MFM Minisode 441

This week’s hometowns include a hot dog day gone wrong and anxiety-inducing parents. Support this podcast by shopping our latest sponsor deals and promotions at this link: https://bit.ly/3UFCn1g. See omnystudio.com/listener https://omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:06Georgia Hardstark?

  Everyone loves the idea of spending an afternoon curled up with a good book.

• 0:10Karen Kilgariff?

  Well, grow up, because it's almost impossible.

• 0:12Georgia Hardstark?

  Luckily, you can take your next great story with you on Audible.

• 0:15Karen Kilgariff?

  Audible has a massive selection of titles to choose from, including This American Life, new books by Michael Connelly, along with classics from Magathah Christie, and so much more.

• 0:24Georgia Hardstark?

  Whether you want a mystery, a true crime story, or something completely different, there's always something new to listen to.

• 0:29Karen Kilgariff?

  New members can start listening with a 30-day free trial at audible.com/mfm.

• 0:34Georgia Hardstark?

  Audible, stories that speak to you. Goodbye. The Hulu original series Phony is now streaming on Hulu and Hulu on Disney+ Sonny's life is pretty great until he wakes up from a car accident to a world that looks exactly like his, with one exception, his mom.

• 0:50Karen Kilgariff?

  Starring five-time Emmy nominee Connie Britton and Sam Nivola, this small town is hiding the mother of all mysteries just beneath the surface.

• 0:57Georgia Hardstark?

  Watch the Hulu original series, Phony.

• 1:00Karen Kilgariff?

  Now streaming on Hulu and Hulu on Disney Plus for bundle subscribers. Terms apply.

• 1:04Georgia Hardstark?

  Goodbye.

• 1:22Georgia Hardstark?

  Hello.

• 1:23Karen Kilgariff?

  And welcome.

• 1:24Georgia Hardstark?

  To my favorite murder.

• 1:25Karen Kilgariff?

  The minisode.

• 1:26Georgia Hardstark?

  Here it is.

• 1:27Karen Kilgariff?

  Look at this.

• 1:29Georgia Hardstark?

  Look at this.

• 1:30Karen Kilgariff?

  Look at it now.

• 1:31Georgia Hardstark?

  You can't, there's no video on this.

• 1:33Karen Kilgariff?

  Feast your eye.

• 1:34Georgia Hardstark?

  You're not, don't touch it with your eyes.

• 1:36Karen Kilgariff?

  Feast your eyeers. Eyeers.

• 1:40Georgia Hardstark?

  You want to go first?

• 1:40Karen Kilgariff?

  No, you have it.

• 1:41Georgia Hardstark?

  Okay.

• 1:41Karen Kilgariff?

  You've got it newscaster style right in your hands. You're excited.

• 1:45Georgia Hardstark?

  Because this is a spooky hometown ghost story.

• 1:48Karen Kilgariff?

  Okay.

• 1:48Georgia Hardstark?

  Hi, diddly ho, murderinos. It starts, is that the first time that's happened?

• 1:53Karen Kilgariff?

  I think so.

• 1:54Georgia Hardstark?

  Wow.

• 1:54Karen Kilgariff?

  Aside from when Ned Flanders did it originally.

• 1:56Georgia Hardstark?

  That's classic. In 1979, it just gets into it.

• 2:00Karen Kilgariff?

  My family moved to the coastal mountains of Oregon into a fairly new, single-wide trailer on a wooded piece of property with a creek running through it at nearly the end of a nine-mile

• 2:10Georgia Hardstark?

  Dirt road.

• 2:11Karen Kilgariff?

  Nine miles is too long.

• 2:12Georgia Hardstark?

  I know.

• 2:13Karen Kilgariff?

  As someone from the country.

• 2:14Georgia Hardstark?

  Driving 10 minutes just to get to your front door from the street.

• 2:18Karen Kilgariff?

  What kind of weed are you growing back there?

• 2:22Georgia Hardstark?

  They lived in that single wide while my dad built the house I would eventually grow up in. I never lived in the trailer, but all my siblings did. I'm the youngest of four. My two sisters shared a room and then my two-year-old brother slept on a little bed on the floor in my parents' room. For several nights, my brother would wake up complaining that someone was walking on him. Finally, my dad grew tired of this ridiculous complaint and took a turn sleeping on the floor to prove my brother was just being an irrational toddler.

• 2:50Karen Kilgariff?

  Uh oh.

• 2:50Georgia Hardstark?

  The next morning, he said he had a terrible night's sleep because someone had been stepping on him.

• 2:56Karen Kilgariff?

  The dad?

• 2:56Georgia Hardstark?

  Yeah.

• 2:57Karen Kilgariff?

  And they're nine miles away, just from the road to get to town.

• 3:01Georgia Hardstark?

  Run and get help. It's gonna be two hours.

• 3:02Karen Kilgariff?

  Um, yeah, if you're a nine-year-old and you need to run and get help.

• 3:06Georgia Hardstark?

  Yeah.

• 3:06Karen Kilgariff?

  See, you better put your Adidas on.

• 3:08Georgia Hardstark?

  Right.

• 3:08Karen Kilgariff?

  You're screwed.

• 3:09Georgia Hardstark?

  Not but a few nights later, oh, I love the way that's written. Not but a few nights later, my mom awoke suddenly and there, standing in front of her, was a little boy about eight years old, holding a medium-sized red rubber ball and staring at her.

• 3:23Karen Kilgariff?

  What?

• 3:24Georgia Hardstark?

  Haunted trailer. I mean, that's scary.

• 3:26Karen Kilgariff?

  What?

• 3:26Georgia Hardstark?

  Yeah.

• 3:27Karen Kilgariff?

  Just say it's a neighbor boy, please.

• 3:28Georgia Hardstark?

  It's not. My mom does not get spooked easily, so she just calmly stared at him and he simply stared back. When she blinked, he was gone. It's a fucking ghost story.

• 3:36Karen Kilgariff?

  Oy, yoy. Roz, get the Roz hotline. We have a ghosted story for you.

• 3:41Georgia Hardstark?

