orlando halfway through the season, which is one of the best coaches I played for as well, Scott Skiles. And so, you know, I was thirty-two, you know, eleven years in the league my last year. And it'd be times where, like, Ramon Sessions, and, well, like, he'd be the starter, and Luke Rittenour. And so, it'd be like games, we're getting blown out. And so, it might be a minute into the game, I mean, a minute left in the game, and he wouldn't put me in. And so, we was talking one day after the game, I was like, he's like, you know, I respect you, and I wouldn't want to put you in the answer. Man, you can put me in with ten seconds. I'm gonna run my ass up there, and I'm gonna do what I'm supposed to do. Like, I know who I am.

• 22:20Speaker 04

  It's never been an ego with me. It's about winning, it's about the team. And so, I've never had a pro- I didn't even play with Scott Skiles that much. Stan Van Gundy in Orlando, when I got traded there, I didn't play, but I thought he was a great coach. Like, some people are, oh, I don't play, forget that, like, no, it ain't about that. And so, for me, I was always an ultimate team guy. Like, I'd go out there, I was a starter in Atlanta. I'd go out there and rebound for the guy that ain't even playing. Like, that's just who I was. I was never a star player or that player that, like, you know what, we gotta keep him. No.

• 22:47Ryan Clark?

  That unselfishness and- Honestly, the ability to adjust to change can help in the coaching realm, right? Because you can bounce around, do different jobs, be in different cities. But I think it was Doc Rivers who encouraged you to become a coach. When you're thinking about that transition, what were your thoughts in going into coaching? And was there any hesitancy in making that decision?

• 23:14Speaker 04

  So I played for Doc in 2003 in Orlando. So, I mean, he ended up getting fired, but he always told me, he said, you know, when you're done playing, you can come coach with me. I was like, man, you crazy. I ain't coaching. I've only been in the league four or five years. I'm like, man, I ain't coaching. Like, I don't want to do that. And so he saw something in me that I ain't see in myself. And so in 2009, you know, my last year, I was done playing. And I was like, OK, I can go overseas and play, or I can do something different. And so I was like, I really don't want to go overseas. Like, you know, I'm done. And so I called Doc. I said, you know what? I want to try this coaching thing. And Doc said, OK, I'll call you back in two days. And I'll let you know. So he was like, yeah, right. He ain't gonna call back. Called back the next day. You know, him and Danny Ainge both, and they gave me a spot. And I was like, you know what?

• 23:58Speaker 04

  Start our player development. See if you like it. See if you want to do this. And the first year and a half, two years, he's kind of like, let me get the player out of me. Like, OK, do this. See if you like this. And then he started giving me more and more things to do. First it was the defense, then it was the offense. And I just learned so much. And I was like, you know what? I do like this. And so then that's kind of like how my coaching career started.

• 24:18Ryan Clark?

  You see, he mentioned Doc, though. His voice went to the Jamie Foxx voice.

• 24:27Fred Taylor?

  I'm sitting over here, man. I'm just waiting on the opportunity to ask you about your time in Washington. You know, obviously, we all grew up playing with Mike. Hell, we got his shoes on. What was that experience like? You know, we hear other great players, the Larry Byrds, saying he's God in a uniform. You know, AI saying he could see Mike's aura. As a guy who got an opportunity to see him every single day in practice, what was that experience?

• 24:51Speaker 04

  It taught me that I was 22 years old, 23 years old, and I didn't work hard enough. And you know, when you're young, you think you're working hard, but until you see people that actually work hard, you don't really know what work is. And MJ being forty years old, you know, we call him Black Jesus. But you know, MJ being forty years old, and he'd be the first guy in the gym. You walk in the gym at, you know, practice at eleven, you walk in the gym, you think you're early at nine o'clock, he's already got a full lather, he's done the lifted court workout and everything. I'm like, damn, like what's... And then we come to practice, he's on one leg. Like, he was hurt the second year, he was on one leg the whole year and played eighty-two games. Like, and so, he practiced every day and he played every game on one leg. And so, you're like, man, MJ, why don't you just sit up?

• 25:34Speaker 04

  I can't, how can I be the leader of the team and sit out and y'all going through all the cra- I gotta be there. Or I lose my powers being a leader. Like, I can't tell you what to do, I'm sitting on the sideline. Like, he was like, damn, like this. Like, he's forty years old on one leg, the greatest of all time, and you gonna practice every day on one leg at forty years old? Like, so I'm not doing enough. And so then, he started this thing called The Breakfast Club. And that's when I actually really started lifting weights. So every morning, we would be on the road, we would get together, go lift weights, and then we'd come back, have breakfast, and then we'd go to shoot around. And that kinda taught me, like, got me into lifting weights and all that stuff. But to see a guy at forty years old, and he was, you know, known as the best player ever, and to still practice every day, be the first guy at the gym, and last guy to leave, like, that just shows you at twenty-three, twenty-four years old, I wasn't working hard enough.

• 26:20Fred Taylor?

  On the other side of that, the guy who gets some of the most comparisons outside of LeBron is Kobe.

• 26:25Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 26:26Fred Taylor?

  You know, what's the difference in Mike and Kobe?

• 26:29Speaker 04

  No difference. Their will to win, their will to wanna kill you every single night and take your heart, their will to miss nine, ten shots in a row, and think the next ten are going in. Like, just that killer instinct, like, it just, those two, I've never seen nothing like it. And, you know, like Bron is, like I said, he's great. And they all to me are great players. It's like, you know, whatever, whatever. I'll never compare due to comparison. But those two were spitting images, like, you know, both 6'6",

• 26:58Fred Taylor?

  Yeah.

• 26:58Speaker 04

  Both, you know, with the frame they got, you know, the athletic ability, the mid-post game, the passing ability, which they didn't want to pass as much, you know, because they want to kill you. Like, I want to, because they want to come in the game, I want to get 50 every night.

• 27:09Fred Taylor?

