$45k Rivian Could Change Everything! New Porsche Supercar? Montana Plate Crackdown!

Have a question you want answered on the podcast next week? Ask HERE https://crsnbds.com/PODQUESTIONS Welcome to THIS CAR POD! Doug DeMuro & Friends offers weekly expert insight and opinion on breaking automotive stories, the car market, and audience Q&A. Thank you to our sponsors! DeleteMe - Visit https://joindeleteme.com/DEMURO for 20% off! Claude - Visit https://claude.ai/cars to get half price Claude Pro for three months Square - Get up to $200 off Square hardware when you sign up at https://square.com/go/CARPOD #squarepod DOWNLOAD OUR APP: https://crsnbds.com/app-store NEW MERCH! https://merch.carsandbids.com FOLLOW CARS & BIDS! YouTube - @carsandbids Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/carsandbids/ TikTok - https://www.tiktok.com/@cars_and_bids Twitter - https://twitter.com/carsandbids FOLLOW ME! Twitter - http://www.twitter.com/dougdemuro Instagram - http://www.instagram.com/dougdemuro Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/ddemuro Chapters: 00:00:00 THIS CAR POD! 00:00:10 Porsche's New Supercar 00:07:11 Rivian R2 Pricing 00:13:05 Audi A8 Is Dead 00:17:19 Car And Driver Calling Out Doug 00:20:47 TE37 Day In Japan 00:23:00 Montana Plate Crack Down 00:27:00 Car With The Most Speeding Tickets 00:32:36 Hyundai Kills Ioniq 6 00:35:57 Mercedes-Benz VLE 00:38:46 Stellantis Is Hiring Engineers 00:42:37 Talk Cars 00:44:08 Kennan Went To Moda 00:53:37 Kennan's SL65 Is For Sale! 01:01:04 Market Report 01:01:47 2010 BMW 535i Wagon 01:06:03 Cadillac Allante 01:08:55 1991 Nissan 300ZX 01:11:31 Community Questions 01:12:26 What Happened To The Racing SIm? 01:13:25 Would A New Viper Save Stellantis? 01:17:37 Does Doug Have The Final Say In What He Reviews? 01:19:40 How Was The Podcast Created? 01:21:17 What Is The Telltale Sign It's Time to Sell? 01:25:40 Would Doug Sell The Carrera GT For An F40? #carsandbids #dougdemuro Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

  At Edward Jones, we believe rich is more than caring about the latest and greatest. It's also taking care of what gives your life meaning. That's why your dedicated financial advisor meets you where you are with personalized financial strategies that help protect what matters so you can preserve your progress while creating a path forward. The key to being rich is knowing what counts. Let's find your rich together. Edward Jones. Member SIPC.

• 0:31Speaker 01

  Into the wild, the Caltier Panther encounters a shimmering crocodile, a lonely lovebird, a breathless zebra, and a restless tiger.

• 0:50Doug DeMuro?

  Hello and welcome to This Car Pod. I'm Kenan. I'm Filippo. I'm Doug, and let's start with the news.

• 0:58Speaker 03

  Ah, Porsche. Now, recently Porsche has been having a little bit of a tough time. They reported a 5.8 billion, uh, 5.8 billion dollars less in profit in 2025. Not a good situation.

• 1:08Doug DeMuro?

  You know what I, you know what hit me though about this? Cause this has been reported, it's been a big splash.

• 1:12Speaker 03

  Big news.

• 1:12Doug DeMuro?

  They reported like 5.9 billion in profit last year and two years ago, and this year they reported like 90 million.

• 1:18Speaker 03

  Yep.

• 1:19Doug DeMuro?

  But you know what my great friend Manny Koshbin once taught me? You don't go broke making a profit.

• 1:25Speaker 03

  That's right.

• 1:26Doug DeMuro?

  90 million is still 90 million. If Filippo made 90 million, you know what he'd be doing? Probably this.

• 1:31Speaker 03

  Probably, probably still this. I don't think anything in his life would change in any regard.

• 1:36Doug DeMuro?

  Why change a good thing?

• 1:37Speaker 03

  Yes, but it gets a little bit worse. Of course VW has been saying for a little while they're gonna cut 50,000 jobs. They can, that includes at Porsche by 2030. So things aren't looking great at Porsche, but they have a new CEO and he has some ideas about how Porsche can make some money. And one of the big things is they, he said recently is quote, "They are looking at sports cars above the 911," which means one of these in theory. Now, of course, there are models of 911 that haven't come out yet. GT2 RS, for instance, but they're considering other models and that we kind of think means there's gonna be a hypercar.

• 2:06Doug DeMuro?

  The fellow who runs Porsche now came from McLaren.

• 2:10Speaker 03

  Which makes me a little bit concerned.

• 2:12Doug DeMuro?

  Isn't that weird? Like you're promoting people and hiring people who have not had success at other companies? Like, I don't understand that.

• 2:20Speaker 03

  Right, they look at the McLaren lineup and it's like, yeah.

• 2:23Doug DeMuro?

  To be fair, McLaren went from

• 2:24Speaker 03

  This is zero here to like here.

• 2:27Doug DeMuro?

  But it was reported only a couple of years ago that they were like teetering on the edge of bankruptcy.

• 2:33Speaker 03

  You start out teetering on the edge of bankruptcy. You're not, it's good. Growth is less teeter, it's teetering a little less.

• 2:39Doug DeMuro?

  Well, but Porsche is not in that position. They need someone who, they don't need like a McLaren. They need someone who like can take a good thing. Now, regardless.

• 2:46Speaker 03

  It's a weird hire.

• 2:47Doug DeMuro?

  So they say there's going to be cars above the 911. You're saying hypercar. My personal point of view is we're going to be talking like SF90 type stuff.

• 2:54Speaker 03

  Well, yeah, to be, yeah, to be clear, they said, we're looking at models and derivatives above our current two door sports cars and above the Cayenne.

• 3:01Doug DeMuro?

  Right. We know, we already, it's crazy that they would say that. We already know they're going to do a three row Cayenne. That's like talked about.

• 3:07Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 3:07Doug DeMuro?

  We also kind of know they're going to do a hypercar. It was supposed to come out along with F80 and W1, but they were going all electric with Mission X. And more or less it has leaked that they are cancelling their development of a full electric. And they're instead going to go for something different.

• 3:22Speaker 03

  Right. Well, yeah, and we're not exactly sure yet. Don't forget they did recently file a patent for a W18 engine. I'm not saying that's going to go, and it seems unlikely to me as well.

• 3:30Doug DeMuro?

  I think that what they ought to do is their time tested, uh, strategy of to take their Formula One engine, like, like they did with the Carrera GT and just put it in a, uh, in a supercar.

• 3:40Speaker 03

  Well, technically with their ties to Audi, they could put an actual Formula One engine in a car for the first time.

• 3:47Doug DeMuro?

  Well, you know, the, the 918 had an actual LeMans race car in it.

• 3:50Speaker 03

  Is LeMans Formula One? Uh, let me do the math. Carry the one.

• 3:53Doug DeMuro?

  But the point is it had a race car motor, like it was real.

• 3:56Speaker 03

  It did. I mean, well, and this would have if they could build engines and the rules didn't change, but timing didn't work out. It's a road car engine in a road car. Just saying, but yes, I'm nonetheless excited.

• 4:06Doug DeMuro?

  Live from a Formula One power.

• 4:08Speaker 03

  It was derivative at best.

• 4:10Doug DeMuro?

  You know what Filippo would do if he got 90 million? He'd buy the lot behind his house. He, cause he's worried about the lot behind his house being developed one day.

• 4:19Speaker 03

  Right. Not in his backyard, I'll tell you that.

• 4:21Doug DeMuro?

  But I'm, I'm, I'm supportive.

• 4:23Speaker 04

  They said as part of that same press conference, "We're using the current challenges as an opportunity to act even more decisively. We will comprehensively reposition Porsche, make the company leaner, faster, and its products even more desirable."

• 4:36Doug DeMuro?

  That's true. I'm glad to hear that they feel that way, and I'm sure that they will. And the products are still great, except for the electric Cayenne, which is not going to sell. But, or the electric Macan, which is not currently selling.

• 4:46Speaker 03

  Right. And yes, and the electric Cayenne that people are infuriated about that doesn't exist yet.

• 4:50Doug DeMuro?

  And the Taycan and Panamera, which neither of them sell.

• 4:53Speaker 03

  Right.

• 4:53Doug DeMuro?

  But other than that.

• 4:55Speaker 04

  And really, they just need to sell cars in China, which they have failed to do the last year. But, you know, maybe.

• 5:00Speaker 03

  I don't know. Yeah, we'll certainly see what happens. Nonetheless, like, I'm excited for whatever the next Porsche hypercar is. We've been waiting a while now.

• 5:07Doug DeMuro?

  It is so weird. Porsche is such a weird brand, because they have this, like, capability to sell cars in the $600 to $2 million price point, but they also sell an SUV that is leased at, like, incentive teaser deals. Like, what other company is like that? Like, it is such a weird situation. So, there probably is room for them to go in at a higher number. I have a suspicion McLaren CEO comes in and says, "Hey, why don't you guys actually compete directly with the 750S? Like, you have your GT3 RS and your GT2 RS, do compete with them, but like, at the very highest level of this existing sports car, why don't you have a purpose-built car, especially with your Porsche brand name? McLaren has a hard time selling cars at this price point, but Porsche wouldn't. Why don't you go and do this?"

• 5:49Speaker 04

  Didn't Porsche have trouble selling Carrera GTs?

• 5:51Speaker 03

  And 918s.

• 5:52Doug DeMuro?

  It was a different market. It was a different market. And 918 is short, but the car is a very different price point. I'm talking about like, the $500,000 to $800,000.

• 5:59Speaker 04

  Yeah, they should.

• 6:00Doug DeMuro?

  Where SF90 is.

• 6:01Speaker 04

  Maybe they will. Maybe that's what it'll be.

• 6:02Doug DeMuro?

  I think that is what it'll be. We hope it has three pedals.

• 6:05Speaker 03

  Oh, my God. Imagine if it did.

• 6:07Speaker 04

  Sorry, I just gotta say now.

• 6:09Speaker 03

  It won't. But if, but...

• 6:10Doug DeMuro?

  Why do you say it won't?

• 6:11Speaker 03

  They're decisive now, Filippo, so...

• 6:13Doug DeMuro?

  If anybody would, it would be Porsche.

• 6:15Speaker 04

  There's three trim at the moment. Porsche sells three trims of cars that have a manual transmission. The Carrera T, the GT3 Touring, and something else.

• 6:24Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah, but Filippo...

• 6:25Speaker 04

  There's no other cars in their lineup, of all the cars they sell, that are manual. I know, they should recognize that there's a huge case for it. They should, but I don't think they will.

• 6:34Doug DeMuro?

  That's being deliberately, like, the 911ST went out of production yesterday afternoon, and not only did it sell out as a only manual transmission car, but used ones are selling for double the sticker price.

• 6:44Speaker 04

  I agree.

• 6:44Doug DeMuro?

  So, like, ultimately, it's a little...

• 6:46Speaker 04

  I agree that they should take the message that there's strong demand.

• 6:49Doug DeMuro?

  They will.

• 6:50Speaker 04

  But don't you kind of think that they won't?

• 6:51Doug DeMuro?

  I think that they want to satisfy enthusiasts. If they're gonna, you know, the Carrera GT's birth story is in a lot of ways related to the fact that Cayenne had come out and a lot of people were discounting Porsche as an enthusiast brand.

• 7:04Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 7:04Doug DeMuro?

  And so they had to come out with something really special like that. I wouldn't be surprised if they come out with a three-row Cayenne and if they come out with all these electric cars, if they say, hey, we're also gonna do a true manual transmission supercar in the image of something like that to really prove to people that even though we're also heading in this direction, we can still head in the true Porsche.

• 7:23Speaker 03

  We haven't forgotten who we are.

• 7:24Speaker 04

  I hope so, but if you want to compete on power and specs, they're already at kind of the pinnacle of where they can go with transmissions they already have and engines they already have.

• 7:32Speaker 03

  But they've proved that they don't have to. They have to compete on is driving involvement because they're an enthusiast's brand. And that's what they capitalize on and they're doing really well with GT3.

• 7:40Doug DeMuro?

  And the fact that 911 STs are selling for 700,000 should give them a message that there are new car buyers willing to spend that money on a special car that has a manual transmission.

• 7:50Speaker 03

  Yeah, this is the signal, Jerry. This is the signal.

• 7:52Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 7:53Doug DeMuro?

  Uh, Porsche is a boring thing to talk about. Let's talk about the most interesting news story of the week. Rivian R2 pricing. Rivian R2 pricing is finally here. Are you ready for it, Filippo? Do you know what it is?

• 8:03Speaker 04

  I don't know what it is and I'm very excited.

• 8:04Doug DeMuro?

  All right, we're filming this before the embargo, so I have to look at my embargoed information. The standard Rivian, base model, 350 horsepower Rivian, 265 miles of range. Take a guess what that car costs. Base model, rear-wheel drive, 350 horse, 060 and 59.

• 8:22Speaker 04

  For the R2, 60. Cause an R1 base is what, 80?

• 8:26Doug DeMuro?

  That starts at $45,000.

• 8:28Speaker 04

  Wow.

• 8:29Doug DeMuro?

  Now, that's not coming right away. The standard, it's a year out.

• 8:34Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 8:34Doug DeMuro?

  It's a year out. The standard, a year and a half. The standard model has 350 horse, 345 miles of range. So it's a long range model. That's 48.5.

• 8:45Speaker 04

  Wow, these are appealing prices.

• 8:47Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah, 350 horse and 345 miles of range, that's what you need from a car. 45, this is predestination, pre-options, I want to be clear.

• 8:53Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 8:53Doug DeMuro?

  That's, that's less than a year out, okay? The premium, which is 450 horse, 0 to 60 in 4.6, 330 miles of range, starts at 54. To me, that's, that's the segment leader.

• 9:05Speaker 04

  A 4Runner TRD off-road premium starts at 56.

• 9:10Doug DeMuro?

  What does a Model Y cost? Like, to me, this, these numbers are really, really appealing. 54,000 for a 450 horse, 540 pound-feet, 0 to 60 in 4.6, 330 miles of range. It checks every box, and it looks like that, and it drives so well.

• 9:26Speaker 04

  It does.

• 9:26Doug DeMuro?

  54,000, what is, what is a-

• 9:28Speaker 04

  Model Y, the rear-wheel-drive basis model starts at 40. To get to a premium all-wheel-drive, you're at 49.

• 9:35Doug DeMuro?

  49. This is within, this is gonna absolutely be within Model Y territory, except it is a much more appealing car. It looks better, it, it can do more. Obviously, it's off-road capable where the Y is not. You don't have the Elon problem, which for a lot of our viewers, I know, it's not a problem. You love the man, but for a lot of people, it is, realistically. Obviously, it's more practical. I, and then there's the performance at the top of the lineup. 650 horse, 3.6 seconds 0 to 60 with the launch package, that's a $58,000 car. Now, again, all this is pre-destination. Destination's 1,500 bucks, so add 1,500 bucks to all those numbers.

• 10:08Speaker 04

  It's also interesting compared to regular ice car. It's like, I talked about a 4Runner, a Land Cruiser, which is maybe more comparable from like a luxury, like-

• 10:15Doug DeMuro?

  Position.

• 10:16Speaker 04

  Positioning standpoint. MSRP for the 1958, which is the base model- It's 57.6.

• 10:20Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah.

• 10:21Speaker 04

  So you're, you can get the top trim-

• 10:23Doug DeMuro?

  57,600? God, that car is so overpriced, it's such a-

• 10:26Speaker 04

  And the regular-

• 10:27Doug DeMuro?

  It's the worst car on sale.

• 10:27Speaker 04

  The regular, if you want the square headlights, is 64.

• 10:30Doug DeMuro?

