Jocko Underground: How Can You Say "GOOD..." When Real Tragedy Strikes?

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Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Jocko Willink?

  This is the Jocko Underground Podcast, number 140, sitting here with Echo Charles, and we have some questions to answer from the people.

• 0:08Speaker 01

  Yeah, good advice, by the way, for the people. These are good questions on this one.

• 0:12Jocko Willink?

  Yeah.

• 0:14Speaker 01

  Alright, so good. Going to the first question is, "So, I'm a Marine, and well over 20 years of federal law enforcement, and both of my sons are Marines.

• 0:21Jocko Willink?

  Er.

• 0:23Speaker 01

  Both amazing, good men with excellent character. We share some of the same reads, as well as push each other, uh, push each other on the fitness journeys. So, good comes up. It's like that word makes you laugh while applying it, but inside it resonates with you. My younger son, 20 years old, active duty, recently came back from Norway, Arctic weather training. Had a cough, was a little tired and losing weight. He was immediately told he has cancer. Within three weeks, he was transferred to Walter Reed and diagnosed with advanced stage three, classic Hodgkin's lymphoma. The treatment won't be easy, but they say it's still curable. The kid has been a beast, but he is down 45 pounds and starts

• 1:04Speaker 01

  chemo in five days. For the last couple of weeks, we've just looked at each other and said, 'Good.' Yesterday, we sat down with the doctors and got the full diagnosis. The treatment strategy, I mean, all the good, the ugly, all on the table. It was just, uh, it was a tough day. Uh, my fucking kids still found the time to reflect on how everyone has something going on in their life. Some worse, some not so bad, but it's their fight. This is just his. We didn't say good yesterday, but we need to, moving forward. So, can you help me finish this line? You were diagnosed with Hodgkin's lymphoma, advanced stage three. Good." Dot, dot, dot.

• 1:49Jocko Willink?

  Yeah, that's rough, obviously.

• 1:55Jocko Willink?

  Uh, that being said, good, you're still here. Right? Like, you're still here. What could have happened in, what could have happened in Norway? You're doing Arctic weather training, you're flying a helicopter, it goes down, everyone dies.

• 2:09Jocko Willink?

  That happens, but that didn't happen. You're still here. Oh, by the way, good, it's curable.

• 2:16Jocko Willink?

  It's curable. How many people get that? That diagnosis for whatever disease they've got, and it's not curable?

• 2:28Jocko Willink?

  So, good, yours is curable. Oh, by the way, good, you can return to full health.

• 2:34Jocko Willink?

  Right? You can get back to where you are right now, or where you were. You can get back there. So that's awesome. That's good. Oh, by the way, good. You get more years of life.

• 2:47Jocko Willink?

  Because there's some people, whatever happens to them, their life's over.

• 2:52Jocko Willink?

  Whether they get in an accident, whether they get in a helo crash, whether they get in a car accident, whether they get a disease that rapidly deteriorates, and they don't get years to live. Maybe they get seconds, maybe they get minutes, maybe they get hours, maybe they get weeks. But you've got years.

• 3:08Jocko Willink?

  So that's good. Oh, by the way, good, you get to maintain your, your mental faculties. Right? You're, you've got, you can carry on conversation still.

• 3:19Jocko Willink?

  You can still think through processes, you can still strategize. Some people get in either diseases or accidents where they lose their, their mental faculties.

• 3:32Jocko Willink?

  Well, that didn't happen to you. Good.

• 3:37Jocko Willink?

  By the way, you get to keep your memories too, of your life, which is awesome.

• 3:42Jocko Willink?

  And by the way, good. You got this instead of someone in your family who's weaker and might not be able to handle it.

• 3:50Jocko Willink?

  Right? What, what trade got made?

• 3:54Jocko Willink?

  Is there some nephew or cousin or parent in the family unit? Or in the extended family?

• 4:04Jocko Willink?

  That, that this would devastate them? Yeah.

• 4:08Jocko Willink?

  But you got it. Good.

• 4:12Jocko Willink?

  And I can tell from this note, three Marines in the family, Semper Fi. I can tell the family unit here is strong and good. This family can push through it better than most. We can support each other. Good.

