Ep. 923: Wild Horse (Mis)Management, Dr. Randall Hunts Austria, and Fishing as a Constitutional Right

Steven Rinella and the MeatEater Crew discuss: Fishing with drones; hunting in Austria; Tim Walz: scourge of miners; constitutional rights to hunt and fish; roadless rule; and more! Presented by Can-Am: maker of the best ATVs, SxS, and Utility Vehicles www.can-am.brp.com http://www.can-am.brp.com Connect with Steve https://www.themeateater.com/authors/steven-rinella and The MeatEater Podcast Network https://www.youtube.com/@MeatEaterPodcastNetwork Steve on Instagram https://www.instagram.com/stevenrinella and Twitter https://twitter.com/stevenrinella?lang=en MeatEater on Instagram https://www.instagram.com/meateater, Facebook https://www.facebook.com/StevenRinellaMeatEater/, Twitter https://twitter.com/MeatEaterTV?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor, and YouTube https://www.youtube.com/@MeatEaterPodcastNetwork See omnystudio.com/listener https://omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

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• 0:04Speaker 01

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• 0:35Speaker 02

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• 1:41Steven Rinella?

  Welcome to the news show. This week, we've got Randall goes to Austria and tears that place a new one. Meat Eater Live, the Christmas tour is even realer than Santa. Roadless rule updates. Does banning drone use for shark fishing save swimmers from getting mauled by sharks? The wild horse situation is out of control in the American West. The Trump administration is taking steps to fix it, and some people are, of course, pissed about that. Colorado voters will have a chance to help right the ship in November. An old dead dude got found in the woods a long time ago, thanks to a forest fire, which kind of grabs you by the boo boo, and more. Now, onto our news. I'll tell you what our news is.

• 2:26Steven Rinella?

  One of the pieces of our news. Meat Eater Live, the Christmas tour is coming your way. We are in a pre, pre-sales phase here.

• 2:39Steven Rinella?

  It's a pre, pre-sales phase.

• 2:43Steven Rinella?

  Meaning, these tickets are not for sale. Soon, there will be a pre-sale, and in the genius of marketers, that means they're for sale. Then, they will become more for sale.

• 2:59Speaker 06

  So you can't buy them now?

• 3:01Steven Rinella?

  It's pre, pre-sale.

• 3:02Speaker 06

  Right.

• 3:03Speaker 07

  Okay.

• 3:03Speaker 06

  Can I buy them? But they will be for sale during the pre-sale and the sale.

• 3:08Steven Rinella?

  They go on sale at the pre-sale.

• 3:13Steven Rinella?

  They remain on sale at the sale.

• 3:18Steven Rinella?

  We're pre, pre-sale. So, there's nothing you can do.

• 3:24Speaker 06

  So there's a pre, pre-sale, non-sale period?

• 3:27Steven Rinella?

  Correct.

• 3:29Speaker 07

  The more, the more confusing it gets.

• 3:31Steven Rinella?

  If you want, no, I'm gonna clean it up. I'm gonna tell you about tickets that you cannot buy. But you can mark your calendar. On September 14th, you can buy them. On some other date later, you can buy them even more.

• 3:51Steven Rinella?

  Monday, December 14th, we will be in Grand Rapids, Michigan, where I graduated from regular college. This is my third try, my third school. 20 Monroe Live, that's, that's the venue we're gonna be at. Grand Rapids, Michigan. That's gonna be a hoop.

• 4:09Steven Rinella?

  We will be joined by the last American smelt dipper, Matt Drolls. I've already got my, our special guest lined up for the night there. Tuesday, December 15th, Milwaukee, Wisconsin, Turner Hall. That's gonna be a hoop. These are guaranteed laugh nights. You are guaranteed, I challenge you to find someone that went to the Christmas show and would give it a thumbs down.

• 4:32Steven Rinella?

  December 16th, Madison, Wisconsin, Bubbly Doug, special guest there, among others, at the Barrymore.

• 4:40Steven Rinella?

  Thursday, December 17th, Des Moines, Iowa. Val, Val Air Ballroom.

• 4:48Steven Rinella?

  December 18th, the Friday night, Minneapolis, Minnesota, Pantages Theater. Not contagious, pantages.

• 4:56Speaker 06

  Oh, thank God.

• 5:01Steven Rinella?

  That'd be awesome. If they changed to the contagious theater. Saturday, December 19th, what's funny about Cantages and Pantages, contagious and pantages is, we had to cancel the Pantages because of the great contagion of 2019.

• 5:18Speaker 06

  But we also did another Pantages.

• 5:21Steven Rinella?

  Did we?

• 5:21Speaker 06

  There was a Pantages one in, in the Northwest that we did.

• 5:25Steven Rinella?

  The hell's that even mean?

• 5:26Speaker 06

  There was a big theater guy, Alexander Pantages, owned 84 theaters. Are you just pulling it out of your ass?

• 5:32Steven Rinella?

  No. Phil ought to know that.

• 5:33Speaker 06

  That's amazing.

• 5:34Steven Rinella?

  Theater guy, shows you how big of a theater guy that big theater guy is.

• 5:38Speaker 06

  Nate's always went up in me.

• 5:39Steven Rinella?

  Thank you, Nate. Like a teeny theater guy.

• 5:43Steven Rinella?

  Last show of the trip, December 19th, before everybody has to get home to their families, Fargo, North Dakota, at the Fargo Theater. Cannot wait to see you guys there. Lots of prizes, lots of laughs, lots of people drinking beer.

• 5:59Speaker 06

  Some holiday cheer.

• 6:01Steven Rinella?

  We, years ago, years ago, we did a show in Billings at the Alberta Bear, and we broke the booze record that had been held. We broke the booze sales record, which had been held by Rob Schneider.

• 6:19Speaker 06

  Pretty good company.

• 6:21Steven Rinella?

  A buddy of mine, I don't, this is weird, he's probably the only guy on there. A buddy of mine had, had been there for David Sedaris a few nights before we went.

• 6:32Steven Rinella?

  And he pointed out, he said, man, the mask habits. The masking habits of the David Sedaris crowd were extremely different than the masking habits of our crowd. And any, and then, I pointed out to him that we now broke the booze record.

• 6:51Steven Rinella?

  And he said, well, I think it's a lot easier, in, in reference to Sedaris, he said, it's a lot easier to carry two Bush lights than two Chardonnays.

• 7:05Steven Rinella?

  So there that is. What's this now?

• 7:09Speaker 06

  My hunting, hunting in Austria.

• 7:12Steven Rinella?

  Oh, but I want to go a little bit out of order here, because I just want to hit something real quick.

• 7:15Speaker 06

  Sure.

• 7:17Steven Rinella?

  No, go ahead. No, I want to go a little bit out of order.

• 7:20Speaker 06

  Yep.

• 7:20Steven Rinella?

  Apologies, Nate. Just while I'm fired up. I have a Honda 7000 EU generator.

• 7:27Speaker 06

  That won't fire up?

• 7:29Steven Rinella?

  Just keep this very quick. Can you reset the, the shot clock?

• 7:35Steven Rinella?

  Phil invented this new thing, we can tell how long we're spending on a topic.

• 7:39Speaker 06

  For reference, live tour is supposed to be two minutes. It went for five.

• 7:44Steven Rinella?

  How long do I have for this? I'm gonna borrow time from this for that.

• 7:48Speaker 06

  I think the timer was mistaken.

• 7:49Steven Rinella?

  So you got, you got two now. Oh, great. I have a Honda 7000 EU generator.

• 7:56Steven Rinella?

  It has a mystery ailment that no mechanic can solve. I've taken it to town two times to have it fixed, both times it has come back not resolved.

• 8:07Steven Rinella?

  Don't give me, if you write in, don't give me any BS about fuel filters, don't give me any BS about fuel pumps. This generator will run for hours, under load, and then inexplicably shut off.

• 8:24Steven Rinella?

  Then it'll run for hours and inexplicably shut off. No mechanic has the patience to fix it, start it, put it under a load, and let it out, run out in the driveway or parking lot, and then go like, oh, wow, shut off. That they don't have the patience for it.

• 8:44Steven Rinella?

  I'm wondering if there isn't something like, so pick, you know how you have a low oil shut off? What if that sensor went haywire? Or something, don't send me easy, don't send me easy fixes. Send, this is like, it's haunted by a devil.

• 9:04Speaker 07

  An exorcism.

• 9:05Speaker 06

  Crystals.

• 9:06Steven Rinella?

  It needs, yeah, it needs like an exorcism. A hot, it's old, I don't know how old it is, it's not 10 years old.

• 9:14Steven Rinella?

  We have a fleet of generators, it's impossible to keep at least one running. A Honda EU 7000 just inexplicably turns off. When you start it up, it's ready to rock.

• 9:31Steven Rinella?

  Don't be telling me about fuel pumps.

• 9:33Speaker 07

  Steve almost didn't bring this up, because he said the audience is only going to tell him.

• 9:37Steven Rinella?

  About fuel pumps.

• 9:38Speaker 07

  Yeah, easy things. So you gotta really like.

• 9:41Steven Rinella?

  Try cleaning the spark plugs? You know, it's like, I don't want to hear about things that an idiot can fix, because I've fixed all the idiot parts.

• 9:49Speaker 07

  Steve is challenging you.

• 9:51Steven Rinella?

  I need a guy that knows these things like his own mother.

• 9:55Speaker 06

  I'm surprised you can't find a mechanic that wants to charge you the hours.

• 9:58Steven Rinella?

  Early rate for a couple hours, just sitting there watching the machine vibrate. No, it's funny. They'll, they'll work on it. I'll ship it to town, which is hundreds of dollars. Ship it back. They'll work on it, but you go like, can you do me a favor? Do you mind just running it? Like for a cup, like run it for a day under a load. Put a box fan on it. I don't care. Run it and see. No, that's not something we can do.

• 10:20Steven Rinella?

  Too busy. Meanwhile, I run it round the clock.

• 10:24Speaker 06

  So if you've got an idea, the meter to podcast.

• 10:29Steven Rinella?

  Not a complex idea, but like, like high level mechanic stuff.

• 10:34Speaker 06

  Subject line mechanic, no generator exorcism.

• 10:39Steven Rinella?

  I own, I'm at the, at the risk of running over time.

• 10:45Steven Rinella?

  No, I own a Honda, a old Honda EU three thousand. I own a Honda five thousand. I own a Honda EU seven thousand. They're all old. Someone might say, but it sounds like it's time for a new generator, but I'm not there yet.

• 11:03Steven Rinella?

  Randall's is back from hunting in Austria.

• 11:05Speaker 06

  Yep.

• 11:06Steven Rinella?

  Tell me about that.

• 11:07Speaker 06

  Oh, it's amazing. I, uh, I was over in Austria for, I think nine days, hunted roe deer. Up in northern upper Austria, um, near the German border. And then I went south and hunted chamois or chamois.

• 11:22Steven Rinella?

  Yeah. Do they say chamois?

• 11:25Speaker 06

  So I got, at least from the perspective of our host, who they, they call it gams there.

• 11:31Steven Rinella?

  Oh.

• 11:32Speaker 06

  Like.

• 11:32Steven Rinella?

  I've never heard that.

• 11:33Speaker 06

  Yeah. Which if you think about it, like chamois and gams, like you can imagine the transition between French and German, a lot of words sort of.

• 11:40Steven Rinella?

  No.

• 11:41Speaker 06

  Okay.

• 11:42Steven Rinella?

  No.

• 11:43Speaker 06

  But yeah, gams is what, gams is the German term. And then they said, chamois, I think is the appropriate pronunciation, but then they say the Kiwis call it chamois.

• 11:52Steven Rinella?

  Yeah.

• 11:53Speaker 06

  And so a lot of people.

• 11:54Steven Rinella?

  Was a big fan of chamois cloths.

• 11:56Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 11:56Steven Rinella?

  And he called them a chamois cloth. He didn't call it a chamois cloth.

• 11:59Speaker 06

  I know, I know, but they, they pronounce it chamois.

• 12:02Steven Rinella?

  It's not sham wow.

• 12:04Speaker 06

  I like saying gams and then, and then a buck is a gamsbok. Like a gamsbok, but a gamsbok.

• 12:11Steven Rinella?

  Gamsbok and a chamois are not the same thing.

• 12:14Speaker 06

  No, it's a word. It's gams, a gamsbok. A gams is a chamois and a bok is a buck.

• 12:21Steven Rinella?

  Got it.

• 12:21Speaker 06

  So it's a gamsbok. A gamsbok is a gams that's a buck.

• 12:26Steven Rinella?

  This is more confusing than the pre-sale. This could create problems because picture that you're in a situation where you're like, you're with your kids.

• 12:34Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 12:34Steven Rinella?

  And there's a gamsbok and a gamsbok together, but one is strictly forbidden.

• 12:39Speaker 06

  Right.

• 12:40Steven Rinella?

  And you're yelling, shoot that gomberbok.

• 12:45Steven Rinella?

  And they shoot the wrong one.

• 12:46Speaker 06

  Yeah. Um, so anyway, the roe deer hunting was, was very cool. They rut in the middle of the summer. So they have a delayed implantation of the fertilized egg. They, they start rutting. It's like sixty or eighty days after they give birth to their fawns. And they, they rut in the middle of the summer so that the. The theory goes that they, they, they aren't going to stress themselves with all the rutting behavior and activity in the lead up to winter. So they can rut. The egg gets fertilized. It doesn't implant in the uterus until December or so.

• 13:23Steven Rinella?

  Okay.

• 13:24Speaker 06

  Um, so it's weird to be hunting bucks in the rut when it's ninety degrees out. Um, but they're really.

• 13:32Steven Rinella?

  It was that hot there.

• 13:33Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 13:33Steven Rinella?

  But you're in a high elevation.

• 13:35Speaker 06

  Uh, there we weren't so high, uh, but I mean, Europe has had a pretty hot summer. Um, a lot of wildfires. We didn't have any smoke, but. It's kind of like coyote hunting. You go to a stand, you call for forty five minutes.

• 13:48Steven Rinella?

  Really?

• 13:49Speaker 06

  Uh, then you go to another stand, you call for forty five minutes and if there's deer there, they come in. Um, they might come in stealthily. They might come ripping in. Uh, we didn't have any that came into like five feet or ten feet, but they will do that. Uh, we had some that came into twenty.

• 14:07Steven Rinella?

  What percentage of stands were you having seeing does or hinds or whatever they call them?

• 14:11Speaker 06

  At least, at least half.

• 14:13Steven Rinella?

  What?

• 14:13Speaker 06

  Yeah. I mean, there's a lot of deer. The other cool thing is, the other cool thing is when you're driving around in, in upper Austria. You think it's like the most huntingest place you've ever been. We were never out of sight of. Two, uh, like tower blinds. Like when you're driving down the road, if you just stopped and looked around in a circle. You're going to see half dozen tower blinds in every, any given direction.

• 14:38Steven Rinella?

  It's like driving around Doug's place in Wisconsin. Yeah, it sounds like Michigan too.

• 14:41Speaker 06

  Yeah. And then we were sitting, at one point we were sitting by the lake at this cafe. I was talking with my host, um, just about the hunting culture there. And I was saying, this is the one place where we haven't seen a hunting blind. And then we look across this lake that has sailboats and, you know, people out and everything. And you can see there's a little clearing up in the woods. And I'm like, I'm pretty sure that's a, that's a blind up there. And it was. So we were never out of sight of a deer blind.

• 15:05Steven Rinella?

  Homemade or they buy an American made blinds?

• 15:07Speaker 06

  No, they're all homemade. Um, a lot of them, it's like milled out of local timber. It's not, it's not like dimensional. Uh, from the hardware store or anything. And, uh, a lot of them are old. I climbed up in one tree stand. That was probably thirty or over thirty five feet high. And the, the crotch board was grown in over the tree, like more than halfway to the point that the two. The two big trunks of the tree were almost touching.