  God, wow. That's about 61 more than I'd spend. Uh, but this, this is an appealing car. And, talk about road, compared to a Land Cruiser, the road manners are so significantly better. You're not stressing out that four-cylinder engine that's barely keeping up with the car. This is a really compelling car. You gotta admit, between 46.5 for the very base model, and the very top trim with destination is still- Under $60,000. That's a 650 horse off-road SUV that does 0-60 in 3.6 with 330 miles of range. It is a perfect all-around.

• 11:02Speaker 04

  Incredibly appealing.

• 11:03Doug DeMuro?

  Incredibly appealing.

• 11:04Speaker 04

  Well, it's really important they hit a home run with this car. I mean, this is what we've been waiting for, admittedly. And I'm personally waiting for R3 because that's my thing, but this is so compelling. It's hard to argue with this.

• 11:15Doug DeMuro?

  Especially, I think R3 is going to be cool, but ultimately this is going to be the volume car.

• 11:18Speaker 04

  Absolutely, of course.

• 11:19Doug DeMuro?

  And I think it is incredibly, I think the only drawback is I really, truly believe it will lead into R1 sales. They don't, but they're wrong. Like, it just straight up will.

• 11:27Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 11:27Doug DeMuro?

  Especially because they're not visually differentiated. But I think that, um, I think that it's going to be a really big hit at those price points. I'm really surprised at those price points, obviously. Honestly. And in fact, the big sellers are going to be the standard and the premium. The standard starts at 48, 490 predestination. That's carefully created to make it fit right under $50,000 base before, uh, with destination, which is totally reasonable.

• 11:49Speaker 04

  And if they're single motor, motor, excuse me, if the single motor, which is a standard, right? If I'm understanding correctly.

• 11:55Doug DeMuro?

  Standard is rear-wheel drive, yeah.

• 11:56Speaker 04

  So if that is still giving you 350 horsepower.

• 11:59Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah.

• 12:00Speaker 04

  Great.

• 12:00Doug DeMuro?

  That's right. That's faster than any gas-powered competitor. It's faster than anything like that.

• 12:05Speaker 04

  Now, you probably do want all-wheel drive, and Rivian, I think, is still going after the off-road, or at least vaguely capable of.

• 12:10Doug DeMuro?

  To the premium, which is what I think I would do looking at these numbers, you step up to the premium, you get another 100 horsepower, you get all-wheel drive standard, a second's chopped off 0-60, your range is not affected at all, and the additional cost is only $5,000. The premium is like the one to get. It's just starting to get a little spendy at about 56 before options. But that's like the one to get.

• 12:29Speaker 04

  I'm impressed by this price.

• 12:30Doug DeMuro?

  You're buying one.

• 12:32Speaker 04

  Yeah, I can see it. You want one. You do. I do. I think it's an incredibly compelling offering. It will quickly go to the top of the list of what do you recommend to somebody?

• 12:41Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah.

• 12:42Speaker 04

  That's.

• 12:42Doug DeMuro?

  Anybody who comes to me now looking for an EV, I'd be like, you need an R2. But what about, no, no, look, it's time for an R2. You certainly don't want an IONIQ 6, am I right? Okay, we got, that's our two pricing, very compelling, very appealing.

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• 13:41Speaker 04

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• 13:51Speaker 00

  At Edward Jones, we believe rich is about taking care of what gives your life meaning. That's why your financial advisor personalizes your plan to help you preserve your progress and create something that lasts. Let's find your rich. Edward Jones. Member SIPC.

• 14:06Doug DeMuro?

  A lot of the rest of the news is devoted to cars that are dead, including the Audi A8, which is dead, surprises no one. We have reported on this podcast that the Lexus LS died, that was maybe six months ago. Obviously, eight, six, eight years ago, the Jaguar XJ died, the Acura RL died, all of the big luxury streams, RLX, all of the big... I don't know, 10 years, it's the big, it's like, we're seeing a pattern. And I have long predicted the death of the A8. One of the last videos of reviews I did of the A8, I was talking about it to be the last generation, which it was. But I still think the Seven Series is not long for this world.

• 14:42Speaker 04

  That's, yes, that is exactly what I thought when I saw this news. And they killed it in the Fatherland too. So in Germany, they're no longer accepting orders. And it's like, you just have to imagine Seven isn't that far behind. I see them a lot though, so, I don't know. They care a little bit more about that position. BMW holds on to the heritage.

• 14:57Doug DeMuro?

  You got to assume also that Seven Series is still selling relatively well enough. That like it's still pop relatively popular.

• 15:07Speaker 03

  It's justifiable for now, but its days may be now.

• 15:10Doug DeMuro?

  Man, it's sales numbers are low though. Oh, five oh six, they were selling seventeen, eighteen, sixteen thousand units a year. This is in the United States. These days they are lucky to crack ten. So in a normal year, they're selling half of what they, I'm sorry, oh, seven, oh, eight, they were selling seventeen, eighteen thousand units. These days are lucky to crack ten. They're selling half of what they were just fifteen years ago. The writing is on the wall.

• 15:29Speaker 03

  Half during the recession. That's.

• 15:31Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah.

• 15:31Speaker 03

  You know.

• 15:32Doug DeMuro?

  The writing is on the wall. It's pretty clear where the future of this car is is.

• 15:36Speaker 03

  Yep. But nonetheless, rest in peace AA.

• 15:39Doug DeMuro?

  It's a good car.

• 15:39Speaker 03

  Such a.

• 15:40Doug DeMuro?

  The AA was a good car. The Lexus LS was a good car. I don't think that any of the failure of this market of these vehicles have anything to do with the, their quality as vehicles. I think it is purely the market segment has moved on. People want SUVs. I mean, you could drive around in this or a Range Rover. You drive around in this, you look like the father of someone who has a Range Rover, you know, or the grandfather.

• 15:58Speaker 03

  I'm fine with that.

• 16:00Doug DeMuro?

  First.

• 16:00Speaker 03

  So true.

• 16:01Doug DeMuro?

  Nobody wants to say, and you know, remember they tried in this generation to make it where you open the door and it raises up like an SUV. So it's not so hard to get in. Shockingly, that that play didn't work.

• 16:10Speaker 03

  Incredible suspension technology though. It like predicts bumps, right? And like it has a camera to scan.

• 16:16Doug DeMuro?

  Cares about it.

• 16:16Speaker 03

  And I'm sure it will be reliable in the long term.

• 16:18Doug DeMuro?

  Nobody cares about any of this. I was the saddest about the Jaguar XJ because I thought the final generation XJ was a fantastic luxury.

• 16:24Speaker 03

  Well, luckily you had like 10 years of it being out.

• 16:26Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah, including with the V8. But this is another luxury sedan debt, full size luxury sedans. Thankfully Cadillac came out with one that costs $400,000. But other than that, other than that, what's left?

• 16:39Speaker 03

  The S class, which just got refreshed. That's going to stick around.

• 16:42Doug DeMuro?

  Yep. The S class, the G90, which obviously will not see another generation.

• 16:46Speaker 03

  No doubt.

• 16:47Doug DeMuro?

  The seven series. That's it. That's all. That's your full size luxury sedan world. It used to be that those were the top of the heap of aspirational, I mean, obviously, there's Rolls Royce and Bentley and stuff, but I'm talking about at this price point. There's, they used to be the top of the heap of aspirational cars. Like when you were a kid, if someone's dad had an S-Class, they were the rich, like, it was like, that was like, the coolest thing imaginable.

• 17:10Speaker 03

  I mean, yeah, totally. This extrapolates to those cars, Rolls Royce and Bentley too. I mean, how many Cullens and Bentegas do you see versus, when was the last time you saw a Series 8 Phantom?

• 17:17Doug DeMuro?

  Absolutely.

• 17:18Speaker 03

  I can't remember, genuinely.

• 17:20Doug DeMuro?

  Totally. Yeah.

• 17:21Speaker 03

  But I love my sedans, but that's sad, that makes me sad.

• 17:25Doug DeMuro?

  I love sedans too, and I think that for enthusiasts, there's still a place for sedans as performance cars. These are certainly not enthusiast cars.

• 17:31Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 17:32Doug DeMuro?

  And it's one more to go on. And you have to assume G90 goes away, and then you're just left with the 7 Series and the S-Class.

• 17:37Speaker 04

  Hey, don't forget about the Panamera.

• 17:39Doug DeMuro?

  The Panamera is a hatchback.

• 17:41Speaker 04

  Hmm. Also, maybe combined with a Taycan.

• 17:43Doug DeMuro?

  You know, that's one of the trickiest things Porsche has ever done. The Panamera, this whole time, it's a luxury sedan, it's a hatchback. They snuck in, just like, just like, snuck your little hatchback into the market, nobody knows.

• 17:52Speaker 03

  Does just having a hatchback make it a genre? Because the 812 is a hatchback.

• 17:58Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah.

• 17:58Speaker 04

  Yep.

• 17:58Doug DeMuro?

  So. The 812 and the Volkswagen Golf duke it out for compact hatchback of the year, in my book, anyway. No, you're right, there is the Panamera, but that's not going to be long for this role.

• 18:08Speaker 03

  No.

• 18:08Doug DeMuro?

  I mean, you look at the sale.

• 18:09Speaker 04

  There is talks of the next gen Panamera. It will be combined with the Taycan.

• 18:12Doug DeMuro?

  You, of course it will. The idea that there were two cars in that segment is so insane from the outset, of course that was what was going to happen.

• 18:19Speaker 04

  Yep.

• 18:20Doug DeMuro?

  Uh, okay, interesting things. Give us our next newsie. Oh my God, did you read this?

• 18:25Speaker 04

  I, I did.

• 18:26Doug DeMuro?

  Car and Driver, notable publication. I'm famous. Called me out in the review of the Honda Prelude. They said, "Internet personalities obsessed with quirks and features have criticized the Prelude's base price. But accounting for inflation, the 97 Prelude is actually more expensive than today's Prelude." That's what they said. The, the thing that they're forgetting is they didn't account for any inflation in terms of horsepower. The, the current Prelude actually has the same horsepower rating as the 97 Prelude that they referenced.

• 18:54Speaker 04

  It turns out that cars have gone cheaper. Like, it turns out if you look at all cars relative to inflation, cars have gone truly notably cheaper.

• 19:01Doug DeMuro?

  I will say, I, I actually love Car and Driver, and I use Car and Driver. A lot for research, for videos that I make and all that. Writing stuff about how the Prelude is not too expensive undermines the credibility of the entire endeavor. There's nobody in the world who thinks this car is reasonably priced. And then you see this, and that's where the criticism comes. Oh, they're getting paid by Honda. It's like, oh, yeah, probably. How do you say they're not? And they're sitting here defending the new Prelude and the tradition of all the great future Prelude's or past ones. I will say this, a car and driver, let's do a little friendly comparison about sales figures. A little wager here, and let's see how it goes. Let's see if this car is successful.

• 19:43Doug DeMuro?

  And I think in the end, the internet personality obsessed with quirks and features will be right. Felipe, you thinking about a Prelude?

• 19:49Speaker 04

  No.

• 19:50Doug DeMuro?

  Huh, and why is that?

• 19:52Speaker 04

  They're so... Because first of all, the Civic Hybrid hatchback exists.

• 19:57Doug DeMuro?

  Exists.

• 19:58Speaker 04

  Second of all, the Accord Hybrid exists at the same price.

• 20:01Doug DeMuro?

  I have now seen one Prelude. It wasn't on the road. It was at a Honda dealer that I drove by. It had been, they had like a viewing platform, and it was on it.

• 20:11Speaker 04

  Wow.

• 20:12Doug DeMuro?

  Trying to get people off the freeway to come.

• 20:14Speaker 04

  Honda, I've seen two.

• 20:16Doug DeMuro?

  With plates?

• 20:17Speaker 04

  With plates. And apparently they have a goal of selling about 4,000 this year. And in February, they did sell like 200-ish, 300, which is like, put some vaguely on track.

• 20:26Doug DeMuro?

  Well, you know, I would argue that, right? Ultimately, 300 times 12 is less than 4,000, and that's when the car is brand new.

• 20:33Speaker 04

  I said vaguely on track.

• 20:34Doug DeMuro?

  If you look at the tail of these cars, it ends up, it doesn't usually increase.

• 20:39Speaker 04

  Supply limited, you know, when the new 400 comes out, first month sales aren't that high.

• 20:43Doug DeMuro?

  I'll tell you right now, this thing ain't supply limited. There is not a Honda dealer in the world who doesn't have three of these either existing at their dealership or inbound, sitting there thinking, how are we gonna put these down? There is not a Honda dealer in the world that isn't in their Monday morning sales meeting, doesn't have all the salespeople come together. All right, two grand to anybody who sells the Prelude this week. Anybody who gets the Prelude out the door gets two grand.

• 21:05Speaker 04

  300 new on lots right now.

• 21:08Doug DeMuro?

  300?

• 21:09Speaker 04

  Which is about a month.

• 21:10Doug DeMuro?

  A month's supply?

• 21:11Speaker 04

  Apparently. It's been out for a month.

• 21:13Speaker 03

  You know, Felipe, if you had that 90 million dollars in profit, you'd still drive right past the Honda dealership and not buy this.

• 21:19Speaker 04

  Oh, yeah. There are other Hondas I would buy.

• 21:20Doug DeMuro?

  People with 90 million can't afford to lose the depreciation that this car's gonna lose.

• 21:27Doug DeMuro?

  This is the only, this is the first piece that I have seen that supported the

• 21:36Speaker 04

  Agreed with your take, yeah.

• 21:37Doug DeMuro?

  I can't believe it.

• 21:38Speaker 04

  I will say, there are second pieces that it handles great, which you also said in your review.

• 21:42Doug DeMuro?

  Agreed, it totally did handle great. It totally did handle great.

• 21:44Speaker 04

  It'd be nice if the rear seats matched fronts, but hey, that's just me.

• 21:47Doug DeMuro?

  That was pretty rough. Alright, move on to the wheels, move on to the wheels.

• 21:50Speaker 04

  Alright, I'm excited to report that earlier this week was TE37 Day.

• 21:54Doug DeMuro?

  I want to give a little story about why we're doing this news story. TE37 is some sort of wheel in Japan. People in the comments will be like, "That's the greatest wheel!"

• 22:01Speaker 04

  Yes, they will.

• 22:02Doug DeMuro?

  I'm not a Japanese wheel guy, but we have a guy here in the office, Ryan Lopez. You may remember him from the broken air conditioner incident a couple of weeks ago. Anyway, he's obsessed with all sorts of modded Japanese cars. And he said to me, he said, "If you do the story on the TE37s being given their own holiday in Japan, I'll do a favor for you." And I said, "Great." I said, "We're low on snacks in the office." I said, "Can you buy them?" He said, "I won't buy them until you do the news."

• 22:26Speaker 04

  So we had no choice.

• 22:28Doug DeMuro?

  So, big day in Japan! Woo-hoo!

• 22:30Speaker 04

  The Japan Anniversary Association, which is apparently the association that makes national holidays in Japan, I did verify this is truly the association that does it, made March 7th, starting this year, the Volk Racing TE37 Day. It's been around for 30 years, this month, or this year, rather, and obviously 37, 37.

• 22:49Doug DeMuro?

  37, 37.

• 22:51Speaker 04

  So Volk TE37s made by Ray's.

• 22:53Doug DeMuro?

  Explain that to me. How is it both Volk and Ray's?

• 22:56Speaker 04

  It's company.

• 22:59Doug DeMuro?

  So this would be like a General Motors Cadillac CT5?

• 23:02Speaker 04

  Which, by the way, every General Motors car said General Motors, it tracks.

• 23:04Doug DeMuro?

  Okay, so, March 7th, great day in Japan, love our TE37s, fantastic wheels. Is that enough to, is that enough to get the snacks in the office? Got it. Okay, move on.

• 23:16Speaker 04

  Go back. Until you saw those pictures, would you have known what a TE37 is?

• 23:20Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah, but that's the only wheel I can identify that isn't OE. I can identify, no, I can identify every OE wheel and one aftermarket wheel. And it's the, oh, and the Ronald Teddy Bears, of course.