  Yeah.

• 27:09Speaker 04

  That's their mentality. You know, where Bron is, I want to come in and get 30, 10, and 10, you know, whatever, and make, you know, the guys around me better, where Kobe and Jordan, like, listen, I want to win, but I want to also kill you and take your heart every single night. And so the comparison of those two, just seeing those two spitting images of each other.

• 27:25Fred Taylor?

  Load management. You know, as you've been on the player's side and the coaching side now, you mentioned Mike, one leg, 40 years old, want to play 82 games. That's a huge topic of conversation now in your sport, load, load management. How do you handle that as a coach, seeing your players? And also, is it fair, you know, for different guys to make those comparisons with the old school guys and where the game is now?

• 27:51Speaker 04

  No, the game is different, you know. Back then, three-point shot, you might shoot 12 threes a game, you know, and now, one guy might shoot 12 threes, you know, so the game was totally different. You know, we had a guy that you're going to post every night, you're going to play at the post, you know, we had guys where it was a four and a five, so it was, you know, you swing, swing, cross screen, the other guy post, you know, so it was like, it wasn't a lot of spacing on the floor because it wasn't a lot of shooting. But now, like, teams are shooting 40, 50 threes a game, so the game has just totally changed, it's totally opened up. But as far as the load management goes, you know, it's different because like when I came in, it was a lockout year, and so we played 50 games, and we played three games in a row, back to back to back.

• 28:30Fred Taylor?

  Yeah.

• 28:30Speaker 04

  You know, I seen Shaq, you know, 300 pounds, like, play every game. You know, I seen Kobe, you know, wrist and play every game, you know, so it's just different. And so the times were different. I think- The science is really, you know, caught up to really try and take care of our players and for the long haul. And it makes sense to me. So it's gotta be a balance. I know it's a lot of compare, like, well, we played in the old days, we played in Chuck Taylor, we didn't. Yeah, but it's changed. I mean, the game has changed. And, you know, whether we like it or not, the science and the data show that, you know, doing certain things helps these players in their longevity and getting ready for the end of the season when you go into the playoffs. Like, guys are more fresh, guys are healthier. And so I see it both ways, you know, because I played in the old school days and now the new school days, but everything, things have changed.

• 29:13Ryan Clark?

  One of the greatest coaches ever is a huge part of that is Greg Popovich. Greg Popovich was fined, I think, like $250,000 initially when he started to allow guys to low manage. But you brought me to a point I want to ask you about. You mentioned, obviously, you asked about Kobe and Mike, but also LeBron. LeBron is part of that conversation, and I believe he's had the greatest career, at least of modern times, that I've got an opportunity to see. January 22nd, 2016, Coach Blatt is fired. You become the head coach of the Cleveland Cavaliers, and you lead that team to what many believe is the most improbable 3-1 comeback in the finals. Everybody talks about the LeBron block.

• 29:58Ryan Clark?

  Obviously, Kyrie comes down, hits the three-pointer. That experience for you as a coach.

• 30:05Speaker 00

  Every game day, you show up for your team. Now, it's your time.

• 30:10Speaker 06

  We go.

• 30:16Speaker 00

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• 30:34Channing Crowder?

  As opposed to a player, how much different was that? And what did it mean to you to lead that team there?

• 30:41Speaker 04

  It was tough. You know, I think when you take over midway through the season, you know, we already played 41 games and you take over, and you've never done it before. So you always think, you know, mentally like, oh, I can be a head coach. But till you actually slide over one seat, you really don't know. And then come in with no training camp, you know, nothing. And you just take over midway through a season for a team that has expectations of winning a championship. I thought it was tough, you know, and it was, it was hard. But when I first walked in that room is I grabbed Kyrie, K-Love and Bron. And I said, listen, this is new for me. I'm gonna need you guys' help, but this is what I see. It's what I need you guys to do for me. And they had my back 100%. And like I said, they made me better because a lot of things I really didn't know until you actually do it. And I'm learning on the fly.

• 31:26Speaker 04

  Like, get hired, next day we got a game. It's like no practice, no like, and it's so like, damn, like, can I really do this? You start questioning yourself, can I really do this? And I'll tell you, like Bron, Kyrie, K-Love, they really kept me on my toes. They really made me a better coach. Like I said, everybody like, you know, I had some success because in Cleveland, winning a championship, going to four finals or whatever. But I've only been coaching for six years. Like, you know, but I've had success early. So people think I've been doing it for a long time. But I really got a lot to learn. Like, I still got a lot to grow. And I understand that. And I'm always willing to learn and work towards that. But that was a crazy, it was a crazy year. And to win a championship, like I said, being down 3-1. And I know you talked about my mom and my grandmother having, you know, cancer. So they couldn't make it to the games.

• 32:10Speaker 04

  And so when we won, everybody, you know, saw the picture on TV. I'm crying. Like, it was just like a chance to like exhale. Like, it was just so much going on with my family, my mom and grandma. They couldn't be there, winning, you know, all the critics saying that we were dead. We couldn't come back, it was over. And so it was just a lot. And so when you finally win and able to exhale, it was like a sign of a sigh of relief. You know what I mean?

• 32:33Channing Crowder?

  Playing with those stars we're talking about already. And now you said, and when you got to Cleveland, you brought up your stars. K-Love, Kyrie, LeBron, that was your, your big three when you got there. Being a player and people always want to say, well, people say you haven't put the cleats on. I don't want to hear your opinion.

• 32:46Speaker 04

  Right.

• 32:46Channing Crowder?

  When they criticize coaches that haven't played. But I do think playing helps you as a coach. Like, to argue that other side, what's, what, what does your playing help in the coaching department? And dealing with Hall of Famers? Like, that whole dynamic, what is, what's the difference between you and Tibbs, who didn't play in the league?

