S2E51: Willow Smith on Creativity, Consciousness, and Music | Talk Tracks

Grammy-nominated artist Willow Smith joins Ky Dickens for a deeply personal conversation about music as medicine, dreams as creative portals, spirituality, and the mystery of human connection. Willow shares how a lifetime of curiosity - from sacred traditions and nature to science and consciousness - has shaped her creative life. She reflects on music as a devotional and communal practice, the role of intuition in her songwriting, and the profound experiences that have expanded her sense of what may be possible. She also discusses “Talk On The Hill,” her beautiful song from her newest album The Thread, inspired by the non-speakers of The Telepathy Tapes and the extraordinary possibilities of communication beyond words. _______ Join The Telepathy Tapes Backstage Pass https://thetelepathytapes.supercast.com/ to get ad-free episodes, never-before-heard interviews, behind-the-scenes documentary footage, and access to our private Discord community. This is your invitation to come closer. To help shape what’s next. To be more than a listener… to be a co-creator of this paradigm shift. So if you’ve felt moved, if you’ve felt seen, if you’ve felt the call, subscribe today and join us: thetelepathytapes.com. https://thetelepathytapes.com/ _______ Thank you to our sponsors! Alloy http://myalloy.com/ - Try the original estrogen-powered M4 skincare from Alloy. Visit myalloy.com http://myalloy.com/ and use code TAPES for $20 off your first order! One Skin https://www.oneskin.co/TAPES - Get 15% off OneSkin with the code TAPES at https://www.oneskin.co/TAPES #oneskinpod. Fabletics http://fabletics.com/tapes - Shop now at Fabletics.com/tapes http://fabletics.com/tapes to get 70- 80% off everything when you sign up as a new VIP. Ka'Chava https://kachava.com/ - Go to kachava.com https://kachava.com/ and use code TAPES for 15% off your first order. Shopify http://shopify.com/tapes - Start your business today with the industry’s best business partner, Shopify. Sign up for your free trial at Shopify.com/tapes http://shopify.com/tapes. BiOptimizers https://bioptimizers.com/tapes - Make this the year you finally get your sleep, your energy, and yourself back. Get 15% off at bioptimizers.com/tapes https://bioptimizers.com/tapes when you use my code, TAPES. Monarch https://www.monarch.com/ - Use code TAPES at Monarch dot com to get your first year of Monarch Core half off at just $50. Progressive http://progressive.com/- Insurance isn't one-size-fits-all. Visit Progressive.com http://progressive.com/ and find a rate that works for you with the Name Your Price® tool. Honeylove https://www.honeylove.com/?utm_medium=Podcast&utm_source=Podscale&utm_campaign=PR&utm_creative=TelepathyTapes&amount=20percent Treat yourself to the most advanced bras and shapewear on the market. Save 20% off Honeylove at honeylove.com/TAPES. https://www.honeylove.com/?utm_medium=Podcast&utm_source=Podscale&utm_campaign=PR&utm_creative=TelepathyTapes&amount=20percentSee Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

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• 1:34Ky Dickens?

  Hi, everyone. I'm Kai Dickens, and welcome to The Talk Tracks, brought to you weekly by TTT Media. In this series, we explore the threads that weave together our understanding of reality, science, spirituality, consciousness, and even unexplained phenomena. Because every era has ideas once dismissed as impossible until someone was willing to investigate them seriously. And on this show, we do just that.

• 1:59Ky Dickens?

  Today, we're joined by Willow Smith, a Grammy, Emmy, and MTV Award-nominated artist who's released nine studio albums and continually evolves her sound and pushes the boundaries of her creativity. Throughout her career, she's spoken openly about spirituality and consciousness and the ways that those explorations have shaped her artistic expression. And we'll talk about one very special piece of that creative journey that has a direct connection to us. Willow has recently released a song called "The Talk on the Hill" for her newest album, The Thread. It's inspired by the non-speakers featured in the telepathy tapes, and it's an incredible song. I personally love how deeply curious Willow is. She's incredibly well-read and approaches questions about reality and purpose

• 2:43Ky Dickens?

  with the humility of someone who is genuinely searching for meaning rather than claiming to have all the answers. And I personally think that is the magic ingredient to her work and to her life. So Willow, welcome to The Talk Tracks. I'm so excited to talk to you about all of this and to finally have you on this couch.

• 3:00Speaker 02

  Thank you. I'm honored to be here.

• 3:02Ky Dickens?

  So Willow, I think of you as an artist and a musician, but I'd love for you to go ahead and introduce yourself.

• 3:07Speaker 02

  Okay, well, I'm Willow. I am a musician and just lover of all things odd and heartfelt and thoughtful. I'm quite an avid dreamer as well. So like, I've had dreams that I am in a place, and then it's almost like a déjà vu kind of situation to where later on in my life, I'm looking around and I'm like, wait, like, I've seen this before.

• 3:39Ky Dickens?

  Wow.

• 3:39Speaker 02

  This is very interesting. Or in a dream, hearing a melody, and then waking up and need to like voice memo the melody, or whatever that may be. I think in my dreams is where I can really travel and see things

• 3:57Speaker 02

  that I wouldn't see in the physical realm.

• 3:59Ky Dickens?

  That's cool. Like what?

• 4:01Speaker 02

  Like, sometimes I'll dream about, like, a couple months ago,

• 4:08Speaker 02

  and I wouldn't necessarily call it a dream, but when I was unconscious, I, this story, because I'm also a writer, so it was like this story came to me about a mother, and I called my mom as soon as I woke up and like explained to her this whole scenario. And then later on in that day, I found out that my friend's mom was sick.

• 4:34Ky Dickens?

  And that was all in your dream?

• 4:35Speaker 02

  Yes. And I was seeing it as a novel. Like, I was seeing it as like, I mean, not that it would be this good, but if I wrote it. But I was seeing it as almost like an Anna Karenina kind of like-esque feel of a novel.

• 4:50Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 4:51Speaker 02

  And I was telling my mom all of this, just thinking it was like a creative idea.

• 4:55Ky Dickens?

  Wow.

• 4:56Speaker 02

  And I was like, hmm.

• 4:59Speaker 02

  I was like, whoa, okay.

• 5:00Ky Dickens?

  So that was like really precognitive.

• 5:02Speaker 02

  Yeah. I didn't say anything because I'm like, I'm not gonna make this moment about me. Like, obviously, I need to be here for you and like, you know, be present with this.

• 5:10Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 5:11Speaker 02

  But that was, that happened recently.

• 5:13Ky Dickens?

  Wow.

• 5:14Speaker 02

  And that was very, just moving. And the fact that I saw it as a creative endeavor and not necessarily, like, I didn't see it as a vision. I didn't see it as like, I just saw it as an idea.

• 5:27Ky Dickens?

  That's interesting.

• 5:29Speaker 02

  And so I feel like in that creative space, we can channel certain things that we may not be aware of.

• 5:36Ky Dickens?

  Totally.

• 5:36Speaker 02

  And me tapping into my friend's like energy field, like, something to do with like, me being so tapped into their energy.

• 5:46Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 5:46Speaker 02

  You know what I mean?