• 23:31Speaker 04

  Now, he also will use TE37 as like a coverall for any aftermarket wheel if it's just, wow, TE37s.

• 23:38Doug DeMuro?

  Any time a car's a copy, someone's got aftermarket wheels. I'm like, look at this thing on TE37. No, great day, great day in Japan to commemorate the very special TE37, which is of course on many four lug vehicles, including Ryan's zesty drift car, which by the way, has functional air conditioning.

• 23:57Doug DeMuro?

  Nothing has air conditioning. All right, move on to the next news story. There was a report in New York Times. This is one of those news articles I hate. New York Times reporting that California is cracking down on Montana people. I don't hate it because I have any cars registered in Montana. In fact, I don't have it for a long time. I hate it because everyone in my life has sent me this news article.

• 24:15Speaker 04

  So this all came from the like state attorney general, whatever, put up like a Facebook post and an Instagram post about this and all the pictures in that article came from that Instagram post.

• 24:25Doug DeMuro?

  California, a lot of states have started to crack down. In fact, California is not the strictest state that is cracking down on this. I'm, every time I read an article about California's enforcement measures, I'm astonished at how lax they are. They're like, we think $20 million is, is, is uncaught sales tax. I'm like, like 10 cars.

• 24:44Speaker 04

  What, what happened?

• 24:46Doug DeMuro?

  They're apparently cracking down. They went after some, they're starting to go after dealers. So one of the interesting things that California has done to try to curb this happening is that if a car in California is sold now to an out of state business, you have to submit a driver's license. Even though a business is buying it, some human being has to submit a driver's license to California DMV, taking ownership of the car. Now, if you buy the car and you live in North Carolina and you ship the car to North Carolina as an out of state business and you provide a North Carolina DL, California's not going to care anymore. But if you buy the car as a California and you submit a California driver's license and you register it to an out of state Montana business, they're going to be knocking on your door, as they should.

• 25:24Speaker 04

  So last week, they announced last week that they charged 14 people with felony tax evasion. And how many dollars in sales tax?

• 25:32Doug DeMuro?

  Specifically though, the article was highlighting that they had, they had found these people through the dealerships.

• 25:37Speaker 04

  $2.3 million in sales tax revenue.

• 25:39Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah. The dealerships who are now providing this form, the dealerships are now required to provide this form anytime a car is sold to an out of state business. And so it's gotten a little bit harder to title a car in Montana if you're a California resident or a California driver's license, unless you play a little fast and loose with things.

• 25:56Speaker 04

  It's such an obvious spot for enforcement.

• 25:58Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah.

• 25:58Speaker 04

  Right, like it's so visible.

• 26:00Doug DeMuro?

  Right.

• 26:01Speaker 04

  It's so obvious in so many cases.

• 26:03Doug DeMuro?

  Right.

• 26:03Speaker 04

  People brag about it constantly. Some of the convictions came from like just texts back and forth.

• 26:09Doug DeMuro?

  Well, that was during discovery.

• 26:10Speaker 04

  They didn't get those. Obviously, it helped with the conviction. Was during discovery, there were just texts back and forth of, oh, my God, I saved so much money.

• 26:16Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah.

• 26:17Speaker 04

  By titling my car in Montana.

• 26:18Doug DeMuro?

  Right.

• 26:19Speaker 04

  So maybe don't. But.

• 26:20Doug DeMuro?

  Kenan, what are you gonna do now? You can't do Montana anymore.

• 26:22Speaker 03

  I have always registered my cars in the state of California. I've paid sales tax on them all proudly, so this sounds like a problem for other people.

• 26:29Doug DeMuro?

  I agree. Now, the article, me too, by the way, Okla. Now, the Okla is what I say when I'm being serious. We should start saying Montana.

• 26:35Speaker 04

  We should not.

• 26:36Speaker 03

  No, that's if you're being disingenuous.

• 26:38Doug DeMuro?

  The article did say that they're gonna crack down on the other four no sales tax states, which are, or specifically start giving more scrutiny to cars in California registered in those states, which are Oregon, Delaware, New Hampshire, and Alaska. New Hampshire is probably not a big one because they have a physical inspection, but I mean, I don't see cars running around with Delaware plates. We see some Alaskas.

• 26:59Speaker 04

  But that's mostly military.

• 27:01Doug DeMuro?

  Oregon's tough because it borders. Like, I see cars from Oregon all the time, but if it's February, I would want to get out of Oregon right now, too.

• 27:07Speaker 04

  The benefit of Montana is that you can create an LSE incredibly easily. The car never needs to be there. There's a bunch of benefits that I think make Montana a little unique.

• 27:14Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah. Alaska's apparently the same way. And Alaska's, yeah, yeah, people do Alaska now.

• 27:20Speaker 04

  Down in San Diego, you can get away with that because every service member has.

• 27:23Doug DeMuro?

  It's tough if you're CHP to pull people over for this because 80% of the time, someone's gonna pull out an Oregon driver's license, go along with their Oregon license plate, and be like, why are you hassling?

• 27:33Speaker 03

  Right. But if it's on a law Ferrari, it might be a little harder to... So I bet that guy just doesn't have an Oregon or Montana license.

• 27:41Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah, maybe. That might be, that might be true. By the way, I took this photo and I took it in California, and the reason I took it is because that... Hyundai accent was trying to parallel park in front of this LaFerrari. And it was the most stressful experience of my entire life just watching it happen. This is probably eight years ago at Monterey Car Week. Uh, okay. What's our next news story?

• 28:03Speaker 04

  Oh, Felipe. So there was a report out this week.

• 28:07Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah.

• 28:07Speaker 04

  Uh, about, uh, by like a transportation alternatives organization about the people that got the most, uh, speed camera tickets in New York State.

• 28:16Doug DeMuro?

  Yep.

• 28:17Speaker 04

  And I want you to just kind of give me a guess at 2025.

• 28:21Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah.

• 28:21Speaker 04

  How much, how many tickets a single car received that was the most, and in this case, school zone speeding tickets.

• 28:27Doug DeMuro?

  Well, I mean, in Manhattan, you get them, I don't know, 40, 50.

• 28:31Speaker 04

  Number one was 100% in Brooklyn.

• 28:33Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah, I'm not surprised. The person's commuting to work every day, doesn't know the cameras there and ignores the tickets because they're registered out of state. I, uh, Honda Accord, some popular car.

• 28:41Speaker 04

  It was 259 tickets. To 2023 Audi A6. By the way, the same car was number one in 2024 as well. Small credit to them. They do pay their entire fines, which were $64,000 last year.

• 28:54Doug DeMuro?

  You're kidding. They paid 64 grand?

• 28:56Speaker 04

  Yeah, they actually paid it, which is rare, by the way. Most of these payments that they, in New York State, you can get the speed camera tickets. They don't connect in any way to your registration, to your license. So it's not points on your license. It's just cash. Uh, there are some interesting ones here.

• 29:10Doug DeMuro?

  Turo? No, because it's the same place every day.

• 29:12Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 29:13Doug DeMuro?

  How weird. They paid?

• 29:15Speaker 04

  They paid. Uh, number two was a less.

• 29:17Doug DeMuro?

  And then kept speeding.

• 29:18Speaker 04

  Yep. Uh, for two years in a row.

• 29:21Doug DeMuro?

  They should be in this tax. Yeah, but a crazy high one. You drive an A6. You could be in an A8 with a car riding degree. Costs more in tickets than the whole car did at that point, I'm sure.

• 29:31Speaker 04

  Absolutely. There are some interesting ones. In some cases, uh, there was a GLA that had 177 tickets, all in a two-month period.

• 29:40Doug DeMuro?

  Wow.

• 29:40Speaker 04

  Not, not before, not since.

• 29:44Speaker 04

  Which is fascinating, but number one, two years in a row is that. Somebody also got 134 tickets totaling 30,000, excuse me, $20,000 in the 2024 BMW 760i, which is legit.

• 29:56Doug DeMuro?

  That's not a V12.

• 29:57Speaker 04

  That's not a V12, but it's still a top.

• 29:58Doug DeMuro?

  Europeans watching this will be like, I don't understand. This is insane, right? These people arrested.

• 30:02Speaker 04

  You gotta wonder.

• 30:03Doug DeMuro?

  In the United States, we have an unusual attitude towards speed cameras. The United States gets made fun of sometimes for having low speed limits. However, enforcement is much less significant than in almost every other developed country. And there are no speed cameras in the United States. And the few places that have implemented speed cameras have done it in very small numbers, only in school zones and construction zones primarily, some stoplights. And even then, they run into a problem because you have the right to confront your accused in the United States, the accuses a camera. Anybody, the governments are always afraid of litigating some of these cases. And so they're actually more willing to just be like, all right, well, they didn't pay. We're not going to go after them. We can't do much. They can't prove who's behind the wheel.

• 30:47Doug DeMuro?

  You know, in Germany, if you get a speeding ticket, a speeding camera ticket, they say, we don't care who's behind the wheel. You're paying this and you're responsible. But in the States, it's very different.

• 30:55Speaker 04

  Getting 259 school zone speeding camera tickets at some point does become a safety hazard.

• 31:01Doug DeMuro?

  It's wild that the person speeds in schools on every day. Send a police officer out there to start writing them actual tickets that will actually affect their driving record.

• 31:09Speaker 04

  This report says that there's 2.5 million people that live within a five-minute walk of the intersections where the 10 super speeders got most of their tickets.

• 31:18Doug DeMuro?

  It's really not all that hard. I know NYPD doesn't do traffic enforcement, but like you could nip this one in the bud pretty quick. Three school zone speeding tickets read to a person, probably you lose your license, I assume, with especially in a short period of time, two or three.

• 31:31Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 31:32Doug DeMuro?

  But they don't do that. That's not how things work in New York. The traffic enforcement is a political thing that is talked about in New York City, but it is not something that's actually enforced.

• 31:43Speaker 04

  If you see a 2020, a black 2023 Audi A6 and you live in Brooklyn, be quite careful.

• 31:48Doug DeMuro?

  What's the plate? Did they give the plate?

• 31:50Speaker 04

  They do give the plate.

• 31:50Doug DeMuro?

  What is it?

• 31:51Speaker 04

  LCM 8254.

• 31:53Doug DeMuro?

  Damn, damn. He should get birthplace with baseball plates. Everyone in New York should.

• 31:57Speaker 04

  2017 IS is number two, Ram 1500.

• 31:59Doug DeMuro?

  2017 Lexus IS?

• 32:01Speaker 04

  Ram 1500. Ram 1500, number three, Geolene number four.

• 32:03Doug DeMuro?

  What's the plate on the Ram? Brother.

• 32:06Speaker 04

  LCK seven.

• 32:07Doug DeMuro?

  Oh, so it's a regular person.

• 32:08Speaker 04

  Regular person. Of course, it's a regular person.

• 32:10Doug DeMuro?

  Well, I don't know. I could see these tickets being racked up by delivery companies or taxis that are driving massive miles and the company just pays them as a

• 32:18Speaker 04

  They would find consequence for that. There's another Ram 1500 on the list as well, and a Mercedes A-Class.

• 32:24Doug DeMuro?

  Really? An A-Class sedan? These are all cars where I wouldn't assume that people would care, so I guess it makes sense.

• 32:30Speaker 04

  Helping run cars and bids. I'm constantly amazed at how many different ways our team has found to use Claude. Like, it started with me using it for research and writing, but now it's spread across the whole company. Our developers are using it to ship faster. The marketing team is drafting copies. Our HR team is making dashboards is genuinely becoming part of how we work. Claude is the AI for minds that don't stop at good enough. It's a collaborator that actually understands your entire workflow and thinks with you. Whether you're debugging code at midnight or strategizing your next business move, Claude extends your thinking to tackle the problems that matter. What gets me is that it's not one use case, it's every department finding their own thing. The connectors mean that Claude can plug into

• 33:12Speaker 04

  the tools your team already uses, like Google Workspace or Notion, so it has real context. It's not just a chatbot anymore. It's like a, kind of like a central brain for the whole operation. Are you ready to tackle bigger problems? Get started with Claude today at claude.ai/cars. That's claude.ai/cars. And check out Claude Pro, which includes access to all of the features that I just mentioned. Claude.ai/cars.

• 33:37Doug DeMuro?

  Okay, next news story, please. Very interesting, very interesting. Ah, another car that's dead, the Infiniti J30.

• 33:44Speaker 04

  Nice. The Ioniq 6 is dead, except for the Ioniq 6 N, which will be sold in 2026.

• 33:51Doug DeMuro?

  Because they came out with it yesterday.

• 33:53Speaker 04

  Yeah, they came out with a refresh in 2025.

• 33:55Doug DeMuro?

  What were they thinking of this car?

• 33:56Speaker 04

  What, so most Hyundai EVs, including the Ioniq 5, are built in the US. The Ioniq 6 is built in South Korea.

• 34:02Doug DeMuro?

  Okay, so there was a tariff issue in addition to it being a sedan. I mean, it was kind of doomed from day one because it looked like the Infiniti J30. And it was electric, it was a sedan.

• 34:11Speaker 04

  It's a cool-looking sedan, but it's a weird-looking sedan.

• 34:14Doug DeMuro?

  I don't think you'd ever like the Infiniti J30.

• 34:17Speaker 04

  I don't love the Infiniti J30.

• 34:19Doug DeMuro?

  Really? It's rear-wheel drive.

• 34:21Speaker 04

  Okay.

• 34:23Doug DeMuro?

  You don't like this car?

• 34:24Speaker 04

  I said I don't love it.

• 34:25Speaker 03

  It's not.

• 34:26Speaker 04

  It's particular.

• 34:27Doug DeMuro?

  Look at that.

• 34:28Speaker 04

  And I agree that the Ioniq 6 is similar. So yeah, it wasn't selling that well relative to other Hyundai EVs and cost 25% more to Hyundai because of the tariffs. Makes sense. The Ioniq 6 add and I think is small enough production numbers that they're willing to eat that.

• 34:42Doug DeMuro?

  And plus, it literally just came out. They should at least give it a shot. Unlike Infiniti, who only gave us four short years with the J30. You can only take the J30 to your golf course for a short, limited time, and then it was stolen from us.

• 34:56Speaker 04

  Sadly. But goodbye.

• 34:59Doug DeMuro?

  You remember this car at all? You ever seen one of these?

• 35:00Speaker 03

  No. I would ignore it. I try to ignore these, but.

• 35:04Speaker 04

  They look kind of cool.

• 35:06Speaker 03

  I don't think so.

• 35:06Speaker 04

  I don't hate how they look either.

• 35:07Speaker 03

  I think they look like a beetle, like a, not a Volkswagen Beetle, like an actual, like grotesque, like call exterminator beetle.

• 35:12Doug DeMuro?

  I agree with both of you. I think it looks like a bug and is weird, but at the same time, I'm sort of drawn to it. This is one of those cars that I wish I would own if I wasn't into cars.

• 35:21Speaker 03

  I wanted to, I see what you're saying. I wanted to like this, but I just can't. I've tried.

• 35:25Speaker 04

  Also, it came out at the same time as Ioniq 5. It sold alongside Ioniq 5. The Ioniq 5 is more practical and is the form factor that people want.

• 35:33Doug DeMuro?

  Credit to Hyundai, though, for coming out with both and giving it a shot.

• 35:36Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 35:37Doug DeMuro?

  I mean, I think a lot of, everybody else just came out with an SUV. Tesla, I guess, did both, obviously, but, but most other people just did the SUV thing. And we got this for a little while and we got reminded about the J30 and now it's gone, gone, gone.

• 35:47Speaker 04

  Except for the end, which is cool.

• 35:50Doug DeMuro?

  Do you think I should review one? Does it have the same, no one's going to buy it is the problem. Does it have the same fake shifting? Oh, I wouldn't mind reviewing one then. Does it have a big wing?

• 35:59Speaker 04

  I.

• 36:00Doug DeMuro?

  It looks like it does. It looks like it has a massive wing. You know, I got on the freeway the other day in something, I was driving something cool, and there was a Hyundai in either a 5 or a 6 up ahead of me there. Couldn't tell.