• 33:05Speaker 04

  For me, it's just like having that feel. Like, you've been in a locker room and you know when guys are tired. You know, it's like, you know, well, we're gonna give them a day off or two days off. Or, you know, when you're going through two-a-days and guys like, man, no, I've done it. Like, you can't tell, like, don't try, like, you know what I'm saying? Like, I've done it. I've, I've been in two-a-days for 30 days. Yeah, not, not for four days. He's all like us. We talk about we played. Y'all boys ain't never been in two-a-days. Y'all did a collective bargaining agreement, y'all can only have four two-a-days. I did 30 days.

• 33:32Channing Crowder?

  Damn.

• 33:33Speaker 04

  So, I, I'm with, you know, Jeff Van Gundy where, you know, we got 30 other practice, 30 two-a-days. But also, on top of that, on days we had, like preseason games, we practiced in the morning. Like, I don't care about the preseason game. Like, we practiced and then played a game at night. So, like, when they see that, they know you've been through it, they can respect it more. And I don't know if that's right or wrong, but they, they know, like, you know what you're talking about. And you can also relate to the players more. You know, because like, a guy like Bones Highland, you know, on our team, a really great player. Like, we got a lot of guys that, you know, we're playing. And I got to talk to them, they're like, man, I've been in your position. Like, like, I know what it's about. Like, you ballin', you playing good, but sometimes you might be able to get on the floor. And so, I've been off the bench, I've been a starter, I've been not played, I've been cut. You know, I've been, well, not cut, but I've been traded.

• 34:18Channing Crowder?

  Yeah.

• 34:19Speaker 04

  You know, so I've been in every role you can possibly be in. So, when I want to talk to the younger players, like, I've been there and I've seen it and I've been a part of it. So, they can kind of understand it more and they listen to you more because you've been through it.

• 34:28Fred Taylor?

  How do you manage the, the personalities of your superstars? You know, you got Russ now, you got PG, and then you also have Kawhi. Like, these are superstars. You know, it's not a whole lot of ball to, to go around. How do you manage those personalities?

• 34:43Speaker 04

  Brian Shaw taught me a long time ago, uh, when I was with the Lakers, like with Kobe and Shaq, like just, just, you know, tell your stars the truth. They might say F you or whatever, but they're gonna respect you at the end of the day. And so I got the relationship where we communicate every day. I, you know, I'm talking with those guys every day, you know, picking their brains, what they like, what they don't like. And my coaching style is like, I want to do what's best for the player that's gonna help the team win. And so, you know, what's your, what's your best spot on the floor? What you like running in the game? Like, I'm gonna ask you these questions so we can kinda incorporate that into the game. So you, you're comfortable when you get the ball in those moments, like you're comfortable on the floor. And so it's not like when I was saying, you do it my way or you don't, like, no, I'm, I don't coach like that. And so I wanna make sure everybody's comfortable.

• 35:25Speaker 04

  And then also, if you're comfortable, but make sure we do it in the confines of the other team and then kinda go from there.

• 35:30Fred Taylor?

  And your style of coaching, you, you've had some great coaches, obviously the legendary Phil Jackson, you mentioned Scott Skiles, uh, Van Gundy and Doc. Your, your philosophy, how much, who did you steal the most of your coaching staff from?

• 35:44Speaker 04

  Everybody, yeah, everybody. And so, you know, when I was playing, I didn't really think I was doing that. I didn't really understand it, you know, but like Doc, just, um, his ATOs after timeout plays, like he's the best, you know, I've seen. And just getting a great shot every time out of timeout, like execution. Uh, Phil Jackson, just being poised on the sideline, do all your coaching in practice and kinda let the guys figure it out. You know, Scott Skiles, um, I remember he used to come in the locker room after we'd lose or win a game and just say, bring it in. And so I find myself doing it all the time. And so I asked Scott Skiles, why, why you do that? And he said, well, Ty, what you do, if you ever coach, you know, you could see something like in the game, you might be totally wrong.

• 36:26Speaker 04

  And you like, when you come in the locker room going crazy, cussing guys out and you look at the film like, damn, it didn't even happen like that. You know what I mean? So after the game, I always find myself, you know, bring it in. And then next day I do the coaching and do the correcting. And so I just took a lot from a lot of different people. And when I was playing, I didn't even know, I didn't even realize I was doing that.

• 36:44Ryan Clark?

  In coaching, you are tied to players. And we've mentioned, especially basketball is different. In football, there's not necessarily one player, unless you have Patrick Mahomes, that can truly be the reason you win and lose every week. In basketball, if you have a LeBron, you got a shot.

• 37:00Speaker 04

  Right.

• 37:00Ryan Clark?

  You know, you have a healthy Kawhi Leonard, you got a shot. The same way it was with Kobe and all of these players. But LeBron leaves for L.A. And you've been, you're a coach that's been to all these consecutive NBA championships. You already have a ring. And they give you six games, coach, and fire you in Cleveland. What was that feeling like for you in saying, I've done all of this. I've accomplished all of these things. And is six games all I'm worth?

• 37:28Speaker 04

  No, I think, you know, Bron left, you know, Kyrie was gone. And so then we had young guys that we had brought in, you know, Collin Sexton, Jettie Osmond. And so, just speaking to Kobe Altman, who's the general manager of the team, like, he just thought it wasn't fair for me to go through a rebuilding stage. He's like, you've accomplished so much. Like, we don't want to put you through a rebuilding stage. Now, if you want to be here, or do you want to go somewhere where you can, you know, win championships and, and, and do that for your coaching career? And so, after talking to Kobe, which is great, you know, if a general manager come to talk to you first about kind of how they see it and what you want to do, that made me feel good. But I thought, you know, me as a young coach, as a black coach, I think that I should be on a stage where we have a chance to win every year.