• 5:47Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 5:47Speaker 02

  I was reading this book where they were talking about in certain Native American communities, their, like, dreams are so important that like, if you don't tell someone that they were in your dream, it's seen as like, oh my gosh, like, no. Like, you have to tell someone that you were in their dream, or that you have to tell someone that they were in your dream.

• 6:08Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 6:10Speaker 02

  Because that can have like huge implications for their future, and like, they need to know. Like, very interesting, like, yeah, very interesting stuff like that.

• 6:19Ky Dickens?

  Have you had any other, like, kind of experiences with the non-physical world or something you couldn't explain that have really impacted you?

• 6:25Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 6:28Speaker 02

  I don't really like to talk about it a lot, but I've had a good amount of experiences with indigenous plant medicine ceremonies.

• 6:39Ky Dickens?

  Cool. Okay.

• 6:40Speaker 02

  I feel weird talking about it on platforms like this, but all I'll say is that going back to the knowledge that these deep cultures have to offer, that, you know, knowledge of the land, knowledge of mutual aid, community systems, and these ceremonies that they have been using to strengthen that community bond for thousands of years. I think that they have been practicing for a long time deep embodied levels of telepathy.

• 7:20Ky Dickens?

  For sure.

• 7:20Speaker 02

  Through their cultural music and through the way that they prepare these plants.

• 7:26Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 7:27Speaker 02

  And I've had the beautiful opportunity to experience this a number of times with my family and some extended family.

• 7:36Ky Dickens?

  I would love to know what, like, you walked away from after the experience that you didn't have before in terms of like knowledge or connection. And when you started talking about it, I thought about, so in season two, we interviewed the chief of the Kuntunawa Nation.

• 7:49Speaker 02

  Wow.

• 7:50Ky Dickens?

  And what was really interesting, I'll never forget, he said, "Our technology is better than your internet."

• 7:55Speaker 02

  Yep.

• 7:56Ky Dickens?

  And he's like, "Because not only can we connect with each other"

• 8:00Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 8:00Ky Dickens?

  "and animals, but we can connect with the other side and with nature and the whole forest." He's like, "Your internet can't do that."

• 8:06Speaker 02

  Oh, no.

• 8:06Ky Dickens?

  And I was like, "That is the best." And he was talking about telepathy and the connection, or, you know, what are these psi abilities?

• 8:14Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 8:14Ky Dickens?

  But grounded in the rituals of a lot of these like historically healing,

• 8:20Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 8:20Ky Dickens?

  really transformative plants.

• 8:22Speaker 02

  100%.

• 8:23Ky Dickens?

  So, I mean, people I know are really profoundly changed. And so I'd love to know, like, what, you don't have to go into the depth of what you experienced, but how you transformed?

• 8:34Speaker 02

  Like, looking into your mother's eyes and being able to feel what she's feeling. And not even just in the moment, but being able to feel, looking into your brother's eyes, looking into your father's eyes, being able to, without words, contact a memory of their inner child.

• 8:58Ky Dickens?

  That's cool.

• 9:00Speaker 02

  And to be able to share in that, in silence.

• 9:07Speaker 02

  And it's very,

• 9:10Speaker 02

  I feel like the human animal...

• 9:15Speaker 02

  Like, we don't have claws, we don't have, um, we can't run that fast, you know what I mean? Like, we're, like, we're very fragile.

• 9:24Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 9:24Speaker 02

  Um, when you're thinking about it, us contrast against other animals who are a bit more durable physically.

• 9:31Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 9:31Speaker 02

  And so I, our sensitivity, I feel like, evolutionarily speaking, is like our strength.

• 9:38Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 9:38Speaker 02

  Um, and so, what I took away from those experiences was a deep knowing.

• 9:46Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 9:46Speaker 02

  And many different, many different memories of, like, I don't have to believe things.

• 9:56Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 9:57Speaker 02

  Like, I, I know.

• 10:00Ky Dickens?

  Right.

• 10:00Speaker 02

  And that's something that is priceless and invaluable, um, because belief can be a little bit tricky.

• 10:14Ky Dickens?

  Right.

• 10:14Speaker 02

  You know?

• 10:15Ky Dickens?

  There's belief and there's knowing.

• 10:16Speaker 02

  One hundred percent. And I think that the biggest thing that I took away from these experiences is a deep knowing.

• 10:25Ky Dickens?

  I just love that that's where you went right now, because, you know, I think back to even like, like Socrates, and some of these people were having these arguments about writing.

• 10:34Speaker 02

  One hundred percent.

• 10:35Ky Dickens?

  Which is like, when writing comes in, people are gonna pretend they know something, but they haven't experienced it, so they don't know it. So there's gonna be a bunch of posers out there.

• 10:42Speaker 02

  One hundred percent.

• 10:43Ky Dickens?

  And, and I, you know, like, I think about this example sometimes, like, chocolate, right? Like, you could write about chocolate, that's not the same as eating it.

• 10:49Speaker 02

  One, one hundred percent.

• 10:51Ky Dickens?

  And I feel like belief is like taking someone else's word for it, interpretation of it, or like, knowledge of it, and being like, okay, I'm gonna strongly hold this.

• 10:58Speaker 02

  Like adopting something that maybe is not inherent in yourself.

• 11:04Ky Dickens?

  Yeah, but there's a strong, it's stronger to just be like, nope, I know, I've experienced it, I know.

• 11:09Speaker 02

  But not all the time are we put in positions to where we can experience those things. And I think that that's the thing that, like, I feel like back in the day, um, maybe these experiences were a little bit more accessible.

• 11:22Ky Dickens?

  Oh, I just love that you're saying that so much, because, you know, we've talked a little bit about psychedelics, and we did a next thing on Ibane, and, and one of the things that I came away with when talking to, like, people and a lot of indigenous leaders was like, you guys can go do psychedelics, whatever, you're doing it wrong.

• 11:38Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 11:38Ky Dickens?

  There's rituals.

• 11:39Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 11:39Ky Dickens?

  There's thousands of years, in some cases, of like, practice.

• 11:43Speaker 02

  There's ways in which we practice these specific things, yes.

• 11:46Ky Dickens?

  And it's reverence, and it is community building, and it's grounding, and there's such a respect for what this can do for the human being with the non-physical world, which, to all of these communities, was right there.

• 12:00Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 12:00Ky Dickens?

  And, you know, I, I've read this, or seen this, or ha, ha, you know, a version of this all the time, which is like, you know, God is that, why isn't God i- in our world anymore the way that, you know, he or she apparently was in the ancient world, when, you know, burning bushes were happening, and this and this. And it's like, because we've left, like, we have, we have put up walls, and become really convenient, and we love our screens, and we are working all the time, and like...

• 12:20Speaker 02

  We've actively walked away

• 12:23Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 12:23Speaker 02

  from the depth of our experience. We've actively walked away and turned a blind eye

• 12:29Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 12:29Speaker 02

  to the depth of our experience

• 12:30Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 12:31Speaker 02

  in so many ways.

• 12:32Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 12:32Speaker 02

  And I think that it's really just like a perspective shift.

• 12:36Ky Dickens?

  Yes, totally.

• 12:37Speaker 02

  There is magic and beauty happening everywhere around us.

• 12:42Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 12:42Speaker 02

  Like, you were talking about, um, how that indigenous leader was talking about, like, your internet is nothing compared to the connections that we can make.