• 36:10Speaker 04

  It was almost certainly a 5. It does have a big wing and it has like cool body treatment, actually.

• 36:16Doug DeMuro?

  Cool body treatment.

• 36:18Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 36:19Doug DeMuro?

  So the question is, how do you create, how do you take this beetle looking car and turn it into a performance looking car? We're about to find out.

• 36:25Speaker 03

  6N?

• 36:26Doug DeMuro?

  6N, yeah.

• 36:27Speaker 03

  It doesn't look that performancy.

• 36:33Speaker 04

  Huh.

• 36:33Speaker 03

  That looks like a rendering.

• 36:35Speaker 04

  That's what kind of what it looks like.

• 36:36Doug DeMuro?

  That's not it. I think you have to put a space between six and eight. Doesn't really matter. The point is, it's all, oh, there we go. There. Look at that. Yeah. Hey, you know what, Kenan? Let's go power sliding one of these around wherever that is in Chuckwalla.

• 36:48Speaker 03

  It's Chuckwalla, for sure.

• 36:49Doug DeMuro?

  You think there's Chuckwalla, there's Joshua trees at Chuckwalla? You think so?

• 36:52Speaker 04

  Uh, maybe. That will, maybe in some, a couple of those corners.

• 36:55Doug DeMuro?

  Maybe they're fake.

• 36:56Speaker 04

  There was a facelift last year, obviously, if nobody cared.

• 36:58Doug DeMuro?

  What else we got in terms of new stores? Anything else?

• 37:01Speaker 04

  Oh, yes, of course. The Mercedes VLE. Which is their, their new luxury electric van. That's obviously made for like limo companies and fleets, but will probably, will be sold to private people.

• 37:12Doug DeMuro?

  Full electric?

• 37:12Speaker 04

  Yeah. It's coming to the US. We don't have range numbers yet, but their big focus is on screens. There's like a huge screen on the interior, as with every new Mercedes product.

• 37:20Doug DeMuro?

  Yep.

• 37:21Speaker 04

  There's a huge rear compartment screen, uh, and it's a new van. The Metris, obviously, was a beloved, well-reviewed, well-regarded minivan. Uh, and if you haven't gone to see Doug's review, you should, because he really expands on why it's so good. Uh, the VLE will, I'm sure, be a success.

• 37:37Doug DeMuro?

  You think it'll be a success?

• 37:38Speaker 04

  Absolutely not. It will do well.

• 37:40Doug DeMuro?

  370 miles of EPA range. 370.

• 37:43Speaker 04

  Um, it will do well with, uh, they, they have two batteries, so the base trim is smaller battery.

• 37:49Doug DeMuro?

  Can I ask you a question?

• 37:50Speaker 04

  It will do well with like the fleets that want a small luxury minivan.

• 37:53Doug DeMuro?

  You often talk about how you wish there were electric vans, plug-in vans, and luxury vans. Why isn't Lexus make a van? Why isn't, folks, this is it. Now, is there only gonna be like an executive transport version? Or is there gonna be like a car seat capable?

• 38:05Speaker 04

  I think there's gonna be a regular version. We are only getting the long wheelbase version.

• 38:09Doug DeMuro?

  We don't, we don't want the shorty. We don't need the shorty. This ain't the ID Buzz. We don't need the shorty.

• 38:13Speaker 04

  So more, but it is exciting that it's coming, because I think it is a niche. I mean, you saw people converting the Metris into the Metris MyBok to have a luxurious people carrier limo situation. This is a good contender for that, too.

• 38:24Doug DeMuro?

  Okay.

• 38:26Speaker 03

  I kind of like the W123-inspired like grill and stuff on the front. I kind of like that.

• 38:30Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah.

• 38:30Speaker 04

  W123.

• 38:31Doug DeMuro?

  It is W. I completely agree with that. It looks like an old, like, high-grill, low-grill Mercedes. I'm interested in this. I'm interested in this from the perspective of someone who wants a minivan. Do you think that this will replace my desire to have a Toyota Sienna?

• 38:46Speaker 04

  No.

• 38:46Doug DeMuro?

  No. Because you think it's gonna be like very commercial van?

• 38:50Speaker 04

  In Europe, it will certainly be a family van too. And I'm sure they will come out with something.

• 38:54Doug DeMuro?

  What makes Europeans different from me?

• 38:56Speaker 04

  They have different car buying preferences.

• 38:58Doug DeMuro?

  Like what?

• 38:58Speaker 04

  They don't buy Toyota Sequoias, for one.

• 39:00Doug DeMuro?

  You know, I saw a Sequoia. Last time I was in Italy, I saw a Sequoia TRD Pro on the street. I got a picture of it.

• 39:05Speaker 04

  Really?

• 39:06Speaker 03

  What was the Sequoias, Swiss?

• 39:07Doug DeMuro?

  No, it was Italian plates, and it was the V8 one, the old body. It was green. I'll send you the picture. I'll give it to you.

• 39:13Speaker 04

  I actually distinctly remember it. And it was quite a moment for me. This might be something that is vaguely appealing. I worry that it won't be as.

• 39:23Speaker 03

  I think it's something that you want.

• 39:24Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 39:25Doug DeMuro?

  Well, I can't wait to see the price point. I personally am interested in this electric van. I'll tell you what, it's only been good news stories this week. A8's gone, didn't like it anyway. IONIQ 6 gone. We already heard that story with the J30. But now, we got an electric minivan. Filippo, there's, and California's cracking down on the losers who try to cheat us all.

• 39:43Speaker 04

  Right.

• 39:43Doug DeMuro?

  Everything is coming up Filippo.

• 39:46Speaker 04

  Yep.

• 39:46Doug DeMuro?

  All right, next news story.

• 39:47Speaker 03

  And that's the end of it.

• 39:48Doug DeMuro?

  That's the end.

• 39:49Speaker 03

  Well, sorry Filippo, it's all over for you.

• 39:50Doug DeMuro?

  Salantis. Filippo wanted to also talk about some van that.

• 39:54Speaker 04

  Oh, I do want to talk about the Ram van.

• 39:55Doug DeMuro?

  We're not talking about.

• 39:56Speaker 04

  But that's not the Salantis story of today.

• 39:57Doug DeMuro?

  Tell us the Salantis story. They're hiring engineers.

• 39:59Speaker 04

  I want to share a quick headline.

• 40:01Doug DeMuro?

  Yep.

• 40:02Speaker 04

  The new folks at Salantis, the new CEO, recognize that they've had some quality issues. And they're hiring 2,000 engineers to fix their quality issues.

• 40:10Speaker 03

  Now, some feel that if you take pride in your work, your quality should be good. So the fact they need 2,000 people to go.

• 40:17Speaker 04

  Their framing for this is actually somewhat fair, which is the companies that have the best quality reputations are the companies that most iterate instead of innovate. So basically their argument is like Toyota uses the same powertrains for decades and decades and decades.

• 40:30Doug DeMuro?

  One problem though is that I have is that Chrysler doesn't do either.

• 40:33Speaker 04

  It was good framing. I didn't say it was correct.

• 40:36Doug DeMuro?

  I totally, I totally agree with that point. I think about this a lot. It is kind of amazing to be sometimes I get in Toyota, some of the features they still don't have.

• 40:44Speaker 04

  Yep.

• 40:45Doug DeMuro?

  Because they don't feel that they're ready yet.

• 40:48Speaker 04

  And they care about the quality. They use the same chassis, they use the same engine for a long, long time.

• 40:52Doug DeMuro?

  I would like to see Chrysler step into the innovation realm therefore.

• 40:56Speaker 04

  Oh, yeah. No, that seems unlikely.

• 40:58Doug DeMuro?

  Okay, well, then I would at least, I would at least like them to be able to create cars that aren't lemon law buy backed.

• 41:04Speaker 04

  That is their hope too.

• 41:05Doug DeMuro?

  2,000 engineers so that, so that Ram 1500s don't get lemon law buy backed.

• 41:11Speaker 04

  And this might not work, to be clear. This might not be enough. They may need more.

• 41:14Doug DeMuro?

  They're just, let's just hire more people.

• 41:16Speaker 04

  Just throw people and money. It also assumes that they hired the best people. I don't know.

• 41:21Doug DeMuro?

  Which you assume they don't. Let me ask you a question. If you're Chrysler, or whoever it is.

• 41:26Speaker 04

  But Atlantis isn't just Chrysler. They have many brands, but yeah.

• 41:29Doug DeMuro?

  That's another problem.

• 41:30Speaker 04

  They have so many brands.

• 41:32Doug DeMuro?

  Do you think that spinning off Ram into its own brand was really stupid?

• 41:35Speaker 04

  It was a tough move, especially when Dodge sells a single vehicle.

• 41:38Doug DeMuro?

  If you're Chrysler, why do you think that 2,000 additional people is going to be the thing that solves the problem? Don't you think like, don't you think like quality like?

• 41:45Speaker 04

  Because some consultant Mackenzie told them that's going to fix everything. I, there's a good rationale, right? Like they need to do a lot more testing, basically is what they're saying, right? They need to go a lot further on their like infotainment and electronic system testing. They need to just do more, more testing generally, and that's what the focus is. It just seems like a lot. It just seems like a lot of people for what, for something that should be. Also, I'm excited to talk about, I don't know, two years on this podcast about them laying off. I don't know. Somewhere between 2,000 and 10,000 engineers. Something in that range.

• 42:14Doug DeMuro?

  God, that's truer than I can even begin to explain. Okay.

• 42:17Speaker 04

  Can I ask you a question?

• 42:18Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah.

• 42:18Speaker 04

  Can you name even 10 of Solentis's brands?

• 42:21Doug DeMuro?

  Are you kidding?

• 42:21Speaker 04

  They have 14.

• 42:22Doug DeMuro?

  I can literally name all of them.

• 42:24Speaker 04

  They have 14? Please go ahead.

• 42:25Doug DeMuro?

  Chrysler.

• 42:26Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 42:26Doug DeMuro?

  Ram.

• 42:28Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 42:28Doug DeMuro?

  Alfa Romeo. Fiat.

• 42:30Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 42:32Doug DeMuro?

  Dodge.

• 42:33Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 42:34Doug DeMuro?

  Okay, so I'm already halfway there.

• 42:36Speaker 04

  Mm hmm.

• 42:37Doug DeMuro?

  Uh, SRT.

• 42:38Speaker 04

  Not a standalone brand.

• 42:40Doug DeMuro?

  There was a time.

• 42:43Doug DeMuro?

  Lancia.

• 42:44Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 42:46Doug DeMuro?

  Which Italian ones have I done? Have I said Fiat?

• 42:48Speaker 04

  You said Fiat.

• 42:49Doug DeMuro?

  Yes, I said.

• 42:49Speaker 04

  And Alpha.

• 42:51Doug DeMuro?

  Eagle?

• 42:54Speaker 04

  Do you think yes?

• 42:58Speaker 04

  The rest will come naturally, once you remember.

• 43:00Doug DeMuro?

  Maserati. Hey, I got eight. I'm doing pretty well.

• 43:04Speaker 04

  Can you get two more?

• 43:04Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah.

• 43:05Speaker 04

  There are 14. Can you get two more?

• 43:06Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah, I can get two more. Um, Opel.

• 43:09Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 43:10Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 43:11Doug DeMuro?

  And Holden.

• 43:14Speaker 03

  I mean, yeah.

• 43:16Speaker 04

  I mean, it's not on this list, but yeah.

• 43:18Speaker 03

  Vaxhall.

• 43:19Doug DeMuro?

  Vaxhall. Yeah, if we're counting that in Opel. Do they even still sell cars under those brands in Europe?

• 43:24Speaker 04

  Apparently.

• 43:25Doug DeMuro?

  So that's ten. What are the other four?

• 43:26Speaker 04

  Abarth that you missed.

• 43:27Doug DeMuro?

  Oh, God, Jesus. That is exactly the kind of crap.

• 43:30Speaker 03

  I knew he was gonna say it.

• 43:30Doug DeMuro?

  I am so done with you. We're moving on to the talk car segment.

• 43:34Speaker 04

  What you actually missed is Citroen, DS, and Peugeot.

• 43:38Doug DeMuro?

  I forgot that they own those. We're moving on to the talk cars segment, which is brought to you by the field behind Filippo's house. The field behind Filippo's house. It could become a tall building and people will look into his windows.

• 43:49Speaker 04

  I would love for it to be built to something.

• 43:51Doug DeMuro?

  That's so great.

• 43:51Speaker 04

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• 45:25Doug DeMuro?

  Tell us about Moda.

• 45:26Speaker 03

  Ah, yes. And I know you guys talked about it a bit last week, but I was at Moda for the entirety of the event and I got to experience all of it.

• 45:33Doug DeMuro?

  Tell us about the flood.

• 45:34Speaker 03

  Everybody wants to know about the flood. The flood was shocking. Now, we knew it was going to rain. Everybody knew this and it sprinkled the day before. It wasn't a big deal, actually. Got some cool pictures. It was kind of nice, actually. It was sunny in the morning, sprinkled in the afternoon. The storm that came through on Sunday came out of nowhere. The skies got really dark and we were all like walking around and my friends and I had gotten there a little bit late and so we wanted to see everything before the rain came down, but it was clear that wasn't going to happen. So we went under what was the auction tent, uh, which is then the award ceremony tent. It could hold about 400 people, I think. It was huge. And then the heavens opened and it was not only the rain, it was the wind. The wind was really bad and lightning, actually, I was told struck a golf cart and was like,

• 46:16Speaker 03

  so they're like, we can't have, people can't be hanging out here. So they told us all and these people are dressed nicely and all this thing. They're like, you have to go inside the Biltmore. And we're, I was like, oh my god.

• 46:25Doug DeMuro?

  How far away was the Biltmore?

• 46:27Speaker 03

  Biltmore must have been, I don't know, 200 yards, 300 yards. I mean, like enough that like, you're gonna get wet. And I was like, okay, I'm gonna wait and be the last person out there and just let the exodus of people go. But then people were sprinting and my friends and I all got separated, but I just drenched, just absolutely drenched. I was sprinting at one point.

• 46:47Doug DeMuro?

  Were we the last person out?

• 46:48Speaker 03

  Close. I waited as long as I could, but the rain was coming down so hard that even like the steps to go up to the Biltmore was like running up a fountain because it was just like cascading down. I got inside, just absolutely head to toe soaked. But then my friend Ryan had a stroke of genius. He decided that, he was like, well, I need towels. Where are our towels? He was like, well, it's probably the fitness center. So he went down to the fitness center. Nobody there. And he texted us all and we eventually caught up. They had a dry sauna, they had hair dryers. So we all got perfectly dry and we're walking around. And so we're just waiting for the rain to stop. Now the rain did stop and we were like, we have to go out right now. I want to see the carnage out there. I want to see what happened. We got and it was just immediate. I think the there were areas just huge flooding.

• 47:32Speaker 03

  And like immediately I started thinking it's like, there's a McLaren F1 here. Where's the McLaren F1? I saw Tyler's car, but Tyler's car was up on like a plinth, you know, the 300 SL was fine. German car can take it. I went down the hill and immediately I come over the hills. There's a 250 short wheelbase backing up out of the mud. There's an F40 in the water. There's a 19.

• 47:50Doug DeMuro?

  When in the day did this happen?

• 47:52Speaker 03

  This was like, I think about 1pm.

• 47:55Doug DeMuro?

  Like the event was ending anyway?

• 47:56Speaker 03

  The event was supposed to end, I think at 3 or 4.

• 47:59Doug DeMuro?

  Had all the awards been already given out?

• 48:01Speaker 03

  No, people didn't care at that point. Some people had gotten their awards. I think Ed was supposed to get an award in his Diablo SV. But anyway, I come over this hill and like, there's the F1 in water and like, there's a 675LT like up to the door sills. Testarossa completely surrounded, the Yesco, like all of these cars that you saw, like images of it was like, and there was nobody around him. And it was like, this is a, it was like something out of like, you know, was it Tom Hartley? Isn't he the one that takes pictures of the cars on the water? That's what it looked like, but it was just chaos. But I will say the cars that got the, you pointed out that some cars were open topped. They tried to put plastic over a lot of them, but the wind was so severe, ripped it off of a lot of cars.