• 38:12Speaker 04

  And, and so that's kind of like, it was kind of like a mutual decision, you know? But Kobe told me, like, I don't want you to have to be here and go through a rebuilding process. And so, I respect that. And so, when I got let go, six games into it, I probably needed it. You know what I mean? Like, just talking to Phil Jackson, he said, every three, four years, you should take a break. You know, if you're good enough, take a break and come back. You should do that. Because, I mean, people don't understand how much goes into coaching. Like, every time you lose a game, you going home, you can't sleep. You think about, what could I have done different? Who could I have played? Bad ATO? Like, it's just a lot of stuff that goes into it. And so, it's a lot, dealing with all the different egos and trying to manage 15 grown men who are rich. And like, it's just, it's a lot, you know? And so, people don't understand, like, how much goes into coaching. And just from a...

• 38:58Speaker 04

  From a standpoint, you're not sleeping at night, you're trying to prepare for the next day.

• 39:01Ryan Clark?

  Coach, y'all wear those games like, it's so different in football. We work all week for three hours.

• 39:07Speaker 04

  Right.

• 39:07Ryan Clark?

  And so, we normally wear the losses and you're high about the wins because you know you're not playing until the next week. If you go on a five-game win streak or losing streak in football, it's actually a month and a half of you doing that. With you guys, you could have a back-to-back or it could be a long road stretch. You actually wear those losses that way, Coach?

• 39:27Speaker 04

  Every game, every game, you know, and it never stops. And it's easy, like, you know, our coaches are Oda Bryanshaw and Larry Drew, like, man, you can't take it home. Like, man, what are you talking, like, like, if we lose a game, I'm taking it home. And I'm not sleeping. And so, we don't, if we don't get that next win, I'm not sleeping again, you know, and so, um, it's just, it's a lot. And so, like, you give so much to the game and you love the game and you respect the game. And the game has given you everything, like, I'm not gonna shortcut it, like, yeah, losses hurt. Every, every night, losses hurt. And sometimes even when you win, like, last night we won, and I ain't think we closed the game right. So, I can't sleep, 'cause I'm thinking about how we can, different ways we can close games. And so, you hear all the people talking and all that, they don't understand. Like, they can say what they wanna say and speak on how they wanna speak about any coach

• 40:11Speaker 04

  or whatever they wanna say on Twitter's and I, I don't have social media, but like, I mean, not about me, just other coaches. But you don't understand what we gotta actually go through every single day, you know, to try to put your team in position to win, you know, for one night. This, it's hard, like, it, it's tough. And so, that's why I feel said, when you get a chance, take some time off, take some time off and kinda rejuvenate yourself and try to come back. But it's a lot of sleepless nights.

• 40:33Channing Crowder?

  Coach, you would take a, a game on a Tuesday night and miss sleep. So, from a head coaching perspective, Ryan brought it up, what happens when a LeBron leaves your team? Or a Kyrie, like, we don't hear it from a head coach perspective, we hear it from the players.

• 40:46Speaker 04

  Right, right.

• 40:47Channing Crowder?

  We hear it from the organization. But you the dude that has to make this team good. And now, LeBron, I'd put him number two. Jordan's gonna be number one in my mind forever. The second-best player ever to touch the court, in my opinion, leaves your team after a championship. Like, how does your process go when your team changes that drastically?

• 41:02Speaker 04

  Well, I mean, I know it's a business and you gotta do what's best for you and your family. So I understand that, you know, 100%, you know, but things do change, you know, overnight. You know, when you have LeBron James leave your team, Kyrie Irving, especially when the team was built around y'all. And now when you leave, like, we had a team full of shooters that couldn't dribble. Like, so, so, yeah, like Kyrie, you know, and Bron, they sent, you know, Kyle Corbin, Channing Frye, Richard Jefferson. Like, we had a lot of guys that eat, but they couldn't cook. You know what I'm saying? So, so, you know, it got tough. You know, so you try to figure out different ways to, you know, manufacture wins, different ways, different styles of how to play. And, um, you know, it was tough, you know, it was tough. But I thought we did some good things, you know, six games. I thought we, and all six of those teams, I think, made the playoffs that year, you know?

• 41:46Speaker 04

  So it was a tough, it was tough, but I thought we enjoyed it. It challenged me in different ways as a coach. Um, but like I said, it wasn't a long time, it was only six games, but it changes everything when, like I said, LeBron James and Kyrie Irving leaves.

• 41:58Channing Crowder?

  What's that conversation like? Does Bron come up to your office? Does Kyrie come to your office? Do you try to convince them to stay? Like, the personal side of, you say, with all your players, you're honest. Do your players give that same respect back to you?

• 42:09Speaker 04

  Yeah, but I mean, Kyrie got traded. And, yeah, I didn't want that.

• 42:13Channing Crowder?

  Yeah.

• 42:14Ryan Clark?

  But, like, that conversation is what I'm at, like, it was something.

• 42:17Speaker 04

  Yeah, we don't want, yeah, we don't want him to go. Come on, man. Like, we had a well-oiled machine, like, you know what I'm saying? Like, and then KD left, you know, Golden State? Like, you know what I'm saying? So like, I mean, it just, you know, no, you never want to see that happen. And so, you know, like I said, it is, it is a business. You know, the franchise has to do what's best for the franchise. The player has to do what's best for the player. And so you understand those things, but you don't want to see it happen. You know, it, it hurts, it's, it's hard, but it's part of the business.

• 42:45Fred Taylor?

  You, you talk about players leaving. What about players coming? LeBron tweeted the other day that Bronny was better than the, the team, most of the players that he had been watching that, that night. How true is that?

• 42:57Ryan Clark?

  Captain.

• 42:58Fred Taylor?

  You think it, Captain?

• 42:58Ryan Clark?

  Yes.

• 42:59Fred Taylor?

  I think Bronny tough. I mean, I don't know, now.

• 43:02Ryan Clark?

  Frederick Taylor.

• 43:03Speaker 04

  I don't know.

• 43:03Ryan Clark?

  Frederick Taylor. I'm gonna be honest. I love, I love my child.

• 43:07Fred Taylor?

  Right, right, right.