• 15:36Steven Rinella?

  Got it.

• 15:36Speaker 06

  Subsumed the whole crotch board.

• 15:38Steven Rinella?

  Yeah.

• 15:39Speaker 06

  Um, so just, it was really cool to see that hunting culture. Obviously, um, there are fewer hunters over there. And it's harder for someone to become a hunter, uh, because hunting is tied to land ownership. And the tag allocation is tied to, uh, the land ownership. They either have, if you have a big enough property, you have sort of your own quota. That you're required to fill by the state. Uh, if there's a bunch of smaller properties, they make what's called a community hunt. Where they sort of have a, a hunting HOA that the state facilitates. And then off of those properties, they have a quota they have to hit.

• 16:14Steven Rinella?

  Got it.

• 16:15Speaker 06

  So, um, what they do is they build ex closures and they, someone will come out from the state with the property manager. And they'll look at what impact the wildlife are having on the area outside of the exposure compared to inside the exposure.

• 16:29Steven Rinella?

  To make a determination.

• 16:30Speaker 06

  To make a determination of what, what the, the load of the wildlife is. Yeah. And it's really interesting, like especially with the roe deer. I mean, they talk about it.

• 16:39Steven Rinella?

  How big of an exposure do they make? Just like a sample patch?

• 16:41Speaker 06

  They're like twenty, the ones we looked at were probably like twenty yards by twenty yards. And they go and they count, they count the species, they count the, the density of growth. And, and so you'll just be driving through this big estate and you'll see different ex closures.

• 16:55Steven Rinella?

  Dude, I'd be in there fertilizing that little thing and like.

• 16:58Speaker 06

  And what's, what's really interesting is like they, when they talk about how they manage the roe deer. They talk about it almost in the same, cause there's a, the forester manages the wildlife as well.

• 17:10Steven Rinella?

  Okay.

• 17:10Speaker 06

  So each property will have like a forester and he'll tell you how many board feet are coming off that property. And he'll tell you how many deer are coming off that property.

• 17:18Steven Rinella?

  Okay.

• 17:19Speaker 06

  And he'll talk about managing for different age classes with the wildlife in the same way that they're talking about manage for different age classes within the forest. And they're like, we don't talk about any of it, um, on its own. It's all part of this holistic view of, of how they manage the property. It's wildlife and, and trees.

• 17:36Steven Rinella?

  Do they name bucks?

• 17:37Speaker 06

  No. They, he said some of the bucks, like some of the bucks people will know. Uh, they don't name them, but.

• 17:44Steven Rinella?

  They'll know all split times and.

• 17:46Speaker 06

  No, they, I don't, I mean, we didn't encounter that, but they, they said there will be guys that get to know certain bucks over the years. Um, but it's not like they get reserved for anybody. It's just sort of the forester will know that this buck exists.

• 17:59Steven Rinella?

  Yeah.

• 18:00Speaker 06

  Um, they live in pretty small territories and they run through the woods like antelope out on the prairie. Like we saw a buck chasing a doe and it looked like birds weaving through the trees, just.

• 18:13Steven Rinella?

  Oh, really? Yeah.

• 18:16Speaker 06

  Really active. I mean, we saw deer every day. We had deer come in. When they spook, when the buck spooks, if he wins you, they'll bark.

• 18:25Steven Rinella?

  Like what?

• 18:28Speaker 06

  Like the first time I heard it, I thought it was a dog.

• 18:30Steven Rinella?

  Um, really?

• 18:31Speaker 06

  Cause people.

• 18:32Steven Rinella?

  That's his warning call.

• 18:33Speaker 06

  Yeah. Cause they also, the other thing is they have right to roam over there. So people, even though we're on private property, people from the community come out to walk their dogs. Or ride their bikes and stuff.

• 18:42Steven Rinella?

  Scotland has that right to roam.

• 18:44Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 18:44Steven Rinella?

  But you can't, it doesn't mean you can hunt.

• 18:46Speaker 06

  Yeah, that's same deal.

• 18:47Steven Rinella?

  You can roam, but you can't hunt.

• 18:48Speaker 06

  Same deal here. And there's some restrictions on the roads, like some roads you can bike on, some you can't, but we, like the, when I shot my first buck. It was early in the morning and I'm glad we shot it when we did, because fifteen minutes later, there's, you know, some old ladies walking their dog on the road right past us. And guys riding their bikes past us. So it was really interesting to see that, how, how, um, interwoven. The hunting is with just people getting outside like it's on public land, but it is private.

• 19:17Steven Rinella?

  Is there, is there any public opportunity out there?

• 19:20Speaker 06

  Um, no, if there is, it's very, very, very limited. Um, it's, it's all private land from my understanding. And, um, to become a hunter over there, you have to go through a very serious hunter ed course. That involves, um, like you have to learn about tracking dogs. You have to learn about all kinds of stuff. You have to learn how to analyze the. The organs of the deer for signs of disease.

• 19:47Steven Rinella?

  Hmm.

• 19:47Speaker 06

  Um, because when you harvest a deer, it's going to go to market. So that's the other side of it is the deer, once it's killed, it doesn't become the property of the hunter. It becomes the property of the state. And so.

• 19:59Steven Rinella?

  Come on, back up.

• 20:00Speaker 06

  Huh.

• 20:04Steven Rinella?

  Like by that's just you can you have no right to have a bite of that thing.

• 20:10Speaker 06

  No, I mean, from what I understand, like the hunter, the hunter could buy it back from the estate, but it be it's the property of the estate.

• 20:17Steven Rinella?

  I thought you said the state.

• 20:18Speaker 06

  No, no, sorry, the estate. Yeah.

• 20:20Steven Rinella?

  Makes total sense. Okay. I thought you meant like the like Austria.

• 20:24Speaker 06

  Right. No, no, it's property of the estate and they talk about it.

• 20:28Steven Rinella?

  You probably say the same thing technically. No, I guess you couldn't.

• 20:32Steven Rinella?

  No, no, I get what you're saying.

• 20:33Speaker 06

  Cause like when you buy a tag here and you put your tag on that animal, that animal is now your property.

• 20:38Steven Rinella?

  But the but the estate could be like, hey, let's party and cook the whole thing up.

• 20:42Speaker 06

  Absolutely, absolutely. And and we did one of the animals I when we went chamois hunting.

• 20:50Speaker 06

  We were gonna take this chamois to the butcher who processes them.

• 20:53Steven Rinella?

  Did you get one?

• 20:54Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 20:54Steven Rinella?

  Was he up in the mountains?

• 20:55Speaker 06

  Yeah. Yeah, we're in steep, we're in steep, steep, high country. I shot two yearlings. So it's it's very much like a coal program.

• 21:04Steven Rinella?

  Okay.

• 21:05Speaker 06

  The big bucks, you only can hunt them in the rut. Cause they live very solitary lives in the timber, but I shot two. The most memorable part of that is the angle that you're shooting and then the recovery. So we we got into some sketchy stuff on the recovery. Chris Gill compared it to the mountain goat hunt.

• 21:25Steven Rinella?

  Oh, Rich Pounder was with you?

• 21:26Speaker 06

  Yeah. And he he got stuck a couple of times and our host had to come up with his big Austrian trekking staff and jam it in the side of the mountain under his feet so he could have a foothold. I also fell when we were coming down with the chamois, I passed it off to I was dragging it.

• 21:42Steven Rinella?

  Cause it's how big?

• 21:43Speaker 06

  Oh, they're like, it's like a dog. They're they're like 60 pounds, maybe.

• 21:48Steven Rinella?

  You know, people use that all the time, but dogs are such different sizes.

• 21:51Speaker 06

  That's a great point. That's a great point. It's like a 60 pound dog.

• 21:54Steven Rinella?

  Like, it's like a whale. What kind of whale?

• 21:56Speaker 06

  I think the the one of the road deer that we weighed, it it weighed gutted, it weighed like 15 or 16 kilos. So like 30, mid 30 pounds.

• 22:04Steven Rinella?

  Got it. Easily carried over your shoulder.

• 22:06Speaker 06

  The chamois were smaller than that. Yeah. Actually, with the road deer, one of them. Uh, we gutted it and then cut the, you know how Heather does the backpack thing?

• 22:15Steven Rinella?

  Yeah.

• 22:15Speaker 06

  They have a thing where they make a little suitcase. So you see, so you cut the tendon, you put the put the legs through and then you fold it and then you just walk out with a little suitcase.

• 22:25Steven Rinella?

  Sure.

• 22:27Speaker 06

  But yeah, I fell coming off one of the chamois recoveries and had one of the Austrian mountain staffs with me that uses like a self arrest. And I slid down this grass. Uh, they were actually filming at the time, but I slid out of the frame of the camera because I went down so far.

• 22:44Steven Rinella?

  It's gonna look good. It's gonna look good on the film.

• 22:47Speaker 06

  I slid between the rocks.

• 22:48Steven Rinella?

  Faster than they could move the camera.

• 22:50Speaker 06

  I had enough time in my mind. I was like, shit, I, you know, maybe I should push harder on this thing to stop. And then I did that. And then I had time to think, I guess I need to push harder than that. And I had several conversations with myself about whether I was applying the appropriate amount of pressure. So, but

• 23:07Speaker 06

  we were bringing one of those chamois to the butcher who who butchers them for market. And we went to this little house, but at what point does the estate transact? Do they transact at the counter, selling finished cuts? Do they transact at the butcher? So they, I I don't know exactly how the money changes hands, but they like where we hunted road deer. They have one butcher pretty much that does everything for them.

• 23:35Steven Rinella?

  Okay.

• 23:35Speaker 06

  And we went to him and and his daughter was there. She spoke English, so she explained it, but they both showed us how they how they like what you'd see in the package. It's like they'd laid it out, you know, two tender, two backstraps and two tenderloins that do the rear, like the big rear muscle group, everything's attached and just gets wrapped up like that. So you can cut it how you want.

• 23:58Steven Rinella?

  Okay.

• 23:59Speaker 06

  They make stew meat, they make burgers, they do all the sausage products. I ate all I did actually eat all of the sausage products they make. It's a lot.

• 24:09Speaker 06

  But then it's when it's marketed, you you can see on the packaging, the forest that it comes from.

• 24:15Steven Rinella?

  Okay.

• 24:16Speaker 06

  And the the the name of the estate.

• 24:18Steven Rinella?

  And but you're seeing it for sale where? At the butcher or he's passing along to the grocer?

• 24:25Speaker 06

  You can buy them at the grocer. Um, you can buy them at the butcher. The butcher has a vending machine actually out on the road that only sells wild game. And so you can go up and there's, you know, like a pack of steaks. There's a, you know, there's a tenderloin. There's a bunch of summer sausage. There's Hmm. Fresh brats.

• 24:42Steven Rinella?

  You just chuck quarters into that thing.

• 24:44Speaker 06

  Yeah, swiping, I swiped, I swiped the meat eater uh, business card in it, probably a dozen times. Cause we had to get all the different angles for the for the film.

• 24:53Steven Rinella?

  Val's sitting there like, what in the world?

• 24:55Speaker 06

  I know, I'm sitting there, I'm sitting there. It was like

• 24:58Steven Rinella?

  I'm turning this card off.

• 24:59Speaker 06

  It was, it was almost like we could have recorded the noise because I would swipe it and it would go beep. And then the thing would go thunk. And then my phone would go ding with the like, please explain this expense. And we just did that over and over and over.

• 25:11Speaker 07

  What were the prices like?

• 25:13Speaker 06

  Uh, it's like a pack, a pack of um frankfurters. So like just a pack of road deer hot dogs. I think it was like six or seven euros. Something like that, like probably eight, nine, $10.

• 25:28Speaker 03

  911, what's your emergency?

• 25:34Speaker 03

  We think they're murder hornets.

• 25:36Speaker 02

  911 Nashville returns.

• 25:39Speaker 04

  There's a homicide detective down here. Three bodies on the ground.

• 25:42Speaker 02

  With emergencies of biblical proportions. I will send swarms upon you and upon your people. That's one of the plagues of the Bible. And somebody's unleashing them on Nashville. Brian Phillippe joins 911 Nashville. All new Thursdays on ABC, next day on Hulu.

• 25:57Steven Rinella?

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• 26:57Speaker 06

  But yeah, it's really interesting. You know, it's obviously like a self-contained system that works. It's so foreign to us in terms of how the wildlife, how the opportunity is allocated and what happens to the meat afterwards, but um, they they, even though it would seem very transactional and you know, again, it's a lot of its calling and management and you sort of think of that as like not very romantic, like there's still this very serious tradition and culture and romanticism around hunting these animals.

• 27:27Steven Rinella?

  But it's like, it's regarded as a thing of enjoyment or a chore?

• 27:31Speaker 06

  Absolutely. It's a thing of enjoyment.

• 27:32Steven Rinella?

  Okay.

• 27:33Speaker 06

  And and um and like there's still that same passion, even though it's very different from what we do. You know, when I think of guys that are calling 200 deer off of an estate or off of a property. I sort of think of that as like whack them and stack them.

• 27:49Steven Rinella?

  Yeah.

• 27:49Speaker 06

  And this was like, you know, we could have sat on a field edge and shot shot bucks, you know, at dawn and dusk, whatever, but we were, you know, the the only way Phil hunts them, who is my host on the deer hunt. It's like you go into the woods and you call them.

• 28:04Steven Rinella?

  Boy, it's too bad you went all the way to Austria and there's a guy named Phil.

• 28:08Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 28:10Steven Rinella?

  He he didn't have a more Austrian. I'd want a guy with a crazy name.

• 28:15Speaker 06

  And it was, his cousin is Matthias, which is good. Yeah. Yeah. And then and then chamois hunting, I went with Paul.

• 28:21Steven Rinella?

  It's like Phil, I already know a ton of Phils.

• 28:23Speaker 06

  Yeah, I know. I got a lot of Phils. I got Phil. But yeah, super, super, super cool experience and like the amount of hospit, like the first five days, I don't think we ate outside of someone's dinner table. Every night they're cooking road deer. Yeah. And and we pretty much only ate wild game.

• 28:43Speaker 06

  Cause they, you know, they sell it, but they also eat it, right? So when they bring a bunch of deer to the butcher for them to sell. It's like, we're gonna take this one. And the butcher sent us home with a big thing of sausage to to cook out that night, but

• 28:56Steven Rinella?

  It's it's totally different, but that was like being in at like the camps in Africa.

• 29:01Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 29:02Steven Rinella?

  Um, there is no domestic meat option.

• 29:06Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 29:07Steven Rinella?

  Jimmy, it's like, it's just every meal. It's always wild game.

• 29:12Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 29:12Steven Rinella?

  You know?

• 29:13Speaker 06

  And we had, I mean, I think the last night when we had this big dinner with all the families um, and the kids and everything, we probably had 20 people there. We had road deer backstraps, we had road deer uh steaks from the rear quarter that had been marinated. We had road deer brats, we had road deer franks. They do another thing where they wrap the frank in bacon and do that. I mean, it's kind of feel like you're in Texas.

• 29:38Steven Rinella?

  Sure.

• 29:38Speaker 06

  At some points, but um we probably had road deer five different ways.

• 29:42Steven Rinella?

  Is that the favorite of the of the chamois?

• 29:47Steven Rinella?

  And the road deer, is road deer the good one or do they like the chamois too?

• 29:52Speaker 06

  I I can't say, I I don't think that I don't think there's a chamois harvest that's that's as uh, and just in the numbers, like I don't think it's the same. So so road deer, like when you buy dog food there. When they go to the butcher, all that trim, like everything that you put in your scrap pile or maybe give this to the dog. That goes to a dog food processor. So you can buy a can of dog food that says in German, road deer. And then the dogs eat basically burger.

• 30:23Steven Rinella?