• 48:39Doug DeMuro?

  There wasn't enough footage of this. Like there, there, people ran inside, no one, people started, it would have been cool to stay out and, because I didn't see any pictures or video of open top cars getting taken on water. The only thing I've seen is I saw somebody with like a cup or a bucket taking water out of a McLaren Elva, the interior of a McLaren Elva.

• 48:59Speaker 03

  To be clear, they were encouraging us to go inside and it was dangerous to be outside. The lightning, the lightning in an open field, not.

• 49:04Doug DeMuro?

  There's that golf cart video where they're driving the golf cart like, get out of here. And, and like a, a part of a tent like collapses.

• 49:11Speaker 03

  My friends were right there. Like they got separated and went to that tent and I have footage of them like looking around.

• 49:16Doug DeMuro?

  It collapsed like right next to a Singer 911, it looked like, like it was.

• 49:19Speaker 03

  Well, and there's a one off Ferrari that it was right there. Uh, and it was just like, it was, I've never witnessed anything like it. Now that's to say, a lot of people are focusing on the negatives and I actually have a video that's coming out, the thoughts on moto, like to talk about this, but. The event, the rest of the event was awesome. It was so much fun and it was great. And I, I've been told that like this event is going to continue to go forward and I really hope so because I, I know everybody was upset like about the rain. I'm sure there are things going on. I'm sure some owners were not pleased, but.

• 49:47Doug DeMuro?

  I wasn't upset. I, I looked at all of those Instagram videos and I was so excited. It was like, this is a car event I'll remember. No one will remember the quail event where I just, you know, showed my Countach along with four others, but everyone's gonna remember the moto where that guy was digging his, his interior of his Elva.

• 50:07Speaker 03

  Well, yeah, like I had to, we watched this like really rich guy roll up his pants and take off his shoes and wade out to his yes. I mean, this poor guy in the test car also kept stalling it. I mean, it was just like, I've just never witnessed anything like it. At all the car events I've been to, it was also a reminder of why like it's, it's Florida.

• 50:24Doug DeMuro?

  It's Florida. Like, that's the thing that surprised me. Like, I was watching that video and I was thinking to myself, this is a fairly typical afternoon rainstorm in Florida. This happened almost every day, honestly. I'm kind of surprised that this hasn't been a situation before.

• 50:36Speaker 03

  Yeah, the wind was a surprise. Forty to 50 mile an hour gust is a lot.

• 50:40Doug DeMuro?

  The wind seemed like an unusual.

• 50:41Speaker 03

  But of course it's on golf course. There are no trees really to slow it down. So it's like, but I think there are definitely learnings that the event organizers will take away from this.

• 50:48Doug DeMuro?

  Giant.

• 50:48Speaker 03

  I saw John Tamir in about 20 seconds before they told us they had to leave the tent and I didn't get to talk to him because he was on the phone, but.

• 50:54Doug DeMuro?

  Was he like the organizer of it or something?

• 50:55Speaker 03

  He's involved with it in some.

• 50:56Doug DeMuro?

  Let me ask you this question and I, and I don't mean to throw shade on the McLaren Elva, all of you McLaren Elva owners watching. Do you think that the rain is forecast and you, you could put it, you could put some covering on, but you have a McLaren Elva and you think to yourself, this is my chance.

• 51:13Speaker 03

  Hold on a second, I gotta, where's the lowest point I can move this to?

• 51:16Doug DeMuro?

  I might finally be able to get out of this car when not lose $2 million. It's insured for what it's, what I paid. Unfortunately, it's only worth a third of what I paid. This is my chance to get out of a McLaren Elva.

• 51:30Speaker 03

  In which case I wouldn't have attempted to take the water out of it, would have left it in there to stew with the electronics.

• 51:35Doug DeMuro?

  Well, maybe he, maybe he made sure that that video got around.

• 51:38Speaker 03

  Right.

• 51:38Doug DeMuro?

  So that, so that it could be seen as he was.

• 51:40Speaker 03

  I tried.

• 51:41Doug DeMuro?

  I tried, tried so hard. I'm so sorry.

• 51:43Speaker 03

  This is my dream car.

• 51:44Doug DeMuro?

  My, my, my insurer, I'm so sorry. I, I, I love this car so much. That, that's why I drove it six miles total.

• 51:52Doug DeMuro?

  It was such a usable car.

• 51:54Speaker 03

  With no windshield.

• 51:56Doug DeMuro?

  And it wasn't, I wasn't upset that I paid two and a half million and it's currently worth $375,000. It didn't bother me at all, but unfortunately I do think it is totaled. So sorry.

• 52:07Speaker 03

  Yeah, maybe, but still, it was such a fun event and my friends and I all had a great time and I suspect we'll go back next year.

• 52:16Doug DeMuro?

  So.

• 52:16Speaker 03

  We'll see what the weather does.

• 52:17Doug DeMuro?

  What other, what other parts of the event are there? There's other stuff.

• 52:20Speaker 03

  There's other stuff, yeah, so there's, you know, there's the auction preview before, Arm South of East has an auction there and that's a lot of, those are always fun to go because you can go check out cars, cool, but then.

• 52:28Doug DeMuro?

  Competitor to cars and bits, like it's a competitive, we don't discuss, unnamed auction company.

• 52:34Speaker 03

  Unnamed auction company, unnamed auction company that sells, you have a lot of Ferraris and cool stuff. Actually, there was a section that had all of our cars. Had a 355, like I had a Carrera GT, Countach, SLR, like the cars, no.

• 52:46Doug DeMuro?

  Have a 2014 Mercedes Benz E350 station wagon?

• 52:50Speaker 03

  No, and it didn't have a target, the rare, you get to hold your head high, no target.

• 52:56Doug DeMuro?

  I'm glad you went, I'm glad, I'm glad you went, I'm glad you enjoyed it. I am jealous that you got to experience what I think will go down as like the car event of the year because of this ridiculous rain.

• 53:07Speaker 03

  I tend to agree. I think that anybody who was there will remember this one for a long time. Were you there during the rain? This is gonna be, it's gonna be our calling card.

• 53:15Doug DeMuro?

  Right, like Amelia goes on the next week and it looked like it was great and it would look like it was fine and successful, but.

• 53:21Speaker 03

  I've been rained out of that event too.

• 53:23Doug DeMuro?

  Oh, really? Is that right?

• 53:24Speaker 03

  The last two years in a row, they had to move the event from Saturday to Sunday because of the rain.

• 53:28Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah, they've moved it.

• 53:28Speaker 03

  And, and also I've gone out and they've had the show and it comes down and like, it is just amazing to see 250 GTO just getting rained on like a normal, I know they're just cars, but it's like, these cars are like, people touch them with white gloves.

• 53:41Doug DeMuro?

  You would never take an art piece or something, right?

• 53:43Speaker 03

  And then to see them driving around after, one last point on this, I will say the coolest cars to see drive around, the cars that made the most sense had no problems, pre-war cars, because they were designed to be driven on roads that didn't exist. Like just mud, they're like right at home.

• 53:54Doug DeMuro?

  Great point. You know what else didn't have problems? The Carrera GTs.

• 53:58Speaker 03

  Certainly the 959s.

• 54:00Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah.

• 54:00Speaker 03

  Oh, 959s definitely.

• 54:01Doug DeMuro?

  Jack it right up and you're all set.

• 54:02Speaker 03

  But I did have a last point on this, I had a lot of fun, so many people came up and said hello and a lot of people were very kind about the podcast, which is so great, I'm so grateful, so it's very humbling whenever someone does that.

• 54:11Doug DeMuro?

  Why is it that so many people come up to us and tell us they listen to our podcast? It's unbelievable.

• 54:14Speaker 03

  Because people do, hundreds of thousands.

• 54:16Doug DeMuro?

  You're listening to this? How humbling.

• 54:19Speaker 03

  It is, it is.

• 54:21Doug DeMuro?

  The number of people come up to me and say, I used to watch your videos, but I love your podcast.

• 54:28Doug DeMuro?

  I'm like, yeah, I don't blame you.

• 54:30Speaker 03

  But I was very humbled by it and just had a wonderful time and Jimmy Prossy says hello.

• 54:34Doug DeMuro?

  Oh, you talked to Jimmy?

• 54:36Speaker 03

  Yeah, I got to see, got to see everybody. See, everybody was there, so it was.

• 54:38Doug DeMuro?

  Who's everybody? Did you talk to?

• 54:40Speaker 03

  Tyler was there, April was there.

• 54:42Doug DeMuro?

  Did you talk to Leno?

• 54:43Speaker 03

  Yeah, he wasn't there. I didn't see him.

• 54:45Doug DeMuro?

  He doesn't live in California. And you know what? Do you blame him?

• 54:47Speaker 03

  You know, but I guarantee he'll be at all, though. He's got, but he's gotta go see Donald.

• 54:51Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah, plus he's got to live there.

• 54:53Speaker 03

  Osborne, to be clear.

• 54:53Doug DeMuro?

  I want to talk about the SL65.

• 54:55Speaker 03

  Yes, SL65 is currently for sale. It's live right now.

• 55:00Doug DeMuro?

  It's the end of an era.

• 55:00Speaker 03

  The cars and the bids.

• 55:01Doug DeMuro?

  A very brief era, but an era nonetheless.

• 55:04Speaker 03

  It was. Now, do you have a question you want to ask?

• 55:07Doug DeMuro?

  No, I just, and I don't even want to gloat. I don't even want to gloat.

• 55:10Speaker 03

  Hey, you said Valentine's Day. What is today? Not Valentine's Day.

• 55:14Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah, but I, part of that is because my own delay in getting the video up. I think you would have been ready on Valentine's Day.

• 55:21Speaker 03

  I would have, you know, to be honest with you, I would have been ready to have the car for another month, I think. But I, I did a lot of what I wanted to do at the SL65. The whole reason I'm getting rid of it is that although the car is very me and I love it, it's just the secondary car should have a manual. It just has to.

• 55:34Doug DeMuro?

  You, by the way, I may have said Valentine's Day, but you said moderate car week, as I recall.

• 55:39Speaker 03

  Well, you know, we can't all be, we're not, we're not both not right. Well, you know, we both missed.

• 55:44Doug DeMuro?

  I am impressed that you did 3,000 miles. Five different amounts.

• 55:46Speaker 03

  Yes.

• 55:48Speaker 03

  I did quite, quite a few miles in the car.

• 55:50Doug DeMuro?

  How many miles did you do?

• 55:51Speaker 03

  It's actually a little bit more than that. I actually have to correct that. I think it's 1,500 more than that. So about 4,500 miles.

• 55:56Doug DeMuro?

  Wow. I mean, that's pretty good. Getting, you know, any enthusiast who can get 5,000, I think that it takes about that many miles to really get the feel for a car. And I think you did 4,500 miles in a car. You had it. You owned it. You did, like, you had that experience.

• 56:08Speaker 03

  For a couple of weeks, I drove it every single day and didn't drive the M5 at all. But yeah, so I think I got the experience with the engine's a masterpiece. I did a video that's live on this, on my YouTube channel now that kind of talks briefly a little bit more about the, the ownership experience. But, you know, I just really, I just, that engine, I genuinely think that is one of the best V12s ever made. Top five.

• 56:27Doug DeMuro?

  It is a wonderful powertrain. Um, and you got to experience it for, I mean, forty five hundred miles. Nick can't go more than sixty, seventy miles without stalling a car.

• 56:37Speaker 03

  That's true, or money shifting it. Um, which you know what's good thing is SLR is automatic. Uh, there's another video I have coming out on Tuesday, Nick and I traded car. We did SLR versus SL sixty five, which is an interesting video. It's kind of long, uh, but it comes out on Tuesday and you can go check that on my YouTube channel. It's a little out of sequence, but I wanted to know and we had, we had a lot of fun.

• 56:55Doug DeMuro?

  But you didn't drag race him in the end.

• 56:56Speaker 03

  Didn't drag race him in the end. I had a, I got, I've been trying to do this thing this year where I trust my gut for feelings. And I just had a feeling it's like, I should, we shouldn't do that.

• 57:04Doug DeMuro?

  Ah, you wouldn't have been fine.

• 57:05Speaker 03

  Nick got a little squeamish about it too, and I actually think he was kind of right.

• 57:08Doug DeMuro?

  Let me tell you this. Giving Nick your keys is risky because of that money shift with the DTRS.

• 57:15Speaker 03

  Well, luckily, no third pedal.

• 57:17Doug DeMuro?

  But don't you think Nick could still find a way? Like shift into reverse on the freeway and be like, I just wanted to see if it could.

• 57:23Speaker 03

  Not to spoil anything, but I also did a video recently where I let my friends drive my SL sixty five. And a lot of them went full throttle, but approached it tip gently. Not Nick, Nick just goes.

• 57:34Doug DeMuro?

  Well, he.

• 57:34Speaker 03

  Reels, reels the tires. Yeah, he is used to, he knows what he's doing.

• 57:38Doug DeMuro?

  And then he money shifts them.

• 57:39Speaker 03

  Yeah, but couldn't do it with this car. But yes, the SL sixty five will go away and, uh, then we'll begin the hunt for the next car.

• 57:44Doug DeMuro?

  We'll begin the hunt for the next car, which is?

• 57:46Speaker 03

  I still want a snake, I want a viper.

• 57:48Doug DeMuro?

  I want a viper for you. We have this two thousand fifteen viper over here.

• 57:52Speaker 03

  Yeah, that's a little out of my price range, admittedly.

• 57:54Doug DeMuro?

  And you know what? It's not better enough to just, I think that the sweet spot of a viper still is a good viper one or two. Like they never refined it so much that I don't still want the original cars. I drove that car thinking it was going to be this refined luxury experience, which is how they pitched it at the time. Like, oh, we finally tamed, well, it still drives like a viper, except that one's a hundred and twenty grand. Or you can get a, a ninety five and you pay.

• 58:22Speaker 03

  And like the fifth gen looks cool, but the first gen is cooler still. It's just so awesome.

• 58:27Doug DeMuro?

  The fifth gen is definitely the best looking, but yes, I agree. The first gen is, is like cool.

• 58:31Speaker 03

  Cooler, it's like, it's more extreme. It's just like, well, maybe not with the aero, extreme aero version of that car. But no, I just want to, I want a viper.

• 58:39Doug DeMuro?

  Many years ago, I owned a blue, white ninety seven.

• 58:41Speaker 03

  Yep.

• 58:42Doug DeMuro?

  GTS. And Filippo drove the car many times.

• 58:44Speaker 03

  Cause Doug refused to.

• 58:47Doug DeMuro?

  He hated it. He was like, nah. Here's an interesting story for you, actually. I got a message a couple of weeks ago. The fellow who bought that car, I sold that car over on Bring the Trailer, because it was before we existed. Now I know that Cars and Bids is the best platform to sell your enthusiast car. Get the most money for your enthusiast car at Cars and, what is, is that about?

• 59:07Speaker 03

  That's an ad integration.

• 59:08Doug DeMuro?

  I could have done it without the tone, but yeah. Okay. Get the most money for your car. There you go. Damn it. Cars and Bids.

• 59:17Speaker 03

  That's the place.

• 59:17Doug DeMuro?

  Anyway, so the guy, I sold that car to a guy in New Jersey and he contacted, he bought a car on Cars and Bids. Oh, nice. And during the buying process, he told our employee that he was working with, he said, our team member, I'm so sorry.

• 59:32Doug DeMuro?

  He told our team member, he said, oh, it's so cool that you're on a team. But he also said, hey, I still have Doug's Viper. He said, does he want it back? I'd sell it back to him. And he's only apparently done like 500 miles in the 10 years since I sold it to him.

• 59:46Speaker 03

  Sounds like a Viper.

• 59:48Doug DeMuro?

  I remember we did that transaction where I sold him the Viper at the Bank of America in South Philly. And they wouldn't let him use the bathroom, even though they had a bathroom.