• 43:09Ryan Clark?

  But I'm not gonna tweet, and Bron, you're my guy. I think it's awesome that you're a great father.

• 43:15Fred Taylor?

  We're, we're talking about, we are talking about bloodline, and we are talking about one of the greatest players ever. He's probably number one in my book, Stan, so that's the conversation. But listen. He knows his bloodline. When LeBron came, I'm gonna ask that.

• 43:29Ryan Clark?

  Ask the basketball mind.

• 43:30Fred Taylor?

  I did ask the coach and we'll get back. But when LeBron came out to himself, that was true. He was better than majority of guys on the court as a high schooler. I could be wrong, but that's the way I saw it.

• 43:42Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 43:43Fred Taylor?

  So what do you think about that coming?

• 43:45Speaker 04

  Well, for Bron, you know, when he came out, like I said, he had the longest run that I've seen. Somebody with the expectations of coming into the league and then surpassing those expectations and then stand on top for 20 years. He averaged 28 points a game at 38. Like, so like, he's dealt with all the scrutiny, all the pressure, and he's exceeded all expectations. And then, like I said, Bronny is a hell of a talent as well. And so, I mean, if you look at young teams and you look at like certain teams, like, yeah, I wouldn't say, I wouldn't say it's far off. Like, you know, Bronny, he could be on that level, some guys that are playing in the league, younger guys that are still trying to find their way. And so, I wouldn't say like every player, all these players, but I mean, like, he's a hell of a talent.

• 44:27Speaker 04

  And so, I could see some comparisons to some of the young guys that's coming to the league at 19, 20, 21 years old that's trying to find their way. So I wouldn't say it was that far off.

• 44:36Fred Taylor?

  So if you guys had an opportunity in '24 and you're in the war room and Bronny's available, would you pull the trigger?

• 44:43Speaker 04

  I would like to. Yeah, I would love to.

• 44:45Ryan Clark?

  How old does that make you feel, though? You know, you're the point, Coach. Coach, you coached a dad, now you might have an opportunity to coach your son, or at the least, coach against it. That says a ton about the longevity of Ty Lou. Not just as a player, but as a coach. I mean, you got your own street, too. You know what I'm saying? And now...

• 45:10Speaker 04

  When you come from a small town, you got a lot of things.

• 45:13Speaker 04

  Yeah, so you come from Mexico, Missouri, man. Yeah, you got a lot of different things, you know, so...

• 45:18Ryan Clark?

  And you are now, Coach, and you're talking about managing those personalities. When you're a player, and I was much like this, you know, when you do become a guy that that works hard, you understand your role in these different things, sometimes the leadership position is hard, and I want to kind of oppose Channing in this, whereas guys like Tibbs or the Van Gundy's, they get this sort of level of respect because of the way people feel they've gone about getting their jobs, right? And then when you become a head coach as a player, they sometimes look at your playing career as the level of respect they'll give you. Like, instead of, instead of a guy being like, "Yeah, I know you played," they're like, "Yeah, you played, but you were a role guy."

• 46:02Speaker 04

  Right.

• 46:03Ryan Clark?

  Is there ever any times where you feel like you may get pushed back from some of the stars because you weren't necessarily that sort of player during your career?

• 46:12Speaker 04

  Yeah, I don't think so. When you win a championship, I think you get stamped as being a, you know, being a pretty good coach, and like I said, I got a long ways to go, and I understand that. I never stopped working, I never stopped trying to figure out different things, different ways to be better. But like, when you talk about Tibbs and Van Gundy and guys like that, like, they, they had a grind.

• 46:33Ryan Clark?

  Yeah.

• 46:34Speaker 04

  Like, you started in the, in the, um, video room, you might be an intern, then you, you know, then you do the video, then you chopping film, you might go to coach at D3, like, so they had a grind. And so, I, I wouldn't say they would say like, "Oh, well, they're better." I would say like, they have the experience, like, because they've done it at every level. Like, Tibbs coaching, oh, I think, D3 or D high school, whatever, you did video, you did film, and so, to get to where you want to get, you've been doing it a long time. Whereas me, you know, I came in and coached with Doc for a while, but then I got elevated, you know, to the head coach in Cleveland, like, a year and a half when I was there, you know, and so, like, well, he's never done it before, like, and like I said, I, truthfully, I didn't know if I could do it either, you know what I mean? But it doesn't make you better one way or another, I just think their grind was different.

• 47:18Speaker 04

  And so, when you see the grind they had to make to get to where they want to get to, you're like, "Damn, that's a lot of work." Like, a lot of hard work, and it's not easy. And so, um, like, so the comparisons are like different, but I, like, when you take the route they took, that's a lot of respect to those guys, because like, to stay with it and do everything they had to do to get to this point, it's a lot of work.

• 47:37Ryan Clark?

  How much truth is there to the story that before Frank Vogel was hired? As the Lakers coach, you were in conversations to be the head coach there as well.

• 47:48Speaker 04

  Yes.

• 47:49Ryan Clark?

  What happened? Like you had another opportunity to?

• 47:52Speaker 04

  I can't remember.

• 47:52Ryan Clark?

  Oh, you can't remember?

• 47:55Channing Crowder?

  My man was ready for that one.

• 47:59Channing Crowder?

  Tom was ready for that one.

• 48:00Speaker 04

  I can't remember.

• 48:02Ryan Clark?

  I think when he texted me to ask me what we were gonna talk about, I left that one out.

• 48:07Speaker 04

  I can't remember, man.

• 48:09Ryan Clark?

  You have an opportunity and you follow Doc Rivers here in L.A. Kawhi Leonard, Paul George, you know, now Russell Westbrook. I believe you guys went to the conference finals. What was it, two years ago?

• 48:23Speaker 04

  Two years ago, yeah.

• 48:24Ryan Clark?

