#2407 - Billy Bob Thornton

Billy Bob Thornton is an Academy Award–winning actor, filmmaker, and musician. He currently stars as Tommy Norris in the Paramount+ series “Landman” and is the lead singer of The Boxmasters. Season two of “Landman” premieres on November 16. “Pepper Tree Hill,” the latest album from The Boxmasters, is available now.www.paramountplus.com/shows/landman/www.theboxmasters.com Perplexity: Download the app or ask Perplexity anything at https://pplx.ai/rogan. Get a free welcome kit with your first subscription of AG1 at https://drinkag1.com/joerogan Take 50% off a SimpliSafe system at https://simplisafe.com/ROGAN Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:01Speaker 00

  The Joe Rogan Experience.

• 0:16Joe Rogan?

  It's working so far.

• 0:17Speaker 00

  Right?

• 0:18Joe Rogan?

  Right?

• 0:18Speaker 00

  I told my wife the other day, I said, "If I live to 85, I'm gonna go to Long John Silver's every day for lunch." "I'm just gonna eat shit that like, everything that I dream of right now that I can't eat, I'm gonna eat all of it. I'm gonna drink whiskey all day long and just eat everything I want."

• 0:36Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, fuck it. You're at the end of the ride.

• 0:38Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 0:38Joe Rogan?

  Unless, that's the problem, is like, on your deathbed, they come up with some new shit that fixes everything.

• 0:44Speaker 00

  Oh, I know, right? That'll be my luck.

• 0:46Joe Rogan?

  New stem cell stuff that regenerates every cell in your body to a 25-year-old, like, oh.

• 0:52Speaker 00

  Exactly, I know.

• 0:54Joe Rogan?

  That'd be a real problem, like, a 70-year-old brain and a 25-year-old body, like, you would have a lot of knowledge.

• 0:59Speaker 00

  For sure.

• 1:00Joe Rogan?

  You'd have a giant advantage.

• 1:01Speaker 00

  Oh, yeah. I fantasize about stuff like that. I fantasize about being able to, like, I imagine, you know, like, my version of heaven, it would be like, if I could go back to when I'm 12 years old, live through junior high and high school again.

• 1:19Joe Rogan?

  Oh, you'd be the king.

• 1:20Speaker 00

  And have the knowledge I have now, and just, I would know exactly how to navigate everything.

• 1:27Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 1:28Speaker 00

  You know what I mean?

• 1:29Joe Rogan?

  Yeah. It's, but that's the fun of growing up, and the not-so-fun of growing up.

• 1:35Speaker 00

  Sure.

• 1:35Joe Rogan?

  Because you don't know what the fuck is going on, and you're so confused, and then you get older, and you go, "Man, if I could just go back, I'd fucking kill it."

• 1:43Speaker 00

  I think about it all the time.

• 1:44Joe Rogan?

  You know, your lovely co-host, uh, co-star, rather, Demi Moore, that movie that she did, The Substance.

• 1:52Speaker 00

  Right.

• 1:52Joe Rogan?

  Is fucking crazy. That's a great piece on this whole, like, fear of aging thing.

• 1:59Speaker 00

  Right.

• 2:00Joe Rogan?

  That movie is wild.

• 2:02Speaker 00

  Oh, yeah.

• 2:03Joe Rogan?

  It's so crazy, but it's like, you know how many women would agree to that deal? If it was a real, that's, it was realistic enough, where you're watching, like, "I know a lot of ladies who would agree to that."

• 2:16Speaker 00

  Right, right.

• 2:17Joe Rogan?

  "I know a lot of ladies."

• 2:18Speaker 00

  Have you seen that South Park episode where they, uh, uh...

• 2:25Speaker 00

  It was it was about that that type of thing, but it was about how they have all these apps that you can make yourself look better in. You know, I mean, it's like it can make you look. Filters that make you look younger and all this kind of stuff. And they had this episode about that where like all these girls who aren't like the hot girls, but their Instagram stuff, they are. And they actually start to think, and so all the guys start going for these girls, even though when they're in front of them, they're not like that. But that's what they look like on there. And yeah, it's pretty crazy.

• 3:00Joe Rogan?

  It's probably accurate, too. As as long as a couple people start doing it, a couple of guys start going for those girls, then everybody else will as well.

• 3:10Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 3:11Joe Rogan?

  Which is most of our world.

• 3:13Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 3:14Joe Rogan?

  Most of our world is some fucking idiot decides bell bottoms look good. And we're all like, shit, I gotta get I gotta get bell bottoms. I wanna get laid. I wanna be cool.

• 3:24Speaker 00

  I had bell bottoms when I, you know, because I was playing in bands and stuff. So whatever was trendy, you know, we wore that stuff. I can remember those bell bottoms that were so big, you couldn't see your shoes. It just looked like a pair of jeans walking down the street. It was so dumb looking.

• 3:43Joe Rogan?

  It's a crazy thing that lasted for a little while. Look like regular jeans. Somebody invented that shit in like the 1800s. And everybody's like, yeah, you nailed it.

• 3:55Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 3:56Joe Rogan?

  And it's like a Jeep. A Jeep still looks like a Jeep. They made a Jeep in like the 1950s. They had a Jeep in 2026. You could see the difference.

• 4:02Speaker 00

  Right.

• 4:03Joe Rogan?

  It's like it's a little bit more advanced, but that's a Jeep.

• 4:05Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 4:06Joe Rogan?

  Jeans, they nailed it. And it's bell bottoms are like, yeah, yeah, yeah. What the fuck were we doing?

• 4:12Speaker 00

  Right? Oh, I mean, I had shirts with like bell sleeves with like pictures of sailboats and stuff on it. It's like, are you kidding me? I mean, you know, like lime green and orange and shit like that.

• 4:25Joe Rogan?

  Remember the Elvis style collars?

• 4:27Speaker 00

  Oh, for sure.

• 4:28Joe Rogan?

  Giant collars. Like, what happened?

• 4:30Speaker 00

  I know.

• 4:31Joe Rogan?

  I have a theory, because all that stuff happened after they passed the sweeping psychedelic Schedule One Act in 1970. And I think they cut everybody off from mushrooms and acid and anything that makes you think.

• 4:47Joe Rogan?

  And then they started giving them coke. And no one knew what to do and they were all just like, and it was disco and the music kinda sucked and everybody got real weird.

• 4:56Speaker 00

  Wow.

• 4:58Joe Rogan?

  I think that's what happened.

• 4:59Speaker 00

  Yeah, I I don't doubt that at all.

• 5:01Joe Rogan?

  That's when the clothes get really fucked up.

• 5:03Speaker 00

  Yeah, it is.

• 5:04Joe Rogan?

  It's the same exact time, cuz before, like, there was like a hippie style, you know, like, Hendrix and, you know, a lot, Clapton, a lot of guys, it was like a flowy hippie, but it looked good. It was kinda cool.

• 5:18Speaker 00

  Sure.

• 5:18Joe Rogan?

  But something happened in the seventies, we just lost all perspective.

• 5:22Speaker 00

  Oh, I know. I mean, when you look at some of the seventies, like especially like, sort of late seventies, you know, the disco era and stuff like that, and you look back at some of these TV shows they had, and you see a lot of these bands and stuff on there, and it's like, who thought that looked good? I mean, who said, who said, this is the thing now? It looked like shit. I mean, horrible, horrible stuff.

• 5:46Joe Rogan?

  Well, I I talk about this all the time, but it's the cars too, man. I I love nineteen sixties muscle cars, but I check out around seventy-one and I only allow seventy-one Barracuda and a Challenger in that group. Everything else after seventy-one is useless to me.

• 6:03Speaker 00

  Oh, yeah.

• 6:03Joe Rogan?

  Except Corvette. Corvette still stayed cool looking. They stayed cool looking deep into the eighties.

• 6:07Speaker 00

  Yeah, that's that's true, yeah. I'm I'm a muscle car guy. I've got a sixty-seven Chevelle, three ninety-six.

• 6:13Joe Rogan?

  Oh, nice.

• 6:14Speaker 00

  And muscle cars are my thing.

• 6:17Joe Rogan?

  I have a seventy.

• 6:18Speaker 00

  Oh, do you really?

• 6:18Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 6:19Speaker 00

  I would like to get a sixty-four GTO, the first year they were made. That's what I'm looking for, but to get one that's perfect, it it, they're pretty pricey, you know?

• 6:29Joe Rogan?

  They're very pricey.

• 6:29Speaker 00

  And I grew up poor, so I don't like to buy stuff for myself. I buy my kids' stuff all the time. And I don't mind how much money I spend on my family, but for me, I just, I don't spend money on myself, so.

• 6:42Joe Rogan?

  Old habits die hard.

• 6:43Speaker 00

  Yeah, they really do.

• 6:44Joe Rogan?

  When I was a kid, my sister's boyfriend's brother, the older brother, was the cool guy in the neighborhood, he had a sixty-five GTO convertible.

• 6:54Speaker 00

  Oh, yeah.

• 6:54Joe Rogan?

  And he would, I used, I worked at a gas station, and he would drive at the gas station. We'd all go like this, like, oh.

• 7:00Speaker 00

  Oh yeah.

• 7:01Joe Rogan?

  Can't believe he owns that. That's really his car? It was, he was the coolest guy in the world.

• 7:06Speaker 00

  Oh yeah, we had those.

• 7:08Joe Rogan?

  Terry Redd.

• 7:08Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 7:09Joe Rogan?

  Woo.

• 7:11Speaker 00

  There was a guy named Mike Page in our town. He was older than my group, you know, he, when we were seniors, he was probably already twenty-five, twenty-six, something like that. And you never real, cause you know, cruising was a thing and you'd cruise through Sonic or whatever.

• 7:26Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 7:27Speaker 00

  It was, you know, and see who was there and all that crap. And everybody parks on the bank parking lot. And you drink beer and then the cops would come by and you'd hide and all your shit, you know? And, um, I mean, it was literally like, uh, you know, the American graffiti days, you know? And, uh, so this guy, Mike, he had a sixty-five candy apple red vet. And he had a mustache. Remember Chuck Negron, singer in the Three Dog Night?

• 7:54Joe Rogan?

  Yes.

• 7:54Speaker 00

  The one with the mustache?

• 7:55Joe Rogan?

  Yes.

• 7:55Speaker 00

  He looked like Chuck Negron. So.

• 7:59Speaker 00

  We would see him pass by and he was like Harrison Ford was in, uh, American Graffiti. It's like you never, you would just, you'd just see him in his car, you know? And, uh, so he was, it was like seeing Elvis Presley go by. And everybody go like, wow. And, uh, that's actually how the Boxmaster's name came about.

• 8:21Joe Rogan?

  Really?

• 8:22Speaker 00

  Yeah, yeah.

• 8:24Joe Rogan?

  How?

• 8:25Speaker 00

  Well, in the South, in those days, there was a, uh, there are two stories how the Boxmaster's name came about. Uh, there's a, there's the politically correct one and there's the one that's not. Uh, and the one that's not is, um, if somebody was a playboy type, you know? It was called a Boxmaster. And, and so.

• 8:51Speaker 00

  And we had a

• 8:52Joe Rogan?

  I would have never guessed that.

• 8:54Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 8:54Joe Rogan?

  That's hilarious.

• 8:55Speaker 00

  And then the old days, people would say, oh, look, there goes the box master when Mike would pass by because he just knew. But you only saw him driving his Corvette up and down cruising. You never saw him, you know, actually doing stuff and you never got out and drank beer.

• 9:08Joe Rogan?

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• 9:51Joe Rogan?

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• 10:31Joe Rogan?

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• 11:16Joe Rogan?

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• 12:00Joe Rogan?

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• 12:13Joe Rogan?

  He was just making an appearance.

• 12:14Speaker 00

  Yeah, yeah.

• 12:15Joe Rogan?

  Just letting everybody know. Look at this. Second generation Corvette.

• 12:19Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 12:20Joe Rogan?

  65. I have a 65 convertible.

• 12:22Speaker 00

  Oh, yeah.

• 12:23Joe Rogan?

  Oh, yeah. I love them.

• 12:25Speaker 00

  Awesome cars. I mean, yeah, muscle cars are the thing to me. Do you remember? Uh, there, there are two.

• 12:33Speaker 00

  Sort of car.

• 12:36Speaker 00

  Times that confused me. Uh, first of all, how can a Mustang ever not be cool? But remember in the late seventies, early eighties, there were. It may as well have been a Ford Fiesta.

• 12:47Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, they were garbage.

• 12:49Speaker 00

  What was that?

• 12:50Joe Rogan?

  It was the gas guzzler crisis, the gas prices crisis.

• 12:52Speaker 00

  Oh, okay.

• 12:53Joe Rogan?

  That's what it was. So they had to make all these cars gas efficient. So they got rid of V8s. They started having these like. Very economical on gas, V6s and like really shitty engines and they made the cars plastic and lighter and cheaper and yeah, they fucked everything up. They fucked everything up. Like the fact, whoever, imagine working at Ford, 1969, you got the Mach 1, which is like, you just look at that and you go, god damn. Every time, to this day, I see one of those on you, god. They just nailed it.

• 13:27Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 13:28Joe Rogan?

  Like you just stare at that car, just walk around it for hours, just looking at it.

• 13:32Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 13:32Joe Rogan?

  And then 10 years later, they got something that you would never want to own.

• 13:35Speaker 00

  No.

• 13:36Joe Rogan?

  Like this is a hunk of shit. This is a fucking box. This is a, it's like a, literally like a box that a washing machine comes in. This is garbage.

• 13:44Speaker 00

  People didn't even want to steal them.

• 13:46Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, crazy. Imagine being the CEO of that company, going, what did we do? What the fuck happened? We had it. We had magic.

• 13:54Speaker 00

  Right.

• 13:54Joe Rogan?

  Like legit magic.

• 13:56Speaker 00

  Remember the Toronado and the Riviera?

• 13:58Joe Rogan?

  Oh, yeah. Oh, my god.

• 14:00Speaker 00

  I mean, you're talking about different looking.

• 14:02Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, but they were cool.

• 14:03Speaker 00

  They're, they're very cool.

• 14:05Joe Rogan?

  Very cool. Weird and huge.

• 14:07Speaker 00

  And huge.

• 14:08Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 14:08Speaker 00

  And the opposite in the spectrum was AMC. What were they thinking?

• 14:14Joe Rogan?

  They were weird. That was a weird car to own, too.

• 14:17Speaker 00

  All of those.

• 14:17Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 14:18Speaker 00

  They had one that looked kinda okay, but, but you know, they had the Pacer and the, uh, what was that? What was that other weird looking? The Gremlin.

• 14:28Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 14:29Speaker 00

  You know, all those, all those kind of things. I mean, it's like, what in the hell is this?

• 14:34Joe Rogan?

  It was a strange company. It was almost like a fake company.

• 14:37Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 14:38Joe Rogan?

  Like it didn't make any sense.

• 14:39Speaker 00

  It didn't make any sense at all.

• 14:40Joe Rogan?

  It was like an Australian, remember like Mad Max? He drove that Australian muscle car. I remember watching, I go, what the fuck is that thing? It was an Australian muscle car. I don't know what it was. Still to this day, I don't know what it was. But that's like what in, what those AMCs were. They were like weird looking.

• 14:55Speaker 00

  Oh, yeah.

• 14:56Joe Rogan?

  Just off.

• 14:57Speaker 00

  Yes, strange, strange looking vehicle.

• 14:59Joe Rogan?

  From a different timeline or something, like.

• 15:01Speaker 00

  Yeah. There was a movie called, uh, it had, uh, Raquel Welch was in it and Donald Pleasence, all these people called, uh, A fantastic voyage where some politician or scientist or something. He'd, he'd, I guess it was an assassination attempt, but it was, there was a brain thing. So they shrink all these scientists down on a little, you know, glass thing, whatever those things are called for. Chemistry or whatever. They shrink the cats down and their little submarine thing.

• 15:38Joe Rogan?

  Oh, I remember that.

• 15:38Speaker 00

  And they shoot them into the guy. And the, yeah, that, that, well, see, that's a pacer. You know, I used to watch it. I go, it's a damn pacer.

• 15:49Joe Rogan?

  That's hilarious.

• 15:51Speaker 00

  And so they go through the guy, all through his veins and arteries and stuff and get to the place where they need to fix it and all this kind of stuff. But antibodies kept attacking him and all this kind of stuff. It was weird. I saw it in the theater and I was pretty impressed, actually.

• 16:03Joe Rogan?

  I remember that movie. That's hilarious. That's hilarious. Shrinking people down.

• 16:11Joe Rogan?

  What's wild is how many ideas were burned up in movies by the time like the nineties rolled around. If you just stop and think about the fact that movies really were only like, movies, I think are the absolute best mirror into the culture. It's like a time machine. Like you could read a history book and you can kind of get a rough understanding of how people behaved back then. But you still think of them in a current context. You think of them like today, but you watch a film. You know, watch a, like a James Cagney film and you're like, whoa, man, this is a different world.

• 16:47Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 16:48Joe Rogan?

  Nobody knew shit.

• 16:49Speaker 00

  Right.

• 16:50Joe Rogan?

  Nobody had any idea what was going on in the world. You got all your news from the newspapers. So these dudes who own the newspapers essentially controlled the narrative for the entire world.

• 16:59Speaker 00

  Absolutely.

• 17:00Joe Rogan?

  And it's, and it's, people behave strange.

• 17:04Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 17:04Joe Rogan?

  Open domestic violence. Domestic violence is normal. Like, shut up.

• 17:10Speaker 00

  Oh, yeah.

• 17:11Joe Rogan?

  She would kiss him and like, it was crazy.

• 17:13Speaker 00

  Oh, right.

• 17:13Joe Rogan?

  Nuts.

• 17:14Speaker 00

  Well, my, my wife, who was raised in the Bay Area, you know, around San Francisco, Marin County there. When I first told her what my dad did to me, she was like, oh, my God, that's like, and honestly, that's what everybody's dad did. It was like, you know, if he was working graveyard shift and you started making a bunch of damn noise at noon, you got your ass beat with a belt. And she was just, she couldn't believe it. I said, oh, no, it was like every day almost, you know? And, you know, not that it was good, but it was just part of our life. We didn't know any better. We really didn't.

• 17:54Joe Rogan?

  No, no one knew any better and we're only figuring it out now.

• 17:58Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 17:58Joe Rogan?

  It's like, like cancelling people retroactively for stuff they did in the eighties, like, okay. That's a different world. You weren't even alive then. That's a different world. When people came, like, you gotta realize, like, your parents, like, think about it this way. People were coming over on a boat from other countries with no knowledge of what was over here. They just got told, oh, there's jobs in America, you know, and you got on a boat from fucking Europe. Like, my grandparents came over here in the nineteen twenties. Like, they had no idea. They come over here and there's a bunch of people that also did the same thing and every, they're basically just savages. They're basically like, one, one or two steps above, like, absolute savages.

• 18:43Joe Rogan?

  You know, they're, they're savages with metal. You know, they've got metal and rubber.

• 18:48Speaker 00

  Right.

• 18:48Joe Rogan?

  And, you know, and they're raising kids. And of course, they're gonna raise kids in a rough way, cause the world is rough.

• 18:54Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 18:54Joe Rogan?

  It's like, everybody got beat up. It was normal. Like, bullying was not, there was no anti-bullying campaigns.

• 19:01Speaker 00

  God, no.

• 19:01Joe Rogan?

  You just had to fight for yourself. Like, that's just how it is. This is life. This prepares you for life. It sucks, but this is life.

• 19:09Speaker 00

  Absolutely. We have guys in our town that you just stayed away from.

• 19:13Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 19:14Speaker 00

  I mean, guys who were, you know, relatively the same age. And I lucked out, cause I, you know, I was a skinny, long-haired little hippie and playing in bands and stuff and. And for some reason, I always liked hanging out with, you know, the guys who are a few years older than me. They had more fun than we did. And so, I remember the first time I ever, well, the first time I ever had a drink of beer, my Uncle Don, he drank Schlitz. And this is back when you had to have a church key and you opened both sides of it. Oh, wow. And he would pour it in a, you know, our glasses, you know, like I said, we were pretty poor. We all lived at my grandmother's house. And it was the jelly jars. When you

• 19:56Speaker 00

  finished the jelly, that became the glasses we drank out of. And he would have a jelly jar glass of beer, and it just looked like apple juice to me. And I would always ask him, you know, six years old, I'd say, hey, can I, can I have some of that? And he goes, you don't need any of this. Well, finally, one day, he goes, yeah, here, have a drink. Tastes like apple juice. And I was like, oh, God almighty. And, but the first time I got drunk in my life was on a Boone's Farm wine, apple wine. And these two guys, Gary and Eddie were their names. And they were just trouble. And Gary had a sixty-four GTO.

• 20:37Speaker 00

  That's probably where I got that thing from. But, I mean, we rolled it one night, no seat belts. I mean, we never even thought about a seat belt. And so, they took me to the Dairy Queen. And we were gonna, you know, get a hamburger, or whatever it was. Well, they ended up like hanging me out the window, just puking all over the Dairy Queen parking lot, you know, because I drank an entire bottle of this and never been drunk in my life. I was twelve, thirteen. And so, these guys, I just, I was fascinated by them. They were all James Dean and Elvis Presley to me, right? And there were a few guys in town

• 21:20Speaker 00

  that everybody knew not to mess with at all. It's like they will literally pull your eyeballs out of the sockets. They kind of considered me a mascot. And they all protected me. So the other guys who were, you know, pricks or whatever, you know, if one of them messed with me, there was a guy named Calvin, a guy named Billy Bob, actually, who was probably ten years older than me. And a guy named Harry and uh who whose family came over from somewhere. They were like, you know, from the Czech Republic or somewhere, but they they grew up, they grew up here, you know,

• 22:02Speaker 00

  so they didn't sound like they were from someplace else. Harry was about five, six, and stocky, you know, and uh there was this dude who who was just mean to everybody. Excuse me, but um somewhere in between our age, uh you know, when we're teenagers, seventeen, eighteen, and Harry and Billy Bob and uh Calvin and those guys, they were like thirty. And there were these other guys who were the mean guys in town who were in between those ages. And they were the real problem because they were just assholes. They weren't, the other guys were cool as long as you didn't mess with them.

• 22:46Speaker 00

  One night, uh this guy, uh two of them were both named Steve, who were the real pricks. And uh one of the Steves uh got me by my hair and drug me around, beat me up a little bit, you know, and I was a fighter, you know, I wasn't bad, you know, I I fought a lot of guys. I quit fighting in my early twenties, but back then, you know, it was just a way of life. And uh this cat roughed me up, a lot bigger than me. And Harry found out about it. Well, we had a bonfire party out of the guy's trailer home that night. And so this cat that had beat me up showed up and Harry had heard about it.

• 23:29Speaker 00

  And Harry is, you know, I'm like Harry's little mascot guy, right? So the guy gets out of his car and comes over there. No, we got a big bonfire going on, right? The guy comes over, Harry didn't say a word to him. He walked up to him. This guy's like a foot taller than Harry. Harry got him, reached up, got him by the hair, hit him one time, broke his jaw, and threw him in the bonfire.

• 23:55Joe Rogan?

  Whoa.

• 23:56Speaker 00

  And a bunch of people had to put him out. I mean, this was just like a Friday night in Arkansas.

• 24:03Joe Rogan?