  My whole family somehow shrugged this off. I feel like when you're living there and you can't do anything about it, you just have to explain it away in your head so you can just get through the day and night.

• 3:51Karen Kilgariff?

  Yes, I love to also talk to that mom about what her childhood was like, that she's like, I think I'm just gonna go ahead and stare this ghost down. Have you ever heard that as an option of somebody that's like, I think there's a ghost at the end of my bed?

• 4:04Georgia Hardstark?

  That means the living people were scarier than the idea of a ghost.

• 4:06Karen Kilgariff?

  That's right. Badass mom times 25.

• 4:09Georgia Hardstark?

  Right.

• 4:10Karen Kilgariff?

  So then a few months later, the previous owners arrived at their door 80s drop by style.

• 4:15Georgia Hardstark?

  Like, that is so real. That is so real.

• 4:19Karen Kilgariff?

  Do you know what happened last night?

• 4:21Georgia Hardstark?

  No.

• 4:22Karen Kilgariff?

  I'm laying down after we record after I had food poisoning, a very tie tie, and about to go to sleep, and someone knocked on my door.

• 4:30Georgia Hardstark?

  Why?

• 4:30Karen Kilgariff?

  Right? So I, of course, freeze, the dogs go insane, and no one's there. And so then I have wait, and I'm like, hmm, what am I gonna do? And finally, I go look out the peephole, no one's there, I open it, ice cream.

• 4:43Georgia Hardstark?

  Is it ice cream?

• 4:44Karen Kilgariff?

  It's secret ice cream delivery.

• 4:45Georgia Hardstark?

  You forgot you ordered ice cream?

• 4:48Karen Kilgariff?

  I've stopped doing that.

• 4:48Georgia Hardstark?

  Okay.

• 4:49Karen Kilgariff?

  That I had to curb because it costs so much money.

• 4:51Georgia Hardstark?

  Yeah.

• 4:51Karen Kilgariff?

  No, I had been out of town, so I forgot to tell my house sitter to take stuff out of the mailbox. So it was mail with a little post-it note that said, please clean out your mailbox. The mailman had to door-deliver the mail because the mailbox was absolutely full.

• 5:05Georgia Hardstark?

  I hate when they ring your doorbell, though, like when you get a package delivered, it's like, I know.

• 5:09Karen Kilgariff?

  Yeah, just throw it there.

• 5:10Georgia Hardstark?

  I see it, okay.

• 5:11Karen Kilgariff?

  I'll be out there. But also, there's something about the late night.

• 5:14Georgia Hardstark?

  It's like an 80s knock. But it was a thing where you'd be like, hey, I grew up here, can I come in and see the house?

• 5:19Karen Kilgariff?

  Yes, totally.

• 5:20Georgia Hardstark?

  That's now a ploy, don't ever believe it.

• 5:22Karen Kilgariff?

  Of course not.

• 5:23Georgia Hardstark?

  But it totally used to be a thing.

• 5:25Karen Kilgariff?

  Completely.

• 5:25Georgia Hardstark?

  That was okay.

• 5:26Karen Kilgariff?

  Or also just like friends and acquaintances being like, hey, I was in the neighborhood, what's up?

• 5:30Georgia Hardstark?

  Right. So the old people, the previous owners, arrived at the door, 80s drop-by style, to see how they were getting along in their new house. Completely unprompted, they asked if any of them had seen the ghost of the little boy.

• 5:42Karen Kilgariff?

  Oh, shit.

• 5:42Georgia Hardstark?

  It was then that my mom was finally shook. The story goes, there was a town at the turn of the century up Langlois Mountain called Okey Town, which was a lumber milling town, so spooky already. The old incinerator is just up the road from my parents' house. There lived a boy named Raymond West, who was playing with his ball. When it rolled into the creek, he went after it and drowned.

• 6:04Karen Kilgariff?

  Horrible.

• 6:05Georgia Hardstark?

  To be clear, in the summer, this creek is safe as could be and rarely more than calf-deep, but in the winter and spring, it will easily sweep you away. My parents were able to find old news articles of the story in the library, and it all checked out. So he ran after the ball that they later saw him with.

• 6:20Karen Kilgariff?

  And now he's like, hey.

• 6:22Georgia Hardstark?

  You wanna play?

• 6:22Karen Kilgariff?

  Hey, you guys.

• 6:24Georgia Hardstark?

  Finally, when we were all living in the house my dad built, my sister was poking around at random books on our massive bookshelf when she found a small, old, tattered book she didn't recognize. It was an old elementary school primer, Dick and Jane style. And when she opened it, the name Raymond West was written in cursive several times throughout.

• 6:43Karen Kilgariff?

  Oh, my god.

• 6:45Georgia Hardstark?

  Thanks for trudging through that lengthy read. The local paper eventually did a story about it, and it's been a tale we tell in my family since I can remember. The trailer is still there, and it's still scary as hell to be alone in.

• 6:56Karen Kilgariff?

  Hell, no. Nine miles up the road.

• 6:59Georgia Hardstark?

  Love you ladies and your whole crew. Stay sexy and don't play near the creek in winter. Mira Bell.

• 7:04Karen Kilgariff?

  Wow. What a story.

• 7:07Georgia Hardstark?

  Ghost story for summer, summer ghost story.

• 7:08Karen Kilgariff?

  Yeah, summer ghost story.

• 7:10Georgia Hardstark?

  Can you guys send us more summer ghost stories?

• 7:12Karen Kilgariff?

  Yeah, you do not have to wait for fall. Here's a summer not ghost story. And it's timely to our main episode from Thursday. And the subject line is "Hot Dog Day Gone Wrong at the Health Department." And then it says "3 Minute Read." And it just starts, "Oh, hey. I've been listening to you since 2017, and I love you both. I work for a Department of Public Health in a large metro area. Our department is a shit show, and we have made local news multiple times in the past year, ranging from a nepotism scandal and false timekeeping to toxic mismanagement."

• 7:46Georgia Hardstark?

  Ouch.

• 7:47Karen Kilgariff?