• 12:51Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 12:51Speaker 02

  Even just like the fungal mycelium

• 12:54Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 12:54Speaker 02

  network.

• 12:55Ky Dickens?

  Yes.

• 12:56Speaker 02

  I think we're also getting farther away from curiosity as well.

• 12:59Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 13:00Speaker 02

  Which is shutting us off from, like, just facts.

• 13:03Ky Dickens?

  I know.

• 13:04Speaker 02

  Shutting us off from just knowing facts about the earth.

• 13:07Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 13:07Speaker 02

  And facts about nature.

• 13:09Ky Dickens?

  Right.

• 13:09Speaker 02

  And I think that as humans, um, kind of separate more and more from like, what makes us human.

• 13:17Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 13:17Speaker 02

  And separate more and more from, I always think about it this way, like, I don't like the zoo. The zoo is not a good place.

• 13:24Ky Dickens?

  Yeah, I feel the same.

• 13:26Speaker 02

  But when you go to a zoo, every single animal has a different habitat, and, you know, different plants, different kinds of water sources, different kinds of food, different kinds of grasses, even sometimes different kind of lights.

• 13:40Ky Dickens?

  Mm-hmm.

• 13:40Speaker 02

  And I think we forget that, like, we are animals,

• 13:44Ky Dickens?

  Mm-hmm.

• 13:45Speaker 02

  and humans require a certain kind of environment. And we're really just separating a lot

• 13:53Ky Dickens?

  Yes.

• 13:54Speaker 02

  from the kinds of environments that

• 13:56Ky Dickens?

  Yes.

• 13:57Speaker 02

  we thrive in as a human animal.

• 13:59Ky Dickens?

  Yes.

• 13:59Speaker 02

  And so I feel like these kinds of things that we're talking about, when we are in our habitat.

• 14:05Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 14:05Speaker 02

  Not like, environmental habitat, emotional, mental habitat,

• 14:09Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 14:10Speaker 02

  community habitat, when those are intact.

• 14:12Ky Dickens?

  Yes.

• 14:13Speaker 02

  I think these experiences are way more accessible.

• 14:16Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 14:16Speaker 02

  But because we're just going away from it, I think it's, we're losing, we're losing contact with so much of what makes the human animal what we are.

• 14:25Ky Dickens?

  Human.

• 14:26Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 14:26Ky Dickens?

  And what can appear as more than human, honestly.

• 14:29Speaker 02

  One hundred percent.

• 14:30Ky Dickens?

  What are the ways you stay in touch with your natural habitat? How do you make this world work for you and your spiritual life?

• 14:37Speaker 02

  Man, it is not easy, and a lot of times, I am searching for that.

• 14:47Ky Dickens?

  Mm-hmm.

• 14:47Speaker 02

  But I think music is a big tether.

• 14:50Ky Dickens?

  Big time.

• 14:50Speaker 02

  Um, I think having some connection with nature, whether that be, like, I love animals.

• 14:56Ky Dickens?

  Mm-hmm.

• 14:56Speaker 02

  I have five animals, I live with five fur babies, and so, like, just, like, I feel like animals are almost like trees, like, trees filter out the carbon dioxide.

• 15:08Ky Dickens?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 15:09Speaker 02

  And they put out oxygen.

• 15:11Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 15:11Speaker 02

  And I feel like animals, you know, I think they can be similar in the energetic vibe of a space to where maybe they take in negativity and they put out, like, intense observation.

• 15:25Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 15:25Speaker 02

  Like, animals are very aware of everything that happens.

• 15:29Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 15:29Speaker 02

  And when you observe them, you get kind of pulled into that sense of, um, awareness and like, in the moment, all the time.

• 15:38Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 15:39Speaker 02

  And so, yeah, they, m- m- maybe they take in, like, un, like, maybe they take in your, like, unawareness, and they put out, like, a sense of just, like, here and now.

• 15:49Ky Dickens?

  Yeah. I love that. What type of animals do you have?

• 15:51Speaker 02

  I have three cats and two dogs.

• 15:53Ky Dickens?

  Oh, yeah, you're right, though, because, like, sometimes in the morning, I'll go outside, and I'll try to meditate or whatever, but, and I have this big dog that looks like a wolf, and she'll come up and just put her head on me for a long time, it's her way of hugging. And then I realize it does the exact same thing as meditating.

• 16:06Speaker 02

  Totally.

• 16:06Ky Dickens?

  I'll just sit there and be like, we are gonna hug for a while. And it feels so good to, like, have an animal ground you like that. It's beautiful.

• 16:13Speaker 02

  Yeah, they're, animals are not caught up in their minds. Everything is about the body and about the environment, and they're so keyed into their environment.

• 16:25Ky Dickens?

  Yes.

• 16:26Speaker 02

  Um, I honestly think that's why the Egyptians loved cats so much.

• 16:29Ky Dickens?

  Yes.

• 16:30Speaker 02

  And kept cats around all the time.

• 16:32Ky Dickens?

  Yes.

• 16:32Speaker 02

  Because I, I have seen my cats' vibe energies that maybe shan't be around.

• 16:40Ky Dickens?

  Yeah, right.

• 16:42Speaker 02

  You know?

• 16:42Ky Dickens?

  Yes, totally.

• 16:43Speaker 02

  Um, and so they do, they keep the space clean in a lot of ways, also of people that shan't be around.

• 16:48Ky Dickens?

  Yes, they do.

• 16:49Speaker 02

  You know?

• 16:50Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 16:50Speaker 02

  Um, and I think that's so important. So, yeah, my animals, one of the ways, uh, music, one of the ways, and just like solitude, like, you know, we have this idea that meditation is supposed to be like, okay, we're doing this, and we're really gonna try to not think.

• 17:06Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 17:07Speaker 02

  But sometimes meditation is just like, being okay with just sitting in silence, and you don't have to be doing anything in particular, you know? But I think in this, like, fast-paced, crazy world that humans have created, that's like getting us farther and farther away from our nature.

• 17:23Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 17:24Speaker 02

  It's very different and odd to just sit in silence.

• 17:28Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 17:29Speaker 02

  And some people find it very, very, um, uncomfortable.

• 17:33Ky Dickens?

  Mm-hmm.

• 17:34Speaker 02

  And so sometimes I'll just challenge myself to not do anything in particular, and just sit, and just look around, and just be in silence.

• 17:41Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 17:41Speaker 02

  Um, and that really, that really just grounds me and brings me back to, like, myself.

• 17:47Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 17:47Speaker 02

  One hundred percent.

• 17:54Ky Dickens?

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• 18:38Ky Dickens?

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• 20:06Ky Dickens?

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• 20:50Ky Dickens?

  And that's really important to me because my days are rarely just one thing. I can go from a recording to an interview to sitting at my desk, to doing press, to taking a walk, to fitting in a workout, to doing something with my kids or going out to dinner. And I really don't want to be changing bras between all of that. The bra is wireless. It gives you actual shape and separation. And I especially love the hook and eye back because you don't have to wrestle it over your head at the end of the day. Treat yourself to the most advanced bras and shapewear on the market. Use our exclusive link to save 20% off Honeylove at honeylove.com/tapes. That's honeylove.com/tapes. After you check out, they'll ask where you heard about them. Please support our show and let them know we sent you. Experience the new standard in comfort and support with Honeylove.