  Against Phoenix. And there are those expectations, not only because you have won a championship, but you've shown the propensity to continue to build championship contending teams. How much pressure is it on you as a head coach when people from the outside looking in are saying, okay, you have these All-Stars, these all-time greats, these future Hall of Famers? So the expectations is, we're putting this team together to go win. Is that part of those sleepless nights, understanding that those expectations are heaped upon you guys now because of the roster?

• 48:59Speaker 04

  I wouldn't say that. I would just say, like, most of the sleepless nights are coming, like I said, when you lose games or when some of you drill for the last three years and we just, we just don't do it, you know? And so, like, what can I do different? Like, is there a different way of teaching it or showing it? But like, things that we know we should do and should do every single night and you don't do it, then those, you know, those accumulate the sleepless nights as well, you know? And so, man, like I said, coaching's hard. And, you know, you gotta be the leader of the team, you know, no matter what. You lose tough games. I might not be able to sleep at night, I might be mad or pissed off, but when I come in the next day, I gotta be smiling, I gotta be vibrant, I gotta be, you know, into it

• 49:40Speaker 04

  and make sure these guys don't feel that, you know, that I'm down or mad about a game that we've just lost. And so, and when you're the leader of the team as well, you know, whether or not... A player messes something up, or I'm gonna take the blame regardless. Like, that's just how I'm built. I know a hundred times over that that wasn't my fault, but I'm gonna go to the media and be like, "You know what? That was my fault. I didn't do this, I didn't do that." And I know that it wasn't my fault, but I'm gonna take the blame. As a leader, that's what you should do.

• 50:07Ryan Clark?

  You look at where you are now in your career. You think back to Mexico, Missouri, and all of those things. When you're with your Uncle J and you're, you know, looking up to him, Globetrotter. I saw he averaged a triple-double in high school. That's absolutely crazy to me. Did you ever envision, Coach, that this would be your journey?

• 50:31Speaker 04

  Not at all. I mean, you always, you know, dreaming apart about making it to the NBA, you know, taking care of your family. But my Uncle J, like, he taught me work at a young age, just seeing how he would go play one on zero, full court by himself, go down to the park, play by himself, take me with him. You know, and just, so I looked up to him and idolized him because, you know, you come from a small town, you don't have cable. We didn't have cable, so I ain't seeing the games and none of that. And a lot of TVs, a lot of games wasn't televised, you know, back then. So, all you know and all you see is, when you go to the high school games, you see like the older guys playing, like, those are the guys you look up to. And so, you know, you're never in the park going, "Cutting out three, two, one, game winner, I'm the coach." Like, "No, you the player."

• 51:16Speaker 04

  You know what I'm saying? "I'm the player." Like, you know what I'm saying? So, it's just, it's just different coaching. Like, it's just, it's different. You know what I mean? For me, because you always wanna be the player, you know? But he taught me a lot, man. And like I said, my Uncle J, who's been there for me every step of the way, and just, you know, he was hard on me. You know, I, one time in high school, I had a quadruple-double. And I'm high, I'm like, "Man, that ain't nothing. That ain't, you wanna go to Georgia Tech? Bobby Cremins don't care about no eighteen points, sixteen assists. You gotta score forty." You can't, I'm like, "I tried a triple, a quadruple-double." Like, "Haven't been done in the state of Missouri, ever."

• 51:50Ryan Clark?

  Right.

• 51:51Speaker 04

  Like, and then the next night, I had a triple-double. "That still ain't enough." Like, "You gotta, like, God." Like, "What you want me to do?" Like, you know what I'm saying? So, like, he was, but it was, it was a tough love. Like, so I would never get complacent, you know? Never think I was good enough. Like, always wanna continue to keep working to prove them wrong. Like, and he, he kept me, he kept me that way. So, I really, I'm thankful for that, you know? So, that was dope.

• 52:12Fred Taylor?

  Hey, Ty, I'm looking at your 2016 Cleveland Cavaliers championship photo right here.

• 52:19Speaker 00

  Every game day, you show up for your team. Now it's your time.

• 52:30Speaker 00

  Ask your prescriber about Wegovy. Someaglutide injection, 2.4 milligrams a GLP-1. Call 1-833-4-WEGOVIE or visit Wegovy.com to view the medication guide and to learn more about Wegovy. Why wait?

• 52:48Fred Taylor?

  As a, as a coach, have you had an opportunity to envision President Biden bumping Barack, President Obama out the way and him holding the 2023 championship jersey up?

• 53:00Speaker 04

  I haven't envisioned that, but now I am, now that you say it.

• 53:03Fred Taylor?

  Maybe it's an opportunity, I don't think it's ever been done.

• 53:06Speaker 04

  What's that?

• 53:06Fred Taylor?

  To have a former President Obama and now his vice president back in the day, you would be able to win a championship under him being the, the new president. I don't think that's ever.

• 53:16Speaker 04

  I don't think so either. That'd be dope. Yeah. Yeah. Super dope.

• 53:19Fred Taylor?

  You guys are sixth right now in the West, but you're getting better.

• 53:22Speaker 04

  Getting better.

• 53:23Fred Taylor?

  Right. So can you foresee it?

• 53:25Speaker 04

  When I'm in the playoffs, I like my chances.

• 53:27Fred Taylor?

  I love it.

• 53:28Channing Crowder?

  And Coach, you talk about, how about your mentor and people raising you up and, and giving you a hard time about quadruple doubles? You being a player, you knowing what these young guys going through. Do you have any, is, is there any indecisionness about how involved you get with their off the court life? How much advice you give them, the financial questions? You're in L.A., bro. The partying, the girls, like, do you ever struggle with how involved you get there?