  "The situation below is just one of the many somewhat unbelievable things that have happened here." And now, the rest of this is totally unbelievable. Not to accuse anybody of lying at all, but it is, as I was reading it, I was like, "You've got to be fucking kidding me."

• 8:01Georgia Hardstark?

  Okay.

• 8:01Karen Kilgariff?

  So, it was "Hot Dog Day", and then in parentheses, it says, "Why our health department had a hot dog day is beyond me."

• 8:07Georgia Hardstark?

  That's the opposite of health.

• 8:10Karen Kilgariff?

  It starts insane.

• 8:11Georgia Hardstark?

  Yeah.

• 8:12Karen Kilgariff?

  "Not many people were grabbing hot dogs, so one of my coworkers, feeling bad for the people who organized the event, got a vegetarian hot dog. She came to regret that decision because by that evening, she had developed food poisoning."

• 8:24Georgia Hardstark?

  Oh, no.

• 8:25Karen Kilgariff?

  "Back in our office, a new employee had just started and was setting up her cubicle. I guess our division director at the time thought he would show off by tossing a bottle of barbecue sauce in the air. Well, he hadn't noticed that the cap on the bottle was loose, so it flew off and barbecue sauce went everywhere."

• 8:44Georgia Hardstark?

  God.

• 8:45Karen Kilgariff?

  A lot of it landed on the new employee's desk.

• 8:47Georgia Hardstark?

  No.

• 8:47Karen Kilgariff?

  Getting on her new laptop and ruining some of her paperwork. A big glob landed on our carpeted office floor. Around the corner came my coworker, who doesn't like to wear shoes.

• 8:58Georgia Hardstark?

  Oh, no. That's a policy in an office. You must wear shoes.

• 9:04Karen Kilgariff?

  At the health department.

• 9:05Georgia Hardstark?

  Department.

• 9:06Karen Kilgariff?

  It's absolutely required at the health department.

• 9:09Georgia Hardstark?

  As a non-naked foot person, I am. This is the worst. This is my worst nightmare.

• 9:14Karen Kilgariff?

  At work. Sure enough, she slipped in the barbecue sauce. With her bare feet.

• 9:18Georgia Hardstark?

  Oh.

• 9:19Karen Kilgariff?

  And then that noise you made is the emoji where it looks like.

• 9:22Georgia Hardstark?

  Yeah.

• 9:23Karen Kilgariff?

  Like, kind of barfing.

• 9:24Georgia Hardstark?

  Yeah.

• 9:24Karen Kilgariff?

  And then it says, let me remind you that the food poisoning, barbecue sauce, and barefoot incidents all took place at a health department. Honestly, kind of embarrassing and kind of the thing that should only happen on TV. But in all seriousness, most of the people I work with are smart, hardworking people who are passionate about improving health outcomes in our community. The attacks on public health at the federal level are scary and disheartening. Some ways to support your local health department are interacting positively with their social media accounts and reporting misinformation in comment sections, talking with your friends and family about current health issues, and utilizing their services. And wearing fucking shoes. How about that? Number one.

• 10:05Georgia Hardstark?

  Uh huh.

• 10:05Karen Kilgariff?

  Let's put that at the top of the list. Shoes required. We're back in the email. A lot of health departments provide immunizations, safer sex supplies, Narcan, primary and dental care, and more. All of which are available to the public. I didn't know any of that.

• 10:20Georgia Hardstark?

  That's incredible.

• 10:21Karen Kilgariff?

  Yeah. And then it says, anyway, stay sexy and don't trust Hot Dog Day.

• 10:25Georgia Hardstark?

  Hot Dog Day.

• 10:26Karen Kilgariff?

  And then this is unsigned. And our producer Molly says, this is unsigned. I'm assuming because it doesn't make the company look great.

• 10:33Georgia Hardstark?

  Right. It sounds like an episode of Parks and Rec, though. Can we be honest?

• 10:37Karen Kilgariff?

  Completely. You can cast that so quickly. Can I just tell you very quickly that along the lines of the guy with the barbecue sauce, when I used to work on the daily talk show that I used to work on, my friend Vicki, who was a producer, she and I would meet before work and walk around my neighborhood. Hood for an hour to like get some exercise in.

• 10:56Georgia Hardstark?

  Yeah.

• 10:56Karen Kilgariff?

  Together. We both get ready at my house and we go to work, which was like three minutes from my house. And one morning we did that and we were in my car, ready to go to work. And I had one of my drinkable yogurts that I love. And we were talking and I started shaking it up, but the cap was off.

• 11:12Georgia Hardstark?

  No.

• 11:12Karen Kilgariff?

  So I literally in the Honda Fit.

• 11:15Georgia Hardstark?

  Yeah.

• 11:15Karen Kilgariff?

  Just shook a drinkable yogurt all over us and we both just.

• 11:19Georgia Hardstark?

  At least it was both of you though, not just her.

• 11:21Karen Kilgariff?

  It just went everywhere in the car. Cause you know, when you're like going to shake something that's kind of thick, you're like, oh, I have to kind of really shake.

• 11:28Georgia Hardstark?

  Yeah. You don't hold back. Oh my God.

• 11:30Karen Kilgariff?

  It was like, I was doing like a champagne spray in the car with drinkable yogurt.

• 11:36Georgia Hardstark?

  First thing in the morning, right before work.

• 11:38Karen Kilgariff?

  And we just both like look at each other dripping in yogurt and just get back out of the car. Go back inside. We have to get ready all over again.

• 11:45Georgia Hardstark?

  Smells so, oh my God.

• 11:47Karen Kilgariff?

  Insane.

• 11:47Georgia Hardstark?

  That's amazing.

• 11:50Karen Kilgariff?

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• 12:31Karen Kilgariff?

  And when you're ready to launch, use offer code MURDER to save 10% off your first purchase of a website or domain. Goodbye. We've all had moments where dealing with healthcare or insurance feels completely overwhelming.

• 12:43Georgia Hardstark?

  You're sick, worried about someone you love, trying to understand what comes next and suddenly you're spending hours on hold, filling out paperwork and trying to figure out who to call.