• 21:38Ky Dickens?

  I'm curious, what role spirituality has played in your creative life? Whew. What role hasn't it played in my creative life? I am a deep believer that music is a vehicle of healing and that when it's done in a thoughtful, intentional way, it can be deep medicine. I think that human beings, pretty much since the beginning of our brains being, and maybe even before this,

• 22:08Ky Dickens?

  before culture as we know it, music has been a vehicle for human beings to create community and places of ceremonial,

• 22:18Ky Dickens?

  devotional ceremonial practices and spaces that are deeply important to just community building and a sense of connection with the land and your chosen family. Yeah, I love that. I was just talking to my cousins the other night and I was saying, I was like, if I'm playing a song or writing a song and I don't feel like it's healing me, or I don't feel like I'm saying something that I need to hear, then I'm almost like, I'm probably not saying something that anyone needs to hear. You know what I mean? Like if I don't feel like it's, like if it's not touching me, Yeah.

• 22:59Ky Dickens?

  I'm less likely to put it out or to think that it is, that it's going to be as important as it needs to be. Because I'm the first person that it needs to touch. Yeah. If I'm trying to touch other people, if I'm trying to touch other people's hearts, Yeah. Like, if it's not touching my heart, then like, what's going on? Like, So true. Like, how, how, how am I going to be able to gauge? Like, how deep of an expression this is of the human experience? Right. If it's not even touching my heart? Yeah. And so I think that's where it starts. That's so true. It starts with like, do I need to hear these lyrics? Yeah. Do I, is there something in these lyrics

• 23:42Ky Dickens?

  that is inspiring me towards a more embodied way of living? Right. I love that. And I think people who've truly changed the world think I needed this for myself. Yeah. I couldn't find it, or I don't have it. So let me give it to everyone else. 100%. That's so beautiful. Yeah. So Willow, you wrote a beautiful song called "The Talk on the Hill" on your newest album, The Thread. It's a beautiful song.

• 24:02Speaker 02

  Thank you.

• 24:03Ky Dickens?

  It's absolutely beautiful. And, and maybe just talk about the origins and what inspired you?

• 24:07Speaker 02

  Well, obviously, I was listening to the telepathy tapes. And I'm just so blown away by what these kids can do. And people, not just kids, but what these people can do. Magic is the wrong word because it feels like not connected to the physical realm. But you see in the videos online that you post on the website, you can see that these non-speakers are really doing these amazing feats that we can't really explain. And so for me, that was just so inspiring. And I wanted to write a song,

• 24:52Speaker 02

  like something so deep like that

• 24:54Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 24:54Speaker 02

  is usually not used as content for like,

• 24:57Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 24:57Speaker 02

  a summer pop song that you want to hear like at a festival or like outside with your friends, or like something that you want to like, joy being like the frontward facing thing.

• 25:08Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 25:09Speaker 02

  And not it being like a brooding, deep emotional thing, which it also is.

• 25:15Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 25:15Speaker 02

  But I wanted to create a song that inspired joy in people. And like, a lot of these people, a lot of these non-speakers are kids.

• 25:24Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 25:24Speaker 02

  And so I wanted to kind of bring that playful

• 25:26Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 25:27Speaker 02

  energy to it. Yeah, that, that childlike wonder.

• 25:31Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 25:32Speaker 02

  That what the world could be.

• 25:33Ky Dickens?

  Yeah, I love it. What were some of your favorite lines in the song?

• 25:37Speaker 02

  Okay, I have a couple. "Gather on the hillside. The wind knows all of our names." That was one of the lines that I really loved because

• 25:49Speaker 02

  you talk about a lot on the podcast, like some of these non-speakers, like knowing each other without having met each other.

• 25:57Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 25:57Speaker 02

  And knowing details about each other's lives that they, there's no possible way they could have known that.

• 26:04Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 26:05Speaker 02

  And so I wanted to kind of say it in a way that was like poetic and not so on the nose.

• 26:10Ky Dickens?

  I love it.

• 26:10Speaker 02

  You know, it's like, let's go to this place where, where the wind knows all of our names. Don't try to figure out why.

• 26:16Ky Dickens?

  Do you know what's so beautiful about that? I want you to keep going. But when I heard it, I was really like, wow. Because I don't know if you listened to our season two, but there was an episode in there of a woman named Rebecca, whose father she's trying to reach, who's got Alzheimer's.

• 26:30Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 26:31Ky Dickens?

  And she's, he's Cuban, he's speaking Spanish. And there's a translator and a lot of it she didn't put together till later. But apparently, he was saying to the man, Dan Gorki, like, "I can hear you, you're in the wind."

• 26:42Speaker 02

  What?

• 26:43Ky Dickens?

  When he was trying to explain the telepathy. He goes, "I can hear you. It's like you're in the wind."

• 26:47Speaker 02

  Wow.

• 26:48Ky Dickens?

  Isn't that cool?

• 26:49Speaker 02

  I literally have goosebumps right now.

• 26:51Ky Dickens?

  And I, that's what I felt when I heard your song. I was like, oh, it's because it all, all those things are to layer eventually.

• 26:55Speaker 02

  Connecting. It's all connecting. "The foundations they shake, we wake up, we wake up."

• 27:03Ky Dickens?

  So good.

• 27:04Speaker 02

  Oh, this one, this one I really liked.

• 27:08Speaker 02

  "Across the earth, they send smoke signals that we can't see. I wish I could read them, learn a new melody. I wish I could see such an unusual freedom. Show me how to gather on the hillside."

• 27:20Ky Dickens?

  Oh, it's so good.

• 27:21Speaker 02

  Thank you. I just, and also, I was very intrigued by like, the parents and the teachers of these non-speakers who kind of got like, they, spending so much time with these kids, they like tapped into their frequency and were experiencing things that they would have never experienced otherwise.

• 27:41Ky Dickens?

  Yes.

• 27:42Speaker 02

  And so that led me to believe that like, maybe there's a way that we can teach this.

• 27:48Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 27:49Speaker 02

  You know what I mean? Like, maybe there's a way that, you know, we could all share in some aspect of this parallel reality.

• 27:59Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 28:01Speaker 02

  You know?

• 28:01Ky Dickens?

  Totally. I mean, because I think you're right. I mean, especially with teachers. I don't know why it's more teachers than parents, but so many of them report that when they're working with an individual for a certain amount of time, often they can start to hear the non-speaker back, like the telepathy can go both ways.

• 28:15Speaker 02

  Totally.

• 28:15Ky Dickens?

  And often they're able to see things like the other side or whatever that they weren't able to do before. And it's like, what does that mean? It means that maybe we can work together to elevate each other.

• 28:26Speaker 02

  100%.

• 28:27Ky Dickens?

  And unlock each other.

• 28:28Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 28:28Ky Dickens?

  Which is unbelievable to think about.

• 28:31Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 28:31Ky Dickens?

  And it also means we're all capable of it.

• 28:33Speaker 02

  100%, which is so exciting to me. There's another concept. Darwin did this whole thing with like finches on this island in the Galapagos.

• 28:45Ky Dickens?

  Yeah, this is sounding familiar.

• 28:46Speaker 02

  Yeah, where like these finches um learned how to open a specific kind of nut in a specific way.