  All right, how's your schedule looking? Feeling busy? Got a lot in the horizon? Well, yeah, it's that time of year when life gets crazy and demands more of your energy. More work, more plans, holiday travel, all while it's getting darker and colder. It can really drain your energy, or you can get out ahead of it. Listen, I talk a lot about AG1. It's the daily health drink that can help you stay one scoop ahead of all the energy drains coming your way this season. Because the superfoods and B vitamins in every scoop of AG1 supports steady energy production without the crash. In fact, just shaking up one scoop of AG1 in water covers your multivitamin, your pre-

• 24:48Joe Rogan?

  and probiotics, antioxidants, superfoods, and more. It's one simple step to start your day ahead of anything that might come your way. And that's why I've partnered with them for so long. Subscribe today to get this clinically-backed formula in the flavor of your choice. Tropical, citrus, berry, or original, to help you stay one scoop ahead. If you use my link, you'll also get a free bottle of AGD3, K2, and AG1 Welcome Kit, plus a few bonus AG1 Travel Packs. Just head to drinkag1.com/joeroogan or visit the link in the description to get started.

• 25:30Joe Rogan?

  That's drinkag1.com/joeroogan. Oh my God. That's a rough part of the world, man, especially back then. Yeah. You know, Malcolm McDowell, he wrote a book about like, where he was talking about why certain populations, like certain parts of the world are rougher. And he was talking about certain parts of America where they were settled initially by people that came from a herding community. Like, so they were like sheep herders in other countries. And when they came over to America, when you have a flock of sheep, someone could steal all your food in the middle of the night. They could just take all your sheep. If you're growing corn...

• 26:15Joe Rogan?

  You know, it's hard to pick all that fucking corn. You gotta throw it in a truck, drag it out. You could just steal someone's sheep. So they're accustomed to extreme violence to protect their sheep. And they're accustomed to acting fast and doing things quickly and violently. And so that's how you got the Hatfields and the McCoys.

• 26:34Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 26:34Joe Rogan?

  That's what that shit's about. People are like, why are those people such fucking psychos? They came from a psycho community in Europe. And then when they made it over to America, they just kept that tradition going.

• 26:46Speaker 00

  Oh, for sure.

• 26:46Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 26:47Speaker 00

  I mean, you know, people talk about, you know, the Irish and the Scots.

• 26:51Joe Rogan?

  Did I say Michael McDow- McDowell? Did I say Michael?

• 26:54Speaker 00

  Malcolm.

• 26:54Joe Rogan?

  Malcolm Gladwell. That's what I meant.

• 26:56Speaker 00

  Oh, okay.

• 26:56Joe Rogan?

  Malcolm Gladwell. Sorry, Malcolm.

• 27:00Joe Rogan?

  Malcolm Gladwell. It's early.

• 27:02Speaker 00

  Yeah, but that's, uh, you know, we still to this day, we talk about, oh yeah, those Irish cats and the Scottish guys, the English guys. If you're in the, you know, like say, South London or whatever, some rough guys over there. Where do you think we came from?

• 27:15Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 27:15Speaker 00

  I mean, you know, I did one of those tests about my genealogy and all that kind of stuff. And, uh, uh, you know, you hear stuff from your family growing up that I grew up thinking I was part Italian and Native American and all these different things, right? And then I do this thing, it's like I'm a full-on English Scottish guy. You know, it's Irish, English, Scottish, almost all of me, except for as my daughter says, she goes, Daddy, why aren't we randomly Swiss? I got a little bit of French Swiss, you know, it's like 11%, something like that. And the rest of it's just that stuff. So all those people come over here and North Carolina or Tennessee, uh, Arkansas,

• 27:58Speaker 00

  you know, all these places, there are words that we use, you know, which, you know, we call the hillbilly language, which actually wasn't considered a hillbilly language in England, you know? But that language was left over. Like we say, reckon you wanna go do something? Reckon, over there, they still use it.

• 28:21Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 28:21Speaker 00

  Uh, Aaron, we'd, uh, meaning one, it's like, if you said to me, hey, can I have a beer? And I say, I ain't got Aaron.

• 28:31Speaker 00

  You know, it's A I R I got Aaron. And all that stuff came from England and Ireland and Scotland.

• 28:38Joe Rogan?

  Well, that's the idea of the southern accent, right? The southern accent is an English accent is just morphed.

• 28:43Speaker 00

  Yes.

• 28:43Joe Rogan?

  In a new place.

• 28:44Speaker 00

  Yeah, exactly.

• 28:45Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, and and morphed particularly probably because of the climate. Like, the climate changed a lot. And one of you know, one of the weirder things about these stereotypes about the South is the hookworm thing. Do you know that thing?

• 29:00Speaker 00

  No, tell me about that.

• 29:02Joe Rogan?

  This is crazy. So for a long time, a giant percentage of people that lived in the South had hookworm. And hookworm is a parasite that you get in your feet from walking around barefoot.

• 29:16Speaker 00

  Okay.

• 29:16Joe Rogan?

  And hookworm affects your cognitive function in a massive way. Makes you slow and stupid. And so this myth of the the southern person being slow and lazy and stupid was all because they were infected with hookworm.

• 29:33Speaker 00

  Wow.

• 29:33Joe Rogan?

  Like the like a giant percentage of these people had hookworm. Like, throw that into our sponsor, perplexity, and tell me how much hookworm was in the South.

• 29:42Speaker 00

  I'm gonna cancel my I'm gonna cancel my therapist.

• 29:45Joe Rogan?

  The phrase hookworm southern draw refers to historical connection between hookworm infections in the American South and certain stereotypes about Southerners, including the way they spoke and behaved. In the late 19th and early 20th century, hookworm infestations were rampant, with estimates suggesting that up to 40% of the people in the region were infected. So hookworm causes symptoms like severe fatigue, anemia, and mental fog, which led to slowness in speech and thought. This contributed to the stereotype of Southerners being lazy or slow-witted, often associated with the southern draw. How did they fix that? Like, what what medication did they use to fix that? Some sort of a Dean wormer?

• 30:29Joe Rogan?

  Health campaigns?

• 30:33Speaker 00

  I mean, I've heard of hookworm, but I had no idea that it had any association with this.

• 30:38Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, I didn't either. When I found that out, I was like, oh, that makes sense.

• 30:43Speaker 00

  Right.

• 30:43Joe Rogan?

  That makes sense. Rockefeller Sanitation Commission surveyed infection rates forty percent. Mobile dispensaries traveled throughout the region, free deworming medications, and educating local doctors. Okay, so they use some sort of an anti-parasitic. All measures including latrines to improve sanitation, educating communities about the risk of soil contamination, and encouraging the routine of wearing shoes. Isn't that nuts that shoes probably fixed it more than anything? People wearing shoes.

• 31:11Speaker 00

  Probably so, yeah.

• 31:12Joe Rogan?

  Yeah. So, that's where it all came from. That's the hookworm thing.

• 31:16Speaker 00

  That's wild.

• 31:17Joe Rogan?

  Isn't that nuts?

• 31:17Speaker 00

  It is nuts.

• 31:18Joe Rogan?

  Because when I was a kid, I mean, to this day, when someone talks, like, if someone wants to make a stereotype about someone being stupid, they use a southern accent.

• 31:27Speaker 00

  Yeah, it's true.

• 31:28Joe Rogan?

  All the time, yeah.

• 31:29Speaker 00

  I grew up with that. I mean, there was a prejudice in Hollywood when I first got out there. There still kind of is. I can't, I mean, especially coming up now, I mean, you know, once you reach a certain level, you know, you can walk into Universal Studios and say, "I want to play Betty Davis." And they're all, "Hey, that's a great idea." But, you know, but when you're coming up, you know, I was, the first thing I ever auditioned for in L.A. was a student film. It was like one of those USC student films. And I go in there, and the part was some guy that just got off the turnip truck from Alabama. And

• 32:12Speaker 00

  I thought, well, I've probably got this. And so, and I was broke and everything, and it wasn't going to pay anything, but I didn't care. It was like, well, maybe I get my foot in the door, because I didn't go to be an actor anyway. I just thought, well, I'll try this stuff. And I go in there and I think the casting person and the director are both east coast people like New York or somewhere. And I did my little audition and they said, can you do it more southern? And I'm like, are you shitting me? It's like, you got to be shitting me. I said, well, what you have to understand is I actually did just get off the turn of

• 32:57Speaker 00

  truck from back there. And this is how you talk, you know? And of course, my accent is not as thick as it was then, but they just said I wasn't southern enough. And it was like, oh, I see what they're getting at.

• 33:08Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 33:09Speaker 00

  So they wanted the foghorn, leghorn, you know, now over hill, what we have is like, and I never heard anybody talk, I grew up down there, I never heard that. And so that's what they would do. There are a lot of performances over the years where people who are not from the South played the part that actually use that accent and they win Academy Awards and stuff. And I'm like, wow. So anyway, I didn't get this part and the guy who got the part literally sounded like he was in the Bronx. But he was doing that thing, you know? I thought, wow, this is gonna be tough out here, you know? But Southerners don't often get picked or even noticed for things like, let's say you're

• 33:53Speaker 00

  doing a gangster movie in the 30s in New York. You know, even if you can do the accent, you know, whatever. But people from New York can get parts playing Southerners. That still goes on.

• 34:10Joe Rogan?

  That's so weird. It's such a weird stereotype. You know, it exists in music too, doesn't it?

• 34:16Speaker 00

  For sure.

• 34:17Joe Rogan?

  Like, southern bands, until Skinnerd came along, southern bands got no respect.

• 34:21Speaker 00

  Absolutely, yeah.

• 34:22Joe Rogan?

  Skinnerd fucked that up just because they were so good. They were so good, everyone was like, alright, man. You gotta let, Free Bird is Free Bird. That guitar solo, you're like, god damn!

• 34:32Speaker 00

  It's ridiculous. I've known those guys a long time, those guys and Skinnerd. Yeah, it's a... You're right, that whole, and also, anybody that was from the south got lumped into the southern rock.

• 34:46Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 34:47Speaker 00

  Thing.

• 34:47Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 34:47Speaker 00

  You know, and they weren't all just people that sounded like Charlie Daniels. I mean, they were very, very different types of bands. The Allman Brothers combined jazz and blues and rock and pop and everything in their music. They were literally masters, the Allman Brothers. Allman Brothers Live at the Fillmore East, probably the best live album ever made, but they just say they're all southern rock bands. It's like, man, it wasn't really like that, you know.

• 35:16Joe Rogan?

  Very different styles.

• 35:17Speaker 00

  Very different.

• 35:18Joe Rogan?

  The Allman Brothers were masters.

• 35:19Speaker 00

  They were.

• 35:20Joe Rogan?

  You know, Midnight Rider is still one of my all-time favorite songs.

• 35:23Speaker 00

  Oh, it's awesome.

• 35:24Joe Rogan?

  If I used to have to do radio when I lived in LA, I'd do morning radio, I'd smoke a joint before I left the house, you know, because it's like 5:30 AM, and I'd listen to Midnight Rider.

• 35:32Speaker 00

  Oh, yeah.

• 35:33Joe Rogan?

  In the dark, on the way there, like, oh.

• 35:35Speaker 00

  Oh, it's a brilliant song.

• 35:36Joe Rogan?

  Oh, it's so good, it just gets you in the mood.

• 35:39Speaker 00

  And the, and country guys, you know, back in those days, when country was actual country music,

• 35:46Speaker 00

  they would hear some of these songs by those kind of guys like the Allman Brothers or Marshall Tucker, whoever it was, and, and cut them, you know, for country albums. Like Waylon Jennings did Midnight Rider.

• 35:57Joe Rogan?

  Oh, yeah, that's right.

• 35:58Speaker 00

  Did a great, great conversion of that, you know, but, yeah, it's, it's kind of odd, you know, being raised in the area of the country that people look at as the armpit, and then you have, you know, and like I said, once you overcome that, uh, within the business, and it's not like they like you any better, you know, it's just that they can use you to make money with, and once, once, you know, that happens, then, you know, you can go in and play Betty Davis.

• 36:24Joe Rogan?

  That's the stereotype of the, the coastal cities, right? It's the stereotype that comes out of New York and LA, where it's like, everything else is stupid.

• 36:33Speaker 00

  Yes.

• 36:33Joe Rogan?

  Like, you're in New York, or you're in LA, and all these retards in the middle, that's the flyover states.

• 36:38Speaker 00

  Right.

• 36:39Joe Rogan?

  They literally would call it the flyover states.

• 36:40Speaker 00

  Yes.

• 36:41Joe Rogan?

  And when you're in control of casting all of the great films and all the great television shows, and you decide what the great albums are.

• 36:51Speaker 00

  Right.

• 36:51Joe Rogan?

  You dismiss, like, those people that are, it takes like a Stevie Ray Vaughan.

• 36:57Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 36:57Joe Rogan?

  It was like an undeniable talent.

• 36:59Speaker 00

  Yes.

• 37:00Joe Rogan?

  Where they go, okay, I don't give a fuck where that guy's from.

• 37:02Speaker 00

  Right, right.

• 37:02Joe Rogan?

  Like, let that guy fucking play.

• 37:05Speaker 00

  Oh, yeah.

• 37:05Joe Rogan?

  Like, that guy's got voodoo in his hands, like, whatever he's doing. I don't care where he's from, but other than that, you would like, they would look at these places like they were less than. You know, or that the people were not as bright. And that stereotype still exists today. I remember, one of the good things about traveling and doing the road a lot as a stand-up is you get to perform all over the country and meet all these different people. And you know, when I would talk to people about Texas in particular, I'd be like, dude, I fucking love it there. They're the most fun people. It's like, it's so fun. It's, and they're normal. They're normal people. They're not Hollywood people angling to try to get a some sort of a social relationship with you so that you can progress their career. They're just cool people, just regular fucking people.

• 37:50Joe Rogan?

  And the, the problem is that these people in these coastal cities are the ones who don't know that. And they're dictating the narrative for the entire country.

• 38:00Speaker 00

  Right.

• 38:01Joe Rogan?

  Based on some, like, very weird prejudices. Very weird. This episode is brought to you by Simply Safe. If you've been on the fence about getting a home security system from Simply Safe, now's a great time to take that leap. Because they have their Black Friday sale going on and it's an excellent deal. Plus, you'll get peace of mind knowing you, your family, and your home have top-notch protection going into the holidays. There's a reason Simply Safe continues to be named Best Home Security Systems by U.S. News and World Report. It can help stop crime before it happens. Traditional security systems typically only respond after someone breaks in. But Simply Safe and their agents take action the moment someone is spotted outside your home.

• 38:46Joe Rogan?

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• 39:25Speaker 00

  Yeah, it's true. I mean, it happens all the time. And people ask me, there was a very famous singer, movie star person. This is a long time ago. It was when I first started getting invited to the parties, you know, and I didn't know anything about this stuff and I.

• 39:43Joe Rogan?

  What year was this around?

• 39:45Speaker 00

  Well, it was around the time of Sling Blade, you know, I mean, I was working and had done some stuff that had been noticed, like one false move and, you know, done a few things, but. Uh, this was around that time and, uh, it wasn't even out yet, I don't think, but screenings had started happening and there was a buzz about it, right? So I get invited to a party, uh, and it was, uh, it was out at David Foster's house. He was always real nice to me and he, uh, at the time he was married to Linda Thompson, who was, you know, Memphis girl. And, uh, she always made southern food and she kind of took a liking to me and said, hey, I want to invite you because, you know, you're from the south and we always have the southern food at our parties and stuff.

• 40:27Speaker 00

  So I go out there and there were a lot of big people there and I found myself outside having a smoke. And I was standing there in a little group of Arnold Schwarzenegger and Mel Gibson and I think maybe Dan Aykroyd was there and I remember, uh, Lionel Richie was in there playing piano in the living room and I'm just like, wow, wait, this is crazy. And, um, but I, I felt it's like that poor kid from the south syndrome, like I don't really belong here. So I was real shy and, you know, that kind of thing.

• 41:01Speaker 00

  Well, this, I went into the kitchen to get another drink. And, uh, this, like I said, I won't name her name, but, uh, a very famous singer and actress from, you know, back in the sixties and seventies. And she very seriously said to me, she said, so this Sling Blade.

• 41:25Speaker 00

  So sorry. Uh, she goes, it's fascinating to me. A lot of people who didn't know me before that thought that I was actually that guy. It's like this mentally challenged guy made a movie and everything like that. And they would meet me and they'd go, "You're the guy in that?" And I'm like, "Yeah." So anyway, but she said it was fascinating to me. And she goes, "And you came out here from, what is it, Alabama or something like that?" And I said, "Arkansas." And she goes, "Arkansas." And with a straight face said to me, "What do you people do down there?" I was like, "Wow."

• 42:05Speaker 00

  And I said, thinking she'd get the joke, I said, "We mostly lay around on the porch with our hound dog and swat flies." She goes, "Oh, interesting, interesting."

• 42:18Speaker 00

  It's like, babe, I was, I was fucking with you there. And, but that was one of the moments where I realized that I really was an outsider out there. And people ask me about my longevity in this business. And I always say, it's because I stay out of it.

• 42:39Speaker 00

  And I tell people, "Do your acting on the red carpet, not in the movie." They say, "Well, you're so natural in this stuff." It's like, that's from ignorance. I don't know anything about acting. I didn't go to Shakespeare school and stuff. I didn't, you know, I look at the thing. I'm playing Tommy Norris in Landman, or I'm playing the guy in Goliath, or Fargo, or Sling Blade, or Monstrous Ball, whatever I was in. I just go out there and do what it says, you know, and be myself in whatever role it is. And because, you know, people want to think there's a trick to everything, that you can learn everything. And it's, it's kinda just not true. I mean, I believe artists, whether they're musicians, novelists, actors, whatever they are.

• 43:23Speaker 00

  I truly believe that you're born with most of it. I'm not saying that you can't learn and that you can't progress, you can't get better. I mean, just repetition makes you better. I mean, you know, just the more you do something, the more comfortable you get with it. But, you know, if, if, if you say, like, if you were to ask me, "What is my process?"

• 43:48Speaker 00

  Hell, I wouldn't know what to tell you. I don't know what my process is. It's like my process is started when I was born. I'm just, I use my life experience and I do this stuff. I had lived a very eclectic life and I just remember all this stuff. I don't need to go in the hallway before a scene and think about when my dad ran over my cat or something. Oh, right, right. And, you know, start, you know, gobbling like a turkey and, you know, yelling and screaming and punching the walls, stuff like that and trying to get all this sense memory. My sense memory is here on the edge of my skin every fucking minute. And, I mean, if you were raised where I was, it was like, you know, I, I don't forget any of that stuff. And I've lived fifty different lives.

• 44:33Speaker 00

  So, plenty to draw on and I just believe that people want. It, it sounds like you're smarter if you say, well, here's how I learn lines. Uh, I take this and then I have this mathematical formula and I, I imagine these letters as numbers and stuff like that and it's like, because the press loves that because it's like, what a genius, you know? They don't, they don't respect, hell, I don't, I just go out there and do it as much because people want to believe Right. that anyone can do this if you get in the right school, if you get the right, uh, you know, uh, teaching from someone. If you go study Shakespeare or whatever it is. Yeah.

• 45:18Speaker 00

  And, you know, I just don't believe that's true. I, I believe you either have it or you don't have it. Like in music, you can learn to play guitar, you can learn to play piano. You can learn to play drums. No, I'll take that back. You can get better at playing drums, but if you're not born a drummer, you're not going to be able to do it. My brother, God rest his soul, who passed away at thirty, Jimmy, he was a brilliant musician, played every instrument in the world. Except when he got on my drums and he looked like he had some muscular disorder. It was like, he was just like, he goes, "How do you do this? You use all, both legs and both arms?"

• 46:00Joe Rogan?

  That's crazy that he can play everything else.

• 46:02Speaker 00

  Everything. And he just couldn't play drums. Drummers can get better and they get to be experts, but the thing in music that you can't teach is feel. You can't teach a vibe or a feel to people. Eric Clapton could play a lick on a guitar, give it to another guy, he plays the same exact lick, it's gonna sound different just because of their feel.

• 46:29Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, that's how like that Miles Davis quote about hitting notes, that everybody can hit the same notes, but it's the attitude of the motherfucker that's the important thing. The attitude of the person singing the notes is everything. That's most of it. And you either have that or you do not.

• 46:49Speaker 00

  No doubt about it.

• 46:50Joe Rogan?

  And some of it's genetic and some of it's just learned experience in your environment and how you grew up.

• 46:56Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 46:56Joe Rogan?

  But yeah, you don't got it, you don't got it.

• 46:58Speaker 00

  I mean, Levon Helm, who was a friend of mine, you know, played drums with the band.

• 47:05Speaker 00

  He and Ritchie Hayward, who was with Little Feet, Frank Beard and ZZ Top, you know, especially on their earlier records, and, you know, Charlie Watts and Ringo and those guys, they all had feel. They had a thing. And then there are these other drummers and these sort of, you know, I call them science bands, you know, where the drummer has like 75 drums and they can do shit that seems humanly impossible, but...

• 47:38Speaker 00

  What happens after the song's over? It doesn't stick.

• 47:42Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 47:42Speaker 00

  Do you know what I mean?

• 47:43Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 47:44Speaker 00

  But Levon, just playing on a little four-piece kit.

• 47:47Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 47:48Speaker 00

  Just had that feel and he played the song. So anytime musicians start thinking it's all about their thing. Like if you're doing movies, the prop people think you need eleven watches on each arm. It's like about your department, everything. Five briefcases and watches everywhere and shit. And it's like, no, I'll just take an old Timex with a round face. I'm good, you know? But it's, uh... When musicians start thinking that they have to make their part cut through and be noticed.

• 48:23Joe Rogan?

  Mmm.

• 48:24Speaker 00

  The best drummers, you don't really notice them. You hear the song. If you go in there and dig deep and listen to them, if you isolate them, you know, and just listen to that, you're like, oh, okay.

• 48:37Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 48:38Speaker 00

  Listen to that cat. But in a, in a perfect world, all you hear is the singer singing and telling you what they're trying to say. And the music is so good behind it that it's just part of it.

• 48:50Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 48:51Speaker 00

  You don't really notice it.

• 48:52Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 48:52Speaker 00

  You know what I mean?

• 48:53Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, and you can't teach that.

• 48:54Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 48:55Joe Rogan?

  That's, it's the feel thing, yeah. And you know it when you hear it. When a song just, oh, yeah.

• 49:02Speaker 00

  Oh, yeah.

• 49:02Joe Rogan?

  It just gets in there, you're like, you guys nailed it.

• 49:04Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 49:05Joe Rogan?

  You put it together, you, you, you fucking nailed it. And the amazing thing, like, about bands, and how long have the Boxmaster been around now? You've been around for...

• 49:15Speaker 00

  Twenty years.

• 49:16Joe Rogan?

  Twenty years. The most amazing thing is that people get together and they stay friends for that long. And with all the conflicts and all the ego and all the bullshit and you're mad, you know, you hang out and like, that to me, when someone makes great music, it's, the most impressive thing is not just that you make great music, but you make great music with people that all get along together. With all these different creative minds and egos and weirdness. Everybody's weird. Every fucking creative person I've ever met is out of their fucking mind.

• 49:46Speaker 00

  Oh, yeah.

• 49:47Joe Rogan?

  And you get all together and then you show up for practice at the same time.

• 49:51Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 49:51Joe Rogan?

  You know, and you rehearse together, you actually do it, you show up for gigs and you perform, you hit your notes on stage. You can all stay friends. Like, that's the most important thing and the most rare thing and the most impressive thing.