• 12:51Karen Kilgariff?

  Research shows patients spend the equivalent of an eight hour workday every month coordinating their own care.

• 12:57Georgia Hardstark?

  Nobody hands you a roadmap when you're dealing with a diagnosis or ongoing health issues.

• 13:02Karen Kilgariff?

  That's why there's Solace Health.

• 13:03Georgia Hardstark?

  Solace provides personal healthcare advocates who average 16 years of healthcare experience and can help you get answers fast.

• 13:10Karen Kilgariff?

  Think of them as someone in your corner who understands the healthcare system and can handle the logistics while you focus on your health.

• 13:15Georgia Hardstark?

  They can help with appointments, insurance denials, medical bills, treatment options, and understanding doctor recommendations.

• 13:21Karen Kilgariff?

  Research shows 92% of patients report a positive impact on their care from working with an advocate.

• 13:27Georgia Hardstark?

  Advocacy improves outcomes and Solace advocates are covered by insurance nationwide.

• 13:32Karen Kilgariff?

  Eligibility varies by insurance plan.

• 13:34Georgia Hardstark?

  Advocates do not provide medical or legal advice or services must be 18 years or older.

• 13:38Karen Kilgariff?

  Go to solacehealth.com/murder to see if you qualify.

• 13:42Georgia Hardstark?

  It takes about two minutes and it's covered by insurance.

• 13:44Karen Kilgariff?

  That's S-O-L-A-C-E health.com/murder.

• 13:48Georgia Hardstark?

  Goodbye.

• 13:52Georgia Hardstark?

  This is called How My Parents Helped Give Me Anxiety. We all have one.

• 13:56Karen Kilgariff?

  Let's all read our emails now.

• 13:59Georgia Hardstark?

  Dear Karen, Georgia, and the Exactly Right Family, I started listening to MFM at episode 16, Blood Murder 16 Magic. Okay. And while that episode freaked me out because you talked about Chandra Levy and I was a new graduate living alone in DC, I knew I had stumbled across something special.

• 14:17Georgia Hardstark?

  I have relied on hearing your voices to get me through a lot, from simply looking for a laugh or needing a savior from boredom at my desk job to calming my ever-present anxiety. I have listened to the entire catalog four times and it will soon be five with the rewind episodes.

• 14:32Karen Kilgariff?

  Girl.

• 14:33Georgia Hardstark?

  Wow, thank you for the numbers.

• 14:34Karen Kilgariff?

  I mean, you are putting in serious numbers for us. Thank you for my home.

• 14:38Georgia Hardstark?

  You're the street team.

• 14:40Karen Kilgariff?

  Thank you for the house I live in.

• 14:42Georgia Hardstark?

  Then it says, thank you for more than I can express. So, yeah, great.

• 14:45Karen Kilgariff?

  Back at you.

• 14:46Georgia Hardstark?

  Speaking of that ever-present anxiety, I have a story about 90s parents that may indicate why I'm now heavily medicated.

• 14:53Karen Kilgariff?

  Ditto.

• 14:54Georgia Hardstark?

  I don't want to call them trash parents because they are still my best friends, but when I heard a recent mini-sode, I finally decided to send this in.

• 15:01Karen Kilgariff?

  Cannot wait for a trash parents story. Also, parents plural, like it's not just trash dad.

• 15:05Georgia Hardstark?

  Yeah, there's nobody looking out for you. For context, my name is Katie and my sister's name is Jenny. This is important for the story. When I was a child, my dad chose to get us to behave in an interesting way. The house I grew up in backed into a wooded area. When we would misbehave or complain, my dad would say, shh, do you hear that? That's Sadie. She's your sister, but she misbehaved and now she lives in the woods.

• 15:30Karen Kilgariff?

  No.

• 15:31Georgia Hardstark?

  You cannot threaten your child with the fake fate of another child.

• 15:38Karen Kilgariff?

  Who's banished?

• 15:39Georgia Hardstark?

  Banished to the forest. Obviously, a terrifying thing to say to your small child. I wasn't sure if I believed it, but why risk it, right? At a young age, I knew I wanted to stay out of the forest. When my little sister got a little older, he would say the same thing. Shh, do you hear that? That's Penny. She's your sister, but she misbehaved and now she lives in the woods. Luckily, little sisters usually have the ability to do what older sisters can't, which is pushback on authority figures.

• 16:04Karen Kilgariff?

  That's right.

• 16:04Georgia Hardstark?

  Yay. She simply told him it wasn't true and it became a long lasting family joke. Over the years, if I got frustrated with my parents, I would joke that I was going to join Sadie in the woods. Or if he heard a weird noise, we'd say, oh, that's Sadie or oh, that's Penny. Years later, I had to write a scary story for one of my French college classes and I based mine on this sweet quote, childhood memory. That's actually, that'd be a great story.

• 16:29Karen Kilgariff?

  It's great. It's kind of pet cemetery.

• 16:31Georgia Hardstark?

  Yeah.

• 16:32Karen Kilgariff?

  Yeah.

• 16:32Georgia Hardstark?

  But with sisters. Let's just say the professor looked very concerned when she returned my paper. Needless to say, you got to base it in reality. Base fiction reality and it's believable.

• 16:42Karen Kilgariff?

  Right, what you know.

• 16:42Georgia Hardstark?

  Needless to say, in my Adele ears, I have had lots of therapy and I am happily medicated. Stay sexy and maybe find a different way to get kids to behave without giving them trauma. Katie. P.S. I made my mom a murderino. Sorry for spilling the beans, mom. Love you.

• 16:59Karen Kilgariff?

  What if her mom's name was Sadie?

• 17:01Georgia Hardstark?

  Oh, yeah. Send your mom to the woods. Oh, my God.

• 17:04Karen Kilgariff?

  That's so good. I have already told the story of Adrienne saying to her kids, "Be careful, the man is watching." Which is like, if you have more than one child-

• 17:11Georgia Hardstark?

  That sounds like religion, though, honestly.

• 17:14Karen Kilgariff?