• 28:53Ky Dickens?

  Cool.

• 28:54Speaker 02

  And then like without these um birds communicating, like on another island nearby, when they had not been doing that before, those birds started opening the nut in the same way.

• 29:09Ky Dickens?

  Wow.

• 29:10Speaker 02

  And so there's this thing, there's an actual scientific concept where it's like, once.

• 29:17Ky Dickens?

  Like morphic resonance.

• 29:18Speaker 02

  Yes, it's like once one of the animals starts doing something different in this weird twist of like, it might be evolutionary, biological, something of that nature, but there's like this sense of connection to where it's like, oh, now we're just all doing it differently.

• 29:37Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 29:37Speaker 02

  Um, or even like athletes where it's like, oh, we couldn't run that fast before. Humans couldn't run that fast before. Now one person does it. And now it's like, oh, we just, it like breaks the seal of what we think is possible. And now more people are able to do it. Um, and so we see this um not only, we see this in like biological um states and with animals and with humans.

• 30:03Ky Dickens?

  Totally.

• 30:04Speaker 02

  I, I don't think that this is entirely different than that. It's just like a new, it's like a new evolutionary step.

• 30:11Ky Dickens?

  Yeah, and I want to bring that into your creative process in a second. Because I think one of the places we see this a lot is in an idea coming into the world.

• 30:18Speaker 02

  Totally.

• 30:19Ky Dickens?

  And like Rick Rubin said in our second season, that sometimes a new like, like genre of music will pop up and on three different continents and they're not copying each other.

• 30:29Speaker 02

  Totally.

• 30:30Ky Dickens?

  They were inspired at the same time.

• 30:31Speaker 02

  Yep.

• 30:32Ky Dickens?

  And it's manifesting in its own like, you know, regional way.

• 30:35Speaker 02

  Yeah, during the same time.

• 30:37Ky Dickens?

  During the same time, but the world, something was like, you guys are now ready?

• 30:40Speaker 02

  Yeah, you're ready for this, yeah. You know, and, and that like moves people, you know, like we're, I think humans are so um, we're so rooted in like, we're community animals.

• 30:52Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 30:53Speaker 02

  You know, and so I think that goes even deeper than we know. Like our ability to connect with our community. And even for better or for worse as well, it's like,

• 31:03Ky Dickens?

  Right.

• 31:03Speaker 02

  if the vibes of your community are going into a more like tribal kind of, you know, violent kind of situation, it's very easy for the human animal to get swept up in that as well. And, and be exhibiting um behaviors that they wouldn't necessarily exhibit otherwise. And that can also go positively as well.

• 31:28Ky Dickens?

  Yeah, now when you are like writing a song or having an idea for a song, does it feel, I mean, there is a difference between like working at something because you're talented and we all do that too. And off or being like fully inspired by a creative download. And you know when it's the different thing, right? Like you can tell when it's that, like, do you get those creative downloads? And then if you are ever having a hard time, which maybe you're not with like creative inspiration, is there something you do to help call it to yourself?

• 31:54Speaker 02

  Yes, um, so interesting, I was um, I was in my house the other day with a friend and he was playing the saxophone and I was just playing the guitar and, and we were trying to come up with something. And I sang a specific, I sang a specific word. And as I was singing the word, the way that I was singing it, I like, in my mind's energy field, like I caught a glimpse of like this little eye.

• 32:28Ky Dickens?

  Hmm.

• 32:29Speaker 02

  And I was like, hmm, what's that? And then as I was singing the song and I kept singing that part over and over again, I realized, OMG, Thom Yorke has a little eye, right?

• 32:41Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 32:42Speaker 02

  And I didn't say anything to my friend. I was just, we kept playing and jamming.

• 32:45Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 32:45Speaker 02

  And we stopped and he was like, you know, it's so interesting. And I was like, what? And he was like, when you sang that one line, that was just like giving like Thom Yorke.

• 32:54Ky Dickens?

  What?

• 32:55Speaker 02

  And I was like,

• 32:56Ky Dickens?

  Love that.

• 32:57Speaker 02

  I was like, yeah, yeah, I felt that too. And I didn't say anything about it, you know what I mean? But like, I will sometimes unconsciously call on musicians

• 33:08Ky Dickens?

  That's cool.

• 33:09Speaker 02

  that I really love.

• 33:10Ky Dickens?

  Mm hmm.

• 33:10Speaker 02

  Um, whether it be a certain way that they move their body or a certain color that I saw them wearing or whatever it is, um, it's that bond that I have with them.

• 33:21Ky Dickens?

  Hmm, I love that.

• 33:22Speaker 02

  From listening to their music so much.

• 33:23Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 33:24Speaker 02

  And sometimes I can like call to their energy

• 33:26Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 33:27Speaker 02

  to kind of just like hang in the room a little and, you know, give me some inspiration.

• 33:31Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 33:32Speaker 02

  Whatever that may be. And it might just be a word, it might be one note.

• 33:35Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 33:36Speaker 02

  But um, I have found that, yeah, like if you call to your favorite musician,

• 33:43Ky Dickens?

  Yep.

• 33:43Speaker 02

  um, they will come to you.

• 33:45Ky Dickens?

  Yes.

• 33:45Speaker 02

  In, in whether it be small ways or, you know, bigger ways.

• 33:50Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 33:50Speaker 02

  But I think that's something that we can cultivate. And some people, you know, you just call that inspiration.

• 33:54Ky Dickens?

  Right.

• 33:54Speaker 02

  But I wasn't consciously trying to do it at that moment.

• 33:58Ky Dickens?

  I think that's so cool because I think you're right and I have never put like language to it.

• 34:02Speaker 02

  Totally.

• 34:03Ky Dickens?

  But that like other artists, because I do think art in and of itself, like you are, if, if it's truly inspired, you are communing with something else.

• 34:10Speaker 02

  Lineage, yeah, the lineage, but it's so interesting because the lineage of really amazing artists all goes back to that really pure channel.

• 34:19Ky Dickens?

  Yep.

• 34:19Speaker 02

  And so it's almost like the lineage is just like a continuation of people tapping into a pure channel.

• 34:26Ky Dickens?

  It's, you're right.

• 34:27Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 34:28Ky Dickens?

  And it's so interesting that like we can rely on each other to do that. And I thought about like, sometimes I'll get like, oh, what do I want to say here, whatever? And the weirdest, I will open up and I will read a Mary Oliver poem. Like Mary Oliver, for some reason, she's in nature all the time. It's a somatic experience where she's noticing the world around her and she'll, you know, focus on like the grasshopper in her hand for like, you know, an entire page.

• 34:48Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 34:49Ky Dickens?

  And it's like, okay, all right, here I am. Okay, good. And it's just so cool how like we can all find those people that are like, you'll be my little gateway

• 34:56Speaker 02

  Totally.

• 34:57Ky Dickens?

  to this more pure channel.

• 34:59Speaker 02

  100%. And that's what artists, I feel like that's what we're supposed to do.

• 35:04Ky Dickens?

  You're right, yeah.

• 35:04Speaker 02

  I feel like we're supposed to be a touch point

• 35:07Ky Dickens?

  Mm hmm.

• 35:08Speaker 02

  um, for others to follow that pure channel.