  Be some good dogs.

• 30:23Speaker 06

  Yeah, yeah. And that was the other fun thing is we hunted, we hunted deer and chamo with dogs the whole time. Like we'd tie, we had the Bino was the dog that came with us road deer hunting.

• 30:32Steven Rinella?

  What's his job?

• 30:33Speaker 06

  You'd climb up in the stand, you'd tie her to the, to the ladder and she'd just sit there silently and then, and then, once you shoot, she's just fired up and you take her to the blood trail and let her loose.

• 30:46Steven Rinella?

  Oh, her job is fine.

• 30:47Speaker 06

  Yeah, there. So they, they trail everything with dogs.

• 30:51Speaker 07

  Even if you saw it like laid dead out in the field.

• 30:53Speaker 06

  Yeah, just good practice.

• 30:54Steven Rinella?

  What breed?

• 30:55Speaker 06

  Practice.

• 30:57Speaker 06

  Bina was like a fox terrier.

• 31:01Speaker 06

  She was like a tiny little, she was thirteen and, and pretty deaf, except for the gunshots. And then the dog we took chamo hunting, not could remember, I can't remember the breed of, of Ixy, but she was, she was a bigger dog. Almost like, yeah, she was kind of a hound, like a short hound, but not like what you think of like, not like Mingus. Like a shorter kind of hound dog.

• 31:26Steven Rinella?

  What was their general attitude? Do they hang out with a lot of Americans? Were they hip to what Americans are all about?

• 31:31Speaker 06

  Yeah, they, so they, they have a business selling American hunting brands over in Europe. So they're, they're a retailer for First Light and FHF and they, they travel the US a lot. And they're familiar with this. So one, one of the funny things was Phil, when I went to go hunt chamo with Paulie. Other Phil, Philip. When I went to go hunt chamo in, in southern Austria with Paulie, I was like, Phil, are you going to come down? And he goes, it's like, you know, what you're asking me to do, he's like, this is the first week of August, what you're asking me to do is to ask like a Texas whitetail nut to leave his whitetail spot in the middle of the rut.

• 32:13Speaker 06

  He had that analogy up his sleeves. So like, they're very conversant.

• 32:17Steven Rinella?

  So were they giving you, like I was in Italy this summer and all the Italians have to come up and tell you how much they hate Trump, but they don't hold it against you. Did you find like that kind of thing going on there? Was everything like political?

• 32:29Speaker 06

  No, we didn't.

• 32:30Steven Rinella?

  Not at all?

• 32:30Speaker 06

  We didn't talk politics. I mean, the, the other, the, the one political thing that came up is, is in southern Austria, the wolves. Wolves. And actually while we were there, there was a grizzly, a brown bear spotted in the same valley that we were in. Yeah. And we found out two days later, but they have wolves coming in and it's a very hot button topic. So it was interesting to have those conversations, sort of in parallel, what's what going on.

• 32:56Steven Rinella?

  Was the, the flavor the same?

• 32:58Speaker 06

  Very much so.

• 33:00Steven Rinella?

  On the wolf question, the flavor's the same.

• 33:03Speaker 06

  Yeah, just a super.

• 33:05Steven Rinella?

  Can't wait to see the video, man. How much video minutes you gonna get? What is this? A two pack? Is it a one pack? Like, what is it?

• 33:11Speaker 06

  That's, that's yet to be determined. I think it's definitely a two parter. Garrett this morning said maybe it's a two hour thing.

• 33:23Steven Rinella?

  I don't know about that.

• 33:24Speaker 06

  I, I just, I'm not throwing that out there. He's, he gave a number of terabytes and I don't know what terabytes mean, but.

• 33:30Steven Rinella?

  Well, what I would do,

• 33:33Steven Rinella?

  just, I would make it like a two or three parter.

• 33:36Speaker 06

  Yeah, that's, that's sort of how I imagine.

• 33:38Steven Rinella?

  But I'd give people a rest.

• 33:39Speaker 06

  We, we also went to a gunmaker in a town where they've been making guns for more than 500 years. Went to a gunmaker that produces 12 rifles a year. They're all hand engraved.

• 33:49Steven Rinella?

  Ain't giving those away.

• 33:50Speaker 06

  No, no, but they're, they're beautiful, like old world double rifles and drillings and fearlings, which is a four barrel rifle. And we just got to hang out with those guys and film them as they, as they did stock work and shit. It was, yeah.

• 34:05Steven Rinella?

  See, this is like a cultural immersion.

• 34:06Speaker 06

  It was a very, it was a very, I felt very lucky to be able to do this and our hosts just like rolled out the red carpet.

• 34:13Speaker 07

  Talk about a four barrel rifle. I was like, surely he doesn't literally mean four barrels on a rifle. Okay, but I'm seeing a four barrel rifle here.

• 34:21Speaker 06

  Yeah. And the, and the thing that you realize, you know, if you talk double rifles, the big thing is regulating the barrels. So they hit the same point of aim. And he's like, think about a fearling, cause then when you have four barrels and you mess with this one, it messes with all the other ones. He's like, you'll just drive yourself insane trying to regulate.

• 34:38Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, I was talking to a guy about that. Yeah, it never occurred to me, that whole process of putting that thing together and ever getting at the two barrels around the same program. Cause you gotta do a lot of tweaking, cause the harmonics are different.

• 34:50Speaker 06

  But then you, then you double the number of barrels and you quadruple the number of connections between barrels. Cause it's two barrels, they're just connecting in one place.

• 35:00Steven Rinella?

  Great point.

• 35:00Speaker 07

  I assume one trigger on a four barrel gun.

• 35:04Speaker 06

  I don't know. You know, I don't think there are four triggers.

• 35:06Steven Rinella?

  You know, our saying, give them both barrels.

• 35:10Speaker 07

  I've never heard that. Give them both barrels?

• 35:13Steven Rinella?

  How would you not have never heard that?

• 35:14Speaker 06

  Give them, give them all four, give them all fear.

• 35:16Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, give them all four, give them all four barrels. That don't sound good. That'd hurt.

• 35:22Speaker 06

  But yeah, we, I mean, it was like a full on cultural immersion and, and just super lucky, super grateful to do that. And our hosts were just the best.

• 35:31Steven Rinella?

  You didn't grow up with like old men talking about giving them both barrels?

• 35:34Speaker 07

  That one I, that's escaped me.

• 35:36Steven Rinella?

  Oh, give them both barrels.

• 35:37Speaker 07

  I like that.

• 35:38Steven Rinella?

  You might say something like that.

• 35:41Speaker 07

  You mean business if you say both barrels.

• 35:43Steven Rinella?

  Oh, yeah. It's like, no one wants to get shot even by one shotgun barrel, but imagine that they give you both. It's terrible.

• 35:49Speaker 06

  One last thing for me.

• 35:50Steven Rinella?

  Okay. Oh, you're gonna hit the deer call?

• 35:52Speaker 06

  Oh, I can, yeah.

• 35:53Speaker 07

  Yeah, look at that thing.

• 35:53Steven Rinella?

  We can turn it around. It's like, who's that playwright that if you produce a gun, it better go off? Is that him? Not a playwright.

• 35:59Speaker 07

  Check off.

• 36:00Steven Rinella?

  Check off?

• 36:00Speaker 07

  Big theater guy over here.

• 36:06Steven Rinella?

  That's the noise they make?

• 36:07Speaker 06

  It sounds great. That's the doe. It's like the little kids were laughing at, the little kids over there, the, the kids of our hosts gave this to me and one of them has a, a call made out of the other antler from the same deer.

• 36:17Steven Rinella?

  And they thought you sucked at it or?

• 36:18Speaker 06

  Yeah, they thought I sucked at it. And then I got some lessons and I sucked less at it, but yeah, you just sit there and call, call.

• 36:25Steven Rinella?

  Just like that?

• 36:26Speaker 06

  Constantly.

• 36:27Steven Rinella?

  Not loud.

• 36:27Speaker 07

  Constantly?

• 36:28Speaker 06

  Constantly.

• 36:29Speaker 07

  That can't be how they behave in nature.

• 36:31Speaker 06

  You might pause for, you might pause for a minute or two here and there, but we're just, you start calling with a fawn call, which is like a squeak, squeak, squeak, squeak, squeak, squeak. And then you'd hit the doe call. And yeah, it was, it was very different from the deer hunting that I'm used to. One last thing.

• 36:50Steven Rinella?

  Oh, there's a picture right there. Look at that sucker, man.

• 36:53Speaker 06

  Yeah. Yeah. So we watched like all that stuff down there is hand engraved and then inlaid with the gold.

• 36:58Steven Rinella?

  We're looking at one of these guns and I didn't realize this. He's got like a shotgun.

• 37:02Speaker 06

  Yeah, twenty gauge.

• 37:02Steven Rinella?

  Twenty gauge shotgun. It's like the breach is open on the bottom at the six o'clock position. So it's a twenty gauge shotgun. At three and nine, you've got some kind of center fire rifle, like a larger caliber.

• 37:16Speaker 06

  Eight by fifty seven. It's a eight by fif, two eight by fifty sevens, a twenty gauge and one twenty two hornet.

• 37:22Steven Rinella?

  And so then at the twelve o'clock position, there's a twenty, dude, you're ready for action. It's like, he's like, I don't give a shit what comes out of them bushes.

• 37:30Speaker 06

  Yeah. And this is, so, so typically when you have two barrel, when you have two rifle barrels and a shotgun barrel, like a, like I've always known that as a drilling. And it's a term you've heard, and I didn't realize this, cause then he says it, so a four barrel is a fearling. And I realized a drilling is a dryling, cause dry is three and we just bastardize it to drilling. But that's where that term comes from. I never understood what drilling was. Yeah. So in, anyway.

• 37:58Steven Rinella?

  You know, you got like Frank of files and what, what's the guy way into Austria?

• 38:04Speaker 06

  I don't know. It might be a Germanophile. Yeah, I'm getting there, getting there.

• 38:11Speaker 06

  Saturday, October.

• 38:12Steven Rinella?

  Oh, did you drink all kinds of beer? Where are you at on beer drinking right now?

• 38:16Speaker 06

  What do you mean, where am I at?

• 38:17Steven Rinella?

  Cause everybody I know is always quitting this and quitting that. Are you like a beer drinker right now?

• 38:21Speaker 06

  Big time.

• 38:23Steven Rinella?

  So were you drinking all kinds of beer over there?

• 38:25Speaker 06

  The problem was, the, the real problem was you go to Germany and Austria and you can drink all this beer because it's four or five percent. It's all very light lagers. And then you go to, Sydney and I went to Belgium for a couple of days and you go up there and it's all nine percent. And so like, you have to re, you have to re-regulate, pull all the levers and re-regulate your intake. You have to put, you have to turn on the choke.

• 38:48Speaker 06

  But anyway, that was great. Yeah. A lot of beers, a lot of sausages, a lot of schnitzels.

• 38:54Steven Rinella?

  I'll take them schnitzels, man. That's for sure. All right, out of the punt gun.

• 38:59Speaker 06

  Sorry, one more thing.

• 39:00Steven Rinella?

  We keep saying that.

• 39:01Speaker 06

  Tailgate tour.

• 39:02Steven Rinella?

  Oh, that's totally different.

• 39:03Speaker 06

  It's totally different, but it also falls under this. So Tailgate Tour, we're kicking that off again. We've got four stops coming up in the next month. This Saturday, August 29th in Missoula, Montana. I will be there. Clay Newcomb will be there for the Griz taking on the Southern Utah Thunderbirds. Uh, so kickoff is at 7:00 PM this Saturday, August 29th. We will be out there from five to seven in the fan zone, which is one of the official tailgating areas near the stadium. Come say hi. We've got games, we've got free stuff and Clay Newcomb will listen to every single one of your hunting stories told in its fullest detail.

• 39:43Steven Rinella?

  Here's the problem. He even wants to see the pictures.

• 39:45Speaker 06

  He'll want to look at all the pictures, even the ones that are just slightly different angles.

• 39:49Speaker 07

  Randall, the problem here is that you guys are only there for two hours. The next weekend, I'm going to be at the Tailgate Tour at North Dakota State. And we are doing that from nine to two thirty or something. So way more stories and a lot more beer drinking.

• 40:02Speaker 06

  Well, this is, yeah. So this is the official tailgating hours because we're part of the university tailgating area. It's open from five to seven. So we have that bookend built in, but yeah.

• 40:12Steven Rinella?

  That's great. Uh, that'd be great. Everybody could come find those guys at Washington Grizzly Stadium, the, uh,

• 40:20Steven Rinella?

  Griz Thunderbird game.

• 40:24Steven Rinella?

  Coming, August 29th, this Saturday.

• 40:27Speaker 06

  On the punt gun.

• 40:28Speaker 07

  You're not gonna talk about the other stops?

• 40:31Speaker 06

  No? Uh, no, I actually asked Jen. Yeah, there's, there's, there's more stops. You can go to the website and check them out.

• 40:38Speaker 07

  The meat eater dot com slash you guys.

• 40:39Speaker 06

  Yep.

• 40:40Speaker 07

  All right, the punt gun. We bought a punt gun back in 2022. We bought this thing so long ago that the people who approved the budget for me to spend $20,000, they just don't work here anymore.

• 40:49Steven Rinella?

  They died of old age.

• 40:51Speaker 07

  Yeah, yeah. The punt gun, not saying it killed them.

• 40:54Speaker 06

  Or they were fired for reckless spending.

• 40:56Speaker 07

  Maybe. Yeah. The, the punt gun may have like played a role in this at some point. We don't know.

• 41:01Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, I, I know. Like even internally, I gotta go, do you remember that punt gun? And people like, no.

• 41:06Speaker 07

  No. That's, that's how long ago.

• 41:09Speaker 06

  When they called me out for spending all the money on the vending machine meats, that's exactly what I'm gonna say. Remember the punt gun? It's gonna pay off someday.

• 41:15Speaker 07

  2022, uh, we bought that. We shot the punt gun. We made a video in 2026. You can watch the video. It's called firing a 140 year old punt gun. Uh, it's on our YouTube channel. We then decided to turn around and sell it through the same folks that we bought it from, which is Rock Island Auction. They're the world's biggest dealer of like fine and collectible and historic firearms. That auction happened this last weekend. Their estimate publicly on their website was 20 to $30,000, which we paid 20,000 for it. Privately, quietly, they were like, you know, maybe 40,000, uh, if, if like the right bidder gets in there. The bidding started, it shot past 50,000 very fast. Um, there were, there were a lot of bidders involved up to that point.

• 41:58Speaker 07

  Beyond 50,000, it dropped down to just two people. Um, it got up to 100,000. Uh, I was told that in the room, the, the folks were giddy. Uh, there was some laughter involved, which is a good thing at a gun auction. They, they told me if, if people are laughing, that's, uh.

• 42:13Steven Rinella?

  Cause it's kinda like a laugh, like you gotta be kidding.

• 42:16Speaker 07

  Yeah. Oh, okay. Yeah. All right.

• 42:18Steven Rinella?

  Now the people bidding, this is like, they're bidding, this is an online auction?

• 42:21Speaker 07

  It is happening in person in Bedford, Texas, but you can participate online. You can participate on the phone. When I bought it originally, I was just bidding from my house in Bozeman. Um, and I was on the phone with somebody who was there in person at the auction. Uh, that is, you know, on your behalf, raising their hand and then placing the bid. Gets up to 100,000. Bidding ends at 117,500. Yes. Uh, so almost 100,000 more than what we paid for it. All of that money is going to the land access initiative. Rock Island is waiving our fees, uh, to make sure that even more money goes to conservation. It's great.

• 42:58Speaker 06

  It's huge.

• 42:58Speaker 07

  Uh, I also have, I've heard from the person who won the, the punt gun. Uh, Rock Island is waiving their shipping fees involved.