  It is. That literally is. It's Catholicism in a nutshell. But also, like, when you're in public and then you're, there's three individuals who haven't been here for very long-

• 17:24Georgia Hardstark?

  Yeah.

• 17:25Karen Kilgariff?

  You've gotta get them to, like, snap to-

• 17:28Georgia Hardstark?

  Totally.

• 17:29Karen Kilgariff?

  For their own safety and everybody else's, like, sanity.

• 17:32Georgia Hardstark?

  You've gotta threaten those kids.

• 17:33Karen Kilgariff?

  You've got to make them insane. All right. This email's subject line is, "Listen to that little voice." It says, "Hi Karen in Georgia. Thanks for keeping me entertained on all my long runs. I'm one of those crazy people who runs marathons for fun."

• 17:48Georgia Hardstark?

  Hi me.

• 17:49Karen Kilgariff?

  How? And then it just says, "But let's get into my story." "A few years ago, I went to a coworker's wedding in Columbia, South Carolina. After the ceremony, the plan was to hit the college bars, since it's a big college town, but first we were supposed to meet the bridal party at the bar in their hotel. My group was staying at a more budget-friendly spot, so we grabbed an Uber over. When we got there, we couldn't get in touch with anyone from the bridal party, and the front desk informed us that the hotel bar was closed. So we decided to head out on our own and explore the local college bars." Would you go to a college bar now?

• 18:21Georgia Hardstark?

  Definitely. Absolutely. Yes.

• 18:23Karen Kilgariff?

  Good times.

• 18:24Georgia Hardstark?

  Maybe. Yeah, I would.

• 18:25Karen Kilgariff?

  Yeah?

• 18:26Georgia Hardstark?

  Maybe I'm thinking of a dive bar, though. Like, a sports bar that's really loud and sticky that actually doesn't sound great. Actually, you know, yeah, you know why? Because they always have quiz night. Every night is quiz night, and you walk in and it's so loud.

• 18:38Karen Kilgariff?

  Yes.

• 18:39Georgia Hardstark?

  Okay, the answer's no.

• 18:40Karen Kilgariff?

  It's a no?

• 18:40Georgia Hardstark?

  Yeah.

• 18:41Karen Kilgariff?

  There was a bar, boys I went to high school with went to Columbia, this was, like, in the late 80s, and there was a dive bar that they used to go to that beers were 25 cents until the first person peed. I've told you the story?

• 18:53Georgia Hardstark?

  No.

• 18:54Karen Kilgariff?

  Yes.

• 18:54Georgia Hardstark?

  Oh, that would be so hard for me.

• 18:56Karen Kilgariff?

  So if you were the person that ruined it, like, everyone in the whole bar hated you, but then people got so drunk. They were like-

• 19:02Georgia Hardstark?

  Yeah.

• 19:02Karen Kilgariff?

  People were, like, beyond shitfaced.

• 19:04Georgia Hardstark?

  You know someone had a diaper on, for sure, too. Right?

• 19:08Karen Kilgariff?

  They, right?

• 19:08Georgia Hardstark?

  Somebody that goes to New Year's in Times Square.

• 19:11Karen Kilgariff?

  Oh, my god. Okay.

• 19:12Georgia Hardstark?

  Okay.

• 19:12Karen Kilgariff?

  We ended up in a place packed with 21-year-old babies when we noticed two people, a man and a woman, who looked closer to our age, standing at the back bar. Naturally, we started chatting. They told us they were siblings. She worked at the college, and he was visiting from the military. They suggested we drink at his hotel bar, which sounded sketchy, but we were trying to be polite.

• 19:32Georgia Hardstark?

  No, don't be polite.

• 19:34Karen Kilgariff?

  Don't. While we were still chatting, I happened to spot a guy wearing a brewery t-shirt from my hometown in Maryland. I got excited and started talking to him. That's when things got weird. The woman suddenly stormed up to me, got inches from my face, and started yelling at me for, quote, "ignoring her brother."

• 19:51Georgia Hardstark?

  What?

• 19:51Karen Kilgariff?

  I was stunned. Even worse, the way she positioned herself between me and my drink set off alarm bells. She got so close that I could no longer see my glass. Something in my gut told me that this wasn't just weird, it was dangerous.

• 20:05Georgia Hardstark?

  Oh, my god.

• 20:05Karen Kilgariff?

  I quickly grabbed my friend Lindsay, left my drink on the bar, and walked out. But as we got to the front door, that little voice in my head spoke up, "Turn around." I did, and saw the guy was following me. His, quote-unquote, "sister" was nowhere in sight. Outside, I spotted a group of guys standing on the sidewalk. I walked straight into their circle and said, "I'm with you, pretend you know me." Without missing a beat, they played along, and the guy walked right past without saying a word. To this day, I don't know for sure what their intentions were, but I'm convinced they tried to drug me and had something sinister planned.

• 20:40Georgia Hardstark?

  Absolutely.

• 20:41Karen Kilgariff?

  I mean, it's so weird.

• 20:43Georgia Hardstark?

  So creepy.

• 20:44Karen Kilgariff?

  Also, when you meet people and they're like, "We're brother and sister," but you're like, "You're not, though."

• 20:48Georgia Hardstark?

  I wouldn't go to a fucking bar with my brother.

• 20:53Georgia Hardstark?

  What would we do? We wouldn't do that.

• 20:55Karen Kilgariff?

  Yeah, what are you doing?

• 20:56Georgia Hardstark?

  No.

• 20:56Karen Kilgariff?

  The kicker, the hotel they were trying to take us to, the one with the bar?

• 21:00Georgia Hardstark?

  Yeah.

• 21:01Karen Kilgariff?

  It was the same hotel that actually had no bar.

• 21:03Georgia Hardstark?

  Oh, like, the original bar?

• 21:05Karen Kilgariff?

  That they planned to go to, and then they were like, "Oh."

• 21:07Georgia Hardstark?

  My god.

• 21:09Karen Kilgariff?

  I hadn't put the red flags together in the moment, but thankfully, I listened to my gut.

• 21:14Georgia Hardstark?

  Yeah.