• 50:02Speaker 00

  Absolutely. And, and with our band in particular, I mean, before that, I, you know, played in a million bands and had a solo band that did four major label solo records and that's where I met some of the guys that that were rolled over into the Boxmasters. Uh, J D Andrew, uh, uh, specifically, who's still, he and I are the longest running members. We started the band together and he and I still run it and, uh, you know, uh, we're the opposite of what normally happens. Normally, a band, when they're younger, they hit it for a while, three or four years, uh, maybe have a couple of hits or at least some things that people know about.

• 50:44Speaker 00

  And then as the years go, go on, you, you start to dwindle a bit, you know? I mean, unless you're the Rolling Stones or the Who. We just opened for the Who on our last tour, which was awesome, yeah.

• 50:56Joe Rogan?

  Wow.

• 50:57Speaker 00

  And, um, so this band has started as, you know, it's like, you know, I got this crap about, it's always an actor who wants to be a musician, just like this guy and that guy. And it's like, no, no, I, I was a musician who came to LA to play music, accidentally became an actor, and next thing you know, I made three hundred and eighty-one dollars on an episode of Matlock with five lines. And I'm like, I'm broke, I better do this. And that's how I became an actor.

• 51:23Joe Rogan?

  That's crazy.

• 51:24Speaker 00

  And so, one way or the other, uh, we started out fighting that stigma for, you know, ten, twelve years. And then all of a sudden it started to go away because we got more and more fans and became a big underground band. And in the last five or six years, got really popular. So here we are, old guys who are still making it, who are still on their way up at our age. And, uh, so it kind of went the other way around with us and, uh, and you're right, I mean, to stick around that long, especially when... It took us a while to get success, to make any money at it and to get the fanbase we have now.

• 52:06Joe Rogan?

  Is there a weird thing too about people like critics or people that are paying attention to the music? They don't just listen to the music and see you guys perform. Instead, they think, oh, that's Billy Bob, the movie star who's trying to be a musician. So this is like stigma to it. So instead of like looking at you and go, oh, it's a cool band. Oh, I like them. This is great. They're like, oh, that's that fucking Sling Blade guy.

• 52:29Speaker 00

  Right.

• 52:29Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, Billy Bob's. This episode is sponsored by BetterHelp. If you've thought about trying therapy with our long-term partner, BetterHelp, insurance options may now be available nationwide with an average copay for eligible members of just $23 per session. And with World Mental Health Day on the 10th, now's the perfect time to give it a try. In fact, don't even wait until the 10th because all that stress you feel, it's not waiting around. So instead of letting it build up, sign up for a therapy session and unload at any time, not just on World Mental Health Day. If you've been waiting to start therapy, BetterHelp works with more than 125 health plan networks

• 53:09Joe Rogan?

  and eligible members have an average copay of just $23 per session with insurance. Don't have insurance or live outside of the United States? You can still get 10% off your first month. Visit betterhelp.com to explore your payment options. That's better, H E L P dot com. This episode is brought to you by Chime. And I know people don't usually get excited about banking, but Chime is doing something different and it's worth paying attention to. In a recent survey, they ranked the number one choice for new checking accounts in America. That means real people, millions of them, are choosing this over traditional banks. That's because banking at Chime is fee-free.

• 53:52Joe Rogan?

  No monthly fees, no overdraft fees and thousands of fee-free ATMs. But here's the real kicker. If you get their Chime card, it gives you 5% cash back on a category you actually pick yourself. Your savings rate, crazy high. It's nine times the National average. They're calling it the most rewarding way to bank. Go to chime.com/rogan. Takes a few minutes to sign up. Chime is a fintech, not a bank, banking services and Chime card, provided by Chime's bank partners. Terms and limits apply. Go to chime.com/disclosures for more details. Trying to do something different. He wants to be a rock star.

• 54:32Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 54:32Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 54:33Speaker 00

  I mean, that's, that's what we put up with for about half of our career with the Boxmasters. Not as much anymore. That, that kind of goes away. It goes away with the public, with the audience. With some of the critics, it's still there because they want to say that about you. It's, it, it has nothing to do with your music. It has to do with, here's my angle for this article.

• 54:57Joe Rogan?

  Yes.

• 54:57Speaker 00

  My angle in this. I mean, I did an article with, you know, a magazine one time that was kind of more of a men's magazine, you know? Talked about music the whole time and talked about sex for about three minutes. The whole article's about sex. You know what I mean? So, I mean, that's just, that's what they do. Cause that's their vibe, you know? And, uh, so, anyway, um, when, when they say this stuff, uh, they're saying it because they want to dig at you.

• 55:27Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 55:27Speaker 00

  And if musicians, you know, famous musicians are at one of our shows, unless it's, you know, ones who are friends of ours, if they want to come back and meet us after the show and say hello, they'll come back there and, and most people wouldn't take this as an insult, but it is. They'll come back and they'll say, "Hey, it looks like you're really having fun up there." Which means, "Oh, isn't it cute? You got a little hobby and you're having fun up there and you get to be a rock star." That's what they mean by it. And I just kick them the fuck out of the dressing room.

• 56:01Speaker 00

  I mean, I'm not joking. There was a very famous guy who came back to see us in Dallas one time. And he came back and he goes, you know, it's really nice you get to do this. I said, get to do what? And he said, you know, get to go out on the road and stuff and, you know, get this part of you and get to have fun up there and stuff like that. I said, well, you know, I have some songs about suicide. I said, so you think that's fun? I said, it's not fun. I'm writing about shit from my soul that I grew up in. I'm also writing things that are hopeful songs. I'm writing a lot of stuff here. We write original music and perform it and people love this band. I said, so don't ever fucking come near me again. Don't ever come to one of our shows again if all you want to do is

• 56:44Speaker 00

  come back here because you're pissed that we just had a record on the radio.

• 56:51Joe Rogan?

  Right, right.

• 56:52Speaker 00

  You know what I mean? And then you were in a band from, you know, 30 years ago and now you're playing, you know, places that are smaller than where we are. So don't come back there and start that shit with me. And I actually, he said, oh, no, no, dude. I'm just saying it really looked like, I said, get the fuck out of here.

• 57:07Joe Rogan?

  Oh, wow.

• 57:08Speaker 00

  I don't care who you are.

• 57:09Joe Rogan?

  Wow.

• 57:10Speaker 00

  And so.

• 57:11Joe Rogan?

  Well, you know when someone's digging at you.

• 57:12Speaker 00

  Absolutely.

• 57:13Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, you know when someone's saying, that was a great show. Looks like you guys are having fun. They're smiling and laughing. That was fucking great. I loved it. I loved it. And then you know, oh, it looks like you're having fun up there.

• 57:22Speaker 00

  Yeah, right.

• 57:23Joe Rogan?

  Oh, you're a cunt.

• 57:25Speaker 00

  Yeah, right.

• 57:26Joe Rogan?

  Oh, okay. Okay, cunt. Yeah. Some people just love to do that. They just want to dismiss.

• 57:32Speaker 00

  And fans think you're so dumb and you have no memory that some of the people who come to your shows to get stuff signed, which, you know, a lot of them, they're not even, well, they're selling them, you know what I mean?

• 57:45Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 57:46Speaker 00

  And in certain cities, like in Kansas City, we're like the Beatles. I mean, there are just certain cities where we sell out the second it goes unsaled. So you got good places and places that aren't as good, you know. No rhyme or reason to it sometimes, but there are people who'll come up to me that I've seen at shows before. And, I mean, if it's a guy that's just this average looking guy, you may not remember them. But if it's a guy who's 6'11" and has red hair with like this giant nose and two teeth, you remember that guy. I saw this guy last year, you know? And so, I've actually had him come up to me and say, one of their favorite things to

• 58:28Speaker 00

  say is, "Oh, it's so funny. We can't wait to come see your show tonight. We didn't even know you had a band." They love to say that. It's like, "Well, you obviously didn't see every TV show we've done. You didn't see, you know, me talking about it on the Today Show or whatever I'm on, you know? This has been going on a long time." Yeah, you knew that. But they want to say that to you.

• 58:52Joe Rogan?

  Right, to dismiss you.

• 58:53Speaker 00

  And so, I've actually had guys, on this tour, a guy came up to me who's been to three of our shows. I know he was there. And he's always in the front. On the third time, he comes up to me and he goes, "Yeah, man, this is really, really cool and everything. Will you sign these bunch of pictures from Bad Santa? I didn't even know you had a band." It's like, well, the first time you came, maybe you didn't. But then the second time you came, I think you probably remembered. And then last year when you were here, and now you're here today. So I think you probably do by today that we have a band, you know? But people love, we're in a society now where nobody wants to, it's a get-me society.

• 59:38Speaker 00

  They're gonna get you. And however they can get you, they wanna get you. And nobody likes to see people succeed. Like, when I was playing the Carl in Sling Blade, every critic in the world loved me. And then all the other ones, a simple plan, I'm playing this poor pathetic wretch and all this kinda stuff, you know? The second I got to, you know, have a love scene with somebody... And I was a leading man, all of a sudden, it's like, wait a minute, you're not one of us. Where did the hump on your back go and all that shit, you know, it's like, and it's like, you actually look better in this movie than you did that. You know, what did you have, plastic surgery or whatever it is?

• 1:00:20Joe Rogan?

  Right, right, right.

• 1:00:21Speaker 00

  And so, once you start to succeed, that's when they start to wanna say shit to you.

• 1:00:26Joe Rogan?

  Yeah. People love watching people fail at things.

• 1:00:30Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:00:31Joe Rogan?

  Because it takes away the pressure that they've, they have in their own life, their lack of success. If, if they could watch a great man fall, that's what's a funny thing is like, the dismissal of your music. Like, they can't dismiss you as an actor, your accomplishments, so they try to dismiss you as like, oh, like, this is a thing you're kinda doing. You wish you were a rock star.

• 1:00:58Speaker 00

  Right.

• 1:00:59Joe Rogan?

  It's a thing, you can't possibly be also a musician.

• 1:01:02Speaker 00

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:01:02Joe Rogan?

  You're just, you're just an artist and you do things that are cool, that you enjoy doing, no, that's not possible.

• 1:01:07Speaker 00

  Why is this ugly fuck married to Angelina? You know, that kinda stuff, you know what I mean? It's a, yeah, I mean, and, you know, not that I disagree, but, uh...

• 1:01:19Joe Rogan?

  It's normal, I get it, I would be thinking that way too if I was 16, you know, if I was a kid, I'd be like, fuck that guy.

• 1:01:25Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:01:26Joe Rogan?

  You know what I mean?

• 1:01:28Speaker 00

  Yeah, it's, it's crazy.

• 1:01:29Joe Rogan?

  I remember when I first saw pictures of you with Angelina Jolie, I didn't think that though, I was like, fuck yeah, dude.

• 1:01:34Speaker 00

  Yeah, we're supposed to root for each other.

• 1:01:36Joe Rogan?

  Yes.

• 1:01:37Speaker 00

  You know?

• 1:01:38Joe Rogan?

  You can look at something and be like, oh, fuck that guy, why is that guy, or you can look at the same thing and go, fuck yeah, way to go dude.

• 1:01:48Speaker 00

  Absolutely.

• 1:01:49Joe Rogan?

  That's awesome, and then you feel good, and he feels good, and everybody feels good, and maybe, you're inspired to do better for yourself. Like, you know what, I wish I was a little bit more like that guy, I gotta maybe discipline myself a little more, get my shit together, get something going. You know, but instead of, fucking that guy sucks, he's fucking overrated, that guy fucking sucks, he's a joke.

• 1:02:11Speaker 00

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:02:11Joe Rogan?

  Yeah. Fucking Sling Blade, oh, he played a retard.

• 1:02:15Speaker 00

  You're right, exactly.

• 1:02:16Joe Rogan?

  The beautiful thing about Sling Blade is you did that on your own, like, you, you did that, and you broke out, like, you're like, look, nobody's giving me a chance. I was gonna do something, and then everybody's like, oh my god, we love you, we love you, you did this on your own.

• 1:02:32Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:02:33Joe Rogan?

  But even then... You try to do something different. You like, you try to like, just be a normal human. And they're like, no, no, no, no.

• 1:02:42Speaker 00

  Yeah, we're not gonna allow that.

• 1:02:43Joe Rogan?

  You gotta be a retard.

• 1:02:43Speaker 00

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:02:44Joe Rogan?

  We like you as a retard.

• 1:02:47Speaker 00

  Absolutely.

• 1:02:48Joe Rogan?

  You're getting a little too big. I don't, I liked it when you were underground. I liked it when nobody knew about you. I bet the boxmasters get that too, right? Like, I liked you in the beginning, before you guys made it.

• 1:02:58Speaker 00

  Yeah, we have people who liked the first two or three albums back, you know, when we first started, which were kind of experimental albums and... But yeah, it's, it's a, that's a thing. It just is and...

• 1:03:10Joe Rogan?

  It's a human thing.

• 1:03:10Speaker 00

  Yeah. And we, we do like more than ever to see people fail, I think. I mean, there was a time when we rooted for people. I think there's also too much exposure now. I think, um, for instance, um, when we were growing up, especially in my era, uh, if we were gonna see Jimmy Stewart, we were only gonna see him in the movie. And it was on film and it had literally a film over it.

• 1:03:39Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 1:03:40Speaker 00

  That made it look like you were watching something magical. Now you got digital where you can see every fucking mole on your face and shit, you know? And, uh, and everything is a behind the scenes. Oh, and, you know, the studio's doing this and now this group wants to come over and they're gonna do a whole thing and they wanna see you on the set and... So, but if I see Mel Gibson sitting in a director's chair, dressed up like he was in Braveheart, talking about the movie, it's like, it takes away something from that. It's like, we've had too much of a peek behind the curtain, I believe. And I think there's, we're too exposed, there's too much access to people. When I was growing up in this business, I wouldn't have dared.

• 1:04:25Speaker 00

  If I'd seen Bob Dylan or Jack Lemmon or whoever it was on the sidewalk, I wouldn't walk up to him. To say Jack Lemmon, punch him in the shoulder and say, hey dude, let's get a picture. I mean, in a million years, I wouldn't have done that. There's a respect. These are my elders, they're my heroes. And probably wouldn't have approached them at all, but if I did, I would be, you know, very apologetic and say, I'm so sorry, but I'm such a huge fan of yours. And you still get that every now and then from decent people, but now cats will come up to me, literally, and just, you know, just come up and like grab me by the arm and say, dude, let's get a picture. The worst ones are, and this is usually guys, usually more guys than women.

• 1:05:09Speaker 00

  They come up and they'll say, hey, man, you're supposed to be famous or some shit. And my wife said, you know, you're like some famous dude, you know, so I don't really give a shit about that stuff, but can we get a picture? And it's like, I've put up with it for 30 years. In the last couple of years, I started saying, how about when you do give a shit, come back and we'll get a picture? You know, because, you know, after a while, you just can't take it. And I'm kind of a codependent guy, so I'm nice to everybody I can be, you know? And it's just every now and then you get a ringer and, uh, and you get drunk people, men and women, who just come over, they'll come to the bus when we're on tour and just start banging on the door and say,

• 1:05:53Speaker 00

  hey, you know, come out here, we got some whiskey, take a shot with us. And it's like, can you imagine doing that to Jimmy Stewart?

• 1:06:01Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 1:06:02Speaker 00

  You know, first of all, back then, you would have just, that is throwing you in jail, you know? But there's something about having heroes that you, that are unattainable for you. That way they can stay in that magic spot. So I think we've lost magic and mystery and all these things.

• 1:06:18Joe Rogan?

  Well, it certainly happens when you hear actors talk about politics. When actors become activists, it's like, okay.

• 1:06:25Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:06:25Joe Rogan?

  Oy, oy.

• 1:06:27Speaker 00

  I donate to a lot of charities, mainly children's stuff, but nobody knows it. I don't go to the award show and talk about it when I'm getting my award. It's like, it's like Ricky Gervais said in that skit of his, you know, he said, uh, he said, look, you know, come up here, accept your little award and fuck off.

• 1:06:47Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 1:06:47Speaker 00

  You know, uh, I, I think, first of all, unless you have really studied stuff and really know about a subject fully.

• 1:06:57Speaker 00

  Uh, who the hell would wanna listen to an actor or a musician talk about politics? You know what I mean?

• 1:07:03Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 1:07:04Speaker 00

  Are we supposed to follow this? I mean, if we are, what if they lead you down the wrong road? And you know, and politically, I'm not a, I call myself a radical moderate. I'm like, very strong in my opinions. But, my opinions don't belong to any political party. And, uh, you know, I just look at what makes sense. And I think we need a common sense party in this country. That's actually what I think we need.

• 1:07:32Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 1:07:33Speaker 00

  Just figure it out. It's pretty easy to figure out what this is all about, you know?

• 1:07:38Joe Rogan?

  A non-ideologically captured party.

• 1:07:41Speaker 00

  Yes.

• 1:07:41Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, that just is like, okay, what do we need to do here? Instead of, it's us versus them, you know? Like, you're seeing this a lot right now because, uh, Mom Donnie won in New York City and people are screaming, "We're winning now, we're winning." Like, what is this "we" shit? It's supposed to be, we are all Americans, you are all New Yorkers. You're all "we." You decided who's gonna run your city. Now, we should all root for this guy to do a great job.

• 1:08:10Speaker 00

  For sure.

• 1:08:11Joe Rogan?

  And this idea that now fuck all these other people that didn't vote for him, like, it's not a tribe, it's not a gang war, okay? It's an election to see who governs your city. And once someone wins, everybody else should be like, okay, well, let's hope this guy's got some good fucking plans and it works out great for everybody. And if you don't think like that, like, you're a part of the problem.

• 1:08:33Speaker 00

  Absolutely. I mean, people are pitted against each other so much these days that it's gotten kinda ridiculous. I mean, and you're right, it is almost like gang warfare, you know? And, uh, and, uh, and here's the other thing, it's like, we could also say, let's all get along. Well, that's never gonna happen because not everybody's gonna get along with everybody.

• 1:08:53Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 1:08:54Speaker 00

  I mean, even on a personal basis, I mean, you could pick any, you know, twenty people, put them in a room, and let's all hang out together for a week and all live in the same house. You're not gonna get along with everybody. But, at the end of the day, our basic- Principles as humans, those should all be the same with all those people.

• 1:09:15Joe Rogan?

  Yes.

• 1:09:15Speaker 00

  You know, which that, I mean, to me, that's getting along.

• 1:09:18Joe Rogan?

  That's attainable.

• 1:09:19Speaker 00

  It is attainable, and I think that we, like, even somebody that maybe you don't agree with their, their principles. If it's just two of you, uh, sitting at a bus stop, talking, it's hard to not, uh, just on a one-on-one basis with people. It's hard to dislike someone that you're stuck with for a couple hours.

• 1:09:42Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 1:09:42Speaker 00

  You know what I mean? You start talking, then you find out, oh, oh, this cat doesn't believe anything I believe, but then all of a sudden you say something like, you know, remember when we used to drink Tang? You know? And then the guy goes.

• 1:09:54Joe Rogan?

  Cause the astronauts drank it, yeah.

• 1:09:55Speaker 00

  Right. And then the guy goes, yeah, we used to drink Tang. The next thing you know, you're having a conversation because you grew up as just kids and humans, you know?

• 1:10:04Joe Rogan?

  Right, right, right. Yeah. It's, I think it's all because of social media is a big part of it.

• 1:10:09Speaker 00

  Yes, I totally agree.

• 1:10:10Joe Rogan?

  It's, cause the division, when I was a kid, you know, I remember like the Reagan days. The, like, there was a lot of people didn't like Reagan, but it was never evil. It was never like this vile hatred of someone that you see today for different political parties and different politicians and, and, and just the way we looked at one side of the country versus the other side of the country. It wasn't divided like that.

• 1:10:34Speaker 00

  No.

• 1:10:34Joe Rogan?

  Like, I always had relatives that were, some of them were conservative and some of them were liberal, like real liberal and everybody was, like, you disagreed, but they didn't fucking disavow each other because you voted for the wrong person. Like, this is bizarre. And I think that sort of insanity is just accentuated by these weird little echo chambers that people exist in that are also infiltrated by bots, so they're not even real people, half of them.

• 1:11:02Speaker 00

  Right, right.

• 1:11:02Joe Rogan?

  So this one FBI analyst, he estimated that it might be as high as eighty percent of the people that are communicating online are bots.

• 1:11:11Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:11:11Joe Rogan?

  On Twitter.

• 1:11:12Speaker 00

  Right.

• 1:11:13Joe Rogan?

  Which is fucking insane.

• 1:11:15Speaker 00

  Well, yeah.

• 1:11:15Joe Rogan?

  Cause it's eighty percent of the people getting all these other people riled up aren't even people.

• 1:11:20Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:11:20Joe Rogan?

  It's either AI chatbots that are run by China or Russia or even our own government.

• 1:11:25Speaker 00

  Right.

• 1:11:26Joe Rogan?

  And then there's actual farms of people that are being told to do these things.

• 1:11:31Speaker 00

  Oh, for sure. I mean, now people get jobs in the entertainment business. Because they're in charge of, I mean, at studios and things, you know, some twenty-two-year-old who's in charge of seeing who has the most followers.

• 1:11:46Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 1:11:47Speaker 00

  And they take someone and make them into a star because they got all these followers. And it's like, but they, they can't do jack shit. It's like, you know, the talent comes, the talent is created as opposed to someone was talented and given the opportunity, you know. Uh, and you're, I think you're right. I mean, social media has really, I mean, it sounds like the old guy chasing kids off their lawn, but it's just the truth. I told my wife when the internet first became a thing, way, way back when it first started, I said, "Watch and see." I said, "This is going to ruin people's view of each other. It's going to ruin our society." I promise you.

• 1:12:28Joe Rogan?

  You really thought that way back then?

• 1:12:30Speaker 00

  Totally.

• 1:12:30Joe Rogan?

  Why? What made you feel that way?

• 1:12:33Speaker 00

  Once you start opening it up to, uh, well, it's like, it's like, well, now everyone has an opportunity. They look at that as equality, as, as an opportunity for everyone, that everyone can get on the internet and now everyone can do something. That's great for the people that actually had something to say or do. But then you got another eighty percent who, you know, have an opportunity and all of a sudden there's someone because they decided to, you know, like, take pictures themselves at the bathroom or something, you know? And, uh, but I, I swear to God, I saw it all coming. And it was, it was, uh, uh, I mean, it gets out of control.

• 1:13:18Speaker 00

  And then AI, for Christ's sakes, yeah, it's fun to watch me in, in a sling blade talking on, uh, uh, like Carl, but it's a little baby trying to order french fries, you know? It's funny, but if it's used for that, or if there's some medical ways that they can use it, that's awesome. But once you start taking jobs away.

• 1:13:41Speaker 00

  From people, I mean, the workforce is going to be destroyed because of that stuff.

• 1:13:47Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 1:13:48Speaker 00

  And, and that's to me not cool unless you're going to find a way to take care of people because it's, it's gonna ruin the workforce. I mean, pretty soon you won't need it.