• 53:51Speaker 04

  I don't struggle. I think, you know, when you hear something or you see something, like, you want to give these young guys as much advice as you can, you know? And so, um, if, if I didn't, I wouldn't be doing my job. And so I don't look at myself as like just a Clippers head coach. I look at myself as a young black man that can inspire a lot of black and brown kids around the world, you know? And so when you're going through tough times and we lost five in a row, like, how are you going to handle it? You know, how, you know, what are you going to do? So for me, it's my job, like I said, to make sure I'm reaching out to just more than basketball players, more than just athletes. It's more about, you know, culture and, and different people that I can help and try to help advance as much as I can, even if you know them or not. You know, like seeing Tyron Lou from Mexico, Missouri, you know?

• 54:36Speaker 04

  Running a billion dollar corporation, you know, through the help of Mr. Bomber, but like, I'm the head coach of a billion dollar corporation. You know, and so when you see that from a guy that's come from a small town, like you can inspire a lot of young black kids, a lot of brown kids, and you know, all kids around the board. And so that's kind of how I look at myself. No matter how tough things get, how hard things get, like it's bigger than me.

• 54:58Channing Crowder?

  You don't have to get no names. But did any of your players ever try to get over on you where you got to remind them, I've been a part of this? The guy comes in, in the steam room, 5 a.m., didn't want to breathe in your face, trying to put the Visine in his eye. You got to remind the bro, I know what's going on.

• 55:11Speaker 04

  Yeah, for sure. Like, yeah, you see it every day.

• 55:13Channing Crowder?

  Yeah.

• 55:14Speaker 04

  Yeah, you see it all the time, but they know they can't pull it over on me. Yeah, they know I know what's going on.

• 55:19Ryan Clark?

  You saying about just being, not just the head coach of the Clippers, but being a black man who has been through this experience. We had Michael Beasley on the show, I guess it has to be almost a year now. And it wasn't a dry eye at the shoot, because he was just talking about the things he had been through in life, the adversity he'd come through and where he was now. You know, with young players that we're watching in the league that are young superstars who are now facing some of those adversities that maybe they weren't prepared for and having to deal with them. What would be your advice to kids that look like us, that get an opportunity, whether they're 19, 20, to be drafted?

• 56:01Ryan Clark?

  And now, same as you, you have now become the breadwinner. You have now to have to behave as the leader. What would be your life in making that adjustment and now going from boy to man?

• 56:14Speaker 04

  The dedication and respect for the game. Because you come into the NBA and the game gives you everything that you want, that you can never imagine or dreamed of, you know, for your family, for yourself, for your friends, and everything that you can, like, you can go on vacation to Paris, like, if you don't make it to the NBA or the NFL, like. So things that the game was giving you, you got to give it back. And that means like, for me, I only went out with the Lakers because Shaq made us go out as young players the night before a game. But my 11-year career, I never went out night before a game. Like, I just never did. I respected the game. I'm not, I'm not going to do that. I respect the game too much. And so my thing is like, just giving the game back what the game has given you. And so, respect for the game. Put your work in every single day. Don't cheat the game. Don't cheat the process. And things will work out.

• 56:58Speaker 04

  And the last thing is just being a good person. It don't hurt to be a good person. You know, no matter how many tough days you have, we all have bad days, but you can always be a good person. And so, um, sometimes it can be to a fault, you know? Since December, I lost seven family members, you know, from Mexico. But we lost six games in a row, so I, I can't leave my team behind. Like, and I know I should be there for my family, and it's been a tough time, cause my family wanted me there. And, and we're going through some tough times right now, but people even notice, but like, seven family members since December, and I ain't go to one funeral because we lost five games in a row. Like, and so like, well, I can take the easy way out and say, I'm gonna go home for a week or I'm gonna go, but I, I just felt like I couldn't do that. And sometimes you can get a game too much.

• 57:41Speaker 04

  You know, sometimes you can get a game too much where like family and stuff, like real life stuff matters, it's important. But I'll just build different, like, if we had won five in a row, hell, you had to went home for three of the funerals, three or four of them, you know? But when you're going through tough times, people wanna see how you react and kinda look at, are you trying to take the easy way out, or are you trying to, you know, do something different? So, you know, it's just decisions you have to make, but my biggest thing for young kids is make sure you give the game back what it's giving you.

• 58:06Ryan Clark?

  You don't have kids, you give the game so much. And just hearing you say that there's been seven people close to you passed, and you haven't gotten the opportunity to go to any of the funerals. Has basketball given you that much that you feel like you owe it all of that?

• 58:23Speaker 04

  Yes, a hundred percent. Just look at the people from Mexico, how I grew up, and we call it one way in, no way out. If it wasn't for basketball, I know what I would be doing, or I know where I'd be at, you know what I mean? And so, man, if it wasn't for this game, I definitely wouldn't be successful in the right, the right, you know, light. No, hell no. Like, you don't see, you don't see success every day in Mexico. You know, how you, how do you measure success when you've never seen it? You know, like, so I'm in Mexico, eleven thousand people, eleven hundred black people, and I see the drugs, and I see the, like, what, what am I seeing that's, that's positive every day? You don't see positivity until you see people around you that are positive. Like, I don't want to be no school teacher. Like, you know what I'm saying? And nothing wrong with that.

• 59:07Speaker 04

  Like, but like, growing up as a young black kid, like, I don't want to be a school teacher and deal with guys like me every day.

• 59:12Channing Crowder?

  Right.

• 59:13Speaker 04

  Like, I, I don't want that, you know? So you don't see that, you know, in Mexico. And so, man, the game is giving me everything. And so, like I told him every day, if God's saying this, I'm coming down in five seconds, you're done, I'm gonna get on my knees and say, thank you for everything. Like, I can't be mad. You know what I mean? And so, I'll die out there on the court. That's, I mean, that's what I love, and that's the game.

• 59:31Channing Crowder?

  But, Coach, you made it out of Mexico. You're not, you didn't become a school teacher. You went on to win multiple championships as a player and a coach. You've made it now, and you're still working hard as you did when you were in Mexico in high school. Like, bro, you hit the finish line.

• 59:48Speaker 04

  But I didn't.

• 59:49Channing Crowder?

  Yes, you did.