• 21:14Karen Kilgariff?

  And then it just says, "Danielle."

• 21:15Georgia Hardstark?

  That's incredible. I also do love and think everyone should utilize, no matter what, the "pretend I'm with you."

• 21:22Karen Kilgariff?

  Yes.

• 21:22Georgia Hardstark?

  To groups of people, if you're alone and you're scared, like, they will follow through with it. Don't worry about being weird or embarrassing.

• 21:29Karen Kilgariff?

  No.

• 21:30Georgia Hardstark?

  Get people gathered around you to help you.

• 21:33Karen Kilgariff?

  Yes, and like more than one so that people have a chance. Also, it's like whether a man or a woman, someone maybe a little larger in stature.

• 21:40Georgia Hardstark?

  Yeah, or like if you're two people who are alone, get together. Yeah, I just, I'm a really big, I'm a really big advocate of that.

• 21:47Karen Kilgariff?

  And I think that people these days, especially because of social media, are just getting hipper and hipper to like, if somebody came up to you and said that, you would be all over it.

• 21:54Georgia Hardstark?

  Absolutely, yeah.

• 21:57Karen Kilgariff?

  We've all had moments where dealing with healthcare or insurance feels completely overwhelming.

• 22:02Georgia Hardstark?

  You're sick, worried about someone you love, trying to understand what comes next, and suddenly you're spending hours on hold, filling out paperwork and trying to figure out who to call.

• 22:10Karen Kilgariff?

  Research shows patients spend the equivalent of an eight-hour workday every month coordinating their own care.

• 22:16Georgia Hardstark?

  Nobody hands you a roadmap when you're dealing with a diagnosis or ongoing health issues.

• 22:21Karen Kilgariff?

  That's why there's Solace Health.

• 22:22Georgia Hardstark?

  Solace provides personal healthcare advocates who average 16 years of healthcare experience and can help you get answers fast.

• 22:28Karen Kilgariff?

  Think of them as someone in your corner who understands the healthcare system and can handle the logistics while you focus on your health.

• 22:34Georgia Hardstark?

  They can help with appointments, insurance denials, medical bills, treatment options, and understanding doctor recommendations.

• 22:40Karen Kilgariff?

  Research shows 92% of patients report a positive impact on their care from working with an advocate.

• 22:46Georgia Hardstark?

  Advocacy improves outcomes, and Solace advocates are covered by insurance nationwide.

• 22:51Karen Kilgariff?

  Eligibility varies by insurance plan.

• 22:53Georgia Hardstark?

  Advocates do not provide medical or legal advice or services, must be 18 years or older.

• 22:57Karen Kilgariff?

  Go to solacehealth.com/murder to see if you qualify.

• 23:01Georgia Hardstark?

  It takes about two minutes and it's covered by insurance.

• 23:03Karen Kilgariff?

  That's S-O-L-A-C-E health.com/murder.

• 23:07Georgia Hardstark?

  Goodbye.

• 23:08Karen Kilgariff?

  Vacation planning should feel like a breeze, not a deep dive into countless travel sites searching for the best deal.

• 23:14Georgia Hardstark?

  With CheapCaribbean's Budget Beach Finder, you can search every destination and every date, all in one search.

• 23:20Karen Kilgariff?

  You'll save time and money with the Budget Beach Finder.

• 23:22Georgia Hardstark?

  Say goodbye to endless scrolling and tab hopping and hello to Budget Beach Bliss at your fingertips.

• 23:27Karen Kilgariff?

  Go to CheapCaribbean.com to try out the Budget Beach Finder and see just how stress-free vacation planning should be.

• 23:34Georgia Hardstark?

  Goodbye.

• 23:37Georgia Hardstark?

  All right, here's my last one, and it's kind of how I want my life to be one day.

• 23:40Karen Kilgariff?

  Okay.

• 23:41Georgia Hardstark?

  Beach combing treasure. Hi, ladies, first time writer here. My sister told me about your podcast back in 2016, and I started a few episodes in and have been along for the ride ever since.

• 23:51Karen Kilgariff?

  Wow.

• 23:52Georgia Hardstark?

  Georgia was talking about mudlarking on Mini So426 and explained how our brains can pick out unnatural, man-made shapes in a beach slash rocky setting. That made me think of my favorite beach combing find, and I had to write in.

• 24:05Karen Kilgariff?

  Ooh, I'm so excited. Whatever this is, I'm gonna love it.

• 24:07Georgia Hardstark?

  It's Victorian.

• 24:09Karen Kilgariff?

  Is it really?

• 24:10Georgia Hardstark?

  We have been spending summers in Prince Edward Island since buying our little seaside cottage in Grahamhead, P E I in 2020. Okay, let me have that fucking life, please.

• 24:20Karen Kilgariff?

  Give it over.

• 24:21Georgia Hardstark?

  I need that. And then I go beach combing every day.

• 24:23Karen Kilgariff?

  Yeah, exactly.

• 24:24Georgia Hardstark?

  Our three kids have loved every second spent by the water and playing on the beach. One of our favorite things to do is hunt for sea glass and random little treasures, and she wrote treasures, that wash up. We have collected dozens of mason jars of sea glass and other strange finds, buttons, Lego pieces, marbles, cow teeth, seal bones.

• 24:43Karen Kilgariff?

  Sorry.

• 24:43Georgia Hardstark?

  Et cetera.

• 24:44Karen Kilgariff?

  Hold on. She went off a cliff there. Cow teeth are horrifying.

• 24:50Georgia Hardstark?

  On a beach.

• 24:51Karen Kilgariff?

  Unless I'm just thinking of horse teeth.

• 24:52Georgia Hardstark?

  Yeah, horse teeth are terrifying.

• 24:53Karen Kilgariff?

  I mean, either way.

• 24:55Georgia Hardstark?

  Why would cow teeth be on the beach?

• 24:56Karen Kilgariff?

  What are they doing to those cows?

• 24:57Georgia Hardstark?

  They jumped overboard on the, and then they...

• 25:01Karen Kilgariff?

  You know that bridge in England where dogs jump off?