• 35:12Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 35:13Speaker 02

  And to tap into that pure channel.

• 35:14Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 35:15Speaker 02

  Um, because sometimes it's really difficult to, to, to do that on your own.

• 35:19Ky Dickens?

  It is.

• 35:20Speaker 02

  You know?

• 35:20Ky Dickens?

  So Willow, I'm like you, I read all the time. I read a ton of nonfiction. I love knowledge. I like science. But I don't like this idea of like scientism as a religion where it's like, we only know the truth and we're laughing at you if you think this or that. And

• 35:33Speaker 02

  Science can be very bigoted.

• 35:35Ky Dickens?

  Yes, Suzanne, I'm trying, I can't remember her name, she wrote Finding the Mother Tree, which was the book about, she really broke the whole thing about trees communicating through the mycelium.

• 35:44Speaker 02

  Also Braiding Sweetgrass is a really great one, but I need to read that one. What is it called again?

• 35:48Ky Dickens?

  Uh, Suzanne Seymour, that's her name, Finding the Mother Tree.

• 35:51Speaker 02

  Finding the Mother Tree.

• 35:51Ky Dickens?

  Yeah, and it was really interesting because when she, she was kind of put in charge of like the nurseries that were happening when Canada made a law that was like, you have to replace um any trees that you, you know, fell, like you have to put them up.

• 36:03Speaker 02

  You have to replant them.

• 36:04Ky Dickens?

  And she was noticing that trees were doing really great on the edges where there's a big trees nearby.

• 36:09Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 36:09Ky Dickens?

  And she's like, I think they communicate. Well, she was like laughed out of town, you know, and it was like, and, and then she's like, I'll go get my degree.

• 36:14Speaker 02

  Totally.

• 36:14Ky Dickens?

  And I will prove this. And she did.

• 36:16Speaker 02

  Wow.

• 36:17Ky Dickens?

  And it's just like, you know, there are the people in frontier science which are looking, is that an anecdote that the trees on the side are doing better? Yeah, but she observed it.

• 36:25Speaker 02

  Yeah, she observed it, you know, and then did research.

• 36:28Ky Dickens?

  Right.

• 36:28Speaker 02

  And was like, actually, there's a lot of parallels to what I'm saying.

• 36:32Ky Dickens?

  Mm hmm.

• 36:32Speaker 02

  Um, and also going, going to like getting laughed out of town in the scientific community, like Diane Powell, her PhD getting revoked

• 36:42Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 36:43Speaker 02

  because she wants to study something. Like this is the thing for me to where it's like, okay, she already earned it though.

• 36:49Ky Dickens?

  Right.

• 36:49Speaker 02

  So it's like, so now, it's like, how, how does that even logically make any sense? It's like she earned it.

• 36:54Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 36:55Speaker 02

  She got, she got the certification. And now with the certification, as this person, she shall be able

• 37:02Ky Dickens?

  I know.

• 37:03Speaker 02

  to then go out into the world and use her amazing mind

• 37:06Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 37:06Speaker 02

  to study whatever it is she wants to study.

• 37:08Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 37:09Speaker 02

  And so I think, yeah, I, I love science and I love academia, but there are so many um,

• 37:17Ky Dickens?

  Gatekeepers.

• 37:18Speaker 02

  Yes, and it's so, and we're not even going to get into the sexism and the racism

• 37:23Ky Dickens?

  All of it.

• 37:23Speaker 02

  of all of that, you know, because that's a whole other podcast.

• 37:26Ky Dickens?

  Yep.

• 37:26Speaker 02

  But um, yeah, it's like, if, if academia and the scholastic pursuit is supposed to be about finding the truth,

• 37:35Ky Dickens?

  Right.

• 37:36Speaker 02

  I feel like we could do it better.

• 37:37Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 37:37Speaker 02

  I feel like we could be even more efficient

• 37:40Ky Dickens?

  Right.

• 37:41Speaker 02

  in the way that we try.

• 37:43Ky Dickens?

  Totally, like, because I keep thinking like freedom of inquiry is what science should be about.

• 37:47Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 37:47Ky Dickens?

  Ask any question.

• 37:48Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 37:48Ky Dickens?

  And then be open for either answer.

• 37:50Speaker 02

  And be open to the process

• 37:52Ky Dickens?

  Right.

• 37:53Speaker 02

  of trying to figure out what that means.

• 37:56Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 37:56Speaker 02

  Like be open to the process

• 37:58Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 37:58Speaker 02

  at least.

• 37:59Ky Dickens?

  Uh, yeah, and you know, I like have been so interested in like, what are the things? Who is at the top that is making things that happen? Like we just, so we just dropped an episode today about energy healing.

• 38:09Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah.

• 38:10Ky Dickens?

  And how MD Anderson was doing a research study on pancreatic cancer cells and had an energy healer and like a fake energy healer and a control group, um, looking at could energy healing, you know, like reverse or stop the spread of pancreatic cancer? And it was effective. And, and the first journal that they tried to put the study into, it was rejected. And we have just witnessed this in with one of the telepathy tests out there that is really well done. It was super conclusive. There was so many, it, it was, it's, it's the best, in such integrity. And I know that this study was sent out to the first journal and they were like, won't even look at it.

• 38:49Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 38:50Ky Dickens?

  And it's like, why? It's, I don't understand why, because it's pushes all of us forward if frontier science.

• 38:57Speaker 02

  In medicine, I really hate to say it, but capitalism truly is like the weird little Gollum child of patriarchy and white supremacy.

• 39:07Ky Dickens?

  It is.

• 39:08Speaker 02

  It's like such, it's the weird little child

• 39:10Ky Dickens?

  No, you're right.

• 39:11Speaker 02

  that was birthed from those two.

• 39:13Ky Dickens?

  I love your like look of that.

• 39:14Speaker 02

  Yeah, it's like, it's like, it's all gnarled.

• 39:17Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 39:17Speaker 02

  Like, you know?

• 39:18Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 39:19Speaker 02

  Um, and, and I really do feel like, because there's so much money to be made

• 39:23Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 39:24Speaker 02

  from people being sick and from people having to pay tooth and limb for, you know, for pharmaceutical um solutions.

• 39:38Ky Dickens?

  Right.

• 39:39Speaker 02

  Um, there's just so much money to be made in that. And so I think that, and you also have to look at like, who's funding?

• 39:46Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 39:47Speaker 02

  Like who's funding these scientific um

• 39:50Ky Dickens?

  Studies, for one.

• 39:51Speaker 02

  You know what I mean? Who benefits from this being a thing or not being a thing?

• 39:56Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 39:57Speaker 02

  Um, and so, yeah, I, not my little

• 40:01Speaker 02

  You know, my conspiracy theorist mind, but it's honestly not even a conspiracy theory. Like, if you really just look at the way, like, if we're talking specifically medical right now, um, the amount of money to be made off of people being sick is just tremendous.

• 40:15Ky Dickens?

  Yes.

• 40:15Speaker 02

  And, um, time and time again, not, not only in the American government or the American system, but we see it globally.

• 40:22Ky Dickens?

  Yeah. Yeah. Well, it's interesting, because, I mean, obviously, you're right. I mean, it's money, it's control, and total control. And one of the things that happened in New York, where they're trying to pass this spelling bill of rights to allow non-speakers the ability to have a communication partner in school so they can communicate.