• 59:58Speaker 03

  They just saw it in South Philly.

• 1:00:00Doug DeMuro?

  And I, that was, I left Bank of America. Like I stopped being their customer. It wasn't immediately after that, but that was like one of like 28 wrongs. And I was just like, I can't do this anymore. By the way, if Bank of America is a sponsor, great company, Charlotte, North Carolina, the Queen City or something.

• 1:00:17Speaker 03

  You think it was the Viper that, oh, this guy doesn't know how to use indoor plumbing?

• 1:00:24Doug DeMuro?

  I will say, there was a horrible awkward moment during the car transaction that I've never forgotten. This was 11 years ago. And I had the car cover for the Viper and him. And, and he said to me, he said, oh, you get the cover? He said, is that inside or outside? And I said, well, the cover goes on the outside of the car.

• 1:00:41Speaker 03

  No one is asking, that's ridiculous.

• 1:00:44Doug DeMuro?

  And he goes, "Yeah, but do you use it inside?" I was like, "Oh, I don't know." But it was actually an inside cover. That's the great irony of the whole thing. I don't know, I had never covered a car before. My life.

• 1:00:54Speaker 03

  But he did not know who he was talking to.

• 1:00:57Doug DeMuro?

  He thought he was talking to someone who cared. Ironically, he's probably doubled his money.

• 1:01:02Speaker 03

  But I want a Viper. I just think there, I just can't shake it. Like, it's, the heart wants what it wants and yeah, sure, maybe I, same thing, maybe I only have the car for six months or whatever, but like, just want to check it off.

• 1:01:12Doug DeMuro?

  I totally.

• 1:01:13Speaker 04

  Yep. I will not do 4,500 miles in this.

• 1:01:15Speaker 03

  You say that, you don't, you don't know?

• 1:01:17Doug DeMuro?

  I don't. It's pretty rough. We had, I did, I drove my Viper a lot. We had it together. Like, it was, it was, it's, it's effortful.

• 1:01:25Speaker 03

  I know, I know it is, but I, that's what I want. That's what I want.

• 1:01:29Doug DeMuro?

  You say, when you first buy a car, remember my Lotus Elise, "This is what I want." And then after six months, you're like, "No one wants to ride in this with me?" "No one will go for it?" "No, okay."

• 1:01:37Speaker 03

  That's true. My friend Ryan has already said, "I will never ride in your Viper." So, you know, whatever. But I, I want one. But in the meantime, the SL65 is new reserve, so it'll find a new home on the cars in the bids.

• 1:01:47Speaker 04

  Nice.

• 1:01:48Doug DeMuro?

  Uh, I can't wait to see what happens.

• 1:01:49Speaker 04

  Beautifully presented, photos are great, and there's so many service records that it's.

• 1:01:53Doug DeMuro?

  Plus, this car.

• 1:01:54Speaker 04

  Kenan is selling this car.

• 1:01:56Doug DeMuro?

  This car is Kenan-owned. It'd be like buying a car from.

• 1:01:59Speaker 03

  Yep, that's right. From who?

• 1:02:02Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah.

• 1:02:03Speaker 03

  I don't know who you equate me to.

• 1:02:04Doug DeMuro?

  Someone else who's very facetious. But German!

• 1:02:07Speaker 03

  Well, yes, it is my car. Whenever you ask questions in the listing, I'm the one who's responding to them.

• 1:02:12Speaker 04

  There are service records go by the 2015. Impressive.

• 1:02:15Speaker 03

  Yes. Oh, yeah. Scanning them took a long time.

• 1:02:17Speaker 04

  I can imagine.

• 1:02:18Speaker 03

  Yeah, but there's a lot of great service history at that car.

• 1:02:20Doug DeMuro?

  Uh, I want to move on to the market report.

• 1:02:22Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:02:22Doug DeMuro?

  Okay, the market report is brought to you, uh, obviously by Ryan Lopez's TE37s. This guy, let me tell you something. Four lugs. They call him Four Lug Lopez.

• 1:02:33Speaker 04

  He likes to know that it's five.

• 1:02:35Doug DeMuro?

  Is it five? Your car?

• 1:02:36Speaker 03

  It's not a base model. It's not a base model.

• 1:02:39Doug DeMuro?

  He did an axle swap. He did a hub swap.

• 1:02:41Speaker 04

  Yeah, there you go. You're, you're getting closer each time you say it.

• 1:02:45Doug DeMuro?

  I don't know what that car has.

• 1:02:51Speaker 04

  Off camera.

• 1:02:52Doug DeMuro?

  He just said it has four lads, four legs, and he swapped it. God!

• 1:02:56Speaker 03

  Said it wasn't a baseball, then admitted maybe it was.

• 1:02:58Doug DeMuro?

  It's hard for me to always be right all the time, but here we are. I want to move on to the market report. Anyway, uh, let's talk about the E61.

• 1:03:05Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:03:05Doug DeMuro?

  We all talked, we all put this down. I put it down first, but Fleepo caught.

• 1:03:08Speaker 04

  That's actually inaccurate. That's okay.

• 1:03:10Doug DeMuro?

  And we sold a 2010 BMW 535i X-Drive Sports Wagon.

• 1:03:16Speaker 04

  Okay. We talked about this last week on our Live Now show on the Cars and Bids channel.

• 1:03:19Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah.

• 1:03:19Speaker 04

  And it was with Ryan and Nick.

• 1:03:21Doug DeMuro?

  Wait, wait, hang on. We sold this car for 50.

• 1:03:24Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:03:25Doug DeMuro?

  Well, Sean's gonna get mad.

• 1:03:26Speaker 04

  I thought you said it. Sorry. Keep going, keep going.

• 1:03:28Doug DeMuro?

  We sold this car for 52,500 United States dollars.

• 1:03:32Speaker 04

  Last week, we talked about it on the Live Now show on the Cars and Bids channel.

• 1:03:35Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah.

• 1:03:35Speaker 04

  Nick and Ryan did not accept at that time that this is the ultimate.

• 1:03:40Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah.

• 1:03:40Speaker 04

  Station wagon. It's a, it's a manual, five series, one of the best looking five series wagons, period. Manual, inline six, all-wheel drive, low miles.

• 1:03:49Speaker 03

  I don't agree with the best looking.

• 1:03:50Speaker 04

  It's okay. Don't worry about it.

• 1:03:51Speaker 03

  The E34 would like a word.

• 1:03:53Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah, but that's an old car now.

• 1:03:54Speaker 03

  Yeah, but he's saying, so is this. This thing is 20 years old.

• 1:03:57Speaker 04

  This looks way more modern than the E61 Sally.

• 1:03:59Speaker 03

  Well, of course it looks more modern. It is more modern, but it's the best looking.

• 1:04:01Speaker 04

  Regardless, it's also a very low mile.

• 1:04:03Speaker 03

  Chris Bangle.

• 1:04:04Speaker 04

  It's a great looking wagon.

• 1:04:05Doug DeMuro?

  Is the F10, which we did not get in the States.

• 1:04:08Speaker 03

  I know. The F10 touring is really cool.

• 1:04:10Doug DeMuro?

  The touring?

• 1:04:11Speaker 03

  The F10 touring, have you, have you, you have eyes?

• 1:04:13Speaker 04

  Yes, of course.

• 1:04:14Doug DeMuro?

  The stand is maybe a little too blobby, but the wagon is.

• 1:04:17Speaker 04

  The wagon is. Regardless, the E61 looks great. This is a really low mile, nice example.

• 1:04:21Doug DeMuro?

  It's also perfect. It's M4.

• 1:04:22Speaker 04

  Yeah, it's the one you want. And they did not accept that this is God's car, but now the market has shown that it is.

• 1:04:27Doug DeMuro?

  What did they say it would sell for?

• 1:04:29Speaker 04

  Uh, they didn't know. They don't know.

• 1:04:30Doug DeMuro?

  Four lug Lopez, oh, 8100 bucks? I don't know.

• 1:04:33Speaker 04

  They don't know. I knew.

• 1:04:35Speaker 03

  That, I have to say, the numbers are surprising. I wish I were here to defend the honor of the E61, because I like the E61. I believe this is the one, sort of the E61 M5, which we can't get yet.

• 1:04:44Speaker 04

  This is the car.

• 1:04:45Speaker 03

  This is the.

• 1:04:46Doug DeMuro?

  I'm not that surprised by the number.

• 1:04:47Speaker 04

  No, I'm not surprised at all.

• 1:04:48Doug DeMuro?

  I have seen over on certain auction platforms, these get to big money, and I'm thrilled that we are now getting really big money for them.

• 1:04:56Speaker 03

  On Bonhams, they're bringing huge money.

• 1:04:57Doug DeMuro?

  Bonhams. Selling them, it's it's right between the

• 1:05:01Speaker 04

  How many other options?

• 1:05:02Speaker 03

  Fluff and Flugan?

• 1:05:03Doug DeMuro?

  Cruze, GT, Zagato.

• 1:05:04Speaker 03

  The American underslung.

• 1:05:06Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah. No, but seriously, and now we are, we've become the wagon place, obviously. And this is the result, this is the kind of result I would expect for this car. Uh, it's low miles, et cetera.

• 1:05:16Speaker 03

  I wouldn't even say we've become, we've always been.

• 1:05:19Doug DeMuro?

  We have, but like high end wagons, you weren't sure, whatever. Now it's like clear that like we are wagon central and like this is the type of car that really appeals to the the real car enthusiast type of buyer. And this is, and also if you're looking for one of these, it's like an 06 100 series Land Cruiser. This ain't coming up again, no matter how much money you have. Like you could be sitting on the sidelines with a hundred thousand dollars, it doesn't mean you're going to find one of these cars. Low mile, M sport, all wheel drive, manual, et cetera. Even just the manual alone on an E61 wagon is very hard to find.

• 1:05:45Speaker 04

  Yeah, totally. This is just, it's such a good car. I'm not surprised by the price. It is what these go for, but this is like, we're getting to, to new records.

• 1:05:53Doug DeMuro?

  And that whole idea of body swapping an E60 M5, hell. What you should instead do is, uh, is body swap an E60 M5 into an E61 regular five series.

• 1:06:04Speaker 04

  Why don't I?

• 1:06:05Doug DeMuro?

  Solves every problem. And it's more valuable.

• 1:06:08Speaker 03

  How can you lose?

• 1:06:09Doug DeMuro?

  Can you tell me if an M5 is sold? Have we sold an E60 M5 for more than this? 52.5. Has anyone since new?

• 1:06:16Speaker 04

  I think we did, we had one really low mile one.

• 1:06:20Speaker 03

  The wagon.

• 1:06:21Speaker 04

  And that's 51.

• 1:06:22Doug DeMuro?

  That's super low miles one, which has been 51.

• 1:06:24Speaker 04

  And that's 74.

• 1:06:25Doug DeMuro?

  The answer is no, we have not. The highest dollar E60 platform car on our site.

• 1:06:30Speaker 03

  Is a 530.

• 1:06:31Doug DeMuro?

  Two straight, this wagon and that wagon, neither were M5.

• 1:06:34Speaker 04

  And I stand by that, that, that feels correct.

• 1:06:36Doug DeMuro?

  Needless to say, on the E39 platform, the, uh, the station wagons do not pull a premium over the, uh, M5.

• 1:06:43Speaker 04

  No, no.

• 1:06:45Doug DeMuro?

  You don't see 525i Tourings pulling along.

• 1:06:48Speaker 03

  But the built ones do and like you, you, we do see them occasionally. I don't know. We sold that other one.

• 1:06:54Doug DeMuro?

  Try doing E39 Touring. I'm curious what.

• 1:06:56Speaker 04

  There you go.

• 1:06:57Speaker 03

  But yeah, E39 tourings.

• 1:07:00Doug DeMuro?

  Like, what's, what are these, what do they bring in if they're not built?

• 1:07:03Speaker 03

  If they're not built, less.

• 1:07:05Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah, 17 for that nice.

• 1:07:08Speaker 04

  Yeah, they're cheap.

• 1:07:09Doug DeMuro?

  They're not that bad. Not like D61.

• 1:07:12Speaker 04

  Pretty much no stakes for that generation, right?

• 1:07:13Doug DeMuro?

  Uh, I want to talk about, uh, there's a couple, two other things I want, three other things I want to talk about. Market report. It's a big market report today. When is the Cadillac Elante? Can you pull up Cadillac Elante? We rarely, on this podcast, I don't know if you've been paying attention, but this podcast is, is, is, we're shilling for cars and bids on this podcast. We're just, you're being, you're being sold right now.

• 1:07:33Speaker 03

  You're talking about this one?

• 1:07:33Doug DeMuro?

  So we only ever talk about good results. We don't ever mention the other stuff. Today I want to change that. I want to talk about the Cadillac Elante.

• 1:07:42Speaker 04

  For the record, this is a good result.

• 1:07:44Doug DeMuro?

  This is a totally market correct result. This Cadillac Elante, non-North Star Cadillac Elante, sold for 3,300 bucks. And it hit me while I was, while I was watching this, this is a really nice car. Like, this is a well-preserved one. If you look at the interior especially, like, it was a nice-looking Elante. The Elante, like, that's, you know.

• 1:08:00Speaker 03

  Yeah, look for what they are.

• 1:08:01Doug DeMuro?

  A little bit of cracking, but like, for an Elante, these cars are never gonna be worth anything. And it's funny because when they came out in the eighties, it was like, this will be the collector's item Cadillac, low-production, Italian-built, you know, Buick, Pininfarina-designed car. They never, ever, ever, ever, ever went up in value. They never will. The market segment who would have sent them up in value is no longer interested in these cars. It's over for our friend, the Cadillac Elante. And three to $6,000 is what they're worth.

• 1:08:30Speaker 04

  Yep.

• 1:08:31Doug DeMuro?

  We turn down more Elantes than we run.

• 1:08:33Speaker 04

  We do.

• 1:08:33Doug DeMuro?

  We get submitted some really rough ones that are like $1,500 cars.

• 1:08:36Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:08:37Speaker 03

  I mean, to be fair, this has 100,000 miles.

• 1:08:38Doug DeMuro?

  It's got miles. But pull up, go to the regular.

• 1:08:41Speaker 03

  A lot of things don't necessarily work.

• 1:08:44Doug DeMuro?

  Go to the regular Elante results. $7,100 for a North Star. This is true on the, on the, on the, on the trailer. There's no outliers here. Like, ultimately, it's funny because this car had so much of a gravitas behind it when it was new. And it never did. Same with Buick Riaada. They never.

• 1:09:00Speaker 04

  The Riaada.

• 1:09:00Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah, the Riaada.

• 1:09:02Speaker 03

  Well, that is, that is interesting. Does this make it the cheapest Pininfarina-designed vehicle you can buy?

• 1:09:07Doug DeMuro?

  That's an interesting question.

• 1:09:08Speaker 03

  Probably. Or close, anyway.

• 1:09:11Doug DeMuro?

  I'm, it's kind of. Did Shane do that Hyundai Matrix? Or was that, was that Bertone?

• 1:09:14Speaker 04

  No, they did. They did the Hyundai Matrix, which was available with seven seats.

• 1:09:17Doug DeMuro?

  And that car is cheaper than this car. You can get a Hyundai Matrix.

• 1:09:20Speaker 04

  I forgot about that car. I love that.

• 1:09:22Doug DeMuro?

  That was a Pininfarina for sure?

• 1:09:23Speaker 04

  No.

• 1:09:24Doug DeMuro?

  It was one at some Italian design house, I think, did it.

• 1:09:28Speaker 04

  Yep.

• 1:09:29Doug DeMuro?

  Boom, pull up the Hyundai Matrix. The real question that we should all have for ourselves is, would you rather have that Cadillac Elante? Or?

• 1:09:37Speaker 04

  Yep.

• 1:09:38Doug DeMuro?

  And Pininfarina's contribution, because to me, it looked a lot like all the other MPVs in Europe at the time. But their contribution was, the rear window was a different height than the side windows. Do you see? That's real Italian design work, right there for you.

• 1:09:54Speaker 03

  Chrysler, listen up, that's innovation.