• 43:05Speaker 06

  Really?

• 43:06Speaker 07

  Which is a, a tremendous thing to ship across the country.

• 43:09Speaker 06

  Yeah. Cause it weighs 40 pounds.

• 43:11Speaker 07

  Weighs a lot. It goes on multiple pallets.

• 43:13Steven Rinella?

  Forty pounds?

• 43:13Speaker 07

  Yeah.

• 43:14Steven Rinella?

  What'd we weigh that?

• 43:15Speaker 06

  I never got to point it around. 75 pounds.

• 43:17Speaker 07

  70 or 80. Uh, it goes on multiple pallets. Um, it gets like, you know, special, uh, shipping involved. Rock Island is waiving the buyer's fees because they were so thrilled uh, about the price. Uh, the buyer is Brandon from North Carolina. He, he did reach out. Uh, he said he came into the day with his top dollar of 50,000. He wasn't gonna go beyond that. He got carried away. He said he really doesn't like.

• 43:38Steven Rinella?

  He was drinking them, he was drinking them German beers or something.

• 43:42Speaker 06

  They had a good auctioneer.

• 43:43Speaker 07

  Brandon told me he really doesn't like to lose. Uh, so it got up to 50 and then he just keep going and, uh, the auction just unraveled and he won it.

• 43:51Speaker 06

  Brandon sounds like a fun guy.

• 43:53Steven Rinella?

  They've ever sold a punt gun. This is an important detail.

• 43:55Speaker 07

  Yes, it is.

• 43:56Steven Rinella?

  It doesn't account for the price, but the first, this is the first time they were ever able to sell a punt gun where they could say this is a functioning, usable punt gun.

• 44:05Speaker 07

  Confirmed that it works. We had a shell for them that the buyer could then make their own shells. They've seen it work, uh, on a YouTube video. Brandon didn't say this is why he spent the money. Um, but Rock Island Auction, they do a tremendous job of making every auction feel like a really big deal. Uh, and if you like, watch sports, this is something that, um, sports fans will criticize or compliment networks on. They're like, you know, ESPN does a really great job of making this Sunday night football game or Saturday night

• 44:37Steven Rinella?

  Big deal.

• 44:37Speaker 07

  football game feel like the biggest deal in the world. Uh, Rock Island does it every time. They, they like really hype it up. They do a great job. And I could see how someone like Brandon comes in, you know, be like, ah, 50,000. They end up spending 117,500.

• 44:50Steven Rinella?

  You know, you know what we're working on for the show?

• 44:51Speaker 07

  What?

• 44:52Steven Rinella?

  Uh, we're bringing in, for the interview show, we're bringing in an auctioneer.

• 44:57Speaker 07

  Oh, okay. Who auctions off what?

• 45:00Steven Rinella?

  We're bringing in a livestock guy.

• 45:02Speaker 07

  Hmm.

• 45:03Steven Rinella?

  Hold on. But my main, it'll be a short interview. I'm gonna be like, why do you guys talk like that?

• 45:08Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 45:09Steven Rinella?

  That's the main thing I'm gonna ask.

• 45:10Speaker 06

  I look forward to that explanation. I hope he explains it.

• 45:13Steven Rinella?

  Nate already knows the truth. Nate already knows from the pre-interviews.

• 45:16Speaker 07

  Hmm.

• 45:17Steven Rinella?

  It's gonna be great. Cause then we're gonna learn how to auction. We're gonna do it in here and everybody can come. And we're gonna learn how to do that whole little deal.

• 45:25Speaker 07

  Yeah. If you wanna learn to auction, I think you go to like a one week seminar and you leave there, no one has.

• 45:30Steven Rinella?

  We're bringing in world, we're bringing in world champions.

• 45:31Speaker 06

  You go to auctioneer school.

• 45:33Steven Rinella?

  Yeah. But no, we're not, we're not bringing in school kids. We're bringing in world champions.

• 45:37Speaker 06

  Potentially the triple crown auctioneer.

• 45:39Steven Rinella?

  Yeah. We're courting the triple crown world champion. This is not some school kid.

• 45:45Speaker 07

  Mm-hmm. You know, it's a big deal. Now here's, here's like the, the coolest thing. You don't know this yet, Steve. Our punt gun sale is a new world record. Uh, this is now

• 45:54Speaker 06

  Wow.

• 45:54Speaker 07

  the most money anyone has ever paid for a punt gun, making it the most valuable punt gun on earth.

• 46:00Steven Rinella?

  Really?

• 46:00Speaker 07

  Yeah.

• 46:01Speaker 06

  That's pretty cool. It's like Rembrandt or something.

• 46:03Speaker 07

  Nobody has ever, uh, bought or sold a punt gun for more than 117,500.

• 46:10Speaker 06

  You're telling me we sold the most valuable punt gun? It's not our punt gun anymore, Spencer.

• 46:15Steven Rinella?

  Dude, I wish people like kept up on Wikipedia pages like they used to. That'd be the best thing in a Wikipedia page.

• 46:21Speaker 07

  Brandon, the buyer, he's not aware of this yet either. Um, so like he, he now owns the world record, the most expensive punt gun in the world, which like with collectibles, something is only worth what someone's willing to pay. And so he set the price and now he, he owns the world's most valuable punt gun.

• 46:37Speaker 06

  Damn.

• 46:38Speaker 07

  Rock Island, they set some other world records during this. Uh, it was the first sale ever that had two guns fetch over $1 million. One of them was the Bonnie and Clyde shotgun that sold for a million dollars. It's now the most expensive shotgun ever. They also sold a German military tank. Yeah. The, the Bonnie and Clyde thing was like the biggest deal. That was the crown jewel of this auction. Uh, they also sold a German military tank for $1 million. Again, the first time at a firearms auction that two items uh, went for over a million. And Bonnie's, Bonnie's shotgun, uh, is now the most expensive shotgun in the world as well. So the most expensive shotgun and the most expensive punt gun.

• 47:15Steven Rinella?

  You know what I'd pay a lot for?

• 47:17Speaker 07

  What?

• 47:17Steven Rinella?

  I'd pay a lot for the shotgun that was used to kill the man that killed, um, that killed Robert Ford.

• 47:29Speaker 07

  Hmm.

• 47:30Steven Rinella?

  The gun that killed Robert Ford, who killed Jesse James.

• 47:32Speaker 07

  You want that one?

• 47:33Steven Rinella?

  I want that shotgun.

• 47:34Speaker 07

  Ask Rock Island. They, they might track down. My understanding.

• 47:37Steven Rinella?

  Say it nearly cut Bob Ford in half.

• 47:39Speaker 07

  Wow.

• 47:41Steven Rinella?

  Other witnesses say it cut his head in half.

• 47:43Speaker 07

  Okay.

• 47:44Steven Rinella?

  He was a slight man.

• 47:47Speaker 07

  The, the Bonnie and Clyde shotgun, it's the one that she's holding in a photo where she's got the barrel shoved into, I think Clyde's guts. Um, they're just like posing for a photo, but that is the shotgun. My understanding is they didn't know that existed until like a year ago. It kinda just showed up and they're like, oh my gosh, this is.

• 48:02Steven Rinella?

  And they were satisfied with the provenance.

• 48:06Speaker 07

  They, I, I guess they tracked down that like this is official. It's actually Bonnie and Clyde's gun. Uh, now the most expensive shotgun in the world. Uh, again, thanks to Brandon for setting that world record. Rock Island for helping us create more money for conservation, uh, and Meat Eater for funding this big dumb idea of having a punt gun.

• 48:23Steven Rinella?

  Love it. What a happy ending.

• 48:24Speaker 06

  It's, that's the end, man. No one's ever gonna bring that up again on this show. I can tell you that much. Now, whenever, whenever I buy a new gun, I'll be like, Sydney, you gotta think, this could be worth $120,000 someday.

• 48:36Speaker 07

  Uh-huh.

• 48:37Speaker 06

  No.

• 48:39Steven Rinella?

  I, that's, if I was her, I would say that.

• 48:44Speaker 03

  911, what's your emergency? Please help us. They're everywhere. We think they're murder hornets.

• 48:52Speaker 02

  911 Nashville returns.

• 48:54Speaker 04

  It's a homicide detective down here. Three bodies on the ground.

• 48:57Speaker 02

  With emergencies of biblical proportions. I will send swarms upon you and upon your people. And somebody's unleashing them on Nashville. Brian Phillippe joins 911 Nashville, all new Thursdays on ABC, next day on Hulu.

• 49:13Speaker 01

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• 50:14Steven Rinella?

  Okay. AMA solicitations. In September, we're doing an Ask Me Anything episode with Steve. Which will be the new show. Which will be the new show. For that week. For obvious reasons, everyone is gone in September. And so this is what we're gonna do. It's gonna be great. It's gonna be the best episode we've done. I'm excited to hear Steve. Steve, Steve. Just answer the question. Here's the deal. You need to send in good questions that are brief. I will not read long questions. Go. Send them to the meat eater podcast at the meat eater.com. If you put them in YouTube comments, you're, I'm probably not gonna see them. And so email me. The window closes September 3rd, and we'll see if they make the cut. Great. Good. On to corrections.

• 50:59Steven Rinella?

  We have a nitpicky correction, a clarification, and a helpful critique of trail cam usage. The winner gets a Moultrie Edge cell cam with, and this is the, the important part, a one year subscription.

• 51:14Steven Rinella?

  You get a camera and a subscription. One is from the

• 51:20Steven Rinella?

  great writer, tennis writer, outdoor writer, hunting writer, Peter Bodo. New York Times contributor. Are we using the interest on meters or not? We're not using it for this one. I'll talk to the guys who sent it in. I'm interested in. We're gonna pick the favorite though. Well, you're, you're interested already. Yeah, I'm in. Didn't heard damn.

• 51:39Steven Rinella?

  Peter Bodo, Austrian born. Yeah, I saw that. Not American. I just read it as not American, but yeah, Austrian born.

• 51:46Steven Rinella?

  Hey fellas, I don't want to be mean spirited. But as a raggedy ass old journalist, I have a few grammatical quibbles to share.

• 51:57Steven Rinella?

  They're not super current, but they recur across different episodes.

• 52:03Steven Rinella?

  His first morality. In a recent news show, episode 866, Boundary Waters tragedy, the gang discussed the morals morality of the old coot trying to prevent others from accessing public hunting land for turkey hunting. You debate, you debated the morality of this, but you should have been debating the ethics of it. As per the Oxford Dictionary, morals are your own internal rules about right and wrong. Ethics are the shared rules of a group, job, or society. So clearly the gent's behavior was an ethical rather than a moral issue.

• 52:49Steven Rinella?

  If it helps, this is a very common error made by all kinds of folks. A bank robber is not immoral, he's unethical. Learning curve. Spencer on the trivia show has talked about the learning curve, making it a common mistake. Something that is easy to learn has a steep learning curve. You get from point A to point Z very quickly. Something difficult to learn, expert marsh, expert marksmanship, spay casting, has a flat learning curve.

• 53:24Steven Rinella?

  I can't point to specific episodes as it was take too much research, but it always struck me. The reality is something, the reality is something easy has a steep learning curve. I didn't know that. I don't think anybody knows that. That's good. Finally.

• 53:42Steven Rinella?

  And lastly, especially on the trivia show, many contestants consistently confuse less and fewer. Dude, I didn't know this either. This is amazing. Less is for things you cannot count.

• 53:59Steven Rinella?

  Well, I'm gonna put it right back in his face on this one, because he says the well has less water. You damn sure count the water in a well.

• 54:05Speaker 03

  But only if you're referring, if you're referring to the units of water, if you just say water is like a general concept, it has less water. If you said it has fewer like cubic feet of water.

• 54:15Steven Rinella?

  Fewer is for things you can't.

• 54:19Steven Rinella?

  Yanis has only six TSS shotgun shells left.

• 54:26Steven Rinella?

  The first two I like. Yep. That third one, I got real questions.

• 54:31Steven Rinella?

  Uh, before we move on. Correction too. Oh, if I may. Yep. I just gotta throw a plug out for Pete's book, Whitetail Nation. It is an under the radar whitetail gem. Nobody, nobody talks about this. Yeah, it's worth blurbing. Um, very fun read. It talks about his kind of journey as a deer hunter from New York and kind of wants to explore this wild deer hunting culture across the rest of the country. And so he goes on this kind of year long pursuit of traveling to different states, diving into Texas, Montana, the Midwest, and you know, does it in a very interesting, unique way, given his perspective, his writing pedigree. Uh, very well done and a fun read for really any deer hunter. Great. Thank you.

• 55:14Speaker 03

  Sounds like a mildly steep learning curve.

• 55:18Steven Rinella?

  Mildly. He didn't get into mildly steep. Oh, it's a new one. Number two, recent Alpha Gal podcast, they had a brief tangent about chiggers. Well, hey friends, he says, these, it's about cheers. He says, just an FYI, chiggers live and lay eggs in the soil. They latch onto you and secrete digestive enzymes into your skin.

• 55:41Steven Rinella?

  Then they use sort of a fancy mouth straw to suck up your broken down proteins. None of this is new. The part that itches are those digestive enzymes. The spots are just, excuse me, the spots are just an inflammatory response to the tissue breakdown. This, none, none of this is new. It's just clarification. There are no chiggers under the skin or anything like that. Okay, not new. Best way to treat the bites, this is new, is just with a topical anti-inflammatory or anti itch cream of some sort. Same sort of thing you'd use to get your dog to stop scratching a sore spot.

• 56:25Steven Rinella?

  This is not gonna be the winner.

• 56:30Steven Rinella?

  Love him to death. Love him to death. Sure he loves his family. I'm sure he's a great American. Not the winner.

• 56:40Speaker 03

  No, but it says he designs anti-inflammatory and anti itch products.

• 56:43Steven Rinella?

  The reason he wrote in is He's got a horse in the race. In your conversation, you talked about various remedies like rubbing oil. No, no, we talked about various mids. Right. But then you never said what actually worked. And he was just saying, this is actually works. But he's also, he's in the pocket of big anti itch. I love the guy. I think we should send him a care package regardless. Cause I like him so much. But that's just not, okay. Episode 915, Dan Moultrie lost camera story. I was explaining that I have lost a camera. It cranks out great photos every day. We cannot find it. Oh, interesting. Well, not so much interesting anymore. Because the lat lawn is in the camera.

• 57:27Steven Rinella?

  Hey Steve, listening to the podcast this week and your question about how to find the trail cam with Dan Moultrie, just a little more background in this.

• 57:34Steven Rinella?

  We were putting a trail cam where we knew there had been a lot of ocelot. From a ocelot collaring project, we knew there was a lot of ocelot pings in the area. And so we're like, let's go put our own camera there and try to make a sweet ocelot video. In what state? Texas. Okay. So we make a pin and we get there and we, we make a pin on a map, but we get there and we don't like the area. Like it doesn't live up to its promise. The e-scouting didn't ground check. So then we wander off into the bush and then we find like the queen mother of all trail cam setups. No one ever thinks to re-pin the actual place.

• 58:15Steven Rinella?

  I sent Yanni, Yanni's down there. I say, hey, go find our camera. Yanni wanders all over hell and I never even get a picture of him looking for it.

• 58:25Steven Rinella?

  I was like, it's by a bush. What do you get on this trail camera? Yeah. Did you get the ocelot? Everything but what I'm trying to get. Hogs, javelinas, Neil guy, water buck, big bucks, regular bucks, you name it. Coyotes, wazoo, um, oryx. So isn't that a gems box? Oryx.

• 58:48Steven Rinella?

  But we can't find it. Okay. Literally everything. And the guy, the corrector says, I was a little surprised that neither you thought about the camera's GPS location. My Moultrie Edge 2 Pro has GPS data under device info.

• 59:03Steven Rinella?

  The gal.