• 1:13:57Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, for sure. Yeah, it's gonna be interesting to see how we navigate that. But I just, I'm shocked that you picked that out early on because I looked at it the other way. I said, this is gonna give people that were outside the system, sort of like you were when you created Sling Blade, this is gonna give people an opportunity to show their talent that maybe would have never gotten an opportunity to be hired by somebody, that they'll be able to create something completely on their own. And I've read all these blogs by people that were really interesting. I was like, okay, I would have never read this guy's book if I just saw it in a bookstore. I wouldn't buy it and pick it up. But I'm reading this guy's, and he's got very interesting insights, and he's just some guy who's a computer coder who lives in Missouri. And somehow or another, he's just smart enough

• 1:14:42Joe Rogan?

  to figure out how to say things in a way that resonates with me. And I would have never seen this guy's words before. And I was like, oh, this is like, good, because it'll make it much more of a meritocracy. It's like if you- This episode is brought to you by Tacovas. All right, seriously, if you're looking for new boots or shoes this summer, you gotta check out Tacovas. These guys make some super durable and handmade boots. Besides being incredibly comfortable right out of the box, they've also got some great slip-ons, perfect for casual summer Fridays. Their stuff is built to last and made for long, hot months ahead. And they look great with everything, from jeans to khakis to linen suits. Dress them up or down. Plus, they've got tons of

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• 1:15:51Joe Rogan?

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• 1:16:31Joe Rogan?

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• 1:17:06Speaker 00

  Yeah, I agree with that still to this day.

• 1:17:10Joe Rogan?

  That too.

• 1:17:11Speaker 00

  That that's true.

• 1:17:12Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 1:17:12Speaker 00

  And in the beginning, I felt that too. I felt, this is great. What I was afraid of was it becoming a runaway train.

• 1:17:20Joe Rogan?

  Well, clearly you were right.

• 1:17:21Speaker 00

  You know, and so it was, I did love the opportunity to discover people I wouldn't have otherwise. And I still feel that way. I still discover people on the internet all the time that it's like, wow, I would have never known that. So that does exist. But out of those, you know, 20%, like I said, there's another 80% that, well, for instance, when I was coming up as an actor, we had like 30 critics to worry about. You know, it was, you know, Rex Reed and Siskel and Ebert and Jeffrey Lyons and all these people. And, but you know, there was a, not a finite number, but semi-final number of critics, you know?

• 1:18:04Speaker 00

  I mean, you had the local ones, you know, and all the states, but, and internationally, but... Uh, now, some guy named Daryl, who doesn't like you, you know, can just write a bunch of shit about you and people believe it.

• 1:18:21Joe Rogan?

  Right, right.

• 1:18:22Speaker 00

  You know, I've been on lists before, I mean, you can ask people I work with on a set. Like I said, I'm codependent. I'm probably nicer to the crew even than I am, you know, the director and the producers and stuff. I mean, not that I'm not nice to them too, but I love, like, the Landman crew. Best crew I ever worked with. And I go out of my way to make sure that they're okay every day. And they'll tell you that. I mean, I've always been, you know, a decent guy on set to people. Uh, I've blown up maybe two or three times ever, and that was always when I was directing. But, uh, uh, somehow, you look at something on the internet. You could be looking up, how do you make blueberry muffins?

• 1:19:06Speaker 00

  And some fucking way, I'll eventually get to something that says what an asshole I am.

• 1:19:14Speaker 00

  You know? And when you see that thing pop up, and it's like, oh, he eats blueberries every day. And that was related to the blueberry muffin thing, and which I do eat blueberries every day. And, uh, and it's been said publicly. But then the blueberries turns into, oh, and he's also weird because he's afraid of antiques. And then it's this and that and the other.

• 1:19:32Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 1:19:32Speaker 00

  Next thing you know, I'm on a list of the top ten actors, and I've seen this a couple of times, who are the most difficult to work with on set. And I'm like, how the hell did this even happen? I mean, that's not true, but somehow, somebody said something.

• 1:19:50Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 1:19:51Speaker 00

  That then became widespread, and then all of a sudden, I end up on one of these lists. And the people I work with would say, God, that's, it could be further from the truth.

• 1:20:00Joe Rogan?

  Once again, people love to find out that someone's secretly an asshole.

• 1:20:04Speaker 00

  Yeah, right.

• 1:20:05Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, they want that. They don't want, like, oh, he's the sweetest guy. They want, oh, he's a piece of shit behind the scenes. It's like, like the Ellen thing. Like, you know, like Ellen was all, like, laughy and smiley, and then when everybody found out, she's actually kind of mean. They were like, oh, good, yeah, fuck her.

• 1:20:22Speaker 00

  Right.

• 1:20:22Joe Rogan?

  You know, it's like they wanted that to be true. They were excited that it was true.

• 1:20:26Speaker 00

  Absolutely, yeah. People love to see that. And, yeah, I mean, I-

• 1:20:32Joe Rogan?

  It's also rumors can just get, they just light fire. And remember the Richard Gere gerbil rumor?

• 1:20:39Speaker 00

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:20:40Joe Rogan?

  I grew up in Massachusetts and my buddy grew up in LA. And I was like, when did you hear that rumor? And he was like, and it was the same time. I'm like, so this fucking rumor burned across the entire country. Probably no basis whatsoever in truth. That Richard Gere had to go to the hospital, get a gerbil removed from his ass. And everybody talked about it. And poor Richard Gere is probably at home going, what the fuck?

• 1:21:01Speaker 00

  Right.

• 1:21:01Joe Rogan?

  How did that happen?

• 1:21:02Speaker 00

  Yeah, it's like I haven't, I've never even been near a gerbil. I mean, it's like, but uh.

• 1:21:08Joe Rogan?

  And every time anybody would see Richard Gere, he would go, oh, that's the guy with the gerbil up his ass.

• 1:21:13Speaker 00

  And they're stamped that way forever.

• 1:21:15Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 1:21:16Speaker 00

  Nobody ever forgets it. And now with the internet, it doesn't go away.

• 1:21:20Joe Rogan?

  No.

• 1:21:20Speaker 00

  And if I want something um taken down off the internet, I have to prove it's me. But the person who put it up there doesn't have to prove who they are.

• 1:21:32Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 1:21:32Speaker 00

  You know what I mean?

• 1:21:33Joe Rogan?

  Right, right, right.

• 1:21:33Speaker 00

  Which seems kind of odd to me, but uh, yeah, that whole thing with uh, Richard Gere.

• 1:21:40Speaker 00

  They want it to be true so badly that everybody you talk to who's got the news, you know, they say, hey, guess what happened with Richard Gere, you know, and then he went to so and so hospital and, you know, whatever it was.

• 1:21:56Speaker 00

  And then you say, nah, come on, I mean, seriously, really and truly. And they go, no, no, no. My neighbors, cousins, a nurse, you know how many fucking nurses were working there that night? Thousands, thousands of nurses were on duty. And I know somebody who knows one of them all across the country, you know?

• 1:22:15Joe Rogan?

  Well, they want it to be true. They wanted to be true because he was too handsome.

• 1:22:20Speaker 00

  Yeah, exactly.

• 1:22:21Joe Rogan?

  Too handsome, doing too well, too good of an actor, you know, like fuck that guy. Oh, he like gerbils up his ass, makes sense.

• 1:22:29Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:22:30Joe Rogan?

  And then the idea is that like you get so much pussy, you just like you get bored.

• 1:22:34Speaker 00

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:22:34Joe Rogan?

  You start sucking dicks, putting things up your ass, like getting, going to the hospital, the G I Joe stuffed up there and.

• 1:22:39Speaker 00

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:22:41Joe Rogan?

  Just some kind of a fucking rumor.

• 1:22:43Speaker 00

  Always.

• 1:22:44Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, it's, you know, it's unfortunate. It's unfortunate people think like that. They want, they want failure.

• 1:22:51Speaker 00

  And the thing with me is I like people, I really do. And people tell me, they, I sign a lot of things and take a lot of pictures of people. And my friends will, I have friends who won't even look at them, you know, in the entertainment business. They're just like, fuck these guys, just walk right by them. And I'll go through these press lines, I'll sign stuff all day. And people ask me, they say, why do you do that? I say, A, they put my kids through school, that's why. You know, I owe them, you know, some attention, you know, and the other thing is, it's like, to them, it means something. You know, fifty years from now, somebody's grandkid is gonna have an autograph by somebody that means something to them.

• 1:23:37Speaker 00

  I mean, it's different than the people selling them. I'm talking about, you know, actual fans who want you to write it out to Uncle Albert or whoever it is.

• 1:23:42Joe Rogan?

  Right, right, right.

• 1:23:44Speaker 00

  And it means something to them. And I, I love my fans. I mean, I, I always have. And I, I cherish them. I feel blessed every day. And I don't.

• 1:23:55Speaker 00

  It, it's, I mean, it's emotionally exhausting sometimes, you know, because, you know, everybody wants to talk to you for a half hour apiece and you can't do it. But I try anyway to talk to them.

• 1:24:09Joe Rogan?

  It's a weird position to be in.

• 1:24:11Speaker 00

  It is.

• 1:24:11Joe Rogan?

  It's a very weird position to be in where they know you and you don't know them. And everywhere you go, that's the case. You walk, any restaurant you walk into, oh, Billy Bob's here. It's like every, people wanna say hi, they wanna come over to your table and shake your hand and talk to you, I got a mouthful of food. And it's like.

• 1:24:28Speaker 00

  Well, you know, they always wanna buy your stuff. When I was broke, starving to death, most of my life until the last thirty-five years.

• 1:24:38Speaker 00

  Uh, nobody ever bought me shit.

• 1:24:40Joe Rogan?

  No.

• 1:24:41Speaker 00

  You know, now, everybody wants to buy me a drink, and I'm like, well, no, let me buy you guys a drink. It's like, I don't need you to buy me a drink now. But then I kind of figured out that what it really is, it's a connection.

• 1:24:52Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 1:24:52Speaker 00

  It's not really about buying the drink.

• 1:24:55Joe Rogan?

  It's an offering.

• 1:24:56Speaker 00

  It's an offering.

• 1:24:57Joe Rogan?

  Friendship offering.

• 1:24:57Speaker 00

  Exactly.

• 1:24:58Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 1:24:58Speaker 00

  And that's why, you know, you take it, you know, you take the drink and you appreciate it and.

• 1:25:05Joe Rogan?

  And occasionally you meet really cool people that way.

• 1:25:07Speaker 00

  Absolutely.

• 1:25:08Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 1:25:08Speaker 00

  I meet people, cool people all the time.

• 1:25:10Joe Rogan?

  All the time, yeah.

• 1:25:11Speaker 00

  All the time.

• 1:25:12Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, there's like, the, the problem is, it's just like social media comments. Like, if you read ten great things about you, but then you read one, like, that guy's a piece of shit. He yells at the crew, like, aw, fuck you, man. And then that ruins your whole day, like.

• 1:25:25Speaker 00

  Right?

• 1:25:26Joe Rogan?

  Ten people saying you're the nicest guy they've ever met, we love him, he's so, so talented, and so authentic, and then one fucking person. And that person gets stuck in your head. That's the same with meeting people. You know, you can meet ten amazing people, this is great, and one guy's like, eh, I don't give a shit. But my wife says you're somebody, like, ah, fuck you.

• 1:25:43Speaker 00

  And that's what you think about, yeah.

• 1:25:45Joe Rogan?

  You sit in your hotel room smoking cigarettes, like, fuck that guy.

• 1:25:48Speaker 00

  Right. Oh, it, it's amazing how people can get under your skin.

• 1:25:52Joe Rogan?

  It is. You know, that's why they do it.

• 1:25:54Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:25:54Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, that's, that's why I always tell comedians, post and ghost. Post something, then get the fuck out of there. Don't read anything about yourself. Don't, don't read the good and don't read the bad. Don't read any of it. You don't want to know. Let them talk, let them yap. Who cares?

• 1:26:10Speaker 00

  I quit reading it, you know, several years ago. I, I, I don't do it anymore and, you know, I just don't even. I, I don't care about awards anymore.

• 1:26:19Joe Rogan?

  Good for you.

• 1:26:20Speaker 00

  I got plenty of them. And because I kind of got in under the wire when awards were kind of real still, you know.

• 1:26:27Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 1:26:29Speaker 00

  And I've won a couple recently, but. These days, I just look at it as like, oh, okay, we're gonna go over here and, you know, have some, you know, dried chicken breast and green beans.

• 1:26:41Joe Rogan?

  Kader's so wack.

• 1:26:44Speaker 00

  And we'll listen to people get up there and pontificate about how awesome they are. And, you know, but see, those are the ones that get me. It's like, how about if you're gonna get one of these things and you truly are honored by it? Well, you honor the people who gave it to you.

• 1:27:03Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 1:27:03Speaker 00

  Just them, and don't go up there and talk about saving, you know, the Badgers in Wisconsin or something, you know what I'm saying? It's like, you know, there's a time and place for that, I believe. And, you know, you should just stick to what it is. And people would argue and say, well, no, because I have a voice and because everybody knows me, this is a great platform for me to put this out there. Well, how about this? If you have a billion dollars and you wanna save the Badgers, fucking save them. I mean, you got plenty of money to save the Badgers, trust me. That's barely gonna cut into your budget.

• 1:27:44Joe Rogan?

  Right, right, right. If that's really your cause, talking about it is just gonna annoy people. And everybody knows what you're really doing. You're saying how awesome you are because you care about things.

• 1:27:53Speaker 00

  That's exactly right.

• 1:27:54Joe Rogan?

  You're saying how special you are because you're really concerned about people in Sudan or whatever the fuck it is. And it's like a flag that you carry with you to let everybody know that you're an amazing person.

• 1:28:04Speaker 00

  Yeah, if you're gonna do it, just do it.

• 1:28:05Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, I've always felt like, I mean, it's easy to say someone's never won an award, but I always felt like awards for art are stupid.

• 1:28:13Speaker 00

  Stupid.

• 1:28:13Joe Rogan?

  Because I don't...

• 1:28:14Speaker 00

  The concept is stupid.

• 1:28:16Joe Rogan?

  If people enjoy it, that's the reward. That's the award. You got it. You won. People enjoyed it, you did something, they enjoyed it, congratulations.

• 1:28:25Speaker 00

  Yes.

• 1:28:25Joe Rogan?

  And everything else is just jerking off.

• 1:28:27Speaker 00

  You know, like it's. Well, they've become shows. Yeah. Now, it's just about the show and it's you may as well be watching. What's the one where all the, you know, pretty people live in an apartment together and that kind of stuff. Right, right, right. Yeah. And my buddy, Rick Overton, you know, Rick. Sure. Overton. I know him very well. I go way back with Rick and Rick did a thing, a voiceover thing for an album of ours years ago. And he said, we were, he was talking about, he goes, when did, when did a dude, a regular dude sitting in a hot tub with six models become fucking reality?

• 1:29:09Speaker 00

  But anyway. Big Brother, right? Yeah, but it's, they're all shows now and, and if you, they also look you in the eye. The ones I don't dig are like, if you didn't like, let's say you hated Landman and you tell me that. You say, you know what? I don't get it. I just don't get it. I can accept that. You know, I go, okay, well, sorry. You don't dig it. Yeah. I'm, we're having a great time on it. And, you know, a lot of people like it, but you know, I respect that. It's the ones who say, hey, I love your, you know, this is with journalists mostly. They'll say, oh, it's the best show on TV. Then you read their article in their paper, wherever it is, in Sweden or wherever the fuck it is.

• 1:29:52Speaker 00

  And they just rip you a new asshole. Yeah. And it's like, that's what I don't respect. It's like, if you don't like it, tell me you don't like it right now. Don't get me to say a bunch of shit about it. Exactly. And then take the piss out of it, you know? Yeah. That's what's, what's wrong. And I'll, I'll tell you, here's one, Screen Actors Guild. I've been in the Screen Actors Guild since the mid eighties. I mean, a long time. I've done so many Q and As for SAG audiences. Out of all this, and these are your peers. Now, maybe if there's an organization that gives out an award, maybe it's political. Maybe I don't get it because they don't like me or whatever it is. Okay, I get it.

• 1:30:38Speaker 00

  All the actors at a SAG thing will come up to me, or any other actor-based, or entertainer-based award, where it's actually your peers voting for you.

• 1:30:52Speaker 00

  If you go to the cocktail party after the Q and A, they couldn't be further up your ass. Then, guess how many SAG awards I have?

• 1:31:04Speaker 00

  How many? All these years?

• 1:31:07Speaker 00

  I think one. And it was like a group, an ensemble deal. And I think I've been nominated twice, maybe three times, in a forty-something-year career in this. They have given me the least notice. My own cats, who want to be in the movie with me. Hey, see if you can get me in Landman. You know, who you're voting for? Adrian Brody. You know, whoever it is. Whoever they voted for, it wasn't me. Now, I don't give a shit. I really don't care. When I do these Q and As now, I do it because I like talking to actors and kind of giving them some information about what we do, hearing what their questions are, what they want to know about. That's why I do it now. Has nothing to do... I actually have...

• 1:31:51Speaker 00

  I told an audience in Boston last year. I said, "Do me a favor. Please don't vote for me." I said, "I'm not here to beg you for an award. So if you don't want to vote for me, don't let me change your mind today. Because this is just... I'm just talking to you guys right now." And I mean that. You know, I'm not just saying...

• 1:32:12Joe Rogan?

  Well, that's a healthy perspective. That's a good way to look at it. Yeah, the award thing is a weird thing. I think one of my favorite award show moments was Marlon Brando, when he didn't want to accept his Academy Award, so he brought up this Native American woman. Talked about the plight of Native Americans in America. And then it turned out that wasn't really a Native American woman.

• 1:32:31Speaker 00

  Right.

• 1:32:31Joe Rogan?

  And she was a crazy person.

• 1:32:32Speaker 00

  Right.

• 1:32:33Joe Rogan?

  Sister outing her. She wasn't at all Native American. She was just fucking nuts.

• 1:32:37Speaker 00

  Oh, my god.

• 1:32:38Joe Rogan?

  She came up with a completely fake name.

• 1:32:40Speaker 00

  Oh, god.

• 1:32:41Joe Rogan?

  Went up there and just like, just was a nut and just got all this attention. And she tricked Marlon Brando and she tricked all those people and everybody was like, you're amazing. She's amazing. And to me, that's Hollywood. That, that moment is what it's really about.

• 1:32:56Speaker 00

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:32:56Joe Rogan?

  That and when they gave Will Smith a standing ovation after he smacked Chris Rock.

• 1:33:01Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:33:02Joe Rogan?

  Like, okay, this is you guys. This is, you're, you're fucking insane.

• 1:33:05Speaker 00

  Right.

• 1:33:05Joe Rogan?

  You guys are nuts. You have no idea which way is north. Someone says it's that way. You're like, it's that way! And everybody runs in that direction.

• 1:33:13Speaker 00

  People have been given awards that didn't actually win because they fucked something up, you know? And they, and they can't go back and say, well, actually, you know?

• 1:33:22Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 1:33:23Speaker 00

  And, uh, you know, it was on the show. It's got to stick, you know, and that kind of thing. But, uh, you reminded me of something that I thought was hilarious with the, with the woman being a nut. I'm saying, remember when there was a cat who was, uh, I think it's happened more than once now, but the original guy I saw, I think, I don't remember exactly. It might have been somewhere in Africa, but some politician or somebody was giving a speech. And there was a cat.

• 1:33:49Joe Rogan?

  Obama.

• 1:33:49Speaker 00

  Acting like the.

• 1:33:51Joe Rogan?

  Sign language.

• 1:33:51Speaker 00

  Sign language guy.

• 1:33:52Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:33:53Speaker 00

  He was doing stuff that looked like he was dancing like James Brown. It was like, it was like it had nothing to do with sign language. I mean, he would literally flip around and do things like this. It's like, I don't know sign language. I know that wasn't fucking sign language, you know?

• 1:34:09Joe Rogan?

  Well, sign language is also different everywhere you go. You know, there's American sign language. There's English sign language. It's a completely different language.

• 1:34:16Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:34:17Joe Rogan?

  Which is really weird.

• 1:34:18Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:34:18Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, it's very strange. Yeah. My buddy Moshe Kasher, he's, his parents were deaf. So he can sign. And he explained to me the whole thing and how, how unique it is.

• 1:34:28Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:34:28Joe Rogan?

  And, you know, he can have full conversations with sign language, both alphabetically and with words. And he can, he could do anything, but it's American sign language. So if he went and tried to talk to someone in, you know, some other country, even if they speak English, like they have a totally different kind of sign language.

• 1:34:43Speaker 00

  So it's just like actual language where if you and I go to China, we're not, you know, what the fuck to say.

• 1:34:48Joe Rogan?

  Exactly.

• 1:34:49Speaker 00

  So, in sign language, yeah. And sign language is an important thing. That's one, that's a good thing that's happened over the last couple of decades is they actually do. Uh, when there's important information, they always have a signer there, you know?

• 1:35:03Joe Rogan?

  I think there's a lawsuit right now to make the Trump administration bring sign language people back to those White House press briefings.

• 1:35:13Speaker 00

  Really?

• 1:35:13Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, I read something, see if you can find that. I read something about that today. I'm like, why would they take that out? Why would you remove sign language thing?

• 1:35:20Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:35:21Joe Rogan?

  I've had them on comedy shows sometimes, like if you perform at some theater and like there's some sort of a mandatory requirement for a sign language person.

• 1:35:29Speaker 00

  Right.

• 1:35:30Joe Rogan?

  And so there's someone that has to keep up with the jokes and explain like sarcasm while you're in the middle.

• 1:35:36Speaker 00

  Wow.

• 1:35:36Joe Rogan?

  Like it's very weird.

• 1:35:38Speaker 00

  That's a hard job.

• 1:35:39Joe Rogan?

  Well, I always fuck with the person too.

• 1:35:41Speaker 00

  Right.

• 1:35:41Joe Rogan?

  Cause I was like, this is so crazy. You have to, you have to try to decipher that. Here it is. Judge orders White House to use American Sign Language interpreters at briefings. Yeah. So were there not ones ever before?

• 1:35:55Speaker 00

  No, it says they stopped when.

• 1:35:57Joe Rogan?

  They stopped during the Trump administration?

• 1:35:59Speaker 00

  Term in January, they stopped in January.

• 1:36:01Joe Rogan?

  Oh, that's crazy.

• 1:36:01Speaker 00

  Wow.

• 1:36:02Joe Rogan?

  Well, that's not smart.

• 1:36:05Speaker 00

  I don't remember it much when I was growing up.

• 1:36:08Joe Rogan?

  I don't remember it at all.

• 1:36:09Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:36:10Joe Rogan?

  I don't remember it at all. I, I, I knew it was a thing, but. This episode is brought to you by The Farmer's Dog. Here's a fun fact. Research shows that dogs who maintain a healthy weight can live up to two and a half years longer on average than dogs who are overweight. Isn't that wild and also kind of obvious at the same time? So why is feeding vague scoops of ultra-processed kibble still the status quo for most dog owners? Healthy alternatives exist, and trust me, I know. I buy one, The Farmer's Dog. I use it for both my dogs. They love it. They eat it up quick. It smells good to them. It smells good to me. It's human-grade food. The Farmer's Dog makes fresh food

• 1:36:50Joe Rogan?

  for dogs and my dogs love it. Their recipes are made with real meat and fresh vegetables that are gently cooked to retain vital nutrients. They also portion out the meals to your dog's nutritional needs, which helps avoid overfeeding and makes weight management easier and isn't getting more. Time with our four legged best friends, something every dog owner wants? The answer to that is yes, obviously. So try the Farmer's Dog today and get 50% off your first box of fresh, healthy food. Plus, get free shipping. Just go to thefarmersdog.com/rogan. This offer is for new customers only.

• 1:37:31Joe Rogan?