• 4:29Jocko Willink?

  And by the way, you get to watch the sunset tonight and you get to watch the sunset tomorrow. And you get to appreciate those things even more. Good.

• 4:41Jocko Willink?

  Oh, and by the way, you lost 45 pounds. Good. You get to do a full bulking phase. Steak, pizza, burgers, fries, milkshakes.

• 4:56Jocko Willink?

  Put back on 45 pounds. Good. Let's go.

• 5:03Jocko Willink?

  And when you wrap up that bulking phase.

• 5:07Jocko Willink?

  Good. You are now going to value your health more than ever. You are going to cherish physical fitness more than ever. Good.

• 5:22Jocko Willink?

  So you are diagnosed with Hodgkin's lymphoma advanced stage three. Good. I get to live.

• 5:33Jocko Willink?

  And I will not waste a second of this life.

• 5:40Jocko Willink?

  So. Definitely sorry you hear about this. Thanks for the service of you and your boys in the Marine Corps.

• 5:50Jocko Willink?

  Stay strong. Fight on.

• 5:53Jocko Willink?

  Semper Fi, do or die.

• 5:57Jocko Willink?

  Keep getting after it. That's what I got, man.

• 6:03Speaker 01

  Next question. I'm a junior officer in the Canadian Armed Forces and I'm looking for advice on something that I'm observing in my unit. Many of our journeymen level workers, corporals, are not interested in getting promoted and taking on leadership roles within the unit, despite the fact that they demonstrate potential to be exceptional leaders. This happens so often that we even have a name for it known as the "corporal for life", and in the Marine Corps, "the Terminal Lance". These junior ranks members are often extremely skilled at their jobs and they really enjoy the specialized work that they do. They know that if they get promoted and take on leadership roles, they will spend less

• 6:47Speaker 01

  time actually doing the work that they enjoy and more time managing people and doing other administrative tasks. The problem is if none of my best performing corporals are interested in being promoted, we will have to promote less experienced and less capable workers into those leadership positions because they might be the only ones who are willing to take on the administrative duties and trade the doing for leading. As our platoon commander, how can I take extreme ownership of this problem and help motivate my high performing corporals to accept promotions and to start the transition from doer to leader? Thanks for your help.

• 7:25Jocko Willink?

  Yeah, good question. There are definitely some things that you can do to try and help them. Number one, well, thanks for your service, but number two, let's make sure that they understand that leadership is a skill, just like any other job. And they think that whatever their job, it could be anybody, right? They could have any kind of job. They could be infantrymen, they could be in the motor pool, they could be cooks, there's any job that you could have inside the military. And they think that getting good at their skill and that particular thing is how they do their job well. And at some point, you've got to make them realize that leadership is a skill.

• 8:01Jocko Willink?

  You've also got to help them see that being a good professional soldier of any kind includes being a leader. It doesn't, if you're in the military, it doesn't matter where you are. It doesn't matter what your job is. Part of that job is being a leader. That's part of the job. Doesn't matter if you're the lowest ranking person. Part of your job is being a leader. And the, the more you progress, the more important leadership becomes, but even at the lowest level, if you're the person that works on the engine in the motor pool, what works on the engines of the vehicles in the motor pool, you're the lowest ranking guy at the unit.

• 8:41Jocko Willink?

  That is a little excerpt of what we are doing on the Jocko Underground Podcast. So if you want to continue to listen, go to jockounderground.com and subscribe and we're doing this to mitigate our reliance on external platforms. So we are not subject to their control and we are doing this so that we can support the Jocko Podcast, which will remain as is, free for all, as long as we can keep it that way. But we are doing this so we don't have to be under the control of sponsors and we're doing it so we can give you more control, more interaction, more direct connections, better communications with us. And to do that, we are, we're building a website

• 9:23Jocko Willink?

  right now where we'll be able to utilize to strengthen this legion of troopers that are in the game with us. So thank you. It's jockounderground.com. It costs $8.18 a month. And if you can't afford to support us, we can still support you. Just email [email protected] and we'll get you taken care of. Until then, we will see you mobilized underground.