• 59:05Steven Rinella?

  Steph. Steph Maddle.

• 59:09Steven Rinella?

  Could be a guy. Steph Curry. Steph Curry. And the guy just died.

• 59:16Steven Rinella?

  So, yes, the minute we talked about this, it became, we, someone else in the room pointed out, uh, you could just go in there and into your app and find your lat lawn. So the camera's now no longer lost. Okay. I got pictures this morning. Great photos.

• 59:36Steven Rinella?

  Uh, yep.

• 59:43Steven Rinella?

  I'm going with the camera. Same. Are we gonna vote? That's my vote. Okay. Uh, let's back up. Nitpicky grammatical stuff. Great. Nate likes it. Wow. Wow. Yeah. Wow.

• 59:58Speaker 07

  Feel like I learned something.

• 59:59Steven Rinella?

  Yep. He put a lot, he put a lot of thought. The learning curve thing, I, I've, I realize I've been doing that wrong my whole life.

• 1:00:05Speaker 07

  But that just makes me not want to say learning curve ever again.

• 1:00:08Steven Rinella?

  Because you're just gonna mix it up.

• 1:00:09Speaker 07

  Well, if you don't mix it up though, then you're like

• 1:00:11Speaker 03

  I think you're confusing.

• 1:00:12Speaker 07

  Correcting somebody and that's kind of weird.

• 1:00:14Steven Rinella?

  That just won. Cause he's show of hands again.

• 1:00:18Steven Rinella?

  No, I'm gonna change. Change my vote. Oh, you can't do that. Howard. No, now I can't say learning curve. You can. Don't say it right. You can. You just have to correct. Are you honestly changing your vote? I'm changing my vote. Only because you. Get out of here. Flip flopper. Yep, I'm flip flopping. Okay, so three. There's a potential, there's seven votes. Hanging chat over here. Anyone on using, um, anti whatevers when you get a chigger bite?

• 1:00:44Steven Rinella?

  Using this guy's personal products.

• 1:00:48Steven Rinella?

  No one. The one Steve declared not to be a winner. That your camera is not in fact lost. I'm going with that one. Wow, four. Okay, wow. Side, sorry, Boto, Peter Boto, love you to death.

• 1:01:01Steven Rinella?

  Love you to death. You just had tough competition. Yeah, you just got fewer votes than the other one. Yeah, that's all that happened. Yeah, it's Nate's fault. We, sorry, Pete. Still a good book.

• 1:01:15Steven Rinella?

  All right, this takes us to, uh, the first harvest success sent into the meteor meat eater podcast inbox. From Rodney Kidd sends in a report, three squirrels. He says, a little report from Indiana early squirrel season. They are not moving much. It's hot. They are speaking to each other in soft tones. You must really listen for them and then sneak.

• 1:01:37Steven Rinella?

  Uh, and he's got a nice photo. He's got his double barrel scatter gun. He's got a stringer, a three. Is that a brace or is a brace two?

• 1:01:47Steven Rinella?

  He's got a brace and a half, but he's got a brace and a half of gray squirrels hanging from a cord. He's got a backpack. He's got a bear grease hat and a real tree. No, and mossy oak. A brace is a pair or exactly two. Great. And he's got some of the kind of woods in Indiana. It looks like it. I just get itchy looking at that. Yeah. That is poison ivy country.

• 1:02:13Steven Rinella?

  I would be washing my hands after I skin those squirrels. People don't know this, they squirrels harvest that soft fuzz off the vines and line their nests with it.

• 1:02:25Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, you can get tore up from squirrels and poison ivy country. Uh, I was sharing that in Michigan, growing up, September 15th, opening day of squirrels. I could always take, uh, opening day deer rifle off, opening day trapping off. I could take opening day a bow off. We could kind of take like a half day off for opening day squirrel season. But, um, the first weekend that would happen of squirrel season, if it didn't, if it, uh, you know, whatever, first weekend. I just loved going down into the beach woods, the beach trees. And sitting there at daylight and listening to the beach nuts raining down. And you just sneak in under where they're like, hitting the forest floor. And the canopy be so thick, the squirrels wouldn't even know you were down below them.

• 1:03:09Steven Rinella?

  Oh, such a good time. And then shooting on up in there with a shotgun. Not even totally sure.

• 1:03:19Steven Rinella?

  What you were aiming at. That's how, at least that's how I remember it happening.

• 1:03:26Steven Rinella?

  You're like, I feel like that noise is coming from right thereabouts. Then the squirrels did know you were there. Yep, then they knew you were there, but man, that first trip, you were gonna get your limit of five, man. Such a good time. In the news.

• 1:03:44Steven Rinella?

  Well, that's great. The, in the news.

• 1:03:48Steven Rinella?

  I read the, I skim, so just to keep my head balanced in life. I read a bunch of different news sources. So when I wake up in the morning, I lay in bed, the missus will still be sleeping. And I'll go into, um.

• 1:04:01Steven Rinella?

  Tik Tok. No, no, no, no, no, no. Four chan. No, I go into, I'll, I'll peruse the Wall Street Journal. I'll, I'll, this is just a headline run, just to be like, what happened overnight? Right? Like who, what I've made, the major things that shaped global event kind of stuff. Well, I'll skim Wall Street Journal. I'll skim the New York Times. I'll skim the Economist. I'll skim Free Press. And I might get onto some other stuff too, but that way you're hearing it, you're hearing it from both sides. Right? Cause all these places have their own biases. So that way you get, you kind of levels your head out a little bit. Big, I, I love New York Times. I like this part of my peruse. But they have the wrong guy.

• 1:04:45Steven Rinella?

  They have the wrong guy on the wild horse beat.

• 1:04:49Steven Rinella?

  He's the wrong man for the job. Sure, he's a nice guy. Sure, he loves his family, great American. Uh, Dave Phillips. I got turned off to, by the journalist Dave Phillips years ago, and he wrote a piece, you know, those pieces where. Those pieces where it's not journalism, it's politics. Like this thing that came out the other day, this news thing, it gets picked up all over the place and this news thing that like, hey, mountain lions reduce vehicle collisions. Cause through some like cockamamie like analysis, they've determined that if you have like, it, it's sort of the argument is the more mountain lions we have, meaning the less mountain lions anybody shoots. The more they'll scare deer away from roads.

• 1:05:34Steven Rinella?

  And I'm like, but when you just change the headline to road hunters? Like road hunters reduce deer car collisions?

• 1:05:44Steven Rinella?

  Cause if you look at like, how many deer get killed by mountain lions? That number is dwarfed by the number of deer that get killed by humans. Why wouldn't it be a big study about how humans reduce deer car collisions? But it's like, it's politics. So the, they, they knew where they wanted to land. Right? They knew they wanted to land at, look at the bright side. All these people are anti predators, but it reduces, it's, it's hogwash. It's, it's just like, it's politics, which is cool. It's fine. Like that's what I traffic in. I traffic in, in manipulating shit to get what I want. Like, do you know what I'm saying? But at least I admit it. Yeah.

• 1:06:22Steven Rinella?

  This guy does it. This guy did this, like this piece while back where he's like, hey, good thing about mountain lions is they, they'll, they'll reduce the wild horse overpopulation. And you talk to anybody that has anything to do with wild horses or anything, anyone that has anything to do with mountain lions and they'd be like, mm, no. Cute, but no.

• 1:06:42Steven Rinella?

  Anyways. They've uncovered, so the New York Times ran this kind of investigative piece where they've uncovered that, that, that, that the Trump administration has found this loophole by which they are shipping, they are selling protected wild horses to slaughter through a loophole, meaning if you, if, well, let me give a little background.

• 1:07:07Steven Rinella?

  In the mid seventies, how long did I tell you I needed for this? Ten minutes. Okay.

• 1:07:12Steven Rinella?

  In the mid seventies. This country passed a very, very bad, short sighted piece of legislation, which was, it's known as, it's, I can't remember the exact term, but the Wild Horse and Borough Protection Act. Terrible piece of legislation did, did not contemplate the complex, the complexities of the future.

• 1:07:34Steven Rinella?

  At the time, there was maybe 25,000 wild horses and burrows out on the landscape of the American West. It defined what a wild horse and burrow was, and it protected them. And, and really tied the hands of future managers and how to deal with the situation should it get out of control. We are now there. It was 1971. It was called the Wild Free Roaming Horses and Burrows Act. Okay. Short sighted, it happens. Like it happens. You make short sighted things because you can't contemplate the future. People always point this up with the constitution, like critics of the American constitution will say, they never contemplated crypto. They never contemplated whatever, you know, I mean, they like, they wrote the document, not contemplating things. And so now

• 1:08:20Steven Rinella?

  sometimes we're in this spot where we're trying to figure out what people meant.

• 1:08:24Steven Rinella?

  This did not contemplate the present.

• 1:08:28Steven Rinella?

  We now have three times as many wild horses and burrows out in the landscape.

• 1:08:35Steven Rinella?

  We have more wild horses and burrows sitting in holding facilities than there were at the time they had packed this legislation. We got 73,000 wild horses and burrows out in the landscape, which is a drier landscape now than it was then. We have 60,000 of these things in storage where we're paying money to store them. Because the, the act that was meant to protect them made it that you couldn't send them to slaughter. It made, there's virtually no outlet for these animals. They have a budget to man, they have a budget to manage wild horses. The whole budget gets burned up. Paying

• 1:09:16Steven Rinella?

  farmers and ranchers and cancers in Oklahoma, a thousand dollars a year apiece to hold these wild horses in perpetuity.

• 1:09:28Steven Rinella?

  The government spends $3,000. Up to 3,000 bucks to catch a wild horse where they're overpopulated.

• 1:09:38Steven Rinella?

  They then sell them for about $25.

• 1:09:42Steven Rinella?

  And they have all this convoluted crap where like first you have to offer it for adoption and no one comes and gets them or three people come and adopt them. I'm being, I'm being ridiculous with my numbers, but it's like, not nearly enough people come forth to adopt them. Then the next step, there's like this sales process and you have to do that. And then if you try that and try this and try that and try this, you can then sell it under a certain caveat. And then the person that buys it is sort of less beholden to the law. And they can then move it to another person and then that person can send it up for slaughter. So there's this big cry fest in the New York Times about the fact that some of these wild horses are getting sent to slaughter, which and if it's illegal, it's illegal. They shouldn't be doing illegal stuff.

• 1:10:24Steven Rinella?

  But this is a problem that is not going away and it has hit maximum absurdity. The only solution here. The only solution here is to not restrict, but lubricate the path to slaughter because these are not, this is not American wildlife. This is a non-native domestic animal.

• 1:10:51Steven Rinella?

  People that, people that cry about ranchers having grazing rights out on public land, like this is tax, this is, this is grazing rights for, for livestock where the, it costs the government tens of millions of dollars. These are not wild animals. They're out competing deer, they're out competing bighorn sheep, all the mountain lions. Like if they all switched their diet to horses, which they don't want, they don't like horses, it's not their preferred thing, they like deer, they like bighorns, they don't want horses, they don't overlap with horses in the proper way. It's like, nothing's gonna take care of this problem. Nothing will take care of the problem. You go back to 2013, the National Academy of Science reports, here's a quote from the

• 1:11:36Steven Rinella?

  National Academy of Science report from 2013. Continuation of business as usual practices will be expensive and unproductive for BLM. Because compelling evidence exists that there are more horses on public rangelands than reported at the national level and that horse population growth rates are high. Unmanaged populations would probably double in about four years. That has happened. If populations were not actively managed for even a short time, the abundance of horses on public rangelands would increase until animals became food limited. Food limited to horse populations would affect forage and water resources for all other

• 1:12:20Steven Rinella?

  animals on shared rangeland and potentially conflict with the multiple use policy of public rangelands and the legislative mandate to maintain a thriving, natural, ecological balance. 2019, the BLM estimated that there are 88,090 wild horses and burrows on rangelands. That is not counting these 47,000 that were paying a thousand dollars apiece to put on otherwise productive farm and ranch land.

• 1:12:59Steven Rinella?

  Because we've tied our hands with ridiculous legislation. It's like, they got the wrong guy on the job. This guy is talking about this old dumb thing where people are supposed to go out and like shoot them with, shoot them with contraceptives? He's still on that? They were gonna pay all these guys to go out and shoot contraceptives into 80, well, let's say half of these are females, I don't know what the ratios are, let's say half of these are females, that you're gonna hire guys to go out and shoot contraceptives into 44,000 wild horses? It's like, wrong man on the job.

• 1:13:40Steven Rinella?

  If the Trump administration is in fact, like, doing a thing that's naughty, you know, I'm a law and order guy, but, but the sentiment of that something, that they have created an unlivable situation, and I would expect at this point, that as Americans get a more sophisticated understanding of ecology, that we would be putting true native North American wildlife way ahead, way ahead in priority of livestock. And these things are livestock.

• 1:14:16Speaker 06

  I have heard, right, there, there's all sorts of different levels of animal rights or animal lovers who, who go really hard on their species of choice. I've heard that the horse lovers are a whole nother level.

• 1:14:29Steven Rinella?

  Dude, they're, they're the Gestapo of animal rights people.

• 1:14:33Speaker 07

  It feels like a group that probably has money, too.

• 1:14:36Steven Rinella?

  What's that Iranian group? Soleimani ran it? They're the Cuds.

• 1:14:41Speaker 06

  The Cuds.

• 1:14:42Steven Rinella?

  Dude, they are the Cuds force of the animal rights movement.

• 1:14:49Speaker 06

  Anyways, see that film Unbranded? Sure. That was like my introduction to this whole thing. They go and they adopt a couple of these Broncos and kind of explore, it was, it was interesting.

• 1:15:00Steven Rinella?

  People, just, but here's the thing, go read the piece yourself. It's called, uh, where is it? It's called, um...

• 1:15:06Speaker 06

  Under Trump, protected wild horses are going to slaughter.

• 1:15:09Steven Rinella?

  Dave Phillips, I usually have great luck with guys named Dave. He should, we should maybe just have this guy on the show, just to be like, dude, come on. He reports on military affairs, which I respect, he's the wrong man for the job on wild horses.

• 1:15:20Speaker 07

  You should start an interview show where you can talk to people like this that you're interested in.

• 1:15:24Steven Rinella?

  We already have an interview show, I'm not gonna make a whole new one.

• 1:15:26Speaker 07

  No, man, it's a joke.

• 1:15:28Speaker 06

  You should have, you should have him talk to Arthur Lawson at, at the Wind River Fishing Game. Yeah, remember, I mean, that, that was a great conversation for wrapping your head around the impact that they have.

• 1:15:39Steven Rinella?

  I have better luck with Daves than any other name. Really? Absolutely.

• 1:15:44Speaker 06

  Is the sample size on Randall just too small?

• 1:15:46Steven Rinella?

  I don't have bad luck on Randall. I don't wanna tell you the names I got bad luck on because it'd make people feel bad with those names.

• 1:15:53Speaker 06

  You already told anybody in this room?

• 1:15:54Steven Rinella?

  Well, much as I love you Nate, Nate, Nate was a problem for me.

• 1:16:01Speaker 06

  Yeah, that was one of the first things you said to me.

• 1:16:06Steven Rinella?

  But dude, Daves, dude, I do, me and Daves do great together. Uh, then you got the tagline, or whatever they call it, I forgot about, I've been out of the, it's been a long time since I took Journalism 101, there's the thing, there's a word for this, it's like the sort of other title. A legal loophole. Yeah, you can tell where this is headed. A legal loophole allows the government to sell Mustangs on the cheap, stripping them of protections and clearing their path to destruction. You know what'd really get this guy worked up? If he somehow found out that they're killing all these cattle from steaks and burgers.

• 1:16:42Speaker 07

  Yeah.

• 1:16:43Steven Rinella?

  He'd be like, they're what?

• 1:16:45Speaker 07

  Yeah.