  This episode is brought to you by Chime. And I know people don't usually get excited about banking, but Chime is doing something different and it's worth paying attention to. In a recent survey, they ranked the number one choice for new checking accounts in America. That means real people, millions of them, are choosing this over traditional banks. That's because banking at Chime is fee free. No monthly fees, no overdraft fees, and thousands of fee free ATMs. But here's the real kicker. If you get their Chime card, it gives you 5% cash back on a category you actually pick yourself. Your savings rate, crazy high. It's nine times the national average. They're calling it the most rewarding way to bank. Go to chime.com/rogan.

• 1:38:15Joe Rogan?

  Takes a few minutes to sign up. Chime is a fintech, not a bank. Banking services and Chime card provided by Chime's bank partners. Terms and limits apply. Go to chime.com/disclosures for more details. I never saw it like at speeches or anything like that, but yeah, it's important.

• 1:38:37Speaker 00

  So can I ask you a comedy question?

• 1:38:39Joe Rogan?

  Sure.

• 1:38:40Speaker 00

  Because it's always fascinated me. I mean, people have said to me before, like especially if I get on a roll and I've had a few beers.

• 1:38:47Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 1:38:48Speaker 00

  They say you ought to do it just, you know, just for one night, just do a stand up in LA or New York or somewhere, Texas, wherever. And I'm like, it's the scariest thing in the world to me. Like I, if you and I are just hanging out, you know, all of us, you know, having a beer.

• 1:39:06Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 1:39:06Speaker 00

  You know, I, maybe I can be kind of funny sometimes, but.

• 1:39:11Speaker 00

  To get on a stage, and here's the reason I'm afraid of it, is because if you're doing a play, if you're doing a, you know, Cat on a Hot Tin Roof, or whatever the hell it is, you don't really know the reaction from the audience. I mean, it's like, they either love the shit out of this, or they don't get it, or whatever, but you don't know in the moment. If you're a stand-up comic, you have one reason to be up there, and that's to make them laugh. So if you don't make them laugh, pretty soon, you're fucked. And I mean, I can't imagine bombing as a comic. And I think about different, you know, people over the years,

• 1:39:53Speaker 00

  that had a very different type of comedy, you know? And, like Stephen Wright, for instance.

• 1:40:01Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, perfect example.

• 1:40:02Speaker 00

  Stephen Wright, who walks out there, doesn't say shit to the audience for a minute, takes a drink of water, and then he goes, "So, uh, last night, I, uh, accidentally put my car key into my door at my house and started my house up. I drove it around the block. Cop pulled me over and said, 'Where do you live?' I said, 'Right here.'" You know, or he goes, he says, "Um, I bought some powdered water, only I don't know what to mix it with." I mean, you know, that kind of stuff. So, this is very sort of like, nobody ever did that before, until he did that. And I'm like, what was it like in the beginning for that guy, where people just going, "The fuck are you talking about?"

• 1:40:46Joe Rogan?

  Well, you know what's interesting with him? He existed in, there's a great documentary on comedy in Boston, called When Stand-Up Stood Out. This guy, Franz Alameda, who was a comic in Boston, created it. And it's all about, there's a very, Boston was a very unique environment in stand-up, where all these comedians were just doing stand-up for Boston audiences. They just, they didn't travel, they just stayed there, and they were some of the best guys that have ever done stand-up, ever. But a lot of it was regional and a lot of it didn't translate when they left Boston.

• 1:41:20Speaker 00

  Right.

• 1:41:20Joe Rogan?

  But they were so fucking good. And there was just a giant group of them and some of them like Lenny Clark broke through and Jay Leno, of course, and Louis CK came out of there, Bill Burr, a lot of guys broke through, right? But there was a core group of guys that were a part of this. There was a, a, a group that would perform at this Chinese restaurant that was also a comedy club called The Ding Ho. And The Ding Ho, but I started in eighty-eight and it was already closed. It had closed by I think eighty-four, eighty-five or something like that. The guy was a gambler, lost all the money and lost his fucking Chinese restaurant, the place went under. And but the, the, the scene still stayed. And everybody was just about the art. There was no way to be famous. It was impossible.

• 1:42:05Joe Rogan?

  You were locally known, you know, so you could perform at a club and people go, oh, Steve Sweetie's gonna be there, well, go see him. But when Steven Wright got on The Tonight Show, it fucked it up for everybody. Cause everybody's like, why him? Why not me? And they got mad. Because Steven Wright had this very bizarre, absurdist act that translated perfectly to like a seven-minute late night, you know, Johnny Carson set. And it, it, he, he was the guy that broke out. He was the guy that broke out where all these fucking killers, man. And this one guy who's just like weird and absurd with fucking crazy hair and all fucked up and looked a little strange.

• 1:42:49Joe Rogan?

  I used to work at a fire hydrant factory. You couldn't park anywhere near the place.

• 1:42:55Joe Rogan?

  It was that, those kind of jokes.

• 1:42:57Speaker 00

  Right, exactly.

• 1:42:58Joe Rogan?

  And in a lot, he created like a lot of resentment where these guys like were upset that this guy who didn't do as good as them on stage was on The Tonight Show. What about me? And it like changed the thing that they were doing.

• 1:43:13Speaker 00

  Wow. That's amazing. Which like when Steve Martin first came out. I worked as a roadie, you know, for a lot of bands when I was a kid. And, uh...

• 1:43:25Speaker 00

  So, you know, George Carlin, Richard Pryor, those guys, they created a thing we hadn't seen before, you know, from anybody. I mean, Richard Pryor doing his as like stories. They weren't jokes. They were just, he would just start talking about these people he knew and then, you know, go through the stories. And Carlin, you know, coming up with all the, that witty stuff, you know, here's some partial baseball scores. One, three, seven, you know, something like that. And so I was privileged as a kid to watch new brands of humor come out on TV that we could see. And I was roadieing a couple of shows for the Nitty Gritty Dirt Band, who I still kind of keep in touch with.

• 1:44:09Speaker 00

  And their opening act was Steve Martin, because he plays banjo. So he played banjo before the Dirt Band came out. This is when I'm a teenager. And he did the arrow through the head, the whole thing. But he had kind of longer curly hair and he wore buckskin clothes and played a banjo. And there was a front of house guy named Danny Smith, who I worked for, you know, with this sound company. And I was back there at the front of house console with him and I see this guy come out and I lost my mind. I, I was screaming, crying, laughing, you know, with some of the shit he did because he just came out and just said, "I'm gonna do the stupidest shit you've ever seen in your life and people are gonna laugh." Yeah.

• 1:44:54Speaker 00

  And it's like, you know, and what he would just do, the whole, "Excuse me," or whatever, you know? And so here's a guy coming out, being over the top and putting arrows to his head shit. And people couldn't get enough of it. And before he did that, nobody else had ever done that. Right. And all of a sudden, here you got a guy that, you know, is doing it. And that became more the norm for a while, you know? It's like it spawned a lot of other people, you know? It's like when we did Bad Santa.

• 1:45:26Speaker 00

  There hadn't been anything like that.

• 1:45:27Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 1:45:28Speaker 00

  And the next thing you know, after Bad Santa, there's bad moms, bad teachers, bad grandpas, bad next door neighbors, you know? Bad guy who works as a dry cleaners, you know? And so, and those will last for several years, you know? Where you, where people are kind of getting that in their heads and naturally they're influenced by it and that brand lasts for a while.

• 1:45:50Joe Rogan?

  Like Yellowstone. There's probably like a lot of Yellowstone type ideas that get pitched after that.

• 1:45:56Speaker 00

  Sure.

• 1:45:56Joe Rogan?

  Yeah. Yeah, Steve Martin got so big that he decided to quit.

• 1:46:02Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:46:02Joe Rogan?

  So he was doing stand up and he was like, I lost all touch with the audience because anything I said was funny. I lost like what's real and what's not real. He was too big and so he decided to not do it anymore.

• 1:46:14Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:46:14Joe Rogan?

  Which is insane.

• 1:46:15Speaker 00

  Right.

• 1:46:16Joe Rogan?

  Because you really think about it like that's the thing that he loved and he was at the time, like one of the only acts that was doing arenas. I mean, he was probably one of the first comedians of all time.

• 1:46:27Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:46:27Joe Rogan?

  To do these huge places.

• 1:46:29Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:46:29Joe Rogan?

  And people would come to see him and it's this variety act. It was part, you know, King Tut, duh, duh, duh. You know, the King Tut song and

• 1:46:36Speaker 00

  Oh, for sure.

• 1:46:37Joe Rogan?

  Let's get small. Like it was like, it was, it was just so unique. And he just decided to step away from it and just do movies.

• 1:46:45Speaker 00

  And it's so wild because, you know, when you mentioned that thing about the big arenas and stuff, another thing that's scary to me about comedy is like if you're not in a room where everybody gets every nuance, that would scare me. I mean, to be, you know, of course he was that big and he had, and it was a big thing where people could see the big movements and stuff. But, you know, Lewis Black, right?

• 1:47:08Joe Rogan?

  Sure.

• 1:47:09Speaker 00

  Lewis Black was, we played, this is probably, you know, at least a decade ago, probably more. And we played at, in Milwaukee at County Stadium. And

• 1:47:22Speaker 00

  It was a biker rally deal we were playing at. And we came on before Kid Rock. So, we play our set, there are 250,000 people at this thing.

• 1:47:35Joe Rogan?

  Wow.

• 1:47:35Speaker 00

  And it was like, you know, half of Woodstock. And so, we went out there and, you know, had a great show. We come off and everything. Well, Louis was there. So, aside from the main giant stage where the concerts are going on, they have one of those blow up tents, you know, the ones where the sound's never good in there.

• 1:47:55Joe Rogan?

  Right, right.

• 1:47:56Speaker 00

  And it, you know, looks like, you know, the Dallas Cowboys training facility tent or whatever it is like that. So Louis comes by the bus to say, "Hey." And we talked for a few minutes. And I knew him from the Sunset Marquis. He would be in the bar there sometimes in LA. And so, we're talking and I said, "Yeah, man, it's a huge crowd out there." He goes, "No, you guys are awesome." He goes, "You don't have anything to worry about out here. They loved you." He goes, "Try doing comedy in a blow up tent with people in folding chairs." He goes, "That's, that's not fun." You know? And especially with a guy like him, who's the whole thing is about anger and, you know, all that kind of stuff. And you've got people in their little folding chairs in the blow up tent, you know, with probably some shitty microphone, you know?

• 1:48:40Joe Rogan?

  Yeah. Those shows are always hell. Those like festival shows.

• 1:48:45Speaker 00

  Right.

• 1:48:46Joe Rogan?

  Or shows where they have like a bunch of different things going on simultaneously. There's a band over there and there's a comedy tent over here. I've done a few of those.

• 1:48:53Speaker 00

  It's horrible.

• 1:48:54Joe Rogan?

  They're always hell.

• 1:48:55Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:48:55Joe Rogan?

  They always do it.

• 1:48:56Speaker 00

  Different stages, so you've got like five bands.

• 1:48:58Joe Rogan?

  Uh huh.

• 1:48:59Speaker 00

  And you can hear every one of them and you're trying to, you know, be funny.

• 1:49:02Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, it's, that's not a good environment for comedy.

• 1:49:05Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:49:05Joe Rogan?

  I mean, I've done a lot of different kinds of comedy, like arenas, theaters, comedy clubs is really where it's supposed to.

• 1:49:14Speaker 00

  Right.

• 1:49:15Joe Rogan?

  Everybody agrees with that.

• 1:49:17Speaker 00

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:49:17Joe Rogan?

  Cause you, I think what comedy is, is it, you're performing, you're doing, but you're also hypnotizing people.

• 1:49:23Speaker 00

  Right.

• 1:49:24Joe Rogan?

  What you're doing is you're getting them to think the way you think. You're putting people into your mindset. When, when I watch a comic that's really good, when they're on stage, I let them think for me. I'm like, go ahead, think for me. Take me on a trip.

• 1:49:33Speaker 00

  Right.

• 1:49:33Joe Rogan?

  Take me on a trip to the way you think of things and you lock in with these, and it's much easier to do that. It feels like as an audience member, it's much easier to get locked in if there's only a hundred other people in the room with you. Or two hundred other people in the room. But as soon as you get to like sixteen thousand, it starts getting weird. It starts getting, it's a different thing. Now it's a show. It's a big show.

• 1:49:57Speaker 00

  For sure.

• 1:49:57Joe Rogan?

  You're not like rea- the only exception is the round. The round is weird because the stage is like this little circle and everyone's around you and it's oddly intimate. Even if there's like, even if I've, I've done the round in Madison Square Garden, so there's like sixteen thousand people in there, but because they're all looking at each other. Everyone sees everybody's face. It's intimate now. Now it's not a separation between the crowd and the performer who's on the stage. Now we're all in this together. It's like a big hug. It's very weird.

• 1:50:31Speaker 00

  That's an interesting point.

• 1:50:33Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 1:50:33Speaker 00

  We've played shows with a band like that in certain theaters where, of cour- of course for a loud ass band like we are, sometimes we're a little big for the room, but you know. Uh, but that, that's an interesting point, especially the thing about people being able to see each other, cause then you don't wanna be the dick that everybody's going, I wish that guy shut the fuck up.

• 1:50:54Joe Rogan?

  Right, right, right, right.

• 1:50:55Speaker 00

  It's like they're right there, cause you know, in a Coliseum, these cats in the back, just hooting and hollering and shit, not paying any attention, you know, it's a different thing. Can I pee?

• 1:51:04Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Let's, we'll pause right here. We'll be right back, ladies and gentlemen.

• 1:51:09Speaker 00

  Now, I can, I can throw this in a cup.

• 1:51:11Joe Rogan?

  Doesn't matter. Unless you want to.

• 1:51:14Speaker 00

  Oh, I don't care.

• 1:51:14Joe Rogan?

  No, doesn't matter. Yeah. Bud Light's cool. They sponsor the UFC, so.

• 1:51:19Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:51:21Joe Rogan?

  And we're back. Where were we? What were we talking about?

• 1:51:24Speaker 00

  Well, we were on comedy and then I just talked about Lewis Black and then.

• 1:51:29Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, we're talking about fear.

• 1:51:30Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:51:31Joe Rogan?

  Fear of performing.

• 1:51:32Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:51:33Joe Rogan?

  And hypnosis, yeah, about how it's kind of like hypnosis.

• 1:51:36Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:51:37Joe Rogan?

  So it's a weird art form, but yeah, the bombing is horrible, but it's also the killing is the greatest feeling of all time. So it's like the only way you get one is with the possibility of the other.

• 1:51:47Speaker 00

  Right.

• 1:51:48Joe Rogan?

  You know, the only reason why you're willing to go through the bombing is because you know how great it feels when you're not bombing.

• 1:51:53Speaker 00

  Right.

• 1:51:54Joe Rogan?

  You know, and killing is so great because you know that it doesn't have to work out. It could take, it could be terrible.

• 1:52:02Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:52:03Joe Rogan?

  But it's a, it's a weird art form and it's a very new one. That's the really, I think, in my opinion, real modern stand-up, you could trace back to one guy and it's Lenny Bruce.

• 1:52:15Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:52:15Joe Rogan?

  Without him, I don't think there is, I mean, it probably would have been invented eventually.

• 1:52:19Speaker 00

  Right.

• 1:52:19Joe Rogan?

  But he's the guy, like that's, like, we have one person and we have film of him. It's not like the first guy to pick up a guitar, like, who's that guy?

• 1:52:28Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:52:28Joe Rogan?

  Try finding him. Like, who invented the fucking drums? Like, good luck.

• 1:52:33Speaker 00

  Because they didn't really, like you said, before him, that wasn't, I mean, he made comedy performers, stand-up comedians like rock stars, you know, it was before that, and all the controversy and all that kind of thing. Because before that, it was like variety shows. If you have Bob Hope and those guys, they're always on some TV show and it was usually them and someone else.

• 1:52:57Joe Rogan?

  Yes.

• 1:52:58Speaker 00

  You know, and, uh, yeah, it was, uh, did you ever know Rodney Dangerfield?

• 1:53:03Joe Rogan?

  Yes. I didn't know him well, but I did meet him and funny enough, I worked, when I, when I was nineteen, I worked as a security guard at Great Woods Center for the Performing Arts. It's like this amphitheater in Massachusetts and Rodney was performing there. And it was at the stage of Rodney's life where he only wore a bathrobe on stage.

• 1:53:24Speaker 00

  Right.

• 1:53:24Joe Rogan?

  Buck naked with slippers and a bathrobe. And I saw Rodney, when I was working there, I was like by the backstage area. I saw Rodney walking in the hallway pacing with his fucking bathrobe on, like, this is the greatest thing of all time? This guy's just gonna go out there in a bathrobe? This was nineteen eighty-six.

• 1:53:45Speaker 00

  Wow.

• 1:53:46Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, and so he went out there with his fucking bathrobe and just. Murder.

• 1:53:51Speaker 00

  Murder.

• 1:53:51Joe Rogan?

  I mean murder.

• 1:53:52Speaker 00

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:53:53Joe Rogan?

  The poor people were falling out of their chairs.

• 1:53:55Speaker 00

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:53:56Joe Rogan?

  Dying laughing and I was like, this is the greatest thing I've ever seen in my life. This guy's in a fucking bath. You want to talk about not giving a fuck?

• 1:54:03Speaker 00

  Right.

• 1:54:03Joe Rogan?

  He really didn't give a fuck anymore. And there was, I want, I wish I had known him where I could have asked him why the bathrobe? Like, what was it about that? Uh, but I've got to think that it was like the ultimate not caring. The ultimate relaxing. When are you ever more relaxed than when you get out of the shower? He's put on a fucking bathrobe.

• 1:54:23Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:54:23Joe Rogan?

  Your dick swinging out there in the wind and he just walked out in front of the whole crowd like that.

• 1:54:28Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:54:28Joe Rogan?

  Fifteen thousand people watching Rodney in a bathrobe, just murdering.

• 1:54:33Speaker 00

  Nick Nolte used to do that.

• 1:54:34Joe Rogan?

  Did he really?

• 1:54:35Speaker 00

  Nolte would do press junkets and interviews with his pajamas on and a robe.

• 1:54:42Joe Rogan?

  Wow.

• 1:54:42Speaker 00

  Did it for years, yeah. And Nolte just was like, man, I just want to be comfortable, you know? Nolte had one of the greatest sayings, uh, for when somebody would come up, uh, to him, who was, uh, a fan or whatever, you know, and, uh, and he was just messing with him. It wasn't serious, but, uh, uh, somebody would come and say, Mr. Nolte, I don't want to bother you. And he'd go, too late.

• 1:55:11Joe Rogan?

  I met Nick Nolte in the nineties because, uh, I was on a show called News Radio and, uh, one of the stars of the show was Vicky Lewis. And Vicky Lewis was dating Nick Nolte at the time, so he was always hanging around.

• 1:55:24Speaker 00

  I knew Vicky.

• 1:55:25Joe Rogan?

  And, uh, I got to know him. He was a really fucking nice guy. And then one time I'm in Fry's Electronics going to get a motherboard. That was back in the days where I would make my own computers. I would, I would like build my own computers and play video games on them. So like get great motherboards and really good video card and all that jazz. And, uh, I see this dude with glasses on who's like going over this box and, uh, I go, I go, hey, man, what's up? He goes, oh, hey, Joe. And I was like, to me, he's the coolest thing in the world that Nick Nolte knew who I was.

• 1:55:57Speaker 00

  Right.

• 1:55:58Joe Rogan?

  Outside of the set, like outside of the set, it was normal. Like inside the set, rather, it was normal. He's there with Vicky, like he says hi to everybody.

• 1:56:04Speaker 00

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:56:05Joe Rogan?

  So, you know, but like to meet him in an electronics store, I was like, this is the craziest thing of all time.

• 1:56:10Speaker 00

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:56:10Joe Rogan?

  I'm like twenty seven at the time. I'm like, this is just so nuts. I know Nick Nolte. This is fucking insane.

• 1:56:16Speaker 00

  That's amazing. I I knew Vicky too. She skinny little red haired.

• 1:56:20Joe Rogan?

  Yeah. Crazy voice.

• 1:56:22Speaker 00

  Oh, right.

• 1:56:23Joe Rogan?

  My god, could she sing?

• 1:56:24Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:56:25Joe Rogan?

  Oh, my god.

• 1:56:26Speaker 00

  Sure could.

• 1:56:26Joe Rogan?

  Powerful voice.

• 1:56:27Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:56:28Joe Rogan?

  To like a talent. Like, wow. That's that to me is one of the most impressive things. When someone could just sing their fucking ass off like. Cause I can't sing at all. So when I hear someone sing like that, I'm like, God, what can you do with your voice? That is insane. The the the beauty of a good song is like, man, it's one of the most misunderstood things that we love. Cause I think it's it's an art form that creates a response in people that's just like a drug. Like if there's a drug that you could take that made you feel like

• 1:57:09Joe Rogan?

  when Midnight Rider comes on the radio and it's just the right time to hear it. Like maybe you just had a shot. You know, and your buddy tells you something, you're like, oh, yeah, man, that was fucking great. And then all of a sudden. It's just, it's like, oh, yeah. And everybody's like, woo. It's a drug.

• 1:57:31Speaker 00

  It really is a drug and and some songs are made for the car.

• 1:57:36Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 1:57:37Speaker 00

  And then other songs are made for a home.

• 1:57:39Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 1:57:40Speaker 00

  Just laying around like especially back in my hippie days. You know, it's like you weren't gonna listen to King Crimson or Pink Floyd in the car. Run off the road, you know?

• 1:57:49Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 1:57:49Speaker 00

  But Midnight Rider.

• 1:57:51Joe Rogan?

  Oh, Midnight Rider is the car song. That is the car. That and Radar Love.

• 1:57:55Speaker 00

  Oh, yeah. Radar Love, that's another one. I saw those cats live.

• 1:57:58Joe Rogan?

  Really?

• 1:57:59Speaker 00

  Golden Earring. They opened, they opened for, uh, uh, Frank Zappa and the Mothers of Invention.

• 1:58:05Joe Rogan?

  Oh, wow.

• 1:58:08Speaker 00

  A Dutch band, yeah.

• 1:58:10Joe Rogan?

  Oh, wow. That's wild. That was a song I used to listen to when I go to visit my girlfriend. She was in western Massachusetts. It was like an hour and a half drive. I listened to Radar Love.

• 1:58:20Speaker 00

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:58:21Joe Rogan?

  Been driving all night, man, way on the wheel.

• 1:58:26Speaker 00

  It's one of those songs that makes you think you are the guy in the song, right?

• 1:58:29Joe Rogan?

  Oh, yeah, you're the star of the song.

• 1:58:31Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:58:31Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, there's songs like that, like, like, uh, Shooting Star by Bad Company. You know, everybody wants to be that guy.

• 1:58:39Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:58:39Joe Rogan?

  Everybody, you're like, yeah, that's me, man.

• 1:58:41Speaker 00

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:58:42Joe Rogan?

  I'm gonna be a superstar, then I'm gonna die young, and everyone's gonna miss me.

• 1:58:45Speaker 00

  Yeah, right.

• 1:58:47Speaker 00

  It was like in the John Lennon documentary where that cat, that homeless hippie cat, comes up to his door. You know, and he's kinda starving and stuff, and he, and he says, I don't know if you ever saw it, but he, he's obviously been living in the bushes, you know, and, and, uh, he thinks that one of Lennon's songs was about him.

• 1:59:05Joe Rogan?

  Oh, no.