• 25:04Georgia Hardstark?

  Oh, I don't want to talk about that.

• 25:05Karen Kilgariff?

  Very sad, but what if, what if there's like, on Prince Edward Island, there's like...

• 25:09Georgia Hardstark?

  Don't go over there, that's where the cows jump.

• 25:11Karen Kilgariff?

  Oh, jeez.

• 25:12Georgia Hardstark?

  Cow jumping.

• 25:13Karen Kilgariff?

  Sorry, wait, and seal bones?

• 25:15Georgia Hardstark?

  Yeah.

• 25:15Karen Kilgariff?

  Dark.

• 25:16Georgia Hardstark?

  Over the years, in this past summer, I found the coolest thing.

• 25:18Karen Kilgariff?

  A big dead seal carcass.

• 25:20Georgia Hardstark?

  It was a whole cow dead. It was so cool.

• 25:23Karen Kilgariff?

  It was a cow hugging a seal.

• 25:24Georgia Hardstark?

  I knew you'd love it. My husband and the kids were up ahead getting a head start on finding the good stuff while I dawdled behind. You always gotta be a dawdler, kind of fresh shit. Just as we were about to head back to the cottage, I spotted a little white fleck that resembled a teeny person up ahead in the sand and rocks. I immediately went up to it to check it out, and it was this little white ceramic lady. I picked her up and couldn't believe what a random thing it was to find. It was like a little, it sounds like a porcelain doll, almost, like figurine. Unsure of what this was, I posted her on my Instagram and a follower commented that she was a very rare find and gave me the name of what it was. It turns out this little beauty was a rare ceramic doll made in the Victorian era, made between

• 26:07Georgia Hardstark?

  1850 and 1920, according to Wikipedia, called a frozen Charlotte.

• 26:12Karen Kilgariff?

  Oh, have you heard of that?

• 26:14Georgia Hardstark?

  No. There's too much info about them to include it all in this email, but the gist is that they were made after a poem called "A Corpse Going to a Ball" by Seba Smith. It was published in 1843 in the newspaper, and it was about a young girl freezing to death in New York in 1840 while on her way to a New York's Eve ball. She didn't listen to her mother when she told her to bundle up and she froze on the sled next to her date, Charlie.

• 26:39Karen Kilgariff?

  Jesus.

• 26:40Georgia Hardstark?

  Poshinary tale.

• 26:42Karen Kilgariff?

  Please, please bundle up on your sled.

• 26:44Georgia Hardstark?

  You're gonna die. The dolls were made as a reminder for children to listen to their parents and be obedient. Oh, it just, it goes back farther than the 90s.

• 26:54Karen Kilgariff?

  So much further, yeah, we thought we had it bad.

• 26:56Georgia Hardstark?

  They were very inexpensive to buy and were tiny enough to fit into a jewelry box, making them super popular with children at the time. I guess some people would also bake them into cakes, kind of like morbid money cakes. According to the internet, you could also get little caskets for them as well.

• 27:11Karen Kilgariff?

  What are we talking about?

• 27:13Georgia Hardstark?

  I mean, Victorians were fucking goth as shit.

• 27:15Karen Kilgariff?

  They so were, but I just feel like I would have heard about this before.

• 27:19Georgia Hardstark?

  I know.

• 27:19Karen Kilgariff?

  I'm so jealous.

• 27:20Georgia Hardstark?

  No. Anywho, she may be a little terrifying and quite possibly a lot haunted, but we have her displayed on a shelf at the cottage with all of our other weird and wonderful beach finds, and we love her. Thanks for reading this. You got me through some dark times after losing my dad in 2018. I picked up a hobby of embroidery and now have been selling it for almost six years.

• 27:41Karen Kilgariff?

  Hell, yes.

• 27:42Georgia Hardstark?

  Doing that and listening to you both and your humor has been such a great distraction from everything I was going through. Can't thank you enough. Love you, ladies. Stay sexy and check those beaches for creepy little Victorian dolls. Meg, Peterborough, Ontario, Canada. And she's at Embroidery by Meg Elliott. And also, she sent us a photo of the doll.

• 28:01Karen Kilgariff?

  Oh, my God.

• 28:02Georgia Hardstark?

  So we'll include it on the Instagram.

• 28:04Karen Kilgariff?

  Yeah, we'll post that up.

• 28:05Georgia Hardstark?

  And we'll tag you, Meg.

• 28:05Karen Kilgariff?

  Oh, my God, I'm so excited. Maybe she should make an embroidery of a frozen Charlotte that we can put on our shelves behind us.

• 28:13Georgia Hardstark?

  It's this treasure.

• 28:14Karen Kilgariff?

  Treasure. And then, but it's like just a dead girl in a slug.

• 28:18Georgia Hardstark?

  We place a special order?

• 28:20Karen Kilgariff?

  Can we place a special order that you ship to a stat, Meg? That's so cool.

• 28:25Georgia Hardstark?

  Yeah.

• 28:25Karen Kilgariff?

  What a feeling where you're like, oh, that's just another little piece of white shell.

• 28:29Georgia Hardstark?

  Yeah.

• 28:30Karen Kilgariff?

  And it's like, no, it's a whole fucking statue.

• 28:31Georgia Hardstark?

  It's an entire email to my favorite murder.

• 28:33Karen Kilgariff?

  Oh, amazing. Okay, this email's subject line is Johnny, Get the Gun. And it just starts, "I've grown up in an Irish Catholic family where my grandma had 16 first cousins, most of whom were badass women who taught me how to fuck politeness from a young age. I had 27 cousins, so go to hell." Just kidding.

• 28:54Georgia Hardstark?

  How many do I have? Four? I have like 12-ish.

• 28:55Karen Kilgariff?

  I've met a good percentage of your cousins, I feel like.

• 28:58Georgia Hardstark?

  You have?

• 28:59Karen Kilgariff?