• 1:16:46Steven Rinella?

  He must not know this, he must not know that this is happening, that people are eating chickens and cattle and stuff.

• 1:16:51Speaker 07

  People like Randall are eating horses.

• 1:16:53Speaker 06

  Yeah, I'm a horse steak guy now.

• 1:16:54Steven Rinella?

  Oh yeah, in New York, or sorry, in Italy, you can get horseandos.

• 1:16:57Speaker 06

  Yeah, I got a horse, I got a horse steak in Belgium.

• 1:16:59Steven Rinella?

  Oh, was that?

• 1:17:00Speaker 06

  It's delicious.

• 1:17:01Steven Rinella?

  Yeah. Dave would be like, if I was like, Dave, dude, I gotta tell you, man, they're killing all kinds of cattle. Eating them.

• 1:17:07Speaker 06

  Selling them. It also sounds, when you say a legal loophole allows them to do this, it sounds like, yeah, legal, it sounds like it's legal.

• 1:17:17Steven Rinella?

  They got the wrong, I, I, like, I'm sure, I, I know, I know he's a, I'm sure he's a great guy, they got the wrong, they need to hand the wild horse beat over. I'll tell you who to hand it to, Jim Roberts. Is that his name, Jim Roberts?

• 1:17:32Speaker 06

  Yeah, I think. Yeah, he's the guy you like.

• 1:17:34Steven Rinella?

  Does pieces for the New York Times, he's from Montana. You need to fire, give Dave more stuff on veterans, fire him off the wild horse beat, bring Jim Robinson to rewrite all that stuff. Here's a great one that Randall found, this one tickles the hell out of me, this is an old news story. Listen to this, you wanna talk about a headline? Forest fire explodes gun of trapper skeleton is found. Lewis and Clark Forest, that's when he knew how to write a headline. Forest fire explodes gun of trapper skeleton is found. Lewis Clark Forest.

• 1:18:16Steven Rinella?

  We're gonna start a segment called Old Ass News, here's the piece. Great Falls, Montana, August 29. What year was it though?

• 1:18:27Speaker 06

  I think it's 1928.

• 1:18:28Steven Rinella?

  That's right, 1928. The skeleton of a trapper, which has lain undisturbed for years, perhaps half a century, has been uncovered by a forest fire in the Lewis Clark Forest. The skeleton was found when bullets from the trapper's old gun exploded from the heat of the flames. The firefighting crews heard the explosion and then found the skeleton. The man had apparently been killed by an animal on the spot where he had made his camp. The rifle was beside the skeleton with a date of 1873 upon it.

• 1:19:12Steven Rinella?

  There was an old iron skillet of the type, long off the market.

• 1:19:17Speaker 06

  That's my favorite part.

• 1:19:18Steven Rinella?

  Yeah. I'll just go back, cause I want people to really savor the true journalism here.

• 1:19:24Speaker 06

  My favorite part.

• 1:19:26Steven Rinella?

  There was an old iron skillet of the type, long off the market, a salt shaker and two bottles of trapper's poison. And then he wraps it up, that, you need to find this guy.

• 1:19:41Speaker 06

  Just the facts, man.

• 1:19:42Steven Rinella?

  Drag him out of the dead and have him take up the wild horse beat for the New York Times. This guy'd give it to you straight. That's journalism.

• 1:19:52Speaker 06

  That's a hell of a story.

• 1:19:53Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, that's journalism.

• 1:19:54Speaker 06

  God, there's gotta be a few more of those laying out there.

• 1:19:56Steven Rinella?

  Oh yeah.

• 1:19:57Speaker 07

  Yeah, I never considered that a forest fire would, uh, like, send unsent bullets off into the atmosphere.

• 1:20:04Steven Rinella?

  And they'd be laying by an old tractor with an iron skillet of the type, not currently for sale.

• 1:20:09Speaker 01

  911, what's your emergency?

• 1:20:15Speaker 03

  Please help us, they're everywhere. We think they're murder victims.

• 1:20:21Speaker 02

  911 Nashville returns.

• 1:20:24Speaker 04

  It's a homicide detective down here.

• 1:20:25Speaker 02

  Three bodies on the ground. With emergencies of biblical proportions. Oh, since swarms upon you and upon your people. That's one of the plagues. And somebody's unleashing them on Nashville. Brian Phillippe, 2911 Nashville. All new Thursdays on ABC, next day on Hulu.

• 1:20:43Steven Rinella?

  OnDeck is built to back small businesses like yours. Whether you're buying equipment, expanding your team, or bridging cash flow gaps, OnDeck's loans up to $400,000 make it happen fast. Rated A plus by the Better Business Bureau and earning thousands of five star TrustPilot reviews, OnDeck delivers funding you can count on. Apply in minutes at ondeck.com. Depending on certain loan attributes, your business loan may be issued by OnDeck or Celtic Bank. OnDeck does not lend in North Dakota. All loans and amounts subject to lender approval.

• 1:21:11Speaker 02

  Breathe in and reset with Lincoln Rejuvenate, an available multi-sensory feature in the 2027 Lincoln Navigator SUV. Experience the luxurious massage, visuals, and scents to help you relax in the driver's seat. It's your time for a reset. Visit lincoln.com to learn more. Lincoln Rejuvenate does not operate unless the vehicle is in park, when the vehicle is off, or if any doors open. Do not use the feature in a closed garage or in other enclosed areas. See owner's manual for important operating instructions. Lincoln and Navigator trademarks of Ford or its affiliates. All rights reserved.

• 1:21:42Steven Rinella?

  Marcus, roadless rule. All right, I'll keep it kind of short since this has been something I know you guys have talked about over the months and the last year or so, but we can dive as far as you want into this. The news came out last week that the USDA has officially proposed their ruling on the roadless rule. So last summer, a lot of people started talking about this because the administration kind of released their, their floating of this idea of rolling back the roadless rule. They started a comment period. 600, 100,000 or so comments were put into the, into the federal record. Many, many, many, many folks spoke out in defense of this place, of this ruling.

• 1:22:24Steven Rinella?

  Fast forward now, back in August 20th, I guess it was, the federal government showcased the fact that they want to officially rescind the roadless rule in its entirety. Soon after that, they released the mandated draft environmental impact statement, and then a 30 day public comment period was opened after that. Can I back you up to one thing? Yeah. The, the comment period is a thing they have to do. No one pays attention to that sadly. I'm curious, who, who, how many comments were there in favor of revoking the roadless, of, of opening all this up? Did you see, was the split, what was the split? About 99% were in favor of keeping it. Yeah.

• 1:23:07Steven Rinella?

  And there was more than 600,000 comments applied. Back when the roadless rule was created, back in 2001, they went through like a year and a half process, and there was 1.6 million comments submitted, and more than 90% of those were in support of this, of the roadless rule. Yeah. So yeah, so the, the public comment period, some people will say, doesn't really matter, but it, it does a couple of things. Number one, it does establish a record of the public's perspective. Sure. That ostensibly the government should be looking at and considering when making their decision, but also down the line when it comes to litigation, when it comes to, Oh. you know, how this might play out for the next administration too. All of that will be reviewed and looked at. Got it. So.

• 1:23:52Steven Rinella?

  So to say like, this is overwhelmingly, this is an overwhelmingly unpopular move with the American public. Yes, and, and I kind of was messing up my words earlier, but about 44 million acres of public land fall underneath this, this ruling. There are also separate roadless rules for Idaho and Colorado. So this would not impact those two states. Good. But the high level thing here is that the roadless rule keeps these forest lands from having most new roads and most forms of industrial scale logging. So the idea that the administration, that the USDA has, has placed around their preferred alternative, which would be to roll it back in its entirety, is that this should help with wildfire mitigation,

• 1:24:37Steven Rinella?

  that this should help with, right, this should help with active management. It's a lie. That's, it's a red hair. Yes, that's true a teeny bit, but that is not where this is coming from. Yes. They use that, they use that.

• 1:24:53Steven Rinella?

  But they, they like way over emphasize how much they care about that. True, but it sounds really good. Yeah. And, and if you look. Oh, what, you want everybody's house to burn down? Well, gosh, I don't want that. If you look. Then let us log the shit out of everything that's unlogged, you know? There's 193 million acres or so of, of national forest lands, right? Almost, uh, almost 100 million acres of those are, are wide open to whatever kind of active management a forest would like, whatever kind of wildfire prescriptions. Then you have the 44 million, it's 58 million if you include Colorado and Idaho, 58 million acres of national forest lands, which do fall underneath some kind of roadless rule protection. But they did include exceptions for wildfire treatment.

• 1:25:36Steven Rinella?

  You can build new roads to battle a wildfire if the exceptions are needed. There are exceptions for wildlife habitat treatments to, to, to make sure to account for some form of active management needed. So there's, there's ways around this, there's flexibility built into the roadless rule to account for these different things. And then there's 37 million or so that are protected by the Wilderness Act, which truly are off limits to those things. So the point being is that there is a lot of room for management of our forests. There's other challenges to getting that management, right? There's litigation, there's forest planning processes. But the roadless rule is not some kind of de facto wilderness that is keeping people out of these places. It is not keeping, you know, actually it's not even, even keeping mining or development of that kind out.

• 1:26:21Steven Rinella?

  It is not keeping grazing off of these landscapes. There are even off-road vehicle use, off-road vehicles are allowed in these places. Existing roads can exist in these places. So it's kind of a, a nice middle ground public land designation that for 25 years has kept these, these roadless cores intact. And I think a lot of people now really appreciate that. And that's why there's, you know, so many hundreds of thousands of people that have spoken out about it. And I expect now that, you know, the official ruling is out there, the draft environmental impact statement is out there. The public comment period is now officially open, that we're going to see something similar again this time around. What that means then for the actual, you know, changes on the, on the ground

• 1:27:03Steven Rinella?

  is that the Forest Service will have to review all the comments that come in over this 30 day period. They will have to assess the sentiment, they'll go through all these different things. And then some number of months down the road, they will release the final environmental impact statement and decision. Like I mentioned, they, they've said they fully intend to roll it back in its entirety. And then what happens after that will be, you know, up to the next administration or whoever's, whoever's appointing the, the forest director in the future. Besides all the stuff that they say they want, that they maybe want a teeny bit, what in your mind is the main thing they want?

• 1:27:42Steven Rinella?

  This is coming, this is coming from someone. Yeah. This is coming from some group. I know that the appetite to do rare earth and old growth in Tongess National Forest, our biggest national forest, is enormous. Right? There's an enormous appetite for those things, and those things are held back by the roadless rule. Like what other things do you feel are the ones that the guy, that the people that are spending money on this and that are pushing this and that are coming up with these little fire mitigation schemes? Yes. What do they want? So the funny thing is that when you look at the timber value and the resource value in many of these places, it is actually not, you know, economically feasible to make a profit from going in there and extracting timber from a lot of these locations.

• 1:28:27Steven Rinella?

  They're high elevation, they're hard to get to. Good. Just building the roads in many cases and maintaining them would cost more than any kind of profit from the timber. So it's not really that. I just spoke with someone today. What is it? The people I've spoken to really think it comes down to more, almost, I've heard it referred to as like a religious thing, like ideological, ideologically opposed to this kind of regulation. They want to come in and move things back to state level, remove roadblocks to any kind of potential development or resource extraction opportunities. So that's what it comes down to. I've heard like the timber industry supposedly, from what I've heard, the timber industry isn't asking for this. Got it. This is, this is something that is coming top down. Philosophical. It's like ideological. Yes. How would a country?

• 1:29:12Steven Rinella?

  Like, why would a country tie its hands behind its back when it comes to industrial might?

• 1:29:22Steven Rinella?

  Yep. We might all be dead tomorrow. Yep. Might as well use everything up now. This, I think, I think the rule this rule is one of those sweet spots where they, they took into account the fact that you need to have flexibility. And maybe, you know, in all honesty, there, there likely are ways this rule could be improved still, right? Things are different now than they were 25 years ago when this was written. Uh, but this full scale rollback seems like a short sighted way of doing it. Yeah. It does, it, yeah.

• 1:29:54Steven Rinella?

  When I sit and ask myself if I was like, what do you fear most? Running out of roads? Or running out of places with no roads? Yeah.

• 1:30:04Steven Rinella?

  I'm like, man, I thought it through long and hard. I just don't think we're gonna run out of roads. 370,000. I don't think sometime down the road, I'm gonna be like, man, whatever happened to all them roads?

• 1:30:15Steven Rinella?

  There's nowhere to drive. It's just, I don't foresee this issue. Yeah. Our, our unfragmented, you know, wild cores are just becoming increasingly more rare. And this is the kind of thing that they're not making any more of. So there's some value to keeping it around. You know, you talk about like when TR was doing all his stuff. At the time, it was very radical and now we look back and it's great. Yeah. I, I looked back at the public comment when Clinton enacted this and they loved it. At the time, it broke records for public comment, like one, one and a half million comments and 95% of those were positive. It's just like the through line is this is great. Since we started. Oh, yeah. I, I mentioned the TR thing all the time.

• 1:30:59Steven Rinella?

  He was controversial at the time. Um, he, he'd be regarded as a tree hug and lunatic now. And now everybody's like, TR, TR, go to the library. Um, while simultaneously trying to dismantle his legacy.

• 1:31:16Steven Rinella?

  So, yeah, if you have interest in sharing your perspective on this, the comment period is open until September 21st around midnight. So going over to the federal register, that's where you can leave your comment. Um, you know, backcountry hunters and anglers and other organizations have like an easy action, right? You can go to their take action center. You can sign on to the form letter. But truly, if you want your voice to be heard, you know, sharing an actually unique comment is gonna get you the most traction and, and not just, you know, doing the action email that sends to your elected officials, but actually going to the federal register where the forest service is mandated to review every unique comment. Yep. So if you go and actually share a unique comment that shows, you know, not only that

• 1:31:59Steven Rinella?

  you understand the issue, but that you have a personal experience or connection or perspective on it, that's going to, you know, get a little bit more credence with those folks too. And again, maybe this administration is going to do what they want to do from the get go. And it doesn't matter what you say. No. But down the line, this stuff will be useful for whatever's next. No, I'll go, I'll go down there. All right, hit me with the Tim Walz thing, because this is puzzling to me. Yeah, so you guys are all familiar with the Boundary Waters, uh, fiasco this spring. They use the Congressional Review Act to rollback that mineral withdrawal. Now, just recently, the governor of Minnesota, Tim Walz, signed this executive order. Can you put that in like idiot terms, please? Yeah, yeah.

• 1:32:41Steven Rinella?

  So there was a set of protections placed around the watershed around the Boundary Waters a few years ago that would keep, uh, certain types of mining from happening right around this incredibly popular, important wilderness area. Oh, yeah, on the headwaters of the rivers that create. Correct. Boundary Waters area. It all came from this mine that's been proposed right on the upstream border of the Boundary Waters. The Twin Metals Mine, like you said, just upstream of this watershed, the, the flow through the Boundary Waters. So that's kind of what led to everything. And it's been years and years and years of back and forth and back and forth on this thing.

• 1:33:22Steven Rinella?

  So in 2023, I think it is, the Biden administration put this mineral withdrawal in place, which basically said, you can't do this kind of mining in this place.

• 1:33:32Steven Rinella?