• 1:59:06Speaker 00

  I think he probably had a little schizophrenia or something, you know? And he was, and Lennon answered the door, you know, and was talking to him, it's in the documentary. And he, uh, he says, well, when you were singing that, I mean, it was like, I felt that, you know, you were singing about me, and it's like, and Lennon just says, no, he goes, I only write songs about me. He said, I, he said, I don't know about your life. He goes, I, I just, all I write about is my experience with stuff, so it's not about you, but he said, are you hungry? And the guy goes, yeah, and next thing you know, he invites them in, and they eat and stuff like that at his house, yeah. But, um, sometimes, you know, some art form can influence people so much that they identify with it so much that it becomes that to them, you know?

• 1:59:51Speaker 00

  Especially people who have some mental issues or something like that can, that can really speak to them.

• 1:59:57Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 1:59:58Speaker 00

  I mean, you know, sometimes in a negative way. I mean, once again, John Lennon, that cat, you know? I mean, Red, uh, Catcher in the Rye.

• 2:00:07Joe Rogan?

  Mm-hmm.

• 2:00:08Speaker 00

  Catcher in the Rye, he thought he was that cat in there, you know?

• 2:00:12Joe Rogan?

  Yeah. Well, people are very malleable, and some people, mentally ill people, extremely. And something, one song, one book, one movie can, I mean, how many people went nuts after they watched Taxi Driver?

• 2:00:27Speaker 00

  Oh, yeah, for sure.

• 2:00:27Joe Rogan?

  I'd like to know that, like, how many people thought they were Travis?

• 2:00:30Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 2:00:30Joe Rogan?

  You know?

• 2:00:31Speaker 00

  For sure, yeah.

• 2:00:32Joe Rogan?

  That was, that was a fucking intense performance.

• 2:00:36Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 2:00:36Joe Rogan?

  De Niro in the early days, god damn that guy.

• 2:00:40Speaker 00

  Yeah, he was great.

• 2:00:41Joe Rogan?

  Pff.

• 2:00:42Speaker 00

  Really great, you know, it's, uh... And you know, it's funny how many comedies he does now, playing a dad or a grandpa.

• 2:00:50Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, angry grumpy grandpa. Yeah. Meet the Fockers.

• 2:00:54Speaker 00

  Right, yeah, that kind of stuff, yeah. Yeah. It's so funny.

• 2:01:01Speaker 00

  You know, Duval, my mentors, you know, were Duval and Bruce Dern.

• 2:01:08Joe Rogan?

  Oh, wow.

• 2:01:09Speaker 00

  And guys like that. And the fact that not only did I get to meet them, but work with them several times apiece and, and you've, once you know everybody, you start to, sometimes you hate to hear yourself talk, because I'll be talking to some younger actor, you know, like 25 or 30, and they'll say, "Oh, yeah, I really loved that movie so-and-so with, you know, with Robert Duval." I go, "Yeah, well, he's my mentor. He brought me up." And it's like, and, yeah, I look at, I've watched some of the old movies too, you know, like, I always thought Lauren Bacall was so hot. Yeah, I knew Lauren Bacall. And it's like, then you start

• 2:01:51Speaker 00

  to sound like an asshole, because, but it's just a fact. You do know them and, but.

• 2:01:57Joe Rogan?

  It's a different reality, though, for you.

• 2:01:59Speaker 00

  It is a different reality. And you get used to it, to the point where you just look at all of these legends who you know.

• 2:02:09Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 2:02:09Speaker 00

  I mean, I knew Gregory Peck very well, Elizabeth Taylor, all of them, and Roddy McDowell, and I got so used to it that I, I would forget most of the time, you know. And then every now and then, you go, "I'm talking to fucking Lauren Bacall."

• 2:02:29Joe Rogan?

  Right, right, right, right.

• 2:02:31Speaker 00

  This Bogart's wife.

• 2:02:32Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 2:02:33Speaker 00

  I mean, are you shitting me? And so I still pinch myself sometimes. I mean, I've been really blessed to have met a lot of great heroes of mine, you know, and become friends with them. Right now, I'm working with Sam Elliott. Sam and I have known each other since, probably the late 80s, somewhere in there. Worked together twice before, but a couple of scenes at a time, Tombstone and then eighteen eighty-three. But kept up with each other over the years and he was another guy who was more of a mentor from a distance. I just always admired Sam and now I work with him every day.

• 2:03:10Joe Rogan?

  That's wild.

• 2:03:11Speaker 00

  And it's amazing, you know.

• 2:03:12Joe Rogan?

  It's gotta be weird, right?

• 2:03:13Speaker 00

  It's so wild that, uh, he's such a sweet man, such a great actor, but when he and I do scenes together, it's literally like you and I talking right now.

• 2:03:25Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 2:03:26Speaker 00

  It's, it's that natural just to, we're, we've essentially talked to each other off, you know, when, when they cut, uh, it's no different than the scene we just did.

• 2:03:38Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 2:03:38Speaker 00

  You know what I mean?

• 2:03:39Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, well, that's when, he's been doing it so long, he's so good, it's just, he's so relaxed, that even though you know it's Sam Elliott, you believe he's whoever the fuck he's playing. Cause there's, it's a, there's a naturalness to it, like you were talking about with yourself, there's a naturalness to it. And that, that translates, when people are watching a film or watching a television show with that, which television shows aren't even really television shows anymore, like I don't think Land Man's a television show, it's a long movie.

• 2:04:08Speaker 00

  It's a ten hour movie.

• 2:04:09Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, it's just, it's like, what is, which is the beautiful thing about streaming. You know, that's really, when you got shows like Ozark and Stranger Things and it really started with The Sopranos, where you're doing, it's essentially like a really long film. It's not, I mean, it's on television, but it's, what does that mean anymore? Fucking everything's on television, most people watch movies on television, like what does that mean anymore? It's just a distribution device for whatever art you're doing.

• 2:04:38Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 2:04:38Joe Rogan?

  And on those kinda shows, like, it's so important for you to buy it. You know, it's, you get this, you've got this character, it's not just one guy in a film, like, oh, I'm not buying that guy.

• 2:04:53Speaker 00

  Right.

• 2:04:53Joe Rogan?

  It's something about, he sounds like an actor, you know?

• 2:04:56Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 2:04:57Joe Rogan?

  Versus nine, ten, eleven episodes in, second season, like, I gotta believe.

• 2:05:04Joe Rogan?

  That guy.

• 2:05:06Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 2:05:06Joe Rogan?

  I gotta be.

• 2:05:07Speaker 00

  For sure.

• 2:05:07Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, and the naturalness is the thing, you know, like, there's a great scene in Landman where you're explaining, which I loved, you're explaining windmills and what green energy and how much fucking horseshit this all is for you to feel good about yourself. I fucking love that scene, but I know you're Billy Bob Thornton, but in that scene, you're that fucking dude who works for an oil company who's like, shut the fuck up. What are you talking, do you know what the fuck you're even talking about?

• 2:05:41Speaker 00

  Right.

• 2:05:41Joe Rogan?

  It's because of that naturalness that that works.

• 2:05:46Speaker 00

  Yeah, it was, that, that scene was, uh, I mean, it became huge. I mean, it was all over the internet, that scene. And, I mean, when I run into an oil guy, wherever it is, I mean, you know, mainly Texas, but wherever I am, they always bring that scene up and thank me and, you know, thanks for showing people what this is. And, you know, I, I do get questions, you know, obviously because of the nature of the show, people try to politicize everything. And the fact of the matter is, is that Taylor, uh, with that show is not taking a side. He's just saying, here's a look behind the curtain at how this works.

• 2:06:26Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 2:06:27Speaker 00

  And it's about, uh, how are the people who work in that industry? Whether you're on the suit side, or you're out there in the fields, uh, and if you're the family of, like I have the family in the show, uh, it, it's just, this is how it works, and this is how it affects the people who work in it. This is how dangerous it is. Here's how much of a gamble it is. And here are all the other crazy people circling your world, in my case, the family, you know, and, uh... It's, um, when I did that scene, I was committed to it, you know, because when I read it, and Taylor's very good about writing gigantic monologues for me.

• 2:07:12Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 2:07:13Speaker 00

  And, uh, uh, when something makes sense to you dialogue wise, uh, it's, it's easy to do a long monologue. Uh, if you don't know what it means, it's harder to learn the dialogue. If, if you understand what the person has written, uh, I'm not saying if you agree with it or disagree with it, but if you understand what they're saying, it's actually easier to do a monologue than it is to do a back and forth scene with people sometimes. I bone more lines on a back and forth conversation than I do when I'm just sitting there telling somebody something.

• 2:07:48Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 2:07:48Speaker 00

  Like Jerry Jones scene.

• 2:07:50Joe Rogan?

  Mm-hmm.

• 2:07:51Speaker 00

  You know, Jerry was telling his life story.

• 2:07:52Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 2:07:53Speaker 00

  I mean, it wasn't, Taylor wrote something there for him, you know, because he'd heard the story before from Jerry. But, um, uh, if it had been written and Taylor said, you gotta write, you know, you gotta say these words, Jerry probably wouldn't have done it, been able to do it. But the fact that Taylor said, just tell that story you told me.

• 2:08:14Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 2:08:15Speaker 00

  It's his story.

• 2:08:15Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 2:08:16Speaker 00

  It'd be like if I ask you, tell me your life story.

• 2:08:19Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 2:08:19Speaker 00

  You can do that.

• 2:08:20Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 2:08:21Speaker 00

  And if you get a, a person who's not an actor to be themselves, they're better than actors, you know? I've, I've always found that. I've, I've cast people in movies that have never been in one before. I just don't tell them we're rolling.

• 2:08:35Joe Rogan?

  (laughing).

• 2:08:36Speaker 00

  I really don't. In Sling Blade, the guy, Rick Dial, who played the guy that ran the fix-it shop, uh, the kind of big guy, I went to school with him since the third grade. And I always thought, this guy could be an actor, you know? And when we did, uh, the first scene with him there in the, in his shop, when, uh, Jimmy Hampton brought me over there and said, this is Carl, he's gonna work, and all that stuff, you know? I just went to Rick and I said, dude, and Brent Briscoe, who played Scooter, the guy could never fix anything. And, uh, I said, look, Rick, the camera crew, they don't have their shit together. You know, I said, they're gonna have to get some marks and do a bunch of stuff, so this is not on us. So, we're gonna run this scene, but we're not really filming it. Just say the dialogue, if you fuck something up, don't worry about it.

• 2:09:21Speaker 00

  He was letter perfect. Once we started saying action and shit, then all of a sudden it got a little different. Most stuff in Sling Blade was a first take.

• 2:09:33Joe Rogan?

  Wow.

• 2:09:34Speaker 00

  And uh.

• 2:09:35Joe Rogan?

  Cause he's relaxed.

• 2:09:36Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 2:09:37Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, the pressure of the moment. Action. Action is a crazy word.

• 2:09:40Speaker 00

  I hate it. I I don't even, usually when I'm direct, I don't direct much anymore, but when I do, uh, uh, I just kinda say, well, you know, you guys go whenever you're ready, you know? And, but then you have A Ds and P As out there on their radios and shit and they're all screaming shit and it's like, you know, don't disrupt the flow here. Just let the cats do it, you know? I mean Clint Eastwood has been known to say, uh, you know, jokingly, but uh, uh, instead of cut, he sometimes, an actor I know worked with Clint and he said, uh, when Clint was satisfied with the scene, he just goes, okay, that's enough of that shit.

• 2:10:22Speaker 00

  Instead of cut, but uh.

• 2:10:24Joe Rogan?

  What was the process of like deciding to do Sling Blade? Like, how did, like, you know, you're obviously trying to find a vehicle for yourself and they're not offering it to you, so you create it yourself, but like, what was the process? Like, how did you decide to do that guy? Like, what was it?

• 2:10:44Speaker 00

  It's, it's a story that nobody believes. I've told it a couple of times and nobody believes it and it's the absolute truth.

• 2:10:56Speaker 00

  I was doing one scene, I think there were two scenes, but it was, uh,

• 2:11:03Speaker 00

  one of them was cut out of the thing. It was, I think it was an HBO movie or something. It starred Val Kilmer. And I was playing a railroad conductor in the nineteen twenties. It was, uh, uh, based on an old movie with Paul Muni, uh, called, uh, I'm a Fugitive from a Chain Gang. Uh, old movie from, I guess, the thirties. And, uh, they remade it and called it The Man Who Broke a Thousand Chains. I played a railroad conductor who had like a wool fucking thing on for the twenties and they had the, you know, the old twenties haircut with the side, sides pretty much shaved off, you know, and all that kind of stuff.

• 2:11:42Speaker 00

  And we're shooting in Riverside, California, at this old railroad museum. And an old director named Daniel Mann, who directed Teahouse of the August Moon with Brando and some other movies, he'd come out of retirement to do this. He was an old cat. As a matter of fact, he was so old school that when I went to read for him, there was a casting director named Kathy Henderson, who was always good to me, so she'd always get me in to see the director. And he was sitting there behind the desk, had a little gray goatee and glasses and I just talked to him for a few minutes and then I read a couple of lines with him. It's just me and him. And he literally said,

• 2:12:25Speaker 00

  "Kid, I got a plot for you in this picture." And it was like, what am I, what is that, Louis Mayer? Who the fuck was I just talking to, you know? And so he put me in the thing. And this was in the eighties. And I'm burning up, you know Riverside, California, it's hotter as shit out there. It was in the summer. So I'm in a wool suit with a conductor hat on and just sweating my ass off. And I go in, and this was in the days when I was still in a honey wagon, so there's just a little tiny room, you know, a little bathroom and a little couch, just like that wide. And at lunch, I went in and I put the air conditioner on, I took that conductor hat off.

• 2:13:09Speaker 00

  And I looked at myself in the mirror and I thought, "You sorry son of a bitch, you're never gonna make it doing any of this shit. Music, movies, nothing. You're just, you know, why are you out here, you know, to make, you know, three or four hundred bucks for a day to... And Val Kilmer's a big star and you're just some idiot with a couple of lines, you know?" And I literally made that face in the mirror at myself. Wow. Made the face and I started talking in that voice. Because I was so in a moment of self-loathing. That I literally started going. Meow. At myself in the mirror.

• 2:13:50Speaker 00

  I did that monologue to the girl that's the college student who comes to interview me in the beginning of the movie. It's like a nine-minute monologue. I did that monologue in the mirror to myself right there. I never wrote it down. And I can remember it to this day. Uh, cause I have all these weird afflictions, you know, I have a terrible anxiety and uh, have obsessive compulsive disorder really bad and I was grew up dyslexic and uh, you know, kind of an edge of the spectrum kind of guy and uh, I always had the ability to remember stuff. I have a photographic memory. I'm dumb as a bag of hair in every other aspect of life. But I have a photographic memory. And uh,

• 2:14:36Speaker 00

  even if it's not something I read on a page, it's up here. And uh, so I remembered that monologue and then I realized that I was talking about certain things that were actually in my life. The idea of him living out back in a, in this shed. Just sleeping in a hole back there and the family would bring him his food and stuff like he was a creature and stuff like that. That was based on a guy in Alpine, Arkansas that uh, lived there. Uh, the story was that uh, his mother was scared by a snake when she was pregnant, you know, old, you know. Right, right. Southern lore shit. And uh, or the father was drunk when he was conceived, you know, but actually he had uh,

• 2:15:21Speaker 00

  uh, polio. And was what the real deal was. He walked funny, he talked funny and everything. So Carl is largely based on a, a combination of this guy, Ed, in, in our town. And uh, uh, Frankenstein.

• 2:15:40Speaker 00

  You know Frankenstein and the kid and the, you know, the sort of not knowing any better, you know?

• 2:15:45Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 2:15:46Speaker 00

  And, um, you know, it's like the, well, I was told by the parents in the Bible that says, you know, if you see some, you know, like sex is bad or whatever it was, he sees his mother with his cat, Jesse Dixon, and he kills her. She told him to do that, you know? So that's where it all came from. And I started doing it as part of a one man show in a theater back in the late eighties. And, uh, uh, from that one man show, that, that whole character was born. And then, uh, uh, I wrote a short film and we did that. And that's why I got best adapted screenplay Oscar was from that.

• 2:16:29Speaker 00

  It wasn't, uh, I mean, it was my original screenplay, but it was adapted from my own thing. And so that's, that's how that came about.

• 2:16:37Joe Rogan?

  So when you went to do a one man show, did you ever think that you want to make it into a film or was it just like, I want to put this on its legs and just whatever this idea I have in my head, I want to make something out of it?

• 2:16:48Speaker 00

  At the, at that time, when I was doing it in the theater, uh, I, I, I didn't think much beyond that. A couple of years later, I started thinking about it and I thought that, that's the story. And I knew the story before I ever wrote it. I wrote it in nine days. And my, my oldest son Willie was actually on my lap most of the time while I was writing on paper because I don't know how to type. And, um, so, uh, I just wrote it on, you know, paper, like a tablet like that, you know? And, um, eventually, you know, we made that little short and then these guys that made

• 2:17:30Speaker 00

  the short wanted to make it into a feature, but they had this whole other idea about it, about they wanted to show what happened when I was a kid and show me murdering the mother. I said, yeah, it's the wrong thing to do, so I made it myself. And I directed a documentary on Widespread Panic, the band out of Athens, Georgia, and Colonel Bruce Hampton, but that's the only directing experience I'd had, and I didn't know shit about it. But I knew the story, you know, and I got Barry Markowitz, my DP, and, you know, got some guys and asked John Ritter, who I was working with at the time, you want to play a gay guy from St. Louis who moves to a little town in Millsburg? And he goes, yeah, I'll do it. None of us thought this thing was going to do what it did.

• 2:18:15Speaker 00

  I thought my mom and my brothers and people like that would see it, and that was it. And it became iconic. Fucking huge. Yeah. Well, how weird was that? Very weird. Very weird. Yeah, I mean, when they say overnight success, that literally was the moment. I mean, I had a name within the movie business from this movie called One False Move that we did in ninety or so, eighty-nine or ninety. But, so people were, you already had made deals to write screenplays for various studios and stuff, but, and I was getting acting work here and there. But when I did Sling Blade, it literally, I woke up one morning and I was not only

• 2:18:56Speaker 00

  a millionaire, but hugely popular, and it freaked me out. I mean, I appreciated every moment of it, but really, when you're going through those times, you, it's such a blur, you know, how quickly it happened and everything, that, I mean, to this day, I think back on it, you know, and think, huh? How the fuck? Get here. And I don't think you could get that movie made now. I think a lot of movies that I've done, you couldn't get them made now. I don't think there's an audience that would either tolerate it or be interested in it,

• 2:19:39Speaker 00

  you know, because most of my writing is based on novelists and not screenwriters. I've stayed out of Hollywood my whole career, pretty much, you know, other than the high-profile relationships, maybe, you know, other than that, I haven't associated with Hollywood much, and.

• 2:19:59Speaker 00

  It was just, you know, thinking back and going, how did I become a movie star? Shit.

• 2:20:05Joe Rogan?

  I think you could do it today, because I don't think anybody had ever done it when you did it.

• 2:20:10Speaker 00

  No, that's, that's true.

• 2:20:12Joe Rogan?

  You know what I mean?

• 2:20:13Speaker 00

  That's true, but I think because, maybe, uh... Well, see, Sling Blade, first of all, it's, it's not a comedy. There's funny stuff in it. But a lot of people come up to me and they say, "Man, that Carl, he's funnier than shit." And it's like, well, if you think about what it's really about, it's not that funny. But, uh, um, I, I just think because of, of the climate. You know, it's like, well, is he making fun of a mentally challenged guy, you know, uh, you know, bad Santa? I mean, it's like, you can't be that crass anymore, or whatever, and...

• 2:20:54Joe Rogan?

  I think you still can.

• 2:20:55Speaker 00

  Yeah?

• 2:20:56Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 2:20:56Speaker 00

  I mean, I, I hope that.

• 2:20:57Joe Rogan?

  I think if you do, people will, will go to see it. It's just, you'll get a lot more pushback now because people think that they can, that they can stop things and cancel you and all that jazz. But the reality is, if it's entertaining, if it resonates with people, they wanna see it. It's just nobody wants to find it. That's like comedies have died. Like, when was the last time there was a really good comedy movie? It's hard to make because of all this pushback. All these people that freak out about things, and if you don't like it, don't, don't go see it.

• 2:21:28Speaker 00

  That's my opinion.

• 2:21:30Joe Rogan?

  You don't like rap music, you don't like people talking about that, don't, don't listen to it. You don't like this, don't, don't go see it.

• 2:21:35Speaker 00

  Absolutely. That, that, that's exactly what I believe. I actually think that critics, maybe, should only do reviews on things they like.

• 2:21:48Speaker 00

  I mean, because, what good...

• 2:21:50Joe Rogan?

  Right, what are you trying to do?

• 2:21:51Speaker 00

  What are you trying to do with the, with the terrible review? So, they claim that they're trying to protect the public from this atrocity.

• 2:22:03Speaker 00

  And I don't understand why they think that they are the savior of everybody's fifteen bucks, or whatever it is. That it's like, you know, I can't believe, you know... Saw this movie like wasted two hours of my life I'll never get back it's like You know when people storm out of a theater?

• 2:22:23Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 2:22:23Speaker 00

  I stormed out of the theater, you know? It's like because of a fucking movie? I mean, seriously? I mean, just go in there and if you don't dig it, you don't dig it and don't worry about it, you know? Just tell the public, hey, you know, I'm nobody, but I saw this movie recently, it's pretty fucking good, you might want to go see it. As opposed to this vile piece of shit, blah, blah, blah, you know?

• 2:22:48Speaker 00

  It's like to have that type of arrogance to think that you are informing them that they should stay away from something like you know shit, you know? I don't get that part, I mean.

• 2:23:01Joe Rogan?

  Well, because you're not gross.

• 2:23:05Joe Rogan?

  It's a gross profession. I mean, do you remember when Siskel and Ebert were like the If you didn't get two thumbs up, you were fucked.

• 2:23:13Speaker 00

  Fucked.

• 2:23:14Joe Rogan?

  Those two guys had so much goddamn power and now we know they're both twats. They both hated each other and you ever see the videos, the two guys just bitching out each other? Talking about, don't fuck this up, like you fucked up the last one, oh, you just fucked that up and like Like, these are the guys, you have the worst fucking personalities and you're telling everybody what's a good film, what's not a good film?

• 2:23:37Speaker 00

  Fortunately, they liked me, but.

• 2:23:40Joe Rogan?

  There's certain things that are undeniable, but it's like that, one of the things I think is great today is audience score, like audience score of a film versus critic score and they're oftentimes completely lopsided.

• 2:23:53Speaker 00

  Yes.

• 2:23:54Joe Rogan?

  Like I pay attention to the audience score, like do people like that movie? If critics like the movie and people hate it?

• 2:23:59Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 2:24:00Joe Rogan?

  Maybe they're not getting it, maybe it's just esoteric, maybe it's weird, maybe I'll, maybe I'll really like it then. But generally speaking, like the critic score is not as interesting to me as was the audience score.

• 2:24:13Speaker 00

  Right.

• 2:24:13Joe Rogan?

  That's who it's made for.

• 2:24:14Speaker 00

  Absolutely, and that's who I pay attention to.

• 2:24:17Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 2:24:18Speaker 00

  I want the fans, I want the audience, you know, because critics, like I said earlier, you know? There are so many critics now.