  My great-grandma Franny, Aunt Dottie, and Aunt Johnny were sisters who decided to live together in their 70s when their husbands had either passed or left. And then in the preface, it says, "For the better." It says, "They lived in Downey, California, near a big, open park. And one night, Franny woke up to someone trying to break into the house through the window above her head. She woke her sisters, and once they realized what was going on, Dottie screamed, 'Johnny, get the gun,' thankfully scaring off the intruders."

• 29:29Georgia Hardstark?

  Hell, yeah.

• 29:30Karen Kilgariff?

  What the men didn't know was that none of these brilliant ladies had ever owned or shot a gun in their life.

• 29:36Georgia Hardstark?

  That is so smart.

• 29:38Karen Kilgariff?

  Dottie's quick thinking likely saved their lives because when they tried to call the police, they realized the phone lines had been cut.

• 29:45Georgia Hardstark?

  That's so sinister.

• 29:46Karen Kilgariff?

  Which is honestly always the scariest part. What were these people planning?

• 29:51Georgia Hardstark?

  Yeah.

• 29:51Karen Kilgariff?

  Well, and also, I'm sorry, but to track it, and I don't know what the timing on this is, but it makes me think that's something the night stalker did.

• 29:59Georgia Hardstark?

  Totally.

• 30:00Karen Kilgariff?

  And it's in Downey.

• 30:02Georgia Hardstark?

  Yeah, yep, okay, you're right.

• 30:03Karen Kilgariff?

  Anyway.

• 30:04Georgia Hardstark?

  100%.

• 30:04Karen Kilgariff?

  Okay, anyway, the phone lines have been cut. Once the police finally arrived after using the neighbor's phone, they said the men likely watched their house for days or weeks from the nearby park, choosing a house with three older women who might have money and planned to end their lives or worse.

• 30:20Georgia Hardstark?

  Fuck, for sure.

• 30:21Karen Kilgariff?

  Thank you for creating a community. So we're just out of that story now. That's it.

• 30:25Georgia Hardstark?

  Oh, my God.

• 30:26Karen Kilgariff?

  These sisters outsmarted these pieces of shit.

• 30:29Georgia Hardstark?

  Johnny, get the gun.

• 30:30Karen Kilgariff?

  Get the gun. Suddenly, everyone's from the Souths for some reason.

• 30:35Georgia Hardstark?

  Everyone's a cartoon fucking southerner.

• 30:38Karen Kilgariff?

  And then it just says, "Thank you for creating a community for current and future badass women to come together. I know Franny, Dottie, and Johnny would absolutely love this fuckward murder podcast. Stay sexy and get yourself an imaginary gun, Amanda."

• 30:52Georgia Hardstark?

  That's so good.

• 30:54Karen Kilgariff?

  Woo, woo. This one's to Franny, Dottie, and Johnny.

• 30:57Georgia Hardstark?

  Thanks, guys. Do you have stories like that or anything else?

• 31:00Karen Kilgariff?

  Anything. Operating phone line cut.

• 31:01Georgia Hardstark?

  Yeah.

• 31:02Karen Kilgariff?

  Have you ever been a phone line operator or like a, were you a 911 operator?

• 31:06Georgia Hardstark?

  Oh, my God.

• 31:07Karen Kilgariff?

  Oh, tell us everything.

• 31:08Georgia Hardstark?

  Good lord.

• 31:09Karen Kilgariff?

  That you can legally tell us.

• 31:10Georgia Hardstark?

  Please.

• 31:11Karen Kilgariff?

  And send it to myfavoritemurder@gmail.

• 31:12Georgia Hardstark?

  And stay sexy.

• 31:13Karen Kilgariff?

  And don't get murdered.

• 31:14Georgia Hardstark?

  Goodbye.

• 31:16Karen Kilgariff?

  Elvis, do you want a cookie? Ah.

• 31:24Karen Kilgariff?

  This has been an Exactly Right Production.

• 31:26Georgia Hardstark?

  Our senior producers are Alejandra Keck and Molly Smith.

• 31:29Karen Kilgariff?

  Our editor is Aristotle Acevedo.

• 31:31Georgia Hardstark?

  This episode was mixed by Liana Scolacci.

• 31:33Karen Kilgariff?

  Email your hometowns to [email protected].

• 31:36Georgia Hardstark?

  And follow the show on Instagram at MyFavoriteMurder.

• 31:39Karen Kilgariff?

  Listen to My Favorite Murder on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

• 31:43Georgia Hardstark?

  And now you can watch us on Exactly Right's YouTube page, and while you're there, please like and subscribe.

• 31:47Karen Kilgariff?

  Goodbye.

• 31:48Georgia Hardstark?

  Goodbye.

• 31:55Karen Kilgariff?

  Vacation planning should feel like a breeze, not a deep dive into countless travel sites searching for the best deal.

• 32:01Georgia Hardstark?

  With CheapCaribbean's Budget Beach Finder, you can search every destination and every date all in one search.

• 32:06Karen Kilgariff?

  You'll save time and money with the Budget Beach Finder.

• 32:09Georgia Hardstark?

  Say goodbye to endless scrolling and tab hopping and hello to Budget Beach Bliss at your fingertips.

• 32:14Karen Kilgariff?

  Go to CheapCaribbean.com to try out the Budget Beach Finder and see just how stress-free vacation planning should be.

• 32:20Georgia Hardstark?

  Goodbye. You know a favorite M-word? Magnesium.

• 32:24Karen Kilgariff?

  Like the kind that's in Dr. Teal's magnesium spray.

• 32:27Georgia Hardstark?

  Made from a proprietary blend of topical minerals, it's designed to relax and prepare you for a night of rest.

• 32:32Karen Kilgariff?

  If you need a reset after your day, make Dr. Teal's magnesium spray part of your nighttime routine.

• 32:37Georgia Hardstark?

  Generously spritz each foot before bed and you'll be all set. I've actually started doing this and I'm obsessed with magnesium. It does everything.

• 32:45Karen Kilgariff?

  Something like this is just like, it's simple, it's easy, and it actually works.

• 32:48Georgia Hardstark?

  Totally. For wellness you can feel, find Dr. Teal's magnesium spray online or in your local bath aisle. Goodbye.

• 32:55Speaker 02

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