  And then this spring, uh, there was this whole legislative battle that we're all familiar with that effectively removed that, opening the potential road for these types of mines to happen there again. So that's what led us to last week, when the governor of Minnesota said, not so fast, he signed this executive order that essentially put substantial roadblocks in the way for a mine. So it's not necessarily a hundred percent, no, it can't happen, but there's a certain amount of like state and federal cooperation that typically has to occur for a mining project or, or any kind of. It would require a lot of state land permits, too. Yeah. So this EO that, that Walz signs, it requires the Minnesota Department of Natural Resources

• 1:34:17Steven Rinella?

  to not undertake any kind of environmental review or permit work associated with proposals like this kind of mining until litigation is completed. There's a, there's a whole set of litigation related to this going on right now. It would, uh, direct the DNR not to participate as a cooperating agency in any federal environmental review. It would, uh, not offer any new state leases for this kind of mining. It would, uh, require the DNR not to offer any new state surface leases for this kind of mining. It would also require them to start drafting legislative language prohibiting this kind of mining in this watershed as well. So spoke to some folks on the ground there in Minnesota about this, basically asking, you know, does this thing have legs?

• 1:35:01Steven Rinella?

  Will this actually stop this or is this kind of window dressing? And the, the cliff notes of what he shared was that this is a roadblock. This would expire 90 days after the, uh, after the new governor, governor takes office. Hmm. So if a new governor comes into Minnesota here that has a different view on this, it would expire and this stuff would be gone. Yeah, that's the, like, any executive order.

• 1:35:28Steven Rinella?

  Um, executive orders are generally much weaker than legislative action because they just get, the next time this, a different person comes in with the same job title, they undo executive orders with other executive orders. Yeah. Which is how we wind up with some of these perpetual issues. Yes. Like these issues that never die. I think the thinking or the hope, though, is that it's likely that the next governor there in Minnesota will be on board with this or close to it. And so this sets, this sets it up easily for, for whoever's next to continue this. Uh, and again, they can't stop federal leasing. They can't stop that from being, you know, from happening, but this certainly will prevent it from moving slow or quickly. This is going to be the opposite of lubricating the rails.

• 1:36:10Steven Rinella?

  This is going to slow down the process and hopefully there'll be other ways and other forms of protection that can, you know, make, make this more permanent down the line. So it's, it's positive news if you care about the Boundary Waters, but it's not a permanent fix. Mm-hmm. This ain't going nowhere. Not going anywhere. We'll keep you posted, though.

• 1:36:29Steven Rinella?

  North Carolina. You want to talk Amendment 84 first? Oh, yeah, I'll do it real quick. Uh, we had a guest on some time ago, Dan Gates came in and talked about the signature collecting phase of putting a, putting a codified right to hunt and fish vote to Coloradoan voters this November. Meaning on your ballot and they're trying to collect enough signatures to put on the ballot. Boy, I'm doing a terrible job with this.

• 1:37:01Steven Rinella?

  There's a ballot initiative in Colorado called Amendment 84. It would codify the right to hunt and fish in Colorado. In order to get it on the ballot, they needed a bunch of signatures. Dan Gates came up from Colorado and did the news show and talked about the signature gathering process. And we alerted Colorado voters where to go to sign to get it on the ballot. Gates has updated me that they're looking good. They're sitting pretty on signatures. This thing is headed to the ballot. We will remind you before, but when you go down to vote, if you're in Colorado and you go down to vote this November, skip all the stuff. I don't care.

• 1:37:44Steven Rinella?

  Skip all the other stuff like president, whatever, that won't be on there, but skip all the other stuff. Find Amendment 84 and vote in favor of Amendment 84's passage. This will be helpful to you. Um, a, a, like, these are widespread. I can't remember how many states now, 30 states, 20 some states have right to hunt and fish things. We're sitting in a state weirdly that does not. Um, we should remedy that, but

• 1:38:11Steven Rinella?

  a, a problem I have with right to hunt the fish legislation is it's sometimes hard to see where the rubber meets the road. Meaning you have this. What are those occasions when you're able to effectively sue the government for violating one's right to hunt and fish? Right? It's like,

• 1:38:33Steven Rinella?

  I have yet to meet anyone that can come to me with a, with a interesting list of ways in which the right to hunt and fish was weaponized against assaults on hunting and fishing rights.

• 1:38:48Steven Rinella?

  But here's an interesting one. Enter North Carolina. Enter North Carolina. Here's an interesting case study on where a right to hunt and fish is, actually proves to be useful. Uh, this story comes to us from Mike L. of North Carolina. And, uh, what he's calling attention to is a lawsuit filed in 2020 by the CCA of North Carolina, the Coastal Conservation Association of North Carolina. And through six years of litigation, a whole bunch of plaintiffs, including five former members of North Carolina's Marine Fisheries Commission, they were able to prove that by allowing the, the commission, by allowing North Carolina's coastal fisheries to degrade

• 1:39:30Steven Rinella?

  and deteriorate, the state of North Carolina violated the legal rights of North Carolinians to fish and harvest fish in the Atlantic. These rights that they infringed on are guaranteed to them by a constitutional right to hunt and fish. Hunt, fish and harvest wildlife. Exactly. Yep. And like, to be like, if you kill the wildlife off, you have taken away my right to harvest. Yep.

• 1:39:56Speaker 03

  911, what's your emergency?

• 1:39:59Speaker 03

  Please help us. They're everywhere. We think they're murder hornets.

• 1:40:03Speaker 02

  911 Nashville returns.

• 1:40:06Speaker 04

  There's a homicide detective down here. Three bodies on the ground.

• 1:40:09Speaker 02

  With emergencies of biblical proportions. All sins swarms upon you and upon your people. And somebody's unleashing him on Nashville. Brian Phillippe, 211 Nashville, all new Thursdays on ABC, next day on Hulu.

• 1:40:25Steven Rinella?

  OnDeck is built to back small businesses like yours. Whether you're buying equipment, expanding your team, or bridging cash flow gaps, OnDeck's loans up to $400,000 make it happen fast. Rated A plus by the Better Business Bureau and earning thousands of five-star TrustPilot reviews, OnDeck delivers funding you can count on. Apply in minutes at ondeck.com. Depending on certain loan attributes, your business loan may be issued by OnDeck or Celtic Bank. OnDeck does not lend in North Dakota. All loans and amounts subject to lender approval.

• 1:40:53Speaker 02

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• 1:41:24Steven Rinella?

  And so ultimately, what this this comes down to is this tension between sound management, the public trust, the marine and estuary resources, and protecting that not only for the current but future generations as well, which is what this this thing kind of stipulates. And they found at trial, including tons of expert testimony, previous, current fisheries, the commission members, as well as other states' commission members, the state had failed to meet any of the standards set by themselves. The court cited undisputed evidence that none of Carolina, North Carolina's 13 state-managed coastal fish stocks is currently

• 1:42:04Steven Rinella?

  viable. So like, they're 0 for 13. And so the situation is, it's really a critique of the commission structure, not necessarily the biologists or the fishermen attempting to steward the resource. And the way this this commission is structured and the results of the the regulations they've pushed down is there's this tension between commercial trawling and gill netting in the estuaries where these these unhealthy fish populations typically spawn. And the three legal grounds that this was litigated on is public trust doctrine, and two provisions of the North Carolina Constitution, the right to hunt and fish, and the duty to conserve lands and waters. And this was the thing, they pointed

• 1:42:44Steven Rinella?

  to pretty regularly is that the state is violating the right and hunt to fish by removing all the fish that people that constituents could go out and pursue. There's of those 13, we won't go into every single one, but southern flounder, river herring, blue crab, spotted sea trout, red drum, hard clam, these are those 13. And none meets the state's definition of viability. Yes, the state's own definition of viability. And there's there's kind of three buckets here. There's one red drum that has tight commercial, they have slot limits, there's no real commercial fishing for them, and they're somewhat on the upswing. There's

• 1:43:25Steven Rinella?

  four that have no stock assessment at all. Like, they just don't, there's nothing to compare it to, you know? We took out a million, whatever, but out of how many? Out of a million? Out of 2 million? Out of 5? And so because there's no data, the court pointed to the fact that you're not managing the fish at all. The lack of data points to a failure on your part to manage this resource. Sure. And those three, those four fish happen to be the preponderance of bycatch in these commercial fisheries. Got it. When a shrimp trawler pulls up his net, they found typically anywhere between 20

• 1:44:01Steven Rinella?

  and 30% of that catch is shrimp, and the other 80 to 70% are yearling fish. That includes the, sorry, the sheep's head, the spotted sea trout, and river herring. Can I tell you a metaphor? Yeah, please. I was in Belize one time, and I was watching these guys check fish traps. And they pull the fish trap up, and they pull out of it whatever snappers and grunts are big enough to mark it. You know what they do with everything that's in that trap? They carry a weed burning torch on the boat with a propane tank. It's a wire mesh trap. They hold that trap up

• 1:44:45Steven Rinella?

  and bake every fish in it with a weed burning torch because that's bait. And they throw it back overboard.

• 1:44:52Speaker 06

  Man.

• 1:44:53Steven Rinella?

  Yeah. I don't think that's happening here. No, no. I said, I said, it's a metaphor. Agreed. It's a metaphor. It's a bycatch metaphor. And so there's a lot of a lot of nuance here between commercial and recreational fishing. But the crux of the issue is these commission structures. And what's interesting is, in North Carolina, they have two commission structures. There's WRC, Wildlife Resource Commission, that's inland game and fish. And then there's the DMF, the Division of Marine Fisheries. And basically, WRC's crushing it. Like, they're out there maintaining and stewarding the wildlife resources. They have 21 appointed members, half by the governor,

• 1:45:34Steven Rinella?

  half by legislature. They don't have certain industry or like requirements on who they are. They're just, by statute, they say, "an experienced hunter, fisherman, farmer, or biologist who shall generally be informed on wildlife conservation restoration programs." You compare that to the, I'm sorry, the Marine Fisheries Commission, those are governor, all governor-appointed, three-year terms, no limits, no confirmation. Two are active or retired commercial fresh fishermen, one's a seafood industry person, two are rec sport fishermen, one's a sport fishing industry person, one is a fishery scientist, and two are general. They vote on the rules presented by the Division of Marine Fisheries, which are the biologists and whatnot. And basically, they they get, they get into blocks, they

• 1:46:18Steven Rinella?

  vote for whatever is good for their block, and there's no care for the resource, they just care about who's getting the fish this year. That seems to be the voting trend that this court, this court case bore out. And so the court's recommendation are restructuring this this commission, adding some sort of legislative oversight, adding a third-party commission that's independent, and streamlining the process to align incentives for those commissioners, and then allowing the DMF to do their job. When I reached out to CCA, the people who brought this, they're currently, they won, you know, they're in the remedy stage, but that's where they're at, is they're deciding what the remedy is from the state for for these plaintiffs. And everyone's kind of tight-lipped at this point, you know? They don't want to impact the process. They don't want to muddy the waters by yapping about it.

• 1:47:02Steven Rinella?

  But hopefully, we'll get some sort of solid remedy for for the resource as a whole, and we'll be able to talk to them about that.

• 1:47:10Speaker 06

  Is this going to end with the state, like, cutting a big check to somebody?

• 1:47:13Steven Rinella?

  I don't know. I think it's going to end with a restructuring of the the commission. And just like, sorry, this is the new way we're going to try it. That's what I imagine. But, you know, we asked the question earlier, it's like, what is it? Like, it's a remedy play, not a money play. I think so. Because then it winds up being a class-action lawsuit, I guess, between all people that hold, oh, I'm on the hook right now to make, to get money from Costa Del Mar, the sunglass company. I'm part of a class-action lawsuit without even knowing it.

• 1:47:39Speaker 06

  I just got paid.

• 1:47:39Steven Rinella?

  Because I was charged, I was charged for repair. Next time you see me and Randall, we're going to have a gold teeth and shit.

• 1:47:44Speaker 06

  I just got paid in a class-action lawsuit, my first one.

• 1:47:48Steven Rinella?

  Wow. Fabulous. How much?

• 1:47:52Steven Rinella?

  It's more than you think.

• 1:47:54Speaker 06

  Four digits.

• 1:47:55Steven Rinella?

  Wow. I always thought it was like 271 when I was in class.

• 1:47:59Speaker 06

  What happened?

• 1:48:00Steven Rinella?

  $2.71.

• 1:48:01Speaker 06

  There's a big, there's a big antitrust lawsuit against a bunch of colleges and universities, and how they administered and offered financial aid. So there's a big lawsuit against, like, University of Chicago, Columbia, all these. And it was like a four-year thing. Every six months, I go, oh, yeah, what's happening with that? And I Google what's happening with it, nothing. And then one day, just on my phone, ding.

• 1:48:23Steven Rinella?

  Yeah.

• 1:48:23Speaker 06

  Somebody's getting a new deal.

• 1:48:24Steven Rinella?

  I know. I'm probably going to make three, four bucks on this Costa deal. Unless I choose to withdraw my name, which is very complicated. They're like, you're in it, and if you want out of it, it's a bitch. But the one I'm excited about, where it is a big deal, is I'm in a class-action lawsuit against the AI company Anthropic for many of my book titles. So there's this whole class-action lawsuit where they were stealing from writers to train AI models. And you can go into this big database, and my name's in there like eight times for books.

• 1:48:56Speaker 06

  Nice.

• 1:48:57Steven Rinella?

  Some, some, and it's like real money. It's real money.

• 1:49:00Speaker 06

  I'm also in a class-action lawsuit against NBA League Pass.

• 1:49:03Speaker 07

  I get emails about that one almost every day, like, in the last probably month.

• 1:49:07Speaker 06

  I'm a big class-action guy now. Big time.

• 1:49:09Speaker 07

  The last month, I've been getting a lot of those.

• 1:49:12Steven Rinella?

  How much are you staying to make there?

• 1:49:13Speaker 06

  I don't know, but.

• 1:49:15Speaker 07

  I should go sign up for that.

• 1:49:16Speaker 06

  I have, I'm on a roll right now.

• 1:49:18Speaker 07

  That was inspiring, Randy. You got four digits? That's inspiring.

• 1:49:21Steven Rinella?

  Low, low, low four digits. This Anthropic deal, this could wind up being like, like, I think it could wind up being like 10, 12 grand, dude.

• 1:49:32Steven Rinella?

  You going to give that to Land Access Initiative? No, man. Well, a lot of it, so a lot of it is, a lot of it is, a lot of it's Meat Eater books, but some of my personal stuff is in there too, so stay tuned. Anyways, are you wrapping her up? Yeah, it's just like, what kind of door does this open? You know, I could see, I could see it getting real squirrely, real fast. As people compete like, you know, you took, I don't have any deer here now and it's because of the commission. They screwed me and it'll just be really interesting. I think it's generally positive. Um, you should go vote for your constitutional right to hunt and fish, um, but who knows where it'll go. Is it, I wonder if it's going to make it more difficult to get that, you know, passed again in the future in other states. Because now they're saying there's constitutional right has teeth. Yep.

• 1:50:15Steven Rinella?

  Now will a state like Montana be more worried or somewhere else about the possible ramifications? Yeah, I don't want to get into details on it, but when they try it, my understanding, which is like fresh, new. I didn't ever heard this. It was tried in the past in Montana. You know the term like strange bedfellows? What's the opposite?

• 1:50:37Steven Rinella?

  Uh, husband and wife. No, strange enemies. Oh. I was, it was pointed out to me that there was some strange enemies to the right to hunt and fish. Not who you'd think would oppose it. And it could be because stuff like this where people are like, man, this is going to turn into a big old headache for me. Right? Not who you'd think. It could be like these commissioners could be like, or whatever. They could be like, oh damn, I knew this was going to happen.

• 1:51:11Steven Rinella?

  It's going to come around and bite me in the ass and here they are. It will be interesting. Tough titties. That's what I say.

• 1:51:22Speaker 06

  Drones?

• 1:51:24Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, buddy.

• 1:51:25Speaker 06

  Drones continue to hit.

• 1:51:26Steven Rinella?

  The end of the show.

• 1:51:27Speaker 06

  Save the best for last, I see.

• 1:51:28Steven Rinella?

  Best for last.

• 1:51:29Speaker 06

  Drones continue to hit the New Jersey headlines.

• 1:51:32Steven Rinella?

  That's a great headline.