• 2:24:27Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 2:24:27Speaker 00

  That, I mean, critics to begin with are generally not, no human is qualified to judge any piece of art. I mean, to start with, I mean, it's like, if you don't like something, or it doesn't strike you, or you see some really silly shit that's kind of not made well, or whatever, that's, that's fine. But, but how can you have a profession where individuals can tell everybody in the world what they should think about something? It's a bizarre world to me. And like you said earlier, like with awards, it's, it's not like sports.

• 2:25:07Speaker 00

  You know, how can you win an award that is an intangible thing?

• 2:25:13Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 2:25:14Speaker 00

  I mean, if, if you run a hundred meter dash in the Olympics, and you're the first son of a bitch that breaks the tape, you won.

• 2:25:23Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 2:25:24Speaker 00

  How in the hell do you know if I won?

• 2:25:28Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 2:25:29Speaker 00

  You know what I mean?

• 2:25:29Joe Rogan?

  A movie.

• 2:25:30Speaker 00

  A movie.

• 2:25:31Joe Rogan?

  Versus that movie, versus this movie.

• 2:25:32Speaker 00

  Oh, yeah.

• 2:25:33Joe Rogan?

  Yeah. And God forbid, you're in a year where there's some sort of socially conscious film that, that has to win. Like, if it doesn't win, then who are these monsters that are voting? You know? You didn't vote for the socially conscious film? Like, how dare you?

• 2:25:50Speaker 00

  And, yeah, the socially conscious film, and also the one with the music that tells you exactly what you're supposed to feel every moment.

• 2:25:56Joe Rogan?

  Yes.

• 2:25:57Speaker 00

  You know?

• 2:25:58Joe Rogan?

  That's the weirdest thing that we've all accepted about films, is that there's music and scenes. That is a weird thing.

• 2:26:04Speaker 00

  Yeah, it is.

• 2:26:05Joe Rogan?

  It, it just happens, and it's normal, because we've been around it our entire, you know, Darth Vader comes out. Dun, dun, dun, dun, ta, ta.

• 2:26:13Speaker 00

  Yeah, yeah.

• 2:26:14Joe Rogan?

  It's always been like that, yeah.

• 2:26:15Speaker 00

  It's like, here comes the shark. We see the fucking shark, dude. It's like, the shark is about to eat Robert Shaw.

• 2:26:23Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 2:26:24Speaker 00

  We're scared already.

• 2:26:25Joe Rogan?

  There's something eerie about a film that doesn't have music now.

• 2:26:28Speaker 00

  There is, yeah.

• 2:26:29Joe Rogan?

  This seems too real.

• 2:26:30Speaker 00

  Yeah, right.

• 2:26:31Joe Rogan?

  Yeah. Like, at least when there's music playing and Psycho. Dun, dun, dun, dun. You know, it, you know, it makes it like, a little, a little more palatable.

• 2:26:40Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 2:26:41Joe Rogan?

  The other issue with critics is that they don't want to be critics. I don't think anybody wants to criticize other people's art. They just don't have anything to contribute. Like if they did, they would probably stop being critics and be novelists or be screenwriters or whatever it is. They just, so generally speaking, the people that gravitate towards that don't have something to contribute to art. So they're just professional haters.

• 2:27:05Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 2:27:06Joe Rogan?

  So most of, that's why they love to write bad reviews.

• 2:27:09Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 2:27:10Joe Rogan?

  And they write the, they're trying to, the most vicious, "I'm gonna destroy his career." The way he portrayed that role, you know, they just try to find the most biting way to dismiss you and to shut you down. But it's the individual, like the type of human that's doing that for a living. It's not necessarily anybody you want to aspire to be.

• 2:27:33Speaker 00

  Well, no. And that's why, like you said, it's the audience.

• 2:27:37Joe Rogan?

  Yes.

• 2:27:38Speaker 00

  That's who you're doing this for. You're not doing this for organizations or award shows or critics or whoever it is. You're doing this for the audience. Those are the people that go pay a ticket price or sign up for Paramount Plus or whatever it is, you know, to, to watch these things. And that's who you want to please. I mean, I don't particularly give a shit if, you know, the actor guys I've run across in my lifetime like my shit or not. I mean, it's like, you know, I'm not really doing it for them unless, unless you love movies, unless you love good work, you know, then, you know, those cats are, you know,

• 2:28:18Speaker 00

  viable, but I just don't, I'm, I'm in a, a good place right now. And so I think, because, you know, my daughter Bella's going to Cal Poly up there and she's doing great. She's 21 years old. My sons both have jobs in their own places and are doing well. I love my wife. I'm doing a show I love with a crew and a bunch of cats and actors that I love. I'm touring, you know, once or twice a year, making a couple of albums a year. I, I just. Don't let that shit bother me anymore.

• 2:28:59Joe Rogan?

  Good for you.

• 2:29:00Speaker 00

  It's like I don't, I honestly don't give a fuck. And you know, people say that sometimes as a reverse psychology kind of idea, you know, it's like, oh, I'm never gonna win this, cause, and I tell my wife every time I'm gonna win an award or lose one, win or lose, you know.

• 2:29:16Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 2:29:18Speaker 00

  Cause I know, I've gotten used to it and I can follow the trend and I go, huh, and she'll go, oh my god, you're gonna get the Golden Globe or the Academy Award, whatever it is. I go, no, no, no, that guy right there's saying get it. She goes, how do you know? I said, trust me, watch and see. I was nominated for a Golden Globe for, uh, the first season of Landman. We went over there and I knew instantly it wasn't gonna happen, cause they had us, if you were in a stadium at a concert hall, and your seat was, here's the stage, your seat's right here, it's gonna take you thirty fucking minutes to get to the stage.

• 2:29:58Speaker 00

  We walked in there and saw our table, I'm like, Jesus fucking Christ. I said, we're, we're sitting back here by like the staff. I said, we're not, you know, the people bringing out the fucking food, you know? And I said, it's not gonna happen. And she said, who's gonna win then? And I'd been telling her this and she didn't believe me. She goes, you still believe that? I goes, I said, the guy from Shogun. I said, I promise you, that guy wins. I mouthed it to her as it was happening. They announced, I couldn't pronounce his name, but I said, the Japanese guy from Shogun. I literally said it when, you know, they have panels of each one of you when they're announcing shit, cause they wanna see the other guys. You know

• 2:30:42Speaker 00

  what I wanna see one day? I wanna see somebody, like, let's say the three of us are nominated for something and we're, and it shows you and it shows me and it shows you and you're trying to act nonchalant like you don't give a fuck. One day, I wanna see somebody just go, fuck! You know what I mean, in one of those things? That would be awesome.

• 2:31:04Joe Rogan?

  I've only been to the Emmys once, and it was when Phil Hartman died. And he was nominated, so we all, as a cast, went. And I'll never forget this, because he didn't win. And Dave Foley looks over at me and he goes, "What the fuck does he have to do to win?"

• 2:31:19Speaker 00

  Right.

• 2:31:22Speaker 00

  Exactly.

• 2:31:24Joe Rogan?

  But it was so funny in the moment. The guy had just gotten fucking, beloved guy got murdered, this big, giant horrible thing. His wife kills herself afterwards.

• 2:31:34Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 2:31:34Joe Rogan?

  And we're all sitting there, and he just looks at me and goes, "What the fuck does a guy have to do to win?" I'm like, "I'm out, I'm out forever, I don't want to come back."

• 2:31:42Speaker 00

  Oh my god.

• 2:31:42Joe Rogan?

  "Leave me alone." "Keep me out of this fucking chaos." And the worst thing you could ever do is get sucked into it and then play to that. And then do stuff specifically to try to win awards, like, ew. Like, ew, what have you become? Ew!

• 2:32:00Speaker 00

  I know.

• 2:32:01Joe Rogan?

  They got you!

• 2:32:02Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 2:32:02Joe Rogan?

  They got you. And they can get you. They can get any of us, just like crack. Crack can get anybody. I have to do a smoke it a few times.

• 2:32:09Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 2:32:09Joe Rogan?

  It'll get you.

• 2:32:10Speaker 00

  Oh, for sure.

• 2:32:11Joe Rogan?

  The thing, I think it's kind of crazy with you, because you're one of the most legitimate overnight successes ever. Like, a lot of people were overnight successes, but it was kind of like a slow drip, and then something kicked, and, oh wow, now it's something big. It's like, man, Sling Blade came out, and all of a sudden you were all over the fucking news. It was like, everywhere. It's like, and that's the wildest ride that anybody can be on. Because, also, this is the ride before the internet, right? So there were not nearly as many famous people.

• 2:32:46Speaker 00

  Sure.

• 2:32:46Joe Rogan?

  That's the thing, if you think about, a movie star, back then, was so different than a famous person today.

• 2:32:54Speaker 00

  Right.

• 2:32:54Joe Rogan?

  Because there's TikTok celebrities and reality TV celebrities, and it's just, there's so many famous people. It's an, it's an unsta-, it's like an unprecedented number of people clamoring for attention.

• 2:33:08Joe Rogan?

  So to be a Billy Bob Thornton when Sling Blade came out was a crazy spot in life. Because there's only like twenty of you motherfuckers out there.

• 2:33:17Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 2:33:18Joe Rogan?

  There's like twenty famous actors.

• 2:33:20Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 2:33:20Joe Rogan?

  Like maybe fifty.

• 2:33:21Speaker 00

  Oh, yeah.

• 2:33:22Joe Rogan?

  That anybody that you could get people to name and you're one of the fifty like holy shit.

• 2:33:27Speaker 00

  Back then, if you're number eighteen on the top twenty list of actors, you're pretty far down the fucking row.

• 2:33:32Joe Rogan?

  Right, yeah, right. It's crazy, right, if you think about it.

• 2:33:37Speaker 00

  Oh, yeah.

• 2:33:37Joe Rogan?

  Because being famous then was a very different thing than being famous now.

• 2:33:41Speaker 00

  It was, it was very famous. I mean, now people are famous because they're socialites, they go to parties and stuff.

• 2:33:47Joe Rogan?

  Or they're the Kardashians, is famous for being famous and no one can explain it.

• 2:33:51Speaker 00

  No.

• 2:33:52Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, but it's like that bizarre world. There's no class you can take to navigate that.

• 2:34:01Speaker 00

  No.

• 2:34:01Joe Rogan?

  No one can help you, no one's gonna, no one can tell you like what to do and what not to do. First of all, it's a new thing, like literally new.

• 2:34:09Speaker 00

  Right.

• 2:34:09Joe Rogan?

  You know, by the time Sling Blade, what year was Sling Blade?

• 2:34:12Speaker 00

  Like, uh, made it ninety-five, came out in ninety-six.

• 2:34:17Joe Rogan?

  So films are much less than a hundred years old. So films are really like real films where people know who the actor is, you know, what is, who's the first film star? Buster Keaton is silent, then you got Charlie Chaplin.

• 2:34:34Speaker 00

  Right.

• 2:34:35Joe Rogan?

  It's real fucking recent, man.

• 2:34:37Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 2:34:37Joe Rogan?

  It's real recent in the zeitgeist of the world.

• 2:34:42Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 2:34:42Joe Rogan?

  And then you're one of them and knowing what the fuck is this?

• 2:34:45Speaker 00

  Yeah. It's unbelievable. I mean, when I would work on sets early on with people that I grew up watching, you know, and I'm just like, wow, you know, I'm standing next to Andy Griffith or whoever it was, Robert Redford, you know. And now you start to realize that you're in a group, in an age group of actors, who are looked at by twenty year olds or thirty year olds like I looked at those guys because they say this stuff to me. I've been watching you since I was a little kid, you know, and all this kind of stuff.

• 2:35:28Speaker 00

  And it's, it's an odd feeling. The only thing is, and maybe I'm off base here, but I think because, and once again, social media has a lot to do with it, I believe. I don't think that because of our lack of, younger generations' lack of, of history, you know, their knowledge, how far history goes back to them. I don't think, you know, a hundred years from now, generations will look at us the way we looked at Humphrey Bogart and Frederick March and all these different people, Spencer

• 2:36:11Speaker 00

  Tracy, Betty Davis, you know, whoever it was. I don't think it's as important, goes back to the access, too much access, too much exposure.

• 2:36:20Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 2:36:21Speaker 00

  And I just don't believe that in the history books, you know, thirty years from now, let's say, they'll look at me or Quaid or Costner or whoever it is as the Bogarts and the Tracys that we, that we revere. Only because society's changed so much and...

• 2:36:45Joe Rogan?

  But is that a bad thing? Because they still, like, people love you and they still love Costner and they still love Quaid and they still love all these people. It's just you know them more that they're human beings now.

• 2:36:58Speaker 00

  Right. Yeah, I don't think that's a bad thing.

• 2:37:00Joe Rogan?

  It's a different thing.

• 2:37:01Speaker 00

  It's a different thing.

• 2:37:02Joe Rogan?

  It's a different thing.

• 2:37:03Speaker 00

  It's a very different thing.

• 2:37:04Joe Rogan?

  A movie star back then, like Clint Eastwood in his prime, you know, like, that's a different, that's a different thing. Like, you never saw that guy outside. It was like, it wasn't like he was, you know, doing YouTube videos and...

• 2:37:16Speaker 00

  No, no, no.

• 2:37:17Joe Rogan?

  Sitting down, talking to people.

• 2:37:18Speaker 00

  Well, I think the difference is, is with Eastwood or any of those guys, DeVall or, but you'd be surprised how many people, if I named Robert DeVall or Gene Hackman, how many people I talked to who don't know who they are.

• 2:37:31Joe Rogan?

  That's crazy.

• 2:37:32Speaker 00

  I worked with a thirty-five-year-old costumer and I said, we were doing a photo shoot and at the time we had four guys on, who made the records, who were in the band. And I said, hey, there's four of us here doing the photo shoot. Which one of us would be Ringo? And this girl, she's thirty-five years old. And this is not that long ago, ten, twelve years ago. And I said, Ringo? She goes, what's that? I said, The Beatles. She goes, oh, I've heard of The Beatles. And I'm like, yeah. Yeah, it's like hearing of George Washington. You know, but anyway,

• 2:38:13Speaker 00

  so, and I said, can you name any of The Beatles? And she goes, no, but weren't they like some kinda... And I said, they were a band who started every fucking thing we do nowadays. And I couldn't believe it. And she was like a hip girl with like orange hair and fucking nose rings and cheek rings and everything else. But it just seems to me that people's history is, it's, it's kind of, it's become different. Like our history, when I was, you know, listening to, you know, whoever, Cream or Jimi Hendrix or Traffic or whatever, I still knew who Billie Holiday and Jimmy Rogers, the singing breakman were, you know? Now, people, a lot of people think Ozzy Osbourne was just a guy on a reality show. It's like,

• 2:38:57Speaker 00

  no, he was in a band called Black Sabbath way back in the late sixties. And I, I think history's important for us, you know? I think if you don't know where shit comes from, you know, I think it's part of what you put into your art, or your influences, and also to see what they went through to get where they were, you know? I just think it's important. I mean, with anybody, politicians, how many people know that Benjamin Franklin, you know, Benjamin Franklin, oh, he's the guy who flew a kite and, you know, discovered how to make electricity come to some other place or whatever. But, you know, they were fighting over states,

• 2:39:39Speaker 00

  you know, when there weren't that many states. And it's like, well, wait a minute, we're in New York, we got way more people than you do in, you know, Virginia or whatever it was. And so we get more representatives and senators, you know, than they do. You know, they only get one or whatever. Well, Benjamin Franklin comes in, who's one of my heroes. He made sense about shit. He comes in and he says, tell you what, how about you have more state representatives than they do.

• 2:40:11Speaker 00

  Cause you got more people in your state, but how about in terms of the senate? Everybody gets two and then you get more representatives. And they're all like, huh, huh, okay. You know, makes sense. I mean, that's, those are the kind of guys I like, you know?

• 2:40:24Joe Rogan?

  Yeah. Well, history is important, but I think one of the problems with people today is like, there's so much information coming at you. That everybody has TikTok brain and young people in particular. Like it's, it's very difficult for them to get a sense of history when they're being inundated by very short attention span content all day long. They're just getting fed nonsense. So it's hard for them to actually read something or sit down and have the attention to get into something and really get fascinated by. Watch a good documentary on somebody or.

• 2:40:56Speaker 00

  Right.

• 2:40:56Joe Rogan?

  Or read a book on somebody. It's they, they're just checking their phone all the time. They're always checking their goddamn phone. They're addicted to these fucking things.

• 2:41:05Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 2:41:05Joe Rogan?

  And they can't have, and growing up that way, like you and I grew up without it. So you get to see it and how it's affecting the way people view the world and it's not good. It's not good. It's, it's, it's certainly not good for creating future versions of Ringo Starr's and John Lennon's. Because it's like, what do you have to say if you don't have any understanding of what's going on and what's ever gone on?

• 2:41:30Speaker 00

  And it's addictive, like you said earlier, because you know, I, I put these things down and yet I've got the fucking thing with me all the time. You know, and if, if I get out in the middle of, you know. The desert in California someplace and don't where the fuck I am. You know, I'm like trying to call home and shit, you know, whatever. But, uh, I mean, I lived most of my life without that. And, uh, having to see if you had any fucking change left because you had to call somebody at a payphone. Uh, we had a thing in LA called the Thomas Guide.

• 2:42:06Joe Rogan?

  I had that.

• 2:42:07Speaker 00

  You had the Thomas Guide where you had to look up shit and had all of LA County, San Bernardino County.

• 2:42:12Joe Rogan?

  Yep.

• 2:42:12Speaker 00

  All of it was in there.

• 2:42:13Joe Rogan?

  It's a book, big old book in your car.

• 2:42:15Speaker 00

  Big old book and you had to look on these maps which are confusing and shit. And, uh, if you took a GPS away now from people. Nobody would ever get to work on time. Nobody would find the fucking place they're supposed to have a meeting. Because you you also can't stop at a gas station anymore. I mean, you know, remember when you would didn't know where the fuck you were and you'd stop over at the uh, uh, uh, gas station and you'd go. Yeah, I I'm trying to get to sixteen twenty-five Wilson Street. Uh, you know, you know where that is? It's supposed to be by like the sawmill. Uh, you know, you'd some guy would go. Yeah, okay. Yeah, what you gonna want to do?

• 2:42:53Joe Rogan?

  People take pride in being able to give you directions.

• 2:42:55Speaker 00

  Right, absolutely.

• 2:42:56Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, it was a big thing. Like a guy who could give you directions to place, that's a cool guy.

• 2:43:02Speaker 00

  Yeah, absolutely.

• 2:43:03Joe Rogan?

  I'm gonna tell you how to get there. This is what you get. You get on the four oh five, we're gonna get on exit sixteen.

• 2:43:08Speaker 00

  Right. Yeah, they knew that shit.

• 2:43:10Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 2:43:11Speaker 00

  I mean, now, I mean, I know LA inside and out. I could be a cab driver there, but, uh. Or I should say Uber driver now, I guess, but, uh.

• 2:43:19Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, there's no cabs anymore.

• 2:43:20Speaker 00

  But one way or the other, uh, you know, i- if. If you're someplace else, I mean, I, you know, I use it too. It's like, uh, but if you took GPS away. It would run people batshit crazy.

• 2:43:33Joe Rogan?

  Yep, yeah. And if you took away the ability to just press someone's name on your phone to call them. If you had to remember their number.

• 2:43:42Speaker 00

  Oh, yeah.

• 2:43:42Joe Rogan?

  We had to remember numbers.

• 2:43:44Speaker 00

  I I still remember numbers.

• 2:43:47Joe Rogan?

  Well, you have a great memory.

• 2:43:48Speaker 00

  From my hometown.

• 2:43:50Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 2:43:50Speaker 00

  I still to this day, I rarely, in other words, I can take my phone and I can type in. The people that I call on a regular basis, I can type in their numbers. I know their numbers. But it is true that if, like, my wife, she'll she'll say, I don't have so and so in my contacts or whatever, you know, it'd be somebody we know really well. I'm like, learn the damn number. I told my our daughter, I said, look, when you're at college, you need to have my number in your head all the time and your mother's, you know?

• 2:44:26Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 2:44:27Speaker 00

  Know the numbers.

• 2:44:28Joe Rogan?

  Especially if you get arrested.

• 2:44:29Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 2:44:30Joe Rogan?

  You know?

• 2:44:31Speaker 00

  For sure.

• 2:44:31Joe Rogan?

  You gotta be a-

• 2:44:32Speaker 00

  You got one call, dude.

• 2:44:33Joe Rogan?

  Nobody knows how to do that anymore.

• 2:44:35Speaker 00

  I know, right?

• 2:44:35Joe Rogan?

  Like, who who've I got to call? I have fucking no idea. I know, like, three people's numbers. Yeah, it's um, it's a it's like being a an overweight person that's addicted to food because you have to eat to stay alive. So you're gonna have to do some of the thing you're addicted to, no matter what.

• 2:44:54Speaker 00

  Right.

• 2:44:54Joe Rogan?

  It's not like gambling. You're a gambling addict. Stay out of the casino. You're gonna be okay.

• 2:44:59Speaker 00

  Right.

• 2:44:59Joe Rogan?

  You know what I mean? But like, if you had to still go to the casino every day and gamble a little, but you're a gambling addict, that's a crazy fucking problem to have. And that's a problem that every young person has with their phone. They're all addicted to their phone.

• 2:45:13Speaker 00

  They're completely addicted.

• 2:45:14Joe Rogan?

  And, you know, all of us too. I'm addicted to my phone.

• 2:45:17Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 2:45:17Joe Rogan?

  And you're you're using it every day because you have to get places, you have to call people, you have to text, you have to check your email. So it's always there.

• 2:45:27Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 2:45:27Joe Rogan?

  And you just have to develop some sort of a relationship with it that's not crazy.

• 2:45:32Speaker 00

  Yeah, that's true. And and people, it it goes from-

• 2:45:38Speaker 00

  Mild addiction to severe addiction to internet creating uh uh this environment where people actually kill themselves.

• 2:45:49Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 2:45:51Speaker 00

  I mean, it's that big a spectrum, you know what I mean?

• 2:45:53Joe Rogan?

  Mm hmm.

• 2:45:54Speaker 00

  And uh, you know, people talk about getting canceled all the time on this stuff and it's like, how about if you don't give a shit? You know, if you do, I'm not on social media. I I don't deal with it. I mean, I, you know, the band has an Instagram, you know? But I don't run it, you know, they put pictures of me taking the garbage out. That's what, that's what, that's what people wanna see. They don't wanna see your picture on stage, you know? They wanna see that you're just this regular dude with your ass crack showing, taking the garbage down the hill to the thing.

• 2:46:28Joe Rogan?

  Normal shit, eating chicken fried steak.

• 2:46:30Speaker 00

  They love that.

• 2:46:31Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, normal shit, yeah. That's true. Well, they wanna know that you're fucking normal, like everybody.

• 2:46:37Speaker 00

  I'm subnormal.

• 2:46:39Joe Rogan?

  But there's also the problem where people are putting up stuff to make themselves look cool. Like, everybody's trying to look cool online.

• 2:46:46Speaker 00

  Oh, yeah.

• 2:46:46Joe Rogan?

  You know, it's just a, what a weird thing to try to do all the time.

• 2:46:50Speaker 00

  And they got Liquefy, that's one thing, where you can make yourself skinny.

• 2:46:54Joe Rogan?

  Oh, boy, that's a problem.

• 2:46:57Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 2:46:57Joe Rogan?

  That's a problem too with a lot of young ladies, cause they see that and then they think that that's attainable.

• 2:47:03Speaker 00

  Right, exactly.

• 2:47:04Joe Rogan?