• 1:09:56Doug DeMuro?

  That's innovation! That's why it wasn't reliable, they innovated.

• 1:09:59Speaker 04

  Also, I apologize, I was thinking of the Qrando for having seven seats, they only had five.

• 1:10:03Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah, the Rondo, of course it's.

• 1:10:04Speaker 03

  Thank you for correcting yourself.

• 1:10:05Speaker 04

  I, I, I, sometimes I get texts like, hey, why were you wrong with this? I wanted to not leave that open this time.

• 1:10:11Doug DeMuro?

  Uh, pull up the three, you want to talk 300ZX?

• 1:10:13Speaker 03

  I do, yes.

• 1:10:14Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah.

• 1:10:15Speaker 03

  So, yes, the 300ZX, which I drove around briefly when I was here, sold for $87,000.

• 1:10:21Doug DeMuro?

  By the way, in, in this era, this was the same price as the Elante.

• 1:10:24Speaker 04

  Just say it.

• 1:10:25Speaker 03

  This one, obviously extremely desirable, crazy low mileage, manual transmission, twin turbo V6, like, the one to have. And you drove it to, this just felt, the way I described driving this car is it felt adult. Like, it felt grown up, compared to like, the other cars of its era.

• 1:10:40Doug DeMuro?

  Buzzy.

• 1:10:40Speaker 03

  Buzzy.

• 1:10:41Doug DeMuro?

  Evo's and the STIs, which had their place, but this car was definitely more.

• 1:10:44Speaker 03

  It's just nice. It just drives great, sounds great, and the shifter feels awesome.

• 1:10:49Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah.

• 1:10:49Speaker 03

  And I'm not at all surprised, I mean, perfect example of Find another one.

• 1:10:53Doug DeMuro?

  It is an interesting thing, though, because for a long time, these have lagged behind their counterparts. And this one, if this was a Supra, it would have sold for $200,000. However, it sold for big money.

• 1:11:03Speaker 03

  Sold for big money, and I'm really glad, because the owner, I helped with this car, like, so fastidious. Like, they had the original tires, which are here, and they're wrapped up. He had boxes in every, boxes in every sub-box, and it is labeled with what goes where, and like, all this stuff.

• 1:11:18Doug DeMuro?

  Sold new at the Nissan dealer in Honolulu.

• 1:11:20Speaker 03

  Yeah, I mean, it was, it just fastidiously kept, probably the nicest one, one of the nicest ones left in existence.

• 1:11:26Doug DeMuro?

  Undoubtedly.

• 1:11:26Speaker 03

  And so it sold for the correct number, real money.

• 1:11:29Doug DeMuro?

  And we posted this, and of course, the comment was, oh, God, this car is ruined. You're ruining cars. They're getting so expensive. I don't think, again, this is like the STI last week. I don't think the Z32 in general is getting too expensive. I think there's a lot of ones you can buy for real cheap.

• 1:11:41Speaker 03

  The next one's, the next one's.

• 1:11:42Doug DeMuro?

  The next one's 41, and that car had 13,000 miles, although it was an automatic. But this car, though, I'm always supportive of the really special cars trading hands for big money and getting preserved. Someone should preserve a few dozen of these cars that we love.

• 1:11:56Speaker 03

  Yep.

• 1:11:57Doug DeMuro?

  And I'm glad that that exists. I totally am supportive of people modifying a lot of them and having fun and driving them or whatever, but like, there should be some out there that in 30 years, when they're all gone, that we can look back on and be like, that car I remember.

• 1:12:09Speaker 03

  For academic reasons, to look back at how it was.

• 1:12:12Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah.

• 1:12:12Speaker 03

  I agree with that. I totally agree.

• 1:12:14Doug DeMuro?

  And this car is clearly an example of that.

• 1:12:16Speaker 03

  Yep.

• 1:12:17Doug DeMuro?

  Uh, I think the new owner's in Florida. It is a very, very, very special car, and I am really, really, I was really excited to drive it. I had never driven a Z32 any distance before. Uh, and I was really impressed with how well it drove out.

• 1:12:29Speaker 03

  My eyes, our eyes, our eyes together were opened.

• 1:12:32Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah, totally. Totally. To the point where you, I still think the Mark Force cooler, better looking.

• 1:12:37Speaker 03

  However, a nice one of these.

• 1:12:38Doug DeMuro?

  If you had, gave me the keys and were like, you're gonna, you know, do a canyon run?

• 1:12:43Speaker 03

  Yep.

• 1:12:43Doug DeMuro?

  And it's fast. It was fast. I was shocked at how quick it is.

• 1:12:47Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:12:47Doug DeMuro?

  Uh, okay, we gotta move on to the questions, uh, the questions which are brought to you by the Gophers in Filippo's Field.

• 1:12:55Speaker 04

  We don't talk about those anymore.

• 1:12:57Speaker 03

  It's just Filippo Field, by the way.

• 1:12:58Doug DeMuro?

  Filippo's like these Gophers. Now, you can ask us questions. You go to carsandbids.com, you click on the community tab. There'll be a post there that says, questions, questions, questions. And you can ask us questions about any topic you want, including Ryan Lopez's air conditioning. We were a little light on questions this week, so please, people, I went to I went through every single question. I went through every single question.

• 1:13:18Speaker 04

  There's 456 of them.

• 1:13:19Doug DeMuro?

  And I only found eight acceptable ones. I'm very picky. Well, half the questions are like, if you had this much money, what would you buy? And I just, I, I wanna get like, deeper than that. I wanna feel more than that.

• 1:13:31Speaker 04

  Right.

• 1:13:32Speaker 03

  He wants a conversation.

• 1:13:32Speaker 04

  You wanna feel really connected.

• 1:13:33Doug DeMuro?

  I wanna feel like one of those Gophers tunneling into.

• 1:13:35Speaker 03

  Do you know how, they can tell how far?

• 1:13:37Doug DeMuro?

  Okay.

• 1:13:37Speaker 03

  They have to fall all the way over to my place if it turns out from you.

• 1:13:40Doug DeMuro?

  Um, first question from Tommy Marshall. I want to get this out of the way, uh, quickly. What Doug, what happened to the racing sim setup from the Linus Tech Tips collab?

• 1:13:49Speaker 03

  They're there.

• 1:13:49Doug DeMuro?

  I'll tell you what happened. It's sitting right over there and anybody who comes into our office, uh, does a lap or two. Um, Sean figured out something.

• 1:13:56Speaker 03

  Leaderboard.

• 1:13:57Doug DeMuro?

  I actually haven't done it yet. But there's a leaderboard and Sean is over here now trying to claim that he's fastest, but he's.

• 1:14:02Speaker 03

  Right. Cause he sat there for hours and just, and it really was just him. He has no, like, we haven't had any more experience.

• 1:14:08Doug DeMuro?

  Nobody's, everyone else who's played on that thing has played it, like, done three laps. Sean has spent like full nights in here, just sitting on the sim. And then, and then so he can pop up like a, like his little, like one of Filippo's gophers.

• 1:14:22Speaker 04

  One of our employees, team members, Johnny, has a faster time on there.

• 1:14:27Doug DeMuro?

  Really? Is that true?

• 1:14:28Speaker 04

  Not anymore, apparently. Getting basically.

• 1:14:30Doug DeMuro?

  Sean's been through four full days.

• 1:14:33Speaker 03

  He took a holiday weekend.

• 1:14:35Speaker 04

  Sean, who's in my line of sight, shaking his head. Johnny in the back is nodding. Yes, his time is faster.

• 1:14:39Doug DeMuro?

  Uh, okay. From next question from Antonio SS22. This is a great and very timely question because I've been thinking the same exact thing. Given the epic success General Motors has had with the C8 Corvette, and you can't say it's been anything other than epic success, truthfully. And now the Lamborghini Huracan is gone. Would it make sense from a market perspective for Stellantis to bring back the Viper where the mid-engine V10 is a halo car for their brand? You know, the Viper, its whole life came and went.

• 1:15:04Speaker 03

  Yeah, there have been periods of time when a Viper is for sale and.

• 1:15:08Doug DeMuro?

  Not, and then comes back, like the Z, honestly.

• 1:15:10Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:15:10Doug DeMuro?

  And, um, I, I drove that one and I was just thinking that same thing. You know, Stellantis is trying to regain some credibility that was lost when they came out with the fake exhaust note hatchback charger.

• 1:15:21Speaker 03

  Yeah, but they can't do that. I'll tell you why. The, every Viper shares something in common. It has a huge V10, naturally aspirated V10 engine and a manual transmission. That would be hard to sell in today's market.

• 1:15:34Doug DeMuro?

  Do you think so?

• 1:15:35Speaker 03

  I think it would be hard to build in any, it has to be in any V10 and it has to have a main.

• 1:15:38Doug DeMuro?

  I will say, the last Viper kind of proved that it maybe it needed to be the last Viper. Like they had refined it, they, it was, it was, they had finally come out with like the right Viper for the audience, like it got made it more expensive and no one bought it and they couldn't get rid of that. They couldn't get out of that experience fast enough.

• 1:15:55Speaker 03

  You know, you say this, but the extreme aero cars are worth so much money now.

• 1:15:59Doug DeMuro?

  In the end, it's actually, but, but I think that actually speaks to the problem with the Viper in general. They came out with this luxury car and which are the ones that people actually want today? It's these ultra crazy ones that actually sold in super small numbers and you cannot justify creating the car just to make the extreme aero one. With all of that said, this, this would be a good time to do it.

• 1:16:18Speaker 03

  It would be. I just, but if they do it with a V8, like that's not a Viper.

• 1:16:22Doug DeMuro?

  It would, I agree.

• 1:16:22Speaker 03

  I think so. You say it gains them credibility. If they mess with the recipe in any way, I think they instantly lose all of it.

• 1:16:28Speaker 04

  Yeah, I will also say that the Hellcat and Hellcat engine things gave a lot of credibility from performance standpoint.

• 1:16:34Speaker 03

  But it's not a Viper, no lineage.

• 1:16:36Speaker 04

  It's all gone. But you know, the other issue, if you look at their brands, most of their brands sell one or two vehicles at the moment.

• 1:16:42Doug DeMuro?

  Yep.

• 1:16:42Speaker 03

  Their brands are also their models.

• 1:16:44Speaker 04

  They don't have a unifying, like what is the Solentis brand? I, nobody knows. What is the Dodge brand? Nobody knows. There's not a unifying theme and I don't think the Ford is one of them.

• 1:16:52Speaker 03

  What are you gonna say? They hired 2,000 engineers to get rid of the one thing that unifies all their brands.

• 1:16:57Speaker 00

  At Edward Jones, we believe rich is about taking care of what gives your life meaning. That's why your financial advisor personalizes your plan to help you preserve your progress and create something that lasts. Let's find your rich. Edward Jones. Member SIPC.

• 1:17:15Doug DeMuro?

  Hey, we don't besmirch the Fiat brand in that way.

• 1:17:19Speaker 03

  Your, your, your like side panels are falling off. Your, your center armrest was sharp.

• 1:17:23Speaker 04

  That predates the answer.

• 1:17:24Doug DeMuro?

  I would argue that what unifies all their cars and their brands, they're all cool. I mean, the Pacifica may be aside, but like every Chrysler and Dodge, you are choosing to buy it knowing their reliability, reputation because you think it's cool. The Ram looks cool.

• 1:17:37Speaker 04

  The Wrangler you're doing because it's cool.

• 1:17:38Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah, I don't, all of them.

• 1:17:40Speaker 04

  But then in Europe, the Opel, the Peugeot, the Citroen, the Fiat, like those are just cars.

• 1:17:45Doug DeMuro?

  But the problem is that they don't have a Viper, an Opel version of the Viper.

• 1:17:49Speaker 03

  That would help.

• 1:17:50Doug DeMuro?

  And I think that if they took the Viper to Europe and needed a Peugeot, the whole world would be in better shape.

• 1:17:56Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:17:56Speaker 04

  Huh.

• 1:17:57Speaker 03

  Be nice to see it. Yeah, just a nice V10 Opel in Luxembourg.

• 1:18:01Doug DeMuro?

  European regulations, they don't allow you to wash that car in your driveway on a Sunday. They don't allow you to fix it in your garage during the week. And they certainly wouldn't allow you to drive it down the street, make a noise.

• 1:18:13Speaker 04

  I just don't think that like it fits any brand identity.

• 1:18:16Speaker 03

  That's true.

• 1:18:17Doug DeMuro?

  I don't know.

• 1:18:17Speaker 03

  But I don't, I, I, well, I'm getting back to this question. I would love it if they would, if the Viper would come back personally. But I just, just don't see it. I think the fifth gen is the last.

• 1:18:27Doug DeMuro?

  Hard to imagine developing a V10 and all that stuff.

• 1:18:29Speaker 03

  Yeah, exactly.

• 1:18:30Doug DeMuro?

  Unless they could justify coming back, not with a V10 and a manual.

• 1:18:33Speaker 03

  They can't, I don't think they can.

• 1:18:35Doug DeMuro?

  Corvette always was a front engine V8.

• 1:18:37Speaker 04

  Corvette's entire brand personality was, we want to be a supercar beater from America. That, that was never Viper's thing.

• 1:18:45Doug DeMuro?

  Maybe it can be. How about the GT-R? Come back as a Viper. Screw, screw a V8, go for a V6. Make a Viper GT-R.

• 1:18:52Speaker 03

  Really?

• 1:18:52Doug DeMuro?

  But that car is sold to the same people who like Vipers.

• 1:18:55Speaker 03

  Well, you know what? If I want, maybe, maybe that's what we need to get the values of the Vipers to go. To bring a V6 back and ruin it all. I don't know.

• 1:19:03Speaker 04

  Do you want the values to go up?

• 1:19:04Doug DeMuro?

  No, he wants to buy one.

• 1:19:05Speaker 03

  I want to buy one. I'm gonna buy one.

• 1:19:06Speaker 04

  Oh, God.

• 1:19:07Speaker 03

  Ride the wave.

• 1:19:07Doug DeMuro?

  He wants to buy one first. Uh, next question from Bars and Kids. Hi Doug. Uh, these days you're only reviewing cars you have interest in personally, or a combination of cars you know will do well for the channel. Do you have the final say in what you will review or don't review? Uh, I have the only say. I want to be clear here. Occasionally Sean will send me a car and be, hey, I think this would do great. Hey, hey, this car, someone, there's a guy who really wants you to review this. I'd be like, no, Sean. No. You've seen these conversations.

• 1:19:36Speaker 04

  Better know what's out of it.

• 1:19:38Doug DeMuro?

  Not happening, sorry.

• 1:19:41Speaker 03

  They're fun to watch.

• 1:19:42Speaker 04

  You will take suggestions and if they fit the brand identity, they, you'll, you'll say yes.

• 1:19:49Doug DeMuro?

  All the cars I review, this is the greatest thing that's happened that I don't think the audience has fully understood just how wonderful this whole, uh, Cars and Bids acquisition has been. Like, you are getting an unfiltered, if we were doing this podcast seven years ago, I'd be like, the Honda Prelude has many great merits. Um, uh, it is a little on the expensive side, just a spidge. But, uh, it's also a wonderful car to drive and, uh, I suspect they'll have no trouble hitting their sales target. But now I'm here like, the Prelude is fast.

• 1:20:21Doug DeMuro?

  And that also extends to the cars that I review. Let me tell you something, okay? There is no situation on this planet in which five years ago, okay, I could have gotten away with reviewing a Nissan Pathfinder, an original Nissan Pathfinder. Uh, what are some of the other? Lexus RX 300, there was no chance that review would have-

• 1:20:42Speaker 04

  Yeah, I mean, some might say that five years ago, Doug, would is a little bit more thoughtful.

• 1:20:46Doug DeMuro?

  There was a time we needed to make money. Now we just have fun. We just have fun. It's what we do here. And it's great. So the answer is, do I have a final say? Yeah. Yeah.

• 1:20:55Speaker 04

  I agree with the, with the say of, you're the only say. That's accurate.