• 1:51:33Speaker 06

  You like that? Not for more nighttime creepy light flights. You may remember back in 2024, which led to thousands of tips to law enforcement and temporary flight bans by the FAA. Jersey coastal town officials are reminding anglers that it is illegal to knowingly or intentionally use an unmanned aircraft system or a drone to take or assist in the taking of wildlife. Per recent New Jersey statute.

• 1:51:58Steven Rinella?

  Oh, sorry. What are you reading from right now?

• 1:52:00Speaker 06

  I typed this up last night.

• 1:52:01Steven Rinella?

  You're reading, this is your own thing?

• 1:52:02Speaker 06

  I, yeah, I'm trying not to.

• 1:52:04Steven Rinella?

  So you came up with a headline that has the word headline?

• 1:52:07Speaker 06

  Yeah, you could put this in a newspaper.

• 1:52:09Steven Rinella?

  Dude, you could. If I had a newspaper, I'd be running it already. I wouldn't even read the rest of it, but go on. We should start a website. It's called like the meat eater.com where we could publish this kind of articles.

• 1:52:19Speaker 06

  Yeah, all right. Yeah. First timer here. Got to figure out how to make money off this.

• 1:52:22Steven Rinella?

  This is phenomenal. Go on. Too good.

• 1:52:26Speaker 06

  Uh, per the recent New Jersey statute, offenders could be slapped with up to six months in jail and up to a thousand dollar fine.

• 1:52:34Steven Rinella?

  Oh, I'm it. For what?

• 1:52:36Speaker 06

  For intentionally trying to catch fish with a drone, specifically sharks in this case.

• 1:52:44Steven Rinella?

  Six months in jail?

• 1:52:45Speaker 06

  Mm hmm.

• 1:52:46Steven Rinella?

  What are you in for?

• 1:52:47Speaker 06

  Fishing. Drone fishing. Yeah. Ocean County towns of Manta Loking and Bayhead have recently been cracking down on anglers who are using drones to carry and drop baited hooks, lines or chum off public beaches into the surf. Specifically for shark fishing. In the last decade, drone fishing for sharks has become very popular on summer nights.

• 1:53:09Steven Rinella?

  Cause every cast is right where you want it.

• 1:53:12Speaker 06

  You drop it wherever you want.

• 1:53:12Steven Rinella?

  Every cast is perfect.

• 1:53:14Speaker 06

  And, and way out there. Way out. Yeah. As a Montanan, sheltered Montana boy fly fisherman. This is very new to me. Drone fishing. I knew it was a thing, but I really looked into it.

• 1:53:25Steven Rinella?

  You're not going to have a drone drop your fly here and there?

• 1:53:28Speaker 06

  Probably not. I can cast better than a drone, I think. Uh, where am I?

• 1:53:34Speaker 06

  It's very popular and for good reason. This new techie tactic allows anglers to fly or cast their baited lines hundreds of yards out to sea.

• 1:53:42Steven Rinella?

  Hmm.

• 1:53:42Speaker 06

  Drop their baits beyond the break, fly their drones back, then wait for a strike. It's highly effective.

• 1:53:48Steven Rinella?

  Hmm.

• 1:53:48Speaker 06

  As we were just saying. And as shark sightings have increased in recent years, especially this summer, the draw from anglers to hit the shores to fish for sharks has also increased. But many beachgoers have expressed their opinions that the practice may be creating a jaws like situation that puts swimmers at risk.

• 1:54:05Steven Rinella?

  Well, just ban swimming.

• 1:54:08Speaker 06

  Good luck. I also think if you can get the baits out further with your drones, that's probably better.

• 1:54:14Steven Rinella?

  My initial thought is like, you're getting the bait out yonder.

• 1:54:18Speaker 06

  Mm hmm.

• 1:54:18Steven Rinella?

  Be like, okay, fine. I'll throw my bait like right there. Where you're swimming.

• 1:54:23Speaker 06

  Not only bait, but supposedly there's been some chum in action going.

• 1:54:27Steven Rinella?

  That's a little, that feels to me a little crazy.

• 1:54:29Speaker 06

  Yeah, that might drift some.

• 1:54:31Steven Rinella?

  That feels a little like you dumped 30 pounds of chum. That feels a little nutty, but.

• 1:54:34Speaker 06

  I like it. Most common, the most common species targeted in the area are brown sharks, sandbar sharks, sand tiger sharks and spinner sharks. But the concerns coming from law enforcement and beachgoers are the large apex predator like, apex predators like tiger sharks and bull sharks that are being lured in by anglers. They're worried that people could be mistaken for chum.

• 1:54:55Steven Rinella?

  Hmm.

• 1:54:56Speaker 06

  Especially small children.

• 1:54:58Steven Rinella?

  I would say if I'd written, I'd be like, the chumps can be mistaken for chumps.

• 1:55:05Speaker 06

  Try that next.

• 1:55:06Steven Rinella?

  Masterclass on headlines today.

• 1:55:07Speaker 06

  Yeah, goodness. According to the University of Florida International Shark Attack File, dating back to the 1800s, there have been 15 recorded attacks along the Jersey shore, including the 1916 attack in the Matawan Creek that was said to be the inspiration for the movie Jaws.

• 1:55:24Steven Rinella?

  Was he drone fishing?

• 1:55:26Speaker 06

  I doubt it.

• 1:55:26Steven Rinella?

  No.

• 1:55:28Speaker 06

  There have been many attacks and there, excuse me, there have not been any attacks in 2026. The last known attack in the area was May 2023. So these concerns of luring sharks closer to the shoreline are just out of precaution.

• 1:55:41Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, it's a solution looking for a problem.

• 1:55:43Speaker 06

  Hmm.

• 1:55:45Steven Rinella?

  There's, there's plenty of, there's plenty of gripes you could have with drone fishing. And I do think that dropping chum on a swim beach is

• 1:55:56Steven Rinella?

  potentially of poor taste.

• 1:55:57Speaker 06

  Yeah. And they're doing it at night when folks aren't typically swimming.

• 1:56:01Steven Rinella?

  Yeah.

• 1:56:01Speaker 06

  Unless you're.

• 1:56:02Steven Rinella?

  But the big argument would be if you're getting it out hundreds of yards and you say like, hey, don't use a drone. Doesn't that same guy then go down with the same bait and plunk it 50 yards out?

• 1:56:14Speaker 06

  And he wades out to his waist and dumps a bucket of chum and then wades back.

• 1:56:18Steven Rinella?

  I mean, like, like, like I, I just confused about, is this coming from hysterical beachgoers who don't really know what they're talking about? Or is this coming from an informed perspective?

• 1:56:30Speaker 06

  A little bit of both, I believe. A lot of concerned beachgoers and I think there's some science behind it too, you know? Extra sharks coming.

• 1:56:38Steven Rinella?

  Are real shark anglers wanting to do this though? Like I feel like the guy that actually wants to cast and, and do some real fishing, this isn't going to appeal to that person.

• 1:56:45Speaker 06

  No, I, I think it's a big thing. Yeah.

• 1:56:47Steven Rinella?

  This is a dude who wants to drag big old hoss about the area. This is what's going on.

• 1:56:51Speaker 06

  Yeah, I saw one shark, shark earlier this year, I think from Florida that was just a giant. And what they'd done was take a huge bait out deep with a drone, drop it. And then you're sitting on shore waiting for them.

• 1:57:04Steven Rinella?

  Hmm. Long drive, boys. Mm hmm. And then there's also the drone thing, just using drones to find bait balls.

• 1:57:10Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 1:57:12Steven Rinella?

  They're drones, dude. I like, I hate them. I like them for the military. I hate them. They're getting to the point in the whitetail world that people are installing drone detectors on their properties. Good. Because they're worried about people snooping on their property with drones because the drone use has become so ubiquitous now.

• 1:57:31Steven Rinella?

  Dude, I'm going to hire some Ukrainians, man, to come down and just take care of that drone business, man. I'm with you. Yeah, I'm not sure, but you better not. When they're going to sell like drone jammers and stuff that anybody could buy. I had a drone hovering over my house there. Did I talk about this? Hovering over my house, my wife ran in the house. There's a drone right over the house. I was going to shoot it, but it was already gone. And so guys like, well, you're technically not allowed to shoot it.

• 1:57:52Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 1:57:52Steven Rinella?

  A guy wrote in like a correction. Many. I would love to go to a judge and be like, uh, guilty. I shot a drone 50 feet over my house. What were you going to shoot it with? Shotgun. TSS.

• 1:58:02Speaker 06

  Well, that's one of the, that's one of the, um, in, in the.

• 1:58:05Steven Rinella?

  Guilty as charged.

• 1:58:06Speaker 06

  In the corner crossing stuff that was happening in Montana a couple of months ago with the state coming out and making a case for corner crossing being illegal. One of the things that they mentioned was, um, that, that sort of the, the sanctity of one's airspace is, is tied to this drone issue, right?

• 1:58:26Steven Rinella?

  There was some precedent, right? They, they determined some airspace.

• 1:58:30Speaker 06

  And so they were saying like, yeah, well, if corner crossing is legal, then anybody could fly their drone into your backyard and snoop around your yard.

• 1:58:36Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, but I'm like, I'm not always that concerned with being consistent. I tell my kids all the time.

• 1:58:40Speaker 06

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:58:41Steven Rinella?

  That's not fair. I'm like, okay.

• 1:58:47Steven Rinella?

  I dove into the local New Jersey Reddit hole. And there have been many concerns. Is that a bar? It's sticky. There have been many concerns from recreational anglers who are worried about the growing popularity of shark fishing in the area, from those who are not practicing ethical catch and release habits. As stated in the New Jersey Fish and Wildlife Marine Digest, if a shark is caught but not kept, it must be released immediately. But unfortunately, a few bad apples have chosen fame over ethics and are dragging sharks too far onto the beach to pose for photos before releasing the sharks, endangering the shark's health, of course.

• 1:59:22Speaker 07

  It's a drone's fault.

• 1:59:24Steven Rinella?

  Well, making it easier. It's not just drone anglers doing this. Anglers should know how to catch, handle, and release fish in an ethical manner and have the right equipment to quickly release sharks back into the water.

• 1:59:36Steven Rinella?

  Using a drone to assist in fishing has been explicitly banned in Hawaii, Texas, Michigan, Kentucky, North Carolina, Alaska, and of course, New Jersey.

• 1:59:45Speaker 07

  What?

• 1:59:46Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, Texas was kind of a surprise.

• 1:59:49Steven Rinella?

  Many of these state regulations- Texans don't, Texans, man, they don't like that word, one bit banned. Many of these states, including- Texans are out on bans. They reference the 1971 Federal Airborne Hunting Act that bans shooting, killing, or harassing animals or birds from an aircraft. But as with many written and unwritten drone laws, the evolution of regulating this new technology is slowly catching up. Hmm. But you should always check with your local state wildlife agencies to get the most up-to-date local regulations before fishing with drones over any body of water. Do you know that song, "His name is Rick, he's got the itch"? Sounds like a commercial. No, it's Rick, our camera guy, likes flying his drone.

• 2:00:33Steven Rinella?

  And he's like, he like, tries to make up reasons to fly it. Sure. And then we'll sing the song, "His name is Rick, he's got the itch." He's a drone enthusiast. It looks fun as hell.

• 2:00:45Speaker 07

  There's an old man in my neighborhood who-

• 2:00:46Steven Rinella?

  Fishing with a drone.

• 2:00:48Speaker 07

  Flies, uh, model airplanes around. That brings me joy. When I see him at the park with a model airplane, a drone doesn't bring me joy in the air.

• 2:00:55Steven Rinella?

  Well, the sound, you just hear that sound and you know what's coming your way and- I hate them. I hate them. It's like, I just hate them.

• 2:01:02Speaker 07

  Yeah.

• 2:01:02Steven Rinella?

  Those people are lucky I'm not like the emperor.

• 2:01:06Steven Rinella?

  For many reasons. I would give-

• 2:01:08Speaker 07

  Chain lightning.

• 2:01:09Steven Rinella?

  I would take everyone's drone and give it to the military. I think the military should have more drones they know what to do with. I got a buddy who fishes drone fishes, but he's got a little boat. Yeah. I remember seeing those- You like that? That's cute. In the old, like the old Cabela's catalog or the old Bass Pro catalog, I remember seeing a little boat with the pincher on the back for your line and I always thought, man, I'd catch some bigger catfish if I had that back. Yeah. There's something cute about that. Yeah. So boat drones good, flying drones bad. I'm not saying it's good, I'm just saying, I just, and, and, and, that's, that's a great report. You're not done, are you? Yeah, that's it. Oh.

• 2:01:49Steven Rinella?

  No, it finished just on time. It was a great report. It's got, like, it's got the, it's got the wheels turning big time, but, like, outside of any individual issue, if someone say, well, what about recovering, you wound a deer and, and the drone helps you recover? I'm like, that's really great, man, because no one, like, no one wants to lose deer, no one wants the deer to go to waste, no one wants the hunter to have to live with not being able to find a deer, but just, so, so there, I'm like, okay, I have some sympathy there. Well, what about this? Or what about that? I'm like, okay, I have some sympathy there. But I just mean, generally, my general attitude toward them is I just hate them, except for the military.

• 2:02:28Steven Rinella?

  I think they should have a boatload of them. Hmm. Yeah, I think restrictions are gonna get tighter and tighter as the years go on.

• 2:02:33Speaker 07

  Well, they're just becoming more and more popular, cheaper, easier to use.

• 2:02:37Steven Rinella?

  It's so invasive. Yeah. It, it, it's like having an anal probe. But in the air. I can't. But in the air. Yeah. Over you. But my body registers it the same.

• 2:02:52Steven Rinella?

  And yes, can't relate to that one.

• 2:02:56Steven Rinella?

  Not a laugh matter, man. All right, thanks for listening to the news show. That's a great report. This is up come talent right here. Yeah.

• 2:03:04Speaker 07

  I'd be careful, September's coming.

• 2:03:07Speaker 07

  Unavailable.

• 2:03:08Steven Rinella?

  What's coming?

• 2:03:09Speaker 07

  Unavailable.

• 2:03:11Steven Rinella?

  You should have bombed. If you'd have come out and just bombed.

• 2:03:16Speaker 07

  Right.

• 2:03:16Steven Rinella?

  And you're like, well, I guess I'm out for September, huh?

• 2:03:20Speaker 07

  Try again this winter.

• 2:03:23Steven Rinella?

  Yeah, January, let me try again. I might be able to do a good news story in January, but I need some time to reflect on how bad I bombed with September coming on.

• 2:03:33Steven Rinella?

  All right, thanks for listening to the news show. Uh, find us next week.

• 2:04:03Speaker 06

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• 2:04:45Steven Rinella?

  Someone once said, "Everybody's got a plan until they get punched in the mouth." I did. Mike Tyson. Oh, well, Mike Tyson and Boost are here to tell you that your mobile plan is punching you in the mouth with prices that can knock you out. That's a low blow. Totally. But you can do something about it. You have to punch back. No, Mike. You gotta switch to Boost with a plan that's $25 a month, forever. Oh, that's a great plan. Maybe you can do both. Boost Mobile, what's your plan?

• 2:05:14Speaker 01

  We know kids don't hold back, and I wouldn't want them to. Get in there, make a mess, slide for home, bring on the stains. I've got OxiClean Versatile Stain Remover. It works on over 100 stains, and it's America's number one stain fighter additive brand. It's color safe and chlorine free, so I use it on whites, colors, and dark fabrics. And OxiClean isn't just for laundry. Mix it with water for use all around the house, kitchens, bathrooms, and even floors. When my kids go all in, I say, "Go for it," because I've got OxiClean to get the stains out. It's not clean unless it's OxiClean.

• 2:05:45Speaker 00

  This is an iHeart Podcast. Guaranteed human.