• 40:39Speaker 02

  Totally.

• 40:39Ky Dickens?

  It was killed, like, in the dead of the night.

• 40:41Speaker 02

  Hmm.

• 40:42Ky Dickens?

  And I knew some of the people on the ground that were really trying to help, like, bring the education through these legislators to, to vote on this. And one of them actually said, "Well, what if non-speaking individuals who are sexually abused more than most people in society because they're silent, start saying who did it?" More or less is what they said in so many words. Which was, I was like, "What?" I, I, I understand if, like, the ABA industry or someone who's profiting off of autism.

• 41:09Speaker 02

  And it's like, "Why don't you want them to say who did it?"

• 41:11Ky Dickens?

  Well, yeah, exactly. Exact, I mean, that was what was so bonkers to me. Like, there's been so many reasons why people might not support spelling that are money-backed.

• 41:19Speaker 02

  Totally.

• 41:19Ky Dickens?

  But the idea of, like, "Wait, if these individuals are telepathic or have had a horrific experience, what if that gets out into the world?" That, it felt so much darker and more nefarious and more awful than, like...

• 41:31Speaker 02

  We don't want people to be able to see deeply into things, to see behind the veil that much.

• 41:37Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 41:38Speaker 02

  So we need to kind of keep them, we need to keep them silenced, because we don't, we don't want the majority of people knowing the depths of what they know.

• 41:47Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 41:48Speaker 02

  These, these non-speakers.

• 41:49Ky Dickens?

  I, I think there's a truth to that, I really do. And I would, I hate to even admit that out loud.

• 41:54Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 41:54Ky Dickens?

  And I'm not a conspiracy theorist either. I mean, I know that you're not either, but like, it is...

• 41:59Speaker 02

  I think that what people... I think sometimes people call, um, pattern recognition

• 42:08Ky Dickens?

  Mm-hmm.

• 42:09Speaker 02

  and a healthy sense of curiosity. So these two things, pat, like, very intense pattern recognition and a healthy sense of curiosity, I think a lot of people just write that off as conspiracy theorism.

• 42:24Ky Dickens?

  Yeah, right.

• 42:25Speaker 02

  Which, um, just doesn't make any sense to me.

• 42:28Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 42:29Speaker 02

  And I think that it's a cop-out.

• 42:30Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 42:31Speaker 02

  And I think that, um, there's a lot of social ways that people, it's like, you don't want to be the odd one out.

• 42:38Ky Dickens?

  Right.

• 42:38Speaker 02

  You don't want to be the, you don't want to be ostracized in your, which is also a big thing about the human animal, because we're so community-oriented.

• 42:46Ky Dickens?

  Right.

• 42:47Speaker 02

  To be ostracized from your community can mean death.

• 42:49Ky Dickens?

  Right.

• 42:50Speaker 02

  And so even though we live in a different time where that doesn't mean physical death, yeah. Our evolutionary bi- biological nervous systems are like, "Okay, red alert.

• 43:01Ky Dickens?

  Right, right.

• 43:01Speaker 02

  I don't want to be ostracized." And so I feel like societally, a lot of healthy curiosity is labeled, um, in really negative ways.

• 43:13Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 43:14Speaker 02

  And that causes people to be silenced.

• 43:17Ky Dickens?

  Right.

• 43:18Speaker 02

  Um, which is, I think, one of the most common ways that, um, we are indoctrinated, um, just because we don't want to, we don't want to be ostracized, we don't want to be labeled, uh, we don't want to be, um, excluded, you know?

• 43:40Ky Dickens?

  My days tend to move really quickly, and I'm always going from one thing straight to another. I might work out in the morning and then spend the afternoon recording or doing interviews, and then suddenly realize I'm supposed to be meeting someone for dinner. So honestly, I love anything that makes my life easier, and that's what I love about Fabletics, which I'm actually wearing right here. I can put on a great pair of leggings, or I can put on a bomber jacket like this that's stretchable and keeps you warm when you're working out, but still looks cool during the day, and I can actually stay in what I put on all day long. It works for a workout, but it also feels polished enough that I don't have to completely change before jumping on camera or heading into a meeting or going out later. And I really appreciate not having to overthink getting dressed.

• 44:23Ky Dickens?

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• 45:06Ky Dickens?

  Suddenly, something sweet becomes so much more interesting, and that's why I'm so excited to try Kachava's new salted caramel flavor. Kachava is already part of my afternoon routine, so this sounds like a delicious way to mix things up, caramel with that little salty edge. And Kachava brings more than flavor. Just two scoops provides plant-based protein, fiber, greens, and so much more in one simple shake. There are no artificial flavors, colors, or sweeteners, and no preservatives. It's a way to satisfy that craving for something delicious while supporting whole-body nutrition. And there are so many flavors to choose from: chocolate, vanilla, chai, matcha, coconut acai, strawberry, and coffee. I love having something to look forward to in the middle of a busy day that also helps me take care of myself. So embrace your own salty side. Go to kachava.com and use code Tapes for 15% off your first order.

• 45:51Ky Dickens?

  That's kachava, K-A-C-H-A-V-A dot com, code Tapes.

• 46:01Ky Dickens?

  Growing up, did you have a big sense of spirituality? Like, was that a part of your life?

• 46:05Speaker 02

  Yeah, I mean, my parents have always been just big lovers and just curious about all things, um, that speak to the human spirit. And ever since I was young, you know, my parents read the Quran, the Christian Bible, the Bhagavad Gita. Um, they were always just, like, curious about every single kind of thought path and spiritual path, and, um, all of the things that we can gain from, learning from all of these different cultures.

• 46:42Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 46:43Speaker 02

  And so, from a young age, I, um, I grew up with a lot of books about Krishna and Radha and Jesus and Allah and, you know, all of these beautiful human expressions of the divine.

• 47:00Ky Dickens?

  It's so cool, because, you know, I think so many people grow up with, like, one framework or one belief system put, put on their path, you know? And when you're exposed to so many,

• 47:09Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 47:09Ky Dickens?

  I'm so curious as to, like, what you believe now, having had all the opportunity to really think through a lot of different ideas.

• 47:16Speaker 02

  Yeah, um, I'm also a deep lover of science as well.

• 47:19Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 47:20Speaker 02

  I, when Interstellar came out...

• 47:24Ky Dickens?

  That's such a good movie.

• 47:25Speaker 02

  Yeah, I, I was really just inspired by that movie. And right after I, um, watched it, I went straight to the bookstore and bought, like, four books on physics and was, like, really deep into the mathematics of it all and just, like, the inner workings of the physical world.

• 47:46Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 47:46Speaker 02

  And when you really go deep into that, um, any, like, deep scientist will tell you that things become a little...

• 47:54Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 47:55Speaker 02

  Things become a little, uh, weird.

• 47:57Ky Dickens?

  Weird.

• 47:57Speaker 02

  And, um, it, it's not very steeped in, like, the materialistic idea that the West has been so, um, trained to, to kind of go in that direction.