• 59:50Speaker 04

  For me, but I got other people to worry about.

• 59:52Channing Crowder?

  You're going to basketball till you die?

• 59:54Speaker 04

  No. I'm gonna go basketball until I got enough money to sit back and say, you know what? You know what? It's just good enough. But like, until, man, no. I got my grandma, my aunties, my uncles, my sisters, brothers, my mom. Like, no. I got too many responsibilities. And when you come from a small town, you know everybody. And so, you gotta take care of everybody in the best way you can, you know, without putting yourself out, you know? And so, no, you got a lot of responsibility. And so, if it was just me, I'd be gone a long time ago.

• 1:00:23Channing Crowder?

  Really?

• 1:00:23Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah. I'd have been gone a long time ago, you know? But it's bigger than me, like I said earlier.

• 1:00:28Fred Taylor?

  In your journey to this day, what's been your greatest pivot in life? The point that, I guess, changed everything for you? That one moment?

• 1:00:37Speaker 04

  It's been a lot of moments, man. You know, I've been blessed and been lucky to really, um, get out of a lot of situations that I should, I don't know how I got out of. When I moved to Kansas City, my sophomore year in high school, and just seeing how my mom was crying because she didn't want me to go. I knew I had to make it worth it. You know, I knew like if I'm gonna leave my mom in Mexico, my sister's too, and my little brother Greg. If I'm gonna leave and do this three-year being in Kansas City, like, it's gotta be worth it. You know what I mean? And so, I'll never forget the look on her face when she was crying. And it was like, it's more like a family decision. Like, we all sit down, like, if we wanna take this next step, if we wanna get them, you know, seen by colleges and, you know, have a chance to play, like, we gotta make this move.

• 1:01:20Speaker 04

  And so, seeing her cry the way she did and seeing how hard it was for me, I knew I had to make it worth it. And so, that was, I probably, that was my biggest pivot. Your family, everybody Chiefs fans? Chiefs and Rams. Because Mexico is, yeah, Mexico is close to St. Louis. Right. Yeah, and then, you know, Kansas City, it's both, it's like a split. You know, everybody's like Chiefs and Rams, so.

• 1:01:41Ryan Clark?

  Well, you could be, it's everybody Chiefs now, because it's the trendy thing.

• 1:01:44Speaker 04

  It is kinda sorta.

• 1:01:45Ryan Clark?

  You got Patrick Mahomes, man, I cheer for Patrick Mahomes.

• 1:01:47Speaker 04

  I mean, I always grew up a Rams fan. Well, first it was Cardinals.

• 1:01:50Ryan Clark?

  Right.

• 1:01:50Speaker 04

  Then they went to Arizona, then it was the Rams. And then they took a team from St. Louis, and then, so I've always been a Rams fan. But I cheer for the Chiefs, it's my second team, you know, because it's Missouri, so, yeah.

• 1:02:00Ryan Clark?

  Well, I'm gonna say this, so, one, two, coach. Pull up the video, I was shooting earlier.

• 1:02:05Speaker 04

  I will, they got it in there, okay.

• 1:02:07Ryan Clark?

  So, pull up the video, coach, if you need, listen, I could do a ten-day, I got six files to give, coach.

• 1:02:13Speaker 04

  Can you take care of the ball?

• 1:02:15Ryan Clark?

  Yo, don't really throw it to me like that. You know, so my, my thought would be, my thought would be, don't give it to me.

• 1:02:20Speaker 04

  Unless you ready to shoot it.

• 1:02:21Ryan Clark?

  Unless I'm, no, I could, you know, coach, all football players think they can hoop. In high school, I thought I could hoop until I got to college, right? Because I wanted to stay championship, I thought, yeah, and I went to play with the real basketball players. Then I realized I really couldn't hoop.

• 1:02:34Speaker 04

  But y'all super athletic, though.

• 1:02:35Ryan Clark?

  Oh, I make layups. I make layups, coach. But when I was down there, man, they said that you are the funniest person in the building. That's what everybody said. So, all I'm asking is, the next Ty Lou, Fourth of July party in Mexico, just invite the pivot.

• 1:02:53Speaker 04

  Man, you serious?

• 1:02:53Ryan Clark?

  Invite the pivot, coach.

• 1:02:54Speaker 04

  Y'all are invited.

• 1:02:55Ryan Clark?

  There it is. There it is, coach.

• 1:02:57Speaker 04

  Y'all are invited.

• 1:02:58Ryan Clark?

  It's crazy.

• 1:03:00Speaker 04

  I like this.

• 1:03:03Speaker 04

  Appreciate you, coach. No, yeah, for sure.

• 1:03:11Channing Crowder?

  I stopped drinking, stopped smoking. Got on, remember Isometrics, delicious drinks and shakes and all this shit? Got on that shit, lost like 20 pounds, was shredded up. Bitch, I couldn't make a play.

• 1:03:22Channing Crowder?

  And I went to Zach, I went to Zach Thomas. Zach Thomas, I said, "Zach, man, this shit, once you're stretching and all, I said, man, I'm about to go out to these streets." "Well, do what you, do what you gotta do." And he turned it up. "We're ball week, folk." Your routine? Yeah, yeah, he said, "Stick to your routine."

• 1:03:34Ryan Clark?

  When I, when I met Zach at the Super Bowl, that's the first thing he talked about.

• 1:03:38Channing Crowder?

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:03:39Ryan Clark?

  He was, he was like, "Man, thank you." He's like, "How I'm dealing with Chan?" I was like, "That's my dog." And he's like, "Yeah, man, Chan, I tried to get him right, but... them up."

• 1:03:49Channing Crowder?

  You gotta get an acupuncture guy every Wednesday.

• 1:03:52Ryan Clark?

  For what?

• 1:03:53Channing Crowder?

  I'm gonna hit Tussis real quick, and I'm gonna be seeing you tomorrow. Whatever your routine is, make you play bad. Appreciate you, Cole.