  And then, what's wrong with me? I look normal. And you realize like, well, she looks normal too. She's got some crazy fucking program turning her into

• 2:47:12Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 2:47:12Joe Rogan?

  this bizarre form of human that doesn't exist in the wild.

• 2:47:16Speaker 00

  Absolutely, yeah.

• 2:47:17Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, it's, Jonathan Haidt wrote about that, where you see as the in the beginning of social media, you see automat- oh, oh, oh, almost instantly, rather, a giant amount of young ladies that experience self-harm, cutting, depression, suicidal ideation, actual suicide. It all ramps up at the same time that social media does. Cause you're comparing yourself to someone's life that's a very distorted version of reality.

• 2:47:44Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 2:47:45Joe Rogan?

  Distorted, like, rose-colored glasses, propaganda version of reality, that this person wants you to know how cool they are. Look at me, I'm with a girl in a bikini and I'm sitting on a Ferrari, the stack of hundreds, fuck you! We're like, wow! How am I not that guy? I'm just a loser. I should jump in front of a fucking train.

• 2:48:07Speaker 00

  And there's a face. You know, when you're, when you're feeding a baby, there's something, I guess it's from our, you know, it's in our DNA or something, but you feed a baby and you go, you open your mouth and they say that that probably came from you're showing the baby what to do.

• 2:48:23Joe Rogan?

  Right, right, right.

• 2:48:24Speaker 00

  But it's, it's, you know, somebody yawns, you yawn, right? And you feed the baby like this. There's a thing with these selfies that people take on the internet that they can't not go.

• 2:48:42Joe Rogan?

  Duck face, yeah.

• 2:48:44Speaker 00

  It's that face.

• 2:48:45Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 2:48:46Speaker 00

  You know?

• 2:48:47Joe Rogan?

  It's very bizarre. I did a bit about that in my act, about imagine seeing a photo from like the early nineteen hundreds where girls like this.

• 2:48:55Speaker 00

  Uh, right.

• 2:48:56Joe Rogan?

  Like, what is, she's a fucking time traveler. This is so strange. Like the invention of the selfie.

• 2:49:02Speaker 00

  Exactly.

• 2:49:03Joe Rogan?

  Uh, my daughters are on Snapchat and they snap each, they snap all their friends. So they, th- this is how they communicate. They rarely text. They just make Snapchats and they just have like in front of the camera.

• 2:49:16Speaker 00

  Right.

• 2:49:16Joe Rogan?

  And then they take a picture and like, oh my God, so bored.

• 2:49:19Speaker 00

  Right.

• 2:49:19Joe Rogan?

  You know, whatever, whatever it is. This is how they're communicating with each other through selfies.

• 2:49:23Speaker 00

  It is.

• 2:49:24Joe Rogan?

  Very weird.

• 2:49:26Speaker 00

  Yeah, every, everything is in snippets.

• 2:49:28Joe Rogan?

  Mm-hmm.

• 2:49:29Speaker 00

  And, and the fact that, you know, if you have a TV, uh, service that has, you know, eighteen hundred channels. Uh, and I find myself doing it. I sit at home, yeah, I got it on the, you know, Cincinnati, uh, you know, Pittsburgh game. Uh, I watch a few minutes and it's like, oh, okay, here. You know, it's, it's first down, they're on their eighteen, you know? Flip it over to the Chargers game, you know what I mean? And, and just go back and forth. And I, I grew up with three fucking channels, you know? And so you had to watch everything all the way through and.

• 2:50:10Speaker 00

  I'm convinced that that's the reason that trivia is easier for people that grew up with very little because you remember every fucking bit of it.

• 2:50:21Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 2:50:22Speaker 00

  Now, you're only, you're only, you've only got like a few seconds on each thing and it's like, I mean, now it's like you're watching, even if it's your team, something else happens and then somebody texts you, you start doing that, next thing you know, like, you know, I'm a Colts fan, you know, doing this and everything, and next thing you know, oh, the game was, oh, yeah, that's right, they're only three and a half minutes, I didn't see the end of the game.

• 2:50:45Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 2:50:46Speaker 00

  You know, and, or I changed it over to, you know, Rawhide on the old guy channel, or whatever, for a few minutes, you know what I mean?

• 2:50:55Joe Rogan?

  I, I was thinking about that once, about podcasts, that, that podcasts are one of the only times where I'm never distracted by anything but the conversation.

• 2:51:04Speaker 00

  Right.

• 2:51:05Joe Rogan?

  And I think it's one of the reasons why I like it so much.

• 2:51:07Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 2:51:07Joe Rogan?

  And the same thing is, uh, when I do commentary for the UFC, I'm talking about the fight, so I can't be looking at my phone, I'm not answering texts, I'm not like checking emails, I'm not looking at TikTok, I'm just locked in on what, what is happening for six hours.

• 2:51:23Speaker 00

  Oh, yeah.

• 2:51:24Joe Rogan?

  And so, those, if you could find a thing where you can have a break, escape from the clutches.

• 2:51:31Speaker 00

  Sure.

• 2:51:32Joe Rogan?

  Of all the information that's in the rest of the world coming at you, all, all the fucking bad news and all the guns and tits and everything that's coming at you from all over the world.

• 2:51:43Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 2:51:44Joe Rogan?

  It's, um, very beneficial.

• 2:51:45Speaker 00

  It's, it's awesome. And I love the fact that your show has, it's, you sit for a few hours.

• 2:51:52Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 2:51:53Speaker 00

  I mean, when do you get a chance to do this? I mean, and that's, you know, I came late to podcasts, but I remember doing, uh,

• 2:52:03Speaker 00

  God, I can't remember who, I did Norm MacDonald's podcast. And I did, one other guy did his podcast. And then, those were the first ones I did. Kevin Pollak, I did Kevin's. I didn't even know what it meant at the time. And since then, you know, I've done a few, but I like them too. It's literally like, the only place you are where the interviewer doesn't check their fucking phone.

• 2:52:32Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 2:52:33Speaker 00

  I mean, I, literally, I do interviews with people. Who, while I'm answering what they just asked me, they text somebody back, or look at it for a second.

• 2:52:43Joe Rogan?

  That's ridiculous.

• 2:52:44Speaker 00

  And it's like, hang on a second. It's like, how important is this to you? That, that, that it's more important to let Mitzi know that you'd rather have spaghetti tonight? You know?

• 2:52:54Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 2:52:54Speaker 00

  I'm like, fucking hell.

• 2:52:55Joe Rogan?

  Well, it's also, you're completely breaking whatever bond that you have in the conversation. It's not, it's, it's two people exchanging information, talking to each other. And you have to look at each other in the eye, you gotta field with this person. It's a dance. And if you stop in the middle of the dance.

• 2:53:13Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 2:53:13Joe Rogan?

  Like, if you were on a date with someone, you're telling them some crazy story, and it's really important to you. And they're just like, yeah, wow.

• 2:53:21Speaker 00

  Well, that's good for your ego, right?

• 2:53:23Joe Rogan?

  This is over. This is, there's no sense in continuing any further with this relationship.

• 2:53:27Speaker 00

  Right?

• 2:53:28Joe Rogan?

  You know?

• 2:53:29Speaker 00

  It's like, honey, were you serious when you said you love me more than anyone? Hang on a second, hang on a second.

• 2:53:35Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, hold on.

• 2:53:37Speaker 00

  Yeah, what were you saying? Oh, yeah, oh, absolutely, I love you more than anybody I ever loved.

• 2:53:41Joe Rogan?

  I just barely love anybody.

• 2:53:43Speaker 00

  Yeah, right.

• 2:53:44Joe Rogan?

  And I'm kind of mildly interested in everybody. And that's sort of what's happening today.

• 2:53:49Speaker 00

  Right, I know.

• 2:53:50Joe Rogan?

  We're mildly interested in everybody, and we love almost nobody.

• 2:53:54Speaker 00

  Right.

• 2:53:54Joe Rogan?

  Yeah. It's weird.

• 2:53:56Speaker 00

  That is weird.

• 2:53:57Joe Rogan?

  It's a, it's a weird time. But, um, the only way we're gonna get through it, that where, that makes any sense is, you gotta say things like that. We have to figure out how to navigate it. It's new. You know, just like, I was saying that when you were a movie star, the first time you became a movie star through Sling Blade. That's a new experience, just period, in human civilization. Becoming a movie star is very recent.

• 2:54:23Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 2:54:24Joe Rogan?

  It's hard, and this is, this- Thing of everything being online, this thing of everybody having access to all this fucking information coming at you. All this media, all this, all these opinions and all this stuff to watch and car accidents and animal attacks and.

• 2:54:43Joe Rogan?

  This is new. This is a completely, so. Almost like the shit that you had to go through when you became famous through Sling Blade. The whole world's gotta go through this new type of thing with phones.

• 2:54:56Speaker 00

  That's true.

• 2:54:57Joe Rogan?

  And with social media and with the internet in general and we're not ready for, we don't know what, we don't know how to do it yet. And people are giving classes on how to manage it and there's apps that can limit your time on certain things, you can cut yourself off.

• 2:55:10Speaker 00

  Right.

• 2:55:10Joe Rogan?

  We don't know what we're doing. This is fucking new as shit. And just like fame, a lot of people are gonna get wrecked by it.

• 2:55:18Speaker 00

  Yes. Totally.

• 2:55:21Joe Rogan?

  It's, it's a completely alien way of being. Like a person that becomes especially, I was, I'm friends with Ricky Schroder, known Ricky for like twenty-five, thirty years. And.

• 2:55:34Joe Rogan?

  There is no way anybody becomes famous at like six and makes it out okay.

• 2:55:41Speaker 00

  Right.

• 2:55:41Joe Rogan?

  It's not possible.

• 2:55:42Speaker 00

  Right.

• 2:55:43Joe Rogan?

  Like I, the way I, I liken it to making cement, but you don't put enough water in, like you, so it's always gonna be fucked.

• 2:55:52Speaker 00

  Sure.

• 2:55:52Joe Rogan?

  There's a part that's never a nor, you had a normal life and then, or semi-normal, whatever, whatever normal means.

• 2:56:00Speaker 00

  Wasn't normal, but I wasn't a movie star.

• 2:56:01Joe Rogan?

  You weren't famous and then became famous, but if you're famous from the time you're a fucking baby. And your whole life, you're in the public eye, growing up, that's insane.

• 2:56:13Speaker 00

  It is insane.

• 2:56:14Joe Rogan?

  Whether it's Miley Cyrus or you know, you look at poor Britney Spears losing her fucking marbles.

• 2:56:19Speaker 00

  All that stuff.

• 2:56:19Joe Rogan?

  What do you expect? Nobody gets through that, okay?

• 2:56:23Speaker 00

  What happened to those, remember the kids that did that show, was it uh different strokes?

• 2:56:28Joe Rogan?

  Mm-hmm.

• 2:56:28Speaker 00

  And like a couple of them.

• 2:56:30Joe Rogan?

  Yep.

• 2:56:30Speaker 00

  Like one girl, she, you know, robbed a liquor store or something and then became a dope addict and a hooker and then, you know, dies young. Uh, and one of the guys on there also, you know, I think he got, got on drugs and then eventually died. Some of them kill themselves, it's, I'm, I'm really happy that my success, in terms of being famous anyway.

• 2:56:57Speaker 00

  Came at a later age. Uh, I, I actually really relish that, you know, that I did not become famous when I was nineteen.

• 2:57:09Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 2:57:09Speaker 00

  Or sixteen, or whatever it was. Cause at that point, with my state of mind in those days and just, just doing everything I wanted, you know, I would have been dead by now.

• 2:57:24Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 2:57:24Speaker 00

  There's no doubt about it. I would have never made it to thirty.

• 2:57:28Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, and if you did, you'd have so much regret.

• 2:57:30Speaker 00

  Oh, yeah.

• 2:57:31Joe Rogan?

  What did I do? The fuck did I do?

• 2:57:33Speaker 00

  Yeah, exactly.

• 2:57:34Joe Rogan?

  Why did I do that?

• 2:57:35Speaker 00

  Oh, yeah.

• 2:57:35Joe Rogan?

  Cause you lost your mind.

• 2:57:36Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 2:57:37Joe Rogan?

  Cause you're famous at eight years old.

• 2:57:39Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 2:57:40Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 2:57:40Speaker 00

  If you've, you know, I, I, it's kind of an old guy thing to say, but, uh, you know, everything I got, I earned it. And I'm glad I did. You know, I'm glad I didn't have a hell of a lot of help along the way that I just persevered and did this stuff. But I think that knowing what work is before you get famous, really helps you out in your life. I mean, you know, I worked at a sawmill, a machine shop, I hauled heavy equipment, hauled hay when I was thirteen. You know, I did all that shit. And, I mean, stuff that, looking back on it, it's like, I don't even know how I did it half the time. I worked as a carpenter's helper.

• 2:58:20Speaker 00

  And, uh, so I, if I hadn't done all that stuff, if all I had known was the entertainment business, I think that would drive any fucking body crazy, you know? I don't think I would have made it through that. If, you know, like, looking at the, the real world out there from a place where you never experienced the real world.

• 2:58:46Joe Rogan?

  Right, right.

• 2:58:47Speaker 00

  Like you're talking about Ricky and all that stuff. It's like, if your only experience has been people getting your fucking juice box for you.

• 2:58:56Speaker 00

  You know, or whatever it is.

• 2:58:58Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 2:58:59Speaker 00

  Then, and you get used to that shit, too. I'm telling you, these days, my wife thinks I, I'm the most helpless son of a bitch in the world. And in some ways I am. I mean, I get into an airport and I'm, I used to go to fucking airports before I was famous. I knew where to go. I knew where to put my shit, you know? Now, I'll go in there and I look like I'm, it's like Logan's Run. I look, I, you know, I get out and I'm looking like, where the fuck are we now? You know? And I'll ask, you know, my assistant or publicist or somebody, I'm like, well, can I take this bag on there? Or is this one, where's the thing we go through? Do I need to do this? Do I need to do that? You know? And it's like, I know fucking well what I have to do.

• 2:59:43Joe Rogan?

  But you're used to people doing things for you.

• 2:59:45Speaker 00

  You get used to it.

• 2:59:46Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 2:59:47Speaker 00

  I mean, you get used to somebody driving you someplace. I'm a driver. I grew up, I raced fucking cars. I'm a muscle car guy. Now, we go someplace, I ask my wife to drive. It's like, well, no, maybe it's because I'm old, maybe because when I walk up and downstairs now, it's a psychological thing. Physically, I'm very fit. I mean, I can do shit, whatever I want to. If I gotta run and I'm singing or whatever, I'm fine. Something psychological happens to you when you get like sixty-eight or sixty-nine. And Tom Mayhew, our tour manager for the band, he and I were talking about it. We were talking about how now when we get in a shower, you know, like we're in a hotel

• 3:00:30Speaker 00

  and you get in a shower, you grab the fucking handicap rail and you go really slow. I don't have to, but I do because something up here tells me, here's my age now. If I fall, I'll be dead in six weeks. Cause I'll break my hip and then I'll get pneumonia and I'm done. And I'm like, I don't, I feel nineteen. But for some reason, going downstairs now, I don't just hop down the stairs anymore. I take it one stair at a time, you know? It's not real. And it's not real that I don't know how to get around a fucking airport. None of that shit's real. And yet, something happened to me.

• 3:01:14Speaker 00

  Where I think now, I'm just this helpless fucking old man who, you know, is gonna have to have my caretaker fucking, you know, get me to the gig. You know, and then I go onstage and I'm just like, you know, it's like, wait a fucking minute. You know, walking up the steps to the stage, I'm just like, you know, and I get up there and fucking go out to the edge of the stage and slap hands and shit. If I fell off that fucking thing, it'd kill me instantly, but I do it. So, none of that shit's real.

• 3:01:42Joe Rogan?

  It's weird.

• 3:01:43Speaker 00

  Right?

• 3:01:44Joe Rogan?

  Well, it's weird when people defy it, right?

• 3:01:46Speaker 00

  No.

• 3:01:47Joe Rogan?

  Like, uh, I saw the Rolling Stones when they came to Austin a couple of years ago at Coda. So, it's like a hundred thousand people or something out there. It was nuts. And I swear to God, it was like an out of body experience, cause you can't believe you're actually seeing Mick Jagger.

• 3:01:58Speaker 00

  Right.

• 3:01:59Joe Rogan?

  You're like, that's him? That's really him. He's really up there, but he's fucking, he's a thousand years old.

• 3:02:05Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 3:02:05Joe Rogan?

  Bun your lip, baby. He's dancing and moving around. He's got two fucking trailers, two trailers that he brings with him everywhere he goes. It's just workout equipment.

• 3:02:15Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 3:02:16Joe Rogan?

  That motherfucker gets after it every day, they say.

• 3:02:18Speaker 00

  Absolutely.

• 3:02:19Joe Rogan?

  He was like, this is the only way. If you don't do that, it'll fall apart and then you got nothing.

• 3:02:23Speaker 00

  For sure.

• 3:02:24Joe Rogan?

  But he's out there like he's thirty years old.

• 3:02:27Speaker 00

  Oh, yeah.

• 3:02:27Joe Rogan?

  It's nuts. It's really amazing to watch.

• 3:02:30Speaker 00

  I mean, like I said, we just opened for the Who.

• 3:02:33Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, right?

• 3:02:33Speaker 00

  And Roger and Pete are, you know, they're eighty, eighty-one, whatever.

• 3:02:38Joe Rogan?

  Crazy.

• 3:02:39Speaker 00

  You know, and, uh, they're the fucking Who, still up there singing their ass off, playing their ass off, you know?

• 3:02:46Joe Rogan?

  That's another new thing. Like, when we were kids, there was no old rock stars.

• 3:02:50Speaker 00

  No.

• 3:02:52Joe Rogan?

  They all died.

• 3:02:52Speaker 00

  Most of them were dead by twenty-nine.

• 3:02:54Joe Rogan?

  Right, twenty-seven.

• 3:02:55Speaker 00

  Twenty-seven, twenty-seven was the year.

• 3:02:57Joe Rogan?

  Jim Morrison, Janis Joplin, they all died at like twenty-seven.

• 3:03:02Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 3:03:04Joe Rogan?

  Yeah. Wow. Kurt Cobain?

• 3:03:06Speaker 00

  Oh, yeah.

• 3:03:07Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, they all died young. So, when we were kids, there was no touring bands that were like seventy years old out there on the road.

• 3:03:12Speaker 00

  Fuck, no.

• 3:03:13Joe Rogan?

  Killing it.

• 3:03:14Speaker 00

  And we're more popular than we've ever been.

• 3:03:16Joe Rogan?

  Ah.

• 3:03:16Speaker 00

  You know, and so.

• 3:03:19Joe Rogan?

  It's all bullshit.

• 3:03:19Speaker 00

  It's all, it's.

• 3:03:20Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, it's all in your head.

• 3:03:21Speaker 00

  It's all in your head.

• 3:03:22Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 3:03:23Speaker 00

  But, you know, and not only were they're not rock stars when we were growing up, that were even many over forty.

• 3:03:31Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 3:03:31Speaker 00

  Uh, aside from the ones who died.

• 3:03:36Speaker 00

  Age has changed a little bit. I mean, like, you know, if you look at my dad's high school yearbook, these motherfuckers, when they were seventeen, they looked like they were fifty-five.

• 3:03:46Joe Rogan?

  Hard living.

• 3:03:49Speaker 00

  Yeah. And like a man in those days, my dad died at forty-four years of age. I thought he was an old man, you know? And when I think of forty-four now, it's like, are you shitting me? That's like babies. But fifty and sixty and seventy meant something different.

• 3:04:10Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 3:04:10Speaker 00

  When I was growing up. Now seventy is kind of like, I mean, you know, a guy like Sam or Dival, they look at me and I'm still like a kid to them and shit, you know?

• 3:04:18Joe Rogan?

  That's crazy.

• 3:04:19Speaker 00

  And seventy-year-olds, and you know, I think it's, a lot of it is, you know, I eat real healthy and I actually had a holistic doctor tell me that, because I'm allergic to a lot of shit. It's not like I got something against eating cows. I'd love to, but I have type AB negative blood, means you don't have many digestive enzymes, and so I just get fucking, you know, indigestion and get all fucked up and bloated. I just grew up, because I ate everything growing up. I mean, shit in Arkansas and Texas. And I just grew up thinking that, that when you eat, you feel like shit. I just thought that's the way it was. I thought, you know, this thing's overrated. Fuck, I feel like hell, you know?

• 3:05:02Speaker 00

  But now I eat really healthy and I eat fish and turkey and, you know, vegetables and fruit and beans and rice and stuff.

• 3:05:08Joe Rogan?

  So it's a red meat issue with you?

• 3:05:10Speaker 00

  Yeah, I can't have beef or pork. So I can have turkey and fish. They digest easier. But, but I think, you know, people are, and especially if you're in the entertainment business, you kind of keep a younger mind and also eating healthy. But this holistic doctor I was talking about, I was talking about the, and this is really unpopular to say, but

• 3:05:41Speaker 00

  Not my words, I was actually told this and I was saying, look, you know, I don't smoke a pack of cigarettes a day. I, I smoke probably three quarters of a pack, you know, unless, you know, we're on the road and I'm on the bus with the guys, you know, and I smoke like an old Buick sometimes, but, um, you know, I drink light beer, I don't drink hard alcohol, stuff like this. And this holistic doctor said, you know, stress is one of the worst things in the world for you. If smoking a few cigarettes a day with, that don't have chemicals in them and you're drinking light beer, which like I said in Landman, you know, has, has less alcohol than fucking orange juice, you know?

• 3:06:21Speaker 00

  Uh, you have a few of those day, a day and, and have a few smokes and if, if that alleviates your stress, especially me being high anxiety, he says probably healthier for you to just keep doing that.

• 3:06:34Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, they say that's one of the worst things ever. Rate, you're rising cortisol, stress, anxiety, it wears on your nerves, your nervous system.

• 3:06:44Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 3:06:44Joe Rogan?

  And then loneliness. They say loneliness is worse than smoking.

• 3:06:49Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 3:06:49Joe Rogan?

  For your overall health. If you smoked a pack and a half a day, you'd be way better off just doing that than being lonely.

• 3:06:56Speaker 00

  Look how many spouses die a few months after, uh, their, their husband or wife died.

• 3:07:03Joe Rogan?

  My grandfather, that's what happened when his wife died. When my grandmother died, he, he died like within a year, he was gone. He was fine before that. You know, he was actually her caretaker, he was taking care of her. And then when she's gone, he was dead in the air.

• 3:07:16Speaker 00

  Yeah, happens all the time.

• 3:07:17Joe Rogan?

  Died of grief. Yeah.

• 3:07:19Speaker 00

  Yeah. Yeah, that, that old saying, you could die for a broken heart, I believe it.

• 3:07:22Joe Rogan?

  That's real. That's real. Sadness. And also it's like, why am I still here? She's gone, I'm ninety, like what is this? What are we doing here?

• 3:07:32Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 3:07:33Joe Rogan?

  You know, let's, let's call it a quit.

• 3:07:37Joe Rogan?

  Call it a show.

• 3:07:39Joe Rogan?

  Listen, man, we just did three hours, so. Cool. I think. This is awesome. That was a lot of fun. I really appreciate you. Oh, anytime, man. Thank you for doing this. I mean, I hope I didn't fuck anything up. No, it was great, man. It was great. It was awesome. I love your show. I love everything you've done, man. So it was a pleasure. What's a pleasure to be here. Thank you very much. Hi, man. All right. Bye, everybody.

• 3:07:57Speaker 02

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