• 48:13Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 48:14Speaker 02

  Um, so, belief is a very interesting word to use. I, um, I'm really into, like, lived experience. And, um, I feel like sometimes the anecdotal side of things can be kind of pushed to the side, which I don't really think makes any sense to me. I feel like, just like any other animal who's alive, you know, we have eyes and ears and a heart and a mind

• 48:37Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 48:37Speaker 02

  that can experience the world around us. And I don't think that we should, like, throw that to the side, like, it doesn't matter.

• 48:45Ky Dickens?

  Right.

• 48:45Speaker 02

  Um, so, belief is a very interesting word.

• 48:49Ky Dickens?

  I love, though, I love hearing that you're a big reader and that you love the science side of it too, because for so long, I think people, or many people have this false assumption that, like, science and spirituality can't exist together.

• 48:59Speaker 02

  Exactly.

• 48:59Ky Dickens?

  I find they go like this.

• 49:01Speaker 02

  Yes, yes.

• 49:02Ky Dickens?

  And if you really start going deep, you're like, "Wow, this is so beautiful." And there's certain things science can't explain yet.

• 49:07Speaker 02

  100%. Um, I love listening, shout out to Neil deGrasse Tyson.

• 49:12Ky Dickens?

  I'm so good.

• 49:13Speaker 02

  I love listening to his podcast as well. And he's had many amazing scientists on his podcast talking about, like, the frontiers of physics, just, it's starting to become very difficult

• 49:25Ky Dickens?

  Mm-hmm.

• 49:26Speaker 02

  because the truths that we're trying to uncover, it seems like nature is, like, trying to, like...

• 49:33Speaker 02

  It seems like nature is trying to like hide what the inner workings really are. And that's really interesting to me. Maybe not hide it, but conceal it through different, like, different ways of expressing itself. In physics, I've heard a lot of physicists being like a little bit tiffed about like, like, we've been pretty much asking the same questions for a really long time and trying to get to another level. But with this framework, with this materialistic framework that we're using, I have a hunch that we're gonna have to kind of switch that a little bit or pivot a little bit on that.

• 50:16Ky Dickens?

  Well, and I love that you brought up the anecdotal thing because for years, for centuries, for thousands of years, people understood the world by observing it.

• 50:24Speaker 02

  Exactly.

• 50:24Ky Dickens?

  And we're working on the big season three right now, which is looking at like rebirth and what happens after life. And one of the big deep dives, we went into like through the anthropology record of cultures around the world who didn't believe in rebirth or reincarnation as a belief. They would see, as people came back, birthmarks on the body of the young one that looked like XYZ uncle who just died. And they had the same personality. And then the little boys born, talking about this memory, that memory.

• 50:53Speaker 02

  Things that the little boys shouldn't know.

• 50:54Ky Dickens?

  No, right. Yeah.

• 50:55Speaker 02

  Even like, I was reading about the Dogon tribe in Africa and like how like scientists have gone deep into these caves that are like so, like thousands of years old. And there are star maps of like specifically the Sirius A, Sirius B star systems that like, they, you can't see that with the naked eye.

• 51:17Ky Dickens?

  No.

• 51:18Speaker 02

  And these carvings or drawings were done way before anyone could look at the sky with a telescope or any kind of technological invention that would let you be able to see how this star system actually is.

• 51:34Ky Dickens?

  It's so wild.

• 51:36Speaker 02

  It's so wild. I think we have a lot to learn from indigenous cultures.

• 51:40Ky Dickens?

  Yes.

• 51:41Speaker 02

  And even like specific quote unquote myths or stories that indigenous cultures have. It's very interesting that sometimes they really line up. Like, it's not explaining specifically the scientific thing.

• 51:57Ky Dickens?

  Right.

• 51:57Speaker 02

  But when you look at the way the story is and the specific points, it lines up really intricately with like ecological systems.

• 52:06Ky Dickens?

  Like the Great Flood.

• 52:07Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 52:08Ky Dickens?

  That's talked about in so many world religions.

• 52:09Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 52:10Ky Dickens?

  And the ice caps melt, the ice age was over. And there was a huge great flood.

• 52:15Speaker 02

  The whole Younger Dryas period and all of that. I find it, I think, I think we're moving towards a more holistic way of thinking about our past, which hopefully is going to inform how we perceive our future and how we create new systems of understanding our life around us. And that's why I love the telepathy tapes and I love what you have done and what you do. Because I feel like it's a great vehicle towards like going in that future direction of like, no, like, we kind of need to like reinvent the way that we see the world as human beings.

• 52:55Ky Dickens?

  Yes, 100%.

• 52:57Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 52:58Ky Dickens?

  Okay, so you've really explored a lot. I mean, really, you're a brilliant mind. You're a brilliant artist. So you are like the convergence of like everything that's really beautifully human.

• 53:07Speaker 02

  Thank you so much. Oh, my God.

• 53:09Ky Dickens?

  It's true. We have to wrap up, but how can people find you? Like, where do you want them to find you the most?

• 53:15Speaker 02

  I am gonna be playing some shows. I just put out an album called The Thread. That's Talk on the Hill is on that album. Yeah, I'm gonna be around, you know?

• 53:28Ky Dickens?

  So you're going on tour, though?

• 53:29Speaker 02

  I, I'm gonna be going on tour. It's not, it's not planned just yet.

• 53:34Ky Dickens?

  Okay.

• 53:34Speaker 02

  But I'm, I'm in the, I'm in the workings.

• 53:37Ky Dickens?

  You got a website, though?

• 53:38Speaker 02

  I do have a website, willow smith dot com. I have a Instagram, Willow Smith.

• 53:45Speaker 02

  Yeah, I'm, I'm just around, you know, doing, doing my little music thing.

• 53:50Ky Dickens?

  All right. They'll come find you. And I love Talk on the Hill. Thank you for writing it. And I can't wait for you to play it live and to hear the responses. Have people liked the song?

• 53:59Speaker 02

  Oh, my goodness, yes. And not many people know what it's about. You know what I mean? They just think it's like a fun summer jam.

• 54:06Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 54:06Speaker 02

  Which is awesome. But then when they realize like, oh, wow, there's like a whole, you know, I hope I can bring people into this beautiful world of what's possible. That you have so graciously just put so much work into bringing to the world. So I'm very grateful for you as well.

• 54:25Ky Dickens?

  Thank you.

• 54:25Speaker 02

  Thank you for having me.

• 54:26Ky Dickens?

  Thank you. That's it for this episode of The Talk Tracks. But new episodes will be released every Wednesday. So stay tuned as we work to unravel all the threads, even the veiled ones that knit together our reality. And please remember to stay kind, stay curious, and that being a true skeptic requires an open mind. To dive in deeper, subscribe to our Backstage Pass by visiting our website. With it, you'll unlock access to bonus content like telepathy tests, Ask Me Anything interviews with myself and guests. You'll be able to enjoy the podcast ad free, connect with other members on our Telepathy Tribe Discord, and hear and see exclusive content from the Telepathy Tapes Vault. Visit our website at thetelepathytapes.com for more info on how to subscribe to our Backstage Pass.

• 55:09Ky Dickens?

  Thank you to my amazing collaborators. Producers Catherine Ellis and Selena Kennedy, technical directing, audio mix and finishing by Jeremy Cole, opening and closing music by Elizabeth P. W., and original logo and cover art by Ben Condor Design. I'm Kai Dickens, your executive producer, writer, and host.