• 1:20:59Doug DeMuro?

  They've tried. They've tried. Sometimes I will not review a car that I want to review. You've just gotta fight. Filippo will bring it to me and you should review this. Nope. I would have if you hadn't said anything about it.

• 1:21:09Speaker 04

  The truth comes out.

• 1:21:11Doug DeMuro?

  Uh, okay. Next question from Rider7. This is actually a question for Sean, but Sean's not mic'd up, so I'm gonna answer it for him. I have a bad colored G-Wagon. No.

• 1:21:19Speaker 03

  I can't handle it.

• 1:21:19Doug DeMuro?

  The question can't-

• 1:21:20Speaker 04

  If I brake lights, it may not work. We don't know.

• 1:21:22Doug DeMuro?

  The question is, we've heard the process of Doug creating the channel and Cars in Bids. What was the process of creating the podcast? Whose idea were the different segments and questions? Let me tell you about the podcast. We brought in Sean on a rainy day.

• 1:21:33Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:21:33Doug DeMuro?

  And, uh, and he's like, you should have a podcast and it should be this. And we were like, alright, and that was that. Don't you think that was kinda how-

• 1:21:39Speaker 04

  Yeah, we did-

• 1:21:40Doug DeMuro?

  I don't recall doing anything.

• 1:21:41Speaker 04

  Pre-Sean, we did some live shows that were like truly live and that- Which we, which we still get asked about a lot. But it turns out that's a lot harder and not as interesting as doing a pre-recorded pod where you can add additional media, where you can make it really an object-

• 1:21:52Doug DeMuro?

  Where you could censor Nick.

• 1:21:54Speaker 04

  Important.

• 1:21:54Speaker 03

  That's what, but that's what people wanna see.

• 1:21:57Doug DeMuro?

  Imagine Nick on a live show.

• 1:21:58Speaker 03

  Nick unplugged. Oh my god.

• 1:22:00Speaker 04

  I mean, we couldn't, we couldn't. We'd need a five second delay at least.

• 1:22:03Doug DeMuro?

  The least, yeah.

• 1:22:04Speaker 04

  Just like-

• 1:22:05Doug DeMuro?

  And when he starts on a tangent, you just pull all the cords, you just sever them. Oops!

• 1:22:10Speaker 03

  Um- And you get that boop, you know, technical issues thing.

• 1:22:13Doug DeMuro?

  Right.

• 1:22:14Speaker 03

  Screen.

• 1:22:14Doug DeMuro?

  Alright. Um, the, that, Sean came in, he created a set, he created a pod, it's a great, it's the biggest automotive podcast. We should give a round of applause.

• 1:22:23Speaker 03

  Yeah, some love for Sean.

• 1:22:24Doug DeMuro?

  For Sean. As I recall, our process of getting Filippo as talent, we were just like, will you do this with us?

• 1:22:29Speaker 04

  Like, we're filming this today, you're here.

• 1:22:31Doug DeMuro?

  He's like, alright, fine. And now he's a staple in our lives. He's like corn.

• 1:22:37Speaker 04

  Heavily incentivized by the side of government? Can I get some of that corn money?

• 1:22:42Doug DeMuro?

  Uh, no, you cannot. Uh, I have-

• 1:22:44Speaker 03

  No big corn for you.

• 1:22:45Doug DeMuro?

  We have time for a couple more questions, surprisingly. Uh, "Dear Doug," uh, this is a great question from JCW Nico, or Doug to Doug, or any of the other side characters on the pod. They're referring to you there specifically. "What is the telltale sign that you're getting tired of owning an interesting car? Is there a specific sign that will make you go, 'Maybe it's time for something new.' Is it time to sell?" I, I will say for me personally, I'm very, I have this lucky thing where I go away in the summer and I don't really play with the cars. And if I'm not thinking about the car all summer, pretty much I saw the car in the fall. That's like-

• 1:23:15Speaker 04

  Does that happen to any car?

• 1:23:16Doug DeMuro?

  The RS2.

• 1:23:17Speaker 04

  That's right.

• 1:23:18Doug DeMuro?

  The RS2, I was like, "Well, this is done." Uh, the yellow Defender-

• 1:23:24Speaker 03

  Well, and the A-Class, which was there on Nantucket, you didn't think about it.

• 1:23:27Speaker 04

  We knew. Well, of course, we knew.

• 1:23:29Doug DeMuro?

  But I think that's a big one. If you're not like actively excited, that's the beginning of it timed to-

• 1:23:34Speaker 03

  Yep, absolutely. Like, you know, by, break up the example, it's like I still, when I park my M5, I still get out, I walk up forward, I look back at it every single time. I've had that car for 10 years. But like, I, there was a point in my 355, it's like I had to pick which car I was gonna go on a drive with my friends and I grabbed the keys to the other car and it was like, "Hmm, it's time to sell the car, it's time to sell the Ferrari." And so I did. So, yeah, I agree. When you, when, if you are, if your gut is already telling you, "I'm not sure for like, time to go." You've, you haven't realized it, but you probably-

• 1:24:00Doug DeMuro?

  I am, to this day, my three, the three cars that I have that are really special, I am excited about them every single time. I look at them, drive them, think about them, etc.

• 1:24:08Speaker 04

  Yeah, I'm sorry to them. Whichever couple cars don't fit in that criteria.

• 1:24:12Doug DeMuro?

  Well, the 993 is like more of a practical car. The 993, I think I'll switch out for other stuff in the future, but I, I still really, that's a, that's a truck, man. That's a utility truck. Me and Sean use it to deliver the mail whenever there's a big storm in Incline Village. Me and Sean go up there with our respective G wagons.

• 1:24:31Speaker 03

  You handling it, him not? And the thing, you however, you either drive, you either sell a car because you're gonna move, you drive it into the ground, or you're forced by our content team to then sell it because we filmed it and decided we were gonna do it. Those are the only situations.

• 1:24:45Doug DeMuro?

  I've sold cars. Not really. You don't have the ability. You're very indecisive in this topic.

• 1:24:51Speaker 04

  No, just sometimes, I get to GTI, I said it some months ago, and still be actively driven.

• 1:24:56Doug DeMuro?

  The GTI was gonna go.

• 1:24:57Speaker 04

  Done 5,000 miles.

• 1:24:58Doug DeMuro?

  The Abarth lasted 18 months after you said you were gonna sell that. The GTI's been at least six months after you said you were gonna sell that. He's a collector.

• 1:25:04Speaker 04

  What's your car? Although yesterday, my wife said that she's tired of, she has to drive a bunch for work, and she's tired of traffic in a GTI.

• 1:25:11Doug DeMuro?

  A manual.

• 1:25:12Speaker 04

  Honestly, it's fair.

• 1:25:13Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah, I totally. So is it gonna go?

• 1:25:15Speaker 04

  No, because it's actually a really useful type of car.

• 1:25:17Doug DeMuro?

  Have you thought about an ILX?

• 1:25:19Speaker 04

  No.

• 1:25:20Doug DeMuro?

  At all?

• 1:25:21Speaker 04

  Never.

• 1:25:21Doug DeMuro?

  Not even for yourself, but just in general?

• 1:25:23Speaker 04

  In general, no. I've thought about a lot of cars. I think the wagon is coming up maybe on some life cycle. But I can't think of anything I want more, and so I'm not gonna sell it.

• 1:25:31Speaker 03

  May I make a suggestion?

• 1:25:32Speaker 04

  Like, you also need to have something.

• 1:25:34Speaker 03

  Nah.

• 1:25:34Doug DeMuro?

  Rivian R2.

• 1:25:35Speaker 04

  You also need to have something that you want to replace with.

• 1:25:37Speaker 03

  You want a R2.

• 1:25:38Speaker 04

  For a lot of really long trips.

• 1:25:39Doug DeMuro?

  You need a newer wagon. You need a 213. You only don't want it because I have it. If I didn't have it, you would absolutely have it today. You hate this idea that you're a budget Doug, which you are, but I love that idea.

• 1:25:52Speaker 04

  I'm just not that interested in it.

• 1:25:53Doug DeMuro?

  I think it's great.

• 1:25:55Speaker 04

  And the 214 doesn't have third rail.

• 1:25:57Doug DeMuro?

  The 213 is better. I drove your car. 213 is so much.

• 1:25:59Speaker 04

  Of course it's better, yeah.

• 1:26:00Doug DeMuro?

  Comfortable or. It has carplay without you having to install a Chinese unit in the thing, which you did.

• 1:26:06Speaker 04

  The prior owner did.

• 1:26:07Doug DeMuro?

  Okay.

• 1:26:08Speaker 04

  Yeah, it doesn't work right now. Very well. It just like reconnect every time. It's a real problem.

• 1:26:12Speaker 03

  I'm stunned at that.

• 1:26:13Doug DeMuro?

  Uh, okay. That's all fair. And I think those are reasonable reasons to sell a car.

• 1:26:19Speaker 04

  But you also need to want something else. Like, there needs to be something that you want that money for, that garage space.

• 1:26:25Speaker 03

  I've been expecting to come to the end of my journey with my M5 a long time ago. Like, I thought like, okay, I'm gonna want something else, but it just hasn't happened. Yet. Maybe it does one day, but like the SL did, the 355 did, it's like.

• 1:26:36Speaker 04

  For the wagon.

• 1:26:38Speaker 03

  The Viper will.

• 1:26:39Speaker 04

  The wagon's not worth all that much anymore. It has 125,000 miles. It's been hit a couple of times. It has some issues. It's an old, it's a 12-year-old car. What else do I want for that money? I don't, nothing really.

• 1:26:50Speaker 03

  What would you do with the eight grand?

• 1:26:52Speaker 04

  Hey, it's worth like 15.

• 1:26:53Speaker 03

  Hey, is the Abarth gone?

• 1:26:54Speaker 04

  The Abarth is gone.

• 1:26:54Speaker 03

  They drove it to Arizona?

• 1:26:56Speaker 04

  No, no, they shipped it to Vegas.

• 1:26:57Speaker 03

  Vegas?

• 1:26:58Speaker 04

  Vegas, it's there.

• 1:26:59Speaker 03

  Damn, driving around Vegas in an Abarth. It will die out there. Someone's gonna shoot it with a 50 cal in the desert at some point. That would be great.

• 1:27:07Speaker 04

  It's a great car. The Abarth was so good.

• 1:27:09Speaker 03

  It was a great car. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:27:11Speaker 04

  I was tired of it, but it was a great car.

• 1:27:12Doug DeMuro?

  Okay, next question from C L E Y E. Clyde, Doug, with a Carrera GT selling for almost $3 million more than a Ferrari F40 at the same auction last weekend, would you ever consider selling the Carrera GT to move into an F40? We talk about Carrera GT F40 a lot here, uh, cause I thought about getting an F40 when I bought the Carrera GT and chose the Carrera GT instead, cause I couldn't afford the F40. You know, one interesting thing, uh, I, the answer to the question is that particular Carrera GT was crazy money and, uh, I don't necessarily think they're equal. One interesting thing though, that we haven't talked about, that this question reminded me of. You know what car hasn't run up like every other car in the last six months is the F40. F40 results have not been particularly strong.

• 1:27:51Speaker 03

  5.23 this past, uh, at, uh, Mota.

• 1:27:57Doug DeMuro?

  For a zero-mile US car.

• 1:27:59Speaker 03

  For a 92, yeah, 92 later car, it was a Euro though.

• 1:28:02Doug DeMuro?

  Uh, Broad Arrow sold this week in Amelia, a US F40 with 8,000 miles for 3.8 million.

• 1:28:08Speaker 03

  Wow.

• 1:28:09Doug DeMuro?

  That is what they sold for. That is what they were selling for five years ago. That is what they are selling for today. The car, the car that, uh, that RM sold in Miami had 800 miles on it. So yes, it sold for 5 million. If an Enzo today sold for, with 800 miles on it, that car would be $15 million.

• 1:28:23Speaker 03

  Well, one did.

• 1:28:25Doug DeMuro?

  And that's what they're selling for. I have been surprised. F40 values, I think you could still to this day buy an F40 for two and a half. F40 values have not gone crazy like the other car.

• 1:28:34Speaker 03

  Well, I think they, no, I think they just made a gazillion of them.

• 1:28:36Doug DeMuro?

  But they made a gazillion Carrera GTs. In fact, the exact same number and Carrera GT values have now doubled in a span where F40 values have done nothing. I have a theory. My theory is people drove the F40.

• 1:28:48Speaker 03

  I have a different theory.

• 1:28:50Doug DeMuro?

  What is your theory, Ken?

• 1:28:51Speaker 03

  My theory is that I have been watching the market very closely where things are shifting. And it's clear that there is a shift away from the older cars. The blue chip like carbureted Enzo era Ferraris have more or less plateaued. There was a world record Dino this past weekend. But I think the interest is more on the early 2000s Ferraris. I think that's like golden age. I think the F4, I mean, the F40 is the one. Very difficult to use and there are a lot of them. And so you're really just, just the only real differentiating factor between them. Yes, you have the cat adjustments, but it's mileage. That's like the really the late year, year production mileage.

• 1:29:25Doug DeMuro?

  Maybe, but a 959 just sold, which is the exact same era as an F40. And honestly, way less cool. A 959 just sold for five and a half, which 959s and F40s were nowhere near the same plane until suddenly they are. And it's like, wait a second, what? I'm interested in this. I'm really surprised watching these F40 results come in that F40 has not taken off either. Now, it did take off quite a bit before, but it's interesting to me that there are not people sitting around saying F40 is a $10 million car when F50 is when Enzo is, et cetera. There was a time when F40 looked like it was eclipsing F50.

• 1:29:54Speaker 03

  Well, yeah, again, I still bring that, that for those examples, I'll bring it back to production numbers. 349 F50s.

• 1:30:00Doug DeMuro?

  Maybe, but Carrera GT, when I bought my Carrera GT, it was 65 to 75% back of that 40. And now it is not far off period.

• 1:30:08Speaker 03

  Well, again, I think part of the reason that is, is there is more interest in collecting those Porsches. The 959, the Carrera GT, the 918.

• 1:30:14Doug DeMuro?

  As there damn should be.

• 1:30:15Speaker 03

  There should be.

• 1:30:15Doug DeMuro?

  Except for the 918, which is like a Prius.

• 1:30:17Speaker 03

  Well, you gotta have it to complete the set. The 288 is, you know.

• 1:30:20Doug DeMuro?

  You agree it's a Prius. In a lot of ways.

• 1:30:23Speaker 03

  Yep. I don't know. I'm very interested. Ferraris are just so hot right now. I'm just very interested, interested to see where things.

• 1:30:30Doug DeMuro?

  Not the F40, except the F40 is literally hot.

• 1:30:32Speaker 03

  So maybe you should.

• 1:30:33Doug DeMuro?

  When you drive it.

• 1:30:33Speaker 03

  Maybe you should buy an F40.

• 1:30:34Doug DeMuro?

  No, I'm not, I'm not, I don't want any more cars this valuable.

• 1:30:36Speaker 03

  Folks, it's never gonna happen.

• 1:30:38Doug DeMuro?

  It's fine with me. I, what I want more than anything else, a Lincoln Bronco.

• 1:30:43Speaker 03

  Coming.

• 1:30:44Doug DeMuro?

  Lincoln Bronco. Bring it to the world, people. Thank you for watching. This is our podcast. Do you have anything else to say?

• 1:30:53Speaker 04

  Check out carsandbids.com.

• 1:30:54Doug DeMuro?

  Oh, Cars and Bids is a sponsor too, not just the field behind Filippo's house. Cars and Bids also-

• 1:30:59Speaker 04

  Which should just be a huge Cars and Bids sign.

• 1:31:01Doug DeMuro?

  If you got the 90 million and bought the field, that's what you would do. You'd put up a big advertisement for Cars and Bids.

• 1:31:06Speaker 04

  That's right.

• 1:31:08Doug DeMuro?

  Thank you for watching our finest podcast ever. Goodbye, everyone.

• 1:31:11Speaker 04

  Goodbye.

• 1:31:12Speaker 03

  Goodbye.